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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,

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Speaker 2: my name is Nolh.

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Speaker 3: They called me Ben.

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Speaker 4: We're joined as always with our super producer, Dylan the

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Speaker 4: Tennessee pal Fagan.

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Speaker 3: Most importantly, you are you. You are here.

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Speaker 4: That makes this the stuff they don't want you to know,

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Speaker 4: As current science argues, if you are hearing this, you

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Speaker 4: are most likely what we call alive. What happens when

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Speaker 4: we die? Guys, let's get past the small talk for

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Speaker 4: the intro. We've asked ourselves this question often.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and we arrived at a conclusion. Yet acquiring minds

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Speaker 5: would like to know.

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Speaker 2: We've spent a couple full episodes thinking about these concepts.

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Speaker 2: What is consciousness? What is it to be alive? What

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Speaker 2: is it to be a universe?

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Speaker 3: What is that?

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Speaker 4: M you know, the universe and the grain of sand?

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Speaker 4: Another question similar, where were we before? What happens when

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Speaker 4: we move on? And as you said, Matt, we've explored

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Speaker 4: this over the years. It's a dilemma or a mystery

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Speaker 4: that humanity has wrestled with since before humans began writing

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Speaker 4: stuff down. It's a question that's as beautiful and awe

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Speaker 4: inspiring as it is terrifying and mysterious.

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Speaker 3: And as we like to say, on stuff.

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Speaker 4: They'll want, you know, past a certain point of inquiry,

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Speaker 4: the science becomes very close to philosophy. It blends inextricably

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Speaker 4: so with spirituality. So one of our favorite new shows

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Speaker 4: addresses these ancient questions, timeless questions, unique, never before heard way.

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Speaker 4: It's called Alive Again. And I know we're talking about

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Speaker 4: this off air before we get into it. Can we

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Speaker 4: play a clip from the show No we must?

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Speaker 6: What happens when we come face to face with death.

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Speaker 6: My truck was blown up by a twenty pound anti

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Speaker 6: tank mine. I jumped out of an airplane. My parachute

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Speaker 6: did not toploy.

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Speaker 2: I was kidnapped by a drunker tilling the outskirts of

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Speaker 2: Mexico City.

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Speaker 6: I was startured than held for ransom.

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Speaker 5: I open an eye and the bayonet comes down one

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Speaker 5: inch from this sheet.

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Speaker 6: I just remember everything getting dark. I was like, oh

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Speaker 6: my god, I'm dying. When we stepped beyond the edge,

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Speaker 6: of what we know. I had the flat line clinically died.

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Speaker 2: In return, I grabbed the electricity going into the train system.

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Speaker 3: All of the electricity went through me.

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Speaker 6: I was dead for aleven point five minutes, and the

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Speaker 6: heart stopped beating alive again. These are first hand accounts

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Speaker 6: of people who have stood at the.

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Speaker 3: I was quite literally losing my own life.

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Speaker 2: I've remembered the baited breath that we all had.

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Speaker 7: It was going to be my reminder to keep reading,

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Speaker 7: and the fear I was bleeding to death.

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Speaker 6: I was not going to be able to make it

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Speaker 6: out of this.

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Speaker 1: He told me, kneel down, We're going to kill you.

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Speaker 6: Their stories are terrifying, miraculous, heartbreaking, and deeply inspiring. It's

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Speaker 6: a miracle I was brought back because if you know

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Speaker 6: anything about CPR, they do not typically go that long.

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Speaker 6: It isn't just about near death experiences. It's about what

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Speaker 6: comes after.

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Speaker 5: And now you got to rebuild the image of yourself again.

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Speaker 6: How surviving the unthinkable transforms us.

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Speaker 5: That is the choice that we get to make, taking

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Speaker 5: the possibility over the pain.

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Speaker 6: You have to learn how to change your mindset.

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Speaker 5: I'm not a victimum survivor that capacity to open our

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Speaker 5: consciousness to something more than just what's in that western box.

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Speaker 6: My name is Dan Bush. My mission is simple.

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Speaker 2: You know your strongest one, you're the most vulnerable.

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Speaker 6: To find, explore, and share these stories. You cannot hold

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Speaker 6: despair and gratitude in your heart.

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Speaker 2: At the same time, everything reduces to its minimum expression,

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Speaker 2: which is the search of meaning.

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Speaker 6: To remind us what it means to be live. I

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Speaker 6: step out of my grave and into my life. This

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Speaker 6: life I'm living now. I have a spiritual function, a

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Speaker 6: spiritual purpose.

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Speaker 7: Having gotten through all of these near death experiences.

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Speaker 6: I'm so proud of myself alive again. Not just that

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Speaker 6: I was the guy that cut his armah, but that

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Speaker 6: I'm the guy who is smiling when he cut his

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Speaker 6: arm off. A podcast about the fragility of life, the

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Speaker 6: strength of the human spirit, and what it means to

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Speaker 6: truly live.

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Speaker 5: Life is precious and I am a success story.

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Speaker 4: And that is a live again. This is a phenomenal

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Speaker 4: show for us and hopefully for you.

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Speaker 3: This is.

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Speaker 4: Tough to put into words, so we needed a little

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Speaker 4: bit of help. We have a special surprise for tonight.

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Speaker 4: We are joined in that endeavor with none other than

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Speaker 4: the creator of Alive Again himself the one and only

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Speaker 4: award winning filmmaker, writer, and producer Dan Bush. Dan welcome,

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Speaker 4: thank you for joining us.

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Speaker 6: Hey, hey guys, thanks so much for having me. What

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Speaker 6: an honor, what a privilege to jump on the show

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Speaker 6: with you. I'm such a fan.

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Speaker 4: Now you had to hear us play your trailer in

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Speaker 4: front of you.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, you said you like it. It kicks butt, and

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Speaker 5: oh my gosh, just that alone is so much fodder

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Speaker 5: for conversation.

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Speaker 3: So y'all, what do you say we take a.

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Speaker 5: Tiny little break and then just jump right into this

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Speaker 5: discussion of the unknown.

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Speaker 2: Let's do it.

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Speaker 3: And we're back.

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Speaker 4: We want to, as we're diving in, talk a little

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Speaker 4: bit about Bona Fie and origin stories. Now, d you've

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Speaker 4: made many many projects. We are in full disclosure, privileged

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Speaker 4: enough to be friends and fans of yours, and we've

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Speaker 4: seen screenings of various films that you have created. You've

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Speaker 4: also done a number of podcasts in advance Alive Again.

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Speaker 6: Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting because you know, this is my

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Speaker 6: first time jumping into sort of a documentary space, if

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Speaker 6: you will. You know, I'm a fiction guy. I'm a storyteller,

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Speaker 6: you know, in my heart of hearts, but I've always

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Speaker 6: there's a there's a commonality between my fiction stories and

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Speaker 6: Alive Again, which is, you know, not just a sort

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Speaker 6: of an exploration of that which exists outside of the

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Speaker 6: boundaries of what we know, what we understand to be true.

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Speaker 6: But you know, I found very quickly when I was

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Speaker 6: doing a Live Again that these stories that I'm collecting

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Speaker 6: they are more about transformation. Yes, there are some real

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Speaker 6: hardcore nd near death experience stories that have all of

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Speaker 6: the things that come with the near death experience, the

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Speaker 6: classical sort of cross cultural phenomenon that are reported, like

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Speaker 6: a life review or encountering you know, a very warm space,

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Speaker 6: or some sort of angelic creatures or even ancestors loved

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Speaker 6: ones who have passed before. And there are a lot

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Speaker 6: of commonalities across you know, different religions in different you know,

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Speaker 6: cultures and different ethnicities and so forth that make it

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Speaker 6: sort of these these phenomenon really interesting and make it

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Speaker 6: go Okay, well there's something going on here. But I

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Speaker 6: also found out that it's about transformation. So a lot

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Speaker 6: of our stories aren't necessarily classical near death experiences, but

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Speaker 6: they're people who have had brushes with death and either

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Speaker 6: had to rehabbilitate or had to come to some understanding.

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Speaker 6: Like Manuel Gesperrett, who was you heard in the U

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Speaker 6: and the teaser there he was abducted by a drug

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Speaker 6: cartel and came to have this extreme compassion and forgiveness

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Speaker 6: for his abductors. And so there are these stories of

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Speaker 6: transformation that I think are really interesting, and it gets

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Speaker 6: into this this thing that happens in storytelling, with filmmaking

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Speaker 6: and with screenwriting, which is the same thing you're you're

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Speaker 6: not you know, you're following a transformation of a character

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Speaker 6: across three acts, you know, and for the purposes of

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Speaker 6: theatrics and storytelling mechanics that usually you know that that

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Speaker 6: abides by a certain set of Aristotilian rules that we

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Speaker 6: all follow with Catharsists and so forth. And it was

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Speaker 6: fun to hear these stories because there's this thing called

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Speaker 6: a liminal or you know, this liminal state, which is

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Speaker 6: the in between states, in between the threshold of you know,

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Speaker 6: the childhood self dies typically in you know, in different

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Speaker 6: like primal cultures. Yeah, and then there's the birth of

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Speaker 6: the adult self or there's some some identity loss, some transformation,

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Speaker 6: and there's this liminal process or this liminal period where

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Speaker 6: there is an unknown and the identity has been ripped

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Speaker 6: away and the new one has not been born yet.

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Speaker 6: And those liminal states are really what we're starting to

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Speaker 6: key in on with the Live Again.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 6: It's just fascinating because there whether it takes you know,

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Speaker 6: eighty years for a liminal state to take place, or

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Speaker 6: whether the liminality happens in five seconds.

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Speaker 3: Right, so somewhere beyond time.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, so we've really started to explore, you know, what

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Speaker 6: it means to be a human being, not just the

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Speaker 6: edges of consciousness, but also the edges of you know, identity.

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Speaker 4: I guess could you give us a bit of an

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Speaker 4: origin story and what inspired they Live Again project?

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Speaker 6: Yeah? Sure, listeners won't be able to see this, but

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Speaker 6: see that picture behind me, yes, all right, So that's

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Speaker 6: my dear old friend Patrice Burnside. She passed away in

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Speaker 6: a car accident. We were together. We moved to Atlanta

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Speaker 6: together back in nineteen ninety six, and she was with

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Speaker 6: me for about three or four years. We had known

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Speaker 6: each other for about ten She passed away in a

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Speaker 6: car accident, and that was nineteen ninety seven. And you know,

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Speaker 6: there were these interesting, strange phenomenon that surrounded her passing

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Speaker 6: that I experienced and other people did too, and they

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Speaker 6: were I was born and grew up in an atheist family.

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Speaker 6: My parents were scientists, and there was sort of this

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Speaker 6: real push to not ever accept anything by faith, because

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Speaker 6: faith could be considered dangerous because it could be used

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Speaker 6: as mind control or what have you, and empirical evidence

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Speaker 6: was the only way to go right, and this sort

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Speaker 6: of idea that there were no illusions about what happens

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Speaker 6: when you die as far as an afterlife. My parents

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Speaker 6: had rebelled against their church because they saw a lot

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Speaker 6: of racist tendencies in the church they went to in

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Speaker 6: the sixties. And so I understand the rebellion, and I

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Speaker 6: understand my father, who's a chemist, and I understand his

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Speaker 6: sort of scientific bent towards not accepting anything that can't

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Speaker 6: be measured. But I, you know, I started to wonder

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Speaker 6: about these experiences I was having. Some people call it

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Speaker 6: shared death, but there's certain experiences that were happening around

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Speaker 6: with me and with what happened with Patrice. Her friends

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Speaker 6: were having dreams about it. The night that it happened,

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Speaker 6: she had gone home to say goodbye to her father,

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Speaker 6: who was a Vietnam vet and an alcoholic and very

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Speaker 6: very dysfunctional. And she actually went and said goodbye to

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Speaker 6: him the night before she passed, which was miraculous. She

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Speaker 6: had hair down, she was a ballerina. She had hair

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Speaker 6: down to her waist and she cut it all off

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Speaker 6: two days before she passed. There was all these transitions

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Speaker 6: she was going through, and all of these things that

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Speaker 6: I experienced before I found out that she had died,

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Speaker 6: they were just phenomenal. They were like, really unexplainable, and

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Speaker 6: it just sparked my curiosity and I was like, what

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Speaker 6: is going on? There's something happening here. And more than anything,

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Speaker 6: it pushed me towards trying to understand why I have

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Speaker 6: my own dogmas about, you know, having grown up in

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Speaker 6: sort of an atheist family and having not really been

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Speaker 6: able to consider certain questions about you know, miraculous events

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Speaker 6: or things we don't understand. So I guess that's the

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Speaker 6: origin of it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 6: And I had heard about near death experiences my whole life,

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Speaker 6: and I'd met a few people who had some crazy stories,

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Speaker 6: and I was like, let me get into it. I mean,

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Speaker 6: I'm not a scientist, I'm a storyteller, but let me,

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Speaker 6: let me try to start charting this and see where

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Speaker 6: it leads.

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Speaker 2: I think some of the most interesting stories you end

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Speaker 2: up finding, at least for personally, for me and alive again,

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Speaker 2: are stories of people who are very scientifically minded and

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Speaker 2: then they do experience a personal end of some sort,

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Speaker 2: and then their attempts to describe what they've gone through,

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Speaker 2: what they've seen, what they've felt, to get that into

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Speaker 2: other people's minds so they understand what they've been through.

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Speaker 3: That.

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Speaker 2: I'm thinking specifically about Adam Tapp, who was a paramedic,

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Speaker 2: you know, and he sees death and close to death

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Speaker 2: all the time in his work, and then to experience

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Speaker 2: being electrocuted. You can listen to that episode's episode five

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Speaker 2: of the show and to hear him describe stuff that

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Speaker 2: seems pretty science fiction y, you know, like pretty out there.

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Speaker 2: Could you describe a little bit of maybe Adam taps.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, Adam. Adam was fascinating. Adam Dye he had a

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Speaker 6: near death experience where he was clinically dead for eleven

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Speaker 6: point five minutes. That's a long time to have no functionality,

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Speaker 6: no no signs of life. And yeah, he he he

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Speaker 6: was electrocuted and he had a very very clear experience

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Speaker 6: of out of body experience and and sort of he

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Speaker 6: describes you know, it's almost interesting because he he sort

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Speaker 6: of describes the coming back into this and Peter Panegor

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Speaker 6: does this too in episode one. There's this description of

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Speaker 6: once you return, coming back and just not being satisfied

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Speaker 6: with sort of this meat avatar that we have the crude,

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Speaker 6: the crude quality of life itself and having to eat

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Speaker 6: and what you know, And it's it's fascinating because he

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Speaker 6: gets into and he's also done a lot of there.

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Speaker 6: You know, he's he's used different psychedelics and he compares

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Speaker 6: those experiences and there are some really there, there are

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Speaker 6: some definite similarities between near death experiences and the use

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Speaker 6: of psychedelics that he sort of describes on the show.

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Speaker 6: One of them that we talk about a lot with

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Speaker 6: our guests is the default mode network. Do you guys

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Speaker 6: know about the default mode network and how that functions

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Speaker 6: with psychedelics?

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Speaker 4: And yes, yeah, and this may be alluding also to

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Speaker 4: an exploration you have with Rick Doblin. Yes, so could

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Speaker 4: you tell or share with the audience what we mean

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Speaker 4: by that prime.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, So, pulling my notes up, default mode network, it's

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Speaker 6: a network of interacting brain regions, right, that become active

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Speaker 6: when the mind is at rest, So if you're daydreaming,

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Speaker 6: if you're talking, thinking about yourself, or thinking about the

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Speaker 6: past or the future, anything that's not directly active. In

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Speaker 6: other words, it's sort of your brain's idle mode, and

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Speaker 6: it's linked to your sense of self. It is your

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Speaker 6: internal monologue. It's the roommate in your head that's nagging

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Speaker 6: you all the time. It's basically where your ego lives,

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Speaker 6: and so if you're not really focused on the outside world,

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Speaker 6: you know, it includes certain areas of the brain, like

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Speaker 6: the medial prefrontal cortex in some other parts of the brain.

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Speaker 6: But under psychedelics, when you take psychedelics like psilocybin or

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Speaker 6: LSD or ayahuasca, the default mode network becomes less active

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Speaker 6: and the normal patterns of brain activity are disrupted, which

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Speaker 6: means that you have this dissociation. Your ego sort of dissolves.

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Speaker 6: And you would think that when you take psychedelics your

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Speaker 6: brain would become much more active. The opposite happens. It

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Speaker 6: calms down, and the thing that this default mode network

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Speaker 6: that's sort of this filter of reality that's constantly putting

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Speaker 6: things together for you and creating pictures for you at

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Speaker 6: all times. It starts to deactivate and so your brain,

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Speaker 6: parts of your brain that normally would not talk to

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Speaker 6: each other start to talk to each other, and you

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Speaker 6: have these feelings of loss of sense of self right

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Speaker 6: ego death yea, And that's sort of one of the

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Speaker 6: phenomenon that come with that.

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Speaker 8: But another one that that he was talking about, adamsapp

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Speaker 8: was talking about, is this And also we get into

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Speaker 8: this a little bit with Rick Doblin, who's the RIX

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Speaker 8: the Presidency of MAPS, multi Disciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies.

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Speaker 6: And that's the non local sort of filter theory of consciousness,

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Speaker 6: and that's a big one we can get into. But

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Speaker 6: it's this idea that you know, because he talks about

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Speaker 6: d m T and these these psychedelics that are potentially

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Speaker 6: released at the moment of death, and you know, these

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Speaker 6: are neurotransmitters that naturally they're naturally occurring, but they so yeah,

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Speaker 6: so there's some some really interesting similarities between near death

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Speaker 6: experiences and what happens in your brain and the brain,

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Speaker 6: the mechanics of the of the neurology and your but yeah,

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Speaker 6: Adam tab gets into that in a really interesting way,

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Speaker 6: because he's one of the several guests we've had who

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Speaker 6: have experienced both, you know.

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Speaker 5: And I was looking through my audible library because it's

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Speaker 5: just kind of like something went off in my head,

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Speaker 5: and I remembered a book that I was listening to

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Speaker 5: a few years ago by Rick Strassmann, MD called DMT

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Speaker 5: The Spirit Molecule, a doctor's revolutionary research into the biology

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Speaker 5: of near death and mystical experiences. And a lot of

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Speaker 5: what you're talking about is covered in that book, and

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Speaker 5: I would highly recommend anybody interested in going a little

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Speaker 5: deeper into that aspect of near death experiences to check

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Speaker 5: that one out. But another one that I've been really

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Speaker 5: enjoying is a book called A New Earth Awakening, Your

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Speaker 5: Life's Purpose by Eckhart Tooley, and in that he talks

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Speaker 5: a lot about the sort of the disconnect between religion

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Speaker 5: and spirituality and how religion sometimes inherently shuts down spirituality

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Speaker 5: because it's sort of this like imposed, very rigorous, sort

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Speaker 5: of form of thought based experience rather than experience exactly,

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Speaker 5: thank you, Ben, rather than the experience of being a human,

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Speaker 5: the experience of being a spiritual being, et cetera. And

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Speaker 5: I just think that a lot of times in the

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Speaker 5: reports from folks who have had in near death experience

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Speaker 5: is reconciling those two things is really fascinating and something

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Speaker 5: that often people are forced to contend with if they

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Speaker 5: were previous to that experience heavily influenced by dogmatic religion.

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Speaker 5: And I'm just curious about, you know, your thoughts about

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Speaker 5: that and anything you've seen, you know, kind of describing

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Speaker 5: that disconnect and that experience.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I think, you know, maybe the core of both

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Speaker 6: stuff they don't want you to know and alive again,

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Speaker 6: is this exploration of controlled narratives maybe. I mean we're

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Speaker 6: looking at reality, you know, I mean we're looking at

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Speaker 6: the shape and our understanding of reality, and whether it's

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Speaker 6: the default mode network or whether it's you know, these

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Speaker 6: narratives are influenced by cultural, religious, institutional even scientific orthodoxies,

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Speaker 6: and you know, they define what we deem possible, what

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Speaker 6: we think is believable or even discussable, you know. And

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Speaker 6: so both of our podcasts in their own way sort

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Speaker 6: of I think, either question or challenge these often these

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Speaker 6: you know, perhaps more Western but materialistic paradigms, you know,

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Speaker 6: and it seems like you guys are constantly uncovering how

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Speaker 6: like social corporate government structures manipulate or suppress information about

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Speaker 6: you know, and I don't know, you know, I want

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Speaker 6: to ask you guys, do you think that's for like

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Speaker 6: to maintain power or stability or you know.

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Speaker 4: I would say consensus reality, right, power and stability or

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Speaker 4: part of it? And right, we're talking off air. Dan,

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Speaker 4: you had a line that I believe stood out to

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Speaker 4: all of us about a sort of ven diagram or

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Speaker 4: in commonality between these these pursuits of ours, similar to

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Speaker 4: surprising commonalities you find with inde experiencers. And you said, specifically,

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Speaker 4: since we also made you listen to your own trailer,

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Speaker 4: we'll give you a quote from yourself back to you,

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Speaker 4: you said, similarly, Alive Again challenges the dominant narratives surrounding consciousness,

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Speaker 4: life and death. You said, particularly the limited Western view

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Speaker 4: that consciousness arises solely from physical brain processes or processes.

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Speaker 4: Could you tell us a little bit about what you

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Speaker 4: see as that Western view versus alternative interpretations, frameworks or

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Speaker 4: modes of thought.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, so there's this sort of there's a materialist it's

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Speaker 6: basically a materialist viewpoint that is the dominant narrative right

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Speaker 6: now in science. And I'm not saying it's wrong because

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Speaker 6: we don't know, but I am saying we don't know,

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Speaker 6: and I am interested in stories that you know, there's

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Speaker 6: this idea of a Western sort of box of knowledge,

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Speaker 6: and there's there's a lot of dogma around what goes

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Speaker 6: in that box and what's not allowed to go in

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Speaker 6: that box. And you know, it's it's interesting because I

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Speaker 6: feel like with a lot of our sciences and a

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Speaker 6: lot of our our educational systems and and even you know,

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Speaker 6: our medical systems and so forth, there's sort of a

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Speaker 6: trained arrogance that creates the sort of wall, and there's

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Speaker 6: these guardians that I don't I don't mean to sound

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Speaker 6: too conspiratorial, even though I'm on the right show to

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Speaker 6: do that. I feel like there's this this sort of

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Speaker 6: this guard rail of thought about what is acceptable and

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Speaker 6: what's not. And it's not that, you know, I it's

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Speaker 6: not that there's anything wrong with with saying no, we

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Speaker 6: don't have evidence to support that. There's no empirical evidence.

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Speaker 6: It's it's all you know here say it's all stories,

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Speaker 6: it's all testimonial. And I get that because you can't

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Speaker 6: really flyline people and do studies in an MRI. I

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Speaker 6: but I do think that there's sort of an arrogance

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Speaker 6: around it, and I do wonder you know, you know,

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Speaker 6: mainstream academia and science establishment. I guess there's prestige, there's funding,

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Speaker 6: there's career stability, that's you know, and anybody who comes

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Speaker 6: out and accepts any sort of ideas of like non

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Speaker 6: local consciousness, which we can talk about in a second.

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Speaker 6: And then there's the pharmaceutical and medical industries, and you know,

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Speaker 6: a strictly materialistic viewpoint maintains that consciousness, including mental health

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Speaker 6: and mood, you know, is purely biochemical, and that's a

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Speaker 6: multi billion dollar pharmaceutical you know, the interventions are you know,

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Speaker 6: and then there's religions and cultural sort of institutions that

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Speaker 6: are threatened by the evidence of you know, the idea

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Speaker 6: of universal consciousness. And we can talk about that a

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Speaker 6: little bit now, the idea of universal and then you know,

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Speaker 6: they call them pseudoscience or unscientific, and they they've shut

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Speaker 6: down pretty quickly, and anybody who who starts to look

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Speaker 6: at it, they can also be shunned by science pretty

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Speaker 6: quickly as well. Well, you know, but there's this idea

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Speaker 6: that started to take root and starting to have some

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Speaker 6: real studies behind it now, which is this idea of

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Speaker 6: non local consciousness. And I can get into the orchestrated

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Speaker 6: objective reduction, and I can get into some of these

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Speaker 6: other ideas you guys know about this stuff that orco

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Speaker 6: ur theories or any of that.

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Speaker 8: Not me.

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Speaker 5: I mean, probably some tangential things are related. But this

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Speaker 5: is definitely new to me for sure.

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Speaker 6: Okay.

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Speaker 2: But the concept, Dan is that consciousness, as we have

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Speaker 2: thought for a long time, is a in some way,

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Speaker 2: the way neurons interact together and create like in our

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Speaker 2: inside our brains somewhere right.

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Speaker 3: Like a pattern of the song.

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Speaker 6: It's it's basically the idea that you know, forever most

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Speaker 6: of us have assumed, just either culturally or scientifically or

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Speaker 6: what have you. The narrative that's out there right now,

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Speaker 6: the dominant narrative is that consciousness is created by the brain.

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Speaker 6: It is a product of the brain. And but you know,

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Speaker 6: started with the likes of Oldest Huxley, and there's a

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Speaker 6: Sir Roger Penrose who was a you know, physicist, and

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Speaker 6: doctor Stuart hammer Off was an aesthetician. But they're they're

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Speaker 6: getting into this idea that consciousness is actually not local,

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Speaker 6: it's not something created by their brain. It's something rather

437
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:26,159
Speaker 6: we are filtering from a unified field beyond ourselves. And

438
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:29,600
Speaker 6: that idea alone, my first thought was, oh both. I mean,

439
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:31,439
Speaker 6: I have my own dogmas about it, and I'm thinking, oh,

440
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 6: you know, that sounds magical in the force and all

441
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:35,159
Speaker 6: that kind of stuff.

442
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:39,440
Speaker 3: And similar to the young and super consciousness. Yeah, yeah, right.

443
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:41,720
Speaker 6: But then you know, if you open up your mind

444
00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:42,920
Speaker 6: a little bit and back off a little bit and

445
00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:44,919
Speaker 6: you hear these indies stories and here's you know, and

446
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:47,640
Speaker 6: some people describe stuff that happens through their psychedelic experiences

447
00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:50,160
Speaker 6: where different part of the brain shuts down and there's

448
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:55,119
Speaker 6: still this level of consciousness. You know, it begs the question,

449
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,600
Speaker 6: what the hell's happening? And so this orc O R

450
00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:05,280
Speaker 6: it's it's orchest strated objective reduction. So the or O

451
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:09,800
Speaker 6: R theory it proposes that quantum computations are occurring in

452
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:15,320
Speaker 6: the microtubules inside of our neurons. Yes, does that make sense? Yes,

453
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,560
Speaker 6: I can get into it. But it's so these these

454
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 6: computations are the theory is that these are non local,

455
00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:23,280
Speaker 6: meaning they aren't confined to a single point in time

456
00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:27,360
Speaker 6: and space. So it's this idea that consciousness arises when

457
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:32,879
Speaker 6: these quantum wave functions collapse in a unified moment. So,

458
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:36,479
Speaker 6: you know, traditional neuroscience views consciousness is purely a product

459
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:40,199
Speaker 6: of the brain activity, neurons firing, synapse is interacting. But

460
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,639
Speaker 6: in this alternate model, this filter theory, it proposes that

461
00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:48,639
Speaker 6: consciousness is actually this unified field and that we're just

462
00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 6: receiving or filtering stuff. Does that make sense.

463
00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 2: It's really interesting, especially when it comes to specific experiences

464
00:26:56,600 --> 00:27:01,199
Speaker 2: where people people get the sense that time either slows

465
00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:05,560
Speaker 2: down or disappears or stops, or they can move time

466
00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 2: along a timeline. There's a I'm just going to go

467
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,240
Speaker 2: back again to h to our buddy Adam tap Here,

468
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 2: who was electrocuted, was dead for eleven and a half minutes.

469
00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:22,160
Speaker 2: He talks about the experience of being defibrillated, having electricity

470
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:25,000
Speaker 2: show through his body, starting his heart again, almost coming

471
00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:29,119
Speaker 2: back for a moment, and then going back into this

472
00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:32,560
Speaker 2: space that he is and he experiences time there as

473
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:37,480
Speaker 2: so stretched out. How does he describe it? It's like inception, right,

474
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:43,720
Speaker 2: It's the yeah, yeah, yeah, where it's like it's like

475
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 2: whatever his consciousness thing is this filter we're talking about

476
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:52,800
Speaker 2: through you know, these quantum these cubits matching up at

477
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 2: the right moment, right that we would consider now uh,

478
00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:58,720
Speaker 2: he he experiences that for a moment, then it just

479
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 2: goes away and he's on some unknown timeline again.

480
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:07,240
Speaker 6: Rights, And it's hard to make sense of that. And

481
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:08,919
Speaker 6: one thing I do know is that the folks that

482
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:14,520
Speaker 6: do have these near death experiences, they there was a paper.

483
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 6: I can steer you guys to the paper, but there's

484
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,719
Speaker 6: been some papers recently that are in defense of and

485
00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:27,760
Speaker 6: in support of, you know, non local consciousness. And you know,

486
00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:29,840
Speaker 6: one of the things they say, and again is just

487
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 6: it is, but like if people have near death experiences,

488
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 6: have an eighty percent more likelihood of not being afraid

489
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:43,920
Speaker 6: of death afterwards, right, Yeah. They are so committed to

490
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:47,280
Speaker 6: this idea. They are so you know, they are so

491
00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 6: assured in their experience and having come back that they

492
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:54,640
Speaker 6: no longer fear death. And I mean that's something right,

493
00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:56,640
Speaker 6: to have died or to have been clinically dead for

494
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:58,040
Speaker 6: some amount of time and then come back and you

495
00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 6: don't fear death anymore. You think it'd be the opposite, right.

496
00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, pause for a word from our sponsors, and

497
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:12,280
Speaker 4: then return with more from Dan Bush. And we've returned

498
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:16,640
Speaker 4: one of so far. I think our collective favorites among

499
00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 4: favorites of Alive Again episodes, is that fascinating conversation you

500
00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 4: have with Rick Doblin. It's episode six NET zero Trauma.

501
00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 4: It's a wide ranging conversation, and I had one of

502
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:35,200
Speaker 4: those what MPR calls a driveway moment, yes, where you

503
00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:39,360
Speaker 4: are listening in the car and you can't get out

504
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,120
Speaker 4: of the car until you hear the rest of the

505
00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:43,960
Speaker 4: things yea. And what stood out to me was this

506
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:49,400
Speaker 4: excellent comparison you all make to to what we sometimes

507
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 4: call the overview effect when astronauts see the planet entire

508
00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 4: and say, you know, they get a little John Lennon

509
00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 4: about it. No religion, right, no countries. Can you tell

510
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:05,760
Speaker 4: us a little bit about how you and Rick find

511
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:10,400
Speaker 4: the overview effect of astronauts similar to the phenomenon of

512
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 4: a near death experience.

513
00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:16,440
Speaker 6: That's interesting. I hadn't quite thought about that. I think,

514
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 6: you know, I think what I'm trying to do ri

515
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:22,520
Speaker 6: rix fascinating. I love him because he talks about this.

516
00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 6: He has this cool concept of net zero trauma, right,

517
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:31,480
Speaker 6: which is not eliminating trauma. It's just not adding any

518
00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 6: more trauma to the global trauma that you know, all

519
00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:37,640
Speaker 6: people are. We're not doing a very good job of

520
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,880
Speaker 6: not adding to that right now in the world. But

521
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 6: and there are you know, some wonderful new sciences, you know,

522
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:49,040
Speaker 6: studies and stuff that are coming out about you know,

523
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 6: generational trauma and how it actually affects the genome. Yeah,

524
00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 6: there is this thing that that I would like to

525
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:59,240
Speaker 6: speak to about that which is something that that I

526
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:02,680
Speaker 6: found through this show, through Alive again in interviewing these people.

527
00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:06,560
Speaker 6: It's something that Aaron Ralston talks about. Aaron Ralston was

528
00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 6: the subject of one hundred and twenty seven Hours, the

529
00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:14,040
Speaker 6: Danny Boyle film. He was solo hiking through the canyons

530
00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:17,000
Speaker 6: in Moab near Moab, and he got trapped and the

531
00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 6: boulder caught his arm, putting it off for years. It

532
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:25,480
Speaker 6: seems patently unpleasant. Yeah, well, we had a wonderful you know,

533
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:27,400
Speaker 6: he shared his story with us on the show. And

534
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 6: he gets to a point where after six days without

535
00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 6: food and water, trapped down there and realizing that he's

536
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:37,160
Speaker 6: going to probably have to cut his own arm off,

537
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:41,560
Speaker 6: before he's willing to go there. He starts to videotape

538
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 6: himself and he just starts to have conversations after saying, hey, look,

539
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:47,240
Speaker 6: if you find me and you find my remains, please

540
00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 6: tell my mom. Other than that, the next step is

541
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 6: he starts to say goodbye to all the people that

542
00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:56,400
Speaker 6: he knew in his life. He starts to speak to

543
00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:58,640
Speaker 6: his family members, and he starts to people, speak to

544
00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:02,480
Speaker 6: people he loved, and to apologize, and this overwhelming sense

545
00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:05,880
Speaker 6: of gratitude starts to overwhelm him right sort starts to

546
00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 6: overtake him, and he he this gratitude continues to lift

547
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:10,440
Speaker 6: him even though he hasn't had any food or water

548
00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:15,400
Speaker 6: for six days. Eventually he does have a near death

549
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:17,320
Speaker 6: experience or he does have an out of body experience

550
00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:22,960
Speaker 6: where he sees his future son like this blonde headed,

551
00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:25,880
Speaker 6: blue eyed kid that he later is so confident that

552
00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:29,600
Speaker 6: he's going to meet someday. But he then in this

553
00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:32,480
Speaker 6: moment when he's he has this gratitude hit him and

554
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 6: he realizes that you cannot He says this, he cannot

555
00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 6: hold simultaneously hold despair and gratitude in your heart at

556
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:41,720
Speaker 6: the same time. And this speaks to something that that

557
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 6: I started to I started to look into, and it's

558
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:52,480
Speaker 6: actually true. Neurologically, those two states are incompatible. So the migdala,

559
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:58,480
Speaker 6: which is responsible for you know, fear, fight or flight, distress, courtisol,

560
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:02,600
Speaker 6: the amygdala, if that's firing and active, there is no

561
00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:06,120
Speaker 6: place where the prefrontal cortex, which is the part of

562
00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:09,880
Speaker 6: your brain that has to do with gratitude, dopamine oxytocin,

563
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 6: which is the love hormone or neurotransmitter, the two are incompatible.

564
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 6: So it's like a light switch. So in that sense,

565
00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 6: the antidote then to despair, to depression, to feelings of fear.

566
00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 6: The antidote truly is on a neurological level gratitude and love,

567
00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 6: because when you start to activate the gratitude and love

568
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:37,880
Speaker 6: part of it, the other one, the amigola, is shut

569
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 6: down in your brain. So you know, they say love

570
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:48,880
Speaker 6: conquers fear, you know it's actually physically biologically true. And

571
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:53,320
Speaker 6: I thought that was basing. And so I think about

572
00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:56,680
Speaker 6: this about Rick Doblin and this net zero trauma, and

573
00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:59,640
Speaker 6: you know, we've known for a long time that you

574
00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:01,920
Speaker 6: can you can sort of shut down your miggelow with

575
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:08,120
Speaker 6: practices of meditation and so forth. But you know, it's

576
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:13,080
Speaker 6: I wonder if everybody in the world turned off there.

577
00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:15,640
Speaker 6: It's hard because you're so scared you don't want to

578
00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:17,760
Speaker 6: let go of the news cycle, right especially these days.

579
00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:21,200
Speaker 6: I'm not going to be here tomorrow. But there's a

580
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 6: strong argument for making the world a better place by

581
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 6: tuning out and focusing on gratitude instead and starting to

582
00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:33,239
Speaker 6: harvest a different sort of mode, which is also can

583
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 6: become you know, people have become contaminated by whatever thought

584
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 6: energies you have. I found, you know, whether if you're

585
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,760
Speaker 6: negative all the time, you're going to create negative environments.

586
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:45,799
Speaker 6: You're going to surround yourself with negative situations and negative people. Yeah,

587
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:47,160
Speaker 6: and the opposite is also true.

588
00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 3: True.

589
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:52,239
Speaker 4: I like that, like pro noia the opposite of paranoia. Yeah,

590
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:56,240
Speaker 4: but a concept we discussed with a friend of ours,

591
00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:57,720
Speaker 4: John Cameron Mitchell.

592
00:34:57,760 --> 00:34:58,839
Speaker 3: It's pretty neat.

593
00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:02,880
Speaker 4: It also reminds me of a word that Nol and

594
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:06,360
Speaker 4: Matt taught me, which was what was the guy's catastrophizing.

595
00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 3: Catastrophizing.

596
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:10,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's just that loop, that spiral of negative thoughts

597
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,000
Speaker 5: and a lot of that too kind of fits in

598
00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:17,560
Speaker 5: with what Eckartotli talks a lot about, which is the

599
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:21,960
Speaker 5: separation from you know, our spiritual selves. It imbues us

600
00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 5: with these thought patterns that are just that, that are

601
00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 5: kind of this almost like.

602
00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:30,480
Speaker 3: Voice inside of our head. Yeah, exactly.

603
00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:34,320
Speaker 5: And it's these constructs that we participate in, whether willingly

604
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:36,879
Speaker 5: or just buy you know, necessity, I guess, because it's

605
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:39,600
Speaker 5: just sort of the structure that we find ourselves in.

606
00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:44,000
Speaker 5: And it's really helpful with you know, mindfulness and meditation

607
00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 5: and you know, some forms of spirituality and even some

608
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:49,200
Speaker 5: forms of religion that are maybe a little less on

609
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 5: the dogmatic side, to kind of separate ourselves from a

610
00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:53,520
Speaker 5: lot of those and while we still have to live

611
00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 5: in the construct that we find ourselves in, it is

612
00:35:57,080 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 5: helpful to be able to, you know, consciously separate yourself

613
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:03,319
Speaker 5: from that. And I think that near death stuff and

614
00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:06,520
Speaker 5: a lot of this psychedelic stuff is a very very

615
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:09,360
Speaker 5: important kind of pathway to that kind of thinking. And

616
00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:12,920
Speaker 5: it made me think of, you know, why are psychedelics illegal.

617
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,640
Speaker 5: Why have they historically been illegal? I think that in

618
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:19,400
Speaker 5: and of itself has historically been a means of control,

619
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:22,120
Speaker 5: because there's a sense that if you experience these things.

620
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:25,720
Speaker 5: Then you are less susceptible to those modes of control,

621
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 5: whether it be governmental or organized religion or.

622
00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:32,399
Speaker 6: What have you. God forbid that we do find out

623
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:36,600
Speaker 6: someday that you know, consciousness is universal and not local,

624
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:38,600
Speaker 6: but you know it's not generated from the brain, but

625
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 6: it's actually something we're all filtering. The universe is consciousness

626
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:47,799
Speaker 6: like that idea? Yeah, yeah, so a lot of in

627
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 6: fact that happens. Peter Panagor our first story, he had

628
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:53,640
Speaker 6: a near death experience while ice climbing, died on a mountaintop,

629
00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:59,040
Speaker 6: came back, and for years he struggled because and several

630
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,719
Speaker 6: other people have have talked about this on our show,

631
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:03,719
Speaker 6: where they take this story of what happening, they take

632
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:07,560
Speaker 6: it to their church, or they take it to their pastor,

633
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:10,319
Speaker 6: or they take it to you know, their rabbi or whatever,

634
00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 6: and they propose this idea and they say, look, this

635
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:13,960
Speaker 6: happened to me, and I'm trying to reconcile this with

636
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:17,400
Speaker 6: what the teachings are you know, in this institution or

637
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:21,600
Speaker 6: what have you. And they were rejected. Yeah, like hands down,

638
00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:24,440
Speaker 6: like this doesn't this doesn't go with the narrative about

639
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:27,319
Speaker 6: what you know, Jesus said and so therefore, you know,

640
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:29,840
Speaker 6: and these people were left going, Okay, I've got to

641
00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:32,759
Speaker 6: find out what the answers are because I thought I

642
00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:35,080
Speaker 6: would have an answer in my church that I thought

643
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:36,959
Speaker 6: that would be a place where I could reconcile these

644
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:40,279
Speaker 6: this this experience that have had with the narrative, and

645
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:40,800
Speaker 6: they couldn't.

646
00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:45,399
Speaker 2: Well, isn't it interesting how close some of those experiences

647
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:49,759
Speaker 2: do feel, like close to the imagery that's written down

648
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 2: in things like a torah or Bible, or you know,

649
00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:55,680
Speaker 2: just in places like that, it feels close. I'm thinking

650
00:37:55,880 --> 00:38:02,160
Speaker 2: about ditch Field, David Ditschfield's paintings that he created in

651
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:05,600
Speaker 2: episode eight. You can listen to that one. David Ditchfield.

652
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:08,680
Speaker 2: This man who fell underneath the train. He got stuck

653
00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:12,879
Speaker 2: and caught underneath the train and almost bled out, and

654
00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:15,600
Speaker 2: he did I guess he. I don't know if he

655
00:38:15,640 --> 00:38:18,160
Speaker 2: was in a como or if he actually physically died.

656
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:21,000
Speaker 6: I can't remember, but I think that they had to

657
00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:24,879
Speaker 6: do a self induced como with him. But he did

658
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:28,920
Speaker 6: have a full on, complete, authentic near death experience.

659
00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 2: Well, can I share? Can I share this picture? Just

660
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:34,320
Speaker 2: this picture so we can all look at it at once.

661
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 2: This is the image that he reported seeing. I don't

662
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:39,920
Speaker 2: know if you guys can see this, it'll blow it

663
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:42,920
Speaker 2: up a little bit. Yeah, thank you of this white

664
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 2: light that was surrounded by flames in essentially space. Like

665
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:53,040
Speaker 2: he said, he felt his own body laying on a

666
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:57,000
Speaker 2: slab of granite out in space and with this light

667
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:01,040
Speaker 2: that approached him and there were others. Weren't there entities

668
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:01,719
Speaker 2: there with him?

669
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:04,920
Speaker 6: Yeah? Yeah, And that's a common it's a common thing.

670
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:08,560
Speaker 6: Is is people. Ronnie White speaks about this his episodes

671
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:10,719
Speaker 6: coming up, Peter panicgre speaks about this. But there's this

672
00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:15,440
Speaker 6: Anne Bayford talks about this. There's this experience of these

673
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:19,920
Speaker 6: other beings who are doing this sort of this fine

674
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:22,239
Speaker 6: tuning and healing of the of the soul.

675
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:24,560
Speaker 5: On certain levels, which is also something you hear reported

676
00:39:24,600 --> 00:39:29,200
Speaker 5: with d m T experiences, the machine elves or what

677
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:30,719
Speaker 5: have you. It seems it to be a lot of

678
00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:31,439
Speaker 5: parallels there.

679
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:36,399
Speaker 6: Yeah. Absolutely, and yeah, and I you know, it's when

680
00:39:36,520 --> 00:39:39,440
Speaker 6: so many people have this similar such a similar experience,

681
00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:42,759
Speaker 6: and there I mean, there are indie experiences where people

682
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 6: described things obviously that they could not have been witnessed to.

683
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:48,800
Speaker 6: They describe conversations that happened while they were the brain

684
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 6: was dead, and or they've seen they see things, uh

685
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:55,120
Speaker 6: in parts of the building that they could not have

686
00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:57,960
Speaker 6: possibly seen because they came in unconscious. And then they

687
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 6: and there there was no brain activity. They could not

688
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:02,319
Speaker 6: have heard anything that there was. It was just zero

689
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:07,320
Speaker 6: brain active, zero functionality, usually through cardiac you know, situations,

690
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,719
Speaker 6: and they come back and they describe clearly they've had

691
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:14,080
Speaker 6: some you know, and there's no explanation for this stuff,

692
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 6: you know.

693
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 4: Right, how did that sensory input and that recollection arrive.

694
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:24,680
Speaker 4: If the materialist view of purely local conscience holds true,

695
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:28,239
Speaker 4: then there is no explanation under that theory, which I

696
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 4: find so incredibly fascinating now even terrifying. What I want

697
00:40:34,719 --> 00:40:37,959
Speaker 4: to go back to something we've we've mentioned a few

698
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:41,799
Speaker 4: times here, Dan, We've brought up the words commonality. We've

699
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:46,400
Speaker 4: brought up the words parallels. Uh We establish or you

700
00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:48,280
Speaker 4: establish through your.

701
00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:49,240
Speaker 3: Work that.

702
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 4: Despite Eddie, you know, living demographic whether that be culture, creed, location,

703
00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:02,880
Speaker 4: uh age, at the time of the experience, you and

704
00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:07,600
Speaker 4: your team do discover these commonalities that go past the

705
00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:11,640
Speaker 4: dogma and the sort of legislative nature of religious beliefs.

706
00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:16,560
Speaker 4: Could you tell us some of the most surprising commonalities

707
00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 4: you discovered. Was there anything that really surprised you.

708
00:41:20,719 --> 00:41:24,040
Speaker 6: I will say that the biggest one, right off the

709
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:26,759
Speaker 6: top of my head, has to do more with that

710
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:29,600
Speaker 6: liminal state that we talked about, and so it wasn't

711
00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:32,839
Speaker 6: so much during the event itself. It was afterwards where

712
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 6: they came back and when asked would you do it again?

713
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:39,080
Speaker 6: We often ask what would you know? Would if you

714
00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:41,480
Speaker 6: had this to do again, to experience again, to die again,

715
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:43,720
Speaker 6: would you do it? And they all say I wouldn't

716
00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:45,960
Speaker 6: change a thing, not that.

717
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you name a couple of things.

718
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:52,880
Speaker 6: Yeah, because of who they've become and how that adversity

719
00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:55,640
Speaker 6: and how that trauma has forced them to grow and

720
00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:58,240
Speaker 6: become something now that they could not have become without.

721
00:41:58,560 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 6: They all say, I and change a thing. Who I

722
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:03,359
Speaker 6: am now is awesome. And even if they even if

723
00:42:03,360 --> 00:42:06,120
Speaker 6: they still can't walk or if they can't, they tend

724
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:07,799
Speaker 6: to have that sensibility.

725
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:09,759
Speaker 5: I guess it makes me think of I mean, the

726
00:42:09,840 --> 00:42:13,520
Speaker 5: ultimate goal of religion for many people is to not

727
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:17,400
Speaker 5: fear death, is to have some understanding that there is

728
00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:20,960
Speaker 5: something positive beyond this life, or in a way that

729
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 5: makes you either live better or a lack of fear

730
00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:27,560
Speaker 5: of what happens when we die. And what more concrete

731
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:31,520
Speaker 5: way to get past that than to actually die and

732
00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:34,320
Speaker 5: then see what it's like. And I can only imagine

733
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:38,200
Speaker 5: the overview effect to your point ben of that experience.

734
00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:42,160
Speaker 6: And you know, not all of them, but a high

735
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:44,440
Speaker 6: percentage of in most of the stories we've collected, a

736
00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:47,360
Speaker 6: high percentage of these near death experiences. They also report

737
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:51,279
Speaker 6: being embraced by a very loving, warm and this is

738
00:42:51,280 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 6: where culture does come in. Like these perspectives, Some describe

739
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:58,120
Speaker 6: it as a Jesus like figure, others from different other

740
00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:01,680
Speaker 6: from other cultures describe it very differently, but the commonality

741
00:43:01,760 --> 00:43:05,840
Speaker 6: is this idea that there's this embrace from a very warm,

742
00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:13,560
Speaker 6: ultimately loving entity that reassures them and makes them feel

743
00:43:13,560 --> 00:43:17,000
Speaker 6: at peace. And that's you know, call it God or

744
00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:19,840
Speaker 6: however we could possibly describe it. It is indescribable. They also

745
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:23,759
Speaker 6: that's another that's another sort of commonality is that it's

746
00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:29,160
Speaker 6: like trying to describe a smell with a crayon. You.

747
00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:33,160
Speaker 4: I love that because it's it reminds me of one

748
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:38,600
Speaker 4: of those old truisms. Honestly, for good storytelling, you meet

749
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:43,360
Speaker 4: people where they're at, so people have a cultural framework

750
00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:47,399
Speaker 4: through which they experience, uh, the indescribable. Like when you're

751
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 4: in that experience, you have to you have to again

752
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:56,800
Speaker 4: kind of filter it through your current lived understanding.

753
00:43:56,680 --> 00:44:00,719
Speaker 6: Right right, Yes, how do you reckon style what you've

754
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:02,840
Speaker 6: just experienced with anything you've been told or taught or

755
00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:05,400
Speaker 6: learned or experience so far? Yeah, just so, yeah, I

756
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 6: can't imagine.

757
00:44:06,120 --> 00:44:09,200
Speaker 5: Mean when they say they had their minds blown, they.

758
00:44:09,200 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 2: Had to a degree, Well, David Ditchfield quotes, I think

759
00:44:13,880 --> 00:44:16,759
Speaker 2: doctor David Eagleman, I think is how you say his name,

760
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:21,279
Speaker 2: someone who is talking about experiencing life like all of

761
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:24,279
Speaker 2: us are experiencing life right now, he says, imagine that

762
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:28,800
Speaker 2: this would be equivalent to VHS tape, like playback of

763
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:31,160
Speaker 2: VHS tape. That's what we're in right now, everything we

764
00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:33,480
Speaker 2: experience every day. And then when you have one of

765
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 2: these NDEs, he describes it as like being pulled out

766
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:40,279
Speaker 2: into a theatrical string screen, you know, like the full

767
00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:45,279
Speaker 2: digital projection, like all of the resolution, and just like

768
00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 2: experiencing that for a moment, then going back to VHS

769
00:44:48,160 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 2: and trying to explain to everybody else who's on VHS

770
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 2: what that was.

771
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:57,000
Speaker 6: Right, So if there's this filtering right of our experience,

772
00:44:57,280 --> 00:44:58,600
Speaker 6: I mean, think about it. The brain is one of

773
00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:01,560
Speaker 6: the most complicated or compli objects in the in the universe.

774
00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:04,200
Speaker 6: There are more connections happening in your brain every every

775
00:45:04,320 --> 00:45:07,520
Speaker 6: microsecond than there are stars in the galaxy.

776
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:08,400
Speaker 3: Take that.

777
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:14,319
Speaker 6: So you know, and so we when you know, when

778
00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:16,840
Speaker 6: you start to look again at sort of the idea

779
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 6: that if you go down to the microtubules and the

780
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:24,400
Speaker 6: subatomic particles, it's basically the ion channels that we were

781
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:27,760
Speaker 6: talking about. So they're they're like these electrical gates on neurons,

782
00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 6: and they regulate the flow of ions calcium, potassium in

783
00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 6: and out of the cell. But so these things they

784
00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:38,680
Speaker 6: when you get down to that level, the electrons are

785
00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 6: exhibiting these quantum effects, right, superposition, being in more than

786
00:45:43,239 --> 00:45:48,000
Speaker 6: one state at the same time, entanglements, which means you know,

787
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:53,400
Speaker 6: instantaneously connected ever a distance the distance is irrelevant, irrelevant,

788
00:45:53,880 --> 00:45:58,719
Speaker 6: the quantum tunneling, where you know, the particles appearing in

789
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:01,760
Speaker 6: places that they shouldn't if you're looking at classical physics.

790
00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:05,799
Speaker 6: So these sort of quantum behaviors are happening on the brain,

791
00:46:05,880 --> 00:46:11,319
Speaker 6: and it just it undermines this strictly materialist model where

792
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:15,239
Speaker 6: neurons are just like binary switches, because they're just not

793
00:46:15,400 --> 00:46:17,680
Speaker 6: It's just there's no way to describe what's happening. And

794
00:46:17,719 --> 00:46:20,800
Speaker 6: it just suggests that consciousness might exist in this quantum

795
00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:23,480
Speaker 6: field and we're just filtering it. I don't know how

796
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:24,840
Speaker 6: to say it. I'm still learning about this.

797
00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:28,240
Speaker 4: Oh, this is perfect of our One of our favorite

798
00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:34,040
Speaker 4: quotes about physics comes from a quantum mechanics professor, doctor Schenkor,

799
00:46:34,280 --> 00:46:37,719
Speaker 4: and he says we quoted him in a recent episode.

800
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:42,080
Speaker 4: He says, right now, no one understands quantum mechanics. As

801
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,800
Speaker 4: he's speaking to his lecture hall, and he says, after

802
00:46:45,880 --> 00:46:49,040
Speaker 4: about seven days, my hope is that none of you

803
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:54,239
Speaker 4: will understand quantum mechanics either, and it's just we bring

804
00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:56,560
Speaker 4: it out. I thought of I thought of what you're

805
00:46:56,560 --> 00:46:59,840
Speaker 4: saying there. We also have looked into some of the

806
00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:04,919
Speaker 4: in our series on the concept of predictive dreams. Right,

807
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 4: the dream state, which has a lot in it's another

808
00:47:08,120 --> 00:47:12,399
Speaker 4: limital space. We could argue, yeah, when you are when

809
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:15,720
Speaker 4: you are speaking with these people who have these vastly

810
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:23,000
Speaker 4: different experiences, right, but also this vast aggregation of commonalities.

811
00:47:24,600 --> 00:47:28,600
Speaker 4: What how do you this this is a strategic question.

812
00:47:28,920 --> 00:47:32,799
Speaker 4: How do you find these people for alive again? And

813
00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:36,759
Speaker 4: how do you as an interviewer, how do you navigate

814
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:39,840
Speaker 4: speaking with them about something so intimate and so personal?

815
00:47:39,960 --> 00:47:40,120
Speaker 3: Right?

816
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:45,920
Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, I think the idea is to just listen,

817
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:50,719
Speaker 6: to really just listen the stories we have found just

818
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:53,320
Speaker 6: by looking up standing we've found through the New York Times,

819
00:47:53,480 --> 00:47:55,919
Speaker 6: or we've looked for them on the online and found

820
00:47:55,920 --> 00:48:00,040
Speaker 6: different situations or different different stories that we've pursued, and

821
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:02,799
Speaker 6: you know, and it's interesting because a lot of them

822
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:06,520
Speaker 6: do lean very religious, very quick, and so I've been

823
00:48:06,880 --> 00:48:10,000
Speaker 6: sort of We've we've got several of those stories that

824
00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:12,000
Speaker 6: are that are heavily in that space. But I really

825
00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:15,359
Speaker 6: like on our show, we have you know, our story producers.

826
00:48:15,800 --> 00:48:19,720
Speaker 6: We have you know, Nick Takowski, Kate Sweeney, Brent Dye, myself,

827
00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:24,719
Speaker 6: Lauren Vogelbaum. We have Kate is sort of a skeptic,

828
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:27,960
Speaker 6: you know, which is great, and I'm kind of an

829
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:32,000
Speaker 6: agnostic just questioning everything. Brent's very Christian and he has

830
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:34,000
Speaker 6: you know, he believes very much in faith in Christian

831
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:44,400
Speaker 6: Dogma and Nick Takowski is just a cynic show, so uh,

832
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:48,560
Speaker 6: you know. And they so these guys together when we're

833
00:48:48,560 --> 00:48:51,360
Speaker 6: talking about what you know, they're out helping me collect

834
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:53,520
Speaker 6: these episodes and they're helping me find these stories. And

835
00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:56,319
Speaker 6: we learned very quickly on that it's not you know,

836
00:48:56,480 --> 00:48:58,480
Speaker 6: it's not just about the near death experiences. It's also

837
00:48:58,480 --> 00:49:00,960
Speaker 6: about what I was talking about, the liminal state. It's

838
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:06,120
Speaker 6: about the transformation, so you know, the human fragility and resilience,

839
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:10,319
Speaker 6: whether or not they've had a pure indie or not,

840
00:49:11,120 --> 00:49:13,520
Speaker 6: I want to know. I'm interested in how this experience

841
00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:15,880
Speaker 6: has changed their understanding, their relationships with the world and

842
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:20,520
Speaker 6: with each other and with themselves. So I will say this,

843
00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:23,960
Speaker 6: speaking back about the picture for those who can't see

844
00:49:23,960 --> 00:49:28,359
Speaker 6: it online, there's Patrice leaping in the desert. That's Great

845
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:32,160
Speaker 6: Sand Dunes National Park. She was a ballerina and this

846
00:49:32,239 --> 00:49:34,200
Speaker 6: was taken about it a year before she passed away.

847
00:49:34,680 --> 00:49:37,560
Speaker 6: And my son, who at the time was about five

848
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:40,480
Speaker 6: or six years old, was looking at the picture and

849
00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:42,440
Speaker 6: he said, you know, who is that? And I told

850
00:49:42,520 --> 00:49:44,560
Speaker 6: him the story and he said, well, what do you

851
00:49:44,560 --> 00:49:46,319
Speaker 6: you know? It's that thing that all parents have to

852
00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:48,480
Speaker 6: face with their children of is you know, what do

853
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 6: you mean she died and well she's not coming back.

854
00:49:50,760 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 6: Well where did she go? And I looked at him

855
00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:56,279
Speaker 6: and I was like, you know, we don't know. We

856
00:49:56,320 --> 00:49:58,080
Speaker 6: don't know where she went. We don't know if she's

857
00:49:58,080 --> 00:50:00,200
Speaker 6: with us anymore or not, you know, but I we

858
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:03,600
Speaker 6: have a I have a feeling about it that I believe.

859
00:50:04,640 --> 00:50:07,760
Speaker 6: And it led to this conversation about like the ending

860
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:11,440
Speaker 6: of things, right that the threshold of this existence and

861
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:15,440
Speaker 6: what may or may not come after. And he said, well,

862
00:50:15,600 --> 00:50:18,719
Speaker 6: maybe she's just at the end of the universe. That's

863
00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:20,960
Speaker 6: what he said, five year old. And I said, amazing,

864
00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:23,319
Speaker 6: what do you mean, I said, what do you His

865
00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:24,759
Speaker 6: name is Roman, I said, what do you Roman? What

866
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 6: do you mean the end of the universe? He's like,

867
00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:27,160
Speaker 6: you know, at the end of it, Like she just

868
00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:31,160
Speaker 6: went to the end of it, was like, and I said, well,

869
00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:35,279
Speaker 6: is there an end to the universe? Because you know,

870
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:38,600
Speaker 6: if you think about it, Roman, you get to the

871
00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:40,239
Speaker 6: end of it, then what's on the other side of

872
00:50:40,400 --> 00:50:44,440
Speaker 6: the end? And he's said and he heard that and

873
00:50:44,480 --> 00:50:47,160
Speaker 6: he started to laugh. Like for a lot of people,

874
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:50,799
Speaker 6: the idea that that time and space are endless is

875
00:50:51,120 --> 00:50:55,920
Speaker 6: daunting and terrifying. But for for Roman, for some reason,

876
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:59,279
Speaker 6: he found that to be the most absurd thing that

877
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:02,640
Speaker 6: had ever triggered his brain. And he started laughing so

878
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:04,480
Speaker 6: hard he was almost crying. He's laughing. I was like,

879
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:07,520
Speaker 6: what's so funn He's like that, you're you know that

880
00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:09,839
Speaker 6: the that the the universe is endless. He just thought

881
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:11,879
Speaker 6: that was the funniest, guy damn thing he had ever heard.

882
00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:14,400
Speaker 3: He was he was looking at you like man.

883
00:51:16,960 --> 00:51:21,399
Speaker 5: But even like, as you know, adults, the concept of

884
00:51:21,560 --> 00:51:25,719
Speaker 5: infinity and the concept of something being endless is impossible

885
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:27,680
Speaker 5: to wrap one's head around by its very nature.

886
00:51:27,719 --> 00:51:31,239
Speaker 6: Right, It's a it's a particularly absurd condition that we

887
00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:35,719
Speaker 6: live in. Yeah, it's what we could observe, right.

888
00:51:36,120 --> 00:51:37,880
Speaker 5: Hey, yeah, let's take a quick break here from our

889
00:51:37,880 --> 00:51:40,160
Speaker 5: sponsor and then come back with more with Dan.

890
00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:47,280
Speaker 6: And we returned.

891
00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:50,719
Speaker 2: I want to try and articulate something here, and I

892
00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:53,920
Speaker 2: can't get it into words, but it goes back to

893
00:51:53,960 --> 00:52:00,240
Speaker 2: this concept of non localized consciousness. Right, So somehow consciousness

894
00:52:00,280 --> 00:52:05,240
Speaker 2: being channeled through the system that is our brain, right,

895
00:52:05,320 --> 00:52:08,799
Speaker 2: and this complex thing. It makes me think about our

896
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:12,359
Speaker 2: conversations dealing with simulation theory, dealing with some of these

897
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:15,839
Speaker 2: concepts of maybe this is a field that we're all

898
00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:20,160
Speaker 2: accessing through these brain things, but we, the thing that

899
00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:24,560
Speaker 2: we would call we, is elsewhere. And then I'm thinking

900
00:52:24,560 --> 00:52:28,040
Speaker 2: about this white light, this energy of love, whatever this

901
00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:30,799
Speaker 2: thing is that's described by so many people. And I

902
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:35,239
Speaker 2: think about the moment when you turn the power on

903
00:52:35,719 --> 00:52:40,719
Speaker 2: of your computer, like that moment that electricity first surges

904
00:52:41,640 --> 00:52:45,480
Speaker 2: through the circuit into the motherboard and activates all the pieces,

905
00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:47,920
Speaker 2: Because if you really do think about it as a circuit,

906
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:51,480
Speaker 2: there is a channel of a white light electricity that

907
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:54,799
Speaker 2: is funneling through all of that stuff to turn it on,

908
00:52:55,480 --> 00:52:57,920
Speaker 2: to make it function. And I just wonder if you

909
00:52:57,960 --> 00:53:01,360
Speaker 2: guys see any weird potential connection with that, with the

910
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:05,400
Speaker 2: concept like the Big Bang and of all of a sudden,

911
00:53:05,520 --> 00:53:08,120
Speaker 2: there is light, all of a sudden there, you know,

912
00:53:10,120 --> 00:53:14,760
Speaker 2: complexity occurs and can occur, and things can have energy

913
00:53:14,840 --> 00:53:20,200
Speaker 2: and light and life. Am I being too weird?

914
00:53:20,440 --> 00:53:23,200
Speaker 6: No? No, no, no, the nature of life and existence?

915
00:53:23,200 --> 00:53:23,960
Speaker 6: Did we get turned on?

916
00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:24,560
Speaker 3: Well?

917
00:53:24,640 --> 00:53:28,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, instead of going instead of going to the end

918
00:53:28,160 --> 00:53:30,960
Speaker 2: of the universe, you go back to the beginning of

919
00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:35,440
Speaker 2: the universe. Whatever that source is that is that allows

920
00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:36,440
Speaker 2: everything to be.

921
00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:38,680
Speaker 3: Big bang, big crunch.

922
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:42,319
Speaker 4: It reminds me of the Oh, Dylan, can we get

923
00:53:42,960 --> 00:53:45,040
Speaker 4: that old sound when windows queued up?

924
00:53:50,400 --> 00:53:51,840
Speaker 3: Do you guys remember that? Of course?

925
00:53:52,600 --> 00:53:55,080
Speaker 6: I think Brian Eno designed that. He did.

926
00:53:55,280 --> 00:54:00,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, no, kidding this, Uh, this is a phenomenal point, Matt,

927
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:04,400
Speaker 4: because and Dan, we're interested in your thoughts on this.

928
00:54:05,080 --> 00:54:09,400
Speaker 4: There is a current prevailing theory alternative theory to the

929
00:54:09,480 --> 00:54:14,560
Speaker 4: Big Bang say that argues the universe as observed now

930
00:54:14,680 --> 00:54:19,280
Speaker 4: by humans exist within a singularity of a black hole,

931
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:23,960
Speaker 4: which could explain some of the observations that simply do

932
00:54:24,080 --> 00:54:30,680
Speaker 4: not function under the Einsteinian understanding of linear time. Now,

933
00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:35,600
Speaker 4: I'm just word salading people smarter than me, but could

934
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:40,280
Speaker 4: there be to your question, Matt, could there be some

935
00:54:40,280 --> 00:54:45,400
Speaker 4: some kind of non localized space beyond time or beyond

936
00:54:45,440 --> 00:54:52,719
Speaker 4: what humans understand in their limited, filtered lived experience that

937
00:54:52,840 --> 00:54:54,640
Speaker 4: gets very close to asking about God.

938
00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:56,960
Speaker 3: That sounds like a physicist three drinks in.

939
00:54:57,239 --> 00:55:01,040
Speaker 6: I mean, the simulation theories are fascinating, lessly fascinating and

940
00:55:01,120 --> 00:55:06,319
Speaker 6: entertaining to me. Again, it's good. It just hits right

941
00:55:06,360 --> 00:55:08,480
Speaker 6: up against we don't can know. I mean, we just

942
00:55:08,560 --> 00:55:11,640
Speaker 6: don't know. We like, we are so limited in what

943
00:55:11,680 --> 00:55:14,799
Speaker 6: we and science turns over so often, so frequently. I mean,

944
00:55:14,840 --> 00:55:17,560
Speaker 6: it wasn't the entire scheme of mankind on planet Earth.

945
00:55:17,560 --> 00:55:20,719
Speaker 6: That wasn't that long ago that we've realized that the

946
00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:27,160
Speaker 6: Sun doesn't go around us. You know we killed that Yeah, yeah, yeah,

947
00:55:27,200 --> 00:55:29,440
Speaker 6: And that idea that you know, science happens one funeral

948
00:55:29,480 --> 00:55:31,799
Speaker 6: at a time, because there's these gatekeepers who don't want

949
00:55:31,840 --> 00:55:35,440
Speaker 6: their entire work in their history, you know, in their

950
00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:36,880
Speaker 6: careers demolished.

951
00:55:37,080 --> 00:55:40,040
Speaker 3: You know, science happens one funeral that time.

952
00:55:40,239 --> 00:55:44,920
Speaker 6: Yeah, there's a quote I find who says that I

953
00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:46,440
Speaker 6: can look it up in a minute, but yeah, this

954
00:55:46,560 --> 00:55:48,840
Speaker 6: science happens one funeral at a time was a quote

955
00:55:48,840 --> 00:55:52,080
Speaker 6: that I heard recently, and it just speaks to the

956
00:55:52,120 --> 00:55:55,680
Speaker 6: idea that, like, you know, we get very dogmatic with

957
00:55:55,719 --> 00:55:59,120
Speaker 6: what we think we can prove, whether with Newtonian physics

958
00:55:59,160 --> 00:56:02,799
Speaker 6: or whatever. And there's that quote. I don't know if

959
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:04,480
Speaker 6: you guys have it. I think I sent it over

960
00:56:04,760 --> 00:56:08,200
Speaker 6: a little segment from our show from Doctor Care. Yeah,

961
00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 6: Doctor Kerr, the death Duela that we that we interviewed,

962
00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:14,280
Speaker 6: she's amazing. Can we play that little clip?

963
00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:15,120
Speaker 3: Absolutely?

964
00:56:15,200 --> 00:56:15,879
Speaker 6: Absolutely.

965
00:56:16,000 --> 00:56:18,279
Speaker 5: I can picture exactly what this profession is.

966
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:19,480
Speaker 6: I mean, that's incredible.

967
00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:20,600
Speaker 3: I've never heard it put that way.

968
00:56:20,920 --> 00:56:22,640
Speaker 6: Death doula. Yeah, it's a thing.

969
00:56:22,719 --> 00:56:22,879
Speaker 3: Yeah.

970
00:56:22,920 --> 00:56:26,920
Speaker 6: They she helps, She helps people transition and families transition

971
00:56:27,239 --> 00:56:29,560
Speaker 6: at the moment of you know, terminal illness. Right.

972
00:56:30,239 --> 00:56:32,880
Speaker 5: You also hear a lot about an end of life

973
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:36,480
Speaker 5: use of psychedelics as well. Yeah, and that means of

974
00:56:36,520 --> 00:56:38,560
Speaker 5: transitioning and I'm fascinated by that.

975
00:56:38,560 --> 00:56:41,040
Speaker 6: That's that's what Rick Doblin did. He actually did a

976
00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:45,000
Speaker 6: study with terminal terminally ill patients and psychedelics that that

977
00:56:45,040 --> 00:56:46,840
Speaker 6: we we talked to him about on I think it

978
00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:51,560
Speaker 6: was episode six, and he talks a lot about how

979
00:56:52,800 --> 00:56:57,759
Speaker 6: you can use M d M A along with UH.

980
00:56:59,200 --> 00:57:01,160
Speaker 6: A lot of times there's a lot of fear involved

981
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:05,600
Speaker 6: with dying obviously, and they can use certain you know,

982
00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:08,440
Speaker 6: opiates to help calm that part. And then the MDM

983
00:57:08,440 --> 00:57:11,600
Speaker 6: make and open up the oxytocin levels and to turn

984
00:57:11,640 --> 00:57:14,319
Speaker 6: off the amigdala like we talked about, and the and

985
00:57:14,360 --> 00:57:17,400
Speaker 6: they and it allows them this this these beautiful moments

986
00:57:17,400 --> 00:57:21,080
Speaker 6: of actually reconciling and actually having meaningful moments with their families.

987
00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:24,560
Speaker 6: Because we're very disconnected from from death in this culture. Right,

988
00:57:25,080 --> 00:57:27,360
Speaker 6: There's another reason I wanted to study to kind of

989
00:57:27,360 --> 00:57:29,960
Speaker 6: go into the shows, because I think one hundred years

990
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:33,200
Speaker 6: ago or so, you would be washing your grandfather's body.

991
00:57:33,680 --> 00:57:37,360
Speaker 3: You would be you know, sending, spending the time at

992
00:57:37,360 --> 00:57:38,080
Speaker 3: the wake as.

993
00:57:37,920 --> 00:57:40,520
Speaker 6: Well, correct, and there would there wouldn't be somebody who

994
00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:42,680
Speaker 6: you know, other people who would come in and take

995
00:57:42,680 --> 00:57:44,720
Speaker 6: them away. You would be there when they died. You'd

996
00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:47,440
Speaker 6: probably be bedside at their at the moment of their passing.

997
00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:51,880
Speaker 5: There's just such a disconnect from death and right, a

998
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:54,120
Speaker 5: lot of it involves fear, but a lot of it

999
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:57,360
Speaker 5: is cultural and just this idea of the death industry,

1000
00:57:57,640 --> 00:57:59,920
Speaker 5: you know, in funeral homes and all of the process

1001
00:58:00,160 --> 00:58:02,840
Speaker 5: that goes into that and then backlash against that. But

1002
00:58:02,920 --> 00:58:04,400
Speaker 5: a lot of that is just the fact that we

1003
00:58:04,440 --> 00:58:07,440
Speaker 5: as a culture and as a society have moved so

1004
00:58:07,680 --> 00:58:12,480
Speaker 5: far away from interacting and interfacing and understanding what it

1005
00:58:12,520 --> 00:58:13,240
Speaker 5: is to die.

1006
00:58:13,600 --> 00:58:16,080
Speaker 6: And we and we and we're fascinated by youth. We're

1007
00:58:16,160 --> 00:58:21,360
Speaker 6: so sure we we sort of worship youth, and you know,

1008
00:58:21,400 --> 00:58:24,600
Speaker 6: in our culture and we we don't think of our

1009
00:58:24,640 --> 00:58:28,600
Speaker 6: elders as having much value, you know, all of these things.

1010
00:58:29,200 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 6: It's just it's crazy to me. I don't understand it.

1011
00:58:31,840 --> 00:58:35,920
Speaker 4: Now before we plate this this clip for you to

1012
00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:39,920
Speaker 4: unpack with us in the audience, Dan, it reminds me,

1013
00:58:40,120 --> 00:58:42,800
Speaker 4: this conversation reminds me of that old quotation. I was

1014
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:45,840
Speaker 4: trying to hunt it down. I found someone who paraphrased

1015
00:58:45,880 --> 00:58:48,280
Speaker 4: it in the film Spartacus in nineteen six.

1016
00:58:48,360 --> 00:58:49,240
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, yeah.

1017
00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:53,440
Speaker 4: But the idea was, you know, why are you afraid

1018
00:58:53,480 --> 00:58:55,840
Speaker 4: to die? Was there a moment when you were afraid

1019
00:58:55,880 --> 00:58:56,440
Speaker 4: to be born?

1020
00:58:57,000 --> 00:58:57,240
Speaker 2: You know?

1021
00:58:57,440 --> 00:59:01,160
Speaker 4: And that's that's wildly profound. With this, we're going to

1022
00:59:01,200 --> 00:59:04,720
Speaker 4: play the We're going to play an excerpt from a

1023
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:07,720
Speaker 4: conversation you had with doctor Kerr.

1024
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:10,960
Speaker 6: If you could inspire one change in how our society

1025
00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:14,760
Speaker 6: approaches death and mortality, what would it be and why

1026
00:59:15,960 --> 00:59:16,800
Speaker 6: it's a big one.

1027
00:59:17,800 --> 00:59:21,000
Speaker 7: We meet death and mortality the same way we meet life,

1028
00:59:21,440 --> 00:59:25,400
Speaker 7: and we meet it through the Western worldview, which has

1029
00:59:26,520 --> 00:59:29,760
Speaker 7: a lot of blinders. It looks at the world as

1030
00:59:29,760 --> 00:59:33,480
Speaker 7: a little box. It says it's material, it's dualistic. It's

1031
00:59:33,480 --> 00:59:37,360
Speaker 7: either on off, yes, no, there's a thousand ways. It's

1032
00:59:37,640 --> 00:59:42,840
Speaker 7: it's happening internally, right, It's we can't have trans personal experiences.

1033
00:59:43,040 --> 00:59:46,600
Speaker 7: So the Western world has this little box, and everything

1034
00:59:46,640 --> 00:59:50,480
Speaker 7: that doesn't fit in this box, we say, well, that's unreal,

1035
00:59:50,680 --> 00:59:55,840
Speaker 7: that's extraordinary, extrasensory, supernatural, parent normal. We have all these

1036
00:59:55,840 --> 01:00:01,240
Speaker 7: ways of just diminishing them, saying they're not real. Now,

1037
01:00:02,080 --> 01:00:04,480
Speaker 7: how you make meaning those is another question, but that

1038
01:00:04,520 --> 01:00:08,400
Speaker 7: they are happening. So that's why I think psychedelics are

1039
01:00:08,440 --> 01:00:10,800
Speaker 7: so exciting. That's why I think this death positivity revolution

1040
01:00:10,920 --> 01:00:13,320
Speaker 7: is so exciting, because people are starting to get their

1041
01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:16,680
Speaker 7: box expanded, and the box of that I'm me and

1042
01:00:16,760 --> 01:00:21,479
Speaker 7: you are you, and we are individuals. Well, we live

1043
01:00:21,560 --> 01:00:26,080
Speaker 7: in a world of ecosystems, where we're all intertwined in

1044
01:00:26,160 --> 01:00:32,200
Speaker 7: webs of corelated reciprocal systems. If we can start to

1045
01:00:32,320 --> 01:00:35,880
Speaker 7: just stretch that box to make space for some more experiences,

1046
01:00:36,320 --> 01:00:38,680
Speaker 7: it not only will change how we meet death, because

1047
01:00:38,680 --> 01:00:42,200
Speaker 7: it won't be that excommunication light switch out, you know,

1048
01:00:42,640 --> 01:00:45,800
Speaker 7: finito end, It'll be the beginning of the next journey.

1049
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:49,000
Speaker 7: It will also change how we live in the world.

1050
01:00:49,960 --> 01:00:50,959
Speaker 6: Profound stuff, right.

1051
01:00:50,880 --> 01:00:53,520
Speaker 3: Yes, you unpacked that for us a bit.

1052
01:00:54,120 --> 01:00:56,680
Speaker 6: I mean, I just think that's what she's getting at

1053
01:00:56,760 --> 01:00:58,440
Speaker 6: is we have a box. We have a Western box,

1054
01:00:58,520 --> 01:01:00,160
Speaker 6: and what is allowed to go in that box we

1055
01:01:00,160 --> 01:01:04,440
Speaker 6: consider knowledge that we consider, you know, infallible, that we

1056
01:01:04,840 --> 01:01:10,760
Speaker 6: think is the edges of reality, and that box. She's saying,

1057
01:01:10,840 --> 01:01:12,600
Speaker 6: Let's just stretch it more and more. Let's stretch it

1058
01:01:12,600 --> 01:01:15,400
Speaker 6: as much as possible. Let's see what's outside the cave.

1059
01:01:15,680 --> 01:01:15,880
Speaker 3: Right.

1060
01:01:16,720 --> 01:01:22,600
Speaker 6: And I'm just excited because there's more of an acceptance

1061
01:01:22,720 --> 01:01:26,640
Speaker 6: for the possibility of things like unified you know, non

1062
01:01:26,680 --> 01:01:31,680
Speaker 6: local consciousness, and there's a sort of an opening. I

1063
01:01:31,680 --> 01:01:37,000
Speaker 6: think people are just ready to sort of stretch their boxes, right,

1064
01:01:37,320 --> 01:01:40,400
Speaker 6: People are more now than ever ready to sort of

1065
01:01:41,080 --> 01:01:45,400
Speaker 6: open up their minds and question some of these dogmas

1066
01:01:45,400 --> 01:01:49,560
Speaker 6: and look at well, in all of time and space

1067
01:01:49,600 --> 01:01:53,040
Speaker 6: and all of human history, we can't have figured everything out.

1068
01:01:53,360 --> 01:01:56,920
Speaker 6: In fact, what we figured out is probably the equivalent

1069
01:01:57,120 --> 01:02:00,520
Speaker 6: of a grain of sand on all of the beaches

1070
01:02:00,640 --> 01:02:02,800
Speaker 6: across the entire globe. Right.

1071
01:02:03,080 --> 01:02:07,480
Speaker 3: And so I mean, still go team, Yes, one hundred percent.

1072
01:02:07,480 --> 01:02:10,160
Speaker 6: We've made some wonderful progress. We've we've we've cracked the

1073
01:02:10,200 --> 01:02:14,440
Speaker 6: code on a lot of things. But there does seem

1074
01:02:14,480 --> 01:02:17,040
Speaker 6: to be a lot of power structures that have an

1075
01:02:17,040 --> 01:02:19,960
Speaker 6: interest of ascid interest in controlling the narrative about what

1076
01:02:20,000 --> 01:02:23,600
Speaker 6: we understand to be real, about what we understand about

1077
01:02:23,600 --> 01:02:28,920
Speaker 6: ourselves internally. And what is that that Joseph Campbell quote

1078
01:02:28,800 --> 01:02:31,720
Speaker 6: where I had, you know, all we have to do

1079
01:02:31,800 --> 01:02:34,160
Speaker 6: is follow the data list thread. And where we had

1080
01:02:34,160 --> 01:02:37,360
Speaker 6: thought you know that quote, Yes, where I had thought

1081
01:02:37,600 --> 01:02:41,040
Speaker 6: to find a god, or where I had thought to

1082
01:02:41,040 --> 01:02:43,520
Speaker 6: find a monster, I find a god. And where I

1083
01:02:43,520 --> 01:02:47,240
Speaker 6: had thought to journey to the outer edges of existence,

1084
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:51,880
Speaker 6: I journey into my own self about doing a horrible job.

1085
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:57,880
Speaker 4: Of noiled it right, And it's the old It's also

1086
01:02:58,440 --> 01:03:02,480
Speaker 4: similar to that y sell you quote. You know, we

1087
01:03:02,640 --> 01:03:05,520
Speaker 4: shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all

1088
01:03:05,520 --> 01:03:09,760
Speaker 4: our exploring exploration shall be to arrive where we began.

1089
01:03:09,600 --> 01:03:10,920
Speaker 3: And know it for the first time.

1090
01:03:11,400 --> 01:03:14,720
Speaker 4: I'm also paraphrasing, I'm sorry, ts if you're hearing.

1091
01:03:14,560 --> 01:03:17,160
Speaker 6: This, so yeah, So I mean with with a live again.

1092
01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:20,439
Speaker 6: I'm simply adding to I feel like what we're doing

1093
01:03:20,520 --> 01:03:23,760
Speaker 6: is we're contributing to the conversation. I'm not trying to

1094
01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:26,680
Speaker 6: push for against any religious dogma. I'm not trying to

1095
01:03:26,720 --> 01:03:29,640
Speaker 6: push for any sort of scientific orthodoxy or against any

1096
01:03:29,720 --> 01:03:36,760
Speaker 6: scientific orthodoxy. I'm simply sharing stories and looking for commonalities

1097
01:03:36,800 --> 01:03:39,080
Speaker 6: and asking as many questions as we can ask about

1098
01:03:39,080 --> 01:03:40,840
Speaker 6: what is the nature of reality, what is the nature

1099
01:03:40,840 --> 01:03:43,080
Speaker 6: of life? And what is the nature of death? And

1100
01:03:43,120 --> 01:03:46,919
Speaker 6: what can we learn from people who have been dead?

1101
01:03:47,560 --> 01:03:51,160
Speaker 4: Is that what we as the audience but hopefully take

1102
01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:52,880
Speaker 4: from the journeys.

1103
01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:57,480
Speaker 6: I mean, look, at some point we're all going to

1104
01:03:57,560 --> 01:04:01,320
Speaker 6: have times up point, we're all going to check out.

1105
01:04:02,040 --> 01:04:06,560
Speaker 6: Everybody you know, and everybody you have ever known, and

1106
01:04:06,600 --> 01:04:08,680
Speaker 6: everybody you will ever know at some point will die.

1107
01:04:10,640 --> 01:04:14,080
Speaker 6: What we can do is instead of fearing that and

1108
01:04:14,160 --> 01:04:16,880
Speaker 6: running from it and closing your eyes to it and

1109
01:04:16,920 --> 01:04:19,640
Speaker 6: looking the other way, instead, we can turn towards it,

1110
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:24,760
Speaker 6: and we can lean into it together and explore space

1111
01:04:24,840 --> 01:04:26,320
Speaker 6: inward an hour together forever.

1112
01:04:27,360 --> 01:04:31,960
Speaker 2: Yay, I'm in ye, Dan, before we get you out

1113
01:04:32,000 --> 01:04:36,200
Speaker 2: of here alive again. Is like it's like a signal

1114
01:04:36,280 --> 01:04:47,120
Speaker 2: you're sending out to the world that just just for

1115
01:04:47,160 --> 01:04:51,640
Speaker 2: everybody who's listening. I do a quick search on IMDb

1116
01:04:51,800 --> 01:04:55,360
Speaker 2: for Dan Bush and find some of the word the

1117
01:04:55,440 --> 01:04:59,920
Speaker 2: film work of this man, and go down a journey,

1118
01:05:00,800 --> 01:05:04,080
Speaker 2: Go on a journey down a rabbit hole, starting at

1119
01:05:04,080 --> 01:05:05,840
Speaker 2: the signal. That is a really good place to start.

1120
01:05:05,840 --> 01:05:09,960
Speaker 2: And there's many places to go in including an especially

1121
01:05:10,520 --> 01:05:17,000
Speaker 2: a movie about reconstructing UH that's coded.

1122
01:05:18,760 --> 01:05:22,520
Speaker 4: Also Don Peyote, The Vault, Reconstruction of Williams Zero.

1123
01:05:22,640 --> 01:05:23,919
Speaker 3: The list goes on.

1124
01:05:24,560 --> 01:05:29,880
Speaker 4: We are we are fans and UH friends hopefully, And

1125
01:05:30,160 --> 01:05:34,040
Speaker 4: it seems that there is a new conversation, a new

1126
01:05:34,120 --> 01:05:38,360
Speaker 4: bridge in the shared experiences of what we call in

1127
01:05:38,560 --> 01:05:43,080
Speaker 4: d E and dan UH. The the mic drop moments

1128
01:05:43,320 --> 01:05:48,000
Speaker 4: you've had with some hard truths that a lot of people.

1129
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:54,360
Speaker 4: You know, it's it's challenging to unpack this, but as

1130
01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:59,120
Speaker 4: our pal Condall once taught us long ago, UH, the

1131
01:05:59,160 --> 01:06:03,680
Speaker 4: world is worth understanding, or at least attempting to do so,

1132
01:06:04,280 --> 01:06:06,880
Speaker 4: you know, And we're all in this together. Thank you

1133
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:11,040
Speaker 4: so much for spending this time with us. Where can

1134
01:06:12,280 --> 01:06:15,480
Speaker 4: let's say we're a person in the audience, right, we

1135
01:06:15,680 --> 01:06:20,160
Speaker 4: have an experience we have had an NDE, a brush

1136
01:06:20,240 --> 01:06:23,640
Speaker 4: with mortality. Is there a way for us to get

1137
01:06:23,640 --> 01:06:25,360
Speaker 4: in touch with you and your team?

1138
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:28,000
Speaker 6: Yeah, thank you so much for bringing that up. Yes,

1139
01:06:28,320 --> 01:06:33,120
Speaker 6: it's simple. It's a live again project at gmail dot com.

1140
01:06:33,520 --> 01:06:35,560
Speaker 6: So just go to send an email to a live

1141
01:06:35,600 --> 01:06:40,200
Speaker 6: Again project at Gmail and we'll respond as soon as

1142
01:06:40,200 --> 01:06:44,080
Speaker 6: we can we are our first season with I think

1143
01:06:44,120 --> 01:06:46,440
Speaker 6: we've collected forty six stories so far and those are

1144
01:06:46,480 --> 01:06:49,280
Speaker 6: in process right now, and hopefully we can you know,

1145
01:06:49,360 --> 01:06:52,560
Speaker 6: continue with these, So please send us your stories and

1146
01:06:52,640 --> 01:06:55,200
Speaker 6: we'll contact you as soon as possible. And guys, that

1147
01:06:55,240 --> 01:06:58,480
Speaker 6: you've spent this much time with me is insane. I

1148
01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:03,160
Speaker 6: just feel honored and also embarrassed. This is ridiculous.

1149
01:07:03,240 --> 01:07:07,080
Speaker 5: It's just such rich, you know, territory to mine. It's

1150
01:07:07,080 --> 01:07:08,760
Speaker 5: it's and then it's an excellent show.

1151
01:07:09,040 --> 01:07:11,160
Speaker 6: I do think that our shows do have that in common,

1152
01:07:11,320 --> 01:07:14,040
Speaker 6: like what is what is real? Right at the end

1153
01:07:14,040 --> 01:07:20,160
Speaker 6: of the day, what the is real? Which narratives are

1154
01:07:20,160 --> 01:07:23,320
Speaker 6: the ones we're gonna focus on. Oh, thank you guys

1155
01:07:23,360 --> 01:07:23,760
Speaker 6: so much.

1156
01:07:24,080 --> 01:07:27,560
Speaker 4: You've got to enjoy Bible Bonkers now Uncle Baby Billy's

1157
01:07:27,560 --> 01:07:30,840
Speaker 4: Bible Balkers. You've got to join us in the future, Dan,

1158
01:07:31,040 --> 01:07:36,200
Speaker 4: because this, uh, we've raised so many questions that could

1159
01:07:36,280 --> 01:07:41,080
Speaker 4: each inspire their own larger interview, enterprise or episode.

1160
01:07:41,440 --> 01:07:41,640
Speaker 3: Uh.

1161
01:07:41,760 --> 01:07:44,240
Speaker 4: For now, UH, We're going to leave it at that.

1162
01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:48,320
Speaker 4: Please do check out Alive Again. Please do reach out

1163
01:07:48,400 --> 01:07:51,360
Speaker 4: to a Live Again project at gmail dot com with

1164
01:07:51,560 --> 01:07:54,440
Speaker 4: stories and experiences of your own.

1165
01:07:54,640 --> 01:07:55,760
Speaker 3: We're not blowing smoke.

1166
01:07:55,880 --> 01:07:59,360
Speaker 4: Dan, even though Matt Nole and I will line up

1167
01:07:59,360 --> 01:08:04,200
Speaker 4: at the Plaza every time you have a premiere, we

1168
01:08:04,280 --> 01:08:07,160
Speaker 4: are immensely impressed. This is an important show and thank

1169
01:08:07,160 --> 01:08:08,720
Speaker 4: you so much for creating it.

1170
01:08:09,040 --> 01:08:10,720
Speaker 6: Well, thank you, thank you, thank you for having me

1171
01:08:10,760 --> 01:08:14,920
Speaker 6: and again I'm fans of yours as well.

1172
01:08:15,040 --> 01:08:18,479
Speaker 4: And that is the first of what we hope will

1173
01:08:18,520 --> 01:08:22,400
Speaker 4: be several conversations with our pal, Dan Bush, the creator

1174
01:08:22,439 --> 01:08:23,200
Speaker 4: of Alive Again.

1175
01:08:23,320 --> 01:08:27,800
Speaker 2: Really great stuff, awesome human being and definitely check out

1176
01:08:27,960 --> 01:08:31,240
Speaker 2: other shows that have been on the iHeart podcast network

1177
01:08:31,280 --> 01:08:35,599
Speaker 2: that Dan has created, including Tomorrow's Monsters, The Manawat Caves,

1178
01:08:35,640 --> 01:08:39,439
Speaker 2: and The Passage, which Ben, you've worked on a couple

1179
01:08:39,479 --> 01:08:41,599
Speaker 2: of those two I'm executive producer of all three of those.

1180
01:08:41,680 --> 01:08:44,120
Speaker 2: But yes, Ben, you've written on a bunch of that

1181
01:08:44,200 --> 01:08:45,600
Speaker 2: and have you voiced any of that?

1182
01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:50,000
Speaker 3: Is this a legal inquiry? Yes, yes, good.

1183
01:08:50,720 --> 01:08:54,519
Speaker 4: Yeah, We're phenomenally fortunate to be able to hang out

1184
01:08:54,520 --> 01:08:57,679
Speaker 4: with Dan his team and Matt. As you said, you've

1185
01:08:57,720 --> 01:09:02,040
Speaker 4: been the executive producer of not only those projects but

1186
01:09:02,120 --> 01:09:04,840
Speaker 4: also Alive Again, so we want to thank you for

1187
01:09:04,880 --> 01:09:05,880
Speaker 4: creating this as well.

1188
01:09:06,520 --> 01:09:10,000
Speaker 2: Heck yeah, that just look give the show a chance

1189
01:09:10,040 --> 01:09:11,800
Speaker 2: if you listening to it right now and listen to

1190
01:09:11,800 --> 01:09:16,000
Speaker 2: that episode one It's nuts. Yeah, that's the one about

1191
01:09:16,040 --> 01:09:19,559
Speaker 2: ice climber who dies and then comes back into his

1192
01:09:19,680 --> 01:09:23,960
Speaker 2: human body and is just so frustrated and then is

1193
01:09:24,040 --> 01:09:28,000
Speaker 2: yearning to go back to that place, that beautiful place wherever,

1194
01:09:28,880 --> 01:09:30,400
Speaker 2: where whatever he experienced.

1195
01:09:30,760 --> 01:09:35,519
Speaker 4: Double dip into infinity. Right, and please also, folks, by

1196
01:09:35,520 --> 01:09:39,200
Speaker 4: the way, if you are interested in some of these conversations, well,

1197
01:09:39,240 --> 01:09:41,200
Speaker 4: actually we got to send these to Dan to He

1198
01:09:41,320 --> 01:09:44,719
Speaker 4: probably heard them our episode on the Third Man Factor

1199
01:09:44,880 --> 01:09:48,040
Speaker 4: for our series on that as well as Can Dreams

1200
01:09:48,080 --> 01:09:50,919
Speaker 4: Predict the Future, both of which ended up being series.

1201
01:09:51,760 --> 01:09:54,600
Speaker 4: We want you to write to Dan if you have

1202
01:09:54,680 --> 01:09:58,519
Speaker 4: had an NDE. We want you to share your thoughts

1203
01:09:58,600 --> 01:10:02,559
Speaker 4: with us. This is to steal a line from Fox News.

1204
01:10:03,120 --> 01:10:06,519
Speaker 4: Now more than ever, this is an exciting time for

1205
01:10:06,800 --> 01:10:12,680
Speaker 4: NDA research, melding science and spirituality. So find us online,

1206
01:10:13,240 --> 01:10:15,599
Speaker 4: drop us a phone call, or send us a good

1207
01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:16,799
Speaker 4: old fashioned email.

1208
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:19,280
Speaker 3: We would love to hear from you. Answer right.

1209
01:10:19,360 --> 01:10:21,320
Speaker 5: You can find us at the handle Conspiracy Stuff, where

1210
01:10:21,320 --> 01:10:24,720
Speaker 5: we exist all over the interwebs on YouTube, where we

1211
01:10:24,760 --> 01:10:27,200
Speaker 5: have video content galore for you to enjoy. As well

1212
01:10:27,240 --> 01:10:30,960
Speaker 5: as on XFKA, Twitter and Facebook with our Facebook group.

1213
01:10:31,000 --> 01:10:33,960
Speaker 5: Here's the way it gets crazy on Instagram and TikTok.

1214
01:10:34,160 --> 01:10:36,680
Speaker 5: On the other hand, we are conspiracy Stuff show, and

1215
01:10:36,680 --> 01:10:37,760
Speaker 5: there's also more.

1216
01:10:38,360 --> 01:10:41,080
Speaker 2: Yes, you can call a phone number and leave us

1217
01:10:41,120 --> 01:10:44,000
Speaker 2: a voicemail and it might get on the air. Our

1218
01:10:44,080 --> 01:10:48,200
Speaker 2: number is one eight three three std WYTK. When you

1219
01:10:48,280 --> 01:10:50,920
Speaker 2: call in, give yourself a cool nickname and let us

1220
01:10:50,920 --> 01:10:52,639
Speaker 2: know within the message if we can use your name

1221
01:10:52,680 --> 01:10:54,800
Speaker 2: and message on the air. If you would like to

1222
01:10:54,840 --> 01:10:56,120
Speaker 2: instead send us an email.

1223
01:10:56,200 --> 01:10:59,920
Speaker 4: We are the entities that read each piece of corresponded

1224
01:11:00,120 --> 01:11:03,080
Speaker 4: we receive. Be well aware, yet I'm afraid sometimes the

1225
01:11:03,200 --> 01:11:06,120
Speaker 4: void writes back. I'd like to hatch a conspiracy with you.

1226
01:11:06,760 --> 01:11:09,720
Speaker 4: Fellow friends and neighbors. Will you help me get my

1227
01:11:09,800 --> 01:11:13,120
Speaker 4: pals Matt and Nole to go get CPR certified with me?

1228
01:11:14,160 --> 01:11:17,479
Speaker 4: Because they change the they change the procedure. Now it's

1229
01:11:17,479 --> 01:11:19,920
Speaker 4: no longer stayed alive for the chest compressions.

1230
01:11:20,800 --> 01:11:23,360
Speaker 3: Anyway. Good stuff to know. Always better to be prepared.

1231
01:11:23,439 --> 01:11:27,600
Speaker 4: Shout out to the Scouts conspiracy iHeartRadio dot com. The

1232
01:11:27,640 --> 01:11:30,400
Speaker 4: CPR stuff is just this conversation has got me really

1233
01:11:30,439 --> 01:11:34,679
Speaker 4: in my head. You got Yeah, man, that's our show

1234
01:11:34,760 --> 01:11:55,280
Speaker 4: Conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1235
01:11:55,439 --> 01:11:57,519
Speaker 2: Stuff they Don't want you to Know is a production

1236
01:11:57,600 --> 01:12:01,040
Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from my iHeartRadio, visit the

1237
01:12:01,040 --> 01:12:04,240
Speaker 2: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

1238
01:12:04,240 --> 01:12:04,960
Speaker 2: favorite shows.