Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. This is Bloomberg Business
Speaker 1: Week with Carol Messer and Tim Stenebek on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2: All Right, so I don't know about you, but at
Speaker 2: certain points over the last couple of years, I know, Tim,
Speaker 2: I've thought about going to Greece. I was just talking
Speaker 2: to my daughter who's planning. She's overseas. That's on her
Speaker 2: list before she heads back home here to New York.
Speaker 2: And you open up your Instagram a lot and think
Speaker 2: about it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, trying not to open up my Instagram too much
Speaker 3: because you know, hashtag fomo. But it does feel like
Speaker 3: at certain points of the year, everyone in my feet
Speaker 3: is either in Greece or Italy. Like, I don't know
Speaker 3: what's going on. It's actually not our imagination here, Carol.
Speaker 3: More Americans are going to Greece. In November of twenty
Speaker 3: twenty three, tourists spending by US travelers increased by sixty
Speaker 3: two point four percent to more than sixty five million euros.
Speaker 2: A lot of folks in Greece wants even more Americans
Speaker 2: to come and spend time and money in Greece. And
Speaker 2: that's why Olga Kavaloyani, the country's Minister of Tourism is
Speaker 2: here in the United States, she joins us, now here
Speaker 2: in our Bloombergy Interactive Brokers Studio OGA. A pleasure to
Speaker 2: have you here. First up, why are you in New York?
Speaker 4: Well, thank you very much for hosting me, and thank
Speaker 4: you very much for giving me the opportunity to talk
Speaker 4: about what we're trying to do in terms of tourism
Speaker 4: in Greece. Of course, American market is a very important
Speaker 4: source market for Greek tourism, and twenty twenty three was
Speaker 4: a record year for Greek tourism as a whole, but
Speaker 4: both in terms of arrivals, also in terms of revenue,
Speaker 4: and it was also a record year in terms of
Speaker 4: Americans arriving in Greece and spending in Greece.
Speaker 2: Show us the pie, like how much in terms of tourists,
Speaker 2: how much are from America, how much are from elsewhere,
Speaker 2: maybe from the European continent or so well.
Speaker 4: The majority of our of our visitors are from European countries.
Speaker 4: So we believe that there's a lot of room, you know,
Speaker 4: for the increase from the American market. But you know,
Speaker 4: up to a couple of years ago, we didn't even
Speaker 4: have a direct connection, so this was actually an impediment.
Speaker 4: So nowadays we have direct connections through New York, Boston
Speaker 4: and Chicago and this year twenty twenty four will be
Speaker 4: having even more connections. So I think direct flights are.
Speaker 3: So there were no direct flights.
Speaker 4: There were direct flights, but they were not year round,
Speaker 4: so they were very seasonal.
Speaker 3: So what do you think when a person, when an
Speaker 3: American is making the choice about where to go on
Speaker 3: vacation and they're choosing, like they're in, you know, in
Speaker 3: that stage where they're planning that trip, what prevents them
Speaker 3: from choosing Greece? Like what's the barrier that they need
Speaker 3: to get over?
Speaker 4: Well, first of all, I think that connectivity is very important,
Speaker 4: so we are very happy that nowadays there is more
Speaker 4: of a direct connection through a lot of airlines. But
Speaker 4: I think that an embediment, if this is a correct
Speaker 4: let's say word, would be that Greece is mostly associated
Speaker 4: with summer vacations. So Greece is always associated with the
Speaker 4: Greek Islands, a beach, vacation, sea and sun, and there
Speaker 4: is a lot more in Greece than just that. So
Speaker 4: what we are trying to do is extended season and
Speaker 4: promote Greece as a year round destination for Americans throughout
Speaker 4: the States, because it's not just the East Coast, it's
Speaker 4: also the West Coast and all the other parts of
Speaker 4: America that well.
Speaker 2: Remind us about the weather in Greece, because it is true,
Speaker 2: like when I'm thinking about when traveling, or I know
Speaker 2: my daughter she was looking when did some overseas traveling
Speaker 2: in December and talked about Greece, and I'm like, I
Speaker 2: think it's kind of cold there in December. But give
Speaker 2: us an idea so as you make it year round.
Speaker 2: I mean, the weather is supportive of doing what in December,
Speaker 2: or give us an idea of how you're thinking about
Speaker 2: that year round approach.
Speaker 4: Well, when we're talking about the year round approach, that
Speaker 4: means that, of course you can have year round beach vacation,
Speaker 4: but the weather is very moderate year round, so you
Speaker 4: would have a very nice experience in the countryside the
Speaker 4: mainland Greece, mountainous areas, and you can have some activities
Speaker 4: outdoors in the nature like trekking, rafting for anyone who's
Speaker 4: interested in astronomy. Of course, Greece is associated with really
Speaker 4: good food, so I think that you would find like
Speaker 4: a Michelin Star restaurants in Athens, but also super super
Speaker 4: cute and super nice at awareness in all parts of Greece.
Speaker 3: We had an executive from a real estate firm based
Speaker 3: in Texas on a few weeks ago, and he's a
Speaker 3: New Yorker but moved to Texas to become a CEO
Speaker 3: of this job. He's of this company, and he told
Speaker 3: us we're asking him what he missed about New York,
Speaker 3: and he was like, I can't get any good Greek
Speaker 3: food in Texas, like in the entire state. He's like,
Speaker 3: when I come to New York, the first thing I
Speaker 3: do is like, goo, get some Greek food, not of
Speaker 3: course saying it's anything close to what you find in.
Speaker 4: Greece, but yeah, but you know, like even you know,
Speaker 4: for us, when we are in a Greek island and
Speaker 4: we have the fish that is just like caught fresh
Speaker 4: fish and it's just grilled fish. You don't really need
Speaker 4: to have a lot of seasoning or you know, like
Speaker 4: very cooking in a very particular way. You just have
Speaker 4: like very very good raw materials, and then you just
Speaker 4: have like olive oil, Greek olive oil, and it's like
Speaker 4: the best meal that you can have.
Speaker 3: I'm sold. I want to talk a little bit about balance.
Speaker 3: Though tourism is certainly important, but also maintaining historical significance,
Speaker 3: maintaining artifacts and making sure that the place doesn't overrun
Speaker 3: with tourists. How do you find that balance.
Speaker 4: Well, it's actually the biggest challenge right now, and this
Speaker 4: is why I'm as a minister. I'm always talking about,
Speaker 4: you know, like the new era for Greek tourism, which
Speaker 4: takes local communities needs into and to you know, significance
Speaker 4: when it comes you know, to planning. Because we see that,
Speaker 4: of course tourism is a very big source of revenue
Speaker 4: for the local economy. It's also a very big generator
Speaker 4: of jobs. For Greece. Tourism represents almost twenty percent of GDP,
Speaker 4: both in terms of direct and indirect contribution, so you
Speaker 4: see this is a very important economic activity. But at
Speaker 4: the same time we see that there's a lot of
Speaker 4: pressure to the local communities and of course we really
Speaker 4: need to to protect and preserve our natural environment, our
Speaker 4: cultural environment.
Speaker 2: When you're blue economy, I have to say I am obsessed.
Speaker 2: I'm a sailor and my husband I are obsessed with
Speaker 2: some of the YouTubers that sail the world and they
Speaker 2: spend a lot of time in the Mediterranian and certainly
Speaker 2: in your neighborhood and at your home, and that economy
Speaker 2: in terms of supporting fishermen, the ocean economy, the blue
Speaker 2: economy is so important. So just to you know, kind
Speaker 2: of push a little bit more on and what Tim
Speaker 2: was asking about, like that economy, you want to make
Speaker 2: sure that doesn't come undone by a mass, you know,
Speaker 2: move of tourists into the area that maybe it can occur,
Speaker 2: because I see it in areas around the world as
Speaker 2: a diver, like just whether it's cruising or cruise ships
Speaker 2: or just over development that just really messes up the
Speaker 2: ocean economy and then impacts a country or I.
Speaker 4: Couldn't agree with you more. This is why our strategy
Speaker 4: is focused on sustainability, and we take sustainability when it
Speaker 4: comes to the marine environment very very seriously. This is
Speaker 4: why we just founded this observatory for Marathion and coastal
Speaker 4: tourism in the middle of the Rain region. So we
Speaker 4: did this and collaboration with the UN World Tourism Organization.
Speaker 4: So Greece, let's say we'll be in the forefront of
Speaker 4: preserving the coastal and the maritime environment in the Mediterranean,
Speaker 4: because of course it's very important for all insular nations
Speaker 4: and coastal nations to preserve the marine environment. So in
Speaker 4: this respect, of course, we are reviewing our strategy when
Speaker 4: it comes, let say, to cruise ships, because I know
Speaker 4: that you guys perspect a little bit. I know that
Speaker 4: it's a big interest into the American market. But you know,
Speaker 4: at the same time, we cannot be having so many
Speaker 4: cruise ships, so many large cruise ships in Greece, so
Speaker 4: we are thinking of, you know, applying some quota and
Speaker 4: having a more strict birth allocation system. So I think
Speaker 4: we should find, as you said before, the correct balance.
Speaker 4: So we need the revenue, but at the same time,
Speaker 4: we need to preserve what makes us really unique and
Speaker 4: authentic and attractive, you know as a destination.
Speaker 3: Thirty seconds and then we're going to do some news
Speaker 3: and we're going to come back. But what is specifically
Speaker 3: about the cruise operators do you find that you need
Speaker 3: to push back on.
Speaker 4: Well, you see that especially in some of the very
Speaker 4: very popular islands such as Mikonos and Santorini, it becomes
Speaker 4: very frustrating even for visitors who are on the island
Speaker 4: and also for the islanders. So we really need to
Speaker 4: find the right balance. And of course I understand, you
Speaker 4: know that there are people who really enjoy cruising, but
Speaker 4: then again you need to have everything in proportion. Let's say,
Speaker 4: you know, like Greece is a smaller country, so we
Speaker 4: need to have proportionate and balanced approach to things.
Speaker 3: Carol Master and Tim Stanoviek here and the two of
Speaker 3: us are really just planning our next adventure.
Speaker 2: We've been googling left and right. Yeah, we're been putting
Speaker 2: up with our googling of like all things Greece.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we're going to Greece. And the reason we're talking
Speaker 3: about Greece is because we have with us right now,
Speaker 3: Country's Minister of Tourism, Olga Kefaloyani. She joins us here
Speaker 3: in the Bloomberg Interactive Brokers studio. So, Olga, we're we're
Speaker 3: looking at all different places we could go in Greece.
Speaker 3: We're already excited to play on our trip. I want
Speaker 3: to talk about costs. You're here in New York. You
Speaker 3: were telling us what we were doing, news that it's
Speaker 3: shockingly expensive to.
Speaker 4: Be here, and I'm sorry I can say that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, say whatever you want, Like really, I just won't
Speaker 3: be used to anyone? Is it? Everything?
Speaker 4: I used to live here twenty years ago? So it's
Speaker 4: not like I haven't been used to like New York
Speaker 4: being quite expensive compared to other places. But I think
Speaker 4: that nowadays it's like super super expensive.
Speaker 2: Everything are you doing about hotels?
Speaker 1: Food?
Speaker 2: Everything?
Speaker 4: Especially food? I mean compared to the prices that you
Speaker 4: would have in Athens. So for the prices that you
Speaker 4: would pay here for you know, relatively mediocre restaurant, plenty
Speaker 4: of fis, you would have the same let's say price
Speaker 4: in a Michelin Star restaurant in Athens, So you understand
Speaker 4: that the quality that you pay is, you know, not comparable.
Speaker 3: What about lodging? When it comes to paying for a hotel?
Speaker 3: What should what's the range?
Speaker 4: Well, you know, the good thing is that there's a
Speaker 4: very big offering. So I think that depending on your budget,
Speaker 4: you can find you know, something that's equivalent, you know,
Speaker 4: to what you want to spend.
Speaker 3: How do you, as Minister of Tourism think about a
Speaker 3: company like Airbnb, because they're pretty it's pretty controversial. There
Speaker 3: are some folks who in governments who don't like it
Speaker 3: because they think that it displaces housing for people who
Speaker 3: live in areas and drives up the price of housing.
Speaker 3: How are you thinking about.
Speaker 4: It, Well, it's true that it's you know, it's a
Speaker 4: challenge nowadays, you know, finding again the word is the
Speaker 4: right balance, because of course we understand that there are
Speaker 4: a lot of people who would only look into this
Speaker 4: kind of accommodation that you know, they wouldn't go to
Speaker 4: a hotel, so they would look for short term rentals
Speaker 4: for their vacation. So as a country that appeals to
Speaker 4: a lot of people, you of course need to have
Speaker 4: all sorts of so the whole range of the offering
Speaker 4: when it comes to accommodation, so both hotels and also
Speaker 4: the short term rentals. Well at the same time, if
Speaker 4: you do not have a framework, then of course this
Speaker 4: creates a lot of i would say social issues, especially
Speaker 4: when it comes to prices for locals, so for accommodation
Speaker 4: for locals. I'm also a member of Parliament, so I
Speaker 4: present Athens and we see that you know, in the
Speaker 4: recent years, some very nice neighborhoods that used to be
Speaker 4: like full of younger people are now younger Greek people
Speaker 4: are now no longer residential areas because they're very near
Speaker 4: the acropolis. So it was you know, it made much
Speaker 4: more sense for people to just rent their apartments for
Speaker 4: visitors through these platforms Airbnb and other platforms for short
Speaker 4: term rentals. So nowadays we have a stricter framework and
Speaker 4: and really we try to have a very balanced approach
Speaker 4: because again we understand that this is something that appeals
Speaker 4: to a lot of visitors, but at the same time
Speaker 4: we also need to have both the revenue, the correct revenue,
Speaker 4: and also, uh, you know, we don't need to have
Speaker 4: like the unfair competition to hotels, which you know, I
Speaker 4: have to go under a lot of scrutiny when it comes,
Speaker 4: you know, to the Ministry of Tourism controls and little
Speaker 4: frameworks for their the way that they operate.
Speaker 2: Okay, I want to go back to what your mission
Speaker 2: is to really expand tourism. Summer check, you got it down.
Speaker 2: There's lots of people who come in, but you'd like
Speaker 2: to expand it throughout the year. And what's interesting is
Speaker 2: your Prime Minister was on with our TV colleagues in
Speaker 2: the fall and specifically he made the point that you know,
Speaker 2: part of the reason that you guys can expand potentially
Speaker 2: your tourist season is because of climate change, right that
Speaker 2: it's impacting a little bit the environment, you know, so
Speaker 2: that's kind of an unforeseen I don't want to say benefit,
Speaker 2: but right because of what's happening, or you're just seeing
Speaker 2: warming right throughout the year.
Speaker 4: Well, you know, the climate crisis, I think is an
Speaker 4: issue for everyone to address, you know, in a very
Speaker 4: very strict manner. So I understand that there's a silver
Speaker 4: lining for everything, but I think that the most important
Speaker 4: thing is, you know, to really address the impact of
Speaker 4: the climate crisis and really for every country to do
Speaker 4: whatever they can to reverse the the effect that we
Speaker 4: see in the environment. And I think that this is
Speaker 4: important for us, it's important for our children and the
Speaker 4: future generations. So I think that all of us have
Speaker 4: a very big responsibility when it comes to to the
Speaker 4: environment and the climate. So Greece has a very strict,
Speaker 4: let's say, legislative process right now when it comes to
Speaker 4: the environment and environmental protection, and we have a plan
Speaker 4: for having all our hotels sustainable by twenty thirty. So
Speaker 4: this is the most important thing for us that we
Speaker 4: see the climate crisis as an obligation for all of
Speaker 4: us to do something differently. And I think that this
Speaker 4: is also something that our visitors are considering when they
Speaker 4: make their bookings, because you know, the carbon footprint and
Speaker 4: you're traveling would do to the environment is also something
Speaker 4: that is of sederation to a lot of people nowadays. Right,
Speaker 4: So I think that we have to do our part
Speaker 4: of the responsibility.
Speaker 2: Reality. No, but I guess what I'm just saying, like
Speaker 2: the reality of not pointing fingers, I mean, the reality
Speaker 2: of we talk to vineyards all the time, right, and
Speaker 2: maybe they're shifting where they're growing because climate change is
Speaker 2: just made a reality if you can't crow here anymore,
Speaker 2: and the same thing, you know, for you guys, or
Speaker 2: for any country, right they're looking at Okay, it's warmer.
Speaker 2: What does that mean potentially that we maybe have a
Speaker 2: longer growing season or a longer tourist season, right. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's just kind of the reality of it.
Speaker 4: Unfortunately, Yes, I understand, but yeah, but on the other hand,
Speaker 4: you know, we really, especially politicians, we really have to
Speaker 4: be very firm when it comes, you know, to what
Speaker 4: we really have to do in order to reverse these
Speaker 4: very negative results to the environment. So this is why
Speaker 4: I really feel that I have to make this point
Speaker 4: and also as a minister, I have to make sure
Speaker 4: that especially tourism is really sustainable. But when we're talking
Speaker 4: about extending the season, we're not talking only about you know,
Speaker 4: the weather and the fact that it's you know, moderate
Speaker 4: year round. It's also that you can have these amazing
Speaker 4: experiences in Greece year round. And you know, actually for me,
Speaker 4: I would say that, especially for people who are interested
Speaker 4: in culture, it's much much better to enjoy all these
Speaker 4: amazing sites, you know, like two thousand and five year
Speaker 4: old sides outside the summer season, because why would you
Speaker 4: go there, you know, like when it's forty five degrees
Speaker 4: celsius and not go when it's much much nicer. And
Speaker 4: then you can also enjoy the wineries. You can also
Speaker 4: enjoy all sorts of other activities in Greece, especially also
Speaker 4: for some people who are interested in skiing. You have
Speaker 4: to know that there are ski resorts in Greece. We
Speaker 4: are upgrading the ski facilities right now. And I'm from Crete,
Speaker 4: and you know, could have like you could skip but
Speaker 4: off base, okay, and then you can go to the ocean.
Speaker 2: We have to run, We have to run. Olga Kea Oliani,
Speaker 2: she is the Minister of Tourism in Greece, joining us
Speaker 2: here in studio