Speaker 1: At the time, there's a war going on. It just started.
Speaker 1: They're making everybody pick aside yes, me and or brother
Speaker 1: card in the middle between two. At that time, we're
Speaker 1: the biggest drug card tells in the world, the most powerful,
Speaker 1: the most dead. At least, card tells. It's not somebody
Speaker 1: telling you like you're in a game. It's the boss
Speaker 1: telling you, Hey, if I find out that you're receiving
Speaker 1: it one kid from you're gonna have to answer. Then
Speaker 1: not only that, he's they're going to say, and all
Speaker 1: your little friends that you had that we know you have.
Speaker 1: I want some ticket cruds. Some of these people are
Speaker 1: my friends. Some of the people I'm like, I'm closer
Speaker 1: and you have that. On top of me cooperating the
Speaker 1: pressure of that or were going on, we're still selling drugs. Mean,
Speaker 1: we're still playing cops and robbers every day. The government
Speaker 1: had a hard time understand. If I tell them don't
Speaker 1: sell the more drugs to me, they're gonna think these
Speaker 1: duds picked to the other side. It's a ward. They
Speaker 1: don't play fair. If we sent our wives away, we
Speaker 1: sent our family away, and then they come into like,
Speaker 1: well where is the feminine? Something wrong? We put them
Speaker 1: in that situation. At the same time, it's like both
Speaker 1: our wives are pregnant while we've been cooperating. The face
Speaker 1: with the strangest expect the strangest things to happen is
Speaker 1: right here are children a month apart. Who does that?
Speaker 1: Who puts their family their kids? Ever we meet the
Speaker 1: mistake of them knowing that we're family man, knowing that
Speaker 1: we're always with our wives. You guys imagined like that,
Speaker 1: what am I doing carrying that with you? That what
Speaker 1: you're doing your betraying everyone, you everything, everything that you
Speaker 1: ever know and everything that you work for, everything, all
Speaker 1: the people around you, your whole life. We're keeping stuff
Speaker 1: from my own family, our wives, us for we're the
Speaker 1: only people that knew what we were doing. We don't
Speaker 1: try anyone because Christia trustworthy. Second, because if we told
Speaker 1: those people we like, we were scared that they were
Speaker 1: going to try to change your mind because it didn't
Speaker 1: benefit anyone. But I've got this for the st Jackson
Speaker 1: and I'm Charlie Webster. And then this is surviving no chapel.
Speaker 1: It's once you brought down the drug woman, getting out
Speaker 1: of the cartel and changing your life is not as
Speaker 1: simple as just walking away. Every path had the potential
Speaker 1: to take away the twins life one way or another.
Speaker 1: Agent family have a way of bringing your priorities into perspective.
Speaker 1: Breaking the cycle of their family history, stopping themselves from
Speaker 1: repeating what their father did to them was going to
Speaker 1: be a monumental task. It all goes back to film
Speaker 1: because that bond that keeps you going, you want to
Speaker 1: be better for the people you love. It feard a
Speaker 1: better life for them, no matter what it takes. Ultimately,
Speaker 1: that was what pushed the brothers to do what they
Speaker 1: had to do. Going to meet the FED, We're in
Speaker 1: a hotel and of course we discuss what I was
Speaker 1: interested in getting the best deal possible, and they were
Speaker 1: looking at me like I was crazy. I do remember
Speaker 1: like my brother call him, I want to know details,
Speaker 1: and I remember him saying, Bro, they don't know what
Speaker 1: the fuck they're doing. They're loves and just loves. I
Speaker 1: don't know if this is a good idea. That didn't
Speaker 1: make us froger. We were in another country with no
Speaker 1: protection whatsoever, and it was just a very scary feeling,
Speaker 1: I think for all of us because we didn't realize
Speaker 1: that the US didn't have any jurisdiction in Mexico and
Speaker 1: that they would basically be on their own and they
Speaker 1: would basically have to do everything as if the US
Speaker 1: wasn't involved. And I think that's what was more of
Speaker 1: the scary part. Knowing how innovative that the Seno Cartel
Speaker 1: was was very frightening, just because you know, they had
Speaker 1: people that they would hire, like I t people that
Speaker 1: would drive around and they would pick up phone conversations
Speaker 1: from the airwaves to make sure that nobody was telling
Speaker 1: cooperation is like that equals death. You're in great thanks
Speaker 1: and there's no guarantee, and I just was, I think
Speaker 1: scared for our lives. It was like so surreal. I
Speaker 1: knew there was no turning back, and that to me
Speaker 1: was scary in itself. When Jay and Peter were meeting
Speaker 1: with agents, but that didn't sit well with me because
Speaker 1: I felt like somebody was going to find out and
Speaker 1: we're kind of going back and forth, kind of just
Speaker 1: sharing information. I remember we met when am I said, listen,
Speaker 1: couple and my call. You want me to go see them?
Speaker 1: You guys want to come. One of them had all tattoo,
Speaker 1: looked like a biker and at that time there's like
Speaker 1: Canadians there, so like, man, you look like they don't
Speaker 1: even think you're agent. You could come with me. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna say that you're my you're my Canadian customer. And
Speaker 1: they're like absolutely not, that would never happen. I guess
Speaker 1: they didn't trust me, like I was not ever going
Speaker 1: to try to put on your harm's way. I mean
Speaker 1: I was getting that bold. I guess getting frustrated. So
Speaker 1: we'll meet with them and just give information. We had
Speaker 1: give him a couple of loads and just talked to
Speaker 1: him about the business. It was just stressful, really really stressful,
Speaker 1: and it was very very stressful. I remember like at
Speaker 1: the time when I'm talking to agents and we were
Speaker 1: like a little deeper into our cooperation and they're like
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give your number to this agent and I
Speaker 1: do not give my number to no one. I don't
Speaker 1: want to know one to know him doing this. And sadly,
Speaker 1: like there was a cooperator who didn't make it. We
Speaker 1: come to find out that there was a Columbian man
Speaker 1: that was cooperating with the and they had found out
Speaker 1: about it against shop against our against Yeah, they had
Speaker 1: a lot of people on the payer of a lot
Speaker 1: of higher ups in the government and had a lot
Speaker 1: of higher rooms the government and the Mexican Mexican government
Speaker 1: had these individuals are working together on special teams with
Speaker 1: with the U. S. Government. Their feedum information there in
Speaker 1: turn feeding information to the cartel. And this is at
Speaker 1: the very top. Sure at that time we're working on
Speaker 1: the deal and cocaine it's a little bit hard to get.
Speaker 1: And then he's on the run. They have one bad
Speaker 1: on the run at the time our trans they're kicking
Speaker 1: out every door everywhere he stays. They're like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: you know, like they're hat on his tail. And I
Speaker 1: remember the cause and say, look, I got five tons coming.
Speaker 1: Who called you? And the people like, I got five tons?
Speaker 1: You tell me how much you want to buy all
Speaker 1: these And we're like, well, let me see how much
Speaker 1: money we can get together. So we end up purchasing
Speaker 1: like a thousand forty kiddos. I record those cars and
Speaker 1: the load got through and I purchased a thousand kil
Speaker 1: loads of that. Well, I turned that over to the
Speaker 1: FEDS and we are not supposed to purchase it from Beltrand.
Speaker 1: Now I'm playing both sides at this. I have to Yeah,
Speaker 1: I took that risk because in order to for me,
Speaker 1: not only to complete my cooperation, I had to keep
Speaker 1: myself alive. It was I said, oh my god, it's
Speaker 1: just a nightmare. There's a nightmare. I'll be thinking like
Speaker 1: I'm the FEDS travel my r thurs done. Like you're
Speaker 1: trying to just satisfy everyone and risking at all every day.
Speaker 1: I can't even tell you in words what it was like.
Speaker 1: At the same time, I have my baby coming. He
Speaker 1: was a zombie for sure. I couldn't eat, really wasn't present,
Speaker 1: trying to juggle so many things. And at the same
Speaker 1: time my brother brought the idea. He brought the idea
Speaker 1: to the table. Then he would disappear on me. I'd
Speaker 1: be so piste off at him, man, like, bro, like
Speaker 1: you gotta help me. What do you mean you did?
Speaker 1: Like I hate to see it like that. That's when
Speaker 1: I feel like I was saying that he didn't like
Speaker 1: the idea of like recording the people. Once that hit home,
Speaker 1: it was like, it wasn't the part you wanted to entertain.
Speaker 1: It's just so ugly of a time. I worked so hard, man,
Speaker 1: just to to do everything I could help the government order,
Speaker 1: you know, and turn to help ourselves in the future.
Speaker 1: I used to feel sometimes the government didn't do I
Speaker 1: couldn't have job to put the case together, you know,
Speaker 1: if we're out there on our own, no help, like
Speaker 1: no guaranteed. There was like no Remember the twelve I
Speaker 1: remember it being a nice, chilly November day in Mexico.
Speaker 1: We had all the people with us. I don't remember.
Speaker 1: I've been expecting to call from the chapel form like
Speaker 1: a day or two, and I had his phone in
Speaker 1: my pocket. I remember it was a white phone and
Speaker 1: I had the recording out of the pocket. At that time.
Speaker 1: I was carrying the recorder around. We're going to eat
Speaker 1: and wearing a cowboy with the trucks me the like
Speaker 1: followers are going up take and the Mexican government sending
Speaker 1: up the police present and an a normal day. You know,
Speaker 1: you're send to look out. Tell you how it looks
Speaker 1: on this day. It was just like Sunday or something.
Speaker 1: We're gonna go, you know, we're gonna have a dimeing
Speaker 1: meal and we're passing up like we're getting to like
Speaker 1: a popular place and Gualahara, you know, they call that
Speaker 1: that glory to me, and I see that day that
Speaker 1: they have a military checkpoint, like a whole cop checkpoint
Speaker 1: with the minitary and I'm with the Cowboy and I
Speaker 1: had to record in my pocket, and I'm like like,
Speaker 1: that's all I need for them to pull me over
Speaker 1: and I have to record in my pocket. Don't just
Speaker 1: stop anywhere and put a checkpoint and they'll just stop
Speaker 1: pulling cars over. I remember they see me and they're
Speaker 1: like they start telling to pull over, and I kind
Speaker 1: of like pulled to the side. I'm like, I'm panic.
Speaker 1: I'm like a little panning moll. I kind of pulled aside,
Speaker 1: but there's like a a long line of the cars
Speaker 1: that already have pulled over. I kind of pulled off
Speaker 1: to the side and I just I just took off
Speaker 1: and they didn't come. Thank you God. I was like,
Speaker 1: thank you God, they didn't come. If it have found
Speaker 1: the record, is what do you think about it? Have
Speaker 1: happened three cords of the work for the cartel? They
Speaker 1: either one they worked like I tell the other they
Speaker 1: actually really good cops and they're turning me in, like
Speaker 1: why do you have recorded? You know? I had to
Speaker 1: keep in the car, like it was just oh my
Speaker 1: little moments where just one after another. Not too long
Speaker 1: after that, I make another recording. I turned in a
Speaker 1: load of heroin the Government's allowed me to pay for
Speaker 1: these loads with our own cats. I give the government
Speaker 1: the money and the process of money and then turn
Speaker 1: it into the cartel, and they're documented. They're gonna document
Speaker 1: all this, so my workers don't know that I'm cooperative.
Speaker 1: So I tell them. I'm on the phone to Age
Speaker 1: and saying, look, we're gonna handle all the money at
Speaker 1: this place at this time. And then you're like, okay,
Speaker 1: let me see if I get my team there. Okay,
Speaker 1: we got a team there. So they're just document that
Speaker 1: they're seeing this exchange of money. Would scare me is
Speaker 1: that when I would send my career that he never
Speaker 1: noticed that the federal there. And that made me feel
Speaker 1: like how vulnerable this operation can be. He doesn't realize
Speaker 1: that the father watch him. I know they're watching them.
Speaker 1: You know. They turned over the money to the car
Speaker 1: tells carrier turning the money. Seven minutes later, my phone rings.
Speaker 1: It's Chapel Miles like Compoli, like their head of security.
Speaker 1: He's like, listen, there's something fucking funny, man. You guys
Speaker 1: rats the guys calling me seeing that. You know there's
Speaker 1: a car following that. The cops are following it, They're
Speaker 1: on him. I was like, like, what the fund are
Speaker 1: you talking about? And I'm calling my working on the
Speaker 1: radio and I'm letting him here. I'm like, hey, did
Speaker 1: you see a car? Did you give the money money?
Speaker 1: And he's like, give him money left? Did you see
Speaker 1: anyone following? Yeah? I seen him on the street. I
Speaker 1: went my way. He one head that makes anyone following you.
Speaker 1: I know that they're following him. I'm like, I don't
Speaker 1: know why you're saying there, like there's something funny here, man,
Speaker 1: I said, let me call you back. I'll never forget that. Then,
Speaker 1: sure enough, I think on this drop off, the DA
Speaker 1: has a helicopter, has a couple of cards. They're following
Speaker 1: the car back with the money. You usually ever recorded
Speaker 1: that a call like that, and I couldn't because he
Speaker 1: caught me off guard. And I picked up the phone
Speaker 1: and was like, hey, listen, motherfucker, they're fucking follow my guy. Now,
Speaker 1: you're fucking snitch or what the fuck swallowed? I was like,
Speaker 1: we're fucking talking to you like that. You asked me
Speaker 1: to do you the favorite now I'm the snitch. I
Speaker 1: said that I'm gonna talk to my dad about this,
Speaker 1: like oh no, no, no, no, just let me just
Speaker 1: see man, maybe it's not you get off the phone love,
Speaker 1: Like whoa ship. I'm passed by that time, Like our
Speaker 1: relationship with the agents already have kind of like like
Speaker 1: kind of you know, you're talking to something, we'll talk
Speaker 1: about life, like you know we're talking about the case
Speaker 1: or you know, with different agents. Hey, you remember this
Speaker 1: time and how do you guys do this like or
Speaker 1: whatever cases? And I remember calling back and said what
Speaker 1: the I'm like literally probably even got emotional, like my
Speaker 1: family is here like a bucket, putting my life in
Speaker 1: danger over twenty fucking kids. Whatever the funk? I was
Speaker 1: just like fun funck who knows, just screaming call it off,
Speaker 1: call it off, call it off. And I'm like shock,
Speaker 1: like what's happening? Like listening mostly like begging them in
Speaker 1: the like worst way. What did they say? Myself? Like
Speaker 1: hold on them like gays, let me see them and
Speaker 1: find out. I did feel a betrayed by then, like
Speaker 1: there's no reason why you're gonna have to put my
Speaker 1: life and you don't have to do it. Need damn
Speaker 1: things like I'm right here, I'm helping you guys. And
Speaker 1: then I remember calling it chap On's head of security
Speaker 1: back and the look, I don't know what to tell you.
Speaker 1: My guy is good. I'm gonna tell him to keep
Speaker 1: take a couple of spins and see what happens, you know.
Speaker 1: And then he was like, look, man, there's something funny.
Speaker 1: All right. You're like, I'm gonna tell you something, right
Speaker 1: not that money ain't gonna be coming until it gets
Speaker 1: in my hats, so you're responsible for it. And then
Speaker 1: I remember a couple of days later, I just follow up,
Speaker 1: but I'm like, hey, so did you get the money?
Speaker 1: Everything good? He's like, yeah, everything was good, man, but
Speaker 1: like weird, like and ten moments were driving me crazy?
Speaker 1: How could you sleep good at night? How did you
Speaker 1: you couldn't? I think I lost. I had lost Peter
Speaker 1: already when he started his cooperation. Was there ever a
Speaker 1: time joining that seven or eight months that you thought
Speaker 1: they'd sist you the carteler's sist you, sis? It was
Speaker 1: nerve wracking. Once I was cooperative. I remember this one
Speaker 1: time like it was in October September. October they said
Speaker 1: they wanted both of us to go, and he would
Speaker 1: call them like at the time, they'll be like senanay,
Speaker 1: so they want to see you, and I understand there
Speaker 1: was a chapel my, we're asking to see us. I
Speaker 1: was like, we both can't go, you know, explain to
Speaker 1: the lieutenant and he let me call you back. Okay,
Speaker 1: why don't you guys to come, But you gotta tell
Speaker 1: me one thing. You're gonna be here and you better
Speaker 1: be here. I was like, let me check some flights
Speaker 1: and I'm talking to my brothers like broh man, I
Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know what to do that they
Speaker 1: can't say anyone to see us. And I was like, look,
Speaker 1: let me ask them for some cocaine. If they give
Speaker 1: it to us, then we're good. If they say no,
Speaker 1: then sounds the draw. But you do not think then
Speaker 1: they could be tricking you. Yeah, but they don't want
Speaker 1: to trick you and give you some kids. So if
Speaker 1: they gave you coke, it was a way to know
Speaker 1: that they hadn't figured you out. Yeah, because then now
Speaker 1: the wouldn't blame Now, come see me and then we'll talk.
Speaker 1: They would have been like, Okay, we'll be there probably
Speaker 1: and be like we gotta go. You know, I remember
Speaker 1: asking them for the cokae. I'm like, I asked them
Speaker 1: for like a larger mind, like hey, let me see
Speaker 1: what I have. And he tells me like, yeah, we
Speaker 1: have three engine eating What if I give me the
Speaker 1: rest of a couple of days. I was like, okay, great,
Speaker 1: when can I pick him up? Well, you can pick
Speaker 1: him up tomorrow, you on today, And I felt okay.
Speaker 1: I felt that tends like we'll see what he says
Speaker 1: and then you know at that time, you know I'm
Speaker 1: talking that he's texting me some stuff and I'm like
Speaker 1: a brother, then you could go. But it was still nervous,
Speaker 1: like sending my brother, you know, J went. He was
Speaker 1: there and everybody was there during that meeting. There was
Speaker 1: a lot of main cretoil. You know. My brother was
Speaker 1: snapping pictures. I can't believe, like, bro, like why would
Speaker 1: you do that? Why would you risk it? I think
Speaker 1: it's not coming. They will let you keep your phone.
Speaker 1: So that was like a major like normal, like why
Speaker 1: would you do that? Sometimes I would record stuff on
Speaker 1: my phone, take like pictures. I remember one time I
Speaker 1: took so many good pictures that something happened where I
Speaker 1: got nervous, and I started to raising the pictures like
Speaker 1: I don't want to be like, why are you taking pictures?
Speaker 1: My wife is right here. I think we talked about
Speaker 1: it and sometimes should be like how did you do that?
Speaker 1: This one time where they had a table and they
Speaker 1: have all kinds of stuff on top of the table,
Speaker 1: bades and stuff, and I said, we're like, I'll come
Speaker 1: some nervous here. I'm like, I'm most definite meat. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna use your phone. I gotta call you chicken, you know,
Speaker 1: had chicken with my wife. Didn't laugh about that, and
Speaker 1: I grabbed the phone, satellite phones and now now I
Speaker 1: would buy a brand new phones so I could actually
Speaker 1: I'll buy a brand new phone that I had with me,
Speaker 1: you know, to be able to talk to Peter to
Speaker 1: like that. So I moved by branch Pools just for
Speaker 1: those visits. I have their phone number. You know, I
Speaker 1: have no service on my phone, so I had lass phone.
Speaker 1: I call the number on the satellite phone. Ever, ring
Speaker 1: I'll hang up was not working. I'll go the next phone,
Speaker 1: hang up. I try to get all the phones there.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be like if I see you don't have
Speaker 1: the foes that I don't know if not going through
Speaker 1: them to see your phone. Now I have all their
Speaker 1: phone numbers. That was nerve wracking because he's there using
Speaker 1: every phone they I always did it though, so it
Speaker 1: wasn't like something you're not scared they'd be suspicious. I
Speaker 1: always did it, and I was calling my wife's phone.
Speaker 1: It's like I was calling the agent. But I was
Speaker 1: just registering all the numbers so I could give it
Speaker 1: to the government. M h. People will travel my art through.
Speaker 1: But I don't care who you are. They're just regular men,
Speaker 1: selfish people. They're not you know, they're not gods. They're now.
Speaker 1: They're regularly corrupt as people. They want to care about themselves.
Speaker 1: They will bend and break every rule and betray you
Speaker 1: and kill you and not care about you. Honest. It
Speaker 1: was funny. They would do anything to say their old family, cooperate,
Speaker 1: sell out their main best friend, to say their own family,
Speaker 1: and then they want to kill you because you do
Speaker 1: the same for years. You cann't eat, I cann't sleep.
Speaker 1: So many things to think about and I live with
Speaker 1: every month every day to try that like that called
Speaker 1: my only Escapables, just a couple of moments of my
Speaker 1: wife that could get and then bring me reminded of
Speaker 1: what I'm gonna do. It was just so dreadful to
Speaker 1: just wake up, so scary to go to sleep, and
Speaker 1: then you know the people who depending on I was
Speaker 1: going to turn my back on them. Everything we work
Speaker 1: so hard to build. Now you're building a big old
Speaker 1: prison around yourself and then you have to knock it
Speaker 1: down so hard to loan to another prison. I wasn't
Speaker 1: patting sorry for myself. I was just mad at myself,
Speaker 1: like this is what I did. At the same time,
Speaker 1: I felt like some kind of like Okay, what I
Speaker 1: could do. I did. I had to tell my family
Speaker 1: out to everything I could do to put myself inca wish.
Speaker 1: I did it every day I could have done. For
Speaker 1: the government, I went above and beyond. There's nothing more
Speaker 1: that I could at that point. I gave them millions
Speaker 1: of dollars. I turn the people turn, enjoying and turning everything.
Speaker 1: I did everything in my power. I went above and
Speaker 1: beyond help build this case. From practically along my brother
Speaker 1: and I were alone. It took word to me we
Speaker 1: were to sacrifice, and took kind's bless instance just be
Speaker 1: here to take. I just still think it was the
Speaker 1: right decisions. Be honest. Now you talked to me on Monday,
Speaker 1: I tell you yes to them, I tak You know,
Speaker 1: nine months of recording deals with the lieutenants of the
Speaker 1: cartel certainly help the FEDS put together their case. But
Speaker 1: there was one major piece of evidence. They needed a
Speaker 1: call with Chapeau himself. It's something that until now have
Speaker 1: been impossible for anybody to get. I remember I missed
Speaker 1: the first call. I missed the call and call me.
Speaker 1: I remember I was standing there, like not even my
Speaker 1: brother standing there. I dropped my bag and I ran
Speaker 1: back to the house. The girls are there and the
Speaker 1: senior I'm turning out, like bollow me up stair because
Speaker 1: it was like the people in the house of the time,
Speaker 1: you know, just running away, like just trying to get
Speaker 1: away to get a quiet space. I was so nervous,
Speaker 1: and not of course to me to recording, but of
Speaker 1: what was to come, What did this mean for my life?
Speaker 1: Like it was an ugly feeling, you know, like getting
Speaker 1: the recorder out and the only thing the fence that
Speaker 1: giving me like earpiece with a microphone, and you know
Speaker 1: when you put the phone to your ear you can
Speaker 1: hear and then they can record. I remember putting it
Speaker 1: to my and like the secretary answered, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: it's the twin gid. Where were you in the house Lusters?
Speaker 1: I remember, and we were in the first stroom and
Speaker 1: I remember lacking the doors, like right there in your face. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I'm like, I don't even know what to say.
Speaker 1: I remember him saying, amigo, like hearing his voice again, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't want, I don't want. The call with Chapo
Speaker 1: was the one chance that Twins had to prove that
Speaker 1: they were telling the truth to the U. S. Government.
Speaker 1: It was the only ticket out there. I've depended on
Speaker 1: this one core. Without the recording, the vital piece of
Speaker 1: evidence the FEDS needed, they wouldn't have been able to
Speaker 1: make a deal. All they had to do was get
Speaker 1: chapout to confess without raising any suspicion at all from
Speaker 1: the world's most notorious and violent drug boss, the man
Speaker 1: who personally admitted to executing at least two thousand people himself. Easy, right,
Speaker 1: I felt, Okay, I did. I had to get over
Speaker 1: that and just used this lie about king a cheaper
Speaker 1: number and that and the heroine the phone calls, what
Speaker 1: else telling them of the truth that I mean him
Speaker 1: had herald working relationship that he knew that might office
Speaker 1: was in Chicago and there that he had sat drugs
Speaker 1: for me and cons and drugs for me to my
Speaker 1: brother and there they was like you know, we're working
Speaker 1: together to move these drugs and SLOM. I understood that
Speaker 1: that time that to make the conversation good is that
Speaker 1: we we talked about future shipments and pass ones. That
Speaker 1: was like a big moment, you know. I remember thinking
Speaker 1: like this is like my way, my ticket home. One day,
Speaker 1: I remember getting another phone and just playing back the conversation,
Speaker 1: like over the anticipation, I hope I got it, like nervous,
Speaker 1: did we get it? Imagined we did it? Man, you
Speaker 1: had a call to Apple back there. Could we do
Speaker 1: this again? This is the thing called go through your mind,
Speaker 1: like playing the conversation again and thinking like I can't
Speaker 1: lose this, this recording on our other phone and remember
Speaker 1: like here you could reread corded, you know, like copied
Speaker 1: on your phone too, like they around off my other phone,
Speaker 1: and then thinking like we're not gonna give it to
Speaker 1: the sets until we make a deal. It was those
Speaker 1: little troubles, a little struggles that you you're facing all
Speaker 1: those perils of cooperating, right. People really don't know, like
Speaker 1: imagine every day it was like this for all those
Speaker 1: months and having our family and being stressful, and again
Speaker 1: it's something that that we had to we had to do.
Speaker 1: We put ourselves in that position. I will say, I
Speaker 1: think for all those years that we sold drugs, those
Speaker 1: months of cooperating, in my head, I was like, we're even,
Speaker 1: you know, we're even. Like I didn't risk myself this much,
Speaker 1: you know. When I was like suddenly the drugs, remember
Speaker 1: the put our life at Verst doing all this. I
Speaker 1: remember like talking to the fans and I was like
Speaker 1: I got it, Like what I got to call my
Speaker 1: own chapol and like get the funk out of like
Speaker 1: for real, like you wanna hear it. It was like
Speaker 1: late and they're like, probably don't funk around me, Like
Speaker 1: you really got it? I got it. Then remember just
Speaker 1: them calling me, calling me our planet's ha gonna work.
Speaker 1: They wanted to that fucking round it bring it because
Speaker 1: meet us where we had been meeting before. In the subdivision.
Speaker 1: It's like a big as oak trip. Like the street lights.
Speaker 1: It was just like a dark spot in this subdivision.
Speaker 1: That wasn't comfortable with meeting it because other people lived there.
Speaker 1: But you know my colonly complains so much. Go part behind,
Speaker 1: you know this land cruiser and bullet problem and cruiser
Speaker 1: with diplomatic plates. I'm jumping in the carp how we're
Speaker 1: up and you know, you know they just shoot me,
Speaker 1: just kill me? That would you want me to just die?
Speaker 1: Just tell me like in cartel world, you know, literally
Speaker 1: behind enemy lines, like just doing that and they're nervous.
Speaker 1: Thing of looking around that nervous back around my palms,
Speaker 1: canna swear like things like cold like sweat, you know,
Speaker 1: on your foreheads, like mad, I just see that. I'm
Speaker 1: angry that you keep putting in this situations. I remember
Speaker 1: going and taking the record and be like I don't
Speaker 1: know this this you better be there that they you
Speaker 1: better be there and my sentence and tell them what
Speaker 1: I did to get this. Oh, no problem, man, We're
Speaker 1: all gonna be like and you just hand it over
Speaker 1: and then what's remember them? Like, what's next? Are they
Speaker 1: gonna indicated? Make sure it's it's his voice. But it
Speaker 1: had been pretty fast. Literally we're like with midnight one
Speaker 1: in the morning when it comes to back, we got
Speaker 1: a match. It's it was late in the night. I
Speaker 1: remember they called. They confirmed that it was authentic recording.
Speaker 1: I could hear scream, cham, I can celebrated celebration. I
Speaker 1: was still taken back. I remember the prositat that would
Speaker 1: tell me, I promise you I'll be doing cart wheels
Speaker 1: in summer sults and your sentence no something that I'll
Speaker 1: be like, I'll do cart wheels and backflips. My brother
Speaker 1: I had the only legal recording the chopol was mom
Speaker 1: they ever had h we didn't have a plan. Two
Speaker 1: weeks after the top of recording. Now we're gonna call
Speaker 1: it to Sunday. Our attorney wants about to us. It's early,
Speaker 1: right ten, And then in the morning. You remember he said,
Speaker 1: you know, the US attorney wants to talk to you.
Speaker 1: He said he wants you guys to train yourselves in today.
Speaker 1: I won't even be looking to it like wow, real
Speaker 1: hit us? Huh what? Just like that? After around nine
Speaker 1: months of recording and cooperating with the US government, it
Speaker 1: was time, the twins were given two hours to meet
Speaker 1: back under the big oak tree in the middle of
Speaker 1: the subdivision and finally hand themselves over the rest of
Speaker 1: their family had been in the dark for months, but
Speaker 1: as soon as the cartel found out about what Pete
Speaker 1: and Jay were up to, they would come for their family.
Speaker 1: So they had to drop the bombshell of what was
Speaker 1: about to happen. And it started with the man who
Speaker 1: brought them into this life in the first place, their father.
Speaker 1: I think it was a higher thing I had to
Speaker 1: do was to place my father. You could be a killer,
Speaker 1: you could be whatever. You're not going to be a thief,
Speaker 1: and you're not going to be a queer. And the
Speaker 1: most important one, you're never gonna be a snitch. M
Speaker 1: I had to light him mean until he came up
Speaker 1: with this. I to try to soften, softening up a
Speaker 1: little bit. We go to his house that we bottom regardless,
Speaker 1: he lived a great life right his streaming in dollar house,
Speaker 1: brand new cards. I said, we have to talk, and
Speaker 1: without my mom. It was hard, like I didn't even
Speaker 1: know how to say it, and I don't even know
Speaker 1: who We even spoke, but I said, uh, I did mention.
Speaker 1: I said that the government found us. He said what
Speaker 1: I said, the government found us. They've been watching that.
Speaker 1: They know exactly where you live. You know where we
Speaker 1: all live. He's like, are you serious? I said, he said,
Speaker 1: come on, let's go. You know he's walking a kay,
Speaker 1: let's go. Let's call it. No, it's over, there's no
Speaker 1: more running. He said, you could go, and I said.
Speaker 1: They knocked on the door and they said, your life
Speaker 1: is going to be in danger anyway, so we're going
Speaker 1: to arrest you or you have a chance you can popery.
Speaker 1: He look, He said, what and what do you say?
Speaker 1: I said, we'll cooperate. I cannot put my family in danger.
Speaker 1: He said, you cooperate? He said, what type of fucking
Speaker 1: men are you? Cooperate? He said demanding people tell you
Speaker 1: they will hunt you, they will here you. You could
Speaker 1: never survive going to custom. How could you do? You
Speaker 1: know what the funk you're doing? And I'm saying not
Speaker 1: even about it as about of family. He's a fuck um.
Speaker 1: There's a fucking cowards. I raised fucking women. He said, Oh,
Speaker 1: now you guys, wanna you know something, just like you
Speaker 1: know who top womire? I remember, like I never like
Speaker 1: talking about it to my dad. I know who they
Speaker 1: are and it was going to be near them. I
Speaker 1: want you met every fucking day you could look up
Speaker 1: to you, admire you do whatever you want. I'm not.
Speaker 1: And he said, they're giving a chance to leave. Do
Speaker 1: it for us. You never did anything for us. You
Speaker 1: put as you gave us this life up, just saying
Speaker 1: just give us a chance. Let's just leave. He said
Speaker 1: I can't. I said, they're willing to forgive you, and
Speaker 1: they're willing to give you a Lisa that hurt that
Speaker 1: like herd. I'm like he looked like them. You guys
Speaker 1: with that polarity. You know, we were on tears, all
Speaker 1: of us. My father was like I could fro his anger.
Speaker 1: And then I said, do it for us, Please just
Speaker 1: do it for us. Be mad, do whatever you want,
Speaker 1: but just do it for us. And I said, me
Speaker 1: and my brother going in prison, you were the same one.
Speaker 1: Just kept nodding yourself. It's just like I'm don't doing
Speaker 1: my son. What you're about to hear is the full unedited,
Speaker 1: two minutes fifty and second conversation that people recorded with
Speaker 1: El Chapo that was played in court during El Chappo's
Speaker 1: trial in two thousand and eighteen. Pete begins by asking
Speaker 1: how Chappo is, and Chappa responds with fine, nice talking
Speaker 1: to you. How is your brother? For an English translation,
Speaker 1: Go to Lionsgate Sound dot com. Damn yeah here, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think we'll check a list on the sinkoles tinko
Speaker 1: you lit. You can mess for words on the pause
Speaker 1: in Quintapo. You think we'll check a list of helois.
Speaker 1: He came under my mouth's voice. However, that okay, we
Speaker 1: just get a new to me. I can tell you
Speaker 1: when I look. Okay, come on one stem Yeah, you're
Speaker 1: in quantum years to give Atlanta conus, can you? I
Speaker 1: can't look? I am okay, okay. Surviving El Chapo The
Speaker 1: Twins Who Brought Down a Drug Board is hosted by
Speaker 1: Curtis fifty s Jackson and me Charlie Webster, our producers
Speaker 1: on myself alongside Jackson mcclennen. Research and editorial support is
Speaker 1: from Casey Hurtz. Edit and sound designed by Nico Palella.
Speaker 1: Original score by Ryan Sorenson. Executive produced by Curtis fifty
Speaker 1: cent Jackson and myself Charlie Webster. If you'd like to
Speaker 1: know more about this story, head over to lions Gate
Speaker 1: Sound dot Com. Curtis fifty cent Jackson presents a lions
Speaker 1: Gate Sound and Geniu Nit audio production exclusively for I
Speaker 1: Heeart podcasts,