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Speaker 1: Hey guys, Steve here, you are listening to one of

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Speaker 1: our original twenty six episodes. If you listen to any

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Speaker 1: of our new episodes, you're gonna notice that we're sounding

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Speaker 1: a little different in these ones. Yeah, there's a reason

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Speaker 1: for that. There is they've been remastered. They have been

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Speaker 1: remastered because they had a really annoying hum. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: mean a huge thanks to listener James for doing almost

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Speaker 1: all of the legwork on this thing. They'll also notice

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Speaker 1: if you had listened to what we're calling the last

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Speaker 1: twenty six episodes before and you're re listening now, the

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Speaker 1: music and sound effects are gone. Yes, we've we've gone

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Speaker 1: back to straight audio, So be warned. We sound a

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Speaker 1: little different today than we do in what you're about

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Speaker 1: to listen to. Yeah, bye bye, Thinking sideways. I don't

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Speaker 1: you never know stories of things we simply don't know

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Speaker 1: the answer too. Hello there, this is in case you're

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Speaker 1: wondering thinking sideways. We are the people who take on

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Speaker 1: unsolved mysteries and we solved them world and you know,

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Speaker 1: and sometimes you know, I don't know. To solve them,

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Speaker 1: we have to sort of make stuff. But now actually

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Speaker 1: we've tried to solve them. But we usually don't succeed anyway.

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Speaker 1: My name is Joe, and in this podcast we're going

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Speaker 1: to tackle our toughest mystery ever, which was why did

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Speaker 1: anybody ever buy a pet rock? Okay, okay, just kidding,

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Speaker 1: and if you're one of those people, please don't be kidding.

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Speaker 1: All right, Well, we're actually going to talk about is

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Speaker 1: a little incident that one of our listeners recommended to us, uh,

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Speaker 1: the Outloft Pass incident, which happened in Russia and the

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Speaker 1: Ural Mountains back in It's one of those big mysterious

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Speaker 1: things that's rocketed around the Internet, and of course it

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Speaker 1: was rocketing around before the Internet existed, so there was

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Speaker 1: a lot of speculation even way back in the day

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Speaker 1: as to exactly what did in these nine intrepid ski

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Speaker 1: hikers in Russia. A little background. These guys were their

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Speaker 1: Their leader was Igor I'm not gonna try to pronounce

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Speaker 1: his middle name, Igor the out Loft. He was twenty

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Speaker 1: three years old. He was the organizer and leader of

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Speaker 1: the group. Uh. And there were nine other people, one

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Speaker 1: of whom dropped out due to illness, seven men and

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Speaker 1: two women, and they headed off into the northern Urals

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Speaker 1: to a place called the Mountain of the Dead. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's like one of those things, Hey, what do you

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Speaker 1: say you want to go for a little hike to

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Speaker 1: the Mountain of the Dead, and you're like, yeah, what

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Speaker 1: could possibly go wrong? Yeah, Now it's apparently it's it's

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Speaker 1: actually Dead Mountain and the local dialect of the local

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Speaker 1: natives there, and it doesn't really mean like you're gonna

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Speaker 1: eye if you're gonna go there. It's not quite like

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Speaker 1: Skull Island. Apparently, it means that it's kind of a

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Speaker 1: place where nothing's really going on from their point of view.

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Speaker 1: If you know, if you can't go up there and

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Speaker 1: kill animals for food and pelts, then it's really kind

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Speaker 1: of useless. So they called a dead Mountain because this

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Speaker 1: wasn't so good. I know, I know, I love Mountain

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Speaker 1: of the Dead and all that stuff. That was that

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Speaker 1: was very cool, Yeah, I know, it's very cool. The

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Speaker 1: expedition was actually to reach a mountain somewhat beyond the

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Speaker 1: Mountain of the Dead, and this was just a little waist,

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Speaker 1: a little just a little stop over for the night

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Speaker 1: on their journey, and they were practicing for a more

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Speaker 1: arctic expedition. They were actually getting a little practice for

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Speaker 1: a serious, serious, like really kick ass expedition. Uh. And

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Speaker 1: it was really tells you something about these guys. They

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Speaker 1: must have been really hardy people to go off and

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Speaker 1: just say it's gonna be a little practice run and

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Speaker 1: then head up a mountain side of deep deep snow

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Speaker 1: and camp overnight and all this stuff and we were

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Speaker 1: gonna be gone for days in the winter time. That

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Speaker 1: they did this too. Yeah, yeah, it was that was

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Speaker 1: they actually was they let in. They actually set out

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Speaker 1: in late January, and they were due to arrive back

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Speaker 1: in about February eleven, and of course they were overdue

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Speaker 1: getting back, but people were too alarmed because expeditions like

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Speaker 1: this can be laid obviously, and so but after a

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Speaker 1: while people started sending out the alarm because these guys

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Speaker 1: had not returned, and so eventually a search party was

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Speaker 1: organized and sent up there. Eventually involved aircraft, helicopters, etcetera.

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Speaker 1: And they eventually found one of their tents. The tent

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Speaker 1: was in the snow. It had been It was on

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Speaker 1: the hillside, about a mile above the tree line, on

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Speaker 1: the hillside of this mountain, the Mountain of the Dead.

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Speaker 1: If I didn't mention that before, Yeah, And interestingly, the

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Speaker 1: tents had been slashed. I think they found one tent

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Speaker 1: and then they found, to believe another, And that's one

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Speaker 1: of the frustrating things about about investigating this thing, is like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know how many tents there were. Some refer

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Speaker 1: to just one tent, as if they all slept in

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Speaker 1: one giant tent, but looking at the pictures, it doesn't

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Speaker 1: look like any of the tents were big enough for

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Speaker 1: all the entire groups. So I believe there were two

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Speaker 1: or three or four tents, but I'm not really sure.

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Speaker 1: It's frustrating. I mean, we'll have to travel to Russia

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Speaker 1: really find it. Well, it is in Soviet Russia during

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Speaker 1: the Cold War era, so a lot of suppressing details

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Speaker 1: that in reports that have eventually surfaced still hit and

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Speaker 1: miss things missing. So yeah, I wondered that too when

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Speaker 1: I saw the pictures. So how long did it take

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Speaker 1: before the rescuers finally found them? It was about three weeks,

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Speaker 1: and they found the tent. They went down. They found

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Speaker 1: footprints radiating away from the tents heading down the hill.

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Speaker 1: Footprints like bootprints, but or like footprints footprints. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's again after several weeks of exposure to whether it's

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Speaker 1: it's probably a little hard to tell, but there was

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Speaker 1: there has been a claim that made that appeared that

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Speaker 1: from the footprints, as some of the people were not

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Speaker 1: wearing shoes. Yeah, and again it's like you know, as always,

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Speaker 1: and this is always a case. Can't get around the

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Speaker 1: fact that people over the years have in started their

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Speaker 1: own little weird things into these stories that may not

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Speaker 1: necessarily be true. On the face of it appears that

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Speaker 1: they went down the hill following the footprints. The footprints

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Speaker 1: eventually disappeared, but they continued on in that general direction

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Speaker 1: to the tree line. At the tree line they find

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Speaker 1: a big pine tree that there was a fire under.

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Speaker 1: The fire was obviously burned out at this but somebody

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Speaker 1: had built a fire there. There was that the branches

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Speaker 1: of the tree had been torn off to about fifteen

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Speaker 1: feet up. Some of the accounts of this had talk

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Speaker 1: about the sheer panic that these people must have been

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Speaker 1: in because they were running from some incredible horror that's

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Speaker 1: scared about of their tent made him run down the

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Speaker 1: hillside in their underwear without boots on, and then they

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Speaker 1: tried to scramble up this tree and tore off branches

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Speaker 1: up to fifteen ft high, okay, so that they found

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Speaker 1: a few of the bodies there. They were nine overall.

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Speaker 1: Three of the bodies they found further up the hillside

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Speaker 1: between the campfire and the tents, and they appeared to

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Speaker 1: be headed, had to have been headed back up towards

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Speaker 1: the tents. The four remaining bodies were found in a

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Speaker 1: nearby ravine. Those bodies had suffered quite a bit of trauma.

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Speaker 1: According to Soviet investigators, the cause of death was quote

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Speaker 1: a compelling natural force unquote. In other words, as their

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Speaker 1: chests to make a couple of chests have been crushed,

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Speaker 1: skulls cracked, etcetera. Yeah, and so that has caused intense

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Speaker 1: intense speculation about things like you know, the abominable snowman

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Speaker 1: uh Soviet military tests. One theory is that the local natives,

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Speaker 1: I forget the name of the local natives had were

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Speaker 1: offended that they there, they trespassed into their territory, and

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Speaker 1: so they had like brutally killed them. One of the

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Speaker 1: one of the bodies, one of the women that was

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Speaker 1: found in the ravine, was missing her tongue, so speculated

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Speaker 1: that the same tribesmen had cut her tongue out before

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Speaker 1: pushing her into the ravine. What how? What? What was

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Speaker 1: the proximity of the ravine to the camp, to the

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Speaker 1: camp and to the campfire. It's like, so if the

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Speaker 1: campus up the hillside, then you go straight down the hillside,

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Speaker 1: you find the campfire. If you go left from there,

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Speaker 1: you go it's like several feet and there's a ravine. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: not not far away. The people found in the ravine

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Speaker 1: were wearing pieces of clothing that had obviously been taken

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Speaker 1: off the other the bodies of their compatriots. It appeared

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Speaker 1: that they died the last of all of them because

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Speaker 1: they were out in the snow and the freezing cold,

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Speaker 1: because it was sub zero. It was sub zero. It

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Speaker 1: was sub zero, and these people, after their friends had

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Speaker 1: died of hypothermia, then they took their clothes obviously because

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Speaker 1: they needed to survive, and then stumbled off and god

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Speaker 1: knows exactly what they intended to do. Uh So, anyway,

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Speaker 1: other other theories to see, there is a condition that

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Speaker 1: when you when you go into deep hypothermia, you stopped

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Speaker 1: thinking correctly need things like taking your clothes up because

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Speaker 1: you think you're too hot and things like that. So

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Speaker 1: that's another possibility. These people were just disoriented because of that?

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Speaker 1: Was there any other weirdness about the bodies? Some supposedly

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Speaker 1: they scanned the clothes for radioactivity and three articles of

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Speaker 1: clothing out of all the articles of clothing and there

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Speaker 1: were radioactive. Now I'm not really sure. There's been a

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Speaker 1: little bit debunking about that whole thing, and apparently some

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Speaker 1: people say that the whole radioactivity thing was basically just

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Speaker 1: inserted into the story later and it would never actually happen.

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Speaker 1: I'm not really I mean to me that the whole

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Speaker 1: thing about it was is if the clothes were if

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Speaker 1: three articles of clothing were radioactive, if they had been

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Speaker 1: exposed to radioactivity, then shouldn't been Yeah, shouldn't all their

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Speaker 1: tooth for example, the feelings in their teeth should be

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Speaker 1: highly radioactive. And so so I'm not really sure, And

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Speaker 1: so that leads me to be that leads me to

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Speaker 1: be a little skeptical about the radioactivity thing. Sure, and

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Speaker 1: you know, correct me if I'm wrong. But I remember

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Speaker 1: reading about this and they said that some of the

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Speaker 1: bodies had a weird orange que to them and their

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Speaker 1: hung Yeah, and you know, I don't know how much

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Speaker 1: of that is just if you lay on your son

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not sure what the effects of exposure

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Speaker 1: in and of itself are, but it has been said

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Speaker 1: that they might have been deeply tanned because they were

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Speaker 1: laying in the sun for weeks and they lit out

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Speaker 1: their shirts on. So so that's that's quite possibly what

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Speaker 1: it is. Discolored, not rotting because it's too cold, but discolored. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And I'm not sure what the effects of prospite on

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Speaker 1: your skin would be and if that would that would

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Speaker 1: discolor your skin also, well they usually goes back, well

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Speaker 1: if if it lasts long ago, but if you die,

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Speaker 1: if you die, yeah, if you die before then, it

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Speaker 1: might just discolor you a little bit. So I you know,

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Speaker 1: So I'm not really sure. But apparently as some of

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Speaker 1: the family members did did say that they were sort

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Speaker 1: of orange colored. They might have just eaten all the

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Speaker 1: carrots in the previous weeks. I don't know. So the

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Speaker 1: what are the theories? Can you really lay them out for? Well,

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Speaker 1: the most compelling theory is um they went to bed.

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Speaker 1: Nobody knows exactly when they when they went to sleep,

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Speaker 1: but it appears that this incident that set them down

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Speaker 1: the hillside happened sometime between seven and eleven o'clock and

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Speaker 1: that evening. I'm not sure how anybody managed to extrapolate that,

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Speaker 1: but okay, we'll take them with their word for that.

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Speaker 1: I remember reading that what they had done is they

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Speaker 1: examined the contents of their stomachs, and they figure, you're

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Speaker 1: hiking in the day and you're gonna make camp before

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Speaker 1: the sun goes down the point you're gonna eat and

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Speaker 1: then go to bed. So if there's less than eight

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Speaker 1: hours of digestion, then they can kind of give it

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Speaker 1: a time frame. That's how I'm guessing they know what

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Speaker 1: the time frame is because a lot of things that

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Speaker 1: I saw a reference that they looked at their stomach content.

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Speaker 1: So anyway, so in the night, they were presumably asleep

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Speaker 1: in their tents or tent. What happened They heard a noise,

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Speaker 1: somebody turns on a light and in the doorway to

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Speaker 1: their tent there's standing a cara. This is actually, this

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Speaker 1: is actually. Uh So anyway, they are of course terrified

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Speaker 1: that now there's it's not this is a theory that's

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Speaker 1: out there. You're not just making this up. Well, we'll

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Speaker 1: get to that. It's okay, okay, So it's unknown whether

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Speaker 1: the cheap a Cabra admitted a hideous cackling laugh or not.

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Speaker 1: But what is heard. But what is what is what

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Speaker 1: is intensely speculated, is at that moment the cheoper Cabra,

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Speaker 1: without even asking if it was okay, pulled out a

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Speaker 1: cigar and lit it. Now we all know about the

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Speaker 1: dangerous effects, so second hand smoke, Steve, so I can

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Speaker 1: tell you if he's making this up or yeah, you

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Speaker 1: know I'm making it up. Okay, Okay, So let's get

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Speaker 1: back to Mr Chipikabra side. Okay, there has been talking

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Speaker 1: about speculation, of course, about UFOs um and I'm not

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Speaker 1: I'm not really sure with the background. I mean, what

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Speaker 1: what have you found that people have said supports the

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Speaker 1: UFO theory. I haven't found anything to support the UFO theory.

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Speaker 1: I mean the radiation, but I don't. I don't, so

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Speaker 1: I don't really think that that's supported by the evidence.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I've I've seen stuff that said that

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Speaker 1: people had reported for months that they had seen weird

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Speaker 1: orange glowing lights and that there was another group that

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Speaker 1: was out at that same time, fifty miles away that

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Speaker 1: had seen an orange light flying around in the direction

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Speaker 1: of the mountain that they were on on that very

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Speaker 1: same night. Yeah and so and so, you know, speculation

246
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Speaker 1: could be that a UFO shoes and shows up, Lily

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Speaker 1: Green Man pop up in their in their campsite, and

248
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Speaker 1: they flee and terror. But the problem I have with

249
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Speaker 1: this theory is that it's five degrees below zero, and

250
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Speaker 1: so if I've got to say, if I have to

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Speaker 1: choose between the possibility that the Little Green Man is

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Speaker 1: going to eat me, which is just a possibility, and

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Speaker 1: the certainty that if I run off into the into

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Speaker 1: the arctic cold with my no clothes on, that I'm

255
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Speaker 1: going to die. I'm gonna I'm gonna hang out and

256
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Speaker 1: see what the Little Green Man's attentions are. I mean,

257
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Speaker 1: it's it's not the it's not you know, to me,

258
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Speaker 1: it's not credible. Okay, So I want to run down

259
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Speaker 1: this path. There's some research that I came across that

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Speaker 1: I'd like to to flesh out on this supposed UFO

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Speaker 1: sighting in the area. Yeah. Uh, And I don't have

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Speaker 1: the location markers to reference on this article that I found,

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Speaker 1: but I think it was at the time they were

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Speaker 1: testing there, it was a nuclear missile, the R forty

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Speaker 1: seven is what I want to say, hauled. And they

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Speaker 1: were launching it from a site that if you were

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Speaker 1: to look at it on a map for where this

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Speaker 1: other camp fifty miles away was where this group of

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Speaker 1: skiers was at, and then the launch point, the launch

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Speaker 1: point sent it directly across all of them to what

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Speaker 1: was known as a testing ground for nuclear missiles. So

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Speaker 1: it's very valid that this other group said we saw

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Speaker 1: the strange George Lightnings guy, You're right. It was a rocket.

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Speaker 1: It was the biggest rocket you had ever seen, and

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Speaker 1: they had no idea because it didn't have any running

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Speaker 1: like to on. They see this orange glow. It's just

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Speaker 1: rocket obviously in very very low orbit because it's going

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Speaker 1: let's say a couple hundred miles only to then explode,

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Speaker 1: and they're going to test it. So that's why this

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Speaker 1: other group of campers thought they saw the strange glow

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Speaker 1: it was a nuclear test. Yeah, not even a nuclear test,

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Speaker 1: just a rocket test. I mean, I'm sure they didn't

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Speaker 1: have a warhead on that thing. That Yeah, it was testing.

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Speaker 1: They were shooting it, yeah, yeah, so yeah, it could

285
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Speaker 1: easily have been that. I Mean, the thing about you

286
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Speaker 1: about UFOs is there's all kinds of stuff flying around

287
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Speaker 1: up there. I mean there's airplanes and helicopters and rockets

288
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Speaker 1: and meteors and all kinds of stuff. Other theories, let

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Speaker 1: me see, we did I talk about the cheoper cabra. Okay,

290
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Speaker 1: I did? Okay, right, Yeah, it's always a damn cheoper cabra.

291
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Speaker 1: The other, well, you know, the other theories is that

292
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Speaker 1: they were confronted with some hideous something god knows what.

293
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Speaker 1: Um there was that talk about. You know, why would

294
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Speaker 1: they why would they leave? Why would they flee their

295
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Speaker 1: tense You know, they've left without footwear, without you know,

296
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Speaker 1: their parks, without all conso, so why would they do

297
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Speaker 1: that unless they were they cut their way out of it.

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Speaker 1: They did. There was evidence that they cut their way

299
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Speaker 1: up from the inside and then and then fled, and

300
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Speaker 1: then fled and tear down the hillside from whatever hideous

301
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Speaker 1: unknown thing it was, and then tore to a bunch

302
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Speaker 1: of branches off this tree trying to climb the tree

303
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Speaker 1: to get away from whatever this thing was. But of

304
00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:01,080
Speaker 1: course there was a campfire right there they tried to build.

305
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Speaker 1: So I mean, I think that it's pretty obvious the

306
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Speaker 1: branches were torn off because they were desperately trying to

307
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Speaker 1: get as much firewood as they possibly could to get

308
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Speaker 1: a fire going. Well and crappy if I'm wrong, But

309
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Speaker 1: the two that were found at the tree that the

310
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Speaker 1: first ones to die, weren't their hands completely mangled from

311
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Speaker 1: cold and then trying to break wood off, and they

312
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Speaker 1: just they cut the holy hack out of themselves and

313
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Speaker 1: tore their hands to pieces. Yeah, and one and one,

314
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Speaker 1: yeah and one version of this the story is telling

315
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Speaker 1: they tore their hands to pieces because they were that

316
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Speaker 1: scared of whatever it was that was after them. But

317
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Speaker 1: but really, and more likely, the tore they has to

318
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Speaker 1: pieces because they were that desperate to get some firewood,

319
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Speaker 1: right damn now, because really what it was and so

320
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Speaker 1: and and and of course the weakness of that theory

321
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Speaker 1: too is that it just speculates as some hideous unknown Well,

322
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Speaker 1: and they were still with the sprints. Yeah, it's hideous creature,

323
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Speaker 1: which lends creators to the troupe of copper theory. Well,

324
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Speaker 1: the cidious creature left no footprints, isn't There Also, and

325
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Speaker 1: I think that you briefly mentioned this, which is also

326
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Speaker 1: falls apart in the face of no footprints, is the

327
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Speaker 1: fact that the local natives that were blamed for In

328
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Speaker 1: one version of it, we're blamed for killing them. Uh

329
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Speaker 1: there a there was no other people footprints or at

330
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Speaker 1: those people that same tribe helped in the search for them.

331
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Speaker 1: And again in the tellings that are fantastical about well

332
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Speaker 1: it's the you know, the yetie or whatever it is, Well,

333
00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:35,760
Speaker 1: that creature punched them and broke their bones, that it

334
00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:38,480
Speaker 1: was people doing it. It was too much force for

335
00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:41,959
Speaker 1: a human to have exerted on another human were leaving

336
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Speaker 1: like repeated beating marks or something. So but again this

337
00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:48,440
Speaker 1: is all debacked by the fact that there simply are

338
00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,200
Speaker 1: no footprints, no physical others whatsoever that any of this happened.

339
00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:54,960
Speaker 1: And frankly, motive is kind of missing. Well what there is?

340
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Speaker 1: Have you come across about why her tongue was gone?

341
00:18:57,320 --> 00:19:02,720
Speaker 1: Small animals or medium sized animals? Yeah, my theory is

342
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Speaker 1: that you know, they died. You know, the big mystery

343
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Speaker 1: for me is this, like, first, why did they flee

344
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Speaker 1: their tents? Because I think the timeline the I can

345
00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:15,120
Speaker 1: totally understand the motives. Right, you're building the fire, You're

346
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Speaker 1: cold as hell because you've got hypothermia. You know, some

347
00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:22,040
Speaker 1: of you were in certain states of more undressed than others,

348
00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:24,800
Speaker 1: you know, so you're like, all right, the threat is gone.

349
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Speaker 1: We're going to go back up there, you know, freeze

350
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Speaker 1: to death on your way up or whatever happened to them,

351
00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:32,359
Speaker 1: you know, the other ones freeze down here. Everybody's just

352
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Speaker 1: trying to survive, and then an avalanche comes along kills

353
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Speaker 1: these last four people in this ravine. They fall into

354
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Speaker 1: ravene or you know whatever. I expect an avalanche and

355
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Speaker 1: small you know, she dies with her mouth open. Small

356
00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:49,560
Speaker 1: animal comes along and it's like, well, that's an easy

357
00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:52,399
Speaker 1: thing to eat, exactly, gnaws it out of her mouth

358
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Speaker 1: first frozen. I'm not sure about the avalanche. Like, for example,

359
00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:00,360
Speaker 1: I came across the site that supposedly deep at all

360
00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:02,679
Speaker 1: all of this stuff and said the shredding and a

361
00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:06,960
Speaker 1: tent for example, was consistent with just an avalanche. But

362
00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:09,440
Speaker 1: the fact of the matter is is they found the tents,

363
00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:13,080
Speaker 1: and so if they've been spared by an avalanche, you know,

364
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Speaker 1: I don't think that they would have been found every Yeah,

365
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Speaker 1: so that was kind of my my thought at the

366
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Speaker 1: beginning was that they heard an avalanche coming, so they

367
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Speaker 1: you know, bailed. But it was my original understanding of

368
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Speaker 1: this story. I had never heard the part about the

369
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Speaker 1: the fire down below that had survived whatever they originally fleet.

370
00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:35,520
Speaker 1: It was my understanding that in the flight, you know,

371
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Speaker 1: everybody died in some no actually some of them for

372
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Speaker 1: a while for a while. Yeah, So it was my

373
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Speaker 1: understanding that I was like I, I always thought, well,

374
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Speaker 1: this is obviously just an avalanche. You know, it could

375
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Speaker 1: have torn the tents up a little bit, it could

376
00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:52,159
Speaker 1: have been smaller up there and gained well, wanna, I

377
00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:58,000
Speaker 1: actually have got to say that personally, the avalanche makes

378
00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:02,520
Speaker 1: the most sense to me, and me flesh this out. Okay, Um,

379
00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:05,479
Speaker 1: so have we've all lived in areas where it's snowed

380
00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:09,240
Speaker 1: a lot, so you've seen ice shifted and big snow

381
00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:15,680
Speaker 1: chunks move, and it's sometimes it's not a giant, giant, traumatic,

382
00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:19,840
Speaker 1: dramatic thing, and precisely it could be. Right. So here's

383
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:23,760
Speaker 1: here's what I I've seen the photos where because they

384
00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:27,360
Speaker 1: recovered the cameras that they were taking pictures of themselves with,

385
00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:32,760
Speaker 1: and somebody took a photo of them making camp, they

386
00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:37,520
Speaker 1: didn't set their tents on top of the snow. They

387
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:41,080
Speaker 1: dug into the snow. They dug in what looks like

388
00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:44,520
Speaker 1: a good two to three feet. What do yeah, what

389
00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:48,600
Speaker 1: you do? Okay, there hadn't been any heavy snowfall in

390
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:53,160
Speaker 1: that area for a couple of weeks, so now it's

391
00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:57,280
Speaker 1: evidently been I'm guessing relatively for the area temper weather,

392
00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:02,440
Speaker 1: and now we get more snow. What happened to me

393
00:22:02,920 --> 00:22:06,600
Speaker 1: would be that it wasn't a massive avalanche like you

394
00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:11,080
Speaker 1: see on television, but more of this huge let's just say,

395
00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:17,480
Speaker 1: five chunk of ice that's buried down suddenly shifts and

396
00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:21,239
Speaker 1: drops a couple of feet and shakes everything up and

397
00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:24,680
Speaker 1: scares everybody, and snow piles up and their tent kind

398
00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:27,720
Speaker 1: of gets buried, so they have to cut their way out.

399
00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:33,280
Speaker 1: That yeah, okay, it's a massive avalanche, but it's enough

400
00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:37,560
Speaker 1: movement to get everybody in a panic where I want

401
00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:40,520
Speaker 1: to take time to put all my clothes on. Oh gosh,

402
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:44,080
Speaker 1: the big ones coming and we gotta get I guess

403
00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 1: I just think that like in that circumstance, if they're

404
00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 1: at all seasoned mountaineers of any kind, especially in Russia,

405
00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:58,560
Speaker 1: right where as cold as hell, you grab something parker,

406
00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:04,000
Speaker 1: you grab your boot, you grab your sleeping bag. But

407
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:08,439
Speaker 1: in the panic of the moment. But you know that

408
00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:10,560
Speaker 1: is the thing too, is I was I was speculating.

409
00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:12,280
Speaker 1: It was exactly what you were talking about. Their tent

410
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:14,000
Speaker 1: got a little bit buried to where they had to

411
00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:17,160
Speaker 1: hack their way out of it, and they were all scared.

412
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:19,560
Speaker 1: But at the same time, these people should be rational

413
00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:22,520
Speaker 1: enough to know that, uh, we're not moving anymore. There

414
00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:25,040
Speaker 1: might be a couple extra seconds, Yeah, there might be.

415
00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:27,320
Speaker 1: There might be an avalanche right about to smack me.

416
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:29,480
Speaker 1: But if I run away now with no clothes and

417
00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,840
Speaker 1: no shoes, I'm going to die for sure, you know.

418
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:36,280
Speaker 1: And so you're you're putting rational thought into a very

419
00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:39,800
Speaker 1: irrational senses. So I wonder, actually, I have this question

420
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,200
Speaker 1: every time I've ever gone camping. You take a bottle

421
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:46,560
Speaker 1: of camping whiskey with you, right, do you take? Or

422
00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:50,440
Speaker 1: if you're in Russia, maybe you vodka, you know whatever.

423
00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:53,840
Speaker 1: So I don't know if they found if they were

424
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:56,199
Speaker 1: inebriate at all, you know, they had made camp for

425
00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:58,600
Speaker 1: the night, maybe they were, you know, having a drink

426
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:00,600
Speaker 1: or two. I think that if I were a little

427
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 1: drunk woke up to what I thought was an avalanche,

428
00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:07,679
Speaker 1: you know, I would probably I would be more prone

429
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:11,600
Speaker 1: to believe that these people would just bail because I

430
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:14,080
Speaker 1: think that, you know, it's my impression that if when

431
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,240
Speaker 1: an avalanche comes, you can kind of hear it coming.

432
00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 1: So if you wake up in the middle of the

433
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:23,080
Speaker 1: night and it's shifted but everything is still still and quiet,

434
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:25,919
Speaker 1: you cut your way out and you're like, gosh, it's cold,

435
00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:28,760
Speaker 1: you know, and I don't hear anything, I don't see anything.

436
00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,120
Speaker 1: You kind of assess your situation. And I have been

437
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:37,399
Speaker 1: in situations in the outdoors of survival before, just personally,

438
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,200
Speaker 1: and I know that if you were at all trained,

439
00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 1: if you're at all seasoned, the first thing you do

440
00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:45,360
Speaker 1: when you're in that situation is, you know, to take

441
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:49,320
Speaker 1: the like five extra seconds to analyze your situation, unless

442
00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:52,639
Speaker 1: you're drunk, yeah right, you know, like it's built in

443
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:55,000
Speaker 1: its second nature for you to take that extra five

444
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:59,320
Speaker 1: seconds to say, am I in absolute immediate danger? Or

445
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:02,240
Speaker 1: am I you know, screwing myself over in the future?

446
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:04,200
Speaker 1: And you know, that's really all it takes. And I

447
00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:06,440
Speaker 1: don't know, you know, avalanches happened really fast, and that's

448
00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:10,040
Speaker 1: totally fair. But I think that if they had any

449
00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:12,760
Speaker 1: kind of experience with this, they would know, well, enough

450
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:14,680
Speaker 1: in my mind, at least they would know well enough

451
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:18,520
Speaker 1: to just say, I'm grabbing something a backpack. You would

452
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,399
Speaker 1: think something you would think, and it's it's It's also

453
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,480
Speaker 1: possible that if they if their turk got buried for

454
00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:26,920
Speaker 1: a while, then they were and they were buried under

455
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,840
Speaker 1: icy snow, then you know they were already by the

456
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 1: time they cut their way out, experiencing hypothermia on top

457
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:35,920
Speaker 1: of being drunk. So that might have interfered with their

458
00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:39,560
Speaker 1: thought process is just a little bit. But but what

459
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,359
Speaker 1: it does appear that they fled in panic, probably because

460
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:44,360
Speaker 1: they thought an avalanche was coming. They ran down, they

461
00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:46,160
Speaker 1: tried to build a fire, and they built a fire.

462
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 1: They succeeded in that, but then they realized fire or not,

463
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:51,680
Speaker 1: they were screwed unless they got back and got their stuff.

464
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:53,840
Speaker 1: Three of them headed back up the hill and never

465
00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:57,320
Speaker 1: made it. And those three when their bodies were found,

466
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,399
Speaker 1: they weren't found together. Yeah, that was what why they

467
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 1: didn't when when they initially found the camp and then

468
00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:05,119
Speaker 1: they found the tree, they didn't find those three bodies

469
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:08,760
Speaker 1: along the way. Those three people were like a hundred

470
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:12,040
Speaker 1: meters apart or something. Yeah, probably right, they were spread

471
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:16,919
Speaker 1: out like one dropt and I I gotta go, and

472
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:21,480
Speaker 1: then finally, you know, I can't do it anymore. Which

473
00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:23,480
Speaker 1: were the three that were found? Were one of them?

474
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:27,920
Speaker 1: One of them? So that one some credence to that theory,

475
00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,600
Speaker 1: if you know, if the guy who's leading it, who's

476
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:34,120
Speaker 1: probably the most clear minded, says, all right, it's mean

477
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 1: like you two, we gotta go. You guys can and

478
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:38,639
Speaker 1: you guys stay here and keep the fire going and

479
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:40,760
Speaker 1: tear branches off the tree by the way and keep

480
00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:43,639
Speaker 1: it going, and so and then as for the other ones,

481
00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:47,159
Speaker 1: apparently they had taken clothing articles off the people that

482
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:49,840
Speaker 1: were left there by the campfire and who were wearing

483
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:52,639
Speaker 1: their underwhere, so they must they must have all found

484
00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:54,720
Speaker 1: each other. But then these guys, I don't know why

485
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:58,040
Speaker 1: I took off wind up. I think, in my opinion

486
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:01,440
Speaker 1: that you're you're thinking about an avalanche as possible, it's

487
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 1: also possible they just fell into the ravine and sustained

488
00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:07,920
Speaker 1: you know, massive traumatic injury. Well that's the thing with ravines,

489
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 1: especially when there's snow and ice covered. You don't see them,

490
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,359
Speaker 1: especially in the dark. Yeah, yeah, I guess, okay, And

491
00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:16,000
Speaker 1: then again I'm just gonna keep poking holes in these theories.

492
00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 1: Is that I know, mountain climbers and the way you

493
00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:23,359
Speaker 1: go anywhere is you go on a single file line, right,

494
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:27,159
Speaker 1: So like you're walking behind, I've been there, right, and

495
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:29,880
Speaker 1: he goes down, You're not going to be like, well,

496
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:32,879
Speaker 1: I'll just keep walking, right because he's just like die.

497
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:41,200
Speaker 1: Unless your mind is followed from hypothermia, keep forgetting the hypotheria. Yeah, yeah,

498
00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:43,680
Speaker 1: I mean, think about what's the best way to prevent hypothermia.

499
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:47,479
Speaker 1: Huddled together and you hold and you share body warmth.

500
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:49,480
Speaker 1: So if you're trying to forward through the snow and

501
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:52,480
Speaker 1: you're bunched up together and one person falls and you're

502
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:57,639
Speaker 1: all tangled together, you'll all go over together. That's entirely

503
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:02,119
Speaker 1: possible to so know I any other thoughts, you guys know,

504
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 1: I I personally I leaned towards the avalanche idea. Yeah, really,

505
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:12,000
Speaker 1: I think the mini avalanche. I mean obviously it wasn't, yeah,

506
00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:14,919
Speaker 1: but that's been my thinking, is that it's just a

507
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,800
Speaker 1: small avalanche bared them, scared the hell out of them,

508
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,119
Speaker 1: and yeah, I think an ice sheet underneath where they

509
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,840
Speaker 1: were just shifted and you know whatever, for whatever reason,

510
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,520
Speaker 1: panics and that's that's the one that I go, Yeah,

511
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: I'm willing to accept that with the added caveats, either

512
00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 1: alcohol or they were experiencing hypothermia a little bit from

513
00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:38,800
Speaker 1: cold Barry Games. I still understand why they were sleeping

514
00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 1: in their underwear. But yeah, I guess when you're when

515
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:45,520
Speaker 1: you're camping out in the freezing weather, I understand that

516
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 1: you take your shoes and socks off so you get

517
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:51,120
Speaker 1: good circulation when you're in sleep. But yeah, you keep

518
00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 1: your long Joan's in. Heck, when it's really cold, I

519
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 1: will sleep in pants and all a sugar too. So

520
00:28:56,000 --> 00:29:01,000
Speaker 1: I don't understand the they were not in. So I

521
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,680
Speaker 1: can tell you what my theory is to add to

522
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:08,160
Speaker 1: your theory. My theory has to do with their events

523
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 1: prior to them going to sleep. You know they had dinner, right,

524
00:29:11,280 --> 00:29:13,680
Speaker 1: You think they were having no, I think they were

525
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:16,360
Speaker 1: having their drinking vodka. I think they got drunk. And

526
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 1: when you're drunk, like and you're with a bunch of people,

527
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:24,040
Speaker 1: what do you do? Sometimes people do you know if

528
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:26,280
Speaker 1: you're if you're getting drunk or you like get in

529
00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 1: and you're suffering because you like get your hot flashes

530
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:31,920
Speaker 1: or whatever you're getting your thing and you take off

531
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 1: your clothes because who knows, but I think that there

532
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:38,480
Speaker 1: I think I suspect heavily that there was some kind

533
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:41,280
Speaker 1: of alcohol involved. And even if they and if they

534
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:44,000
Speaker 1: were taking clothes off, it was getting colder, they weren't

535
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 1: feeling it because of the alcohol, and then they weren't

536
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:49,120
Speaker 1: feeling it because of the hypothermia. You know, one of

537
00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:52,120
Speaker 1: the symptoms of hypothermia is that you actually think that

538
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 1: you're hot, often so you start to peel clothes off

539
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 1: severe hypothermia. Yeah, an, the reason, the reason they were

540
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 1: wearing it just or underwears, and and this is something

541
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 1: I learned years ago camping as a boy scout and

542
00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 1: a kid and everything, is that you actually stay warmer

543
00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:08,280
Speaker 1: if you stripped down, if you keep your clothes on,

544
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:11,280
Speaker 1: for some paradoxical reason, you will actually be colder than

545
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:15,320
Speaker 1: if you're wearing your underwear. Yeah. No, it's just totally

546
00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:20,200
Speaker 1: the truth that it goes against everything I've ever learned

547
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:27,000
Speaker 1: in survival. Yeah, I mean, yeah, that is, well, that's

548
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:30,120
Speaker 1: a whole subject for another episode. Yeah, I mean, because yeah,

549
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:33,160
Speaker 1: that is like that was at least back, you know,

550
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:36,520
Speaker 1: two or three decades ago. That was the accepted wisdom

551
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:38,440
Speaker 1: is that you will stay warmer if you stripped under

552
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:40,440
Speaker 1: your shorts, that if you keep it then if you

553
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:43,200
Speaker 1: keep all your clothes on. So that's my speculation as

554
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 1: to why they were in their shots. All right, Okay,

555
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:52,960
Speaker 1: so mystery Salt. Congratulations you guys. Good job. Actually yeah, yeah,

556
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:55,720
Speaker 1: I think this one is not not exactly up in

557
00:30:55,760 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 1: a shut, but I think we came close to it. Yeah. Uh. Anyway,

558
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 1: if you'd like to contact us, and I know you do,

559
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 1: our email addresses Thinking Sideways Podcast at gmail dot com. Uh,

560
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:11,040
Speaker 1: if you'd let check our website. It is Thinking Sideways

561
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:15,600
Speaker 1: podcast dot com anyway, So anyway, check out our website

562
00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:18,400
Speaker 1: for lots of links on it. It's got links to

563
00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:22,239
Speaker 1: the show and lots of other unsolved mysteries out there

564
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 1: if you haven't listened to us before. Okay, and also

565
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:28,440
Speaker 1: a shout out to Andrew, our listener who suggested this

566
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 1: topic for tonight. Yes, thanks again that this was a

567
00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 1: good one. I had, I know, when we talked about before,

568
00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:35,600
Speaker 1: I hadn't heard this one, and this was definitely a

569
00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 1: really interesting you know, it was actually an amazing coincidence.

570
00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:40,600
Speaker 1: I stumbled across this like a week before we got

571
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:42,880
Speaker 1: the suggestion from Andrew, and that was like the first

572
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,240
Speaker 1: I had ever heard of it, an interesting little mystery,

573
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:49,200
Speaker 1: which of course we solved. I like getting you know,

574
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:53,800
Speaker 1: listeners suggestions. Yeah. Absolutely, people find things all the time

575
00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:57,360
Speaker 1: that we don't know about. I love to hear from folks.

576
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,440
Speaker 1: I mean, we've we've gotten stuff before, so it's great. Absolutely,

577
00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:02,200
Speaker 1: and Andrew, after you've heard what we have to say

578
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 1: about it, if you think we're full of it, we'd

579
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:06,959
Speaker 1: like to hear from you again. Please. Anyway, that's it

580
00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:12,920
Speaker 1: for now. I'm Joe. Goodbye, bye, bye bye,