1 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:04,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:14,400 Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio, Hello and Happy Friday. I'm Holly Frye and 3 00:00:14,480 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V. 4 00:00:15,240 --> 00:00:15,680 Speaker 2: Wilson. 5 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:17,880 Speaker 1: We talked about self help books this week. 6 00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:20,599 Speaker 2: We did Listen. I love a little self help book. 7 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 2: You want to. 8 00:00:21,680 --> 00:00:23,680 Speaker 1: Teach me how to make a great chart to do something? 9 00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:24,119 Speaker 2: I'm in it. 10 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:27,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, I like Ben Franklins method. I'm going to adapt 11 00:00:27,320 --> 00:00:29,720 Speaker 1: it for my own use in twenty twenty six. Okay, 12 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:34,800 Speaker 1: my virtues will not be the same. Yeah, I have 13 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 1: similar conflicted feelings to what you talked about in the introduction, 14 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:42,599 Speaker 1: because there have been times in my life where I 15 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:48,879 Speaker 1: was one hundred percent manufacturing my own misery. Uh, and 16 00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:52,600 Speaker 1: my own decisions and my own choices were at the 17 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:54,640 Speaker 1: root of that. And then there have been other times 18 00:00:54,640 --> 00:01:00,319 Speaker 1: in my life where what I needed was medication. Yeah, 19 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 1: and then a third level of times in my life 20 00:01:03,800 --> 00:01:07,199 Speaker 1: where maybe I didn't need medication, but maybe the circumstances 21 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 1: that were happening were so big and consuming that like 22 00:01:11,360 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 1: no amount of positivity can really counteract all of that, right, 23 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 1: And so there for sure been times that like various 24 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:24,319 Speaker 1: self help advice really could help me, But also times 25 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 1: where if somebody had tried to tell me any of that, 26 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:28,959 Speaker 1: not only would it have not helped, it would have. 27 00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:30,480 Speaker 2: Just made me feel worse. Yeah. 28 00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: I mean I feel like, you know, the people in 29 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 1: my life were not understanding that what I was dealing 30 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:39,479 Speaker 1: with was not you need to accentuate the positive. Yeah, 31 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 1: sometimes that feels so infantalizing and just completely you know, 32 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:52,279 Speaker 1: like ignorant and dismissive. And it's cruel to people sometimes 33 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 1: to be like, oh, this is a fixable problem, blah 34 00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 1: blah blah. Yeah, like sometimes it might be a fixable problem, 35 00:01:57,040 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: but people are not always ready to receive that information. Yeah, 36 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,360 Speaker 1: and it can be very hurtful. Yeah, it's tricky. 37 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 2: So it's tricky. 38 00:02:04,960 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 1: We've all known someone where we're like, if they just 39 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 1: did this differently, everything would work better. But you don't 40 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:13,280 Speaker 1: know what's going on in their brain chemistry sometimes either. 41 00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:15,080 Speaker 1: That's why I wanted to mention at the end that 42 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:17,679 Speaker 1: there are people there are some studies that suggest, right 43 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:21,919 Speaker 1: for people that are negative thinkers, there is a term. 44 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,359 Speaker 1: It's called, i think, defensive negativism. It's like you are 45 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 1: so inclined to see how things can go terribly wrong 46 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 1: that you actually end up better prepared for any possible outcome, 47 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 1: whereas if you're like Sunshine and Daisies and like it's 48 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 1: going to work out and then it goes horrifically sideways, 49 00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 1: you just fall apart because you were not even considering 50 00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:50,240 Speaker 1: what could happen. Yeah, and there are other that's like one, 51 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: you know, sort of psychological profile that obviates the fact 52 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 1: that this stuff does not is not always going to 53 00:02:56,680 --> 00:03:00,480 Speaker 1: be effective for everybody. But yeah, it's such an interesting, 54 00:03:00,919 --> 00:03:03,760 Speaker 1: interesting space. Yeah, what you just said reminded me a 55 00:03:03,800 --> 00:03:06,839 Speaker 1: little bit of some research from like the beginning of 56 00:03:07,840 --> 00:03:14,079 Speaker 1: the COVID nineteen pandemic, where people who had issues with anxiety, 57 00:03:14,240 --> 00:03:19,640 Speaker 1: me included, had an initial relief in that anxiety because 58 00:03:19,639 --> 00:03:22,840 Speaker 1: it was sort of like our minds went, oh, the 59 00:03:22,919 --> 00:03:26,959 Speaker 1: disaster I've been waiting for is here. And my mom 60 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 1: had kind of like my mom also a very anxious person, 61 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 1: and then when she was I'm laughing because she laughed 62 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 1: about it too, when she was diagnosed with an incurable 63 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:41,840 Speaker 1: progressive disease, it was like her mind went, oh, okay, 64 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:45,760 Speaker 1: we're here. Now. I've been preparing for this my whole life. 65 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: I was waiting for the bad thing to happen, and 66 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:53,320 Speaker 1: now we have the bad thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's 67 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 1: I mean, right, there are other iterations of those kinds 68 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:00,400 Speaker 1: of things where there were people I'm I mean, I know, 69 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 1: for me, the early part of the pandemic was actually 70 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:07,760 Speaker 1: like a weirdly good time. I was obviously not happy 71 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 1: about people becoming ill and all of the death that 72 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:14,720 Speaker 1: we were dealing with, but the stillness of being home 73 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:17,960 Speaker 1: was something I had not experienced for a long time, 74 00:04:18,040 --> 00:04:20,440 Speaker 1: and it was very good for my brain. Yeah, and 75 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:23,479 Speaker 1: I think like there, I mean, in every other possible 76 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:26,719 Speaker 1: you know, scenario of what works in terms of positive 77 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:31,120 Speaker 1: and negative thinking is also true. I will tell you this. Okay, 78 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:35,919 Speaker 1: it's a short book, but reading I didn't read it 79 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 1: all the way through. But reading Seneca's on the Shortness 80 00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:42,200 Speaker 1: of Life, I mean I had read parts of it 81 00:04:42,720 --> 00:04:46,280 Speaker 1: in various courses in high school and college, but I 82 00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 1: hadn't revisited it in like thirty years, and now I'm like, 83 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:51,159 Speaker 1: I need to reread this whole thing. It's actually very 84 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:52,320 Speaker 1: reassuring and nice. 85 00:04:52,640 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 2: Yeah. 86 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 1: His wisdom is very much like live in the moment. Yeah, 87 00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:01,279 Speaker 1: don't keep putting stuff on, just do what you want. 88 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,039 Speaker 1: To do with your life because there's never a perfect time. 89 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:05,719 Speaker 1: Now is the time? 90 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:07,719 Speaker 2: And I'm like, I love you, Seneca. 91 00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, that reminds me of a movie I watched very 92 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: recently which has come See Me in the Good Light. 93 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,520 Speaker 1: It is about spoken word poet Andrea Gibson and their 94 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: partner when Andrew was diagnosed with a varying cancer and 95 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 1: they wrote a poem that begins along the lines of 96 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:33,920 Speaker 1: feeling like they were about at the beginning of a nightmare, 97 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:38,039 Speaker 1: but it really being a story of how much easier 98 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 1: happiness is to find when you realize you don't have 99 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:43,480 Speaker 1: much time left to find it, right, that's a paraphrase. 100 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:45,520 Speaker 2: I'm not Andrea. 101 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 1: Gibson in any way, but it had a lot in 102 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 1: common with what we read of Seneca. Yeah, yeah, I 103 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:54,880 Speaker 1: really really liked revisiting that, and I want to sit 104 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:57,599 Speaker 1: down with it over the end of the year here 105 00:05:57,640 --> 00:05:59,240 Speaker 1: and just kind of read you the whole because, like 106 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:01,839 Speaker 1: I said, it's not that long. Yeah, very easy. The 107 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 1: Charles Manson thing is fascinating to me. That's wild that 108 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:07,720 Speaker 1: he's like, Yeah, I read that book and it really 109 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 1: changed my life. And then I let a cult and 110 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:14,640 Speaker 1: that made me able to lead a cult and convince people. 111 00:06:15,080 --> 00:06:18,279 Speaker 1: And there have been interviews with members from his cult, 112 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:21,240 Speaker 1: people that are still in prison, who have been like, yeah, 113 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:23,839 Speaker 1: that's exactly what he did. Yeah, he used all those techniques. Yeah, 114 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: now I understand what was happening, which is just wild 115 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:29,440 Speaker 1: to me because it's such an extreme It's not like 116 00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 1: I want this guy to do my paperwork for me. 117 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 1: It's like such an extreme behavior that he's convincing people 118 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:37,840 Speaker 1: that they had the idea to do that. That is 119 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:39,000 Speaker 1: to me like mind blowing. 120 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 2: Mm hmm. 121 00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:55,040 Speaker 1: Here's my fun part of the behind the scenes. I'm 122 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:58,239 Speaker 1: still on Ben Franklin. Listen Ben Franklin. I don't believe 123 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:01,600 Speaker 1: in holding anybody up as on a pedestal, but I 124 00:07:01,640 --> 00:07:04,200 Speaker 1: really like the way he talks about how to do this, 125 00:07:04,360 --> 00:07:07,360 Speaker 1: and I really like the whole ideology of like you 126 00:07:07,400 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 1: can work on one thing at a time and revisit 127 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 1: it and know that you're gonna have to cycle through it, 128 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 1: and it's a progress you know, it's you're progressing. You're 129 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:17,360 Speaker 1: not necessarily ever going to get to this like apex 130 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:20,200 Speaker 1: state of achievement. But here is where I'm reading that, 131 00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:22,400 Speaker 1: and there's another section that I didn't go into that. 132 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:24,520 Speaker 1: I was like, Ben Franklin, what's wrong with you? And 133 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 1: here's what it is. He wasn't. I'm literally I don't 134 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:30,920 Speaker 1: even know how to discribe. It's so silly and it's 135 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:35,400 Speaker 1: so unimportant. But it really was just like, what again, 136 00:07:35,760 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 1: my brother, I have the solution for you. Why didn't 137 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:41,280 Speaker 1: you do this this way? He was erasing his black 138 00:07:41,360 --> 00:07:44,840 Speaker 1: marks and starting over with the same page instead of 139 00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 1: making another page. And then in his book he talks 140 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: about how difficult that made it and how it wore 141 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:53,920 Speaker 1: through the page, and then eventually he realized he could 142 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 1: use like a sturdier substance that he could make the 143 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:00,640 Speaker 1: permanent lines with, and then something like a an oil 144 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:02,640 Speaker 1: crayon that could be easily marked off. And I'm like, 145 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 1: did you not just think to turn the page and 146 00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 1: make another chart? Maybe maybe thought I would waste paper. 147 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 2: Maybe, but I don't know. 148 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 1: I feel like if you were turning the page, if 149 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:17,520 Speaker 1: you had a paper or a you know, a journal 150 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 1: or something that was for this purpose, you would be 151 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: able to see your progress over time exactly. Yeah, that 152 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 1: one blew my mind. 153 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:27,000 Speaker 2: Maybe thought it was wasteful. 154 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 1: I'm gonna that's another use for the time machine. I'm 155 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:31,960 Speaker 1: gonna go back and be like, yo, yeah, Ben Franklin, 156 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 1: do you want me to just make all the charts 157 00:08:33,760 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 1: for you and you can just turning the pages? Because 158 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:39,160 Speaker 1: I don't mind. I have a template. I'm an Aaron 159 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:41,480 Speaker 1: Conduring girly. I have figured out all the things I 160 00:08:41,559 --> 00:08:46,360 Speaker 1: need too. Yeah, if you thought a different one on 161 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 1: every page was wasteful, he would really hate how many 162 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: journals I've bought and written three or four pages in 163 00:08:51,480 --> 00:08:54,959 Speaker 1: and then never picked up again. I do think Ben 164 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 1: Franklin would love bullet journaling. 165 00:08:56,800 --> 00:08:57,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so too. 166 00:08:57,760 --> 00:09:01,840 Speaker 1: I think he would love it, Yeah, because he did 167 00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 1: like to keep a little He loved a little chart. 168 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 1: He'd love to make a little diagram of how his 169 00:09:07,559 --> 00:09:09,960 Speaker 1: day was gonna go. I was about to say, I 170 00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:13,319 Speaker 1: wonder what Samuel Peeps would think of, but I don't 171 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:17,640 Speaker 1: think Samuel Peeps would be a bullet journaler. Samuel Peeps, 172 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,040 Speaker 1: I'm gonna make a callback to a much earlier episode. 173 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:23,319 Speaker 1: Samuel Peeps would be one of those dudes who buys 174 00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:25,920 Speaker 1: an almanac and keeps his little journal entry in each 175 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 1: day of the almanac. 176 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:28,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, he would do that. 177 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:33,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, because his his entries were just too usually 178 00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 1: brief and sometimes just very almost utilitarian, and how they 179 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 1: were focused on things. 180 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:41,559 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think he would really be into bullet journaling. 181 00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 2: Ben Franklin would. Yeah, then Franklin loves a bullet journal. 182 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:45,959 Speaker 2: That's the shirt. 183 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,439 Speaker 1: I do have a million self help books on how 184 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 1: to clean ma darn house. Yeah, ask me how clean 185 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:55,320 Speaker 1: my house is. I don't want to no amount, no 186 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:57,840 Speaker 1: amount clean. I mean part of it is just I'm 187 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 1: a maximalist. I have too much stuff I have. Recently, 188 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 1: since we got back from Morocco, I have really been 189 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 1: like something flipped in my head while we were traveling 190 00:10:06,880 --> 00:10:09,080 Speaker 1: and I was like, I need to get rid of 191 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:12,000 Speaker 1: some of my stuff. Yeah, which is very hard for 192 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 1: me because I'm one of those people that imbuse stuff 193 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 1: with personality in my head, like I was that child 194 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:22,920 Speaker 1: that would like I had a little chart to rotate 195 00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:26,320 Speaker 1: my stuffed animals so no one felt left out where 196 00:10:26,320 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 1: it would be like, Okay, now the seven of you 197 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 1: can be on the bed, but I don't have room 198 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:33,040 Speaker 1: for eight. But I promise you next ones in line 199 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 1: are going to move onto the bed next week. Like 200 00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 1: in my head and animate objects have feelings and thoughts. 201 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,160 Speaker 1: I know that's very cuckoo. So it's hard for me 202 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:42,839 Speaker 1: to get rid of things because I don't want them 203 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: to feel abandoned or unloved, even shoes, even stupid things. 204 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:54,320 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm trying to think of how small and 205 00:10:54,400 --> 00:10:56,240 Speaker 1: unimportant a thing has to be before I don't give 206 00:10:56,280 --> 00:11:00,440 Speaker 1: it a personality in my head. Yeah, I'm like a 207 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:01,200 Speaker 1: binder clip. 208 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:02,560 Speaker 2: Yeah. 209 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: And I'm just sitting here thinking about Marie Condo and 210 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 1: how much her whole philosophy is based in like Shinto animism, 211 00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:13,600 Speaker 1: and how that seems to have parallels with your giving 212 00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:18,199 Speaker 1: objects feelings. Yeah, yeah, I always have. Yeah, I don't 213 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:23,280 Speaker 1: always always. It's like I have an obnoxious number of 214 00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:28,000 Speaker 1: stuffed animals and they all have names, personality traits. 215 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:32,680 Speaker 2: Listen. 216 00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 1: I know it's very silly, but it is what it is. 217 00:11:35,720 --> 00:11:38,200 Speaker 1: I don't want to always be a maximalist. I understand. 218 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 1: I agree that your goods will eventually cause you problems. 219 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:44,280 Speaker 1: I have too many things, but I love them. 220 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:47,679 Speaker 2: Yeah. Here we are. I'm working on it. I'm working 221 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:47,960 Speaker 2: on it. 222 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:54,600 Speaker 1: We're recording this shortly before Christmas. Yeah, and I've had 223 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 1: some every year. 224 00:11:56,160 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 2: You know. 225 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:59,680 Speaker 1: My dad is like, what's your Christmas list, and this 226 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:01,560 Speaker 1: year there was just there was nothing on it. 227 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:03,000 Speaker 2: There were no things on it. 228 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 1: He was really trying to get me to tell him 229 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:06,960 Speaker 1: something that and I was like, what I want for 230 00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:12,319 Speaker 1: Christmas is less. I want less things. Can the Christmas 231 00:12:12,360 --> 00:12:15,839 Speaker 1: present be something that is in my house that I 232 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,160 Speaker 1: don't use anymore, that I don't even remember that I own. 233 00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:20,719 Speaker 1: It's just gone. 234 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:22,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, I. 235 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: Long ago, thankfully, we don't really do Christmas presents. Brian 236 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 1: and I will sometimes get each other very silly, small things, 237 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 1: but not big presents. A long time ago in my family, 238 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:36,200 Speaker 1: I was like, I would like to give you all 239 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:39,080 Speaker 1: the gift of don't worry about it. Yeah, I don't 240 00:12:39,120 --> 00:12:41,040 Speaker 1: need more stuff. None of us are going to pick 241 00:12:41,080 --> 00:12:43,959 Speaker 1: the things that the other people really wanted anyway, We're 242 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:47,079 Speaker 1: all too busy to make a list. We're giving each 243 00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:50,920 Speaker 1: other the gift of freedom. Don't even think about it. 244 00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:52,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's fine. I love this. 245 00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I mean most of the time, like my 246 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:57,760 Speaker 1: close friends, if I'm going to give them something, it's 247 00:12:57,840 --> 00:12:59,840 Speaker 1: usually something I found throughout the year that seems like 248 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:02,199 Speaker 1: exactly the right thing for them. And sometimes I will 249 00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:04,559 Speaker 1: not wait until Christmas. But also a lot of times, 250 00:13:04,559 --> 00:13:07,839 Speaker 1: it's like a consumable, like a yeah yea delicious food 251 00:13:07,880 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 1: that they love, or like their favorite tea, or an 252 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 1: alcohol that they're a fan of like because we don't 253 00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:16,120 Speaker 1: none of us need more stuff. As much as I'm 254 00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:19,360 Speaker 1: a stuphoholic, I know I've reached a one in, one 255 00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 1: out policy as a bare minimum right now, and then 256 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:26,679 Speaker 1: we'll see how long that lasts. Because I'm real bad 257 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:29,280 Speaker 1: about it. I have the fugue state in the morning 258 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 1: when I'm not awake yet and I'm drinking my coffee 259 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,160 Speaker 1: on the couch, and I order stuff without even knowing it. 260 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:36,440 Speaker 1: That's how I have a new sewing machine that I 261 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:40,320 Speaker 1: don't even remember ordering, but I have the receipt that 262 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 1: I ordered it. Clearly I ordered it, but it is pink, 263 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:49,240 Speaker 1: so I mean I needed that clearly. I have yet 264 00:13:49,240 --> 00:13:57,680 Speaker 1: to unbox it because I don't have space. We talked 265 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:01,240 Speaker 1: on New Year's Eve about dinner party that happened in 266 00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:05,680 Speaker 1: an iguanadon which I chose just because it seemed so silly. 267 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:08,839 Speaker 1: This is exactly my kind of dinner party. Yeah, I 268 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 1: I was looking around for something that would be, you know, 269 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 1: contextually relevant to New Year's New Year's Eve. We've had 270 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: various things that we have put out when an episode 271 00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:22,120 Speaker 1: has come out on either New Year's Eve or New 272 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:27,200 Speaker 1: Year's Day that has been somehow related in some way. 273 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:30,920 Speaker 1: And I also was like, I would like to just 274 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:36,760 Speaker 1: do something kind of silly, the best kine, the best kind. Yeah, 275 00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:40,960 Speaker 1: because heavy things are happening in the world. I've done 276 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:43,800 Speaker 1: a number of heavier episodes of over the course of 277 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:47,560 Speaker 1: the year. I was like, let's just wind up the 278 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:54,160 Speaker 1: year with something silly and delightful, benign and kooky and 279 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:59,880 Speaker 1: mostly benign except for Richard Owen being weirdly mean and 280 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:00,800 Speaker 1: hetty and a. 281 00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 2: Jerk to people. 282 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 1: I so I had I had outlined the basic stuff 283 00:15:09,400 --> 00:15:13,720 Speaker 1: about the park and the construction of the dinosaurs and 284 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:15,920 Speaker 1: all of that kind of stuff, and I was like, 285 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:18,560 Speaker 1: I think we need just a little bit in here 286 00:15:19,760 --> 00:15:23,680 Speaker 1: about Benjamin Waterhouse Hawkins, Like I don't really have like 287 00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:27,360 Speaker 1: who is this person? Yeah, And I can't remember which 288 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 1: source I wound up at first. It might have been 289 00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:32,320 Speaker 1: the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography. 290 00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:34,440 Speaker 2: It might have been Britannica. I don't remember. 291 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: I had gone to some basic source that I would 292 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:43,760 Speaker 1: turn to to get basic biographical information about a person. Yeah, 293 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:46,480 Speaker 1: and I was just sort of skimming through blah blah blah, 294 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:55,800 Speaker 1: born in London, da, DA, bigamous marriage. I was like, 295 00:15:55,880 --> 00:15:57,960 Speaker 1: should I stop what I'm doing and do this whole 296 00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 1: episode on this guy? And I was like, no, you 297 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:02,600 Speaker 1: took too many notes about the rest of it, and 298 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:05,359 Speaker 1: plus you're too busy with the dinosaur. 299 00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:08,040 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yes, we're going to do the dinosaur thing. 300 00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:13,360 Speaker 1: I had previously flagged the models that he had made 301 00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:16,120 Speaker 1: for dinosaurs that were supposed to go in Central Park. 302 00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: I have an old article on that that I had 303 00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:21,960 Speaker 1: flagged as like maybe something to do an episode on, 304 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:25,360 Speaker 1: and that never really came to fruition. But of course 305 00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:27,560 Speaker 1: it will be part of things if there ever is 306 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:34,280 Speaker 1: an episode just on Waterhouse Hawkins, yeah, and his marriage 307 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 1: to two women at the same time. This episode, you 308 00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:43,080 Speaker 1: may not have realized, might have a slight downer vibe 309 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 1: to a very specific group of listeners. Okay, to Disney 310 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:51,240 Speaker 1: fans who have to acknowledge that we will no longer 311 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:57,560 Speaker 1: have dinosaur in Animal Kingdom Park after early February as 312 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:00,560 Speaker 1: part of a park refresh which has an iguana in it. 313 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:02,600 Speaker 1: Uh huh, They're not gonna make it. 314 00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:04,959 Speaker 2: They're not gonna make it. We're not ever gonna make 315 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:10,000 Speaker 2: it on that ride again. It's fine. 316 00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:12,680 Speaker 1: I'm okay because you know I've said before I love change. 317 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:14,560 Speaker 1: I'm kind of addicted to it, so I'm fine with it. 318 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,040 Speaker 1: But a lot of people get really upset when things 319 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:21,680 Speaker 1: in the park change. Yeah, but we'll always have the memories. 320 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:25,800 Speaker 1: We'll always have Felicia a ors Allen. I'm trying to 321 00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:30,000 Speaker 1: remember because I've been to Animal Kingdom a couple of 322 00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:32,399 Speaker 1: times as a grown up, once with you. 323 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, surely we rode that. Surely we did. Yeah, Like, 324 00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 2: I just can't bring it to mind what I am remembering. 325 00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:45,280 Speaker 1: Oh, there's a remote possibility we skipped it because we 326 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:49,680 Speaker 1: had already done Star Tours, which did not did not 327 00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:50,520 Speaker 1: agree with you. 328 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 2: I had an unhappy time on Star Tours. Yeah. 329 00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:56,359 Speaker 1: It is also on a gimbal rig, but one that 330 00:17:56,560 --> 00:18:00,280 Speaker 1: is a moving car. So I vaguely recall us having 331 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:04,120 Speaker 1: a conversation of I don't think you're gonna like this ride, yeah, 332 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:06,400 Speaker 1: or at least your body won't, even if your mind 333 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:10,760 Speaker 1: wants to. I was so excited about Star Tours and 334 00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:16,920 Speaker 1: the way that ride works is for folks who don't know. 335 00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 1: You are seated on a platform that's on a gimble rig, 336 00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:27,240 Speaker 1: it moves around. You're looking at a three D movie basically, 337 00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:33,280 Speaker 1: and that technology has gotten really pretty good, but it's 338 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:37,760 Speaker 1: not really possible to have it be perfect between what 339 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 1: you're experiencing physically on the gimble rig and what your 340 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:46,080 Speaker 1: eyes are seeing on the projection. And I instantly was like, 341 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:52,920 Speaker 1: oh no, And I spent the entirety of the ride 342 00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:56,200 Speaker 1: with my whole being focused on not being ill. 343 00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, and so I have never gone on any other 344 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:03,040 Speaker 2: ride that works that way. Yeah. 345 00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:06,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, for Dinosaur, you're in a car, but the car 346 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:10,200 Speaker 1: has its own like, yeah, similar movement as you're moving 347 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:13,080 Speaker 1: through the environment. And so I think I think we 348 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:15,840 Speaker 1: did have a discussion about it in situ where I 349 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:19,920 Speaker 1: was like, I'm a little worried about this ride for you, Yeah, 350 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:23,800 Speaker 1: and I described it and you went nope below nonks 351 00:19:24,080 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 1: probably went and got a cocktail somewhere. 352 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:26,880 Speaker 2: Yeah. 353 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:30,480 Speaker 1: Things that I definitely remember from Animal Kingdom are that 354 00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:34,520 Speaker 1: big tree of life. Yes, and there is a picture 355 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:40,040 Speaker 1: that I think either you or Brian took of me 356 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:45,160 Speaker 1: standing in front of it, just making an exuberant expression. 357 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 2: It looks like it's growing out of my head. It's 358 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:47,760 Speaker 2: pretty great. 359 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:50,159 Speaker 1: Then I probably took it because Brian would line it 360 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 1: up better than that. It's just my guess. 361 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:54,440 Speaker 2: Yeah. 362 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:57,160 Speaker 1: And then I also remember this is the FII Ride 363 00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:03,120 Speaker 1: of course, yes, and delicious food, oh more delicious food 364 00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 1: around every corner. There's also I don't remember exactly where 365 00:20:08,080 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 1: this is an Animal Kingdom, but you know, as you're 366 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:13,560 Speaker 1: walking around places that are decorated to look like a 367 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:17,440 Speaker 1: place that you were walking through. There's one place that 368 00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:20,600 Speaker 1: we that had a sign that said something to the 369 00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:25,600 Speaker 1: effect of must have papers to pass. That's probably over 370 00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:29,600 Speaker 1: by Expedition Everest. That sounds maybe right, and like that's 371 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:31,480 Speaker 1: not the exact wording on it at all, But I 372 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:33,840 Speaker 1: remember seeing it as an adult and being like, if 373 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 1: I saw that sign as a six year old, I 374 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:41,960 Speaker 1: would be so focused on whether we were going to 375 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:45,159 Speaker 1: get in trouble for not having whatever passes it is 376 00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:49,800 Speaker 1: that they are requiring. Anyway, those are random memories of 377 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 1: Animal Kingdom Park, which is only tangentially related to eating 378 00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:58,200 Speaker 1: dinner and an iguanadon. I mean, if Disney were smart, 379 00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:02,200 Speaker 1: that would be great. Keep using Fridays to tell Disney 380 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:02,720 Speaker 1: what I want. 381 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:02,879 Speaker 2: Them to do. 382 00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:06,600 Speaker 1: But eight inside one of the rides, but it goes down. 383 00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:09,760 Speaker 1: Probably that would be only for very fancy pants people there. Yeah. 384 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 2: Yeah. 385 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 1: Some of the articles about this mentioned a museum in 386 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:16,800 Speaker 1: the United States where a dinner was held. It was 387 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 1: not clear to me whether it was like in the 388 00:21:20,280 --> 00:21:25,040 Speaker 1: rib cage of a giant fossil of some extinct animal, 389 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:28,320 Speaker 1: or whether it was like under the articulated skeleton, and 390 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:33,200 Speaker 1: whether it had been an inspiration to these folks when they. 391 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:33,840 Speaker 2: Put this together. 392 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:35,720 Speaker 1: And I was like that all just seems kind of 393 00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 1: speculative to me, especially since this other dinner was something 394 00:21:39,359 --> 00:21:43,080 Speaker 1: like twenty years before the Iguanadon dinner, So I just 395 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:46,000 Speaker 1: didn't get into it. Also, I on purpose arranged the 396 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:48,480 Speaker 1: outline so that you had to read the menu. 397 00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 2: You mean, jerk. 398 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:52,560 Speaker 1: I mean, my French is decent, but some of that 399 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 1: is like Frenglish. 400 00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, some of it feels like half made up French. 401 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:02,320 Speaker 1: Ye, like the you know, there would be like a 402 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:04,920 Speaker 1: French word in it, but then an English word yeah, 403 00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 1: about a very specific English way of cooking something. And 404 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:14,040 Speaker 1: I was like, well, yeah, shabootles. Yeah, just wing it 405 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:17,080 Speaker 1: is what I say, Just swing it, swing it it's 406 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:20,000 Speaker 1: all food. I was bounded that I couldn't find more 407 00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:23,680 Speaker 1: specifics about how the meal was prepared, because there was 408 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:27,080 Speaker 1: just this one source that said that Hawkins's cooked most 409 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:31,840 Speaker 1: of it, and then the bill of fare crediting Charles 410 00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: higginbottom of the the Annerly Tavern, and then European Mansion 411 00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:42,119 Speaker 1: House Street. The only references I found to European Mansion 412 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:47,240 Speaker 1: House Street were an archaeological find in that area that 413 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:49,840 Speaker 1: found like drink wear. 414 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,560 Speaker 2: That was embossed with that. Huh. 415 00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:57,440 Speaker 1: And I did not go down that rabbit hole for 416 00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:00,560 Speaker 1: two very long, but I was like, I wonder, what's 417 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:02,399 Speaker 1: up with this? What sounds like it must be a 418 00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:07,840 Speaker 1: restaurant of some sort. So anyway, anyway, we have started 419 00:23:07,840 --> 00:23:11,560 Speaker 1: a new year now as of when this Friday behind 420 00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:14,960 Speaker 1: the Scenes is coming out, So I hope everyone had 421 00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:19,080 Speaker 1: a great New Year's Eve, whatever was going on, whatever 422 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:22,120 Speaker 1: is coming up for you this coming weekend. I hope 423 00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:25,159 Speaker 1: it's also great. I know for a lot of folks 424 00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:31,399 Speaker 1: that are in kind of office jobs type situations, this 425 00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 1: is sort of the weekend before we're returning. 426 00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:36,480 Speaker 2: Back to work post holidays. 427 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 1: So if you're able to take a final breath before 428 00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:44,160 Speaker 1: diving back into the workplace. If you're in a role 429 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:48,399 Speaker 1: where you've been working this whole time, I hope there 430 00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:50,480 Speaker 1: has been a break for you in there somewhere, And 431 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:52,800 Speaker 1: if not, I hope there is one coming up soon. 432 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:54,359 Speaker 2: You know. 433 00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 1: We just wish the best for everybody. We hope your 434 00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:01,000 Speaker 1: year is off to a good start. We will be 435 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:04,760 Speaker 1: back with a Saturday Classic tomorrow and something brand new 436 00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:12,800 Speaker 1: on Monday. Stuff you Missed in History Class is a 437 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:17,200 Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the 438 00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:20,719 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 439 00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:21,439 Speaker 1: favorite shows.