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Speaker 1: You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Girl. Welcome

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Speaker 1: back to I Choose Me. We talk about the choices

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Speaker 1: we make in life and where they lead us. I'm

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Speaker 1: so incredibly excited about today's conversation. My guest is an

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Speaker 1: actress you have loved and cried with for years, probably

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Speaker 1: especially on one of the most culturally dominant shows of

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Speaker 1: our time. But what you might not know is that

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Speaker 1: she's also a director, a producer, a pastor's daughter, and

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Speaker 1: someone who makes profound choices every single day to live

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Speaker 1: a life aligned with her purpose. Please welcome the brilliant, wonderful,

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Speaker 1: and deeply real Sarah Drew. I have so much to

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Speaker 1: talk to you about. You've been so brave in your

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Speaker 1: career and all the choices you've made. You work NonStop,

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Speaker 1: so many credits, I couldn't keep scrolling through them all.

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Speaker 2: It's been what.

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Speaker 3: I feel, so lucky and so blessed, and I you know,

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Speaker 3: I don't. I just I love where I love to work,

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Speaker 3: and I love that there have been opportunities to keep working,

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Speaker 3: and and then I started writing, so then I started

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Speaker 3: making my own work and I love them. It's it's yeah,

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Speaker 3: it's a lot but it's and it's a lot to

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Speaker 3: juggle with kids and everything.

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Speaker 1: It really is it? Really speaking of kids, something you

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Speaker 1: said really resonated with me. I think you said before

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Speaker 1: you had your kids that you were terrified of becoming

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Speaker 1: a mom, because that's it. I mean, I mean, that's

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Speaker 1: the one of the biggest I choose me moments. You

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Speaker 1: can make that choice to become a mother. What what

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Speaker 1: were you so terrified of? And now that you have

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Speaker 1: what a tween and a teen? Yeah, are you so

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Speaker 1: terrified or are you more terrified?

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Speaker 3: It's it's it's gosh, it's just all of the ever thing, right.

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Speaker 3: I think I was really afraid of failing like a

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Speaker 3: as a mom. Just I knew that becoming a mother

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Speaker 3: would require a lot of sacrifice, and I was really

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Speaker 3: content to be pretty self absorbed. Actually, wait, and I

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Speaker 3: think that there was a real fear that I would

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Speaker 3: not be able to rise to the occasion. And I

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Speaker 3: remember writing to my dad. My dad's a pastor, retired pastor,

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Speaker 3: but he is like just a founta of wisdom always

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Speaker 3: for me and I when I was pregnant, it's like

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Speaker 3: I'm not sleeping it. Also, it also took me a

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Speaker 3: while to feel ready to even start the process of

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Speaker 3: trying to get pregnant, like a bunch of my friends

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Speaker 3: had had babies before me. I remember hiding it, like

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Speaker 3: with an anxiety attack in a side room at a

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Speaker 3: baby shower, just because there's so much joy happening in

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Speaker 3: the room, and I'm like, I'm just not ready for this.

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Speaker 3: I don't. I want. I want all these things in life,

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Speaker 3: and I want everything to be all set up. I

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Speaker 3: want the table set, you know, before I embark on

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Speaker 3: this thing that feels so huge. And the reality is

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Speaker 3: that the table is never set in life. You are

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Speaker 3: constantly clearing dishes and resetting the table. That's a good

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Speaker 3: add it just it's if you're waiting for the table

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Speaker 3: to be set for anything, you will never move forward.

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Speaker 1: So true, right, like universal.

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Speaker 3: Yes, absolutely, And I think that knowing that I had

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Speaker 3: to get comfortable in the surrender of it all, in

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Speaker 3: the reality of like, yeah, I'm totally going to fail

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Speaker 3: at times. As long as I can get comfortable with

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Speaker 3: messing up and repairing and taking responsibility and learning from

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Speaker 3: those mistakes, then the sky is the limits in terms

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Speaker 3: of how you can grow and how you can parent

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Speaker 3: and how you can be a partner and you know

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Speaker 3: how you can be an artist the world. You just

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Speaker 3: have to keep throwing shit at the wall.

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Speaker 1: I mean for sure.

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Speaker 3: No, it's it's like that fear.

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Speaker 1: Though of the unknown. It can stop so many of

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Speaker 1: us from taking action.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely, absolutely, it was very I remember my dad when

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Speaker 3: I emailed him just to be like, I'm not sleeping

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Speaker 3: at night. I'm so scared of this child coming and

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Speaker 3: then me just like ruining their life or just not

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Speaker 3: enjoying anything any part of it. Like everything about it

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Speaker 3: is so scary. He gave me a bunch of like

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Speaker 3: lovely Bible verses to meditate on, and then one of

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Speaker 3: the things that really sustayed with me was he said,

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Speaker 3: I want you to start habit of aggressive gratitude. I

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Speaker 3: was like, what he said, when you are in a practice,

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Speaker 3: and he called it aggressive because it's like you got

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Speaker 3: to work at it. You got to be on the gratitude.

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Speaker 1: You got to keep choosing. You had to.

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Speaker 3: Keep choosing it over and over and over again. Because

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Speaker 3: it doesn't us fly at your face. I mean it

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Speaker 3: does in like heightened moments of bliss and whatever, but

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Speaker 3: in real life, it's more it's easier to find the

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Speaker 3: faults and of course imperfections, yes, of course. So like, fine,

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Speaker 3: look deciding I'm waking up in the morning and I'm

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Speaker 3: choosing to be grateful for this and this and this,

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Speaker 3: And he said, it's going to feel weird at first,

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Speaker 3: but once you get going with it, you'll start to

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Speaker 3: see things in your world that just make you go, oh,

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Speaker 3: I was looking for it because I was already in

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Speaker 3: gratitude this morning, and there's something else to be grateful for,

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Speaker 3: something else. And he said, you can't just tell yourself

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Speaker 3: to stop fearing. You have to replace it with something else.

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Speaker 3: So replacing it with this active, aggressive gratitude, it ends

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Speaker 3: up kind of dispelling that stuff that usually never comes

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Speaker 3: to pass, because that's what fear is, you know, it's

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Speaker 3: not substantive, it's not real, it's it's just a thought.

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Speaker 3: It's thoughts, and ninety eight percent of the things we

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Speaker 3: freak ourselves out about don't come to pass, right, So yeah,

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Speaker 3: So I started a practice of doing that, and it really, yeah,

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Speaker 3: it really transformed like just my heart and my heart

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Speaker 3: space and just sort of preparing the way for this

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Speaker 3: child to come and change my life.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. And that's what happens when you become

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Speaker 1: a mother. What would you say now to your younger

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Speaker 1: self who was so scared in that moment, or if

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Speaker 1: somebody's listening now that maybe's having their first baby.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, oh, I would just say, first of all, you

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Speaker 3: got to want to be a mom a parent, Like,

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Speaker 3: don't just fly into it because everybody else says that

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Speaker 3: this is a thing you should do. I think the

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Speaker 3: desire needs to be there, and I think maybe a

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Speaker 3: lot of people walk into it kind of going because

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Speaker 3: this is what we're supposed to do, right, We're just

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Speaker 3: supposed to have babies.

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Speaker 1: In the I'm a mom and I take care of family.

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Speaker 3: It's exactly like, I think there needs to be a

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Speaker 3: real desire there. But if that desire is there, the

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Speaker 3: leap is terrifying. But the adventure is so beyond your

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Speaker 3: wildest dreams. And I don't mean that it's full of

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Speaker 3: bliss all the time. It is hard, and it is

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Speaker 3: oh so painful at times hilariously funny. You know, when

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Speaker 3: they get to the age where they start cracking jokes

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Speaker 3: and they start becoming company instead of work. It's like

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Speaker 3: this magical transformation where you're like, you are funny and

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Speaker 3: I'm enjoying you.

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Speaker 1: What is it like with the tweeney and the teeny?

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Speaker 1: How is it in your house right now?

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Speaker 3: It's really fun and really vibrant. Homework has gotten harder,

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Speaker 3: and so there are many tears involved with homework.

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Speaker 1: What is this thing with homework?

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Speaker 3: The homework load is really intense, The managing schedules is

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Speaker 3: really intense. The relational drama has like picked up, and

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Speaker 3: so there's real things that are happening in the kids'

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Speaker 3: hearts and stuff. But also my kids are like musical

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Speaker 3: theater kids, and there's a lot of singing in our house.

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Speaker 3: They're like belting at the top of our lungs. Like

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Speaker 3: my daughter will start singing a song from Dear Evan Hanson.

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Speaker 3: Then my son will pick it up in his room,

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Speaker 3: and then they'll just be singing across the house in harmonies.

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Speaker 1: Oh, that's so interesting.

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Speaker 3: So you live in a musical. I live in a musical. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: There are times when my husband and are like and

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Speaker 3: I are like, if we could just turn the volume down,

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Speaker 3: just like a tiny bit, it would feel better on

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Speaker 3: our nervous systems. But of course, no, don't ever say that.

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Speaker 1: Oh, let them sing, No, let them sing Yeah, is

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Speaker 1: so true, because there will be a day in their development.

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Speaker 1: Hopefully it'll be quick when they'll Yeah, I don't want

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Speaker 1: them to be quiet. Maybe you won't, maybe they won't

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Speaker 1: ever be quiet.

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Speaker 3: But I don't no, I will say all of the

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Speaker 3: really deep conversations, like when they really need to talk

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Speaker 3: about something, begin at ten fifteen at night.

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Speaker 1: That kind of passed my prime.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm already asleep. My face mask is on my head,

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Speaker 3: ready to be shoved over my eyeballs. Oh my god, mommy,

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Speaker 3: I need to tell you about something.

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Speaker 1: It's the worst.

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Speaker 3: You're like, okay, yep, here we go, Here we go

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Speaker 3: another hour.

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Speaker 1: God bless the fact that they're coming and talking to you.

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Speaker 3: I would not trade it for anything. And my son

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Speaker 3: right now is doing a production of a Christmas Carol

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Speaker 3: and it's like it's a noise within which is a

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Speaker 3: professional theater in East Pasadena. So he's got eight shows

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Speaker 3: a week. He's just had a student matinee today. You know,

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Speaker 3: he is working, working, and also applying for high schools,

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Speaker 3: and so we've been immersed in just time management, which

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Speaker 3: is those conversations are so agonizingly unfun. Not fun.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's a lot to juggle. I feel like

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Speaker 1: I always said, like I would take back the diaper

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Speaker 1: years in a heartbeat. Those were so much more easy, so.

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Speaker 3: Much easier, so much easy, so much more, so much

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Speaker 3: less emotional weight was there. Yeah, it was just about

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Speaker 3: taking care of something, keeping it a lot, just keep

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Speaker 3: it alive, just keep it, just both.

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Speaker 1: Called it it.

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Speaker 3: You know it, it's crying. What does it need? There

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Speaker 3: are four things it could need?

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Speaker 1: So okay, I want to talk about the cultural giant

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Speaker 1: that was your home for nine seasons. So for those

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Speaker 1: of you listening that don't know, maybe you lived under

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Speaker 1: a rock. You played April Kepner on The Great Gray's Anatomy.

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Speaker 1: What an honor. It really shaped your career?

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, absolutely transformed my life.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, really really, I want to know how. But I

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Speaker 1: also think, like you know, when you're a part of

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Speaker 1: a big crew like that, it's very easy to kind

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Speaker 1: of find your rhythm and your and things and you

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Speaker 1: kind of your purpose. You know, when you step away,

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Speaker 1: things change. Oh yeah, it's a big transition. We'll talk

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Speaker 1: about that in a second. But how to being a

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Speaker 1: part of that world shape who you are as a

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Speaker 1: person on a personal level? I mean in so many ways.

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Speaker 3: I think one of the biggest ways for me was

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Speaker 3: actually learning how to use my voice on a set

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Speaker 3: in an environment where that was welcome and encouraged. I

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Speaker 3: Sandra oh Is I just love her so much. I

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Speaker 3: have so much respect for her, and she's so talented, incredible,

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Speaker 3: She's so incredible. But what I got to witness with

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Speaker 3: the way that she engaged with the writers, it was

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Speaker 3: such a beautiful thing to see. She would advocate so

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Speaker 3: passionately for her character and her character's storylines, and the

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Speaker 3: writers loved it because it was it was done with

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Speaker 3: such respect and such collaboration, and it was like they

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Speaker 3: were on this journey together. And I was like, oh, man,

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Speaker 3: if Sandra oh can do that, is she can use

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Speaker 3: her voice and advocate for because you sign on to

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Speaker 3: a show and you have no idea where the writers

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Speaker 3: are going to take you, right, and it's so it's

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Speaker 3: every every week is a new episode going, oh, I

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Speaker 3: guess that's who I am? Is that who I am?

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Speaker 1: Oh?

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Speaker 2: Okay? You very much like.

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Speaker 3: Life, very much like life exactly. You're adjusting and recalibrating

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Speaker 3: and and but then as you get to know your

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Speaker 3: character and you start to inhabit your character for a

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Speaker 3: long time, then things start to feel like, well, I'm

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Speaker 3: not sure she would actually go down that road, or

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Speaker 3: maybe she would go down that road in this kind

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Speaker 3: of a different way. And now that I've been living

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Speaker 3: in her skin for a couple of years, like, I,

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Speaker 3: what about if we do it like this?

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Speaker 1: Had you been in environments previously where you didn't have

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Speaker 1: a voice, I didn't.

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Speaker 3: I didn't know that I was allowed to have a voice.

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Speaker 3: I think I think in my previous like, I've always

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Speaker 3: been vocal in terms of like blocking, you know, when

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Speaker 3: we're on set, in terms of oh, oh, is that

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Speaker 3: how the scene is going to go? Oh? Because I

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Speaker 3: was thinking about it from this perspective, but oh, let's

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Speaker 3: try it this way, you know, in that kind of collaboration.

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Speaker 3: But in terms of getting the script and then going

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Speaker 3: is that the trajectory of my character? I don't know.

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Speaker 3: But what about what we did in the scene two

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Speaker 3: episodes ago and when she said this thing? How is

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Speaker 3: that connecting to this? Help me understand? Or is there

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Speaker 3: another way that we can say this that feels more

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Speaker 3: in line with who she was two episodes ago? You know,

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Speaker 3: I just had never I had never known that I

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Speaker 3: could speak into that piece of the collaborative process.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that affected you in your personal life

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Speaker 1: as well? Did that kind of spill into you finding

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Speaker 1: a new sort of.

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Speaker 3: I think it's more that I've always expressed my opinion

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Speaker 3: in life, but I didn't bring it to my work.

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Speaker 3: So it was more about allowing more of like who

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Speaker 3: Sarah is to come into play in the work environment.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I'm an actor but also a people pleaser

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Speaker 3: by nature and an achiever by nature. And so I

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Speaker 3: think I spent a lot of my life just wanting

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Speaker 3: to keep everybody happy, you know. And even if I

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Speaker 3: was like, I'm not sure about that, I'm often will

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Speaker 3: I would often take responsibility for something I didn't I

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Speaker 3: didn't have responsibility for just to avoid the conflict, just

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Speaker 3: to make everybody okay, you know. And so I think

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Speaker 3: in allowing myself to speak but also learn how to

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Speaker 3: navigate in the relationships so that I wasn't stepping on

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Speaker 3: toes and nobody was getting a And it was really

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Speaker 3: about let's craft something gorgeous together, and look at what

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Speaker 3: you're bringing to the table, and look at what I'm

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Speaker 3: also bringing to the table, and how can we find

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Speaker 3: the best idea together. You know, it's kind of hard.

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Speaker 1: To shift from you know, your those years where you're

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Speaker 1: creating the autonomy and figuring yourself out and then finding

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Speaker 1: your stride, and then you meet somebody and you're in

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Speaker 1: a relationship. Yeah, and then that's like screech, tire screech.

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Speaker 3: The funny thing is I've been with my husband for

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Speaker 3: like twenty six years. So we met, I know, we

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Speaker 3: met when I was so, so, so young. And what's

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Speaker 3: very interesting about that is, I feel like you change

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Speaker 3: and grow so much in your twenties and thirties, it's bananas.

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Speaker 3: I feel like we met, we've reacquainted each other with

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Speaker 3: a new version of ourselves every seven months.

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Speaker 1: How old were you.

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Speaker 2: When you met him?

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Speaker 3: Eighteen?

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Speaker 1: Wow? Okay, yeah, it's good.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So we were babies and we got married. I

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Speaker 3: was twenty one. I was like a month out of college,

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Speaker 3: and so I think I was finding myself while I

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Speaker 3: was already in a relationship. And I'm so grateful that

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Speaker 3: I met him as young as I did. It didn't

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Speaker 3: come without its challenges, for sure, but he's not in

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Speaker 3: the industry, and he is he and he knew me

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Speaker 3: before I had I had found any kind of success.

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Speaker 3: I was a college kid, you know, nothing had happened

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Speaker 3: in micro I was just Sarah, and so we got

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Speaker 3: to kind of take this journey of discovery together. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I love that. Yeah, because it can be a lonely journey,

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Speaker 1: especially for a woman.

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Speaker 3: Yes, I imagine it is. I mean, I don't know,

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Speaker 3: I don't know, I don't I was just thinking about

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Speaker 3: it today because I mean, so much stuff with with

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Speaker 3: what our kids are going through and my son entering

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Speaker 3: into high school at Applying Price, there's a lot that we're

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Speaker 3: sort of spinning around in our heads and a lot

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Speaker 3: of things we're thinking about. And my husband is so

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Speaker 3: grounded and so level headed, and he he thinks about

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Speaker 3: things from nineteen thousand different perspectives and does research on

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Speaker 3: every single possible thing. Oh, I'm much more so helpful.

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Speaker 3: I'm much more impulsive, much more like, this is my gut,

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Speaker 3: let's just do this, you know. And it's and I'm

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Speaker 3: so grateful to him because he has been I've been

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Speaker 3: in and out of town so much so he's really

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Speaker 3: been the grounded force in our family life. And I

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Speaker 3: was just I was just driving in my car, going

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Speaker 3: thank God that I have Peter. Thank God that I

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Speaker 3: met him when I did, Thank God that he is

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Speaker 3: the father of my children and my partner in life.

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Speaker 1: Like it was just there's that aggressive gratitude.

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Speaker 3: Yes, you can keep practicing, Just keep practicing.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely. So. Your character went through quite a lot on

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Speaker 1: grays Havy.

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Speaker 3: I so much trauma, Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So much trauma, drama, all the things, emotions. I know

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Speaker 1: from experience how that can kind of put you in

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Speaker 1: a certain head space, especially when you're at work doing

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Speaker 1: really I mean, your character was saving lives or not, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and dealing with all of that. How did you turn

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Speaker 1: that off? As your kids were younger? You would go

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Speaker 1: to work I'm assuming twelve hours a day at least

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Speaker 1: at least yeah, and then you would come home and

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Speaker 1: switch gears to being a mom and have to shed

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Speaker 1: all of what you just were.

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Speaker 3: I mean not always successfully, right. I had a really

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Speaker 3: I mean a couple crazy stories, one of which is

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Speaker 3: I played this really traumatic pregnancy storyline while I was

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Speaker 3: pregnant with my daughter. Yeah, I was eight months pregnant

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Speaker 3: with her when when I played this horrible labor delivery

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Speaker 3: and death scene where the baby dies in my arms

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Speaker 3: and I'm Okay, actually that's pregnant. Yeah, And I got

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Speaker 3: home and ten hours later went into premature labor. And

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Speaker 3: she came a month early and was in the nick

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Speaker 3: you for two weeks, like.

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Speaker 1: That's not gonna happen to me.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, she was like, I'm getting out of here. You

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Speaker 3: started it apparently on set, pretending. So here we go.

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Speaker 3: We're in labor now, you know. So, because your body,

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Speaker 3: when you're going through trauma, you're and you're really entering

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Speaker 3: into the imaginary space in that way of the character

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Speaker 3: of the character, you don't your body doesn't know the difference.

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Speaker 3: Your body's like, oh, yeah, we're adrenaline spiking now, and

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Speaker 3: our cortisol levels are through the roof and you're panicking now,

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Speaker 3: and you're hyperventilating now, and so our heart is racing,

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Speaker 3: and so we don't we don't know that this isn't real.

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Speaker 3: There's a lion that's really chasing us, you know. And

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Speaker 3: so coming out of that was really hard. I do

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Speaker 3: remember when my character was going through a divorce. It

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Speaker 3: was such a dark, sad storyline. And it was so

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Speaker 3: sad too because my friend Jesse Williams, who played my

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Speaker 3: main acting partner on the show. We both loved working

359
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Speaker 3: together and loved being in this in this on Green relationship.

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Speaker 3: It was so we had we told so many beautiful stories.

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Speaker 3: We had such a fun, delightful friendship, and we were

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Speaker 3: both sad then they were just like splashing pieces, you know,

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Speaker 3: And and I would come home and be like so

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Speaker 3: sad about just how sad April and Jackson were. And

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Speaker 3: I remember my husband being like, you have two living

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Speaker 3: children and you are in a happy marriage. Can I

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Speaker 3: talk to Sarah and not April now, Like, can you

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Speaker 3: let the trauma from your fake life? Just like relax

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Speaker 3: in the corner.

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Speaker 1: Very helpful to like it here.

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Speaker 3: Let's just say I just need to come back to

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Speaker 3: meet Sarah, Like you're too much in April's pain, Because

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Speaker 3: she was in pain every day. I would have to

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Speaker 3: go for like twelve hours and just be in agony.

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Speaker 1: That sounds like so much fun.

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Speaker 3: I mean, weirdly, I'm a bit of a glutton for

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Speaker 3: punishment when it comes to any kind of big emotion.

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Speaker 3: I mean, otherwise why would I.

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Speaker 2: Be an actor?

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Speaker 1: You know, I think emotions are so underrated. Yeah, people

381
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Speaker 1: just try to hide them. People tell you they're bad,

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Speaker 1: You're too emotional.

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Speaker 3: No, you let a fly. I say this to my

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Speaker 3: son all the time because he he cries, and from

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Speaker 3: the earliest years of his life, I'm like, apps, get

386
00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:26,600
Speaker 3: that cry out, you express it. Don't ever think this

387
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Speaker 3: is a weakness. Crying is so good. It feels so good.

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Speaker 3: And whenever he has like a big cry about something,

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Speaker 3: I'm like, yes, yes, let's exercise all of this, get

390
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Speaker 3: it all out of your systems. Feel so good.

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Speaker 1: I love that.

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Speaker 3: That's a good mom right there, that's a good mom.

393
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Speaker 3: So Shonda Rhimes, who created the show, famously has.

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Speaker 1: A no jerks policy. Did you ever feel as a

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Speaker 1: female actress, or even just an actor, did you ever

396
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Speaker 1: feel pitted against other actors or actresses for more?

397
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Speaker 3: Never?

398
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Speaker 1: Nothing, Oh my gosh, never.

399
00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:08,119
Speaker 3: No. I felt so supported and so cared for. And

400
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Speaker 3: I even remember after my daughter Hannah was born, I

401
00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:15,960
Speaker 3: had started I'd had some postpartum that I was struggling with,

402
00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:20,040
Speaker 3: and I was I was finding that whenever I would

403
00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 3: work second half of Fridays, it always turned into friturday

404
00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:24,880
Speaker 3: and then I'd get home at four in the morning

405
00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:26,320
Speaker 3: and my baby would be up at six and I

406
00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 3: didn't have childcare on the weekends. And then I just

407
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 3: couldn't catch up on sleep and I went to her

408
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:32,879
Speaker 3: after a couple weeks of doing this, I was like,

409
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Speaker 3: I'm kind of falling apart, like I can't remember my lines,

410
00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:39,720
Speaker 3: and I just I need some support. I need some help.

411
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Speaker 3: If there's any way that I can just like be

412
00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:47,560
Speaker 3: off of the rotation for second half of Fridays. I

413
00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:51,080
Speaker 3: could do any other day knowing that I have support

414
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:54,040
Speaker 3: coming and helping, and I could sleep, you know, but

415
00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:57,440
Speaker 3: on Friday nights and She's like done, this is a matriarchy.

416
00:22:57,520 --> 00:22:59,919
Speaker 3: For the rest of the season, You're never working se

417
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,879
Speaker 3: have a Friday's Like it was so easy to just

418
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:08,040
Speaker 3: she was so supportive, and everybody that comes onto a

419
00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:10,240
Speaker 3: Shonda show was like, if you want to have babies,

420
00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:13,560
Speaker 3: do it now to show and do it now because

421
00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:17,000
Speaker 3: it's like the sweetest environment. Everybody would go on the

422
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:18,119
Speaker 3: shows and just have the babies.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, it's a fertile ground.

424
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Speaker 3: It's fertile ground.

425
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Speaker 1: Yes, Oh my gosh. You lived inside April Kaepner for

426
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,359
Speaker 1: a very long time, and she went so through so

427
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,160
Speaker 1: many ups and downs. Such a very relatable character because

428
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:39,320
Speaker 1: we all go through those highs and those lows. What

429
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:42,720
Speaker 1: part of her still is in you today? Oh, that's

430
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:46,040
Speaker 1: great question, because playing a character for that long, Oh,

431
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:48,400
Speaker 1: she's like always.

432
00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 3: Going to be a part of me. I mean there

433
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 3: were pieces of me that kind of led into her

434
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:59,040
Speaker 3: and became her, as well as pieces of her that

435
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:02,639
Speaker 3: that all take with me forever. What I what I

436
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:08,399
Speaker 3: take from April A couple things. It's really so sweet.

437
00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:12,359
Speaker 3: Whenever I meet fans who just love April, often there

438
00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:17,080
Speaker 3: are like shaking in tears. And it's almost always not

439
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:20,400
Speaker 3: because they're like, oh it's Sarah Drew. It's because April

440
00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:23,720
Speaker 3: has gone. April has been on their iPad or on

441
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:25,560
Speaker 3: their phone or in their living room or whatever for

442
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,080
Speaker 3: years and years and years. They've watched the seasons many

443
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:31,240
Speaker 3: many times, and they have witnessed this young woman who

444
00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:34,480
Speaker 3: was mocked and ridiculed when she came on to the show,

445
00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:37,520
Speaker 3: and the audience hated her too. I mean, it was injured.

446
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:40,280
Speaker 3: Wasn't just the other characters made fun of the audience. Oh,

447
00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:43,199
Speaker 3: she was kind of grating and a bit annoying and

448
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:46,520
Speaker 3: a little insecure, and like there just was like she

449
00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 3: I was only supposed to be there for two episodes. Lately,

450
00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:51,879
Speaker 3: oh yeah, and then they brought me back and it

451
00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:55,560
Speaker 3: was this yeah, it's crazy. She then became this other.

452
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 3: She blossomed into this whole other, you know, nine years

453
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:02,359
Speaker 3: later a person. But what I think so many people

454
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:05,879
Speaker 3: connect to is that April felt really lonely. She was

455
00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:09,560
Speaker 3: really lonely, and then she found her tribe in this hospital.

456
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:12,320
Speaker 3: She kind of came into her own. She has this

457
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:15,840
Speaker 3: whole episode where she's like her sisters called her an

458
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,520
Speaker 3: ugly duckling forever, but she's like, I'm not an ugly

459
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:22,199
Speaker 3: duckling anymore. I'm a swan. And not just because she

460
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:25,400
Speaker 3: had a glow up and looks pretty or whatever, but

461
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:28,600
Speaker 3: because she she came into her own in terms of confidence.

462
00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:30,960
Speaker 1: She works her butt off.

463
00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:35,720
Speaker 3: To be excellent, an excellent surgeon. She has empathy for

464
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,560
Speaker 3: her for her patients. That and she has this faith

465
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:44,399
Speaker 3: that she has like lived by and is sort of

466
00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:48,879
Speaker 3: the true north of her life. That I mean. She

467
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:52,280
Speaker 3: gets divorced, she loses a baby, she almost dies on

468
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:56,719
Speaker 3: the table having another baby, She goes she gets fired

469
00:25:56,800 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 3: twice on the show. You know there. She goes through

470
00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:04,239
Speaker 3: so much and she has this massive crisis where she

471
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:07,399
Speaker 3: loses her faith and goes into this dark space in

472
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:13,440
Speaker 3: my final year on the show, and then relentlessly comes

473
00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:17,439
Speaker 3: back into joy and comes back into life and.

474
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:19,920
Speaker 1: Won't give up.

475
00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:22,239
Speaker 3: She doesn't give up on herself, she doesn't give up

476
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 3: on the people that matter to her. She's just relentlessly

477
00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:31,200
Speaker 3: in pursuit of goodness and joy and hope. And I

478
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 3: think so many people who feel lonely or who have

479
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,680
Speaker 3: been beat up by life a bit, they watch April

480
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 3: and they go, if April can do it, I can't

481
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,880
Speaker 3: do If she can make it through losing a child,

482
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:50,280
Speaker 3: then maybe I can get through the miscarriage I just had,

483
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:53,719
Speaker 3: you know. If she can get through the pain of

484
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,000
Speaker 3: losing the love of her life and then come out

485
00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:59,159
Speaker 3: the other side and go through this twisty turny journey

486
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:02,199
Speaker 3: to then find her happiness and her purpose, maybe I

487
00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:03,639
Speaker 3: can too, you know.

488
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 1: So I.

489
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 3: That's what I will always take from her. Oh she's

490
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:13,399
Speaker 3: such a fighter. She's a warrior, you know, but like

491
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 3: an emotional warrior who's relentlessly trying her best to be good,

492
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 3: you know, Like not there are warriors that are just like, ah,

493
00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 3: I'm just gonna win, you know what I mean. But

494
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 3: she just is like no, I just want to do

495
00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:34,000
Speaker 3: the right thing, you know, I don't know. I just

496
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 3: I love and respect her.

497
00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:39,960
Speaker 1: So that is so so good. So leaving a show

498
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 1: like that, yeah, can be a big emotional and personal shift.

499
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 3: Oh big time.

500
00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:47,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, what was that like for you?

501
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:49,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was a very big grief because I didn't

502
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:52,440
Speaker 3: see it. I didn't know it was coming. It wasn't

503
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:56,720
Speaker 3: my decision, and so it was a very big, like wow,

504
00:27:56,920 --> 00:28:00,440
Speaker 3: shock to the system for sure. I had no idea,

505
00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 3: and I it was a really interesting journey. And I've

506
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:07,440
Speaker 3: spoken to so many of my friends who've gone through

507
00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:12,879
Speaker 3: losing jobs. There's a weird grief that comes from a

508
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,520
Speaker 3: job loss that you almost feel embarrassed that you grieve

509
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,200
Speaker 3: something like a job so deeply. It's like it's not

510
00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:22,920
Speaker 3: a person, it's not you haven't lost like nobody's lost

511
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 3: my life.

512
00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:26,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, but but you.

513
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:30,640
Speaker 3: But there's so many aspects of being in a community,

514
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:35,199
Speaker 3: in a work community, doing your life's work with this

515
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 3: specific group of people who know you, know your name,

516
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,160
Speaker 3: you know them, you know you've been on this road

517
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 3: for almost a decade and having that and not to

518
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 3: mention the identity stuff that goes with it, Like I

519
00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 3: remember in those early days, right after being written off,

520
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:56,719
Speaker 3: I was just like, I've been that girl that's on

521
00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 3: that show.

522
00:28:57,960 --> 00:28:59,160
Speaker 1: For so long?

523
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:01,600
Speaker 3: Right, who am if I'm not that girl that's on

524
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 3: that show? You know, Like Gray's put me into a

525
00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:12,200
Speaker 3: household name. It gave me notoriety that I had never

526
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 3: previously had, and then all of a sudden, I'm not

527
00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:18,440
Speaker 3: there and they're continuing on without me. You know it

528
00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:22,040
Speaker 3: is it's a big thief. Yeah, it's a big grief,

529
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 3: and I had to kind of give my self permission

530
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 3: to feel all the feelings that are associated with it.

531
00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 3: And sometimes I would, you know, I would, I would

532
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:34,920
Speaker 3: say something in an interview, and then somebody would grab

533
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:42,000
Speaker 3: a I think somebody grabbed Sarah Likin's getting written off

534
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 3: the show to attending her own funeral, which is of course.

535
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 3: I was saying it in the context of when you

536
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:51,920
Speaker 3: leave something that nobody was expecting you to leave, the

537
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:54,360
Speaker 3: love that pours out is so epic. It's like you're

538
00:29:54,400 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 3: listening to yourself being eulogized. It's just just but I

539
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:05,360
Speaker 3: know exactly well, and then of course everybody mocks oh yeah, okay,

540
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:07,360
Speaker 3: it was like a funeral, like get over yourself. It's

541
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 3: so stupid, Sarah. But for me, it's just like in

542
00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 3: our lives, we don't often tell people how much we

543
00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 3: love them and why we love them just on a

544
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 3: random Wednesday. You know. It usually takes something big for

545
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,040
Speaker 3: someone to express all of those things, And so the

546
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 3: bigness of the moment of being written off ended up

547
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 3: bringing all these lovely thoughts and words from people to

548
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:37,840
Speaker 3: the surface. So it was so tender and beautiful and

549
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:42,560
Speaker 3: gorgeous and like something I never would have experienced if

550
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:44,840
Speaker 3: I had just left of my own accord, or if

551
00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:45,640
Speaker 3: I you know.

552
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,960
Speaker 1: So it's it took me.

553
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:51,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, it took me a minute. I've totally lost my

554
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:53,600
Speaker 3: train of thought, just went of fun.

555
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:56,640
Speaker 1: It was about just getting settling into the fact that

556
00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 1: you're no longer yes that girl from that show.

557
00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, so it took me. It took me a minute.

558
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,720
Speaker 3: I it was hard to keep watching the show just

559
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:07,360
Speaker 3: because I said, oh, that's my family going on. That's

560
00:31:07,360 --> 00:31:08,360
Speaker 3: a set I haven't.

561
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:11,120
Speaker 1: What was the time between like the end of that

562
00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:13,840
Speaker 1: role and your next role? Do you did it was

563
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:14,640
Speaker 1: a lady? Yeah quick?

564
00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:16,640
Speaker 3: Or it was pretty quick.

565
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:17,120
Speaker 2: I did.

566
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:22,440
Speaker 3: I went. I did a Christmas movie for Lifetime, I

567
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:26,040
Speaker 3: think a couple months later. So yeah, I was oh,

568
00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 3: actually no, there there was an immediate thing because I

569
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 3: was told that I wasn't going to be on the

570
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:36,760
Speaker 3: show anymore on a Tuesday, and then my team, you know,

571
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:39,360
Speaker 3: reached duiler. Are there any pilots that are still casting?

572
00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 3: Back when we had a pilot season, are there any

573
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 3: pilots that are still casting? And so I wound up

574
00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:46,520
Speaker 3: testing and getting cast as a lead in a pilot

575
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:50,320
Speaker 3: for Cagney and Lacey. So I actually was shooting it

576
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 3: literally day one of shooting that pilot was exactly the

577
00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,800
Speaker 3: next Tuesday, like one week later. There's some medicine for

578
00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:00,560
Speaker 3: your grief. Yeah it was. That was a a lovely

579
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,840
Speaker 3: little god hug. For sure, it didn't get picked up,

580
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 3: but it didn't matter. It was a very sweet moment

581
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 3: of feeling like, oh, I'm gonna be okay, Okay.

582
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:15,320
Speaker 1: People still want me, like, oh my gosh, it's so true.

583
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:20,320
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, okay you grew up a pastor's daughter. Yes,

584
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 1: that can have you know, you're very proud of it,

585
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 1: which is wonderful. That can have a rep you know,

586
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's got a stigma. My best friend when

587
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 1: I was a teenager, was a pastor's daughter, and we

588
00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:35,360
Speaker 1: got into some trouble. Let me tell you. When I

589
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:37,760
Speaker 1: was hanging out for Rohnda Ronda if your little Mironda

590
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:41,520
Speaker 1: Ronda and Rex, her brother, we we got in trouble

591
00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:43,760
Speaker 1: and the pastor would always catch us.

592
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 3: Oh that's so funny.

593
00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 1: Did you ever get into trouble as a past.

594
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:52,280
Speaker 3: I was such a goody two shoe I have my

595
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 3: I just wanted to do the right thing all the time. So, oh, hi,

596
00:32:56,680 --> 00:33:01,400
Speaker 3: April Kepner, she is April Keptainer. Yeah and April are

597
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:06,680
Speaker 3: so similar. I maybe I wish I'd gotten into a

598
00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:07,600
Speaker 3: little bit more trouble.

599
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:08,480
Speaker 1: Be fun.

600
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:10,920
Speaker 3: It would have been fun, but I didn't want to.

601
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:16,959
Speaker 3: I was also so driven and so focused. So, like

602
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:21,080
Speaker 3: you know, I was acting, and acting was the greatest

603
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:25,479
Speaker 3: love of my life, and so and I wasn't I

604
00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:27,760
Speaker 3: wasn't allowed to do the shows unless I was keeping

605
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:29,720
Speaker 3: up with my work, and I didn't have time to

606
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 3: get into trouble. If I'm being perfectly honest. My high

607
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 3: school was so rigorous that I had to use every

608
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 3: twenty minutes. I had to get my homework done so

609
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:41,320
Speaker 3: that I could then go to required sports and then

610
00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:43,960
Speaker 3: scarf some food down my mouth and then go to

611
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 3: rehearsal for three hours every night. You know, so I

612
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,560
Speaker 3: didn't Yeah, I didn't have time to get into trouble.

613
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:52,280
Speaker 1: Do you see that repeating with your own kids like

614
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:56,360
Speaker 1: that drive? Yes, what do you like? Do you think

615
00:33:56,400 --> 00:34:01,040
Speaker 1: that's a good thing? Or would you now knowing because

616
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,480
Speaker 1: you went through it and now and you've come all

617
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 1: the way on to the other side of it, Like

618
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:07,480
Speaker 1: do you want that for them? Or do you want them?

619
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:12,200
Speaker 3: I don't want the stress and anxiety that I remember feeling,

620
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:14,200
Speaker 3: and my son is feeling it right now and I

621
00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:21,239
Speaker 3: and I it's and it's challenging. And also he's like,

622
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:23,320
Speaker 3: it's all worth it because I want to do this

623
00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:25,920
Speaker 3: show so badly. The show is like bring is bringing

624
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 3: me so much joy. I feel so alive. I feel

625
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:31,279
Speaker 3: like this is what I'm supposed to be doing, and

626
00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:32,920
Speaker 3: I know I have to get my work done, so

627
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:34,680
Speaker 3: this is just what we have to do. We just

628
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:35,319
Speaker 3: have to do it.

629
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:38,359
Speaker 1: The apple did not find I know what.

630
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:43,239
Speaker 3: I just what I don't want what. I want my

631
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:47,640
Speaker 3: children to not get caught up in which I think

632
00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 3: I spent a long time in my life untangling from

633
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:56,000
Speaker 3: is if you're not excellent at everything, you're somehow failing.

634
00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:01,279
Speaker 3: So you know, for instance, math is challenging from my

635
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:05,279
Speaker 3: son right now. And he is so brilliant and so

636
00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:08,319
Speaker 3: special and so incredible, but just his his math is

637
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:08,680
Speaker 3: is harder.

638
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:09,239
Speaker 1: It's just harder.

639
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 3: It's harder for both my kids. In fact, that's where

640
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:15,000
Speaker 3: all of the drama from school lies. It's all math

641
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:19,680
Speaker 3: for both of them. And oh and he's been practicing

642
00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:24,360
Speaker 3: for this this this test that is for one of

643
00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:26,920
Speaker 3: the schools he's applying to for high school. You're require

644
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:28,960
Speaker 3: to do this test. And it's been so discouraging and

645
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:32,280
Speaker 3: so frustrating, and everything in me just wants to scream

646
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:37,239
Speaker 3: it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, you know. And I

647
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:40,719
Speaker 3: could shout it till I'm blue in the face. And

648
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 3: he is still deciding that he's failing, you know. And

649
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:46,759
Speaker 3: I do that. I do that to my I did

650
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,680
Speaker 3: that to myself growing up to My parents never demanded

651
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:53,360
Speaker 3: that excellent, that excellence from me. They never did, but

652
00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:56,120
Speaker 3: I did it to myself. And I can see him

653
00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:58,240
Speaker 3: do that to himself, and my daughter does it to herself,

654
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:02,479
Speaker 3: and we don't. We do not demand that they get

655
00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:05,520
Speaker 3: all a's or anything like that. We just ask that

656
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 3: they do their best. That's the only thing that we ask.

657
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:12,719
Speaker 3: But I yeah, I can. I can already feel that

658
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:16,560
Speaker 3: perfectionism creeping in. I'm not quite sure how to combat

659
00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 3: it because I'm still trying to figure it out.

660
00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, you said you've been unraveling that.

661
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:26,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's been with me. I know. I

662
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:28,680
Speaker 3: know this that you're going to ask me the question

663
00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:30,239
Speaker 3: about what did I do? What have I done for

664
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:35,120
Speaker 3: my That's just me choosing me and this relates to

665
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:36,799
Speaker 3: what my answer for that is going to be. But

666
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:40,880
Speaker 3: it's very, very very difficult for me to do anything

667
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:44,479
Speaker 3: in life that isn't achieving something in some way.

668
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:47,239
Speaker 1: Okay, so break it down.

669
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 3: No, I love this vulnerability. This is very real.

670
00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:53,840
Speaker 1: People can relate. I can relate.

671
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:59,480
Speaker 3: Oh, it's so hard. Even if I'm enjoying time with

672
00:36:59,560 --> 00:37:02,360
Speaker 3: my friends, I'm like, this is so good because we

673
00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 3: are forming community that matters and lasts, you.

674
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:06,759
Speaker 1: Know what I mean.

675
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:14,200
Speaker 3: There's something productive about being in relationship. You know, I

676
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 3: can't like cooking release I hate well, you have to eat,

677
00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 3: it's not fun.

678
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:23,520
Speaker 1: Are you perfect at it? Are you perfectionist?

679
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:27,120
Speaker 3: When it comes to like, no, I'm not a perfectionist

680
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:30,120
Speaker 3: at that. My husband mostly cooks and I do the

681
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 3: cleanup usually, But I don't have to be perfect at everything,

682
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:41,240
Speaker 3: although I do demand very high quality for my work

683
00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:46,120
Speaker 3: and stuff, for sure. But my issue is that I've

684
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:47,720
Speaker 3: like people have asked me if I have a hobby.

685
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:49,680
Speaker 3: I don't have a hobby. I've never had a hobby

686
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:51,680
Speaker 3: in my life. My hobby when I was growing up

687
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:55,000
Speaker 3: was acting, and then it became my career, and then

688
00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:59,760
Speaker 3: I remember for many years having seasons of like deep boredom,

689
00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:02,879
Speaker 3: like waiting for the phone to ring, of when am

690
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:04,600
Speaker 3: I going to get the next audition or get the

691
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:08,840
Speaker 3: next job or whatever. Now, with my life very full,

692
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:13,040
Speaker 3: with both work and children and everything, I don't really

693
00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:16,440
Speaker 3: have very much time to breathe most of the time.

694
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:20,640
Speaker 3: But even if I did, it's very hard for me

695
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:25,560
Speaker 3: to do something that isn't even reading a book. Even

696
00:38:25,640 --> 00:38:27,360
Speaker 3: reading a book is like, Okay, what am I going

697
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:29,680
Speaker 3: to learn? How will I expand if I read this book?

698
00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:32,319
Speaker 3: How will I grow? An empathy? And so growing an

699
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:36,160
Speaker 3: empathy is purposeful, so like there's no just just do

700
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:36,960
Speaker 3: it because it's fun.

701
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 1: M h Okay, I'm going to need you to come

702
00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:42,879
Speaker 1: back after the kids leave the nest. Yes, and you're

703
00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 1: in a different phase.

704
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 3: I'm going to tell you about all my hobbies. Oh,

705
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:47,840
Speaker 3: I'm going to learn how to basket.

706
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 2: We please, Okay.

707
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:00,440
Speaker 1: Being a pastor's daughter, I do want to know, though,

708
00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:02,760
Speaker 1: do you think that shaped you? You said your parents

709
00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:06,279
Speaker 1: didn't demand that anything from you. They just wanted you

710
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:08,320
Speaker 1: to do you and do your best, just like you're

711
00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:11,160
Speaker 1: parenting your kids. But do you think being a pastor's

712
00:39:11,239 --> 00:39:14,600
Speaker 1: daughter it defined you or shaped you in other people's

713
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:16,360
Speaker 1: eyes or in your own.

714
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:22,640
Speaker 3: I think what I'm eternally there's two sides of a coin.

715
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:26,520
Speaker 3: I'm eternally grateful for the faith that they gave me

716
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:31,960
Speaker 3: I have. I have a true north that doesn't shake it.

717
00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:35,239
Speaker 3: I mean it shakes at times, but it isn't. There's

718
00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:38,040
Speaker 3: never a moment when I don't, like know, beyond a

719
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:40,520
Speaker 3: shadow of a doubt, that I am beloved by the

720
00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:43,200
Speaker 3: creator of the universe, and that my life is purposeful,

721
00:39:43,239 --> 00:39:46,080
Speaker 3: and that i'm you know, I'm here for a reason

722
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:53,319
Speaker 3: and everything. When something that's hard happens, it becomes what

723
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:55,759
Speaker 3: is the what is the lesson? Here? And where? How

724
00:39:55,800 --> 00:39:57,239
Speaker 3: do I move forward and where do I find the

725
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 3: gold in this like that was given to me one

726
00:40:01,080 --> 00:40:03,719
Speaker 3: by my parents' faith and the way that they live

727
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:07,440
Speaker 3: their lives and the way they parented me. There is

728
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:12,520
Speaker 3: also on the other side of it, there is a

729
00:40:12,840 --> 00:40:16,120
Speaker 3: I think, a perfectionism that I that I put on

730
00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:18,279
Speaker 3: myself in a way my brother didn't, And I think

731
00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:22,520
Speaker 3: that might be a female versus male thing maybe, But

732
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:26,360
Speaker 3: I I took some of the lessons of my faith

733
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 3: and they became I'm I'm only lovable. I am loved,

734
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:38,080
Speaker 3: but I'm only lovable because I'm really working my ass

735
00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 3: off to be acceptable to God. My brother didn't get this. Again,

736
00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:46,920
Speaker 3: it's not it wasn't just that wasn't what was spoken

737
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:50,480
Speaker 3: in the household. It's just the way that I received

738
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 3: and metabolized what the what I was taught. And so

739
00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:06,680
Speaker 3: I think for me, that understanding of being loved because

740
00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 3: you're loved because you're loved, period and full stop, was

741
00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:13,240
Speaker 3: something I learned in probably my thirties, and I mostly

742
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:16,799
Speaker 3: learned it because of walking through a dark season with

743
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:19,920
Speaker 3: my husband where we needed to go to counseling and

744
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 3: we had to figure some stuff out, and one of

745
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:25,239
Speaker 3: the biggest lessons I learned in that was that I

746
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:28,799
Speaker 3: felt kind of like I remember sitting in one of

747
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:32,879
Speaker 3: my our therapy sessions and saying, I feel like an

748
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:36,600
Speaker 3: invalid wife, and the therapist is like, what do you

749
00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:40,080
Speaker 3: mean by that? I said, well, I feel like Peter

750
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,120
Speaker 3: didn't know what he was getting himself into when he

751
00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:44,319
Speaker 3: married me, and now that he really knows me, like

752
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 3: really knows me, really sees me, he's so disappointed, but

753
00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:52,160
Speaker 3: he's too good of Amana walk away. And my husband

754
00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:54,920
Speaker 3: was like, I don't understand why she thinks this. I

755
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:58,399
Speaker 3: don't believe that. I don't feel this way. I love

756
00:41:58,440 --> 00:42:02,240
Speaker 3: her so much like I And the therapist was like, Sarah,

757
00:42:02,239 --> 00:42:04,880
Speaker 3: you got a liar living in you. It was just

758
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:09,600
Speaker 3: trying to steal your joy at every single turn, trying

759
00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:11,680
Speaker 3: to tell you you don't deserve love, trying to tell

760
00:42:11,719 --> 00:42:13,880
Speaker 3: you that God doesn't love you, trying to tell you

761
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:16,360
Speaker 3: that your husband doesn't love you, that nobody out in

762
00:42:16,400 --> 00:42:18,720
Speaker 3: the world loves you unless you're achieving this, this, this,

763
00:42:18,600 --> 00:42:20,879
Speaker 3: and this. You got to tell the liar to shut

764
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:21,359
Speaker 3: the fuck up.

765
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 1: Yes, And that was.

766
00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:32,000
Speaker 3: One of the biggest, most explosive moments of release in

767
00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 3: my life being able to name that it wasn't actually

768
00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:42,200
Speaker 3: me that was creating It was just not a voice

769
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:44,200
Speaker 3: in my head, but it was. It was, well, the

770
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:47,640
Speaker 3: voice I don't know, the voice of culture. Yes it was.

771
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:51,919
Speaker 3: It was a voice that I gave way too much

772
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:55,600
Speaker 3: credence to and couldn't imagine a world where that voice

773
00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:56,640
Speaker 3: wasn't true.

774
00:42:56,960 --> 00:42:59,719
Speaker 1: That voice can be so strong and so loud, and

775
00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:02,920
Speaker 1: so many of us are minds. I know, I've had

776
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:07,359
Speaker 1: that same struggle, and it's very very hard to sort

777
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:10,400
Speaker 1: of take the bull by the horns when it comes

778
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:13,600
Speaker 1: to that voice, because if it's inside your head and

779
00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:20,279
Speaker 1: it's very loud, it's constant, it's very dependable messages. You're like, well,

780
00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:22,600
Speaker 1: then I should it's true, it must be true. Yeah.

781
00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:25,200
Speaker 1: It keeps saying the same thing, and that.

782
00:43:25,160 --> 00:43:29,520
Speaker 3: Voice in some way enables you to have some kind

783
00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:33,319
Speaker 3: of control because if you're if the voice is saying

784
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 3: you'll be loved if you do this, this and this,

785
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:37,040
Speaker 3: then you can go, okay, I'll just do that, that

786
00:43:37,120 --> 00:43:38,759
Speaker 3: and that right, and then I'll be loved as long

787
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:41,239
Speaker 3: as I'm doing that, that and that, you know, and

788
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:46,160
Speaker 3: when you release that and go, I don't need you

789
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:48,560
Speaker 3: to give me control of what I really need to

790
00:43:48,600 --> 00:43:52,439
Speaker 3: do is just surrender to the reality that I I

791
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:55,799
Speaker 3: am just I am a loved being. I am a

792
00:43:55,880 --> 00:44:01,360
Speaker 3: created being, and I am loved full stop. It's but

793
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:04,560
Speaker 3: then you go, but why, why what did I do?

794
00:44:05,360 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 1: When you say, I felt like, well what now?

795
00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:08,080
Speaker 3: I know?

796
00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:11,200
Speaker 1: Well what do I do? I what do I think? Exactly?

797
00:44:12,600 --> 00:44:16,160
Speaker 3: It was for me. It was a few days after that.

798
00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:19,000
Speaker 3: I remember that session so clearly, and I reached out

799
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:23,240
Speaker 3: to my community of like faith sisters and my parents

800
00:44:23,280 --> 00:44:24,560
Speaker 3: and whatever, and I was like, can you guys just

801
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:27,280
Speaker 3: pray for me because I don't know how to shut

802
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:29,560
Speaker 3: up a liar in my head, Like I don't know

803
00:44:30,239 --> 00:44:35,359
Speaker 3: how to stop this joy stealing from joy stealer from

804
00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 3: stealing my joy. I don't know how to do it,

805
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:40,839
Speaker 3: and I need help. And I do believe there was

806
00:44:40,920 --> 00:44:45,600
Speaker 3: some kind of supernatural intervention because I remember a couple

807
00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:50,400
Speaker 3: days later, I'm sitting at the table and my husband

808
00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:52,359
Speaker 3: walks into the room and he just looks at me.

809
00:44:52,520 --> 00:44:55,759
Speaker 3: It's the morning. He's like, I love you, honey, and

810
00:44:55,840 --> 00:44:59,920
Speaker 3: I swear to you. I felt like chills from my toe.

811
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:01,840
Speaker 3: It was all the way up my It was like

812
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:05,680
Speaker 3: heat all the way up my whole body, off the

813
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:08,919
Speaker 3: top of my head, chills everywhere. And I just looked

814
00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:13,520
Speaker 3: at him and I was like, I believe you. I

815
00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 3: have never fully believed you when you have said that

816
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:20,480
Speaker 3: to me, And for the first time in my life,

817
00:45:20,640 --> 00:45:24,480
Speaker 3: I believe you. I'm somebody's favorite person. I'm your favorite

818
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 3: person and that's real and that's true and that just

819
00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:31,920
Speaker 3: is period. And I just burst into tears and there

820
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:37,880
Speaker 3: was something that just broke and released and let me

821
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:43,279
Speaker 3: go in that moment, and it, yeah, it transformed. That's

822
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:43,879
Speaker 3: so much.

823
00:45:44,239 --> 00:45:48,200
Speaker 1: That's so good, almost crying because I feel like that,

824
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:51,279
Speaker 1: I feel that moment for you, Like how profound that

825
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:54,840
Speaker 1: must have been. What a breakthrough just in this internal

826
00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:58,920
Speaker 1: like prison that you were in, you know. Yeah, And

827
00:45:59,080 --> 00:46:02,560
Speaker 1: what after that happened? How did you stay the course?

828
00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:06,000
Speaker 1: Because that joy sucker didn't leave forever.

829
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:09,800
Speaker 3: No, and it does crop back up now and again,

830
00:46:09,840 --> 00:46:16,279
Speaker 3: But I swear to you, from that moment it had,

831
00:46:16,920 --> 00:46:18,880
Speaker 3: it did not have a choke hold on me anymore.

832
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:21,560
Speaker 3: You were able to say I couldn't see what it was.

833
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:25,399
Speaker 3: I could say, I don't believe you. You're lying, you're

834
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:30,440
Speaker 3: a liar, You're a liar. You're not being honest. I'm sorry,

835
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:34,319
Speaker 3: but you're not. My husband is always his wife was like,

836
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:38,000
Speaker 3: he's just so wonderful. But I remember early in our

837
00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:42,359
Speaker 3: relationship I wanted him. My parents would always express their

838
00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:45,359
Speaker 3: love through verbal affirmation. In many they express their love

839
00:46:45,360 --> 00:46:47,440
Speaker 3: in lots of different ways, but my parents would always

840
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:49,279
Speaker 3: be like, I love you because of this, because of this,

841
00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:50,879
Speaker 3: because I look, you did this, and we're so proud

842
00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:54,440
Speaker 3: of you. Because because because right and with my husband,

843
00:46:54,480 --> 00:46:57,919
Speaker 3: he wouldn't give me the laundry list ever, I mean ever,

844
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:00,680
Speaker 3: he just was always just I just love you. I

845
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:02,719
Speaker 3: just love being with you, I just love being around you.

846
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 3: I just I think you're so awesome. I just love you.

847
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:07,319
Speaker 3: Sometimes you're like.

848
00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:09,200
Speaker 1: But why why, I know? Tell me? Can you just

849
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 1: tell me why? What is it that you look about me?

850
00:47:11,120 --> 00:47:14,799
Speaker 3: Tell me why? And I remember asking him once, why

851
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:18,239
Speaker 3: don't you tell me why you love me? And he said,

852
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:21,400
Speaker 3: because I don't want you to ever feel that my

853
00:47:21,480 --> 00:47:24,319
Speaker 3: love is going to ever go away if for some

854
00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:26,239
Speaker 3: reason you stop being able to do one of those

855
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:29,239
Speaker 3: things or one of those things that I say, this

856
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:31,880
Speaker 3: is why I love you. And then what happens if

857
00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:33,719
Speaker 3: I say I love you because I love dancing with you,

858
00:47:33,800 --> 00:47:36,440
Speaker 3: and then you know, you break a leg or you

859
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:39,399
Speaker 3: can't dance anymore, your hip goes out or whatever, like

860
00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:41,560
Speaker 3: I don't want you to ever have in the back

861
00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:44,360
Speaker 3: of your head. There was a condition to this, and

862
00:47:44,440 --> 00:47:46,440
Speaker 3: it was because he's like, I just want you to

863
00:47:46,520 --> 00:47:48,680
Speaker 3: always know that I love you, so period.

864
00:47:49,760 --> 00:47:52,839
Speaker 1: What that's that's a really I'm so happy for you

865
00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:56,000
Speaker 1: because that I can know. I know how tortures that

866
00:47:56,520 --> 00:48:00,320
Speaker 1: negative liar brain can mind can can control.

867
00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's I mean, it's still there, but it is not.

868
00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:07,600
Speaker 3: It does not it does not have the choke hold, right, Yeah,

869
00:48:07,600 --> 00:48:12,080
Speaker 3: and I feel I used to feel like, oh God

870
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,600
Speaker 3: loves me, but you know he had his son had

871
00:48:15,640 --> 00:48:20,000
Speaker 3: to die because I suck so bad. It's like kind

872
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:23,640
Speaker 3: of correct. Yeah, you know that doesn't exist. That thought

873
00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:25,960
Speaker 3: doesn't exist in my head anymore. That used to be

874
00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 3: the thought that I had both prior to so interesting.

875
00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:30,000
Speaker 1: Because I was going to ask you like your faith

876
00:48:30,040 --> 00:48:32,560
Speaker 1: as a younger girl and what you learn from your

877
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:35,680
Speaker 1: parents and then becoming your own person, your own adult

878
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:39,040
Speaker 1: which you've said didn't have until your thirties, where you

879
00:48:39,160 --> 00:48:43,400
Speaker 1: actually chose to believe what you chose to believe instead

880
00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:45,440
Speaker 1: of what they chose for you. Even though it was

881
00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:47,480
Speaker 1: similar or yes, maybe even the same.

882
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:49,640
Speaker 3: It's not it's not exactly the same. I mean, I

883
00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:54,960
Speaker 3: I feel like the biggest transformation for me. I think

884
00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:57,560
Speaker 3: I was in a bit of a really protective bubble,

885
00:48:57,680 --> 00:49:01,080
Speaker 3: and so everything in the world felt pretty black and white,

886
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:05,000
Speaker 3: like this is correct, and this is incorrect, and and

887
00:49:05,040 --> 00:49:08,680
Speaker 3: I because I just and I was surrounded by people

888
00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:11,040
Speaker 3: of faith all growing up, so I didn't really have

889
00:49:11,120 --> 00:49:16,040
Speaker 3: exposure to other perspectives. And then I enter into Hollywood

890
00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:20,399
Speaker 3: and my whole world of angels into color. I don't

891
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:22,000
Speaker 3: know why they call it the angels.

892
00:49:22,120 --> 00:49:28,360
Speaker 1: I really don't. Well, they're circling, for sure, circling.

893
00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:31,040
Speaker 3: But they're circling. They're working hard, They're working very hard

894
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:35,440
Speaker 3: over time. But I do I think that for me

895
00:49:36,600 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 3: engaging with a communities of people from every different background,

896
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:46,520
Speaker 3: every different belief system. I definitely walked into Hollywood feeling

897
00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:49,840
Speaker 3: like I'm here to teach everybody about Jesus. You know,

898
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:52,480
Speaker 3: that was that was what I thought I was supposed

899
00:49:52,520 --> 00:49:52,719
Speaker 3: to do.

900
00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:54,040
Speaker 1: And they lined up around the corner.

901
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:58,840
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, they really wanted to hear What was amazing

902
00:49:59,239 --> 00:50:02,799
Speaker 3: is that, like right off the bat in my first

903
00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:07,239
Speaker 3: couple of jobs, I was just very clearly sat down,

904
00:50:07,600 --> 00:50:11,680
Speaker 3: not by anyone, because I usually had some semblance attacked,

905
00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:16,360
Speaker 3: but I was sat down emotionally by witnessing. I have

906
00:50:16,440 --> 00:50:20,720
Speaker 3: this one really lovely encounter. I was doing a play

907
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:23,839
Speaker 3: and I was having an anxiety attack, and I was

908
00:50:24,080 --> 00:50:26,839
Speaker 3: feeling really overwhelmed in this woman who had a very

909
00:50:26,840 --> 00:50:30,279
Speaker 3: different background, had very different like partying habits and things

910
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:32,800
Speaker 3: like that that I would have, you know, found totally

911
00:50:32,800 --> 00:50:35,239
Speaker 3: scandalous at the time. And I'm like, oh, yes, she

912
00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:40,439
Speaker 3: needs to be saved, you know. She she sat me down.

913
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:42,680
Speaker 3: She's like, all right, darling, I'm just going to take

914
00:50:42,680 --> 00:50:44,560
Speaker 3: you through a little meditation right now, and I want

915
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:45,960
Speaker 3: you to close your eyes and I want you to

916
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 3: breathe deeply. And she walked me through this beautiful meditation

917
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:53,440
Speaker 3: that involved getting in a boat. They're no oars, you

918
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:56,120
Speaker 3: put your hands in the boat, you breathe in. You

919
00:50:56,239 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 3: know that the river is going to take you where

920
00:50:58,080 --> 00:51:00,600
Speaker 3: the river needs to go. And it's like she was

921
00:51:00,680 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 3: speaking truth, God's truth to me in a different language language.

922
00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:10,120
Speaker 3: And I had this It was a total revelatory moment

923
00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:14,399
Speaker 3: where I was like, Oh, I'm here to sit down

924
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:18,160
Speaker 3: and learn and listen. I'm not here to stand up

925
00:51:18,200 --> 00:51:21,239
Speaker 3: and preach on a box. This is what life is.

926
00:51:21,560 --> 00:51:25,520
Speaker 3: This is the expression of my faith is sitting and

927
00:51:25,920 --> 00:51:30,000
Speaker 3: engaging with a community and learning and seeing God in

928
00:51:30,040 --> 00:51:33,680
Speaker 3: every person's face. That's what I'm supposed to be. It's beautiful.

929
00:51:34,360 --> 00:51:37,000
Speaker 1: That's beautiful. I want to ask you. There's a couple

930
00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:39,239
Speaker 1: of things I want to ask you. You and your

931
00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:45,160
Speaker 1: husband have adopted or established a no sarcasm rule. Oh yes,

932
00:51:45,400 --> 00:51:49,280
Speaker 1: in your house, and you choose not to speak unkindly

933
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:55,520
Speaker 1: to one another, so it's a no meanness rule. Yeah,

934
00:51:55,560 --> 00:51:56,719
Speaker 1: but sarcasm as well.

935
00:51:58,320 --> 00:52:00,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's funny because now my son and

936
00:52:00,400 --> 00:52:06,560
Speaker 3: I are pretty sarcastic with its fun. It's fun. It

937
00:52:06,600 --> 00:52:09,799
Speaker 3: was a It was kind of one of these little

938
00:52:09,920 --> 00:52:15,600
Speaker 3: nugget like gift nuggets from my husband's mentor who just

939
00:52:15,640 --> 00:52:18,000
Speaker 3: said one of the one of the things that can,

940
00:52:18,680 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 3: especially in a long term relationship, that can start to

941
00:52:22,719 --> 00:52:26,080
Speaker 3: dig with It starts as fun and then it can

942
00:52:26,360 --> 00:52:30,040
Speaker 3: start to get more cutting because the the kind of

943
00:52:30,120 --> 00:52:32,200
Speaker 3: humor it is is a little bit cutting to begin with,

944
00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:36,719
Speaker 3: and then as like resentments build that sarcasm. I keep

945
00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:40,560
Speaker 3: thinking about the movie, the about the emotions.

946
00:52:40,719 --> 00:52:42,399
Speaker 1: Oh, inside out, inside out.

947
00:52:42,320 --> 00:52:48,279
Speaker 3: Too, they show sarcasm. It's just this giant crater with

948
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:50,439
Speaker 3: one person on this side and one person on this side,

949
00:52:50,440 --> 00:52:52,680
Speaker 3: and someone tries to say something and then it turns

950
00:52:52,719 --> 00:52:55,760
Speaker 3: into something else by the time it reaches the other person.

951
00:52:56,080 --> 00:52:59,239
Speaker 3: This is such a great image for how sarcasm can

952
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:02,719
Speaker 3: kind of get in there and create a giant divide.

953
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:08,200
Speaker 3: And so we just we were goofy and silly. That's

954
00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:11,280
Speaker 3: how we express our humor with each other in the household.

955
00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:14,040
Speaker 3: But just we don't my husband, I don't use sarcasm

956
00:53:14,320 --> 00:53:16,200
Speaker 3: with one another. We just we were like, that's a

957
00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:18,759
Speaker 3: great idea. I think we'll I think we'll go by that.

958
00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:28,320
Speaker 1: I want to talk about another one of your great choices,

959
00:53:28,680 --> 00:53:31,840
Speaker 1: and that is doing your back on Hallmark for a

960
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:37,480
Speaker 1: very fun, cozy, but twisty, mysterious Mistletoe Murders. I have

961
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:39,880
Speaker 1: to talk about this because I want to know what

962
00:53:39,960 --> 00:53:42,360
Speaker 1: made you choose to play Emily Lane.

963
00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:44,240
Speaker 3: It's such a fun show.

964
00:53:44,520 --> 00:53:46,400
Speaker 1: I've heard, yes, I haven't seen it yet.

965
00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:49,480
Speaker 3: Oh, it's so fun. You're going into season we just

966
00:53:49,719 --> 00:53:53,120
Speaker 3: we just aired season two. We're waiting to see if

967
00:53:53,160 --> 00:53:56,399
Speaker 3: we get a pickup for season three. Okay, knocking on all.

968
00:53:56,320 --> 00:54:00,680
Speaker 1: The does it only play around the holidays like it came.

969
00:54:00,520 --> 00:54:02,919
Speaker 3: Out on Hallmark Plus last year the first season did,

970
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:05,600
Speaker 3: and then they aired season one and season two back

971
00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:07,640
Speaker 3: to back this year on the main home.

972
00:54:07,880 --> 00:54:09,000
Speaker 1: Jill so good.

973
00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:14,560
Speaker 3: Yes, it's a really fun I've never done a murder mystery.

974
00:54:14,560 --> 00:54:17,680
Speaker 3: I've never played a sleuth before, so that was really cool.

975
00:54:18,080 --> 00:54:21,160
Speaker 3: The script was really amazing when it came across my desk.

976
00:54:21,320 --> 00:54:25,160
Speaker 3: Was really really, really fantastically crafted mystery. But the thing

977
00:54:25,200 --> 00:54:27,600
Speaker 3: that really made me want to do this is that

978
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:31,680
Speaker 3: Emily has the secret past life and so she there's

979
00:54:31,719 --> 00:54:34,920
Speaker 3: this duality to her where she's we don't know if

980
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:37,960
Speaker 3: she's hiding from someone or running from something, or we

981
00:54:38,000 --> 00:54:39,279
Speaker 3: don't know if she was good, we don't know if

982
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:41,920
Speaker 3: she was missed it. That's the thing. So you have

983
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:45,160
Speaker 3: every two episodes, there's one murder mystery that gets solved,

984
00:54:45,239 --> 00:54:49,319
Speaker 3: and then there's a really delicious romance with her and it.

985
00:54:49,280 --> 00:54:51,560
Speaker 1: Was always a handsome detective Okay, yes.

986
00:54:52,719 --> 00:54:56,400
Speaker 3: And then the greater overarching mystery over the course of

987
00:54:56,400 --> 00:54:59,240
Speaker 3: both seasons so far has been who is Emily Lane?

988
00:54:59,719 --> 00:55:03,000
Speaker 3: What her backstory? So we play in these flashbacks and

989
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:06,760
Speaker 3: we get to, especially in season two, kind of tease

990
00:55:06,800 --> 00:55:09,799
Speaker 3: out more of her as a high schooler. And then

991
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:11,360
Speaker 3: I got to play I got to do like the

992
00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:14,960
Speaker 3: twenty five year old version of Emily.

993
00:55:15,160 --> 00:55:16,280
Speaker 1: That's so fun.

994
00:55:16,440 --> 00:55:19,360
Speaker 3: So it's like it has some alias vibes and soon

995
00:55:19,520 --> 00:55:23,120
Speaker 3: Kamaras vibes. It's really Oh what a really fun like

996
00:55:23,280 --> 00:55:27,360
Speaker 3: fe role like fetal, yeah, strong woman.

997
00:55:27,440 --> 00:55:29,480
Speaker 1: I love that. Does the audience get to kind of

998
00:55:29,480 --> 00:55:32,359
Speaker 1: try to figure out who Emily is? Oh?

999
00:55:32,440 --> 00:55:35,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, who Emily is? And also who the killer is

1000
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:38,520
Speaker 3: for the episode? My kids love the show. They're completely

1001
00:55:38,600 --> 00:55:40,560
Speaker 3: obsessed with it. Yeah, and they'll like the whole way

1002
00:55:40,560 --> 00:55:42,120
Speaker 3: through they'll be like, I think it's him. Oh no,

1003
00:55:42,200 --> 00:55:44,799
Speaker 3: I think it's her. Wow, Actually, hang on, what is

1004
00:55:44,840 --> 00:55:45,359
Speaker 3: she doing here?

1005
00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:45,759
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1006
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:46,479
Speaker 3: It's really fun.

1007
00:55:46,840 --> 00:55:49,080
Speaker 1: I know our listeners love to hear like the inside

1008
00:55:49,080 --> 00:55:52,239
Speaker 1: tips of the biz. When you step into a new

1009
00:55:52,320 --> 00:55:55,520
Speaker 1: role and you have the handsome detective relationship that you

1010
00:55:55,680 --> 00:56:00,120
Speaker 1: have to now create this connection and tension and like

1011
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:01,960
Speaker 1: the chemistry has to be right.

1012
00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:02,359
Speaker 3: How do you?

1013
00:56:02,719 --> 00:56:06,720
Speaker 1: How do you do that? Just such a great question,

1014
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:11,960
Speaker 1: because I for a while I've said I can have

1015
00:56:12,040 --> 00:56:14,879
Speaker 1: chemistry with a doorknob. Yeah, if I want to, Yeah,

1016
00:56:15,280 --> 00:56:15,960
Speaker 1: you feel the same way.

1017
00:56:16,000 --> 00:56:18,479
Speaker 3: I feel exactly the same. Good I really do feel

1018
00:56:18,520 --> 00:56:22,880
Speaker 3: exactly the same way. No, I think what I I

1019
00:56:22,920 --> 00:56:25,560
Speaker 3: am always on the hunt for loveliness. That is just

1020
00:56:25,960 --> 00:56:28,919
Speaker 3: kind of who I am in the world. And if

1021
00:56:28,920 --> 00:56:31,759
Speaker 3: I have to create chemistry really quickly with somebody, I

1022
00:56:31,880 --> 00:56:35,720
Speaker 3: kind of have this like, like what is lovely and

1023
00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:39,239
Speaker 3: delightful about you? So even if they're difficult, or if

1024
00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:43,960
Speaker 3: they're not whatever, even if they're things that aren't delightful

1025
00:56:44,480 --> 00:56:48,120
Speaker 3: across the board, I can in that moment put the

1026
00:56:48,120 --> 00:56:52,239
Speaker 3: blinders on and just focus. I remember, I have a

1027
00:56:52,360 --> 00:56:56,520
Speaker 3: very this is a good kind of story about chemistry.

1028
00:56:57,040 --> 00:56:59,600
Speaker 3: My first professional show was playing Juliette and Romeo and

1029
00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:03,040
Speaker 3: Juliette at this theater outside of New York, Macarter Theater,

1030
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:06,400
Speaker 3: and I remember going into New York to do the callback.

1031
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:10,040
Speaker 3: So I read like balcony scenes with the two different

1032
00:57:10,120 --> 00:57:12,640
Speaker 3: Romeos that they had, and I remember getting on the

1033
00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:16,720
Speaker 3: subway and I was so kind of high on the

1034
00:57:16,840 --> 00:57:22,960
Speaker 3: romance of the scene of like just the heightens the

1035
00:57:23,160 --> 00:57:27,040
Speaker 3: ultimate romance ultimate romantic scene right that I got on

1036
00:57:27,080 --> 00:57:29,280
Speaker 3: the train and I saw this like old probably seventy

1037
00:57:29,280 --> 00:57:31,760
Speaker 3: five year old bearded guy across the way, and I

1038
00:57:31,800 --> 00:57:33,960
Speaker 3: was like, if I had to, I could fall in

1039
00:57:33,960 --> 00:57:36,400
Speaker 3: love with that guy right now. Like I could do it.

1040
00:57:36,520 --> 00:57:40,920
Speaker 3: I could do it because when you when you allow

1041
00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:45,280
Speaker 3: your imagination to go fully into this is my real

1042
00:57:45,320 --> 00:57:47,800
Speaker 3: set of circumstances, and I truly really am in love

1043
00:57:47,840 --> 00:57:51,600
Speaker 3: with this person. When you let your imagination take you there,

1044
00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:55,160
Speaker 3: you could You could have chemistry with a trash can.

1045
00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:57,160
Speaker 1: You really could you? Just because it's just.

1046
00:57:57,160 --> 00:58:00,240
Speaker 3: It's just it's an imagine, it's an imagination exercise, right,

1047
00:58:00,720 --> 00:58:04,160
Speaker 3: and then some coasters are just delightfully easy to play with,

1048
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:07,480
Speaker 3: and then others take a little more tiding.

1049
00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:11,040
Speaker 1: Yes, we both dealt with that, I'm sure well. Before

1050
00:58:11,080 --> 00:58:14,960
Speaker 1: I let you go, Sarah Drew, what was your last

1051
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:16,200
Speaker 1: I Choose me moment?

1052
00:58:16,760 --> 00:58:21,880
Speaker 3: Last year, I burned myself out a little bit with

1053
00:58:21,920 --> 00:58:27,800
Speaker 3: work writing, producing while also starring on a show, and

1054
00:58:27,840 --> 00:58:31,080
Speaker 3: I was so exhausted that by the time November hit,

1055
00:58:31,840 --> 00:58:34,760
Speaker 3: I decided to start reading Romanticy.

1056
00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:40,440
Speaker 1: What I did not see this Kiming.

1057
00:58:40,920 --> 00:58:48,040
Speaker 3: Yes, I got so into Romanticy I basically was supposed

1058
00:58:48,040 --> 00:58:50,480
Speaker 3: to be writing all spring all winter and did not.

1059
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:54,720
Speaker 3: I read forty six books. I had to give it

1060
00:58:54,760 --> 00:58:58,080
Speaker 3: up for lent, Like I was like, I just need

1061
00:58:58,120 --> 00:59:01,680
Speaker 3: to pause because this has taken over my life. But

1062
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:05,960
Speaker 3: I will say I was saying earlier, it's very difficult

1063
00:59:06,120 --> 00:59:09,560
Speaker 3: for me to do something that is just just brings

1064
00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:14,120
Speaker 3: me joy and delight, that is not accomplishing anything. And

1065
00:59:14,440 --> 00:59:21,040
Speaker 3: reading fantasy and romanticy is like such a delightful traps

1066
00:59:21,160 --> 00:59:25,120
Speaker 3: into another world. I'm not trying to option anything, turn

1067
00:59:25,200 --> 00:59:28,360
Speaker 3: anything into a movie. I'm not trying to grow and

1068
00:59:28,440 --> 00:59:34,440
Speaker 3: expand I'm just trying to find delight. And I I

1069
00:59:34,480 --> 00:59:37,080
Speaker 3: would say that that was a nice moment of choosing me.

1070
00:59:37,400 --> 00:59:41,680
Speaker 3: I love that perfect Thank you so much for being

1071
00:59:41,760 --> 00:59:42,120
Speaker 3: with us.

1072
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:43,720
Speaker 1: I love Debbie here