1 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:10,799 Speaker 1: We need to learn what our needs are. 2 00:00:11,039 --> 00:00:13,800 Speaker 2: Everybody has needs in a relationship, and actually needs in 3 00:00:13,840 --> 00:00:15,720 Speaker 2: a relationship are so understated. 4 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:18,840 Speaker 3: Tys Gibson is a relationship coach, best selling author from 5 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:20,600 Speaker 3: the founder of Personal Development School. 6 00:00:20,680 --> 00:00:22,599 Speaker 2: The analogy I often give to people as somebody with 7 00:00:22,640 --> 00:00:25,200 Speaker 2: a different attachment style than you. It's almost like you 8 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:26,880 Speaker 2: sit down to play a board game and you have 9 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:29,160 Speaker 2: the rules for Monopoly and I have the rules for Scrabble. 10 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:32,400 Speaker 2: It's going to cause like a lot of unnecessary misunderstandings. 11 00:00:32,400 --> 00:00:35,200 Speaker 2: It's safe to express emotions, it's okay to be vulnerable, 12 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 2: to rely on other people and to trust them. They 13 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:39,560 Speaker 2: get this really healthy modeling, and as they grow older, 14 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:42,280 Speaker 2: they also get modeling for how to communicate and negotiate 15 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 2: their needs and how to have healthy boundaries. 16 00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:47,440 Speaker 3: I'm Razzi da Vlukia and on my podcast A Really 17 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:51,479 Speaker 3: Good Cry, we embrace the messy and the beautiful, providing 18 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:55,440 Speaker 3: a space for raw, unfolded conversations that celebrate vulnerability and 19 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:58,760 Speaker 3: allow you to tune in to learn, connect and find 20 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 3: comfort together. Thank you so much for being here. I 21 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:05,360 Speaker 3: am so grateful to you. I have been binge reading 22 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:08,560 Speaker 3: your books and I am so grateful that you have 23 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:10,679 Speaker 3: done so much of the work for us so we 24 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 3: can understand things so simply through your words. 25 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:15,920 Speaker 4: And I just want to get straight into it. 26 00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 3: So tell me how you started learning about attachment theory 27 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:22,560 Speaker 3: and what got you interested in it. 28 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 2: So I grew up in like a very chaotic household, 29 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 2: for sure, and I was a very sensitive child. So 30 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:30,240 Speaker 2: I have a younger sister, and I think as a 31 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:31,920 Speaker 2: child that was parentified a lot. So I was kind 32 00:01:31,920 --> 00:01:33,080 Speaker 2: of put in the middle of a lot of the 33 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 2: chaos and the drama my parents went through, like a 34 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:39,319 Speaker 2: twenty year divorce that went to the Superior Court of Canada, 35 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:40,880 Speaker 2: just one of those things. And I think I grew 36 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:44,280 Speaker 2: up as like the sensitive person, kind of thinking like, 37 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 2: why can't it be different? Why do people who love 38 00:01:46,520 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 2: each other? And I knew they really cared about each 39 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:49,960 Speaker 2: other and they were very loving, like my parents are 40 00:01:50,080 --> 00:01:52,880 Speaker 2: very good hearted people, but they just really brought out 41 00:01:52,920 --> 00:01:56,560 Speaker 2: really difficult sort of sides to one another. And so 42 00:01:56,760 --> 00:01:58,320 Speaker 2: I think from a very young age, I was really 43 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 2: interested in human behavior. I think it's difficult. I'm not 44 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 2: recommending that people parentify their children and put them in 45 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 2: the middle of things, but I think the silver lining 46 00:02:06,800 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 2: for me was that I actually really love human behavior 47 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:11,959 Speaker 2: and learning about people. And I think from a young 48 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:14,600 Speaker 2: age I was kind of immersed in this environment where 49 00:02:14,919 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 2: I was, in a sense, being forced to learn about 50 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 2: a lot of why people do the things that they do. 51 00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:21,799 Speaker 2: And I became very curious at a young age, and 52 00:02:21,880 --> 00:02:25,359 Speaker 2: so I internalized a lot, went through my own sort 53 00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:28,960 Speaker 2: of struggles both personally and in relationships, and then did 54 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:31,119 Speaker 2: a lot of healing work and was like, how can 55 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:33,720 Speaker 2: I go into my adult life feeling like relationships aren't 56 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 2: scary and aren't so chaotic and so difficult. And a 57 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:38,840 Speaker 2: lot of the work and healing that I had to 58 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:43,520 Speaker 2: do with myself ended up being the things that actually 59 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:45,560 Speaker 2: brought me into this sort of realm of work later on. 60 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 2: So a big part of my focus became, Okay, well 61 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 2: how can I go into not just how we understand 62 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:54,160 Speaker 2: our attachment styles, but how can we change them? Because 63 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:56,120 Speaker 2: I was a fearful, avoidant attachment style, which is a 64 00:02:56,160 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 2: tricky one, and I was very hot and cold, and 65 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:00,880 Speaker 2: I think at that point it was like, well, I 66 00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:02,520 Speaker 2: don't want to live like this forever and feel like 67 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 2: relationships are difficult like this, and so doing that work 68 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 2: with myself first and becoming securely attached and then allowed 69 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 2: me to bring that out to other people as well. 70 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 3: And what was your first experience with attachment styles? And 71 00:03:13,200 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 3: just we know what, before we do that, could you 72 00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 3: just give anybody, everybody that's listening an overview of what 73 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:19,200 Speaker 3: attachment theory is. 74 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 4: Yes, I feel like we're using the tab and feeling 75 00:03:21,639 --> 00:03:22,320 Speaker 4: wait what is that? 76 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 1: Absolutely so attachment theory. 77 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 2: We can think of it in a simplified manner as 78 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:30,320 Speaker 2: being basically the subconscious set of rules you have for love. 79 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:33,520 Speaker 2: So if you grow up that yeah, and it's sort 80 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:34,800 Speaker 2: of like we all have this rule book. And the 81 00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:36,720 Speaker 2: analogy I often give to people is somebody with a 82 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:39,400 Speaker 2: different attachment style than you. It's almost like you sit 83 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 2: down to play a board game and you have the 84 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 2: rules for Monopoly and I have the rules for Scrabble, 85 00:03:43,880 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 2: and it's going to cause like a lot of unnecessary 86 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:49,880 Speaker 2: friction and misunderstandings and miscommunications because we're like, what do 87 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:51,640 Speaker 2: you mean, We're supposed to be doing it this way. 88 00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 2: And so that's really what our attachment style is. And 89 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 2: it was originally the Body of Work was originally born 90 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:00,840 Speaker 2: from John Bowlby and Mary Ainsworths out of care University 91 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:04,200 Speaker 2: decades ago, and then a lot of that original research 92 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:07,280 Speaker 2: I learned in like first year psych at university. But 93 00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 2: it's sort of like it's really profound in a sense, 94 00:04:10,440 --> 00:04:12,800 Speaker 2: but it talks about the four attachment styles, but it 95 00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 2: doesn't talk about how we can change our attachment style, 96 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 2: how we can become secure, how we can recondition. Basically, 97 00:04:18,400 --> 00:04:21,560 Speaker 2: and we know we have neuroplasticity and so because of that, 98 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:24,240 Speaker 2: we can change our attachment style. So that's where our 99 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 2: body of work was born from there. But the four 100 00:04:26,120 --> 00:04:29,040 Speaker 2: major attachment styles out of John Bolby's work are number one, 101 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:32,680 Speaker 2: the securely attached child. Securely attached children obviously grow up 102 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:34,720 Speaker 2: as secure adults, and they grew up in a household 103 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:37,120 Speaker 2: where there's a lot of what we call approach oriented behaviors. 104 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:39,800 Speaker 2: So basically there's a lot of when a child is 105 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:44,039 Speaker 2: in distress, crying, feeling sad, the parent will go towards them, 106 00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:47,120 Speaker 2: and through those approach oriented behaviors, it actually conditions the 107 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:50,359 Speaker 2: child to feel like I'm worthy of love, It's safe 108 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:53,200 Speaker 2: to express emotions. My needs will get mad if I 109 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:55,880 Speaker 2: express emotions. It's okay to be vulnerable to rely on 110 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:58,000 Speaker 2: other people and to trust them, and so they get 111 00:04:58,040 --> 00:05:00,599 Speaker 2: this really healthy modeling, and as they grow, they also 112 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:03,480 Speaker 2: get modeling for how to communicate and negotiate their needs 113 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:05,840 Speaker 2: and how to have healthy boundaries. So they grow up 114 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:08,880 Speaker 2: to have that framework to become really secure adults because 115 00:05:08,920 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 2: of that framework model to them as children. And then 116 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 2: there's the three insecure attachment styles. One is the anxious preoccupied. 117 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:18,039 Speaker 2: This is somebody that tends to have a lot of 118 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:21,880 Speaker 2: either real or perceived abandonment in childhood. So it can 119 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:24,520 Speaker 2: be that they either literally go through an abandonment where 120 00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 2: a parent is divorced and they kind of move out 121 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 2: of the household and they're not around very much. Or 122 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 2: it can also be a lot of very loving emotions 123 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,280 Speaker 2: and actions from caregivers, but maybe they're working all the time, 124 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 2: so it's sort of like, yeah, so it's like love 125 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:41,200 Speaker 2: is there, love is taken away. Love is there, Love 126 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 2: is taken away, And that repetition and emotion fires and 127 00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 2: wires those neural pathways for a person to constantly fear 128 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 2: abandonment and fear that the other shoe will drop, and 129 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:54,440 Speaker 2: so they become the clinging individuals. Sometimes in adult relationships 130 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:57,480 Speaker 2: because that's their way of trying to cope and maintain proximity. 131 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 3: And okay, so that was this team will right go 132 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 3: through them and then then we're going to go through 133 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:04,280 Speaker 3: them in depth. But I feel like if they hear 134 00:06:04,320 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 3: the terms, you'll be really useful to them when we're 135 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:07,719 Speaker 3: going back through it. 136 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:08,480 Speaker 1: Absolutely. 137 00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 2: So on the other end of the spectrum, there's the 138 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:13,920 Speaker 2: dismissive avoidant. Dismissive avoidance usually grow up with the overarching 139 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 2: theme being childhood emotional neglect, and sometimes even in mashment 140 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:20,560 Speaker 2: and so childhood emotional neglect causes a child when they're 141 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:23,440 Speaker 2: very young to go, something must be wrong with me 142 00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 2: that I can't get my needs met because we're literally 143 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:31,040 Speaker 2: wired for attunement, for connection, for emotional responding from our caregivers, 144 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:35,000 Speaker 2: and so a child internalizes it because they every child 145 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:36,040 Speaker 2: internalizes everything. 146 00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:37,599 Speaker 1: That's how the mind works when they're learning. 147 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:39,839 Speaker 2: And so a child can't go, oh, my parents are 148 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 2: emotionally unavailable, so instead they go, something must be wrong 149 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 2: with me. And so they tend to be the ones 150 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 2: that are afraid to even bond too much in terms 151 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 2: of relationships, and they constantly keep people at bay and 152 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:52,599 Speaker 2: try to keep a distance because they don't want to. 153 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:54,280 Speaker 1: Feel like that again as adults. 154 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 2: And so that's or dismissive avoidant. They tend to fear 155 00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 2: commitment as adults, they tend to sort of be a 156 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 2: little slur to warm up, a little more stand offish. Yeah, 157 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 2: and last, but not least, it's the fearful avoidant. 158 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:04,919 Speaker 1: This is what I was. 159 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:08,160 Speaker 2: Fearful avoidance grub usually in chaotic childhood, so it can 160 00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 2: be a lot of fighting in the home. It can 161 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 2: be parentification, but it can also be more extreme things 162 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 2: like having a cluster B personality disordered parent, somebody with 163 00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 2: borderline personality disorder or narcissistic personality disorder, or it can 164 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:23,520 Speaker 2: also be that you have parents who maybe struggle with addiction. 165 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:26,840 Speaker 2: And basically the overarching theme is like you have some 166 00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 2: really good moments with love and connection, some really nice ones, 167 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:31,600 Speaker 2: but some really scary ones or kind of horrific ones, 168 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:33,920 Speaker 2: and so you never know what you're going to get. 169 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:36,160 Speaker 2: And if you imagine, like an example of a parent 170 00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:39,200 Speaker 2: who's an addict, let's say mom's an alcoholic. As an example, 171 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,840 Speaker 2: one day Mom comes home, she's had too much to drink. 172 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 2: She's scary, she's confusing. Another day she's had too much drink. 173 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:48,800 Speaker 2: She's in a great mood. Another day she's so bering 174 00:07:48,880 --> 00:07:51,200 Speaker 2: up and she's in a really bad mood. She's detoxing. 175 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 2: Another day she's sober and she feels guilty about her behavior. 176 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 2: So she's kind and it's like you just don't know 177 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:58,280 Speaker 2: what you're going to get at any point in time. 178 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:01,000 Speaker 2: And so a child like that up in a household 179 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:03,600 Speaker 2: and then feels as an adult like they want love, 180 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:05,240 Speaker 2: but when it gets too close, they get scared, and 181 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,080 Speaker 2: so they're very hot and cold and pushion, pull, and 182 00:08:08,120 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 2: it's sort of like. 183 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:10,840 Speaker 1: Come here, come here. If somebody gets closer, like get back. 184 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, And so they give a lot of mixed messages 185 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:15,880 Speaker 2: because a lot of that is like the internal feelings 186 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 2: that they're caring and responding to. 187 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:19,280 Speaker 1: So those are the four for major here. 188 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:21,400 Speaker 3: That was really informative. And I feel like when I 189 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 3: read through your book and I was reading through all 190 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:26,720 Speaker 3: these attachment styles, I could think of different people in 191 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:29,880 Speaker 3: my life who carry different qualities, and what it really 192 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:33,200 Speaker 3: made me think was, God, it helps me feel so 193 00:08:33,440 --> 00:08:36,400 Speaker 3: much empathy towards the people in my life, not even 194 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 3: just empathy but understanding of myself, understanding of other people, 195 00:08:41,080 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 3: but so much more compassion for it. And I think 196 00:08:44,040 --> 00:08:48,400 Speaker 3: that these styles help you to connect not just to 197 00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:51,440 Speaker 3: your partner, not just to your parents, to but every 198 00:08:51,480 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 3: single person that you come into contact with. You can 199 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 3: kind of start understanding their behavior and therefore have more 200 00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 3: of a compassionate nature. Where you're thinking, this all stems 201 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:02,800 Speaker 3: from like a that was either neglected or grew up 202 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:05,520 Speaker 3: in a really difficult environment, and those things are being 203 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 3: carried with us. 204 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:08,319 Speaker 4: So how does. 205 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:11,760 Speaker 3: One go from you know, hearing this where you hear 206 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:14,240 Speaker 3: what the attachment styles are and being like, oh this 207 00:09:14,320 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 3: is me or oh this is my partner, this is 208 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:17,320 Speaker 3: my mom. 209 00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:19,200 Speaker 4: What do we then do about it? 210 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 3: Like? How how does one How did you start to 211 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:24,319 Speaker 3: heal yourself and what would you know? You said you 212 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:26,400 Speaker 3: did a lot of healing work. What were the healing 213 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 3: techniques that really helped you? And how do we move 214 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:34,000 Speaker 3: through these towards being a secure? Can everyone be a secure? 215 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:34,560 Speaker 4: Yes? 216 00:09:34,679 --> 00:09:38,560 Speaker 2: Yes, everybody can be sec It does require work, Like 217 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:40,440 Speaker 2: I would say, the caveat is if somebody's not really 218 00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 2: willing to do the work, and that's where the sort 219 00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:45,360 Speaker 2: of the glass ceiling arises. 220 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 4: But I did. 221 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 3: So. 222 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 2: I first started in client practice after doing a lot 223 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:50,960 Speaker 2: of my own work, and I saw over the course 224 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:53,000 Speaker 2: of about a decade, almost eighteen I went through almost 225 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 2: eighteen thousand client slashs. And if people are willing to 226 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:59,760 Speaker 2: do the work, people become secure. If somebody came in 227 00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 2: and they were willing, but they dragged in their partner 228 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:03,760 Speaker 2: who was unwilling, that would be where like that that 229 00:10:03,880 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 2: there's not much you can. 230 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:05,200 Speaker 1: Do past that. 231 00:10:05,679 --> 00:10:07,839 Speaker 2: So my original background was actually I came out of 232 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 2: school for psychology, went into specializing in hypnosis, and I 233 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:14,680 Speaker 2: really wanted to learn how we can really change our 234 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 2: subconscious mind. So one of the things I learned in 235 00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:21,080 Speaker 2: school was that your conscious mind cannot outwill or overpower 236 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:24,400 Speaker 2: your subconscious mind, which to me was like mind blowing 237 00:10:24,400 --> 00:10:26,720 Speaker 2: because it was like, oh, that's why everybody every New 238 00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:29,319 Speaker 2: Year's it's like I'm gonna quit eating chocolate and seven days. 239 00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 1: Later they're back to the same thing. 240 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:33,160 Speaker 2: Or we set all these goals but we don't follow through. Well, 241 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,320 Speaker 2: it's because we're not engaging the subconscious mind in the 242 00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 2: process of transformation. So I got into hypno therapy did 243 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:41,839 Speaker 2: like this year long certification and all of that, did 244 00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 2: a lot of like NLP, a lot of these things 245 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:46,560 Speaker 2: to really understand how the mind works, and then started 246 00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 2: doing client sessions with hypnosis and was like, kind of 247 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:52,040 Speaker 2: I thought the power dynamics were strange. I felt like 248 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:54,679 Speaker 2: it was like give the mani fish instead. 249 00:10:54,400 --> 00:10:55,680 Speaker 1: Of tea into fish. 250 00:10:56,320 --> 00:10:58,680 Speaker 2: And I was like, what, I'd rather spend time telling 251 00:10:58,679 --> 00:11:01,360 Speaker 2: people how their subconscious works and how they can recondition it. 252 00:11:01,440 --> 00:11:03,680 Speaker 2: Because when you look at hypnosis and you pair that 253 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:07,840 Speaker 2: with neuroplasticity research, there's like a science behind transformation. So 254 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:09,720 Speaker 2: there's a lot of tools we can use to change 255 00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 2: our subconscious mind, which is how the needle actually moves. 256 00:11:12,880 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 1: So what I found over about. 257 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:18,079 Speaker 2: Ten years of working with people was that there's basically 258 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:21,680 Speaker 2: four major categories and two kind of minor ones that 259 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:24,280 Speaker 2: we have to focus on in order to become securely attached. 260 00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:28,120 Speaker 2: The first is reprogramming our core wounds. So we all 261 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 2: have core wounds, and they're basically like our relationship baggage. 262 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:34,160 Speaker 2: So if I grew up for example, for me, I 263 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 2: grew up in an environment where there was a lot 264 00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:37,640 Speaker 2: of chaos, and so I really had a hard time 265 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:40,240 Speaker 2: trusting because I was kind of like, if my parents 266 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:43,319 Speaker 2: are betraying trust, like how will I trust anybody? And 267 00:11:43,400 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 2: so you know that's an I am betrayed core wound. 268 00:11:45,880 --> 00:11:48,520 Speaker 2: And each attachment style actually has very unique core wounds. 269 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 2: Anxious attachments have more like I'll be abandoned, I'll be alone, excluded, disliked, rejected, 270 00:11:54,040 --> 00:11:56,760 Speaker 2: dismissive avoidance are more like I'll be seen as defective 271 00:11:56,880 --> 00:11:59,880 Speaker 2: or something's wrong with me because of that internalized shame wound. 272 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 2: I'll be weak, if I'm vulnerable, it's unsafe to open up. 273 00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:06,960 Speaker 2: I'll be trapped, helpless, powerless. Fearful woids basically have both 274 00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:08,920 Speaker 2: sides because they have that anxious end of winds, so 275 00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 2: a little more core wound reprogramming, but they also have 276 00:12:11,640 --> 00:12:15,040 Speaker 2: this core wounded I'll be betrayed, I'm unworthy, and I 277 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:17,440 Speaker 2: am bad, like feeling like people will get them in 278 00:12:17,480 --> 00:12:20,439 Speaker 2: trouble or punish them for no reason. So a lot 279 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:22,880 Speaker 2: of the first work I did just of my own accord, 280 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,760 Speaker 2: was doing a ton of core woundery programming, which is 281 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:29,920 Speaker 2: based on how we can sort of self hypnotize when awake. 282 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 2: It's not like really in a process of hypnosis at all. 283 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:37,040 Speaker 2: It's just a process of like firing and wiring neural pathways. 284 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:39,280 Speaker 2: We can always talk about like a tool or something later. 285 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 2: There's some really easy takeaways that people could get started. 286 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:43,200 Speaker 1: On immediately who are less. 287 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:45,600 Speaker 2: So first we have to get all of those ideas 288 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 2: out of our subconscious mind. Because if I'm going into 289 00:12:48,040 --> 00:12:50,480 Speaker 2: trying to love somebody and I'm like, well, I'm going 290 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:51,920 Speaker 2: to be betrayed, I'm going to be a band, and 291 00:12:51,920 --> 00:12:53,920 Speaker 2: I'm going to be trapped, and all these fears are there, 292 00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:56,480 Speaker 2: then it makes it really difficult to let our guard 293 00:12:56,559 --> 00:12:58,960 Speaker 2: down or to feel normal. So we have to recondition 294 00:12:59,040 --> 00:13:01,120 Speaker 2: those ideas. We're not born with them, they get conditioned 295 00:13:01,160 --> 00:13:03,760 Speaker 2: into us. We can recondition them of the same court. 296 00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:05,959 Speaker 3: And so I guess that first step what I'm hearing 297 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:10,640 Speaker 3: from you is identifying, like learning and learning yourself and 298 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:13,920 Speaker 3: identifying what is my mind thinking in that moment, like 299 00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:16,199 Speaker 3: noticing it, because I think a lot of us go 300 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:19,440 Speaker 3: on autopilot. If you've had it from such a young age. 301 00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:21,680 Speaker 3: You know, I'm going into a room, whether it's with 302 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:24,079 Speaker 3: my partner or whether it's with my friends, and the 303 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:26,840 Speaker 3: first thing I'm thinking is, oh, if I act in 304 00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:28,600 Speaker 3: this way, they're not going to like me. Like let's 305 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:30,600 Speaker 3: say that's let's say that's the initial thought that comes 306 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 3: into my mind. But you become so used to having 307 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 3: those thoughts that they don't feel abnormal, they feel so 308 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:39,560 Speaker 3: part of you. They feel like they are are your normality. 309 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:44,360 Speaker 3: And so I think, yeah, the identifying part is so 310 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:47,840 Speaker 3: important when you actually start listening and hearing what is 311 00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:50,079 Speaker 3: going through my mind as I'm going through the world, 312 00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:53,160 Speaker 3: what is going through my mind as I'm interacting with 313 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:56,240 Speaker 3: my partner, with my close friends, with the people that 314 00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:59,360 Speaker 3: I'm closest to, how am I reacting to things? And 315 00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:03,199 Speaker 3: so okay, step one, identify exactly, and. 316 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:05,840 Speaker 2: It's really identify and then do the reprogramming work. So 317 00:14:05,840 --> 00:14:08,080 Speaker 2: we'll give a tool in a little bit too, but 318 00:14:08,240 --> 00:14:09,480 Speaker 2: I'll sort of go through the few and then I 319 00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 2: can come back to a tool for actually how to recondition, 320 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:13,440 Speaker 2: but exactly to your point, like, we have to know 321 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:16,719 Speaker 2: what it is first, and so a great way that 322 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:20,160 Speaker 2: people can discover it is whenever we're triggered, So whenever 323 00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:23,360 Speaker 2: we're feeling stressed or sad or emotional, if we can 324 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:26,720 Speaker 2: really anchor in the situation, So it's when my partner 325 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 2: didn't call me back, for example, what do I make 326 00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 2: it mean about me? And if we can ask ourselves 327 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:34,040 Speaker 2: that question, it's a really good way of retrieving the 328 00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 2: core wound. It's based in cognitive behavioral therapy, and so 329 00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 2: when we see that, we can go, oh, well, I'm 330 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 2: making that mean that I'm going to be abandoned, yes, 331 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:45,600 Speaker 2: Or I'm making that mean I'm disliked or rejected, or 332 00:14:45,880 --> 00:14:47,760 Speaker 2: I'm making that mean that you know, I'm with the 333 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 2: wrong person, I'm going to be trapped, you know. So 334 00:14:49,800 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 2: we each have like really individual meaning, and when we 335 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:54,800 Speaker 2: can look at times we felt really emotional or triggered 336 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:57,160 Speaker 2: and ask ourselves, what do I make that mean about me? 337 00:14:57,600 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 2: We'll see clearly what those core wounds tend to be. 338 00:15:00,320 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 2: So that's sort of the first way to pull them up, 339 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:03,640 Speaker 2: and then we can do the reprogramming. 340 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:06,400 Speaker 3: So what do I so identify and then what do 341 00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:07,560 Speaker 3: I make what was it? 342 00:15:07,560 --> 00:15:09,080 Speaker 1: What would I make this mean about me? 343 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 3: What would I make this mean about me? I can 344 00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:12,720 Speaker 3: say relate to that. The first thing that I thought 345 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:15,920 Speaker 3: of when you said that was, I remember when me 346 00:15:15,960 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 3: and my husband first got married, he would have this 347 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:22,280 Speaker 3: habit of when he would come into the door, he 348 00:15:22,280 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 3: would leave his shoes right by the door, and I 349 00:15:25,160 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 3: would be in my mind, I would be thinking, what 350 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:28,920 Speaker 3: does he think I'm just going to pick up after him? 351 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:30,400 Speaker 4: Is that why he's leaving it by the door. 352 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:34,080 Speaker 3: He thinks that it's my responsibility to pick those shoes 353 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:37,280 Speaker 3: up and put them away. And it kept tearing away 354 00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 3: at me over and over again. And when I thought 355 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:41,960 Speaker 3: about what that meant for me, it was because I 356 00:15:42,040 --> 00:15:44,840 Speaker 3: felt like I felt insecure about being at that time 357 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:47,760 Speaker 3: a housewife. Where I was where I was staying at 358 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:49,680 Speaker 3: home and he was working, and that was a shift 359 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 3: that I had just made, and it was something that 360 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:55,920 Speaker 3: I felt insecure about. And so constantly any actions he 361 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:58,000 Speaker 3: was taking, which he didn't mean it to be that, 362 00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:01,440 Speaker 3: my interpretation was, Oh, so he's leaving that though, because 363 00:16:01,440 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 3: he thinks I should be doing this. 364 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:03,960 Speaker 4: And then I spoke to. 365 00:16:03,960 --> 00:16:06,080 Speaker 3: Him and he was like, no, I'm so happy doing it. 366 00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:08,120 Speaker 3: I just you know, at that moment in time, it's 367 00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 3: not when I want to pick this up or when 368 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 3: I want to do that. But I would have done 369 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:13,000 Speaker 3: it an hour later, or I would have done it 370 00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 3: in my own time. And so the interpretation that I 371 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:18,680 Speaker 3: had made for myself was so different to what his 372 00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:19,880 Speaker 3: meaning actually. 373 00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:21,440 Speaker 1: Were exactly exactly, but it. 374 00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 3: Was purely based on my insecurities or things that I 375 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:27,320 Speaker 3: felt maybe in the past, or having to look after someone, 376 00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:30,400 Speaker 3: you know, whatever it was, it was definitely stemming from 377 00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:32,560 Speaker 3: something far beyond just the shoes that were left in 378 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:33,240 Speaker 3: front of the door. 379 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: So that's so cool. It's such a good example. 380 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 2: So if you go a step further, it just tell 381 00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 2: me if either one of these resonate with you, I 382 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:42,760 Speaker 2: don't matter, I'm I am unimportant, or I am disrespected. 383 00:16:43,080 --> 00:16:47,840 Speaker 3: I think that I am unimportant definitely stems from even 384 00:16:47,880 --> 00:16:51,000 Speaker 3: school times where I never felt like I was worth, 385 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:54,200 Speaker 3: Like I was never told or shown that I was 386 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 3: worthy to even be in the classroom because I was 387 00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 3: always not getting the grades or always not being the 388 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:01,240 Speaker 3: person that was performing in the right way to get 389 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:03,920 Speaker 3: attention or to get adoration in that way. And so 390 00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:07,560 Speaker 3: the unimportant thing I think has always played has been 391 00:17:07,600 --> 00:17:10,320 Speaker 3: a thread throughout what I'm doing, or like the feeling 392 00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:12,160 Speaker 3: of being a little bit unworthy, and then you kind 393 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:14,280 Speaker 3: of translate it into other things totally. 394 00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:16,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, And so that's like what core wounds come from. 395 00:17:16,440 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 3: It. 396 00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:20,439 Speaker 2: They never come from like actual like that moment with 397 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 2: your husband coming through the door. They're always pre existing, 398 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,280 Speaker 2: and then they get activated in those moments and then 399 00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:29,600 Speaker 2: it's something where like the shoes on the floor, like, oh, 400 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 2: it's your shoes on the floor, but it's you know, 401 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,199 Speaker 2: people are like, oh, it's not a big deal, but 402 00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:35,960 Speaker 2: really it's not about what the objective experience is. It's 403 00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:38,440 Speaker 2: the subjective stuff that we have inside of us that 404 00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:42,879 Speaker 2: arises that feels so uncomfortable. Yeah, so we do a 405 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:44,680 Speaker 2: lot of the work. The first part is like learning 406 00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:46,679 Speaker 2: exactly what our core wounds are. There's a list of 407 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:48,919 Speaker 2: like eighteen or twenty. I can actually send you a 408 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:50,359 Speaker 2: link if you want to put in the show notes 409 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:50,800 Speaker 2: or something. 410 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:53,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, the listeners identify theirs. 411 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:56,280 Speaker 2: But you can see those ones and then it's like okay, 412 00:17:56,359 --> 00:17:58,680 Speaker 2: then we can plug them into the reprogramming, and then 413 00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:01,680 Speaker 2: we can actually leave these things that were conditioned into 414 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 2: our subconscious mind from pre existing experiences, which makes us 415 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:07,119 Speaker 2: way less likely to jump to those conclusions in the 416 00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:08,679 Speaker 2: future or feel that distress. 417 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 4: It's so true. 418 00:18:09,640 --> 00:18:11,560 Speaker 3: I think about all the times where I've kind of 419 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:16,000 Speaker 3: jumped to conclusions or had very snappy responses to things, 420 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:18,080 Speaker 3: and I'm like, why did I there was such a 421 00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:21,480 Speaker 3: tiny thing? Like, technically it's a tiny thing, but because 422 00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:24,200 Speaker 3: you allow things to build up so much, it doesn't 423 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:27,800 Speaker 3: feel tiny at all, Like that one thing feels so 424 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:31,840 Speaker 3: huge because of either things I haven't worked through myself 425 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:34,440 Speaker 3: or things that I haven't worked through with other people. Yes, 426 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:38,080 Speaker 3: that has ended up leaving little scars exactly, God, no, 427 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:38,440 Speaker 3: please go. 428 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:40,919 Speaker 2: Well, I'm just gonna say I always tell people like 429 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:43,880 Speaker 2: it's never because some people will do that, right, You're 430 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:46,000 Speaker 2: probably not doing that as much, but people will shame 431 00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:48,160 Speaker 2: themselves for having reactions to things like oh, I can't 432 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:49,440 Speaker 2: believe I was snappy. 433 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:49,879 Speaker 1: Over this little thing. 434 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 2: And it's because it's never about the external experience. It's 435 00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 2: always about what it triggers internally for us. And so 436 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:58,080 Speaker 2: it's also a reminder for us to be like gentle 437 00:18:58,119 --> 00:19:00,719 Speaker 2: with ourselves. And then if we see ourselves doing that, 438 00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:03,000 Speaker 2: it's never helpful to like shame ourselves or read ourself 439 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:05,399 Speaker 2: up or something. It's so important to get an adopt 440 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:07,840 Speaker 2: a state of curiosity and to be like, well, why 441 00:19:07,880 --> 00:19:09,879 Speaker 2: did that affect me so much? What am I making 442 00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:12,439 Speaker 2: it mean about me? And then we see, oh I 443 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:15,200 Speaker 2: was making it mean I am unimportant or I am unworthy, 444 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:17,000 Speaker 2: and oh my gosh, there's this like trail of that 445 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:19,440 Speaker 2: in my experience, how it all makes sense? 446 00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:22,119 Speaker 3: Gosh, can you imagine how many well I'm sure you 447 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:24,200 Speaker 3: already know through the work you've done, but how many 448 00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:25,720 Speaker 3: arguments are saved. 449 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:26,840 Speaker 4: After people realize these. 450 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 3: Little things, Like seriously, I can just imagine the clarity 451 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:33,920 Speaker 3: of communication and like the clarity of understanding. Even if 452 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 3: you figure out yourself as being secure, but then you 453 00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:40,080 Speaker 3: end up noticing those traits in your partner helps you 454 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:45,240 Speaker 3: to also help them unwind and and you know, figure 455 00:19:45,280 --> 00:19:47,439 Speaker 3: those parts out, like where is that coming from? Like 456 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 3: how is that? How is what I said? What are 457 00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 3: you translating it to be? You know, I remember I 458 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:57,719 Speaker 3: heard recently Gaba Mathe I love him too, and he 459 00:19:57,800 --> 00:20:00,119 Speaker 3: was talking about how this was more to do with 460 00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:02,320 Speaker 3: what other people think about you, But he was talking 461 00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:06,880 Speaker 3: about how you can never control how someone perceives what 462 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:11,160 Speaker 3: you've said, because it's going through all these layers, all 463 00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:12,680 Speaker 3: these filters of. 464 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 4: Their pain, of their trauma. 465 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:16,920 Speaker 3: And so you can say the same thing to five 466 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 3: different people and each person will have internalized it completely 467 00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:25,080 Speaker 3: differently exactly. And there's this word in Sanskrit. It's called 468 00:20:25,880 --> 00:20:29,760 Speaker 3: some scars, and some scars are tiny. They're described as 469 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 3: tiny little footprints that are essentially left on you every 470 00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 3: single time you go through an experience. But what happens 471 00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:38,960 Speaker 3: is sometimes they can get washed away when you end 472 00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:42,520 Speaker 3: up processing them. But otherwise, every single time that same 473 00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:44,960 Speaker 3: thing happens, that the imprint gets deeper. 474 00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 4: And deeper and deeper. 475 00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 3: And so I always think about that when I go 476 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:51,720 Speaker 3: through life. I'm like, all these little impressions they refer 477 00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:53,920 Speaker 3: to us, All these little impressions that are being made 478 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 3: determine how we receive anything that we come into contact. 479 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:02,040 Speaker 1: With exactly and will give. And it's so funny. 480 00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:04,399 Speaker 2: Because this is like how the subconscious works too, is 481 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 2: exactly what you just described as some scars, which is 482 00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 2: every time we go through a negative thing that we 483 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:12,119 Speaker 2: can't properly emotionally in process or subconscious stores it so 484 00:21:12,160 --> 00:21:13,920 Speaker 2: that it can protect us from it in the future. 485 00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:14,400 Speaker 4: Wow. 486 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:16,400 Speaker 2: But then when we keep giving the same meaning, we're 487 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 2: actually firing and wiring those neural pathways are getting stronger 488 00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:21,959 Speaker 2: and deeper. And now you think of your subconscious mind 489 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:24,360 Speaker 2: as like the lens you see the world through where 490 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 2: it's almost like every time you have something that like 491 00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:29,040 Speaker 2: or like almost like a windshield when you're driving your 492 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:30,560 Speaker 2: car and you get these like splats of mud on 493 00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:33,240 Speaker 2: your windshield and they build up and become dirty and dirtier, 494 00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:35,919 Speaker 2: and unless you're cleaning them out, it skews your vision. 495 00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:37,680 Speaker 4: Yes, that's a great analogy. 496 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:39,720 Speaker 3: So with people, you know, I have a lot of 497 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:42,879 Speaker 3: friends who get into relationships and you know, you end 498 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,400 Speaker 3: up having these patterns when you end up seeking out 499 00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:50,119 Speaker 3: the same thing over and over again. Is that linked 500 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:54,360 Speaker 3: to these attachment theories from a young age? And if 501 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:58,119 Speaker 3: you notice yourself getting into patterns and usually then we 502 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:00,480 Speaker 3: recognize the patterns usually when they negative, not when they're 503 00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:01,960 Speaker 3: positive patons. 504 00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:02,560 Speaker 4: How would one? 505 00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:04,400 Speaker 3: And obviously these are the ways that you get out 506 00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:09,639 Speaker 3: of it, But when do you know to stop, Like, 507 00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:11,919 Speaker 3: how do you know to stop those patterns? How do 508 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 3: you stop it from how do you differentiate it from 509 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:17,440 Speaker 3: who you just are as your personality versus something that 510 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 3: is wrong with you or something that you have to 511 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 3: adapt and. 512 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 2: Change because of how much it's causing us pain. So 513 00:22:24,119 --> 00:22:27,280 Speaker 2: I feel like emotions like they're a beautiful feedback mechanism, 514 00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:29,560 Speaker 2: Like they're always telling us when something is out of alignment. 515 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:31,440 Speaker 2: And sometimes what we do is we shame our emotions 516 00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:34,119 Speaker 2: or suppress them. But they're always saying something to us. 517 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:35,920 Speaker 2: And when we can use them as an opportunity to 518 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,199 Speaker 2: go inward, we can go in and heal and do 519 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 2: that underlying work. And so what's really interesting is that 520 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,600 Speaker 2: our subconscious mind really wants to maintain its comfort zone. 521 00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:48,240 Speaker 2: So it seeks comfort because it equates it to familiarity 522 00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:51,280 Speaker 2: and thus safety. And so your subconscious at the end 523 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:53,679 Speaker 2: of the day is really survival wired. So even if 524 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:56,440 Speaker 2: we're going through decades of painful patterns and relationships, will 525 00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:58,720 Speaker 2: attract the same type of people and invest in those 526 00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:03,359 Speaker 2: personalities because we're like, it's familiar, and thus I'm still 527 00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:07,320 Speaker 2: likely to survive. And so what's really interesting is it 528 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:12,120 Speaker 2: for each of the attachment styles, we are generally most 529 00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 2: attracted to what represents the subconscious comforts wone we have 530 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:17,000 Speaker 2: in relationship to self. 531 00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:19,359 Speaker 1: So how we. 532 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:22,960 Speaker 2: Get conditioned as children we will tend to internalize. So 533 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:25,359 Speaker 2: I always say, for example, like our internal dialogue is 534 00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:28,199 Speaker 2: often our internalized dialogue from childhood, Like how we were 535 00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 2: spoken to will often speak to ourselves. And so let's say, 536 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:34,560 Speaker 2: for example, you would really critical parents, then you become 537 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:37,800 Speaker 2: really critical of self, and then you see that you're 538 00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:41,080 Speaker 2: attracted to really critical people because they mirror back to 539 00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:43,840 Speaker 2: you how you treat yourself, and thus it feels safe 540 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:47,480 Speaker 2: and familiar. Wow. And so you'll often see like anxious 541 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,320 Speaker 2: attachment styles. They are very dismissive of themselves and their 542 00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:52,959 Speaker 2: own feelings because they're busy people pleasing, so they're more 543 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:54,840 Speaker 2: attracted to emotionally unavailable people. 544 00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:56,639 Speaker 1: A lot of the time, dismissive A. 545 00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 2: Winds are very preoccupied with their own time to themselves, 546 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:01,440 Speaker 2: and often the attracted to people who are also. 547 00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:02,920 Speaker 1: Preoccupied with the amount of time. 548 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 2: So we end up attracting what's our mirror, not into 549 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:09,280 Speaker 2: like what we're looking for, but into who we are 550 00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:12,280 Speaker 2: to self. And that's why it's so important to become 551 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:14,919 Speaker 2: securely attached to self first, so we're more likely to 552 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,919 Speaker 2: be investing in people who are also going to be 553 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:19,920 Speaker 2: secure and show up in safe and healthy ways. 554 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:22,240 Speaker 4: See that puts a whole different meaning to. 555 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:26,160 Speaker 3: Love yourself first, and then you'll find the person that's 556 00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:28,600 Speaker 3: gonna love you best Like that to me. You know, 557 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:30,280 Speaker 3: everyone's like, you know, you have to feel really secure 558 00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:32,520 Speaker 3: by yourself first before you get into a relationship. But 559 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:34,800 Speaker 3: I think the way you just described it of it 560 00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:37,639 Speaker 3: being this reflection, you know, what you end up seeking 561 00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:39,879 Speaker 3: out is a reflection of how you treat yourself. Then 562 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 3: it makes sense, right then you actually want to be 563 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:45,080 Speaker 3: in a place rather than someone coming in and trying 564 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,840 Speaker 3: to fix these broken pieces of you. You then realize, 565 00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:51,399 Speaker 3: oh my god, I could deserve so much more, Like 566 00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 3: I could attract so much more in my life, and 567 00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:56,800 Speaker 3: I there's a possibility that I deserve way more. But 568 00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:00,720 Speaker 3: I need to believe I deserve more, and I need 569 00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,840 Speaker 3: to believe that things in my own self can be 570 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,640 Speaker 3: better before I can attract better exactly. 571 00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:09,119 Speaker 2: And that goes back to like these major things. So 572 00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:11,000 Speaker 2: it's really interesting. So we talked about like that. You know, 573 00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:13,360 Speaker 2: there's a four major things. Yeah, so the first one 574 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:14,840 Speaker 2: is core wounds, right, and we have to I have 575 00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 2: to go through the other ones. But the core wounds, 576 00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 2: like if I'm telling myself all day I'm not good 577 00:25:20,359 --> 00:25:23,359 Speaker 2: enough or I'm unworthy, I never So I saw a 578 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 2: lot of clients within that ten year period or so 579 00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:28,600 Speaker 2: when I was running my practice who came out of 580 00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 2: also narcissistic relationships and not like how people throw away 581 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:35,560 Speaker 2: through around the term, but like actual, you know, narcissistic 582 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:39,199 Speaker 2: personality disorder. And it's so interesting because this was like 583 00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 2: the most obvious example to me. And this is to 584 00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:44,560 Speaker 2: be very clear, I'm not victim blaming at all, and 585 00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:46,479 Speaker 2: I'll speak to that in a moment, but but what 586 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:49,040 Speaker 2: I would see is that every person who ended up 587 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:52,560 Speaker 2: in a relationship with a narcissist, they first were very 588 00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:55,960 Speaker 2: self critical, They violated their own boundaries to please people 589 00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:59,719 Speaker 2: all the time. They would manipulate themselves into like becoming 590 00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:02,720 Speaker 2: what people wanted from them to people please them, and 591 00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:04,480 Speaker 2: they were often in a position where they were not 592 00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:06,840 Speaker 2: empathizing with their own feelings. They were like judging themselves 593 00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:11,280 Speaker 2: for feelings. So of course somebody comes along who's not 594 00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:13,440 Speaker 2: going to be very nice to you. They're going to 595 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:15,520 Speaker 2: be like cruel or mean and how they talk to you, 596 00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:19,080 Speaker 2: They're going to manipulate your life, they're going to violate 597 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:21,159 Speaker 2: your boundaries, they're not going to empathize with you, like 598 00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:24,240 Speaker 2: all these characteristics of a narcissist. And what happens is 599 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:26,919 Speaker 2: the conscious mind is responsible for three to five percent 600 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:31,240 Speaker 2: of our beliefs, thoughts, emotions, and actions, and subconscious and 601 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:34,720 Speaker 2: unconscious collectively are ninety five to ninety seven percent. And 602 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,600 Speaker 2: every client that I would see go through this would 603 00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:40,720 Speaker 2: come into my practice and they would say, I knew better. 604 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:43,640 Speaker 2: It was almost like logically, which is our conscious mind, 605 00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:45,800 Speaker 2: I knew that something was not right. I knew that 606 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,119 Speaker 2: this person wasn't being healthy, but it was like I 607 00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:51,160 Speaker 2: couldn't stop myself from going and investing in this relationship. 608 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,840 Speaker 3: The autopilot is exactly almost like this dormant autopilot thing 609 00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:59,600 Speaker 3: where it's almost like we're asleep, like it's it's the subconscious. 610 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,959 Speaker 3: To me, it feels like unless you start tuning into it, 611 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 3: it becomes this part of you that is asleep on 612 00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:10,760 Speaker 3: basically just following patterns that you've already followed before without 613 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:13,720 Speaker 3: trying to reji like you have to realign it. But otherwise, 614 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:17,040 Speaker 3: living through your subconscious means I'm going to collect all 615 00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:19,199 Speaker 3: these things that happen. We're going to store it, like 616 00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:21,879 Speaker 3: you said, and then we're going to live in that 617 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:25,760 Speaker 3: same pattern over and over again until you wake up 618 00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:28,560 Speaker 3: and until you wake me up and start telling me different. 619 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:32,359 Speaker 2: Exactly exactly, and start doing that reconditioning work, and so 620 00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:34,919 Speaker 2: it's like this whole like landscape of what's happening. So 621 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:38,160 Speaker 2: that first part is people learning to reprogram their core wounds, 622 00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:39,879 Speaker 2: because as long as I have core wounds, like for me, 623 00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,280 Speaker 2: it's so interesting. I saw my parents go through this 624 00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:46,239 Speaker 2: big sort of you know, confused dynamic, and I had 625 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:48,439 Speaker 2: this huge betrayal core wound, and then I was in 626 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:51,320 Speaker 2: relationships as a young person with people who would betray me, 627 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:53,679 Speaker 2: and it was like, oh my gosh, this is my 628 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,560 Speaker 2: subconscious comfort zone and as soon as I recondition that 629 00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,399 Speaker 2: that would change. Right, So we tend to like actually 630 00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:01,320 Speaker 2: not just have these core ones, but then we invest 631 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 2: in people who are more likely to activate them. So 632 00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:05,840 Speaker 2: that's the first The second part is we need to 633 00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 2: learn what our needs are. Everybody has needs in a relationship, 634 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:12,520 Speaker 2: and actually needs in a relationship are so understated. So 635 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:14,760 Speaker 2: there's the beautiful work of doctor Gary Chapman. He talks 636 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:17,120 Speaker 2: about the five love languages, and I would actually say, 637 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:20,679 Speaker 2: much more important than the love languages are our needs 638 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:23,679 Speaker 2: because I can I have a big quality time love language, 639 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,840 Speaker 2: but I have a big need for emotional connection, and 640 00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:30,080 Speaker 2: if I spend quality time watching Netflix with somebody, it's 641 00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:31,959 Speaker 2: not the same as having like a deep conversation and 642 00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:34,760 Speaker 2: feeling like that's like a really connecting thing. So our 643 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:37,280 Speaker 2: needs are absolutely huge, and they're how we actually give 644 00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:40,640 Speaker 2: and receive love in a relationship. And when needs are 645 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:44,040 Speaker 2: not being met, and not to fear amonger people listening 646 00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:47,200 Speaker 2: to this, but when needs are not met, that is 647 00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 2: the context for usually how infidelity happens long term and relationships, 648 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,600 Speaker 2: because the subconscious mind is a needs meaning machine, and 649 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:56,440 Speaker 2: so what will happen is we won't get our needs met, 650 00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:59,760 Speaker 2: let's say in a twenty year marriage, and then we'll 651 00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:02,880 Speaker 2: start to resent, and then somebody comes along who does 652 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 2: meet those needs. They do make you feel seen or 653 00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,800 Speaker 2: heard or significant, and the subconscious mind will go through 654 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:11,760 Speaker 2: these enormous feelings of infatuation, which obviously this is usually 655 00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:13,959 Speaker 2: with the exception of people who are like sex addicts 656 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:16,920 Speaker 2: or things like that, the vast majority of infidelity happens 657 00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 2: in these very drawn out times where needs are not 658 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:22,000 Speaker 2: being that and then the person justifies it and strays. 659 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 2: And so every person has needs. We need to learn 660 00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,360 Speaker 2: our own needs and how to meet our needs ourselves 661 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:32,600 Speaker 2: first so that our subconscious mind is ready to receive 662 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:35,400 Speaker 2: them from other people and we're primed. And then the 663 00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 2: third piece becomes we need to learn to communicate our 664 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:40,880 Speaker 2: needs vulnerably and transparently and so hard. 665 00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:43,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess like, okay, we've done on this week. 666 00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:45,520 Speaker 3: And then you have to learn how to ask for 667 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:48,160 Speaker 3: what you need, which I think even more so for 668 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,719 Speaker 3: women than I think for anybody else. We're just so 669 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:55,440 Speaker 3: used to being the people were being in a position 670 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,840 Speaker 3: of being givers and being people who are. 671 00:29:59,040 --> 00:29:59,960 Speaker 4: Okay, care take. 672 00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,320 Speaker 3: It's part of our nature to be that way, and 673 00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:04,480 Speaker 3: so to then be like, this is what I need, 674 00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:08,440 Speaker 3: it feels like such a big step and a very 675 00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:11,240 Speaker 3: vulnerable moment to even do that. 676 00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:14,880 Speaker 2: So big so as a fearful avoidant as well. In 677 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:17,720 Speaker 2: the past, I remember the first time I communicated in 678 00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:19,480 Speaker 2: need and it was to my now husband, and we've 679 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,720 Speaker 2: been together for like ten years, but we were early 680 00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:24,200 Speaker 2: on into dating, and I had done a lot of 681 00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:26,760 Speaker 2: this work on myself first, but I hadn't really done 682 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:28,760 Speaker 2: it in a relationship. I took this kind of time 683 00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:31,720 Speaker 2: out from dating, like this sacred kind of pause, to 684 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:33,360 Speaker 2: like do a lot of inner work because I knew 685 00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:36,200 Speaker 2: that I needed it, and and it's funnily enough, he 686 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:37,920 Speaker 2: was like the first person actually dated after. 687 00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:39,240 Speaker 1: Coming out of that and then we got married. 688 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:43,480 Speaker 2: But he like, I remember one time I felt really 689 00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:46,280 Speaker 2: insecure about something and it was like this misunderstanding that 690 00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 2: was happening, and we were only a few months into dating, 691 00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:51,680 Speaker 2: and I remember knowing, if I don't say right now 692 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 2: that I just need like clarity and reassurance that I'm 693 00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:55,880 Speaker 2: going to store it and I'm just going to kind 694 00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:56,720 Speaker 2: of push him away. 695 00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:59,240 Speaker 1: And I remember like where I was, what I was wearing. 696 00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:00,880 Speaker 1: It was such a good moment because. 697 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 2: It was so scary, but I was like, hey, you know, 698 00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:06,640 Speaker 2: I'm feeling like a little bit unsure about this situation 699 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:09,440 Speaker 2: that's happening, and I need like clarity and reassurance to 700 00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:11,280 Speaker 2: feel okay. Otherwise I know it's just gonna I'm gonna 701 00:31:11,320 --> 00:31:12,440 Speaker 2: get in my head and I don't want it to 702 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:14,680 Speaker 2: come out in a different way in the relationship. And 703 00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 2: he like was so sweet about it and so like 704 00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:19,800 Speaker 2: and it was the first time met ever communicated, and 705 00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:24,200 Speaker 2: it was like positively reinforced like that, and it was like, oh, 706 00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:26,840 Speaker 2: this is what it's supposed to feel like and it's 707 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,160 Speaker 2: so scary when we haven't done that before. And to 708 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:31,240 Speaker 2: your point, like women a lot of the times too, 709 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:33,520 Speaker 2: are like care takers and they're not supposed to like 710 00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:36,400 Speaker 2: have have needs or take up too much space. But 711 00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:40,600 Speaker 2: I think that without that, relationships just often become dysfunctional. 712 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,080 Speaker 2: And the more we have unmet needs and there's a 713 00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:46,520 Speaker 2: lack of communication that goes in direct correlation with how 714 00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:50,960 Speaker 2: much resentment boils in the relationship, and so that's the 715 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 2: big thing. So so we do the core wounds, we 716 00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,840 Speaker 2: identify and reprogram core wounds. We learn our needs and 717 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 2: we learn to meet them to with self. So if 718 00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:00,680 Speaker 2: I need encouragement, I better be more validated of self. 719 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,040 Speaker 2: If I need certainty, how can I create my own 720 00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:05,440 Speaker 2: certainty with more boundaries in my life or things like that. 721 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:07,920 Speaker 2: And there's like each attachment style we can go through 722 00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 2: them afterwards too, but each attachment set actually has very 723 00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:12,480 Speaker 2: unique needs that tend to be there, so we can 724 00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:14,200 Speaker 2: learn from that what they are, and then we learn 725 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:15,480 Speaker 2: to meet them with self, and then we learn to 726 00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:18,400 Speaker 2: communicate them with others. And then the last kind of 727 00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:21,400 Speaker 2: pieces is we have to develop healthy boundaries, and then 728 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:23,760 Speaker 2: we have to do a little emotional regulation just through 729 00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:27,720 Speaker 2: things that get us into parasympathetic nervous system mode, meditation, 730 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:30,080 Speaker 2: breath work, habits, just like little things that will help 731 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:33,480 Speaker 2: us reregulate if we come from a history of relationship trauma, 732 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:35,840 Speaker 2: and then in doing that. 733 00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:36,880 Speaker 1: That will shift our behaviors. 734 00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:39,040 Speaker 2: So really it's like if you can learn your coremones 735 00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:42,960 Speaker 2: and reprogram them, learn your needs, express your needs to 736 00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,720 Speaker 2: other people, emotionally regulate, and have good boundaries. It sounds 737 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:47,680 Speaker 2: like five like things that take a lot of time, 738 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:51,000 Speaker 2: but really it's like ninety days for people to really 739 00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:54,000 Speaker 2: do the reprogramming. Do like a little breathwork exercise in 740 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:56,560 Speaker 2: the morning, you're regulating your nervous system, and then go 741 00:32:56,600 --> 00:32:59,120 Speaker 2: into your life and learn to understand your needs and 742 00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:01,360 Speaker 2: communicate them to peace and set your boundaries and really 743 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,280 Speaker 2: like just conditioning that for ninety days, we'll see people 744 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:06,080 Speaker 2: really move into being securely attached. 745 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, because you know, what you're just saying reminds me 746 00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,120 Speaker 3: of the friends I was talking about, where if they're 747 00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:13,760 Speaker 3: used to being in you know, similar relationships where it's 748 00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:16,720 Speaker 3: actually quite painful. The problem is even when a man 749 00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:20,640 Speaker 3: comes along that is completely different and possibly a secure man. 750 00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 3: They find it disturbing and they can't even appreciate the 751 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:31,960 Speaker 3: man who is secure, communicating, stable, And so it's almost 752 00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:35,160 Speaker 3: like you lose out on these opportunities to have because 753 00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:37,360 Speaker 3: they're always thinking, Oh, I just need to find that guy, 754 00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 3: that guy that makes me feel secure, the guy that 755 00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:43,520 Speaker 3: makes me feel like it's all going to be okay. 756 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:45,880 Speaker 3: But the problem is you find that and then it's boring. 757 00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:49,680 Speaker 3: And you find that, and then it's suddenly like, oh, 758 00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:50,840 Speaker 3: but what else do I do? 759 00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:51,120 Speaker 4: Now? 760 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:54,120 Speaker 3: This is I'm just bored and I don't know how 761 00:33:54,160 --> 00:33:56,960 Speaker 3: to react to this. And so it's almost an unfair 762 00:33:57,320 --> 00:33:59,680 Speaker 3: position that you're putting the other person in because you 763 00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:03,080 Speaker 3: have and you're not ready to receive that yet. And 764 00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:05,360 Speaker 3: so what you were talking about it just kind of 765 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:08,200 Speaker 3: makes it. It's almost like the work that has to 766 00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:10,160 Speaker 3: be done before an exam, right, you have to do 767 00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:13,160 Speaker 3: the work that it takes to accept the goodness that 768 00:34:13,200 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 3: comes into your life if you've been in a position 769 00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:17,960 Speaker 3: that's used to not receiving that exactly. 770 00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 2: And like, it's so hilarious that you said this because 771 00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:22,560 Speaker 2: I just recorded a YouTube video. It hasn't come out yet, 772 00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:25,080 Speaker 2: And it's about how if you're not secure, you'll often 773 00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:29,160 Speaker 2: find secure people boring. And and because in our so 774 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:31,800 Speaker 2: we do these like programs in the personal development school 775 00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:33,480 Speaker 2: and people all the time. So we'll do like these 776 00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:35,760 Speaker 2: daily webinars and people will come in and type stuff 777 00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:37,400 Speaker 2: and all the time. Like I was like, I have 778 00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:39,200 Speaker 2: to make a video about this and address it because 779 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:41,759 Speaker 2: so often people will literally be in there and they'll 780 00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:44,640 Speaker 2: be like, hey, I'm like seeing the secure person, but 781 00:34:44,719 --> 00:34:46,759 Speaker 2: I don't know, like I feel like it's kind of boring. 782 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:49,319 Speaker 1: All the time, like just non stop. And so you 783 00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:49,759 Speaker 1: nailed it. 784 00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,840 Speaker 2: And it's because if your subconscious comfort zone and I 785 00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:54,920 Speaker 2: actually had that experience firsthand when I was younger and 786 00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:57,560 Speaker 2: dating when I was not securely attached, and because my 787 00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:01,080 Speaker 2: subconscious comfort zone was chaos, I was attracted to chaos, 788 00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:03,440 Speaker 2: and anybody who's gonna make me feel calm instead of chaotic, 789 00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:05,640 Speaker 2: I would reject because it was not familiar. 790 00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:07,040 Speaker 1: And even though it's. 791 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:10,640 Speaker 2: Like totally backwards, I would perceive that as not safe because. 792 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:12,600 Speaker 1: I'm not used to it. And so it's like we want. 793 00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:14,960 Speaker 2: To go back to what's familiar, but sometimes that's not 794 00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:16,840 Speaker 2: the actual thing. That helps benefit us. 795 00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:19,799 Speaker 3: Yeah, and they're not safe is because you're not used 796 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:22,560 Speaker 3: to having to have someone that doesn't respond in ups 797 00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:24,440 Speaker 3: and downs. And I think that's that's what it is. 798 00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:26,840 Speaker 3: It's like the adrenaline rush, right. I think about it, 799 00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:29,200 Speaker 3: even with friends who go on tour and they're on 800 00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:31,760 Speaker 3: you know, on stages, or they used to people screaming 801 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:34,800 Speaker 3: their name and they're so used to this high high 802 00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:38,919 Speaker 3: that can't be experienced anywhere else, and so everything else 803 00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:42,080 Speaker 3: feels so dull and so boring. And in the same way, 804 00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:44,920 Speaker 3: it's like if you're used to this pining of oh 805 00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:46,640 Speaker 3: my gosh, when is he gonna talk to me again? 806 00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,319 Speaker 3: Or oh my goodness, he's so angry with me right now, 807 00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:51,000 Speaker 3: but eventually you know it's gonna get better, and then 808 00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:52,480 Speaker 3: it's gonna get worse, and then it's gonna get better, 809 00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:54,520 Speaker 3: and then it's gonna get worse. It's this, You're on 810 00:35:54,520 --> 00:35:57,960 Speaker 3: a roller coaster with adrenaline over and over again, and 811 00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:01,600 Speaker 3: so when there's no adrenaline rush in that way, you 812 00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:04,280 Speaker 3: start to think this is really boring. 813 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:05,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. 814 00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:07,880 Speaker 2: And something else that I found to be so like 815 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:10,600 Speaker 2: useful and honestly is kind of is I don't want 816 00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:13,160 Speaker 2: to say like sad, but it's so important to recognize 817 00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:15,560 Speaker 2: this is that every relationship as well, it. 818 00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:16,440 Speaker 1: Has six stages. 819 00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:18,719 Speaker 2: So this was originally based off the work of doctor 820 00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:20,960 Speaker 2: Susan Johnson, but I sort of adapted over the years. 821 00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:23,120 Speaker 2: The first stage is the dating stage. It's like our 822 00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:24,960 Speaker 2: betting stage. We're supposed to see if somebody is a 823 00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:27,439 Speaker 2: good fit. Then we go into the honeymoon stage, which 824 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,040 Speaker 2: is like the rose colored glasses that like. The dating 825 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:32,879 Speaker 2: stage usually lasts zero to six months, honeymoon stage another 826 00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:34,880 Speaker 2: year or so, sometimes up to a year and a half. 827 00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:37,719 Speaker 2: Then we go into the power struggle stage. I can't 828 00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:39,680 Speaker 2: tell you how many times I would have clients come 829 00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:41,520 Speaker 2: in when I was running my practice and they would 830 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:44,719 Speaker 2: be like they would be like, I married my wife 831 00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:48,359 Speaker 2: at a year. We moved kind of quickly, and then 832 00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:50,200 Speaker 2: as soon as we got married, she turned into a monster. 833 00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:52,279 Speaker 2: Like I would hear a story after a story like this, 834 00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,080 Speaker 2: and it was like, no, no, no, you just it 835 00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:55,799 Speaker 2: wasn't like she was trying to bait you to get 836 00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:58,080 Speaker 2: married and then become someone else. It's just that you're 837 00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:00,960 Speaker 2: in the power struggle stage now, and if we make 838 00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:02,600 Speaker 2: it out of the power struggle stage, we go into 839 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:05,680 Speaker 2: the security, commitment and bliss stages. But and the bliss 840 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:08,280 Speaker 2: stage is like the honeymoon stage, but you deeply know somebody, 841 00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:10,440 Speaker 2: you really let them in, you know their fears and flaws, 842 00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:12,200 Speaker 2: and you've accepted each other's and there's like a lot 843 00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:15,040 Speaker 2: more communication and openness. And that's where we're trying to 844 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,640 Speaker 2: get to. But most people who are insecurely attached, they 845 00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:20,759 Speaker 2: go dating stage, honeymoon stage, power struggle stage, break up, 846 00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:24,560 Speaker 2: start again. Oh so they also don't realize that, like 847 00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:27,880 Speaker 2: love isn't supposed to be the high of the honeymoon 848 00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:29,880 Speaker 2: stage or the low of the power struggle and they 849 00:37:29,960 --> 00:37:32,320 Speaker 2: keep trying to like keep the highs and the lows alive, 850 00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:35,040 Speaker 2: because what you'll find is, if you make it out 851 00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:37,319 Speaker 2: of the power struggle stage, love is less about like 852 00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:39,560 Speaker 2: the highs and lows of almost like that pleasure seeking, 853 00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:43,040 Speaker 2: and more about this really deep fulfillment and that only 854 00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:45,439 Speaker 2: happens when we build those deeper roots. And when people 855 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:48,120 Speaker 2: don't realize that that's how it works, and they don't 856 00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:50,200 Speaker 2: know their attachment style, it's like we go in blind 857 00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:52,800 Speaker 2: to love and relationships and it keeps us so easily 858 00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:55,879 Speaker 2: stuck with the wrong expectations or rules for love. 859 00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:58,440 Speaker 3: One of my best friends is exactly like this, and 860 00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:00,799 Speaker 3: she'll know when she's listening to this the butec she. 861 00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:01,239 Speaker 4: In my mind. 862 00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:04,520 Speaker 3: But that's our conversation over and over again. She keeps saying, Oh, 863 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,120 Speaker 3: you know, I wanted to feel like it felt when 864 00:38:07,120 --> 00:38:09,839 Speaker 3: I was really when I was younger and dating in relationships, 865 00:38:09,880 --> 00:38:12,440 Speaker 3: Like when I'm meeting people, it doesn't feel that exciting anymore. 866 00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:14,359 Speaker 4: And it doesn't. And I was like, but all those 867 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:16,400 Speaker 4: people you broke up with, so there was a reason 868 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:18,000 Speaker 4: that that didn't work out. 869 00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:22,440 Speaker 3: But she's constantly seeking this, like she's like, what about 870 00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:24,359 Speaker 3: the butterflies and the excitement. I was like, you still 871 00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:27,520 Speaker 3: feel that, but it just feels it's a different type, 872 00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:29,920 Speaker 3: Like the excitement is different, but for a good in 873 00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:32,359 Speaker 3: a good way. Yes, the butterflies are there, but it's 874 00:38:32,400 --> 00:38:35,200 Speaker 3: not as intense. And I think it's the intensity that 875 00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:38,719 Speaker 3: people are so used to that intensity of emotion, and 876 00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 3: it's almost like you just want to feel something, even 877 00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:43,200 Speaker 3: if it's even if it's a bad feeling, you just 878 00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:44,680 Speaker 3: want to make sure you're feeling. 879 00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:45,360 Speaker 1: Yep, totally. 880 00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:47,319 Speaker 2: And we get to we get addicted to the neural 881 00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:49,239 Speaker 2: chemistry of our court wounds. When they're up, we get 882 00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:51,880 Speaker 2: not just cortisol but also dopamine. And it's actually very 883 00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:54,640 Speaker 2: similar neurochemically to what people get addicted to when they're gambling. 884 00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:57,920 Speaker 1: And so yeah, and like the intermittent. 885 00:38:58,200 --> 00:38:59,200 Speaker 4: So much sense. 886 00:38:59,719 --> 00:39:02,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so it's there for that reason. 887 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:04,560 Speaker 2: But I would say, and I'm curious, like you probably 888 00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:07,160 Speaker 2: noticed this, but I would say, you know, we can 889 00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:09,600 Speaker 2: sort of share about this as people, probably for anybody 890 00:39:09,600 --> 00:39:11,960 Speaker 2: who hasn't had this experience, but I would see this 891 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:14,200 Speaker 2: with tons of people, both in my practice, through our 892 00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:15,680 Speaker 2: programs and people. 893 00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:17,280 Speaker 1: It's like pleasure. 894 00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:19,319 Speaker 2: Seeking can only go like this high and this low, 895 00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:22,359 Speaker 2: but fulfillment can outgrow the peaks of pleasure, like when 896 00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:25,279 Speaker 2: you have such deep fulfillment and really deep connection and 897 00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:29,120 Speaker 2: peace and appreciation and gratitude like all of those things, 898 00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:33,680 Speaker 2: they grow slower, like you know, but over time, the 899 00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:37,080 Speaker 2: depth of fulfillment won't like the pleasure of like the 900 00:39:37,160 --> 00:39:39,680 Speaker 2: roller coaster doesn't hold a candle to how fulfilled you feel. 901 00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:42,600 Speaker 2: But people, because they're not getting the opportunity to go 902 00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:44,400 Speaker 2: through the stages and get to that point, have no 903 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,799 Speaker 2: reference or contacts, and so they keep seeking out those 904 00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:48,600 Speaker 2: highs and lows. 905 00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:51,319 Speaker 3: Yeah, I always just think, why should the person that 906 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:54,960 Speaker 3: I'm spending my life with make me feel the same 907 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:57,880 Speaker 3: way I feel when I'm in the most anxious stages 908 00:39:57,920 --> 00:39:59,760 Speaker 3: of my life, like the things that scam me the most. 909 00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:03,439 Speaker 3: If you're feeling the same way with your partner as 910 00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:05,720 Speaker 3: you do doing the things that scare you the most 911 00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:08,719 Speaker 3: on a daily basis, that can't like. 912 00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:10,000 Speaker 4: That doesn't make sense. 913 00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:11,359 Speaker 3: And I think about it all the time, like, oh 914 00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:14,160 Speaker 3: if I if like I the way that it should 915 00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:16,960 Speaker 3: be is my nervous system feels soothed when I'm with 916 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:20,680 Speaker 3: my person, like my I feel at ease and calm. 917 00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:22,960 Speaker 3: But again, it's what you're saying, it's when that's not 918 00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:28,799 Speaker 3: your normality. It feels like being in anxiety feels so 919 00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:31,680 Speaker 3: much better for you than being in a state of 920 00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:32,239 Speaker 3: calm and. 921 00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:33,320 Speaker 1: Ease, exactly. 922 00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:36,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of people who who I work 923 00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:39,880 Speaker 2: with in the school and they come in and they say, Hey, 924 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:43,719 Speaker 2: I've become securely attached and I'm dating somebody now, and 925 00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:46,120 Speaker 2: I can't tell the difference if I'm if I don't 926 00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:48,280 Speaker 2: like them, or if attachment style is just not activated. 927 00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:50,840 Speaker 2: And I'm like, you're gonna know if you don't like somebody, 928 00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:52,920 Speaker 2: and you'll still have the butterflies, like you' still have 929 00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:54,600 Speaker 2: those good feelings and like a little bit of nerves 930 00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:57,319 Speaker 2: if you're interested in somebody, in that excitement, but it 931 00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:00,400 Speaker 2: won't There's something called like your attachment style being at debated, 932 00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:02,799 Speaker 2: which is when your wounds are on, and a lot 933 00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:08,160 Speaker 2: of people actually misperceive when they're not securely attached that oh, 934 00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:11,040 Speaker 2: my wounds are activated, I'm feeling really anxious or I'm 935 00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:14,200 Speaker 2: feeling really avoidant or stress, and that must mean I 936 00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:16,120 Speaker 2: like this person, And it's like, no, no, no, there's 937 00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:19,439 Speaker 2: a difference between infatuation and a good, healthy, rooted way 938 00:41:19,560 --> 00:41:22,600 Speaker 2: versus your attachment style being in that chaotic space. 939 00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:24,919 Speaker 3: Yeah, and when I was reading your book, you talked 940 00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:28,400 Speaker 3: about in anxious anxious attachment, you were talking about the 941 00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:31,759 Speaker 3: difference between sacrifice and compromise. I would love for you 942 00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:33,160 Speaker 3: to go into that a little bit because I found 943 00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:34,120 Speaker 3: that really interesting. 944 00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:37,080 Speaker 2: Yes, it's a really important concept for people who are 945 00:41:37,120 --> 00:41:39,600 Speaker 2: either anxiously attached or even just like leaning anxious, like fearful, 946 00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:43,360 Speaker 2: wouldn't have that anxious side as well, so generally what 947 00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:45,720 Speaker 2: happens is we often tend to go into a space 948 00:41:45,719 --> 00:41:49,120 Speaker 2: of thinking, Okay, I'm going to do what I think 949 00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:50,160 Speaker 2: you would want me to do. 950 00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:52,480 Speaker 1: I'm not going to communicate about it. I'm going to 951 00:41:52,520 --> 00:41:53,560 Speaker 1: try to mind read you. 952 00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:56,440 Speaker 2: And a lot of times, like the deeper level of 953 00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:59,120 Speaker 2: this is actually someone called covert contracts, where we basically 954 00:41:59,160 --> 00:42:02,120 Speaker 2: think I'm going to kind of buy my future favors 955 00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:05,319 Speaker 2: for you through doing a bunch of things now, and 956 00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:07,440 Speaker 2: we track it and we're like, I'm gonna do these 957 00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:08,920 Speaker 2: five things, so when I need to ask you for 958 00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:11,880 Speaker 2: this thing next week, you're going to owe me. And 959 00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,680 Speaker 2: this is like often behavior we learn when we grow 960 00:42:14,760 --> 00:42:16,600 Speaker 2: up in a household where we're taught we have to 961 00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:18,840 Speaker 2: people please or we can't really be ourselves or we 962 00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:21,400 Speaker 2: can't communicate about our needs or get them met. And 963 00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:25,720 Speaker 2: so that's sacrificing, that's going against ourselves to please others, 964 00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:29,520 Speaker 2: and it will always end in resentment. Compromise is we 965 00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:31,960 Speaker 2: learn to communicate our needs openly as a couple or 966 00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:33,920 Speaker 2: as a unit. Even like let's say you and I 967 00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:37,200 Speaker 2: are living together, we're super close friends, Like even in 968 00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:40,440 Speaker 2: that kind of relationship, it can be with friendships, family relationships. 969 00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:43,879 Speaker 2: We want to be fully transparent and be able to say, hey, 970 00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:46,040 Speaker 2: here's what I am available for and these are my 971 00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:48,960 Speaker 2: needs and what are yours, And compromise means we actually 972 00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:51,879 Speaker 2: both honestly put our cards on the table and then 973 00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,640 Speaker 2: we work through define common ground. And what that does 974 00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:57,560 Speaker 2: is it prevents her from being resentment and also both 975 00:42:57,640 --> 00:42:59,680 Speaker 2: people feel seen and hurt. Like when we actually get 976 00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:02,719 Speaker 2: into relationships where we share our needs with somebody and 977 00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,400 Speaker 2: they hear us out and they meet them and vice versa, 978 00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:07,480 Speaker 2: and we know that we can talk those things through. 979 00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:10,600 Speaker 2: There's such a deep sense of fulfillment and safety in that. 980 00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:13,600 Speaker 2: And so compromise means we can actually be honest and 981 00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:16,879 Speaker 2: authentic and truthful with the people closest to us. And 982 00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:19,759 Speaker 2: when we do make those compromises, we take ourselves into 983 00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,040 Speaker 2: consideration in the process. So I have been given an 984 00:43:22,040 --> 00:43:24,960 Speaker 2: analogy for people too who are newer to this concept, 985 00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:29,000 Speaker 2: where let's say my neighbor says tays, I want you 986 00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:32,120 Speaker 2: to come over on Friday, and let's say it's Thursday evening, 987 00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:33,719 Speaker 2: and they're like, I need you to help me move. 988 00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:36,040 Speaker 2: I'm moving, I'm packing all my stuff. Can you come 989 00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:37,799 Speaker 2: over at six pm and help me till two in 990 00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:40,320 Speaker 2: the morning. You know, let's say I love my neighbor 991 00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:42,040 Speaker 2: and I really want to help them because I really 992 00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:44,720 Speaker 2: care about them. I'm not going to sit there and go, okay, 993 00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:47,200 Speaker 2: two in the morning if that's not something that you know, 994 00:43:47,239 --> 00:43:49,279 Speaker 2: if I have a busy Saturday the next day, or 995 00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:51,239 Speaker 2: if that's something we're at the end of a busy week, 996 00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:53,319 Speaker 2: I'm not available for that. So what I would do 997 00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,839 Speaker 2: is I would take myself into consideration and think and 998 00:43:56,960 --> 00:43:59,120 Speaker 2: feel into myself and be like, well, what am I 999 00:43:59,160 --> 00:44:01,440 Speaker 2: available for? Yeah, and maybe I say, you know what, 1000 00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:03,400 Speaker 2: I can't come that late, but I can come at 1001 00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:06,279 Speaker 2: six o'clock till eight o'clock or six until ten, or 1002 00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:08,279 Speaker 2: I'll come at six until eight o'clock and I'll cook 1003 00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:10,600 Speaker 2: you some dinner and bring it over too. And so 1004 00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:14,200 Speaker 2: that's also part of the construct of making compromises is 1005 00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:17,400 Speaker 2: we don't lose our frame of reference being attuned to 1006 00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:21,279 Speaker 2: ourselves when we make those decisions. And so because we 1007 00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:25,080 Speaker 2: do that, we never feel resentful because we're actually acting 1008 00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:27,640 Speaker 2: in relationships in an authentic way based on our trips. 1009 00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:29,960 Speaker 3: And when I was reading through your book, anyone listening 1010 00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:32,800 Speaker 3: to you now. When I first started dating my husband, 1011 00:44:32,840 --> 00:44:35,359 Speaker 3: he was definitely a secure and I think I was 1012 00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:38,840 Speaker 3: a dismissive avoidant, and it was It's been such an 1013 00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:41,360 Speaker 3: interesting journey because he's I mean, he's always held space 1014 00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:43,560 Speaker 3: to help me grow and like all the things that 1015 00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:45,480 Speaker 3: you were saying, I'm like, gosh, you really did do that. 1016 00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:49,600 Speaker 3: Like he's been secure since I think since we started dating, 1017 00:44:49,640 --> 00:44:54,080 Speaker 3: and he's remained that way throughout our relationship. But he's 1018 00:44:54,120 --> 00:44:57,080 Speaker 3: also the type of person who's kept who's kept this 1019 00:44:57,160 --> 00:44:59,919 Speaker 3: space open for me to have my journey to grow 1020 00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:02,960 Speaker 3: through that. And that makes such a difference because I 1021 00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:05,320 Speaker 3: imagine it can be very frustrating for someone who is 1022 00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:09,440 Speaker 3: as secure and having someone who is constantly battling certain 1023 00:45:09,480 --> 00:45:13,319 Speaker 3: things and battling against him when he's not fighting against me, 1024 00:45:13,440 --> 00:45:15,320 Speaker 3: do you know what I mean? Like I he's always 1025 00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:19,799 Speaker 3: he's always there to hold the space, and I'm fighting him, 1026 00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:22,200 Speaker 3: but against things that I've had from my. 1027 00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:23,080 Speaker 4: Past, not him. 1028 00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:25,560 Speaker 3: So he's like, I'll carry your bags, and I'm like, 1029 00:45:25,600 --> 00:45:26,560 Speaker 3: why should you carry my bag? 1030 00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:27,520 Speaker 4: I can carry my own bag. 1031 00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,000 Speaker 3: And he's doing out of love, not because he thinks 1032 00:45:30,040 --> 00:45:32,440 Speaker 3: I can't look after myself. But I have a wound 1033 00:45:32,440 --> 00:45:34,960 Speaker 3: that feels like, oh, people think I can't look after myself, 1034 00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:37,040 Speaker 3: that I'm that I'm all over the place and I'm 1035 00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:39,439 Speaker 3: going to forget things, and so no, you can't hold 1036 00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:41,920 Speaker 3: my bags. I can look I can hold my own bags. 1037 00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:44,680 Speaker 3: And so we've gone through our and slowly as I 1038 00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:46,239 Speaker 3: was reading through book, I was like, gosh, I really 1039 00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:48,200 Speaker 3: did do those things when we started dating where I 1040 00:45:48,239 --> 00:45:51,160 Speaker 3: would be so I'll be fighting a cause, but the 1041 00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:53,440 Speaker 3: cause wasn't him. It was it was me trying to 1042 00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,919 Speaker 3: fight something of other people in my past, so other 1043 00:45:55,960 --> 00:45:58,320 Speaker 3: things that I'd been through, but it was all coming 1044 00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:00,640 Speaker 3: out through the way he was treating me in such 1045 00:46:00,680 --> 00:46:03,520 Speaker 3: a sweet way, and I was like, no, you're trying 1046 00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:07,680 Speaker 3: to be loving. No, I don't want it. I totally understand. 1047 00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:09,920 Speaker 2: So my husband, when I met my husband was dismissive 1048 00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:12,960 Speaker 2: avoidant as well, and so I like very much understand him, 1049 00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:16,239 Speaker 2: and he's been amazing dismissible avoidance. Like if they show 1050 00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:18,719 Speaker 2: up and they like do the work and are mindful, 1051 00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:21,480 Speaker 2: and like they're so sweet because they're like so empathetic 1052 00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:23,520 Speaker 2: and they're very caring, and it takes them a little 1053 00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:26,920 Speaker 2: bit to feel safe, being vulnerable enough to express it. 1054 00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:30,759 Speaker 2: But on the inside that's really a part of who 1055 00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:33,400 Speaker 2: they are. And so what's so beautiful about their journey 1056 00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:35,719 Speaker 2: to being secure? And I saw this so much in 1057 00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:38,080 Speaker 2: my husband is like as you sort of peel back 1058 00:46:38,120 --> 00:46:39,960 Speaker 2: the layers and as he felt safer and safer to 1059 00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:41,839 Speaker 2: like kind of drop his guard and like let me in, 1060 00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:47,719 Speaker 2: it's like this very like beautiful soul. Yeah, And so 1061 00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:50,080 Speaker 2: it's so cool to see that journey too, And it's 1062 00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:51,200 Speaker 2: beautiful that you've been through that. 1063 00:46:51,280 --> 00:46:51,600 Speaker 4: Y definite. 1064 00:46:51,640 --> 00:46:53,480 Speaker 3: I think I am still still going through it, but 1065 00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:57,240 Speaker 3: I definitely have improved. Another part that you spoke about 1066 00:46:57,320 --> 00:47:00,280 Speaker 3: was the concept of ameshment, and you know, being from 1067 00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:05,279 Speaker 3: Indian culture, it's something which is quite normal in our 1068 00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:10,279 Speaker 3: culture to constantly put what your ideas and constructs are 1069 00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:12,759 Speaker 3: of what your child is and what you want them 1070 00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:15,840 Speaker 3: to be based on your own fears or own insecret. 1071 00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:17,480 Speaker 4: You know, my parents came as immigrants to. 1072 00:47:19,239 --> 00:47:22,000 Speaker 3: The UK, and so a lot of what their traumas 1073 00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:25,040 Speaker 3: had that they'd gone through was so much with financial security, 1074 00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:28,200 Speaker 3: making sure you get the grades, making sure you know 1075 00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:30,719 Speaker 3: you have stability in your life because they lacked so 1076 00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:33,480 Speaker 3: much stability growing up, and so it all made. 1077 00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:33,880 Speaker 4: Sense to me. 1078 00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:37,160 Speaker 3: But I could see now looking back how a lot 1079 00:47:37,160 --> 00:47:40,280 Speaker 3: of the emphasis and what they put emphasis on also 1080 00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:45,320 Speaker 3: kind of I then carry with me through my life. 1081 00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:48,200 Speaker 3: But their intentions were so sweet because of what they'd 1082 00:47:48,200 --> 00:47:51,600 Speaker 3: been through. But at the same time, it put a 1083 00:47:51,640 --> 00:47:53,960 Speaker 3: lot of pressure on me in areas which I wasn't 1084 00:47:53,960 --> 00:47:56,040 Speaker 3: thriving at and therefore felt like a lot of my 1085 00:47:56,160 --> 00:47:58,960 Speaker 3: value was based on those things, and when I couldn't 1086 00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:00,799 Speaker 3: perform it those things, if felt like it took away 1087 00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:03,960 Speaker 3: my value, if that made sense. And so if my 1088 00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:05,560 Speaker 3: parents are listening, I love you and you did the 1089 00:48:05,560 --> 00:48:09,640 Speaker 3: best thing, and like the incredible parents, But traumas. 1090 00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:11,359 Speaker 4: Just get passed on in that way. And so. 1091 00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:15,240 Speaker 3: The ameshment, when I read it, I was like, wow, 1092 00:48:15,400 --> 00:48:17,479 Speaker 3: we have to learn. Even reading it as someone who 1093 00:48:17,680 --> 00:48:20,600 Speaker 3: eventually wants to be a parent, I was thinking it's 1094 00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:22,560 Speaker 3: so easy. I was, you know, I want my child 1095 00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:24,000 Speaker 3: to do this, and I want him to be like 1096 00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:25,960 Speaker 3: this or her to be like this, and then you're 1097 00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:29,200 Speaker 3: constantly building these constructs for them that they haven't signed 1098 00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:29,799 Speaker 3: up for yet. 1099 00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:32,280 Speaker 4: Yes, exactly, could you explain ameshment? 1100 00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:34,840 Speaker 3: For anybody who doesn't know, and how that can affect 1101 00:48:34,840 --> 00:48:37,720 Speaker 3: someone's attachment style and going through their life. 1102 00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:39,239 Speaker 1: Yes, it's such an important topic. 1103 00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:40,840 Speaker 2: I love that you shared that too, because it's like, 1104 00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:42,480 Speaker 2: so I think it's so nice for people and they 1105 00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:44,840 Speaker 2: listen to hear these like real life examples and to 1106 00:48:44,880 --> 00:48:47,160 Speaker 2: your point, like when people are conditioned to have an 1107 00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:51,439 Speaker 2: insecure attachment style, parents either already have that attachment style 1108 00:48:51,480 --> 00:48:53,640 Speaker 2: themselves and so it's just being passed along because there 1109 00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:56,680 Speaker 2: are rules subconsciously about love or what we passed down, 1110 00:48:57,600 --> 00:48:59,680 Speaker 2: or it's people who think that they're doing the best 1111 00:48:59,719 --> 00:49:02,200 Speaker 2: thing their child infinitely, like I can't tell them how 1112 00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:04,520 Speaker 2: you tell you how many times I would see clients 1113 00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:07,719 Speaker 2: who were parents who would be like, oh my gosh, 1114 00:49:07,760 --> 00:49:09,799 Speaker 2: I've learned about this attachment style stuff. I realized I 1115 00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:13,160 Speaker 2: was so tough on my children. But my relationship to 1116 00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:15,560 Speaker 2: why I was tough on my children was that I 1117 00:49:15,600 --> 00:49:17,160 Speaker 2: thought I was preparing them the beast that I could 1118 00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:21,280 Speaker 2: for the world exactly, And so it's never like anybody's fault. 1119 00:49:21,320 --> 00:49:24,279 Speaker 2: It's just a process of recognition and awareness and how 1120 00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:27,000 Speaker 2: we can do that in our work to heal what's necessary. 1121 00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:29,960 Speaker 3: So my mom would always whenever we talk about therapy 1122 00:49:30,040 --> 00:49:31,920 Speaker 3: or things that we've been through in childhood, and you know, 1123 00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:33,200 Speaker 3: I loved my childhood growing up. 1124 00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:34,239 Speaker 4: My parents were phenomenal. 1125 00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:36,279 Speaker 3: But whenever we talk about little things that we think 1126 00:49:36,280 --> 00:49:38,239 Speaker 3: have affected us, she's like, does that mean I wasn't 1127 00:49:38,239 --> 00:49:38,640 Speaker 3: a good mom? 1128 00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:39,960 Speaker 4: I was like, it's not that at all. 1129 00:49:40,520 --> 00:49:42,720 Speaker 3: You know, I can imagine why that must hurt parents 1130 00:49:42,719 --> 00:49:45,279 Speaker 3: so much as well, to know that they've created, you know, 1131 00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:48,320 Speaker 3: ripple effects in their children or anything that's been traumatic 1132 00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:50,400 Speaker 3: in their child. But it's also not a reflection of 1133 00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:53,040 Speaker 3: being a bad parent. Like it's you're not a bad 1134 00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:55,640 Speaker 3: parent because you went through trauma that you've passed on 1135 00:49:55,680 --> 00:49:57,240 Speaker 3: to a child, Like that doesn't make you a bad 1136 00:49:57,280 --> 00:50:00,200 Speaker 3: parent in any way. It just makes you human and 1137 00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:03,400 Speaker 3: like not a superhero that has healed and done everything 1138 00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:07,040 Speaker 3: that you you know, it's it's so unrealistic to not 1139 00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:10,120 Speaker 3: carry certain things with you through So for any parent 1140 00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:12,560 Speaker 3: this is thing too. It's like, just because good child 1141 00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:15,799 Speaker 3: has carried anything with them through through you doesn't make 1142 00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:16,680 Speaker 3: you a bad parent. 1143 00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:18,320 Speaker 1: Exact yeah, exactly. 1144 00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:21,600 Speaker 2: And it's so common to have these different attachment challenges, 1145 00:50:21,640 --> 00:50:23,799 Speaker 2: Like it's it's not this and it's also not like 1146 00:50:24,160 --> 00:50:26,880 Speaker 2: a diagnosis like you're stuck with it forever. It's a 1147 00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:30,720 Speaker 2: set of patterns that we have in relationships. So yeah, absolutely, 1148 00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:34,239 Speaker 2: But to answer your question about enmashment, so basically, en 1149 00:50:34,239 --> 00:50:37,160 Speaker 2: meashment is that we will emotionally take on others emotions 1150 00:50:37,160 --> 00:50:39,920 Speaker 2: as if they're ours, and oftentimes we'll follow through with 1151 00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:43,000 Speaker 2: behavior more focused from the outside end rather than the 1152 00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:46,920 Speaker 2: inside out. And this can be common in codependent families. 1153 00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:49,920 Speaker 2: This can be common culturally, absolutely, and some cultures more 1154 00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:52,799 Speaker 2: than others. And this basically teaches us that, like, we 1155 00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:55,800 Speaker 2: are responsible for everybody around us and how they feel. 1156 00:50:56,360 --> 00:50:59,200 Speaker 2: And there's there's something called directed meashment or indirect so 1157 00:50:59,280 --> 00:51:02,399 Speaker 2: directed mesh will often be that enmeshment is taught like, 1158 00:51:02,760 --> 00:51:04,960 Speaker 2: let's say you have a brother or a sister and 1159 00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:07,160 Speaker 2: they're going through a hard time. You better skip your 1160 00:51:07,160 --> 00:51:11,120 Speaker 2: soccer game to go be there for your brother because 1161 00:51:11,560 --> 00:51:13,200 Speaker 2: and so you know, there can actually be this like 1162 00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:15,520 Speaker 2: teaching of that. Or you shouldn't go out on Friday 1163 00:51:15,560 --> 00:51:18,960 Speaker 2: with your friends as a teenager because your sibling needs you, 1164 00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:21,319 Speaker 2: And so that's very direct where it's taught, and even 1165 00:51:21,320 --> 00:51:24,360 Speaker 2: negatively reinforced if you're not operating that way. And then 1166 00:51:24,400 --> 00:51:27,319 Speaker 2: there's indirect in meshment, which often happens when we have 1167 00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:31,320 Speaker 2: a child who's in a home where they can't understand 1168 00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:32,880 Speaker 2: what their parents are going through. But it's a very 1169 00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:35,360 Speaker 2: hard time. So I can share a story of a 1170 00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:38,319 Speaker 2: client once and I won't say his name, we'll call 1171 00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:43,560 Speaker 2: him see yes, And he had a single mom and 1172 00:51:43,640 --> 00:51:46,880 Speaker 2: she was extremely depressed, and so he grew up in 1173 00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,280 Speaker 2: a family where he would always see her like sleeping. 1174 00:51:49,480 --> 00:51:51,800 Speaker 2: He always knew something was off and she wasn't okay, 1175 00:51:52,280 --> 00:51:54,040 Speaker 2: and so he would kind of like do extra cooking 1176 00:51:54,120 --> 00:51:55,799 Speaker 2: or cleaning around the house or take a lot on 1177 00:51:56,560 --> 00:51:59,759 Speaker 2: And basically she wasn't like trying to make him take 1178 00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:03,600 Speaker 2: on her emotions, but because he could see her in 1179 00:52:03,680 --> 00:52:07,399 Speaker 2: distress constantly, he would internalize that and worry like, if 1180 00:52:07,440 --> 00:52:09,360 Speaker 2: she's not okay, how am I going to be okay? 1181 00:52:09,360 --> 00:52:11,640 Speaker 2: Because his children, we know that we're dependent on our 1182 00:52:11,680 --> 00:52:15,879 Speaker 2: parents to survive, and so there's this dynamic foster where 1183 00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:19,520 Speaker 2: we can become really afraid if somebody's not okay around us. 1184 00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:21,840 Speaker 2: And so then as adults, we tend to if we 1185 00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:24,840 Speaker 2: come from and mashed backgrounds really take on the feelings 1186 00:52:24,880 --> 00:52:28,080 Speaker 2: of others very quickly, and sometimes that can cause us 1187 00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:29,920 Speaker 2: to like constantly try to get close to them and 1188 00:52:29,960 --> 00:52:31,759 Speaker 2: fix them. Or sometimes we can kind of go through 1189 00:52:31,760 --> 00:52:35,239 Speaker 2: burnout really easily because we're taking so much on, which 1190 00:52:35,280 --> 00:52:37,400 Speaker 2: instead we cope with by kind of pushing away and 1191 00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:40,560 Speaker 2: keeping a distance so that we can just maintain attunement 1192 00:52:40,640 --> 00:52:42,839 Speaker 2: to self and how we actually feel as a means 1193 00:52:42,840 --> 00:52:43,400 Speaker 2: to regulate. 1194 00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:48,560 Speaker 4: Wow, intense, but amazing. Can you be a mix of two? 1195 00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:49,759 Speaker 4: Can you be? 1196 00:52:50,360 --> 00:52:52,480 Speaker 3: I'm assuming when you're secure, you can only be secure, 1197 00:52:52,560 --> 00:52:54,360 Speaker 3: But what about the other three? Can you kind of 1198 00:52:54,480 --> 00:52:56,160 Speaker 3: be a mix of all three of them? 1199 00:52:56,360 --> 00:52:59,239 Speaker 2: Yes, So you can actually like have what we call 1200 00:52:59,239 --> 00:53:01,759 Speaker 2: a primary and secondary attachment style. It's basically that you'll 1201 00:53:01,800 --> 00:53:04,400 Speaker 2: learn different patterns, so you're usually rooted in one. So 1202 00:53:04,440 --> 00:53:06,520 Speaker 2: you can be secure with like anxious edges, like a 1203 00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:08,520 Speaker 2: little bit of anxious, do you know if that comes up, 1204 00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:10,640 Speaker 2: but it's not dominantly how you're going to show up. 1205 00:53:10,640 --> 00:53:12,960 Speaker 2: You'll still communicate your needs, you have a little less 1206 00:53:12,960 --> 00:53:15,840 Speaker 2: core wounds things like that. You can also be fearful 1207 00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:18,960 Speaker 2: avoidant leaning more anxious, or fear of avoidant leaning more 1208 00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:22,840 Speaker 2: dismissive or dismissive with a little bit of fearful avoidance secondary. 1209 00:53:22,880 --> 00:53:24,239 Speaker 2: So you've got like a little bit of hot and 1210 00:53:24,280 --> 00:53:26,759 Speaker 2: cold or anxious leaning a little fearful avoidant. But what 1211 00:53:26,760 --> 00:53:28,680 Speaker 2: we don't see is a jump from one to the other. 1212 00:53:28,800 --> 00:53:32,480 Speaker 2: So you won't generally see a dismissive avoidant person who's 1213 00:53:32,520 --> 00:53:36,480 Speaker 2: then you know, anxious as their secondary. And one of 1214 00:53:36,520 --> 00:53:38,799 Speaker 2: the big differences I think that's important to note is 1215 00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:40,280 Speaker 2: it's it's based on how you behave. 1216 00:53:41,280 --> 00:53:43,600 Speaker 4: So I was gonna ask, like, what are these symptoms? 1217 00:53:43,680 --> 00:53:47,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, So dismissive avoidance sometimes will say to 1218 00:53:47,040 --> 00:53:48,880 Speaker 2: me like, oh, but I feel anxious. Sometimes, like if 1219 00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:51,480 Speaker 2: I ask someone out and I'm waiting to hear back 1220 00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:53,080 Speaker 2: from them, I still feel anxious. And it's like, well, 1221 00:53:53,120 --> 00:53:57,120 Speaker 2: dismissive avoidance aren't robots, but you're you're still going to 1222 00:53:57,200 --> 00:54:00,160 Speaker 2: feel human feelings. But generally what you'll see is when 1223 00:54:00,160 --> 00:54:02,520 Speaker 2: dismissed the winds feel a little anxious, they'll tend to deactivate, 1224 00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:06,080 Speaker 2: they'll tend to try to minimize their need for attachment as. 1225 00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:06,880 Speaker 1: A means of self soothing. 1226 00:54:06,880 --> 00:54:08,319 Speaker 2: So they'll be like, well, if it doesn't work, it 1227 00:54:08,320 --> 00:54:11,240 Speaker 2: doesn't really matter, or maybe they weren't anyway. 1228 00:54:12,520 --> 00:54:16,880 Speaker 4: Do you say that's the dismissing yes, yes, yeah, so 1229 00:54:17,280 --> 00:54:17,560 Speaker 4: you can. 1230 00:54:17,520 --> 00:54:19,680 Speaker 2: Still feel anxious, but your way of coping with that 1231 00:54:19,760 --> 00:54:21,760 Speaker 2: anxiety will be to try it down exactly. 1232 00:54:22,040 --> 00:54:23,560 Speaker 3: So that's how you feel, say, want to talk about it, 1233 00:54:23,800 --> 00:54:25,360 Speaker 3: I don't want to. I don't want to hear about it. No, 1234 00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:27,399 Speaker 3: I don't want to discuss what's making me anxious. 1235 00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:28,760 Speaker 4: Right now, because it'll make me more anxious. 1236 00:54:28,760 --> 00:54:30,520 Speaker 1: Exactly exactly. 1237 00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:33,520 Speaker 3: I am. I can be your your what's the word 1238 00:54:34,160 --> 00:54:36,759 Speaker 3: the figure that you can show as a dismissive. 1239 00:54:38,000 --> 00:54:39,400 Speaker 1: I know what you meant, the mascot. 1240 00:54:39,719 --> 00:54:42,839 Speaker 4: They gotta be the mascot, Yeah, for sure. 1241 00:54:42,880 --> 00:54:45,799 Speaker 2: And so that's that's the dismissed avoidant. And then you'll 1242 00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:48,960 Speaker 2: see anxious attachment styles. When they feel anxious, they keep 1243 00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:50,680 Speaker 2: trying to get closer to people, so they'll do the 1244 00:54:50,760 --> 00:54:53,840 Speaker 2: exact opposite. And in fact, if you take an anxious 1245 00:54:53,840 --> 00:54:57,000 Speaker 2: and a dismissive together, it's yeah, it can be so 1246 00:54:57,080 --> 00:54:59,680 Speaker 2: hard because if there's a conflict or an argument, that 1247 00:54:59,800 --> 00:55:02,400 Speaker 2: is what needs usually some time and space to process 1248 00:55:02,400 --> 00:55:03,799 Speaker 2: what they're feeling, to kind of cool off, and then 1249 00:55:03,800 --> 00:55:06,959 Speaker 2: they'll come back to it. But anxious attachments, they they're 1250 00:55:07,160 --> 00:55:09,640 Speaker 2: terrified of time and space, so they're like, no, we 1251 00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:11,440 Speaker 2: need to talk about right now, and then the dismissive 1252 00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:13,719 Speaker 2: is often like, no, I'm not ready to talk about 1253 00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:15,400 Speaker 2: it right now, and then of course we have like 1254 00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:18,839 Speaker 2: all of the unnecessary chaos that ensues until people find 1255 00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:22,240 Speaker 2: the happy medium through compromising, when they know their attachment 1256 00:55:22,280 --> 00:55:23,719 Speaker 2: style and they know how to address these things. 1257 00:55:23,760 --> 00:55:26,000 Speaker 3: Because I imagine, like if you're an anxious attachment person 1258 00:55:26,040 --> 00:55:28,040 Speaker 3: and you're constantly wanting to communicate, but then if you 1259 00:55:28,080 --> 00:55:31,640 Speaker 3: have a dismissive avoidant and they're shutting you down, would 1260 00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:35,200 Speaker 3: the anxious attachment person end up kind of changing their 1261 00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:39,080 Speaker 3: behaviors and how they communicate and almost become a dismissive 1262 00:55:39,080 --> 00:55:43,480 Speaker 3: avoidant as well because they're not given the space to express. 1263 00:55:43,520 --> 00:55:44,279 Speaker 4: Does that make sense? 1264 00:55:44,360 --> 00:55:45,720 Speaker 1: It's such a great question. 1265 00:55:45,840 --> 00:55:48,759 Speaker 2: It's very insightful because what you're saying and what you're 1266 00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:51,759 Speaker 2: getting at too, is like neuroplasticity, Like yeah, basically, if 1267 00:55:51,719 --> 00:55:54,840 Speaker 2: we get around space through repetition and emotion, it happens 1268 00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:57,600 Speaker 2: over and over again, and so yes, in theory, that 1269 00:55:57,640 --> 00:56:01,360 Speaker 2: will happen whoever we're connected to the most, but generally 1270 00:56:01,480 --> 00:56:05,520 Speaker 2: because that sparked from big core wounds, often the core 1271 00:56:05,640 --> 00:56:08,880 Speaker 2: wounds and how they're feeling in that situation instead is 1272 00:56:08,880 --> 00:56:12,319 Speaker 2: what reinforces those feelings. So often what you'll generally see 1273 00:56:12,400 --> 00:56:13,920 Speaker 2: is that they'll just go through a really big power 1274 00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:17,480 Speaker 2: struggle intil the relationship dissolves because the anxious attachment will 1275 00:56:17,560 --> 00:56:19,440 Speaker 2: keep needing to talk in the moment and then dispissa 1276 00:56:19,440 --> 00:56:21,279 Speaker 2: it will be like, oh my goodness, like give me 1277 00:56:21,360 --> 00:56:23,799 Speaker 2: a second, and then they'll go into one room and 1278 00:56:23,800 --> 00:56:25,879 Speaker 2: then the anxious follows them, and then you know, you'll 1279 00:56:25,960 --> 00:56:28,840 Speaker 2: usually see this whole thing unfold or I find. 1280 00:56:28,680 --> 00:56:30,359 Speaker 3: You get shut down, like if you get shut down 1281 00:56:30,440 --> 00:56:33,000 Speaker 3: lots of times, and then eventually you're like, okay, fine, 1282 00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:35,120 Speaker 3: I'm gonna stay quiet. I'm just gonna stay quiet. And 1283 00:56:35,160 --> 00:56:36,799 Speaker 3: then you stay quiet, you stay quiet, you stay quiet. 1284 00:56:36,800 --> 00:56:39,400 Speaker 3: Eventually just blow up and say you're like, actually, I 1285 00:56:39,440 --> 00:56:41,680 Speaker 3: wasn't I wasn't actually trying to avoid it. I was 1286 00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:44,440 Speaker 3: just trying to keep it in exactly, and then you 1287 00:56:44,440 --> 00:56:46,759 Speaker 3: have anxious explosion, yes exactly. 1288 00:56:46,840 --> 00:56:49,720 Speaker 2: And so generally you'll see it like people will try 1289 00:56:49,760 --> 00:56:51,640 Speaker 2: to not have it go that way, but often that 1290 00:56:51,719 --> 00:56:53,920 Speaker 2: will be the output, and then it'll just be like, 1291 00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:56,480 Speaker 2: you know, I would see couples come into our programs 1292 00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:58,120 Speaker 2: and it would just be like they're just arguing all 1293 00:56:58,160 --> 00:57:00,160 Speaker 2: the time, or they're just like back and forth at 1294 00:57:00,200 --> 00:57:02,799 Speaker 2: each other's throats with that. But then it's like, okay, well, 1295 00:57:02,840 --> 00:57:05,360 Speaker 2: if you reprogram your core wounds, you're not so afraid 1296 00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:08,440 Speaker 2: of abandonment or you feel safer to be vulnerable if 1297 00:57:08,440 --> 00:57:11,120 Speaker 2: you're the more avoidant person, and so then like, okay, 1298 00:57:11,160 --> 00:57:13,640 Speaker 2: now we're not so triggered when those things happen. And 1299 00:57:13,680 --> 00:57:15,839 Speaker 2: then when you learn to communicate your needs and talk 1300 00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:19,560 Speaker 2: about boundaries, it's like, oh, it's totally fine. And generally 1301 00:57:19,640 --> 00:57:21,640 Speaker 2: what you'll see people say is the output between like 1302 00:57:21,680 --> 00:57:25,240 Speaker 2: a dismissive, avoidant anxious, preoccupied is you'll usually see that 1303 00:57:25,280 --> 00:57:28,080 Speaker 2: they learn for the dismissi avoidance to say, hey, I 1304 00:57:28,120 --> 00:57:29,760 Speaker 2: don't know what i'm feeling just yet. I need a 1305 00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:32,120 Speaker 2: moment to process, but I'm going to take twenty minutes 1306 00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:34,560 Speaker 2: and then I'll come back and talk it out with you, 1307 00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:36,320 Speaker 2: and I will be here, and so they can take 1308 00:57:36,360 --> 00:57:39,000 Speaker 2: their space, but they're communicating that they're not abandoning them, 1309 00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:39,640 Speaker 2: that they'll come. 1310 00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:40,840 Speaker 4: Back that's nice. 1311 00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:44,160 Speaker 2: And then the anxious preoccupied knows okay, like they just 1312 00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:46,040 Speaker 2: need to figure out what they're feeling, and they're gonna 1313 00:57:46,080 --> 00:57:47,520 Speaker 2: come back to me, and then they can hold that 1314 00:57:47,600 --> 00:57:51,000 Speaker 2: space for longer. And then as they're reprogramming their wounds 1315 00:57:51,000 --> 00:57:53,760 Speaker 2: and those triggers aren't so strong, eventually you just see 1316 00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:57,000 Speaker 2: them have a really adaptive, healthy coping mechanisms and relationcation. 1317 00:57:57,520 --> 00:58:00,320 Speaker 4: Yes everything, isn't it huge? Okay? 1318 00:58:00,320 --> 00:58:02,800 Speaker 3: What would you say a good few, maybe like three 1319 00:58:02,960 --> 00:58:06,120 Speaker 3: questions that somebody should be asking themselves before they get 1320 00:58:06,120 --> 00:58:07,160 Speaker 3: into a relationship. 1321 00:58:07,320 --> 00:58:08,680 Speaker 1: Ooh, I like this question. 1322 00:58:09,440 --> 00:58:11,480 Speaker 2: I would say. The first question is what are my 1323 00:58:11,560 --> 00:58:15,680 Speaker 2: non negotiables? Because this is something that although that should 1324 00:58:15,720 --> 00:58:18,080 Speaker 2: seem like such an obvious thing. I cannot tell you 1325 00:58:18,120 --> 00:58:19,880 Speaker 2: how many times I would see people who would come 1326 00:58:19,920 --> 00:58:21,560 Speaker 2: to me and be like, hey, I've been with my 1327 00:58:21,560 --> 00:58:24,440 Speaker 2: partner for five years. They said that they never were 1328 00:58:24,440 --> 00:58:27,680 Speaker 2: going to have children. I wanted children. We both thought 1329 00:58:27,720 --> 00:58:29,840 Speaker 2: each other would change, and now here we are, and 1330 00:58:29,880 --> 00:58:32,120 Speaker 2: so like, we need to know our non negotiables and 1331 00:58:32,160 --> 00:58:34,040 Speaker 2: that can be you know. I know for me, if 1332 00:58:34,040 --> 00:58:37,080 Speaker 2: I ever had to start dating again, I would say, 1333 00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:40,760 Speaker 2: somebody has to be willing to resolve conflict in a relationship, 1334 00:58:40,840 --> 00:58:42,840 Speaker 2: like you know, that would be a non negotiable somebody 1335 00:58:42,880 --> 00:58:46,560 Speaker 2: willing to talk things out, or you know, if somebody 1336 00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:48,720 Speaker 2: grew up with I had a client once whose mother 1337 00:58:48,840 --> 00:58:51,560 Speaker 2: passed away from lung cancer. Her non negotiable was, I 1338 00:58:51,560 --> 00:58:54,320 Speaker 2: will never date someone who smokes. So like, non negotiables 1339 00:58:54,360 --> 00:58:57,360 Speaker 2: are different for each person, but knowing her non negotiables 1340 00:58:57,360 --> 00:58:59,840 Speaker 2: just really helps us avoid really big errors in relationships. 1341 00:59:00,440 --> 00:59:02,680 Speaker 2: So what are the things that you know? And what 1342 00:59:02,720 --> 00:59:04,760 Speaker 2: a non negotiable is is what are the things that 1343 00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:08,439 Speaker 2: if somebody exhibited these behaviors or showed up this way 1344 00:59:08,520 --> 00:59:12,160 Speaker 2: in a relationship, you staying in that relationship would be 1345 00:59:12,200 --> 00:59:13,200 Speaker 2: a betrayal to self. 1346 00:59:13,280 --> 00:59:15,680 Speaker 3: Okay, Yeah, Because I was gonna say sometimes no negotiable. 1347 00:59:15,880 --> 00:59:17,360 Speaker 3: I was going to ask you, how you know where 1348 00:59:17,360 --> 00:59:19,800 Speaker 3: the non negotiables are valid? 1349 00:59:20,120 --> 00:59:20,640 Speaker 1: Yeah? 1350 00:59:20,680 --> 00:59:22,040 Speaker 3: You know, I mean, like, how do you know whether 1351 00:59:22,040 --> 00:59:24,919 Speaker 3: your non negotiables are fair and valid to the other 1352 00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:26,720 Speaker 3: person or is it really just about you? 1353 00:59:27,040 --> 00:59:29,920 Speaker 1: Yeah? Great question, And I would say that it's exactly that. 1354 00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:32,400 Speaker 2: It's like the moment I would stay in relationship with 1355 00:59:32,440 --> 00:59:35,360 Speaker 2: somebody who did those things, I would be betraying myself. 1356 00:59:35,360 --> 00:59:37,400 Speaker 2: And I would feel like, wow, this is me going 1357 00:59:37,440 --> 00:59:38,320 Speaker 2: against my truth. 1358 00:59:38,400 --> 00:59:40,600 Speaker 3: And so these are non negotiables more to do with 1359 00:59:40,720 --> 00:59:43,640 Speaker 3: personality and behavior rather than non negotiables to do with 1360 00:59:43,760 --> 00:59:50,640 Speaker 3: externals like finances or attributes like physical attributes, or can 1361 00:59:50,680 --> 00:59:52,400 Speaker 3: they be the non negotiables. 1362 00:59:51,800 --> 00:59:54,320 Speaker 2: That's a great question. Those can be the non negotiables. 1363 00:59:54,360 --> 00:59:56,800 Speaker 2: Like you know, I've seen people who came from a 1364 00:59:56,840 --> 00:59:59,800 Speaker 2: family upbringing where their parents divorce and they lost everything. 1365 01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:01,680 Speaker 2: They're non negotiable. It's like I'm not going to get 1366 01:00:01,720 --> 01:00:03,560 Speaker 2: with a partner who has more than a x amount 1367 01:00:03,560 --> 01:00:05,560 Speaker 2: of money in debt, or I'm not going to marry 1368 01:00:05,560 --> 01:00:07,680 Speaker 2: the person if that person can't manage their money or 1369 01:00:07,920 --> 01:00:10,960 Speaker 2: you know. So there can definitely be those things. Physical attributes, 1370 01:00:11,200 --> 01:00:14,080 Speaker 2: I would say less so, but it can still technically 1371 01:00:14,080 --> 01:00:16,880 Speaker 2: be there. But I would say those are more like 1372 01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:20,960 Speaker 2: our preferences than non negotiables. But sometimes the negotiables can 1373 01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:23,560 Speaker 2: be literally like around money or things like that. Usually 1374 01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:26,320 Speaker 2: it's if there's this relationship to like safety that a person. 1375 01:00:26,440 --> 01:00:28,520 Speaker 3: There's a deep a meaning behind it, like it's not 1376 01:00:28,640 --> 01:00:31,640 Speaker 3: the finance, it's what it represents for them exactly. Yeah, Okay, 1377 01:00:31,640 --> 01:00:34,360 Speaker 3: so number one is what are your non negotiables, Yes, well, 1378 01:00:34,480 --> 01:00:35,520 Speaker 3: any other questions. 1379 01:00:35,720 --> 01:00:38,960 Speaker 2: Number two, what are my standards or needs? Okay, we 1380 01:00:38,960 --> 01:00:40,920 Speaker 2: can kind of use them interchangeably in this context. So 1381 01:00:41,000 --> 01:00:42,840 Speaker 2: just like the things that I'm actually looking for from 1382 01:00:42,880 --> 01:00:45,240 Speaker 2: a relationship. And the reason this is really important is 1383 01:00:45,240 --> 01:00:48,320 Speaker 2: because most people go into dating on autopilot, and when 1384 01:00:48,320 --> 01:00:52,800 Speaker 2: they don't know their standards, they're working from their autopilot framework, 1385 01:00:52,840 --> 01:00:56,400 Speaker 2: which is usually their pre existing core wounds. Often they're 1386 01:00:56,400 --> 01:00:58,920 Speaker 2: deeply on met needs from childhood. They're expecting people to 1387 01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:01,440 Speaker 2: kind of meet without like being able to articulate them. 1388 01:01:01,920 --> 01:01:03,320 Speaker 1: And we have to spend. 1389 01:01:03,000 --> 01:01:06,160 Speaker 2: Our dating stage of relationships vetting, Like if we don't 1390 01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:09,320 Speaker 2: do this, we're not dating intentionally, and then you know, 1391 01:01:09,440 --> 01:01:11,040 Speaker 2: somebody may be in a period where they don't want 1392 01:01:11,040 --> 01:01:12,880 Speaker 2: to date intentionally, they just want to like date people 1393 01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:15,840 Speaker 2: and see what they learn. But like, we ideally want 1394 01:01:15,840 --> 01:01:18,640 Speaker 2: to be clear about what we're looking for, and ideally 1395 01:01:18,960 --> 01:01:22,280 Speaker 2: the dating stage is best done if I know what 1396 01:01:22,280 --> 01:01:25,320 Speaker 2: I'm needing, the other person knows what they're needing, and 1397 01:01:25,360 --> 01:01:28,560 Speaker 2: we're able to vet during the dating stage by asking 1398 01:01:28,600 --> 01:01:31,800 Speaker 2: like one question per date to get to the bottom 1399 01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:33,800 Speaker 2: of those things. So if I knew that, Like, a 1400 01:01:33,880 --> 01:01:36,120 Speaker 2: really important thing for me is somebody who's also interested 1401 01:01:36,120 --> 01:01:40,240 Speaker 2: in personal growth. For example, I might on a date say, hey, 1402 01:01:40,480 --> 01:01:43,000 Speaker 2: you know I love personal growth. I'm reading these kinds 1403 01:01:43,000 --> 01:01:44,680 Speaker 2: of books. Do you like this stuff? 1404 01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:44,880 Speaker 3: You know? 1405 01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:46,800 Speaker 1: And so we would just ask the question. 1406 01:01:47,240 --> 01:01:49,320 Speaker 2: I think sometimes people hear the standards and needs and 1407 01:01:49,360 --> 01:01:51,640 Speaker 2: they're like, I'm going to sit down with my paper 1408 01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:54,800 Speaker 2: and I'm going to ask seventy four questions on day one, 1409 01:01:54,880 --> 01:01:56,360 Speaker 2: and it's like, no, it's going to be like a 1410 01:01:56,440 --> 01:01:59,800 Speaker 2: job interview. But knowing what we're actually looking for is 1411 01:02:00,040 --> 01:02:04,120 Speaker 2: extremely important. And then I would say, number three, how 1412 01:02:04,120 --> 01:02:06,120 Speaker 2: do I actually feel when I'm around this person? 1413 01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:08,000 Speaker 1: Because we do a lot of. 1414 01:02:07,960 --> 01:02:11,880 Speaker 2: The you know, oh, I I'm you know, this person's 1415 01:02:11,920 --> 01:02:14,560 Speaker 2: dismissing me and they're they're you know, not looking out 1416 01:02:14,560 --> 01:02:16,560 Speaker 2: for me, and that's my comfort zone for how I 1417 01:02:16,600 --> 01:02:18,400 Speaker 2: treat myself. So I want to dive in their head 1418 01:02:18,440 --> 01:02:22,840 Speaker 2: first and then wait. But if that's triggering you, that's 1419 01:02:22,920 --> 01:02:25,600 Speaker 2: either for you to work out and your triggers, or 1420 01:02:25,640 --> 01:02:27,840 Speaker 2: for you to communicate about and see if the needle moves, 1421 01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:30,760 Speaker 2: or probably both. And so just being mindful of like 1422 01:02:30,800 --> 01:02:33,760 Speaker 2: what our actual experiences and our emotions. I can't tell 1423 01:02:33,760 --> 01:02:36,479 Speaker 2: you how many times I would see people never giving 1424 01:02:36,560 --> 01:02:38,600 Speaker 2: up on their ex and then I'd be like, well, 1425 01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:40,600 Speaker 2: how did this person actually make you feel the entire 1426 01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:43,320 Speaker 2: time you're with them? And they'd be like, oh, like 1427 01:02:43,480 --> 01:02:45,760 Speaker 2: really bad, and I'd be like, well, why are you 1428 01:02:45,840 --> 01:02:48,880 Speaker 2: chasing them right now? And so just depending on like 1429 01:02:49,080 --> 01:02:51,240 Speaker 2: if it's just an attachment style clash, or if it's 1430 01:02:51,240 --> 01:02:54,640 Speaker 2: somebody maybe somebody totally different who has like narcissistic personality 1431 01:02:54,680 --> 01:02:57,480 Speaker 2: disorder or just isn't healthy, Like we have to be 1432 01:02:57,520 --> 01:02:59,960 Speaker 2: able to attune to ourselves and notice how we actually 1433 01:03:00,120 --> 01:03:02,080 Speaker 2: you feel in that person's company. 1434 01:03:02,120 --> 01:03:05,920 Speaker 3: There's are great questions to ask yourself. I loved what 1435 01:03:05,960 --> 01:03:09,200 Speaker 3: you said in the second one about intentionally dating because 1436 01:03:10,920 --> 01:03:12,280 Speaker 3: I feel like I can't remember where I heard this. 1437 01:03:12,400 --> 01:03:14,640 Speaker 3: But it's like, you have to do the work at 1438 01:03:14,680 --> 01:03:17,200 Speaker 3: some point. So you could have fun for a year, 1439 01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:20,040 Speaker 3: for two years dating, but then you get married and 1440 01:03:20,080 --> 01:03:22,440 Speaker 3: the work starts because then you start noticing, and so 1441 01:03:22,960 --> 01:03:26,120 Speaker 3: the work has to be done. You can choose when 1442 01:03:26,160 --> 01:03:28,400 Speaker 3: it happens, and so either you end up having to 1443 01:03:28,440 --> 01:03:31,840 Speaker 3: do extra work once you're married and start thinking that 1444 01:03:31,920 --> 01:03:33,720 Speaker 3: you know someone, but you haven't done the depth of 1445 01:03:33,760 --> 01:03:37,320 Speaker 3: the work to figure that out, or slowly, in small 1446 01:03:37,320 --> 01:03:40,880 Speaker 3: little ways, as you keep dating, you start asking those questions, 1447 01:03:40,920 --> 01:03:45,800 Speaker 3: you start intentionally doing that work. So either you don't 1448 01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:49,560 Speaker 3: waste your time or you don't have It's almost like 1449 01:03:49,640 --> 01:03:51,280 Speaker 3: leaving your home muchil the last minute. 1450 01:03:51,320 --> 01:03:53,400 Speaker 4: You know, but you know you have to do it. 1451 01:03:53,520 --> 01:03:55,560 Speaker 3: That was me always, I know I have to finish 1452 01:03:55,640 --> 01:03:59,160 Speaker 3: my dissertation, but I am up the night before trying 1453 01:03:59,200 --> 01:04:02,520 Speaker 3: to cram everything and so anxious when I'm doing it. 1454 01:04:02,560 --> 01:04:05,040 Speaker 3: And so it's either you do things as time is 1455 01:04:05,080 --> 01:04:08,600 Speaker 3: going on, or you suddenly realize you've bombarded yourself with 1456 01:04:08,760 --> 01:04:11,080 Speaker 3: all this work that has to be done in the relationship. 1457 01:04:11,280 --> 01:04:14,160 Speaker 3: And when you start realizing it all at once, imagine 1458 01:04:14,160 --> 01:04:17,240 Speaker 3: the pressure that it puts on that relationship, exactly in 1459 01:04:17,280 --> 01:04:20,240 Speaker 3: your honeymoon phase of when you when you've just got 1460 01:04:20,240 --> 01:04:22,240 Speaker 3: married and sudden you start noticing all these things that 1461 01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:24,280 Speaker 3: you had no idea about in the two three years 1462 01:04:24,320 --> 01:04:25,840 Speaker 3: of dating because you were busy having fun. 1463 01:04:26,160 --> 01:04:26,760 Speaker 1: Exactly. 1464 01:04:26,840 --> 01:04:28,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I always tell people because some people will 1465 01:04:28,920 --> 01:04:30,160 Speaker 2: be like, well, I don't want to do the work. 1466 01:04:30,200 --> 01:04:31,600 Speaker 2: The work is work, And I'm always like, you know 1467 01:04:31,640 --> 01:04:34,520 Speaker 2: what it's way more work to try to not do 1468 01:04:34,600 --> 01:04:37,360 Speaker 2: the work because it's going to get really big and 1469 01:04:37,400 --> 01:04:39,160 Speaker 2: there's going to be a lot of work at some point, 1470 01:04:39,800 --> 01:04:42,000 Speaker 2: or you're gonna find yourself floating from a relationship to 1471 01:04:42,080 --> 01:04:45,280 Speaker 2: relationship going oh my gosh, why are relationship so hard? 1472 01:04:45,440 --> 01:04:47,480 Speaker 1: Until you do that in our work for a period 1473 01:04:47,480 --> 01:04:47,800 Speaker 1: of time. 1474 01:04:47,920 --> 01:04:49,600 Speaker 4: See, my Mum's always right. Don't leave your homework to 1475 01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:50,320 Speaker 4: the last minute. 1476 01:04:50,400 --> 01:04:54,120 Speaker 3: Okay, don't leave your homework to the last minute. What 1477 01:04:54,120 --> 01:04:57,600 Speaker 3: would you say are questions you mentioned, you know, asking 1478 01:04:57,600 --> 01:04:59,760 Speaker 3: certain questions on days? What would you say are the 1479 01:04:59,800 --> 01:05:01,840 Speaker 3: questtions you should ask your partner? Do you have like 1480 01:05:01,880 --> 01:05:04,960 Speaker 3: three questions that if you're in a dating environment, you're 1481 01:05:04,960 --> 01:05:06,840 Speaker 3: starting to date someone, what would be three questions that 1482 01:05:06,880 --> 01:05:07,800 Speaker 3: you recommend asking. 1483 01:05:07,880 --> 01:05:10,440 Speaker 2: That's a great question. I would say number one, like 1484 01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:12,200 Speaker 2: what is this person actually looking for? 1485 01:05:12,560 --> 01:05:12,720 Speaker 3: You know? 1486 01:05:12,760 --> 01:05:16,000 Speaker 2: And I think having that question in there, I don't 1487 01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:17,840 Speaker 2: think that has to be like date number one, but 1488 01:05:17,880 --> 01:05:20,360 Speaker 2: I think that when somebody is more secure and they're 1489 01:05:20,440 --> 01:05:23,840 Speaker 2: rooted in themselves, like that's something you ask when you're 1490 01:05:23,840 --> 01:05:26,520 Speaker 2: a few weeks into the dating stage, because if you 1491 01:05:26,520 --> 01:05:29,280 Speaker 2: don't have the security to just like have the dialogue 1492 01:05:29,320 --> 01:05:32,800 Speaker 2: or conversation, and if you're looking for something different than them, 1493 01:05:33,040 --> 01:05:35,080 Speaker 2: even if you're compatible in lots of ways, if you're 1494 01:05:35,120 --> 01:05:37,560 Speaker 2: different in different stages of life, like that actually just 1495 01:05:37,560 --> 01:05:39,840 Speaker 2: becomes a non negotiable. So like what are they looking 1496 01:05:39,840 --> 01:05:42,480 Speaker 2: for like in this season of their life in regards 1497 01:05:42,480 --> 01:05:44,920 Speaker 2: to dating, but also what are they looking for in 1498 01:05:44,960 --> 01:05:46,439 Speaker 2: a partner? I would say it would be number two, 1499 01:05:46,480 --> 01:05:48,800 Speaker 2: Like what are those important qualities and characteristics? And it 1500 01:05:49,040 --> 01:05:52,080 Speaker 2: goes back to this part where vetting should be reciprocal, 1501 01:05:52,160 --> 01:05:54,560 Speaker 2: like we're not just supposed to that. It's funny because 1502 01:05:54,560 --> 01:05:57,040 Speaker 2: different attachment cells may do this in different ways. So 1503 01:05:57,200 --> 01:06:00,560 Speaker 2: anxious attachment cells will kind of like find somebody attractive 1504 01:06:00,600 --> 01:06:02,960 Speaker 2: and like them, and then they won't vet them at all. 1505 01:06:02,960 --> 01:06:04,840 Speaker 2: They'll just people please them and try to win them over. 1506 01:06:05,480 --> 01:06:08,240 Speaker 2: Dismissive avoidance sometimes because they get afraid of being vulnerable. 1507 01:06:08,280 --> 01:06:10,280 Speaker 2: Can flow find a little bit when they get too close, 1508 01:06:10,680 --> 01:06:12,640 Speaker 2: so they can be like a little nitpicky of people 1509 01:06:12,960 --> 01:06:15,040 Speaker 2: because they don't want to feel like, oh yeah, this 1510 01:06:15,160 --> 01:06:17,080 Speaker 2: is a perfect connection, or they don't want to like 1511 01:06:17,120 --> 01:06:18,680 Speaker 2: them too much or put them on a pedestal, so 1512 01:06:18,720 --> 01:06:21,360 Speaker 2: they'll kind of like flow find a little bit, and 1513 01:06:21,520 --> 01:06:24,760 Speaker 2: the balance is what we're ideally looking for. We're looking 1514 01:06:24,800 --> 01:06:26,960 Speaker 2: for I'm going to vet you and look for the 1515 01:06:27,080 --> 01:06:29,520 Speaker 2: qualities that you have and see if those are a 1516 01:06:29,520 --> 01:06:31,440 Speaker 2: good fit for my life without being two in the 1517 01:06:31,480 --> 01:06:35,440 Speaker 2: flaw finding space. And I'm also going to, you know, 1518 01:06:35,640 --> 01:06:39,080 Speaker 2: make sure that I'm clear about your qualities and I'm 1519 01:06:39,080 --> 01:06:41,360 Speaker 2: going to open up about my own so that you 1520 01:06:41,360 --> 01:06:42,080 Speaker 2: can see if I'm a. 1521 01:06:42,080 --> 01:06:42,720 Speaker 1: Good fit for you. 1522 01:06:43,160 --> 01:06:45,040 Speaker 2: And so it's not people pleasing, but it's being open 1523 01:06:45,080 --> 01:06:47,520 Speaker 2: and vulnerable and transparent so we can see if this 1524 01:06:47,600 --> 01:06:50,080 Speaker 2: is actually something that could work. And so I would 1525 01:06:50,120 --> 01:06:52,320 Speaker 2: say those are two really important questions. And I would 1526 01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:55,280 Speaker 2: say the third question is really going to be about 1527 01:06:55,320 --> 01:06:59,000 Speaker 2: like what are your non negotiables around dating, because again, 1528 01:06:59,080 --> 01:07:01,600 Speaker 2: when we can get that touper clear, we put ourselves 1529 01:07:01,600 --> 01:07:03,120 Speaker 2: in a position where we're just not like wasting our 1530 01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:05,320 Speaker 2: time and we're able to do things so much more intentionally. 1531 01:07:05,600 --> 01:07:07,400 Speaker 4: Thank you. Those are great question for people. 1532 01:07:07,480 --> 01:07:11,000 Speaker 3: I actually had written down the question of do you 1533 01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:14,600 Speaker 3: does your style make you that way towards yourself and 1534 01:07:14,720 --> 01:07:16,920 Speaker 3: you've already answered that, but it was really interesting to 1535 01:07:16,920 --> 01:07:19,280 Speaker 3: me when I read my question after going through the 1536 01:07:19,320 --> 01:07:22,120 Speaker 3: attachment styles and reading the book that I didn't even 1537 01:07:22,800 --> 01:07:25,600 Speaker 3: you know, in my mind, I wasn't sure, Like I 1538 01:07:25,680 --> 01:07:28,680 Speaker 3: was like, but what's crazy to me is that you 1539 01:07:28,720 --> 01:07:31,080 Speaker 3: don't expect them to be something you do to yourself. 1540 01:07:31,240 --> 01:07:32,840 Speaker 4: Yes, Like I think you could read that. 1541 01:07:33,000 --> 01:07:34,800 Speaker 3: I think you could go through these attachment styles and 1542 01:07:34,800 --> 01:07:36,880 Speaker 3: be like, yeah, he presents is this and I present 1543 01:07:37,000 --> 01:07:40,520 Speaker 3: as this to him or to her, but thinking about 1544 01:07:40,680 --> 01:07:44,280 Speaker 3: the fact that I do it to myself, Yes, it's 1545 01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:45,720 Speaker 3: I didn't connect the two. 1546 01:07:45,960 --> 01:07:48,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's like, I think so important for anybody 1547 01:07:48,400 --> 01:07:50,560 Speaker 2: listening to flash out to like dismissive a point sometimes 1548 01:07:50,600 --> 01:07:53,840 Speaker 2: will neglect their own emotions because it's that internalized emotional 1549 01:07:53,920 --> 01:07:56,280 Speaker 2: neglact and sometimes kind of like push things down or 1550 01:07:56,320 --> 01:07:58,040 Speaker 2: like step it away or avoid it a little bit. 1551 01:07:58,080 --> 01:07:59,760 Speaker 3: That because there are other people in the world going 1552 01:07:59,760 --> 01:08:02,880 Speaker 3: through this and this, and so why should I feel 1553 01:08:02,880 --> 01:08:03,600 Speaker 3: sad about this? 1554 01:08:04,120 --> 01:08:04,840 Speaker 1: And that's like. 1555 01:08:04,840 --> 01:08:09,640 Speaker 2: In its own essence, it's this beautifully packaged emotional denial, 1556 01:08:10,400 --> 01:08:12,360 Speaker 2: right because it's like, oh, like other people are going 1557 01:08:12,360 --> 01:08:14,560 Speaker 2: through harder things, so I'm not allowed to have or 1558 01:08:14,560 --> 01:08:17,679 Speaker 2: be entitled to my feelings, which is just emotional neglect 1559 01:08:17,720 --> 01:08:20,240 Speaker 2: of self in a different form and so, and you'll 1560 01:08:20,240 --> 01:08:23,519 Speaker 2: see like for each person they are that to self. Right, 1561 01:08:23,680 --> 01:08:26,320 Speaker 2: anxious preoccupants are people pleasing everybody else, but in that 1562 01:08:26,640 --> 01:08:29,680 Speaker 2: they're literally abandoning themselves all the time. And so no 1563 01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:33,280 Speaker 2: wonder their abandonment wound is so strong is because they're 1564 01:08:33,360 --> 01:08:35,920 Speaker 2: keeping it alive. Like I always think of when we 1565 01:08:35,920 --> 01:08:37,720 Speaker 2: don't know how to meet our own needs, and this 1566 01:08:37,800 --> 01:08:40,479 Speaker 2: is very like anxious attachment cell. Like imagine that you 1567 01:08:40,520 --> 01:08:43,160 Speaker 2: have an anxious attachment cell and they're driving to a 1568 01:08:43,160 --> 01:08:45,760 Speaker 2: gas station and their gas tank is fully empty. You 1569 01:08:45,800 --> 01:08:47,599 Speaker 2: pull into the gas station and you're like, oh my god, 1570 01:08:47,600 --> 01:08:50,240 Speaker 2: it better be open. You're panicking. But if your gas 1571 01:08:50,280 --> 01:08:52,400 Speaker 2: tank is always halfway full when you pull in, if 1572 01:08:52,400 --> 01:08:54,439 Speaker 2: this gas station is not open or they're out of gas, 1573 01:08:54,520 --> 01:08:55,880 Speaker 2: you're like, oh, that's fine, I can go to the 1574 01:08:55,880 --> 01:08:58,479 Speaker 2: next gas station because your tank is half full. And 1575 01:08:58,520 --> 01:09:00,200 Speaker 2: that's really what it means to meet our own needs 1576 01:09:00,240 --> 01:09:02,599 Speaker 2: a relationship to self. Not only is it our form 1577 01:09:02,640 --> 01:09:05,920 Speaker 2: of self soothing, but it's also our ability to not 1578 01:09:06,080 --> 01:09:09,559 Speaker 2: panic and get so dysregulated if somebody's not available to us, 1579 01:09:09,600 --> 01:09:12,240 Speaker 2: because we're not running on empty in the relationship to self, 1580 01:09:12,280 --> 01:09:14,320 Speaker 2: all the time, and so because they keep themselves on 1581 01:09:14,360 --> 01:09:17,160 Speaker 2: empty there, they fear that from other people just like 1582 01:09:17,200 --> 01:09:19,839 Speaker 2: by the same token, like even for a fearful avoidant, 1583 01:09:19,840 --> 01:09:20,719 Speaker 2: which I haven't mentioned. 1584 01:09:21,200 --> 01:09:22,120 Speaker 1: Like for me, I. 1585 01:09:22,120 --> 01:09:24,360 Speaker 2: Would be like all or nothing all the time with myself, 1586 01:09:24,720 --> 01:09:26,560 Speaker 2: like really focusing doing a really good job for a 1587 01:09:26,600 --> 01:09:28,880 Speaker 2: few days on being kind to myself whatever, and then 1588 01:09:28,960 --> 01:09:29,559 Speaker 2: drop off and. 1589 01:09:29,479 --> 01:09:30,759 Speaker 1: Go to the full opposite direction. 1590 01:09:30,960 --> 01:09:32,640 Speaker 2: And like you'd see that, and then of course I 1591 01:09:32,680 --> 01:09:35,200 Speaker 2: show up that way in relationships because that's relationship to 1592 01:09:35,240 --> 01:09:35,920 Speaker 2: me first. 1593 01:09:35,840 --> 01:09:38,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think we just were not taught to even 1594 01:09:38,920 --> 01:09:41,640 Speaker 3: reflect on ourselves in that way. You read all these 1595 01:09:41,640 --> 01:09:44,120 Speaker 3: things and you're thinking about how am I acting to 1596 01:09:44,160 --> 01:09:46,200 Speaker 3: this person or how is this person acting to me? 1597 01:09:46,760 --> 01:09:48,559 Speaker 3: But the last thing you think about is how am 1598 01:09:48,600 --> 01:09:49,639 Speaker 3: I acting to myself? 1599 01:09:50,000 --> 01:09:52,679 Speaker 4: How am I relating to myself? How am I speaking 1600 01:09:52,720 --> 01:09:53,320 Speaker 4: to myself? 1601 01:09:53,560 --> 01:09:55,439 Speaker 3: And so I think it's such a great exercise to 1602 01:09:55,479 --> 01:09:58,400 Speaker 3: go through, like start with yourself before you end up 1603 01:09:58,400 --> 01:10:01,560 Speaker 3: thinking about anybody else that you or acting towards or 1604 01:10:02,960 --> 01:10:04,080 Speaker 3: having an interaction with. 1605 01:10:04,280 --> 01:10:05,439 Speaker 4: It makes such a difference. 1606 01:10:05,600 --> 01:10:07,920 Speaker 1: Absolutely, can you. 1607 01:10:07,840 --> 01:10:10,240 Speaker 3: Tell people because I haven't even mentioned I mentioned the 1608 01:10:10,280 --> 01:10:13,439 Speaker 3: book briefly, but there are two books of yours that 1609 01:10:13,520 --> 01:10:16,559 Speaker 3: I have. Could you share the books with people? Because 1610 01:10:16,560 --> 01:10:19,439 Speaker 3: I think that after listening to this, I mean, how 1611 01:10:19,479 --> 01:10:22,400 Speaker 3: informative was this. This was such a great conversation. But 1612 01:10:22,439 --> 01:10:24,120 Speaker 3: I think for people to know what should the next 1613 01:10:24,160 --> 01:10:26,400 Speaker 3: steps be, I think reading your book would be great. 1614 01:10:26,439 --> 01:10:28,200 Speaker 3: So could you share both your books and just give 1615 01:10:28,240 --> 01:10:30,200 Speaker 3: a little bit about what each of them are? 1616 01:10:30,479 --> 01:10:31,320 Speaker 1: Yes, thank you. 1617 01:10:31,880 --> 01:10:34,080 Speaker 2: So the first is called The Attachment Theory Guide, and 1618 01:10:34,080 --> 01:10:35,840 Speaker 2: it's kind of like about the attachment cells and how 1619 01:10:35,840 --> 01:10:39,280 Speaker 2: to recognize which one you are. And then there's our 1620 01:10:39,280 --> 01:10:41,840 Speaker 2: second book, which is called Learning Love, and it's all 1621 01:10:41,880 --> 01:10:43,960 Speaker 2: about like it's really learning self love and how to 1622 01:10:43,960 --> 01:10:47,120 Speaker 2: bring that into relationships. But it's actually about those major characteristics, 1623 01:10:47,160 --> 01:10:51,799 Speaker 2: so reprogramming core wounds, learning your needs, emotional regulation, the boundaries, 1624 01:10:51,800 --> 01:10:53,920 Speaker 2: and the communication. And so we go through when we 1625 01:10:53,920 --> 01:10:56,240 Speaker 2: break down how to recognize each attachment cell, but then 1626 01:10:56,320 --> 01:10:59,280 Speaker 2: how to reprogram your attachment cell and actually heal it 1627 01:10:59,320 --> 01:11:02,400 Speaker 2: to become secure attached, and we go through all the 1628 01:11:02,439 --> 01:11:04,679 Speaker 2: different like reprogramming exercises and all that stuff. 1629 01:11:04,720 --> 01:11:05,200 Speaker 4: So it's great. 1630 01:11:05,280 --> 01:11:06,760 Speaker 3: So you feel like people are able to do this 1631 01:11:06,840 --> 01:11:10,800 Speaker 3: by themselves without needing the help of a professional if 1632 01:11:10,960 --> 01:11:13,680 Speaker 3: they can go through the you know, go through the 1633 01:11:13,680 --> 01:11:16,559 Speaker 3: books and they able to help themselves before needing to 1634 01:11:16,600 --> 01:11:18,280 Speaker 3: maybe go out to somebody to do that. 1635 01:11:18,600 --> 01:11:21,120 Speaker 1: Yes, they're designed to be that way for sure. 1636 01:11:21,280 --> 01:11:22,840 Speaker 2: I mean I don't want to tell people like, don't 1637 01:11:22,840 --> 01:11:26,120 Speaker 2: ever get support, but it's all designed to be that 1638 01:11:26,200 --> 01:11:26,639 Speaker 2: you can. 1639 01:11:26,479 --> 01:11:28,960 Speaker 1: Go through and become securely attached for doing that work. 1640 01:11:29,160 --> 01:11:30,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, my god, thank you. This is amazing. 1641 01:11:30,840 --> 01:11:32,479 Speaker 3: But I want to ask you a few questions about 1642 01:11:32,520 --> 01:11:35,800 Speaker 3: you actually, Okay, what would you say is something that 1643 01:11:35,840 --> 01:11:38,120 Speaker 3: people don't know about you that you would want them to. 1644 01:11:39,360 --> 01:11:41,920 Speaker 2: I would say, I'm not sure if it's like I 1645 01:11:41,920 --> 01:11:43,840 Speaker 2: want them to, but I would say that something I 1646 01:11:43,920 --> 01:11:46,719 Speaker 2: never share is I actually grew up and played soccer. 1647 01:11:46,840 --> 01:11:49,519 Speaker 2: I played Division one soccer. I got a full ride 1648 01:11:49,520 --> 01:11:51,840 Speaker 2: soccer scholarship. It was like my passion and like my 1649 01:11:51,960 --> 01:11:54,400 Speaker 2: first really big thing. I was obsessed with my young 1650 01:11:54,439 --> 01:11:58,160 Speaker 2: adult life. And yeah, fun fact amazing. And what are 1651 01:11:58,200 --> 01:12:00,439 Speaker 2: you reading and listening to right now? What are your 1652 01:12:00,439 --> 01:12:02,840 Speaker 2: favorite podcasts? Your favorite books at the moment? Oh my gosh, 1653 01:12:02,840 --> 01:12:05,360 Speaker 2: there's so many. I feel like I'm just so I 1654 01:12:05,400 --> 01:12:07,840 Speaker 2: love a course in Miracles. I'm really into like a 1655 01:12:07,880 --> 01:12:10,479 Speaker 2: lot of the spiritual stuff. And so every morning I 1656 01:12:10,520 --> 01:12:12,759 Speaker 2: listened to like an hour long Course of Miracles podcast 1657 01:12:12,840 --> 01:12:14,760 Speaker 2: go through like the Daily last Day. 1658 01:12:14,800 --> 01:12:17,160 Speaker 1: They're so good. It takes a bit to like it. 1659 01:12:17,240 --> 01:12:19,280 Speaker 2: I didn't get into it right away, but I'm really 1660 01:12:19,280 --> 01:12:21,519 Speaker 2: into like the spiritual side of things too, and so 1661 01:12:21,680 --> 01:12:25,960 Speaker 2: I love that. That's like my my like deep peaceful activity. 1662 01:12:26,840 --> 01:12:30,160 Speaker 2: And then I'm reading doctor Gaber mad Day's book, one 1663 01:12:30,160 --> 01:12:31,439 Speaker 2: of those newer books that he wrote, I think with 1664 01:12:31,439 --> 01:12:34,120 Speaker 2: his son. It's called The Myth of Normal and I love, 1665 01:12:34,160 --> 01:12:35,719 Speaker 2: I love all the stuff that where he talks about 1666 01:12:35,720 --> 01:12:38,599 Speaker 2: like the body and how this is affected and yeah, 1667 01:12:38,800 --> 01:12:40,680 Speaker 2: and I'm also reading this other book because I'm really 1668 01:12:40,760 --> 01:12:44,240 Speaker 2: interested in a lot of health related things too, called 1669 01:12:44,280 --> 01:12:49,160 Speaker 2: The Root Cause Oh Bye, Isabella wentz Okay. 1670 01:12:49,200 --> 01:12:51,000 Speaker 1: And it's like that's one of the best health book 1671 01:12:51,000 --> 01:12:53,960 Speaker 1: I've ever read. It's so good. So yeah, really good ones. 1672 01:12:53,960 --> 01:12:55,800 Speaker 4: It's amazing. And what are you working on at the moment? 1673 01:12:55,800 --> 01:12:59,200 Speaker 3: Are you excited about anything in life that you're ready 1674 01:12:59,240 --> 01:13:00,000 Speaker 3: to share with people? 1675 01:13:00,920 --> 01:13:02,160 Speaker 1: Yeah? So we are. 1676 01:13:03,320 --> 01:13:05,320 Speaker 2: So we have the Personal Development School. We have like 1677 01:13:05,320 --> 01:13:08,000 Speaker 2: all these programs are like more immersive programs for becoming 1678 01:13:08,040 --> 01:13:11,599 Speaker 2: securely attached with these like ninety day boot camps, and 1679 01:13:11,840 --> 01:13:15,439 Speaker 2: I'm working on creating this certification for people to also 1680 01:13:15,479 --> 01:13:17,519 Speaker 2: get like certified in all these different things. 1681 01:13:18,240 --> 01:13:21,280 Speaker 1: So excited for that. And then I'm working on preparing 1682 01:13:21,320 --> 01:13:21,599 Speaker 1: to have. 1683 01:13:21,560 --> 01:13:23,320 Speaker 2: A baby in a year or so, Like I'm like, 1684 01:13:23,320 --> 01:13:25,000 Speaker 2: we're going to maybe start the process, my husband and 1685 01:13:25,040 --> 01:13:26,600 Speaker 2: I in a little bit, so like that's sort of 1686 01:13:26,640 --> 01:13:27,840 Speaker 2: a personal thing that I'm working. 1687 01:13:27,880 --> 01:13:29,679 Speaker 3: Oh. I love that you shared that because I think 1688 01:13:30,600 --> 01:13:34,120 Speaker 3: the preparation you know, Iraida talks about that all the time. 1689 01:13:34,240 --> 01:13:37,519 Speaker 3: How when you're thinking about having a child, need you 1690 01:13:37,600 --> 01:13:40,000 Speaker 3: need at least a minimum of six months, if not 1691 01:13:40,040 --> 01:13:43,080 Speaker 3: a year to start not just preparing your mind or 1692 01:13:43,080 --> 01:13:47,040 Speaker 3: your external environment, but your physical body and to invite 1693 01:13:47,280 --> 01:13:49,880 Speaker 3: you know, your in your in your spiritual state, your 1694 01:13:49,920 --> 01:13:52,360 Speaker 3: mental state, and your physical state to be prepared to 1695 01:13:52,400 --> 01:13:55,200 Speaker 3: invite a beautiful soul into your body and into your life. 1696 01:13:55,360 --> 01:13:57,439 Speaker 3: And so I love that you said that you're preparing 1697 01:13:57,479 --> 01:13:59,640 Speaker 3: for that because I think it is something that is 1698 01:13:59,680 --> 01:14:03,080 Speaker 3: such a uh it's a responsibility and it's something so 1699 01:14:03,280 --> 01:14:05,960 Speaker 3: magical that happens that to spend the time to prepare 1700 01:14:06,000 --> 01:14:07,040 Speaker 3: for it is so important. 1701 01:14:07,080 --> 01:14:08,640 Speaker 1: Oh, that's so cool. It's so cool to hear that. 1702 01:14:08,680 --> 01:14:09,759 Speaker 1: I've never heard that before. 1703 01:14:09,760 --> 01:14:12,519 Speaker 3: I'll share some books with you. Honest really love that 1704 01:14:13,000 --> 01:14:15,599 Speaker 3: last question. When was it the last time you cried? 1705 01:14:17,200 --> 01:14:19,439 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, are you a crier? I have a crier? 1706 01:14:19,560 --> 01:14:20,439 Speaker 3: Are you are? 1707 01:14:21,080 --> 01:14:23,800 Speaker 2: I cry happy tears a lot more now than sad tears. 1708 01:14:23,840 --> 01:14:27,040 Speaker 2: But I will say, my poor dear sister is going 1709 01:14:27,040 --> 01:14:29,080 Speaker 2: through a hard time physically with some health stuff, some 1710 01:14:29,120 --> 01:14:30,280 Speaker 2: really serious health stuff. 1711 01:14:30,320 --> 01:14:32,200 Speaker 1: So I cried a few days ago about that. 1712 01:14:32,360 --> 01:14:34,360 Speaker 2: We were really worried about her. She she had to 1713 01:14:34,400 --> 01:14:36,920 Speaker 2: go to the hospital. She she went through a lot 1714 01:14:36,960 --> 01:14:39,640 Speaker 2: of like heart issues, and she's really young, so that 1715 01:14:39,800 --> 01:14:40,280 Speaker 2: made me cry. 1716 01:14:40,280 --> 01:14:42,679 Speaker 1: I feel like if I told her cry on your podcast. 1717 01:14:42,760 --> 01:14:44,760 Speaker 3: No, you didn't have to go into detail, but I 1718 01:14:44,800 --> 01:14:48,080 Speaker 3: appreciate you doing that, and honestly, everybody on everybody does 1719 01:14:48,080 --> 01:14:51,080 Speaker 3: listening to this, say little prayer for your sister. I 1720 01:14:50,800 --> 01:14:53,280 Speaker 3: think I wished her well and thank you so much 1721 01:14:53,320 --> 01:14:53,639 Speaker 3: for this. 1722 01:14:53,920 --> 01:14:55,599 Speaker 4: This was phenomenal, I think. 1723 01:14:56,240 --> 01:14:58,439 Speaker 3: I mean, I can't wait for all of you to 1724 01:14:58,439 --> 01:15:01,720 Speaker 3: listen to this, And when you do, please please go 1725 01:15:01,960 --> 01:15:06,920 Speaker 3: and find Tyson's share all your thoughts and give her thanks. 1726 01:15:06,960 --> 01:15:09,000 Speaker 4: If you appreciated it. Thank you all so much. 1727 01:15:09,680 --> 01:15:13,240 Speaker 3: Subscribe to the podcast and I would love feedback whatever 1728 01:15:13,280 --> 01:15:13,479 Speaker 3: it is. 1729 01:15:13,680 --> 01:15:14,360 Speaker 4: Thanks so much.