1 00:00:15,436 --> 00:00:25,996 Speaker 1: Pushkin. Imagine that right now, you're driving a car, which, 2 00:00:26,116 --> 00:00:28,796 Speaker 1: if you actually are driving a car, is probably an 3 00:00:28,796 --> 00:00:31,916 Speaker 1: easy thing to conceptualize. But imagine you're in your car 4 00:00:32,276 --> 00:00:35,196 Speaker 1: and you're stuck in bumper to bumper traffic. Your lane 5 00:00:35,236 --> 00:00:37,836 Speaker 1: is ending soon, so you turn on your turn signal 6 00:00:38,036 --> 00:00:41,676 Speaker 1: and try to merge, but car after car pretends just 7 00:00:41,836 --> 00:00:44,436 Speaker 1: not to see you, and that's when the drivers behind 8 00:00:44,476 --> 00:00:48,316 Speaker 1: you start honking their horns at you, like it's somehow 9 00:00:48,396 --> 00:00:50,956 Speaker 1: your fault that no one will let you in. Now, 10 00:00:51,116 --> 00:00:53,036 Speaker 1: I'd like to think that during a moment like this, 11 00:00:53,196 --> 00:00:55,596 Speaker 1: I'd think back to my years of training as a 12 00:00:55,636 --> 00:00:58,596 Speaker 1: happiness expert, that I'd embrace a bit of compassion for 13 00:00:58,636 --> 00:01:01,876 Speaker 1: the other drivers, or just remember to take a deep breath. 14 00:01:02,316 --> 00:01:06,036 Speaker 1: But no, Instead, I usually undergo an immediate hulk like 15 00:01:06,196 --> 00:01:10,076 Speaker 1: transformation from a friendly, everyday commuter into a full on, 16 00:01:10,436 --> 00:01:14,356 Speaker 1: profanity shouting road rage masshole. My car may be at 17 00:01:14,356 --> 00:01:18,996 Speaker 1: a standstill, but my emotions and specifically my rage, has 18 00:01:19,036 --> 00:01:21,956 Speaker 1: gone from zero to sixty in what feels like less 19 00:01:21,996 --> 00:01:26,596 Speaker 1: than a millisecond. The science shows that burst of anger 20 00:01:26,676 --> 00:01:29,076 Speaker 1: like these don't really help us out in the long run, 21 00:01:29,396 --> 00:01:32,556 Speaker 1: Unlike a green superhero. Our human fury can be much 22 00:01:32,556 --> 00:01:35,196 Speaker 1: more under control than we think if we have the 23 00:01:35,276 --> 00:01:38,676 Speaker 1: right strategies. It's such an uncomfortable feeling, right, I mean, 24 00:01:38,876 --> 00:01:42,836 Speaker 1: everybody has had this experience of anger or you've gotten 25 00:01:42,916 --> 00:01:45,036 Speaker 1: really really good and not paying attention to your own 26 00:01:45,036 --> 00:01:47,396 Speaker 1: feelings and your dissociated all the time. But it doesn't 27 00:01:47,516 --> 00:01:50,476 Speaker 1: feel good, and there's a physiological reason for it. Our 28 00:01:50,516 --> 00:01:53,276 Speaker 1: body is pushing us to do something. It's a very 29 00:01:53,276 --> 00:01:56,716 Speaker 1: protective mechanism, and the body is determined to force us 30 00:01:56,756 --> 00:02:00,316 Speaker 1: into action in order to protect us, which is why 31 00:02:00,516 --> 00:02:03,636 Speaker 1: is so incredibly uncomfortable to feel angry and to want 32 00:02:03,676 --> 00:02:06,116 Speaker 1: to do something about it as soon as possible. This 33 00:02:06,276 --> 00:02:09,276 Speaker 1: is Faith Harper. She's a therapist based in San Antonio, 34 00:02:09,316 --> 00:02:12,756 Speaker 1: Texas who's written several books designed to make neuroscience more 35 00:02:12,836 --> 00:02:16,156 Speaker 1: understandable to the general public, including one that's taught me 36 00:02:16,276 --> 00:02:18,996 Speaker 1: a lot about strategies I can use when my mass 37 00:02:18,996 --> 00:02:21,596 Speaker 1: whole self wants to bust out. But I'll warn you. 38 00:02:21,756 --> 00:02:24,516 Speaker 1: Faith's book has a distinctly not safe for work title. 39 00:02:25,076 --> 00:02:29,436 Speaker 1: It's called Unfuck Your Anger. Using Science to Understand Frustration, 40 00:02:29,636 --> 00:02:34,076 Speaker 1: rage and Forgiveness, and the colorful title really fits because, 41 00:02:34,116 --> 00:02:35,956 Speaker 1: as Faith puts it at the start of her book, 42 00:02:36,396 --> 00:02:40,236 Speaker 1: nothing pisses her off more than being angry, but sometimes 43 00:02:40,236 --> 00:02:42,716 Speaker 1: she just can't help it. I got angry last night 44 00:02:42,716 --> 00:02:44,596 Speaker 1: because I'm trying to pull into a parking spot and 45 00:02:44,716 --> 00:02:46,756 Speaker 1: somebody opens their car door and then leaves it open 46 00:02:46,796 --> 00:02:48,476 Speaker 1: while they're digging around in their truck. I don't know 47 00:02:48,476 --> 00:02:51,196 Speaker 1: what they're doing. Move, I'm trying to park, I'm trying 48 00:02:51,196 --> 00:02:53,556 Speaker 1: to go grocery shopping. It just feels like there's this 49 00:02:53,676 --> 00:02:56,316 Speaker 1: idea of how things should be, and when people break 50 00:02:56,356 --> 00:03:00,796 Speaker 1: the contract, we get mad. Anything that doesn't align with 51 00:03:00,796 --> 00:03:03,396 Speaker 1: how we expect the world to work can create these 52 00:03:03,436 --> 00:03:08,596 Speaker 1: feelings of distress. But this need for movement to create change, 53 00:03:08,636 --> 00:03:10,516 Speaker 1: and the change that I created was rather than yell 54 00:03:10,516 --> 00:03:11,916 Speaker 1: at the lady digging in or trunk because I went 55 00:03:11,916 --> 00:03:14,116 Speaker 1: to other partet spot. And so why don't give be 56 00:03:14,196 --> 00:03:16,436 Speaker 1: like a quick definition of anger, because you know, it 57 00:03:16,436 --> 00:03:18,716 Speaker 1: differs from some of these other negative emotions that we've 58 00:03:18,716 --> 00:03:20,556 Speaker 1: talked about in this season of the podcast. You know, 59 00:03:20,556 --> 00:03:22,876 Speaker 1: how would you define it? It comes from the Latin 60 00:03:22,956 --> 00:03:28,356 Speaker 1: route meaning to outmove. It's creating energy to propel action. 61 00:03:28,836 --> 00:03:32,916 Speaker 1: It's the nervous system getting wound up enough to do something. 62 00:03:33,156 --> 00:03:37,436 Speaker 1: So anger is your body directing you to create change. 63 00:03:37,756 --> 00:03:40,116 Speaker 1: And I think that's a good neutral definition because we 64 00:03:40,196 --> 00:03:42,876 Speaker 1: have these ideas about anger being very negative and something 65 00:03:42,876 --> 00:03:45,756 Speaker 1: that we shouldn't have versus paying attention to my body 66 00:03:45,836 --> 00:03:48,356 Speaker 1: is wanting me to make some kind of correaction and 67 00:03:48,396 --> 00:03:51,196 Speaker 1: protect itself. We've talked in this season a lot about 68 00:03:51,236 --> 00:03:54,116 Speaker 1: different negative emotions, things like sadness and anxiety, And with 69 00:03:54,196 --> 00:03:56,516 Speaker 1: all these emotions, there's this kind of urge to ignore 70 00:03:56,556 --> 00:03:58,916 Speaker 1: them or runaway, right because they don't feel good. But 71 00:03:58,956 --> 00:04:00,836 Speaker 1: with anger, you know we have that urge, but I 72 00:04:00,836 --> 00:04:03,036 Speaker 1: think the reason is different. I think with anger there's 73 00:04:03,036 --> 00:04:06,036 Speaker 1: a real worry that if we acknowledge it and act 74 00:04:06,116 --> 00:04:09,196 Speaker 1: on it, we could hurt someone, hurt ourselves. Right. It 75 00:04:09,316 --> 00:04:11,996 Speaker 1: sure happens too, right, I mean, so, so talk about why, 76 00:04:12,036 --> 00:04:14,116 Speaker 1: even though you know there's a potential for harm with 77 00:04:14,156 --> 00:04:16,396 Speaker 1: this emotion, we shouldn't ignore it. That's not really the 78 00:04:16,476 --> 00:04:20,436 Speaker 1: right response. Yeah, any emotion that we ignore I call 79 00:04:20,476 --> 00:04:23,556 Speaker 1: it holding the beach ball underwater. You can spend all 80 00:04:23,596 --> 00:04:27,236 Speaker 1: of your time and attention doing that. And for those 81 00:04:27,276 --> 00:04:29,036 Speaker 1: of us who grew up splashing around in the pool 82 00:04:29,036 --> 00:04:30,436 Speaker 1: and have done that. You know, you can push it 83 00:04:30,516 --> 00:04:32,236 Speaker 1: under it and you can do nothing but that, But 84 00:04:32,316 --> 00:04:34,956 Speaker 1: eventually you're going to need to do something else. Your 85 00:04:34,996 --> 00:04:37,556 Speaker 1: attention span is going to wander somewhere else, and that 86 00:04:37,596 --> 00:04:39,236 Speaker 1: beach ball is going to pop up, is going to 87 00:04:39,356 --> 00:04:40,876 Speaker 1: hit you in the face. Things are going to go 88 00:04:40,956 --> 00:04:43,236 Speaker 1: flying everywhere. You're going to have to deal with it 89 00:04:43,276 --> 00:04:47,596 Speaker 1: at some point. So ignoring any complicated emotion doesn't make 90 00:04:47,636 --> 00:04:50,796 Speaker 1: it go away. It actually festers and makes it worse. 91 00:04:50,836 --> 00:04:52,756 Speaker 1: And that's true of all the uncomfortable emotions that you're 92 00:04:52,756 --> 00:04:55,236 Speaker 1: talking about in the series. Anger is no different. So 93 00:04:55,276 --> 00:04:57,436 Speaker 1: when people are worried, like well, I don't want to 94 00:04:57,516 --> 00:05:01,396 Speaker 1: react from anger, ignoring it is just going to have 95 00:05:01,556 --> 00:05:04,276 Speaker 1: it pop up in some weird way. Instead of having 96 00:05:04,356 --> 00:05:06,716 Speaker 1: a conversation with a co worker that needs to be had, 97 00:05:06,756 --> 00:05:08,276 Speaker 1: you're going to go home and yell at your partner. 98 00:05:08,396 --> 00:05:10,636 Speaker 1: And maybe not even that day, maybe a month later, 99 00:05:10,676 --> 00:05:12,836 Speaker 1: as things build up. And so I think this is 100 00:05:12,836 --> 00:05:15,436 Speaker 1: a really important way to think about anger, right, because again, 101 00:05:15,556 --> 00:05:18,236 Speaker 1: you know, we can sometimes think these emotions they're just uncomfortable, right, 102 00:05:18,316 --> 00:05:21,476 Speaker 1: But you've argued this, sometimes anger is normative. It's helpful 103 00:05:21,596 --> 00:05:24,116 Speaker 1: you know, talk about what you mean there. Yeah. Yeah, 104 00:05:24,156 --> 00:05:27,076 Speaker 1: I should say first of all that I was that 105 00:05:27,236 --> 00:05:30,756 Speaker 1: kid even at a very young age. My data especially 106 00:05:30,796 --> 00:05:33,356 Speaker 1: like that's too many battles. You can't put every battle 107 00:05:33,356 --> 00:05:35,996 Speaker 1: in your pocket. You have to pick two or three 108 00:05:36,036 --> 00:05:38,756 Speaker 1: at a time, put some down. I was always that 109 00:05:38,836 --> 00:05:41,836 Speaker 1: person that was mad about injustice and mad about how 110 00:05:41,876 --> 00:05:44,956 Speaker 1: other people treated and wanted to punch the sun at 111 00:05:44,996 --> 00:05:48,396 Speaker 1: a very young age, and my parents were probably like, 112 00:05:48,396 --> 00:05:50,196 Speaker 1: I don't know what to do with this person. Obviously, 113 00:05:50,236 --> 00:05:53,036 Speaker 1: I became a therapist interested in social justice issues. The 114 00:05:53,316 --> 00:05:55,196 Speaker 1: story that I tell in the book is about Rosa Parks. 115 00:05:55,236 --> 00:05:57,076 Speaker 1: Most people know who Rosa Parks, but they don't know 116 00:05:57,116 --> 00:05:59,596 Speaker 1: the story of how she became Rosa Parks. Right. She 117 00:05:59,796 --> 00:06:03,276 Speaker 1: was not politically active and engaged. Her brother had served 118 00:06:03,396 --> 00:06:07,676 Speaker 1: in World War Two, was an incredibly decorated hero and 119 00:06:07,796 --> 00:06:10,836 Speaker 1: came back and was treated like shit because he was 120 00:06:10,876 --> 00:06:14,836 Speaker 1: a black man in a structurally racist society. And that 121 00:06:14,996 --> 00:06:17,396 Speaker 1: pissed her off, and so she could have yelled and 122 00:06:17,436 --> 00:06:19,876 Speaker 1: screamed about it, but she decided to get involved. She 123 00:06:19,916 --> 00:06:23,396 Speaker 1: became involved with her local chapter of NWACP. She became 124 00:06:23,436 --> 00:06:26,836 Speaker 1: the secretary of that local chapter, and when the bus 125 00:06:26,876 --> 00:06:31,236 Speaker 1: boycott was determined to be a good, non violent course 126 00:06:31,276 --> 00:06:34,036 Speaker 1: of action, the idea was that she was going to 127 00:06:34,076 --> 00:06:36,836 Speaker 1: replicate something else that had already happened in Birmingham. There 128 00:06:36,876 --> 00:06:39,716 Speaker 1: had been a young, unwed, pregnant woman who had been 129 00:06:39,716 --> 00:06:41,556 Speaker 1: told not to sit down and move, and they said, well, 130 00:06:41,636 --> 00:06:45,516 Speaker 1: let's replicate this action with somebody who will not be 131 00:06:45,716 --> 00:06:48,156 Speaker 1: torn up needlessly, or can at least take it if 132 00:06:48,156 --> 00:06:50,316 Speaker 1: it happens. So the action happened, and it wasn't that 133 00:06:50,476 --> 00:06:51,996 Speaker 1: Rosa Parks got on the bus and she was tired 134 00:06:52,036 --> 00:06:54,036 Speaker 1: and she said, screw y'all, I'm not getting up. And 135 00:06:54,076 --> 00:06:56,676 Speaker 1: then they papered all of the historically black neighborhoods with 136 00:06:56,716 --> 00:07:01,636 Speaker 1: flyers about the protest. And so rather than just reacting, 137 00:07:01,956 --> 00:07:07,076 Speaker 1: she became very, very involved in strategic about creating change. 138 00:07:07,396 --> 00:07:10,276 Speaker 1: And so that's anger being you. Your body's telling you 139 00:07:10,316 --> 00:07:13,316 Speaker 1: something's wrong, and there was like no lies, detective, there 140 00:07:13,396 --> 00:07:17,196 Speaker 1: was something incredibly wrong there. But by handling in this 141 00:07:17,316 --> 00:07:21,076 Speaker 1: more measured and thoughtful way, so much more tends to 142 00:07:21,116 --> 00:07:23,676 Speaker 1: get done than just beating the crap out of somebody. 143 00:07:23,876 --> 00:07:26,836 Speaker 1: So I loved these stories about these cases where anger's normative. 144 00:07:26,956 --> 00:07:29,156 Speaker 1: But of course the problem is that anger can also 145 00:07:29,236 --> 00:07:30,876 Speaker 1: stick with us. We can kind of get caught in 146 00:07:30,916 --> 00:07:33,676 Speaker 1: these cycles of anger where our emotions kind of blow 147 00:07:33,716 --> 00:07:35,796 Speaker 1: up on a hair trigger. So talk about why that's 148 00:07:35,796 --> 00:07:38,356 Speaker 1: not great either, well, and I think that's when we 149 00:07:38,516 --> 00:07:42,596 Speaker 1: feed it. There used to be this primal screen kind 150 00:07:42,636 --> 00:07:45,956 Speaker 1: of therapy, which was a big thing in the seventies 151 00:07:46,156 --> 00:07:48,236 Speaker 1: that you can just go in and kind of vomit 152 00:07:48,396 --> 00:07:50,276 Speaker 1: and you do like you feel better for a minute 153 00:07:50,316 --> 00:07:53,756 Speaker 1: because you're like, yeah, I'm mad and everything sucks, and 154 00:07:53,956 --> 00:07:56,476 Speaker 1: my therapist now agrees, and this group we're sitting naked 155 00:07:56,476 --> 00:07:58,636 Speaker 1: in the woods and everybody agrees or whatever. And then 156 00:07:58,676 --> 00:08:03,236 Speaker 1: we found kandas Pert's research found that that's not true. 157 00:08:03,276 --> 00:08:06,556 Speaker 1: That that process of just having this vomit where we're 158 00:08:06,556 --> 00:08:10,236 Speaker 1: not doing anything with it became something I hate to 159 00:08:10,316 --> 00:08:12,356 Speaker 1: use the word addiction because it's not an addiction, but 160 00:08:12,396 --> 00:08:14,716 Speaker 1: it becomes a very out of control behavior. It's this 161 00:08:14,876 --> 00:08:17,356 Speaker 1: thing that we want to engage in and that we 162 00:08:17,596 --> 00:08:20,796 Speaker 1: need it to feel better, but it just becomes this 163 00:08:21,036 --> 00:08:23,116 Speaker 1: loop that we go in and we scream about stuff, 164 00:08:23,116 --> 00:08:24,756 Speaker 1: but we're not doing anything with it. Just like any 165 00:08:24,796 --> 00:08:27,876 Speaker 1: uncomfortable emotion, it's like, Okay, so our body's telling us 166 00:08:27,876 --> 00:08:29,676 Speaker 1: to pay attention to something. What do we need to 167 00:08:29,716 --> 00:08:32,276 Speaker 1: pay attention to? Are we listening to an old tape? 168 00:08:32,356 --> 00:08:34,716 Speaker 1: And we need to remind ourselves that, you know, that's 169 00:08:34,756 --> 00:08:37,636 Speaker 1: an uncomfortable association because of past traumas, and it's not 170 00:08:37,716 --> 00:08:40,476 Speaker 1: reality based or is it reality based? And so if so, 171 00:08:40,516 --> 00:08:42,436 Speaker 1: how do we work with it? And so we're not 172 00:08:42,756 --> 00:08:45,676 Speaker 1: moving through it, we're just stuck in it. And so 173 00:08:45,956 --> 00:08:48,076 Speaker 1: what you've fargued is in these cases where people are 174 00:08:48,116 --> 00:08:50,476 Speaker 1: like legitimately being a jerk or there's like a legitimate 175 00:08:50,516 --> 00:08:53,596 Speaker 1: structural inequity, you've heard you that even in those cases, 176 00:08:53,636 --> 00:08:56,396 Speaker 1: we should try to be good about regulating our anger, 177 00:08:56,716 --> 00:09:00,716 Speaker 1: being kinder and more patient. Why right, Well, we get 178 00:09:00,716 --> 00:09:04,276 Speaker 1: more done. You know, anger can be scary for the 179 00:09:04,276 --> 00:09:07,276 Speaker 1: people around us. It can be scary and uncomfortable for ourselves. 180 00:09:07,276 --> 00:09:10,316 Speaker 1: It feels very much like a lack of control for 181 00:09:10,476 --> 00:09:15,956 Speaker 1: physiological reasons. So recognizing it, let's try to manage the 182 00:09:15,956 --> 00:09:19,236 Speaker 1: beach ball without shoving it underwater, is far more helpful 183 00:09:19,276 --> 00:09:22,996 Speaker 1: and efficacious for getting anything done. And I have clients 184 00:09:22,996 --> 00:09:26,116 Speaker 1: that will come in and they're mad, and they're screaming, 185 00:09:26,436 --> 00:09:28,156 Speaker 1: and I'll go ahead and give them some rope to 186 00:09:28,156 --> 00:09:30,716 Speaker 1: do that because I'm curious what their pattern is around that, 187 00:09:31,156 --> 00:09:32,756 Speaker 1: and this is a safe place to do it. And 188 00:09:32,756 --> 00:09:35,836 Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, so I don't feel unsafe with you. 189 00:09:36,156 --> 00:09:38,436 Speaker 1: I understand where this is coming from. You've got a 190 00:09:38,436 --> 00:09:40,316 Speaker 1: lot of pain here that's being expressed in this way. 191 00:09:40,316 --> 00:09:43,196 Speaker 1: But you know, you're kind of a big dude, and 192 00:09:43,276 --> 00:09:46,116 Speaker 1: you're pretty loud, and I'm wondering how other people are 193 00:09:46,116 --> 00:09:48,876 Speaker 1: responding to this in your life? Are people hearing what 194 00:09:48,916 --> 00:09:51,556 Speaker 1: you're saying when it's expressed in this way? And that's 195 00:09:51,556 --> 00:09:53,396 Speaker 1: the point, Like we're trying to create change, is what 196 00:09:53,436 --> 00:09:57,196 Speaker 1: are the mechanisms of change? And screaming and raging doesn't 197 00:09:57,276 --> 00:10:00,636 Speaker 1: get people real far, even though social media is full 198 00:10:00,676 --> 00:10:04,516 Speaker 1: of it. That's not how action is created. If we 199 00:10:04,556 --> 00:10:07,876 Speaker 1: want to channel our anger productively rather than chaotically, we 200 00:10:07,956 --> 00:10:10,756 Speaker 1: need to figure out where our anger goes wrong and 201 00:10:10,796 --> 00:10:13,756 Speaker 1: how to respond with a bit more chill. But doing 202 00:10:13,836 --> 00:10:16,836 Speaker 1: that requires figuring out how anger works in the first place. 203 00:10:17,636 --> 00:10:19,476 Speaker 1: When we get back from the break, we'll take a 204 00:10:19,556 --> 00:10:22,316 Speaker 1: deep dive into the biology of anger. We'll see the 205 00:10:22,436 --> 00:10:25,396 Speaker 1: understanding the purpose of this ancient emotion can give us 206 00:10:25,396 --> 00:10:27,516 Speaker 1: some hints about how to use our anger in more 207 00:10:27,516 --> 00:10:38,956 Speaker 1: effective ways. The happiness lab will be right back. To 208 00:10:39,076 --> 00:10:42,236 Speaker 1: really understand an emotion, it's often helpful to learn more 209 00:10:42,236 --> 00:10:45,756 Speaker 1: about how that emotion first originates and how it interacts 210 00:10:45,756 --> 00:10:49,276 Speaker 1: with the rest of our neural circuitry. Therapist Faith Harper 211 00:10:49,316 --> 00:10:52,236 Speaker 1: has argued that we can understand anger better once we 212 00:10:52,276 --> 00:10:56,756 Speaker 1: realize that this emotion starts with perception. Well, the body 213 00:10:56,916 --> 00:10:59,996 Speaker 1: is perceiving something, and a lot of times we don't 214 00:11:00,036 --> 00:11:01,916 Speaker 1: even really know what it is. We are getting so 215 00:11:01,996 --> 00:11:05,396 Speaker 1: much information that it's sort of downloading and we can 216 00:11:05,436 --> 00:11:07,956 Speaker 1: pay attention to a few pieces of it at the 217 00:11:08,036 --> 00:11:10,476 Speaker 1: prefreederal cortex level, and the rest of it is kind 218 00:11:10,476 --> 00:11:13,276 Speaker 1: of souping around on there. And so sometimes I have 219 00:11:13,356 --> 00:11:14,876 Speaker 1: people like that was angry, and I didn't know why 220 00:11:15,116 --> 00:11:17,956 Speaker 1: your body was paying attention it read something as a threat. 221 00:11:17,996 --> 00:11:21,836 Speaker 1: You were in the store and you smelled somebody's cologne 222 00:11:22,036 --> 00:11:23,676 Speaker 1: and it was the same cologne that was warned by 223 00:11:23,676 --> 00:11:26,036 Speaker 1: somebody who really don't like That kind of stuff happens 224 00:11:26,156 --> 00:11:30,476 Speaker 1: all the time. So getting really curious is important because 225 00:11:30,636 --> 00:11:32,316 Speaker 1: people listening to this yaye, yeah, but I have no 226 00:11:32,396 --> 00:11:34,996 Speaker 1: idea like why him pissed all the time, And that's okay. 227 00:11:35,036 --> 00:11:38,156 Speaker 1: A lot of it's precognitive or it's body based. Most 228 00:11:38,156 --> 00:11:40,996 Speaker 1: of our messaging is afferent, is coming from the body. 229 00:11:40,996 --> 00:11:43,516 Speaker 1: We're having like this vaguel tone experience that our brain 230 00:11:43,556 --> 00:11:47,036 Speaker 1: then interprets his abpiss. So when we decide an emotion 231 00:11:47,116 --> 00:11:49,716 Speaker 1: as negative or positive, as when we get into trouble 232 00:11:49,876 --> 00:11:54,796 Speaker 1: versus an emotion just exists. And when we get curious about, hey, 233 00:11:55,076 --> 00:11:58,316 Speaker 1: I'm really grumpy and upset right now, I wonder what 234 00:11:58,436 --> 00:12:01,276 Speaker 1: that's about, or I'm irritated, and I'm not quite sure 235 00:12:01,516 --> 00:12:04,796 Speaker 1: why people that are just huge impass are having a 236 00:12:04,836 --> 00:12:08,076 Speaker 1: lot of that right now because everybody is so tight 237 00:12:08,156 --> 00:12:10,276 Speaker 1: and exhausted and frustrated. Where a year and a half 238 00:12:10,276 --> 00:12:13,796 Speaker 1: into pandemic and we're having these big societal upheavals, and 239 00:12:14,116 --> 00:12:16,556 Speaker 1: sometimes we're just picking up on other people's shit, right 240 00:12:16,836 --> 00:12:19,636 Speaker 1: So getting curious of like, hmm, I wonder what that's about. 241 00:12:19,796 --> 00:12:23,356 Speaker 1: I wonder what's going on takes the internalized stigma and 242 00:12:23,396 --> 00:12:25,836 Speaker 1: the externalized stigma out of it. And so rather than 243 00:12:25,876 --> 00:12:28,436 Speaker 1: like oh, I'm mad and I shouldn't be, or that's 244 00:12:28,476 --> 00:12:31,356 Speaker 1: a bad emotion to have something's wrong. It's just like, 245 00:12:31,756 --> 00:12:35,156 Speaker 1: I wonder what that's about. I wonder what's going on. 246 00:12:35,436 --> 00:12:37,316 Speaker 1: My body picked up on something, but it's obviously not 247 00:12:37,396 --> 00:12:38,956 Speaker 1: something I need to pay attention to you right now. 248 00:12:39,116 --> 00:12:41,276 Speaker 1: But you're telling body like I got you. I paid attention, 249 00:12:41,276 --> 00:12:42,956 Speaker 1: but I don't see anything. So I think we're good. 250 00:12:43,316 --> 00:12:45,876 Speaker 1: And then you're no longer trying to shove something away, 251 00:12:45,876 --> 00:12:47,476 Speaker 1: and the body's like, are you sure? Like, yo, you 252 00:12:47,476 --> 00:12:49,556 Speaker 1: can continue to watch, but I think we're fine. Let's 253 00:12:49,596 --> 00:12:51,396 Speaker 1: just go ahead and go to the grocery store. And 254 00:12:51,396 --> 00:12:54,556 Speaker 1: then we're having a negotiation rather than trying to wrestle 255 00:12:54,596 --> 00:12:57,276 Speaker 1: control away from the amygdal up which never works. And 256 00:12:57,316 --> 00:13:00,196 Speaker 1: so let's talk about how anger manifests in the body. 257 00:13:00,236 --> 00:13:02,356 Speaker 1: You know, give me a kind of sympathetic nervous system 258 00:13:02,396 --> 00:13:04,516 Speaker 1: one oh one. You know, how does anger really start? 259 00:13:04,556 --> 00:13:08,036 Speaker 1: Physiologically speaking? Yeah, we think that the brain is controlling 260 00:13:08,036 --> 00:13:10,316 Speaker 1: the body, like there's somebody up there with a joystick, 261 00:13:10,476 --> 00:13:12,636 Speaker 1: and the body's really controlling the brain. The vegas nerve 262 00:13:12,716 --> 00:13:15,436 Speaker 1: is sending up this information. There are four pathways up 263 00:13:15,436 --> 00:13:17,756 Speaker 1: and only one down. Eighty percent of the messaging is 264 00:13:17,796 --> 00:13:19,476 Speaker 1: body to brain, not brain to body. You know, a 265 00:13:19,476 --> 00:13:21,156 Speaker 1: lot of us have heard of fight flight, and we 266 00:13:21,196 --> 00:13:24,276 Speaker 1: actually have fight flight freeze. And what that is is 267 00:13:24,516 --> 00:13:28,556 Speaker 1: the nervous system, specifically the vagus nerve, the tenth cranial nerve, 268 00:13:28,596 --> 00:13:32,556 Speaker 1: which connects to pretty much everywhere in our body. All 269 00:13:32,596 --> 00:13:35,916 Speaker 1: of our organs is reacting. We're built for connection. We're 270 00:13:35,916 --> 00:13:39,756 Speaker 1: wired for connection, and if something challenges that, then the 271 00:13:39,756 --> 00:13:45,196 Speaker 1: body's job is survival. And so we're having this very physiological, 272 00:13:45,716 --> 00:13:48,956 Speaker 1: animalistic response and the people get really embarrassed that their 273 00:13:48,996 --> 00:13:51,356 Speaker 1: bodies are doing what their bodies are supposed to do, 274 00:13:51,556 --> 00:13:54,316 Speaker 1: which goes back to paying attention to those early warning 275 00:13:54,396 --> 00:13:57,876 Speaker 1: signs is the best way through a legal event. And 276 00:13:57,916 --> 00:13:59,996 Speaker 1: then if you get overactivative, but even just going like 277 00:14:00,036 --> 00:14:02,116 Speaker 1: this is what's going on. I just need to let 278 00:14:02,116 --> 00:14:05,236 Speaker 1: this rush of hormones get through me and then I'm 279 00:14:05,236 --> 00:14:06,836 Speaker 1: going to feel a little nauseous and then I'll have 280 00:14:06,876 --> 00:14:09,996 Speaker 1: something little sugar. I've recognizing like this is just something 281 00:14:09,996 --> 00:14:12,236 Speaker 1: that I have to now work through because my body 282 00:14:12,316 --> 00:14:15,276 Speaker 1: is doing its job. Is really helpful. I mean, I'm 283 00:14:15,276 --> 00:14:18,996 Speaker 1: a yoga teacher, so just ignore me. So that's why 284 00:14:19,076 --> 00:14:21,756 Speaker 1: things like yoga and she goong and taichi and very 285 00:14:21,756 --> 00:14:24,916 Speaker 1: mindful movement can be incredibly beneficial because we're bringing the 286 00:14:24,996 --> 00:14:28,596 Speaker 1: brain and body back together, and the mechanism of that 287 00:14:28,876 --> 00:14:31,356 Speaker 1: is the vegas earp And this isn't really new information. 288 00:14:31,396 --> 00:14:34,796 Speaker 1: That's our new word for it, but acupuncturists three thousand 289 00:14:34,876 --> 00:14:37,116 Speaker 1: years ago called it the do channel. Same thing, so 290 00:14:37,156 --> 00:14:39,596 Speaker 1: we've always known about the mind body connection. We get 291 00:14:39,636 --> 00:14:42,196 Speaker 1: really good at forgetting and we also get really good 292 00:14:42,196 --> 00:14:45,956 Speaker 1: at thinking that other people's science may not be correct 293 00:14:45,996 --> 00:14:48,396 Speaker 1: because of the words that they used, or they didn't 294 00:14:48,436 --> 00:14:51,796 Speaker 1: have an fMRI to understand what was going on. But 295 00:14:51,996 --> 00:14:54,516 Speaker 1: we've had thousands of years of understanding that this is 296 00:14:54,556 --> 00:14:57,196 Speaker 1: what bodies do. This isn't brand brand new. One thing 297 00:14:57,316 --> 00:14:59,276 Speaker 1: you noted in the book, which I thought was really important, 298 00:14:59,356 --> 00:15:01,316 Speaker 1: is that, you know, we sometimes think of anger as 299 00:15:01,356 --> 00:15:03,556 Speaker 1: like an on off switch, and I'm angry or I'm not. 300 00:15:03,796 --> 00:15:06,596 Speaker 1: You'll talk about why that's not necessarily always the case. 301 00:15:07,316 --> 00:15:10,796 Speaker 1: So we think we have three emotions, mad, sad, glad. 302 00:15:10,916 --> 00:15:14,076 Speaker 1: There's actually a huge spectrum of emotions, and even within 303 00:15:14,076 --> 00:15:16,756 Speaker 1: the anger, it can be frustrated, it can be irritated, 304 00:15:16,916 --> 00:15:19,636 Speaker 1: it can be going back to parking lot, lady was 305 00:15:19,676 --> 00:15:22,596 Speaker 1: I angry, it was I pissed off. No, I was irritated, 306 00:15:23,236 --> 00:15:25,396 Speaker 1: but it would be very easy for me to continue 307 00:15:25,436 --> 00:15:28,356 Speaker 1: to feed that and it turned into a rage of thought. So, 308 00:15:28,676 --> 00:15:31,796 Speaker 1: you know, I'm always trying to get my clients and 309 00:15:31,836 --> 00:15:34,036 Speaker 1: people who read my book to recognize what are those 310 00:15:34,156 --> 00:15:37,516 Speaker 1: early signs of, like oh, my jaw gets tight, my 311 00:15:37,556 --> 00:15:40,316 Speaker 1: shoulders go up, really trying to pay attention to it 312 00:15:40,476 --> 00:15:43,316 Speaker 1: sematically so we can attend to what needs to be 313 00:15:43,356 --> 00:15:47,356 Speaker 1: attended to before it gets into a full blown rage fit. 314 00:15:47,396 --> 00:15:50,156 Speaker 1: Because anybody who has tried to calm themselves down in 315 00:15:50,156 --> 00:15:51,756 Speaker 1: a full blown reach fit or a two year old 316 00:15:51,796 --> 00:15:54,196 Speaker 1: in a full blown rache fit knows that it's nigh 317 00:15:54,196 --> 00:15:56,076 Speaker 1: impossible and you just kind of have to let it 318 00:15:56,116 --> 00:15:59,596 Speaker 1: wear itself out. You know, there's multiple layers to any 319 00:15:59,636 --> 00:16:02,116 Speaker 1: strong emotion. We can be content or we can be 320 00:16:02,156 --> 00:16:04,556 Speaker 1: completely blissed out right in the same mistrue with anchor. 321 00:16:04,756 --> 00:16:06,796 Speaker 1: I think it's so cool to recognize the biology of 322 00:16:06,796 --> 00:16:08,956 Speaker 1: this stuff, because you know, this isn't the body each 323 00:16:09,236 --> 00:16:11,436 Speaker 1: to get us into trouble, or get us fired from work, 324 00:16:11,556 --> 00:16:13,116 Speaker 1: or get us in a fight in a parking lot. 325 00:16:13,276 --> 00:16:15,916 Speaker 1: This is the body's way to survive. This is a 326 00:16:15,996 --> 00:16:18,996 Speaker 1: system that's built to keep us safe. Right. Yeah. And 327 00:16:19,076 --> 00:16:20,476 Speaker 1: the second thing I think that's kind of cool, is 328 00:16:20,516 --> 00:16:22,676 Speaker 1: it when you think about the evolutionary reason for this, 329 00:16:22,796 --> 00:16:26,436 Speaker 1: you really learned that this is why anger works so fast. Right, 330 00:16:26,796 --> 00:16:28,956 Speaker 1: If the job is to get us away from some tiger, 331 00:16:29,036 --> 00:16:30,916 Speaker 1: it couldn't think and diither of like is this the 332 00:16:30,996 --> 00:16:33,596 Speaker 1: right appropriate context or kind of scream at someone. The 333 00:16:33,636 --> 00:16:36,236 Speaker 1: brain's just kind of doing its job really fast. Yeah, Right, 334 00:16:36,276 --> 00:16:38,356 Speaker 1: Like if you touch a hot stove, you don't want 335 00:16:38,396 --> 00:16:40,236 Speaker 1: to sit there and go, oh my goodness, this is hot, 336 00:16:40,276 --> 00:16:42,316 Speaker 1: this may burn, I may have consequences from that. Is 337 00:16:42,356 --> 00:16:44,596 Speaker 1: my insurance activated? No, you want to move your hand. 338 00:16:45,476 --> 00:16:49,316 Speaker 1: It's the same thing in society has evolved so much 339 00:16:49,356 --> 00:16:52,676 Speaker 1: faster than human bodies have. Our bodies are really not 340 00:16:53,356 --> 00:16:55,956 Speaker 1: meant to be in this room doing a zoom session 341 00:16:56,116 --> 00:16:58,476 Speaker 1: right now. Right. All of these things are meant for, 342 00:16:58,516 --> 00:17:01,556 Speaker 1: like you say, being chased by a tiger, not dealing 343 00:17:01,596 --> 00:17:04,196 Speaker 1: with somebody not being aware of their surroundings in the 344 00:17:04,196 --> 00:17:06,596 Speaker 1: parking lot and leaving their door open. And so this 345 00:17:06,676 --> 00:17:09,556 Speaker 1: is why researchers who study aggression really try to look 346 00:17:09,596 --> 00:17:12,796 Speaker 1: into the evolutionary aspects of these triggers which can sometimes 347 00:17:12,836 --> 00:17:14,636 Speaker 1: give us some insight. And so in your book you 348 00:17:14,716 --> 00:17:17,156 Speaker 1: review some work by our Douglas Field, who talks about 349 00:17:17,156 --> 00:17:20,916 Speaker 1: these these nine rage triggers. Fields has this acronym he 350 00:17:20,956 --> 00:17:23,916 Speaker 1: calls life morts. So the l is life or death, 351 00:17:23,996 --> 00:17:26,316 Speaker 1: you know. I mean that kind of makes evolutionary sense, right, 352 00:17:26,316 --> 00:17:27,716 Speaker 1: like if you're going to die, you know, you need 353 00:17:27,756 --> 00:17:30,156 Speaker 1: a fast response. But another one, which is cool is 354 00:17:30,196 --> 00:17:32,196 Speaker 1: this idea of insult you know, so talking about you 355 00:17:32,196 --> 00:17:34,476 Speaker 1: know how a lot of our anger triggers are about 356 00:17:34,516 --> 00:17:36,916 Speaker 1: this notion of what's insulting us? Well, I think a 357 00:17:36,996 --> 00:17:38,596 Speaker 1: lot of that goes back in the fact that we 358 00:17:38,676 --> 00:17:43,156 Speaker 1: are hardwired for connection and we are hardwired to be 359 00:17:43,316 --> 00:17:48,116 Speaker 1: protective of our people, and so insult to that or 360 00:17:48,196 --> 00:17:51,396 Speaker 1: disrespect of that is a threat, right, We're having to 361 00:17:51,476 --> 00:17:53,916 Speaker 1: resettle of like no, I am to be respected and 362 00:17:54,036 --> 00:17:56,436 Speaker 1: you're not, and we're going to have a problem is 363 00:17:56,476 --> 00:17:58,596 Speaker 1: what the body is doing, and that's where the anger 364 00:17:58,756 --> 00:18:01,196 Speaker 1: is coming from. Another set of triggers that are part 365 00:18:01,196 --> 00:18:03,916 Speaker 1: of the life Morts model are cases where who is 366 00:18:03,996 --> 00:18:05,996 Speaker 1: under threat? Right, And so he has a couple of 367 00:18:06,036 --> 00:18:08,676 Speaker 1: cases that make tons of evolutionary sense. So f is 368 00:18:08,716 --> 00:18:11,756 Speaker 1: for fai, M is for me, he is for tribes. Yeah, 369 00:18:11,796 --> 00:18:13,716 Speaker 1: you talk about this idea that some of our fast 370 00:18:13,756 --> 00:18:16,716 Speaker 1: anger response might be a protection device for the people 371 00:18:16,756 --> 00:18:20,876 Speaker 1: we should care about. Evolutionarily speaking, right, very few people 372 00:18:21,196 --> 00:18:23,516 Speaker 1: are completely an island. You know. There was that god 373 00:18:23,556 --> 00:18:25,916 Speaker 1: that they found who was living alone in the woods 374 00:18:26,476 --> 00:18:28,596 Speaker 1: for many, many years and like just kind of stealing 375 00:18:28,596 --> 00:18:31,316 Speaker 1: what he needs. But that's weird. Human beings do need 376 00:18:31,396 --> 00:18:33,916 Speaker 1: other human beings and our survival depends on it, which 377 00:18:33,956 --> 00:18:36,956 Speaker 1: is why our relaxed state is tend and befriend and connection. 378 00:18:37,436 --> 00:18:40,316 Speaker 1: I'm a relationally trained therapist. Relational cultural theory is what 379 00:18:40,356 --> 00:18:43,116 Speaker 1: I work from. And you know, in the seventies it 380 00:18:43,196 --> 00:18:45,476 Speaker 1: was this idea that we're hardwired for connection, and now 381 00:18:45,516 --> 00:18:47,756 Speaker 1: we have the science that they're set out that we 382 00:18:47,876 --> 00:18:50,716 Speaker 1: really do need that for survival. And so those early 383 00:18:50,756 --> 00:18:53,716 Speaker 1: ideas about psychology is we need to move to self 384 00:18:53,756 --> 00:18:57,836 Speaker 1: actualization and you don't need anybody are patently false. And 385 00:18:57,876 --> 00:19:00,116 Speaker 1: then we can also see now the evolution psychology is 386 00:19:00,156 --> 00:19:02,556 Speaker 1: like why would we defend somebody that we don't need. 387 00:19:03,196 --> 00:19:05,276 Speaker 1: It's not just like well I love my husband and 388 00:19:05,316 --> 00:19:07,036 Speaker 1: I want you to leave him alone. No, I need 389 00:19:07,156 --> 00:19:10,596 Speaker 1: my husband. He's part of my people, and we need 390 00:19:10,636 --> 00:19:12,676 Speaker 1: each other. I mean, nobody else is going to do 391 00:19:12,716 --> 00:19:14,396 Speaker 1: the dishes in my house or something happens to my 392 00:19:14,476 --> 00:19:16,356 Speaker 1: husband and I don't want to do them, so we're 393 00:19:16,396 --> 00:19:18,916 Speaker 1: going to have to fight. Yeah, So part of it 394 00:19:18,916 --> 00:19:20,916 Speaker 1: is about the people that are being affected, but part 395 00:19:20,956 --> 00:19:23,156 Speaker 1: of it is about the stuff in our life that's 396 00:19:23,156 --> 00:19:25,396 Speaker 1: being affected. You know. He talks about the ease for 397 00:19:25,596 --> 00:19:28,676 Speaker 1: environment and the rs for this idea of resources. Yeah, 398 00:19:28,716 --> 00:19:30,996 Speaker 1: you know, so talk about how the space can kind 399 00:19:30,996 --> 00:19:33,556 Speaker 1: of be part of the context for these triggers. I mean, 400 00:19:33,556 --> 00:19:36,276 Speaker 1: we're really seeing that, and we have been for a 401 00:19:36,316 --> 00:19:39,676 Speaker 1: couple of years now, this idea of resources being limited, 402 00:19:39,676 --> 00:19:42,956 Speaker 1: and we really saw it in full technique color last 403 00:19:43,036 --> 00:19:45,156 Speaker 1: year with all the shortages. And it's about caring for 404 00:19:45,196 --> 00:19:46,916 Speaker 1: ourselves and caring for the people around. So it's not 405 00:19:46,956 --> 00:19:49,796 Speaker 1: like I just want all the stuff. But where is 406 00:19:49,796 --> 00:19:51,876 Speaker 1: this idea that I need all the stuff coming from? 407 00:19:52,036 --> 00:19:56,476 Speaker 1: Is this mechanism of caring for my family, my mate, 408 00:19:56,516 --> 00:19:59,516 Speaker 1: my kids, my tribe. Is I want to make sure 409 00:19:59,596 --> 00:20:02,956 Speaker 1: that everybody has food and toilet paper, you know, and 410 00:20:02,996 --> 00:20:04,956 Speaker 1: all these other things. If you look on it, You're like, 411 00:20:05,116 --> 00:20:09,636 Speaker 1: we're being protective of our fast fashion clothing. Now we're 412 00:20:09,676 --> 00:20:14,116 Speaker 1: being protective of resources again to keep us alive and 413 00:20:14,316 --> 00:20:17,236 Speaker 1: the people that we love alive, because we all need 414 00:20:17,276 --> 00:20:19,716 Speaker 1: each other. And so when we walk through these lifeboards, 415 00:20:19,716 --> 00:20:23,156 Speaker 1: we sometimes can get some insight into paradoxes of spots 416 00:20:23,196 --> 00:20:24,796 Speaker 1: where we get angry, where you're like, why do we 417 00:20:24,836 --> 00:20:26,956 Speaker 1: get angry at this and not that? And you know 418 00:20:27,356 --> 00:20:29,396 Speaker 1: one that I can relate to because I am definitely 419 00:20:29,436 --> 00:20:31,916 Speaker 1: guilty of this is road rage. If I'm walking in 420 00:20:31,956 --> 00:20:34,156 Speaker 1: a big city and it's really crowded and someone walks 421 00:20:34,156 --> 00:20:36,396 Speaker 1: in front of me, I don't freak out. But if 422 00:20:36,476 --> 00:20:39,396 Speaker 1: somebody cuts me off on I ninety five, Yeah, I'm 423 00:20:39,396 --> 00:20:45,236 Speaker 1: filled with this incredibly fast, deeply evolved rage. We're gonna scrap. Yes, yes, exactly. 424 00:20:45,276 --> 00:20:46,796 Speaker 1: I'm glad I'm not the only one yere. But so 425 00:20:46,836 --> 00:20:49,636 Speaker 1: talk about why understanding these triggers can help explain that 426 00:20:49,716 --> 00:20:52,356 Speaker 1: sort of strange context of road rage and why we 427 00:20:52,436 --> 00:20:54,956 Speaker 1: just don't get nearly as pissed off in other contexts. 428 00:20:54,996 --> 00:20:57,356 Speaker 1: The expectation is, if we're walking down the street, we're 429 00:20:57,396 --> 00:21:00,076 Speaker 1: all sharing this space, and even though we're really doing 430 00:21:00,116 --> 00:21:03,196 Speaker 1: the same thing on the road. The car's property, and 431 00:21:03,236 --> 00:21:06,316 Speaker 1: that feels like somebody invading our home if they cut 432 00:21:06,396 --> 00:21:08,316 Speaker 1: us out. And also, I mean, I think it feels 433 00:21:08,356 --> 00:21:12,316 Speaker 1: more threatenings are more dangerous. If somebody bumps into your car. 434 00:21:12,436 --> 00:21:15,116 Speaker 1: There's far more consequences for that than if somebody bumps 435 00:21:15,116 --> 00:21:18,116 Speaker 1: into your body with their backpack in the store. That's irritating, 436 00:21:18,516 --> 00:21:21,196 Speaker 1: but there's not going to be thousands of dollars of 437 00:21:21,356 --> 00:21:25,716 Speaker 1: damage and great physical injury impossible death from that. So 438 00:21:25,756 --> 00:21:28,556 Speaker 1: I think that's also part of what's playing recycle all 439 00:21:28,556 --> 00:21:32,596 Speaker 1: the information that's downloading for us, and that takes a 440 00:21:32,636 --> 00:21:34,876 Speaker 1: lot of the self stigma out of it, of like, Okay, 441 00:21:34,876 --> 00:21:37,716 Speaker 1: I'm just working with the process of a human body 442 00:21:37,916 --> 00:21:40,516 Speaker 1: and recognizing I'm more upset about this in my car 443 00:21:40,596 --> 00:21:43,636 Speaker 1: because I think of my car as my property by space, 444 00:21:43,636 --> 00:21:45,436 Speaker 1: and if you've got my kid in the car, Okay, 445 00:21:45,436 --> 00:21:47,956 Speaker 1: Now it's on. Now that we have a better sense 446 00:21:47,996 --> 00:21:51,396 Speaker 1: of how anger works biologically, why it feels so fast, 447 00:21:51,716 --> 00:21:54,516 Speaker 1: and why it's not a bad response per se, we 448 00:21:54,516 --> 00:21:57,236 Speaker 1: can start to understand that even though rage doesn't feel great, 449 00:21:57,476 --> 00:22:00,316 Speaker 1: it's really a feeling that's there to try to help us, 450 00:22:00,836 --> 00:22:04,836 Speaker 1: but biological good intentions are not. We often react pretty 451 00:22:04,836 --> 00:22:09,076 Speaker 1: badly to our anger. Think see thing yelling, middle fingers 452 00:22:09,236 --> 00:22:13,436 Speaker 1: raised with strangers on the highway. These responses not so good. 453 00:22:13,796 --> 00:22:16,796 Speaker 1: So how can we react to these frustrations better? We'll 454 00:22:16,796 --> 00:22:19,596 Speaker 1: here's some of Faith's strategies for working positively with our 455 00:22:19,636 --> 00:22:31,836 Speaker 1: anger when the happiness Lab returns in a moment so far. 456 00:22:31,916 --> 00:22:35,076 Speaker 1: Therapist and anger expert Faith Harper has explained that rage 457 00:22:35,116 --> 00:22:37,556 Speaker 1: is our bodies way of saying, hey, something is wrong 458 00:22:37,556 --> 00:22:40,076 Speaker 1: in our environment and we need to change it asap. 459 00:22:40,716 --> 00:22:43,156 Speaker 1: It's an important alert system that we need to listen 460 00:22:43,196 --> 00:22:45,956 Speaker 1: to in order to be happier. But listening to that 461 00:22:45,996 --> 00:22:50,636 Speaker 1: alert doesn't necessarily require flipping off complete strangers. Some ways 462 00:22:50,676 --> 00:22:53,196 Speaker 1: of reacting to our anger are more helpful than others. 463 00:22:53,916 --> 00:22:57,156 Speaker 1: This is something Faith is seen firsthand in her therapy practice. 464 00:22:57,956 --> 00:23:02,356 Speaker 1: When anger becomes a mechanism of controlling others, that's obviously problematic, 465 00:23:02,676 --> 00:23:05,076 Speaker 1: and in fact, one of the first things that I 466 00:23:05,116 --> 00:23:07,396 Speaker 1: look at was do they calm down when they get 467 00:23:07,436 --> 00:23:10,796 Speaker 1: what they want? If a kid is having a complete 468 00:23:10,876 --> 00:23:14,516 Speaker 1: melt down and you're like buying, here's the cookie, and 469 00:23:14,556 --> 00:23:18,196 Speaker 1: they're still melting down, then the anger is very physiological, 470 00:23:18,396 --> 00:23:22,116 Speaker 1: not something they're doing to manipulate. So I always look 471 00:23:22,156 --> 00:23:25,876 Speaker 1: with people like the weaponizing anger and they're completely in control, 472 00:23:25,956 --> 00:23:28,916 Speaker 1: but they're punching walls to show you what they're physically 473 00:23:28,956 --> 00:23:31,196 Speaker 1: capable of, or you know whatever, And then they get 474 00:23:31,196 --> 00:23:33,956 Speaker 1: what they want and they're buying and they're sweetest pie. 475 00:23:34,036 --> 00:23:37,876 Speaker 1: That's a different thing, right. That's not a physiological evolutionary 476 00:23:37,916 --> 00:23:41,876 Speaker 1: anger response that somebody weaponizing their body against somebody else. 477 00:23:42,116 --> 00:23:45,236 Speaker 1: But if they get what they want and they're still activated, 478 00:23:45,396 --> 00:23:48,396 Speaker 1: if their nervous system is still jangled and like the 479 00:23:48,476 --> 00:23:51,956 Speaker 1: problems resolved and the other person who bumped into them 480 00:23:51,956 --> 00:23:55,276 Speaker 1: backs off or whatever, but they're still like this, that's 481 00:23:55,316 --> 00:23:58,796 Speaker 1: an evolutionary physiological response. That's what we look at to 482 00:23:58,916 --> 00:24:01,956 Speaker 1: parse out where is it coming from. Is this purely 483 00:24:01,996 --> 00:24:05,196 Speaker 1: behavioral or is this physiological? So one of the techniques 484 00:24:05,236 --> 00:24:08,036 Speaker 1: you've used is this acronym ahen, can you walk me 485 00:24:08,076 --> 00:24:11,396 Speaker 1: through what the acronym? Sure? So the asanswer anger and 486 00:24:11,476 --> 00:24:15,356 Speaker 1: the idea is it comes from one, two, or three 487 00:24:15,636 --> 00:24:19,916 Speaker 1: of the following variables, which is H hurt E expectations 488 00:24:19,956 --> 00:24:25,116 Speaker 1: not met, or N needs not met, or any combination thereof, 489 00:24:25,676 --> 00:24:28,956 Speaker 1: and so unpacking it very simply where your feelings hurt? 490 00:24:28,996 --> 00:24:31,436 Speaker 1: Are you angry at your partner because they were supposed 491 00:24:31,436 --> 00:24:33,636 Speaker 1: to be home for dinner and you had planned a 492 00:24:33,716 --> 00:24:36,356 Speaker 1: nice dinner and then they had gone out drinking after 493 00:24:36,396 --> 00:24:40,836 Speaker 1: work and whipsie daisy, But you're hurt. Your anger is 494 00:24:40,836 --> 00:24:44,476 Speaker 1: coming from being very hurt by somebody and your body 495 00:24:44,516 --> 00:24:46,796 Speaker 1: reacting in a way to express that. Did you have 496 00:24:46,836 --> 00:24:49,596 Speaker 1: an expectation for them to show up? Hey? You know 497 00:24:49,676 --> 00:24:52,476 Speaker 1: it's a really good and simple tool for parsing out 498 00:24:52,516 --> 00:24:56,236 Speaker 1: what's the underlying emotion? That helps us figure out our 499 00:24:56,236 --> 00:24:59,476 Speaker 1: patterns of responses, and then you get those aha moments 500 00:24:59,476 --> 00:25:02,036 Speaker 1: of oh this really kind of connects to my trauma 501 00:25:02,116 --> 00:25:04,396 Speaker 1: history that I have a lot of emotional neglect in 502 00:25:04,476 --> 00:25:08,796 Speaker 1: my household, and I'm feeling that same being mishart or misunderstood. 503 00:25:09,516 --> 00:25:11,836 Speaker 1: We start recognizing these patterns and so we go, oh 504 00:25:11,956 --> 00:25:14,636 Speaker 1: there it is, okay, got it. That helps us work 505 00:25:14,636 --> 00:25:16,516 Speaker 1: with it in a different way, and that helps us 506 00:25:16,636 --> 00:25:19,996 Speaker 1: then figure out those early signals of like, oh, yeah, 507 00:25:20,036 --> 00:25:21,316 Speaker 1: this is a big trigger for me, so I need 508 00:25:21,316 --> 00:25:23,716 Speaker 1: to pay attention to this. My jaws getting tight, I 509 00:25:23,796 --> 00:25:25,756 Speaker 1: know what that means. About myself. I need to do 510 00:25:25,796 --> 00:25:28,316 Speaker 1: something with that. And I've had a lot of people 511 00:25:28,316 --> 00:25:31,356 Speaker 1: who have had, you know, decades of being in one 512 00:25:31,436 --> 00:25:33,436 Speaker 1: pattern and they're looking at me like I'm nuts and 513 00:25:33,476 --> 00:25:35,196 Speaker 1: like I'm never going to be able to do that, 514 00:25:35,876 --> 00:25:38,076 Speaker 1: and you know, within a year they're like, oh, yeah, 515 00:25:38,156 --> 00:25:40,036 Speaker 1: my jaws tied. And I was really frustrated by this, 516 00:25:40,076 --> 00:25:42,316 Speaker 1: and I handled it just fine, because the whole point 517 00:25:42,316 --> 00:25:44,236 Speaker 1: of therapy is not to just like have to sit 518 00:25:44,276 --> 00:25:46,276 Speaker 1: in my office and cry. The point is to be 519 00:25:46,316 --> 00:25:49,116 Speaker 1: able to learn new skills. So you're managing your own 520 00:25:49,156 --> 00:25:52,436 Speaker 1: life without me, and so with things like angers like here, 521 00:25:52,556 --> 00:25:54,756 Speaker 1: let me help you from this place of perspective of 522 00:25:54,876 --> 00:25:57,436 Speaker 1: noticing patterns and going, oh, but that's also kind of 523 00:25:57,436 --> 00:25:59,196 Speaker 1: like what you said about your mom, you know, and 524 00:25:59,236 --> 00:26:01,436 Speaker 1: then it gives you other ways to work with it. 525 00:26:01,476 --> 00:26:03,316 Speaker 1: And so that's why AHEN is so good, because it 526 00:26:03,356 --> 00:26:08,076 Speaker 1: really simplifies what's going on underneath this big response that 527 00:26:08,156 --> 00:26:11,556 Speaker 1: I'm having. And we also we have some cultural narrative 528 00:26:11,556 --> 00:26:17,316 Speaker 1: issues around anger. Anger is considered appropriate, it's considered powerful, 529 00:26:17,436 --> 00:26:22,316 Speaker 1: it's considered effective. It's very masculine emotion and energy. We 530 00:26:23,156 --> 00:26:28,916 Speaker 1: really struggle socially to let men have a wide range 531 00:26:29,156 --> 00:26:32,556 Speaker 1: of emotional experiences. Men aren't supposed to cry, men aren't 532 00:26:32,556 --> 00:26:35,436 Speaker 1: supposed to be sad or hurt or disappointed or depressed. 533 00:26:35,556 --> 00:26:38,716 Speaker 1: They're allowed to be angry. That's macho. So a lot 534 00:26:38,716 --> 00:26:41,316 Speaker 1: of time the anger is masking that all that other stuff. 535 00:26:41,356 --> 00:26:44,836 Speaker 1: We're not allowing this free range of expression of emotions 536 00:26:44,836 --> 00:26:46,476 Speaker 1: and being able to work with them and have them 537 00:26:46,476 --> 00:26:49,516 Speaker 1: be validated and understood. You're allowed to be angry or 538 00:26:49,516 --> 00:26:52,116 Speaker 1: you can be a pussy basically. I mean, you know, 539 00:26:52,156 --> 00:26:56,156 Speaker 1: we can talk about testosterone and differences and gender birth 540 00:26:56,156 --> 00:26:58,636 Speaker 1: assignment and the like, but a lot of it is 541 00:26:58,636 --> 00:27:02,156 Speaker 1: also cultural and what's acceptable and what's not. And so 542 00:27:02,316 --> 00:27:04,436 Speaker 1: one of those strategies you've talked about in the book 543 00:27:04,516 --> 00:27:06,516 Speaker 1: is this idea that if we can kind of use 544 00:27:06,516 --> 00:27:09,396 Speaker 1: this ninety second rule, we can ride the waves. Would 545 00:27:09,396 --> 00:27:11,356 Speaker 1: walk through the strategy of what it would look like 546 00:27:11,396 --> 00:27:14,116 Speaker 1: to ride the wave of anger. It comes from neuroscience, 547 00:27:14,156 --> 00:27:15,596 Speaker 1: but this is one of those things like we've known 548 00:27:15,636 --> 00:27:18,636 Speaker 1: this for thousands of years Buddhist practice. This is this 549 00:27:18,756 --> 00:27:21,636 Speaker 1: idea that an emotion is meant to give us information 550 00:27:22,316 --> 00:27:24,516 Speaker 1: and when we either hold on to it or we 551 00:27:24,636 --> 00:27:26,596 Speaker 1: try and shove it away, which is just another version 552 00:27:26,596 --> 00:27:28,276 Speaker 1: of holding onto it. That's when it gets stuck and 553 00:27:28,316 --> 00:27:30,956 Speaker 1: becomes this longer turn mood because people like I'm not 554 00:27:30,996 --> 00:27:33,556 Speaker 1: angry for ninety seconds. I've been angry for ten years. Okay, 555 00:27:33,676 --> 00:27:36,156 Speaker 1: that's the mood, and there's something going on to this's 556 00:27:36,196 --> 00:27:38,956 Speaker 1: making that very sticky for you. The ninety second rule 557 00:27:38,996 --> 00:27:41,556 Speaker 1: is this idea that we're having this rush, we're getting 558 00:27:41,556 --> 00:27:45,396 Speaker 1: all this messaging. It's being interpreted with this emotionality in 559 00:27:45,436 --> 00:27:48,476 Speaker 1: the amygdala. Our thoughts are based on that, and if 560 00:27:48,476 --> 00:27:51,236 Speaker 1: we go, oh, okay, curious, I wonder what that's about. 561 00:27:51,236 --> 00:27:53,476 Speaker 1: I wonder if I can figure that out. Something's going on. 562 00:27:53,596 --> 00:27:58,156 Speaker 1: I'm having a big reaction to that, okay, And that 563 00:27:58,716 --> 00:28:01,516 Speaker 1: it dissipates because we're paying attention to it, which is 564 00:28:01,516 --> 00:28:03,676 Speaker 1: all the body wants. Somebody just wants us pay attention, 565 00:28:03,836 --> 00:28:06,636 Speaker 1: like I am trying to help you out. Sis is 566 00:28:06,636 --> 00:28:09,476 Speaker 1: what the body is saying. And if we're ignored it, 567 00:28:09,476 --> 00:28:11,156 Speaker 1: it's going to throw down and the body's going to wit. 568 00:28:11,676 --> 00:28:15,076 Speaker 1: So once we start paying attention and negotiating, then the 569 00:28:15,236 --> 00:28:19,396 Speaker 1: anger doesn't last nearly is long because it flushes out 570 00:28:19,396 --> 00:28:22,196 Speaker 1: because we're attending to what's going on. We're making the 571 00:28:22,236 --> 00:28:24,516 Speaker 1: movement that the body wants to make. And so that's 572 00:28:24,556 --> 00:28:27,116 Speaker 1: where the ninety second comes from, just going oh okay, 573 00:28:27,396 --> 00:28:30,396 Speaker 1: breathing through it, sitting with it, not reacting from it. 574 00:28:30,396 --> 00:28:32,396 Speaker 1: Because we're not talking about somebody coming with us a knife, 575 00:28:33,076 --> 00:28:35,796 Speaker 1: you know, behind a dumpster on a Saturday night. We're 576 00:28:35,796 --> 00:28:38,156 Speaker 1: talking about I'm mad at my partner because they didn't 577 00:28:38,196 --> 00:28:41,276 Speaker 1: they didn't do the dishes. What's up with that? Why 578 00:28:41,276 --> 00:28:43,956 Speaker 1: am I having a strong response to a small problem 579 00:28:44,236 --> 00:28:46,356 Speaker 1: kind of thing. So that's a case where we can 580 00:28:46,396 --> 00:28:48,476 Speaker 1: kind of sit with the emotion and let it dissipate 581 00:28:48,516 --> 00:28:51,156 Speaker 1: on its own. Sometimes it feels so striking that it's 582 00:28:51,156 --> 00:28:53,196 Speaker 1: really hard to do that. And in that case, you 583 00:28:53,236 --> 00:28:55,156 Speaker 1: will have other techniques that we can use to hack 584 00:28:55,156 --> 00:28:57,956 Speaker 1: our physiology. You know, this idea that because the vagus 585 00:28:57,996 --> 00:29:00,036 Speaker 1: nerve is what's going on, we can actually maybe even 586 00:29:00,116 --> 00:29:02,756 Speaker 1: use our breath to deal with that. Talk about some 587 00:29:02,836 --> 00:29:06,076 Speaker 1: of these. The idea is there are multiple ways that 588 00:29:06,076 --> 00:29:09,036 Speaker 1: we can access our vaguest nerve externally, we can do 589 00:29:09,276 --> 00:29:12,476 Speaker 1: things to calm our bodies. I've had people tell me 590 00:29:12,476 --> 00:29:14,836 Speaker 1: that they're really embarrassed that when they're upset, they kind 591 00:29:14,836 --> 00:29:17,116 Speaker 1: of pull into the fetal position or rock and I'm like, well, 592 00:29:17,116 --> 00:29:18,996 Speaker 1: what you're doing is actually you're soothing your vegas nerve. 593 00:29:19,076 --> 00:29:21,916 Speaker 1: And that makes entire sense, and that's not just a 594 00:29:21,996 --> 00:29:24,836 Speaker 1: weird thing that you only see in movies where people 595 00:29:24,996 --> 00:29:27,756 Speaker 1: are in a psychiatric hospital. That's actually an accurate portrayal, 596 00:29:27,756 --> 00:29:29,916 Speaker 1: but accurate for a reason, and so that when the 597 00:29:30,076 --> 00:29:33,316 Speaker 1: bending over the soothing the vegas nerve. Anytime we extend 598 00:29:33,436 --> 00:29:37,916 Speaker 1: our outbreath, that's parasympathetic. If your outbreath is longer than 599 00:29:37,916 --> 00:29:40,436 Speaker 1: you're in breath, because the inbreath is sympathetic, that's getting 600 00:29:40,436 --> 00:29:43,316 Speaker 1: your body ready, and the outbreath is parasympathetic, that's the 601 00:29:43,356 --> 00:29:46,636 Speaker 1: calming breath. So if that one's longer, you're also going 602 00:29:46,676 --> 00:29:49,276 Speaker 1: to change your vagal tone and breathing is free. It's 603 00:29:49,276 --> 00:29:50,996 Speaker 1: worth trying. I took clients all the time, like, this 604 00:29:51,036 --> 00:29:53,636 Speaker 1: is an experiment. If it doesn't work, that's fine, and 605 00:29:53,636 --> 00:29:55,236 Speaker 1: they're like, Okay, it felt really dumb, but it kind 606 00:29:55,236 --> 00:29:58,356 Speaker 1: of helped, you know. I talked with clients about that 607 00:29:58,436 --> 00:30:01,276 Speaker 1: we're not responsible for that first emotion. That first emotion 608 00:30:01,356 --> 00:30:04,716 Speaker 1: is physiological. It's tied to our histories. It's tied to 609 00:30:04,796 --> 00:30:06,876 Speaker 1: things that are amygdala has held on too to keep 610 00:30:06,956 --> 00:30:10,036 Speaker 1: us safe. And there's nothing raw with any emotion that 611 00:30:10,076 --> 00:30:12,396 Speaker 1: you're having. It's a really important information. It's what we 612 00:30:12,436 --> 00:30:14,596 Speaker 1: do with that that's the important part. Right. So I said, 613 00:30:14,596 --> 00:30:16,356 Speaker 1: you're not responsible for your first thought. You're responsible for 614 00:30:16,396 --> 00:30:18,596 Speaker 1: your second thought and your first behavior. So as long 615 00:30:18,636 --> 00:30:20,956 Speaker 1: as we're looking at the first thought and not reacting 616 00:30:20,956 --> 00:30:23,276 Speaker 1: from that and going, oh, I'm angry, I should scream 617 00:30:23,316 --> 00:30:26,476 Speaker 1: at this woman who won't close her card door is 618 00:30:26,476 --> 00:30:29,316 Speaker 1: not an appropriate response, even though it would have been 619 00:30:29,356 --> 00:30:32,596 Speaker 1: a satisfying one, because what was she doing? So the 620 00:30:32,636 --> 00:30:34,796 Speaker 1: second thought is or I could just go back somewhere 621 00:30:34,796 --> 00:30:36,716 Speaker 1: else and let's just go, And then my behavior was 622 00:30:36,756 --> 00:30:39,316 Speaker 1: to do something different. This is not an acceptable way 623 00:30:39,356 --> 00:30:41,396 Speaker 1: to be in society. Is a screament strangers, so let's 624 00:30:41,396 --> 00:30:44,596 Speaker 1: do something else. Like neural pathways don't go away. But 625 00:30:44,796 --> 00:30:46,876 Speaker 1: if we keep working on not going down them and 626 00:30:46,996 --> 00:30:49,036 Speaker 1: building new ones, it becomes easier to go down the 627 00:30:49,076 --> 00:30:51,276 Speaker 1: new one and have a new a different response, and 628 00:30:51,316 --> 00:30:53,676 Speaker 1: the old one gets weeded over. You know, what fires 629 00:30:53,676 --> 00:30:56,676 Speaker 1: to gather wires together, So what has wired to create 630 00:30:56,716 --> 00:31:00,036 Speaker 1: these consistent anger patterns and let's create these new ways 631 00:31:00,036 --> 00:31:03,636 Speaker 1: of managing it. I'm going to use the uncomfortable breathing 632 00:31:03,636 --> 00:31:05,876 Speaker 1: techniques that dumb doctor Faith wants me to use that 633 00:31:05,956 --> 00:31:07,876 Speaker 1: I don't like them and it's uncomfortable, but okay, they 634 00:31:07,956 --> 00:31:10,556 Speaker 1: kind of help. And just like one salad doesn't make 635 00:31:10,596 --> 00:31:14,356 Speaker 1: you healthy, this is all practice. We're having to unfuck 636 00:31:14,596 --> 00:31:18,596 Speaker 1: years or decades of managing things one way that served 637 00:31:18,596 --> 00:31:21,156 Speaker 1: at one point that no longer serve, and now we're 638 00:31:21,156 --> 00:31:23,756 Speaker 1: having to learn to manage them another way. And so 639 00:31:23,956 --> 00:31:26,596 Speaker 1: do you think that really understanding our emotion and really 640 00:31:26,596 --> 00:31:29,396 Speaker 1: committing to acknowledging anger can help us live a life 641 00:31:29,436 --> 00:31:31,956 Speaker 1: that's flourishing, where we can use our anger productively but 642 00:31:32,036 --> 00:31:34,356 Speaker 1: not kind of have it control us. Oh? Absolutely, I 643 00:31:34,356 --> 00:31:36,876 Speaker 1: mean I'm a therapist. That's my jam. Right. That's what 644 00:31:36,876 --> 00:31:39,676 Speaker 1: we're here trying to do is have people recognize you're 645 00:31:39,676 --> 00:31:44,116 Speaker 1: having this embodied experience of life and we're not perfect. 646 00:31:44,156 --> 00:31:47,796 Speaker 1: Expecting ourselves to be perfect is setting ourselves up for failure. 647 00:31:48,236 --> 00:31:50,676 Speaker 1: I mean, so much of it is like, oh that's 648 00:31:50,716 --> 00:31:53,516 Speaker 1: why I do that, that makes sense, that's a little crazy, 649 00:31:54,156 --> 00:31:56,596 Speaker 1: or oh yeah, that's about all that stuff that happened 650 00:31:56,596 --> 00:32:00,676 Speaker 1: when I was that makes sense, okay, cool, and then 651 00:32:00,716 --> 00:32:03,396 Speaker 1: we're working with it in a completely different way. Clients 652 00:32:03,396 --> 00:32:04,676 Speaker 1: here from me all the time. I'm like, I don't 653 00:32:04,716 --> 00:32:06,916 Speaker 1: know that we get better so much as we get 654 00:32:06,956 --> 00:32:10,556 Speaker 1: better at it. And that's also recovery. Right. One of 655 00:32:10,596 --> 00:32:13,276 Speaker 1: my former interns that same people just know that they're crazy, 656 00:32:13,396 --> 00:32:16,156 Speaker 1: like everybody crazy. And if you're saying you know, and 657 00:32:16,236 --> 00:32:18,076 Speaker 1: you're working on it and you know where it is 658 00:32:18,156 --> 00:32:19,796 Speaker 1: and you know what you have to do with it, 659 00:32:20,116 --> 00:32:22,676 Speaker 1: versus just out there being a chaos monster. And I 660 00:32:22,756 --> 00:32:26,356 Speaker 1: love that analogy of recognizing like nobody has this down 661 00:32:26,516 --> 00:32:30,476 Speaker 1: where all works in process. I love Faith's description of 662 00:32:30,516 --> 00:32:32,996 Speaker 1: anger that it's our body's way of giving us the 663 00:32:33,076 --> 00:32:36,196 Speaker 1: energy to get out of a difficult situation. I'm going 664 00:32:36,236 --> 00:32:38,796 Speaker 1: to remember this when I start to feel frustrated and 665 00:32:38,996 --> 00:32:41,516 Speaker 1: try to appreciate my anger signals a bit more than 666 00:32:41,556 --> 00:32:44,156 Speaker 1: I usually would. But I'm also going to recognize that 667 00:32:44,196 --> 00:32:47,316 Speaker 1: the energy boost I get from feeling annoyed doesn't mean 668 00:32:47,356 --> 00:32:49,796 Speaker 1: I need to let my experience of rage run wild. 669 00:32:50,396 --> 00:32:53,076 Speaker 1: I can listen to what my ire is saying without 670 00:32:53,076 --> 00:32:55,556 Speaker 1: blowing my top. I'm also going to commit to paying 671 00:32:55,596 --> 00:32:59,036 Speaker 1: attention to the circumstances that get my blood boiling. If 672 00:32:59,076 --> 00:33:01,916 Speaker 1: I can recognize the patterns that cause my frustration ahead 673 00:33:01,956 --> 00:33:04,196 Speaker 1: of time, I'll have a better chance of changing my 674 00:33:04,276 --> 00:33:07,436 Speaker 1: circumstances in ways that will boost my well being even 675 00:33:07,476 --> 00:33:10,756 Speaker 1: more broadly. And if all that fails, I now have 676 00:33:10,796 --> 00:33:12,996 Speaker 1: some new breathing techniques I can use to chill out 677 00:33:13,036 --> 00:33:15,276 Speaker 1: my fight or flight system the next time I'm stuck 678 00:33:15,276 --> 00:33:18,676 Speaker 1: in traffic. I hope my conversation with Faith has given 679 00:33:18,716 --> 00:33:20,876 Speaker 1: you some helpful tips that you can use to deal 680 00:33:20,996 --> 00:33:23,996 Speaker 1: with your own anger a bit more productively. And I 681 00:33:24,036 --> 00:33:26,356 Speaker 1: also hope that you'll return soon. When we tackle how 682 00:33:26,396 --> 00:33:29,356 Speaker 1: to deal with other negative emotions, there seemed to be 683 00:33:29,476 --> 00:33:32,796 Speaker 1: no bandwidth there to say, actually, maybe we're not supposed 684 00:33:32,796 --> 00:33:34,716 Speaker 1: to be happy right now. Maybe sadness is what we're 685 00:33:34,716 --> 00:33:38,276 Speaker 1: supposed to feel when we experience loss or disappointment. There 686 00:33:38,316 --> 00:33:40,956 Speaker 1: is this real reluctance to be sad, and I wondered 687 00:33:40,996 --> 00:33:43,516 Speaker 1: how we could be living in a happier way ultimately 688 00:33:43,876 --> 00:33:47,636 Speaker 1: by embracing us sadness too. On the next episode of 689 00:33:47,796 --> 00:33:53,796 Speaker 1: The Happiness Lab with me, Doctor Laurie Santos, If you 690 00:33:53,876 --> 00:33:57,476 Speaker 1: love this show and others from Pushkin Industries consider subscribing 691 00:33:57,516 --> 00:34:01,276 Speaker 1: to Pushkin Plus. Pushkin Plus is a podcast subscription that 692 00:34:01,356 --> 00:34:04,956 Speaker 1: offers bonus content and uninterrupted listening for only four ninety 693 00:34:04,996 --> 00:34:08,476 Speaker 1: nine a month. As a special gift to Pushkin Plus subscribers, 694 00:34:08,716 --> 00:34:11,636 Speaker 1: I'll be sharing a series of six guided meditations to 695 00:34:11,676 --> 00:34:14,396 Speaker 1: help you practice the lessons we've learned from our experts. 696 00:34:14,956 --> 00:34:17,996 Speaker 1: Pushkin Plus is available on the show page and Apple Podcasts, 697 00:34:18,196 --> 00:34:28,236 Speaker 1: or at pushkin dot fm, slash plus. The Happiness Lab 698 00:34:28,276 --> 00:34:31,396 Speaker 1: is co written and produced by Ryan Dilley, Emily Anne Vaughan, 699 00:34:31,716 --> 00:34:35,756 Speaker 1: and Courtney Guerino. Our original music was composed by Zachary Silver, 700 00:34:36,156 --> 00:34:40,196 Speaker 1: with additional scoring, mixing and mastering by Evan Viola. Special 701 00:34:40,236 --> 00:34:45,156 Speaker 1: thanks to Milabelle, Heather Faine, John Schnars, Carli Migliori, Christina Sullivan, 702 00:34:45,356 --> 00:34:50,076 Speaker 1: Grant Haynes, Maggie Taylor, Eric Sandler, Nicole Morano, Royston Preserved, 703 00:34:50,436 --> 00:34:54,636 Speaker 1: Jacob Weisberg, and my agent, Ben Davis. The Happiness Lab 704 00:34:54,716 --> 00:34:57,316 Speaker 1: is brought to you by Pushkin Industries and me Doctor 705 00:34:57,396 --> 00:35:01,156 Speaker 1: Laurie Santos. To find more Pushkin podcasts, listen on the 706 00:35:01,196 --> 00:35:06,556 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts,