1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:06,120 Speaker 1: Very pleased this afternoon to be joined on this edition 2 00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:12,400 Speaker 1: of the Warning podcast by Rabbi Tina Grimberg, who leads 3 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:19,880 Speaker 1: the Congregation d'Ache Nobam in Toronto, Canada. Welcome, Rabbi Tina. 4 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:24,720 Speaker 2: Pleasure, pleasure, Thank you, Steve, Thank you for having me. 5 00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 1: My pleasure to have you with us. 6 00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 2: Our times now right our times. But I'm I'm glad 7 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:38,000 Speaker 2: to be here and to speak with you. 8 00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: There is an aniversary today that is of note in 9 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 1: the United States, December nineteenth, and it marks the day where, 10 00:00:55,120 --> 00:01:01,360 Speaker 1: one week into service in Belgium as part of the 11 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 1: advancing United States Army, twenty six year old Master Sergeant 12 00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:14,080 Speaker 1: Roderick Edmunds of Knoxville, Tennessee was taken prisoner in the 13 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 1: German counter offense of that history remembers as the Battle 14 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 1: of the Bult And as it came to be, Master 15 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 1: Sergeant ed Madmins, aged twenty six, found himself on January 16 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:38,000 Speaker 1: twenty seventh, which is coincidentally another important date which I'll 17 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:41,920 Speaker 1: mention in a second. But Master Sergeant Edmunds, on the 18 00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:49,360 Speaker 1: day that Red Army forces liberated Auschwitz, found himself standing 19 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:55,920 Speaker 1: in front of almost thirteen hundred Americans as the senior 20 00:01:56,200 --> 00:02:03,440 Speaker 1: American soldier in Stalog. There were no officers, no lieutenants, 21 00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 1: captain's majors, just the twenty six year old master sergeant. 22 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:13,800 Speaker 1: The Nazi commandant out and demanded that the Jews be 23 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:18,440 Speaker 1: identified and separated from the rest of the American soldiers. 24 00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:26,959 Speaker 1: Master Sergeant Edmunds said nothing to anybody, did not consult, 25 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:30,560 Speaker 1: and he said, we will do that. We are all 26 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:36,120 Speaker 1: Jews here. And as the Nazi commander withdrew his side 27 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:41,079 Speaker 1: arm and held it to Master Sergeant Edmund's heads and 28 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:45,880 Speaker 1: bredon have pulled the trigger. The Master Sergeant's counter offer, 29 00:02:45,919 --> 00:02:48,800 Speaker 1: at age twenty six was, you could kill all of us. 30 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:55,240 Speaker 1: We are Americans. We don't do that. We are all Jews, 31 00:02:55,600 --> 00:03:00,919 Speaker 1: and that you will be a war criminal and will 32 00:03:00,919 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 1: be hunted to the ends of the earth as we 33 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:07,480 Speaker 1: win this war which was by then which was by 34 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:13,840 Speaker 1: then evident. He came home and never told anybody about 35 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:17,240 Speaker 1: this story. He had three marriages. His son was a 36 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:23,760 Speaker 1: Baptist minister, and his last wife handed these wartime diaries, 37 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 1: and the son found the name, found the story, and 38 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: was reading a New York Times piece apparently about a 39 00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 1: real estate transaction involving former President Nixon, and in that story, 40 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:43,160 Speaker 1: by happenstance was an element of this tale by the 41 00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 1: lawyer who represented Richard Nixon, who was one of the 42 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:50,480 Speaker 1: three hundred Jews there that day that was saved, and 43 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:56,520 Speaker 1: he was declared years after his death righteous amongst the Nations, 44 00:03:56,600 --> 00:04:01,120 Speaker 1: and the first American serviceman to be so declared. But 45 00:04:01,240 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: his capture was eighty years ago today. In that battle, 46 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 1: Adolph Hitler's last gas in Europe, in a war that 47 00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:19,599 Speaker 1: killed upwards of one hundred million people and led to 48 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 1: the genocide of the Jews, was underway on December sixteenth, 49 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:31,960 Speaker 1: on the same day that a former American president and 50 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 1: the leading Republican candidate for president in the United States 51 00:04:36,320 --> 00:04:45,240 Speaker 1: talked about immigrants poisoning the blood of our country, which 52 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:51,599 Speaker 1: is absolutely hilarian Nazi language. You are an immigrant to Canada, 53 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 1: you are a Rabbi, you are a Jew, and I 54 00:04:55,160 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: heard you deliver a sermon over Yam Kapor. I believe 55 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 1: that I think was one of the most brilliant expositions 56 00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 1: I've ever heard anybody deliver on the subject of anti Semitism. 57 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:14,480 Speaker 1: So I wanted to have you here today to talk 58 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:22,760 Speaker 1: about that subject and open it up by asking about 59 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:29,200 Speaker 1: that incident from eighty years ago where going to the 60 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:34,640 Speaker 1: sermon that I heard. Anti Semitism that you grew up 61 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:42,240 Speaker 1: with in Europe in the East of Europe is very different. 62 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 1: But the anti Semitism, as I understood your sermon troublingly 63 00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:49,440 Speaker 1: seems to be enduring. 64 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:57,520 Speaker 2: So, first of all, thank you. I am very privileged 65 00:05:57,560 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 2: to serve a congregation the hey, no, I'm and I 66 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:08,080 Speaker 2: it was you know, I was honored to have you there. 67 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:12,800 Speaker 2: And then, you know, after that developed this connection. I 68 00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:15,919 Speaker 2: didn't want to write that sermon. I didn't want to 69 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:20,600 Speaker 2: write it. And usually when I struggled with sermons and 70 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:25,200 Speaker 2: trying to choose a topic to speak on, they're all 71 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:33,279 Speaker 2: often done several conflicting ideas that absolutely fight for my attention. 72 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:36,280 Speaker 2: But here there was no choice. And this is before 73 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 2: October seventh. I felt compelled to write. And I'm not 74 00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 2: sure what was guiding or maybe I do what was 75 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 2: guiding my hand was a difficult sermon to research, and 76 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:50,800 Speaker 2: more so actually to be able to say it out 77 00:06:50,839 --> 00:06:55,840 Speaker 2: loud that I began to re experience the trauma of 78 00:06:56,880 --> 00:07:01,880 Speaker 2: growing up. So, you know, working in my in a 79 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:06,839 Speaker 2: capacity as a Rabbi. I go to the hospitals very 80 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:09,280 Speaker 2: often and I speak both to patients and doctors. And 81 00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 2: one thing began to show up in the last over 82 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,000 Speaker 2: a decade is that there is not one type of cancer. 83 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:18,920 Speaker 2: There are millions of type of cancers out there. That 84 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:22,400 Speaker 2: and maybe I'm exaggerating, I'm not a physician, but in 85 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:30,240 Speaker 2: other words, there are many antisemitisms as well as their antisemites. 86 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:36,600 Speaker 2: So not one antisemitism is alike any other antisemitism because 87 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:41,360 Speaker 2: people come to it from some often very personal ideations 88 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 2: or group ideas, and then they adapted themselves. So the 89 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:54,160 Speaker 2: antisemitism of Soviet Ukraine, maybe to some degree with different 90 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:56,960 Speaker 2: than antisemitism I encountered in the United States. But let 91 00:07:57,040 --> 00:08:01,000 Speaker 2: me just say that story of a argent standing up 92 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:03,280 Speaker 2: a twenty six year old young man to be able 93 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:09,120 Speaker 2: to have these inspiring words is a strike. And that's 94 00:08:09,120 --> 00:08:13,520 Speaker 2: what we found in the United States. I actually came 95 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 2: to the United States first the nineteen seventy nine. I 96 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 2: was sixteen year old girl. I finished had to finish 97 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:24,120 Speaker 2: high school, then went to graduate school, and then subsequent 98 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:27,840 Speaker 2: ended up in Canada and went to seminary in New York. 99 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:31,640 Speaker 2: But it was. I remember the first years in the 100 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:35,160 Speaker 2: United States and I thought to myself, my goodness, there 101 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:38,880 Speaker 2: there is a world that's of this. Not only that, 102 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 2: but I met American Christians who were so passionate about 103 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:48,680 Speaker 2: Bible and about their Jewish roots, meaning from Christianity, that 104 00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:53,080 Speaker 2: Christianity burst from that. Actually, George and every corner, and 105 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 2: Indiana was extremely friendly side for me. I found friends there. 106 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:02,719 Speaker 2: So my experience of new world was very, very positive 107 00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 2: and free of this feeling of oppression. So let me 108 00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:12,360 Speaker 2: just say, on account of the Soviet antisemitism. You know, 109 00:09:12,440 --> 00:09:15,960 Speaker 2: anytime society is oppressed, as we know, there will be 110 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 2: an ugly underground of infection that will be rising up 111 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 2: from the masses. And so the Ukrainians were oppressed as well, 112 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 2: and intellectuals were oppressed as well. And God forbid, if 113 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:32,600 Speaker 2: you are a different sexual orientation, there was plenty of 114 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:35,319 Speaker 2: those who would have turned you in and you would 115 00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:41,160 Speaker 2: be deemed as a pervert. The pain of antisemitism will 116 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 2: experience was not only that. At times it was so 117 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:49,520 Speaker 2: difficult you didn't understand what was it about, meaning why 118 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:51,680 Speaker 2: would you not be liked? I mean I was a kid, 119 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 2: I was a girl. What could I possibly have done, 120 00:09:55,679 --> 00:10:00,280 Speaker 2: but the fact that we had no Jewish educations, so 121 00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:03,600 Speaker 2: I had no Jewish pride, I had no Jewish knowledge, 122 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 2: There was nothing to combat. To be able to look 123 00:10:06,880 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 2: at this dark force and feel that I have the 124 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:14,959 Speaker 2: spiritual ammunition to be able to counteract, to be able 125 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:18,800 Speaker 2: to respond to it turns you on the inside, an 126 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 2: inside and it turns into shame. So you have an 127 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:23,520 Speaker 2: identity of a Jew, but you did not have the 128 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:27,800 Speaker 2: education and the privilege of learning because it was forbidden. 129 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:32,600 Speaker 2: So in the United States, you know, that was initial 130 00:10:32,679 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 2: years of prosperity, but then you will run into an 131 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 2: issue as well, because it does exist among people. But 132 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:44,880 Speaker 2: that antisemitism was somewhat different, you know, in its shape. 133 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:47,520 Speaker 2: And one thing that was a big surprise, and I 134 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:50,760 Speaker 2: mentioned that in a sermon in a story, is that 135 00:10:50,880 --> 00:10:53,599 Speaker 2: it came with a smile that I was not ready for. 136 00:10:56,559 --> 00:11:00,320 Speaker 2: That came with kind of that political correctness I did 137 00:11:00,320 --> 00:11:04,080 Speaker 2: not see. But when you turn on a social media, 138 00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:11,040 Speaker 2: that antiseptis that cancer actually echoes very much the terrible 139 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 2: reality of the Soviet Ukraine that we you know, we 140 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:17,720 Speaker 2: came from. So there's some very similarities to the I 141 00:11:17,760 --> 00:11:22,320 Speaker 2: call it that cancer, and it's in every every organism. 142 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: In other words, when organism is troubled, it will show up. 143 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:31,200 Speaker 2: And what can I say in terms of the treatment 144 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:38,240 Speaker 2: and education and counteract in I'm blissful to say that 145 00:11:38,360 --> 00:11:42,559 Speaker 2: in my interface work with churches and even moss and 146 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:46,559 Speaker 2: and in in a larger sense, I found so many 147 00:11:46,600 --> 00:11:49,920 Speaker 2: friends who wanted to stand to stand by I asked, 148 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:54,880 Speaker 2: both in against antiseptism or any phourbias for that matter, 149 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:59,320 Speaker 2: because it's never one, you never paid one. Usually it's 150 00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:03,599 Speaker 2: like you quite the gialtarian in one in terms of 151 00:12:03,679 --> 00:12:07,680 Speaker 2: its dislikes of a certain minority. And then it sort 152 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:14,200 Speaker 2: of mushrooms. But as as as painful some of this is, 153 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,360 Speaker 2: I also want to say that there is incredible connections 154 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 2: and the number of phocals that came after October October 155 00:12:21,320 --> 00:12:26,640 Speaker 2: seventh to me from my uh, from my non Jewish friends, 156 00:12:27,160 --> 00:12:30,920 Speaker 2: as well as traveling hours and hours in my study 157 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:35,320 Speaker 2: with my congradians who stay the world, my colleagues, my 158 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:39,120 Speaker 2: art community, my liberal circles has turned away its face. 159 00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:41,839 Speaker 2: So I know I'm beyond the questions. You're ready to 160 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 2: do your prepared so I'm gonna pull back. But but 161 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:48,800 Speaker 2: find that sermon was hard to conceptualize in to write, 162 00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:51,640 Speaker 2: and I felt I had no choice. It was the king. 163 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:55,680 Speaker 1: Let me, let me, let me come back to two 164 00:12:55,760 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 1: things that you said before we push forward into the 165 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:07,320 Speaker 1: world that exists post October seventh. So your family survived, 166 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 1: It's survived the programs, it survived the Nazis, it survived 167 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:19,200 Speaker 1: the Second World War, you survived. How many Jews were 168 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 1: there in Ukraine before nineteen thirty. 169 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:29,600 Speaker 2: Nine, It's an It's an excellent question. So Ukraine, I 170 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 2: cannot answer you. But in order for Hitler to kill 171 00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:38,000 Speaker 2: three million of Polish Jews, you have to have over 172 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:41,640 Speaker 2: three million. So I only have I just you know, 173 00:13:41,679 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 2: I don't have I wasn't prepared to delve into statistics. 174 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:48,319 Speaker 2: I'm happy to send it to you later on. So 175 00:13:48,679 --> 00:13:53,760 Speaker 2: with the pale of settlement, which is alland Belarus, Ukraine 176 00:13:53,880 --> 00:14:01,079 Speaker 2: and some Russia Soviet Union or Greater Russia. And I'm sorry, 177 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 2: I know we're also speaking after the war with Russia 178 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 2: to Russian Ukraine developed, So all of it sounds how 179 00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:10,199 Speaker 2: should I say, infected, But nevertheless, it was a great 180 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:13,840 Speaker 2: saracet empire. There was a huge number of population of Jews, 181 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:17,600 Speaker 2: who ended up living in that eastern part of Europe 182 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:23,000 Speaker 2: because they conditioned for many years, were also favorable. One 183 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:26,320 Speaker 2: thing I don't want to paint is that Jewish history 184 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:30,800 Speaker 2: say has been nothing but uh plethora of oil and 185 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:34,240 Speaker 2: oil Judaism. It's like it was always awful. We had 186 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 2: we had years of Asbury right, and and also years 187 00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 2: where in the same time there was a prosperity and 188 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 2: horrible things. So so it was Allish nobility actually that 189 00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:51,480 Speaker 2: asked Jews to come from Germany and settle and develop 190 00:14:51,560 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 2: trade in along the Rhine River and then take us 191 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:58,400 Speaker 2: into eastern Europe. The trade was developed so Poland can 192 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:03,560 Speaker 2: be developed. One of the famous the kings of Poland 193 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 2: was Kazimir and there's a selection in Kraka where I 194 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 2: worked with the Ukrainian refugees in the past two years. 195 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:15,560 Speaker 2: Jews and non Jews, majority non Jews who fled water 196 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:21,400 Speaker 2: with Ukraine. They they settled along the rivers and developed 197 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 2: trade and developed merchantry, which helped Poland to blossom in 198 00:15:26,360 --> 00:15:29,560 Speaker 2: terms of its uh it or developed Poland in terms 199 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 2: of its you know, in terms of its economic system. 200 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:37,400 Speaker 2: So Jews settled and then of course with the Soviet 201 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:42,920 Speaker 2: they inherited the Great Mother. Russia inherited quite a number 202 00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:46,920 Speaker 2: of Jews, and by well and Soviet Union was established 203 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 2: and all a sudden, the limitations and quarters of Jews 204 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:55,360 Speaker 2: entering universities was taken off because we were limited by 205 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 2: the way, so was in Canada. You could not go 206 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:03,160 Speaker 2: to medical school like the world quotas that were very serious. 207 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 2: They didn't just was it not. I think nineteen fifties 208 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:09,440 Speaker 2: when I think, if I'm correct, what us were lifted, 209 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:12,120 Speaker 2: But I have to check that date, so forgive me 210 00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 2: that that year. But when it was lifted, then the 211 00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:18,840 Speaker 2: Jews rushed to universities because they wanted to learn. So 212 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:24,120 Speaker 2: it wasn't only yeshiva learning learning religious concept. It was 213 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:31,080 Speaker 2: also cultural in general of civil to enter civil society, 214 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 2: and before that as well they were. But so my 215 00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 2: family survived, and the reason we survived World War two 216 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 2: is because both my mother's family and my father's family. 217 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:45,800 Speaker 2: My mother's from Key of a Plaid East and my 218 00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 2: father was relocated with his mother all over the Volga 219 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 2: River and because of the stalin Grad, horrific battle that 220 00:16:56,680 --> 00:17:01,600 Speaker 2: turned the tide of Eastern Front of a war. It 221 00:17:01,760 --> 00:17:05,919 Speaker 2: was the bloodiest of battles where you know, the number 222 00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:12,959 Speaker 2: of young men perished is unspeakable. My father survived and 223 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:17,000 Speaker 2: then my parents met a sweethearts in a dorm because 224 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:20,879 Speaker 2: he was destroyed. Nazis destroyed going in in the meantime, 225 00:17:21,240 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 2: ordering thirty Southern Jews in three days. I have a 226 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:29,680 Speaker 2: great end who died in that massacre. And then as 227 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:33,120 Speaker 2: the key was liberated, the key was again destroyed because 228 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:37,960 Speaker 2: they were pushing Nazis back, you know, through Europe. And 229 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 2: so my parents returned and they met and they fell 230 00:17:41,359 --> 00:17:45,199 Speaker 2: in love with children. So great love story. But so 231 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 2: families survived because my grandfather, one grandfather was drafted into 232 00:17:50,119 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 2: the Soviet army, served as an autist and came back 233 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:56,760 Speaker 2: wounded and died within a few weeks after victory was proclaimed. 234 00:17:56,800 --> 00:17:59,119 Speaker 2: But he could see his boys. My father. 235 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:01,879 Speaker 1: Well, one of the things that you said is you 236 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:05,200 Speaker 1: talked about these periods of European history. So there are 237 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:10,120 Speaker 1: through the centuries, there's a Jewish identity that is continuous, 238 00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 1: contiguous in Europe, in these countries. But by the time 239 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:19,520 Speaker 1: you are growing up, you don't have much of a 240 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:24,920 Speaker 1: Jewish identity. And I wanted to ask you about that 241 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:30,639 Speaker 1: because what that says to me, Ronald Reagan used to 242 00:18:30,680 --> 00:18:36,560 Speaker 1: talk about this almost in a way that I received 243 00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:39,280 Speaker 1: as a kid as a cliche or a platitude, But 244 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 1: it was this notion that freedom is only ever one 245 00:18:43,720 --> 00:18:49,240 Speaker 1: generation away from being extinguished. And I think a deeper 246 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:54,640 Speaker 1: reading of American history is that if you look at 247 00:18:54,640 --> 00:18:59,639 Speaker 1: some of the indigenous tribes the laws of culture, is 248 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 1: that one of the great enduring crimes of the Nazis 249 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 1: and an immediate aftermath and of the Soviets, was the 250 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 1: extinguishment of a five thousand year old culture. And it 251 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:18,480 Speaker 1: is possible, even within just a generation. 252 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 2: You can destroy it. 253 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:22,760 Speaker 1: To be able to destroy it and to do it, 254 00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 1: it is that fragile. And it probably speaks because of 255 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:36,560 Speaker 1: that fragility to the incessancy of the aspiration to finish 256 00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:42,000 Speaker 1: the job right to to to to wipe out and 257 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:44,800 Speaker 1: and to destroy it, because there's been a there's been 258 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 1: a perpetuity the hate, to the stigmatization. There has always 259 00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 1: been a there has always been an impulse to get 260 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 1: the Jews throughout out throughout history, and I just wonder, 261 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:07,520 Speaker 1: you know, thinking about the fragility of that. And you 262 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 1: told this story in your sermon about the young man 263 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:16,800 Speaker 1: who goes off to college wearing a symbol a necklace 264 00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:18,320 Speaker 1: of his Jewish identity. 265 00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:22,159 Speaker 2: Right huge, I've never seen and then I never seen it. 266 00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:23,200 Speaker 2: I think it wasn't as big. 267 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:27,640 Speaker 1: And then within a short period time, you know, that 268 00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:33,040 Speaker 1: first symbol of identity extinguished, and really about the commitment 269 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:40,159 Speaker 1: necessary to the sustainment of identity, of culture and ultimately 270 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:44,240 Speaker 1: nationality before we before we get in October seventh. 271 00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:49,160 Speaker 2: Right, so let me let me just you know the 272 00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 2: there's an excellent article that's been circling by a full 273 00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:58,960 Speaker 2: more sense for his I think teachers for Northwestern, very 274 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:05,320 Speaker 2: talented writer, and he is a page he's a professor 275 00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:09,280 Speaker 2: of Slavic literature, and his specialty isn't the Stayevski especial 276 00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:11,720 Speaker 2: And of course you know, no one writes about suffering 277 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 2: better than nineteenth century Russian writers. And he brings the 278 00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 2: case of the Stayevsky says that how come men who 279 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:27,680 Speaker 2: who can talk about suffering with such sensitivity, such an 280 00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:31,679 Speaker 2: incredible intellectual, be so anti Semitic? What is it that 281 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 2: feeds the brilliant mind and soul in all other ways 282 00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:38,439 Speaker 2: but not to see suffering in its fullness? And he 283 00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:42,600 Speaker 2: develops and tries to understand to the point that he says, well, 284 00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:47,760 Speaker 2: he quotes one of the I think Russian literary critics, 285 00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 2: but one of them he says, well, he says, he wrote, 286 00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:52,600 Speaker 2: if the whole world hates Jews, there must be a reason. 287 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:55,440 Speaker 2: There must be a reason, if it's to our generation, 288 00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:59,080 Speaker 2: there was something something about these people that so that's 289 00:21:59,080 --> 00:22:04,160 Speaker 2: so dislikable. So he gives the more Doctor Morrison gives 290 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:09,000 Speaker 2: a very interesting example of particular antisemitism that Dostoyevsky doesn't 291 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,880 Speaker 2: want to own being an intellectual, so for him it's 292 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 2: a philosophy. He says, he's not antisemitic. But the fact 293 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:20,399 Speaker 2: is that he blames Disraeli right at that time, the 294 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:25,280 Speaker 2: right hand men in uh, you know, in in English parliaments. 295 00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 2: He blames him uh for of capitalism becoming more and 296 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 2: more so pronounced that he hates all the Jews for 297 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 2: bringing capitalism to the world and destroying the souls as 298 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 2: a result of that. That actually religious aspirations that should 299 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:45,560 Speaker 2: be the the masses. And his antisemitism, which he doesn't 300 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:47,960 Speaker 2: want to own. He says, I don't hate Jews, but 301 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:50,880 Speaker 2: he does it in a philosophical way, and that will 302 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:56,639 Speaker 2: take us to October seventh, because antisemitism will more into 303 00:22:56,680 --> 00:23:01,679 Speaker 2: different forms. So even Dostoyevsky, great Dostiyev idea, is it 304 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 2: about against Jewish industrialisms who war or or bankers and 305 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:14,240 Speaker 2: so forth, the next generation will find it in a 306 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:17,119 Speaker 2: different place. So as much as I would like to 307 00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:20,080 Speaker 2: say that that when it comes to if you have 308 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 2: some anti Israel rhetoric based on the fact that you 309 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 2: criticize lack of democracy in Israel, I don't understand how 310 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:34,119 Speaker 2: that relates to bombing or bringing guns in a Jewish 311 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:38,560 Speaker 2: day school in diaspora here in Canada. Just take ten 312 00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:43,560 Speaker 2: minutes away from my house. So you hide your sensibility 313 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:47,280 Speaker 2: behind a different philosophy. But the fact, as you put it, 314 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:51,240 Speaker 2: it does exist, and it changes form in different in 315 00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:56,560 Speaker 2: different generations, and it attacks this cancer attacks lulnerable souls, 316 00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:01,159 Speaker 2: souls that do not spend an mind enough time in 317 00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:06,359 Speaker 2: critical thinking. Do they choose isolation by looking in Boy, now, 318 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:09,359 Speaker 2: my goodness, I'm speaking to you from my love of 319 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:12,800 Speaker 2: the little pink color iPad. Boy, it knows what to 320 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:17,520 Speaker 2: feed me. If I want a pillbox, yes, if I 321 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:22,720 Speaker 2: need a exercise particular for women over fifty, boy, it 322 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,159 Speaker 2: knows me better than I know myself. And you have 323 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:29,840 Speaker 2: these vulnerable souls who are fed and ted and fed 324 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 2: with the material that they cannot both. Often often they 325 00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:43,680 Speaker 2: to warp through to question, to read, greater to hear 326 00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:47,800 Speaker 2: other people, so anticipitism. At times it was driven by 327 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:53,040 Speaker 2: the church. How come the mad tradition, the Judaism rejected 328 00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:56,520 Speaker 2: Christianity of Christian roots? How dare you? It's a hate 329 00:24:56,560 --> 00:25:01,359 Speaker 2: of a parent, It's a dislike that religion. Christianity was 330 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:06,600 Speaker 2: rejected for Spanish and prosponsionquisition. My witness the amount of 331 00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:11,280 Speaker 2: land that was confiscated and wealth from the people who 332 00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:15,800 Speaker 2: were accused Antichrist or burned at a stake unbelievable. That's 333 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:20,560 Speaker 2: materialistically driven, So you have it's not about the people. 334 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:23,440 Speaker 2: It's about often what the people meaning. I'm not about 335 00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:28,000 Speaker 2: the Jews. It's about what the system that produces this poison? 336 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 2: What is it after? And very often it will incorporate 337 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:37,840 Speaker 2: lost individuals. Crusades picked up along with its pillage the 338 00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:42,920 Speaker 2: finest of Europe. But everyone couldn't read, couldn't write when 339 00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:48,399 Speaker 2: the pitchfork was going to liberate Jerusalem from infidels, and 340 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:52,399 Speaker 2: under the way to a bit of looting and killing. Well, 341 00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:58,200 Speaker 2: there were plenty of little villages along the way indiscriminatory murder. Right, 342 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:02,560 Speaker 2: So you have it. You have this in a You 343 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:06,080 Speaker 2: can have, for example, interaction and office where your Jewish 344 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:09,880 Speaker 2: boss was not really terribly kind to you, and all 345 00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:13,720 Speaker 2: of a sudden you will walk out hating average that 346 00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:16,959 Speaker 2: you meet Jewish person didn't do the right thing. I 347 00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:18,720 Speaker 2: want all the Jews do the right thing, to be 348 00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:23,680 Speaker 2: most generous, mos standards, the sweetest, open caring, only all 349 00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:25,960 Speaker 2: the best. That's why I would interrupting it is how 350 00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:28,879 Speaker 2: do you take this extraordinary tradition that was divided but 351 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:33,520 Speaker 2: that was absolutely uh deprived to me and give it 352 00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 2: over with love and affection and spirit for good. 353 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:48,679 Speaker 1: Let me ask you a question and apply your very 354 00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:59,639 Speaker 1: formidable intellect towards it. How how do you process the 355 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:07,040 Speaker 1: three president's t two presidents now one former president University 356 00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:13,480 Speaker 1: of Pennsylvania president since resigned. Some of the leading global 357 00:27:15,320 --> 00:27:20,359 Speaker 1: higher education institutions in the world, world famous everywhere MIT 358 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:28,560 Speaker 1: University of Pennsylvania, Harvard University. That the question about anti 359 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:37,119 Speaker 1: Semitism is answered as it is within a human lifetime 360 00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:46,399 Speaker 1: of the Holocaust, which central lesson is expressed as a 361 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 1: combination of never again and never forget. How can it 362 00:27:55,680 --> 00:28:06,160 Speaker 1: be that, thirty years after Schindler's List is released in 363 00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 1: the culture, that the culture, at least in an elite 364 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:20,399 Speaker 1: academic sense, has moved from point A to point B 365 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:27,440 Speaker 1: without much conversation about any of the space that exists 366 00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:32,840 Speaker 1: underneath point A to point B. I think it's incredible 367 00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:36,440 Speaker 1: and begining you meditate. 368 00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:38,719 Speaker 2: On that, so let me see and forgiving me. At 369 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:41,160 Speaker 2: times I don't I mean, I don't know if because 370 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:42,800 Speaker 2: it's it's sort of bennic thing, but at times it 371 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 2: or myself in particular, do not stay very focused, but 372 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 2: eventually hopefully get to what to where we would be heading. Uh. 373 00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:56,440 Speaker 2: I think, first of all, the idea of freedom of 374 00:28:56,520 --> 00:29:00,720 Speaker 2: speech I do not believe exists in the full sense. 375 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:03,800 Speaker 2: We actually not free to say what we think. Sometimes 376 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:06,320 Speaker 2: it's a good idea and sometimes it's not a good idea. 377 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:09,920 Speaker 2: What I when I listened to the three women speaking, 378 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:13,800 Speaker 2: I was horrified for a couple a couple of issues. 379 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:16,720 Speaker 2: First of all, there were my fellow women meaning that 380 00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:20,000 Speaker 2: you should know what oppression is like. And by the way, 381 00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:24,160 Speaker 2: this is not because my entire feminine experience and feminist 382 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 2: experience were in the presence of oppressive a system or 383 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:31,240 Speaker 2: oppressive man. No, but as a female who worked and 384 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:36,680 Speaker 2: rolled them and been part the sensitivity was a lot 385 00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 2: of sensitivity. Was stunning. Forgive me if I expect at 386 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:40,840 Speaker 2: this moment. 387 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 3: From a from a lover of the world, from another mother, 388 00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:50,040 Speaker 3: such distance of sensitivity. So first of all, you might 389 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:54,400 Speaker 3: have to edit this, this piece ode. So I'm continued 390 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:57,040 Speaker 3: speaking what I was upset, and I would expect the 391 00:29:57,080 --> 00:29:58,360 Speaker 3: same from men as well. 392 00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,480 Speaker 2: But what the second thing I was, I was stand by. 393 00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:05,560 Speaker 2: They looked scared to me, and I look for those 394 00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:12,120 Speaker 2: science as as both as a rabbi and as a therapist. 395 00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,840 Speaker 2: With these three women looked frightened. They were frightened to 396 00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:20,720 Speaker 2: speak what they really thought. And the idea of intellectual 397 00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:25,800 Speaker 2: freedom in university is very much under attack, and I 398 00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:28,880 Speaker 2: don't know if we'll ever fully existed. Maybe there was 399 00:30:28,960 --> 00:30:35,000 Speaker 2: a little renaissance period in between. They were looked frightened 400 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 2: of what will be the consequence if they really say 401 00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 2: what they think, because I don't believe they have done. 402 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:50,200 Speaker 2: So they looked behind their response invisible to us. There 403 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:53,800 Speaker 2: were members of the board they were donors. There were 404 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:57,880 Speaker 2: all there were groups of students and student body to 405 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:01,480 Speaker 2: which they were answering. I did not feel we received 406 00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:07,120 Speaker 2: a truly in depth what they thought of reality. They 407 00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:11,040 Speaker 2: were what you call in a Jewish kitchen path part 408 00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:16,040 Speaker 2: means neither meat, neither neither milk. It is usually belongs 409 00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:19,480 Speaker 2: to vegetables and when And they were in front of 410 00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:25,240 Speaker 2: the woman who was spectacular interviewer of an examiner. She 411 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,240 Speaker 2: was the panic I think her last name, what Congress 412 00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:32,960 Speaker 2: war was unbelievably clear and an antarget. So first of all, 413 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,000 Speaker 2: this is what I thought, This is what I saw. 414 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:38,240 Speaker 2: The other thing is the power in the and the 415 00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:45,920 Speaker 2: our feeling that overlooming subject of the Holocaust, Urban Cutler, 416 00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:51,040 Speaker 2: whoist who is was uh, you know MP and I 417 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:55,240 Speaker 2: think I'm saying it correctly for a liberal party here 418 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,160 Speaker 2: in Canada. And who is also was charged with anti 419 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:03,760 Speaker 2: to deal with the anti Semtism because regular regular threats 420 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:07,520 Speaker 2: of death threats that are posed against him. But at 421 00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:11,880 Speaker 2: the conference in nineteen Semitism, which was planned and nobody 422 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:14,920 Speaker 2: expected after October sevenths It was planned way before, but 423 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 2: it just happened to be after October seventh. In Ottawa. 424 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 2: He said, remember this is still this is twenty twenty three, 425 00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:25,880 Speaker 2: nineteen forty three, and it's caught up. It was like, 426 00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:29,520 Speaker 2: you're right, we can't be. We know we have a 427 00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:32,440 Speaker 2: lot more going for us than we did in nineteen 428 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:36,800 Speaker 2: forty three. We have democracy on our side, we are vocal, 429 00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:39,520 Speaker 2: we speak, and so forth, so on. For a while 430 00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:42,880 Speaker 2: I repeeded this, this is twenty twenty three, this is 431 00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 2: not nineteen forty three. I'll tell you what's a problem 432 00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:50,440 Speaker 2: with it. So I would compare my Jewish reality compared 433 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:52,720 Speaker 2: to a gas champer. As long as they're not going 434 00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:55,280 Speaker 2: to put me in a in a gas chamber, everything 435 00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:57,720 Speaker 2: else is not okay? Or is it okay? 436 00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:02,680 Speaker 4: Do you see like this, this specterrum of between living 437 00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 4: a good life of a free person in the world, 438 00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:10,800 Speaker 4: either being of various faith communities. 439 00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:13,760 Speaker 2: In general, being a Jew, being a vibrant Jew, being 440 00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:18,920 Speaker 2: outspoken Jew. The next step, as long as it's not Orschwitz, 441 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,000 Speaker 2: then it's okay. Well, there are plenty of things that's 442 00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 2: not Auschwitz. That's not okay. The fact that my son 443 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,560 Speaker 2: has to be concerned of what's happening on campus is 444 00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:33,360 Speaker 2: not okay, And it's not Auschwitz. And what we're hoping 445 00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:38,520 Speaker 2: is that a simple human being burdened with the war 446 00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:41,680 Speaker 2: may be fired. Maybe lonely sitting in front of this 447 00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:48,960 Speaker 2: computer will make a sophisticated leaf that will say, well, 448 00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:53,040 Speaker 2: if I continue reading these horrible articles about Jewish people, 449 00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:55,600 Speaker 2: I might end up like a Nazi, and then I 450 00:33:55,600 --> 00:34:00,400 Speaker 2: can actually destroy and kill. That's a very very sophisticated journey. 451 00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:05,080 Speaker 2: You try to think individual on w is frankly are 452 00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:11,000 Speaker 2: I don't want to see people. I want to see 453 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,719 Speaker 2: them in the best possible light and hope for their 454 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,719 Speaker 2: for their openness and rehabilitation, if I may say. But 455 00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 2: what we're asking for people to do is these terrible 456 00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:25,359 Speaker 2: minds make a very very hugely that where their prejudice 457 00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:28,719 Speaker 2: can take them, and I don't believe majority people can. 458 00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,640 Speaker 2: And then there are some individuals that will take as 459 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:37,440 Speaker 2: in my son's school and walk through his high school 460 00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:41,080 Speaker 2: he's now in university, walk through his high school and 461 00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,640 Speaker 2: next thing you know, there is the police. There's a 462 00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:46,719 Speaker 2: bum threat and all the kids have vacated three times. 463 00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,680 Speaker 2: Three times. So no, it's not nineteen forty three, but 464 00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:53,000 Speaker 2: I have to tell you the bar is pretty low. 465 00:34:56,640 --> 00:35:01,640 Speaker 1: I think it's really interesting to hear you talk about 466 00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:06,840 Speaker 1: that and make that comparison. And so I think about 467 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:13,719 Speaker 1: this completely differently, and I'll lay it out from for you, 468 00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,640 Speaker 1: because I think about it not as somebody who is 469 00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:21,600 Speaker 1: even converting to Judaism, but just as somebody who's fifty three, 470 00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:25,319 Speaker 1: who's reached middle age and has a and has a 471 00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:30,640 Speaker 1: perspective on time and as an amateur student of history. 472 00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:38,719 Speaker 1: Nineteen forty three is a year after the Wance Conference 473 00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:42,359 Speaker 1: where the murder of the Jews is officially planned. And 474 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:47,680 Speaker 1: really what we recall of the Holocaust, such as it was, 475 00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:57,920 Speaker 1: the mechanized, industrialized murder through the gas chambers, the incineration, 476 00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:02,960 Speaker 1: the confiscation of good its properties Auschwitz. All of this 477 00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:11,759 Speaker 1: killing takes place between nineteen forty two and January spring 478 00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:16,520 Speaker 1: of nineteen forty five, including up through the very very 479 00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:22,400 Speaker 1: last minutes that the Nazi Reich existed. They were killing 480 00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:30,640 Speaker 1: Jews to the very last second, including after Hitler killed himself. 481 00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:34,239 Speaker 1: And so if you think about nineteen forty three, in 482 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:39,000 Speaker 1: that moment, how did you get to nineteen forty three? 483 00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:44,320 Speaker 1: And that took twenty years, That took Brooke nineteen twenty 484 00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:49,879 Speaker 1: three from Adolph Hitler's puch, and you can divide that 485 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:53,040 Speaker 1: twenty years, you can divide it in half. It took 486 00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:57,200 Speaker 1: ten ten years from Hitler's push to taking power, and 487 00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:02,520 Speaker 1: it took ten years to nineteen forty three. It took 488 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:06,240 Speaker 1: six years to start the war, It took two years 489 00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:10,880 Speaker 1: to strip Jews of their rights, and it took five 490 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:14,920 Speaker 1: years to get to the largest state program in history. 491 00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:19,839 Speaker 1: And in nineteen forty in the United States, Charles Lindbergh 492 00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:28,080 Speaker 1: came really within organizing one vote away the cancelation of 493 00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:33,359 Speaker 1: the American military draft, which would have made an invasion 494 00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:40,680 Speaker 1: across the Channel impossible before say, nineteen forty six, which 495 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,879 Speaker 1: meant that the Holocaust, such as it was would have 496 00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:49,920 Speaker 1: gone on for much much longer. And the question in 497 00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:57,600 Speaker 1: twenty twenty three isn't about nineteen forty three, it's about 498 00:37:57,640 --> 00:38:05,719 Speaker 1: where are we in the trajectory and in the of 499 00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:11,960 Speaker 1: an unfinished story. The one thing I know historically to 500 00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:15,760 Speaker 1: be true is that when we talked about the history 501 00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:20,520 Speaker 1: we've talked about, the sixteenth century was deadlier than the fifteenth, 502 00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:24,000 Speaker 1: The seventeenth, more than the sixteenth, the eighteenth, more than 503 00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:27,920 Speaker 1: the seventeenth, the nineteenth, more than the eighteenth, the twentieth 504 00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:30,800 Speaker 1: the deadliest of all. And we come to the middle 505 00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:38,399 Speaker 1: of the century with an existential moral proposition. Mankind can 506 00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:44,200 Speaker 1: now extinct itself with weapons that are within them, the 507 00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:48,239 Speaker 1: power of the gods contained within them, the power of 508 00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:55,480 Speaker 1: the proverbial gods. War hasn't stopped, but the acceleration of 509 00:38:55,760 --> 00:39:04,520 Speaker 1: disaster has slowed until the end of the life spans 510 00:39:04,719 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 1: of the people who survived the events, and the political 511 00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:14,520 Speaker 1: hope of the preeminent leader for the good for freedom. 512 00:39:14,680 --> 00:39:18,960 Speaker 1: In that moment, Franklin Roosevelt, in a discussion with the 513 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:22,440 Speaker 1: Canadian Prime Minister, goes on late at night and he 514 00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:25,600 Speaker 1: says to Prime Minister Kinging that his aspiration is not 515 00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:31,880 Speaker 1: that the world to come, this American led, freedom led 516 00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:35,440 Speaker 1: international order will endure forever. He just wants it to 517 00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:38,960 Speaker 1: last for as long as everybody is alive. On the 518 00:39:39,080 --> 00:39:41,640 Speaker 1: day the war is won, and the youngest of those 519 00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:46,279 Speaker 1: people are about eighty years old, and we have this 520 00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:53,359 Speaker 1: wave of amnesia sweeping at a time where we know 521 00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:59,879 Speaker 1: how that story ended, but we have no idea where 522 00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:03,320 Speaker 1: this story is going going. 523 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:08,759 Speaker 2: My son was fast, you know, the eighteen year old 524 00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:12,880 Speaker 2: young man who said, I'm much less concerned about Israel 525 00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:17,040 Speaker 2: and much more concerned about Jews in you know, in diaspora. 526 00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:22,160 Speaker 2: I think the side actually turned. If diaspora, a Jewish 527 00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:26,359 Speaker 2: community was concerned about, you know, how Israel will fare, 528 00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:29,399 Speaker 2: actually I think it's the other way of how we're 529 00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:34,840 Speaker 2: going to do. Look, one of the Jewish concept is 530 00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:37,160 Speaker 2: that you're not allowed to despair, even if it feels 531 00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:43,759 Speaker 2: like it's dark. So I I was in a car 532 00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:48,120 Speaker 2: with human instead and we speak Fressian. I grew up 533 00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:50,640 Speaker 2: in Kiev and the language of love is Russian for me. 534 00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:56,840 Speaker 2: Even even so you know, my you know, what's happening 535 00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:00,640 Speaker 2: in Ukraine and with Russia is also complicated than heart 536 00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:06,799 Speaker 2: wrenching two. But always I speak Russian to him often enough, 537 00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:10,040 Speaker 2: and I said, you know, I never thought that when 538 00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:13,360 Speaker 2: I chased train out of Ukraine, and that's exactly what 539 00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:17,560 Speaker 2: my sister and I did, and I talk about it 540 00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:20,799 Speaker 2: in a book where you know, we were lost to 541 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:23,040 Speaker 2: get to get off the platform and the train began 542 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:26,000 Speaker 2: to move and two young women myself and my sister 543 00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:30,240 Speaker 2: were left. My parents were in a in the heart itself, 544 00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:34,040 Speaker 2: trying to help elderly and pulling people in, but all 545 00:41:34,160 --> 00:41:38,879 Speaker 2: departures like this are are filled with chaos. I said, 546 00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:41,719 Speaker 2: when I chase that train, I never thought that you 547 00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:47,640 Speaker 2: would ever have to face anti Semitism. Your grandfathers and 548 00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:51,759 Speaker 2: our goal was to create the world without it for you. 549 00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:55,759 Speaker 2: But that's not the case. That's not the case. So 550 00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:57,759 Speaker 2: what do I see in my work and in my son, 551 00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:02,640 Speaker 2: is actually this crisis a weakened Jewish identity. There are 552 00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:07,399 Speaker 2: number of responses. You know, when when things are hard 553 00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:11,920 Speaker 2: for the Jews. The laws around Hanukah and that is 554 00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:15,560 Speaker 2: customs and you know, traditions, and we just finished this 555 00:42:15,640 --> 00:42:19,920 Speaker 2: extraordinary festival of light. You're supposed to announce miracle, and 556 00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:23,640 Speaker 2: you put Johanukiya, your minora, right at the window or outside. 557 00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:26,240 Speaker 2: In Israel, they go into a box outside on the streets. 558 00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:30,839 Speaker 2: You see these beautiful boxes with lit thenora's And when 559 00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:34,440 Speaker 2: things are really hard for the Jews, you put Johanukiya, 560 00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:39,960 Speaker 2: you light it on the table inside the house. So 561 00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:43,319 Speaker 2: at times in our history we have to light it 562 00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:45,879 Speaker 2: in the house, and the times we light it right 563 00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,080 Speaker 2: there at the window. So some Jews chose to go 564 00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:53,319 Speaker 2: on the inside, and others have been absolutely inspired to go. 565 00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:58,359 Speaker 2: And I have been asked to do more conversions and 566 00:42:58,560 --> 00:43:01,279 Speaker 2: more young Jewish people have been calling and asking what 567 00:43:01,719 --> 00:43:06,000 Speaker 2: giving me traditions to live by than I have ever 568 00:43:06,120 --> 00:43:09,239 Speaker 2: had in twenty years, twenty five years of serving Jewish community. 569 00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:16,680 Speaker 2: So actually where it's going from? I want to examine 570 00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:20,960 Speaker 2: this from oi to joy and that we will face this. 571 00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:25,719 Speaker 2: And I am both frightened and determined that if we 572 00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:31,600 Speaker 2: give education to our children and our people to live 573 00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:35,160 Speaker 2: this beautiful Jewish righteous life, work with very deeply with 574 00:43:35,320 --> 00:43:39,640 Speaker 2: interface in interface dialogue, which I do regularly with my 575 00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:44,319 Speaker 2: Christian colleagues and friends as well as people of other 576 00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:51,560 Speaker 2: faith and visual about democracy. We stand the chance, We 577 00:43:51,680 --> 00:43:55,640 Speaker 2: stand the chance, and overall the world is better and 578 00:43:56,120 --> 00:43:59,560 Speaker 2: than it's used to be. We actually, depending on numbers 579 00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:02,000 Speaker 2: used to pillage each other, there a lot better with 580 00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:05,600 Speaker 2: greater success. We are more civilized as well as more 581 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:13,919 Speaker 2: sophisticated to kill. Absolutely, But I I see the light 582 00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:18,040 Speaker 2: even when there's darkness around me, and to see people 583 00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:21,319 Speaker 2: seeking out their Jewish identity and the roots and say 584 00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:25,399 Speaker 2: yi laheim to life. And I can be there from 585 00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:30,200 Speaker 2: that place of of shame and of lack of education 586 00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:34,839 Speaker 2: as a Jew who fled that terrible system. Judaism in 587 00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:38,440 Speaker 2: the Soviet Union was erased, but it was left in 588 00:44:38,480 --> 00:44:41,919 Speaker 2: your pastport to know you're a Jew. By the time 589 00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:45,640 Speaker 2: it got to me, there was my grandmother's Yiddish whispers 590 00:44:45,719 --> 00:44:51,960 Speaker 2: and little stories here and there. But Judaism in in 591 00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:55,920 Speaker 2: in in the North America and in education that we 592 00:44:56,080 --> 00:45:02,160 Speaker 2: try to impart has the life giving and life surviving 593 00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:09,480 Speaker 2: skills for the future. And I will not stop to 594 00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:15,240 Speaker 2: share that education. And so your concern is absolutely history 595 00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:18,840 Speaker 2: can present that trajectory is scary. Where we are in 596 00:45:18,920 --> 00:45:22,680 Speaker 2: this trajectory, you can say in nineteen thirty eight maybe, 597 00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:25,960 Speaker 2: and then it doesn't take long. I don't believe this 598 00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:29,799 Speaker 2: will unfold as such. But when I speak to Holocaust survivors, 599 00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,120 Speaker 2: I cry with them. And one thing I want to say, 600 00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:36,560 Speaker 2: I want to today's my father's your side. You know 601 00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:39,160 Speaker 2: he died four years ago. You couldn't have found more 602 00:45:39,200 --> 00:45:43,640 Speaker 2: elegant men, more charm being more involved with his two 603 00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:46,360 Speaker 2: more in love with his wife and his two girls. 604 00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:51,840 Speaker 2: And he served in the Soviet Army. His father served 605 00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:57,080 Speaker 2: for entire years of the war along with Ukrainians, along 606 00:45:57,200 --> 00:46:00,000 Speaker 2: with was big it was Biggist and along with George 607 00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:07,279 Speaker 2: gans to fight a horrible, horrible war of Hitler. I'm 608 00:46:07,280 --> 00:46:10,319 Speaker 2: glad my father isn't seeing what he's has not. He 609 00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:13,960 Speaker 2: died before the war in Ukraine unfolded. I will shood 610 00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:15,799 Speaker 2: to live to one hundred and twenty. But I have 611 00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:20,120 Speaker 2: to tell you, I'm glad he didn't see this and 612 00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:24,200 Speaker 2: to see Holocaust survivors and what he would have seen 613 00:46:24,239 --> 00:46:28,319 Speaker 2: on October October seventh would have destroyed my parents. To 614 00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:35,880 Speaker 2: see Holocaust survivors reliving this is absolutely devastating. So what 615 00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:39,360 Speaker 2: do we do? We bring them to hear our children 616 00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:43,640 Speaker 2: sing in Hebrew? What do we do We make phone 617 00:46:43,640 --> 00:46:48,719 Speaker 2: calls to Israel and here ISRAELI speak about spirit and 618 00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:55,240 Speaker 2: future and desire for peace. What do we do every 619 00:46:55,719 --> 00:47:00,560 Speaker 2: Saturday morning eight sixty four, Shepherd? Where you were therefore 620 00:47:00,920 --> 00:47:04,920 Speaker 2: high holidays? We bring people in the sanctuary and we 621 00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:09,640 Speaker 2: sing and we dance and we educate. So no, no, 622 00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:14,759 Speaker 2: we won't let it happen. No frighten us. 623 00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:20,640 Speaker 1: Let me ask you a final question, and that's two. 624 00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:31,279 Speaker 1: What do you say to young people who are watching 625 00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:45,280 Speaker 1: the terrible consequence of October seventh on fold without any 626 00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:52,920 Speaker 1: historical context, in complete ignorance about the cost of war, 627 00:47:53,160 --> 00:48:01,040 Speaker 1: the horror of war, the intellectual construct of of just war, 628 00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:10,040 Speaker 1: the consequences of violations of international law being committed by 629 00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:16,759 Speaker 1: hamas in terms of embedding themselves with civilian population, including 630 00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:27,000 Speaker 1: militarizing hospital facilities, elder care facilities, childcare facilities, so on, 631 00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:34,000 Speaker 1: so on and so forth. But no matter the casualties 632 00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:38,280 Speaker 1: are high, is. 633 00:48:38,719 --> 00:48:41,080 Speaker 2: You feel for civilians lost? 634 00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:47,200 Speaker 1: A Jewish baby's life and its loss in the eyes 635 00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:51,400 Speaker 1: of God is no greater or less loss than a 636 00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:56,040 Speaker 1: Arab baby, or Muslim baby or Christian baby. That all 637 00:48:56,400 --> 00:49:00,880 Speaker 1: are equally a tragedy, tragedy in a a front. But 638 00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:08,320 Speaker 1: that when an event like this happens, when an evil 639 00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:19,080 Speaker 1: manifests itself, yes, that the evil must be confronted, and 640 00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:29,160 Speaker 1: that that confrontation will will mean violence and death and 641 00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:42,200 Speaker 1: destruction at an epic scale that cannot be averted, but 642 00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:48,880 Speaker 1: can be the beginning of an error of peace on 643 00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:52,920 Speaker 1: the other side if people so choose it. But how 644 00:49:53,520 --> 00:49:58,279 Speaker 1: do you explain this to a to an eighteen year old, 645 00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:02,000 Speaker 1: to a twenty year role that is reacting on their 646 00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:08,399 Speaker 1: social media feeds emotionally to the images of war. 647 00:50:10,120 --> 00:50:14,160 Speaker 2: You know, so we've been quite quite privileged to live 648 00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:18,520 Speaker 2: in a time where you know, the war is not 649 00:50:19,239 --> 00:50:22,080 Speaker 2: underground in Canada or in the United States, we have 650 00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:27,560 Speaker 2: it's elsewhere, right, you know, it's kind of overseas, right, 651 00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:30,719 Speaker 2: But these images are brought close to you. What is 652 00:50:30,719 --> 00:50:34,680 Speaker 2: amazing is that how that war is offull anywhere, including Rwanda, 653 00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:40,840 Speaker 2: including in Syria, including in Afghanistan. So Middle East is 654 00:50:42,840 --> 00:50:47,319 Speaker 2: affected by and a gas is affected by horristic war. 655 00:50:47,560 --> 00:50:50,560 Speaker 2: But this is not the only place where our justice 656 00:50:50,760 --> 00:50:54,759 Speaker 2: needs to be stirred and spilt. That's number one. It's 657 00:50:54,760 --> 00:50:58,560 Speaker 2: impossible to explain so much in such a short period 658 00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:03,319 Speaker 2: of time. First of all, the attention of teenage young 659 00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:05,680 Speaker 2: people is very short. I see it when I try 660 00:51:05,719 --> 00:51:08,080 Speaker 2: to have a conversation and get to a third sentence, 661 00:51:08,320 --> 00:51:10,120 Speaker 2: and I don't know if you have teenage children, but 662 00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:15,080 Speaker 2: you they ran out like it's amazing. It's a you're 663 00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:18,160 Speaker 2: onto something else, almost like a toddler. Forgive me. I 664 00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:20,520 Speaker 2: don't mean to infantilize them, but there is a bit 665 00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:24,799 Speaker 2: of rite you. Well, so there was one. I think 666 00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:28,680 Speaker 2: the most I can do I can't control media, and 667 00:51:28,760 --> 00:51:32,560 Speaker 2: very often it's profoundly unfriendly and frankly lack of nuance, 668 00:51:33,360 --> 00:51:36,799 Speaker 2: lack of nuance to compare, to compare the death of 669 00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:40,799 Speaker 2: hostages that were only and uh and what happened you 670 00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:46,040 Speaker 2: know in those in a southern Israel, to compare, to 671 00:51:46,080 --> 00:51:51,319 Speaker 2: make the equivalents so easily without distinguished? What does that 672 00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:53,799 Speaker 2: mean to come into someone else's home? What does that mean? 673 00:51:53,920 --> 00:51:59,080 Speaker 2: The battleground? Yes, life is life. However there is a 674 00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:02,200 Speaker 2: nuance in different You cannot do it on the fly. 675 00:52:02,560 --> 00:52:08,280 Speaker 2: And the little social feeds they receive a young people 676 00:52:08,360 --> 00:52:13,560 Speaker 2: received are actually support their inability to discipline, to read, 677 00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:17,640 Speaker 2: to digest and to have a critical thought That takes effort, 678 00:52:18,400 --> 00:52:20,480 Speaker 2: that takes And that's what's the beginning of my conversation 679 00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:24,280 Speaker 2: when I thought, really you have to really think through something. 680 00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:29,840 Speaker 2: They are they want quick answers, and I see credible 681 00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:33,440 Speaker 2: isolation in young people. On one hand, I can with 682 00:52:33,560 --> 00:52:36,640 Speaker 2: my want to be all over the world any time 683 00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:38,640 Speaker 2: I can do anything. It means I can do nothing 684 00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:45,080 Speaker 2: because everything is not it is not anything. So so 685 00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:51,840 Speaker 2: the depth of analysis is really missing us. The media 686 00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:56,400 Speaker 2: content that just hardly hardly is uh uh is supportive. 687 00:52:56,880 --> 00:53:00,920 Speaker 2: So I would say to those who are all to 688 00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:06,440 Speaker 2: pay attention, you have series of dialogues without punishment or 689 00:53:06,719 --> 00:53:11,400 Speaker 2: harsh judgment, but desire to say, well, tell me why 690 00:53:11,440 --> 00:53:13,799 Speaker 2: do you feel and think like this? And would you 691 00:53:13,880 --> 00:53:19,279 Speaker 2: be open to me challenging or another opinion. So I 692 00:53:19,360 --> 00:53:21,759 Speaker 2: don't see this on a larger scale. I see this 693 00:53:21,840 --> 00:53:24,680 Speaker 2: on one to one and we've done so also at 694 00:53:24,680 --> 00:53:31,520 Speaker 2: the Darnoa where in polarization of are you and Darenauum 695 00:53:31,640 --> 00:53:34,040 Speaker 2: is not a place of polarization. It's a very tolerant, 696 00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:39,520 Speaker 2: loving community. But there is a room for grief. I mean, 697 00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:47,719 Speaker 2: what happened on October seventh the beyond bit despicable, but barbarism. 698 00:53:50,200 --> 00:53:56,280 Speaker 2: I also feel for Gaza civilian who is warning her child, 699 00:53:57,280 --> 00:54:01,160 Speaker 2: or her beloved mother or anyone knows who's under rubble. 700 00:54:01,960 --> 00:54:06,040 Speaker 2: So I have to have room to love with both, 701 00:54:06,239 --> 00:54:11,800 Speaker 2: with both parts of your heart. Is possible. It's possible 702 00:54:11,920 --> 00:54:15,080 Speaker 2: to be belonging to a group and seeing the group 703 00:54:15,160 --> 00:54:19,919 Speaker 2: a central element of your of your manifestation of life 704 00:54:20,080 --> 00:54:22,960 Speaker 2: in this world as part of it, and see humanity. 705 00:54:24,080 --> 00:54:26,600 Speaker 2: But that's what we need to teach. That's what we 706 00:54:26,680 --> 00:54:30,279 Speaker 2: need to teach. Is it easy? The answer is absolutely not. 707 00:54:30,600 --> 00:54:34,319 Speaker 2: Did we lose that next generation? I refuse to think 708 00:54:34,360 --> 00:54:40,440 Speaker 2: that we have has it been difficult for all of us? 709 00:54:40,920 --> 00:54:47,719 Speaker 2: I my study turned into a place of tears for 710 00:54:47,880 --> 00:54:51,200 Speaker 2: people who are grieving, grieving what has taken place, and 711 00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:54,879 Speaker 2: grieving their place in the world. We are in the threshold, 712 00:54:55,760 --> 00:55:00,640 Speaker 2: but I feel that will hold hands and even if 713 00:55:00,640 --> 00:55:04,400 Speaker 2: it's dark at times doesn't mean light. Light doesn't shine. 714 00:55:05,480 --> 00:55:07,919 Speaker 1: What a perfect place to leave it. Leave it there 715 00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:11,480 Speaker 1: with Rabbi Tina. Thank you so much for your time, 716 00:55:11,560 --> 00:55:15,640 Speaker 1: your words of wisdom. Thank you for watching. Make sure 717 00:55:15,680 --> 00:55:19,480 Speaker 1: you subscribe to our channel so you never miss a video. Also, 718 00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:22,799 Speaker 1: for more content just like this, please consider joining our 719 00:55:22,920 --> 00:55:26,880 Speaker 1: Warning premium community. You can find out more in the 720 00:55:26,960 --> 00:55:27,880 Speaker 1: description below. 721 00:55:28,680 --> 00:55:36,120 Speaker 2: Dudes to a bench whom you should think you