1 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:21,919 Speaker 1: Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan four years roughly, that's 2 00:00:22,239 --> 00:00:24,279 Speaker 1: forty eight months, just so that we can kind of 3 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:27,880 Speaker 1: frame that out just for a quick second. Four years 4 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:32,760 Speaker 1: I've been waiting. I've been waiting to find out what 5 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:38,800 Speaker 1: happened to Suzanne Morphew. Well, the day has arrived. I 6 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:42,400 Speaker 1: can't say I'm completely satisfied, but I felt like it 7 00:00:42,479 --> 00:00:45,239 Speaker 1: was time to sit down that Dave and I have 8 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:50,000 Speaker 1: a conversation for a special episode that's going to deal 9 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 1: with this complex scientific evidence that we have laid out 10 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 1: before us. Right now, I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this 11 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:05,840 Speaker 1: is Body Bags. Dave. Let me let me reach something 12 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:09,760 Speaker 1: real quick before we dig into this, and I'm going 13 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 1: to give you five names. I'm going to give you 14 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:16,640 Speaker 1: five names, and these are names that we need to 15 00:01:16,720 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 1: keep at the forefront of our mind when talking about 16 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:24,960 Speaker 1: Susanne Morphew. They are as follows, doctor Emily Russell Kinsley, 17 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:35,800 Speaker 1: doctor Leon Kelly, doctor Allison Cooper, doctor Meghan Clientsner, and 18 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:45,960 Speaker 1: doctor Jared Murdoch. Dave, five five physicians. Five physicians signed 19 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:53,120 Speaker 1: off on what amounts to a four page report that 20 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:56,840 Speaker 1: we're looking at right now. Uh and I'm sure that 21 00:01:56,880 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: everybody else around the country will eventually have this in 22 00:01:59,840 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: their hands. And as I always tell everybody to talk 23 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:06,320 Speaker 1: to me, don't believe what I'm saying, don't look it up. 24 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 1: Look it up for yourself, man, go check it out. 25 00:02:08,880 --> 00:02:12,400 Speaker 2: All right, Before we go too much further, why were 26 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:15,639 Speaker 2: there so many doctors involved in Today we're dealing with 27 00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:19,760 Speaker 2: the death of Susanne Morphew, who went missing on Mother's 28 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:23,440 Speaker 2: Day four years ago? Can you believe it's been We're 29 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:25,920 Speaker 2: We're that close, Joe. We're a couple of weeks away 30 00:02:25,919 --> 00:02:26,600 Speaker 2: from Mother's Day. 31 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:31,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we are that close. We certainly are. And uh. 32 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 2: And I started covering this as a missing person's case 33 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 2: when she That's why this is so important to me. 34 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:39,520 Speaker 1: I remember the day. Yeah, I remember sitting there and talking. 35 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:43,600 Speaker 1: It was immediately after Mother's Day. Ye. Nancy had me 36 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 1: on Yes and on her show, and I was I 37 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: was chatting about this, and I remember distinctly thinking about 38 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:54,359 Speaker 1: and this is when they found the bicycle. Now I 39 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:56,239 Speaker 1: think they had the helmet, if I'm not mistaken. 40 00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:58,320 Speaker 2: Found that they found the bike the day of the 41 00:02:58,440 --> 00:02:59,880 Speaker 2: day she went missing, and they found the bike that No, 42 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 2: it was the helmet they found a couple of days 43 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:03,799 Speaker 2: later and a mile away. 44 00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 1: Right and it was dispersed in I remember talking to 45 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:11,160 Speaker 1: on air to Nancy about this case at that time, 46 00:03:11,240 --> 00:03:15,160 Speaker 1: you said missing persons, And you know that what I 47 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 1: was thinking is, first off, hid in the heck this 48 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 1: bicycle get so far off the road? And but from 49 00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:22,760 Speaker 1: a forensic standpoint, was there any kind of trace evidence 50 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:26,800 Speaker 1: that you could that you could recover off of this thing? Uh, 51 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 1: you know, points of contact where people are putting their hands, 52 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:34,480 Speaker 1: people's people's hands other than Susanne Morpheus, now where you 53 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:37,680 Speaker 1: could find DNA evidence of some type. Was there any 54 00:03:37,720 --> 00:03:40,320 Speaker 1: blood evidence on there? Because you know, when I when 55 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 1: I hear bicycle, I'm thinking bicycle versus motor vehicle and 56 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:50,280 Speaker 1: strike and guess who always loses in that It's gonna 57 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 1: be the person on the bicycle. But there was there 58 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,240 Speaker 1: was no body. There was no body, And this thing 59 00:03:56,360 --> 00:04:00,040 Speaker 1: is like concealed, I mean, it's off it's it's not 60 00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: like it's just like down in the ditch. You know, 61 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 1: this thing is like it's off the road. 62 00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:07,440 Speaker 2: The bike, and so yeah, yeah, it was down a ditch. 63 00:04:07,520 --> 00:04:09,680 Speaker 2: Actually it was on the side of a cliff. I'm 64 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:13,560 Speaker 2: not kidding. When now backing up to the day we 65 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 2: did this, it was the weekend we had gone through 66 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:19,600 Speaker 2: Mother's Day, where we have a missing person. We've got 67 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 2: very suspicious activity and a bike that is found that night. 68 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 2: And the bike it was found halfway down a cliff. Now, 69 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 2: if you've ever done any mountain biking, you know there 70 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:33,200 Speaker 2: are some dangerous areas, but this was just off of 71 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:35,840 Speaker 2: a road and it had gone down. But the bike 72 00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:40,320 Speaker 2: showed no damage. The bike shows no damage whatsoever. It 73 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 2: had been basically it rolled down the hill and stopped, 74 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:45,839 Speaker 2: but the helmet's not there. They don't find the helmet 75 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 2: right away. They're looking for things. But the thing is 76 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:50,400 Speaker 2: that Suzanne Morphew. And by the way, she was not 77 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:55,159 Speaker 2: a longtime mountain bike enthusiast. It was a fairly new thing. 78 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:59,400 Speaker 2: She was a cancer patient and that actually came into 79 00:04:59,400 --> 00:05:02,320 Speaker 2: play in the auto because yeah, I did when they 80 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 2: found a piece of medical hardware. It was a port 81 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:09,800 Speaker 2: that they used to administer medication. But it was reported 82 00:05:09,839 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 2: that you have a woman missing fifty ish and he 83 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,280 Speaker 2: was just forty nine at the time, and cancer patient, 84 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:21,400 Speaker 2: and they're setting it up, say, maybe she just decided 85 00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:24,279 Speaker 2: to take herself out and do away with herself. That 86 00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:26,240 Speaker 2: was how it was kind of being put out there 87 00:05:26,279 --> 00:05:28,400 Speaker 2: to some. But when her bike was found that night, 88 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 2: it was found halfway down a cliff, her helmets nowhere 89 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:32,760 Speaker 2: to be found. The other thing she normally took when 90 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:37,520 Speaker 2: she was biking, left in her car. Immediately people start 91 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 2: looking at the inner circle, you know, Yeah, things look suspicious. 92 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,040 Speaker 2: So we started looking at Barry, her husband, Ary more 93 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:45,919 Speaker 2: few and. 94 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:49,520 Speaker 1: We we've always you know, we've we've talked about that extensively, 95 00:05:49,560 --> 00:05:54,000 Speaker 1: about the circle of intimates, you know, those people that 96 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:57,520 Speaker 1: that would be in her orbit, because David, I got 97 00:05:57,560 --> 00:05:59,520 Speaker 1: to tell you, you know, you've heard that old term. 98 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:06,520 Speaker 1: They got a pipe in Sunshine beautiful area. However, it's 99 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:09,880 Speaker 1: not like you've got random acts of violence that are 100 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:12,760 Speaker 1: going on all the time. And I know where her 101 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 1: body was found that there was uh and you know, 102 00:06:16,839 --> 00:06:20,080 Speaker 1: there there were other cases of people that had been 103 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:24,160 Speaker 1: found apparently adjacent to that location, and they used all 104 00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:29,120 Speaker 1: kinds of very theatrical terms killing field, I heard somebody say. 105 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:33,240 Speaker 1: And there were uh, a bone yard, there were all 106 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:36,080 Speaker 1: kinds of things. But come on, let's let's get real, 107 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 1: all right, this is not. You're not going to have 108 00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:43,360 Speaker 1: somebody that's going to go out and maliciously kill this 109 00:06:43,400 --> 00:06:46,800 Speaker 1: woman stranger on stranger kind of event, you know, And 110 00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:50,039 Speaker 1: and so automatically as an investigator, you're gonna look, we 111 00:06:50,080 --> 00:06:50,520 Speaker 1: want to let. 112 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:52,360 Speaker 2: Me ask you this show. You find the bike, the 113 00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 2: bike has it, the bike is down the hill. There 114 00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:57,279 Speaker 2: is no body. I've had a bike greg before. And 115 00:06:57,320 --> 00:06:59,680 Speaker 2: by the way, my body was near the bike. It 116 00:06:59,720 --> 00:07:02,400 Speaker 2: wasn't close, but it was nearby, you know, because I 117 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 2: wasn't dead. I was alive, and I walked up the hill. 118 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 2: Now my bike stayed at the bottom of the hill, 119 00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 2: but I was found. Okay, she wasn't found. They found 120 00:07:10,480 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 2: her helmet days later and a mile away. It immediately says, 121 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 2: did somebody run her off the road and then take 122 00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 2: her body and throw the bike down the cliff? Did 123 00:07:21,760 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 2: they run her off the road and she crashed down 124 00:07:23,320 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 2: there and they went down there and got her body 125 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 2: up and took her off. I mean, it makes no 126 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 2: sense for her bike to be found halfway down a cliff. 127 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:32,400 Speaker 2: But there's no sign of any grass being trampled, there's 128 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:34,560 Speaker 2: no sign of anybody walking back up the hill, any 129 00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 2: sign of people walking down. There's nothing in the dirt 130 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 2: indicative of a car running her off the road or 131 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:43,680 Speaker 2: by the way, not even trail in the dirt. By 132 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:46,480 Speaker 2: the way, this is that night, This is seven point 133 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 2: thirty that night. They think she went biking at eight 134 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 2: o'clock that morning. 135 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a reason. There's a reason they're called hit 136 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:58,880 Speaker 1: and run because when people hit a subject, whether they're 137 00:07:58,880 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 1: a pedestrian or a boss or even another motor vehicle, 138 00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 1: they leave. They don't stay around to collect a body 139 00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:10,920 Speaker 1: and haul it off somewhere, which is, you know, just 140 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:13,400 Speaker 1: so super bizarre. In this case, I think that that's 141 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:15,760 Speaker 1: one of the things that had us all kind of befuddled. 142 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 2: But there was one thing that was said that night. 143 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 2: Her husband he had a good IDEA mountain lion. Mountain lion. Yeah, 144 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:26,400 Speaker 2: he said it that night when the when he meets 145 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:28,480 Speaker 2: with the cops at seven thirty, eight o'clock, nine o'clock, 146 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 2: whatever time it was that night they found the bike 147 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:32,760 Speaker 2: at seven thirty. He was on his way back from 148 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 2: wherever he claimed to be. Bottom line, he suggested, well, 149 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 2: a mountain lion. How about I knew that. 150 00:08:38,760 --> 00:08:41,680 Speaker 1: I knew that that was BS the moment I heard it, 151 00:08:41,720 --> 00:08:44,440 Speaker 1: and not necessarily bs because it's coming from him. I 152 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:48,640 Speaker 1: thought that it was an absurd suggestion. You know, let's 153 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:50,720 Speaker 1: roll with bear as well. We're at it right. You know. 154 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,080 Speaker 2: I had to study mountain lions, Joe. You know what 155 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:57,600 Speaker 2: I found. What's that mountain lions are severely territorial. They 156 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:01,559 Speaker 2: also don't run impacts and landstakes out an area and that. 157 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:03,680 Speaker 1: Is his or hers. They are solitary. 158 00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:04,360 Speaker 2: And that's it. 159 00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 1: The reason I knew this going back many years is 160 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:11,359 Speaker 1: that I actually was in the presence of a presentation 161 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:14,839 Speaker 1: probably the most gas and by my standard, one of 162 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:17,000 Speaker 1: the most gasoly things I've ever seen. I was actually 163 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:19,520 Speaker 1: at the American Academy Forensic Science meeting and there was 164 00:09:19,559 --> 00:09:24,199 Speaker 1: an odentologist from you guessed it, of all places, Colorado, Wow, 165 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 1: and he presented He presented a case that he had 166 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 1: worked of a jogger. And I'm going to get this wrong, probably, 167 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:35,320 Speaker 1: but I think it was in Boulder where this young 168 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:37,720 Speaker 1: lady had taken off down a trail and guess what 169 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:42,120 Speaker 1: she ran under? She ran under an outcropping of rock 170 00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:45,880 Speaker 1: that and this trail is set up for people to 171 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 1: walk and run on. And there were two guys in 172 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:51,800 Speaker 1: the parking lot that left after her. It was like 173 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:55,560 Speaker 1: a lunchtime job kind of thing. They had out and 174 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 1: when they get probably two to three minutes into their run, 175 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 1: Dave Thereby that out and the Mountain law and the 176 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 1: Mountain Lion has its teeth sunk into her back in 177 00:10:05,800 --> 00:10:07,719 Speaker 1: the middle of the trail, and they scared the thing 178 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:11,960 Speaker 1: off and left her. The injuries were so ghastly. And 179 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:13,960 Speaker 1: this is the other thing that I took away from 180 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:16,840 Speaker 1: that based upon what I was seeing. You know what, 181 00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:19,959 Speaker 1: you would see a lot of blood, there would be 182 00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:24,440 Speaker 1: a blood trail of you would see perhaps evidence of 183 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:27,680 Speaker 1: drag marks. And I'm not talking about just like where 184 00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 1: you're carrying dead weight. I'm talking about if an individual 185 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:35,040 Speaker 1: had been attacked in the middle of the road and 186 00:10:35,200 --> 00:10:37,840 Speaker 1: drug off and they were not dead, they'd be fighting. 187 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 1: It's just a natural response. And you would see brush 188 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 1: torn down, all kinds of things, and you just that 189 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:49,440 Speaker 1: wasn't coming up. And so it wasn't an animal wild 190 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 1: animal attack. It just it just didn't register her. But 191 00:10:52,840 --> 00:10:56,680 Speaker 1: I do know this. We have finally got an actual 192 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:01,960 Speaker 1: autopsy report. Listen, it's not us, but it's more than 193 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: we had yesterday. We knew that it was coming, but 194 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 1: I gotta tell you for our purposes here on body backs, 195 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:12,960 Speaker 1: it reveals quite a bit. I'm really interested to get 196 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:33,679 Speaker 1: into this. David couldn't believe it a couple months back. Well, 197 00:11:33,679 --> 00:11:35,960 Speaker 1: I guess we were in twenty twenty three more than 198 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:39,960 Speaker 1: a couple of months when the news came out that 199 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:43,720 Speaker 1: they had discovered at that time what they believed to 200 00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:49,679 Speaker 1: be Susanne Morphew's remains, and then they confirmed that they 201 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:53,600 Speaker 1: were in fact her remains. Because I gotta tell you, 202 00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:59,480 Speaker 1: I got to tell you, Boba. I was thinking they're 203 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:02,040 Speaker 1: never gonna find her. And again I go back to 204 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:06,400 Speaker 1: this idea of isolation, because this place is so very isolated, 205 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:10,080 Speaker 1: and there's any number of locations that she could have 206 00:12:10,240 --> 00:12:14,320 Speaker 1: been hidden because this is not densely populated. I don't 207 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 1: know if people understand how vast this area is out there, 208 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:23,080 Speaker 1: and the fact that that these remains were found is 209 00:12:23,320 --> 00:12:26,160 Speaker 1: just dumb luck as far as I'm concerned, and I 210 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 1: thought about it at that time. I talked to other 211 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 1: people about it and they kind of we came to 212 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:33,199 Speaker 1: that consensus. And the fact that they have them, Wow, 213 00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 1: I didn't see that coming up at whoever did this, 214 00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 1: because I gotta tell you, I'll go ahead. I'm not 215 00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:40,760 Speaker 1: I'm not bearing the lead here, but I'll go ahead 216 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,959 Speaker 1: and tell you right now what we're looking at. They've 217 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:48,640 Speaker 1: they've ruled her death as a homicide, but there's a 218 00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 1: few qualifiers here there, and I'm going to have to 219 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 1: get into. 220 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:54,800 Speaker 2: Really curious how you're going to do this, Joe, because look, look, 221 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:57,400 Speaker 2: just to give you an idea, and if the refresher 222 00:12:57,480 --> 00:13:01,559 Speaker 2: core is on the more the appearance of Suzanne Morphew 223 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:06,040 Speaker 2: right before she went missing Mother's Day of twenty twenty. 224 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:10,840 Speaker 2: On May the sixth, she sent a text message to 225 00:13:10,880 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 2: her husband of twenty five years, Barry Morphew. By the way, 226 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 2: they knew each other in high school. He was a 227 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:16,840 Speaker 2: high school baseball player, got drafted out of high school 228 00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 2: by the Toronto Blue Jays. She was a school teacher, 229 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:23,840 Speaker 2: and they got married had two girls. Once she had 230 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:25,960 Speaker 2: the girls, she decided to take time off from her 231 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:30,480 Speaker 2: teaching duties to raise her girls, and Barry started a 232 00:13:30,600 --> 00:13:34,000 Speaker 2: landscape company. They ended up moving to Colorado. As one 233 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 2: of the daughter's Mallory, I believe went to college there, 234 00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 2: and so here we are. It's May six, twenty twenty. 235 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 2: They've been out in Colorado a couple of years. Some 236 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:46,120 Speaker 2: people said it was to save their marriage. The marriage 237 00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:48,959 Speaker 2: was not doing well, and sure enough May six, three 238 00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:52,720 Speaker 2: days before she goes missing. Four days rather, she sends 239 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:55,600 Speaker 2: a message to him, I'm done. I could care less 240 00:13:55,640 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 2: what you're up to and have been for years. We 241 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:03,280 Speaker 2: just need to figure this out. Civilly. Suzann Morphy wrote 242 00:14:03,280 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 2: that to her husband four days before she went missing. Now, 243 00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:08,520 Speaker 2: the reason this is important is because during their investigation 244 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:12,319 Speaker 2: police found this. But what they found is that Barry 245 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 2: Morphew had gone through great effort to delete that text 246 00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:19,320 Speaker 2: message from her phone and from his. 247 00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 1: But the thing is, why would you do that? Yeah? 248 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 2: May ninth, the morning. According to court documents, fifty nine 249 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 2: communications were exchanged between Suzanne Morphew and a man she 250 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 2: was dating. She had been seeing somebody behind her husband's 251 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:38,920 Speaker 2: back for a couple of years. They'd gotten together in 252 00:14:38,920 --> 00:14:42,080 Speaker 2: New Orleans and Florida. He was from Michigan, somebody she 253 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:44,360 Speaker 2: had known for many, many years, A long time. She 254 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:48,240 Speaker 2: just had her fill of Barry Morphew. Verry Morephew, You're 255 00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:51,280 Speaker 2: going to find out was charged with murder, not today, 256 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:55,400 Speaker 2: not yesterday. All the evidence put together led police to 257 00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:59,480 Speaker 2: Barry Morphew, and they arrested Barry Morphew and charged him. However, 258 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 2: the color of Bureau Investigation, the guy one of the 259 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 2: lead detectives on the case at the time they charged 260 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:09,600 Speaker 2: and arrested Barry Morphew, he was against it. Don't do it. 261 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 2: It's the wrong move. We do not have enough evidence 262 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:14,880 Speaker 2: to do this. And sure enough, as they started going 263 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:17,320 Speaker 2: through the motions in court, they got it moved out 264 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:20,000 Speaker 2: of Chafe County into a different county, you know, because 265 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 2: of the attention and the lack of people to choose 266 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:26,600 Speaker 2: from in chp County. And once they got into a 267 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:29,200 Speaker 2: new county, they're getting ready to start arguments, were getting 268 00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 2: ready to follow this case, and all of a sudden, 269 00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:36,280 Speaker 2: the defense pleads with the judge to drop this, get 270 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:38,920 Speaker 2: this out of kick it out. Judge looks over everything, 271 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:42,400 Speaker 2: and sure enough, the judge dismissed it. We're talking a 272 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 2: couple of weeks away from getting in this trial underway. 273 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:49,480 Speaker 2: The judge dismissed the case against Barry Morphew. In April 274 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 2: of twenty twenty two, the eleventh Judicial District Attorney filed 275 00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:58,240 Speaker 2: the motion to dismiss without prejudice, which means file can 276 00:15:58,280 --> 00:15:59,640 Speaker 2: be charged. It can be charged again. 277 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:02,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I knew that that was. They have that 278 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:05,840 Speaker 1: in their back pocket. So this is as far as 279 00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 1: I'm concerned. This situation is far from over, but it 280 00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 1: I think that one of the things that we have 281 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,800 Speaker 1: to consider is now that this assessment has been done. 282 00:16:17,560 --> 00:16:20,640 Speaker 1: You know, we've got we've got little beams of light 283 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:23,280 Speaker 1: that are now beginning to kind of spread out and 284 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:26,160 Speaker 1: show forth here about what do they have to work with. 285 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:30,040 Speaker 2: Well, the restaurant when they got him, Yeah, is your 286 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:34,520 Speaker 2: light ray? I read it just before we tape this today. 287 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:35,760 Speaker 1: Please whole force. 288 00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:40,520 Speaker 2: Man. The things they found inside that house, the evidence 289 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:44,480 Speaker 2: they found that made them want to charge very more 290 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:49,400 Speaker 2: for you after the autopsy report today made incredible sense. 291 00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 2: Justin Scott Morgan, incredible sense. They found, Yeah, the gun 292 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:59,800 Speaker 2: you used of fired darts that tranquilize animals. 293 00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:01,640 Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, found one of those. 294 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:04,679 Speaker 2: They found a cap that goes on the end of 295 00:17:04,720 --> 00:17:08,359 Speaker 2: that needle in the dryer in the laundry. Why would 296 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:11,400 Speaker 2: you have that unless you recently shot one. They found 297 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:14,360 Speaker 2: an unspent twenty two caliber shell or a bullet rather 298 00:17:15,080 --> 00:17:16,919 Speaker 2: found a few other things around the house too, that 299 00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:19,480 Speaker 2: now that we actually have something to talk about with 300 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,639 Speaker 2: regard to an autoposy, it makes a lot of sense. 301 00:17:23,080 --> 00:17:26,240 Speaker 2: So I got to ask you, Joe. They only found bones, right, 302 00:17:26,680 --> 00:17:29,560 Speaker 2: that's all we found, because she had been from May 303 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:32,480 Speaker 2: of twenty twenty until September when they have twenty twenty three. 304 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:34,920 Speaker 2: Last September, they found her bones, right. 305 00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, they did, and at the time, at the time, 306 00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:41,199 Speaker 1: we didn't know what the status of it was, all right, 307 00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:46,000 Speaker 1: cause I there were commentators that came out and said that, oh, yeah, well, 308 00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:48,800 Speaker 1: there's a potential that we're still going to have what's 309 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:52,760 Speaker 1: referred to as soft tissue, and what that means is 310 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:57,800 Speaker 1: that you'll still have skin, you'll have muscle, you'll have fat, 311 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:02,480 Speaker 1: and all of the components, even if they're in an 312 00:18:02,520 --> 00:18:06,200 Speaker 1: advanced state of decomposition that was being put forth. I've 313 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:09,320 Speaker 1: never held that opinion. I always felt as though that 314 00:18:09,400 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 1: her remains would essentially have been skeletonized, and my thought was, 315 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:21,960 Speaker 1: are they going to be scattered to the point where 316 00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:25,119 Speaker 1: you're not going to have a complete skeleton. And I 317 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 1: cannot say that they do in fact have a complete skeleton, 318 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:35,080 Speaker 1: but they've got they've got enough. And it's painstaking work 319 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:38,280 Speaker 1: because when you're in kind of ah see, how can 320 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 1: I put this? When you're when you're out in an 321 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:44,600 Speaker 1: area like this and you have a body that is 322 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:50,040 Speaker 1: in what they have framed Dave as a shallow grave. 323 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:53,679 Speaker 1: Her body is not just laid on top of the earth. 324 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 1: She's in a shallow grave. Now, we don't have any 325 00:18:57,600 --> 00:19:01,880 Speaker 1: specifics in the autopsy report as far as greatest depth 326 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:05,520 Speaker 1: of this defect in the ground, which I'd be very 327 00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 1: keen on knowing. I want to know because you know, 328 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:12,919 Speaker 1: the deeper deeper the hole is in the ground. Uh, 329 00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:16,439 Speaker 1: that goes to a time, doesn't it, because it takes 330 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:20,080 Speaker 1: more time. And what I did here and you might 331 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:23,520 Speaker 1: find this find this quite interesting day. The soil out 332 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:27,760 Speaker 1: there is not like going into your grandma's tomate a 333 00:19:27,800 --> 00:19:32,280 Speaker 1: garden and turn it over, you know, topsoil and loam 334 00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:36,440 Speaker 1: and manure and all that. And no, this is this 335 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:40,280 Speaker 1: is hard, hard work that you're talking about. It would 336 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:44,360 Speaker 1: require exertion. As a matter of fact, I'd heard one 337 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:47,280 Speaker 1: fellow in an interview say that if you're going to 338 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 1: show up to dig a hole out here, you need 339 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:52,240 Speaker 1: a pick ax with and god, God, I was thinking 340 00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:55,119 Speaker 1: of pick axe. Yeah, and then then you need a 341 00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 1: really sharp shovel in order to you know, complete the 342 00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:01,639 Speaker 1: deal because it's so firm, and so you would in 343 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 1: order to generate a hole. First off, you got to 344 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:08,200 Speaker 1: be vested. You got to be vested. You've got to 345 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:13,879 Speaker 1: be somebody that wants to bury this woman's remains well, 346 00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:16,800 Speaker 1: and then you think about how are you going to 347 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:19,119 Speaker 1: know about this area? How are they gonna have specific 348 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 1: knowledge of this particular location where she is found? And 349 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:26,520 Speaker 1: then you have to show up with right tools because 350 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:30,399 Speaker 1: whoever went out there would know that. Okay, I'm not 351 00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:32,800 Speaker 1: just you know, I'm not gonna you know, have the 352 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 1: have the shovel here that you know, I picked up 353 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:39,240 Speaker 1: this local box store, you know I and is hanging 354 00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:40,840 Speaker 1: on the rack with all the other ones. I'm gonna 355 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:44,399 Speaker 1: need something hefty, something robust. I'm gonna need other tools 356 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:49,800 Speaker 1: to break loose this soil. And so that again requires 357 00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:52,520 Speaker 1: a lot of effort. Can you imagine being out there 358 00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:58,200 Speaker 1: and you're digging a hole, and could you be seen 359 00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:00,960 Speaker 1: by the main road with some to see a truck 360 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:04,440 Speaker 1: or a car that's out there parked on the side 361 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:07,960 Speaker 1: of the road, or was her body removed from the 362 00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 1: road and then taken many many yards away from the 363 00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:16,280 Speaker 1: road and you got a loan figure out there digging 364 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:18,919 Speaker 1: away working hard. Were you going to do that in 365 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 1: the daylight? Well, it's kind of a it's not necessarily 366 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:25,680 Speaker 1: a robust population around there. Maybe you could get away 367 00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 1: with it. I have no idea, but I think that 368 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,479 Speaker 1: someone would have had to have accomplished this, probably at 369 00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:36,360 Speaker 1: nighttime day in order to facilitate this. But who could 370 00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 1: have put their hand to the plow as it were, 371 00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 1: relative to this to facilitate it. So the fact that 372 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,840 Speaker 1: they recovered her in this hole and the remains appeared 373 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:51,880 Speaker 1: to be concentrated around that specific defect, which by the way, 374 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:57,679 Speaker 1: they did in fact identify, they wound up having to 375 00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:01,359 Speaker 1: recover the remains out there. And another interesting part to 376 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,959 Speaker 1: this is that they recovered what they believe or animal 377 00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:06,880 Speaker 1: bones that are out there as well. So you've got 378 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:11,159 Speaker 1: this kind of commingling of remains or skeletal remains that 379 00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:17,480 Speaker 1: are going on. And so that requires not necessarily simply 380 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: a you know, I talked about the five physicians early 381 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:22,159 Speaker 1: on that signed off. You're gonna have to call in 382 00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:25,120 Speaker 1: a forensic anthropologists. As a matter of fact, I want 383 00:22:25,119 --> 00:22:28,280 Speaker 1: a forensic anthropologists out there at the site with the agents. 384 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:32,240 Speaker 1: I want them conducting the excavation because they're trained to 385 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:34,600 Speaker 1: do this. And they're also trained and this is kind 386 00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:37,080 Speaker 1: of an amazing feat to me out of One of 387 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:41,280 Speaker 1: my dear friends is a PhD forensic anthropologists, and that 388 00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:44,160 Speaker 1: boy could walk down the road and he never looked up. 389 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 1: He never looked to the left of the right, you 390 00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:48,879 Speaker 1: know where. He always looked at the ground and he 391 00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 1: could find things just laying on the ground. We were 392 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:55,680 Speaker 1: walking across a parking lot one day. He found a 393 00:22:55,720 --> 00:23:00,679 Speaker 1: match box that I didn't see it was, and it 394 00:23:00,800 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 1: had clay on it. Where they were doing work, David 395 00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: Singh had an image engraved on it of a hunter 396 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:09,679 Speaker 1: with a dog, and it turned out the circle of 397 00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:11,800 Speaker 1: the thing was like eighteen eighty eight and he just 398 00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 1: happened to look down and he's seeing this thing. They 399 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 1: have forensic anthropologies. We hear about the body farm and 400 00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:20,280 Speaker 1: all this sort of thing. They are amazing with the 401 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:22,600 Speaker 1: way they can, Like you and I might see a 402 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 1: clot of dirt or rock, that's not what they see. 403 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:29,920 Speaker 1: They see something completely different. It takes years and years 404 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:33,040 Speaker 1: of training in order to appreciate the environment and kind 405 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:36,919 Speaker 1: of understand it. But they did recover these remains, and 406 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 1: so everything has to be examined, and in the case 407 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 1: of Susanne Morphew, one of the things that would have 408 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:47,440 Speaker 1: to take place is that they would try to reconstitute 409 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,360 Speaker 1: her skeleton on one table. And I guarantee you, Dave, 410 00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:56,000 Speaker 1: they took pictures of this there and there's for those 411 00:23:56,040 --> 00:24:00,920 Speaker 1: that don't have the actual the actual list and from 412 00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 1: just bear with me here be patient. There is actually 413 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:14,920 Speaker 1: here are. They collected everything in three bags and they 414 00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:19,840 Speaker 1: have these things broken down so that they collected in 415 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 1: their first suite. They have collected Day one. There's a 416 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:27,120 Speaker 1: Day one bag and then there is a second Day 417 00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:30,240 Speaker 1: one bag that actually contains the skull. So they've kept 418 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:33,560 Speaker 1: the skull separate from whatever it was that they found 419 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 1: on the first day. And so on day two and 420 00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 1: three they went out and found more remains which they 421 00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:44,359 Speaker 1: backed together, so they wound up with three bags of remains. 422 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 1: It's commingling of these remains and you can't really kind 423 00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:49,879 Speaker 1: of understand that. You know, when you're out there, you 424 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:52,919 Speaker 1: have to take it back to the laboratory environment to 425 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,119 Speaker 1: break everything down, and you know, plus you've got dirt 426 00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:59,200 Speaker 1: and they also found wood, and wood many times dave 427 00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:02,680 Speaker 1: can actually look like bone. But here's here's what we 428 00:25:02,800 --> 00:25:04,840 Speaker 1: came up with. This is kind of the inventory, just 429 00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:07,120 Speaker 1: so that everybody's in the same sheet of music. Here. 430 00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:10,360 Speaker 1: So here we go. We have a skull with the mandible, 431 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:13,800 Speaker 1: which is actually the jaw. We have the sacrum, which 432 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:19,280 Speaker 1: the sacrum is it's not it involves the cocas, but 433 00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:23,679 Speaker 1: it's it's that last destination going down your spine, that 434 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:28,360 Speaker 1: big flat bone that is literally that comprises your tailbone. 435 00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:32,320 Speaker 1: They've got multiple ribs. It's surprising me many times that 436 00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:35,879 Speaker 1: they actually find ribs because ribs animals love these things. 437 00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:40,560 Speaker 1: So they've got bilateral radius and ola, which are the 438 00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:45,040 Speaker 1: two bones in the forearm. They've got the manubrium, and 439 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,719 Speaker 1: they've got the sternum, and of course the sternum is 440 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:50,160 Speaker 1: that plate that covers your heart right in the center 441 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,520 Speaker 1: of your chest. You can feel yours. They've got the 442 00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 1: right scapulum, which is you know that kind of wing 443 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,919 Speaker 1: shaped bone that's on your that's on your okay, so 444 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:04,760 Speaker 1: the right one. They've got one of the clavical which 445 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,440 Speaker 1: is your collar bone. They've got the right and left 446 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,080 Speaker 1: femeral bones. They've also got the right and left tip 447 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:15,359 Speaker 1: fib which are the two bones in your lower leg. 448 00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:21,840 Speaker 1: And then they've got multiple vertebral bodies as well. And 449 00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:24,440 Speaker 1: here's the kicker. And this is what this leads to, Dave. 450 00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,720 Speaker 1: There was no and I mean no soft tissue left. 451 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:33,640 Speaker 1: I thought that I really thought that what we were 452 00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:35,880 Speaker 1: going to see was that we were going to have 453 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 1: some semblance of soft tissue, because many times, particularly in 454 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,600 Speaker 1: more of an arid climate like this, you can have 455 00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: natural mummification that takes place and you'll have soft tissue 456 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:49,879 Speaker 1: the remainder of the skin that will kind of be 457 00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:54,240 Speaker 1: dried out and thinly stretched over the scalpal remains. But 458 00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,840 Speaker 1: at the end of the day, the answers are actually 459 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:18,480 Speaker 1: going to rest in the bone. When you have a 460 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:22,679 Speaker 1: decomposed body. And when I say decomposed, the body is 461 00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:26,920 Speaker 1: essentially in a state that is first off unrecognizable. Most 462 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:31,200 Speaker 1: of the time is as you can imagine as very pungent. 463 00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: It's swollen, skin is really greasy, you've got skin slippage 464 00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:37,280 Speaker 1: going on. All of these changes have taken place for 465 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:39,600 Speaker 1: a protract period of time. But the saving grace here 466 00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:44,680 Speaker 1: scientifically is that you still have soft tissue. And even 467 00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:48,160 Speaker 1: though you might not could get TALX results from blood 468 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 1: because the blood has gone through such decomposition. What we 469 00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:01,560 Speaker 1: would do Dave many times is take a slice, particularly 470 00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:03,520 Speaker 1: of the liver. You can do it with the brain too, 471 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:07,080 Speaker 1: but with the liver, and you place the liver into 472 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:11,520 Speaker 1: that slice of liver into a tube like a test tube, 473 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,160 Speaker 1: and you put it on a centrifuge and you spin 474 00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:16,560 Speaker 1: it down. You spin it down to the point where 475 00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:20,600 Speaker 1: it liquifies, and you can draw that up and you 476 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:24,200 Speaker 1: can perform toxicology. And here's another little known fact that 477 00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 1: if you think that was bad, the next one I'm 478 00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:27,800 Speaker 1: about to give you is really bad. 479 00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 2: I'm thinking, if you start talking about farber beans and kent, 480 00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:32,320 Speaker 2: I'm really going to lose my hand. 481 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 1: No. No, I'm going to talk to you about maggots though, 482 00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:39,120 Speaker 1: because one of the things that we can do with 483 00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:43,400 Speaker 1: maggots is if we can extract maggots from the body, 484 00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:49,680 Speaker 1: guess what they do, particularly with opiates and cocaine. They 485 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: will begin to metabolize those drugs that are contained within 486 00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:55,480 Speaker 1: the body. If you can collect the maggots, you can 487 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 1: spin those down and actually find out what was going 488 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,520 Speaker 1: on in the system of the ceased. Now you can 489 00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:03,560 Speaker 1: get a qualitative amount most of times, but you're not 490 00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:05,960 Speaker 1: gonna be able to get a quantitative amount like that 491 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 1: will say, Okay, you're in lethal levels, not like blood, 492 00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:13,840 Speaker 1: so you're still tissue, right, Yeah, that's that's with tissue. 493 00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:16,280 Speaker 1: And so that's you know, the five physicians that I 494 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:19,959 Speaker 1: mentioned just a moment ago. That's a conundrum here there, 495 00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:23,240 Speaker 1: and let me address this real quick. I know that 496 00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:25,600 Speaker 1: we're going long on this, but this is a great 497 00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:31,920 Speaker 1: moment that everybody can learn from. The reason you have 498 00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:35,160 Speaker 1: five physicians on this thing, Dave is first off, they're 499 00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:39,080 Speaker 1: no fools. They know what the heat of the spotlight 500 00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:42,680 Speaker 1: is like, right, and they're not They're not going to 501 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:45,600 Speaker 1: try to put the responsibility off on the others. These 502 00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,520 Speaker 1: guys are physicians. So what they do is they sit 503 00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 1: around in morning meetings and I've been in them, and 504 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:55,360 Speaker 1: they talk about cases of the day. Dude, They've been 505 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,560 Speaker 1: talking about this case for a long time at this office, 506 00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:01,400 Speaker 1: and so what is hopen happened is can you imagine 507 00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:04,640 Speaker 1: this if you ever wrote a report, and you didn't 508 00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:07,960 Speaker 1: just have like one of your colleagues review, you got 509 00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 1: five reviewing it. And they're gonna pick this thing. They're brutal, 510 00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:14,080 Speaker 1: I mean they're brutal, and they need to be kind 511 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:17,000 Speaker 1: the truth. You have to because you say, I wouldn't 512 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:21,600 Speaker 1: have come to this conclusion. But whatever occurred, you've got 513 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:25,560 Speaker 1: validation by five separate subjects here that are saying scientifically, 514 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:29,520 Speaker 1: we're signing our name on the scene, and we agree 515 00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:30,640 Speaker 1: with your diagnosis here. 516 00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 2: Then I got to know how they came up with it, 517 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:34,080 Speaker 2: because you just went through the whole thing about how 518 00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:38,280 Speaker 2: we're going to get toxicology reports from a liver that 519 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,880 Speaker 2: you've run through a centrifuge and through skin and blood 520 00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:45,200 Speaker 2: and things like that. But from everything we're seeing, you know, 521 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:47,400 Speaker 2: you started off with the Raiders of the Lost Art 522 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:50,680 Speaker 2: guys going out there and getting the bones, right, that's 523 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:53,600 Speaker 2: all we've got. We've got bones, and we do have 524 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:57,160 Speaker 2: some clothing, but we don't have any soft tissue. We 525 00:30:57,200 --> 00:30:59,120 Speaker 2: don't have any tissue. We don't have any We have 526 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:04,600 Speaker 2: nothing other than hard bones. Joe, a skull, a femur. 527 00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,120 Speaker 2: We don't I'm not seeing I've looked at this whole report. 528 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,200 Speaker 2: How are you going to get toxicology when all you 529 00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:09,960 Speaker 2: have are bones? 530 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:15,840 Speaker 1: Okay, everybody, find your hip joint. Okay, up at the 531 00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,959 Speaker 1: top the top of your femur. Okay, where your your 532 00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:25,320 Speaker 1: femur actually fits into that ballen socket, that joint right there. 533 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 1: That the head as it's referred to, the head of 534 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:32,880 Speaker 1: the femur is arguably one of the most robust, dense 535 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 1: bones in the body. But guess what else it contains. 536 00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:40,080 Speaker 1: It has vessels in there, okay, and so anything that 537 00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:44,800 Speaker 1: is in there is there is a possibility that you 538 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:52,160 Speaker 1: can actually there's a possibility that you can actually extract 539 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:56,080 Speaker 1: data from there if you will. I know that sounds 540 00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,239 Speaker 1: very computer like, but you know, data is really what 541 00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:03,120 Speaker 1: we're looking for. And it's interesting here kind of backing 542 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:06,400 Speaker 1: up just for a second. One of the things that 543 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 1: was done, and this is a quote, the right femeral 544 00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:14,320 Speaker 1: head of femeral fragment and femur head is retained for 545 00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:20,640 Speaker 1: toxicology testing prior to release for forensic anthropology examination. So 546 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:24,800 Speaker 1: what they did, Dave is given the status of this bone, 547 00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:28,520 Speaker 1: one of two things happened. Either the head of the 548 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:33,800 Speaker 1: femur was fragmented off and they retained it. Or and 549 00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:36,600 Speaker 1: I've seen this done before. They went to the shaft 550 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:40,120 Speaker 1: just beneath the head of the femur and they used 551 00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:43,280 Speaker 1: a striker saw and they cut the thing right into 552 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 1: and they held onto the entire head of the femur. 553 00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:48,160 Speaker 1: And if you're holding onto the entire head of the 554 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:51,400 Speaker 1: femur when you begin to test this thing, because you're 555 00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:54,280 Speaker 1: going to it's a destructive tests, you I don't you 556 00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:56,880 Speaker 1: know people talk about destructive and non destructive. This is 557 00:32:56,920 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 1: a destructive test. So you want the biggest opportunity of 558 00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:04,920 Speaker 1: sample at that point, tom, So you ruin it, you don't. 559 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:10,000 Speaker 1: It's gone, baby, it's gone. And so that's that's apparently 560 00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:12,680 Speaker 1: what they did here. They retain that and then they 561 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:18,440 Speaker 1: turned everything over to to the forensic anthropologist. So they 562 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:20,960 Speaker 1: would have had to sit down with a forensic anthropologists 563 00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:24,200 Speaker 1: say listen, we did this to the bone, and I 564 00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:26,520 Speaker 1: want you to think that some kind of dismemberment has 565 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:29,720 Speaker 1: taken place or anything like that. And there is a 566 00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:33,200 Speaker 1: forensic anthropologist that's actually mentioned in the autopsy report, and 567 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:34,840 Speaker 1: it would have been their job to examine the bone. 568 00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:39,600 Speaker 1: So they're examining essentially a headless femur or fragmented UH 569 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:42,520 Speaker 1: femur that has been extracted. It was fragmented, and they 570 00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:45,160 Speaker 1: try to contain everything. But how do we get to 571 00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:49,680 Speaker 1: this point? Well, what has to happen is essentially, I'm 572 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:52,239 Speaker 1: going to try to put this in as simple as 573 00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:57,240 Speaker 1: terms as possible. They take a solid sample of bone 574 00:33:57,320 --> 00:33:59,720 Speaker 1: and they will drop it into a tube and they're 575 00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:07,200 Speaker 1: essentially going to bombard this thing and use the methodology 576 00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:12,239 Speaker 1: that's called a SE. It's it's called accelerated solvent extraction, 577 00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:18,480 Speaker 1: and the idea is to bring out as much of 578 00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:22,560 Speaker 1: the content of that bone that can be analyzed, and 579 00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:27,240 Speaker 1: they're going to throw this thing into a mass spect 580 00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:30,480 Speaker 1: machine mass spectrometry to take a look and see what 581 00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,000 Speaker 1: they can find in there. Because there's certain there's certain 582 00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:35,160 Speaker 1: base elements you're going to find in bone, and we 583 00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:38,000 Speaker 1: always hear about this. You need to, you know, eat 584 00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:40,200 Speaker 1: plenty of calcium. When you have calcium in your diet 585 00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:42,160 Speaker 1: and all this. You're going to expect to find minerals 586 00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:45,360 Speaker 1: like that, but what you're not going to expect to 587 00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:54,200 Speaker 1: find is animal tranquilizer. And in this particular case, hold 588 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:57,080 Speaker 1: onto your hat. That's what they found in the head 589 00:34:57,120 --> 00:35:02,760 Speaker 1: of the femur. So I cannot imagine. I can only 590 00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:07,320 Speaker 1: imagine right now because this again, you've got a doctoral 591 00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:11,480 Speaker 1: level forensic toxicologist at the State crime Lab that's involved 592 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:14,280 Speaker 1: in this now, and I can just imagine they're sitting 593 00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:16,440 Speaker 1: there in their lab, They're in their white lab coat. 594 00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:19,840 Speaker 1: This thing has been taken to the state, to the 595 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 1: State lab. The forensic toxicologists is sitting there and they 596 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:29,040 Speaker 1: had they had like this. All of a sudden, this 597 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:31,800 Speaker 1: clarity came upon when they begin to read this test 598 00:35:32,239 --> 00:35:36,160 Speaker 1: and they were like, holy smokes, look what's Look what's contained? 599 00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,080 Speaker 1: I think there are people out there that would like 600 00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:41,280 Speaker 1: to know this information. Immediately, they're picking up the phone, 601 00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:44,840 Speaker 1: the five doctors. They're calling the five doctors at this 602 00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:48,080 Speaker 1: point in time, say hold on a minute, has Well, 603 00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:50,399 Speaker 1: You've got something to tell you that you're not going 604 00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:52,160 Speaker 1: to believe. We're going to send a full report, but 605 00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,719 Speaker 1: I got to tell you just over the phone. This 606 00:35:56,000 --> 00:36:00,000 Speaker 1: is a gigantic piece of information because Dave, the compound 607 00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:05,600 Speaker 1: that we're talking about here is used in tranquilizer darts 608 00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:10,279 Speaker 1: to literally sedate animals. What was it you told me 609 00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:13,359 Speaker 1: about what one of the compounds. There's essentially I think 610 00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:16,560 Speaker 1: six compounds in here. Yeah, one of the compounds you 611 00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:19,560 Speaker 1: had said you said something about a large A large animal. 612 00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:24,680 Speaker 2: Dude, I'm not trying to be disrespectful, and I say, no, really, 613 00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 2: I don't even know how to pronounce this thing. Okay, 614 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:29,600 Speaker 2: but it's a sedative. I looked it up. It's a 615 00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:38,799 Speaker 2: sedative used commonly used for pigs and elephants. Who is 616 00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:42,120 Speaker 2: going to ingest a sedative for pigs and elephants when 617 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:44,320 Speaker 2: you can find human ones not far away? 618 00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:50,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's uh, it's it's certainly well, it's certainly intriguing, 619 00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:56,279 Speaker 1: I think from from an investigative standpoint. And yeah, I think, Dave, 620 00:36:56,360 --> 00:37:00,399 Speaker 1: the the one that you're actually referring to here is 621 00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:07,359 Speaker 1: the ASA prone, which is actually it's used. Okay, here, 622 00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:08,799 Speaker 1: let me paint this picture for you. 623 00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:11,120 Speaker 2: Imagine you You got to have me understand it, Joe, 624 00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:12,960 Speaker 2: because this is really messed with my head in the 625 00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:14,040 Speaker 2: last couple of hours. 626 00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:18,160 Speaker 1: Well just imagine, just imagine you've got a charging elephant 627 00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:20,480 Speaker 1: coming at you, but you don't want to kill the elephant. 628 00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:25,040 Speaker 1: All right now, it's certainly going to take a higher dose, say, 629 00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:27,440 Speaker 1: for instance, than if you were shooting I don't know 630 00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:33,360 Speaker 1: raccoons or squirrels or foxes in your backyard, but it would. 631 00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:37,239 Speaker 1: It would. It has been used to sedate elephants, Dave. 632 00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:41,320 Speaker 1: And so it's and it's not just that it doesn't 633 00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:46,239 Speaker 1: simply just kind of stand alone. There are other elements 634 00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:50,400 Speaker 1: to this compound that all mix in, and every single 635 00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:56,040 Speaker 1: one of them has has something to do with sedation, 636 00:37:56,480 --> 00:38:00,000 Speaker 1: anti anxiety, all these sorts of things. So if you 637 00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:04,719 Speaker 1: if you hit somebody up, say, for instance, with this substance, 638 00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:10,640 Speaker 1: they're pretty quickly they're gonna get weak need David. Uh, 639 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:13,520 Speaker 1: they're gonna get to the point where they're not gonna 640 00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:17,680 Speaker 1: be able to function. Uh. If you've if you've ever, 641 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:23,120 Speaker 1: if anyone out there has ever had anesthesia, that that 642 00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:25,440 Speaker 1: first burst of drugs that they give you to kind 643 00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:27,600 Speaker 1: of get you ready for surgery, where you kind of 644 00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:29,879 Speaker 1: get that milky warm feeling. It's one of the best 645 00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:32,200 Speaker 1: feelings in the world. You know, you don't care about 646 00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:36,400 Speaker 1: anything else, there's no anxiety. You're gonna go through that, 647 00:38:36,680 --> 00:38:38,839 Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden, because of these other 648 00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:42,880 Speaker 1: compounds that are in here, when you mix them together. 649 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:47,800 Speaker 1: Darkness is gonna wash over you. And they ain't a 650 00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:51,080 Speaker 1: damn thing you knew about it. Because it's in your system. 651 00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:55,480 Speaker 1: Your body begins to metabolize this thing. You're uptaking this stuff, 652 00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:59,520 Speaker 1: and it's hard. It's hard to know. I know that 653 00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:04,600 Speaker 1: they're be a lethal level with these substances. I think 654 00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:06,799 Speaker 1: that more is going to come out because look, we 655 00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:09,440 Speaker 1: still don't have the toxicology report at this point, we 656 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:12,160 Speaker 1: don't even have the anthropology report. All we have is 657 00:39:12,200 --> 00:39:17,640 Speaker 1: this four page report that was issued from the medical examiner. 658 00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:20,520 Speaker 1: You know, to all interested parties, there's going to be 659 00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:23,520 Speaker 1: a lot more of this to come. But you know, 660 00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:27,799 Speaker 1: we not only did they recover bones out there, they've 661 00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:32,040 Speaker 1: got remnant of clothing as well. That's found in this 662 00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:36,239 Speaker 1: grave with Suzanne morephew, and it's a lot of it 663 00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:44,919 Speaker 1: is kind of fragmented and ragged. But what really struck me, Dave, 664 00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:50,920 Speaker 1: was the fact that they found they found a bullet. 665 00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:58,600 Speaker 1: They found a bullet out there. So what sense do 666 00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:05,280 Speaker 1: we make of this? Can we actually appreciate a gunshot 667 00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:11,640 Speaker 1: wound in bone? Possibly, But here's the rub. It has 668 00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:16,520 Speaker 1: to have passed through a bony structure and have left 669 00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:21,520 Speaker 1: a fracture that would have occurred not postmortem, but anti mortem, 670 00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:24,480 Speaker 1: and they can suss that out. They can actually make 671 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:31,359 Speaker 1: sense of that. And can you tie that projectile back 672 00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:34,879 Speaker 1: to a very particular weapon, because here's another thing that 673 00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:38,879 Speaker 1: wasn't mentioned. We don't know what caliber is. We only 674 00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:43,560 Speaker 1: know that we've got a weathered projectile that is found 675 00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:47,200 Speaker 1: there in the dirt adjacent to this woman's body that 676 00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:54,440 Speaker 1: is now skeletonized with tattered clothing, and she's got tranquilizers 677 00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:58,920 Speaker 1: in her in the head of her femur. 678 00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:02,759 Speaker 2: Yea four types Joe and this and the bullet, those 679 00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,440 Speaker 2: two things come to mind because you found the cap 680 00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:08,040 Speaker 2: for the needle bit you used in a dark gun. 681 00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:10,040 Speaker 2: They found that in the dryer. And by the way, 682 00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:14,360 Speaker 2: Barry Morphew said he did that he used these tranquilizers 683 00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:16,680 Speaker 2: for deer, that he would shoot them so that he 684 00:41:16,719 --> 00:41:22,120 Speaker 2: could harvest their antlers. I'd never heard that before, but 685 00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:24,680 Speaker 2: that's the kind that's Yeah, that's why, that's why they 686 00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:26,759 Speaker 2: found the cap in the dryer. It must have just 687 00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:30,520 Speaker 2: been in my pocket. Of course, that doesn't explain anything else. 688 00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:32,160 Speaker 2: But they also found the bullet next one. 689 00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:34,680 Speaker 1: Well down in these parts. Yeah, goottle boys put on 690 00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:36,880 Speaker 1: their put on their boots and their blue jeans, and 691 00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:39,680 Speaker 1: they go walking through the woods. You could find you know, 692 00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:41,600 Speaker 1: you can find racks just laying on the ground if 693 00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:43,520 Speaker 1: you know where to look, and you're looking for rub 694 00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:45,000 Speaker 1: on the tree and all that sort of thing. But 695 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:48,719 Speaker 1: you're telling me you're going to tranquilize a deer, which 696 00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:50,879 Speaker 1: I think out there that have mule deer which are 697 00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:52,840 Speaker 1: bigger than our white tail deer. I guess it is 698 00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:54,960 Speaker 1: white tail too. I guess you're gonna take it. What 699 00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:56,719 Speaker 1: are you gonna do? Take a saw and saw it 700 00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:57,359 Speaker 1: off their head? 701 00:41:57,800 --> 00:41:58,279 Speaker 2: I don't know. 702 00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:01,520 Speaker 1: I've never I've never heard this. I heard it, you know, 703 00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:06,520 Speaker 1: when these initial reports came. But I'm fascinated by this because, yeah, 704 00:42:06,680 --> 00:42:09,640 Speaker 1: we've got the tranquil we've got the elements that go 705 00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:14,080 Speaker 1: along with this thing. But Bubba, we've got we've got 706 00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:17,719 Speaker 1: this doll gone round that's out there. I want to 707 00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:21,440 Speaker 1: know what the caliber is and also the status of 708 00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:24,360 Speaker 1: the round. Is it deformed in any way? Did it 709 00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:29,600 Speaker 1: pass through multiple bony structures in the body? Is it 710 00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:31,239 Speaker 1: Is it a round that could have been a hollow 711 00:42:31,320 --> 00:42:35,920 Speaker 1: point that mushroomed? Is it a tiny round, I don't know, 712 00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:41,040 Speaker 1: like a twenty five caliber three eighty or a twenty 713 00:42:41,080 --> 00:42:44,920 Speaker 1: two caliber. I'd be very fascinated by that. I'd want 714 00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:47,400 Speaker 1: to know. Or is it a rifle round? You know, 715 00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:51,160 Speaker 1: if it's a rifle round, it's going to be kind 716 00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:56,000 Speaker 1: of robust, you know, seven point six y two perhaps 717 00:42:56,120 --> 00:43:00,319 Speaker 1: or less so five point five six. I want to 718 00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:05,920 Speaker 1: know what this round was and what type of weapon 719 00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:10,400 Speaker 1: was it fired from. And also if you've got a projectile. 720 00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:15,520 Speaker 1: If you've got a projectile, to me, that means that 721 00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:18,480 Speaker 1: they used a metal detector out there. How big a 722 00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:21,520 Speaker 1: sweeping area did you cover out there when you're doing 723 00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:24,960 Speaker 1: your search all over the place. Did you recover a 724 00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:28,120 Speaker 1: spent casing. If it's a spent casing, then we automatically 725 00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:31,680 Speaker 1: know that this is a semi automatic handgun. If it 726 00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:35,960 Speaker 1: is a handgun and it ejected, didn't find it. But 727 00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:42,440 Speaker 1: if it's a revolver. If it's a revolver, that means 728 00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:51,000 Speaker 1: that whoever fired this projectile walked away with the spent 729 00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:55,239 Speaker 1: casing still contained in the cylinder of that revolver. And 730 00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:57,439 Speaker 1: that's one of the things that you're looking for here. 731 00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,360 Speaker 1: I think that there's a lot more to come on 732 00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:06,440 Speaker 1: this case, David, but I don't know if it offers 733 00:44:06,520 --> 00:44:11,120 Speaker 1: anybody really any peace. I think that maybe we're a 734 00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:16,400 Speaker 1: less we might be a bit less confused, But I 735 00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:24,000 Speaker 1: know this. It seems as though that when her body, 736 00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:29,680 Speaker 1: Susan Morphew, her body was removed from that hole in 737 00:44:29,719 --> 00:44:34,719 Speaker 1: the ground and that hard, hard soil with her, came 738 00:44:35,840 --> 00:44:43,080 Speaker 1: some answers, but also amountain of questions. I'm Joseph Scott 739 00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:45,920 Speaker 1: Morgan and this is body Ma