1 00:00:07,440 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: Welcome to Creature feature production of iHeartRadio. I'm your host 2 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:15,960 Speaker 1: of Many Parasites, Katie Golden. I studied psychology and evolutionary biology, 3 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:18,759 Speaker 1: and today on the show, we're giving the creature Kringle 4 00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 1: Time's reindeer a break and hiring some new mystical steeds 5 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:25,720 Speaker 1: to carry kringle claus sleigh, and using a bit of 6 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 1: Kringle Time magic, we're bringing some megafauna back from extinction, 7 00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: discover some unforgettable ungulates as we answer the age old 8 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:41,160 Speaker 1: question or dragons herbivores. Joining me is friend of the pod, 9 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:44,560 Speaker 1: friend of ungulates everywhere, and host of the show, secretly 10 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:47,720 Speaker 1: incredibly fascinating Alex Schmidt. 11 00:00:47,800 --> 00:00:51,000 Speaker 2: Hey, Katie, it's amazing to be here at especially thank 12 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:54,600 Speaker 2: you for teeing up megafauna. It's very very excited. I 13 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:57,720 Speaker 2: love it. Yeah, mammals in both the bison and my 14 00:00:57,760 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 2: heart as dancing around very hippy. Yes, I have fun. 15 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:09,039 Speaker 1: Well look at the size. So yeah, we're all about 16 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:11,880 Speaker 1: ungulates today, Alex, do you like an ungulate? 17 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:16,640 Speaker 2: I think I learned the word ungulate from a Far 18 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 2: Side cartoon. I don't know how many other people had 19 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:22,080 Speaker 2: that experience, but there's it's like a guy in a 20 00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:27,720 Speaker 2: back alley. It's like the strip is like a guy 21 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:29,840 Speaker 2: in a back alley. It's the trope of like a 22 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:32,640 Speaker 2: guy with a coat full of illicit watches or whatever. 23 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 2: But it's a guy in a back alley saying, hey, 24 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 2: you want to buy an ungulate, and then there's a 25 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:40,880 Speaker 2: bunch of like antelope and the shadows. It's great, Oh my. 26 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 1: God, that's amazing. That's amazing black market ungulate. Yeah, they 27 00:01:47,440 --> 00:01:51,600 Speaker 1: are a clade of quadruped mammals. Typically they've got hooves. 28 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:57,080 Speaker 1: This includes animals you'd probably expect like horses, deer, cows, camels, 29 00:01:57,120 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: and sheep, but also animals you might not expect, like rhinos, draftes, 30 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:06,760 Speaker 1: tape ears, and even cetaceans, which is dolphins in whales. 31 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:10,639 Speaker 1: And the reason dolphins and whales are in that clade 32 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:16,720 Speaker 1: is they evolved from terrestrial ungulate ancestors, so they do 33 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,800 Speaker 1: not have those they are. You know, thinking of a 34 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:23,239 Speaker 1: dolphin as an ungulate is very strange, but they are 35 00:02:23,639 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 1: in that clade because they did evolve from weird little 36 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 1: deer things. 37 00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:32,520 Speaker 2: I didn't know. They got to remain in the club. 38 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 2: That's amazing. 39 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, they're still in the club. I mean, I don't. 40 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:38,440 Speaker 1: I think if you called a dolphin an ungulate, you 41 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: might get some weird looks. But they are technically in 42 00:02:41,919 --> 00:02:45,480 Speaker 1: the same clade as ungulates, so you know, you might 43 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 1: get some side eyes. You're like, yeah, dolphins is an. 44 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:53,160 Speaker 2: Ungulate because I care about scientific accuracy and I also 45 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:55,959 Speaker 2: care about, you know, fitting in with the cool marine 46 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 2: biologists exactly. So it's important to. 47 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:03,000 Speaker 1: Kind of a west side story situation where you have 48 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 1: the marine biologists and then the terrestrial animal biologists snapping 49 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 1: their fingers and. 50 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:13,239 Speaker 2: Right, the sharks and something besides the chats, the silicants 51 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:16,440 Speaker 2: or whatever old ocean thing they care about. 52 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, theikitas in the chevrotanes sounds really badass, but those 53 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:27,200 Speaker 1: are two of the cutest examples of cetaceans and ungulates. 54 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:30,560 Speaker 1: So first, let's talk about what a hoof is. So 55 00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:36,280 Speaker 1: not all ungulates have hoofs, but most hoofed animals are ungulates. 56 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:40,120 Speaker 1: A hoof is the tip of a toe of an 57 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:44,120 Speaker 1: animal where the nail or claw has evolved into a 58 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:48,080 Speaker 1: very thick and hard, caratinous chunk that the animal can 59 00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 1: walk on. So there are both even toed ungulates like 60 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:56,760 Speaker 1: deer who have an even number of toes on each foot, 61 00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 1: or the odd toed ungulates like horses who walk on 62 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 1: an odd number of toes. For instance, horses walk on 63 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:09,400 Speaker 1: one big old toe which has grown to incredible proportions, 64 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:16,240 Speaker 1: so uh, yeah, they're just walking on their tiptoes. Ungulate 65 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:21,760 Speaker 1: legs are typically pretty interesting anatomically. So the part of 66 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: the horse that you would probably think of as the 67 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:29,840 Speaker 1: knee is actually its wrist. So that big knobby thing 68 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 1: on the horse, you're like, that's where its knee is, right, 69 00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 1: that's where it's walking. That's its ankle and or wrist. 70 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:44,040 Speaker 1: So below that are the elongated, infused bones of the metacarpals. 71 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 1: In humans, the metacarpals are actually that first segment of 72 00:04:48,279 --> 00:04:51,480 Speaker 1: our fingers and toes. You guys can't see it because 73 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 1: I'm in your ears, but I'm showing Alex my fingers 74 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 1: because this is the metacarpals. 75 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 2: So so yeah, it's just the rest of it is 76 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:04,839 Speaker 2: Katie's hoof. Actually it continues into her head. 77 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 1: And they fuse into a single horrifying hoove that I 78 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:13,960 Speaker 1: like to prance around on, which is, you know, really 79 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:18,920 Speaker 1: an interesting image. But yeah, I mean, basically, horses are 80 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:24,240 Speaker 1: walking on one long toe. So that's interesting and a 81 00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:25,240 Speaker 1: little bit upsetting. 82 00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:29,840 Speaker 2: I guess this is really changing my whole understanding of horses, 83 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:33,320 Speaker 2: Like the whole essentially bottom half of what I think 84 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 2: of as their leg is basically a foot. Like that's incredible. 85 00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 1: Yeah wow, yeah, so like freaky yeah, because if you 86 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:46,279 Speaker 1: think of a horse leg, it bends in like three 87 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:49,360 Speaker 1: places kind of. So you've got the shoulder part, but 88 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:52,440 Speaker 1: then under that you have the actual knee and or elbow, 89 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:56,720 Speaker 1: and then under that you have where you would kind 90 00:05:56,760 --> 00:06:02,239 Speaker 1: of think the knee would go is actually the wrist 91 00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:05,240 Speaker 1: or ankle joint, and then below that you have the 92 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 1: finger joints. 93 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:10,000 Speaker 2: So it's weird. Yeah, it's like I'm thinking of that 94 00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 2: meme where it's like how would a dog wear pants? 95 00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:14,840 Speaker 2: And it's either across or at the back, Like now 96 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:17,000 Speaker 2: I'm thinking of how would a horse wear shoes? And 97 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:19,839 Speaker 2: the shoe is like half the leg, you know, because 98 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 2: it's it's the foot or whatever. Freaky. 99 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 1: H I think there's some kind of drawing of like 100 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:29,600 Speaker 1: what a human would look like with horse proportions. 101 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:33,480 Speaker 2: Oh, it's called Bowjack Horsemen. It's a very good show. 102 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 2: A lot of people like it. 103 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 1: There's a lot of fun diagrams of people walking like horses, 104 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 1: and it's showing sort of the the similar stuff. Well, 105 00:06:42,680 --> 00:06:45,800 Speaker 1: my Google search is certainly very strange and interesting, but 106 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:51,159 Speaker 1: not very scientifically relevant. So moving on on you it's 107 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:55,880 Speaker 1: weird toe walkers, but it gets weirder and we can 108 00:06:56,000 --> 00:07:00,600 Speaker 1: look back in time to some extinct species that were 109 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:10,600 Speaker 1: absolutely just bonkers. So there used to be a gigantic 110 00:07:10,800 --> 00:07:14,960 Speaker 1: deer that would roam around in Ireland and Russia and 111 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:19,320 Speaker 1: parts of Europe, called the Irish elk, and it was 112 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:22,400 Speaker 1: not an elk, it was a deer. It was also 113 00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:31,360 Speaker 1: known as megeloceras gigantius because it was giganteus. So its 114 00:07:31,360 --> 00:07:34,880 Speaker 1: skeletal remains have been found in the bogs of Ireland, 115 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 1: which those bogs are really amazing at preserving dead things. 116 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 1: It probably went extinct over seven thousand years ago, so 117 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 1: humans definitely overlapped with this thing. So it had a 118 00:07:49,240 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 1: massive set of moose like antlers. So you have two 119 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 1: types of antlers. You have sort of the antlers you 120 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 1: see on like a deer, but then the antlers you 121 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:01,680 Speaker 1: see on a goose or like a I think it's 122 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 1: called a fallow deer. Yeah, a fallow deer are palmated antlers. 123 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 1: So a palmated antlers basically means hand like antlers, just 124 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:14,160 Speaker 1: like a moose. You know, they're they're they have sort 125 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:18,960 Speaker 1: of this uh solid palm and then it branches off 126 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:25,000 Speaker 1: into quote unquote fingers. So yeah, palmated antlers. And it 127 00:08:25,160 --> 00:08:34,319 Speaker 1: was absolutely pants weddingly huge, gigantic, gigantic ew Yeah, I'm. 128 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:38,559 Speaker 2: Sorry, I'm imagining the first human to invent pants overlapping 129 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 2: with the end of this animal. So like they finally 130 00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 2: finish pants and immediately pee up because. 131 00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:47,520 Speaker 1: Yea, yeah, well I think they were invented to be 132 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:51,480 Speaker 1: peed in like like you know, some very early human like, 133 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 1: oh my god, that deer makes me want to pee 134 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:58,480 Speaker 1: my my pants, and then he invents pants and peas 135 00:08:58,520 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 1: them promptly. 136 00:08:59,400 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 2: Yeah. 137 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 1: So the big old deer stood it around seven feet tall, 138 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:10,559 Speaker 1: over two meters at the shoulders. It could weigh over 139 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 1: one five hundred pounds or seven hundred kilograms. It was 140 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 1: similar in size to a moose, plus you know, maybe 141 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:21,559 Speaker 1: a little bigger than a moose, but it had much 142 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 1: bigger antlers. The antlers were the biggest known of any deer, 143 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:31,559 Speaker 1: and they spanned twelve feet from side to side, so 144 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:35,199 Speaker 1: that's three point six meters of antlers, and they weighed 145 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 1: almost ninety pounds or forty kilograms, over twice the size 146 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:41,840 Speaker 1: of the antlers of a moose. 147 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:48,440 Speaker 2: So yeah, big antlers, right, that's the freakiest part that 148 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:50,760 Speaker 2: it's the same size of the rest of the animal 149 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:55,480 Speaker 2: pretty much. Yeah, just pile on so much. 150 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 1: Do you remember that old the Grinch who Stole Christmas 151 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:04,680 Speaker 1: car tune version of the Jim Carrey version. Yeah, yeah, 152 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:08,360 Speaker 1: the car like the check the Check Jones cartoon, And 153 00:10:08,559 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 1: he's trying to disguise his the little dog into a deer, 154 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:14,800 Speaker 1: so he puts a big set of antlers on the dog, 155 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:17,880 Speaker 1: so the dog tips forward, and he keeps having to 156 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 1: shave off the antlers until it's the right size for 157 00:10:22,360 --> 00:10:28,080 Speaker 1: the dog to wear. Yeah, that keeps tipping forward. That's 158 00:10:28,080 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 1: how I imagine these deer just like tipping forward all 159 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:33,280 Speaker 1: the time. But yeah, that's why their bodies had to 160 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:37,080 Speaker 1: be so huge and muscular. They even had like this 161 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:40,320 Speaker 1: big hump on their back, similar to a bison. That 162 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:45,120 Speaker 1: would help probably kind of balance them a little more 163 00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:48,440 Speaker 1: and also gave them the ability to both store fat 164 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:53,960 Speaker 1: and have longer leg strides at the attachment of their shoulders. 165 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:57,679 Speaker 1: So yeah, just beasts, big old beasts. 166 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:01,440 Speaker 2: And probably almost like hair owing to see. Because because 167 00:11:01,440 --> 00:11:04,640 Speaker 2: I have family and Colorado who've seen a moose in 168 00:11:04,679 --> 00:11:07,719 Speaker 2: the wild in real life, and they described it as 169 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:11,719 Speaker 2: a little more scary than majestic, you know what I mean, 170 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:14,600 Speaker 2: Like they're that big, and they're kind of aggressive, and 171 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:17,120 Speaker 2: they only have you know, like one percent of these 172 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 2: antlers or whatever. I don't want to see an Irish 173 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 2: elkan life boy, oh boy, forget it. 174 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:26,400 Speaker 1: Well, absolutely, yeah, I think moose are scary. I appreciate 175 00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:30,600 Speaker 1: them obviously. I think they're beautiful animals. I respect them. 176 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:33,320 Speaker 1: I would not want to be face to face with 177 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:38,400 Speaker 1: a moose. That is terrifying. They're big, dangerous wild animals. 178 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 1: I think that sometimes and certainly not people who live 179 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:46,360 Speaker 1: with moose, I think they probably understand and have a 180 00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:51,040 Speaker 1: healthy respect for the moose. But deer and moose and 181 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 1: ungulates in general, I think maybe other than bulls, we 182 00:11:55,320 --> 00:11:57,960 Speaker 1: kind of don't think of as dangerous, but they certainly 183 00:11:58,040 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 1: can be. 184 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:01,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, Bulls, bulls, I think, because of media, are the 185 00:12:01,559 --> 00:12:04,400 Speaker 2: one exception where we're like, oh yeah, that plant eater 186 00:12:04,520 --> 00:12:07,000 Speaker 2: is dangerous, right, But otherwise we have this weird like 187 00:12:07,559 --> 00:12:10,560 Speaker 2: dinosaur I think based concepts where we're like, oh, if 188 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 2: it eats plants, you can hug it, and if it 189 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:15,280 Speaker 2: eats heat, it's it's the bad guys in the movie. 190 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:19,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, but really not the case. Even like if you've 191 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 1: seen these herbivores fighting back against the carnivores, especially in 192 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:36,120 Speaker 1: the sub Saharan savannah, like the giraffes kicking lions, and 193 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 1: you know it just just they can really, I mean, 194 00:12:41,160 --> 00:12:44,280 Speaker 1: they can sometimes kill lions like a giraffe even something 195 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 1: like you know, some of the bigger, the bigger ungulates. 196 00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:50,320 Speaker 2: Like are hippos ungulates hippos. 197 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 1: Are gilts and they can certainly ruin your day and 198 00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:56,480 Speaker 1: stomp in your head. Yeah, oh will the beast can 199 00:12:56,640 --> 00:13:01,880 Speaker 1: really mess a line up. Absolutely just reck alion. So yeah, 200 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 1: I mean it's they are very capable. Moose are very capable. 201 00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:13,120 Speaker 1: Even regular sized deer can hurt people. They can kill people, 202 00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 1: They can stomp you, they can gore you, you know, 203 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:19,400 Speaker 1: if you anger a deer up close. I mean, we 204 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:22,440 Speaker 1: have a great advantage with our weapons and stuff, and 205 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:25,600 Speaker 1: generally they're afraid of us. But if they feel like 206 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 1: they've got to fight you to get out of a situation, 207 00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 1: you're in a lot of trouble, because yeah, they are, 208 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 1: they're dangerous animals and so and so this thing with 209 00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: antlers twelve feet wide antlers that's like two deer, Like 210 00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:47,040 Speaker 1: it could carry two Deus in each set of antlers. 211 00:13:47,080 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 1: You know, like that's insane, that's it's it's absolutely the 212 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:57,000 Speaker 1: deer of your nightmares. And yeah, I mean we did 213 00:13:57,160 --> 00:14:01,880 Speaker 1: apparently hunt them, which I guess early humans were just like, yeah, 214 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:06,160 Speaker 1: mammoth giant deer, No big deal, just gonna go up 215 00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:09,079 Speaker 1: to this thing. I mean, I'm sure, I'm sure there 216 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 1: was a good amount of collateral damage of early humans 217 00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 1: of like, what's this thing? And the next thing they know, 218 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 1: like they've been cleanly hewn in half by a giant 219 00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 1: set of antlers. But yeah, I mean, one of the 220 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:28,880 Speaker 1: theories for why these went extinct is because of those 221 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 1: huge antlers, because they are very costly in terms of nutrition. 222 00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 1: You need a lot of nutrition to build up those 223 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: muscles and to be able to actually grow such huge antlers. 224 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 1: And they're also kind of, you know, not the most 225 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:52,520 Speaker 1: aerodynamic things in the world. So if you're trying to 226 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 1: run through a forest away from a group of human hunters. 227 00:14:56,440 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 1: I would imagine they'd get stuck in things, like in trees, 228 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 1: and you know, it's probably not the most advantageous feature. 229 00:15:05,560 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 1: The reason they got so huge was for probably sexual selection, 230 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:13,400 Speaker 1: because they were huge in males, and it was probably 231 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:17,360 Speaker 1: to impress females and to signal to other males that like, 232 00:15:17,400 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 1: they were awesome and great and don't even bother trying 233 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:20,960 Speaker 1: to compete. 234 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, they're essentially built like Johnny Bravo, but he doesn't 235 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:26,000 Speaker 2: need all that hair up there. Come. 236 00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:32,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely sort of the ornamental bodybuilders of the ungillate world, 237 00:15:32,640 --> 00:15:35,480 Speaker 1: where it's kind of it's kind of decorative. You know, 238 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:39,240 Speaker 1: it looks intimidating, but a lot of it is decorative. 239 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 1: I mean, they could definitely crush you if they fell 240 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:54,920 Speaker 1: on you, but you know. So now we're going to 241 00:15:55,000 --> 00:16:01,360 Speaker 1: talk about one of the most uncanny, weird just getting 242 00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:05,200 Speaker 1: we're getting real freaky with these with these deer alex. 243 00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:09,480 Speaker 1: We're going to talk about ro Poto Suradidae, which is 244 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:12,440 Speaker 1: a family of even tote ungulates of North and Central 245 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:16,040 Speaker 1: America that went extinct over four million years ago, whose 246 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 1: bodies look similar to deer, but their heads look like 247 00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 1: a deer from Salvador Dali's nightmares. 248 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:26,920 Speaker 2: So not as good dreams where stuff's melting but it's happy. 249 00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 1: Although maybe with Salvador Deli, maybe his nightmares were just 250 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 1: realistic things like cute teddy bears and normal looking things, 251 00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:38,280 Speaker 1: and he's like, ah, I just dreamed about o'clock that 252 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 1: wasn't melting. 253 00:16:40,720 --> 00:16:44,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, I could tell time. No. 254 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:50,200 Speaker 1: So my inspiration for this section is actually from a 255 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 1: Twitter thread by an ecology student Aditya Stranath and some 256 00:16:54,960 --> 00:16:59,200 Speaker 1: paleo artists discussing one of the weirdest extinct families of 257 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:03,720 Speaker 1: ungulates out there, so protosur today. If you look at 258 00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:08,119 Speaker 1: one of these skulls, you will be convinced that dragons 259 00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:11,040 Speaker 1: were real. Alex I have shared with you some of 260 00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:13,399 Speaker 1: these schools. These will also be in the show notes. 261 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:18,359 Speaker 1: They you know, they look like dragons or dinosaurs. 262 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:23,760 Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, it's got dinosaur vibes and then also sort 263 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:29,800 Speaker 2: of a horse mouth as I understand skeletons. Yeah, like 264 00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:32,480 Speaker 2: if you came upon it in the desert southwest, all 265 00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 2: bleached and stuff, you would assume it's some sort of 266 00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:39,360 Speaker 2: dark tower situation where a gunslinger was fighting monsters. 267 00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:45,640 Speaker 1: Yeah. So there are many different species with really wacky 268 00:17:45,680 --> 00:17:50,040 Speaker 1: looking skulls, but typically they would have four horns quote 269 00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:54,320 Speaker 1: unquote horns. They're actually most likely osso cones. So an 270 00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 1: osso cone is something like you see on a giraffe. 271 00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:01,040 Speaker 1: They are a bone structure covered in skin and fur. 272 00:18:01,359 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 1: For the section, I'm gonna use terms like horn and 273 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:08,639 Speaker 1: antler just to describe the shape of these things, but technically, 274 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:14,000 Speaker 1: horns are a structure covered in keratin, and antlers are 275 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:17,160 Speaker 1: a bony structure that are shed and regrown every year, 276 00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:20,960 Speaker 1: and they, like a deer's antlers, will actually start out 277 00:18:21,080 --> 00:18:23,400 Speaker 1: covered in a thin layer of skin and fur which 278 00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 1: is shed, whereas osca cones, which is what we're talking 279 00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:30,639 Speaker 1: about here, are structurally similar to antlers and that they 280 00:18:30,680 --> 00:18:33,720 Speaker 1: have a bony base and they're covered in skin and fur, 281 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:36,760 Speaker 1: but they're permanent and so they never shed that skin 282 00:18:36,800 --> 00:18:37,520 Speaker 1: and fur coating. 283 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 2: Oh just amazing. 284 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:42,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, like the little knobs on a giraffe head. 285 00:18:42,720 --> 00:18:44,479 Speaker 1: I don't think about them too much, but when I do, 286 00:18:44,560 --> 00:18:46,000 Speaker 1: I realize they're kind of weird. 287 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:48,359 Speaker 2: Right, I do, because I used to give tours of 288 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:50,239 Speaker 2: a zoo at Brookfield Zoo, and we had a lot 289 00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:53,040 Speaker 2: of giraffes that were part of the tour vout and 290 00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 2: I think people always thought of them as just silly. 291 00:18:56,800 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 2: But then those little I guess osacone on the top 292 00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 2: of the head, they indicate some sort of more warlike 293 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:06,080 Speaker 2: past to me of the giraffes. I don't know if 294 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:08,240 Speaker 2: that's true. And then, as you said, giraffes will totally 295 00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:10,639 Speaker 2: fight and kick in the modern day, they still got. 296 00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:14,919 Speaker 1: It, yeah, but with their next but yeah, I mean 297 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:20,080 Speaker 1: it's interesting. I don't know exactly what the osccones are 298 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:23,480 Speaker 1: used in giraffes. They may be for mate selection. I 299 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 1: don't think they're used for fighting, but they may have 300 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,359 Speaker 1: had a relative that used them for fighting or for 301 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 1: mate signaling. So yeah, so in these extinct species, these 302 00:19:36,040 --> 00:19:39,240 Speaker 1: were probably used in sexual selection because it was the 303 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:44,439 Speaker 1: males that had the most just bananas situation going on 304 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 1: with these auso accounts. 305 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:49,360 Speaker 2: So yeah, once again, Johnny Bravo, Johnny Bravo's most species, 306 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:51,919 Speaker 2: it turns out, folks, I don't know if you're familiar 307 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:54,960 Speaker 2: with the cartoon, I think the nineties maybe later last. 308 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:57,639 Speaker 1: Anyway, nineties cartoon where it was this guy who's like 309 00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:04,800 Speaker 1: body mass was ninety percent the pectorals and and biceps 310 00:20:04,800 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 1: and then tiny little legs. And actually, you know what, 311 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:12,280 Speaker 1: that Johnny Bravo analogy is going to hold out throughout 312 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:14,800 Speaker 1: the show, especially with our last one we're going to 313 00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:16,240 Speaker 1: talk about. So hold on to that. 314 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:23,840 Speaker 2: Thought scientific name Jonicas bravonicus and the you know, the 315 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:25,280 Speaker 2: finer scientific text out there. 316 00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:32,160 Speaker 1: So most species of Protocertidae had two horny protrusions behind 317 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,159 Speaker 1: the eyes and two on the snout. But depending on 318 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 1: the species, these horns were in all sorts of different 319 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:42,840 Speaker 1: weird shapes, and yeah it was the males ran particularly 320 00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:48,040 Speaker 1: wild with it. So one species called Synthetocerous had a 321 00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:52,119 Speaker 1: nose antler that started out as like one long unicorn 322 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:57,880 Speaker 1: horn and branched into two, so kind of like kind 323 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:00,720 Speaker 1: of like a slingshot. I could imagine, you know, you 324 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 1: wrapping a rubber band around it and using it as slingshot. 325 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:07,720 Speaker 1: What was that old show with like the Caveman family 326 00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:11,199 Speaker 1: who would like ride around on weird dinosaur things and 327 00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:16,320 Speaker 1: like with the flinstones, No, I mean flintstones is one 328 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:20,560 Speaker 1: of those things. Oh, definitely flintstones would use this as 329 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:24,919 Speaker 1: like a mobile, like a slingshot creature. But now there 330 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:27,040 Speaker 1: was another one, the. 331 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,119 Speaker 2: Movie The Crudes. I have not seen the movie. 332 00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:34,800 Speaker 1: The I googled cartoon dinosaur times eighties, and that didn't 333 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:36,000 Speaker 1: help me really at all. 334 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:38,840 Speaker 2: Slingshot in an old cartoon. I almost thought you were 335 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:41,200 Speaker 2: going to say Bart Simpson, like what, he just goes 336 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:45,040 Speaker 2: around sling shotting things. But other stuff is, especially in 337 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:48,240 Speaker 2: the early seasons, they were like he's a real trouble maker. 338 00:21:48,280 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 2: And part of it was that he had a slingshot 339 00:21:50,119 --> 00:21:52,919 Speaker 2: in his back pocket, which no child has done since. 340 00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:55,639 Speaker 2: I don't know, FDR. It's very old fashioned to me. 341 00:21:57,320 --> 00:21:59,800 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, the Dennist, the one that slingshot in the 342 00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:04,360 Speaker 1: back pocket. Herculoids. It was herculoids. Do you remember herculoids? 343 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:06,000 Speaker 2: No, I don't know it. I don't know it. Yeah, 344 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:06,720 Speaker 2: I've never heard of it. 345 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:08,800 Speaker 1: I mean it was a little before our time. I 346 00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:11,680 Speaker 1: think I only saw reruns and stuff. But they had 347 00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:17,679 Speaker 1: like weird like dinosaur monsters and like a rhino that 348 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:20,480 Speaker 1: would shoot stuff out of its forehead, and like a 349 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:23,719 Speaker 1: gorilla made out of stone, and then these just like 350 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 1: big goo things. Anyways, it was a really Weird Show, 351 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:31,160 Speaker 1: and this makes me think of something from that Weird Show. 352 00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:36,879 Speaker 1: I think it was from the seventies, but yeah, so 353 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 1: so in addition to the slingshot on its nose, it 354 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: also had these two horns behind its eyes that were 355 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:48,679 Speaker 1: curved and even weirder. So there's this dip in the 356 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 1: nasal bones that some people, including palaeo artists vill Sinkonin, 357 00:22:55,359 --> 00:23:00,879 Speaker 1: speculate may have been because of an inflatable skin pouch 358 00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 1: at the base of the horn that males could have used, 359 00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:09,639 Speaker 1: similar to how animals like elephant, seals or frigatebirds inflate 360 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:13,280 Speaker 1: a pouch for sexual displays, but like right on top 361 00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:17,679 Speaker 1: of its nose. So I'm definitely including a link to 362 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:21,560 Speaker 1: a hilarious and really interesting animated three D recreation by 363 00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:26,320 Speaker 1: Villis Sincronin. It's this such a goof ofsaurus, Like, I mean, 364 00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 1: it's an ungulate, mammalian ungulate, but it's so goofy looking. 365 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,159 Speaker 1: And then on top of that, the potential for this 366 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:39,240 Speaker 1: inflatable nose pouch just incredible, magnificent. 367 00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 2: I'm looking at this little video and look, they did 368 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 2: a really professional job. It's really well put together, and 369 00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:55,159 Speaker 2: it makes it funnier to me. Y's just this. It 370 00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:58,480 Speaker 2: looks like it has like an Edgar Allen Poe Telltale 371 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:02,639 Speaker 2: heart underneath the front of its face. I love it 372 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:05,720 Speaker 2: really good, Like it won't stop beating in a way 373 00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 2: that's unsettling. 374 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:10,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's It looks like it would make a 375 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 1: little like bicycle horn honking sounds. 376 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:22,480 Speaker 2: Or have like that wheezing nerd voice that's in cartoons, 377 00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:25,160 Speaker 2: like it's trying to talk, but there's just wheezing all 378 00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:25,600 Speaker 2: the time. 379 00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 1: Great, yeah, yeah, no exactly, I mean there's and this 380 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:34,400 Speaker 1: is just one species. There are several species of really 381 00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 1: weird looking ones, and I'm including in the show notes 382 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 1: a diagram of a few of them. One of them 383 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:46,880 Speaker 1: was Para paratocerous ward eye, which appeared to have two 384 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:51,719 Speaker 1: big triangular horns right above the eyes, like almost like 385 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:58,119 Speaker 1: eye eye lit lashes that fused into a horn, and 386 00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:03,159 Speaker 1: then two smaller bony triangular protrusions in front of the eyes, 387 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:07,920 Speaker 1: and this weird little wishbone shaped bone right on top 388 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:10,239 Speaker 1: of its skull between the ears, like it's wearing one 389 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:16,200 Speaker 1: of those little propeller hats. Yeah. 390 00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:22,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, it almost looks like old TV antennas and pictures 391 00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 2: of old TVs in a way that no one has now, 392 00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:29,720 Speaker 2: Like yeah, like it's picking up channels two through seven 393 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 2: for free, and it's really proud of it, you know, 394 00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:33,600 Speaker 2: beating the Kalo Company. 395 00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:38,160 Speaker 1: I mean it's it's ridiculous. And there's Protocera Celaire, which 396 00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 1: was I don't I struggled to figure out how to 397 00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:45,200 Speaker 1: describe this. It has fangs, that's important, like vampire fangs. 398 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 1: It has like two bony shark fins or dolphin fins, 399 00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:54,800 Speaker 1: like at the sides of its nose, and then just 400 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:58,280 Speaker 1: a complete chaos as you go up the face. There 401 00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:03,000 Speaker 1: are ridges around its eyes, like a square ridge right 402 00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:09,240 Speaker 1: above its eyes, and then two joysticks right behind its size. 403 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:12,760 Speaker 1: So that's the thing. 404 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:18,840 Speaker 2: It basically has one of the landscape backgrounds from Wiley, 405 00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:22,160 Speaker 2: Coyote and roadrunner on top of its head like several 406 00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:25,479 Speaker 2: maces in a way that would be our greatest national 407 00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:26,480 Speaker 2: park but doesn't exist. 408 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:29,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a skate park built on top of a 409 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:34,399 Speaker 1: deer head. Yeah, it's just these things are they're so 410 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:41,280 Speaker 1: I mean, so ambitious, just the ambition of these creatures 411 00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:44,199 Speaker 1: that thought they could get away with these horns. 412 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:48,840 Speaker 2: It also, I'm not a hunter. But I feel like 413 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:52,280 Speaker 2: the hunting community would be losing its mind if it 414 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:54,760 Speaker 2: could have this many different kinds of antlers to count 415 00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:57,639 Speaker 2: and rate themselves on, right, like they all love just 416 00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:00,560 Speaker 2: the amount of points deer antlers have, they would they 417 00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:04,000 Speaker 2: would be like like weird stat had baseball nerds about 418 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:05,919 Speaker 2: see it was available to them today. 419 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,720 Speaker 1: These antlers would require some long division. It's it's a situation, 420 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:19,600 Speaker 1: it's a whole situation. So now we're going to talk 421 00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:26,280 Speaker 1: about truly the most Johnny Bravo of all deer. It 422 00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 1: is a species of giant gorilla bear deer that went 423 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:35,600 Speaker 1: extinct over seventy eight thousand years ago, found in North America, Eurasia, 424 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:39,159 Speaker 1: and Africa. So these are. 425 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:41,440 Speaker 2: You did you say gorilla bear deer? 426 00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:45,359 Speaker 1: Yeah they did, No, Actually I said giant gorilla bear deer. 427 00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:51,679 Speaker 2: Oh I'm sorry. The fourth animal there is giants like 428 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:53,320 Speaker 2: in Jack of the Beadstock. Really cool. 429 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:59,880 Speaker 1: So these were odd tooed ungulates and though they were 430 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 1: autoed ungulates, they didn't really have the same hoof legs 431 00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:08,600 Speaker 1: structure as ungulates such as horses. Instead of hooves, they 432 00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,040 Speaker 1: had these three big claws kind of like a sloth. 433 00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:16,439 Speaker 1: And the way they walked were very strange. Do you 434 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:20,159 Speaker 1: know those like strider costumes. I think they're in like 435 00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:22,720 Speaker 1: the dark crystal and a lot of people wear them 436 00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:26,960 Speaker 1: for like parades or Halloween or something where you're kind 437 00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 1: of you have two stilts that you hold with your arms, 438 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:33,800 Speaker 1: and then you're on a set of shorter stilts with 439 00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:37,119 Speaker 1: your back legs, and people kind of walk around like 440 00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:42,720 Speaker 1: some kind of weird animal. It's basically shaped like that. 441 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 2: It's like it's like Cloverfield monster postures. Yeah, that where 442 00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:49,440 Speaker 2: you have like big, big, big front legs and then 443 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:53,160 Speaker 2: little back ones. Yes, everyone does shake cam footage. 444 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:57,400 Speaker 1: That is what these are. Absolutely and they liked to 445 00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:03,760 Speaker 1: eat leaves and shrubs, so they had these little short 446 00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:11,320 Speaker 1: hind legs and really really big beefcakes arms obviously skipping 447 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,920 Speaker 1: leg day but doing like quadruple duty on arm day. 448 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:19,760 Speaker 1: And they walked on their knuckles of their forelimbs, kind 449 00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:23,040 Speaker 1: of similar to a gorilla, sort of like side knuckling. 450 00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:26,239 Speaker 1: It actually more like an ant eater walks. Because they 451 00:29:26,240 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 1: had such huge claws on their front limbs. They couldn't 452 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: really walk directly on these claws. They had to curl 453 00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:35,440 Speaker 1: them inwards and walk on the sides on their knuckles, 454 00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 1: and then their heads were horse like and they had 455 00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:43,920 Speaker 1: like the you know, basically a big, big horse mouth 456 00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:51,960 Speaker 1: and they would so a review of what's happening here, 457 00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:56,560 Speaker 1: beefy body of a gorilla walks like a cross between 458 00:29:56,600 --> 00:30:00,680 Speaker 1: a gorilla and an ant eater, has claws like a sloth, 459 00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:04,880 Speaker 1: head and neck like a horse. They weighed over one 460 00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:09,280 Speaker 1: three hundred pounds or six hundred kilograms. They were about 461 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,560 Speaker 1: six feet tall at the shoulders or one point eight 462 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:18,040 Speaker 1: meters and over seven feet long or two meters, and 463 00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:21,720 Speaker 1: it could use its huge claws to pull down trees 464 00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:24,479 Speaker 1: and strip off limbs for them to get at leaves 465 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:27,080 Speaker 1: or probably to fight off predators. 466 00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:29,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, they could just put up those dukes and do 467 00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:32,000 Speaker 2: it and maybe fall over if it picks up its 468 00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:34,840 Speaker 2: front legs. But you know, still pretty good until that 469 00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:35,520 Speaker 2: pretty good. 470 00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:38,920 Speaker 1: Even funnier, they probably were able to rear up on 471 00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 1: their hind legs to get at tall trees. So just 472 00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:45,960 Speaker 1: these little teeny tiny like I mean, their legs aren't 473 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:49,000 Speaker 1: that tiny, they're like bare legs, but compared to the 474 00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:52,600 Speaker 1: front of them with these huge arms, they do look 475 00:30:52,880 --> 00:31:00,760 Speaker 1: disproportionately small. And yeah, I mean yeah, like, yeah, looking 476 00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:04,560 Speaker 1: at this thing, it's like it's like a mule or 477 00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:08,640 Speaker 1: a donkey cross with like a bear or a giant 478 00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 1: sloth and with huge claws that could definitely decapitate you. 479 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 1: Uh yeah, I don't know, absolute cuties it is. 480 00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:24,080 Speaker 2: It's like pretty nice looking for being the exact nightmare 481 00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:27,200 Speaker 2: collas you have described. Yeah, it's pretty fun to look 482 00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 2: at for being parts of seven different mammals. It almost 483 00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:34,600 Speaker 2: feels like somebody was vaguely told about mammals in passing 484 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 2: and tried to draw what that is. Yeah. 485 00:31:37,320 --> 00:31:41,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, it feels like a b steerie drawing from a 486 00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:45,239 Speaker 1: monk who's never seen a horse or a gorilla and 487 00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:54,200 Speaker 1: tried to draw a combination of the two from memory. Yeah. 488 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,280 Speaker 2: I mean, and they're like, you're a monk, aren't you 489 00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:58,280 Speaker 2: supposed to be focused on the Bible, And they're like, 490 00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:00,400 Speaker 2: it's part of it. It's part of it. Don't worry 491 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,880 Speaker 2: about it, don't worry about it. I'm creative. 492 00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:07,560 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, man, they love to draw their their weird 493 00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:10,440 Speaker 1: animals and those little inserts in the side. I mean, 494 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:12,640 Speaker 1: I don't blame them. God, it must have been boring 495 00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:13,200 Speaker 1: to be a monk. 496 00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:15,840 Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. Yeah, and you know, enough time staring at 497 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,520 Speaker 2: the wall and brewing beer that will be better later. 498 00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:20,640 Speaker 2: You know, you'd want to start drawing weird lions. 499 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm going to try to draw a lion 500 00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:26,680 Speaker 1: despite never having seen one or even heard a description 501 00:32:26,800 --> 00:32:36,040 Speaker 1: of one. I think it's like a dog with spikes. Yeah, 502 00:32:36,040 --> 00:32:39,320 Speaker 1: but I would absolutely like feed one of these sugar cube, 503 00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:42,560 Speaker 1: call it sea biscuit, and ride around on it until 504 00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:45,640 Speaker 1: it like decided it was annoyed by me and just 505 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:47,840 Speaker 1: sliced me cleanly in two. 506 00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 2: It could it could definitely be the tank in your 507 00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:59,080 Speaker 2: like fantasy role playing group of four or five characters. 508 00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:01,360 Speaker 2: It could definitely be the one that receives a lot 509 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,240 Speaker 2: of damage. Well, somebody else is a mage and there's 510 00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:05,400 Speaker 2: an archer or whatever. 511 00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:10,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, it's it's a It's definitely the 512 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 1: tank and yeah, or like a Star Wars creature that 513 00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:22,160 Speaker 1: you know, oh that makes some ridiculous fully sound effect 514 00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:24,240 Speaker 1: as you ride around on it. Yeah. 515 00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:27,120 Speaker 2: Star Wars. I feel like throughout that franchise they're very 516 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:30,320 Speaker 2: anti megafauna, right, Like there's some people ride and stuff, 517 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:33,760 Speaker 2: but the Wampa and then the rain Corps and then 518 00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:36,720 Speaker 2: that big thing in the seventh movie and stuff. There's 519 00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:38,719 Speaker 2: a lot of like, if it's a big animal, it's 520 00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:41,560 Speaker 2: a monster. No thanks, big animals are cool, get out 521 00:33:41,560 --> 00:33:43,640 Speaker 2: of here. Star Wars not into. 522 00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:48,000 Speaker 1: It, but yeah, I do. I do think like if 523 00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:53,800 Speaker 1: if if Creature Kringle times reindeer need a break, I 524 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:55,880 Speaker 1: don't know. I would love I would love to see 525 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:59,880 Speaker 1: a sleigh driven by like a couple of a couple 526 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:05,800 Speaker 1: giant irish elka, a couple of weird uh Protocerididae with 527 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:10,759 Speaker 1: just absolutely Boushian mc esher like faces, and then you know, 528 00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:13,600 Speaker 1: bringing up, bringing up the rear, maybe a couple of 529 00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:15,200 Speaker 1: these gorilla deer. 530 00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:28,560 Speaker 2: I love it, just just following like a celebrities bodyguards. 531 00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:29,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, sunglasses and those like little little ear wires. It's like, 532 00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:36,120 Speaker 1: you know, baby reindeer to Papa Papa, Papa Santa. We 533 00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:48,359 Speaker 1: eyes on the package. 534 00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:45,919 Speaker 2: And then later in the movie you find out they're 535 00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:48,840 Speaker 2: actually really sweet eyes. You judge them for their size, 536 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:50,640 Speaker 2: but actually one of them does a lot of needle 537 00:34:50,640 --> 00:34:51,840 Speaker 2: point and. 538 00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:55,279 Speaker 1: The other willed a movie into existence, like later in 539 00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:59,440 Speaker 1: the movie about this crew of non reindeer. 540 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,440 Speaker 2: I've been storyboarting this whole time. My hand is very tired. 541 00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:10,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, it'd be called Santa Claus, and then there'd be 542 00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:14,160 Speaker 1: like in the poster art these fake claw rips and 543 00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:15,560 Speaker 1: then blood dripping down right. 544 00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:18,360 Speaker 2: I am astonished that it's not already a movie title. 545 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:26,200 Speaker 1: Santa Clause movie. Oh, it certainly is. It's got two 546 00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:31,560 Speaker 1: stars on IMDb. There's different types of Santa Claus movies. 547 00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:36,319 Speaker 1: There's one that's starring kittens, as it looks like one 548 00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:39,160 Speaker 1: kitten's like a reindeer, one kittens like an elf. So 549 00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:43,680 Speaker 1: Santa Claus the Kittens Movie. Then there's Santa Claus starring 550 00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:50,040 Speaker 1: a skeleton dressed as Santa, carrying a axe. 551 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:53,360 Speaker 2: Hold on. So they were like, we're gonna make a 552 00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:57,160 Speaker 2: horror movie called Santa Clause. What's the first monster we pick? 553 00:35:57,280 --> 00:36:00,440 Speaker 2: Definitely something that has no claws, a skeleton. Perfect. 554 00:36:02,600 --> 00:36:07,680 Speaker 1: There is also a fourteen movie called Santa Stole Our Dog? 555 00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:13,880 Speaker 1: Not sure, and then there's another Santa Claus movie with 556 00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:18,520 Speaker 1: kittens that seems to be pretty popular one. 557 00:36:18,200 --> 00:36:22,240 Speaker 2: Santa Stole Our Dog. Santa He's just a huge jerk. 558 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:27,359 Speaker 1: I know this is not this is not necessarily the 559 00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 1: theme of the podcast, but I do have to see 560 00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:35,600 Speaker 1: if I can read the UH description of this This movie, 561 00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 1: The Santa Stole Our Dog. So Santa Stole Our Dog 562 00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:46,040 Speaker 1: is a twenty seventeen Christmas movie. It's called Santa Stollar Dog, 563 00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:52,160 Speaker 1: A Merry Dog on Christmas by Brian Michael Stoller. 564 00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:55,320 Speaker 2: Ryan Michael Steeler. Of course he wrote this, of course 565 00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:56,360 Speaker 2: he did so. 566 00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:59,959 Speaker 1: The summary is pretty simple. On Christmas Eve, Santa Claus 567 00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:03,920 Speaker 1: accidentally steals the family dog, so begins an epic journey 568 00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:06,560 Speaker 1: through the twelve Days of Christmas as the family ventures 569 00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:09,520 Speaker 1: to the North Pole to get their beloved canine back. Now, 570 00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:13,440 Speaker 1: the cover of the Santa Stolar Dog has a Dodo 571 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:18,440 Speaker 1: bird on it, which I'm not sure I understand that 572 00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:21,719 Speaker 1: this is definitely something I'm gonna have to watch and 573 00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:23,920 Speaker 1: get back to you guys on what's going on with 574 00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:26,000 Speaker 1: this UH with this movie. 575 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,600 Speaker 2: Because it looks I am astonished that this movie connected 576 00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:34,480 Speaker 2: to megafauna. There's a Dodo on it. Incredible great megafauna, right, amazing. 577 00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:40,480 Speaker 1: I feel like they're medium fauna. Medium that's santascle Art Dog. 578 00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:44,759 Speaker 1: I don't think I'm allowed. Maybe I could play just 579 00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:47,720 Speaker 1: a little clip from the trailer. Let me let me see, 580 00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:51,560 Speaker 1: this is a this is a this is a special 581 00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:55,360 Speaker 1: Creature feature first me playing a clip from a trailer 582 00:37:55,400 --> 00:38:01,040 Speaker 1: that only has a tenuous connection to uh animal biology. 583 00:38:01,600 --> 00:38:04,480 Speaker 2: I have also pulled up this IMDb page and I'm 584 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:07,640 Speaker 2: seeing a very cock eyed Santa, who is apparently played 585 00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:11,080 Speaker 2: by Ed Asner rip and I'm also seeing the subtitle 586 00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:15,000 Speaker 2: of Santa Stollar Dog is a merry dog one Christmas 587 00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:18,200 Speaker 2: exclamation point. A lot going on. 588 00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:21,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so I did I did manage to get 589 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:24,680 Speaker 1: the trailer to Creature Kringle Times Miracle. 590 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,680 Speaker 2: There's okay, giving Santa a lot of credit up front. 591 00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:42,560 Speaker 2: Maybe he's a thief guys, Okay. 592 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:48,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, it stars Ed Asner's Santa Claus bad cgi Reindeer, 593 00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:53,840 Speaker 1: and uh you know, yeah, no, this is a wow. 594 00:38:55,080 --> 00:39:00,480 Speaker 1: The trailer is basically just the kids going Santa Stoller Dog, 595 00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:03,839 Speaker 1: and then the adults going like, Santa stole our dog, 596 00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:07,600 Speaker 1: and then there's a newspaper that reads Santa steals family's dog, 597 00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:12,440 Speaker 1: and then Santa going like, Who's dog? Did I allegedly steal? 598 00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:15,840 Speaker 2: Who do you belong to? 599 00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:20,799 Speaker 1: Wonderful? I feel so blessed to find this. 600 00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:26,400 Speaker 2: It's just ninety straight minutes of people making surprised faces 601 00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:29,720 Speaker 2: back and forth. That's the entire time. Stole a dog. 602 00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:34,320 Speaker 1: A dog was stolen by undel. 603 00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:38,680 Speaker 2: Oh. 604 00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:41,840 Speaker 1: Well, so thank you so much for joining me. Alex. 605 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:43,960 Speaker 1: Where can people find you anything? 606 00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:47,480 Speaker 2: It's always great, always awks great. And Anya, I make 607 00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:50,359 Speaker 2: a podcast called Secretly Incredibly Fascinating. I really hope people 608 00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:52,719 Speaker 2: check it out. Each one's about one thing that people 609 00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:55,840 Speaker 2: think is ordinary, and then we get into history, science, 610 00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:58,480 Speaker 2: law about why it's amazing. And there are many wonderful 611 00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:02,439 Speaker 2: episodes with Katie gold what. Yes, you should check them out, 612 00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:05,120 Speaker 2: especially there'll be one start of January, a new one. 613 00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:07,480 Speaker 1: It's exciting. I love the topic. 614 00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:12,239 Speaker 2: Yeah, the topic might make you make a series of 615 00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:13,920 Speaker 2: high pitched noises as you enjoyed it. 616 00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:21,640 Speaker 1: Mike, thank you here here, here here, yeah, and thank 617 00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:24,040 Speaker 1: you so much for listening. If you're enjoying the pod 618 00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:28,080 Speaker 1: and you leave me a rating and review, I read 619 00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:31,240 Speaker 1: all the reviews and I cherish them and I print 620 00:40:31,239 --> 00:40:33,480 Speaker 1: them out and I hang them up in my house. 621 00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:37,000 Speaker 1: I'm like, look at that one from we'd Goku sixty 622 00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:40,359 Speaker 1: nine who liked my show. So thank you so much. 623 00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:43,120 Speaker 1: And if you think you have an answer to the 624 00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:46,200 Speaker 1: animal sound, gissing game. You can write me at Creature 625 00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:49,359 Speaker 1: feature Pod at gmail dot com, Creature Future Pod on Instagram, 626 00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:52,360 Speaker 1: Creature Feet Pod on Twitter. That's FB eighteen not v 627 00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:56,440 Speaker 1: et sounding very different, and of course thanks to the 628 00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:59,440 Speaker 1: Space Colssics for their super awesome song ex Alumina. Creature 629 00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:02,640 Speaker 1: Features are direction of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts like the 630 00:41:02,680 --> 00:41:05,320 Speaker 1: one you just heard, visited the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 631 00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:08,280 Speaker 1: or Hey guess what mayby listen to your favorite shows. 632 00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:12,279 Speaker 1: See you next Wednesday.