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Speaker 1: Cool zone Media.

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Speaker 2: In nineteen ninety five, a middle aged former marine decided

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Speaker 2: to go back to school. He'd been out of the

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Speaker 2: service for years. He had already had an entire second

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Speaker 2: career as a mining engineer, but he was having trouble

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Speaker 2: finding a job. On the eve of the dot com boom,

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Speaker 2: he saw an opportunity for a new direction. He enrolled

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Speaker 2: at Arizona State University to study computers. That first semester,

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Speaker 2: he enrolled in a class called Introduction to Macintosh. Through

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Speaker 2: the university, he had unlimited access to the World Wide Web,

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Speaker 2: accessible twenty four to seven at the school's on campus

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Speaker 2: computer center. By day, he learned the basics of computer programming,

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Speaker 2: but at night, alone in the computer lab, he browsed

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Speaker 2: the web. It was there that he first discovered websites

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Speaker 2: devoted to white nationalism. He devoured the writings of doctor

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Speaker 2: William Luther Pierce, the leader of the neo Nazi group

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Speaker 2: National Alliance. He created an account on a forum for

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Speaker 2: followers of the World Church of the Creator, and within

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Speaker 2: months he was invited to meet in person with the

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Speaker 2: leadership of the local chapters of both organizations. Ralph Brandt

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Speaker 2: enrolled in computer classes looking for a third act, and

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Speaker 2: I guess he got one. I don't know how proficient

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Speaker 2: he ever got at computer programming, but in the thirty

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Speaker 2: years since he first stumbled upon an online forum for racists,

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Speaker 2: he's found purpose. Now, at nearly seventy six years old,

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Speaker 2: he's the chairman of white nationalist group angling for a Comeback.

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Speaker 2: I'm Molly Conger, and this is weird, Little guys. This week,

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Speaker 2: more than ever, I have felt overwhelmed by the realization

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Speaker 2: that this show doesn't really have individual episodes. There are

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Speaker 2: no self contained stories with beginnings, middles, and ends. This

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Speaker 2: has all just been one really long story that I'm

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Speaker 2: telling out of order. The last two main Feed episodes,

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Speaker 2: I told you a story about Merlin Miller, a failed

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Speaker 2: filmmaker who fell down a rabbit hole after nine to eleven,

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Speaker 2: became obsessed with conspiracy theories, and ran for president in

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Speaker 2: twenty twelve on the ticket of an openly white supremacist,

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Speaker 2: fascist eugenicis political party called the American Third Position Party.

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Speaker 2: And in that second episode, I hinted that the group

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Speaker 2: behind his candidacy hasn't really gone away. In the aftermath

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Speaker 2: of Merlin Miller's disastrous run for president, the party rebranded. Remember,

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Speaker 2: the group originally formed out of the collapse of a

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Speaker 2: California group called the Golden State Party, so named because

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Speaker 2: it was mostly made up of members of the neo

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Speaker 2: Nazi skinhead group, the Golden State Skinheads. So the Golden

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Speaker 2: State Party collapsed in two thousand and nine, and they

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Speaker 2: regrouped as the American Third Position Party in twenty ten,

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Speaker 2: and then the group rebranded again as the American Freedom

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Speaker 2: Party in December of twenty twelve. And my plan for

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Speaker 2: the next episode, this one, the one you're listening to now,

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Speaker 2: was just to speed run through the party's activities over

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Speaker 2: the decade that followed, bringing us all the way back

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Speaker 2: up to the present day, and then be done with it.

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Speaker 2: But I think we're going to have to revisit some

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Speaker 2: parts of this story in more depth some other time,

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Speaker 2: maybe not next week. As I was scrounging around and

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Speaker 2: compiling my notes and collecting filings from failed campaigns, and

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Speaker 2: watching grainy old videos of speeches at White Nationalists summits

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Speaker 2: held in hotel conference rooms, and listening to Nazi podcasts

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Speaker 2: at double speed, just wishing that they would get to

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Speaker 2: the point, I started to feel a little bit crazed.

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Speaker 2: I mean that's not unusual, to be honest, that happens

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Speaker 2: a lot. It's maddening work for a variety of reasons.

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Speaker 2: But I kept coming across familiar names, familiar organizations, people

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Speaker 2: and places and things that I didn't expect to see

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Speaker 2: in this story, finding connections to past episodes and to

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Speaker 2: stories I haven't written yet. There's a psychological phenomenon called apophenia.

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Speaker 2: It's a tendency to see patterns where they don't exist,

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Speaker 2: to find connections between unrelated things, to see meaning in

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Speaker 2: random stimuli. In its most extreme, it can be a

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Speaker 2: symptom of mental illnesses like schizophrenia or obsessive compulsive disorder.

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Speaker 2: But you also see it on display in the writings

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Speaker 2: of conspiracy theorists, and you've definitely seen it at work

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Speaker 2: if you know someone with a gambling problem. But it's

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Speaker 2: a cognitive bias we all experience from time to time,

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Speaker 2: seeing shapes in the clouds, seeing a man in the moon,

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Speaker 2: finding meaning, and coincidentally looking at your watch at eleven eleven.

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Speaker 2: We all get a little apophenia now and then, and

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Speaker 2: it's something I try to be really vigilant about. Am

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Speaker 2: I seeing connections in my research because they're real, or

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Speaker 2: am I just getting that rush of recognition because at

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Speaker 2: this point I have at least a few pages of

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Speaker 2: notes on almost every prominent white supremacist active in the

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Speaker 2: United States for the last five decades, and everything just

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Speaker 2: feels a little familiar. And theirs really is a small world.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes the same guy pops up in a few seemingly

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Speaker 2: unrelated places, because there's only so many places for that

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Speaker 2: guy to be if he's been active in the movement

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Speaker 2: over the course of many years. I try to keep

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Speaker 2: that pretty front of mind so I don't drive myself

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Speaker 2: completely mad, you know, But sometimes sometimes it feels like

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Speaker 2: everything is connected because it is. It's not a coincidence.

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Speaker 2: It's not apophenia, it's not conspiratorial thinking. It's not my

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Speaker 2: mind finally buckling under the weight of the horrors. Sometimes

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Speaker 2: if you dig down deep enough, it's the same guy's

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Speaker 2: name on all the paperwork. Remember earlier this year when

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Speaker 2: I accidentally spent three months writing about white supremacist terrorism

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Speaker 2: and apartheid South Africa, if you can remember back that far.

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Speaker 2: Those episodes started with vignette about this series of rallies

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Speaker 2: held in twenty twelve, organized by Monica Huggett Stone's South

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Speaker 2: Africa Project. But the main rally, the big one, the

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Speaker 2: one in Sacramento, Monica wasn't actually there. The actual on

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Speaker 2: the ground organizers in Sacramento were the Golden State Skinheads,

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Speaker 2: the same group that originally approached William Daniel Johnson to

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Speaker 2: remake their Golden State Party into the American Third Position Party.

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Speaker 2: And here's Mike Myers, the leader of the Golden State Skinheads,

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Speaker 2: whose name is actually Michael SESAMs, taking credit for that

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Speaker 2: pro apartheid rally when he gave a speech at the

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Speaker 2: American Freedom Party conference a year later.

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Speaker 3: We've thrown rallies, filed for in game permits, and dealt

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Speaker 3: with the logistics of planning many successful protests, like the

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Speaker 3: National South Africa Project last year in Sacramento, the NTI

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Speaker 3: League Immigration protests in Sacramento this year. And that's a

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Speaker 3: nation about happy dozen or so other activism related events.

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Speaker 3: And just as pasture of the law.

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Speaker 2: And when I went back and looked at the pictures

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Speaker 2: of those rallies in twenty twelve, there's William Daniel Johnson

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Speaker 2: in photos of the South Africa Project rally held in

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Speaker 2: Los Angeles in February of twenty twelve. And it's no

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Speaker 2: coincidence that William Daniel Johnson was a member of the

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Speaker 2: board of directors at the Foundation for the Marketplace of Ideas,

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Speaker 2: a nonprofit founded by white supremacist lawyer Kyle Bristow with

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Speaker 2: the goal of being an ACLU for the alt right.

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Speaker 2: The foundation raised the money for the series of lawsuits

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Speaker 2: that Bristow filed against colleges and universities in twenty seventeen

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Speaker 2: to force them to allow Richard Spencer to speak on campus.

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Speaker 2: When that foundation fell apart, one of its other board members,

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Speaker 2: a man whose name you've heard before, Augustus solen Victus,

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Speaker 2: tried to start something similar, and he called it the

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Speaker 2: Conservative Legal Defense Fund. That too, is now defunct, But

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Speaker 2: the incorporation paperwork for that group shows that American Freedom

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Speaker 2: Party board members Jamie Kelso and William Daniel Johnson were

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Speaker 2: not only involved, but they were using Johnson's law office

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Speaker 2: as the mailing address. And it's no coincidence that Nathan

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Speaker 2: Dimigo was invited to speak at the party's conference earlier

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Speaker 2: this year. He actually got his start in organized racism

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Speaker 2: a decade ago as a member of the American Freedom Party.

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Speaker 2: Before he founded Identity Europa in twenty sixteen, he was

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Speaker 2: leading the American Freedom Party's short lived youth division, a

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Speaker 2: group called National Youth Front. Identity Europa didn't publicly maintain

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Speaker 2: ties to the American Freedom Party, but it does appear

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Speaker 2: to have originally just been a rebranding of National Youth

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Speaker 2: Front after a similarly named but not racist group threatened

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Speaker 2: to sue over the use of the name. And here's

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Speaker 2: Nathan Dimigo in December of twenty fifteen talking to Richard

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Speaker 2: Spencer about the upcoming launch of a renamed National Youth Front.

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Speaker 2: This is just three months before he re emerged as

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Speaker 2: the leader of Identity Europa.

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Speaker 4: We're going to be looking at relaunching in a few

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Speaker 4: months from now, and it's going to be, in a

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Speaker 4: way a much.

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Speaker 1: More mature organization.

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Speaker 4: It's going to be a European rights organization explicitly.

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Speaker 2: Nathan Dimigo's reappearance at this year's American Freedom Party conference

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Speaker 2: was a little bit of a surprise to me. He'd

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Speaker 2: mostly stepped back from active organizing since the twenty seventeen

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Speaker 2: United the Right rally. He filed for bankruptcy to try

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Speaker 2: to get out from under a lawsuit filed against him

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Speaker 2: and the other organizers of that deadly rally, but he

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Speaker 2: lost the lawsuit in twenty twenty one, and a bankruptcy

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Speaker 2: court ruled just last week that the judgment is not

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Speaker 2: dischargeable in his bankruptcy case. He is currently appealing that

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Speaker 2: decision with the help of movement lawyer Glen Allen. Glen Allen,

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Speaker 2: you may recall from the last episode, was the Nazi

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Speaker 2: lawyer who helped Merlin Miller start his American Eagle Party

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Speaker 2: after he left the American Freedom Party. And Nathan Dimigo

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Speaker 2: isn't the only Identity Europa member to resurface in connection

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Speaker 2: with the American Freedom Party. After Identity Europa collapsed for

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Speaker 2: good in twenty twenty, some former members were turned to

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Speaker 2: the group that spawneded, joining the American Freedom Party. Notably,

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Speaker 2: the party's current executive director is a former Identity Europa

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Speaker 2: member who calls himself John Fassbender. So there are a

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Speaker 2: lot of threads to pull here, and there's no way

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Speaker 2: to unravel the whole ball of yarn today. So I

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Speaker 2: suppose we should start with what the American Freedom Party

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Speaker 2: even is, or rather what it is not.

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Speaker 4: These views are not. They're not weird, they're not bad, right,

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Speaker 4: and they're held by totally normal people.

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Speaker 2: Okay, we're off to a bad start. That's the party's

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Speaker 2: executive director, John Fasspender, very unconvincingly claiming that they're not weird.

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Speaker 2: I don't buy it. But that's not the only lie

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Speaker 2: he tells on podcasts. The American Freedom Party is not

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Speaker 2: a duly registered national political party, and that's a very

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Speaker 2: specific claim that he makes in almost every interview. It

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Speaker 2: just isn't, but Fastpender is quite adamant that it is.

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Speaker 2: Here he is boasting about it to Macedonian nationalist podcaster

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Speaker 2: Nick Gilvie in late twenty twenty three.

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Speaker 4: In fact, we are currently the only registered political party

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Speaker 4: that expeuses pro wide views in the United States right now.

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Speaker 4: There are plenty of provide organizations, but they do not

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Speaker 4: have say, valid access, the ability to run candidates and

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Speaker 4: so on and so forth. So we take great pride

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Speaker 4: in that it is something we work tirelessly to maintain.

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Speaker 2: And when he went on Jilvi's show again in April

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Speaker 2: of twenty twenty four, he made the same claim.

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Speaker 4: Yes, we are a political party. We have gone through

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Speaker 4: the process we have registered.

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Speaker 5: We have obtained the necessary signatures to obtain valid access

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Speaker 5: in various states across the country.

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Speaker 2: Here's Fastbender telling Nazi podcaster Nick Gregory about it in

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Speaker 2: November of twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 4: The American Freedom Party is the only duly registered political

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Speaker 4: party in the United States that is with the ability

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Speaker 4: to run candidates that is to say, which represents pro

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Speaker 4: white ideals, that is to say, American nationalist principles, white identitarian ideals.

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Speaker 2: Back in twenty twenty two, a member of the party's

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Speaker 2: board told Ryan Sanchez, a Groper aligned Nazi podcaster who

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Speaker 2: calls himself the Culture War Criminal, that their status as

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Speaker 2: a federal political party did come with some downsides, like

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Speaker 2: an inability to accept large anonymous cryptocurrency donations, and as.

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Speaker 6: A registered political party with the Feral Elections Commission.

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Speaker 5: We.

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Speaker 6: Have some issues with crypto as well, in terms of

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Speaker 6: how much crypto we can take. So crypto is not

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Speaker 6: something we're doing right now directly through the party.

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Speaker 2: I know that's an important point. There are some pretty

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Speaker 2: specific rules, regulations, and laws about how a political party

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Speaker 2: handles money. I won't claim to know or understand all

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Speaker 2: of them. You can get pretty confusing, but surely the

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Speaker 2: guy running a political party would have a passing familiarity

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Speaker 2: with at least the broad strokes of how that sort

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Speaker 2: of thing works.

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Speaker 7: Right there. One question was what does it take to

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Speaker 7: register as a political party? Is the process complicated? And

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Speaker 7: then another person pointed out that part of the reason

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Speaker 7: of the LCD is that donations to parties are public record.

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Speaker 7: Do you have any comments on that, because I know

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Speaker 7: that's something that people talk about all the time. There

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Speaker 7: is the op SEC issue of like if I send

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Speaker 7: you the fifty dollars for the year membership, right, is

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Speaker 7: that publicly known?

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Speaker 4: Sure?

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Speaker 5: Well, I'll say this as far as you know the

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Speaker 5: accounting aspect of it, and as far as you know

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Speaker 5: how information is, what information is public record and what

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Speaker 5: information isn't. I couldn't give in accurate answer because it's

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Speaker 5: just not my my level of understanding on that end

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Speaker 5: of things in the party. Definitely, when it comes to

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Speaker 5: finances and so on, I'm pretty pretty much ignorant. That

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Speaker 5: being said, as far as you know sending in donations

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Speaker 5: and how it is to register as a political party,

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Speaker 5: first of all, it is there.

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Speaker 4: It is.

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Speaker 5: It is a bit complicated, you know, it does require

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Speaker 5: a lot of you.

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Speaker 4: Know, basically a lot of paperwork filing.

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Speaker 2: Oh dear. In May of twenty twenty three, the party's

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Speaker 2: executive director had no idea if membership dues are being

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Speaker 2: reported as donations to a political party. It doesn't sound

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Speaker 2: like he knows what, if any reporting is being done

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Speaker 2: at all, But he does know that, despite the immense

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Speaker 2: complexity of the paperwork, somebody definitely filed that paperwork that

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Speaker 2: makes them a real political party. And just one more,

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Speaker 2: This one is both very specific and extremely recent. Fassbender

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Speaker 2: was interviewed by a Canadian white nationalist and aspiring musician,

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Speaker 2: Steve Hansen, just a few weeks ago. There's no wiggle

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Speaker 2: room here, Fassbender clearly says, the organization is a federally

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Speaker 2: recognized political party.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and you know this is a federal political party, correct, Correct?

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Speaker 2: But like I said, no, they're not. I'll admit to

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Speaker 2: you right now, I don't know how to run a

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Speaker 2: political party either, but I didn't put my face on

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Speaker 2: a website claiming to, so I think we can all

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Speaker 2: agree to cut me some slack on the subject. To

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Speaker 2: be recognized as a political party, you have to register

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Speaker 2: for state and local elections that may just be at

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Speaker 2: the state level, and the rules in every state are different.

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Speaker 2: There are certain activities and fundraising thresholds where a state

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Speaker 2: level party committee may have to register with the Federal

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Speaker 2: Election Commission, but honestly I don't care enough to find

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Speaker 2: out more about that. And of course, to be a

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Speaker 2: political party at the national level, well, you've got a

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Speaker 2: file paperwork with the Federal Election Commission and they did try.

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Speaker 2: I mean, anyone can fill out a form and send

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Speaker 2: in a piece of paper. That doesn't mean it worked.

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Speaker 2: Someone filed paperwork with the Federal Election Commission last month

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Speaker 2: to form the American Fart Party, along with paperwork for

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Speaker 2: a Fart Party candidate committee running for Senate in Iowa.

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Speaker 2: That doesn't mean that the Fart Party is real. It

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Speaker 2: just means technically somebody committed a federal crime, although it's

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Speaker 2: extremely unlikely to be prosecuted. The Fart Party was obviously

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Speaker 2: someone's idea of a joke that's actually really common. The

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Speaker 2: FEC receives mountains of prank filings every year. They revised

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Speaker 2: the rules in twenty sixteen just to make it a

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Speaker 2: little bit easier to throw away the ones that were

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Speaker 2: obviously and intentionally fictitious. They're a wreck high number of

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Speaker 2: fake filings that election cycle. A teenager in Iowa who

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Speaker 2: filed a statement of candidacy for D's Nuts told ABC

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Speaker 2: News in twenty sixteen, one of the main reasons that

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Speaker 2: I ultimately filed was because I found out they had

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Speaker 2: little staff, resources or authority, and we're supposed to trust

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Speaker 2: these guys with our elections. I have made it public

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Speaker 2: that I've withdrawn from the race, but I do not

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Speaker 2: apologize for what I did. The FEC is vastly underfunded,

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Speaker 2: and while it seems like I have a burning hatred

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Speaker 2: of the FEC, I actually support the FAC getting additional funding.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, dse Nuts. And like I said, it is

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Speaker 2: technically against the law to knowingly file paperwork with the

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Speaker 2: Federal Election Commission that contains false or fictitious information, but

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Speaker 2: enforcement is vanishingly rare. Investigations tend to be limited to

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Speaker 2: high profile incidents involving real people, like fake paperwork filed

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Speaker 2: in twenty twenty claiming to be authorized by Kanye West. So,

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Speaker 2: whether it's an obvious joke like the Fart Party, or

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Speaker 2: someone who just honestly doesn't know what they're doing, like

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Speaker 2: the American Freedom Party. Someone at the Federal Election Commission

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Speaker 2: is reading every piece of paperwork that gets filed. They're understaffed, underfunded,

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Speaker 2: under resourced in every way imaginable. But they process the

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Speaker 2: paperwork and when the paperwork is inadequate, they send back

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Speaker 2: something called a Request for Additional Information an RFAI. It's

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Speaker 2: a form letter. It's not really personalized, but there's a

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Speaker 2: little bit of text in there explaining exactly what was

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Speaker 2: in SIFIA about your filing. Maybe the committee treasurer forgot

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Speaker 2: to sign it. Maybe the number at the bottom of

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Speaker 2: a column of dollar amounts isn't the correct sum. Maybe

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Speaker 2: they just don't think your name is really Jesus Christ

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Speaker 2: or Forrest Gump, whatever it is. You'll get the RFAI

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Speaker 2: and then you have a chance to file a corrected form.

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Speaker 2: Back in twenty twelve, when Merlin Miller was running for

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Speaker 2: president on the party's ticket, they did file some paperwork.

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Speaker 2: In April of that year, party chairman William Daniel Johnson

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Speaker 2: filled out FEC Form one, the form for a statement

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Speaker 2: of organization for a committee. Now remember back then they

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Speaker 2: were called the American Third Position Party, So he's filling

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Speaker 2: out this form as the American third position National Committee,

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Speaker 2: things started to go arrived. By page two, there are

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Speaker 2: checkboxes for different types of committees. Is this a party committee,

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Speaker 2: a candidate committee. If it's a candidate committee, is it

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Speaker 2: the candidate's principal fundraising committee? Is it a political action committee.

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Speaker 2: You have to choose, and you can only choose one.

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Speaker 2: Johnson checked too many boxes. It took the FEC about

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Speaker 2: two months to get back to him, but the letter

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Speaker 2: offered some helpful clarification about which boxes you might check

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Speaker 2: in different circumstances and explain that you can't check all

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Speaker 2: of them, and it also referred him to the relevant

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Speaker 2: federal regulations. Johnson then filed a corrected form indicating that yes,

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Speaker 2: he was trying to form a national party committee. So

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Speaker 2: that's it, right, he did it. He filled it out right,

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Speaker 2: not quite. Now that the form is properly filled out,

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Speaker 2: it can actually be evaluated on the merits. And it

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Speaker 2: turns out you can't just get a party started by

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Speaker 2: filling out a form. The fart party's paperwork was filed,

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Speaker 2: but it's going to get thrown out. Filling out a

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Speaker 2: form isn't a golden ticket to party recognition, and the

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Speaker 2: Federal Election Commission makes the final call on whether an

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Speaker 2: organization has done enough political party stuff to be considered

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Speaker 2: a political party, things like do they engage in voter

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Speaker 2: registration drives? Do they have a national headquarters and state

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Speaker 2: party committees? Do they hold a national convention? Are they

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Speaker 2: actively seeking and successfully getting ballot access in multiple states

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Speaker 2: for multiple candidates for office other than just the presidency.

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Speaker 2: There's no room for any of that on the form, obviously,

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Speaker 2: So in order to be recognized as a national party committee,

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Speaker 2: you have to formally request something called an advisory opinion

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Speaker 2: from the Federal Election Commission. According to the FEC, quote,

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Speaker 2: advisory opinions are official commission responses to questions about how

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Speaker 2: federal campaign finance law applies to specific factual situations. From

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Speaker 2: the web page about the advisory opinion process quote. Anyone

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Speaker 2: may request an advisory opinion as long as the request

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Speaker 2: is affected by the question he or she presents a

359
00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 2: requestor cannot ask for an advisory opinion about someone else's activities,

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Speaker 2: hypothetical situations, or general questions of law. Advisory opinion requests

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00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:40,159
Speaker 2: must be in writing. The request must include a complete

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Speaker 2: description of all facts relevant to the specific transaction or activity,

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00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:51,760
Speaker 2: and they're all a public record. The FEC's website has

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Speaker 2: a searchable database of every advisory opinion since nineteen seventy five.

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Speaker 2: The Commission informed the American Free and Party in July

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Speaker 2: of twenty twelve that they would need to get an

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Speaker 2: advisory opinion before calling themselves a national party committee, and

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Speaker 2: William Daniel Johnson wrote back in September of twenty twelve

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Speaker 2: that he had requested one and he was just waiting

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Speaker 2: for a decision. But there's no official record that any

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Speaker 2: opinion was ever sought by anyone involved. I searched every

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Speaker 2: combination of words and names. I downloaded a spreadsheet that

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Speaker 2: almost crashed my computer. I looked at every request filed

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Speaker 2: since twenty ten, just to be safe. It's not there.

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Speaker 2: It's possible Johnson made some kind of attempt, like maybe

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Speaker 2: he did write a letter saying make me a party.

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Speaker 2: But again, the request must include a complete description of

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Speaker 2: all facts relevant to the specific transaction or activity, and

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00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:04,800
Speaker 2: the database doesn't include requests that were insufficient for consideration.

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00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 2: So maybe he thinks he asked for an advisory opinion,

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00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:13,119
Speaker 2: but according to the official record, no, he did not.

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Speaker 2: But like I said, the FEC doesn't really have the

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00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:22,960
Speaker 2: resources to chase down every piece of non compliant paperwork.

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Speaker 2: The American Freedom Party continued to file as though they

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Speaker 2: were a national party committee, but they weren't actually raising

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00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:35,879
Speaker 2: any money at least not that they really reported. And

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00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:40,399
Speaker 2: they were kind of halfheartedly running candidates for president in

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Speaker 2: twenty sixteen, but their paperwork was a mess, and they

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00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:48,480
Speaker 2: weren't doing the work to actually get those candidates on ballots.

390
00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:53,520
Speaker 2: I mean, forget trying to convince the voters. The party

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00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:56,480
Speaker 2: couldn't even convince their own candidates to stay in the

392
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Speaker 2: race or the party. Their initial nominee was a man

393
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Speaker 2: named Ken Givedden, but he dropped out in July of

394
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Speaker 2: twenty fifteen, just a few months after being nominated. The

395
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:12,199
Speaker 2: man they'd picked as his VP, Bob Whittaker, stepped up

396
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 2: to take the presidential nomination, but he quit too in

397
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Speaker 2: April of twenty sixteen. He was mad that the party

398
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Speaker 2: was pouring money into a political action committee to pay

399
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:28,960
Speaker 2: for racist robocalls supporting Donald Trump. Bob Whitaker also died

400
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 2: at age seventy six not long after this, so maybe

401
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:35,960
Speaker 2: he just didn't have the stamina. The next candidate on

402
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:40,360
Speaker 2: the list was Tom Bowie. You might actually remember him

403
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:43,719
Speaker 2: from some viral YouTube videos a few years back in

404
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:47,360
Speaker 2: which he proudly accepts the title of most racist man

405
00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:52,560
Speaker 2: in America. There's no evidence that his campaign ever raised

406
00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:56,960
Speaker 2: or spent any money at all, so as far as

407
00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:01,600
Speaker 2: expending their limited enforcement resources, it was probably just not

408
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:06,240
Speaker 2: worthwhile for the Federal Election Commission to follow up unless

409
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:10,640
Speaker 2: and until there was any actual possibility of this party

410
00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:16,320
Speaker 2: being meaningfully engaged in anything you could consider actual electoral activity,

411
00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 2: So they just kept filling out their paperwork wrong and

412
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:26,240
Speaker 2: filing it. In twenty nineteen, the party was gearing up

413
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:31,120
Speaker 2: for the twenty twenty presidential election. The candidate they chose

414
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 2: this time around was a Christian identity pastor in Tennessee

415
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:38,840
Speaker 2: named Rick Tyler. Tyler had run for office a handful

416
00:29:38,920 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 2: of times before, never receiving more than a few thousand votes,

417
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 2: but hope springs eternal, I guess. He announced his candidacy

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00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:50,360
Speaker 2: in May of twenty nineteen in a speech at the

419
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 2: University of Tennessee. The university was very clear with the

420
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 2: press at the time that no one invited Rick Tyler

421
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 2: to speak on campus. He had simply rented out the

422
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 2: alumni hall, which is something any member of the public

423
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 2: can do, and the university had no legal avenue to

424
00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 2: refuse to rent it to him. Shortly before Rick Tyler's

425
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:18,160
Speaker 2: poorly attended and heavily protested announcement in Tennessee, William Daniel

426
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:22,719
Speaker 2: Johnson wrote a letter to the Federal Election Commission kind of.

427
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 2: He filed an amended statement of organization for the party

428
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:32,440
Speaker 2: that FEC Form one, but stapled to the front of

429
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:37,440
Speaker 2: the form, he attached a letter. I don't think that's

430
00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:41,080
Speaker 2: an accepted form of communication with the Federal Election Commission.

431
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 2: I don't think they'll reply to your letter if you

432
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:49,480
Speaker 2: just staple it to a form, But he tried, and

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00:30:49,520 --> 00:30:55,280
Speaker 2: the letter reads as follows. Gentlemen, the requests of this

434
00:30:55,360 --> 00:30:58,680
Speaker 2: correspondence are made in conformity with the Freedom of Information

435
00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 2: Act USC Paragraph five to five to two, in accordance

436
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 2: with which obligation of response is twenty days. The American

437
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,760
Speaker 2: Freedom Party will be applying for FEC certification as a

438
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:13,360
Speaker 2: political party for the United States of America. In order

439
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 2: for the party to meet FEC legal requirements for certification,

440
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:20,440
Speaker 2: we require the FEC to forward to US post haste

441
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:24,240
Speaker 2: within the twenty days as allocated by statute the exact

442
00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:27,800
Speaker 2: requirements necessary to comply for FEC full certification for the

443
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:31,760
Speaker 2: twenty twenty election cycle. We request that the provided FEC

444
00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 2: requirements as provided by the FEC be irrevocable and be

445
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 2: used and applied to all applying or already approved political

446
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:44,840
Speaker 2: parties equally for the twenty twenty presidential election cycle. That's

447
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 2: definitely not how it works. The Federal Election Commission doesn't

448
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 2: do that. You can't just write to them and ask

449
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 2: them open ended questions about how you should be doing

450
00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:03,280
Speaker 2: election stuff. Besides, why didn't he just google it or

451
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:09,640
Speaker 2: hire a political consultant and didn't he already know the answer? Remember,

452
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:14,000
Speaker 2: back in twenty twelve, seven years before this, they sent

453
00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:18,320
Speaker 2: him a letter about the requirements he needs to get

454
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 2: an advisory opinion, and he claimed he was working on it.

455
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 2: The rules had not changed in those seven years. I'm

456
00:32:26,800 --> 00:32:30,960
Speaker 2: not sure the FEC replied to his letter, though they did,

457
00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:34,880
Speaker 2: however a few months later send another request for Additional

458
00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:39,040
Speaker 2: information letter, again informing the organization that what they need

459
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:42,760
Speaker 2: to do is get an advisory opinion before they can

460
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:48,120
Speaker 2: be considered a national party committee and Johnson again used

461
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:52,440
Speaker 2: the Federal Election Commission electronic filing system to send them

462
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:58,320
Speaker 2: a letter, so his letter is preserved in the committee's filings,

463
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:04,720
Speaker 2: and he wrote, I don't understand what you request. We

464
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 2: only take in under ten thousand dollars per year. Do

465
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 2: we need to petition the Commission for an advisory opinion?

466
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,560
Speaker 2: Should we check a different box on our forms or

467
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:19,960
Speaker 2: use different forms we file Form three X. Your letter

468
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:24,160
Speaker 2: threatens enforcement action if our response is not adequate. I

469
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,360
Speaker 2: don't want that, but I don't understand what the issue is.

470
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 2: And then shortly after he filed that letter, they just

471
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 2: stopped filing entirely, probably in part because they were feeling

472
00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:42,800
Speaker 2: discouraged by their paperwork problems and they weren't actually raising

473
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:47,480
Speaker 2: any money to report. But also their candidate got arrested

474
00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 2: for tax evasion, so maybe their hearts just weren't in

475
00:33:50,840 --> 00:34:07,720
Speaker 2: it anymore. But I just can't wrap my head around

476
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:12,680
Speaker 2: Johnson's confusion here. The guidance available on the FEC's website

477
00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 2: is clear enough. He had been personally and directly notified

478
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:21,360
Speaker 2: about the need to request an advisory opinion back in

479
00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 2: twenty twelve. He even claimed to have done it so

480
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:30,360
Speaker 2: obviously he knew he needed to do it. But the

481
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:34,959
Speaker 2: most galling thing about this feigned ignorance is he knows

482
00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:39,400
Speaker 2: someone who knows how to do this. This isn't foreign territory.

483
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:44,120
Speaker 2: When I was looking through the database of advisory opinions,

484
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 2: I looked specifically for any opinion on this particular subject,

485
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:52,240
Speaker 2: some kind of third party group trying to get recognition

486
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:55,680
Speaker 2: as a national political party. I wanted to see what

487
00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 2: those requests look like, how often this is happening, and

488
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 2: how the federal allow commissions evaluating them. The Green Party's

489
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 2: request was initially denied in nineteen ninety six, but when

490
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:09,800
Speaker 2: they reapplied in two thousand and one, they were granted

491
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:14,080
Speaker 2: national party status. The Reform Party went through the process

492
00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 2: in nineteen ninety eight. The Constitution Party, which was originally

493
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 2: called the US Taxpayers Party, was denied in nineteen ninety two,

494
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:24,680
Speaker 2: but tried again in nineteen ninety five and gained party status.

495
00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:30,279
Speaker 2: So I'm flipping through these opinions and these applications, and

496
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:34,160
Speaker 2: it's clear that the American Freedom Party wouldn't qualify even

497
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:37,960
Speaker 2: if they had tried, But they could have at least

498
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 2: looked to these past applications to see how they were

499
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:44,440
Speaker 2: supposed to structure this and what kinds of party activities

500
00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:49,480
Speaker 2: they should be aiming for if they wanted to qualify.

501
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:52,680
Speaker 2: But maybe William Daniel Johnson didn't think to search the

502
00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:58,239
Speaker 2: database for inspiration. But why didn't he just ask the

503
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:03,399
Speaker 2: party's executive director, Not John Fasspender. He's still thinking high

504
00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 2: school at this point. But from twenty ten to twenty fourteen,

505
00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:11,800
Speaker 2: the American Freedom Party's executive director was a man named

506
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 2: Don Wassell, and from nineteen eighty seven until nineteen ninety five,

507
00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:22,200
Speaker 2: Don Wassell was the executive director of another party, the

508
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:27,279
Speaker 2: Populist Party. When the Populist Party ran David Duke for

509
00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:32,480
Speaker 2: president in nineteen eighty eight, Don Wassell submitted the party's

510
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:37,480
Speaker 2: request for an advisory opinion. So in twenty twelve when

511
00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:40,920
Speaker 2: the party got that letter, why was it a shock?

512
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 2: I mean, the Populist Party didn't get national party status.

513
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 2: So I'm not saying Wassall would have been good at it,

514
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:51,520
Speaker 2: or that he would have succeeded, but it does at

515
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:55,480
Speaker 2: least appear as though he successfully stated the party's case

516
00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:58,919
Speaker 2: to the degree that was possible. In nineteen eighty eight,

517
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 2: and that's something Johnson doesn't seem to have even tried

518
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 2: to do. By the end of the summer of twenty twenty,

519
00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 2: the American Freedom Party had voluntarily terminated their committee with

520
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 2: the Federal Election Commission, and they've never refiled. There is

521
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 2: no currently active committee associated with that name, nor any

522
00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:24,680
Speaker 2: committee I can find associated with the names of any

523
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:28,879
Speaker 2: current or former member of their Board of directors. They

524
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:32,880
Speaker 2: never successfully gained federal recognition as a national party, but

525
00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:36,080
Speaker 2: at least until twenty twenty, they could point to those

526
00:37:36,160 --> 00:37:42,839
Speaker 2: forms and pretend now they're not even trying. I guess

527
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:45,919
Speaker 2: it is possible that Fassbender is telling the truth about

528
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:51,800
Speaker 2: gaining ballot access or party recognition in individual states, although

529
00:37:51,840 --> 00:37:55,000
Speaker 2: I can find no evidence of it, and he never

530
00:37:55,040 --> 00:38:00,480
Speaker 2: says which states. Every state has its own rules, and

531
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 2: they don't all have good websites. But I dug around

532
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:07,239
Speaker 2: on the Board of Election site for a dozen or

533
00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:09,840
Speaker 2: so states that I believe they have some connection to,

534
00:38:11,520 --> 00:38:18,000
Speaker 2: and I couldn't find anything recent. In California, the only

535
00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:21,000
Speaker 2: state that has easily searchable records of all requests file

536
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:25,000
Speaker 2: with the state for party status, they only ever tried

537
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 2: once in twenty fifteen, in California, a party attempting to

538
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:35,239
Speaker 2: qualify for recognition has to submit signed affidavits from zero

539
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 2: point thirty three percent of the total number of registered

540
00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:42,759
Speaker 2: voters in the state. So in twenty sixteen that would

541
00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:48,560
Speaker 2: have meant around fifty seven thousand signatures. They submitted five,

542
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:55,640
Speaker 2: not five thousand, not five hundred. Literally one two three

543
00:38:55,760 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 2: four five they got five signatures. So even though I

544
00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:05,640
Speaker 2: don't have numbers that detailed from other states, there's no

545
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:09,360
Speaker 2: state whose rules would reward that level of effort. Every

546
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:13,480
Speaker 2: state requires at least some thousands of signatures, even the Dakotas.

547
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:20,280
Speaker 2: The American Freedom Party doesn't even have a corporate entity

548
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:24,799
Speaker 2: behind it anymore. The party incorporated in North Dakota in

549
00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:29,360
Speaker 2: twenty seventeen, but board member Jamie Kelso stopped filing the

550
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:32,560
Speaker 2: paperwork in twenty nineteen, and the state dissolved the corporation

551
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:37,279
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty one. The California brand that Johnson incorporated

552
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:40,640
Speaker 2: in twenty nineteen was forfeited in twenty twenty for a

553
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 2: failure to file reports. They very recently updated their membership

554
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:50,600
Speaker 2: application page, removing any clear reference to how much it

555
00:39:50,719 --> 00:39:55,200
Speaker 2: costs or how you can make that payment, but until

556
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:58,600
Speaker 2: June of twenty twenty five, the website instructed applicants to

557
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:02,160
Speaker 2: mail a check for fifty do to a UPS store

558
00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:07,120
Speaker 2: mailbox in New York City. They don't sell shirts or

559
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:12,319
Speaker 2: stickers or hats. You can't pay online, you can't make

560
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:18,080
Speaker 2: a donation. They aren't even asking for money, which seems

561
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:22,000
Speaker 2: hard to believe. But I looked everywhere. Aside from that

562
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:25,399
Speaker 2: recently removed page on the website with instructions to make

563
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:29,600
Speaker 2: checks out to the American Freedom Party, there's no publicly

564
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:32,319
Speaker 2: visible information about how you could give them money, even

565
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:36,040
Speaker 2: if you wanted to, And that seems like it would

566
00:40:36,040 --> 00:40:39,000
Speaker 2: be a pretty big problem. How can you expect to

567
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:41,520
Speaker 2: recruit younger members if the only way to get involved

568
00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:45,240
Speaker 2: is to mail a paper check. That's a real barrier

569
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:49,680
Speaker 2: to entry in the twenty first century. But maybe the

570
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:53,520
Speaker 2: logistics aren't a big deal because there aren't very many

571
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:58,200
Speaker 2: members even trying to pay those dues. They don't hold

572
00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:00,919
Speaker 2: public events, so there's there's no way to even guess

573
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:05,040
Speaker 2: how many members they might have. The group's channel on

574
00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:08,319
Speaker 2: the messaging app Telegram has about three thousand members, but

575
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:14,439
Speaker 2: that has almost no correlation to actual group membership. Patriot Front,

576
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:19,239
Speaker 2: for example, has seventeen thousand followers on Telegram and probably

577
00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 2: just a few hundred members nationwide. In twenty twenty two,

578
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:28,480
Speaker 2: John Fassbender claimed that membership was growing at quote an

579
00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:34,560
Speaker 2: alarming rate, but he wouldn't give a number. Charles Lincoln II,

580
00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:38,320
Speaker 2: a disbarred attorney who's occasionally listed on the party's FEC

581
00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:42,080
Speaker 2: filings as their treasurer, said in a live stream last

582
00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:44,840
Speaker 2: year that he'd been involved with the party since its founding,

583
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:47,960
Speaker 2: and he'd actually just come from a board meeting earlier

584
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 2: that day, but he had no idea how many members

585
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:53,320
Speaker 2: the group might have.

586
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:59,040
Speaker 1: AFP. I don't know how to introduce the AFP except

587
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:05,000
Speaker 1: it's a very small It's basically the board and a

588
00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:08,080
Speaker 1: few members Beside the board. I don't know what our

589
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:08,840
Speaker 1: membership is.

590
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:15,000
Speaker 2: Not only can he not even begin to guess how

591
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:20,000
Speaker 2: many members there might be, He's never met one. They

592
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:21,320
Speaker 2: might not exist.

593
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:26,120
Speaker 1: Again. I can speak mostly for the board rather than

594
00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:29,080
Speaker 1: the membership. I don't really know any members who are

595
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:32,840
Speaker 1: not members of the board.

596
00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:39,280
Speaker 2: This was in February of twenty twenty four. Lincoln claims

597
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:43,799
Speaker 2: to have been involved with the organization for fourteen years,

598
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:48,600
Speaker 2: he's attending board meetings, he was responsible for the party's

599
00:42:48,680 --> 00:42:50,960
Speaker 2: campaign finance reports when they were trying to run a

600
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:56,720
Speaker 2: candidate for president, and he's never actually met a member

601
00:42:56,760 --> 00:43:02,239
Speaker 2: of the party aside from the board of directors. In

602
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,040
Speaker 2: another one of Lincoln's streams that same month, he had

603
00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:08,880
Speaker 2: party chairman William Daniel Johnson on and he characterized the

604
00:43:08,920 --> 00:43:12,960
Speaker 2: number of members only as quote, not a whole lot.

605
00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 2: So they're not really running candidates, they're not really registered

606
00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:26,000
Speaker 2: as a political party. They don't want your money. And

607
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:28,480
Speaker 2: their own chairman said last year that there aren't very

608
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:34,960
Speaker 2: many members, So what are they doing. I listened to

609
00:43:35,080 --> 00:43:38,080
Speaker 2: every crumb of audio I could find from the last

610
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:42,719
Speaker 2: four years. There's not a ton, but it's still more

611
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:46,719
Speaker 2: than I would have preferred to listen to. The party

612
00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:50,560
Speaker 2: went sort of dormant in twenty twenty after they terminated

613
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:54,120
Speaker 2: their committee with the FEC, their presidential candidate got arrested,

614
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 2: and their corporate entity was involuntarily dissolved. They didn't do

615
00:43:58,680 --> 00:44:02,680
Speaker 2: much for a while. In the fall of twenty twenty one,

616
00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 2: they were ready to announce to the world that they

617
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:07,440
Speaker 2: were back from their hiatus.

618
00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:12,279
Speaker 4: The reason being is We've been on a hiatus for

619
00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:15,880
Speaker 4: a long time now, while we completely overhauled and relaunched

620
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:19,320
Speaker 4: the party, it is completely unrecognizable from what it was

621
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:19,959
Speaker 4: a year ago.

622
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:27,640
Speaker 2: Well maybe not the world, but a conference room full

623
00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:31,920
Speaker 2: of racists attending the American Renaissance anual conference. Anyway, the

624
00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:34,800
Speaker 2: group had a new website, a couple new board members

625
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:40,120
Speaker 2: under forty and they were ready to try again. I

626
00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:44,520
Speaker 2: felt like I was missing something. I kept triple checking

627
00:44:44,520 --> 00:44:47,480
Speaker 2: the dates on these videos because it just didn't make

628
00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:52,279
Speaker 2: any sense. From the fall of twenty twenty one through

629
00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:57,000
Speaker 2: interviews recorded this year in twenty twenty five, they seem

630
00:44:57,080 --> 00:45:02,359
Speaker 2: to be just constantly announcing that they're it's happening any

631
00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:05,360
Speaker 2: day now. We're just about to announce something new and exciting.

632
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:08,040
Speaker 2: We're back from our hiatus. You haven't seen us in years,

633
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:14,640
Speaker 2: and we're back now, and it never happens. In two

634
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:18,880
Speaker 2: interviews given over a year apart, Fastbender boasts that the

635
00:45:18,920 --> 00:45:23,360
Speaker 2: party is just about to launch a nationwide campus organization,

636
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 2: a wing of the party for college students. The plan

637
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 2: was so close to being implemented three years ago. The

638
00:45:33,680 --> 00:45:36,120
Speaker 2: website hasn't had a new article at almost a year

639
00:45:37,480 --> 00:45:40,440
Speaker 2: They sometimes have a Twitter account, but it keeps getting

640
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:44,800
Speaker 2: banned for hate speech. They hid information about their national

641
00:45:44,800 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 2: convention behind a password on the website and never publicly

642
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:52,719
Speaker 2: posted any information about how an interested prospective member might

643
00:45:52,760 --> 00:45:59,000
Speaker 2: inquire about attending. That's not how political parties behave, but

644
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:02,400
Speaker 2: it isn't out of step with the standard mo of

645
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:05,960
Speaker 2: a group whose members don't want to be publicly associated

646
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:11,000
Speaker 2: with it. Their executive director isn't even using his real name.

647
00:46:12,239 --> 00:46:16,160
Speaker 2: Jonathan Magnano started using the name Johann Fassbender in twenty

648
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:22,800
Speaker 2: eighteen in private chats for Identity Europa members. And aside

649
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:25,840
Speaker 2: from that smattering of candidates in the twenty tens, you

650
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:29,319
Speaker 2: know Merlin Miller in twenty twelve, Harry Bertram for some

651
00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:32,920
Speaker 2: state level offices in West Virginia twenty eleven, twenty twelve,

652
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:37,880
Speaker 2: that disastrous revolving door of candidates for president in twenty sixteen.

653
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:44,719
Speaker 2: The party doesn't really run candidates. Most of the campaigns

654
00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:49,320
Speaker 2: publicly associated with the party aren't even on the ballot

655
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:52,960
Speaker 2: as American Freedom Party candidates, if they got on the

656
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:57,719
Speaker 2: ballot at all. Current party chairman Ralph Brandt tried to

657
00:46:57,760 --> 00:47:00,440
Speaker 2: run for city Council in Mesa, Arizona, and twenty tive twelve,

658
00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:04,640
Speaker 2: but he failed to collect the two hundred and thirty

659
00:47:04,719 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 2: three signatures required to get his name on the ballot.

660
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 2: When Harry Bertram ran for office in West Virginia, he

661
00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:15,839
Speaker 2: was usually just listed on the ballot as an independent

662
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:20,759
Speaker 2: candidate and instead of receiving funds labeled as being from

663
00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:24,960
Speaker 2: his party. One significant cash and fusion related to Bertram's

664
00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:30,080
Speaker 2: twenty eleven campaign came in as an independent expenditure from

665
00:47:30,080 --> 00:47:35,680
Speaker 2: the party's chairman in his personal capacity, which, again, I

666
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:39,000
Speaker 2: don't know a lot about elections, but that doesn't seem

667
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:42,160
Speaker 2: entirely in line with my understanding of campaign finance law.

668
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:49,360
Speaker 2: I can't actually find anyone publicly claiming to be running

669
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:52,640
Speaker 2: as a member of the American Freedom Party at any

670
00:47:52,680 --> 00:47:56,600
Speaker 2: time in any place in the last five years since

671
00:47:56,640 --> 00:48:02,800
Speaker 2: their big relaunch and recommitment, but Fastpender is constantly claiming

672
00:48:02,840 --> 00:48:06,879
Speaker 2: it's happening. He just can't tell you who the candidates are,

673
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:11,560
Speaker 2: or where they live, or what they're running for. So

674
00:48:11,600 --> 00:48:17,960
Speaker 2: the party is fielding candidates, but only secretly. When he

675
00:48:18,040 --> 00:48:21,640
Speaker 2: was asked last month how many candidates the party ran

676
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:25,799
Speaker 2: in the most recent election cycle, he finally gave a number.

677
00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:35,320
Speaker 4: Three, so we had three. Typically, the AFP holds our

678
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:39,359
Speaker 4: candidates identities and their ties to the party relatively close

679
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:41,320
Speaker 4: for obvious reasons, because.

680
00:48:41,520 --> 00:48:42,000
Speaker 3: No, we don't.

681
00:48:42,040 --> 00:48:44,280
Speaker 4: That's not to say that we don't run some candidates

682
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:47,040
Speaker 4: very openly as AFP, though we do. There's stratton, there's

683
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:49,640
Speaker 4: validity in both. But as far as we're concerned, it's

684
00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:53,239
Speaker 4: about winning first and foremost. If you need to run

685
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:56,040
Speaker 4: as a Democrat in an area, run as a Democrat.

686
00:48:56,080 --> 00:48:57,759
Speaker 4: If you need to run as a Republican, run as

687
00:48:57,760 --> 00:49:00,480
Speaker 4: a Republican. If the viability is they are to run

688
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:04,200
Speaker 4: as the American Freedom Party openly, run as the American

689
00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:08,840
Speaker 4: Freedom Party.

690
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:12,040
Speaker 2: So what does it mean to be a political party

691
00:49:13,120 --> 00:49:17,760
Speaker 2: If you can't accept or spend money. The board members

692
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:20,640
Speaker 2: don't even know if there are members of the party,

693
00:49:21,440 --> 00:49:24,880
Speaker 2: and it's so toxic to be associated with the brand

694
00:49:24,960 --> 00:49:29,080
Speaker 2: that you can't even say the names of your own candidates,

695
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:35,120
Speaker 2: In what way is that a political party? Honestly, I

696
00:49:35,120 --> 00:49:39,040
Speaker 2: don't know. I'm trying so hard to figure out some

697
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:41,600
Speaker 2: kind of plausible theory of what's going on here to

698
00:49:41,640 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 2: offer you, because usually the answer is grift, plain and simple.

699
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:53,160
Speaker 2: But they aren't asking for money. I don't get it.

700
00:49:55,120 --> 00:49:57,600
Speaker 2: The party does seem to be making another attempt to

701
00:49:57,640 --> 00:50:02,239
Speaker 2: move forward a national convention in March of this year,

702
00:50:03,640 --> 00:50:06,880
Speaker 2: again because they can't convince their own members to publicly

703
00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:10,680
Speaker 2: associate with the party. Even the very limited number of

704
00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:14,200
Speaker 2: carefully curated photos of the event have all of the

705
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:19,520
Speaker 2: attendee's faces blurret out. On social media. They posted videos

706
00:50:19,520 --> 00:50:23,719
Speaker 2: of just four speakers, and none of those speakers are

707
00:50:23,719 --> 00:50:28,360
Speaker 2: in the party leadership, at least not publicly. There's no

708
00:50:28,440 --> 00:50:34,560
Speaker 2: indication that they're current chairman Ralph Brandt even attended. It's

709
00:50:34,600 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 2: not who was missing that really intrigued me, though, it's

710
00:50:38,200 --> 00:50:42,400
Speaker 2: who was there. The keynote speaker at the party's convention

711
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:47,000
Speaker 2: wasn't a member of the board of directors. It wasn't

712
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:50,560
Speaker 2: a past or current candidate for office on the party's ticket.

713
00:50:52,120 --> 00:50:57,440
Speaker 2: It was Thomas Rousseau, the leader of Patriot Front. I

714
00:50:57,719 --> 00:50:59,920
Speaker 2: couldn't tell you how many members of the American Free

715
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:04,080
Speaker 2: Edom Party attended the convention, but photos show a contingent

716
00:51:04,120 --> 00:51:10,640
Speaker 2: of about a dozen members of Patriot Front. In December

717
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 2: of twenty twenty four, just a few months before that convention,

718
00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:17,440
Speaker 2: in March, the American Freedom Party issued an official statement

719
00:51:17,640 --> 00:51:21,719
Speaker 2: endorsing Patriot Front, declaring their values to be in seamless

720
00:51:21,719 --> 00:51:25,040
Speaker 2: harmony and pledging to stand shoulder to shoulder united by

721
00:51:25,040 --> 00:51:30,960
Speaker 2: their shared vision. This is perhaps a return to their roots.

722
00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:34,920
Speaker 2: The party originally grew out of a group of skinheads

723
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 2: trying to find a way to look legitimate. The white

724
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:43,799
Speaker 2: power movement has always had suits and boots. That is

725
00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:48,919
Speaker 2: your respectable intellectual types, your Richard Spencer, dapper Nazi kind

726
00:51:48,920 --> 00:51:51,680
Speaker 2: of guys, your hotel conference rooms full of middle aged

727
00:51:51,719 --> 00:51:54,400
Speaker 2: men watching a PowerPoint about the genetic superiority of the

728
00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:59,760
Speaker 2: Aryan race. Then it has their counterparts, the street fighters,

729
00:52:00,560 --> 00:52:03,799
Speaker 2: the black shirts, the men who hide their faces and

730
00:52:03,800 --> 00:52:09,040
Speaker 2: wrap their knuckles. The two groups often find themselves at odds,

731
00:52:09,239 --> 00:52:14,279
Speaker 2: disagreeing about tactics and optics, but they need each other

732
00:52:15,600 --> 00:52:19,440
Speaker 2: and they know it all the way Back in twenty

733
00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:24,000
Speaker 2: thirteen at the American Freedom Party conference, board member Tom

734
00:52:24,040 --> 00:52:26,880
Speaker 2: Sunich stood up to say something after the leader of

735
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:28,960
Speaker 2: the Golden State Skinheads finished his remarks.

736
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:36,520
Speaker 8: I would like to thank this young gentleman. This is

737
00:52:36,520 --> 00:52:39,040
Speaker 8: what I keep saying. It is a very good people.

738
00:52:39,719 --> 00:52:42,520
Speaker 8: I can do my job with my pen, with my cravat,

739
00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:45,440
Speaker 8: with my suit, and he can do his job. But

740
00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:49,640
Speaker 8: I know first hand there's a frontman, there's a good people,

741
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:52,719
Speaker 8: and certainly you can come in in just as we

742
00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:55,239
Speaker 8: can be coming in so folks to religious service, thank

743
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:55,839
Speaker 8: you very much.

744
00:53:03,400 --> 00:53:07,920
Speaker 2: I can do my job with my pen, with my suit,

745
00:53:09,560 --> 00:53:16,439
Speaker 2: and he can do his job. Everyone in the room

746
00:53:17,080 --> 00:53:21,080
Speaker 2: knows what that job is. The job of the Nazi

747
00:53:21,120 --> 00:53:28,280
Speaker 2: skinhead is violence. Patriot Fronts aesthetic is obviously very different

748
00:53:28,360 --> 00:53:33,359
Speaker 2: from the classic neo Nazi skinhead. They aren't bald and tattooed,

749
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:39,279
Speaker 2: they've abandoned the Doc Martins. Culturally, they're very different from

750
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:44,200
Speaker 2: skinheads in their clean cut khaki pants and matching jackets.

751
00:53:45,040 --> 00:53:50,040
Speaker 2: But politically, I think the symbiosis proposed here is similar.

752
00:53:51,560 --> 00:53:55,200
Speaker 2: We'll do the paperwork and give speeches, and you will

753
00:53:55,280 --> 00:54:00,879
Speaker 2: march in the streets. The American Freedom Party has never

754
00:54:00,960 --> 00:54:05,240
Speaker 2: once succeeded in any of its endeavors, and it's unclear

755
00:54:05,280 --> 00:54:08,799
Speaker 2: what their future plans are at this point, but it

756
00:54:08,880 --> 00:54:11,000
Speaker 2: does look a little bit like there are some groups

757
00:54:11,000 --> 00:54:18,120
Speaker 2: out there trying to once again unite the right. Hopefully

758
00:54:18,120 --> 00:54:19,799
Speaker 2: this isn't a story we have to come back to,

759
00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:23,839
Speaker 2: at least not with a new ending. I do hope

760
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:26,239
Speaker 2: to circle back on some of those intriguing loosens in

761
00:54:26,280 --> 00:54:32,040
Speaker 2: the middle eventually. For now, though, I'll leave you with

762
00:54:32,120 --> 00:54:35,359
Speaker 2: this inspiring statement made by one of the speakers at

763
00:54:35,360 --> 00:54:39,960
Speaker 2: that convention in March. Sam Dixon has long since retired

764
00:54:39,960 --> 00:54:43,320
Speaker 2: from his career as a lawyer for the Klan. These days,

765
00:54:43,320 --> 00:54:45,920
Speaker 2: he makes the rounds speaking at white nationalist events all

766
00:54:45,920 --> 00:54:49,400
Speaker 2: over the country, and he runs a lucrative real estate business,

767
00:54:49,440 --> 00:54:52,640
Speaker 2: purchasing property tax debt and forcing old people out of

768
00:54:52,640 --> 00:54:56,640
Speaker 2: their homes for pennies on the dollar. He gave a

769
00:54:56,760 --> 00:55:01,640
Speaker 2: rambling thirty minute speech, managing to impart absolutely no wisdom

770
00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:05,400
Speaker 2: gleaned from his sixty years in the movement, but he

771
00:55:05,440 --> 00:55:09,480
Speaker 2: had one very important message for the white nationalists attending

772
00:55:09,480 --> 00:55:13,000
Speaker 2: that Ethno State Party conference at a mysterious castle in

773
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:14,120
Speaker 2: West Virginia.

774
00:55:16,200 --> 00:55:17,239
Speaker 4: We are not weird of us.

775
00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:18,760
Speaker 5: We are normal.

776
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:35,959
Speaker 2: Weird Little Guys is a production of Cool Zone Media

777
00:55:35,960 --> 00:55:39,440
Speaker 2: and iHeartRadio. It's research, written and recorded by me Lollie Conger.

778
00:55:39,840 --> 00:55:42,880
Speaker 2: Our executive producers are Sophie Leutman and Robert Evans. The

779
00:55:42,920 --> 00:55:45,719
Speaker 2: show is edited by the wildly talented Rory Gigan. The

780
00:55:45,760 --> 00:55:48,480
Speaker 2: theme music was composed by Brad Dickert. You can email

781
00:55:48,520 --> 00:55:50,840
Speaker 2: me at Weirdly Guys podcast at gmail dot com. I

782
00:55:50,880 --> 00:55:53,680
Speaker 2: will definitely read it, but I probably won't answer it.

783
00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:57,120
Speaker 2: It's nothing personal. You can exchange conspiracy theories about the

784
00:55:57,120 --> 00:55:59,560
Speaker 2: show with other listeners on the weird Little Guys subredd.

785
00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:02,759
Speaker 2: It just don't post anything that's gonna make you one

786
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:03,800
Speaker 2: of my word Little Guys