WEBVTT - Brad Stone's Key Takeaways from Davos

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to the City of London, the City of the City,

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<v Speaker 2>the City of London. Please mind the gap between the

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<v Speaker 2>and the financial heart of the country.

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<v Speaker 3>The city, the city.

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<v Speaker 4>Welcome to in the city, stand clear of the downs.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Francis Laqua and I'm David Merritt.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's that time of your day in the city,

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<v Speaker 1>in the mountains, in the snow.

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<v Speaker 2>It's our favorite time of the year. It's the busiest

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<v Speaker 2>time of the year. It's the most sportest time the

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<v Speaker 2>especially as we limp crawl towards the finish line of

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<v Speaker 2>the World Economic Forum. It's Thursday afternoon. We thought it

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<v Speaker 2>was probably about time to get our heads together, pick

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<v Speaker 2>over the remains of what's been a very busy week

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<v Speaker 2>and what the vibes of What are the big.

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<v Speaker 1>Takeaways So geopolitics, of course, a lot of what's happening

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<v Speaker 1>with AI, but all the conversations continue to return to

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<v Speaker 1>Donald Trump. Less about the president himself, but more about

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<v Speaker 1>his policies and his rhetoric will be interpreted putting America

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<v Speaker 1>first and leaving the rest of the world behind him.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, a couple of hours after we take this. He

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<v Speaker 2>is beaming in apparently var zoom into the main plenary hall.

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<v Speaker 2>He's going to be taking some questions, so rumors have

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<v Speaker 2>been swinding that he is going to shop. Looks like

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<v Speaker 2>that's not going to happen, but everyone's still hanging on

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<v Speaker 2>what his words are going to be. The softenoon.

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<v Speaker 1>There's one man we need to speak to. He's Bradstone.

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<v Speaker 1>He's editor of Bloomberg Business Week before that, senior executive

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<v Speaker 1>editor for Global Technology at Bloomberg News. Also the author

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<v Speaker 1>of four books on Amazon, but also talking about Uber, AIRBNBN,

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<v Speaker 1>the battle for the new Silicon Valley. Brad, thank you

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<v Speaker 1>so much for joining us.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you, Francine, thank you David.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, basically the week has been just trying to

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<v Speaker 1>figure out AI and the US chief executives are extremely

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<v Speaker 1>bullish on what happened to them, and the Europeans just

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<v Speaker 1>being a bit depressed.

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<v Speaker 3>I think the conversation here has been on two tracks.

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<v Speaker 4>AI is one, Trump and the global economy or another.

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<v Speaker 4>But certainly AI last year the forefront of everyone's mind.

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<v Speaker 4>Last year it was kind of Sam Altman's coming out party.

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<v Speaker 3>We had him at the Blueberg House. That's right. This year.

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<v Speaker 4>Dario Amoday, he's the CEO of Anthropic. He kind of

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<v Speaker 4>represents the one of them. He has a partnership with

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<v Speaker 4>Google and Amazon. But look, this year, even more than

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<v Speaker 4>last year, I think there's a feeling that we are

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<v Speaker 4>on the verge of something. You could call it super intelligence,

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<v Speaker 4>you could call it AGI. In any event, the kool

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<v Speaker 4>aid is being handed out amply, and everybody's talking about

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<v Speaker 4>it and what it means for labor and the global

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<v Speaker 4>economy and full employment.

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<v Speaker 3>That's right.

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<v Speaker 2>I remember last everyone was sort of badging themselves a

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<v Speaker 2>day without really knowing what it might meant. But this

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<v Speaker 2>year we put some dollar numbers on it all. And

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<v Speaker 2>of course not you know, in Washington we had this

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<v Speaker 2>announcement from Trump about this big new investment initiative with

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<v Speaker 2>some provots apport on switch, but a big number. Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>I love the night.

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<v Speaker 3>Let me provide some context.

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<v Speaker 4>First of all, Stargate and they bandied about these numbers.

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<v Speaker 4>A five hundred billion, probably last dollar investment in a

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<v Speaker 4>series of data centers and energy sources. So Oracle is involved,

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<v Speaker 4>open Ai is involved, and apparently Massi Son is raising

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<v Speaker 4>the money. And then Donald Trump of course giving the

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<v Speaker 4>rabbinical blessing to it. But what's so interesting here, and

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<v Speaker 4>Mark Venieff came to the Bloomberg House and talked a

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<v Speaker 4>little bit about it yesterday, is the rivalries, the divides

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<v Speaker 4>that are emerging in this rush to super intelligence. Microsoft

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<v Speaker 4>was supposed to be open AI's partner at the dance,

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<v Speaker 4>and there's Larry Ellison, and there's a lot of personality

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<v Speaker 4>clashes and philosophical divisions around how we build this infrastructure,

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<v Speaker 4>what it means, and who is going with kind of

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<v Speaker 4>who to develop it.

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<v Speaker 1>But who really has the money? Because there was also

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<v Speaker 1>it was the first facts that we saw, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>between Elon Musk and I mean it was via open AI,

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<v Speaker 1>but actually it was almost a dig at Donald Trump

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<v Speaker 1>and say, yeah, it's great announcing this, but who has money.

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<v Speaker 1>There's no money to build this yet, right.

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<v Speaker 4>And we should say here, we are in Davos, and

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<v Speaker 4>the conversation is really revolving around things that are happening

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<v Speaker 4>in DC.

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<v Speaker 3>So I do think that's interesting.

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<v Speaker 4>So you're right, Elon Musk, an ally of the presidents

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<v Speaker 4>comes out and tweets or posts on.

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<v Speaker 3>X that maybe open A doesn't really have the money.

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<v Speaker 4>Now that there's a lot of bad blood between alt

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<v Speaker 4>men and Elon Musk because you know, long story there

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<v Speaker 4>and so, but he does raise and I think Elon

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<v Speaker 4>Musk is right that there's a little bit of vapor

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<v Speaker 4>around these announcements. Do you remember seven years ago Donald

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<v Speaker 4>Trump opening a macindosh plant in Texas with Tim Cook

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<v Speaker 4>that had been in operation for eight years. It's the

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<v Speaker 4>kind of thing that we're going to get a lot of.

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<v Speaker 4>I think these sort of quasi announcements where we're really

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<v Speaker 4>trying to interpret what are they trying to tell us?

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<v Speaker 3>But what is the reality behind the presentation?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but I just love that, you know, we've since

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<v Speaker 2>the election, we've been debating when know that when is

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<v Speaker 2>this alliance of tech leaders and Donald Trump kind of

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<v Speaker 2>start to salah? Are we seeing that ready?

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<v Speaker 3>No signs of it yet?

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, and that, you know, that is something I'm

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<v Speaker 4>taking away from Davas, particularly the US CEOs. Francine you

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<v Speaker 4>were mentioning that it's quite a different story among the

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<v Speaker 4>European business leaders, but for the American business leaders, they're

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<v Speaker 4>putting forth a sense of optimism and excitement that they

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<v Speaker 4>are bought into this idea that it is time to

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<v Speaker 4>build realistically, it's probably the taxes are coming down, the

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<v Speaker 4>regulations are going away, and who knows, you know, when

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<v Speaker 4>he starts to overheat the economy and the bhond yields

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<v Speaker 4>go up and the market crashes, if there will be

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<v Speaker 4>a different tune. But we're in week one and everybody

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<v Speaker 4>seems to be on board in.

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<v Speaker 2>Front and your conversation. I mean, I heard you talking

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<v Speaker 2>to now I think, and he said, what was the line?

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<v Speaker 2>He said, I've never experienced such pessimism about Europe. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>isn't that. I keep hearing that this way, and you've

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<v Speaker 2>been hearing that in all the conversations, you know.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, it was funny because because Larry Think I

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<v Speaker 1>think tongue in cheek was also saying it's a good

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<v Speaker 1>entry point. And then I've also heard you know, you

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<v Speaker 1>could have collateral benefits from the US, because if Donald

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<v Speaker 1>Trump completely rips up or gets rid of the money

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<v Speaker 1>that was meant to go into Ira, then it could

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<v Speaker 1>go actually to Europe, where you could have some kind

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<v Speaker 1>of you know, jealousy from the Europeans saying what they're deregulating.

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<v Speaker 1>But my concern when you speak to chief executives, especially

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<v Speaker 1>off the record is they understand AI, but they don't really, right,

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<v Speaker 1>So AI is everything. It's Strava like telling me what

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<v Speaker 1>route I've taken or not taken because I don't run.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's also the super human artificial intelligence which could

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<v Speaker 1>really change everything, like personal robots. So what are we

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<v Speaker 1>actually talking about, Francine.

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<v Speaker 3>That's a really pesky question, but it is.

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<v Speaker 4>It is the good question, right, I mean right, because

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<v Speaker 4>how do we get from the chatbots right to what

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<v Speaker 4>Benioff was talking about yesterday, which is the we f

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<v Speaker 4>app will tell you what they think you're interested in,

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<v Speaker 4>because they're using salesforces Einstein to suddenly prognostications of a

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<v Speaker 4>super intelligence that is smarter than humans. Dari or Mody

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<v Speaker 4>coming to the Bloomberg House and saying we're going to

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<v Speaker 4>get there by twenty twenty seven, Sam Altman saying it's

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<v Speaker 4>going to happen during Trump's next current term.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, to be honest, I do think there's some handwaving.

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<v Speaker 4>I think you're right, And maybe it's not being described

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<v Speaker 4>all the well because we don't exactly know what it is.

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<v Speaker 4>But the idea is, and it's very much in vogue

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<v Speaker 4>here at Davos that the technology goes and it does things.

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<v Speaker 3>For us, we don't have to supervise it.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but we've heard lots of people say this here

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<v Speaker 2>as well in after interview, that everyone does need to

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<v Speaker 2>get the chief executives need to start understanding the applications

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<v Speaker 2>and the companies who are applying AI in their organizations.

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<v Speaker 2>They're going to be more efficient, they're going to have

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<v Speaker 2>better customer service, they're going to have a better bottom line,

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<v Speaker 2>and those who don't and then get left behind. And

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<v Speaker 2>so to keep coming back to the US Europe thing,

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<v Speaker 2>but it does fail to what you just said about again,

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<v Speaker 2>the Americans are kind of zooming over the horizon here,

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<v Speaker 2>leaving the Europeans in a kind of dust, don't they.

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<v Speaker 4>Well, I mean there are some you know, national or

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<v Speaker 4>continental champions. The CEO of Miss Strall was here. Did

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<v Speaker 4>you talk to him this week, prent He did have

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<v Speaker 4>good boots.

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<v Speaker 1>I noticed that, and like orange boots because Mistral, you

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<v Speaker 1>know the logo is like orange and black.

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<v Speaker 4>That's right, so you know, and of course they are

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<v Speaker 4>making their play an open source, which is you know,

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<v Speaker 4>powerful technology.

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<v Speaker 3>So all is not lost.

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<v Speaker 4>But you know, Trump coming in here and even this

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<v Speaker 4>week his first week making it clear that this is

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<v Speaker 4>a national security issue, that the rivalry is with China,

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<v Speaker 4>and that he will put the muscle of the US

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<v Speaker 4>government behind open Ai and the other national champions of Yes,

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<v Speaker 4>I think we have yet to see that in Europe.

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<v Speaker 3>And it is somewhat concerning.

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<v Speaker 1>Deep Mind is deep Mind you you know British company.

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<v Speaker 1>I know they're owned by Google, but they still have

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<v Speaker 1>the headquarters there. Dennis's British. He thinks about things from

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<v Speaker 1>more from a European perspective.

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<v Speaker 4>And yet because of the ownership by Google, because the

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<v Speaker 4>brains of deep Mind are our power, the Gemini large

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<v Speaker 4>Language model, I think we can really more realistically think

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<v Speaker 4>about it as US technology at this point.

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<v Speaker 2>And you mentioned China. Just another thing that has been

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<v Speaker 2>really striking to me has been kind of the absence

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<v Speaker 2>of China from this form and in its place a

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<v Speaker 2>huge presence by India. They have not one but two

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<v Speaker 2>houses on the promenade, they have many Ministers of State.

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<v Speaker 2>He Modi is not here himself, but the theme of

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<v Speaker 2>India as an investment choice is the growth engine in

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<v Speaker 2>APAC and potentially then in the world. Has been coming

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<v Speaker 2>across Loud and Clay and on the tech side as well,

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<v Speaker 2>with the skills and the talent that's emerging in India.

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<v Speaker 2>That's something that I've taken away.

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<v Speaker 4>I will say that one thing that I'm coming away

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<v Speaker 4>from this week is an interest and a curiosity in

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<v Speaker 4>learning more about a Chinese company called deep Seek, a

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<v Speaker 4>lot of people are talking about in the tech community

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<v Speaker 4>here at Davos.

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<v Speaker 3>It's a former hedge.

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<v Speaker 4>Fund I believe, based in Beijing that has a large

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<v Speaker 4>language model that in some ways people are saying this

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<v Speaker 4>is just as powerful as the Western model.

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<v Speaker 3>So don't really know a lot about it yet.

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<v Speaker 4>They're very private, they're not here, but it's something that

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<v Speaker 4>is on my radar as business to get the job done.

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<v Speaker 1>But I think, you know, the fact that the Chinese

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<v Speaker 1>has a significant less presence than in the past may

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<v Speaker 1>be telling of things to come. Because if you're kind

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<v Speaker 1>of in the you know, in the eye line of

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<v Speaker 1>Donald Trump, I mean, you don't want to be seeing

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<v Speaker 1>too much. You kind of want to stay behind the radar.

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<v Speaker 1>And some of the most interesting conversations that I've had,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, in Davos's chief executives that are not American

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<v Speaker 1>that are trying to figure out what you do with

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<v Speaker 1>a Trump presidency. So first you need to try and

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<v Speaker 1>understand the difference between policy and noise or negotiation tactic.

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<v Speaker 1>But also you don't want to be targeted. So do

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<v Speaker 1>you stay below the radar? Do you try and find meeting?

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<v Speaker 1>You know, do you try and and actually get some

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<v Speaker 1>FaceTime with him? How do you communicate with him? So

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<v Speaker 1>it's really interesting as people lattery, but you also have

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<v Speaker 1>to be remembered unless it's for something bad. I mean

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<v Speaker 1>it's very complicated, is it. Yeah, study psychology, it is.

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<v Speaker 3>But I think you know I was talking about the optimism.

0:11:05.080 --> 0:11:07.760
<v Speaker 4>I mean it's the Trump psychology, which is why everybody's

0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:11.040
<v Speaker 4>so rosy. They know that this is a transactional president

0:11:11.240 --> 0:11:13.640
<v Speaker 4>and everyone's got their bouquet of roses and is putting

0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:14.800
<v Speaker 4>it at his feet right now.

0:11:14.840 --> 0:11:17.000
<v Speaker 2>I mean you've you've interviewed him, Brad, right, I mean,

0:11:17.160 --> 0:11:18.960
<v Speaker 2>does that pers Nanci come frough, you know, sitting around?

0:11:19.000 --> 0:11:22.640
<v Speaker 3>I mean there's an interesting juxtaposition. You know. We interviewed

0:11:22.720 --> 0:11:25.080
<v Speaker 3>him BusinessWeek no video.

0:11:24.800 --> 0:11:28.680
<v Speaker 4>Cameras in mar Lago in August and it was a

0:11:28.720 --> 0:11:32.320
<v Speaker 4>great conversation. And then our colleague John Micklethwaite interviews on

0:11:32.440 --> 0:11:36.080
<v Speaker 4>stage on camera, and it's a much more different, more

0:11:36.200 --> 0:11:40.719
<v Speaker 4>pugilistic Donald Trump. So it is it is interesting when

0:11:40.760 --> 0:11:43.920
<v Speaker 4>he has an audience, he plays to it. When it's quiet,

0:11:43.920 --> 0:11:46.720
<v Speaker 4>he's a little bit more solicitous of the media.

0:11:46.960 --> 0:11:49.200
<v Speaker 2>Do you think across all the interviews here to say

0:11:49.200 --> 0:11:52.120
<v Speaker 2>on camera fromt Scene and Brad, when you've been interviewing

0:11:52.120 --> 0:11:53.760
<v Speaker 2>people on stage at the house or here on the

0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:56.520
<v Speaker 2>TV set, the impression I g is people are just

0:11:56.520 --> 0:11:58.400
<v Speaker 2>more resident this year to say anything ready. They don't

0:11:58.400 --> 0:12:00.240
<v Speaker 2>want to put their heads about the parapet is this

0:12:00.360 --> 0:12:01.199
<v Speaker 2>part of the Trump offeit.

0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:03.000
<v Speaker 1>But I think it's because they don't know. I don't

0:12:03.040 --> 0:12:05.319
<v Speaker 1>think it's because they're trying to be coy or don't

0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:07.400
<v Speaker 1>want to say anything. I think it's really uncertainty. We've

0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:09.720
<v Speaker 1>seen in the markets right it's been quite wild because

0:12:09.720 --> 0:12:12.079
<v Speaker 1>it's like, oh, you know, tech stocks will do fine,

0:12:12.160 --> 0:12:15.480
<v Speaker 1>We're good. There's security issues with China. Stocks are down.

0:12:15.520 --> 0:12:16.839
<v Speaker 1>So I think we're a little bit in the way

0:12:16.880 --> 0:12:21.120
<v Speaker 1>and see situation especially you know for businesses that want stability.

0:12:21.559 --> 0:12:24.040
<v Speaker 1>We're not really one hundred percent sure what these executive

0:12:24.120 --> 0:12:26.880
<v Speaker 1>orders mean. I mean, the crypto can, I don't know

0:12:26.920 --> 0:12:29.400
<v Speaker 1>where it ends up if it's about DOGI and having

0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:31.760
<v Speaker 1>you know, memes. We're going to do a dogie of

0:12:31.880 --> 0:12:35.080
<v Speaker 1>Dave Marra that's my next project, or whether you know

0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:38.080
<v Speaker 1>it'll be more infiltrating with blockchain in the whole of

0:12:38.080 --> 0:12:40.000
<v Speaker 1>the financial system. I don't know that.

0:12:40.440 --> 0:12:40.880
<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

0:12:40.960 --> 0:12:44.040
<v Speaker 4>I know they can't go wrong with flattery. I think

0:12:44.080 --> 0:12:46.920
<v Speaker 4>they're holding their tongue on crypto and the Trump coin

0:12:47.000 --> 0:12:50.840
<v Speaker 4>and the Milania coin. I think there's probably nobody wants

0:12:50.840 --> 0:12:52.640
<v Speaker 4>to say it, but you know, there's a little bit

0:12:52.640 --> 0:12:53.760
<v Speaker 4>of drifting right now.

0:12:53.800 --> 0:12:55.960
<v Speaker 3>It's very hard, it's very.

0:12:55.480 --> 0:12:58.360
<v Speaker 4>Hard to rationalize, but you know, nobody wants to be

0:12:58.480 --> 0:13:02.240
<v Speaker 4>left behind. Trump is freeing the technol the AI race

0:13:02.600 --> 0:13:05.440
<v Speaker 4>as a as a national security initiative, and an everybody

0:13:05.480 --> 0:13:06.080
<v Speaker 4>is going.

0:13:05.840 --> 0:13:07.440
<v Speaker 3>To their respective teams right now.

0:13:07.920 --> 0:13:10.559
<v Speaker 1>The other concern is that, you know, there's only one

0:13:10.600 --> 0:13:13.000
<v Speaker 1>show in town, and that's Donald Trump. And if you're

0:13:13.000 --> 0:13:16.560
<v Speaker 1>a leader, you spend so much time dealing with the

0:13:16.559 --> 0:13:19.360
<v Speaker 1>Trump administration in terms of how to respond what he's saying.

0:13:19.679 --> 0:13:21.800
<v Speaker 1>You know, don't you know put your head above the

0:13:21.840 --> 0:13:24.320
<v Speaker 1>parapet that you may lose sight of what's going on

0:13:24.400 --> 0:13:26.199
<v Speaker 1>at home. And this is against some of the things

0:13:26.200 --> 0:13:28.720
<v Speaker 1>that I've been here in the corridors is that you know,

0:13:28.800 --> 0:13:31.000
<v Speaker 1>he's there's there's one show. He likes to be the

0:13:31.040 --> 0:13:33.920
<v Speaker 1>center of tension. He likes talking, he likes being provocative,

0:13:34.640 --> 0:13:38.079
<v Speaker 1>and that could, you know, take away attention from important

0:13:38.120 --> 0:13:40.000
<v Speaker 1>matters for leader in chief executive.

0:13:40.040 --> 0:13:42.040
<v Speaker 2>I certainly know the big political interviews we've had here

0:13:42.080 --> 0:13:46.480
<v Speaker 2>this week. President Selenski, who spoke to John Mirkalthwaite yesterday,

0:13:46.559 --> 0:13:48.600
<v Speaker 2>made it very clear that Trump is the key, of

0:13:48.600 --> 0:13:51.200
<v Speaker 2>course to any resolution, but also the involvement of American

0:13:51.240 --> 0:13:53.600
<v Speaker 2>troops in any sort of peace deal. He made that

0:13:53.720 --> 0:13:57.040
<v Speaker 2>very clear as well. So Trump is the ultimate player

0:13:57.080 --> 0:13:58.679
<v Speaker 2>in any sort of resolution.

0:13:58.600 --> 0:14:01.720
<v Speaker 1>And Argentina and I'll just the script to make a

0:14:01.760 --> 0:14:02.920
<v Speaker 1>deal with Donald Trump.

0:14:03.520 --> 0:14:05.120
<v Speaker 4>I also just want to add that you know, these

0:14:05.160 --> 0:14:07.040
<v Speaker 4>business leaders their weather veins.

0:14:07.080 --> 0:14:09.360
<v Speaker 3>They point in the direction that the winds are blowing.

0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:12.120
<v Speaker 4>And back in the US right now, we've seen the

0:14:12.160 --> 0:14:15.520
<v Speaker 4>emergence of a sort of very conservative feeling among the

0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:20.200
<v Speaker 4>American populists. There are not great protests on corporate campuses

0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:23.280
<v Speaker 4>in universities, despite the executive orders of the of the

0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:25.320
<v Speaker 4>first week. So I think a lot of business leaders

0:14:25.680 --> 0:14:28.280
<v Speaker 4>have their finger up to the wind, and they are.

0:14:28.520 --> 0:14:31.640
<v Speaker 3>They're playing to their constituencies.

0:14:30.840 --> 0:14:33.480
<v Speaker 2>And a remarkable ability to pivot.

0:14:35.720 --> 0:14:39.120
<v Speaker 4>Mark Bennioff, as staunch a Democrat as you could find,

0:14:39.200 --> 0:14:41.960
<v Speaker 4>had nary award of criticism yesterday at the Bloomberg House

0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:42.960
<v Speaker 4>to say about Donald.

0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:45.880
<v Speaker 2>Fatty song were in about everything that names and.

0:14:45.800 --> 0:14:48.760
<v Speaker 4>I'm sure his private feelings made different from his public posture.

0:14:49.360 --> 0:14:50.960
<v Speaker 1>One of the other things that you know, we've been

0:14:50.960 --> 0:14:54.800
<v Speaker 1>thinking about is because Donald Trump likes a deal, we

0:14:54.840 --> 0:14:56.840
<v Speaker 1>don't really know what deals he's making with whom. So

0:14:56.880 --> 0:15:00.560
<v Speaker 1>something that could be confrontational or not, do you political

0:15:01.080 --> 0:15:02.920
<v Speaker 1>means that it would be in exchange for something else.

0:15:02.960 --> 0:15:05.080
<v Speaker 1>So TikTok for me is quite interesting or what he's

0:15:05.200 --> 0:15:07.600
<v Speaker 1>you know, he walked down in terms of like, ah,

0:15:07.720 --> 0:15:09.360
<v Speaker 1>is it really dangerous if it's just a bunch of

0:15:09.440 --> 0:15:13.200
<v Speaker 1>kids looking at crazy videos? Does he need China for

0:15:13.360 --> 0:15:15.840
<v Speaker 1>something else? Or do we ever really know what he's thinking.

0:15:16.320 --> 0:15:18.640
<v Speaker 3>It's difficult. He introduced the idea of a TikTok ban.

0:15:18.920 --> 0:15:23.120
<v Speaker 4>There is bipartisan consensus that TikTok is biased towards the

0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:26.400
<v Speaker 4>priorities of the Chinese government. So sure he's getting something

0:15:26.440 --> 0:15:28.480
<v Speaker 4>it may not be from China, maybe for some of

0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:31.240
<v Speaker 4>his donors who are major investors in TikTok's owner.

0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:34.000
<v Speaker 1>By dance just on TikTok. What happens because the Chinese

0:15:34.640 --> 0:15:36.880
<v Speaker 1>have to agree to whoever they sell it to, right,

0:15:36.920 --> 0:15:38.920
<v Speaker 1>so they said no to a number of people because

0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:40.960
<v Speaker 1>it's my understanding that if they sell it, they also

0:15:41.000 --> 0:15:42.600
<v Speaker 1>have to give the algorithm, and that's the loss of

0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:43.320
<v Speaker 1>the Chinese want.

0:15:43.480 --> 0:15:44.800
<v Speaker 3>We have reported a bloomberg.

0:15:44.800 --> 0:15:46.800
<v Speaker 4>They appear to be warming up to the idea that

0:15:46.800 --> 0:15:48.960
<v Speaker 4>they're going to have to sell the social network, maybe

0:15:48.960 --> 0:15:51.520
<v Speaker 4>not the algorithm, and then we should probably prepare for

0:15:51.560 --> 0:15:54.920
<v Speaker 4>Trump to steer it towards his allies like Larry Ellison

0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:55.640
<v Speaker 4>and Elon Musk.

0:15:55.680 --> 0:15:57.840
<v Speaker 1>I was just going to say, Elon Musk, how we

0:15:57.920 --> 0:16:01.160
<v Speaker 1>had the brother here yesterday and again there was a

0:16:01.240 --> 0:16:04.040
<v Speaker 1>rumor that he show up with Elon lost that would

0:16:04.040 --> 0:16:06.720
<v Speaker 1>have been rumor which has since been.

0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:10.240
<v Speaker 4>I don't think Elon has great things to say about Davos.

0:16:10.480 --> 0:16:12.520
<v Speaker 1>Well, they had a fat right on ax like a

0:16:12.520 --> 0:16:15.360
<v Speaker 1>couple of years ago. I feel like the next twelve

0:16:15.400 --> 0:16:17.600
<v Speaker 1>months are going to be pretty volatile and pretty bumpy.

0:16:17.840 --> 0:16:19.640
<v Speaker 1>I mean, Brad's already thinking about what we're going to

0:16:19.680 --> 0:16:21.160
<v Speaker 1>talk about next year in Davos.

0:16:21.200 --> 0:16:23.640
<v Speaker 2>I'm the worst crystal ball guys there is, and you know,

0:16:23.800 --> 0:16:25.440
<v Speaker 2>think about its sitting at last year, we had no

0:16:25.480 --> 0:16:27.040
<v Speaker 2>idea what was to come. So I'm going to I'm

0:16:27.040 --> 0:16:29.440
<v Speaker 2>going to demur on that. Apart from the one the

0:16:29.440 --> 0:16:31.680
<v Speaker 2>big serieslit geopolitical question that we've had to see, we

0:16:31.720 --> 0:16:33.920
<v Speaker 2>have a ceased in them. At least clearly something is

0:16:33.960 --> 0:16:37.160
<v Speaker 2>going to move in Ukraine. So perhaps there's less conflict

0:16:37.160 --> 0:16:37.560
<v Speaker 2>in the world.

0:16:37.600 --> 0:16:40.040
<v Speaker 4>Well, I mean my question if the US is withdrawing

0:16:40.120 --> 0:16:43.320
<v Speaker 4>as the world's policeman, you know what other conflict will

0:16:43.320 --> 0:16:47.200
<v Speaker 4>we see? Power abhors a vacuum. Trump has shown very

0:16:47.200 --> 0:16:49.960
<v Speaker 4>reluctant to deploy American troops. I have a feeling next

0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:52.280
<v Speaker 4>year we will be talking about Donald Trump, because that

0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:55.280
<v Speaker 4>is first rule of the Trump presidency. You talk about

0:16:55.320 --> 0:16:57.760
<v Speaker 4>Trump and there it will be something that we have

0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:00.840
<v Speaker 4>not yet imagined in terms of global conflict.

0:17:01.080 --> 0:17:02.800
<v Speaker 1>It'll be interesting to see if the Europeans are banks.

0:17:02.800 --> 0:17:06.200
<v Speaker 1>We also didn't have We had one European leaders who's

0:17:06.240 --> 0:17:09.440
<v Speaker 1>going to election on twenty third of February because they're

0:17:09.520 --> 0:17:10.800
<v Speaker 1>just not strong enough at home and.

0:17:10.720 --> 0:17:12.720
<v Speaker 2>If Larry think is right. Maybe you know that the

0:17:12.760 --> 0:17:16.000
<v Speaker 2>inverse devils indicator that excess pessimism here means that it's

0:17:16.000 --> 0:17:18.600
<v Speaker 2>time to buy Europe. Maybe that's there.

0:17:19.960 --> 0:17:21.199
<v Speaker 1>Brad thank you so much for joing here.

0:17:21.320 --> 0:17:21.640
<v Speaker 3>Thank you.

0:17:26.320 --> 0:17:28.800
<v Speaker 1>Thanks for listening to this episode of In the City

0:17:28.800 --> 0:17:31.119
<v Speaker 1>from Bloomberg. It was hosted by me Franklin Lackwell with

0:17:31.200 --> 0:17:34.760
<v Speaker 1>Dave Merritt, was produced by Sammersati and Moses, and sound

0:17:34.800 --> 0:17:39.280
<v Speaker 1>designed by Blake Maples. Special thanks to Bradstone. Please subscribe, rate,

0:17:39.440 --> 0:17:46.560
<v Speaker 1>and review wherever you listen to podcasts. Cool that's done.