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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha.

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Speaker 2: I welcome to staff. I never told you protection of

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Speaker 2: iHeart Radio, and today welcome to another edition of Happy Hour.

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Speaker 2: As always, if you are drinking or whatever you're doing,

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Speaker 2: please do so responsibly. Are you sipping on anything, Samantha.

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Speaker 1: I am sticking with my water because I have decided

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Speaker 1: I've been dehydrated and need more of that in my life.

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Speaker 1: Hydration not dehydration.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was the I don't know listeners have heard

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Speaker 2: about this, but the city of Atlanta had a major

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Speaker 2: water issue, a lot of water rain breaks, and I

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Speaker 2: was in it. And it was funny because I have

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Speaker 2: so many issues at my apartment, which by the way,

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Speaker 2: I need to update you, Samantha on my car drama

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Speaker 2: because there is more. There is more. But I thought

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Speaker 2: it was just my apartment breaking down. Again, it turns

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Speaker 2: out with like a city wide issue and you're like, Okay,

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Speaker 2: I went all the store to get water and there

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Speaker 2: was no water. So I'm also I'm recovering because I

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Speaker 2: drink a lot of water and so like did not

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Speaker 2: have it. But I also went home that would get

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Speaker 2: as the same weekend I went home, so I missed

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Speaker 2: like the good chunk of it. But anyway, that being said,

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Speaker 2: I'm drinking wine. Yes, yes, you know, and there's no water,

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Speaker 2: you go for the wine, I guess. So today for

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Speaker 2: the half hour, since it is Pride month and I

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Speaker 2: have been thinking about a lot of things around that lately.

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Speaker 2: I mentioned something in our recent Feminis Around the World

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Speaker 2: episode that we did which was on me, and I

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Speaker 2: was very shy and embarrassed. Great things, But one thing

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Speaker 2: I mentioned in there is something I wanted to come

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Speaker 2: back and talk about, and well, actually, there are a

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Speaker 2: couple things. There are a couple of things I want

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Speaker 2: to revisit. One is that I said in there that

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Speaker 2: I feel really settled, which I do that I feel

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Speaker 2: like one of the issues I'm running into now is

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Speaker 2: other people don't feel settled with me, and so they're

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Speaker 2: like embarrassed for me, or they feel like they have

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Speaker 2: to explain me, and I like, I'm good, you don't

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Speaker 2: have to, you know, talk about it. It's all right.

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Speaker 2: So that is something I've run into a couple times.

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Speaker 2: And most of the time it's really sweet, like it's

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Speaker 2: like genuinely coming from a good place. But sometimes I'm like, nah,

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Speaker 2: don't worry about it. Don't have you don't have to

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Speaker 2: do that. And also when I was talking in there

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Speaker 2: about like the kind of head turn people do to me,

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Speaker 2: now I feel like this is something like a lot

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Speaker 2: of people experience of like marginalized communities. If you're feminist,

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Speaker 2: if the people know you're feminists in the head turn.

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Speaker 2: I think what's interesting to me about this is that

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Speaker 2: I was like pro gay rights, but now people know

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Speaker 2: I'm gay, and so it's sort of like a strange

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Speaker 2: It's just a difference. It's just a little bit of

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Speaker 2: a difference that I'm having to adjust to. But one

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Speaker 2: of the things I mentioned in there in passing, but

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Speaker 2: I really did want to come back and talk about,

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Speaker 2: is this thing that I mentioned about gay animals Samantha right,

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Speaker 2: because there was this documentary that came out and conservatives

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Speaker 2: were up in arms about it about how it was propaganda. Again,

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Speaker 2: I have not seen it. I can't speak to it,

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Speaker 2: but I can tell you that I have numerous memories

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Speaker 2: of people telling me the animal Kingdom doesn't have queer animals,

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Speaker 2: there are no gay animals, therefore humans can't be gay.

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Speaker 2: It's like the natural order is that you it's heterosexual

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Speaker 2: and everything else is devient because we can look to

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Speaker 2: the Animal Kingdom and look, they are not having gay sex. Well,

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Speaker 2: it turns out they are. But the thing is, like

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Speaker 2: I also even if that wasn't the case, I just would.

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Speaker 1: Appreciate weird comparison in general, like.

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Speaker 2: Why animals do a lot of things people don't do right,

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Speaker 2: the like animal Kingdom is weird, wild, fascinating, terrifying, and

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Speaker 2: a lot of it is just not stuff that humans

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Speaker 2: do right. And so I don't think that that should

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Speaker 2: necessarily be your reasoning when you're like, oh, you can't

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Speaker 2: be gay because listen the animals. I've done all my

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Speaker 2: research and I've never found a gay animal, which you

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Speaker 2: definitely haven't.

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Speaker 1: You did no research there. You just want to pretend no.

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Speaker 2: And that does come up in a lot of things,

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Speaker 2: like I know we've all experienced this in one way

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Speaker 2: or another where people would use examples from the Animal

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Speaker 2: Kingdom to make some kind of point about how women

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Speaker 2: are weaker, for example, when again, as you and I

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Speaker 2: talked about, it's a lot of instances in the Animal Kingdom.

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Speaker 2: If we're going to go down that path of that

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Speaker 2: not being the.

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Speaker 1: Case, that's not true.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yes, and I did get a kick out of

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Speaker 2: I know I wrote about this in her book. I've

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Speaker 2: mentioned it before, but one of the first times I

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Speaker 2: heard the term asexual was in the nineteen ninety eight

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Speaker 2: film Godzilla. And recently I watched a new movie not

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Speaker 2: a sponsor under Paris and spoilers, I guess the shark

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Speaker 2: can reproduce without a male.

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Speaker 1: Oh this is the one, you were like, It's actually

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Speaker 1: pretty good.

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Speaker 2: I liked it. I really liked it. It's really interesting

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Speaker 2: given the Olympics are coming up and everything that's going

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Speaker 2: on with that. But uh, it was I was kind

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Speaker 2: of watching it like, well, don't need a man according

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Speaker 2: to this. If I'm looking to the animal.

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Speaker 1: Kingdom based on this, I'm good.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, but it's interesting how prevalent that response has been.

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Speaker 1: Uh.

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Speaker 2: And also like even my mom she asked me about

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Speaker 2: it because she was like a lot of her conservative

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Speaker 2: friends will say that, and she was like kind of

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Speaker 2: confused by it, and I was like, it doesn't really matter.

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Speaker 2: I mean, maybe animals. It sounds like, you know, they

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Speaker 2: do get up to all kinds of stuff, But even

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Speaker 2: if they didn't, I just don't think this is the

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Speaker 2: This is the conversation that we should be having, right,

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Speaker 2: It's fascinating to me that how many people like to

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Speaker 2: do that, And it does go back to so many

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Speaker 2: of those kind of like natural order things. But when

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Speaker 2: you break down those natural order things, so many often

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Speaker 2: they are constructed like social order things, Like I feel

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Speaker 2: like the same people would make the same argument about

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Speaker 2: like the woman should stay home and take care of

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Speaker 2: her the kids, and the man should go out in

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Speaker 2: this very heteronormative way because that's the natural order, when

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Speaker 2: that's not the case, and even like looking into humanity,

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Speaker 2: that's not the case everywhere and hasn't been the case everywhere.

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Speaker 2: It's just that people like to make that argument of

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Speaker 2: this is the way it should be based on nature,

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Speaker 2: like this is just how we are, And it's a

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Speaker 2: it's a strange argument to have with someone because yes,

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Speaker 2: usually they have not they're not scientists, they haven't really

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Speaker 2: done any of the research around that. If they see

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Speaker 2: things that contradict their points, then they're they ignore it.

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Speaker 2: But also, yeah, I kind of don't want to be

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Speaker 2: arguing with you about like how dogs have sex, like

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Speaker 2: that's just not the life I want to.

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Speaker 1: Lead, right, Also talking about how like some male species

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Speaker 1: eat the offspring, Like what where are we going with this?

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Speaker 2: Bro, Like, I just don't think this is I don't

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Speaker 2: think this is helpful, right, And it's just, Yeah, it's

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Speaker 2: strange because I feel like some people, like some people

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Speaker 2: in this case being the people making that argument, like

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Speaker 2: being compared to animals or like in nature. But so

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Speaker 2: many times I just have these questions for you about, well,

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Speaker 2: you know a lot of animals don't live in your

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Speaker 2: air conditioned house with your food you buy from the.

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Speaker 1: Store, Like I don't have apposable thumbs.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I don't think we can carry this out,

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Speaker 2: you know, the way that you want to carry it out.

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Speaker 2: But that kind of goes back to also this thing

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Speaker 2: about kind of cosplaying. We talked about this with Bridget

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Speaker 2: briefly about kind of cosplaying as the the farmer or

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Speaker 2: the person who can live off the land when it

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Speaker 2: comes to tradwives or something like that, when that's a

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Speaker 2: really romanticized like they have people helping them, they do

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Speaker 2: have a job, they have all of these other things.

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Speaker 2: So I feel like the comparison to well, look how

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Speaker 2: this animal did it, You're not that animal.

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Speaker 1: They don't believe in the conception of God and Jesus,

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Speaker 1: like they don't worship anywhere. They don't like for those

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Speaker 1: who are conservative churches who really want to go to

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Speaker 1: this route. And you're like, well, you want to take

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Speaker 1: this picture of what you've seen in the Bible where

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Speaker 1: the sheep and all these animals bow quote unquote to do.

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Speaker 1: That's not a thing, like that's an art piece. And

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Speaker 1: as much as you want to pretend like they definitely

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Speaker 1: you can't see whether or not they actually have whatever

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Speaker 1: you think is a sole spiritual aspect of them like

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Speaker 1: that that's not necessarily a part of their thing. They

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Speaker 1: don't go and build churches and then get money and

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Speaker 1: then try to build more onto the church. So this

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Speaker 1: is like a weird flex for you to be like,

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Speaker 1: this is the standard of humanity, yeah, when they're not humans.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. And it's also just it goes back to the

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Speaker 2: point we've made several times because I feel like the

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Speaker 2: argument underlying it is both like this is natural the

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Speaker 2: natural thing, which again does ignore that animals do engage

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Speaker 2: in gay activity, but also that sex is for reproduction,

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Speaker 2: which we know even outside of the queer community is

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Speaker 2: not the case. There are multiple reasons why that is

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Speaker 2: not the case, that to me, just doesn't make any

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Speaker 2: sense because people have sex. If you wanted to have

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Speaker 2: a baby every time you had sex, Like, I can't

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Speaker 2: even fathom. Either you're not having that much sex or

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Speaker 2: you're having way too many kids. I don't know. So

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Speaker 2: the argument just doesn't work for me. But they, I'm

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Speaker 2: telling you, I come across a surprising amount and I

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Speaker 2: just can't get them to see past that, right.

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Speaker 1: And the level of like, again, we have people who

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Speaker 1: are not able to conceive, whether it's due to fertility

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Speaker 1: issues or things like that, or whether it's because they're

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Speaker 1: getting older and fertility issues or they just have like

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Speaker 1: it's just not a possible thing. Are they also forbidden

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Speaker 1: forever from sex, not sex just also not being married,

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Speaker 1: not like if that's not allowed for them, like they

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Speaker 1: are now ostracized from that part of the livelihood. Then

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Speaker 1: you know, shouldn't we have other conversations about this, because

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Speaker 1: again that doesn't make sense. Also a reminder we should

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Speaker 1: all be naked, I guess, I mean, which comes into

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Speaker 1: a whole of a conversation because they also oppose that

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Speaker 1: they're like put on more clothes dimmitt.

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Speaker 2: Well, and again I'm thinking of a specific group of

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Speaker 2: people here. They also don't believe in evolution, which makes

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Speaker 2: sense given, but if you're thinking more like animals, but

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Speaker 2: you're also saying we're not anything.

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Speaker 1: Like we are higher beings.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just the level of dissonance I don't understand.

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Speaker 2: And also I feel a lot of people using this

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Speaker 2: argument use it for well, that's why you know, boys

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Speaker 2: will be boys, because it's in their nature. So it

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Speaker 2: is almost a strange card of saying, well, this is

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Speaker 2: why men want sex so much, need sex so much

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Speaker 2: in some cases, it's like their animal nature and women don't,

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Speaker 2: which is also not true. But they're like using that

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Speaker 2: mindset to justify that as well.

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Speaker 1: Right, But also for that to be justified the usage

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Speaker 1: of medication to help these men who should be this

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Speaker 1: virile whenever what and whatnot because I can't do it

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Speaker 1: naturally is also against all the rest of this conversation,

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Speaker 1: which they are like they never ever really complain about

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Speaker 1: and are like, yeah, absolutely, well that's would be a

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Speaker 1: part of life.

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Speaker 2: Hey, yeah, yeah, And it's I just have so many

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Speaker 2: I know no one here is surprised. I'm not surprised either,

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Speaker 2: but it's just so frustrating. It like all of the

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Speaker 2: hypocrisy I hear when I hear this based on other

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Speaker 2: things that they say. And it is true that nature

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Speaker 2: is amazing. It does have examples of all kinds of

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Speaker 2: queer behavior, and I think that's really cool. I think

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Speaker 2: we can acknowledge that and not use it to justify

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Speaker 2: the existence of that in humans.

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Speaker 1: Right, There's so many things to be said about why

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Speaker 1: they really really oppose something, and they need to find

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Speaker 1: reasons other than the fact that they just it disrupts

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Speaker 1: their belief system in a way that says that they

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Speaker 1: are not the moral all out being that gets to

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Speaker 1: rule on right and wrong. Like it's just this whole

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Speaker 1: level of like, Okay, this allows me to be judgmental

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Speaker 1: in a way that I can say is science, but

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Speaker 1: it's not science.

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Speaker 2: Right, And if you give them the science, then they

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Speaker 2: don't want they don't believe it exactly. I'm sorry if

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Speaker 2: this was a bit of a mess. Listeners, My thoughts

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Speaker 2: are all over the place with it because I just

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Speaker 2: can't every time I try to like figure out what

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Speaker 2: they're thinking on one thing. Again, I'm actually thinking of

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Speaker 2: a very specific group of people in my life. Then

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Speaker 2: they do something I'm like, but don't you see that.

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Speaker 2: I can't argue with you, right because it doesn't None

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Speaker 2: of this makes sense, none of this.

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Speaker 1: The hypocrisies, and I think it's just again like the

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Speaker 1: black and white that they live in that doesn't exist,

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Speaker 1: that never existed, and they're realizing that what they have

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Speaker 1: learned and what they have tried to live their life by,

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Speaker 1: or what they think they needed to live that life by,

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Speaker 1: when it gets shaken and there's a hole or any

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Speaker 1: of that, then they doubled down in a way that

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Speaker 1: they are enable to have any alternate conversation or any

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Speaker 1: other way of listening or hearing or thinking, because they

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Speaker 1: need to just find what they need to back up

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Speaker 1: their own own conversations or own beliefs without actually looking

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Speaker 1: for it, like they just want someone to validate them.

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Speaker 1: And then if someone lives in a lifestyle or if

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Speaker 1: something is disproven, then they have to find a way

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Speaker 1: to block that out completely to protect themselves from being wrong.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I've been thinking about this a lot too,

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Speaker 2: about there's some people that it doesn't matter, like you're

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Speaker 2: never going to change your minds, right, and it's it's

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Speaker 2: sad because you want to or like you don't want

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Speaker 2: to give up on them completely, but you're just there.

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Speaker 2: It's almost like a value they've chosen is I will

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Speaker 2: never ever change this, right.

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Speaker 1: And so, and they would rather lose someone that was

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Speaker 1: like someone like I'm just thinking in general with families,

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Speaker 1: like they would rather lose someone than to backtrack and

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Speaker 1: think about the actual reality hid the things that they

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Speaker 1: say or think.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well I hope this made sense? Is I

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Speaker 2: think it?

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Speaker 1: I think it fits the narrative pretty well, like because

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Speaker 1: it's sampling that the reasoning, the conversations, the rationalization, the judgment.

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Speaker 1: I think it's chaotic in general. So this is the

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Speaker 1: best you can do and try to feel like what.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because I was just trying to keep track of

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Speaker 2: like their thoughts and I couldn't uh wait wait no, okay, okay, okay, Well, listeners,

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Speaker 2: if any of you have any thoughts about this, if

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Speaker 2: you have your favorite queer behavior and an animal I

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Speaker 2: actually do really like that stuff. I just don't think

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Speaker 2: it should be like our what we turn to right

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Speaker 2: for humanity, but I do like that stuff. Uh yeah,

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Speaker 2: please right, and let us know. You can email us

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Speaker 2: at stephaniemomstuh atiheartmedia dot com. You can find us on

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Speaker 2: Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast or on Instagram and TikTok

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Speaker 2: at Stuff We Never Told You. Also, yes, we are

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Speaker 2: doing our Sex and the City Watch party with the listener,

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Speaker 2: so write in contact us if you would like to

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Speaker 2: be on that. We've already heard from some people, so

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Speaker 2: that's really cool. Just keep doing that. If you're interested,

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Speaker 2: and if you entered already last time we did it,

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Speaker 2: you would like to re enter for this time, then

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Speaker 2: please re enter. We also have a tea public store

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Speaker 2: and we have a book you can get wherever you

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Speaker 2: get your books. Thanks as always too our super producer Christina,

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Speaker 2: our executive producer Maya, and our contributor Joey. Thank you

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Speaker 2: and thanks to you for listening Stuff I Never Told

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Speaker 2: You inspection of my Heart Radio. For more podcast from

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