1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:26,040 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:28,840 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Noel. They called 6 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:31,800 Speaker 1: me Ben. We're joined as always with our super producer 7 00:00:31,840 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: Alexis code named Doc Holiday Jackson. Most importantly, you are you. 8 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:39,440 Speaker 1: You are here, and that makes this the stuff they 9 00:00:39,520 --> 00:00:42,720 Speaker 1: don't want you to know. It's that time of the 10 00:00:42,760 --> 00:00:47,720 Speaker 1: week again, fellow conspiracy realists. We get to hear from you, 11 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:52,040 Speaker 1: and we get to share your stories with your fellow listeners. 12 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:55,800 Speaker 1: We've got some interesting stuff here, I mean we always do. 13 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:59,720 Speaker 1: We've got some great questions, We've got some strange tales 14 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,960 Speaker 1: in the land of dream, and then we've got a 15 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:08,240 Speaker 1: controversy of the cosmetic sort. I don't know about you, guys, 16 00:01:08,400 --> 00:01:10,640 Speaker 1: Matt Noel, but I'm coming off of a little bit 17 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:14,280 Speaker 1: of a Halloween hangover and I've already started counting the 18 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:17,960 Speaker 1: days down to next Halloween. I've even done a thing 19 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: on a on a different show than Nolan. I do 20 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 1: ridiculous history. Where I've been, I've been segue into Thanksgiving 21 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:27,959 Speaker 1: by saying, Hey, the Thanksgiving is horrible for some people. 22 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 1: You know that's a scary situation, right. Oh yeah, I 23 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:34,400 Speaker 1: mean just having to hang out with your you know, 24 00:01:34,720 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 1: in laws and family and all in one setting and 25 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:40,039 Speaker 1: not get into some sort of like political flame war 26 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:46,080 Speaker 1: terrifying prospect. Yeah, it's wonderful. It's wonderful spending time. So 27 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 1: there we go, there we go. That's that's very sweet. 28 00:01:50,600 --> 00:01:53,280 Speaker 1: So what we're uh, maybe what we can do for 29 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 1: some of our listener males. It's always been an exercise 30 00:01:56,600 --> 00:01:59,440 Speaker 1: and gratitude for us here on stuff. They don't want 31 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:02,680 Speaker 1: you to know you are the reason this show exists. Uh. 32 00:02:02,720 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 1: We're going to continue as we heard all headlong toward 33 00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:10,639 Speaker 1: two uh, with that spirit of thankfulness to everyone who 34 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:13,799 Speaker 1: wrote in, and we want to encourage you. We only 35 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:15,720 Speaker 1: do about three or four of these every week, but 36 00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 1: we would encourage you to write in because, as we 37 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:21,840 Speaker 1: always say, we hear every voicemail we get, we read 38 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 1: every email you send, uh, and we cannot wait to 39 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:31,280 Speaker 1: hear from specifically you, Yes, you, specifically you listening, especially 40 00:02:31,720 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 1: if your name is add because Ann, you wrote to 41 00:02:36,720 --> 00:02:40,799 Speaker 1: us to say the following this is a good one. 42 00:02:40,840 --> 00:02:44,560 Speaker 1: I think we'll all enjoy this. Hey, Ben, Noel, and Matt. 43 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 1: I'm a long time listener since the YouTube days, but 44 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: first time writer. I love the show. Thank you for 45 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 1: all the hard work you put into the show and 46 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:54,639 Speaker 1: creating content five days a week. I have a request. 47 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:58,400 Speaker 1: I recently learned about the topic of the metic warfare. 48 00:02:58,560 --> 00:03:02,520 Speaker 1: That's m E M E T. I see like meme. 49 00:03:02,919 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: Memetic warfare is a form of psychological and political warfare 50 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 1: using memes. Information and disinformation is spread via memes in 51 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:15,400 Speaker 1: order to persuade the public to create disunity and or discord. 52 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:19,440 Speaker 1: Memetic warfare is the more efficient and sustainable solution to 53 00:03:19,639 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 1: traditional boots on the ground warfare. The theory is that 54 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:28,840 Speaker 1: by indirectly infiltrating a nation through disinformation, this dissemination weakens 55 00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:33,080 Speaker 1: the nation. Consequently, the country is divided and cannot unify 56 00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 1: behind any belief. Ben, you have touched on this topic 57 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 1: of disinformation regards to anti vaccine support. It begs us 58 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:43,640 Speaker 1: to ask the question who or what is behind a 59 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:47,280 Speaker 1: certain agenda, is the information authentic and how can you 60 00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:50,920 Speaker 1: verify the source? Memetics ties in nicely with your recent 61 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:53,960 Speaker 1: episodes on spies. I hope you consider doing a deep 62 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:57,640 Speaker 1: dive into memetic warfare. Thank you for your balanced approach 63 00:03:57,680 --> 00:04:01,920 Speaker 1: to the conspiracy realm, and happy how Halloween, and happy 64 00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:04,760 Speaker 1: Halloween to you, and hope you had a good one. Uh, 65 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:07,440 Speaker 1: this is this is something. Look, it's still a secret 66 00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:11,640 Speaker 1: that we all all of us here doc Mission Control, 67 00:04:11,880 --> 00:04:14,920 Speaker 1: nol Matt myself, we all enjoy a good meme and 68 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:17,479 Speaker 1: if we see one that's especially funny, we send it 69 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:20,560 Speaker 1: to each other after hours and stuff. Sometimes we've even 70 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:23,600 Speaker 1: stopped the show to be like, hey, look at this. 71 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:30,720 Speaker 1: Uh what was it recently? Oh is the Cathulu turkey. 72 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:33,560 Speaker 1: It's like, stop, we have to look at this. Of 73 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:36,000 Speaker 1: the two you showed, the second one actually had a 74 00:04:36,080 --> 00:04:38,760 Speaker 1: nice kind of crisp brown skin to it, and it 75 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 1: was just the squid parts coming out, which they look 76 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:43,359 Speaker 1: pretty cooked at like a good squid as much as 77 00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:45,159 Speaker 1: the next guy, even though they are some of the 78 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:49,160 Speaker 1: most sentient intelligent sea creatures. Uh and apparently, um, it's 79 00:04:49,279 --> 00:04:51,920 Speaker 1: very you've seen my octopus teacher. Not the best thing 80 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:54,400 Speaker 1: to eat probably, But the other one then was absolutely 81 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 1: nightmare fuel had had crab legs spilling out like very 82 00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 1: raw looking squashy octopus tentacles, and the turkey itself seemed 83 00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 1: very dry. Google eyes didn't help. But but yeah, we know, 84 00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:11,159 Speaker 1: we know that memes are important and now a day's 85 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:14,440 Speaker 1: most people in the age of the Internet define a 86 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 1: meme as you know, typically like a one panel thing 87 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:20,599 Speaker 1: that that can recur or it can be altered because 88 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:23,960 Speaker 1: it's part of a living conversation. But really a meme 89 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:28,039 Speaker 1: is just an element of culture or system of behavior 90 00:05:28,480 --> 00:05:33,040 Speaker 1: that can be passed from one individual to another by 91 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:36,760 Speaker 1: non genetic means. So that would be like um, a 92 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:41,000 Speaker 1: meme is almost any unit of an idea. If we 93 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:44,080 Speaker 1: all just started saying I want to be positive not 94 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 1: negative here. If we all, just, for instance, started saying, um, 95 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:51,040 Speaker 1: as an old one on the show Vibes is a 96 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:54,719 Speaker 1: great movie starring Jeff Goldbloom, then we would be communicating 97 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:59,599 Speaker 1: this meme. Memes are inherently contagious, they exist to be shared, 98 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:05,240 Speaker 1: and in the age of information warfare, they have been weaponized. 99 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 1: For an I'd like to recommend excellent article on the 100 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 1: New York Times that answers some of your questions Russian 101 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:17,480 Speaker 1: disinformation targets, vaccines and the Biden administration. This is by 102 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 1: Julian E. Barnes. This is just one example the The 103 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:26,440 Speaker 1: practice here is two fold. The first goal is to 104 00:06:27,279 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: is for the Russian government to promote its own meme 105 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:34,440 Speaker 1: uh nut memes, its own vaccines uh and to do so, 106 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:38,080 Speaker 1: they also are pursuing the second goal, which is to 107 00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:42,800 Speaker 1: discredit vaccine programs from the US and from Western Europe. 108 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 1: And one of the reasons this stuff is so successful 109 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:50,920 Speaker 1: is because it hinges on a very simple idea. You 110 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:54,320 Speaker 1: can make people laugh and you can be anonymous through 111 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:57,560 Speaker 1: the use of memes. I mean, sure, people can slap 112 00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:00,520 Speaker 1: a watermark on there, and you know, we all have friends, 113 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:03,159 Speaker 1: I'm sure who feel like their meme was stolen the 114 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:07,480 Speaker 1: meme that they reposted got stolen. Okay. But but what 115 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:11,520 Speaker 1: we see here is something very valuable to the world 116 00:07:11,520 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 1: of asymmetric warfare. We've talked about asymmetric warfare in the past. 117 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:18,880 Speaker 1: The idea in its extreme is basically something like this. 118 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 1: Let's say let's say uh, Matt is in charge of 119 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 1: a country that doesn't have an aircraft carrier. Matt, would 120 00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 1: you rather spend untold billions of dollars building an outdated 121 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 1: aircraft carrier to try to fight the eleven that the 122 00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 1: US has a rather or or choose wisely, my friends, 123 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:50,160 Speaker 1: or would you rather spend let's say, a couple of 124 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 1: hundred one point five billion building missiles that can out 125 00:07:55,240 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 1: maneuver and destroy an aircraft carrier. M hmm, I'm gonna 126 00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:06,680 Speaker 1: go with c trained dolphins to go on suicide missions. 127 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:12,160 Speaker 1: Now I'm just choking. Yeah, the only you're right, option 128 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:15,160 Speaker 1: A doesn't make any sense, right, have one aircraft carrier 129 00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:18,280 Speaker 1: to defend yourself and or go on the offense against 130 00:08:18,280 --> 00:08:22,680 Speaker 1: eleven or twelve? Got it? Yeah, that's the basic idea. 131 00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 1: You can you can leap frog tactics even if you 132 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 1: can't leap frog technology. Leap frogging technology is when let's say, um, 133 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:36,600 Speaker 1: your primary geo political adversary is a country run by 134 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:39,720 Speaker 1: Noel and Noel you are the U S. You have 135 00:08:39,760 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 1: eleven aircraft carriers. Finally, right, you did all the research. 136 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:47,080 Speaker 1: You It's it's almost impossible to put a price on 137 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 1: the blood, sweat, tears and treasure that your country has 138 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:54,719 Speaker 1: put into these But now the secrets out and all 139 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:58,319 Speaker 1: your hard won research can be used against you as 140 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:01,080 Speaker 1: by countries run by Matt. I'm not trying to paint 141 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:04,800 Speaker 1: you as a despot. That's fine, I am. But the 142 00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:08,199 Speaker 1: thing is, as soon as I developed the you know, missiles, 143 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:13,120 Speaker 1: the aircraft killer missiles, NOLL then develops the aircraft killer 144 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:18,120 Speaker 1: missile defense system, and then it just goes on develop 145 00:09:18,160 --> 00:09:21,960 Speaker 1: the aircraft killer missile defense system, defense system, you know, 146 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:25,679 Speaker 1: and we just yeah, whatever, I mean, it's just it's 147 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:30,360 Speaker 1: it's endless. And then you guys unite when when my 148 00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 1: spacecraft lands and we start the whole game over again, 149 00:09:34,440 --> 00:09:37,120 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. It never ends, And so 150 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:40,280 Speaker 1: sounds like a good time to Me's sure it is 151 00:09:40,400 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 1: time well spent. Well, then we can start the meme 152 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:47,080 Speaker 1: campaign to that's like dece info about the air the 153 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 1: whatever your thing is where you invaded, it's not real, 154 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: and we just make means about it not being real, 155 00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:57,160 Speaker 1: right and so and this is this is amazing because 156 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 1: memes can be used as a form of asymmetrical warfare. 157 00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 1: They're used through front groups based in Russia, They're used 158 00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 1: through front groups based in China. And to be absolutely fair, 159 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:12,679 Speaker 1: it sounds like we're dunking on other countries. But make 160 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 1: no mistake, folks, the US is also actively engaged in 161 00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:21,960 Speaker 1: mimetic warfare. UH. Memes can be insidious in that they 162 00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:26,319 Speaker 1: can also slowly radicalize people. So you could, for instance, 163 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: if you wanted to, it is completely possible to um 164 00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:36,480 Speaker 1: get ahold of a user base or people who generally 165 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 1: just follow what they think is a meme account. And 166 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,440 Speaker 1: it might have a theme, right, it might be memes 167 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:44,040 Speaker 1: for US veterans or something. And then if you have 168 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:47,560 Speaker 1: control of that and the and you are anonymous, because 169 00:10:47,559 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 1: the assumption by the public, by the customers or the 170 00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 1: audience rather is that you yourself are a US veteran, right, 171 00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:59,680 Speaker 1: but you might not be. But then it's like, but 172 00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:02,280 Speaker 1: it's just to cartoon frog. What could be wrong with that? 173 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 1: You know? I mean you look at him. He's so cute, 174 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:07,080 Speaker 1: and he's smoking a cigarette and making this fun little 175 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:10,440 Speaker 1: smirk and saying all these veiled racist things. Wait a minute, 176 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 1: I've been radicalized. Yes, And there's a psychle exactly, Just so, 177 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 1: there's a psychological tendency that occurs. This is hardwired in humans. 178 00:11:21,080 --> 00:11:24,080 Speaker 1: It is a political It knows no ideology, and it 179 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:28,840 Speaker 1: is simply this. People of similar beliefs when they hang 180 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:32,840 Speaker 1: out with one another, they tend to become over time 181 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 1: more extreme and those beliefs. It does not matter what 182 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:40,120 Speaker 1: kind of belief we're talking about. Group polarization is real, 183 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:45,680 Speaker 1: and it's uh, it's weird because you can see examples 184 00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:50,080 Speaker 1: of it in almost any any kind of forum, any 185 00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:53,040 Speaker 1: kind of town hall, any kind of community, and it 186 00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:55,439 Speaker 1: doesn't does not matter what we're talking about. A lot 187 00:11:55,440 --> 00:11:58,680 Speaker 1: of people would instantly go to politics, right because we 188 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:01,959 Speaker 1: live in pretty divisive times here in the West. Part 189 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:05,719 Speaker 1: of that divisiveness, I propose, does come from the influence 190 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 1: of foreign powers, and they are using mimetic warfare. This 191 00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:15,440 Speaker 1: is taken very seriously the Rand Group, who is not perfect, 192 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 1: but the Rand Group is very intelligent. The Rand Group 193 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 1: has done a lot of work on this. You can 194 00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 1: read some of their research online right now, and they're 195 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:28,439 Speaker 1: at the level they're taking this so seriously that their 196 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:33,960 Speaker 1: level of discourse now is not is this happening? What 197 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:37,000 Speaker 1: would it look like? Their level of discourse is how 198 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:41,960 Speaker 1: is this happening? What does the US need to do 199 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:46,240 Speaker 1: in response? And one particular paper I read focuses on 200 00:12:46,280 --> 00:12:50,439 Speaker 1: the US Air Force, Like that's how serious and concrete 201 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:53,440 Speaker 1: the problem becomes. You don't know where those memes are 202 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:57,240 Speaker 1: coming from you really do not, and they are so 203 00:12:57,320 --> 00:13:01,199 Speaker 1: easy to spoof. You know, this is um This could 204 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 1: be a wolf in sheep's clothing kind of idea. And 205 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:07,720 Speaker 1: the the main thing that we need to remember about 206 00:13:07,880 --> 00:13:11,200 Speaker 1: this sort of information warfare is that it has to 207 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:17,480 Speaker 1: build upon some kernel of pre existing belief right. It 208 00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:22,800 Speaker 1: has to like if someone has serious doubts about a 209 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:26,200 Speaker 1: political candidate, or not serious doubts, but they have some 210 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,080 Speaker 1: kind of reservation about a political candidate, or they have 211 00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 1: some kind of reservation about a medical treatment that can 212 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:36,920 Speaker 1: be subjected to this group polarization, and the likes come 213 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:39,360 Speaker 1: in on Facebook and your friends and the group chat 214 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 1: or sharing and responding and oh my god, I'm getting attention. 215 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:47,200 Speaker 1: I'm getting social validation. This therefore must mean I am 216 00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:53,960 Speaker 1: onto something, and you're onto something, but you're you're in 217 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:57,120 Speaker 1: a grift. That's what's happening. People are changing your opinion 218 00:13:57,240 --> 00:14:02,520 Speaker 1: without being transparent and without concern for how it may 219 00:14:02,600 --> 00:14:05,800 Speaker 1: or may not benefit you. We know that due to 220 00:14:05,880 --> 00:14:10,760 Speaker 1: things like Foundations of Geopolitics, the idea of by Alexander Ducan, 221 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:13,600 Speaker 1: we know that the idea for a lot of powers 222 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 1: who found themselves outmatched in conventional warfare was to resort 223 00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:22,320 Speaker 1: to this weaponized information to propaganda, and we've seen that 224 00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:26,800 Speaker 1: it's tremendously of influential. It is difficult to quantify. Even 225 00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:29,840 Speaker 1: the New York Times article I mentioned earlier says it's 226 00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 1: incredibly difficult to figure out how much stuff is actually 227 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 1: being produced, purpose made by adversarial for an interest. But 228 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:43,920 Speaker 1: we know that we know that this is a perfect 229 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: time to be a propagandist, especially if you want to 230 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:52,720 Speaker 1: promote disunity in an adversarial power. Well, there's a segment 231 00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:56,800 Speaker 1: on a recent John oliver Um last week tonight where 232 00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 1: he was talking about just how easy it is too. 233 00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:01,400 Speaker 1: I mean, the biggest thing that I think is spreading 234 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:05,320 Speaker 1: some of the most dangerous disinformation is things that are masquerading. 235 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 1: Is like infographics that have some little watermark like it's 236 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:11,520 Speaker 1: from an agency or some kind of official source. And 237 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:13,360 Speaker 1: he just like, I don't know, he's got some clip 238 00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 1: of somebody on YouTube showing you just how easy it 239 00:15:15,960 --> 00:15:18,440 Speaker 1: is to make those on you know, photoshop and have 240 00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:21,640 Speaker 1: them offset just so slightly, and like, you know, literally 241 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 1: make some outrageous claim at the top, like in bold text, 242 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 1: and have them kind of follow that infographic format, and 243 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 1: then before you know, you know, your your grandparents are 244 00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:32,440 Speaker 1: sharing it around because it has the it's it's not 245 00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:36,360 Speaker 1: a meme, it's literally, you know, disinformation posing as some 246 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:39,800 Speaker 1: sort of legit infographic. But I've definitely seen that becoming 247 00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 1: more of a thing too. Oh yeah, I'm lame early 248 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:46,280 Speaker 1: two thousand's websites, guys. I don't know if you remember 249 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:48,960 Speaker 1: back in the day when everything became a quiz or 250 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:54,440 Speaker 1: an infographic, and that was really like because we can 251 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:56,600 Speaker 1: get hits on those, and they're really share able if 252 00:15:56,640 --> 00:15:59,080 Speaker 1: people love clicking on them, and that's the Internet. Our 253 00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:04,080 Speaker 1: grandparents remember, burn the Bomb's world. And then also also yeah, 254 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 1: well on that note, uh, medic warfare. We're talking about 255 00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 1: it on the high macro level. We're talking about this 256 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:14,680 Speaker 1: in terms of state warcraft, but it is also just 257 00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 1: it can also just be a tool of like common 258 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:23,160 Speaker 1: criminal organizations. Never take those Facebook quizzes. It doesn't matter 259 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:28,800 Speaker 1: what bullshit astrological sign makes your favorite croissant thing is. 260 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:32,160 Speaker 1: You can figure that out for yourself. And that information 261 00:16:32,200 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 1: that you give can be used against you frequently enough 262 00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:38,160 Speaker 1: that you should assume it is the case. But those 263 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:44,280 Speaker 1: meta quizzes are fine, take the metic quizzes and I'm joke. 264 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:48,360 Speaker 1: You know they Facebook is rebranded to Meta without changing 265 00:16:51,560 --> 00:16:55,239 Speaker 1: and just Learned, there's a Just Learned. There are surprise 266 00:16:55,400 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 1: other companies named Meta. Alright, go with God but whomever 267 00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:04,480 Speaker 1: you're messing with. Yeah, but the whole point of bringing 268 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:06,199 Speaker 1: that up, kind of in a joking way, is just 269 00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:11,399 Speaker 1: to say that we have taught ourselves as humans using 270 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:15,160 Speaker 1: an Internet and an interconnected set of information, to trust 271 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:19,000 Speaker 1: those things, to trust all of that. You know, the infographics, 272 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:22,119 Speaker 1: the quick blurb that we don't even necessarily need to 273 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:25,359 Speaker 1: be cited. We just trust that it's a thing, and 274 00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:27,840 Speaker 1: it doesn't matter who shares it with us or you 275 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:30,359 Speaker 1: know how it gets to us. If it's a graph 276 00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:33,680 Speaker 1: and it looks legitimate, it's got some numbers going up 277 00:17:33,680 --> 00:17:38,560 Speaker 1: and some numbers going down. Oh this must be real. Yeah, 278 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:42,440 Speaker 1: and you know, uh US mass media is also very 279 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 1: into this. There are plenty of examples from any of 280 00:17:46,119 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 1: your favorite channels, unfortunately, about of of graphs that visually, 281 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:53,840 Speaker 1: if you just glance at them while they're on the 282 00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:56,600 Speaker 1: screen for say five to ten seconds, they appear to 283 00:17:56,760 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: be supporting whatever the anchor or self appointed pundit slash 284 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:04,640 Speaker 1: expert is saying, but if you looked at the sources 285 00:18:05,320 --> 00:18:09,080 Speaker 1: and you actually read the report, then you would see, Hey, 286 00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 1: that that bar on the graph that says thirty should 287 00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:17,320 Speaker 1: actually be higher or larger taller than that other bar 288 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:20,560 Speaker 1: that says fifteen percent? So why do they not match? 289 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:22,960 Speaker 1: And the clever thing about that is if you are 290 00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:25,920 Speaker 1: the producer of those bad faith attempts, you can always 291 00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:28,440 Speaker 1: go back and say, oh, yeah, that was our bad 292 00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 1: that was that was a good eyebro because you have 293 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:35,880 Speaker 1: you've been caught by one person out of thousands, so 294 00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: the effect is the same. Um, I do believe this 295 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:41,880 Speaker 1: is a full episode, and it's uh, it's important, as 296 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:44,679 Speaker 1: Fox would say, now more than ever and uh. In 297 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:49,640 Speaker 1: the meantime, highly recommend looking into an experiment the Taiwanese 298 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:52,720 Speaker 1: government did or a kind of a war game where 299 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 1: they had memetic engineering teams in every government department try 300 00:18:58,119 --> 00:19:04,400 Speaker 1: to combats info efforts, which you know their main Taiwan 301 00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:08,879 Speaker 1: is getting most of their dis info assaults from mainland China. 302 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:12,399 Speaker 1: But what these teams did is they had sixty minutes 303 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:15,439 Speaker 1: to respond to dis info by using an approach they 304 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:19,600 Speaker 1: call humor over rumor. Uh so clowning people because the 305 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 1: Internet loves clowning people. We could be teaching them, but 306 00:19:23,359 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 1: we're more into clowning them as a civilization. Also check 307 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:31,120 Speaker 1: out Evolutionary Psychology, Memes and the Origin of War by 308 00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:35,160 Speaker 1: Keith Henson, and stay tuned because we'd love to make 309 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:38,680 Speaker 1: this an episode in the near future. In the meantime, 310 00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:42,200 Speaker 1: tell us your favorite memes. Tell us the most dangerous memes. 311 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:44,320 Speaker 1: Tell us your take on the medic warfare. Is it 312 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:50,280 Speaker 1: overblown or is it even more dangerous than experts believe? 313 00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:54,440 Speaker 1: One three three std w y t K or conspiracy 314 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:57,439 Speaker 1: at I heart radio dot com. We're gonna pause to 315 00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:06,119 Speaker 1: share some dank memes and then we'll be back. And 316 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:08,960 Speaker 1: we are back, and we're jumping to a voicemail sent 317 00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:13,560 Speaker 1: to us from Voodoo. Hey guys, you can call me Voodoo. 318 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:15,639 Speaker 1: I've been listening to your show for for many years. 319 00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:18,160 Speaker 1: Uh just recently been listening to where you've been asking 320 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 1: for scary stories and also had the episode recently about 321 00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 1: reoccurring dreams. I've got one that's a little bit of 322 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:27,720 Speaker 1: both for you. Um, from the ages of about ten 323 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:32,680 Speaker 1: until about fifteen years old, I'd have a reoccurring dream. UM. 324 00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:35,200 Speaker 1: When I was younger, it was probably three to five 325 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:37,080 Speaker 1: times a week. As I got older, it was probably 326 00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:38,960 Speaker 1: once or twice a month. But the dream is always 327 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:43,280 Speaker 1: the same. An older version of me was at a party, UM, 328 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:47,280 Speaker 1: dancing with a lady, and at some point we decided 329 00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:49,280 Speaker 1: to go outside and stand on the patio and have 330 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:52,399 Speaker 1: a conversation and look up at the sky. UM. She 331 00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:54,640 Speaker 1: gives me a kiss on the cheek and walks back 332 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:57,159 Speaker 1: into the party. I linger on the patio for a 333 00:20:57,200 --> 00:21:00,480 Speaker 1: little while and see a what looks like a glowing 334 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:05,080 Speaker 1: something in the air. UM. This thing starts moving closer 335 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:08,760 Speaker 1: and closer and closer to me, eventually striking me in 336 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:13,080 Speaker 1: the head and knocking me unconscious. UM pan out to 337 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:16,520 Speaker 1: see my body landing on the ground, and the thing 338 00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:18,560 Speaker 1: that hit me in the head is a silver orb, 339 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:22,120 Speaker 1: which then opens up and a little glowing ball comes 340 00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:25,160 Speaker 1: out of it and enters into my ear, at which 341 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:29,720 Speaker 1: point I wake up. UM terrified me for years. Then 342 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:32,760 Speaker 1: I kind of came to groups with it, eventually stopped 343 00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:36,520 Speaker 1: having the dream, And ever since I stopped having the dream, 344 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:39,240 Speaker 1: I've had a reoccurring ear infection in my right ear. 345 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:42,439 Speaker 1: I'm now thirty eight years old and it continues to happen. 346 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:44,480 Speaker 1: I don't know if there's anything to it, but said, 347 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:47,920 Speaker 1: you guys might be interested in love the show. Thanks. 348 00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 1: There we go message from voodoo of all people in 349 00:21:53,119 --> 00:22:04,440 Speaker 1: places do do yes as the voodoo that you do. Yeah. So, uh, 350 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:08,440 Speaker 1: First of all, a reoccurring dream that involves a U 351 00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 1: A P. It's very small u AP that makes physical 352 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:18,960 Speaker 1: striking contact to your head. And then somehow you're having 353 00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:22,600 Speaker 1: an out of body experience within this dream. And then 354 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:26,360 Speaker 1: you're watching the U A P open up and another 355 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:30,280 Speaker 1: little floaty thing is coming out and going into your ear. 356 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:34,560 Speaker 1: So it's almost like, um, not quite the abduction experience, 357 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:39,440 Speaker 1: but the probe probe like experience where something is being 358 00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:43,560 Speaker 1: inserted into your body during an encounter from the stars. 359 00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:47,960 Speaker 1: He reminds me, it reminds me of that movie Phantasm. Um, 360 00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:51,359 Speaker 1: it's like creepy underticker looking dude launches this like weird 361 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 1: silver orb that then like shoots out knives and like 362 00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 1: slices into the people's like drills into their brains. It's 363 00:22:57,840 --> 00:22:59,959 Speaker 1: a little less grizzly version of that. But that's immediately 364 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:01,720 Speaker 1: what I thought of when I heard like little silver 365 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 1: or going into brains, and then after having these dreams 366 00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:09,679 Speaker 1: over the course of years and years and years, to 367 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:13,200 Speaker 1: have some kind of physical malady affecting the same place 368 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:17,000 Speaker 1: where this thing was affecting you in your dreams. I 369 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:23,720 Speaker 1: don't know, right, I've got to introduce you that professor 370 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,639 Speaker 1: one day, Matt, so the the the I have a 371 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:28,920 Speaker 1: theory and voodoo. I don't know if this will be 372 00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:32,080 Speaker 1: helpful or not, but I do think it is pretty 373 00:23:32,119 --> 00:23:35,199 Speaker 1: solid and I would be interested to hear what you 374 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 1: think of this. Is it possible that your subconscious mind 375 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:43,800 Speaker 1: is alerting you to something or was alerting you to 376 00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:50,120 Speaker 1: something that it clocked about your physical health through symbols 377 00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:54,680 Speaker 1: it communicated with you through Dare I say memes or 378 00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:59,360 Speaker 1: or archetypes? Um? I think that I would hazard that 379 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,119 Speaker 1: that is That is a very I won't say a percent, 380 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,920 Speaker 1: but that is very likely. Um. What could be going 381 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:11,160 Speaker 1: on because other people throughout history of reported similar ideas. 382 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:14,080 Speaker 1: One of the most common would be, you know, people 383 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 1: have the anxiety dream, often of something being wrong with 384 00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 1: their teeth right, teeth falling out or cracking, etcetera, etcetera. 385 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:26,720 Speaker 1: But in some cases that's also your subconscious mind saying hey, 386 00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,240 Speaker 1: you have a cavity or something like that. Right, Our 387 00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:35,240 Speaker 1: our minds are very, very very um intelligent, and our 388 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:38,800 Speaker 1: conscious minds are only a piece of the iceberg there. 389 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 1: So it may be that some part of you was 390 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:45,879 Speaker 1: trying to communicate with another part of you, which I 391 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:49,359 Speaker 1: find endlessly fascinating. Check out our episode series on dreams 392 00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:51,240 Speaker 1: if you haven't had the chance to do so yet, 393 00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:54,959 Speaker 1: I'm going to throw some monks you guys. Yes, agreed 394 00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:58,360 Speaker 1: as well. I talked to Voodoo just shortly before we 395 00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:03,359 Speaker 1: start rolling here. The dreams began when he was around 396 00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:07,280 Speaker 1: seven or eight years old, and they just kept happening. 397 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:11,199 Speaker 1: So it was always, he says, always an older woman 398 00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:14,640 Speaker 1: in this case that he was with that always gave 399 00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:17,600 Speaker 1: him that kiss. Before this whole you know, situation went 400 00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:20,560 Speaker 1: down with the U A P. Starting around seven or 401 00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:23,120 Speaker 1: eight years old, and then around the time he gets 402 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:26,359 Speaker 1: to sixteen seventeen years old, just before you know, the 403 00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:29,680 Speaker 1: end of high school, he stops having these dreams altogether. 404 00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 1: But what coincides with that time is when he began 405 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:39,560 Speaker 1: scuba diving. Scuba diving a whole lot, and when he 406 00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:42,560 Speaker 1: began scuba diving is when he started having the recurring 407 00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:47,919 Speaker 1: ear infections. So the dreams scuba diving is here before it? 408 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:52,240 Speaker 1: Are the dreams after it? Are the ear infections? Well, 409 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 1: it isn't scuba diving. Can't you get like swimmers ear 410 00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:58,520 Speaker 1: and stuff or like have some issues because of the pressure. 411 00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:01,600 Speaker 1: I mean, it seems like that's the that's the the 412 00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:05,960 Speaker 1: differentiating factor. There's the scuba diving. But look to my mind, 413 00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:07,560 Speaker 1: and I know I'm probably incorrect here, and a lot 414 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:09,439 Speaker 1: of Look you say what you want, that's fine, I 415 00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:12,120 Speaker 1: think what you want wherever you are. To my mind, 416 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:16,680 Speaker 1: it's very strange that the decision to begin scuba diving 417 00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:19,639 Speaker 1: and the training and everything is at that middle point 418 00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:23,560 Speaker 1: between almost these pre cognitive dreams that something's going to 419 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:25,840 Speaker 1: happen with his ear, something's going into his ear that 420 00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:29,959 Speaker 1: shouldn't be there, and then it actually happening because of 421 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,479 Speaker 1: the activity that he's partaking in. I don't know, it's 422 00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,480 Speaker 1: weird to me. Well, a self fulfilling prophecy is still 423 00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:39,119 Speaker 1: a prophecy, is it not? I would, I would argue, 424 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,800 Speaker 1: And then additionally, you know, additionally, I think we made 425 00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:45,600 Speaker 1: a pretty not a solid case obviously, but we made 426 00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:49,119 Speaker 1: a pretty good speculative case that time could work differently 427 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:54,480 Speaker 1: in dreams. Um. And then nobody really wants to throw 428 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:59,760 Speaker 1: around the p word precognition in academia. But just because 429 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:03,639 Speaker 1: current academic culture poop poo's the thing doesn't mean it 430 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:07,359 Speaker 1: doesn't exist. Keep in mind, this is the same civilization 431 00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:10,240 Speaker 1: that beat the living Christ out of a guy for 432 00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:13,800 Speaker 1: suggesting that doctors should maybe wash their hands before they 433 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 1: put them inside people, and that guy died in an asylum. 434 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,520 Speaker 1: Like I so I think it's um, I think it's 435 00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,400 Speaker 1: quite possible. There's more too. Well, I'm certain there's more 436 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:27,919 Speaker 1: to the science of dreams and the function of the 437 00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:31,560 Speaker 1: brain during sleep. Uh, there's more to it than current 438 00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:35,960 Speaker 1: society is aware. But it also would also be interested. Like, 439 00:27:36,040 --> 00:27:39,440 Speaker 1: that's a really good point about scuba diving, because it 440 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:44,200 Speaker 1: can cause your problems if you're not up to snuff 441 00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:47,639 Speaker 1: on your on your safety precautions and your guidelines. You know, 442 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:51,280 Speaker 1: like the swimmer's ear is a real thing. Um. People 443 00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:56,160 Speaker 1: can have fluid and blood leakage in the middle ear. Uh, 444 00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:59,119 Speaker 1: and that can lead to infections if it's left untreated. 445 00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:03,119 Speaker 1: And it's just the time that it's the timeline, you 446 00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:06,679 Speaker 1: know what I mean. That's what's interesting, because these dreams 447 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:12,439 Speaker 1: didn't start after the scuba stuff, right, Yeah. But now 448 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:16,120 Speaker 1: later in his life, as he's scuba diving more and more, 449 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,679 Speaker 1: he's getting a little more adventurous with the types of 450 00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:22,639 Speaker 1: dives he's going on. And Voodoo says, one of the 451 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:26,520 Speaker 1: most interesting things he does now is night diving. This 452 00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:29,359 Speaker 1: is not something I was aware of. I just perhaps 453 00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:31,919 Speaker 1: I'm not curious enough, and I've never been certified to 454 00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:36,399 Speaker 1: go scuba diving. But the act of going into the water, 455 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,480 Speaker 1: going fairly deep down on a scuba dive in the night, 456 00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:43,360 Speaker 1: where the only lights you have are the flashlights, the 457 00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:47,080 Speaker 1: lights on the other divers, and yourself. So when you 458 00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:50,320 Speaker 1: look out on the sea floor wherever you are, all 459 00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:52,719 Speaker 1: you can see are these little pools of light from 460 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:56,920 Speaker 1: all the other divers. And Voodoo described it very much 461 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:00,880 Speaker 1: like being on another planet, exploring another plan in the dark, 462 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:04,720 Speaker 1: with only your torch if you will um. And for 463 00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:09,479 Speaker 1: some reason, my mind takes that back to this you 464 00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:13,600 Speaker 1: know again unidentified aerial phenomena in his dream that is 465 00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:17,360 Speaker 1: exploring planet Earth and interacts with him. He's saying, you 466 00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:20,880 Speaker 1: can when you're on these night dives. You can see 467 00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:25,040 Speaker 1: fish and turtles as they're sleeping. You can see some 468 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:28,040 Speaker 1: of the anemonies that will or the an enemy that 469 00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:32,520 Speaker 1: will glow. If you shine your light on certain smaller fish, 470 00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,440 Speaker 1: a larger fish will be alerted because they can now 471 00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:38,280 Speaker 1: see that other fish, and they will make a meal 472 00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: of it. And there's something also connected with that to me, 473 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:47,479 Speaker 1: of being on another planet exploring with this other vision 474 00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:51,000 Speaker 1: that he had, of this thing coming from the stars, 475 00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 1: directly from the stars to visit him specifically. I don't know. Look, 476 00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,239 Speaker 1: I'm over here just analyzing Voodoo's dreams, but I just 477 00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:02,280 Speaker 1: found it to be compelling. Guys, agreed, And we've we've 478 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 1: been getting a lot of folks writing in with with 479 00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 1: strange encounters in the world of dream. Some of them 480 00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 1: are downright terrifying stories and experiences. Uh. And you know that. 481 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,040 Speaker 1: I don't know about you, guys, but the version of 482 00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:22,720 Speaker 1: reality I subscribed to doesn't make a huge distinction between 483 00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,920 Speaker 1: the world of imagination in the world of physicality. So 484 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 1: to me, if something happens in a dream, especially if 485 00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:33,720 Speaker 1: you believe in a multiverse, all kind of interpretation of 486 00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,160 Speaker 1: of the world or the universe to me, if something 487 00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,840 Speaker 1: happens in a dream, that means it's on some level real. 488 00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:42,880 Speaker 1: And if our dreams are just a way for another 489 00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:46,720 Speaker 1: part of the mind to hold up a mirror or 490 00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:52,240 Speaker 1: to make commentary on something that's happening, or some interpretation 491 00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:56,320 Speaker 1: of something that's happening, then that also is no less real. 492 00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 1: Your mind was telling you something voodoo, that is, that 493 00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,840 Speaker 1: is not that, That is not an opinion. That's a fact. 494 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:08,080 Speaker 1: Your mind was telling you something. It's just tough to 495 00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:12,960 Speaker 1: figure out what that was. And if there is correlation 496 00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:18,200 Speaker 1: to the events in the waking world and this version 497 00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:21,080 Speaker 1: of it. M hm, Well, guys, that's all I've really 498 00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:24,320 Speaker 1: got voodoo. If you're interested, you can head over to 499 00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:29,640 Speaker 1: places like Psychology today read all about recurring dreams or 500 00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,840 Speaker 1: what is it the Sleep Foundation, which is, you know, 501 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:35,280 Speaker 1: a place where you can go to learn about stuff. 502 00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:39,440 Speaker 1: They've they've got pretty good bibliographies and references at the 503 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:43,280 Speaker 1: bottom of the Sleep Foundation Recurring Dreams article, so you 504 00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:46,640 Speaker 1: know that's worth looking into. I'm just laughing because I 505 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 1: thought you were just laughing because I thought you were 506 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:52,560 Speaker 1: going to say it was a snooze fest. No, it's not. 507 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 1: Ant never say something like that. Yeah, they there's some 508 00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:59,040 Speaker 1: great writing over there. It's just I don't know. It's 509 00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:00,880 Speaker 1: kind of the stuff that you expect. The things that 510 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,280 Speaker 1: we've talked about before, like you said, been the losing 511 00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:06,560 Speaker 1: teeth and they could miss not being ready for school, flying, 512 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:10,400 Speaker 1: falling car crashes. Uh. This, this dream that you told 513 00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:13,800 Speaker 1: us about voodoo is just unlike any recurring dream I've 514 00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:16,360 Speaker 1: heard of. Completely agree. I mean, it's definitely a weird one. 515 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:18,640 Speaker 1: I wasn't trying to neg it, saying that maybe it 516 00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:21,960 Speaker 1: was connected to some pressure thing with the Scooba diving. 517 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,280 Speaker 1: I think it's interesting now coincidence if if, if they 518 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:28,239 Speaker 1: aren't related. But yeah, I mean, what an odd recurring dream? Like, 519 00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,600 Speaker 1: what is it implying You're right, Ben? Is it some 520 00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:36,040 Speaker 1: sort of recognition of an impending ailment? Or is it 521 00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:40,200 Speaker 1: the cause itself? Hard to say, but really fascinating stuff. 522 00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:43,160 Speaker 1: I would I would not to be a believe fair. 523 00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:47,040 Speaker 1: We do have to note one thing post these dreams. 524 00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:51,000 Speaker 1: If anything had happened to your ear voodoo, it would 525 00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:54,600 Speaker 1: be very difficult, I think for many people to not 526 00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:59,440 Speaker 1: feel that there was some possible correlation, no matter what 527 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:03,719 Speaker 1: that thing might be. Right, absolutely, and it could just 528 00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,880 Speaker 1: be perceived right because you're making that connection because it 529 00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 1: makes it makes us feel better to see that pattern 530 00:33:09,800 --> 00:33:13,960 Speaker 1: than for it to just be chaotic. Right on, Ben, 531 00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 1: All right, well, hey, we're gonna take another quick sponsor break, 532 00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:20,400 Speaker 1: but we'll be right back with another message from you. 533 00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:31,080 Speaker 1: Welcome back the public. That's you, the listeners of this show, 534 00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:33,680 Speaker 1: the most important part of the show. Uh. And one 535 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:37,360 Speaker 1: of you wrote in with a lovely two tiered email 536 00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:39,680 Speaker 1: with two I'm gonna I'm just gonna briefly rush over 537 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:41,800 Speaker 1: the first point and then get right into the second one. 538 00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:46,400 Speaker 1: This one comes from bronze ranked boomer. UM love that, 539 00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:49,080 Speaker 1: Uh says, Hey, guys, I'm behind the recent episodes. I 540 00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:51,840 Speaker 1: just finished the one with the robot dog from Boston Dynamics. 541 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:54,239 Speaker 1: I thought you'd get a kick out of this. And 542 00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:58,680 Speaker 1: then bronze ranked boomer linked to a YouTube channel um 543 00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:01,920 Speaker 1: from a dude named Mike cool Reeves who is a 544 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:06,200 Speaker 1: young maker type guy builds robots and weird devices and 545 00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:10,000 Speaker 1: a lot of things involving tasers. Um, kind of just 546 00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:13,319 Speaker 1: like you know, dumb inventions like he had build a 547 00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:17,640 Speaker 1: machine robot that picks tomatoes out if your salad. Um. 548 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:20,879 Speaker 1: There's the one video called using mind control to drive 549 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:24,720 Speaker 1: a car electrocuting my muscles to force me to dab 550 00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:27,520 Speaker 1: things like that. But his most recent video, which has 551 00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:32,360 Speaker 1: upwards of twelve million views uh, is called teaching a 552 00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,920 Speaker 1: robot Dog to Pe beer. Um. And he has one 553 00:34:35,920 --> 00:34:41,200 Speaker 1: of these Boston Dynamic robot dogs that he modifies significantly, UM, 554 00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:43,960 Speaker 1: with a little tankful of beer, a little nozzle that 555 00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:46,000 Speaker 1: goes right you know where the business end of a 556 00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:48,880 Speaker 1: dog would go, um, and some like little r do 557 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:52,840 Speaker 1: we know micro computer dealies And yeah, he teaches the 558 00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:55,960 Speaker 1: dog quote unquote teaches the dog to pe beer into 559 00:34:56,000 --> 00:35:00,480 Speaker 1: a cup. At first a disaster. I just of peas 560 00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:03,239 Speaker 1: all over the place. UM, And I think he eventually 561 00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:06,480 Speaker 1: gets it right. But the dog is is called pisspot 562 00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:09,319 Speaker 1: nine thousand, which I thought was great, So thank you 563 00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:12,880 Speaker 1: for that. And then bronze ranked Boomer or b r 564 00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:16,600 Speaker 1: b ha uh. That goes on to talk about this 565 00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:20,120 Speaker 1: other story UM. Recently, there was a backlash in the 566 00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:24,880 Speaker 1: streaming community of something called blue light blocking skincare. The 567 00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:29,960 Speaker 1: streamer Valkyrie or Valkyrie sounds spelled UM was promoting her 568 00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:33,200 Speaker 1: skincare line called reflect of course it's missing the valves, 569 00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:36,240 Speaker 1: because that's just how branding works these days. She claims 570 00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:40,920 Speaker 1: that her product will protect blue light from damaging your skin. Um, 571 00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:44,359 Speaker 1: here is a link of skincare product. And interestingly enough, 572 00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:47,759 Speaker 1: when you go to r f lct dot com, you 573 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:51,799 Speaker 1: get this message saying Reflect is no longer available. Think 574 00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:54,520 Speaker 1: you know all who played important roles to conduct research, 575 00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:58,560 Speaker 1: developed products, create a brand, and serve as partners along 576 00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:02,200 Speaker 1: our journey. While we believe in the formulations created after 577 00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:06,560 Speaker 1: further reflection, uh, we have decided to move forward on 578 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:10,759 Speaker 1: new paths, effectively terminating the Reflect brand. Should you have 579 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:15,280 Speaker 1: further questions, please contact inquiries at Reflect dot com. Um. 580 00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:17,960 Speaker 1: Then there's this thread that BRB links to on Reddit 581 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:22,440 Speaker 1: talking about various scientific research into blue light uh and 582 00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:26,280 Speaker 1: what it can do to our brains and our you know, eyes, 583 00:36:26,560 --> 00:36:31,120 Speaker 1: and potentially our skin. Um. So here's the thing. Oh 584 00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:33,040 Speaker 1: and then b RB goes on she also made a 585 00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:36,359 Speaker 1: video trying to explain her situation, but it just made 586 00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,360 Speaker 1: it worse. She claims they have researched the damage of 587 00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:42,759 Speaker 1: blue light on people's skin, but she can't reveal the 588 00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:49,480 Speaker 1: studies because it's specific for her company. So it now 589 00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:52,880 Speaker 1: looking at So is blue light skin damage legit or 590 00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:58,040 Speaker 1: just some scam to get people to buy skin care products. Um? 591 00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:00,560 Speaker 1: So this all starts with like, you know, you may 592 00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:03,800 Speaker 1: notice on your phone there's a mode called night mode 593 00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:06,719 Speaker 1: that filters out blue light. Matt, I believe you've talked 594 00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:12,239 Speaker 1: about wearing blue blocking sunglasses. Isn't that right? Yeah, I 595 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:18,359 Speaker 1: don't think that necessarily. No, No, no, that that part 596 00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:20,040 Speaker 1: that that No, No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying 597 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:23,120 Speaker 1: that's where it starts, right, This idea that blue that 598 00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:26,600 Speaker 1: blue light causes eye stream um, and that you know 599 00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:31,960 Speaker 1: they can leads to uh, prolonged exposure to blue lights. 600 00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:37,279 Speaker 1: Um can cause you know, development of cataracts or something 601 00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:39,120 Speaker 1: like that over a long period of time. Because blue 602 00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:42,839 Speaker 1: light is one of the most powerful colors of light, 603 00:37:43,239 --> 00:37:46,120 Speaker 1: and the sun you know, puts out a ton of 604 00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,440 Speaker 1: blue lights. So like filtering that, you know, from your 605 00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:50,920 Speaker 1: eyes in addition to just filtering out UV rays, it's 606 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,719 Speaker 1: obviously gonna be a good thing for your eyeballs. Um. 607 00:37:53,960 --> 00:37:56,600 Speaker 1: Valkyrie made this case based on the fact that she 608 00:37:56,840 --> 00:37:59,760 Speaker 1: is a twitch streamer, you know, a gamer and YouTube 609 00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:03,480 Speaker 1: intent creator. Um So she's you know hopping on this 610 00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:07,560 Speaker 1: blue light bad train. UM, but really took the next 611 00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:11,160 Speaker 1: level in this notion that blue light is somehow bad 612 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:14,840 Speaker 1: for your skin. Um, there is no research that I 613 00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:19,800 Speaker 1: have found that even remotely UM indicates that. And in fact, 614 00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:23,120 Speaker 1: there's a Time magazine article that I found this just 615 00:38:23,239 --> 00:38:26,080 Speaker 1: forget what you think you know about blue light and sleep, 616 00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:29,160 Speaker 1: because we've also been told that using our phones at 617 00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:32,320 Speaker 1: night because of the blue light, uh, is in fact 618 00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:36,360 Speaker 1: bad for your sleep. Turns out, according to a recent 619 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:41,239 Speaker 1: paper published by the University of Manchester in Current Biology, 620 00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:44,279 Speaker 1: UM is trying to kind of challenge that idea. UM. 621 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:46,880 Speaker 1: They did a study where they exposed mice to different 622 00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:51,600 Speaker 1: lights of various hues but equal brightness, and they found 623 00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:55,120 Speaker 1: that warm toned light was actually worse for the mice 624 00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:58,359 Speaker 1: sleep because it could actually trick their bodies and thinking 625 00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:02,400 Speaker 1: it's daytime, while cool or blue lights UH more closely 626 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:07,239 Speaker 1: mimic you know the way it looks around twilight. UM. 627 00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:09,799 Speaker 1: So this sort of throws a wrench into the whole, like, 628 00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:11,839 Speaker 1: you know, oh, night mode on your phone is gonna 629 00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:14,120 Speaker 1: make it okay. I mean, honestly, it looks like it's 630 00:39:14,160 --> 00:39:17,080 Speaker 1: more likely just the fact that you're on your phone, 631 00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:20,719 Speaker 1: you know, and not quieting your mind than it is 632 00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:24,239 Speaker 1: like blue light having some sort of elongated like you know, 633 00:39:24,440 --> 00:39:28,840 Speaker 1: negative effect on your your sleep. And other researchers that 634 00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:32,040 Speaker 1: are cited in this time article argue that electronics keep 635 00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:35,120 Speaker 1: you up, some can keep you because of the bright lights. Um. 636 00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:38,000 Speaker 1: It really is more the time suck of it all 637 00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:41,440 Speaker 1: and the distraction keeping your mind from you know, resting 638 00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:44,399 Speaker 1: than it is the color of the light. Um. There's 639 00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:48,719 Speaker 1: also specifically an article that BRB linked to UH from 640 00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:53,319 Speaker 1: the Washington Post about this specific case and the controversy 641 00:39:53,360 --> 00:39:56,160 Speaker 1: that kind of like you know, spring from it. Um. 642 00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:58,320 Speaker 1: So here's what they say. I'm just gonna read a 643 00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:00,520 Speaker 1: court from this. Blue light is a form a visible, 644 00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:03,560 Speaker 1: high energy light that is only slightly less powerful than 645 00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:06,200 Speaker 1: ultraviolet light, which is admitted by the sun, and can 646 00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:09,000 Speaker 1: cause skin and eye damage over time. While some experts 647 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:12,320 Speaker 1: have suggested that blue light from screens might contribute to eyestrain, 648 00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:15,560 Speaker 1: it's still an area of contentious debate. The notion that 649 00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:20,000 Speaker 1: blue light might cause skin damage has even less scientific backing, 650 00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:24,200 Speaker 1: and the interview UM a person named Shari Marshbine, who 651 00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:28,400 Speaker 1: is a board certified dermatologist from New York who says, um, 652 00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:31,360 Speaker 1: there is at this time in conclusive evidence as to 653 00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:34,040 Speaker 1: whether or not screens can actually produce enough light to 654 00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:37,120 Speaker 1: cause serious skin damage. A lot of companies are focusing 655 00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:39,719 Speaker 1: on blue light protection because we know this comes from 656 00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:43,600 Speaker 1: sun exposure, even if the evidence pointing towards devices isn't 657 00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:47,480 Speaker 1: as clear. Um. So, yeah, it does seem like this 658 00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:51,120 Speaker 1: was not sure if the partners and this, you know, 659 00:40:51,120 --> 00:40:53,479 Speaker 1: this is just an entrepreneurial venture, you know, I'm sure 660 00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:56,560 Speaker 1: there were It's not like Valcore Valcuree was like coming 661 00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:59,480 Speaker 1: up with these formulas all by herself. Maybe she was 662 00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:02,359 Speaker 1: taken for a bit of a ride to UM. But 663 00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,360 Speaker 1: you know, this kind of creating a problem maybe that 664 00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:08,520 Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily exist or at the very least isn't supported 665 00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:10,480 Speaker 1: by science. I can see why people might get a 666 00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:12,960 Speaker 1: little irritated about that, especially from a big, you know, 667 00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:17,920 Speaker 1: highly paid Instagram influencer. Um. Yeah, what do what do 668 00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:20,280 Speaker 1: you guys think? I mean, I think anytime there's a problem, 669 00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:24,960 Speaker 1: you can you can exploit it right and by to 670 00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:28,399 Speaker 1: make money at least to offer a solution. And we've 671 00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,839 Speaker 1: talked about it before the medical industry where you can 672 00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:36,440 Speaker 1: if you want to make up a problem that you 673 00:41:36,520 --> 00:41:40,879 Speaker 1: then offer the only solution to the only currently available solutions. Right. 674 00:41:41,719 --> 00:41:44,600 Speaker 1: I'm not saying that's what's happening here, but it wouldn't 675 00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:47,600 Speaker 1: be the first time. Sure, Yeah, I think that's accurate. 676 00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:53,000 Speaker 1: There's also the idea, m Yeah, the statement that this 677 00:41:53,640 --> 00:41:58,600 Speaker 1: these findings are inconclusive or uncertain at this time is 678 00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:03,160 Speaker 1: super are helpful for businesses that want to sell things 679 00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:06,520 Speaker 1: because they can say, no, one's proven, it's not bad 680 00:42:06,600 --> 00:42:10,960 Speaker 1: for you, right. Uh. This, this uncertainty is where a 681 00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:15,200 Speaker 1: lot of profit opportunities thrive. But with the studies that 682 00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:18,920 Speaker 1: I was I was reading, I found a really interesting 683 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:23,799 Speaker 1: one from the National Library of Medicine that may may 684 00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:26,560 Speaker 1: have found something slightly different from some of these folks. 685 00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:30,239 Speaker 1: They were saying that this h g V or the 686 00:42:30,680 --> 00:42:33,960 Speaker 1: fancy name for the for blue light can be harmful 687 00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:36,359 Speaker 1: to skin, but it can also be beneficial. It all 688 00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:41,720 Speaker 1: depends upon the intensity and the wavelength. So the idea then, 689 00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:44,719 Speaker 1: at least according to this and there's one study out 690 00:42:44,719 --> 00:42:48,480 Speaker 1: of many, the idea then would be, if that is true, 691 00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:55,399 Speaker 1: would this blue blocking cosmetic not possibly be harmful for skin? 692 00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:58,040 Speaker 1: You have to be so careful with cosmetics because of 693 00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:01,080 Speaker 1: all the all the claims that are aid and how 694 00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:05,319 Speaker 1: how um well I don't like the term woo, but 695 00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:09,160 Speaker 1: how misleading they can be or how in bad faith 696 00:43:09,280 --> 00:43:12,000 Speaker 1: they can be right Uh that there is an interesting 697 00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:15,960 Speaker 1: little side note that comes from another dermatologist UM named 698 00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:20,760 Speaker 1: Kathleen Susie who's actually a dermatologic surgeon UH and director 699 00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:24,960 Speaker 1: of Yale's Aesthetic Dermatology program. UM. So she does speak 700 00:43:24,960 --> 00:43:28,560 Speaker 1: about a very specific subset of patients that could actually 701 00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:32,840 Speaker 1: have pigmentation issues that could be like exacerbated by exposure 702 00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:35,520 Speaker 1: to blue light emissions from the sun. UM. She says, 703 00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:39,279 Speaker 1: blue light can induce pigmentation in the skin, UH, particularly 704 00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:42,799 Speaker 1: in darker skinned individuals. Prolonged exposure to blue light. And 705 00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:45,120 Speaker 1: we're talking about like blue light emissions from the sun 706 00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:48,480 Speaker 1: can introduce hyper pigmentation. UM. There was this sort of 707 00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:51,840 Speaker 1: theoretical concern that patients who are prone to pigment issues. 708 00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:54,440 Speaker 1: So this isn't just your average fair skin individual with 709 00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:57,560 Speaker 1: no pigmentary history. UH, this is someone who might suffer 710 00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:00,919 Speaker 1: from a condition called melasma or their skin is prone 711 00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:04,560 Speaker 1: to hyper pigmentation or darkening. UM could be more sensitive 712 00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:07,239 Speaker 1: to external triggers of blue light outside of sun rays. 713 00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:09,800 Speaker 1: So again she goes on to say it's very specific, 714 00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:12,400 Speaker 1: you know, niche group of patients UM and points to 715 00:44:12,440 --> 00:44:15,960 Speaker 1: a twenty nineteen study where researchers exposed one side of 716 00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:19,919 Speaker 1: UM participants faces to the equivalent of blue light from 717 00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:23,279 Speaker 1: a very powerful screen and shielded the other for eight 718 00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:26,759 Speaker 1: hours per day, five days in a row. Um, they 719 00:44:26,840 --> 00:44:29,239 Speaker 1: largely found no difference in the side of the face 720 00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:32,960 Speaker 1: that was exposed, uh, compared to the other. But what 721 00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:36,279 Speaker 1: this does, so this is screen strength, right, This is 722 00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:40,320 Speaker 1: not sun strength, which is what this expert was referring 723 00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:43,360 Speaker 1: to that could actually have an effect. And this whole 724 00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:48,280 Speaker 1: cosmetic line was specifically, you know, addressing screen time. UM. 725 00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:51,440 Speaker 1: So yeah, that strikes me as being utter bs uh. 726 00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:53,879 Speaker 1: It was probably why they pulled it. Internet snake oil 727 00:44:53,960 --> 00:44:56,200 Speaker 1: is what it seems like to me. And of course, 728 00:44:56,480 --> 00:44:59,840 Speaker 1: you know, again, I feel ethically bound to point this 729 00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:04,560 Speaker 1: out every time these sorts of conversations come up. Again, 730 00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:10,839 Speaker 1: if this is not causing actual harm to anybody in 731 00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:13,799 Speaker 1: in any way, and it makes you feel better, then 732 00:45:14,040 --> 00:45:17,799 Speaker 1: it's okay. Just don't don't be under the illusions that 733 00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:21,279 Speaker 1: the science is sound. And also we have to acknowledge 734 00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:26,000 Speaker 1: that the idea of causing actual harm could mean, um 735 00:45:26,160 --> 00:45:28,920 Speaker 1: could be the same as using this instead of seeking 736 00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:32,440 Speaker 1: medical treatment for some condition of the skin or another. 737 00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:36,279 Speaker 1: So it's like, you know, if you're in if you're 738 00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:42,440 Speaker 1: in your local Sephora or whatever makeup store and you 739 00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:46,720 Speaker 1: see something that is like this has baby angel tears, 740 00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:50,760 Speaker 1: and because as baby angel tears, it's going to protect 741 00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:56,080 Speaker 1: you from elbow weariness, which is when your elbows get depressed. 742 00:45:56,440 --> 00:46:00,360 Speaker 1: And if that like makes you feel better, then fine, 743 00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:03,920 Speaker 1: do it. But don't be surprised if you just spend 744 00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:06,799 Speaker 1: a few minutes looking into literally anything other than web 745 00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:11,080 Speaker 1: md a k a. You have cancer dot com. If 746 00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:14,800 Speaker 1: you look into any reputable medical investigation, you can't and 747 00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:17,399 Speaker 1: you and you find out that surprised. There's no such 748 00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:21,719 Speaker 1: thing as baby angel tears, and elbow weariness is a 749 00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:25,600 Speaker 1: weird name for several other possible conditions. Then you know, 750 00:46:25,719 --> 00:46:28,959 Speaker 1: consider what else, Consider what a doctor might say about 751 00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:31,719 Speaker 1: your elbows. I mean, I'm walking that example down the 752 00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:33,840 Speaker 1: street a little bit because I think it's funny and 753 00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:37,200 Speaker 1: hopefully I'm right, but it's um, it's something people need 754 00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:40,120 Speaker 1: to be aware of the goal is not always to 755 00:46:40,239 --> 00:46:44,200 Speaker 1: help you. The goal is to help persuade you to 756 00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:50,920 Speaker 1: buy something that's a very important, very good and agreed agreed. Uh. 757 00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:53,680 Speaker 1: And again this is like two clicks away from like 758 00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:58,080 Speaker 1: the survival type supplements and meds that like Alex Jones 759 00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:02,560 Speaker 1: chills you know on his show. Uh. In my opinion, UM, 760 00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:06,480 Speaker 1: I think maybe this this person's heart was in the 761 00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:09,600 Speaker 1: right place, and I feel like maybe she too was 762 00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:12,560 Speaker 1: taken for a bit of a ride by her partners. Um. 763 00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:15,359 Speaker 1: Then the backlash kind of you know, shut the whole 764 00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:18,120 Speaker 1: thing down. So I don't necessarily think that she was 765 00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:25,360 Speaker 1: you know, operating with like complete disregard for the facts. It. No, 766 00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:27,279 Speaker 1: it doesn't seem like it, but it does seem like 767 00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:32,000 Speaker 1: this is absolutely you know uh WHOI as they say, Um, 768 00:47:32,040 --> 00:47:35,279 Speaker 1: but yeah, that's this one. So always, uh be vigilant 769 00:47:35,560 --> 00:47:38,359 Speaker 1: and do your own research and don't let people feed 770 00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:39,960 Speaker 1: you a bill of goods, you know when it comes 771 00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:41,640 Speaker 1: to like stuff that you're putting on your skin or 772 00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:45,120 Speaker 1: in your body. Oh and send us, send us your 773 00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:50,640 Speaker 1: favorite your favorite strange claims in the cosmetic industry. Uh, 774 00:47:50,840 --> 00:47:54,160 Speaker 1: the US is actually pretty tame about a lot of these, 775 00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:58,040 Speaker 1: even when they don't even when they don't withstand scientific rigor. 776 00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:00,960 Speaker 1: But the rest of the world does have some some 777 00:48:01,040 --> 00:48:05,439 Speaker 1: wild stuff out there, so be careful. And again, if 778 00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:09,040 Speaker 1: you identified with something in Voodoo's story, or if you 779 00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:14,400 Speaker 1: have uh some perspective on the function of time and dreams, 780 00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:17,799 Speaker 1: we'd love to hear from you if you also I 781 00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:19,960 Speaker 1: think we said this at the beginning of this week's segment, 782 00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:23,879 Speaker 1: but if you have some examples of weaponized memes, then 783 00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:26,239 Speaker 1: please send them our way. We can't wait to hear 784 00:48:26,239 --> 00:48:28,719 Speaker 1: from you. We try to be easy to find online. 785 00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:30,960 Speaker 1: I asked. The Internet is where you may find us 786 00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:35,200 Speaker 1: in all of the places of note, including Facebook, Twitter, UM, 787 00:48:35,239 --> 00:48:37,160 Speaker 1: and YouTube, where you can find us with the handle 788 00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:41,600 Speaker 1: conspiracy Stuff. We are Conspiracy Stuff show on Instagram. And 789 00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:43,359 Speaker 1: if you don't want to be on the internet, UM, 790 00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:45,800 Speaker 1: you want to maybe use more old school or analog 791 00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:48,400 Speaker 1: means of communications, well we got you covered there too. 792 00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:51,080 Speaker 1: That's right. We have a phone number, but before you 793 00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:53,239 Speaker 1: call it, and before I tell you how to call it, 794 00:48:53,480 --> 00:48:56,080 Speaker 1: I asked that you please take a second and review 795 00:48:56,120 --> 00:48:59,520 Speaker 1: this show on whatever podcatcher you use, especially if it's 796 00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:03,400 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts. That helps us out a ton, especially if 797 00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:05,560 Speaker 1: you like the show. If you don't like the show, 798 00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:08,400 Speaker 1: you know uh, you can call us and tell us 799 00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:10,600 Speaker 1: how you don't like it rather than write a review. 800 00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:15,160 Speaker 1: Our number is one eight three three st d W 801 00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:18,560 Speaker 1: y t K. Hope you're singing along at home. You'll 802 00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:20,719 Speaker 1: call it. You'll hear a message telling you you are 803 00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:23,120 Speaker 1: indeed in the right place. You'll have three minutes. Those 804 00:49:23,200 --> 00:49:26,840 Speaker 1: three minutes are yours. Do with them what you will, 805 00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:29,919 Speaker 1: but as always, make the most of your time. Give 806 00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:32,600 Speaker 1: yourself a sick nickname. Tell us what's all your mind. 807 00:49:32,719 --> 00:49:35,000 Speaker 1: The second most important thing about your call is to 808 00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:36,960 Speaker 1: let us know if we can use your voice and 809 00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:40,680 Speaker 1: or message on the air. First most important thing, do 810 00:49:40,760 --> 00:49:44,920 Speaker 1: not edit yourself. If you have some additional photographs, if 811 00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:47,440 Speaker 1: you have some links you'd like to send us, We 812 00:49:47,680 --> 00:49:50,320 Speaker 1: love to hear from you. We do read every email 813 00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:52,120 Speaker 1: we get. All you have to do is drop us 814 00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:54,920 Speaker 1: a line where we are conspiracy at i heart radio 815 00:49:55,120 --> 00:50:15,239 Speaker 1: dot com m h M. Stuff they don't want you 816 00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:17,920 Speaker 1: to know is a production of I Heart Radio. For 817 00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:20,359 Speaker 1: more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the i heart 818 00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:23,200 Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 819 00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:23,920 Speaker 1: favorite shows,