1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:03,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to What's Burning. I'm Rachel Nichols here with Mr 2 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:07,640 Speaker 1: Stephen Jackson. That would be NBA Champion extraordinaire, Steck. You're 3 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:11,400 Speaker 1: making waves on Instagram. You're doing everything this week. Would 4 00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:13,840 Speaker 1: you put out you said Lebron wasn't a top five 5 00:00:13,840 --> 00:00:16,720 Speaker 1: player currently? On the I Am Athlete podcast, you posted 6 00:00:16,720 --> 00:00:19,840 Speaker 1: an I G post you said that, what, Jordan's your 7 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 1: number one all time, Kobe's number two, Lebron's number three? 8 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: What's going on? Yeah, he's definitely my third. And I'm 9 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:29,080 Speaker 1: I'm not speaking from I have to tell you this. 10 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:31,320 Speaker 1: I'm not speaking from a fan perspective. I'm thinking from 11 00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:34,720 Speaker 1: a player's perspective. You know, I've been around players, not 12 00:00:34,800 --> 00:00:36,920 Speaker 1: been around those locker rooms in those games, and I 13 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:40,160 Speaker 1: played against most of those guys, and uh, I've seen 14 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:42,440 Speaker 1: different things from actually being out there on the course. 15 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:44,880 Speaker 1: So there's no disrespect. But I think if being in 16 00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 1: the top three all time, I think they're still saying 17 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:50,560 Speaker 1: a lot about somebody. Absolutely, and he's not done yet too, 18 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:52,879 Speaker 1: so we gotta wait to see what happens there. Right. 19 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 1: I want to talk more about current stuff though. Trade 20 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 1: deadline Friends. Thursday, February ninth a little more than a 21 00:00:58,480 --> 00:01:01,800 Speaker 1: week away. It's feels like it's one of the more 22 00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:05,520 Speaker 1: open years in recent history in terms of especially the West, 23 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:08,600 Speaker 1: like anyone could win, anyone could lose. There's this whole 24 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:11,199 Speaker 1: plot of teams that are sort of separated by only 25 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:15,399 Speaker 1: five games between third and thirteen place, So it's kind 26 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 1: of hard to tell which teams are going to go 27 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:20,440 Speaker 1: in which direction. Which means I want to play a 28 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 1: little game with you, my friend. It is called blow 29 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 1: it up or stay the course? Should these teams sell 30 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 1: at the deadline or keep their core pieces? And we 31 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:31,679 Speaker 1: go through a few teams. I gotta start with Phoenix 32 00:01:31,720 --> 00:01:33,280 Speaker 1: because this is a team that was in the Western 33 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:35,840 Speaker 1: Conference finals just two years ago. They dropped down to 34 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:38,959 Speaker 1: a second round exit last year. This year, stack their 35 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:41,800 Speaker 1: number nine in the West, one game under five hundred, 36 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:44,759 Speaker 1: and look, they're one of the oldest teams in the NBA. 37 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:48,640 Speaker 1: Chris Paul thirty seven, not playing to his usual standards. 38 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 1: There's the whole DeAndre Ayton quagmire. They've got Jay Crowder 39 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:54,920 Speaker 1: as an asset. He hasn't played all season because he 40 00:01:54,960 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 1: wants that chunky contract the Sons didn't want to give 41 00:01:57,240 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 1: him and in the middle of it all, you know 42 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 1: who's there. Devin Booker twenty six years old looking at 43 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:04,560 Speaker 1: the team that is eight and fourteen when he doesn't 44 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 1: play so staff, what should Phoenix do? They definitely need 45 00:02:08,880 --> 00:02:11,120 Speaker 1: to blow it up right to it ain't no secret, um, 46 00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:12,760 Speaker 1: you know they you know all the stuff that then 47 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:14,800 Speaker 1: went on with the owner. You know that that has 48 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:16,440 Speaker 1: put a cloud over their team. They need to kind 49 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:19,880 Speaker 1: of start from scratch CP. It's basically you know, got 50 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 1: them to the finals, but everything has been kind of downhill, sister, 51 00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:24,639 Speaker 1: and you know, a lot has been going over that 52 00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: team with eight and it's just so much, you know, 53 00:02:26,880 --> 00:02:28,360 Speaker 1: I think I think they need to blow it up. 54 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:30,960 Speaker 1: I think they have to make a decision who they 55 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:32,960 Speaker 1: can keep. But in the order for them to get 56 00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:34,639 Speaker 1: back to where they are right, they definitely have to 57 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 1: break it up. That feels extreme, blow it up. I 58 00:02:37,600 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 1: mean they've still got a decent core. What about just 59 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:43,560 Speaker 1: adding someone, what about just like tinkering and adding some 60 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: of it? Yeah, I just don't think there's nobody out 61 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: there all all of all the key players are big guys. 62 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:51,120 Speaker 1: That was that you know they called players. There's one 63 00:02:51,160 --> 00:02:53,639 Speaker 1: player away all those guys are locked in the contracts. 64 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:55,400 Speaker 1: Most of those guys are locked in the contracts so 65 00:02:55,720 --> 00:02:58,320 Speaker 1: and are happy way they're at. So um, you know 66 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:00,320 Speaker 1: what I mean. I just I just don't see that 67 00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:02,760 Speaker 1: that working. That the core is good, right, the core 68 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:04,959 Speaker 1: is pretty decent, you know. But I just think that 69 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:07,440 Speaker 1: the star problems was what is what they need to 70 00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: have make some us some much changes. Look Chris Paul, clearly, 71 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:12,800 Speaker 1: I mean, he's thirty seven. He can't be what he 72 00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 1: was five years ago, maybe even two years ago. I 73 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: still want him for playoff experience on this team in 74 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:22,040 Speaker 1: key moments, and I just we'll talk about O g 75 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:23,959 Speaker 1: and Obi in a few minutes because we've gotta have 76 00:03:24,000 --> 00:03:26,919 Speaker 1: a whole Toronto discussion as well. I think he could 77 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 1: make a big difference there. I feel like if they're 78 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:31,000 Speaker 1: willing they get a new owner, if they're willing to 79 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,119 Speaker 1: spend spend some money, spend some draft picks, they could 80 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 1: tweak enough to really make a run. But they'd have to. 81 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 1: It's like a half blow up. I'm with you. I'm 82 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:40,840 Speaker 1: like a half blow up. And I do think Eton 83 00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:43,120 Speaker 1: is not a lock to stay there. Um, I'm not 84 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:45,760 Speaker 1: saying he's available, right now, but I do think that, 85 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:48,440 Speaker 1: you know, Booker is a nonstarter. I don't know if 86 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: Ayden's a nonstarter. We'll see, We'll see. I don't know. 87 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:53,880 Speaker 1: Let's talk about Portland's started the season nine and three, good, 88 00:03:53,960 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 1: good start, but it's gone way downhill. Blazers sitting at 89 00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 1: number twelve, three games under five hundred and stack. This 90 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: is a team that did not think they would be here. 91 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 1: They spent a lot of money this summer. They signed 92 00:04:05,080 --> 00:04:07,600 Speaker 1: Damian Lillard to that extension that will make him one 93 00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:10,960 Speaker 1: of the most well paid players in NBA history. They 94 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: brought in Jeremy Grant, They have Josh Hart, they have 95 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:16,400 Speaker 1: Anthony Simon's Shaden Sharp. Those are their two young pieces. 96 00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:19,120 Speaker 1: We know what a good coach johnsy Billups is, so 97 00:04:19,360 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 1: it's clearly not enough with all those pieces. And when 98 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:25,480 Speaker 1: it's a rough season in Portland, you know, the question 99 00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:27,839 Speaker 1: it always comes back to, is there a point the 100 00:04:27,839 --> 00:04:30,920 Speaker 1: Blazers need to trade Dame and his salary and start 101 00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 1: from scratch? What do you think? I just think the 102 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:35,919 Speaker 1: way the way they got their money set up, Rachel, 103 00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:37,799 Speaker 1: it ain't just dang. They got a lot of money 104 00:04:37,839 --> 00:04:39,719 Speaker 1: tied up in a lot of guys over there that 105 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 1: can be key trade pieces, you know, and and they 106 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 1: got some guys over whatever rages that can go to 107 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:47,039 Speaker 1: other teams and be that one guy, you know. So 108 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:50,280 Speaker 1: Portland has I think Poortland, out of any team, has 109 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:52,120 Speaker 1: a lot of pieces to make big trades and to 110 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:54,440 Speaker 1: make a better team for Damon Chauncey. But they just 111 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:56,920 Speaker 1: haven't done it. Over the years, they brought certain guys 112 00:04:56,920 --> 00:04:58,919 Speaker 1: in that they thought was gonna make, uh make a 113 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 1: change for this team, and they just haven't done it. 114 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:03,240 Speaker 1: And uh, I think just losing c J was was 115 00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:05,560 Speaker 1: a was a big loss for them. C Json my guy, 116 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:09,159 Speaker 1: what the the The combination of him and Dane was 117 00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:11,400 Speaker 1: just special to see every night. But they just they 118 00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 1: couldn't get it done either. So they're gonna have to 119 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 1: uh find a way to get Dame another big name player, 120 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:18,840 Speaker 1: and that Rachel for some help because he's been doing 121 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:20,720 Speaker 1: this for so long. I don't think Dame is gonna leave. 122 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 1: I don't think they want Dame to leave. I think 123 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 1: it's gonna have to be all those other pieces and 124 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:27,080 Speaker 1: put their money together. Yeah, that's a great point because 125 00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:29,839 Speaker 1: they're kind of this catchwain two, right, Dame can't really 126 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:32,680 Speaker 1: go to them and publicly asked for trade after all 127 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:35,159 Speaker 1: he has said and done and genuinely feels about his 128 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:38,200 Speaker 1: loyalty to the city. They can't trade him away as 129 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:40,120 Speaker 1: a franchise. They can't do that to the fans and 130 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:41,679 Speaker 1: just be like, yeah, we're getting rid of Daan Willard. 131 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:43,760 Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's a tough position to without him 132 00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 1: saying he wants to go. They had an interesting situation 133 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:50,040 Speaker 1: with Jeremy Grant Stack because Dame wanted him, they were 134 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 1: tight from the Olympic team. He asked Portland to go 135 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:55,560 Speaker 1: out and get Jeremy. They did um, but he's got 136 00:05:55,600 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 1: an expiring contract, so they did offer to extend him army. 137 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:03,919 Speaker 1: Grant reportedly rejected the extension. It could just be because 138 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:05,720 Speaker 1: he can get a lot more money in the summer, 139 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:08,159 Speaker 1: or it could be because he's going to look around 140 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:10,840 Speaker 1: in the summer. If you're Portland's do you take that 141 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 1: risk and keep him on Or is that one of 142 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:15,560 Speaker 1: the pieces that when you say, hey, they gotta make 143 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 1: big changes around Dame, that you say great, if you're not, 144 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:19,840 Speaker 1: if we might lose you for nothing this summer, we 145 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:22,640 Speaker 1: gotta get rid of you. Well, that name is different Rage. 146 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:25,559 Speaker 1: That's one of those guys I keep uh the energy 147 00:06:25,640 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 1: he brings and the way he's been playing the last 148 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:29,159 Speaker 1: couple of years. I think he could be one of 149 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 1: those guys that really can help any team. He's one 150 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:33,200 Speaker 1: of those guys that's the one player away guy. I 151 00:06:33,240 --> 00:06:34,919 Speaker 1: don't I don't think he's I don't think he's the 152 00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 1: guy that needs to leave Rich. I think it could 153 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:38,280 Speaker 1: be other guys in that team. And damn, we got 154 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: him for a reason because you know, a lot of 155 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:42,479 Speaker 1: guys like like his energy and this effort and he 156 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:45,800 Speaker 1: brings it every night. Yeah, no, he's He's a player's player. 157 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,120 Speaker 1: There's no question about it. I want to go over 158 00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 1: the East because we got Chicago sitting at number ten. 159 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:54,359 Speaker 1: There's no timetable for when a Lonzo ball is going 160 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:56,160 Speaker 1: to come back becau zach Lavine. We know it is 161 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:59,720 Speaker 1: locked up for forty plus bill per year until seven, 162 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 1: but the Rosen is gonna enter free agency not after 163 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:06,200 Speaker 1: this season but the next one. And Mushevik is a 164 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:10,960 Speaker 1: free agent after this season. I gotta say, like, I know, 165 00:07:11,120 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 1: the big swing they took with those three guys is 166 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:16,920 Speaker 1: their core, but their ceiling is not a championship ceiling, 167 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 1: it is clearly lower. And you've got Alex Caruso, who 168 00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:22,880 Speaker 1: everyone in the league seems to want. What would you 169 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:25,680 Speaker 1: do if you're that front office deck, Well, they got 170 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:28,080 Speaker 1: they got a lot of money tied up in the 171 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 1: big man. So you know, once and once he becomes 172 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:32,640 Speaker 1: a free agent, they can they can get two big 173 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:35,760 Speaker 1: pieces hopefully up put a little package together to get 174 00:07:35,760 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 1: two guys and that can come in and get a 175 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:40,560 Speaker 1: banger probably and another and another big man that can 176 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:43,320 Speaker 1: score to kind of to have two guys equal him. 177 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 1: But that team is just not put together to be 178 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 1: a championship team, like you said, right when you look 179 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 1: at it, they got, they got, They got a lot 180 00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:53,600 Speaker 1: of guys that we like as as basketball fans and 181 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:57,200 Speaker 1: watching the game. But just a combination of Alonzo being 182 00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:01,160 Speaker 1: heard de Rosen, you know, having his nice zach lavine 183 00:08:01,200 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 1: being in and out, you know, Uh, Caruso being fan 184 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:05,880 Speaker 1: favorite and he's not even the star of the team. 185 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:07,560 Speaker 1: Is like, it's a lot of things that's going on 186 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 1: over there that that that don't equal winning. And uh 187 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 1: that's why you see that the things going on the 188 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:14,240 Speaker 1: way they are. I mean, if you're a Laker fan 189 00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: watching Alex Caruso and also hearing that the front office 190 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: could get I mean, there are reports out there the 191 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:21,520 Speaker 1: Bulls are asking for as much as two first round 192 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:24,800 Speaker 1: picks for him, and the Lakers coustle have that. That's 193 00:08:24,800 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 1: painful enough. But there's talk about the Lakers wanting Luchavik. 194 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: What do you think of that? Would you like to 195 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:32,760 Speaker 1: see him there? I mean I like that. I mean 196 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:35,080 Speaker 1: the combination of him and Anthony Davis, that's gonna take 197 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:36,880 Speaker 1: a lot of press off of Anthony Davis. I'll tell 198 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:40,080 Speaker 1: you that when he comes back. Um Um, I like it, right. 199 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:41,840 Speaker 1: I think that'd be a good move for m Anything going, 200 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:45,079 Speaker 1: anything for them, be a help to try to change 201 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:48,400 Speaker 1: things there, because you know they still have time. Yeah. No, 202 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:51,720 Speaker 1: I mean, I just certainly think with Uchavik being expiring, 203 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:54,480 Speaker 1: you gotta just cut bait at this point with this 204 00:08:54,559 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 1: idea that those three are going to get it done 205 00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 1: for you. But we'll see what the Bulls want to do. 206 00:08:58,600 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 1: Let's talk about Toronto to we mentioned o Ganna Nobe earlier. 207 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:05,960 Speaker 1: Raptors twelve in the East. They've got Scottie Barnes, who's 208 00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:07,840 Speaker 1: twenty one years old, he's setting a lot of their 209 00:09:07,880 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 1: future timeline. Fred van Bleet and Gary Trent Jr. They 210 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:14,880 Speaker 1: could walk for nothing this summer. They've got player options, 211 00:09:14,920 --> 00:09:16,959 Speaker 1: so they're right for a trade if the Raptors want 212 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:19,280 Speaker 1: to go that blow it up direction. And again O 213 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:22,439 Speaker 1: G and nob he is supposedly the hottest guy on 214 00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:25,680 Speaker 1: the market stack according to you know, front office sources 215 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:28,480 Speaker 1: and all that stuff. He is the guy that everyone says, 216 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:31,120 Speaker 1: that's your one piece away. So he is going to 217 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:34,679 Speaker 1: command insane price on the trade market if the Raptors 218 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:37,120 Speaker 1: go that direction. So should the Raptors go that direction? 219 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:38,600 Speaker 1: Should they just kind of blow it up right now? 220 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:42,760 Speaker 1: I mean me personally, I'm I'm not. I wouldn't agree 221 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:46,360 Speaker 1: with O G. I can't say his last name. I can't. 222 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:48,480 Speaker 1: I don't agree with O G being that Yeah, O G. 223 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 1: I I can't agree with that. I don't think he's 224 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:54,160 Speaker 1: that that that guy to me, um, yeah, he's a 225 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:56,720 Speaker 1: young tality. He plays hard, but he has a lot 226 00:09:56,760 --> 00:09:58,600 Speaker 1: of holes in this game. To me, he's not that 227 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:03,000 Speaker 1: efficient offensively. He makes a lot of aggressive hustle plays, 228 00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:05,400 Speaker 1: but just a guy you can just give the ball 229 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 1: to and go get you thirty. He's not that guy. 230 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:10,760 Speaker 1: So um, I like him, but I just think it's 231 00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:12,600 Speaker 1: so much things. There's so much stuff that's wrong with 232 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:16,200 Speaker 1: that team. As far as the personnel. Um right, Um, 233 00:10:16,440 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 1: they don't. I don't think it's just built. It's built 234 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:21,600 Speaker 1: to to compete like they've been in the past, you know, 235 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:24,600 Speaker 1: just having that the right size three guard. You know, 236 00:10:24,679 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 1: sometimes they they're they're one, two and three. They're having 237 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:29,560 Speaker 1: in the game of time that they're they're real small. 238 00:10:29,920 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 1: You know what I'm said that they they're not the 239 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 1: size of a team that we're looking at. It's gonna 240 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:36,120 Speaker 1: be in the playoffs, but um, a lot of things 241 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:37,920 Speaker 1: need to change it. I like the coach. I think 242 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:41,000 Speaker 1: the coach is solid um and I think Vambie's time 243 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 1: in Toronto maybe up because you know, he's had success 244 00:10:44,400 --> 00:10:46,400 Speaker 1: there and it happens to everybody. It's not that he's 245 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:48,920 Speaker 1: not playing well, deserves to be there. But you know 246 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:52,680 Speaker 1: what I'm saying that everybody running onnesday course sometimes in places, well, 247 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:55,440 Speaker 1: we saw the Raptors when it was Kyle Larry. Everyone 248 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:57,959 Speaker 1: thought they would deal Kyle Lowry because his contract was 249 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: gonna be up that summer and the Raptors just said, 250 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:02,640 Speaker 1: out of respect for him, they didn't feel like they 251 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 1: found a good enough deal, so they kept him, and 252 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 1: then of course they did lose him. They're kind of 253 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:08,760 Speaker 1: in the same situation with Fred van Bleet. I mean, 254 00:11:08,760 --> 00:11:10,880 Speaker 1: I know he's got a player option, but still they're 255 00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 1: basically looking at him possibly losing him for nothing this summer. 256 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:16,920 Speaker 1: I gotta think that they will make a different decision 257 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 1: this time. I mean, Fred van Bleet, while he's done 258 00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:21,120 Speaker 1: great things for that franchise, does not have the Kyle 259 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:23,959 Speaker 1: Lowry status in Toronto in terms of that respect factor. 260 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:26,559 Speaker 1: And I don't know. The Clippers I think are huge 261 00:11:26,600 --> 00:11:29,920 Speaker 1: contenders to get him because the idea of finally giving 262 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:32,160 Speaker 1: them a real starting point guard and pairing him with 263 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:35,640 Speaker 1: Kwhi Leonard again is very appealing in l A. So 264 00:11:35,720 --> 00:11:38,160 Speaker 1: I can see that trade happening, and we'll see with 265 00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:40,720 Speaker 1: Ojana nov I know Dallas is you know, interested in 266 00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:42,640 Speaker 1: what happens there. There's a couple of there's a couple 267 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:44,280 Speaker 1: of teams that think if they put him next to 268 00:11:44,360 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 1: their superstar, do that to Luca Rage, Don't do that 269 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:52,240 Speaker 1: to Luca. Don't do that. No, I don't do that. 270 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:56,720 Speaker 1: Well we will see it's gonna be an interesting week, Sack, 271 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:58,319 Speaker 1: and we'll be back next week, just a couple of 272 00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:00,680 Speaker 1: days before the deadline, so we will talk were about this. 273 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:02,400 Speaker 1: But I gotta take a little about that the games. 274 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:05,199 Speaker 1: I know you saw that Lakers Celtics game over the weekend. 275 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 1: How the refs missed that foul in Lebron? What are 276 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:09,680 Speaker 1: sending the line for the win? We all know that 277 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:11,360 Speaker 1: was a funk up, But I want to ask you 278 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:14,520 Speaker 1: about the aftermath. Right the Lakers are pointing to four 279 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:16,920 Speaker 1: games now where they say they should have one but 280 00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:20,439 Speaker 1: didn't do to officiating mistakes that obviously would shift them 281 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 1: a lot in the standings. Lebron has been tweeting four 282 00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 1: days now he doesn't understand why he's targeted, and the 283 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 1: Twitter account for the NBA Refs Union published this. They're 284 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: saying the miscall was quote gut wrenching for us. They said, 285 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:36,720 Speaker 1: quote this play will weigh heavily and cause sleepless nights 286 00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 1: as we strive to be the one. Feels good to 287 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:48,560 Speaker 1: be lebronn Man. Right, Hey, Race, I gotta say it right, 288 00:12:48,679 --> 00:12:51,800 Speaker 1: if we had social media when we played. Nobody has 289 00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:53,839 Speaker 1: been filed in the history of the NBA, to me 290 00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 1: than Raw on our tests, nobody, because he was bigger 291 00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:01,080 Speaker 1: than everybody that guarded him every night. Right, nobody got 292 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:04,600 Speaker 1: filed and he would have been if if he could 293 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 1: have done that, I would have put a picture of 294 00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:09,720 Speaker 1: a referee and him getting fired. He would have got fined. 295 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 1: So crazy, This is just unbelievable because it happens Rachel, 296 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:16,920 Speaker 1: happens all the time. It's happened to me, It's happened 297 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:19,040 Speaker 1: to a lot of players. I mean a lot of stars, 298 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:21,200 Speaker 1: especially guys that have the ball to end the games. 299 00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:25,200 Speaker 1: It happens. But the fact that he's able to single 300 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,760 Speaker 1: it out on I g and and and keep talking 301 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:30,120 Speaker 1: about it, and then everybody just keep posting and keep 302 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:33,320 Speaker 1: posting it. Pat Beverley got fine. I don't know if 303 00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 1: Braun gonna get fine. And that's what it feels good 304 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 1: to be Braun, to be able to talk about the 305 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 1: ref like that. I do not think Lebron is gonna 306 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:42,160 Speaker 1: get fined. And I mean it's funny, right, I mean 307 00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:44,760 Speaker 1: Shack used to always say the same thing as Lebron. Right, 308 00:13:44,800 --> 00:13:47,720 Speaker 1: I don't get the calls and and they're both right, 309 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:50,400 Speaker 1: I mean they don't get every foul called on them. 310 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:52,560 Speaker 1: Do you think they should or do you think the 311 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: way players have to defend them? It just is what 312 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:56,800 Speaker 1: it is. What do you take because you played against 313 00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 1: both those guys. Man, I'm gonna just say this, Yeah, honest, 314 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:03,840 Speaker 1: gets filed so many times and so many fires. It 315 00:14:03,920 --> 00:14:06,320 Speaker 1: just happens, right, you know. And you know the referee 316 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 1: has been bad. It's nothing new. They're always bad, you know, 317 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:12,560 Speaker 1: because and I say this, Race, because you have a 318 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 1: lot of guys out there that never actually played the 319 00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:17,880 Speaker 1: game with basketball, right, they know how to officiate the game. 320 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: So it's some plays that the way you move, your buy, 321 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:22,440 Speaker 1: the way you fall, some of those players are not 322 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 1: gonna be filed. But but some blatant, like just blatant files. 323 00:14:25,320 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 1: If you know the game and watch the game, have 324 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 1: been playing the game, you won't miss those and and 325 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:31,560 Speaker 1: and and and that's why it happened. It's been happening, Race. 326 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: But you know, if you Lebron and it was a 327 00:14:33,920 --> 00:14:36,000 Speaker 1: big game, you know, to to be able to point 328 00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:38,240 Speaker 1: it out and put it all on I g. Everybody's 329 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:40,640 Speaker 1: going crazy, But the referees always do stuff like that. 330 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: Rach is nothing new. Well, Darvin Ham said he thinks 331 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:46,120 Speaker 1: there should be a fourth referee on the fourth to 332 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:47,960 Speaker 1: catch more stuff like that. Do you agree or is 333 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 1: that to quite it up? I mean that that could 334 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:53,200 Speaker 1: be an answer, but that also could clog up the 335 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,920 Speaker 1: cloud too, so you know, having another rep out there, 336 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 1: I mean, that's that. That's a lot. Sometimes you see 337 00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 1: guys running into referees as is with three da so 338 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:04,200 Speaker 1: so I don't know how to a work race, but 339 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 1: that would be a good idea to just to see 340 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 1: if it will work well. They experimented with it in 341 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 1: Summer League a few years ago and then they didn't 342 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 1: do it, so I gotta think they it didn't quite take, 343 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,040 Speaker 1: but we'll see. I don't know. Every time something like 344 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 1: this happens, everything gets put under the microscope again. We 345 00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:21,000 Speaker 1: will find out. We gotta talk All Star to stack 346 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:24,200 Speaker 1: because they announced their starters last week. A few selections 347 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 1: that caught people's eyes. Zion Williamson in there despite only 348 00:15:27,920 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 1: playing twenty nine games this season. You've got Katie as 349 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:34,200 Speaker 1: a starter over Joel Embiid, even though Durant has obviously 350 00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:36,160 Speaker 1: been hurt. May not even make it back for the 351 00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 1: All Star Game. Where are you in terms of voting 352 00:15:39,640 --> 00:15:42,160 Speaker 1: a number of games a guy has played. How much 353 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:44,440 Speaker 1: does that factor in for you if you were picking 354 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:47,600 Speaker 1: the All Star selections, Well, I mean it matters a lot. 355 00:15:47,720 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 1: I mean, Katie's played the buckle the season. You know, 356 00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:51,960 Speaker 1: he just went down recently, you know, and he's been 357 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:53,600 Speaker 1: carrying his team. One of the best players in the 358 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 1: league of course at the top of the talk. So 359 00:15:56,920 --> 00:15:59,360 Speaker 1: and I'm happy for Zigon. Rates are really happy for him. 360 00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:01,000 Speaker 1: But you know, play at twenty nine out of fifty 361 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:03,920 Speaker 1: one games is not a lot. You know, it's it's team. 362 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:06,600 Speaker 1: The team has been playing well too, but you know 363 00:16:06,760 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 1: that you got some kind of way, uh figure out 364 00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:13,160 Speaker 1: this voting. You know, there's so many guys that that 365 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:16,080 Speaker 1: dedicate themselves to playing every game and you know, you know, 366 00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 1: I'm not I can't hold it against them because of 367 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 1: the injury. You know, that's unfortunate sometimes, but there's so 368 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:24,720 Speaker 1: many guys that actually play almost every game that's out 369 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:26,600 Speaker 1: there helping their team and you know, and have their 370 00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:29,720 Speaker 1: team at the top of their conferences, right that deserves 371 00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:32,680 Speaker 1: to be in that spot. Um, So you know, they 372 00:16:32,760 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 1: got to really look at that. Man. I mean, I'm 373 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:37,680 Speaker 1: happy for them, but I think you know, you gotta 374 00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 1: play at least thirty five for the games, you know, 375 00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:42,760 Speaker 1: the beginning of the season to make it up to 376 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:45,800 Speaker 1: be All Star. It's tough. I mean I always feel 377 00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:48,760 Speaker 1: like when you're voting for All NBA, when I have 378 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:50,960 Speaker 1: voted for that, I have really taken into account how 379 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:53,040 Speaker 1: much did you play, how available you were, because All 380 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 1: NBA is about what kind of season did you have 381 00:16:55,960 --> 00:16:58,960 Speaker 1: this season. I will admit I am always a little 382 00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:01,560 Speaker 1: looser with my All Star our votes because I do 383 00:17:01,680 --> 00:17:03,280 Speaker 1: think when people say, oh, it's not supposed to be 384 00:17:03,280 --> 00:17:06,639 Speaker 1: a popularity contest, it is literally a popularity contest. That 385 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 1: is what it is. People vote for who their most 386 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:12,000 Speaker 1: popular favorite player is. It is the All Star game. 387 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:14,520 Speaker 1: There to me has to be a little more room 388 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:17,040 Speaker 1: in this when you're voting for this for just who 389 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:19,280 Speaker 1: are the biggest stars? Who do people want to see? 390 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:23,440 Speaker 1: Who's electric out there? I do look at those votes differently. 391 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:26,359 Speaker 1: It is tough when you've got guys who played you know, 392 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:28,719 Speaker 1: less than you know right around half the games and 393 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,080 Speaker 1: other guys who've played all the games and it put 394 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:33,920 Speaker 1: up really good numbers. Two. But I do get why 395 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:36,440 Speaker 1: not only did the media and the fans vote for 396 00:17:36,560 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 1: zion Um. The fellow players actually put him, i think, 397 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:44,200 Speaker 1: in in third spot. They really voted high for him, 398 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:46,960 Speaker 1: and that to me is also interesting too. They published 399 00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:50,000 Speaker 1: the NBA who the players voted for. The players account 400 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:53,280 Speaker 1: the votes and you can kind of see who they 401 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:56,880 Speaker 1: respect and who they don't. Nikola Yoki, for example, got 402 00:17:56,880 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 1: more votes from the players than Lebron for the west 403 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,320 Speaker 1: on court spots. That hasn't happened before. That kind of 404 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:05,199 Speaker 1: speaks to this like growing, you know, respect among the 405 00:18:05,240 --> 00:18:08,040 Speaker 1: players for your kitchen, just people being like he's crazy, 406 00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:10,479 Speaker 1: he's crazy. Good um. And then it went the other 407 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:13,640 Speaker 1: way with Trey Young. Stack. Listen to this. The other 408 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: players ranked Trey Young as the twelfth best guard in 409 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:20,439 Speaker 1: the East. They put LaMelo Ball, Tyrese Halibert and a 410 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:23,840 Speaker 1: bunch of other guys ahead of him. Trey's averaging game. 411 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:25,840 Speaker 1: What do you make for the fact that they other 412 00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:28,440 Speaker 1: players put him as the twelfth best guard the East. Yeah, 413 00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:31,040 Speaker 1: they gotta get out their feelings, right, they gotta feelings. 414 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:33,200 Speaker 1: There's no way he's the twelve best point guard in 415 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:36,199 Speaker 1: the East. It's no way. Um, you know, you know 416 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:38,880 Speaker 1: he's one of those guys that you know, he wants 417 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:41,280 Speaker 1: to compete every night. You don't care who you is. 418 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 1: He's gonna talk his noise, you know. And and he 419 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:46,520 Speaker 1: has a servace swack about himself. He's a small guy. Uh. 420 00:18:46,840 --> 00:18:48,320 Speaker 1: Some of the way he's some of the shots he 421 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:50,560 Speaker 1: takes and how he finishes in the pain is is 422 00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:53,000 Speaker 1: amazing to be his side. So he has a chip 423 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:54,600 Speaker 1: on the show to rage. And I don't blame him. 424 00:18:54,640 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 1: But you know that that that that says a lot 425 00:18:57,119 --> 00:18:59,439 Speaker 1: to the race, even though he's twelve. That says a 426 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:01,359 Speaker 1: lot to That says a lot to That says a 427 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:05,119 Speaker 1: lot of that's that's that's that's respecting a different way. 428 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 1: What do you mean, Well, yeah, put me on the 429 00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:09,439 Speaker 1: y y'all putting me at the bottom because y'all probably 430 00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:11,600 Speaker 1: hating on me because we are because I talked so much. 431 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:14,360 Speaker 1: I talked so much trash and I'm cocky, but I'm 432 00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:16,720 Speaker 1: married to tin A and I guarantee every time we 433 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,639 Speaker 1: step on that court, I everything that you say I 434 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:21,400 Speaker 1: don't do, I do, and I put my I put 435 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 1: points on you. I get twin points on everybody out here. 436 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:26,080 Speaker 1: So you might not like it, but you gotta respect it. 437 00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:33,119 Speaker 1: Who was that guy when you were playing? Who? Like? 438 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:35,640 Speaker 1: Just players around the league did not like even though 439 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:41,639 Speaker 1: they had to respect his game. I'm always I always 440 00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 1: felt like Ron was good with other players though, did 441 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:47,639 Speaker 1: other players not respect Ron? I was with him? They 442 00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:51,000 Speaker 1: were they respected him, rage, they respected him. But on 443 00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:54,520 Speaker 1: the court he didn't respect nobody, right, you know what 444 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:56,960 Speaker 1: I'm saying. It was the way he the way he played, 445 00:19:57,000 --> 00:20:01,880 Speaker 1: looks so disrespectful. Rage. It's just no, I've never seen 446 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:07,520 Speaker 1: nobody play basketball I like that in my life. I 447 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:09,560 Speaker 1: just think it's very interesting to see who they like 448 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:11,639 Speaker 1: who they don't. And also, by the way, the players 449 00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:14,200 Speaker 1: not taking this that seriously. Chad home Grind got four 450 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:16,199 Speaker 1: votes from the players. He has yet to play a 451 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:20,879 Speaker 1: single game. I don't know. I should the players have 452 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,679 Speaker 1: more more of a percentage of the votes, but come on, guys, 453 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: a lot of emotional guys raised. They don't need to 454 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:31,880 Speaker 1: have votes. On the radar presented by Draft Kings Sports Book, 455 00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:35,200 Speaker 1: let's talk about the Pacific Division. Interesting right now, stack 456 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:38,120 Speaker 1: the Kings, the Warriors, the Clippers, the Sons, Lakers all 457 00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:40,880 Speaker 1: within five games of each other. So you can look 458 00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:43,080 Speaker 1: here at the odds. But if you just look at 459 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 1: those five teams, who do you think finishes with the 460 00:20:45,560 --> 00:20:49,040 Speaker 1: best record out of this pack? I will have to 461 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:52,840 Speaker 1: go the Warriors. I just think as they Yeah, I 462 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:55,679 Speaker 1: just feel like as they get get healthy with the 463 00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:57,680 Speaker 1: experience they have, you know what I mean, I think 464 00:20:57,720 --> 00:20:59,159 Speaker 1: they can find a way to ramp it up and 465 00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:01,280 Speaker 1: go on to run by the to the season. They 466 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:04,280 Speaker 1: better fix that road record. Of course, that's that's the 467 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:06,680 Speaker 1: main problem. But you know, you ought to be a 468 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:09,080 Speaker 1: championship team, you know, you have to win on the road, 469 00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:11,119 Speaker 1: and then They've been able to figure out some years. 470 00:21:11,119 --> 00:21:12,680 Speaker 1: But I think right now they just need to worry 471 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:15,240 Speaker 1: about finishing the season on a good note, and I think, 472 00:21:15,280 --> 00:21:17,080 Speaker 1: you know, everything goes to click like it has in 473 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:20,280 Speaker 1: the past. They also have you know, that's like sixteen 474 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 1: game player kind of thing. Those guys have been doing 475 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: this for so long they know when to turn it up. 476 00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:27,440 Speaker 1: So I'm not I'm not worried about them in the playoffs. 477 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:29,639 Speaker 1: I wonder how they're going to finish the regular season. 478 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:31,520 Speaker 1: I do think you gotta watch out for the Clippers 479 00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:33,080 Speaker 1: because I do think they're going to make a move 480 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 1: at the deadline, so that could impact how they finish, 481 00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:40,439 Speaker 1: but we shall see find out legendary moments presented by 482 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 1: top Shot and Stack. Of course we're talking legendary moments 483 00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:45,639 Speaker 1: with you. We got to talk about We Believe Warriors. 484 00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:48,359 Speaker 1: So many memorable moments from that team. What do you 485 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:52,480 Speaker 1: choose on the court most memorable We Believe Warriors moment? Well, 486 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:54,359 Speaker 1: I got too quick was rich. I was able to 487 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 1: hit seven threes and that deciding game, I think that 488 00:21:57,560 --> 00:21:59,679 Speaker 1: that was the most I was able to hit. And 489 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:02,800 Speaker 1: it was special for me that game because uh be 490 00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:04,800 Speaker 1: Baron Davis came to before that game. He told me 491 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,960 Speaker 1: he wasn't feeling well and um and uh his knees 492 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:09,479 Speaker 1: wasn't brought me. He told me he really need him. 493 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:11,960 Speaker 1: And after the game he gave me a compliment on TV. 494 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:14,440 Speaker 1: I didn't I didn't see it to probably like eight 495 00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:17,639 Speaker 1: years later on the on on YouTube or something, but 496 00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:19,560 Speaker 1: they interviewed him after the game on T and T 497 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:22,240 Speaker 1: and they asked him, um about my play and he 498 00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:23,600 Speaker 1: was like a lot of people say a lot of 499 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,120 Speaker 1: things about Stephen Jackson, but they never mentioned how great 500 00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 1: basketball player is and and I hold that to my heart. 501 00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,120 Speaker 1: So that's two of the greatest moments I remember from 502 00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:34,800 Speaker 1: that time. Anyone who doesn't mention what a good basketball 503 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 1: player you are, friend is missing the boat. Before I 504 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:40,000 Speaker 1: let you go, Stack, we gotta talk nfl. Um, that 505 00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:43,080 Speaker 1: was rough for the forty niners this weekend, I'm not 506 00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 1: gonna lie. And that was also quite crazy for the 507 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:47,919 Speaker 1: Chiefs at the end. What do you think of the 508 00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:51,679 Speaker 1: games this weekend? You know, it's unfortunate. It's unfortunate for 509 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:54,720 Speaker 1: the Bengals. Um, there was a great game. I hated 510 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:57,720 Speaker 1: to see in like that over punity, big old clumsy 511 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:00,440 Speaker 1: guy running too hard. You can't make that type of 512 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:02,199 Speaker 1: mistake in the game. I would love to see that 513 00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:04,080 Speaker 1: game going over time and see both teams had a 514 00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:06,920 Speaker 1: ball and uh leaving into the quarterbacks hands and not 515 00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:10,000 Speaker 1: in the referees hands. But congratulates to the Chiefs many 516 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:11,720 Speaker 1: but they would. I think it's three times in the 517 00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:13,920 Speaker 1: last four years they've been a Super Bowl. I'm mistaken. 518 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:18,080 Speaker 1: And the Eagles, you know, um, it's good to see 519 00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:20,000 Speaker 1: two black quarterbacks in the game. I'm not an Eagles fan. 520 00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:22,320 Speaker 1: I'm a Cowboy fan, so I'm not saying anything good 521 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:25,200 Speaker 1: about the Eagles, but I will say that I'm happy 522 00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:27,919 Speaker 1: that it's two black quarterbacks able to headline of the 523 00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 1: Super Bowl. It's beautiful. It was nice. You saw Joel 524 00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:33,399 Speaker 1: and Beat and James Harden at the game supporting. I 525 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:35,639 Speaker 1: love it. I always love it when like players from 526 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:37,639 Speaker 1: one team in the city come out to the players 527 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 1: in the other team. So that made let's go Chief, 528 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:42,439 Speaker 1: Let's go Chief. That was gonna ask you who you 529 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:44,639 Speaker 1: got in the Super Bowl, though, you got just because 530 00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:46,640 Speaker 1: you don't want to see another NFC East team win 531 00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:50,040 Speaker 1: or what. Well, Um Kelsey is a friend of the show, 532 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,200 Speaker 1: So I'm going for the Chiefs. I'm never I'm never 533 00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 1: going for the Eagles. Um men, Gilly the Kid and 534 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:57,840 Speaker 1: while from me, and that's where the game. We've been 535 00:23:57,960 --> 00:24:00,240 Speaker 1: arguing all the time about this, but I'm never saying 536 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:04,359 Speaker 1: anything good about the Eagles ever. I feel like I 537 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,840 Speaker 1: know a lot of Giants fans and when the Eagles 538 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:10,399 Speaker 1: and Patriots played in the Super Bowl, they didn't they 539 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:14,119 Speaker 1: were very conflicted on who to root against. It's just 540 00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:16,040 Speaker 1: that they'd like an earthquake or something to happen so 541 00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:18,160 Speaker 1: no one could win the game. That was the best outcome. 542 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,560 Speaker 1: So y'all in the NFC East or you very it's 543 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:26,720 Speaker 1: very it's very visceral for you. Yeah, this person Stack. 544 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:28,639 Speaker 1: We're gonna catch you on all the Smoke later this 545 00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:32,480 Speaker 1: week with Charles Barkley. I'm so excited for that. Thank 546 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:36,920 Speaker 1: you for today. Everything's awesome. I can't wait to see 547 00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:40,639 Speaker 1: that either. Rachel Charless was he did his thing. Man. Uh. 548 00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:44,320 Speaker 1: I didn't know how that interview was gonna go because 549 00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:46,959 Speaker 1: you know, I've said some things about Chuck and you know, 550 00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 1: in the media and all that, but uh, he came 551 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,480 Speaker 1: in as a big brother. He came in as somebody 552 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:57,200 Speaker 1: who's been doing this for uh for forever and the season, 553 00:24:57,400 --> 00:25:00,320 Speaker 1: and he came in, um showing us the same respect 554 00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 1: that we gave him. So it was beautiful. Well, look, 555 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:05,239 Speaker 1: Chuck has said things about guys out there too, so 556 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 1: he got well, no, but he knows you gotta be honest, right, 557 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 1: I mean, you can't pull punches. The really good people 558 00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:13,640 Speaker 1: in this game cannot pull punches. That's why people love 559 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:15,880 Speaker 1: listening to you all. That's why people love listening to him. 560 00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:18,080 Speaker 1: So I love hearing that you guys are all together 561 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:20,399 Speaker 1: in one place, and I can't wait to hear it. 562 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:23,159 Speaker 1: That's gonna be really good now, We've got a special 563 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:26,399 Speaker 1: interview with Jocelyn rose Lyon. She is the award winning 564 00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 1: director of Stand, coming out this Friday on Showtime. Here's 565 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:33,480 Speaker 1: a quick look at the trailer. One of the greatest 566 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:37,000 Speaker 1: players in the instrument was cheated out of his career. 567 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:40,400 Speaker 1: I noticed my mood was not standing for the national man. 568 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 1: Am I saying that everything in America is bad? No, 569 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:44,720 Speaker 1: but whatever the bad is, and as a less we 570 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:47,840 Speaker 1: don't stand for my moon. Never said I'm gonna burn 571 00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:50,600 Speaker 1: the house down, but the clan burned his house down 572 00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:54,880 Speaker 1: his willingness to take a stand. He should be celebrated 573 00:25:54,920 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 1: for that. Al Right, you guys just saw the trailer 574 00:26:04,080 --> 00:26:07,280 Speaker 1: for Stand, the Story of Mahmud abdul Rof, and this 575 00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:11,399 Speaker 1: premieres on Friday on Showtime. We are very lucky to 576 00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:14,119 Speaker 1: have the director of the film, Johnson rose Lions with 577 00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:17,840 Speaker 1: us today. Welcome. Thank you, Rachel, so great to be here. 578 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,800 Speaker 1: Thank you for having me. I don't think everyone knows 579 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:23,080 Speaker 1: what Stand is the story of, so you can you 580 00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:25,040 Speaker 1: just tell the audience what they can expect and what 581 00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 1: sort of logline for this film is. Yes, Stand is 582 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,560 Speaker 1: a story of well, I use basketball as the vehicle 583 00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 1: to tell Montmod abdul rolf story, which is a very dynamic, 584 00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:41,960 Speaker 1: layered story. There are mental health issues, activism, it's it's 585 00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:45,439 Speaker 1: a very layered story about his journey to find his 586 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:51,120 Speaker 1: paternal family, his kind of inner journey with Tourette syndrome, 587 00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 1: and of course his journey with the NBA and the 588 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:59,359 Speaker 1: media bias he experienced with his protest in some people 589 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:02,320 Speaker 1: don't even know what he did, or what he was protesting, 590 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 1: or who he is. So can you explain for people 591 00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:08,639 Speaker 1: who may not have known that pocket of history what 592 00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 1: his story with the NBA is. Yes, I mean part 593 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: of it's a great question, Rachel, because part of why 594 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,320 Speaker 1: so many people don't know about Matt Mud abdul Rao 595 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:22,080 Speaker 1: story almost thirty years later is because social media didn't 596 00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:25,480 Speaker 1: exist when he took a stand and when he made 597 00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:29,480 Speaker 1: prayer during the national anthem, he had just converted to 598 00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:33,080 Speaker 1: Islam and he made a prayer, Um, it's a lot 599 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:36,760 Speaker 1: uh and or his dua he made doua made prayer 600 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,159 Speaker 1: the Islamic prayer and Uh. He was really silenced. So 601 00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:44,639 Speaker 1: he only had one outlet, which was through the media 602 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,040 Speaker 1: and the television's Um. There was no social media for 603 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:54,080 Speaker 1: him to explain what was behind that stand and that protest. Well, look, 604 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:56,520 Speaker 1: I think a lot of people watching this may hear 605 00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,400 Speaker 1: that and they go, oh, okay, well that's a sports documentary. 606 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:01,280 Speaker 1: I did love the fact that you just said it 607 00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:03,640 Speaker 1: was a way too vehicle to tell the story. This 608 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:07,359 Speaker 1: is a very emotion packed roller coaster ride of a story. 609 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 1: I don't think you have to be a sports fan 610 00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:12,040 Speaker 1: to watch this. I mean, it's great if you are, 611 00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:14,240 Speaker 1: but but I wouldn't think that you'd have to be right. 612 00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 1: I completely agree. I think sports just like any vehicle, 613 00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:21,280 Speaker 1: you know, I look at things through the lens of light, 614 00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:24,880 Speaker 1: like I think humans. We we radiate light, and when 615 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:27,280 Speaker 1: we look at people who are stars, we say, well, wow, 616 00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:30,280 Speaker 1: they're a star really, because they're generating light. They're they're 617 00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:32,680 Speaker 1: gloding light. We're very drawn to the light. I think 618 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 1: Matt Mood abdul ra has a light about him, and 619 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:38,440 Speaker 1: his story is a light and the container for his story, 620 00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,640 Speaker 1: or the vehicle, is basketball. That's how we see his 621 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,720 Speaker 1: light shine through because he has a gift. But there 622 00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:47,520 Speaker 1: was so many other layers in the story that Stand 623 00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:49,800 Speaker 1: is able to tell. And I'm really honored that I 624 00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:53,760 Speaker 1: was able to help guide that story in through through 625 00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:56,640 Speaker 1: this movie. It's interesting what you say about the social 626 00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,280 Speaker 1: media because there's so much talk about how mak Mood 627 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:03,760 Speaker 1: was Alan Kaepernick before Colin Kaepernick. But it's not that simple, right. 628 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 1: I mean I saw a quote from Dr Harry Edwards, 629 00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:08,920 Speaker 1: the renowned civil rights expert. He noted that cap had 630 00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,120 Speaker 1: the power of as you say, social media, he had 631 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:13,440 Speaker 1: the force of the Black Lives Matter movement behind him. 632 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:16,400 Speaker 1: Then even going further back, Muhammad Ali and Kareem Abdul 633 00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:19,400 Speaker 1: Jabar had the framework of the Black Power movement behind them. 634 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 1: But his point was Mahmoud there was no greater movement 635 00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:24,480 Speaker 1: behind him, And the quote was that he was an 636 00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:28,080 Speaker 1: ocean alone with no paddle. How do you think that 637 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,680 Speaker 1: affected Makmoud's journey in his story? Well, mar Mood is 638 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: he's just a really strong person and it's amazing what 639 00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 1: he went through. The fires that mottmod walked through to 640 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: me make him an alchemist. And he was able to 641 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 1: walk through literal fires like the case, the literal and fires, 642 00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:48,959 Speaker 1: literal fires like they burned his home to the ground, 643 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:54,160 Speaker 1: and those fires, both inner and external, did not break him. 644 00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:56,480 Speaker 1: They made him. They rebirthed him like a phoenix. It's 645 00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:58,800 Speaker 1: like he really rose from the ashes and became the 646 00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:01,680 Speaker 1: mottmod Abdul he was meant to. And I think, you know, 647 00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:05,080 Speaker 1: he is a testament too we can always be reborn 648 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:08,400 Speaker 1: to ourselves and we can overcome obstacles because he sure 649 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:12,480 Speaker 1: faced a lot. And it's really amazing to me too 650 00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:16,720 Speaker 1: because I think going back to the Kaepernick before Kaepernick, Yes, 651 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 1: mom Mood really took a stand in a time when, 652 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 1: like David Aldridge said in the film, when we interviewed him, 653 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:24,320 Speaker 1: I was just so captivated by the way in which 654 00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,000 Speaker 1: he framed it. It's you know, he was on in 655 00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:29,200 Speaker 1: the island alone, like you said, Rachel, like an ocean 656 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:31,360 Speaker 1: with no paddle. I mean, he was out there alone 657 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:35,800 Speaker 1: and he didn't have a strategy behind the protest. He 658 00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:37,640 Speaker 1: didn't have a campaign, he didn't have a team, he 659 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,360 Speaker 1: didn't have social media as an outlet to say what's 660 00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:42,560 Speaker 1: next or what are we gonna do with this? So 661 00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:45,600 Speaker 1: it was it was probably a time for him that 662 00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:48,960 Speaker 1: was very introspective and based on the research I did 663 00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:50,840 Speaker 1: and the amazing team I got to work with, the 664 00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 1: producers and writers, we we really got to see his 665 00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:57,560 Speaker 1: journey was very painful and very difficult at that time. 666 00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,560 Speaker 1: He ended up losing everything and see in the film Um, 667 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:07,080 Speaker 1: including his his wife, just his mental health was definitely affected. 668 00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:11,160 Speaker 1: Everything was was was affected by that. And one of 669 00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:13,719 Speaker 1: the really striking things in the documentary was to see 670 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:17,160 Speaker 1: how little support other players gave him at the time. 671 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:21,080 Speaker 1: You had guys like hakimla Juan saying, Hey, I'm a Muslim, 672 00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:23,440 Speaker 1: I don't agree with his reasoning, I don't agree with 673 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,760 Speaker 1: what he's doing. What do you think was so complicated 674 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,480 Speaker 1: for other players, not not just them, but frankly now 675 00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:32,320 Speaker 1: when it comes to these situations and when they're asked 676 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:35,480 Speaker 1: to put sort of their credibility on the line, and 677 00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:39,600 Speaker 1: they get away a bunch of different stuff, right. Absolutely. 678 00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:42,240 Speaker 1: I think Shaq has a SoundBite in the film that 679 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:46,120 Speaker 1: really actually kind of encapsulates how players may see that. 680 00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:48,560 Speaker 1: To your point, I think a lot of times we 681 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:51,560 Speaker 1: look at things through the lens of the government or 682 00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:54,960 Speaker 1: the corporations or the larger entity that's kind of paying 683 00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:58,320 Speaker 1: us to controlling the space that we're working in. And 684 00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:01,040 Speaker 1: I think it's very complicated it for players to take 685 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:05,400 Speaker 1: a stand um because of course it can jeopardize your 686 00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:09,360 Speaker 1: standing with your job, um and your image. And we 687 00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:13,160 Speaker 1: all know how quickly the media can label people as 688 00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:16,880 Speaker 1: the villain or can villainize someone who's not, just because 689 00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:19,120 Speaker 1: we we need heroes and in order to have heroes, 690 00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:22,480 Speaker 1: we have to have villains. So I think it was complicated. Um. 691 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 1: I do, however, see certain players in his life, like 692 00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:29,000 Speaker 1: Jalyn Rose who was there with him at the time. Um, 693 00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:32,360 Speaker 1: they did. They did cover him, and they did support him, 694 00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:34,320 Speaker 1: and he did have the support if you if you 695 00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:36,440 Speaker 1: look at the film from that lens, there was support, 696 00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:38,920 Speaker 1: but it certainly wasn't the support that I think they 697 00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:42,560 Speaker 1: would have given him now, and certainly not the support 698 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:47,080 Speaker 1: that the movement behind someone like Kaepernick had. Well. Look, 699 00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:49,240 Speaker 1: I mean it's an interesting thing as we talk about, 700 00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:51,760 Speaker 1: you know, player autonomy, which is of course a huge 701 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,840 Speaker 1: subject in the n b A. When guys are getting 702 00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:57,959 Speaker 1: more money a in salary, getting paid and be in 703 00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,960 Speaker 1: terms of sponsorship, it gives them more freedom to say 704 00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 1: this is what I believe. These are the social movements 705 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,920 Speaker 1: that I want to be supportive of, because if you 706 00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:08,760 Speaker 1: decide you don't like it and you don't want to 707 00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 1: pay me anymore, that doesn't matter. I'm fine, Whereas back 708 00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:14,120 Speaker 1: in the days that you guys are covering in this 709 00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:19,360 Speaker 1: documentary that wasn't the case. Right. Well, it's interesting too 710 00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:22,320 Speaker 1: because you bring up sponsors, and I mean, that's the 711 00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:24,200 Speaker 1: thing is we never know what the stance of a 712 00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:27,600 Speaker 1: sponsor will be when we make our own voice heard, 713 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:31,040 Speaker 1: and if it's not in alignment with their values or 714 00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:34,160 Speaker 1: their brand, what that's gonna do to our relationship with them. 715 00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:39,560 Speaker 1: Mott mood, his his strength and courage really inspires me 716 00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:44,600 Speaker 1: because he did not care what he lost because to him, 717 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:48,040 Speaker 1: what I learned about him in directing the film is 718 00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:52,680 Speaker 1: that his freedom and his peace is is being able 719 00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:54,800 Speaker 1: to say and do what he feels is right no 720 00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:58,240 Speaker 1: matter what. And so if it means losing his job 721 00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 1: or losing his image and certain way to to him, 722 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,400 Speaker 1: that's not the value, that's not success, that's not his piece. 723 00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:08,000 Speaker 1: So I I really um it's a lot of courage 724 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,960 Speaker 1: and fearlessness that he had to take on that kind 725 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:14,960 Speaker 1: of approach with such huge entities. And you do a 726 00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,480 Speaker 1: great job in the film of sort of showing how 727 00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:20,160 Speaker 1: like with life, it all comes back around that that 728 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,840 Speaker 1: certain people later on after he did lose everything. The 729 00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:26,760 Speaker 1: years went by and people started to come back around 730 00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:30,160 Speaker 1: to his message, wanted him leading their basketball camps, wanted 731 00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:33,520 Speaker 1: him for speaking engagements. So uh, he did the story 732 00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:35,319 Speaker 1: you follow with his family. He was able to find 733 00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:37,759 Speaker 1: some of his family. So it's a really as I said, 734 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:41,160 Speaker 1: it's very emotional. It's really deep tail of sort of 735 00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:45,279 Speaker 1: all of these complicated issues, and I just I don't know. 736 00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:47,440 Speaker 1: I wanted to kind of turn the camera back around 737 00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:49,920 Speaker 1: on you and that we know pro sports is a 738 00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:52,960 Speaker 1: male dominated industry. What was it like for you, as 739 00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:55,319 Speaker 1: a young female director to be the one to tell 740 00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:59,400 Speaker 1: the story. It's a great question. It was difficult in 741 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:02,239 Speaker 1: some ways. I have an amazing team, some of which 742 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:05,560 Speaker 1: are women producers. So I was lucky to have, um 743 00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 1: a mixed group, both women and men on my side. UM. 744 00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:12,600 Speaker 1: Being in this space for a long time now, I've 745 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:16,880 Speaker 1: been very accustomed to being one of the only women directors. UM, 746 00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:20,239 Speaker 1: and I'm definitely a minority. I feel like when we 747 00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:22,399 Speaker 1: walk in in the room, so to speak, we are 748 00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:24,759 Speaker 1: at a disadvantage already because people see us as a 749 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,000 Speaker 1: woman first and a filmmaker second. One thing, I really, 750 00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,879 Speaker 1: UM feel very grateful for Actually was my first conversation 751 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:34,680 Speaker 1: with Steven Espinosa from Showtime Sports, the president of show 752 00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:37,920 Speaker 1: Time Sports. We had an incredibly in depth conversation about 753 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:40,920 Speaker 1: my creative approach for the film, and we were on 754 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,640 Speaker 1: the same page. We spoke the same language. I shared 755 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:45,799 Speaker 1: with him that I wanted to tell motmod abdul raub 756 00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,640 Speaker 1: story through kind of the lens of shadow boxing, that 757 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:51,800 Speaker 1: his journey was a very inner journey, facing his shadows 758 00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:54,520 Speaker 1: to find his light. We talked about him being a fighter, 759 00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: and we talked about it being more than basketball, that 760 00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:01,680 Speaker 1: basketball was the vehicle. And I remember Espinoza saying that 761 00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:04,200 Speaker 1: this is the story of so many other things, a 762 00:36:04,239 --> 00:36:08,160 Speaker 1: mental health activism. UM. But I think for me, I 763 00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:11,600 Speaker 1: tend to I tend to trust what comes my way. 764 00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:13,680 Speaker 1: If it's a yes, if it's for me, it'll find me. 765 00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:16,800 Speaker 1: And I felt this film was for me to tell UM. 766 00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:19,680 Speaker 1: I think that I've been prepared for this journey. I 767 00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:22,600 Speaker 1: converted to Islam in two thousand and three, so I 768 00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:26,960 Speaker 1: had a very personal relationship to converting to a religion myself, 769 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:29,600 Speaker 1: and I didn't grow up with that religion at all. Um. 770 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:32,000 Speaker 1: So similarly to Mot Mood, I was able to relate 771 00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:34,200 Speaker 1: to that part of his journey from the spiritual lens 772 00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:39,600 Speaker 1: and just just seeing kind of this space. We've grown 773 00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:41,520 Speaker 1: a lot. There's a lot of initiatives for women in 774 00:36:41,560 --> 00:36:44,960 Speaker 1: film now where diversity and inclusion women in film behind 775 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:47,080 Speaker 1: and in front of the camera is actually a thing, 776 00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:50,759 Speaker 1: kind of like activism at the intersection of athletes is 777 00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:53,680 Speaker 1: a thing. So these things weren't big back when mot 778 00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:57,319 Speaker 1: mood took his stand. Now they're they're actually trendy. It's 779 00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 1: it's it's acceptable. In fact, it's applauded. We want more 780 00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:03,080 Speaker 1: women in a film. We want to see people take 781 00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:05,480 Speaker 1: a stand for what they believe in. So I feel 782 00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:08,120 Speaker 1: super grateful to be able to direct a film like 783 00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:11,880 Speaker 1: this at a time like now. I mean, look, obviously, 784 00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:13,600 Speaker 1: when you say things that are meant to come your way, 785 00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,600 Speaker 1: do this was obviously meant for you. This film, it's 786 00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:19,960 Speaker 1: an incredible achievement. I found it, as I said, just riveting. 787 00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:23,120 Speaker 1: I can't wait until everyone else they're out there gets 788 00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:25,120 Speaker 1: to see the job you did with it, gets to 789 00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:27,680 Speaker 1: see the film. Thank you Jocelyn so much for being here. 790 00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:30,440 Speaker 1: We really appreciate it. Thank you so much, Rachel for 791 00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:32,680 Speaker 1: having me. It's an honor. So excited for everyone to 792 00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:35,160 Speaker 1: see the film and for all you guys out there, 793 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:39,040 Speaker 1: don't forget what's burning. Available every week on Showtime Basketball YouTube. 794 00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:43,200 Speaker 1: Also on Twitter, Instagram, TikTok all the Things Show Basketball. 795 00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:44,239 Speaker 1: We'll see you next week.