Speaker 1: Welcome to NFL Daily. Where we're in the dog days
Speaker 1: a training camp. Training camp is sort of over for
Speaker 1: some teams. That's weird. I'm Greg Rosenthal. I'm here with
Speaker 1: Nick Shook. He's in Cleveland. I'm in Los Angeles. It
Speaker 1: is Sunday evening, August ninth, and yes, the last full
Speaker 1: week of training camp practices before most of the league
Speaker 1: plays their preseason games are over. And when I say
Speaker 1: camp is over, I mean teams like the Rams, the Giants,
Speaker 1: the Bill like they've packed up their one location and
Speaker 1: they're going to another and perhaps practicing not in front
Speaker 1: of the fans. Things are already changing, Shook. And we
Speaker 1: have so many risers and follers, so many nuggets from
Speaker 1: a week that included you in Canton watching Carson Beck,
Speaker 1: you know, become a household name if he wasn't already.
Speaker 2: Watching the greatest Hall of Fame game I've ever covered
Speaker 2: in person. Let me tell, oh, yeah, what electric night
Speaker 2: that was. It's crazy, Greg, it's August ninth, it I mean,
Speaker 2: I know, July twenty seventh, which is when all the
Speaker 2: camps generally opened for the veterans twenty seven to twenty eighth.
Speaker 2: It feels like it was just yesterday, because it was
Speaker 2: basically less than two weeks ago, but it legit feels
Speaker 2: like it was yesterday. Training camp has flown by, and
Speaker 2: I know the guys that were in camp do not
Speaker 2: feel that way right.
Speaker 1: For a lot of the teams, they do the install
Speaker 1: period right away that just ended. It's like eight nine practices,
Speaker 1: and then there's a transition where you start doing some
Speaker 1: game prep, where you're working on specializing, where you start
Speaker 1: to really narrow down what the depth chart is going
Speaker 1: to look like. And that's what a lot of these
Speaker 1: risers and folloers are going to be about throughout the program.
Speaker 1: So let's start positive, and let's just roll through a
Speaker 1: bunch of the different ups. And one of the items
Speaker 1: of news that popped over the weekend, unfortunately, if you're
Speaker 1: a Deshaun Watson fan, it's a good weekend for you.
Speaker 1: He got all the first team reps after looking great
Speaker 1: for two straight days according to the people there, and
Speaker 1: great is relative, but in terms of how he had
Speaker 1: been playing two positive days in a row, one of
Speaker 1: them was after they essentially stopped playing Shudar Sanders with
Speaker 1: the first team. Weird, because Todd Munkin who's been a
Speaker 1: straight shooter, said yeah, we're gonna keep the rotation going.
Speaker 1: Then later that they he absolutely didn't. So look, if
Speaker 1: you're looking for Deshaun Watson to start week one, throwing
Speaker 1: the ball to Denzel Boston, who is definitely a riser.
Speaker 1: A lot of people saying he is the best looking
Speaker 1: Browns offensive player in camp period, maybe at any position.
Speaker 1: It sounds like it's trending that way. If nothing else
Speaker 1: for preseason week one, it sounds like he'll start.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the biggest takeaway that I heard this week
Speaker 2: was Denzel Boston just being the star of camp and
Speaker 2: whether it was somebody who was visiting for a day
Speaker 2: like I saw Ben Solack from ESPN. His takeaways were
Speaker 2: literally just different ways to describe how Denzel Boston is
Speaker 2: a monster in this camp. Camp. You know, standouts are one.
Speaker 2: Thing on field is different. We'll get the first test
Speaker 2: of that this week. But it is good for Browns
Speaker 2: fans to hear that they may have their next favorite
Speaker 2: receiver because they haven't really had one that they've really
Speaker 2: really loved since that guy who wore number twelve and
Speaker 2: couldn't stay on the field because of disciplinary issues. I'm
Speaker 2: talking about Josh Gordon the quarterback thing. It's it's weird
Speaker 2: because the narrative as of God, what did I do?
Speaker 2: I did Cleveland Radio this past week.
Speaker 1: It was like two days ago, it was different.
Speaker 2: They were like, oh, shoot Doors, but at this point
Speaker 2: you might as well just name him the starter. And
Speaker 2: then now all of a sudden's Deshawn's momentum. So again,
Speaker 2: this is one of those things, more than anything with
Speaker 2: this team that's going to be decided I think on
Speaker 2: the field in preseason, so we'll see. I was out unfold.
Speaker 1: I think the fix is in. They want to give
Speaker 1: him one more shot. I've been saying that for months. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's unfortunate Cedric Tillman, for instance, we're doing Risers at
Speaker 1: this part. But one thing that's rising to me is
Speaker 1: just the base level of this Browns receiving group, because
Speaker 1: now that Jerry Judy is in theory just part of
Speaker 1: your top three with Boston in concepcion, like everyone's moved
Speaker 1: down the order, like guys like Cedric Tillman and I
Speaker 1: might not even make this team. So that that is
Speaker 1: a good sign if you're a Browns fan. Let's go
Speaker 1: to New England where aj Brown, Christian Gonzalez going at
Speaker 1: it all week. Uh even got into it like yelling
Speaker 1: at each other a little bit. Little our iron sharpens iron.
Speaker 1: Let's let's listen to Christian Gonzales talk about it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's good on good. You know, he's
Speaker 3: a he's a number one receiver in this league going
Speaker 3: up against a number one corner. I mean, that's how
Speaker 3: it's gonna go. You know, it's it's football at the
Speaker 3: end of the day. You know, there's never no disrespect
Speaker 3: or anything. You know, we're just battling and getting each
Speaker 3: other better. That's He's gonna face corners like that that
Speaker 3: are you know, gonna gonna yap at him, get a
Speaker 3: gonna try to get in his head. And I'm a
Speaker 3: face receivers like that that are strong and come right
Speaker 3: back at me.
Speaker 1: So it's great work for for the both of us.
Speaker 1: I just wanted to get some positivity here early in
Speaker 1: the show. There are some pretty major injuries to talk about,
Speaker 1: like Laramie Tunzel and other situations, and the Patriots have
Speaker 1: some negative stuff too. But if I was gonna pick
Speaker 1: a positive from this week, Gabe Akis, their second round
Speaker 1: pick by all accounts, has hit the ground running and
Speaker 1: they need it. With Harold Landry been out with an injury,
Speaker 1: they don't have much of a pass rush. He reportedly
Speaker 1: look good and then at receiver to Mario Douglas. According
Speaker 1: to Greg Baddard, who really covers this team closely, you know,
Speaker 1: he knows he's done well in each of his training camps.
Speaker 1: He's the type of shifty, slack guy that often does
Speaker 1: well in training games. But he says this this year
Speaker 1: feels a little different that he is right there at
Speaker 1: the top of this depth chart. And I to me, like,
Speaker 1: if you're asking me who's going to lead this team
Speaker 1: in receptions, AJ Brown and Di Mario Douglas are probably
Speaker 1: the top two candidates. I am kind of buying that
Speaker 1: hype that the guy who came in with Drake May,
Speaker 1: who has the best chemistry third year leap, Like he's
Speaker 1: not going to go away just because they bring in
Speaker 1: guys and you're making a face at me.
Speaker 2: No, I just think it's interesting. It's intriguing the idea
Speaker 2: of a J. Brown as your threat to win in
Speaker 2: one on ones, potentially downfield, and then pop Douglas underneath,
Speaker 2: Like it makes for a very balanced, you know, a
Speaker 2: passing attack that can attack you basically at all three levels.
Speaker 2: I like this idea, the idea of him leading them
Speaker 2: in receptions. That's that's one that I'm going to have
Speaker 2: to see happen.
Speaker 1: Okay, the Patriots what we'll get to some followers a
Speaker 1: little bit later. I wanted to hit inside that same division.
Speaker 1: Chop Robinson keeps getting positive notes for the Dolphins. Not
Speaker 1: a lot of national Dolphins covered right now, so it's
Speaker 1: good to hear he might be having a little bit
Speaker 1: of a third year resurgence in this defense, which is
Speaker 1: going to be much more attacking, much different. Also a
Speaker 1: lot of positive notes. You know from the people on
Speaker 1: the ground that Malik Willis has had a nice camp.
Speaker 1: Let's go to Tampa where this is the type of
Speaker 1: thing that you need trading camp for. And I know
Speaker 1: you have to see it on the field, YadA YadA.
Speaker 1: But the way that the bucks Edge group is coming
Speaker 1: together reminds me of what I just talked about with
Speaker 1: the Browns. And the most surprising part of it is
Speaker 1: a man named David Walker. I don't know if you
Speaker 1: scouted him heavily going into the twenty five draft, but
Speaker 1: he missed all last year they were excited about him.
Speaker 1: He was a third round pick for Tampa, misses it
Speaker 1: with the knee injury, doesn't play as a rookie. He
Speaker 1: has a sack in all nine days of trading camp
Speaker 1: in which there were team drills, which is a wild
Speaker 1: like streak to keep going. And maybe it seems a
Speaker 1: little fluky, but a lot of the Bucks reporters have said, like,
Speaker 1: he's looked like the best player in camp and if
Speaker 1: nothing else, like he's not gonna displace Yaya Diabi. But
Speaker 1: you have Ruben Bain who's looked good. Those two guys
Speaker 1: are saying, hey, we're gonna be like the new version
Speaker 1: of Freeeny and Robert Mathis because they're not like the
Speaker 1: biggest guy, tallest guys that were okay, like calm down,
Speaker 1: but they're young guys who are getting excited. And you
Speaker 1: also have al Kahed Mohammad there. And so now I
Speaker 1: look at this group. It was a group for instance,
Speaker 1: Anthony Nelson and our friend John Ledyard pointed this out
Speaker 1: was like the number three edge a year ago and
Speaker 1: now he's the number six edge on the team. And
Speaker 1: so everything, you know, you add a couple you know,
Speaker 1: new players, free agents, rookies and then Walker getting back
Speaker 1: into the mix if he's a good rotation guy. I'm
Speaker 1: pretty excited about this Bucks defense.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well you have to be because it's a make
Speaker 2: or break situation for them. Given I mean, you know what,
Speaker 2: You're gonna get it out out of the offense. For
Speaker 2: the most part. This has become an offensive team, but
Speaker 2: you have to be better defensive. You have to be
Speaker 2: more towards Todd Bowles identity to justify his employment and
Speaker 2: to also win football games and keep the negative vibes
Speaker 2: from taking over. This is a good week of positivity
Speaker 2: and getting it from a player like this is very
Speaker 2: encouraging because, like you just explained, it adds to your depth.
Speaker 2: Now you got to keep ryding that, keep building that.
Speaker 2: If this can become a more balanced team, then I'll
Speaker 2: start to feel a lot better about them than I
Speaker 2: do right now than I did at the start of
Speaker 2: training camp.
Speaker 1: I like like the direction. There have been some injuries,
Speaker 1: but overall, like I feel like this defense might be
Speaker 1: more exciting than the offense, which was just has not
Speaker 1: been the case there for a couple of years. It
Speaker 1: definitely was the case with the Colts last year with
Speaker 1: Daniel Jones rolling through the early portions of the season.
Speaker 1: He has been back. We've been tracking this Shane Stike
Speaker 1: and very excited about his quarterback.
Speaker 4: Obviously, we chart all the throws, we chart accuracy throws,
Speaker 4: all that stuff, and he's on fire right now.
Speaker 2: So it's awesome to see.
Speaker 3: It's obviously a good sign for a football team when
Speaker 3: he's thrown the ball that way.
Speaker 1: For sure, hasn't had a lot of health there at
Speaker 1: wide receiver Alec Pierce still has not come back. Josh
Speaker 1: Downs was out of practice this weekend with an injury.
Speaker 1: We don't know how serious that is, but they're trying
Speaker 1: to use him on the outside, and it just doesn't
Speaker 1: make sense. They don't have anyone really stepping up on
Speaker 1: the outside. Maybe it's Ashton Duel in Westbrook, Akina like Woo,
Speaker 1: and yet the reports are that Daniel Jones is like
Speaker 1: dicing up this defense. So I don't know if that's
Speaker 1: a bad sign for the defense or just a great
Speaker 1: sign for Daniel Jones. He needs to get his receivers
Speaker 1: back on the field. But it's one of my biggest
Speaker 1: takeaways from the first couple of weeks of training camp
Speaker 1: is just okay Daniel Jones is like we'll see when
Speaker 1: the season actually starts, but everyone there seems to think
Speaker 1: like he's all the way back in a way that
Speaker 1: even with Patrick Mahomes at his knee brace, so we'll
Speaker 1: get to I don't feel like that's the case for
Speaker 1: him and for Daniel Jones, like it does feel like
Speaker 1: they're just expecting him to be full system go.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was weird at the start of camp that
Speaker 2: they seem to have such a positive outlook that they
Speaker 2: were just just basically guaranteeing, not guarantee, but all beg guarantee,
Speaker 2: operating as if he's going to be raided a role.
Speaker 2: I'm thinking about this receiver situation as you're describing it,
Speaker 2: and I'm looking at their depth chart just thinking like
Speaker 2: maybe this is a big twelve thirteen personnel candidate team
Speaker 2: this year, Like maybe it's just Tyler Warren and Moley
Speaker 2: Cox and Drew Ogletree and you're just gonna pound it
Speaker 2: with Jonathan Taylor who just got paid again, and then
Speaker 2: you just kind of work off of that with Alec
Speaker 2: Pierce once he comes back healthy and Josh Downs, but
Speaker 2: moving Josh Downs out of the slot, I don't like
Speaker 2: the idea of putting him the outside. That's that's not
Speaker 2: what he should be doing. I think I think we're
Speaker 2: underrating Nick Westbrook a keene a little bit, just a
Speaker 2: tiny bit. But he's not like the He's not a
Speaker 2: number three that's gonna be like, oh, that's turning my head.
Speaker 2: But I think he might be more productive there than
Speaker 2: you expect.
Speaker 1: John Byrne in the chat, says lakewan Fredwell breakout.
Speaker 2: I was gonna say it.
Speaker 1: I was like, great, you kind of forgot Treadwell still
Speaker 1: getting checks if he makes the team because that those
Speaker 1: training team checks aren't aren't that meaningful for a former
Speaker 1: first round pick. But yeah, if you got any questions,
Speaker 1: we appreciate you watching along live on Sunday nights. It's
Speaker 1: Sunday Nights with Shook and yeah, give us, give us
Speaker 1: a like and uh ask your questions. Let's go to
Speaker 1: the bills who opened high Mark Stadium here, and we'll
Speaker 1: go positive first before getting to the uniforms. O Cyrus
Speaker 1: Torrance got paid a lot of money. I was like,
Speaker 1: eighty eight million dollars guaranteed for Osyrus Torrance. But he's
Speaker 1: been an ascending player. I think who they want to
Speaker 1: be This is why you let a guy like David
Speaker 1: Edwards go in free agency, because you want to pay
Speaker 1: your homegrown talent and you're really excited about him. Some
Speaker 1: other just depth chart notes that I wanted to get
Speaker 1: to Caleb Elam's or who's a mid round rookie has
Speaker 1: been getting a lot of the green dot. You know
Speaker 1: that the starting linebacker reps partly because of injuries there
Speaker 1: and now they're getting healthier at linebacker. But just someone
Speaker 1: that the official Bills podcasts have been saying has really
Speaker 1: stood out. That's with Chris Brown and Steve Tasker. They
Speaker 1: also say Joshua Palmer has looked much more like the
Speaker 1: guy that they expected a year ago. He's healthier, more
Speaker 1: comfortable in the offense, doing some yards after the catch,
Speaker 1: and so it might be something where he's not a
Speaker 1: fantasy guy, but if he can just help out the
Speaker 1: Bills a little bit more than last year where he
Speaker 1: basically was a free agent bust, that would be big
Speaker 1: for them. Dalton Kincaid, according to The Athletic, has been
Speaker 1: the best receiving option in camp. My note for him
Speaker 1: is just like he's healthy, sweet, like he has not
Speaker 1: had many multi week periods in the NFL, including in
Speaker 1: camp where he's just healthy. So cross your fingers, because
Speaker 1: Kincaid is the fantasy guy on this team I'd be
Speaker 1: most interested in, and so far one of the guys
Speaker 1: we've talked about a lot on the show over the years,
Speaker 1: Alec Anderson, who is that kind of brought in the
Speaker 1: whole sixth offensive lineman trend in the NFL. He right
Speaker 1: now is winning the left guard battle. Are you are
Speaker 1: you a Kincaid guy? I don't know what got your
Speaker 1: fancy out out of all these bills notes, but are
Speaker 1: you like a Kincaid guy? Because I do feel like
Speaker 1: Dalton Kincaid has like eleven hundred yard season, gets drafted
Speaker 1: as the te fourteen in fantasy and finishes fourth. I
Speaker 1: just don't know what season that's going to be shook.
Speaker 1: It could be this season, it could be in two seasons.
Speaker 1: Like it's going to happen one season. I don't think
Speaker 1: it's gonna happen every season. I think it's gonna happen
Speaker 1: one season.
Speaker 2: Can Yeah, you know what, that's a fair projection. The
Speaker 2: thing is is like answering that question is a little
Speaker 2: bit difficult. Are you a Dalton Kincaid guy. I'm an
Speaker 2: aspirational Dalton Kincaid guy, if that makes sense. Like, I'm
Speaker 2: hoping that he ends up living up to the expectation
Speaker 2: that followed him out of college and the expectation that
Speaker 2: comes with sharing a tight end group with Dawson Knox.
Speaker 2: But it hasn't really happened entirely yet. So for the
Speaker 2: player on like just the player by himself, I am.
Speaker 2: I'm very much Dalton Kincaid guy. I just don't want
Speaker 2: to set my expectations too high, So maybe one of
Speaker 2: those seasons comes around and then you know, it reaches
Speaker 2: that bar checks that box and we're fine. I'm a
Speaker 2: fan of him as a player, I just don't expect
Speaker 2: him to be a big fantasy monster or anything like that.
Speaker 1: Now, are you a uniform guy, because I sort of.
Speaker 2: I am the uniform I don't know if you know this,
Speaker 2: but I am the NFL dot Com uniform guy.
Speaker 1: Okay, so let's let's put up the Nickel City uniforms.
Speaker 1: The officially opened the Bills new facility looks really cool.
Speaker 1: You know that the fans are covered, you know, from
Speaker 1: the elements, but it's an open air stadium, which you're
Speaker 1: getting to see it for the first time. It almost
Speaker 1: looks like a very cool, you know, euro soccer stadium.
Speaker 1: So shout out to the Bills for getting that done.
Speaker 1: But they go out there the first time Josh Allen
Speaker 1: is on the field in the new stadium, he is
Speaker 1: wearing these uniforms, which I don't hate as much as
Speaker 1: everyone And I can't remember a uniform getting as routinely
Speaker 1: dismissed as this one, which reminds me a little bit
Speaker 1: shook people say in CFL. Reminds me a little bit
Speaker 1: of the Dave Craig Seahawks uniforms, like that that era
Speaker 1: of Seahawks, which you know it's not Bills, but it's
Speaker 1: not the worst thing ever, are you? Are you as
Speaker 1: anti these uniforms as everyone else's.
Speaker 2: I appreciate when a design group tries something new and
Speaker 2: tries to be different with a team that is pretty
Speaker 2: locked into their color scheme, their look, their logo. There's
Speaker 2: not a lot of variety with the Bills. It's basically,
Speaker 2: you know, the bill logo, like the main one that
Speaker 2: we all know, the primary, and then you have just
Speaker 2: your wordmark. There's no secondary marks to work with, which
Speaker 2: I think limits them when it comes to things like this,
Speaker 2: so instead they try to take the charging streak from
Speaker 2: the logo and make it on that's their logo on
Speaker 2: the side of the helmet. I don't think that's executed properly,
Speaker 2: and it looks really weird from behind because it meets
Speaker 2: in the back of the shape of a V, which
Speaker 2: reminds me of Fresno State wearing the V on the
Speaker 2: back of their helmet college football. I also think that
Speaker 2: the Bills are not a team that needs a gray uniform.
Speaker 2: I don't care about the Nigta City thing. They had
Speaker 2: a red color Rush uniform that was way better than this,
Speaker 2: so it's ambitious. I like the effort. You're trying to
Speaker 2: do something different, but ultimately it deserves some of the
Speaker 2: criticism it's gotten.
Speaker 1: We are, yeah, we're getting a lot of booze, a
Speaker 1: lot of negativity, and I agree. And the little Bills
Speaker 1: on the uniform, it just it looks a little too
Speaker 1: much like Boise State. Ben asks any idea how DJ
Speaker 1: Moore is looking for target share. Shakir holding the top
Speaker 1: wide receivers and Kinkaid getting more targets scares me. I
Speaker 1: think DJ Moore is the most talented receiver on this team,
Speaker 1: I think you're going to get a honeymoon season out
Speaker 1: of him. I think they gave up too much for him,
Speaker 1: but ultimately I think he leads them in yards. I
Speaker 1: think Khalilshaker, it's it's been a little bit diminishing returns,
Speaker 1: especially with Joe Brady running things lately, and so I
Speaker 1: think he's going to get a pretty good target share
Speaker 1: at DJ Moore and end up like living up to
Speaker 1: what's been a pretty high fantasy billion. All right, let's
Speaker 1: move on from the Bills. Let's go to the riser
Speaker 1: that shockingly has not been mentioned that much on NFL Daily.
Speaker 1: It's one of these stories of the century, I would
Speaker 1: say in the NFL. The fact that the Jets have
Speaker 1: brought back Geno Smith to start games again is one
Speaker 1: of the craziest things ever, Especially Gino Smith out of
Speaker 1: one of the worst off of one of the worst
Speaker 1: seasons of any starting quarterback, and all of last season
Speaker 1: maybe the worst. I mean, he was right there with
Speaker 1: anyone that actually started the whole season, and that he's
Speaker 1: the freaking starter for the New York Jets after how
Speaker 1: it ended last time. And you know what he's doing, Nick,
Speaker 1: He is lighting up the defense. He's giving them a
Speaker 1: high level day after day. A. D Mitchell is going
Speaker 1: down the field, he's getting protected by armand Membu. I'm
Speaker 1: hashtag noticing that a lot of people saying armand Membu
Speaker 1: has taken another step and is possibly the best player
Speaker 1: on this team and maybe the best player on this
Speaker 1: offense already. I like it. I like the competence that
Speaker 1: I'm hearing all the Jets reporters are like, maybe we
Speaker 1: just haven't seen it in a while, but this looks pretty.
Speaker 2: Good competence on one side of the football. It's a
Speaker 2: little concerning that Gino's lighting the defense up in training camp,
Speaker 2: just because I feel like the defense needs to be better.
Speaker 2: That is, you know, your head coach Aaron Glenn's identity,
Speaker 2: and it's a team that also, you know, notoriously didn't
Speaker 2: have an interception all last year. So getting lit up
Speaker 2: by Geno, while it's not that surprising, given, but we
Speaker 2: know Gino can do when he's protected, well, it is
Speaker 2: a little concerning, but.
Speaker 1: Fair, you know what.
Speaker 2: You know what I'm happy to hear about from this
Speaker 2: that you just described the Jets invested in a mountain
Speaker 2: of a tackle and it paid off this time because
Speaker 2: it sure is held in with Makai Beckton. So I'm
Speaker 2: so glad that the vibes should go with armand Membu.
Speaker 1: And I was pining for armand Membu instead of Will Campbell.
Speaker 1: Will Campbell's reportedly had a pretty good camp. He missed
Speaker 1: a couple of days with injury, so I just decided
Speaker 1: not to mention that in the Patriots thing. But Membo
Speaker 1: is special. If you watch his tape last year, commenter notes, a, Yeah,
Speaker 1: Frank Reich is on the Jets staff, it is easy
Speaker 1: to forget that. I am very curious what Frank Reich's
Speaker 1: returned to the NFL because I would have never expected
Speaker 1: him to get an offensive coordinator job. Again, by the way,
Speaker 1: Isaiah Williams, who was the team MVP last year as
Speaker 1: a return man, is reportedly a wide receiver four Locke
Speaker 1: doing a lot more on offense, and they really like
Speaker 1: him in that four slot right now. Travis Hunter another
Speaker 1: wide receiver four, which is weird, but that's what John
Speaker 1: Shipley says. He's like, you know, really cemented himself. It's
Speaker 1: been pretty clear that it's defense and offense. But it's
Speaker 1: defense first, like Star and it's offense next, we kind
Speaker 1: of it took a year to get there, but this
Speaker 1: offense has been rolling in camp for the most part.
Speaker 1: In terms of the skill position everyone's taking terms. Parker
Speaker 1: Washington looks to be their number one threat, but Brian Thomas,
Speaker 1: including on Sunday, has gotten a lot of positive pop
Speaker 1: of how he's fitting into the offense. But what I
Speaker 1: went as kind of a winner here we're doing risers
Speaker 1: and followers. The riser was maybe a little bit of
Speaker 1: certainty with the running backs, like everyone's wondering what it's
Speaker 1: gonna be and in their first scrimmage, and for the
Speaker 1: most part in the practice reports, it's been pretty consistent.
Speaker 1: It's like they're mostly splitting between Basil Tuton and Chris Rodriguez,
Speaker 1: but between the twenties it's more Teuton, and then around
Speaker 1: the goal line it's more Chris Rodriguez, And in short
Speaker 1: yarded situation it's more Chris Rodriguez. And if it's an
Speaker 1: important third down, it's like la Quinn Allen. So when
Speaker 1: they actually do this plan shook in the regular season.
Speaker 1: Don't complain if you're a fantasy owner, like they're telling
Speaker 1: you what they're gonna do it as much as I
Speaker 1: like Basil Tuton, like they're telling you what you're gonna do.
Speaker 1: They're all gonna have their They don't see any of
Speaker 1: them as like a three hundred touch type of guy.
Speaker 1: And that's fine for NFL football, it's not great for fantasy.
Speaker 1: So just just know that, yeah, and enjoy the explosiveness
Speaker 1: that they'll display in.
Speaker 2: The passing game. And maybe if you're gonna lean toward
Speaker 2: one guy that's way at the bottom of your fantasy bench,
Speaker 2: lokwen Allen, because it sounds like he's the third down back. Look,
Speaker 2: this is a committee backfield, and I feel like we've
Speaker 2: moved away from committee backfields in some cases because we've
Speaker 2: had the re emergence or the new emergence of some
Speaker 2: stars that end up being on the field all three downs,
Speaker 2: like Abe, John Robinson, Jami or Gibbs A, Saquon Barkley.
Speaker 2: But committee backfields are a good sign because that means
Speaker 2: you have options because running back, as we know, but
Speaker 2: the heaviest physical toll of any position in the NFL
Speaker 2: is running back, especially running back who's gonna look at
Speaker 2: three hundred touches. So this is good news for the Jaguars.
Speaker 1: So We'll get to their injuries on the offensive line
Speaker 1: later when we're doing the followers. But Liam Cohen, who
Speaker 1: does not beat around the bush, was beaming after this
Speaker 1: scrimmage about how good the running game looked. It's a
Speaker 1: complex running game. It's year two, so despite a lot
Speaker 1: of injuries up front, he is a running game guy.
Speaker 1: He's been so good. I mean, just think about that
Speaker 1: Bucks running game when he was there for year how
Speaker 1: much better it was. He sounded very happy with where
Speaker 1: it's at. I think they could be a dangerous offense
Speaker 1: because of the depth obviously at receiver, but also because
Speaker 1: this dude knows how to coach up the running game.
Speaker 1: So I'm really looking forward to that. It is Rare
Speaker 1: Shook in a Bengals training camp to be talking about
Speaker 1: the defense, but the defensive optimism, and I know it's camp.
Speaker 1: I know it's hyperbole, but the Cashus Howell optimism has
Speaker 1: got me excited. This was a kid I was excited
Speaker 1: about coming into the draft. He goes top of the
Speaker 1: second round. He is beating their left tackle pretty regularly,
Speaker 1: which maybe isn't a great sign for Orlando Brown. There's
Speaker 1: been some talk about Orlando Brown maybe not having the
Speaker 1: best camp in the world, Cedric Thompson. I believe his
Speaker 1: name is beating him a handful of times too. But
Speaker 1: here's part of the optimism is that Howell is going
Speaker 1: to have one on ones because he's next to Dexter
Speaker 1: Lawrence and Dexter Lawrence according to I think it was
Speaker 1: Dan Horde that has covered this team for a while,
Speaker 1: was like, my expectations for Dexter Lawrence was high and
Speaker 1: he's exceeded them. And again, I know it's this time
Speaker 1: of year, but this time of year last year, people
Speaker 1: said Dexter Lawrence didn't look great because he wasn't one
Speaker 1: hundred percent healthy. So I'm just excited where this defensive
Speaker 1: line is at.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm not trying to put any throwning cold
Speaker 2: water on this because I'm also excited.
Speaker 1: About Now you could throw a cold water. I need
Speaker 1: some cold water thrown on me. It is like ninety
Speaker 1: five degrees in this garage and it's August ninth and
Speaker 1: every team is going to the Super Bowl.
Speaker 2: I mean, that's where we are in the preseason process
Speaker 2: right still optimism season. But I want to say two things. One,
Speaker 2: I love the fact that they went for cash as hell,
Speaker 2: because he was the antithesis of what they usually go for,
Speaker 2: which is trades guy. He's the opposite of a trades guy,
Speaker 2: but he is an explosive edge rusher and he's a
Speaker 2: situational edge rusher, and you're right, he's going to get
Speaker 2: looks because he's lined up next to Dexter Lawrence. But
Speaker 2: what's really important here is also when you're watching training
Speaker 2: and you're watching a lot of you know, eleven on eleven,
Speaker 2: best on best, usually the guys that ended up popping
Speaker 2: the most just from the observer's perspective are edge rushers.
Speaker 2: Are guys who get after quarterbacks because oftentimes you're not
Speaker 2: seeing the little nuances and things that are amounting into
Speaker 2: smaller victories for other guys unless it's a long you know, completion,
Speaker 2: not even really a long run because they're asually not
Speaker 2: tackling that often. It's gonna be an edg rusher getting
Speaker 2: to the quarterback and doing it frequently. And that's exactly
Speaker 2: who Cash is, how is, because that's who he was
Speaker 2: in college. If he's deployed properly during the regular season,
Speaker 2: he may become Bengals fan favorite. So I do like
Speaker 2: the idea of it. But let's just let's let them
Speaker 2: get on the field first.
Speaker 1: Well, it's like anything with the camp. Sometimes it's like,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, the defensive line is dominating. Is that a
Speaker 1: bad sign for the Bengals offensive line? Where Like one
Speaker 1: of the most repeated takes from people I respect and
Speaker 1: see like is that the Bengals offensive line is much better.
Speaker 1: They actually finally fixed it. And I'm not sure my
Speaker 1: eyeballs did not tell me that last year, even pass protecting,
Speaker 1: and there was a story of Joe Burrow kind of staring,
Speaker 1: collecting himself in the locker room pretty like upset after
Speaker 1: one of these practices. He's had a bunch of interceptions.
Speaker 1: They're installing a new offense. The fact that the defense
Speaker 1: is making the offense in Joe Burrow this mad is interesting.
Speaker 1: Dan Pitcher, the OC tried to explain it this way.
Speaker 1: We feel like this is going to help us build
Speaker 1: an offense that can win a number of different ways.
Speaker 1: Can help us win an NFC AFC World Championship. If not,
Speaker 1: you know, a training camp trophy. We don't really need that.
Speaker 1: I don't really care the under center play action. It's
Speaker 1: different for Joe Burrow and they have stuck with it.
Speaker 1: It's one of the things I've been watching. Have been
Speaker 1: listening to The Growler, which is a good Bengals podcast
Speaker 1: with Paul Deaner, and they say the offense really has changed.
Speaker 1: They are trying to do it, and it's been a
Speaker 1: bit of a bumpy road for Joe Burrow who's only
Speaker 1: played one way for his whole career. It's just something
Speaker 1: very interesting to watch in the preseason too, because they're
Speaker 1: going to play them in the preseason.
Speaker 2: Yes, and that's gonna be a great first like look
Speaker 2: for us US at this different offense, because what do
Speaker 2: you need in order for play action to work consistently? First,
Speaker 2: you need a running game that's being taken seriously, But secondly,
Speaker 2: you need an offensive line that can hold up to
Speaker 2: execute the fake. And that's gonna be the great test
Speaker 2: of whether this offensive line is fixed. Because I'm on
Speaker 2: the same page as you when it comes to that group.
Speaker 2: Still not overly impressed by them last year, So that
Speaker 2: could explain why they're having these struggles at this point camp.
Speaker 2: But the good thing is it's still on the August ninth,
Speaker 2: More Risers. Let's go to the NFC South the Saints.
Speaker 2: Jordan Tyson just quietly out there practicing. All the injury
Speaker 2: concerns hasn't been a problem. He's wowing me some of
Speaker 2: the clips.
Speaker 1: I know, we're not supposed to fall for these clips,
Speaker 1: but man, he's breaking dude's ankles. He's opened by five yard.
Speaker 1: Just the way he moves is really exciting. Barrion Brown
Speaker 1: is a late round rookie receiver that also has been
Speaker 1: playing well. It sounds like he's going to make this
Speaker 1: team and just been trying to add a little bit
Speaker 1: to their depth. Someone to watch in the preseason Barry
Speaker 1: and Brown. When we talk Risers, how about Clint Kubiak
Speaker 1: putting his foot down on and showing the rest of
Speaker 1: the Raiders he is boss. Let's hear him talk about
Speaker 1: Kirk Cousins and Max Crosby getting into it the other day. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's training camp, you know.
Speaker 4: Those are those two leaders of our team going at it.
Speaker 1: So that is part of camp.
Speaker 4: Obviously, you fight in the game, you throw a punch
Speaker 4: in the game, especially then you're out of the game.
Speaker 1: So we got to be smart, treated like a game.
Speaker 1: So what he did shook was bencham the next day.
Speaker 1: Pretty interesting that he sat Crosby and Cousins down almost
Speaker 1: to send a message in maybe give Fernando Mendoza some
Speaker 1: love with the first team. Who knows, but that's interesting Kubiak.
Speaker 1: I'm sure Max Crosby was not thrilled with that.
Speaker 2: I love this idea of this new staff and Clint
Speaker 2: Kubiak coming in and just putting his foot down and
Speaker 2: setting a standard that he carried over from the Super
Speaker 2: Bowl champion Seahawks, where he's like, We're just not gonna
Speaker 2: let this stuff happen anymore. I know it's a simple, Hey,
Speaker 2: Max Crosby's going hard, but we're just not. This is
Speaker 2: not going to We're not gonna let it slide anymore.
Speaker 2: We are the Raiders and we are going to be
Speaker 2: a different Raiders team then they've been for the last
Speaker 2: ten years. And it starts with things like this. I
Speaker 2: also do like the idea of getting Fernando some extra
Speaker 2: reps of the ones.
Speaker 1: For ad and reportedly like he's looked good. It's overall
Speaker 1: I've been trying to track, like how is this rookie
Speaker 1: camp going? And I think right now it's like par
Speaker 1: like it's ups, it's downs, it's flashes that you want
Speaker 1: to see. It's not it's not so good that it's
Speaker 1: making you think, oh, this is going to be Russell
Speaker 1: Wilson his rookie year and make you have to start him.
Speaker 1: But he has much tougher competition in Kirk Cousins, so
Speaker 1: we'll see. I think that that growth would actually come
Speaker 1: in the next two weeks. Then it would really matter
Speaker 1: right now. So if Fernando was going to go, I
Speaker 1: think it's going to be the next couple of weeks.
Speaker 1: You know who's been going. According to Jamison Hensley, I
Speaker 1: believe said this, who's been covering the Ravens for thirty years.
Speaker 1: He doesn't know if he's ever seen a rookie I believe,
Speaker 1: just rookie period, but definitely rookie receiver. You slash as
Speaker 1: much as Jacoby Lane. What are you doing, Huke?
Speaker 2: I'm wafting the good of that right there, because this
Speaker 2: was my guy. This was the fit for the Ravens.
Speaker 2: This is exactly what I thought might happen. I love
Speaker 2: to hear this so far.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's their number three receiver, I think, and I
Speaker 1: I wasn't sure about him, as you know, coming out
Speaker 1: of college, because he's all about the like acrobatic, contested
Speaker 1: catch that's a tough skill set. He's like a Brandon
Speaker 1: Lloyd type. But man, he has been rolling and it
Speaker 1: gives the often some shape. If he's a real number three,
Speaker 1: we'll see obviously it's early, but at this point I
Speaker 1: think the expectation is he's going to be the three.
Speaker 1: According to you know, the athletic jet tes Walker is
Speaker 1: probably the four, and then the other rookie right now,
Speaker 1: Elijah Surratt is probably.
Speaker 2: I like that group. That's a five that I could
Speaker 2: really get behind.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not going to go there. If Bateman
Speaker 1: is your two, and a rookie i've never seen play yet.
Speaker 2: Is your three? Telling you I got to see it.
Speaker 2: It's a diverse group. I liked the idea.
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, I'm with you for now. By the way,
Speaker 1: Ethan Pocik, who's their center that everyone expected to be
Speaker 1: their starter, hasn't played with the starters at all, but
Speaker 1: he's coming off a torn achilles, so they're like working
Speaker 1: him in slowly. The coaching staff says he's ramping up
Speaker 1: in that he will battle with Danny Pinter to be
Speaker 1: their center later in camp, but it's not necessarily his job.
Speaker 1: Peter Skaransky is a riser because he got major money.
Speaker 1: He is the number one paid guard in the NFL.
Speaker 1: He is the contract that I cited earlier, so I
Speaker 1: apologize for having the wrong money on Osiris Torrens. It
Speaker 1: was the four for one hundred and eighty eight million
Speaker 1: dollars guaranteed for Scroansky. I think a lot of tape
Speaker 1: knowers would put Scoransky in one of the best young
Speaker 1: guards in the league. So it makes sense that he
Speaker 1: is now locked in long term and the highest paid
Speaker 1: guard in the league because he was the next one up.
Speaker 1: He had really good I think development in terms of
Speaker 1: his run blocking and his pass blocking, and that showed
Speaker 1: up at the scrimmage. So did cam Ward really good
Speaker 1: numbers at the scrimmage. You know, we had a lot
Speaker 1: of team scrimmages. This used to be a bigger thing
Speaker 1: when teams would tackle to the ground, but a lot
Speaker 1: of teams practiced in the stadium over the weekend in
Speaker 1: their various stadiums. It'll be the last team scrimmage in
Speaker 1: Nissan Stadium because they have a new stadium open up
Speaker 1: next week or next year in Nashville. And Carnell Tate
Speaker 1: made some nice catches on that one, including a fancy
Speaker 1: one hander. If you're watching us now, you could say, oh,
Speaker 1: why wasn't why didn't Cam Wore just put it on him?
Speaker 1: I mean that that happens. But he also Carnel Tate
Speaker 1: put up three touchdowns on Sunday, the practice after the scrimmage.
Speaker 1: So Carnel Tate Wandale. This is a pretty diverse wide
Speaker 1: receiver group two and so far all systems go for
Speaker 1: everyone there.
Speaker 2: I just talked about Jakobe Lane being my guy. Charnel
Speaker 2: Tate was my guy in this class. He was wide receiver.
Speaker 2: He was a guy that you know, some people were
Speaker 2: shocked to see him go as high as fourth overall,
Speaker 2: making plays like that and making contested catches which they
Speaker 2: also threw up on their socials, and they've done it
Speaker 2: multiple times during this camp. He's doing everything that you
Speaker 2: expect him to do, and he's giving Cam Moore the
Speaker 2: number one receiver that he lacked, and hopefully they can
Speaker 2: kind of hit the ground running more or at least,
Speaker 2: you know, at a better stride than they were at
Speaker 2: this time last year under a new coach, a really
Speaker 2: strong offensive staff, at least on paper, new era, figure
Speaker 2: it all out, get into a rhythm instead of dealing
Speaker 2: with the dysfunction that they had to do deal with
Speaker 2: during Camboard's rookie year. I liked the some sneaky optimism
Speaker 2: coming out of Nashville.
Speaker 1: And I appreciate the positivity coming my way here from
Speaker 1: you know, a commenter, thank you for the Titans positivity.
Speaker 1: I know you had to dig deep. Not really, I'm
Speaker 1: excited to watch this offense and see what this team is.
Speaker 1: I think it's just a better division right now, so
Speaker 1: that that'll make it tricky for them. I mentioned the
Speaker 1: Colts earlier. By the way, I mentioned to put Seth
Speaker 1: McGowan while I'm thinking AFC South just seems like he's
Speaker 1: locking in rookie running back as their RB two. If
Speaker 1: you're curious in fantasy leagues, let's go with some Chargers winners.
Speaker 1: Tuley tou Ley Polotu is back in team drills. He
Speaker 1: hasn't signed his contract, but maybe there's some sort of
Speaker 1: agreement there of how they were going to handle it.
Speaker 1: He's practicing, so if if indeed that was a holden,
Speaker 1: it's over despite him not having a contract. I don't
Speaker 1: have much to say about the Chargers. I just wanted
Speaker 1: to note that like Rayshawn, Slater's been healthy. I know
Speaker 1: he missed some team drills for a couple of days,
Speaker 1: but then he was back. Lad McConkie healthy. A lot
Speaker 1: of hype around the running backs, Mitchell making a lot
Speaker 1: of big plays. Mike McDaniel saying Omari and Hampton has
Speaker 1: improved the most of any player on the roster. We'll
Speaker 1: be there Tuesday, so I don't want to spend too
Speaker 1: much time on them.
Speaker 2: Can I put something out there?
Speaker 1: Though?
Speaker 2: This is going to be the most enjoyable rushing attack
Speaker 2: to watch in the NFL this year. The lost Chargers.
Speaker 1: Okay, we will see. Maybe we'll get McDaniel on the show.
Speaker 1: I don't know. We've put in our requests. He was
Speaker 1: one of them. We'll see if we can get him
Speaker 1: on Tuesday. We'll be down there. That'll go up on Wednesday.
Speaker 1: Marshawn Lloyd is another guy I've monitored just staying healthy
Speaker 1: at Packers camp. He's their backup running back. But Josh
Speaker 1: Jacob's been in and out, so he's a guy who
Speaker 1: just hasn't been able to put together healthy weeks. Drew Aller,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give as a little bit of a Riser.
Speaker 1: I think he's probably the one standing out the most
Speaker 1: among the Steelers' backup candidates, So that's nice. In Minnesota,
Speaker 1: it's been a lot of outside zone running talk with
Speaker 1: former Dolphins coach Frank Smith, who is with Mike McDaniel.
Speaker 1: So they're all the players have been talking about. They're
Speaker 1: really excited, especially the offensive lineman Aaron Jones, about the
Speaker 1: new running game there. So we're gonna keep an eye
Speaker 1: on that outside zone there, and uh, I'm gonna go
Speaker 1: to Philadelphia next where we'll get to the receivers that
Speaker 1: have been out later. But Dantavian Wicks man, I think
Speaker 1: he is having a really strong camp and I think
Speaker 1: he's at the point, you know, Makai Lemon was kind
Speaker 1: of quiet and missed, has been missing time he's been
Speaker 1: out four or five days that Dantavian Wicks feels like,
Speaker 1: you know, he might be the two three along with
Speaker 1: Dallas Goddard in that offense behind Devonte Smith.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's there's a lot of like it's an
Speaker 2: interesting group, yes, like the same receiving group that it
Speaker 2: was a few years ago. So like there's intrigue, Like,
Speaker 2: I mean, Hollywood Brown is in this group. Elijah Moore
Speaker 2: is in this group, but you were kind of counting
Speaker 2: on Lemon filling out one of those top three spots,
Speaker 2: even though it's a rookie, and you should never you
Speaker 2: know fully count on rookies. I'm very curious to see
Speaker 2: what because we don't really know. Like this offense I
Speaker 2: think is going to look pretty different than it did
Speaker 2: in years past. Obviously new offensive coordinator and Sean Manion,
Speaker 2: but you also have this almost completely different receiving group now.
Speaker 2: And is there a possibility for Eli Stowers to become
Speaker 2: more involved behind Dallas Goddard as a glorified receiver who's
Speaker 2: listed as a tight end. A lot of things I
Speaker 2: want to really watch closely when they hit the field
Speaker 2: the preseason.
Speaker 1: It's optimism season, Chuck, So I just want you to
Speaker 1: be positive. It's why we've gone so long on the Risers.
Speaker 1: If you are listening to this, you know in your
Speaker 1: ears as a podcast, We'll take a quick break now
Speaker 1: and finish up with the Risers because I don't have
Speaker 1: as much negativity to talk about. We roll along and yes,
Speaker 1: we're taking your questions and maybe we'll have a little
Speaker 1: deeper of a dive on Aaron Donald's return, because we
Speaker 1: actually haven't talked about the impact football wise, that it's
Speaker 1: going to be later in the week, because it sounds
Speaker 1: like it's happening this week. It's now all but decided,
Speaker 1: and now the reports are that, like now that they're
Speaker 1: back at the team facility, could be happening this week.
Speaker 1: So we'll wait till that's official and we'll kind of
Speaker 1: break down a little bit how we see him fit
Speaker 1: into the offense, because I don't assume that he's going
Speaker 1: to be the Aaron Donald of old. At Eagles camp,
Speaker 1: which we were just talking about, like Jalen Carter is
Speaker 1: reportedly having an awesome camp after signing this new contract.
Speaker 1: It's like, you can't expect Aaron Donald to necessarily be
Speaker 1: the top of the top. Maybe he'll prove us wrong,
Speaker 1: but we'll get into him a little later in the week.
Speaker 1: The Cowboys are a team where overall, I don't think
Speaker 1: there's been a lot of news coming out of that camp.
Speaker 1: Ryan Florinoy having a good camp. Jayden Blue sounds like
Speaker 1: the backup running back there in Atlanta. What do you
Speaker 1: think of the Zachariah Branch comp to Jalen Waddle that
Speaker 1: to a tongue of II Loo trying to give him
Speaker 1: because there is a lot of Zachariyah Branch talk at
Speaker 1: Falcons camp right now.
Speaker 2: I mean, Zach Branch did himself a lot of favors
Speaker 2: by transferring to Georgia and then you know, having a
Speaker 2: successful time in Athens because he did not leave usc
Speaker 2: with that type of reputation. It continues up on the
Speaker 2: positive trajectory for Zach Branch. But I also do think,
Speaker 2: as we've acknowledged multiple times already tonight, that it is
Speaker 2: hyperbole season. So this is a group in which he
Speaker 2: could make me carve out a spot in the three
Speaker 2: and then maybe makes I think he'll make some plays.
Speaker 2: He's an athlete like he was, and he made some
Speaker 2: plays at Georgia. The jump to the NFL. Will see
Speaker 2: how well he adjusts to it. Sounds like so far
Speaker 2: he is, but again, like many cases, we'll see it
Speaker 2: on the field. First.
Speaker 1: Here's a thing. It is hyperbole season. It's not necessarily
Speaker 1: going to translate to the regular season. But what it
Speaker 1: does is it gives him the chance to do it.
Speaker 1: Like his camp I think has ensured he is going
Speaker 1: to have a big role Week one, and so we
Speaker 1: didn't know. You know, you just never know with rookies.
Speaker 1: They don't have many great players there. It's all you know,
Speaker 1: a Lamedea, it's Johan Dotson. I think he's going to
Speaker 1: cut into those guys playing time based on how it's looked,
Speaker 1: but also the preseason matters. The Falcons are a rare
Speaker 1: team though, getting some preseason like practice in because they
Speaker 1: are doing some live tackling. There's only a handful of
Speaker 1: teams left doing it, but the Falcons have done that
Speaker 1: a couple times. Despite the injuries that they've had. They're
Speaker 1: doing some live tackling. Let's go to the Giants, where
Speaker 1: I think Malachi Fields has probably stood out the most
Speaker 1: in their wide receiver group, maybe their wide receiver too.
Speaker 1: Malik Neighbors is steadily ramping up, but he has not
Speaker 1: even done seven on sevens yet, and so we're still
Speaker 1: watching that. I'm not I don't think it's necessarily a
Speaker 1: guarantee that he is starting or playing Week one. Darius Alexander,
Speaker 1: though their defensive tackle, was a rookie last year, does
Speaker 1: sound like he is starting. Had a really good camp
Speaker 1: in Detroit. I wanted to throw this one at you,
Speaker 1: like their biggest acquisition this year. Shook could be a
Speaker 1: McNeel Alien McNeil returning to twenty twenty four Alie McNeil
Speaker 1: because he was returning off the injury last year. He
Speaker 1: was hurt in twenty twenty four and by every rapport
Speaker 1: I listened to this, this podcast, the Lion's collective like
Speaker 1: he has been that dude at training cam and to me,
Speaker 1: that is huge. Their defensive line could look a lot different,
Speaker 1: a lot better this year if he is right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a presence that I mean, they just
Speaker 2: missed guys up the middle generally last year because McNeil
Speaker 2: coming off of injury and just a lack of depth there.
Speaker 2: Tyler Williams never really stepped up and did what a
Speaker 2: lot of people thought he would. Myself included having somebody
Speaker 2: back like that at their full strength after you know,
Speaker 2: battling through the challenges that come with playing through a
Speaker 2: season that came after a significant injury is always going
Speaker 2: to make you better because it all starts in the trenches.
Speaker 2: It's also going to be better for the rest of
Speaker 2: this group because, as the Lions have learned over the
Speaker 2: last few year's, depth is very important and they still
Speaker 2: never really quite found the ideal pairing with Aiden Hutchinson
Speaker 2: off the edge. That's no disrespect to want. I'm I
Speaker 2: actually love watching dj want to play football. But it's
Speaker 2: going to be more about the strength of the front
Speaker 2: four instead of just this edge and that edge. And
Speaker 2: because of a guy like Alee McNeil there, if you
Speaker 2: can make the whole group better, it's going to help
Speaker 2: out the entire defense and make your team better.
Speaker 1: So Levi Onwuzurique, who's been around this year like might
Speaker 1: not make that team from the sound of it. And
Speaker 1: Peyton Turner, the former Saints' first round pick like he
Speaker 1: hasn't been healthy at all, but some of the young
Speaker 1: players have stepped up. And then McNeil getting back and
Speaker 1: Tylee Williams looking better this offseason. We'll see. It's early,
Speaker 1: but Achmeda Hassenan is another player six round pick from
Speaker 1: a year ago who is believed to be really threatening
Speaker 1: to play a lot of snaps. So I just feel
Speaker 1: a little bit better about their defense now than I
Speaker 1: did a couple of weeks ago. The final thing rising
Speaker 1: other than just giving some love to Jordan love for
Speaker 1: like one particular throw, is competition at Texans practice I
Speaker 1: really tracked Seth Pain his YouTube channel and he's just
Speaker 1: saying like it's been going back and forth, which has
Speaker 1: been is nice to see instead of one way traffic,
Speaker 1: which it was apparently I think it was on Sunday's practice,
Speaker 1: the defense kind of fought back and totally dominated and
Speaker 1: make made the Texans defense her offense look a little
Speaker 1: bit more like last year that CJ. Stroud was stacking
Speaker 1: days and the running game was stacking days, and it's
Speaker 1: if you can just look competent against this Texans defense,
Speaker 1: it is a great way to get ready for the season.
Speaker 2: I need to know, well, I mean, first to hear
Speaker 2: that CJ. Stroud's stacking days in the running game stacking days,
Speaker 2: that tells me that the offensive line is also stacking days.
Speaker 2: And this is an offensive line that has been a
Speaker 2: sore spot for the Texans for the last few years,
Speaker 2: and it's also kind of been rebuilt recently. So, you know,
Speaker 2: does the arrival of a guy like Wyatt Teller help
Speaker 2: build out this group into a stronger unit, Because if
Speaker 2: they can actually fix what was going on up front,
Speaker 2: which was a lot better last year than two years ago,
Speaker 2: but if you can get even better now then maybe
Speaker 2: I'll believe in this offense again, and then maybe CJ.
Speaker 2: Stroud can show the whole world that he is the
Speaker 2: guy that was awesome as a rookie and hasn't been
Speaker 2: awesome in the last couple of years. If that happens,
Speaker 2: then that immediately vaults this team much higher up into
Speaker 2: the power rankings or whatever you want to call it
Speaker 2: of the NFL, because that's been their weakness.
Speaker 1: They've been whatever you want to call it. You've got
Speaker 1: power rankings, have we Has anyone announced that?
Speaker 2: No, it was just me trying to avoid attention, but yeah,
Speaker 2: this has been a defensive lighting team.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't care if anyone said it. If this
Speaker 1: is Exclusive Shook as the new power rankings guy at
Speaker 1: the NFL, we'll see where the Texans are. I would
Speaker 1: have them quite high. Tank Dell, who everyone's excited to
Speaker 1: see back in practice, it's still not fully back, I'm
Speaker 1: not I'm not sure how much we can count on
Speaker 1: him early in the season. We'll see. The final thing
Speaker 1: I just wanted to say as a winner was there
Speaker 1: was one throw from Jordan Love at the family night
Speaker 1: to Matthew Golden that it's just this just a thing
Speaker 1: of beauty. I don't know if there's anyone in the
Speaker 1: NFL that throws a pre to your ball than Jordan Love.
Speaker 1: And I know Christian Watson go get it, but soaking
Speaker 1: Matthew Golden down the field and I am really looking
Speaker 1: forward to that. I know we shouldn't scout camp on
Speaker 1: like highlight, but throughout that many people that could make
Speaker 1: a highlight like that shook. I think Jordan Love is
Speaker 1: gonna have like a monster season. Okay, I sign me
Speaker 1: up for that because he needs to after what happened
Speaker 1: last year.
Speaker 2: He needs to.
Speaker 1: Oh he was good, Las ended bad, just ended bad. Okay,
Speaker 1: let's go to the negatives. And we've put off talking
Speaker 1: about the biggest item of news since we last taped
Speaker 1: for a while. So these are the followers, the stock down,
Speaker 1: whatever you want to call it. At this point in camp,
Speaker 1: the commanders have had a rough camp and Laramie Tunsel
Speaker 1: tearing his triceps is absolutely brutal. I was really concerned
Speaker 1: about this offensive line even before this injury, and I
Speaker 1: know there was optimism for a variety of reasons of
Speaker 1: how the rest of the line like shaped up, but
Speaker 1: I also thought like these guys were drafted for a
Speaker 1: different type of system. It's a new system. They have
Speaker 1: a new center in Nick Allegretti, who's had a lot
Speaker 1: of injuries as a pro and has been out basically
Speaker 1: all of training camp. So now you're you know, you're
Speaker 1: into your backup, backup kind of at center, and Sam
Speaker 1: Cosmey's had injuries, and I know you're hoping Josh Connelly,
Speaker 1: who looked good at the end of last season, you know,
Speaker 1: steps up and continues it at right tackle. But it
Speaker 1: all kind of falls apart if Laramie Tunzel isn't there
Speaker 1: and torn triceps could knock them out for most of
Speaker 1: the season. It how it works a lot of times
Speaker 1: is how severe the tear is upon surgery depends on
Speaker 1: how long he'll be out, So, you know, the most
Speaker 1: optimistic it's probably closer to three months, but even that's
Speaker 1: half the season. And you have a guy in Brandon
Speaker 1: Coleman who has played a lot of left tackle, the
Speaker 1: young player, but there's a reason why they tried to
Speaker 1: replace him and moved him to guard.
Speaker 2: It's just just.
Speaker 1: A little bit of shaky footing, right. You know, you're
Speaker 1: having to sign stuff on Diggs, which I don't know
Speaker 1: if they really wanted to have to do, even though
Speaker 1: I think it's a good move, Like just it's a
Speaker 1: little uncertain right now with what's going on with the
Speaker 1: Washington commanders.
Speaker 2: And you you combine it with the uncertainty that comes
Speaker 2: with revamping almost your entire starting defense right like you're
Speaker 2: starting defense like it that I thought, you know when
Speaker 2: I said it, when I first kind of pointed it out,
Speaker 2: I thought it might being crazy dan Quinn's seat getting warm.
Speaker 2: But if the way that these types of things shape
Speaker 2: up and the pressure that mounts, like it all starts
Speaker 2: with jayde Daniels, but if you can't protect him, then
Speaker 2: you're gonna run into some of the same situations that
Speaker 2: you ran into last year. And so yeah, this is
Speaker 2: a legitimate concern, especially when you don't know what you
Speaker 2: have on the other side of the ball, the team
Speaker 2: you have, the defense with the it was worse than
Speaker 2: the NFL in terms of yards allowed per game last year.
Speaker 2: A lot of reasons to be a little uneasy at
Speaker 2: this point in camp.
Speaker 1: Another one, by the way, is that Trey Amos, who
Speaker 1: was their best cornerback last year, hasn't practiced basically at
Speaker 1: all at training camp. And then when he did return,
Speaker 1: he got hurt on his first day back. I also
Speaker 1: looked at this wide receiver Morass coming into training camp,
Speaker 1: remember that position battle. We were hoping Antonio Williams was
Speaker 1: going to step up kind of a They've really struggled
Speaker 1: to draft wide receivers. He's a slot guy. Stefan Diggs
Speaker 1: not just a slot guy, but probably best in the slot.
Speaker 1: He kind of blocks him. I haven't heard a lot
Speaker 1: about Antonio Williams at that camp. Not like the greatest
Speaker 1: sign there. Treylon Burks is maybe the outside receiver. So
Speaker 1: nothing to panic about. If you're a Commanders fans, like all,
Speaker 1: hope is not lost. But Laramie Tunsel's probably your most
Speaker 1: valuable player other than Jayden Daniels. So you know it
Speaker 1: is what it is like that that's as big a lot.
Speaker 1: There's a reason why they gave him a monster raise.
Speaker 1: He played awesome for them a year ago. So what
Speaker 1: we've done Shook is stayed disciplined and in some scenarios,
Speaker 1: most scenarios, I had winners early in the show for
Speaker 1: a team where I know I have losers, and that's
Speaker 1: the case for your Cleveland Browns where it's a little early,
Speaker 1: but like, should I be concerned that Spencer Fano has
Speaker 1: not won the left tackle job that actually it seems
Speaker 1: like Dwan Jones like might win it, and maybe they're
Speaker 1: just yeah, okay.
Speaker 2: Yes, you should be concerned. You spent the first round
Speaker 2: pick on this guy, a pretty high pick. He traded
Speaker 2: back to spend it, but he still spent a pretty
Speaker 2: high pick on him, and you did it with the
Speaker 2: conviction that he was polished enough and prepared to be
Speaker 2: able to step in and man that spot from day one,
Speaker 2: and he's just not there yet. And you should especially
Speaker 2: be concerned because Dwan Jones, who started as a rookie.
Speaker 2: You know, when he ended up taking the field as
Speaker 2: a rookie, he started off great. I mean he was.
Speaker 2: He was attracting all sorts of praise for not giving
Speaker 2: up sacks and just looking like a dominant player. He's
Speaker 2: been nothing like that over the last two years. I
Speaker 2: know he's dealt with injuries, but he hasn't been anywhere
Speaker 2: close to that. This is why a big reason why
Speaker 2: you went and rebuilt your whole offensive line. And we
Speaker 2: know the left tackle is the most important position on
Speaker 2: the line. So yeah, you should be concerned, especially given
Speaker 2: you don't know if he's going to play quarterback.
Speaker 1: Okay, good, And it might just be something where they're
Speaker 1: seeing what Dwan Jones looks like and you know, making
Speaker 1: Fano earn it. We'll see in trade like this is
Speaker 1: he's someone I really want to watch in the preseason?
Speaker 1: Is Fano?
Speaker 2: He was a guy that I didn't I wasn't as
Speaker 2: high on as other people working.
Speaker 1: Well, they were high on him the first tackle off
Speaker 1: the board, like they get they had their pick and
Speaker 1: they traded back and then they took them and it's
Speaker 1: part of like a bigger like, oh, all these names
Speaker 1: look good when they fix their offensive line and it
Speaker 1: looks better. But Elton Jenkins has missed a lot of camp.
Speaker 1: In fairness, both Elton Jenkins and Tevin Jenkins returned over
Speaker 1: the weekend, so right now they are healthy again. But
Speaker 1: both of them have had a lot of injuries in
Speaker 1: their career. Both of them have missed most of training
Speaker 1: camp so far or various points of training camp. They're
Speaker 1: back on the field right now, and it's just like
Speaker 1: crossing your fingers that those guys can stay healthy. Lane
Speaker 1: Johnson is a guy we had noted was not at
Speaker 1: training camp for much of the last week and we'll
Speaker 1: get to the cam Ward comment in just a little bit.
Speaker 1: Lane Johnson announced more or less that this is going
Speaker 1: to be his final season, and he didn't put a
Speaker 1: like one hundred percent promise, but he's going into the
Speaker 1: year with the idea that this is going to be
Speaker 1: his last season. Was a really interesting press conference. He
Speaker 1: was away from the team for four days. Not sure why.
Speaker 1: He said, it's just really hard being away from his kids,
Speaker 1: his family. He said both of his parents are having
Speaker 1: health issues. His mom said it as a cancer battle,
Speaker 1: so that might be part part of why he was
Speaker 1: away from the team. He also pretty pointedly mentioned it
Speaker 1: really bothers him, like the lack of recognition that he's
Speaker 1: got for everything that he's put his body through, and
Speaker 1: he sees he's like he's not in the top one hundred.
Speaker 1: And he's talked about in the past like he was
Speaker 1: second team All Pro and whoever, I forget who it was,
Speaker 1: you could look it up the first team All Pro
Speaker 1: from a couple of years ago, like how sacks that
Speaker 1: person gave up compared to Lane Johnson. It really bothered
Speaker 1: him that he was second team All Pro when he
Speaker 1: thinks he's the absolute best offensive lineman in the league.
Speaker 1: It's interesting that that is part of the reason, Like
Speaker 1: it's draining his energy from the sound of it. And
Speaker 1: he said he just wanted to come into this year
Speaker 1: with a clear mind. He's he's talked about his mental
Speaker 1: health issues too. It's a brutal position, he said, you know,
Speaker 1: concussions all that. One of the greatest players in Eagles history,
Speaker 1: just point blank, one of the best tackles of this century,
Speaker 1: point blank. If I did my top twenty five or
Speaker 1: twenty five, like he should maybe be on there. And
Speaker 1: just you know, looking forward to him getting his flowers
Speaker 1: over this last year, and it'll be interesting. You know,
Speaker 1: he's a guy who has a chance to win a
Speaker 1: third Super Bowl title with the with the Eagles this year.
Speaker 2: It's it's a thankless job to play tackle in the NFL,
Speaker 2: to really play any offensive line position in the NFL,
Speaker 2: but especially I think right tackle, because you're not the
Speaker 2: glorified left tackle. And I understand the frustration. I also
Speaker 2: think that this sounds like he's the guy who's overwhelmed
Speaker 2: right now and is also coming off of a very
Speaker 2: injury riddled season in which he tried to fight his
Speaker 2: way back and just couldn't do it. And that's draining.
Speaker 2: That is absolutely draining, especially when you put so many
Speaker 2: years of high level football into your career. But I
Speaker 2: will say that, like it could be a good thing
Speaker 2: that he's pretty upset or just like, you know, pissed
Speaker 2: off by the fact that nobody's ever really given him
Speaker 2: any recognition, because it's like, all right, this is your
Speaker 2: last year. Go prove him all wrong. Leave it all
Speaker 2: out on the field. Let's go get one great season
Speaker 2: out of him. I hope he can stay healthy, because
Speaker 2: you're absolutely right. He's a generational right tackle. He's been
Speaker 2: one of the best in the NFL throughout most of
Speaker 2: his career, and he's going to be somebody that's going
Speaker 2: to be very hard to replace once he packs it up.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he will be in Canton. We're going to go
Speaker 1: through the players that'll be eligible for a first time
Speaker 1: and just give a couple of quick thoughts on what
Speaker 1: happened in Canton and the induction this weekend. But Lane
Speaker 1: Johnson to me, is a no doubter first ballot Hall
Speaker 1: of Famer, So, yeah, you're right, he'll get his love
Speaker 1: this season. The offense has reportedly looked pretty good at camp,
Speaker 1: you know, considering it's a new offense and how many
Speaker 1: injuries they've had. McKay lemon and DeVante Smith have been
Speaker 1: out for most of the last week. It worries me
Speaker 1: McKay lemon, you know a little bit. I don't know
Speaker 1: if he was making you know, a huge, huge impact
Speaker 1: before that, so you wanted to get him on the field.
Speaker 1: Eli Stowers too, is their second round pick, not getting
Speaker 1: like a lot of love from the people watching on
Speaker 1: a day to day basis, might not be ready for
Speaker 1: much of a role there. Let's go to Detroit where
Speaker 1: we got the surprising news on Sunday afternoon. I'm not
Speaker 1: gonna say it made me emotional where I teared up,
Speaker 1: but because we've gone through this before with Teddy Bridgewater.
Speaker 1: But I was a little bit sad, not as sad
Speaker 1: as as Dan Campbell. Let's listen to.
Speaker 4: Him, but I feel like this is this is where
Speaker 4: it's out for sure right now, you know, this is
Speaker 4: where it needs to be and where he felt and
Speaker 4: his biggest word was letting us down. That's the type
Speaker 4: of guy he is, and he's not you know. That's
Speaker 4: that's as far as it can get so it's been
Speaker 4: a lot.
Speaker 1: Dan Campbell was with Teddy in New Orleans. Everyone who's
Speaker 1: big around Teddy Bridgewater just seems to love him. You
Speaker 1: do wonder. I don't know. Camp's tough. He's away from
Speaker 1: his family. He's a Florida guy.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 1: I have a feeling if some team really needs a
Speaker 1: quarterback in like November and just calls Teddy Bridgewater, he
Speaker 1: might be on the sideline again.
Speaker 2: But I mean, that's probably not what happened last year.
Speaker 1: One of my favorites exactly.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm actually moved by Dan Campbell being so moved.
Speaker 2: But yeah, but you're right. It just that goes to
Speaker 2: show what he's meant to the people that he's worked
Speaker 2: with in his NFL career. He's a guy who was
Speaker 2: a former first round pick who had his moments, never
Speaker 2: quite got some, you know, the flowers that maybe he deserved.
Speaker 2: He became a reliable back up. He stepped in in
Speaker 2: a big spot in New Orleans back in the day
Speaker 2: he was coaching high school last year. He's been through
Speaker 2: a lot in that this past year because he was
Speaker 2: trying to help his players out and you know, got
Speaker 2: penalized for it by the state and there's been a
Speaker 2: whole battle over that, allowing you know, coaches to help
Speaker 2: out their players financially.
Speaker 1: And Teddy Bridgewater a lot, He's got a lot of
Speaker 1: named after exactly.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so he's been through a lot, and I can
Speaker 2: understand you get this point in camp, we're just like,
Speaker 2: they don't have an in me anymore. But man, it's
Speaker 2: not often that you see a coach get emotional like
Speaker 2: that when a guy retires during camp. Usually like, yeah,
Speaker 2: he's retiring, next question. So you know where he has.
Speaker 1: Gotten the credit that he deserves over the years, Nick
Speaker 1: Schuck right there, you I mean, big two gloves guy
Speaker 1: between between around the NFL and now NFL Daily. How
Speaker 1: many I mean, how many people have podcasted more than me?
Speaker 1: I would say, you know, so like volume wise, I
Speaker 1: have done my part and probably overrated him at times.
Speaker 1: But in the perfect situation, you know, surround him with
Speaker 1: the right people. He was great some other down news
Speaker 1: with the Lions. By the way, they're signing Josh Dobbs,
Speaker 1: so that just passion, just makes total sense that he's
Speaker 1: the one replacing him the couple injuries there, SIONI Vaki
Speaker 1: their their backup running back candidate has a broken nose,
Speaker 1: so he's been out, and I mentioned Levi own Wuzurek
Speaker 1: been kind of struggling. Doesn't sound like he's necessarily even
Speaker 1: a lock to make that team. Isaac Slaw people were
Speaker 1: hoping would kind of make a big leap. Maybe not
Speaker 1: happening so far in camp. They have plenty of weapons there,
Speaker 1: but they would love him to develop a little more,
Speaker 1: so we'll keep an eye on that. There was a
Speaker 1: question or a comment that said cam Ward through a
Speaker 1: prettier deep ball than Jordan Love. I'm gonna put you
Speaker 1: on the spot. You can you can compare these two.
Speaker 1: Certainly shook, but I also will ask just like prettiest
Speaker 1: deep ball, this was Russell Wilson's terrain. Certainly Aaron Rodgers
Speaker 1: at his peak. Don't think he's he's there anymore, although
Speaker 1: he's got plenty plenty of juice. Still like prettiest deep
Speaker 1: ball in the league right now. I don't know who
Speaker 1: your contenders are, if you have anyone that would top
Speaker 1: those guys. If you agree with Ward over Love.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm, prettiest because prettiest is different than most effective. Yes,
Speaker 2: you got to put Josh Allen in there. He hasn't
Speaker 2: really had a field stretcher, but you got to put
Speaker 2: him in there because he's got a cannon. That's that's
Speaker 2: a debate that that's one that I would actually really
Speaker 2: like to dive into, because.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's a way of not answering Stafford is Stafford's
Speaker 1: is pretty is pretty.
Speaker 2: Pretty, He's but his passes are pretty no matter the distance.
Speaker 2: It's the thing. It's different. Sure, very it's a very
Speaker 2: specific argument to make here. I got to think about
Speaker 2: this more. But I mean, if you're just talking about
Speaker 2: Pat Mahomes when he had Tyreek Hill was a pretty
Speaker 2: deep ball.
Speaker 1: Sure. I mean, if you're just talking about a go
Speaker 1: ball down the sidelines, Jade, not many throw it better
Speaker 1: than Jalen Hurts. It's it's like, it's it's his, it's
Speaker 1: his skill. But set, I just I think Jordan with
Speaker 1: the Ward over Love one. I think Love is my
Speaker 1: choice for the prettiest. But reasonable minds can disagree. Let's
Speaker 1: go to the Patriots. I mentioned Will Campbell out of
Speaker 1: practice for a few days, and it highlighted something I
Speaker 1: haven't enjoyed reading about and hearing about. Greg Badard of
Speaker 1: Boston Sports Journal has been all over this, but I've
Speaker 1: heard it from a few of the other Patriots reporters.
Speaker 1: Caleb Lomu struggling quite a bit at at Patriots practice.
Speaker 1: He is the twenty one year old tackle that they drafted,
Speaker 1: so not ready. It sounds like to step into the
Speaker 1: starting lineup there and Will Campbell if there was never
Speaker 1: going to be a battle. But Will Campbell reportedly taking
Speaker 1: a nice step forward in his second camp. Should I
Speaker 1: be concerned, shook? Not that the first round pick who's
Speaker 1: not even starting anyways, is struggling, but that Tommy de
Speaker 1: Veto's team beat Drake May's team like handily in the
Speaker 1: scrimmage with points some sort of point system. I don't
Speaker 1: know what the point system is, like you get points
Speaker 1: for first downs, you get whatever. Divito beats Drake May
Speaker 1: in Gillette Stadium. Panic time for Drake May fans.
Speaker 2: It depends are they going against the ones of the twos?
Speaker 2: This is like they they mix it up. They mixed
Speaker 2: it in the same machinery. What's going on here?
Speaker 1: Yes, they mix it up? So like I was listening
Speaker 1: to the breakdown, it was like, well, Drake May had
Speaker 1: more like first team offensive lineman, but but de Vito
Speaker 1: had more receivers. But basically they tried to split the
Speaker 1: difference and they played with like the pible teams.
Speaker 2: Who they're playing against, that's the question. They playing against
Speaker 2: the same thing.
Speaker 1: They mixed kind of the ones in the twos to
Speaker 1: try to even out the teams, and uh, Divito's team,
Speaker 1: I think with a big day from Pop Douglas came
Speaker 1: out on top. I mean, I didn't love hearing that.
Speaker 2: It's just like, this is like when you are with
Speaker 2: your friends and you pair up or you like make
Speaker 2: groups of three and then you're just like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: I know my team stacked, like but it was supposed
Speaker 2: to be random draw. It feels like that's the kind
Speaker 2: of result of this.
Speaker 1: I've done this.
Speaker 2: I'll play some sort of multiplayer game with my friends
Speaker 2: and then we get into certain combinations and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 2: my team's in a crush, or I look at the
Speaker 2: group and I'm like, I got to carry the team
Speaker 2: because this is not a good group.
Speaker 1: Maybe it would be telling we should do this at
Speaker 1: different training camps, because it would be really telling to
Speaker 1: see who the quarterbacks take, you know, for their team,
Speaker 1: if they.
Speaker 2: Were allowed to draft them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because from the sound of it like Da Mario
Speaker 1: Douglas was, you know, the most productive guy and for
Speaker 1: whatever reason in this setting or maybe just this camp,
Speaker 1: and he knows the offense. It's a complicated offense, a
Speaker 1: lot of choice routes. McDaniels, he's done it for a
Speaker 1: couple of years. It's like, I think they would take
Speaker 1: him over Romeo Dobs And I.
Speaker 2: Think imagine if you're playing with like your third string tackle,
Speaker 2: and and you imagine you are the third string tackle
Speaker 2: but you're blocking for Drake Man and you're like, oh god,
Speaker 2: I really got to perform now because I'm on Drake's
Speaker 2: team instead of the third team.
Speaker 1: Carlton Davis has been out with a hamstring injury since
Speaker 1: the earliest part of training camp, which is just par
Speaker 1: for the course. But he played a lot last year,
Speaker 1: so maybe he just doesn't like to practice or can't
Speaker 1: stay healthy in practice, but he just never practices over
Speaker 1: the last four years for any team that he's on.
Speaker 1: And traveon Henderson like, if you're looking for the year
Speaker 1: two breakout, it might happen, but there's been nothing in
Speaker 1: camp to indicate that he has made up any ground
Speaker 1: on ramondre Stevenson. If anything, it's probably been the opposite
Speaker 1: in terms of patience and vision and the past protection
Speaker 1: stuff that they really value Remandre, So that's something. And
Speaker 1: then my guy Kyle Williams just seems a little buried
Speaker 1: on the depth chart, Like I assume he'll make the team,
Speaker 1: but he's not part of the top five, which is
Speaker 1: a little worrisome for a second year.
Speaker 2: I told you you're figuring this out, you might have
Speaker 2: to part with some guys that you hold near and
Speaker 2: dear to your heart, the AJ Brown effect.
Speaker 1: Here's what you do. You trade Kishon Booty for a third?
Speaker 1: Could we get a third? Could they get a third
Speaker 1: for a kis.
Speaker 2: That's a little hig unless the team's desperate.
Speaker 1: Some other followers will call him Jack. I've noted is
Speaker 1: not really in the top two for the Raiders at
Speaker 1: wide receiver, and they're really playing a lot of two
Speaker 1: tight ends on the field, so that's an important formation.
Speaker 1: And then I know, like when Trey Tucker or Jalen
Speaker 1: Naylor has been out, like they bump up Malik Benson,
Speaker 1: who's a rookie, maybe even ahead of Besh. So something
Speaker 1: to note. We we said that Kenyan Sadik the tight
Speaker 1: end for the Jets is gonna be out for a
Speaker 1: little while. That's a bummer. D'Angelo Pond's also their rookie
Speaker 1: has not practiced at training camp. Joseph aside, their big
Speaker 1: defensive end pickup has also not practiced at camp. Neither's
Speaker 1: Tovandre Sweat, their defensive tackle that they traded for. So
Speaker 1: a lot of injuries there on the Jets defense, which
Speaker 1: maybe helps explain some of you know, we talked about
Speaker 1: literally the defense, you know, you know they do like
Speaker 1: the practices under the lights. I forget the do the
Speaker 1: Steelers do it at the college that they do trading camp.
Speaker 1: I forget Saint Vincent College or whatever. The Steelers coach
Speaker 1: Mike McCarthy used to have something called the Mojo moment,
Speaker 1: which became a little famous when they did hard knocks
Speaker 1: and in Pittsburgh. He now calls it the Franco Moment
Speaker 1: in honor of Franco Harris because the immaculate reception, he said,
Speaker 1: was the ultimate mojo moment. It was kind of lucky,
Speaker 1: but whatever. Sorry, I don't know if he caught it.
Speaker 2: I don't know. If I was good, probably caught it.
Speaker 1: He probably caught it. It would have been a crime if
Speaker 1: they didn't give it to him. The mojo moment at
Speaker 1: the practice in front of the lights for the Steelers
Speaker 1: was okay, the first, second, and third team offense all
Speaker 1: going to get a chance to go do a drive
Speaker 1: down the field and score a touchdown. First team offense
Speaker 1: comes out, they gotta go down the field. It's Aaron Rodgers.
Speaker 1: This is you know, at this time of year, this
Speaker 1: is what you live for if you're Aaron Rodgers. First
Speaker 1: down and ten back to pass. Very first throw, he
Speaker 1: throws it inside a Roman Wilson, Jabell Dean cuts on it,
Speaker 1: picksick stabll Dean. There's your mojo moment. It's over. The
Speaker 1: drives over. You don't get another chance. That's the rules.
Speaker 1: It's over.
Speaker 2: The first I mean, I knew what was coming because
Speaker 2: I have the notes in front of me. But as
Speaker 2: soon as he said throws itto Roman Wilson, I thought,
Speaker 2: oh god, oh no, probably not.
Speaker 1: Roan Wilson supposedly having a good camp and is well
Speaker 1: ahead of Jeremy Bernard, the third round rookie. So there
Speaker 1: was a second round rookie. So that's a note. But yeah,
Speaker 1: not a good moment.
Speaker 2: Look, I have such a hard time reconciling this entire
Speaker 2: Steelers situation going into this year, because like Aaron Rodgers
Speaker 2: even said that he was basically sure he was done,
Speaker 2: and then they hired Mike McCarthy and and the door
Speaker 2: was basically closing on him coming back, and then they
Speaker 2: hire Mike, and Mike's foot goes in between the door
Speaker 2: and the doorframe and he keeps it open. And that's
Speaker 2: why Aaron Rodgers comes back. And then McCarthy shows up,
Speaker 2: and he's got all this love for Pittsburgh and it
Speaker 2: makes for good stories and good headlines during training camp.
Speaker 2: And he's got a new mantra tempered, you know, to
Speaker 2: like make a reference to steel making, and they're going
Speaker 2: to be tempered by training camp and become stronger and
Speaker 2: more durable and everything else. And yet part of me
Speaker 2: is like he brings the offensive genius to this and
Speaker 2: that's all great, but what are these Steelers gonna be?
Speaker 2: I don't know it.
Speaker 1: It's one play and uh, one of the viewers right now,
Speaker 1: what asked, didn't Jamal Dena pick six Roders? I do
Speaker 1: remember a Tampa one was Jamel Dean that would that
Speaker 1: would be incredible? And uh, and yeah, it's good good
Speaker 1: for the defense where I am excited about some of
Speaker 1: the things I've heard about this Steelers defense. There's they've
Speaker 1: been lining up the three edge rushers, Herbig, high Smith,
Speaker 1: and Watt together with Herbig kind of had an off
Speaker 1: ball lookeruation car package.
Speaker 2: Let's got Okay, that's cool.
Speaker 1: I love that Maxi Honatcher, who I mentioned a week
Speaker 1: ago on this very show you know, wasn't getting a
Speaker 1: lot of runs, started to get more run with the
Speaker 1: first team and reportedly looked really good. So he would
Speaker 1: have been in my risers. But he did that for
Speaker 1: a few days and then he got hurt and he's
Speaker 1: been out of practice now for about three days. So
Speaker 1: that's that's not a great sign. And then Brandon eccles,
Speaker 1: who is probably their starting nickel unlessen forgetting someone is
Speaker 1: in a boot or yeah, at least he's starting or
Speaker 1: playing a lot of snaps for them. He has been
Speaker 1: in a boot. Eric, our producer, is watching. He's enjoying.
Speaker 1: He lives for these Sunday nights for me making him
Speaker 1: drive in on Sundays in the middle of the summer
Speaker 1: to tape these shows. And he now has a rejoinder
Speaker 1: for the answer to the prettiest deep ball uh in
Speaker 1: the league. So I don't know what he's coming with here,
Speaker 1: but let's let's see Landing. He's home with the flock
Speaker 1: up shut down one more time. That was Carson Beck.
Speaker 1: You want to talk about losers, You want to talk
Speaker 1: about followers? How about me not being able to honk
Speaker 1: about Carson Beck and the greatest Hall of Fame ending
Speaker 1: of all night, all time. Now, we talked about how
Speaker 1: he played really well on our Thursday night show while
Speaker 1: Carson Beck was in there, but we didn't get to
Speaker 1: see Haines kang and finish off that game with a
Speaker 1: back and forth first ever Hall of Fame game where
Speaker 1: both teams were over thirty, Haines King with a buzzer
Speaker 1: beating run. Unfortunately, he's kind of in the follers too,
Speaker 1: shook because he heard his hamstring at some point in that
Speaker 1: game and is out for a few weeks. I don't
Speaker 1: know if you know.
Speaker 2: He toughed it out and took that running score in
Speaker 2: from five yards out at the buzzer, because that's what
Speaker 2: Haines King does, That's what he did at Georgia Tech.
Speaker 2: All he did was make plays with his legs. He
Speaker 2: was actually better runner than a thrower. And then he's
Speaker 2: throwing it all over the field on Thursday night, and
Speaker 2: then he runs it into cap the most electric Hall
Speaker 2: of Fame game ever by doing it in his fashion.
Speaker 2: But actually, that's good. That's a funny choice. Eric the
Speaker 2: Carson Beck ball because it's pretty. It was pretty, and
Speaker 2: he did it a few times. He got some Panthers
Speaker 2: defenders double moves a couple of times in that game.
Speaker 2: But my favorite moment from that was as you heard
Speaker 2: on the highlight there, you could probably hear the contact
Speaker 2: the stick from the defensive back who hit that receiver.
Speaker 2: Whole press box just went ooh when he got it.
Speaker 2: We were all surprised that he got up and celebrated.
Speaker 1: Some of the analysts looking at UESPN needs to calm
Speaker 1: down a little bit with like Carson Weck and Carson
Speaker 1: Beck needs to be in the mix to start, like,
Speaker 1: no one's running any defense here. I love that he
Speaker 1: passed this first test. Let's not draw too much from
Speaker 1: him other than it was it was fun to watch.
Speaker 1: It was fun to watch.
Speaker 2: It's funny that you mentioned that nobod's running any defense though,
Speaker 2: because I'm watching him like carve up the Panthers, and
Speaker 2: then there's like a third down there, like high red zone.
Speaker 2: They run a stunt and you can just tell because
Speaker 2: it's the first time you see any sort of defensive
Speaker 2: line action outside of a straight rush, and it immediately
Speaker 2: gets home in Sackson and they have to stittle for
Speaker 2: a vehicle and I'm just like, that's preseason in a
Speaker 2: nutshell right there. They finally actually did one stunt and
Speaker 2: it immediately worked right.
Speaker 1: And the thing I like the best was he had
Speaker 1: a little bit of pocket presence when when the when,
Speaker 1: and the pressure is coming from his right, just a
Speaker 1: nice little shuffle like them Like I'm no quarterbacks mechanics day,
Speaker 1: but it looked good and that's something I think that
Speaker 1: can potentially carry over. But I'm not gonna draw too
Speaker 1: many conclusions other than curious to watch them the rest
Speaker 1: of the preseason. A follower right now, I guess would
Speaker 1: be anyone else wanting to watch Patrick Mahomes in the preseason.
Speaker 1: Let's listen to Andy Reid who says, yeah, that's probably
Speaker 1: not happening.
Speaker 5: There's a pretty good chance, but I don't play him,
Speaker 5: and percentages are leading that way. I don't know if
Speaker 5: I'm playing the second or third game. I mean, I
Speaker 5: don't know that, so, but percentages probably leaning against doing
Speaker 5: that and letting the other guys. We've got new people
Speaker 5: in those other positions and behind him that need some work,
Speaker 5: and so the more reps they get, the better.
Speaker 1: A lot of questions, a lot of guys that I'll
Speaker 1: be curious to watch Week one for the Chiefs because
Speaker 1: mahome Is probably isn't gonna play in the preseason that
Speaker 1: just aren't all the way back, Like Xavier Worthy still
Speaker 1: out with his shoulder injury. We assume he'll be back
Speaker 1: at some point. Manswor Delane still non contact, Rashie Rice,
Speaker 1: it's just been this it's low ramp up period, but
Speaker 1: he's not like fully back, and just so really important
Speaker 1: players that just have had had some injuries. They have
Speaker 1: one on the offensive line right now too, I believe
Speaker 1: at right tack. You know, it's just a lot and
Speaker 1: we'll see. Steve spegnol I thought it was noteworthy he
Speaker 1: said he wants a little more vocal leadership and they
Speaker 1: miss Trent McDuffie and Jalen Cook. Pretty interesting for him
Speaker 1: to just say he just wants to hear the communication
Speaker 1: be a little better. Let's go to the Saints, who
Speaker 1: had some injury news. I'm concerned about Kristin Miller, their
Speaker 1: second round rookie has been out for most of the
Speaker 1: training camp. Was excited to see him play. They lost
Speaker 1: a depth piece, Dylan Raidin's at the offensive line was
Speaker 1: kind of their sixth or seventh offensive lineman, so for them,
Speaker 1: an important player. He tore his acl he's going to
Speaker 1: be out for the season. And then I didn't like
Speaker 1: the sound of how Kellen Moore talked about Cam Jordan's
Speaker 1: hamstring injury. It's tough to parse injuries this time of year,
Speaker 1: whether to mention them or not, but it just sounded
Speaker 1: the way that he talked that this could be a
Speaker 1: while and I just don't love to hear that out
Speaker 1: of camp Jordan. And they're a team that already lost
Speaker 1: Brian Berci for this season. Just their lines. I question
Speaker 1: the depth on both their lines and the risk that
Speaker 1: they have in terms of the injury possibility right now
Speaker 1: for both their lines. Just do mean that Saint's optimism
Speaker 1: a little.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm glad you mentioned the depth, because like on paper,
Speaker 2: your starting group more on the offensive line than the
Speaker 2: defensive line, looks still looks pretty solid for the most part,
Speaker 2: but yeah, depth, and we know depth matters, especially if
Speaker 2: you suffer. They're pretty thin, I think already on the
Speaker 2: defensive line after losing Perceieds. So it's like, yeah, you
Speaker 2: got to hope for some luck there to make sure
Speaker 2: that you can maximize what's possible with this team. And
Speaker 2: you're right dimming the optimism a little bit, although I
Speaker 2: still I'm on the optimism for you right now.
Speaker 1: I mean A Kimes picked them to win the division.
Speaker 1: I like them. I'm just like they could be a
Speaker 1: lot better and still only have seven wins, and that's okay.
Speaker 1: You know, that's okay.
Speaker 2: It's a winnable division.
Speaker 1: The rest of the division in terms of, you know,
Speaker 1: health right now, has has been like okay, I would say,
Speaker 1: and I mean the Panthers haven't had as much injuries lately.
Speaker 1: We're hearing Haines King by the way it was, I
Speaker 1: think he was hurt on that last play right now,
Speaker 1: But the rest of this show is probably gonna have
Speaker 1: a lot of little injury updates. We've got the follower situation,
Speaker 1: so I'm just going to roll through some injuries here,
Speaker 1: starting with the Bears. A little worried about Luther Burden,
Speaker 1: that Luther Burdon hype was out of control in the
Speaker 1: fantasy streets. I don't know if you knew about this.
Speaker 1: He has a groin injury that sounds like it's going
Speaker 1: to keep him out. I don't know if it's gonna
Speaker 1: be one week, if it's got to be three weeks,
Speaker 1: if it's going to be more. It's going to be
Speaker 1: somewhere in the middle. But a concern there. So you
Speaker 1: got a lot of like jday Walker, Zamian Thomas, I
Speaker 1: believe left practice on Sunday too. Not sure how serious
Speaker 1: that is. Braxton Jones and min to sweat their left
Speaker 1: tackle right now and their edge left practice not believed
Speaker 1: to be long term according to Ben Jonson. But then
Speaker 1: you go to their secondary and it's crazy. Cam Lewis,
Speaker 1: who was a replacement for Kobe Bryant, is also hurt
Speaker 1: right now. Jalen Jones, who was the replacement for Kyler
Speaker 1: Gordon in the slot, they're both out. Elijah Hicks is
Speaker 1: another guy hurt in the secondary. So you hate when
Speaker 1: it's clustered. It's early. We got a month to go here,
Speaker 1: but Dennis Allen at least in practice, he's going to
Speaker 1: be tested. I feel like the Bears. I I was
Speaker 1: making a list of the teams that have suffered the
Speaker 1: most injuries the most concerning aspects. They've obviously lost their
Speaker 1: left tackle too, Like they're high on that list.
Speaker 2: Yeah, them and the Panthers to the first teams that
Speaker 2: I think of when it comes to this stuff, and
Speaker 2: you're right, clustered is the most concerning part. You spread
Speaker 2: it out and you get one here, one there. You
Speaker 2: can still kind of find ways to navigate because you
Speaker 2: have such a large roster at this point in the process.
Speaker 2: But when it's a whole group, and especially when you
Speaker 2: talk about the secondary, like that's a secondary that welcomed
Speaker 2: new additions and now all of a sudden you're looking
Speaker 2: at Dylan Thinaman to kind of hold it down back there, kind.
Speaker 1: Of forgot about Dylan theena man hasn't really heard a.
Speaker 2: Good player at Oregon, but a rookie who has not Yeah,
Speaker 2: he hasn't really popped in camp either. So look, I'm
Speaker 2: not going to be one of those people that gets
Speaker 2: in the crowd that then lists the Bears as the
Speaker 2: number one regression candidates. So then Ben Johnson will just
Speaker 2: mention it in a press conference, but I do think that, yeah,
Speaker 2: this this qualifies for the followers right here in slight concern.
Speaker 1: Some injury news elsewhere that will point out that the
Speaker 1: Jaguars have been without both their tackles and Patrick McCarry
Speaker 1: at guard, Emmanuel Pregnan at guard who is a high pick.
Speaker 1: So like they're missing all sorts of tackles and offensive
Speaker 1: linemen right now. I mentioned some of the Giants receivers
Speaker 1: that were going up earlier, some of them going down,
Speaker 1: Jalen Hyatt, Isaiah Hodgens, Juju Smith Schuster. If I had
Speaker 1: to guess, those guys could be on the outside looking
Speaker 1: in in terms of even making the team. We talked
Speaker 1: about Josh Downs, who I do think ultimately will be
Speaker 1: a slot guy for the Colts later, but they just
Speaker 1: haven't been healthy. I also wanted to note that Cam
Speaker 1: Taylor Britt, their cornerback, probably their third or fourth cornerback,
Speaker 1: is suspended for one game for violating the personal conduct policy.
Speaker 1: We found out. And then a bummer report from Ian
Speaker 1: Rappaport this afternoon that Anthony Richardson could be cut or
Speaker 1: traded soon and that there's real concern about whether his
Speaker 1: eyes have fully recovered after that freak accident with the
Speaker 1: resistance ban before a game, which is really disappointing. There
Speaker 1: were a lot of reports shook that he's had a
Speaker 1: big problem with catching shotgun snapped. It's like a bummer man.
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I know people like to pick on
Speaker 1: him how he came into the league. He was a
Speaker 1: twenty one year old kid who had some real wow
Speaker 1: plays and I know he was getting replaced anyways by
Speaker 1: Daniel Jones, but that injury is is depressing and for
Speaker 1: Ian Rappaport to go public with that report makes me
Speaker 1: think that trade or cut could be coming as early
Speaker 1: as like next week.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And if it's because that's not just like poor performance,
Speaker 2: that's a lack of ability to pro I mean it's quarterback.
Speaker 2: You have to have your eyes, you know, it's one
Speaker 2: of your greatest tools is your eyes. And if you're
Speaker 2: struggling to catch shotgun snaps, that mean that tells me
Speaker 2: that the rest of the picture is probably not very
Speaker 2: clear for you either. So it's it goes from being like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is a guy who didn't work out there, it's like, oh, damn,
Speaker 2: like not he doesn't even have a chance because now
Speaker 2: he's being held back by a freak accident. That's it's
Speaker 2: just that's unfortunate.
Speaker 1: It stinks another young quarterback who's at as Sarah struggles.
Speaker 1: Certainly is a lot of attention on him. JJ McCarthy
Speaker 1: hasn't felt like Kyler Murray's exactly crushed it in this competition,
Speaker 1: But the longer it goes on on the disparity in
Speaker 1: terms of first team reps is just noticeable. So I
Speaker 1: like how Luke Bron, who hosts Locked on Vikings, put
Speaker 1: it on Blue Sky the other day. He basically said
Speaker 1: multiple things can be true that JJ McCarthy does look
Speaker 1: a little more controlled this year, like he's a little
Speaker 1: more under controlled, there is improvement there, and that Kyler
Speaker 1: Murray has a couple like wild misses every day that
Speaker 1: you're just like, huh, like is he picking everything up?
Speaker 1: And yet when you just watch the whole back and
Speaker 1: forth and you're there every day, and then certainly how
Speaker 1: the reps are stacked, there's only one takeaway, which is
Speaker 1: that Kyler is running away with this. So I just
Speaker 1: think that's kind of where we're at in terms of
Speaker 1: the Vikings battle. This is a Sunday night show. If
Speaker 1: you're watching us, you know we're doing it every Sunday
Speaker 1: evening and it has been a little interactive, and you know,
Speaker 1: we got the tip that Jamel Dean picked off Aaron Rodgers.
Speaker 1: What the hell, Eric Roberts he found the play. Let's
Speaker 1: listen to it back in twenty twenty the COVID year.
Speaker 1: Every time he.
Speaker 3: Catches the ball, you see Rogers he's kind of smiling
Speaker 3: and laughing because he's just kind of taking Tanya.
Speaker 1: In since the first time he saw him, and just
Speaker 1: loves the way he plays the game.
Speaker 2: Bashes pecks, intercept it back the other way.
Speaker 6: Touchdown Tampa Bears intercepted by Jamel Dean.
Speaker 1: There is no other show on the interwebs, in the
Speaker 1: in the blogosphere anywhere, if any that even exists anymore,
Speaker 1: that is finding Jamel Dean highlights mid show and then
Speaker 1: playing them. You want to know why, because they don't
Speaker 1: even have the permission.
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, that's right, NFL media advantage, that
Speaker 2: still happens. That's Aaron Rodgers targeting DeVante Adams in a
Speaker 2: stadium that the broadcast is pomping crowd noise into because
Speaker 2: there's like nobody there, because it was a pandemic weeding
Speaker 2: get up.
Speaker 1: If I remember correctly, that was like his first pick
Speaker 1: six in a very long time, because Rogers has only
Speaker 1: thrown I don't know what it is now, but at
Speaker 1: the time that was only his third career pick six,
Speaker 1: which was crazy. He was on a wild streak of
Speaker 1: like years without having a pick six. And so yeah,
Speaker 1: Jamel Dean, he just gets after him, charges Faller right
Speaker 1: now before we go to their camp, I think Trevor
Speaker 1: Penning has kind of been eliminated from their competition at
Speaker 1: left guard, which is about four way four ways deep
Speaker 1: at this point, which is interesting, like they just can't
Speaker 1: decide anything. The Packers offensive line, certainty is another one.
Speaker 1: They're just totally up in the air, I think because
Speaker 1: of injuries, because of how the offensive line is playing.
Speaker 1: And that's about it in terms of our risers and
Speaker 1: follers for this second full week of training camp. But
Speaker 1: we do have one other thing to talk about to
Speaker 1: end the show, and that's the Hall of Fame speeches
Speaker 1: in the ceremony. Obviously, it's a great weekend in camp.
Speaker 1: Campton and Drew Brees, I think had a really strong speech.
Speaker 1: You can tell how well he prepared for that speech.
Speaker 1: I know that the Saints fans and the media in
Speaker 1: my life was like really fired up as emotional. How
Speaker 1: many people were there, some all those old Saints. That's
Speaker 1: one of the coolest things to see. Who comes out
Speaker 1: and you're like, is that Brandon Coleman in the crowd
Speaker 1: with Drew Brees and Michael Thomas and Lance Moore and
Speaker 1: some of the current players like Alvin Kamara and Cam
Speaker 1: Jordan were there, and Sean Payton getting teary eyed, and
Speaker 1: that was really fantastic for mister Saint. And I think
Speaker 1: of Larry Fitzgerald the same way and what he meant
Speaker 1: to the Cardinals. Adam Vina Terry a little different, you know,
Speaker 1: because he means a lot to two different franchises. He
Speaker 1: had one of the most surprising Hall of Fame speeches
Speaker 1: of all time. He went blue, not like Colts blue,
Speaker 1: just like I'm gonna pretend I'm a stand up comedian
Speaker 1: for like fifteen minutes blue. Let's listen to him, you know,
Speaker 1: relate his wife to Pat McAfee.
Speaker 6: Hey, Pat McAfee's here in the crowd today.
Speaker 2: Great to see you, brother.
Speaker 1: The only person who enjoyed holding.
Speaker 6: My balls more than my wife. She held for me
Speaker 6: in the off season when everyone else was gone, Ye,
Speaker 6: get that right.
Speaker 1: Adam, what are you doing at him? The first joke
Speaker 1: was the first joke was great McAfee. If you watch
Speaker 1: the video, interesting reaction. If you know, you know Vinitary.
Speaker 1: I think if he was a stand up and he's
Speaker 1: testing out the material, I think he realizes, don't follow
Speaker 1: it up with the holding it in the off season,
Speaker 1: like you nailed it with the first joke, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. It almost got a little weird afterwards,
Speaker 1: and it was unnecessary, but he nailed it. He nailed
Speaker 1: the delivery. Didn't nail the Belichick joke as much. Did
Speaker 1: you happen to see that one? No?
Speaker 2: I did not hear the Belichick joke.
Speaker 1: I didn't even want to play it here because he
Speaker 1: like kind of killed the delivery. But essentially, yeah, Belichick
Speaker 1: couldn't make it because you know, he was, you know,
Speaker 1: probably busy with unc and also evaluating you know, his
Speaker 1: girlfriend's cheerleading competition over the world.
Speaker 2: Oh, it was just like wow, Wow, is there is
Speaker 2: there animosity there between Minitary and the Patriots.
Speaker 1: I mean he basically cut him, so yeah, true, send
Speaker 1: him to agree long memory some of some players of
Speaker 1: long memories, and maybe like he he immediately followed it
Speaker 1: up with and I think he's the greatest coach of
Speaker 1: all time. Like he was quick to do that, and
Speaker 1: he did give like respect in other ways. But look,
Speaker 1: if if Bill Belichick didn't handle that situation well, and
Speaker 1: they haven't really talked much since, like that's the risk
Speaker 1: you take. I guess is in the very blue Hall
Speaker 1: of Fame speech, Vinattieri doesn't really give you that much love.
Speaker 1: Like he did a whole bit on you know, Peyton
Speaker 1: Manning's forehead, but it was like the it was like
Speaker 1: maybe he like maybe had a drink or something and
Speaker 1: went like a little like the tone was just like
Speaker 1: a little too too hard. I don't know, maybe I'm
Speaker 1: just getting soft in my old age. I loved I
Speaker 1: like the balls joke.
Speaker 2: Then yeah, yeah, I actually think it's a little refreshing
Speaker 2: to not I mean, look, you're talking to somebody who
Speaker 2: who used to volunteer with the local committee to like
Speaker 2: set up and tear down and do all the stuff
Speaker 2: behind the scenes and serve wine at the Cold Jacket
Speaker 2: dinner and stuff like that. I did that when I
Speaker 2: was like twenty one right with my dad, and it
Speaker 2: was like at the highlight of it basically signaled it
Speaker 2: was the start of the football season and it was
Speaker 2: my dad one of my dad's favorite things. But what
Speaker 2: I often did during those times is they didn't have
Speaker 2: time limits. There's no band to play them off. And
Speaker 2: I one year I was guarding Michael Strahan's row with
Speaker 2: Kelly Rippa and everybody else. I was personal detail at
Speaker 2: that row on a knee, listening to speeches for like
Speaker 2: hours long, like ninety minute speeches.
Speaker 1: So there was no ninety minute speeches. I used to tractice.
Speaker 1: Back in the day, there were some like thirty five
Speaker 1: to forty minutes speeches. Now they say they cap it.
Speaker 1: I think at twelve some people still go like way over,
Speaker 1: but they really like they try to make it way tighter.
Speaker 1: Some people still go fifteen to twenty whereever, but in
Speaker 1: general it is a tighter operation. Agree with their comments.
Speaker 1: Are angry at that kickers are just weird.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I mean they are only part of the
Speaker 2: team in like that their inclusion on the roster. They
Speaker 2: go out of the field and practice separately from everybody else.
Speaker 2: They spend most of the time hanging out in the
Speaker 2: locker room, in the trainer's room, and then they come
Speaker 2: on for special teams periods and that's it. So of
Speaker 2: course they're gonna be a little weird.
Speaker 1: And I always do wonder if Vinetteri hit so many
Speaker 1: of the biggest clutch kicks of all time, including you know,
Speaker 1: the one in the snow not to win the game
Speaker 1: in the tuck role, just to get to overtime, and
Speaker 1: then he hit one in overtime to win the game
Speaker 1: that was close, but the epic one was to send
Speaker 1: it to ot. I always wonder if like his blood
Speaker 1: pressure ran low, because I forget if it was a
Speaker 1: preseason game or like an early regular season game early
Speaker 1: in his career when Parcels basically told him, like, if
Speaker 1: you don't turn around, like you're gonna get cut. And
Speaker 1: he went out there that day and he hit his
Speaker 1: kicks nothing. You know, if you're a rookie, and then
Speaker 1: you can solve that earlier in your career, like you're
Speaker 1: going to be a great kicker moving forward, at least
Speaker 1: if you're at in Minitarry. There were some poignant moments,
Speaker 1: you know, Roger Craig revealed in a in a taped
Speaker 1: induction that you know he has dementia and you know,
Speaker 1: talked about that. His doctors do believe that, you know,
Speaker 1: it came from playing football. He also had many incredibly joyous,
Speaker 1: beautiful moments, including the Friday night ceremony with Eddie Departalo,
Speaker 1: his former owner, getting the gold jacket. It was it
Speaker 1: was great. Roger Craig is just an effusive guy, but
Speaker 1: you know, a tinge of bitter suite of what it
Speaker 1: cost him, and you can't help but think about, like
Speaker 1: Luke Keekley is there getting inducted, just the all time panther,
Speaker 1: and one of the reasons he left the game because
Speaker 1: of his concussion issues was he just didn't want to
Speaker 1: risk that. And just those two guys getting inducted on
Speaker 1: the same weekend was poignant, and congratulations to all of them.
Speaker 1: Before we go, I just you threw this out at me.
Speaker 1: I thought it was a great idea. The twenty twenty
Speaker 1: seven class inductees are crazy, Like if your Tory Holt
Speaker 1: or these guys that have been waiting year after year
Speaker 1: and you look at who's coming the next couple of years,
Speaker 1: it is so stacked. This is ridiculous. Here's the list
Speaker 1: of the people eligible for the first time next season.
Speaker 1: I'm going to list them in the order. I'm going
Speaker 1: to be specific here, shook of who I think has
Speaker 1: the best chance to make it right away, not who
Speaker 1: I think should. That's a little bit of a different question. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: if you want to know should, you could ask. But
Speaker 1: Rob Gronkowski Adrian Peterson, you could flip those two. But
Speaker 1: I think those two got to go in. Ben Roethlisberger,
Speaker 1: who I'd be shocked if he's not a you know,
Speaker 1: a first ballot. And yet I've heard some people disagree.
Speaker 1: Richard Sherman, Antonio Brown, Gerald McCoy, Andrew Whitworth, Cam Newton,
Speaker 1: Eric Weddle, Alex mack. Then we're getting you know deeper,
Speaker 1: Le'Veon bell of guys that you know probably gotta wait.
Speaker 1: But like in a normal year, I think Gerald McCoy
Speaker 1: would be like a like the third guy usually like
Speaker 1: he's made a lot of all pros and he's way
Speaker 1: down this list. Gronk, Adrian Peterson, Big, Ben Sherman. Those
Speaker 1: are four guys who have a great argument to get
Speaker 1: in right away. Antonio Brown's going to be an interesting conversation,
Speaker 1: I'm sure they'll make him. Wait, he might be the
Speaker 1: latest quarter the greatest wider seer I've ever covered. I
Speaker 1: really think he's that good. To me, he actually is
Speaker 1: a no doubter. It's like that is a lot amazing group.
Speaker 1: Andrew Wilworth might be a no doubt. I don't even know.
Speaker 1: That is a crazy, crazy group. I don't know, like
Speaker 1: where you would stack those guys? What you think about
Speaker 1: all those great players at once.
Speaker 2: Your slam dunk first ballots have to be Gronk and
Speaker 2: Adrian Peterson, and then from there it's essentially who else
Speaker 2: do we have to get on the list that has
Speaker 2: already been eligible before? Do any of these guys surpass them?
Speaker 2: It's going to get comp and this is what happens
Speaker 2: is every year that passes that some of these guys
Speaker 2: don't make it. The backfield tends to come in and
Speaker 2: kind of overtake them. And especially when it's a strong
Speaker 2: group like this, I would like to see Whitworth. I
Speaker 2: don't think he's going to be a first ballot, but
Speaker 2: I think that the longevity, the high level of performance
Speaker 2: the second act of his career with the Rams should
Speaker 2: get him in quickly. I don't think he'll be a
Speaker 2: first ballot, but I think Gronk and ap are pretty
Speaker 2: much like two slam dunks.
Speaker 1: Yeah, with Whitworth Walter Payton Man of the Year he
Speaker 1: left on that and a title and a first team
Speaker 1: All Pro to first team All pros. I think it's
Speaker 1: total blasphemy that Ben Roethlisberger wouldn't be a first ballot
Speaker 1: Hall of Famer. That is, and I'm not like a
Speaker 1: rings guy because that that's not about that. It's about
Speaker 1: that he was one of the three to five best
Speaker 1: quarterbacks in the league and was weirdly underrated.
Speaker 2: And the second half his career. Yeah, and don't I
Speaker 2: don't think he's gonna get crazy. I think a second,
Speaker 2: I think he's probably a second guy. And that's the
Speaker 2: thing is, how many of these guys do you pick
Speaker 2: from that are newly eligible from the first say.
Speaker 1: At least at least those three would be my answer
Speaker 1: to that question, and then Sherman that I'd have to
Speaker 1: compare it to the other guys that are waiting, because
Speaker 1: I have a feeling if I look at the guys
Speaker 1: who didn't make it this year, that i'd have Sherman
Speaker 1: probably ahead of a lot of them. In Whitworth. You know,
Speaker 1: then he's in that mix, and we'd have to get
Speaker 1: deeper into the conversation. Antony Brown's the toughest one. I
Speaker 1: agree with the take that you know, people are going
Speaker 1: to punish him for everything off the field. He's one
Speaker 1: of the greatest wide receivers I've ever seen, point blank.
Speaker 2: I mean that's that. The idea of him giving a
Speaker 2: speech has probably got some people nervous though.
Speaker 1: And I know you can discount like that. He probably
Speaker 1: hurt his team at times because of the way that
Speaker 1: he acts, and so that's why, like if you a
Speaker 1: year or whatever. He also was a four time first
Speaker 1: team All Pro. His stretch this is this is a
Speaker 1: thing for another day, his stretch from twenty thirteen to
Speaker 1: twenty seventeen, Like he was playing at the same time
Speaker 1: as Megatron and Andre Johnson. He would I thought he
Speaker 1: was better than them, Like yeah, anyways.
Speaker 2: I don't know if he was at the time, at
Speaker 2: the time he was, yeah, yeah, he's right there, yeah definitely,
Speaker 2: just like yeah, yeah, and the man.
Speaker 1: Those Steelers, I don't know. People love the Steelers, so
Speaker 1: they'll probably all get in. We love the Steelers, We
Speaker 1: love all thirty two teams equally even if you say
Speaker 1: that we don't, and we're going to be covering them
Speaker 1: all week long. Shook, thank you. We'll be doing this
Speaker 1: again next Sunday night. So check us out, then check
Speaker 1: us out in the feed. Hit that music, Eric, let's
Speaker 1: get out of here. We are going to be welcoming
Speaker 1: Jordan Rodrigue back onto the program on the show that's
Speaker 1: going to go up on Monday. We are doing NFC South.
Speaker 2: We haven't.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm like, which South have been? We've done. Trevor
Speaker 1: Sikima fan favorite already also coming back on the show
Speaker 1: on Monday for that. Join us then