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Speaker 1: And you're here.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for choosing the iHeartRadio and Coast to Ghost Day

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Speaker 2: and Paranormal Podcast Network. Your quest for podcasts of the paranormal, supernatural,

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Speaker 2: and the unexplained ends here. They invite you to enjoy

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Speaker 2: all our shows we have on this network, and right now,

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Speaker 2: let's start with Chase of the Afterlife with the Santra Chandpoint.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and

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Speaker 3: opinions expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions

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Speaker 3: only and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast

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Speaker 3: to Coast AM employees of premier networks, or their sponsors

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Speaker 3: and associates. We would like to encourage you to do

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Speaker 3: your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself.

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Speaker 4: Hey everyone, it's Captain Ron and each week are and

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Speaker 4: Beyond Contact. We'll explore the latest news in ufology, discuss

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Speaker 4: some of the classic cases, and bring you the latest

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Speaker 4: information from the newest cases as we talk with the

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Speaker 4: top experts.

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Speaker 5: Welcome to another episode of Beyond Contact. I am Captain Ron,

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Speaker 5: and today I'm speaking with Kelly Chase. Kelly is a

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Speaker 5: branding and marketing expert and also the host and creator

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Speaker 5: of the very successful UFO rabbit Hole podcast, and deservingly so.

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Speaker 5: Kelly has been in this field in earnest for only

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Speaker 5: about three to four years, and over that very short

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Speaker 5: span she has amassed an incredible breadth and depth of

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Speaker 5: knowledge in this area through reading an immense amount of material.

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Speaker 5: She has further ramped up her knowledge on the subject

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Speaker 5: through doing podcasts and interacting with experiencers. It's always enlightening

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Speaker 5: speaking with her, and I feel like she's a very refreshing, grounded,

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Speaker 5: rational approach to this topic. Hi, Kelly, how you doing today?

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Speaker 1: Oh? Hey, Ron, it's so great to be here. I'm

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Speaker 1: doing great. How are you?

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Speaker 5: I am terrific and I'm really looking forward to this.

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Speaker 5: We're just going to have a fun, casual conversation today,

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Speaker 5: and it's going to be a lot of fun because

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Speaker 5: I know you have a lot of insight on this

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Speaker 5: topic here beyond contact, I tend to just jump in

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Speaker 5: off the high board and get right into the heart

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Speaker 5: of the matter. So let's do that. You have looked

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Speaker 5: at this phenomenon pretty deeply over the last few years.

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Speaker 5: You've read a ton of material, You've interviewed experts, spoken

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Speaker 5: to people who claimed to have direct first hand witness

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Speaker 5: to either a UFO sighting or even direct contact with

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Speaker 5: what we'll call for now aliens. After all of that,

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Speaker 5: and I know this is just wild speculation, but what

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Speaker 5: do you think is happening out there? Do you think

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Speaker 5: that US Earthlings are in fact having contact with some

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Speaker 5: form of non human intelligence? And if so, where might

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Speaker 5: they be coming from? Are they from another galaxy? Are

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Speaker 5: they from another dimension? Are they extra tempestrial beings from

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Speaker 5: the future? Do they live on Earth somewhere parallel to us?

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Speaker 5: All of the above? What's the answer?

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Speaker 1: Starting with an easy one, right? But this is the question, right,

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Speaker 1: And I think that's what has gotten me so obsessed

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Speaker 1: from the very beginning. And I will say my answer

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Speaker 1: to this changes and evolves all the time, just based

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Speaker 1: on new information. But I think that really what we're

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Speaker 1: dealing with here is likely something that is something that

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Speaker 1: we've been dealing with throughout the history of humanity in

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Speaker 1: one form or another. It seems as though we are

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Speaker 1: sharing our planet in one sense or another with probably

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Speaker 1: multiple non human intelligences that we just have sort of

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Speaker 1: failed to recognize, or at least failed to recognize within

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Speaker 1: our current paradigm. Something that I think is really interesting

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Speaker 1: about this whole thing is that I think that the

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Speaker 1: Earth probably has a much more complex ecology than we

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Speaker 1: recognize currently. You know, when you think about the Earth

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Speaker 1: and what we have here, like we really do have

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Speaker 1: a gem and if you go, you know, hundreds of

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Speaker 1: millions of light years in just about any direction, you're

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Speaker 1: not going to find anything like it. This just abundance

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Speaker 1: and proliferation of life that just kind of springs up

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Speaker 1: from every surface and in every corner. We've even found it,

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Speaker 1: like miles underground and at the bottom of Mariana Trench.

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Speaker 1: It seems like this entire planet is just this ball

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Speaker 1: of life. And it seems as though it could be

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Speaker 1: that there's more here than we thought that there was,

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Speaker 1: and that it's very likely that our planet is this

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Speaker 1: kind of beacon around which life congregates. And I think

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Speaker 1: that the that we're only just now kind of waking

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Speaker 1: up to the sheer, vastness and complexity of what that

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Speaker 1: life actually looks like, and that there's probably things that

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Speaker 1: are here that maybe we just haven't we haven't evolved

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Speaker 1: to deal with in terms of our senses and our understanding,

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Speaker 1: and that we're beginning to become more aware of that now,

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Speaker 1: and so I think we're probably dealing with a lot

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Speaker 1: of different things and that what we're coming up against

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Speaker 1: is really a paradigm shift where we recognize a new

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Speaker 1: kind of life, a new way that life can exist.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely, I guess, well, yeah, I mean, listen, these are

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Speaker 5: all everything we say at speculation because we're dealing with

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Speaker 5: an unknown topic. But it is interesting to think about.

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Speaker 5: It's always your perspective as well, and your technology as well.

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Speaker 5: For example, I don't have the exact dates on this,

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Speaker 5: but let's say two hundred years ago, we didn't know

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Speaker 5: there were microbial beings walking around on our body.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 5: Now we have the ability to zoom in and see them,

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Speaker 5: and we can see what's unfortunately crawling around in our bed,

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Speaker 5: you know what I mean. We didn't know that before.

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Speaker 5: It was only when we got the technology to see

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Speaker 5: there could we in fact learn what's there. Just like

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Speaker 5: you were saying about the Marianna Trench, before we were

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Speaker 5: able to go down that low, we didn't know that

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Speaker 5: this existed, and yet it was just right there down

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Speaker 5: the street and we didn't know it was there. So

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Speaker 5: that I always feel like, could be what's going on

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Speaker 5: with this now on human intelligence, I always like to

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Speaker 5: bring up the what they call the jungle theory. You know,

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Speaker 5: when you're walking through the jungle to scientists and they

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Speaker 5: see an ant hill and they pick up one and

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Speaker 5: they put a number on its back and they put

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Speaker 5: it back. You know, the answer completely unaware that us

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Speaker 5: humans are there, and yet we are and we're interacting

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Speaker 5: with them. So it might be something like that that

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Speaker 5: we just don't have the technology or wisdom to know.

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Speaker 4: Yet.

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Speaker 5: What do you feel is the strongest piece of evidence

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Speaker 5: for this being a real phenomenon.

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Speaker 1: I know that this is an answer that a lot

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Speaker 1: of people aren't going to love because I think that

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Speaker 1: you know where we are, which I understand. We're looking

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Speaker 1: for hard data right because we want to be able

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Speaker 1: to prove this. We want to be able to say

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Speaker 1: scientifically conclusively that this thing is real. But I think

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Speaker 1: that where we are right now, honestly, what the best

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Speaker 1: piece of evidence is is anecdotal. And I think that

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Speaker 1: for a lot of people, like anecdotes have become this

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Speaker 1: dirty word where it's like, well, it's just anecdotal, so

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Speaker 1: you can't prove it, so it means nothing except that

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Speaker 1: like there are a lot of different kinds of science,

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Speaker 1: like we're trying. I don't think that we should expect

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Speaker 1: to hold every single field to the same standard of

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Speaker 1: science that we hold, say like physics, where we have

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Speaker 1: this like very very hard science that's like very provable

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Speaker 1: and very like very easy to calculate and you know,

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Speaker 1: comes down to like mathematical equations, because that's just not

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Speaker 1: how everything works. There's other kinds of science. There's psychology

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Speaker 1: and anthropology, and these are the kinds of science that

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Speaker 1: we use when we're trying to deal with things that

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Speaker 1: can't be broken down into an equation like species and

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Speaker 1: humans and cultures and that sort of thing. We can

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Speaker 1: study those things, still not in as precise and replicable

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Speaker 1: of a way as we can study, say the laws

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Speaker 1: of physics, but that doesn't mean that there's nothing that

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Speaker 1: we can know about them. And the way that we

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Speaker 1: go about that in these other kind of softer science

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Speaker 1: fields is that we collect, you know, all of this

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Speaker 1: anecdotal data together. And it's not that you accept every

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Speaker 1: single anecdote or every single piece of data as being

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Speaker 1: like absolute and you don't question it. What you do,

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Speaker 1: if you're responsible, is you take all of the anecdotes,

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Speaker 1: and you take all of this data and you put

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Speaker 1: it together and you look for patterns that emerge, and

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Speaker 1: then you try to understand what it is that you're

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Speaker 1: dealing with from that. And I think that that's completely valid,

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Speaker 1: and I think that something really dangerous is happening in

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Speaker 1: our culture where we feel like we can't rely on

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Speaker 1: what other human beings are telling us about their experience,

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Speaker 1: about what they know. That doesn't mean that people don't lie.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't mean that there's not people aren't mistaken, or

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Speaker 1: that they aren't frauds. But we're to the point where

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Speaker 1: we don't even trust our own experience when these things happen,

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Speaker 1: because we've decided it can't be it can't be real.

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Speaker 1: And so but I think the fact that you know,

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Speaker 1: if you go back hundreds of years, thousands of years,

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Speaker 1: we have accounts that very much look like the UFO phenomenon,

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Speaker 1: or you know, interactions with some kind of a non

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Speaker 1: human intelligence that follow the same shape and pattern and

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Speaker 1: kind of like structure of these encounters that people are

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Speaker 1: having now tells us that there's something there. We don't

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Speaker 1: know what it is. We have to figure that out still,

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Speaker 1: But that to me, is probably the most compelling piece

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Speaker 1: of evidence.

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Speaker 5: I agree. I don't know why we suddenly discount eyewitness testimony.

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Speaker 5: We have a lot of people that have made these claims.

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Speaker 5: Why all of a sudden are these people not credible?

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Speaker 5: And I don't think that that's fair. And we have

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Speaker 5: a huge number of them. We don't need all of

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Speaker 5: them to be credible, we just need one. So keeping

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Speaker 5: that in mind, it makes me feel that there is

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Speaker 5: some substantial evidence for this. And there's other cases like

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Speaker 5: when you were saying that, I was thinking that, you know,

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Speaker 5: when they caught these priests doing things to choir boys

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Speaker 5: and whatever at the church, what kind of evidence did

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Speaker 5: they have for that other than anecdotal witnesses or these

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Speaker 5: guys claiming this. There's no video, there's no proof, there's

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Speaker 5: no anything. But that was enough to catch all these guys.

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Speaker 5: So we need to a little more fair in this

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Speaker 5: realm as well. You're listening to Beyond Contact on the

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Speaker 5: iHeartRadio on Coast to Coast AM Paranormal podcast network. We

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Speaker 5: are back on Beyond Contact. We're talking with Kelly Chase,

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Speaker 5: and Kelly, I wanted to ask you, is there a

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Speaker 5: case or two that really pushed you over the edge,

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Speaker 5: that made you go, you know what, this is really

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Speaker 5: credible to me.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think early on one of the

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Speaker 1: cases that really stuck out to me was the nineteen

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Speaker 1: fifty two flap over Washington, DC. Just the fact that

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Speaker 1: this is something that was documented in newspapers around the world.

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Speaker 1: There's no real way to argue that something didn't happen

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Speaker 1: there because it was witnessed over multiple hours of these

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Speaker 1: things flying over Washington, d C. There were craft that

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Speaker 1: were spotted hovering over our Congress for hours at a time,

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Speaker 1: and this was witnessed by literally, you know, thousands, if

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Speaker 1: not more people, to the extent that our government had

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Speaker 1: to have the biggest press conference that they had had

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Speaker 1: since the end of World War Two to go and

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Speaker 1: tell people that like, there was nothing to see here.

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Speaker 1: But their explanation never made any kind of sense, because

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Speaker 1: this was, like I said in one of her multiple

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Speaker 1: hours and also over multiple days, they were scrambling fighter

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Speaker 1: jets to go and get these things, to try to

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Speaker 1: figure out what they were, and to pretend as though

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Speaker 1: our entire military was flummixed and just sort of tricked

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Speaker 1: by some like weird you know, radar data or something

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Speaker 1: that was incorrect, which in no way explains all the

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Speaker 1: people who are seeing these things on the ground. You

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Speaker 1: can't see, you know, radar artifacts from the ground. I

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Speaker 1: think that that in and of itself, you know, shows

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Speaker 1: you that there's something really interesting going on there. And

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Speaker 1: so that one really early on for me, was one

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Speaker 1: that really stuck out to me, cause I think it's

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Speaker 1: really hard to say that something significant didn't happen.

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Speaker 5: So the weather balloon thing did not land for you,

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Speaker 5: is what you're saying. The weather balloons does not seem

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Speaker 5: to be strong enough. I agree. So you are a

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Speaker 5: non believer in all of this, all of the UFO things.

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Speaker 5: You in fact, were an atheist until about three years ago.

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Speaker 5: And after all this research, when did you get to

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Speaker 5: the point where you believe this type of thing really

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Speaker 5: was happening? And then how did that affect your world paradigm?

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Speaker 5: And does it change the nature of your whole view

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Speaker 5: of reality? How was that?

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Speaker 4: You know?

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Speaker 1: That's such a great question, and it's been as I

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Speaker 1: suspect it is for a lot of people. It's been complex,

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Speaker 1: Like it's really hard to say exactly at what point

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Speaker 1: the flip totally like the switch totally flipped for me,

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Speaker 1: because I think that there was a point where, like

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Speaker 1: I recognized that there was something to the UFO phenomenon

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Speaker 1: and got really obsessed. But over time, you know, it

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Speaker 1: takes time for your mind to kind of open up

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Speaker 1: to these things. And I think a lot of people

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Speaker 1: have the experience that when they start, they're like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: clearly there's something going on here, and I'm going to

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Speaker 1: look into it, but I'm not going to consider abductions

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Speaker 1: or I'm not going to consider, you know, telepathic content.

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Speaker 1: Everybody draws their line in the sand somewhere else in

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Speaker 1: terms of like what they're willing to consider and what

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Speaker 1: they're own what they're not willing to consider. And so

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Speaker 1: over the last few years, I think that I have

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Speaker 1: had that goalpost continually move as based on what I've read,

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Speaker 1: based on my own experiences, and also really based on

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Speaker 1: getting to know other experiencers and understanding that there are

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Speaker 1: extraordinarily intelligent, very highly functioning, completely non crazy people who

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Speaker 1: have some stories that sound very very crazy. And so

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Speaker 1: I think in a lot of ways, it's been it's

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Speaker 1: been a slow process having this kind of a paradigm

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Speaker 1: shift in your life. It happens slowly and all at

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Speaker 1: once kind of at the same time. It's hard to

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Speaker 1: like point to an exact moment to say, like that

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Speaker 1: was the moment that I fully recognized that this was real,

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Speaker 1: because even after having my own profound experiences, it takes

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Speaker 1: a process of integration, right, and to even recognize that

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Speaker 1: something happened to yourself. But over time, the way that

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Speaker 1: that's really changed my perspective on the world is that

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Speaker 1: I think that I've just come to realize that there's

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Speaker 1: a lot more to human experience than we're being told,

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Speaker 1: and that those parts that we've sort of amputated from

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Speaker 1: our human experience and that we don't recognize and that

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Speaker 1: we don't recognize as valid are actually some of the

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Speaker 1: most important parts of what it means to be a human.

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Speaker 1: Because once you start to let those things in and

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Speaker 1: you start to consider them, and you start to take

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Speaker 1: your own anomaloust experiences seriously, it opens your world up

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Speaker 1: and you start to think differently, and you start to

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Speaker 1: care more about you know, not just about this subject,

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Speaker 1: but about being a good part and what your impact

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Speaker 1: is on the world, and like the things that matter

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Speaker 1: and like loving your family and these like really basic

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Speaker 1: things suddenly become come to the forefront in your life,

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Speaker 1: which is a kind of a counterintuitive thing that happens.

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Speaker 1: But I know it's not just me. This happens to

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Speaker 1: almost everyone I talk to you it gets involved in

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Speaker 1: this subject. So it's been a really it's been the

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Speaker 1: most incredible experience of my life, to be honest, and

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Speaker 1: I'm just so grateful to have been on this journey.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, it's interesting you mentioned that about it's intelligent people

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Speaker 5: that have had these experiences that you've talked with. When

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Speaker 5: we hear the experts and the people that the psychiatrists

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Speaker 5: and psychologists who've talked to these people, they say, it's

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Speaker 5: all walks of life, from big name celebrities to doctors, lawyers,

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Speaker 5: the works. It's right across the board. It doesn't discriminate,

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Speaker 5: it doesn't discern who's having these experiences, which is fascinating,

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Speaker 5: and I wanted to ask you that how have you

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Speaker 5: seen how these experiences have tended to affect other people's lives.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's really fascinating because I think because

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Speaker 1: of the nature of my podcast, where it's for people

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Speaker 1: who are newer to the topic, that I end up

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Speaker 1: hearing from a lot of people who are new to it,

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Speaker 1: and then I get to sort of see them on

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Speaker 1: their own journey. And you know, I actually just got

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Speaker 1: a text message this morning from somebody that I had

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Speaker 1: talked two months ago, who, as a result of getting

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Speaker 1: into this topic, started asking these bigger questions about, like,

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Speaker 1: you know, not just what is the UFO phenomenon, but

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Speaker 1: who am I? And why am I here? And what

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Speaker 1: is my purpose and ended up making a whole life

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Speaker 1: change and now is working for an organization that raises

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Speaker 1: money for climate change initiatives. And he texted me today

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Speaker 1: just to say like, thank you, and I'm so feeling

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Speaker 1: so fulfilled in my new work and all of that,

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Speaker 1: which which I don't really even feel like I can

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Speaker 1: take credit for. I feel like there's something about the

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Speaker 1: phenomenon itself that when you engage with it, it transforms

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Speaker 1: your life in a way that is really profound. And

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Speaker 1: so I think seeing that process play out, and I've

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Speaker 1: seen this process play out probably hundreds of times now

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Speaker 1: with people that I've met, and that to me is

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Speaker 1: probably the most fulfilling and exciting part of this work

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Speaker 1: and why I keep doing it.

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Speaker 5: That was a very positive answer. I guess I was

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Speaker 5: expecting you to say how oftentimes these sort of experiences

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Speaker 5: can also ruin people's lives. I often hear of people

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Speaker 5: who have had a let's say, an abduction experience or

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Speaker 5: some sort of experience like that, they end up divorced,

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Speaker 5: they end up losing their job. It can be very

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Speaker 5: difficult for many of these people, right.

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Speaker 1: Oh, absolutely absolutely, And I think what's so important is

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Speaker 1: that these conversations and like the community that we're all

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Speaker 1: building together is so important because when people don't have

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Speaker 1: when something like this happens and you don't have a community,

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Speaker 1: and you don't have any context, and you don't have

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Speaker 1: anywhere to take this thing that happened to you, it

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Speaker 1: can be extraordinarily destabilizing. It can be extraordinarily isolating. It

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Speaker 1: can you know, rip apart families and people lost their jobs,

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Speaker 1: people have lost their lives over this. And so you know,

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Speaker 1: that's why I think it's so important that we continue

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Speaker 1: to have these conversations just talk about it, but that

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Speaker 1: wese form communities and we start to also form like

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Speaker 1: frameworks for integration, for understanding what might be going on here,

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Speaker 1: so that people have a place to talk about it

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Speaker 1: in a way to talk about it, because I think

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Speaker 1: that when we're able to integrate these things and we're

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Speaker 1: not just having to reject them outright or hide them

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Speaker 1: or like keep it as our dirty little secret, it

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Speaker 1: can have this like really beautifully transformational effect, Whereas when

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Speaker 1: we have to bury it, it has this like corrosive effect.

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Speaker 1: And so I think that that's why, you know, that's

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Speaker 1: why I'm so passionate about this work.

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Speaker 5: No doubt. I think that now that things are a

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Speaker 5: little bit more opened up than they were, say, thirty

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Speaker 5: forty fifty years ago, that there are places for them

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Speaker 5: to go, there are places for them to congregate and

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Speaker 5: share their stories. I'm sure that gives them a lot

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Speaker 5: of satisfaction and comfort, which is wonderful. When we come back,

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Speaker 5: we're going to talk to Kelly about how she shifts

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Speaker 5: through all of this different misinformation and disinformation to get

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Speaker 5: to what's really going on out there. You are listening

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Speaker 5: to Beyond Contact on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

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Speaker 5: AM Paranormal podcast network. We are back on Beyond Contact

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Speaker 5: and I'm talking with Kelly Chase right now. Kelly, I

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Speaker 5: wanted to ask you that how do you navigate this

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Speaker 5: immense amount of material that's out there. There's a lot

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Speaker 5: of misinformation, there's a lot of disinformation, there's a lot

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Speaker 5: of speculation. How do you navigate all this to get

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Speaker 5: to what your version of what you think is happening

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Speaker 5: is happening.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it really is tough. And I think that kind

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Speaker 1: of the first part of navigating this is having a

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Speaker 1: really deep humility. And I think that that for me,

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Speaker 1: that came about pretty naturally, just because I had such

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Speaker 1: a profound shift in my worldview. Like you said, before

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Speaker 1: I was in I didn't believe in any of this stuff.

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Speaker 1: I didn't believe in anything wo I didn't even believe

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Speaker 1: in God. And so to have had my worldview shift

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Speaker 1: so profoundly, it kind of gives you this natural humility

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Speaker 1: because you realize how that you've been wrong before and

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Speaker 1: that you could be wrong again, and that you're only

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Speaker 1: ever kind of one data point away from having to

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Speaker 1: like scrap it all and start over. And so I

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Speaker 1: think that like staying in that place is probably the

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Speaker 1: most important part. And it's hard to do because we

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Speaker 1: as humans really want to be certain, like we really

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Speaker 1: want to feel like we have the right answer, and

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Speaker 1: it's hard to kind of stay in that space of

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Speaker 1: humility and saying like, I don't actually know, And so

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Speaker 1: a lot of what I do is I will I

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Speaker 1: will read just about anything on this topic, and I've

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Speaker 1: actually will go to the point where I intentionally read

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Speaker 1: things that people are like, oh, that since a scam

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Speaker 1: artist or that's trash, you shouldn't read that. You know,

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Speaker 1: maybe I'll feel that way after I've read it too,

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Speaker 1: but I think that like you at least have to

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Speaker 1: give it a shot, right, But for the most part,

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Speaker 1: I try to take in as much information as I

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Speaker 1: can from as many different sources as possible, and to

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Speaker 1: try to connect the dots where where I can, and

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Speaker 1: to notice patterns where they emerge. But there is always

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Speaker 1: sort of this decision tree thing going on in my

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Speaker 1: brain where you know, if you don't if I don't

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Speaker 1: actually know something is true, which is for most of

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Speaker 1: this subject is like most of the things about it,

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Speaker 1: you can't really know if it's true or not. You

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Speaker 1: kind of have to hold that intention and say like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: so if this is true, then these other things are

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Speaker 1: also likely true. But if it's not true, then those

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Speaker 1: things probably aren't true. In this other set of things,

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Speaker 1: is probably true, and so there's this kind of like

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Speaker 1: web that's created of like all of these different contingencies,

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Speaker 1: and so like, I can't say that I know for

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Speaker 1: sure that I'm getting the best information or that my

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Speaker 1: ideas are the best ideas. All I can do is

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Speaker 1: try to stay like as intellectually honest as possible about

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Speaker 1: what I actually know and what is just sort of

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Speaker 1: like an idea that sounds right or that I like,

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Speaker 1: or that maybe connects these dots in a way that's satisfying,

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Speaker 1: but that might not actually be the case. And so

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Speaker 1: you know, I think there's very little that I can

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Speaker 1: say about the UFO phenomenon that I can say for

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Speaker 1: sure is I know to be a fact. And I

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Speaker 1: think that you just sort of have to to sit

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Speaker 1: in that place and allow yourself to know that you

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Speaker 1: don't know, and that allows you to kind of remain

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Speaker 1: flexible and skeptical enough in your thinking.

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Speaker 5: I think that's really really critically important. It certainly is

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Speaker 5: from my view. I feel that the more people say

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Speaker 5: that they know what's going on, the less they know

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Speaker 5: what's going on, because it's just not it's an unknown

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Speaker 5: that's what we're dealing with here. But I do like

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Speaker 5: to get closer to it, and I do like when

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Speaker 5: I have corroborating evidence, when I have multiple witnesses seeing

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Speaker 5: the same thing, saying the same thing. Obviously, these one

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Speaker 5: off cases, it doesn't mean they're not true, it doesn't

435
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:08,000
Speaker 5: mean that person didn't have that experience. But it is

436
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:11,000
Speaker 5: harder for me and certainly people outside this community to

437
00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:15,040
Speaker 5: accept those things because that's that's a wild story, you know.

438
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:18,120
Speaker 5: But some of these, like the doctor David Jacob's work,

439
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:22,639
Speaker 5: you know, he sees the same story over and over

440
00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:26,480
Speaker 5: from all walks of life. That's pretty compelling no matter

441
00:23:26,520 --> 00:23:29,639
Speaker 5: who you are. That's a data set, and people disregard

442
00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:32,159
Speaker 5: that data. We were talking about the evidence earlier. What

443
00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:34,720
Speaker 5: about the data that people like him have collected. I've

444
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,600
Speaker 5: got two thousand people from every walk of life saying

445
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:40,200
Speaker 5: that this happened to him, and nine hundred of them

446
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:43,119
Speaker 5: are word for word. That's something to me, just a

447
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:45,520
Speaker 5: normal rational way of thinking is like, well, wait a minute,

448
00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:48,400
Speaker 5: what something's going on. I don't know that it's alien,

449
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:51,719
Speaker 5: I don't know what it is, but something right. Let

450
00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:54,439
Speaker 5: me ask you this, have you noticed a change? Not

451
00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:56,359
Speaker 5: you personally, but if you noticed a change when you

452
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,959
Speaker 5: were researching these books and things in the overall thinking

453
00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 5: in this area with respect to extraterrestrial beings in the

454
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:06,639
Speaker 5: way it was perceived like in the forties and fifties

455
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:10,119
Speaker 5: and then the seventies, eighties, and then you know today,

456
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:13,080
Speaker 5: like we've seen kind of an evolution, right, how has

457
00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:14,800
Speaker 5: that changed for you? Have you noticed?

458
00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:15,440
Speaker 3: Yeah?

459
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:18,359
Speaker 1: I think the evolution of how it's changed in our

460
00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,960
Speaker 1: kind of cultural perspective is fascinating and really important to

461
00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:24,080
Speaker 1: understand because I think people tend to think that like

462
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:28,000
Speaker 1: whatever their initial impression is of UFOs, just from what

463
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:30,280
Speaker 1: they've gotten from the media or whatever they know casually,

464
00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:32,360
Speaker 1: is sort of the whole picture, and it's really it's

465
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:35,520
Speaker 1: really not. And you know, going back to you know,

466
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:38,359
Speaker 1: the late nineteen forties, you know when this sort of

467
00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:42,640
Speaker 1: modern UFO phenomenon kind of came into prominence. Back then,

468
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:46,040
Speaker 1: it wasn't it wasn't assumed it was aliens at all. Actually,

469
00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:49,080
Speaker 1: that was like one of many hypotheses, including that, you know,

470
00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:53,239
Speaker 1: it was perhaps Soviet technology. And there's also a lot

471
00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:55,679
Speaker 1: of people who thought maybe these were coming from you know,

472
00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 1: the inner Earth, from like a hollow Earth kind of

473
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:00,240
Speaker 1: scenario that were all kinds of different ideas of what

474
00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:02,280
Speaker 1: could have been going on. And I've kind of made

475
00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:04,920
Speaker 1: a habit of when I go into use bookstores, I'll

476
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:08,360
Speaker 1: buy like any UFO book that was written before nineteen

477
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 1: seventy five, because I don't care what it is or

478
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,800
Speaker 1: who or who wrote it, because you know, back then

479
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:17,040
Speaker 1: it was before we kind of had these more solidified

480
00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:19,840
Speaker 1: ideas of what was going on. And it's really fascinating

481
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 1: how differently people thought about it back then, because then

482
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:24,639
Speaker 1: you move forward and we have you sort of have

483
00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:27,199
Speaker 1: like the beginning of the Contact d movement, but a

484
00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:31,200
Speaker 1: lot of those contact e's were talking to entities that

485
00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 1: looked human or appeared to be human or near human,

486
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:38,080
Speaker 1: you know, kind of the Space Brothers situation. But then

487
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:41,000
Speaker 1: the Space Brothers kind of like disappeared, and you know,

488
00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:43,840
Speaker 1: after sort of the era of Betty and Barney Hill,

489
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:46,400
Speaker 1: we suddenly get into more of you know, abductions, and

490
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 1: sort of the Grays began to become more of the

491
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 1: kind of arc type of what we were dealing with here.

492
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,480
Speaker 1: And so even like the face of who we imagined

493
00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:58,160
Speaker 1: to be or who actually was inside of the UFOs

494
00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:02,760
Speaker 1: has has changed over time, and I find that really

495
00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:06,760
Speaker 1: fascinating how we've kind of changed our perspective on who

496
00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:08,520
Speaker 1: these people are. Like before we thought they were coming

497
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:10,880
Speaker 1: from from Venus and now they're coming from like Zeta

498
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:13,879
Speaker 1: Reticuli or something like that, and those things seem to

499
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:17,919
Speaker 1: align with our own technological awareness and our awareness of

500
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,640
Speaker 1: the universe around us and what's Yeah.

501
00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:23,359
Speaker 5: But to me, doesn't this hurt the whole credibility of it?

502
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:27,159
Speaker 5: Because if it's real, why wouldn't the first abductee or

503
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 5: contact ee say is coming from Zata Reticuli. Why did

504
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:33,800
Speaker 5: they say it's coming from Mars Because they were influenced

505
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,639
Speaker 5: by movies or culture or whatever, And now all of

506
00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:39,720
Speaker 5: a sudden, they're coming from this other star system. That

507
00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:43,480
Speaker 5: is something that I think hurts the credibility of these claims.

508
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:45,640
Speaker 5: And it's like in Whitley Strieber's book where he talks

509
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:51,119
Speaker 5: about cases of way back, way way back, where people

510
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,000
Speaker 5: told stories of little beings coming down from the trees

511
00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:57,479
Speaker 5: and they called them fairies and they were short, bald,

512
00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 5: big eyes, almond shaped eyes. You know, it was through

513
00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 5: their lens that they were using. And they call them

514
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:06,880
Speaker 5: ferries or they call them gnomes or whatever. They had

515
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 5: their terms for them. And then you read a passage

516
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 5: from an abductee case in the nineties and it's very

517
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:17,280
Speaker 5: very similar to something written a thousand years earlier, but

518
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 5: we see it through the lens of space age technology

519
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 5: and travel through the universe.

520
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 1: So yeah, absolutely, I mean, I think what's I think

521
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:28,440
Speaker 1: what's really interesting about the phenomenon itself is that it

522
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 1: it does seem to be inherently deceptive, Like there's something

523
00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:38,480
Speaker 1: about it that undermines it, Like the phenomenon undermines itself

524
00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:42,240
Speaker 1: that like undermines its own credibility. There are things about

525
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 1: it that that just don't make sense. And it does

526
00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:48,639
Speaker 1: seem that when we encounter these things, we tend to

527
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:52,240
Speaker 1: encounter things in a way that fits with our current

528
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:54,639
Speaker 1: cultural paradigm. You know, even going back to like the

529
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,560
Speaker 1: airship flaps of that, you know, eighteen nineties, or you

530
00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,879
Speaker 1: had these like weird dirigible looking things like propellers and

531
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:04,160
Speaker 1: weird things like that. You know, that was what people

532
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,320
Speaker 1: were seeing in the sky. And so you know, what

533
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:08,720
Speaker 1: is that It's hard to tell in it. To me,

534
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:11,280
Speaker 1: it hints at a lot of things that are potentially

535
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:14,800
Speaker 1: really interesting, like something that could potentially pack our perception,

536
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:19,119
Speaker 1: or something that is intentionally presenting itself to us in

537
00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:21,720
Speaker 1: a certain way that we can maybe that we can understand,

538
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:25,479
Speaker 1: or that is maybe intentionally trying to hide its own source.

539
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:28,120
Speaker 1: And then when you mix that up with government misinformation

540
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 1: and everything else that happens, you kind of have this

541
00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:34,040
Speaker 1: like absurd tapestry of these stories and it's really hard

542
00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:36,679
Speaker 1: to make sense of, like what exactly is the reality

543
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 1: behind these things? What is that? And I don't think

544
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:40,960
Speaker 1: we have any kind of a good answer for that.

545
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 5: I agree, and I think if there's some government involvement,

546
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:45,960
Speaker 5: they want it that way. They would like it to

547
00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 5: be a mess. They want us to not know what's

548
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 5: going on. Speaking of the government, when we come back,

549
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 5: we're going to ask Kelly what her thoughts are on

550
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 5: government disclosure or the Big D disclosure. You're listening to

551
00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:59,960
Speaker 5: Beyond Contact on iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal

552
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 5: Podcast Network. We are back on Beyond Contact with Captain Ron.

553
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:26,640
Speaker 5: I'm talking to Kelly Chase, and now we're going to

554
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 5: talk about government disclosure. Kelly, even if our government makes

555
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 5: this announcement, everyone seems to have their own definition of

556
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:37,520
Speaker 5: what quote unquote disclosure is and what it'll take for

557
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,200
Speaker 5: them to believe that this is real. I do think

558
00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:42,440
Speaker 5: on this issue, most people have made up their mind.

559
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 5: They don't typically say, well, I'm open. They don't. It's

560
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:48,920
Speaker 5: like in today's politics, the vast majority of people are

561
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,840
Speaker 5: dug in. It doesn't matter what their candidate says, doesn't

562
00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 5: matter what he does, They've made up their mind. They're

563
00:29:54,520 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 5: voting for this guy. I find the same thing here

564
00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:00,160
Speaker 5: in the UFO community. We get a new, great documentary

565
00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:03,240
Speaker 5: with all this new witnesses that came forward, and people

566
00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 5: inside the community get even more excited and they feel like, wow,

567
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:09,920
Speaker 5: there's even more evidence to support my belief. But people

568
00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:13,680
Speaker 5: outside the community just dismiss it. Like everything else. Very

569
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,880
Speaker 5: rarely is there something that moves the needle or sways

570
00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:19,200
Speaker 5: people from one side to the other. We did have

571
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:21,440
Speaker 5: that back in twenty seventeen with the New York Times

572
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:23,880
Speaker 5: article and the videos and all of that. That was

573
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:27,280
Speaker 5: truly a watershed moment for this community. But since then

574
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:30,239
Speaker 5: I've seen very little that's actually made a difference in

575
00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:33,600
Speaker 5: people's core beliefs. So much so, in fact, that you

576
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:36,480
Speaker 5: start to realize that disclosure can mean so many things.

577
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 5: For some people, I don't even know why they need

578
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:42,280
Speaker 5: to have this formal disclosure anyway. I'm not sure we

579
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:44,040
Speaker 5: need to hear it from the government for it to

580
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:46,920
Speaker 5: be real. For others, it would take the President of

581
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 5: the United States to say this is real, show the craft,

582
00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:53,840
Speaker 5: show the bodies, and then some would still not believe it.

583
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 1: What do you think, Yeah, I mean, I think we're

584
00:30:56,000 --> 00:31:00,479
Speaker 1: in this really interesting space with this because one thing

585
00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:04,680
Speaker 1: that the government has done really successfully, and something that

586
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:08,760
Speaker 1: I think is a downside of the disclosure movement in

587
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:12,200
Speaker 1: a way, is that we were in this position where

588
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 1: we feel like we are we're sitting here like with

589
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: our handout, waiting for the government to tell us what's

590
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 1: going on here, and that puts in a lot of

591
00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 1: ways that we're like giving up our own agency because

592
00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 1: we're relying on somebody else to tell us what's true.

593
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,280
Speaker 1: And the reality of the UFO phenomenon is that it's everywhere.

594
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 1: There have been, you know, millions of sightings around the

595
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:38,400
Speaker 1: world by all kinds of people in all walks of life.

596
00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 1: And sure, maybe the government has some craft and maybe

597
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:46,520
Speaker 1: even bodies in some like underground bunker somewhere, but what

598
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:50,000
Speaker 1: they can't do is lock up the UFO phenomenon underground,

599
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:52,680
Speaker 1: Like they can't own it, they can't possess it, they

600
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:55,880
Speaker 1: can't keep it from us. And there's absolutely nothing that's

601
00:31:55,960 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 1: keeping everyday people from going out and investigating this on

602
00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 1: their own and deciding what they think that you can't

603
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 1: it's part of the nature of our reality. It's a

604
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 1: very integral part of human experience that we can see

605
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,160
Speaker 1: going back thousands of years in various ways and in

606
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 1: various forms, and so like, this isn't something that they

607
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 1: can keep from us. And so as much as I

608
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:19,760
Speaker 1: support disclosure, and I do think that like fundamentally, if

609
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 1: there is such thing as an inalienable right, I think

610
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:26,080
Speaker 1: that the right to understand the nature of our reality

611
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 1: is perhaps one of the most fundamental and so like,

612
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 1: of course, I you know, support transparency and disclosure, but

613
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:35,360
Speaker 1: I do worry that like that has become the only

614
00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:38,440
Speaker 1: conversation in the UFO community that at all, Like, if

615
00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:40,719
Speaker 1: it doesn't come from the government, if it doesn't have

616
00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:43,560
Speaker 1: that stamp of approval, if there isn't some military you know,

617
00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:47,600
Speaker 1: video that has like a strict provenance, then we don't

618
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:50,680
Speaker 1: have like permission to consider it, and I just kind

619
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:53,160
Speaker 1: of like reject that idea, and I hope that we're

620
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:57,760
Speaker 1: able to reclaim ufology as something separate from the disclosure movement.

621
00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:00,560
Speaker 5: I agree one hundred and fifty percent is exactly right.

622
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:02,840
Speaker 5: I don't know why we need that. That's why they

623
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 5: put out these nonsense things like from Arrow, oh there's

624
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:08,000
Speaker 5: nothing to see here, even though we've talked directly with

625
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:10,400
Speaker 5: people who have given them evidence and then they say

626
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:12,800
Speaker 5: there is no evidence. It would have been much stronger

627
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 5: for Arrow to come out and just say, you know,

628
00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,200
Speaker 5: there is some things we can't explain, or some things

629
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:22,520
Speaker 5: are unknown, but we don't see any direct positive something

630
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:25,280
Speaker 5: like that, instead of just a blanket no, not now,

631
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 5: I don't even trust you at all. It just made

632
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 5: no sense to me. The thing is, this is such

633
00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 5: a complex issue. It's so much more than I think

634
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:38,000
Speaker 5: most people realize. It's hard because unlike other topics, we

635
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:40,880
Speaker 5: can't know the truth, or at least the whole truth.

636
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 5: All of this is an unknown and we're just trying

637
00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 5: to get a little more understanding. It's not like if

638
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:49,160
Speaker 5: we find an artifactor, we find something, we can go, oh,

639
00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 5: here's the answer, as in certain discoveries made in other

640
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 5: disciplines you find the answer. Let's say tomorrow morning, you

641
00:33:56,600 --> 00:34:00,719
Speaker 5: and I find a craft buried in your backyard. Number One,

642
00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:03,600
Speaker 5: we wouldn't believe it. Number Two, If we got it

643
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 5: checked out and we prove that this metal can't be

644
00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:10,720
Speaker 5: made here on earth, the vast majority of people would

645
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 5: still not believe it. Even then, all of this, all

646
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:17,560
Speaker 5: it really does is open up more questions. Who built this,

647
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 5: where are they from, Where are they, why are they here?

648
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:23,040
Speaker 5: What happened to them? It's not like any of these

649
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:24,840
Speaker 5: are simple answers, you know what I'm saying?

650
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:28,239
Speaker 1: Oh? Absolutely, I mean I think that I think that

651
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:30,520
Speaker 1: it would be difficult even if they if the President

652
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:32,759
Speaker 1: got on TV and said UFOs are real and we

653
00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:35,600
Speaker 1: have bodies, and they rolled out the bodies, I think

654
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:38,440
Speaker 1: it would be really difficult even for people like you

655
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 1: and me to accept that, like that that was real,

656
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:43,799
Speaker 1: because like, how do you know? And it seems kind

657
00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:46,840
Speaker 1: of crazy. We're and we're also at this kind of

658
00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,839
Speaker 1: crisis point. I think is a culture in terms of

659
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 1: the extent to which we trust kind of the government

660
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:56,640
Speaker 1: and legacy institutions and like authority in general. I think

661
00:34:56,640 --> 00:34:58,319
Speaker 1: that people are just kind of catching on to the

662
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 1: fact that, like, not just with the UFO phomenon, but

663
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 1: with a lot of other things that we have been

664
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:07,360
Speaker 1: intentionally misled. And so the president can get on television

665
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:09,960
Speaker 1: and say almost anything, and half of the country is

666
00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 1: going to believe him, and the other half is going

667
00:35:11,640 --> 00:35:15,200
Speaker 1: to say absolutely not. And so we don't have a

668
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 1: good place, like a good We can't even really rely

669
00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 1: on the government for this sort of like consensus understanding

670
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:23,480
Speaker 1: of what our reality is anymore anyways, And so you know,

671
00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:25,400
Speaker 1: I don't know that our end goal even really should

672
00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 1: be the president getting on television and confirming this one

673
00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:29,959
Speaker 1: way or another, because I don't know that that's going

674
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:31,240
Speaker 1: to be helpful.

675
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 5: It's an interesting proposition. And then you know, we have

676
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:38,120
Speaker 5: these things about the bodies they found in Brazil and Peru,

677
00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:41,880
Speaker 5: they got these mummies. Well, obviously most of us immediately

678
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:44,719
Speaker 5: dismissed that as nonsense and silly, and now it looks

679
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:47,040
Speaker 5: like there's something to it. I don't think that as aliens.

680
00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 5: I don't think most people think it's quote unquote alien

681
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 5: off planet. But they may in fact be real biological

682
00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:55,320
Speaker 5: beings of some kind. They could be you know, little

683
00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:58,479
Speaker 5: monkeys or some sort of thing that we even maybe

684
00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 5: another you know, branch of humanity in some way, but

685
00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:04,560
Speaker 5: they may in fact be real. It looks like, now

686
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:07,560
Speaker 5: there might be something to it, but immediately we dismissed that.

687
00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:10,320
Speaker 5: As soon as I heard that, I just literally physically

688
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:13,279
Speaker 5: laughed because they kind of made it sound like they

689
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:15,040
Speaker 5: were alien in nature, you know, and they have the

690
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:17,400
Speaker 5: big heads and the whole thing. So of course, you know,

691
00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:20,360
Speaker 5: that's our knee jerk reaction. And I'm knee deep in

692
00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:22,840
Speaker 5: this stuff. You can imagine how the rest of the

693
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:25,239
Speaker 5: world heard of it. They were just like, oh, that's silliness.

694
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:29,719
Speaker 5: So it's going to be very hard to overcome these things.

695
00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:31,799
Speaker 5: And I think even if the president comes out like

696
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 5: you're saying, I don't know if that's a good thing

697
00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 5: or a bad thing. I mean that the whole world

698
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 5: would change, of course. And then what if a president

699
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:41,840
Speaker 5: from another country comes out. Does it have the same impact.

700
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:45,760
Speaker 5: How many people in America would change their belief Because

701
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:49,040
Speaker 5: the Brazilian president came out and said we have alien

702
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:52,920
Speaker 5: bodies and craft. I think that's a low number. You

703
00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:55,080
Speaker 5: just said that. If our president said a lot of

704
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 5: people wouldn't believe. Imagine if another country discloses, because this

705
00:36:59,239 --> 00:37:03,000
Speaker 5: is a worldwide phenomenon. You're right that they have recovered

706
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:06,200
Speaker 5: craft supposedly, and if they do, they'll probably be able

707
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:11,080
Speaker 5: to protect that intellectual property in that technology. But they can't,

708
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:15,240
Speaker 5: like you're saying, cover up this phenomenon because it's happening

709
00:37:15,239 --> 00:37:18,399
Speaker 5: to citizens of the world. Throughout the world, people are

710
00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:22,960
Speaker 5: dealing with this. They're doing it firsthand and directly, not

711
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:25,840
Speaker 5: through a government or anything like that. So the governments

712
00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:29,000
Speaker 5: of the world can't really truly stop this. As far

713
00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:31,200
Speaker 5: as we know, We're going to have to stop there

714
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 5: for today. We will be back next week with part

715
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:37,280
Speaker 5: two of this interview with Kelly Chase. Thanks so much, Kelly,

716
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:40,360
Speaker 5: I really enjoyed this conversation. I appreciate all your information.

717
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:43,720
Speaker 5: It's really fantastic. Thanks again, and thank you for listening

718
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:47,080
Speaker 5: to Beyond Contact. You can follow me Captain Ron on

719
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 5: Twitter and Instagram at CID underscore Captain Ron. Stay connected

720
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,760
Speaker 5: by checking out Contact intheesert dot com. Stay open minded

721
00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:58,920
Speaker 5: and rational as we explore the unknown right here on

722
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:02,600
Speaker 5: the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast am Paranormal Podcast Network.

723
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:09,960
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

724
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:13,279
Speaker 2: am Paranormal podcast Network, make sure and check out all

725
00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:16,440
Speaker 2: our shows on the iHeartRadio app or by going to

726
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:22,840
Speaker 2: iHeartRadio dot com