1 00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 1: Welcome to Securing America with b Frank Effney, the program 2 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 1: that's a kind of owner's manual for protecting the country 3 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:34,239 Speaker 1: we love against all enemies foreign and domestic, to the 4 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:37,320 Speaker 1: glory of God and his Kingdom. We're going to spend 5 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:42,199 Speaker 1: a very special hour probing with one of the great 6 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 1: leaders on national security in general and specifically with respect 7 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 1: to the threat we face to the national security from 8 00:00:52,479 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 1: the greatest enemy we've ever faced, namely the Chinese Communist Party. 9 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 1: I want to set the stage four topic A for 10 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:06,480 Speaker 1: my conversation with Captain James Finnell, the United States Navy retired, 11 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:11,840 Speaker 1: by sharing with you some thoughts about what's reportedly about 12 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:16,480 Speaker 1: to happen. Donald Trump is reportedly poised to allow hard 13 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: left British Prime Minister care Starmer to ensure the security 14 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 1: and continued use of Diego Garcia and an Indian ocean 15 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:28,160 Speaker 1: base indispensable to America's power projection capabilities in much of 16 00:01:28,200 --> 00:01:30,920 Speaker 1: the world. That would be the same Cure Starmer, who 17 00:01:30,959 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 1: was recently in Beijing seeking a new special relationship with Xijingpeng. 18 00:01:35,800 --> 00:01:38,559 Speaker 1: She seeks to end the US presence in the Indo 19 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 1: Pacific and wherever possible supplant US there. Unfortunately, the deal 20 00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:47,319 Speaker 1: Starmer's government has negotiated with the African nation of Mauritius, 21 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 1: which mister Trump brightly described last month as an act 22 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:54,480 Speaker 1: of quote great stupidity unquote, will predictably lead to the 23 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 1: Chinese Communists taking over Diego, Garcia, just as they did 24 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: our Bagram airbase in Afghanistan. It's hard to believe that 25 00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:07,600 Speaker 1: this president wants to share such a strategically benighted legacy 26 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 1: with his much reviled predecessor. What's some of my thoughts. 27 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:17,239 Speaker 1: For more of them, please check out my writing at 28 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:20,840 Speaker 1: x at Frank Affney. Also the work we do at 29 00:02:20,880 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 1: the Usfuture dot org Institute for the American Future. You 30 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: can help make that work possible and indeed this program 31 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 1: by donating at Usfuture dot org. I encourage you to 32 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:35,560 Speaker 1: do so. Well. Captain Fanel is in the house. Welcome aboard, Captain, 33 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 1: it is always a privilege to have you with us, 34 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:42,640 Speaker 1: especially for a full hour conversation about well the main thing, 35 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:46,320 Speaker 1: as you've rightly called it for decades, namely the threat 36 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:50,639 Speaker 1: we do face and growing threat indeed from the Chinese 37 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 1: Communist Party. Welcome aboard, Sir Frank thanks. 38 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:55,160 Speaker 2: Good to be with you. 39 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:59,200 Speaker 1: Well, thank you for all that you do in this space. Jim. 40 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:02,080 Speaker 1: I want to say especially a word of thanks for 41 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:07,440 Speaker 1: your incredibly important book co authored with doctor Bradley Thayer, 42 00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 1: Embracing Communist China America's greatest strategic failure, because the light 43 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:16,440 Speaker 1: motif of what we're going to be talking about, I'm 44 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:26,440 Speaker 1: afraid is a continuing, well strategically monumental error in that regard, 45 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:30,079 Speaker 1: including at least if these reports are to be credited 46 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:34,840 Speaker 1: by President Donald J. Trump, I hope to god they 47 00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:38,400 Speaker 1: won't be. You were part of a team of eighty 48 00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:41,760 Speaker 1: of us who wrote him last week, as I recall, 49 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 1: encouraging him to just say no to this benighted deal. 50 00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:51,240 Speaker 1: Tell us where you think things stand and why that 51 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 1: should be the right responsor. 52 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 3: Well, up until yesterday morning, Frank I thought that the 53 00:03:56,600 --> 00:04:00,520 Speaker 3: president's true social post from last week that this is 54 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:03,560 Speaker 3: a stupid deal and he didn't agree with it in 55 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:06,960 Speaker 3: a public spat with the United Kingdom, was gonna, you know, 56 00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 3: put enough pressure on the UK's Prime Minister Starmer, to 57 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:15,080 Speaker 3: you know, go back and have to pull this off 58 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:18,159 Speaker 3: the table. It's in a bill up for a bill 59 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 3: to approve this treaty that they signed with Mauritius last year, 60 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:26,400 Speaker 3: and so I thought it was dead. And then yesterday 61 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:30,720 Speaker 3: morning the Telegraph from the UK put out a report 62 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:35,400 Speaker 3: of article saying Trump is expected to approve Starmer's chegosteal. 63 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:38,760 Speaker 3: That says yesterday morning, and it says that there's been 64 00:04:38,800 --> 00:04:43,160 Speaker 3: an intense lobbying effort by the Starmer regime, and it 65 00:04:43,279 --> 00:04:44,719 Speaker 3: said elements. 66 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:46,279 Speaker 2: Of the US Intelligence Agency. 67 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 3: To lobby the President to go along with it because 68 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 3: Starmer said there could be a security guarantees provided to 69 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 3: America that would ensure that we would not lose our 70 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:01,840 Speaker 3: access to this base. But everybody who's been involved with 71 00:05:01,880 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 3: this issue, of the people who signed the letter last week, 72 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 3: as we discussed, we all know that legally, under international 73 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:11,880 Speaker 3: law and the treaties that the US has with the 74 00:05:11,960 --> 00:05:16,640 Speaker 3: United Kingdom, that is not necessarily a guarantee that can 75 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 3: be ironclad. 76 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 2: And so the idea that we. 77 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:23,800 Speaker 3: Would put that at risk, especially after what the President 78 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:28,239 Speaker 3: has mocked Joe Biden for what he did in twenty 79 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:34,040 Speaker 3: twenty one by giving away bogram president openly for four years, you. 80 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:35,560 Speaker 2: Know, condemned what Joe Biden did. 81 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:39,839 Speaker 3: The stupidity of that taking away advantage over Western China. 82 00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 3: And now to give this away would essentially lock the 83 00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:45,560 Speaker 3: United States of America out of the Middle East in 84 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:51,560 Speaker 3: terms of strategic basing capacities for our air forces and 85 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 3: potentially for our naval forces. And we have the US 86 00:05:54,400 --> 00:05:57,600 Speaker 3: fifth Fleet in Bahrain. But if the Iranians were able 87 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:01,320 Speaker 3: to hang on and survive and down the Persian golf, 88 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:04,200 Speaker 3: the Arabian Golf, we wouldn't be able to get in 89 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:07,240 Speaker 3: and out of there except through you know, having to 90 00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 3: come from some longer place away like the UK, or 91 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 3: someplace like Singapore, which may not be assured anymore either. 92 00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:20,480 Speaker 3: So it would be monumentally a mistake for the President 93 00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:23,120 Speaker 3: to do this. So I don't know the validity of 94 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:26,479 Speaker 3: what this UK Telegraph or a conservative paper over there, 95 00:06:27,800 --> 00:06:31,880 Speaker 3: so it may have some credibility, but there's no there's 96 00:06:31,880 --> 00:06:35,440 Speaker 3: no statements, there's no POC, there's no rep from the 97 00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:36,080 Speaker 3: United States. 98 00:06:36,080 --> 00:06:36,840 Speaker 2: It's quoted in this. 99 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:40,520 Speaker 3: So this looks to be another British effort to try 100 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:44,000 Speaker 3: to get around and manipulate information. But what's interesting is 101 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:46,720 Speaker 3: this is in you know, this is in a right 102 00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:50,200 Speaker 3: right leaning paper in the UK, so I would expect 103 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 3: a Guardian or another paper to you know, have this 104 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:56,159 Speaker 3: kind of report, but not necessarily the Telegraph. So I 105 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 3: am concerned about it. It says a Secretary of State, 106 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 3: rubio As has previously criticized a deal, and he's asking 107 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:04,279 Speaker 3: his lawyers to look at it. 108 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:06,560 Speaker 2: But we don't have anything more than that. So I 109 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:08,040 Speaker 2: think it's going to get down to some. 110 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:12,240 Speaker 3: Legal examination of the agreements, the treaty agreements and alliance 111 00:07:12,280 --> 00:07:15,200 Speaker 3: agreements of the US and the UK have and would 112 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:19,640 Speaker 3: those supersede any kind of an agreement that the UK 113 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:20,920 Speaker 3: would make with Mauritius. 114 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:22,680 Speaker 2: And maybe somebody in. 115 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:27,720 Speaker 3: International law can tell the President that that would occur. 116 00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 2: But what is driving the UK to do this? Not 117 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:32,560 Speaker 2: only are. 118 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 3: They giving away the strategic territory, but they're also having 119 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:38,960 Speaker 3: to pay billions thirty five billion to Mauritius to give 120 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:42,560 Speaker 3: them something that was never ever Mauritius ever in the 121 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:47,040 Speaker 3: history of the world. There's no there's no geographic there's 122 00:07:47,080 --> 00:07:50,880 Speaker 3: no indigenous population connection, there's nothing. The only thing is 123 00:07:50,880 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 3: is when the British Empire was an empire, they said, hey, 124 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:58,200 Speaker 3: we have a big administrative base in Mauritius and we 125 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 3: have holdings throughout the Indian Ocean, and so when it 126 00:08:00,920 --> 00:08:05,240 Speaker 3: comes to the Chagos Islands, we'll let any disputes be 127 00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 3: administered in Mauritius. That's that's not any kind of historical 128 00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 3: claim by any stretch of the imagination. 129 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 2: So there's something going on here. 130 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 3: And what really compounds it is the fact that Starmer 131 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 3: is now under intense pressure in the UK. In fact, 132 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:25,360 Speaker 3: just in the last thirty minutes I just saw an 133 00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:29,360 Speaker 3: expost that said Keure Starmer's come out and publicly apologized 134 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:35,240 Speaker 3: to the victims from Jeffrey Epstein for his association via 135 00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:40,120 Speaker 3: Lord Mandleson, who he appointed as the UK's ambassador of 136 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:43,040 Speaker 3: the United States. And this Mandlsson's up to his eyeballs 137 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:46,840 Speaker 3: with Epstein, and you know, who knows what will happen 138 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:49,760 Speaker 3: to him legally, but by all accounts it sounds like 139 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 3: he was involved in some kind of pretty shady, very 140 00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:58,079 Speaker 3: bad business, you know, was abusive and vile to women, 141 00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:00,960 Speaker 3: young girls or were now women. So there's going to 142 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,960 Speaker 3: be an accountability there. And Starmar is the guy that 143 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 3: put him in position. And if you recall what happened 144 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:10,160 Speaker 3: to Boris Johnson during COVID, the British government and the 145 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:14,199 Speaker 3: British press were relentless against Boris Johnson and drove him 146 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 3: from number ten Downing Street simply because he had an 147 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 3: office party at ten Downing Street, you know, during COVID, 148 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:22,960 Speaker 3: and they weren't supposed to do that. 149 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,320 Speaker 2: So partly even close to the same kind. 150 00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 3: Of criminality, potential criminality that Starmar's involved with. So I 151 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:35,600 Speaker 3: think this is really something that the President should not 152 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:37,680 Speaker 3: cowtow on or back off on. 153 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 2: He should press. 154 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 1: Amen, Jim, we have to take a short break when 155 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 1: we come back. I want to get into this idea 156 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:47,719 Speaker 1: that the intelligence community thinks this is a good idea 157 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:52,359 Speaker 1: as well as the rest of the national security establishment. 158 00:09:52,520 --> 00:10:15,400 Speaker 1: Be right back, books, stay ten, We're back, and we're 159 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:19,320 Speaker 1: visiting with Captain James Finnel, United States Navy retired, one 160 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 1: of our nations most distinguished and I think astute naval 161 00:10:25,160 --> 00:10:29,720 Speaker 1: intelligence officers. Though he has now retired, he has very 162 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:33,520 Speaker 1: much continued his public service to our country over the 163 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:36,679 Speaker 1: space of I think some thirty years or so of 164 00:10:37,760 --> 00:10:42,480 Speaker 1: that service in uniform, much of it's been raising an 165 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:46,679 Speaker 1: alarm about what was coming. What he forecast would be 166 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:53,440 Speaker 1: the decade of concern as the Chinese military becomes well 167 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:57,920 Speaker 1: a peer competitor, as people euphemistically like to put it, 168 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: if not superior to us in many ways, militarily at 169 00:11:02,200 --> 00:11:06,880 Speaker 1: the least. And Captain Finel, as I mentioned earlier, you've 170 00:11:06,880 --> 00:11:11,960 Speaker 1: written a tremendously important book on this subject, embracing Communist China, 171 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:18,040 Speaker 1: America's greatest strategic failure, and countless essays and articles on 172 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:20,320 Speaker 1: all manner of things, many of them at American greatness. 173 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:24,920 Speaker 1: I want you to expplain to us as best you 174 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 1: can how it could be that the intelligence community in 175 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:33,320 Speaker 1: which you operated for so long could be telling the 176 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:36,040 Speaker 1: President of the United States at least this is what's 177 00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:44,800 Speaker 1: reportedly been going on, that it's absolutely bankable that Kerr Starmer, 178 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 1: a radical leftist who is I think, presiding over the 179 00:11:49,559 --> 00:11:57,000 Speaker 1: demise of his country and its seeming adopting a vassal 180 00:11:57,080 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 1: state status to communist China based on his appeasement of 181 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 1: the CCP during his recent visit to China. There seems 182 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:10,720 Speaker 1: to be so many things wrong with this deal. But 183 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 1: if that is in fact an intelligence assessment, it suggests 184 00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 1: to me that we've got a even more serious problem 185 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 1: with our intelligence community than I thought. Explain what's going 186 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 1: on here if you. 187 00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 3: Would, Yeah, Frank, Well, for the last forty years, we've 188 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:33,560 Speaker 3: had an unwritten policy. Since we switch recognition in nineteen 189 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 3: seventy nine from Taiwan to the People's Republic of China, 190 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 3: there has essentially grown in our governmental system, especially at 191 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:45,080 Speaker 3: State Department, but also in the bowels of the Pentagon 192 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:49,680 Speaker 3: and in the intelligence community Langley and other places. That 193 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:54,320 Speaker 3: says it really is important to engage with China, because 194 00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 3: we engage with them, you know, they'll be brought into 195 00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:00,920 Speaker 3: our system and they'll slowly adopt the system in some 196 00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:04,320 Speaker 3: form or fashion, maybe not completely, but it'll be better 197 00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:08,720 Speaker 3: than confrontation because confrontation will lead to immediately to thermonuclear war. 198 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:12,600 Speaker 3: So you know, that's kind of the short description of 199 00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:15,720 Speaker 3: how the mentality is. And so over forty years of 200 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 3: that mindset that was only first broken in Trump's first administration, 201 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:25,680 Speaker 3: we're still battling against people that have you know, went 202 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:29,520 Speaker 3: to college and got their degrees, got into the government, 203 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:33,560 Speaker 3: went to think tanks, went and got advanced degrees, went 204 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 3: back into the government, got their PhDs, They wrote books, 205 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:40,200 Speaker 3: they were invested in going to China for conferences and 206 00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:43,319 Speaker 3: being hosted by the Chinese Communist Party through their various 207 00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 3: think tanks, and they have hundreds of think tanks in 208 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:49,240 Speaker 3: China compared to the handfuls that we have. 209 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 1: And so, by the way, Jim, if I understand this correctly, 210 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: you can't get a visa to go to China, let 211 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 1: alone do all of that schmoozing there if you are 212 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:02,680 Speaker 1: in disc with the CCP. Is that right right? There's 213 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:03,640 Speaker 1: actor here too. 214 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 3: Yes, that there's a whole cadre of people that have 215 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:09,720 Speaker 3: been denied visus whenever they spoke out. And one of 216 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 3: the most famous in academias a guy named Perry Link, 217 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:16,160 Speaker 3: doctor Perry Link, and he was a China expert, and 218 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 3: he made some critical comments about China and he was 219 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:22,360 Speaker 3: banished from China for the last thirty to twenty thirty years, so. 220 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 1: Which is bad for your reputation as an academic among 221 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 1: other things. 222 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:31,200 Speaker 3: Well, he survived and the doctor Link survived as well 223 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:33,600 Speaker 3: respected in America, but he has not been able to 224 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 3: go back. 225 00:14:34,040 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 2: And so they hold this over people. 226 00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 3: Not they don't come out and say it to you, 227 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 3: but it's all known and people know that, so it 228 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:42,720 Speaker 3: it affects what they say. And we see it in 229 00:14:42,760 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 3: the analysis so I'm not surprised that somebody inside the 230 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:50,320 Speaker 3: US intelligence community is advising the president from two angles, 231 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:54,200 Speaker 3: the UK NATO angle, which is saying, hey, we've been 232 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:56,720 Speaker 3: too hard on NATO, and we've said too much about 233 00:14:56,960 --> 00:15:00,560 Speaker 3: Greenland and the Panama Canal and what we did Innezuelas, 234 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:03,440 Speaker 3: so we're going to lose Europe. So this would push 235 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:05,520 Speaker 3: them over the edge, so we better not do that. 236 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 3: And then you have the China hands, the engagers in 237 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 3: the IC in the China side that says, don't worry 238 00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 3: about it. 239 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:12,240 Speaker 2: It's not a threat. 240 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:17,480 Speaker 3: There's all these legal hoops and treaties and obligations and 241 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:19,680 Speaker 3: things that there's no way they could get it, so 242 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:21,960 Speaker 3: don't worry about it. And that's the same crew that said, 243 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 3: don't worry about the Chinese navy. It's never going to 244 00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:27,160 Speaker 3: be more than a brown water navy. Today it's the 245 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:29,880 Speaker 3: largest navy in the world. I have the same feeling 246 00:15:29,880 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 3: about in the economic arena. We have people in the 247 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 3: economic arena, the so called China hands, experts in economics 248 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:39,640 Speaker 3: that have told us for thirty forty years, don't worry 249 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:42,280 Speaker 3: about the Chinese currency. It's never going to overtake the 250 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 3: US dollar. 251 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:44,359 Speaker 1: Yeah, possibly happen. 252 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:47,600 Speaker 3: Right, and we're on that path. And so I've seen this. 253 00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:51,320 Speaker 3: I've seen this before. This isn't my first rodeo. So 254 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:53,960 Speaker 3: when I hear somebody tell the President, hey, don't worry 255 00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:56,480 Speaker 3: about it. You don't you're not going to lose Diego Garcia, 256 00:15:56,920 --> 00:16:01,640 Speaker 3: I instinctively say, no, that's let's just not take that 257 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:04,480 Speaker 3: on good faith. Let's hold our cards and keep what 258 00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:08,720 Speaker 3: we have. We're not abusing anybody, we're not hurting anybody. 259 00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:11,560 Speaker 3: The place is pristine. We up and keep it up. 260 00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:15,680 Speaker 3: There's no pollution, it's fine, So there's no reason to 261 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:18,440 Speaker 3: give it up. The people of Chagos, they have their 262 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:21,400 Speaker 3: disputes with the United Kingdom. That's something that they can 263 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,640 Speaker 3: take up separately. The United Kingdoms led in hundreds of 264 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 3: thousands of immigrants already, so if they want a few more, 265 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:30,960 Speaker 3: they can do that. But that's not our business to 266 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 3: get involved with. So I think it's a strategic blunder 267 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:38,520 Speaker 3: if we just pass on this, and I think it'll 268 00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:42,720 Speaker 3: be an albatross around the President's neck and it'll be 269 00:16:42,840 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 3: used against him in the twenty six midterms and in 270 00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:50,240 Speaker 3: the twenty eight election against the GOP which is a 271 00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:53,440 Speaker 3: secondary concern, but it is something if you want to 272 00:16:53,520 --> 00:16:56,920 Speaker 3: maintain a strong national defense and you know that one 273 00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:59,200 Speaker 3: party isn't inclined to do that because they have a 274 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 3: pass track wreck of gutting our national defense, then you 275 00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:05,680 Speaker 3: may not want to allow that party to have such 276 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:07,280 Speaker 3: wide ranging controls. 277 00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 1: Again, yeah, Jim, let me ask you about two particular 278 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:14,200 Speaker 1: aspects of this deal, and we're talking about the Chagos 279 00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:18,399 Speaker 1: Islands writ large, but specifically Diego Garcia, of course, is 280 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 1: at the center of this controversy about the British deal. 281 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:25,480 Speaker 1: One aspect of it is you alluded to this. They're 282 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:30,680 Speaker 1: going to have to spend billions of dollars to lease 283 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:38,560 Speaker 1: this island base from Mauritius. Last time I checked, the 284 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:42,480 Speaker 1: Brits are not exactly a wash with cash. And our 285 00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:45,679 Speaker 1: friend Cleo Pascal, who has done wonderful work along with 286 00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:49,560 Speaker 1: you and Colonel Grant Newsom and others, has pointed out 287 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:53,439 Speaker 1: that if you miss one payment, you're late in making 288 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:57,479 Speaker 1: a payment to Mauritius, the deal is cratered and they 289 00:17:57,520 --> 00:17:59,920 Speaker 1: can use that as a pretext to kick us out. 290 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 1: Is that so, sir? And again, how could anybody possibly 291 00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:07,640 Speaker 1: think this is a sensible arrangement. 292 00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:12,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, Frank, I've heard those arguments made by Cleo, and 293 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:15,760 Speaker 3: I'm not a legal expert, but that sounds about right. 294 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:20,200 Speaker 3: Other folks that we know, like retired Captain Brent Sadler 295 00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:23,560 Speaker 3: from the Heritage Foundation, has talked about, you know, we 296 00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 3: would need an actual new treaty signed between the United 297 00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:32,000 Speaker 3: States and the UK to specifically state that this base 298 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 3: could not be given away. It would have to be 299 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:37,399 Speaker 3: approved and ratified by the Senate in order to make 300 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 3: sure that that could not be twisted on us in 301 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 3: the case that the BRIT's mister payment. And we're already 302 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:47,399 Speaker 3: you know, we're up to our eyeballs with the Brits 303 00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 3: in accus the Aucus Agreement, Australia UK US Defense Agreement, 304 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 3: which is largely focused on building nuclear submarines that will 305 00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:01,359 Speaker 3: be deployed out in the Western Pacific with Australia. So 306 00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:03,480 Speaker 3: we were counting on the Bridge to be able to 307 00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:06,960 Speaker 3: come through with some serious money that we're not sure about. 308 00:19:07,240 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 2: And now they're going to sign up for a. 309 00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:11,720 Speaker 3: Thirty five billion dollar giveaway to Mauritius for a base 310 00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:13,199 Speaker 3: that we already have possession of. 311 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 1: I understanding to tell you that ain't going to happen. 312 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:19,920 Speaker 1: There will be at least an interruption in these payments, 313 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:25,320 Speaker 1: and that would be a pretext again for ensuring not 314 00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:27,760 Speaker 1: only that this base is no longer available to us, 315 00:19:27,840 --> 00:19:31,720 Speaker 1: but Jim, I'm convinced that the ultimate play which kir 316 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:37,560 Speaker 1: Starmer seemingly is all about, is you know, appeasing China, 317 00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:41,679 Speaker 1: and there it will wind up in the hands of 318 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:45,440 Speaker 1: the People's Liberation Army Navy. There's one other aspect of 319 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 1: this gym that I want to cover with you as well. 320 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:48,359 Speaker 1: We're going to have to take that up on the 321 00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:50,159 Speaker 1: other side of the very short break. I hope you'll 322 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:54,119 Speaker 1: stay tuned for more of this incredibly important conversation with 323 00:19:54,240 --> 00:19:58,040 Speaker 1: Captain James Finela, United States Navy, retired. You're right back. 324 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:21,919 Speaker 1: We're back, So is Captain James Finnell, A dear friend, 325 00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:25,399 Speaker 1: a valued member of our committee on the Present Danger China, 326 00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:31,160 Speaker 1: and one of the country's pre eminent experts on matters 327 00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:36,120 Speaker 1: involving the Chinese Communist Party, born of years of studying 328 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:39,840 Speaker 1: them and working to counter them in his role as 329 00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:44,919 Speaker 1: a naval intelligence officer, excuse me, ultimately rising through the 330 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:49,720 Speaker 1: ranks not only to captain but as the chief of 331 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 1: Intelligence and Information Operations for the US Pacific Fleet, he 332 00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:59,240 Speaker 1: was intimately involved in again warning about this decade of concern. 333 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 1: We're in it, folks, and the question is how soon 334 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:08,120 Speaker 1: does China lash out in that kinetic way. And we'll 335 00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:10,359 Speaker 1: get to that in a moment. But Jim, just a 336 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 1: final thought on this whole deal about Diego Garcia. As 337 00:21:14,840 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 1: I understand it, Mauritius is a signatory to one of 338 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:28,040 Speaker 1: these nuclear disarmament ideas that would, if they have sovereignty 339 00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:35,200 Speaker 1: over Diego Garcia, preclude the United States Navy from storing 340 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:42,879 Speaker 1: nuclear weapons on that base and would allow the Chinese 341 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:48,920 Speaker 1: communists the right to inspect to ensure that that isn't 342 00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:54,400 Speaker 1: taking place. Again, all of this is seemingly just unbelievably, 343 00:21:55,840 --> 00:22:02,119 Speaker 1: you know, dangerous as well as strategically benight self, you know, 344 00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 1: imposed errors. Is there something I'm missing about that aspect 345 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:07,320 Speaker 1: of the steal? 346 00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:11,040 Speaker 3: Now, Frank, that's spot on. That's reporting again out of 347 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:17,040 Speaker 3: the UK. There's an African Nuclear Weapon Free Zone treaty 348 00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:20,920 Speaker 3: which Mauritius is a signator to, and it allows for 349 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:24,400 Speaker 3: the inspection of those African territories that are a part 350 00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:28,520 Speaker 3: of that agreement. So, and the Mauritian Deputy Prime Minister 351 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:31,240 Speaker 3: here in this last few months or weeks, has said 352 00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:34,000 Speaker 3: that they've declared that the UK and the US will 353 00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:36,920 Speaker 3: not be allowed to store nuclear weapons at Diego Garcia. 354 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:39,720 Speaker 3: So they've already told us ahead of time that they're 355 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:42,359 Speaker 3: going to take that off the table for us. So 356 00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:47,960 Speaker 3: if we allow this to happen, then it's not through ignorance, 357 00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:50,760 Speaker 3: it's through malice forethought. I just cannot put in any 358 00:22:50,760 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 3: other way. It's absolutely incredible that we would allow that 359 00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 3: to happen. 360 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 1: Well, Jim, I want to commend to our audience that 361 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:03,199 Speaker 1: make a look at this letter. I guess it was 362 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:06,600 Speaker 1: only called a public statement that you and I and 363 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:12,720 Speaker 1: Cleo and Grant Newsham and some seventy six others recently 364 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:19,800 Speaker 1: signed on the grounds that this idea of surrendering, as 365 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:26,560 Speaker 1: we did Bagram Airbase in Afghanistan to Mauritius, let alone 366 00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:30,840 Speaker 1: to the Chinese Communist Party, the island base of Diego 367 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:37,880 Speaker 1: Garcia is so absolutely reckless in terms of the national 368 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:41,679 Speaker 1: security interests of the United States and those that we 369 00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:46,199 Speaker 1: support with our power projection capabilities, that it must not happen. 370 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:52,880 Speaker 1: And I pray that Captain Sadler is on something here 371 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 1: that at a minimum, the Senate would insist that it 372 00:23:56,200 --> 00:24:00,239 Speaker 1: have some say in this decision if in fact it 373 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:04,040 Speaker 1: goes that way. Unfortunately, I'm seeing in a number of places. 374 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:07,920 Speaker 1: It's not just the garden any longer or the Daily Telegraph. 375 00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:10,760 Speaker 1: I guess you said, but it's all over that the 376 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,320 Speaker 1: President is about to make this decision. Perhaps by the 377 00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:16,159 Speaker 1: time this programmaires, he will have done so, I pray not, 378 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:21,760 Speaker 1: and we will be very much talking about it in 379 00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 1: the days to come if he does. But Jim, let 380 00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:28,679 Speaker 1: me pivot to this other issue of the day with China, 381 00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:32,760 Speaker 1: and you have been very actively engaged in the debate 382 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:38,400 Speaker 1: about what exactly is going on with Jijingping and the 383 00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:44,280 Speaker 1: military of China. It's generally described sort of generically as 384 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:52,040 Speaker 1: purges that he's been engineering among senior military officers, and 385 00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:56,239 Speaker 1: you have been deeply skeptical of the idea that this 386 00:24:56,359 --> 00:25:01,680 Speaker 1: is all evidence that he's losing his grip, that he's 387 00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:06,080 Speaker 1: in fact now no longer capable of projecting power himself, 388 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 1: notably against Taiwan. Give us your current read on what's 389 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:12,840 Speaker 1: going on. And they say to the debate about. 390 00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:18,440 Speaker 3: It, sir well Frank. She last or a few weeks ago. 391 00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:23,600 Speaker 3: A couple of weeks ago, removed the last two of 392 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:28,600 Speaker 3: seven members of this Central Military Commission. One of them 393 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:33,760 Speaker 3: was a vice chairman, General Jiang Yoshi, and he was 394 00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:38,160 Speaker 3: seventy five years old. He was the elder most senior 395 00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:44,600 Speaker 3: PLA uniformed officer, greatly respected for his service long service. 396 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:48,720 Speaker 3: He was a princely. His father served along Mao, just 397 00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:52,280 Speaker 3: like Ji Shaping's father served along Mao. So if your 398 00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:54,879 Speaker 3: father was somebody that went through the Long March and 399 00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:59,080 Speaker 3: was part of Mao in establishing the People's Republic of China, 400 00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:03,520 Speaker 3: you get a special dispensation of place in the Communist 401 00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,240 Speaker 3: Party and you are touched, as they say, you've got 402 00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 3: a blessing over you. So he's been in that system 403 00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:13,439 Speaker 3: in the PLA, greatly respected and fought in their last 404 00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:17,760 Speaker 3: combat operation against Vietnam in nineteen seventy nine. A completely 405 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:22,760 Speaker 3: different world, a completely different combat operation, ground warfare, and 406 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,720 Speaker 3: a completely different age with different weapons systems and things 407 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:28,160 Speaker 3: of that nature. But over the course of the last 408 00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:30,560 Speaker 3: thirteen plus years that she's been in power, he has 409 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:36,480 Speaker 3: been selectively removing people that have been identified as being corrupt, 410 00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,520 Speaker 3: and we know that the Chinese system, especially in the military, 411 00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:44,560 Speaker 3: there's corruption there, whether it's over corruption to cash in 412 00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:47,080 Speaker 3: on weapons sales and things of that nature, or it's 413 00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 3: open corruption for your promotion, so various forms of corruption 414 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:54,040 Speaker 3: and gias. Made it a point since he came in 415 00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,800 Speaker 3: that he was going to purify the party and the 416 00:26:56,800 --> 00:26:59,080 Speaker 3: PLA to make sure that there was no more corruption, 417 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:03,560 Speaker 3: and he is been about transforming the PLA from what 418 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:07,760 Speaker 3: it was when he took over command of the Chinese 419 00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:10,680 Speaker 3: Communist Party and as the chairman of the Central Military 420 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 3: Commission in late twenty twelve, and over those thirteen fourteen 421 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:18,680 Speaker 3: years now he has done some dramatic shifts, for instance, 422 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:23,840 Speaker 3: transforming from seven military regions which were stovepipes into five 423 00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:27,639 Speaker 3: theater commands that are joined run by joint staffs that 424 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:31,000 Speaker 3: are answerable to a Central Military Commission that is now 425 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:34,000 Speaker 3: joined and not run just by the Army. And so 426 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:36,359 Speaker 3: we now see some of the theater commands led by 427 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,640 Speaker 3: Navy admirals, some led by Air Force generals. And we've 428 00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:43,199 Speaker 3: seen the raising up of the Army or the Air Force, 429 00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:48,040 Speaker 3: the Navy, and the Space Force, and also the creation 430 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:52,160 Speaker 3: of the Joint Logistics Support Force, the Joint Information Support Force, 431 00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:54,159 Speaker 3: so that they have the things that are needed to 432 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:58,000 Speaker 3: be able to be truly combat effective in any operation 433 00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:01,840 Speaker 3: that they were assigned. He's actually seen the procurement of 434 00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:04,879 Speaker 3: these major weapons systems. I focus on the Navy, so, 435 00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:07,879 Speaker 3: as I said in a previous segment, the Chinese Navy 436 00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:10,639 Speaker 3: twenty five years ago, thirty years ago, they were a 437 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:14,160 Speaker 3: brown water coastal navy. Today they are the largest navy 438 00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:16,919 Speaker 3: in the world, and they are certainly by far the 439 00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:21,880 Speaker 3: most largest navy in the Western Pacific, with the largest 440 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:27,959 Speaker 3: number of surface combatants, submarines, aircraft carriers now and advanced 441 00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:31,520 Speaker 3: supersonic and hypersonic anti ship cruise missiles that can be 442 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:36,440 Speaker 3: launched from aircraft, surface ship, submarines, and shore batteries. They 443 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:41,080 Speaker 3: operate in what they call complex electromagnetic environments that g 444 00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:43,840 Speaker 3: has instituted, and all of that has been going on 445 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,240 Speaker 3: under G and in fact, just today they just announced 446 00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 3: they rolled out another Type five to two Delta ten 447 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,440 Speaker 3: thousand ton destroyer of the lu Yang three class. This 448 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 3: is almost their fortieth one in the last about twelve years. 449 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 3: At the same time, also today there was an announcement 450 00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,560 Speaker 3: that China removes three lawmakers with the defense sector who 451 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:09,480 Speaker 3: had ties to these top generals. So what g is 452 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,320 Speaker 3: doing is he's purging the military from people that are corrupt. 453 00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,880 Speaker 3: Yet we continue to see the PLA grow and operate, 454 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:19,480 Speaker 3: not just in what they have, but in what they're doing. 455 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:26,320 Speaker 3: For instance, their operations around Taiwan. In the last five years, 456 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 3: they have increased air operations around Taiwan by fifteen fold. 457 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:34,680 Speaker 2: Fifteenfold in five years. 458 00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:38,000 Speaker 1: If you look at this crossing that center line between 459 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:39,080 Speaker 1: the center. 460 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:42,840 Speaker 3: Lines of another thing, this is around Taiwan fifteen times 461 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 3: greater than it was five years ago. And the center 462 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:48,080 Speaker 3: line up until twenty twenty, they had only crossed it 463 00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 3: four times. Now they're crossing in a thousand times a year. 464 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 3: So and their training, all. 465 00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 1: Of which is part of what has been described by 466 00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:02,280 Speaker 1: rehearsals the of Taiwan right, and she. 467 00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:05,040 Speaker 3: Has been purghing for this whole time that he's been 468 00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,000 Speaker 3: in power. So the idea that his purges have made 469 00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 3: him weaker and have less control of the PLA, it 470 00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:16,520 Speaker 3: just it doesn't pass observable evidence of what we're seeing 471 00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,320 Speaker 3: from the PLA. And then you add in the diplomatic 472 00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:23,160 Speaker 3: arena where she has just hosted, you know, the Prime 473 00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:25,959 Speaker 3: Minister of Canada, the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, 474 00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:29,880 Speaker 3: the Prime Minister of Finland. He's got the Rman Chancellor 475 00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:33,400 Speaker 3: coming up. He had the Prime minister from Uruguay. He 476 00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:35,800 Speaker 3: is hosting all of these things, and he's putting out, 477 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:41,080 Speaker 3: you know, cognitive warfare propaganda that says that she and 478 00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:42,640 Speaker 3: the Chinese Communist. 479 00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,560 Speaker 2: Party are leading the world. 480 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 3: In terms of diplomacy and engagement and that they are the. 481 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:51,440 Speaker 2: Most rational world leaders. And then you look at their 482 00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:52,560 Speaker 2: economic growth. 483 00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:58,280 Speaker 3: They continue to make inroads with the Belton Road and 484 00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:02,440 Speaker 3: their currency and so across all these fronts they continue 485 00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:07,920 Speaker 3: to show demonstrable pieces of evidence that, g if he's 486 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 3: not in power, then I would hate to think of 487 00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 3: what it is if he is in power, because right 488 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 3: now they are on the rise and we are not 489 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,200 Speaker 3: recognizing it. And so this is my concern is that 490 00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:22,080 Speaker 3: there's a group of people that are in the diaspora 491 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:25,800 Speaker 3: from China, people from other groups that are looking at 492 00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:28,200 Speaker 3: this and say to themselves, oh, this is proof that 493 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:30,320 Speaker 3: he's not in charge. And so we're going to push 494 00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:33,560 Speaker 3: that narrative, and it has been pushed everywhere. In fact, 495 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:37,640 Speaker 3: it's so effective that it's impacting analysis from people that 496 00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 3: should know better. 497 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:42,280 Speaker 2: And that's my great concern. 498 00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:45,719 Speaker 1: Because, as you call him, Jim, along with the fellow travelers, 499 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:50,240 Speaker 1: the captured elites are the enemy within. It seems to me, Jim, 500 00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:51,960 Speaker 1: we have to take another short break. We'll be right 501 00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:56,080 Speaker 1: back with more with Captain James Finela, United States Navy, retired, 502 00:31:56,560 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 1: co author of Embracing Communists China, don't continue doing that. 503 00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:24,440 Speaker 1: We're back, and so I am delighted to say. As 504 00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:28,360 Speaker 1: Captain James Fannel, United States Navy retired, he is these 505 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:32,640 Speaker 1: days a Senior Fellow with the Geneva Center for Security Policy. 506 00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:35,840 Speaker 1: He is the co author, with doctor Bradley Thayer, of 507 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:41,520 Speaker 1: a marvelous book, Embracing Communist China, America's Greatest Strategic Failure. 508 00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:47,960 Speaker 1: He is also an essayist of considerable renown at American Greatness. 509 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,320 Speaker 1: Much of his essays appear there. I urged you to 510 00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:54,680 Speaker 1: check them all out, And Jim, I wanted to just 511 00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:57,720 Speaker 1: ask you, based on something you touched on in several 512 00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:02,960 Speaker 1: of your previous comments about what's going on with our 513 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:08,800 Speaker 1: friends so called in Great Britain and our friends so 514 00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:14,600 Speaker 1: called in Canada and even in Australia despite that August deal. 515 00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:19,600 Speaker 1: In all three of these countries you have hard left, 516 00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:27,760 Speaker 1: if not downright, communists leaderships that seem ever more aligned 517 00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:33,200 Speaker 1: with the Chinese and engaged in ways that are well 518 00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:38,560 Speaker 1: absolutely contrary to our vital interests. Don't know about New Zealand. 519 00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:41,040 Speaker 1: It might apply there too, It certainly has in the past. 520 00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:45,360 Speaker 1: But these are the Anglophone countries as they're called, who 521 00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:48,720 Speaker 1: have made up with us the so called Five Eyes 522 00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:54,200 Speaker 1: intelligence sharing arrangements. You might speak a little bit about 523 00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:58,040 Speaker 1: the importance of the kind of intelligence that we do 524 00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:03,680 Speaker 1: share with those allies and the implications of what's happening here, 525 00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:07,680 Speaker 1: not only with respect de Ji's obvious efforts to divide 526 00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:14,160 Speaker 1: and conquer, but also perhaps obtain access to some of 527 00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:15,919 Speaker 1: the most sensitive secrets of our nation. 528 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, Frank, the Five Eys Sharing Agreement intelligence sharing agreement 529 00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:23,560 Speaker 3: was born out of the Cold War, and as you said, 530 00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:29,880 Speaker 3: it was the five anglosphere countries US included. And because 531 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:32,640 Speaker 3: in the post World War two environment, you know, we 532 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:36,040 Speaker 3: were the first ones to get satellites up in the space, 533 00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:39,799 Speaker 3: we had a great advantage in our capacity to do 534 00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:44,640 Speaker 3: a collection from space called national technical means. But because 535 00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:48,200 Speaker 3: our allies, like the UK was the British Empire, they 536 00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:52,440 Speaker 3: had listening stations and human intelligence assets around the globe, 537 00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:57,320 Speaker 3: just like Australia gives us, you know, access to different 538 00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:01,280 Speaker 3: kinds of telemetry information. And in New Zealand as well 539 00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:03,960 Speaker 3: and Canada in the north. We work with them in 540 00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:07,399 Speaker 3: Norad to protect our northern tier with radar and things 541 00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:09,799 Speaker 3: of that nature. So we had this system arranged where 542 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:13,000 Speaker 3: we basically there was it was unimpeded. 543 00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:15,640 Speaker 2: We shared like we were one nation in a sense. 544 00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:19,520 Speaker 3: Not everything, but i'd say a large, large percentage of 545 00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:23,760 Speaker 3: intelligence is shared amongst those five nations. And never before 546 00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:29,360 Speaker 3: would anybody ever suggest to disrupt that for the reasons 547 00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:33,040 Speaker 3: that you just stated, because there was always this belief 548 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,520 Speaker 3: in the IC that well, you know, this is separate 549 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:38,319 Speaker 3: from politics, this is national security and we don't want 550 00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:42,040 Speaker 3: to disrupt that. But when you start asking yourself what 551 00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:46,400 Speaker 3: are allies doing, who's running those countries and what are 552 00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:49,600 Speaker 3: they doing with the information that they have, I mean 553 00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:54,080 Speaker 3: there's even rumors about how do they use this five 554 00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:58,040 Speaker 3: eyes in our own election system? We can't spy on 555 00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:00,400 Speaker 3: our own people doing elections. But if we ask our 556 00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:03,759 Speaker 3: allies to spy, there's nothing that says they can't do that. 557 00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:07,480 Speaker 1: So I'm not though they did do that in twenty twenty. 558 00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:10,080 Speaker 3: If I'm not mistaken, well, there's a lot of people 559 00:36:10,080 --> 00:36:12,560 Speaker 3: that are suggesting that and there's some evidence to that. 560 00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:16,080 Speaker 2: So my point is we need it's time for us. 561 00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:19,120 Speaker 3: To reassess where we are with the Five Eyes Agreement. 562 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:23,239 Speaker 3: We have a strong, strong ally in Japan right now, 563 00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:25,960 Speaker 3: and we've had a strong ally in Japan, and Japan 564 00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:28,800 Speaker 3: is on the front lines facing the main thing, the 565 00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:32,279 Speaker 3: Chinese Communist Party, and we don't have the same kind 566 00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:36,640 Speaker 3: of alliance or information sharing agreement with them that we 567 00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:41,120 Speaker 3: do with our the UK and others. So why is 568 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:43,560 Speaker 3: that not that way? And what are we doing about it? 569 00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:47,279 Speaker 3: So I would say just depoliticize it. I have the 570 00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:52,600 Speaker 3: Secretary of Defense and the War and the Director of 571 00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:57,839 Speaker 3: National Intelligence Central Intelligence. Let's reconsider all of this. It's 572 00:36:57,840 --> 00:36:59,680 Speaker 3: going to get political and there's going to be intense 573 00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:02,360 Speaker 3: push back in resistance to it, but we have to 574 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:05,880 Speaker 3: be concerned about our national security and if we're allowing 575 00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:10,640 Speaker 3: people to see signals, intelligence data, and and other kinds 576 00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:14,080 Speaker 3: of data, from us, and how are they using that 577 00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:16,440 Speaker 3: and who are they sharing it with. We used to 578 00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:18,480 Speaker 3: have an assurance that it wouldn't go outside of that 579 00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:20,320 Speaker 3: five eyes. 580 00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:23,280 Speaker 2: We don't have that necessarily anymore. 581 00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:26,160 Speaker 3: And now we find out that the UK is going 582 00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:29,400 Speaker 3: to allow U Starmar's going to allow the PRC to 583 00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:32,360 Speaker 3: build what they call a super embassy in the middle 584 00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:38,560 Speaker 3: of London that's going to have an underground cavernous facilities 585 00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:42,800 Speaker 3: with several hundred rooms, over two hundred rooms. That's really 586 00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:48,879 Speaker 3: close to critical underground cables that could be containing our intelligence. 587 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:51,880 Speaker 3: So people need to wake up and make sure we're not, 588 00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,799 Speaker 3: you know, letting them get inside our lifelines. 589 00:37:56,080 --> 00:38:00,319 Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, and again it further reinforces the point we've 590 00:38:00,360 --> 00:38:03,520 Speaker 1: just been discussing. Why on Earth would you rely on 591 00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:07,759 Speaker 1: a government that is behaving this way to assure your 592 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:13,440 Speaker 1: continued strategic power projection capabilities over much of the world. 593 00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:17,960 Speaker 1: It's absolutely insane. Jim. One other thing that I did 594 00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:20,399 Speaker 1: want to ask you about. I saw it, I think 595 00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:26,040 Speaker 1: in one of the incredibly important reports and analyzes and 596 00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: news stories and the like that you circulate through your 597 00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:34,120 Speaker 1: Red Storm Risen Google group. It's a very important public service. 598 00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:39,399 Speaker 1: The Chinese are making noise about I'm not sure it's 599 00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:46,600 Speaker 1: coming from the official Chinese government entities, but they're surrogates 600 00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:52,719 Speaker 1: that there will be war in our hemisphere if President 601 00:38:52,719 --> 00:39:00,520 Speaker 1: Trump persists in trying to get China extract it from it. 602 00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:05,720 Speaker 1: It's deeply penetrated Latin America, as you know, Jim, both 603 00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:10,359 Speaker 1: physically and you know through their business entanglements and their 604 00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:13,920 Speaker 1: Belt and Road initiative and so on, and they don't, 605 00:39:14,080 --> 00:39:17,239 Speaker 1: I think, have any intention of going anywhere, notwithstanding the 606 00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:20,960 Speaker 1: loss of Maduro in Venezuela, one of their key assets 607 00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:24,799 Speaker 1: and allies. What do you make of these threats? Are 608 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:27,799 Speaker 1: they're credible as you see it, that we could find 609 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:30,520 Speaker 1: ourselves in a shooting war with China over our efforts 610 00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:33,920 Speaker 1: to re establish the Monroe Doctrine or some call it 611 00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:38,400 Speaker 1: the don Row Doctrine and our hemispheric security policy. 612 00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:42,279 Speaker 3: Yeah, Frank, I think right now, what I these these 613 00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:46,120 Speaker 3: discussions and these articles that are coming out in PRC press. 614 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:49,040 Speaker 3: I haven't seen anything officially from the PRC government, but 615 00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:51,520 Speaker 3: what's coming out in Global Times and others, is this 616 00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:54,640 Speaker 3: idea that the United States. 617 00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:56,719 Speaker 1: Jim, I'm sorry I have to interrupt you we've got 618 00:39:56,760 --> 00:39:58,600 Speaker 1: to take a short break and get the answer on 619 00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:00,560 Speaker 1: the other side of it. Stay tun folks, be right 620 00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:23,600 Speaker 1: back with Captain Jim Fanel. We're back for this final 621 00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:28,600 Speaker 1: installment of a very very informative and well frankly distressing 622 00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:31,840 Speaker 1: conversation with Captain Jim Fanel, one of our leading experts 623 00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:35,120 Speaker 1: on the threat we face from the Chinese Communist Party. 624 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:36,839 Speaker 1: We're proud to have him as a member of our 625 00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:39,879 Speaker 1: Committee on the Present Danger of China to collaborate well 626 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:43,560 Speaker 1: weekly on this program, among other ways. We're deeply, deeply 627 00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:46,880 Speaker 1: grateful to you, sir, for your continuing service. Let me 628 00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:49,640 Speaker 1: just finish this thought. You were responding to a question 629 00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:53,440 Speaker 1: that I put to you about China in our hemisphere. 630 00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:56,799 Speaker 1: I had to interrupt you the break, but finish your 631 00:40:57,080 --> 00:40:57,840 Speaker 1: answer if you would. 632 00:40:58,840 --> 00:41:03,720 Speaker 3: I think, frank that the PRC is responding through their 633 00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:07,799 Speaker 3: surrogates in their press like Global Times, to kind of 634 00:41:07,840 --> 00:41:10,560 Speaker 3: put out their feelers in response to what President Trump 635 00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:14,400 Speaker 3: has done with this hemispheric defense policy and the fact 636 00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:15,560 Speaker 3: of what he's having. 637 00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:16,359 Speaker 2: Success in it. 638 00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:19,920 Speaker 3: For instance, with what just happened in Panama this last week, 639 00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:24,480 Speaker 3: where the Panamanian Supreme Court said that c K. Hutchinson, 640 00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:29,120 Speaker 3: this Hong Kong shipping group that owns both ends of 641 00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:35,280 Speaker 3: the Panama Canal for control of the essentially the Panama 642 00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:39,440 Speaker 3: Canal in terms of the waterway and the locks and 643 00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:42,560 Speaker 3: all that. They have now been said that they're not allowed. 644 00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:45,239 Speaker 3: That was an illegal deal and they're going to have 645 00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:48,640 Speaker 3: to turn over this to I think initially MERSK as 646 00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:52,239 Speaker 3: a temporary administrator of the canal, which is there from 647 00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:56,720 Speaker 3: the Netherlands. That's quite interesting until there's a new arrangement made. 648 00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:00,439 Speaker 3: And so I think China is now recognizing that they've 649 00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:03,600 Speaker 3: invested by some estimates, I saw an estimate today from 650 00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:09,400 Speaker 3: Liechtenstein based analysis that said that China's invested over the 651 00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:14,160 Speaker 3: last you know, several years, you know, several billions close 652 00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:18,920 Speaker 3: to trillion dollars into South America across all these countries, 653 00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:23,120 Speaker 3: whether it's five G with Huawei and other telcom installations, 654 00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:27,960 Speaker 3: port facilities like improve and other investments in the economies 655 00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:31,120 Speaker 3: of these countries to get iron ore and lithium and 656 00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:35,480 Speaker 3: natural resources. So China's been fully working under the radar 657 00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:40,000 Speaker 3: over the last twenty years, you know, in pushing themselves 658 00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:43,840 Speaker 3: into Latin America and now the President has said, no, 659 00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:46,600 Speaker 3: that's not going to happen anymore, and so they're rightly 660 00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:51,600 Speaker 3: not rightly in their minds, they're rightly upset about this, 661 00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:52,440 Speaker 3: and so they're going to. 662 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:54,359 Speaker 2: Try to push back on it. 663 00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:58,160 Speaker 3: But the idea that they're going to launch combat operations 664 00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:01,400 Speaker 3: in Latin America, I think that's wretch today. They have 665 00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:06,160 Speaker 3: other fish to fry in terms of Taiwan in Central Pacific, Japan, 666 00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:10,600 Speaker 3: and disputed territories with India. But let's just assume that 667 00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:13,400 Speaker 3: the decade of concern goes their way and they're able 668 00:43:13,440 --> 00:43:18,240 Speaker 3: to gobble up Taiwan. You can guarantee between twenty thirty 669 00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:21,760 Speaker 3: and twenty forty nine, China will be much much more. 670 00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:25,640 Speaker 3: The Chinese military will be much much more active in 671 00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:28,319 Speaker 3: Latin America than they are right now, because they'll have 672 00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:32,120 Speaker 3: restored China to what they believe is their rightful territory 673 00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:34,480 Speaker 3: and that it'll be an open field for them to 674 00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:38,320 Speaker 3: operate in Latin America if President Trump and his views 675 00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:38,840 Speaker 3: go away. 676 00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:43,480 Speaker 1: This is absolutely predictable, it seems to me, and the 677 00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:47,200 Speaker 1: Chinese are given themselves the option. With what are inherently 678 00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:53,440 Speaker 1: dual use infrastructure developments in many of the nations of 679 00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,560 Speaker 1: the region. It's something that President Trump has got to 680 00:43:56,600 --> 00:44:01,560 Speaker 1: stick to and implement and his success as well. Jim, 681 00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:04,959 Speaker 1: let me turn to one last item with you. There's 682 00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:07,240 Speaker 1: a lot of talk the moment, as you know, about ICE, 683 00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:12,960 Speaker 1: the Immigration and Customs Enforcement team that is trying to 684 00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:17,359 Speaker 1: remove illegal aliens, the worst of the worst, we're told. 685 00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:21,360 Speaker 1: My view of this is that if you're really serious 686 00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:23,279 Speaker 1: about the worst of the worst, you've got to be 687 00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:27,800 Speaker 1: thinking about and taking action against what, by some estimates, 688 00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:32,960 Speaker 1: are tens of thousands of Chinese soldiers that were brought 689 00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:36,560 Speaker 1: into this country illegally thanks to Joe Biden's open borders, 690 00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:40,040 Speaker 1: and this has made all the more dangerous. This worst 691 00:44:40,120 --> 00:44:43,799 Speaker 1: of the worst, truly worst of the worst, threat is 692 00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:47,640 Speaker 1: by virtue of something that our colleague Sam Fadis has 693 00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:53,560 Speaker 1: called attention to as of you, namely that we've found 694 00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:59,640 Speaker 1: another biological warfare laboratory like the one in Ridley, California, 695 00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:02,720 Speaker 1: down the road from a key naval installation up there 696 00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:07,560 Speaker 1: now in Las Vegas, and there are reports that they're 697 00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:10,479 Speaker 1: suspected that there may be as many as twenty other 698 00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:15,120 Speaker 1: of these labs scattered around the country. Something specifically warned 699 00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:17,520 Speaker 1: about by the Select Committee on China and the United 700 00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:23,400 Speaker 1: States House of Representatives. Jim, I guess my concern is severnfold. 701 00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:28,359 Speaker 1: One is that's a formula for utter disaster if those 702 00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:34,160 Speaker 1: soldiers marry up with the vials of deadly pathogens that 703 00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:38,640 Speaker 1: Sam says could could kill sixty to ninety percent of 704 00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:43,319 Speaker 1: those exposed to them. And on top of it, we 705 00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:49,239 Speaker 1: don't seem to be prioritizing the detection, let alone the 706 00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:54,120 Speaker 1: removal neutralization of these soldiers. Give us quickly two minutes 707 00:45:54,120 --> 00:45:55,480 Speaker 1: of your thoughts. 708 00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:58,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, Frank, when we exposed or we didn't expose, but 709 00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:01,640 Speaker 3: when we talked about the reply in the San Joaquin 710 00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:05,319 Speaker 3: Valley near Fresno biolab that was found two years ago, 711 00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:07,440 Speaker 3: I mean it was a big deal for me because 712 00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:10,440 Speaker 3: I had served at Naval Air Station Lamour, which is 713 00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:13,680 Speaker 3: the master jet base of the US Pacific Fleet's West 714 00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:18,520 Speaker 3: Coast faighteen onnets and their carrier air wing staffs, and 715 00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:21,600 Speaker 3: I'd lived there, worked there, and that place is less 716 00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:24,279 Speaker 3: than thirty miles away that they found this. Now I 717 00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:28,440 Speaker 3: find out we find out that there's another biolab in 718 00:46:28,520 --> 00:46:32,280 Speaker 3: Las Vegas near Nellis Air Force Base within twenty miles 719 00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:33,560 Speaker 3: of Nellis Air Force Base. 720 00:46:34,080 --> 00:46:36,000 Speaker 2: If there's another twenty around. 721 00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:39,280 Speaker 3: Or more, where are they Unless somebody needs to start 722 00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:42,839 Speaker 3: doing their intelligence work and start mapping these locations out 723 00:46:42,920 --> 00:46:45,880 Speaker 3: to see if they're next to our military installations. And 724 00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:48,880 Speaker 3: if we find another one it's even close in the 725 00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:52,279 Speaker 3: twenty mile radius of a military installation, then we have 726 00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:55,879 Speaker 3: a problem. We have a problem, but it will be undeniable. 727 00:46:55,920 --> 00:46:58,040 Speaker 3: This should be the top story in the country today. 728 00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:00,880 Speaker 3: But my fear is is that what's going to happen 729 00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:03,800 Speaker 3: is is that there are going to be whisperers, China 730 00:47:03,800 --> 00:47:06,160 Speaker 3: whisperers that are going to come to President Trump in 731 00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:09,080 Speaker 3: the dark of the night or in tweets or whatever, 732 00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:11,319 Speaker 3: and they're going to tell them, don't worry about this, 733 00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:15,279 Speaker 3: mister president. This is something that's been created to disrupt 734 00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:18,360 Speaker 3: your economic deal that you're going to try to cement 735 00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:21,239 Speaker 3: with g when you go in April to Beijing. And 736 00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:23,279 Speaker 3: so he's going to be told that this is all 737 00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:26,799 Speaker 3: something about nothing, and it's just a bunch of you know, 738 00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:29,480 Speaker 3: far right people trying to stir up things to get 739 00:47:29,520 --> 00:47:32,080 Speaker 3: back at China because they're the China super hawks and 740 00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:33,440 Speaker 3: they don't like China. 741 00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:34,440 Speaker 2: And if I could tell. 742 00:47:34,320 --> 00:47:38,480 Speaker 3: The President anything right now, it say, sir, you cannot 743 00:47:38,719 --> 00:47:43,120 Speaker 3: doubt what China says they want to do read unrestricted warfare, 744 00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:45,759 Speaker 3: understand their intense hatred of US. 745 00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:49,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, and not doubt, not least their plan, according to 746 00:47:49,760 --> 00:47:54,239 Speaker 1: dunk challping to use bioweapons to depopulate the United States 747 00:47:54,320 --> 00:47:57,200 Speaker 1: so it could be colonized by China. Jim fail. We 748 00:47:57,280 --> 00:47:59,640 Speaker 1: have to leave it at that. Thank you so much, Captain, 749 00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:03,439 Speaker 1: you are national treasure. Come back to us again soon, 750 00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:04,680 Speaker 1: if you would, I hope the rest of you'll do 751 00:48:04,680 --> 00:48:07,360 Speaker 1: the same next time. Until then, go forth and multiply 752 00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:17,440 Speaker 1: m