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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Savor production of iHeartRadio. I'm Annie Reese.

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Speaker 2: And I'm learning Vogel baumb and today we have an

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Speaker 2: episode for you about polenta.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, Was there any particular reason this one was

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Speaker 1: on your mind? Oh?

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Speaker 2: I have no idea anymore. It could It was so

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Speaker 2: long ago, days and days. I guess I was probably

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Speaker 2: looking for for a grain or a dish or something,

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Speaker 2: and then it sounded tasty.

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Speaker 1: I was like, all right, yeah, yeah, oh yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: already on my grocery list.

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Speaker 3: Oh cool.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but I actually have only had polina once.

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Speaker 3: In my entire life.

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Speaker 1: What, Yes, And I remember when it was Okay, specifically,

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Speaker 1: I was a grown adult and it was or back

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Speaker 1: when Kristen Conger and Ben Bowlin had the video series

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Speaker 1: for Stuff. We interviewed a local chef and he made polenta. Okay,

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Speaker 1: that was the first and only time I've had it.

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Speaker 1: I've definitely had things that I've seen people fight about

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Speaker 1: very similar be you know, similar things like grits.

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Speaker 3: But polenta. That was that was it. That was my

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Speaker 3: time and it was delicious.

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Speaker 2: Sure yeah, so good. Sure, I've I've had more than

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Speaker 2: one polenta in my life. I yeah, I have eaten

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Speaker 2: at a lot of Italian restaurants or Italian themed dishes. I've

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Speaker 2: I've made it myself a number of times. I've always

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Speaker 2: made like like the kind of porridge kind. But I

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Speaker 2: have been looking at photographs of really tasty looking preparations

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Speaker 2: of like of like a more firm, like like slice

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Speaker 2: polenta situation and then like grilled or like fried, and

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Speaker 2: I'm like, oh no, like, there there's a polenta world

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Speaker 2: out there that I need in my life.

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Speaker 1: There is, there is, And in fact, we've mentioned recently

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Speaker 1: Laurna and I the Savored team might be traveling soon.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's happening. I believe they booked it.

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I'm so like anything could change it any time, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think it's gonna happen. And I happened to be

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Speaker 1: looking at menus last night. Oh and I saw a

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Speaker 1: lot of places had plenta fries.

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Speaker 2: Sure, yeah, that is that. That is a photograph that

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Speaker 2: I've encountered a number of times over the over this

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Speaker 2: this reading cycle, and I am incredibly interested in it.

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Speaker 3: Well, and it might be our future.

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Speaker 2: All right, let's do it. We will report back.

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Speaker 1: Oh yes, yes, yes, it was funny because when I

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Speaker 1: was looking at the menus like so many, I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: we did an episode on that. I have to get that.

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Speaker 1: So yes, we will report back. But I guess this

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Speaker 1: brings us to our question, sure polenta?

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Speaker 3: What is it?

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Speaker 2: Well? Polenta is a type of staple grain porridge that

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Speaker 2: is typically made from yellow corn meal as a savory dish,

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Speaker 2: though it can come in just a lot of different

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Speaker 2: varieties and forms. It can be cooked up anywhere from

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Speaker 2: like soft and spoonable to sliceable to so firm that right.

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Speaker 2: It can be fried in cubes or fries and eaten

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Speaker 2: with your fingers. It can be the base of say

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Speaker 2: an impressive roast or stew kind of dish, or be

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Speaker 2: the simple feature onto itself. You can make it sweet

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Speaker 2: if you really want to. I can't tell you not too.

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Speaker 2: It's like it's like if grits had a wider repertoire

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Speaker 2: it it can be an amazing backing player or the

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Speaker 2: top billing as this straightforward permutation of like what corn

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Speaker 2: can be. You know how It's a grain that can

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Speaker 2: be tender and creamy and comforting with very few additions.

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Speaker 2: It's it's so simple and it can contain multitudes. It's like,

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Speaker 2: do you have that friend or maybe you are that

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Speaker 2: friend who makes things look effortless because of the sheer

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Speaker 2: amount of preparation that they have put into whatever it

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Speaker 2: is they're doing. Polenta can be like that.

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Speaker 4: Oh thanks for plenta, right, yes, so yes these days.

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Speaker 2: Polenta is usually made from whole grain yellow corn that

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Speaker 2: has been dried and ground into either a coarse or

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Speaker 2: medium grain meal. The types of corn used our flint

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Speaker 2: corn or dent corn. These are starchy types that are

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Speaker 2: not as sweet and juicy as the sweet corns that

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Speaker 2: we cook and eat fresh or off the cob or whatever.

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Speaker 2: So the corn is dried and ground, and to prepare polenta,

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Speaker 2: you heat the corn meal with like two to four

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Speaker 2: times as much liquid until the particles of corn are

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Speaker 2: totally hydrated. And further, you're usually looking to agitate the

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Speaker 2: mix by stirring frequently or perhaps constantly. I have no

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Speaker 2: I have no spoon in this game. This will help

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Speaker 2: break up some of the starch molecules, which will then

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Speaker 2: like chain and scaffold together in a sort of gel

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Speaker 2: matrix with the water to form a soft structure. Like

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Speaker 2: you don't want your polenta to be to be runny

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Speaker 2: or grainy, particularly like it should be anywhere from say

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Speaker 2: a soft scrambled egg to a firm omelet in texture.

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Speaker 1: Hmm, okay, I'm going to keep all this in mind

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Speaker 1: when I get Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there are lots of guides on how to achieve

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Speaker 2: different textures of polenta, and cooks do have strong opinions

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Speaker 2: about how it should be done. Oh I'm sure, Oh yes, sure,

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Speaker 2: oh yes, So however you think it is correct, I

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Speaker 2: believe in you and I want you to do that. Yes,

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Speaker 2: we love a strong opinion. Polenta can physically again, you

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Speaker 2: do you. But it can physically be cooked plain with

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Speaker 2: water or flavored with a stock of whatever variety, or

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Speaker 2: made creamier with whatever kind of milk or cheese you like,

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Speaker 2: or can incorporate stirrings like herbs or spices, or stuff

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Speaker 2: like mushrooms. It can be served as a porridge or

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Speaker 2: formed into cakes. It can be the starch base and

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Speaker 2: a meal topped with meats or veg or stews, or

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Speaker 2: be more the star of a dish or side dish

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Speaker 2: with just simple garnishes or sauces. As cakes, polenta can

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Speaker 2: be further grilled or pan fried or lightly breaded and

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Speaker 2: deep fried. That way, it might be served on skewers

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Speaker 2: or as a dippable snack. Small rounds of polenta are

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Speaker 2: a type of yolki yoki y alla romana, so you know,

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Speaker 2: check that out. See see our yolk episode for more

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Speaker 2: on that. In these days, you can buy instant polenta,

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Speaker 2: which is made with a fine grain corn meal or

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Speaker 2: perhaps pre cooked corn meal, or even totally pre made polenta,

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Speaker 2: either in like a microwavable bowl or in tubes like

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Speaker 2: cookie dough, or pre formed into cakes of various shapes

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Speaker 2: and sizes.

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Speaker 1: Yes, And funnily enough, we're recording this later than we

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Speaker 1: normally would because we had kind of a storm and

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Speaker 1: power outages yesterday and I was kind of slammed in

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Speaker 1: like saving a lot of data, and so I was

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Speaker 1: supposed to go to the grocery store yesterday. I was like, okay,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna to just get somebody to deliver groceries for me.

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Speaker 3: And I tried.

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Speaker 1: I looked at polenta. There was a common argument under

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Speaker 1: the polenta from like my local grocery store on this

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Speaker 1: local delivery, okay, about like the quality of the polino

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Speaker 1: wow that they were offering and I.

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Speaker 2: Was like, this is hilarious, that's amazing, that's really cool.

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Speaker 3: Yeah they were.

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Speaker 1: They were like, no, you should only get it if

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Speaker 1: it's this kind, because this is just not even really polina.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, a whole thread of common of strong hecking opinions.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's I. I for sure ran across the opinion

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Speaker 2: that instant polenta like pre made polenta maybe, but instant

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Speaker 2: polenta never, Like, what are you even doing the vibes

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Speaker 2: And there's.

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Speaker 1: A part of me that feels so tickled by someone

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Speaker 1: who would comment thread like no, it was, it's kind

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Speaker 1: of endearing, to be honest.

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Speaker 2: And I did write like like, depending on which article

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Speaker 2: I was reading, like some people would be like, no,

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Speaker 2: it's only medium grain, that's only the appropriate grain, and

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Speaker 2: other people being like, no, it's only coarse grain. That

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Speaker 2: is the only appropriate grain, and just very firm and

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Speaker 2: certain in their opinion. And I was like, yeah, sure

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Speaker 2: do write.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, into it, into it. Well, what about the nutrition.

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Speaker 2: Actually, we are going to talk a lot about this

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Speaker 2: in the history section. Corn is lacking in some vital nutrients,

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Speaker 2: and so if you're eating too much of that at

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Speaker 2: the expense of a wider variety of foods than you

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Speaker 2: can run into some problems. It's it's a starch. It's

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Speaker 2: a starch base. You know, it depends again, this is

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Speaker 2: one of the things where like how much butter you

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Speaker 2: put in there, it's really going.

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Speaker 3: To affect what the nutritional profile is.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, it's it's a starch base.

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Speaker 1: That's nice. It's so comforting it is. Well, we do

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Speaker 1: have some numbers for you.

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Speaker 2: Okay, all right, the the like global production numbers of

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Speaker 2: polenta are tied into those of corn meal, and I

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Speaker 2: could not find a source without paying thousands of dollars

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Speaker 2: for a market research paper, and I did not do that.

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Speaker 2: So so I have, right, I have a couple of

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Speaker 2: numbers for you. I have we have a world record.

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Speaker 2: The Guinness record for the largest serving of polenta was

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Speaker 2: achieved in twenty fifteen in Italy. It weighed five twenty

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Speaker 2: kilos that's eleven and sixty seven pounds.

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Speaker 1: Oh well, my whole rest of the day is derailed

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Speaker 1: because I can't fathom.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, if it helps. The dimensions or the dimension

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Speaker 2: of the pot that it was made in. The pot

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Speaker 2: was two point five meters in diameter, that's about eight

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Speaker 2: feet across.

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Speaker 3: I mean it helps a little.

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Speaker 2: So this is like a full on, like hot tub

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Speaker 2: sized serving of polenta. Wow, like a large hot tub

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Speaker 2: hmm wow.

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Speaker 1: Well, now I want to see if you've ever read

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Speaker 1: or seen The Black Cauldron, they need to do it with.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean there's a lot we'd have to

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Speaker 1: figure out a lot of the details, but sure there's

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Speaker 1: some logistics, but the idea is there.

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Speaker 2: Right there, Come on, yeah, okay. And so there are

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Speaker 2: a number of polentiff festivals in Italy in places where

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Speaker 2: it is a traditional dish, and different festivals have different vibes,

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Speaker 2: like all clearly involved polenta tastings, but you know, some

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Speaker 2: feature like like football competitions soccer. Some have like nonfiction

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Speaker 2: book readings and agricultural presentations and perhaps of note one

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Speaker 2: in Prato was in as of this year twenty twenty three,

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Speaker 2: it was in its four hundred and forty seventh year.

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Speaker 2: It originated after the events of fifteen twelve, When the

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Speaker 2: story goes, the Spanish sacked the town, lots of death

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Speaker 2: and destruction, and in the famine that followed, the local

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Speaker 2: lords sent along some chestnut flower along with herring and

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Speaker 2: cod to help the survivors out and at the time

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Speaker 2: chestnut flower not cornmeal, was polenta was being made with

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Speaker 2: there so previously on ash Wednesday, now on the first

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Speaker 2: Sunday of Lent, they hold a chestnut Polenta festival. It

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Speaker 2: involves all of this historical reenactment and costumes and a

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Speaker 2: parade and these big, round, like two foot across cakes

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Speaker 2: of chestnut polenta, plus herring and cod of course, and

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Speaker 2: other foods and wines.

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Speaker 3: It's run.

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Speaker 2: This is my favorite detail. It's run by this historical

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Speaker 2: group that calls themselves the Societa de la Misuria, which

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Speaker 2: is the Society of misery or perhaps poverty. I've seen

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Speaker 2: it translated both ways, but that is just so. I

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Speaker 2: feel like Italians are more goth like on any given

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Speaker 2: Tuesday than I could possibly achieve being through trying an eyeliner.

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Speaker 3: Like, yeah, I love this.

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Speaker 1: Yes, I feel like we have a lot of these

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Speaker 1: European especially food societies organizations. Yeah, have these pretty like

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Speaker 1: metal hardcore names.

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Speaker 3: It's so cool. Oh, I know, I love it.

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Speaker 2: I hope that, you know, like, if our society survives

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Speaker 2: another couple hundred years, that these type of historical societies

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Speaker 2: pop up here in the United States.

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Speaker 3: Yes, I hope so too. I hope so too. It

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Speaker 3: also just I.

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Speaker 1: Love the idea that if you grow up in a

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Speaker 1: place like maybe having a Polento festival run by the

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Speaker 1: Society of Misery is.

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Speaker 3: Just normal, Like, oh, clearly, yeah, yeah right.

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Speaker 1: I love that I grew up at a small town

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Speaker 1: we had a festival, and to me it's pretty normal,

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Speaker 1: and I bet to a bunch of other people it's not.

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Speaker 3: But it's just kind of funny that. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the day that we all get our sixteenth

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Speaker 2: century and go down to the town center and eat

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Speaker 2: some pullinton. That's what you do.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know why you're so confused about it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I love it.

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Speaker 3: Well, we do have quite the history for you.

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Speaker 2: We do, and we're going to get into that as

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Speaker 2: soon as we get back from a quick break for

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Speaker 2: a word from our sponsors.

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Speaker 3: And we're back. Thank you, sponsors, Yes, thank you.

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Speaker 1: So corn and cornmeal are native to the Americas, and

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Speaker 1: corn is a different and terrifying episode. Oh yeah, we

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Speaker 1: talked about baby corn for a minute. I thought maybe

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Speaker 1: we had already done corn. I think we've done a

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Speaker 1: lot of things corn jacent, yes, exactly.

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Speaker 3: But we have not tackled corn.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, like in like the in like the tortillas episode,

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Speaker 2: and oh gosh, some rite some other things that involve cornmeal.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yes, yes, but that's but yeah, that is.

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Speaker 2: A problem, that is right, That is a number of

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Speaker 2: problems for future.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and I will say this one is a bit

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Speaker 1: messy because of the corn aspect that so many people

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Speaker 1: consider as necessary for modern polina. Like you don't if

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Speaker 1: it doesn't have cornual in it, it's not polenta.

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Speaker 2: Right, and there are other like dditions of different flowers

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Speaker 2: that different people incorporate. But but right, it's it's pretty

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Speaker 2: solidly considered how you make polenta in most places these days.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, and it made like tracking down pre corn

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Speaker 1: polenta very very difficult, but it did exist before the

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Speaker 1: introduction of corn to Italy. Polina was made with a

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Speaker 1: variety of things like barley, millet or ground up chestnuts.

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Speaker 1: As far back as ancient Rome. According to some sources,

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Speaker 1: people were eating something that is close to what we

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Speaker 1: would call polenta. But yeah, people like to fight about it.

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Speaker 1: People like to fight about it. When Europeans started colonizing

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Speaker 1: North America, corn meal was a literal lifesaver for many

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Speaker 1: during tough winters when food was scarce, and corn had

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Speaker 1: a few advantages over wheat, like shorter growing season's higher yield,

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Speaker 1: and because of that, it spread pretty quickly around the

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Speaker 1: rest of the globe when the Europeans found out about it,

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Speaker 1: from Europe to the Middle East to Asia. Europeans at

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Speaker 1: the time wrote that Native Americans cooked corn meal with

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Speaker 1: water and served it with sauces and sometimes proteins like fish,

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Speaker 1: So that sounds pretty close to plento. A lot of

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Speaker 1: articles I read described as sort of excitement in Europe,

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Speaker 1: and in this case, particularly amongst Venice merchants around new

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Speaker 1: products coming from the Americas in the fifteen hundreds, because

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Speaker 1: they wanted to trade these items. They wanted to profit

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Speaker 1: off of this excitement, but to do that they had

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Speaker 1: to find ways to convince people how to use it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because like what we talked about in episodes, kind of

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Speaker 1: like hot chocolate, there was a bit of a learning

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Speaker 1: curve of educating folks about how they could use these

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Speaker 1: ingredients that were new to them. It's kind of like

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Speaker 1: those recipe books that would come out that we talked

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Speaker 1: about all the time in like the nineteen twenties, where they're.

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Speaker 3: Like, you can use bananas with my own.

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Speaker 1: It's sort of like that, Yeah, you can, you can.

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Speaker 1: But one of the easiest ways to use corn was

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Speaker 1: to grind it up and use it as a flower,

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Speaker 1: and most people were familiar with flower, they knew how

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Speaker 1: to use flour, so that was kind of a good

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Speaker 1: jumping off point for convincing people you want this thing,

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Speaker 1: you can use this thing. From there, people could boil

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Speaker 1: the flour of the corn meal by itself or with

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Speaker 1: flavorings or additions to come up with a hearty and

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Speaker 1: filling porridge.

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Speaker 3: And corn did.

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Speaker 1: Grow pretty well in parts of Europe, particularly southern Italy,

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Speaker 1: and it was cheap, meaning that it was part of

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Speaker 1: the diets of classes of lower socioeconomic status. By the

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Speaker 1: seventeenth century, cornal was largely in general use and it

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Speaker 1: became the staple that was used to make polenta. However,

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Speaker 1: as you mentioned at the top, Lauren, it was a

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Speaker 1: filling and cheap alternative, but it didn't have plinta, didn't

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Speaker 1: have all the nutrients people needed, and the impoverished relying

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Speaker 1: on it suffered because of that, specifically from a degenerative

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Speaker 1: disease called pelagra, stemming from a deficiency in vitamin B

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Speaker 1: three and this was a big deal. We've talked about

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Speaker 1: it before in previous episodes. Records exist going back to

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Speaker 1: the second half of the seventeen hundreds that were linking

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Speaker 1: polagra to polenta consumption.

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Speaker 3: In Italy.

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Speaker 1: A survey from eighteen seventy nine found that nine out

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Speaker 1: of ten of those surveyed in regions where polina was

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Speaker 1: common suffered from polagra. Yeah, it was pretty pretty severe. Notably,

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Speaker 1: indigenous peoples in the Americas had figured this out way

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Speaker 1: earlier and new to supplement things like plinca or corn

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Speaker 1: porridge with beans and tomatoes, stuff like that. The Europeans

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Speaker 1: did not have this knowledge.

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Speaker 2: Yep, yeah, yep. Meanwhile, in Italy in eighteen nineteen, there

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Speaker 2: was this phenomenon of polenta blooming with spots of what

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Speaker 2: appeared to be blocklood, what like prepared polentis sitting out

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Speaker 2: would suddenly grow these these these red spots on it,

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Speaker 2: and people were like, it is cursed by the devil,

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Speaker 2: that is what is going on here.

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Speaker 3: Obvious.

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Speaker 2: But a chemist by the name of Bartolommeo Bizio decided

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Speaker 2: to get to the bottom of this, and he found

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Speaker 2: a microorganism. He thought it was a fungus turns out

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Speaker 2: to be a bacterium. He named it sarah Tilla marcisens.

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Speaker 2: And this this is a bacteria that will grow in

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Speaker 2: a colony and will produce this pink to red kind

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Speaker 2: of pigment. If you've ever had like in your in

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Speaker 2: your shower, like on your shower curtain, maybe you're like

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Speaker 2: in your toilet bowl, a little bit of pink coloration,

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Speaker 2: that's what this is from. It can be pretty benign

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Speaker 2: or cause all kinds of problems, but I wanted to

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Speaker 2: bring it up because again, like this is just so

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Speaker 2: heck and metal. That's great. Like people were like, blood

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Speaker 2: is growing on my polenta. It's been cursed by Satan

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Speaker 2: and this guy got to the bottom of it. It's

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Speaker 2: pretty cool. It was also happening sometimes on statues, like

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Speaker 2: it would create this red pannnectation on statue so it

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Speaker 2: looked like the statues were bleeding.

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Speaker 3: I love it. That's creepy. Yeah, that is creepy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Also, I am admittedly kind of nervous around grains

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Speaker 1: after the last of us.

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Speaker 2: So.

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Speaker 3: They knew what was up. Yeah, fair enough, fair enough. Wow.

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Speaker 1: Plants popularity post colonization in the United States that dates

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Speaker 1: back to at least eighteen twenty four, when Mary Randolph

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Speaker 1: published a polinta recipe in her work The Virginia Housewife,

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Speaker 1: which fun facts. I, Lauren and I are very different

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Speaker 1: in how I do these outlines.

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Speaker 3: I like word vomit and then edit it. Yeah. I

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00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:57,960
Speaker 3: was going back over.

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Speaker 1: Yesterday to fact check and edit and all that stuff,

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Speaker 1: and I accidentally put Maya Rudolph instead of Mary.

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Speaker 3: Randall Off and I was reading it. I was like,

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Speaker 3: I don't think that's right.

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Speaker 2: I don't think that seems incorrect.

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Speaker 3: I'm so glad. I was like, nah, I gotta check

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Speaker 3: that it wasn't correct, very incorrect.

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Speaker 1: But anyway, one of the reasons that polina was absent

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Speaker 1: in cookbooks before this was this association of polina amongst

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Speaker 1: them more well off as a.

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Speaker 3: Quote poor man's cruel or porridge.

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Speaker 1: And there was also racism around Native Americans and their foods.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't expecting to find this, but I found some

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Speaker 1: anecdotal accounts of Italians about their relatives being forced to

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Speaker 1: give up their polina pots during World War two. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: so that they could be melted to make things like ammo.

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Speaker 1: Because of that, some had this painful association with polenta,

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Speaker 1: and it was also kind of associated with like it

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Speaker 1: was something that you could eat during rationing in Italy,

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Speaker 1: So people had kind of this painful association with it,

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Speaker 1: the same.

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Speaker 2: Way that like caale fell out of fashion over here

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Speaker 2: after it being such a wartime garden staple, sure exactly.

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Speaker 1: And then that kind of got amplified for people who

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Speaker 1: came who were forced to leave Italy and came to

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Speaker 1: America and lived in poverty here. But when that generation

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Speaker 1: died out, a lot of their children or their grandchildren

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Speaker 1: sought out polina as a link to their heritage.

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Speaker 3: In their past.

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Speaker 1: Wow, it was a pretty moving article from that I

391
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Speaker 1: found about it. The America's particularly the non indigenous population,

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Speaker 1: had their own struggle with polagra, especially in North America

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Speaker 1: and particularly in the southern parts of North America. Between

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Speaker 1: nineteen oh seven and nineteen forty, around three million Americans

395
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Speaker 1: developed polagra. And this is worth mentioning because polenta or

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00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:20,840
Speaker 1: the southern equivalent of it, a lot of people like

397
00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:25,240
Speaker 1: to fight about this, like I said, was consumed more

398
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:31,360
Speaker 1: commonly in the south. And also once again, if they'd

399
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:34,760
Speaker 1: listened to the indigenous folks, then they probably could have

400
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,160
Speaker 1: avoided the whole thing stepping way back.

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00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:40,119
Speaker 3: But this blew my mind.

402
00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:46,320
Speaker 1: Okay, let's talk about bram Stoker's Dracula. All right, let's

403
00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:51,120
Speaker 1: I mean you brought up blooming blood, Satan's Blood, and polina.

404
00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 3: Let me talk about Dracula.

405
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:53,080
Speaker 2: Okay.

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00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:56,760
Speaker 1: It was published in age ninety seven, and it included

407
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Speaker 1: a mention of polenta.

408
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:00,160
Speaker 3: And here's the oh.

409
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:02,240
Speaker 1: And I apologize if I butcherl out this because I

410
00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 1: tried to look at the pronunciations and no, luck, no, look.

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00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 2: Okay, here we go.

412
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:10,919
Speaker 1: I had for breakfast more paprika and a sort of

413
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:15,200
Speaker 1: porridge of maize flower which they said was mama liga polina,

414
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:18,800
Speaker 1: and eggplant stuffed with force meat, a very excellent dish,

415
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 1: which they call implitata.

416
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:23,640
Speaker 3: It does sound good.

417
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:26,400
Speaker 2: That does sound yeah, that sounds great.

418
00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:28,359
Speaker 3: I need to go back and read that book.

419
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:32,600
Speaker 1: It's been a minute since I've read it, and I

420
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Speaker 1: don't remember this.

421
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Speaker 2: I don't think I ever got through it. Yeah.

422
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah.

423
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Speaker 1: Well, anyway, in the nineteen seventies there were scientific studies

424
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Speaker 1: into whether polenta was a say it with me afra.

425
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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's why usually we get this way earlier than

426
00:26:56,440 --> 00:27:01,960
Speaker 2: like the nineteen seventies. That's great. Oh, I was like.

427
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 1: Surely, but yeah, And as with many things we discussed,

428
00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:14,879
Speaker 1: polina has gone from this quote poor man's food to

429
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:18,639
Speaker 1: something frequently found on the menu of expensive restaurants in

430
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:22,160
Speaker 1: recent years. That's not to say that it's not made

431
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:28,240
Speaker 1: in home still at all, but I mean my association

432
00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:31,240
Speaker 1: with it, with this one time I had it was

433
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 1: that's too fancy for me.

434
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:36,280
Speaker 3: That's why I've never had it. Oh wow, Uh it wasn't. Yeah.

435
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:38,600
Speaker 1: I literally thought like, oh that's something I would get

436
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 1: expensive Italian restaurant.

437
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 3: I won't.

438
00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:45,880
Speaker 1: And I found some articles that were mostly tongue in chic,

439
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 1: but they were making the point about grits, which is

440
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,239
Speaker 1: not the same thing, not the same thing, but they

441
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 1: were saying, kind of it's like that thing where grits

442
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 1: is scene is so kind of cheap and only a

443
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,720
Speaker 1: certain type of people eat it, and it's very it's

444
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:05,159
Speaker 1: bland and all this stuff. But if you change grits

445
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:07,720
Speaker 1: to bolinta, like the name, how many people would.

446
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 2: Be like, oh, no, I love that, right, yeah?

447
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:11,120
Speaker 1: Right?

448
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:14,920
Speaker 3: It was interesting, I mean.

449
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:18,480
Speaker 2: And there is also the phenomenon of Southern food becoming

450
00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:23,679
Speaker 2: this elevated restaurant thing recently where yeah, like like you go,

451
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 2: it's so wild to be back when we were traveling

452
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:29,880
Speaker 2: and we would be in a completely non South part

453
00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:33,400
Speaker 2: of the country and there would be grits on menus

454
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 2: and I was like, what are you talking about? I mean,

455
00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 2: like cool, but like what right? Like no, I'm not

456
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:41,960
Speaker 2: going to get the tripping grits like that, Like I

457
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:43,280
Speaker 2: can get that at home and it's probably going to

458
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 2: be better. Sorry.

459
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I will never forget one of the first times

460
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:50,800
Speaker 1: I went to New York and I was like.

461
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,040
Speaker 3: Your country girl, like going to the big city.

462
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,120
Speaker 1: My tour guide happened to be someone who was quite

463
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 1: quite rich. It's a long story, but anyway, okay, cool

464
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 1: she was telling me about. She was like, there's this

465
00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: new restaurant I've got to take you to in downtown

466
00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 1: New York. They have twenty types of grits. And I

467
00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 1: was like what, yeah, well.

468
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,320
Speaker 3: You know, I hope they were all delicious.

469
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:29,360
Speaker 2: We did not end up going, Okay, okay that, Yeah,

470
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:31,920
Speaker 2: I was gonna say where good.

471
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 1: I have no idea what twenty I mean, I guess

472
00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:37,520
Speaker 1: I could if I really thought about it, I could

473
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 1: come up with twenty types of grits.

474
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 2: But yeah, there's different varieties of corn and different grinds

475
00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 2: on the corn meal, and different ingredients you can incorporate,

476
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,240
Speaker 2: and different methods of cooking. Sure m hm.

477
00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:57,880
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.

478
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:00,760
Speaker 1: And again I was looking at Minus last night and

479
00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:02,520
Speaker 1: I saw a lot of polina and I was kind

480
00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:07,480
Speaker 1: of I don't have the experience with polina, so's I

481
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,800
Speaker 1: couldn't judge, but I was. I was like, wow, you

482
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 1: can really do polenta in a lot of ways. I

483
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 1: didn't realize, but yeah, maybe, like we said, maybe we'll

484
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 1: get to test it out report back absolutely, absolutely, yes,

485
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:25,960
Speaker 1: Well that's what we have to say about polina for now.

486
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,600
Speaker 2: It is. We would of course love to hear from you,

487
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:32,280
Speaker 2: and we do have some listener mail for you, and

488
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:33,760
Speaker 2: we're going to get into that as soon as we

489
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:35,520
Speaker 2: get back from one more quick break for a word

490
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:45,440
Speaker 2: from our sponsors. And we're back.

491
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 3: Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you, and we're back with listener. Man.

492
00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 3: It's like stirring polinza stirring. Yeah.

493
00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:02,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I remember from the time that chef

494
00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 1: was cooking it.

495
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:04,080
Speaker 3: There's a lot of story.

496
00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:10,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, yep, yep, Taylor wrote, I am catching up

497
00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:12,920
Speaker 1: on episodes and have a few stories when it comes

498
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 1: to rabbits. The first is that I too, am a

499
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:22,640
Speaker 1: terrible rabbit owned. When I was about six or seven,

500
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:25,760
Speaker 1: my parents let my sister and I get rabbits as pets.

501
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 1: My dad told us not to scare them and went

502
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:30,840
Speaker 1: on with his day with no explanation as to why.

503
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 1: The cages of these rabbits were on rolling carts so

504
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 1: that we could move them out onto the patio if

505
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,760
Speaker 1: the weather was nice, so the cage itself was about

506
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,360
Speaker 1: three feet off the ground. Being the curious kid I was,

507
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:46,280
Speaker 1: I wanted to know why we couldn't scare the rabbits

508
00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:49,800
Speaker 1: and set off to creep up below the cage. I

509
00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:52,720
Speaker 1: jumped out at the rabbits, and sure enough, one had

510
00:31:52,720 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 1: a heart attack and died. I was devastated. My mom

511
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 1: came running in to see what was wrong, and when

512
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:05,440
Speaker 1: I told her what my dad had said, she immediately

513
00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:08,080
Speaker 1: started to yell at him that you can't just say

514
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:14,080
Speaker 1: that you can't scare rabbits and not explain. Needless to say,

515
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:19,400
Speaker 1: we did not get any more rabbits. Traditionally, rabbit is

516
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:22,560
Speaker 1: a very popular meat in Sicily, where my family comes from.

517
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:26,080
Speaker 1: Because of the accessibility for trading in during the Age

518
00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 1: of Expiration, Cicily was one of the first areas to

519
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: receive chocolate, and thus it is in many of our dishes.

520
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,600
Speaker 1: One particular dish I remember from childhood was a rabbit

521
00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 1: in a mully like chocolate sauce. My parents told me

522
00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 1: to eat it to see if I liked it before

523
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 1: telling me that it was rabbit meat, and my little

524
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:49,160
Speaker 1: ears heard rabbit meat, which is what we still refer

525
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:53,720
Speaker 1: to it as today. Finally, in regards to Annie's traumatic

526
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 1: Pixar short, when you first started discussing the rabbit and

527
00:32:57,440 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 1: the Pixar short, I thought you were going to talk

528
00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:03,320
Speaker 1: about Presto, which is a short about a magician's rabbit

529
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:05,720
Speaker 1: who takes over the show but refusing to be pulled

530
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 1: out of the hat. It was one of my favorite

531
00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 1: shorts as a kid, and I hope it can reinstill

532
00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:14,360
Speaker 1: some trust in rabbit shorts for you. The one any

533
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,440
Speaker 1: described sounds terrifying and I am glad I have never

534
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:22,160
Speaker 1: seen it. Yeah, as you should be, although I was

535
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 1: almost a terrible person and I almost sent the link

536
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:26,320
Speaker 1: because I feel like it must be shared.

537
00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:27,760
Speaker 3: Like the rings, Yeah, I said.

538
00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I see I see you.

539
00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:34,120
Speaker 1: Oh I have never seen presto, but it sounds way cuter.

540
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, that one is nice. I can yes, I'm

541
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 2: gonna test. Yeah, but yeah, no, that is you. Yeah.

542
00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 2: You have to explain things to kids or they'll just

543
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:46,640
Speaker 2: I mean, you have to explain things to me at

544
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:49,240
Speaker 2: a certain point like this. This counts towards adults too,

545
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:52,760
Speaker 2: like yeah, don't just give someone a rule and then

546
00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 2: expect them to not do it, like well, I never

547
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:57,479
Speaker 2: would have thought of it before, but now I need

548
00:33:57,520 --> 00:33:57,760
Speaker 2: to know.

549
00:33:57,720 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 3: What happens exactly.

550
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:03,360
Speaker 1: And I don't think I ever I explained it to you,

551
00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:04,800
Speaker 1: Lauren after we talked about it.

552
00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 3: I don't think I ever said. But that's kind of

553
00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 3: what happened to my rabbit.

554
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:13,279
Speaker 1: I was so excited to see her Fluffy, and I

555
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:15,279
Speaker 1: was like, oh thought, and I ran at her and

556
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:16,600
Speaker 1: she jumped so hard.

557
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:21,480
Speaker 3: And that was it for Fluffy. So I see you, Taylor,

558
00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:22,480
Speaker 3: I see you.

559
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 1: Well alright, p Fluffy, Yeah.

560
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,439
Speaker 3: Poor buddy. I love rabbit. Rabbit meat.

561
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, what a thing to feed someone, right, you know

562
00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 1: again when you're a kid.

563
00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:50,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, okay. Chad wrote, we are tickled Pink

564
00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:53,960
Speaker 2: listening to your latest episode about back beers while catching

565
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 2: up from a long break where we just happened to

566
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 2: be in Louisville for bock Fest, goat races, and food.

567
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:04,319
Speaker 2: Long story short, we invited four couple friends of ours

568
00:35:04,360 --> 00:35:06,640
Speaker 2: to hang out with us in Louisville doing all things

569
00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:09,000
Speaker 2: we loved when we spent time there during the pandemic,

570
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:12,919
Speaker 2: which of course included Bockfest while a much abbreviated version

571
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 2: during twenty twenty to twenty twenty two. The city is

572
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:18,879
Speaker 2: filled with great food and bourbon and people. And if

573
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:21,360
Speaker 2: you haven't yet visited, let us know and we'll happily

574
00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:25,400
Speaker 2: share our list of goodies and places to go do, eat, drink.

575
00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:28,680
Speaker 2: It's a lovely place and we know you'd like it. Plus,

576
00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:32,080
Speaker 2: there are many Olmsted designed parks to go and explore.

577
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:36,000
Speaker 2: It's like a Midwest central park city. So here are

578
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:38,720
Speaker 2: a few photos and a video of the goat parade.

579
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,879
Speaker 2: And yes, they do goat races throughout the day. It's

580
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:44,840
Speaker 2: really crazy because some of those goats just do not

581
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:47,440
Speaker 2: care to race, while others run anyway.

582
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:52,520
Speaker 1: They like, Yeah, thank you for confirming this, because that's

583
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:53,920
Speaker 1: what that's how I thought.

584
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:57,440
Speaker 2: The goat races right right, like you tele agoat to

585
00:35:57,520 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 2: race and it's either going to like stand there and

586
00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:03,520
Speaker 2: stare at you with its creepy little goat eyes or yeah,

587
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:05,960
Speaker 2: she's just gonna run a muk yeah run.

588
00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:13,319
Speaker 1: Amok exactly exactly. The pictures were great, much appreciated. It

589
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:14,280
Speaker 1: sounds like a hooped.

590
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:15,479
Speaker 3: It sounds like a fun time.

591
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:19,760
Speaker 2: Yeah and nanny, yes, yeah, and no, And we love Louisville.

592
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 2: Yeah we got to go. That was was that our

593
00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:24,759
Speaker 2: very first field track.

594
00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:29,640
Speaker 1: I think it was I think like outside of Atlanta area.

595
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, we got to go and yeah, talk

596
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:38,640
Speaker 2: to some bourbon folks at Russell Russell's Reserve and try

597
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:45,239
Speaker 2: some bourbon and eat a hot brown, order too many

598
00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:47,640
Speaker 2: plates of that for the table, and have a lot

599
00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 2: of food. Yeah yeah, oh man, I would love to

600
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 2: go back. What a great place.

601
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:54,239
Speaker 1: It was fun, it was a great It was a

602
00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 1: great trip and it was beautiful. Sure we get to

603
00:36:57,160 --> 00:36:59,399
Speaker 1: see some of the scenery kind of outside the city

604
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 1: and it was very yeah yeah yeah. Well, thank you

605
00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 1: to you both of these listeners for writing in. If

606
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:09,440
Speaker 1: you would like to write to us, we would love

607
00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:12,360
Speaker 1: to hear from you. Our emails Hello at sabrepod dot com.

608
00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:14,759
Speaker 2: We are also on social media. You can find us

609
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:17,799
Speaker 2: on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram at saver pod and we

610
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:20,719
Speaker 2: do hope to hear from you. Savor is production of iHeartRadio.

611
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:23,000
Speaker 2: For more podcasts in my Heart Radio, you can visit

612
00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:26,520
Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to

613
00:37:26,560 --> 00:37:29,400
Speaker 2: your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our super producers

614
00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:32,160
Speaker 2: Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening,

615
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 2: and we hope that lots of more good things are

616
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 2: coming your way