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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is alive

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Speaker 1: from coast to coast with Caroline Hide in New York

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Speaker 1: and Ed Lovelow in San Francisco.

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Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Tech. I'm Tim Senovek in New York.

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Speaker 2: Coming up, Open AI closes one of the biggest funding

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Speaker 2: rounds in history. We're gonna have the details. Plus, Anthropic

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Speaker 2: accidentally releases internal source code behind its claud coding assistant.

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Speaker 2: And today is launch day for Artemis two. We are

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Speaker 2: on the ground at Kennedy Space Center. We're going to

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Speaker 2: get you the latest. First though, a.

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Speaker 3: Check on the markets.

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Speaker 2: Tech stocks in the green along with other US stocks.

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Speaker 2: This as optimism grows that the war in the Middle

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Speaker 2: East may be nearing a conclusion. Look at what we

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Speaker 2: see right here on the big board. The NAZAC wondered

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Speaker 2: off to a pretty strong start for the quarter, but

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Speaker 2: this does come after a relatively bad quarter where it

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Speaker 2: fell six percent out of correction territory though we should

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Speaker 2: note also the S and B five hundred up nine

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Speaker 2: tens of one percent, following a decline in the most

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Speaker 2: recent quarter of four point six percent. Oil still above

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Speaker 2: one hundred dollars a barrel. This is Brent crude up

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Speaker 2: one and one sixty six is where we are down

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Speaker 2: two percent. To talk about a tough quarter for Brent

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Speaker 2: crude up a whopping seventy percent. We've got a great

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Speaker 2: program coming up. Investors are a little nervous when it

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Speaker 2: comes to stocks, but still higher on this first day

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Speaker 2: in the quarter. I do want to start in Washington,

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Speaker 2: where President Trump has arrived at the Supreme Court for

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Speaker 2: oral arguments in the birthright citizenship case. Bloomberg Washington correspondent

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Speaker 2: Tyler Kendall joins us with the latest. Tyler, an unprecedented

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Speaker 2: move for a sitting president to attend these arguments at

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Speaker 2: the Supreme Court. What can you tell us.

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Speaker 4: The ATM.

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Speaker 5: So, we're about an hour into the oral arguments here

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Speaker 5: at the Supreme Courts. Right now, the US Solicitor General

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Speaker 5: John Sower is still being questioned by the justices. We

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Speaker 5: have to keep in mind this case centers on President

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Speaker 5: Trump's executive order that he signed on the first day

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Speaker 5: in office, seeking to bar US born children of undocumented

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Speaker 5: immigrants from obtaining US citizenship. And what the justices are

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Speaker 5: looking at today is the Trump administration's interpretation of the

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Speaker 5: citizenship clause under the fourteenth Amendment. We're not going to

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Speaker 5: get to walky into it here, but the Trump administration,

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Speaker 5: as we're hearing outlined right now by the US Solicitor General,

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Speaker 5: is essentially arguing that in order for the Amendment to apply,

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Speaker 5: it requires a relationship of what he is calling full

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Speaker 5: allegiance to the United States, which the Trump administration says

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Speaker 5: does not extend to undocumented immigrants or temporary visitors. We

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Speaker 5: are about to hear from the challengers in this case.

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Speaker 5: The ACLU lawyer is about to be questioned by the

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Speaker 5: Supreme Court justices who argues that the Fourteenth Amendment has

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Speaker 5: a long standing legal precedent of granting's citizenship to those

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Speaker 5: born on US soil. Now, Tim, we're not expecting to

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Speaker 5: get a ruling today from the justices, but rather we're

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Speaker 5: looking for those signals on how they may rule. We

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Speaker 5: had some indications going into this that some conservative justices

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Speaker 5: may be skeptical, and that appears to be echoed in

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Speaker 5: what we have heard so far. That includes Chief Justice

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Speaker 5: John Roberts calling one of the administration's arguments quote quirky.

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Speaker 5: Although it does appear the administration has some sympathy. I'll

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Speaker 5: give one example, Samuel Alito, Conservative Justice, saying that the

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Speaker 5: administration is likely correct that when they were ratifying the

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Speaker 5: fourteenth Amendment, the drafters weren't thinking about undocumented immigration. So

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Speaker 5: it's going to be something to watch here. But you're

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Speaker 5: exactly right. This is very unprecedented. The first time you've

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Speaker 5: ever seen a sitting US president president inside for oral

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Speaker 5: arguments as they decide the future of one of his

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Speaker 5: key policies.

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Speaker 2: Bloomberg Tyler Kendall with the latest outside the Supreme Court.

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Speaker 2: Let's turn out to the Middle East, where attentions remain

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Speaker 2: high as the war with Iran continues. President Trump said

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Speaker 2: he'll only consider a ceasefire if the straight of horn

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Speaker 2: moves is fully reopened. He is set to address the

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Speaker 2: nation tonight as questions grow over the path forward and

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Speaker 2: the broader economic impact from more. Let's bring in Bloomberg

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Speaker 2: Balance of Power co host Kaylee lines. Kaylee, the back

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Speaker 2: and forth between Washington and what we're hearing and what

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Speaker 2: we're learning out of Iran. There still seems to be

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Speaker 2: quite a bit of daylight there.

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Speaker 6: What can you tell us, Yeah, there certainly is tim

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Speaker 6: which is a repeated pattern in the US. As one thing,

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Speaker 6: Iran pushes back. There's also a repeated pattern that the

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Speaker 6: President says one thing or is reported to be considering

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Speaker 6: one thing, and then says another. As we are in

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Speaker 6: a very different place, it seems regarding the Straight of

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Speaker 6: Horn moves than what the Wall Street Journal indicated yesterday,

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Speaker 6: which was that the President was considering at least wrapping

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Speaker 6: up military operations without the straight reopening. Now he says

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Speaker 6: there will be no ceasefire if the Strait is not open.

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Speaker 6: But Iran is very much pushing back on that. In

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Speaker 6: a statement citing the Iranian Revolutionary guardcore in state media,

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Speaker 6: they said, and this is a quote, the Straight of

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Speaker 6: hor Mows will not be open based on the absurd

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Speaker 6: displays of the American President, going on to say, the

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Speaker 6: situation in the Strait is decisively and dominantly under the

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Speaker 6: control of the IRGC Navy. Now, of course, the US

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Speaker 6: military continues to strike that navy and other military targets.

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Speaker 6: The President alluding to that in a true social post

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Speaker 6: today in which he said that until the Strait is open,

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Speaker 6: free and clear, the US will continue to blaster on

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Speaker 6: into oblivion, or as they say, back to the Stone Ages.

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Speaker 6: So this is still a war that is ongoing, and

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Speaker 6: the President has indicated it could continue for at least

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Speaker 6: a few more weeks. He told reporters in the Oval

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Speaker 6: Office last night. It could be two to three weeks more,

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Speaker 6: and of course the entire nation will hear from him

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Speaker 6: at nine pm Eastern Time, also from the Oval in

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Speaker 6: which he is expected to address the future of this conflict.

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Speaker 6: Perhaps we will hear from him as to whether or

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Speaker 6: not he is considering actually deploying ground forces or another

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Speaker 6: surge operation, as we're seeing more assets deployed to the

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Speaker 6: Middle East, including a third aircraft carrier. Would he be

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Speaker 6: doing that if he did not intend to use it?

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Speaker 6: And we also can expect to hear from him on

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Speaker 6: the NATO alliance specifically, at least that's what he's told Reuters,

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Speaker 6: that he will be addressing our allies not coming to

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Speaker 6: the US AID when it comes to this war in Iran,

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Speaker 6: after he earlier told the Telegraph that NATO is just

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Speaker 6: a paper tiger and that he is seriously considering withdrawing

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Speaker 6: the United States from it.

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Speaker 2: Tim a lot for Joe and Kayla to keep an

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Speaker 2: eye on keep eye on them. One pm for the

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Speaker 2: early edition of Bloomberg Balance of Power Bloomberg Scaye Lions

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Speaker 2: joining us from Washington. Well, let's discuss the broader implications

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Speaker 2: of these latest developments, especially when it comes to tech markets.

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Speaker 2: I want to bring in Fiona Sencata, senior market analyst

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Speaker 2: and City Index for more. Fiona, I want to talk

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Speaker 2: about the de escalation trade that we saw and potentially

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Speaker 2: that we are seeing today. I should note that traders

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Speaker 2: at Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan are suggesting this was

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Speaker 2: mostly a squeeze.

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Speaker 3: What is it in your view?

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Speaker 2: Is it a squeeze or is it a de escalation trade.

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Speaker 7: It's a good question. I mean, it's not the first

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Speaker 7: time we've seen it, so I think there is reason

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Speaker 7: to be cautious about whether it really is a de

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Speaker 7: escalation trade or not. I mean, obviously we know the

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Speaker 7: Nazak fell almost five percent across March. It moved into

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Speaker 7: correction territory decline ten out of the past eleven twelve sorry,

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Speaker 7: ten out of the past eleven weeks. And it's rare

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Speaker 7: that we see such negativity towards tech stocks. So you know,

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Speaker 7: there really has been a lot of cell pressure on

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Speaker 7: the tech sector. But we are seeing that bounce back.

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Speaker 7: The daily performance yesterday was the best and almost a year,

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Speaker 7: and that de escalation trade or squeeze that we're talking

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Speaker 7: about is holding today.

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Speaker 8: Now.

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Speaker 7: I think there is reason to be cautious here, brickids.

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Speaker 7: I mean, although we've heard before from Trump that we

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Speaker 7: could be sort of you know, moving towards an end

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Speaker 7: to the war, the market I don't think is going

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Speaker 7: to be convinced until we see that straight off Hornmeuse reopen,

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Speaker 7: or at least you know, clear signs that we're heading

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Speaker 7: in that direction. And the reason for that is, brickis,

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Speaker 7: whilst oil priaces remain high, treasury yields are also going

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Speaker 7: to be remaining high, and that just sort of you know,

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Speaker 7: takes the the or hits demand for equities, and particularly

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Speaker 7: for tech stocks. We do tend to see that they

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Speaker 7: come under pressure as yields rise. Now, yields have come

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Speaker 7: back from that sort of almost four point five percent

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Speaker 7: that they are at on Friday to around four point

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Speaker 7: three today, But as I said, I think we really

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Speaker 7: would want to see more concrete signs of that straight

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Speaker 7: of Hall Mews reopening in order for this trade to

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Speaker 7: really gain much more traction and retake the some more

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Speaker 7: key levels on the way up.

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Speaker 2: I'm so glad you went there, because that's exactly what

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Speaker 2: I wanted to talk about. With the brand crewed above

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Speaker 2: one hundred dollars a barrel, WTI very close to one

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Speaker 2: hundred dollars a barrel. I think a lot of people

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Speaker 2: are scratching their heads saying, wait a second, why are

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Speaker 2: we seeing a surge in equities, especially tech if oil is.

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Speaker 3: Still this high?

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Speaker 2: Fiona to what extent our oil prices tied to tech stocks?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, so, I mean, you wouldn't necessarily immediately link the

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Speaker 7: two together. But as I said, that drive that elevated

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Speaker 7: oil price adds inflationary pressures globally, but particularly if we're

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Speaker 7: looking here in the US as well, and that just

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Speaker 7: really does keying those treasury yields elevated now. Also, that

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Speaker 7: also sort of supports the view that the Federal Reserve

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Speaker 7: is going to be taking potentially a more hawkish approach

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Speaker 7: to monetary policy. All of this ties into the fact

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Speaker 7: that we are seeing less support for tech stocks. Lower

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Speaker 7: lower yields are beneficial for stocks, but more importantly for

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Speaker 7: tech stocks because they reduce the discount rate apply to

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Speaker 7: future earnings, making valuations more attractive. So when we have

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Speaker 7: those higher yields, that really does make tech stocks less attractive. So,

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Speaker 7: as I said, you know, I think oil prices are

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Speaker 7: going to remain here, and I think interestingly, even if

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Speaker 7: we do see that straight of horn we's reopen, it

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Speaker 7: will take time for oil prices to come down. And

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Speaker 7: if they do come down, and when they do come down,

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Speaker 7: I guess the actual baseline rate is likely to be

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Speaker 7: much higher than what it has been, that sixty dollars

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Speaker 7: a barrel, more towards the eighty dollars a barrel, because

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Speaker 7: we're going to see it a longer period for the

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Speaker 7: that sort of normalization. But also I think there will

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Speaker 7: be a risk premium that will remain tied in there.

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Speaker 2: I want to throw something at you. It's private markets

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Speaker 2: now but expected to become a public equity this year,

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Speaker 2: and that's open AI. We're going to talk to Shrien

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Speaker 2: Gafari from our Bloomberg News team. She reported out yesterday

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Speaker 2: the eight hundred and fifty two billion dollar valuation after

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Speaker 2: a one hundred and twenty two billion dollar round. What

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Speaker 2: does a potential IPO of open AI and of anthropic

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Speaker 2: this year due to the broader tech equity market.

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Speaker 7: Now, I think it would be extremely exciting. I think

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Speaker 7: there would be a huge amount, unprecedented amount of interest,

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Speaker 7: and I think it would actually be positive for DAI train.

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Speaker 7: I think the AI train has come under pressure. We've

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Speaker 7: seen sort of, you know, a lot of questions about

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Speaker 7: where it's going, whether it is whether the rallies that

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Speaker 7: we've seen over the past sort of year, they've obviously

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Speaker 7: come into quest I would say over the past six months,

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Speaker 7: and I think sort of those IPOs going public in

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Speaker 7: those companies would actually potentially redrive attention and interest into

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Speaker 7: that trade.

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Speaker 2: Fiona Sinkata from City Index. Always good to check in

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Speaker 2: with you. Thanks for joining us on Bloomberg Tech. Well

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Speaker 2: coming up, as we just mentioned open ai closing one

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Speaker 2: of the biggest funding rounds in history.

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Speaker 3: We're gonna have the details next. This is Bloomberg Tech.

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Speaker 2: Open Ai is now valued at eight hundred and fifty

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Speaker 2: two billion dollars. The i company closed a one hundred

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Speaker 2: and twenty two billion dollar funding round intended to help

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Speaker 2: with its costly push for more chips, data centers, and talent.

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Speaker 2: Let's get the details with Bloomberg's Ai reporter Sharen Gafari, Shuran,

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Speaker 2: those are big numbers. I liken the piece you said,

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Speaker 2: this funding is by any measure, one of the largest

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Speaker 2: transactions in history dwarfing not just previous fundraising rounds by

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Speaker 2: fellow privately back startups, but also acquisitions and IPOs. Is

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Speaker 2: this it for open A before it goes public.

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Speaker 9: We don't know yet, but it definitely could be. You know,

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Speaker 9: in a press call with open Ai CFO, she talked

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Speaker 9: about how this helps them have maximum flexibility. If they

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Speaker 9: want to remain private for a little longer, they could.

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Speaker 9: If they want to go public, they also could.

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Speaker 5: You know.

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Speaker 9: Obviously, we are heading into a year where we are

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Speaker 9: expecting some AI IPOs, including potentially open AI. However, you know,

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Speaker 9: given a the macro uncertainty and changing conditions and be

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Speaker 9: the need for these companies to prove a very solid

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Speaker 9: path to profitability at least in the future as a IPO,

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Speaker 9: it's obviously too soon to say exactly when or if

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Speaker 9: these companies will this year.

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Speaker 2: Okay, these companies that includes Thropic. I just want to

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Speaker 2: flick out another piece that you wrote, this one along

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Speaker 2: with colleague Mark Anderson, about Anthropic accidentally exposing its system

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Speaker 2: behind claud code human error in this case, what exactly happened?

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Speaker 9: Yeah, so the company acknowledged that this was human error,

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Speaker 9: not a sort of hack. However, this is source code,

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Speaker 9: so this is the underlying material that goes into the

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Speaker 9: claud code product. We're already seeing some users try to

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Speaker 9: replicate that code now and put it out there, and

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Speaker 9: that is obviously that is not a good outcome for

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Speaker 9: the company. So it raises questions about what went wrong,

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Speaker 9: how they're going to stop that again, especially given earlier

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Speaker 9: in the past week they had another incident with a

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Speaker 9: leaked another kind of human error leaked blog.

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Speaker 2: Post Bloomberg shreen Gafari from our AI team. Check out

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Speaker 2: her reporting and the entire teams reporting on the Bloomberg

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Speaker 2: terminal and at Bloomberg dot Com.

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Speaker 5: Well.

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Speaker 2: At the same time, shares of OpenAI i've actually fallen

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Speaker 2: out of favor in the secondary markets. Investors have been

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Speaker 2: looking to offer load as much as six hundred million

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Speaker 2: dollars worth of shares, but finding no buyers, instead seeing

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Speaker 2: demand surging for rival Anthropic. Bloomberg's Hemaparmer covers hedge funds

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Speaker 2: and she joins us. Now, so how about what's going

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Speaker 2: on here, because it seems like there's this disconnect at

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Speaker 2: least with the latest funding round that I just talked

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Speaker 2: about with sharene and what you're seeing or what hedge

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Speaker 2: funds are seeing in the secondary market, what can you

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Speaker 2: tell us So.

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Speaker 10: The secondary market's really interesting and what they're paying attention

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Speaker 10: to right now is this evaluation gap. So the gap

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Speaker 10: between the three hundred and eighty billion dollar valuation for

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Speaker 10: Anthropic and this eight hundred and fifty two billion dollar

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Speaker 10: valuation for open AI. And if you are thinking that

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Speaker 10: Anthropic is going to have around in the future and

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Speaker 10: is going to close that gap and it could be

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Speaker 10: sizeably bigger, you might be looking to snap up Anthropic

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Speaker 10: shares now to get in early as that nap, as

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Speaker 10: that gap potentially narrows. And so when you look at

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Speaker 10: the two options, open AI may seem in less of

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Speaker 10: a favor compared to the hot we're seeing Anthropic shares

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Speaker 10: in the secondary going for a valuation of six hundred

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Speaker 10: million or more.

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Speaker 2: It's incredible. I mean, it just shows how quickly things

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Speaker 2: can shift. And we did see last week and move

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Speaker 2: away at least from Sora for open AI, maybe streamlining

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Speaker 2: before an IPO and also really leaning into what anthropics

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Speaker 2: bread and butter is the idea of coding and selling

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Speaker 2: to enterprise customers. What's amazing to me is really how

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Speaker 2: quickly this has shifted, and wonder if it can actually

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Speaker 2: shift back a different way anytime soon. How quickly do

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Speaker 2: you things move in the secondary market.

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Speaker 10: So the secondary market moves slower obviously than stocks would do,

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Speaker 10: but you can see changes within a few days, within

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Speaker 10: a few weeks. When you look at companies like open Ai,

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Speaker 10: there are some concerns about the spend and this raise

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Speaker 10: will help to absorb some of those costs. But when

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Speaker 10: you look at the expenditure that some of these companies

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Speaker 10: are making, an ai huge costs. And then when you

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Speaker 10: look at open Ai, these leading into enterprise a little

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Speaker 10: bit slower than Anthropic, but not to say, I mean

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Speaker 10: they've raised one hundred and twenty two billion dollars from investors.

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Speaker 10: The other thing to think about with the secondary is

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Speaker 10: sometimes existing investors may seek liquidity, not because they're souring

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Speaker 10: on the company, but they just either want some extra

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Speaker 10: money to play with, or you know, they see their

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Speaker 10: position as already sizable within their book.

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Speaker 2: Maybe you got to buy a house or a plane

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Speaker 2: or something I don't know. From Bloomberg, Sama Palmer, thanks

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Speaker 2: so much, shot out having a story on the terminal.

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Speaker 2: We got some breaking news right now, billionaire Elon Musk.

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Speaker 2: SpaceX has filed confidentially for an IPO. Let's check out

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Speaker 2: more about timing with that in just a few minutes.

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Speaker 2: We're going to have more details on that coming up.

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Speaker 2: In the meantime, a conversation on AI's expanding role in cybersecurity.

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Speaker 2: We're going to break with ARMD and CEO Kevin Nndia.

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Speaker 2: That's next on Bloomberg Tech. SpaceX has filed for an IPO.

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Speaker 2: Some breaking news. Let's get to our own Ed Ludlow,

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Speaker 2: who's at Kennedy Space Center in Florida, and this story

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Speaker 2: that you wrote along with Bailey Lipschaltz. JASEX said a

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Speaker 2: file confidentially for an IPO ahead of AI rivals. What

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Speaker 2: can you tell us about timing? What did you learn?

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Speaker 10: Yeah?

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Speaker 11: I mean the main thing and the important point of

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Speaker 11: us confirming via sources that the paperwork is in is

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Speaker 11: it probably does put SpaceX on track for a June IPO.

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Speaker 11: There has been lots of reporting about will they or

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Speaker 11: won't they you know, as a starter gun moment for

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Speaker 11: the broader IPO window. But of course, the mechanics of

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Speaker 11: what they're trying to do raising fifty billion dollars plus

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Speaker 11: maybe seventy five billion dollars at the high end at

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Speaker 11: evaluation of one point seventy five trillion, it's going to

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Speaker 11: take a very large coalition of bankers and banks to

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Speaker 11: run that book in what will be the biggest IPO

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Speaker 11: in history on a dollar raise or valuation perspective. So

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Speaker 11: we've known this was coming, but you know, it is

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Speaker 11: a big psychological moment for the markets that it's in,

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Speaker 11: and and you it sets SpaceX up to execute on

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Speaker 11: the groundwork that they've been putting into place for a

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Speaker 11: little while.

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Speaker 3: Now. It's a great piece.

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Speaker 2: We're going to have more from Ed Ludlow from Kennedy

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Speaker 2: Space Center a little later in the program. Breaking news

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Speaker 2: coming from Ed and Bailey. Check out their story on

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Speaker 2: the Bloomberg terminal for more. Well, as we mentioned, Anthropic

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Speaker 2: has accidentally exposed the source code behind its AI coding

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Speaker 2: assistant Claude. In an emailed statement, Anthropics said no customer

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Speaker 2: data or credentials were involved and that the issue was

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Speaker 2: caused by human error and not a security breach. The

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Speaker 2: incident comes as the company is pushing back against a

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Speaker 2: US government designation labeling it a potential supply chain risk.

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Speaker 2: Joining us now to discuss the role of AI in

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Speaker 2: cybersecurity is Kevin Mandia, CEO of our Modern It's an

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Speaker 2: AI platform that simulates real world attacks to identify and

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Speaker 2: fix vulnerabilities. And Kevin, that's exactly where I want to

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Speaker 2: start the vulnerabilities of this with that anthropic story that

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Speaker 2: I talked about with Sharen and just mentioned this vulnerability.

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Speaker 2: It seems to be as a result of user error,

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Speaker 2: not necessarily an attack. How do you look at that

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Speaker 2: in the context right of overall vulnerabilities when it comes

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Speaker 2: to the threat landscape today, Well.

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Speaker 4: No question, whenever you lose source code, there's a reputational hit.

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Speaker 4: But that's you know, when I looked at this case,

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Speaker 4: they didn't lose customer data, they didn't lose customer credentials,

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Speaker 4: they didn't lose customer model weights. And that's where the

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Speaker 4: magic happens when you use agents, because agents have total

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Speaker 4: recall on your data and how you purpose those agents.

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Speaker 4: So this is one of those things that happens to companies.

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Speaker 4: Whenever you have a human in the loop, you have

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Speaker 4: a process that's potentially frail or degrades over time, so

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Speaker 4: they're going to have to manage through the reputational.

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Speaker 3: Hit on this.

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Speaker 4: But at the same time frame, I'm a cybersecurity expert

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Speaker 4: and I look at this. Whenever you lose source code,

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Speaker 4: there will be folks that scour that looking at ways

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Speaker 4: to how does this software work and how do we

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Speaker 4: take advantage of it, maybe in this case with prompt injection.

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Speaker 4: So all you're really going to get out of this

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Speaker 4: tim is probably a faster release cycle because now you

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Speaker 4: have millions of people looking at your code that you

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Speaker 4: never intended to have them look at it. So you're

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Speaker 4: going to have a fast release cycle should there be

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Speaker 4: any identified vulnerabilities from the extra million sets of eyes

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Speaker 4: that are looking at your source code.

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Speaker 2: You were the founder and CEO of Mandian before it

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Speaker 2: was sold to people Cloud, your former CEO of Fire.

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Speaker 2: You have been doing this for decades. This era that

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Speaker 2: we live in right now with soon to be everybody

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Speaker 2: having an AI agent that can act on behalf of them,

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Speaker 2: and also seemingly perhaps bad actors having AI agents that

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Speaker 2: can act on them how does that look out there

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Speaker 2: today compared with other times in this industry? Are we

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Speaker 2: more vulnerable now than ever before?

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Speaker 4: That's a great question, Tim. I think we're going through

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Speaker 4: an inflection point. I hate that term, but it's just

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Speaker 4: dead reality. Whenever you see a shift change in technology,

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Speaker 4: the unfortunate reality is that usually mal intent can be

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Speaker 4: implemented faster than positive. That just is what happens. So

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Speaker 4: you look at the Internet. It allows people to commit

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Speaker 4: crimes or try to make money from nine thousand miles

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Speaker 4: away from where they perpetrate the crimes. And wherever money goes,

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Speaker 4: crime follows, wherever information goes, espionage follows.

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Speaker 3: That's our systems.

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Speaker 4: So you're going to see in under two years AI agents,

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Speaker 4: because they can think and learn and have total recall,

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Speaker 4: they will become the offense in the cyber domain. And

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Speaker 4: the cyber domain has always been contested, Tim, There's always

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Speaker 4: been bad guys on this, you know, on the Internet.

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Speaker 4: But now these bad guys or the espionage actors are

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Speaker 4: going to be able to use agents to work at

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Speaker 4: compute speed. So the change we're going to live in

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Speaker 4: the cyber domain is that you're going to see the

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Speaker 4: speed of attack go way up, so vulnerability discovery will

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Speaker 4: be condensed down to seconds rather than days or minutes.

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Speaker 4: And you're going to see over time, defense have to

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Speaker 4: be autonomous. It can't have humans in the loop. So

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Speaker 4: we're going to go through that inflection point over the

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Speaker 4: next two years.

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Speaker 3: But Agent to.

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Speaker 4: AI is absolutely going to speed up the risk that

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Speaker 4: everybody has in the cyber demand.

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Speaker 2: Kevin, then give me we only have twenty seconds left.

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Speaker 2: But how are you now doing that and addressing that

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Speaker 2: at our modern.

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Speaker 4: Well, we are addressing it. What you're going to see

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Speaker 4: is Armaden is going to be all offense, all the time.

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Speaker 4: We're going to be the agents that train your defense

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Speaker 4: of agents so you can respond at the speed of

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Speaker 4: compute and respond autonomously to the threats that emerge. New

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Speaker 4: and novel threats will be found by the good guys

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Speaker 4: before the bad guys.

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Speaker 2: Kevin Mandia, Armaden CEO joining us from San Francisco. Kevin,

439
00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:35,879
Speaker 2: good to see you well coming out. Intel moves to

440
00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,840
Speaker 2: back by back half a chip plan in Ireland, signally

441
00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:41,520
Speaker 2: renewed confidence. Look at the stock up more than nine

442
00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:43,719
Speaker 2: point nine percent today. We're going to have more on

443
00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:57,680
Speaker 2: that deal next. This is Bloomberg. Welcome back to Bloomberg Tech.

444
00:22:57,680 --> 00:22:59,960
Speaker 2: I'm Tim Seneveek in New York. Let's take a look

445
00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:04,200
Speaker 2: at markets on this first trading day of the second quarter,

446
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:08,240
Speaker 2: after a really bruising first quarter of the year. The

447
00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:10,960
Speaker 2: S and P five hundred up about one percent right now,

448
00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:14,280
Speaker 2: Nasdaq one hundred up one point four percent. This after

449
00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:16,600
Speaker 2: a really bruising first quarter where the Nasdaq one hundred

450
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:18,920
Speaker 2: fell about six percent, the S and P five hundred

451
00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:22,600
Speaker 2: fell about four point six percent. Rendcrud still above one

452
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:25,920
Speaker 2: hundred dollars a barrel, The war in Iran still weighing

453
00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:30,000
Speaker 2: on overall sentiment. You can see Brent down two dollars

454
00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:33,160
Speaker 2: a barrel. That's about two percent. But at these elevated levels,

455
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 2: still a lot of questions about what the duration of

456
00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:37,560
Speaker 2: this conflict actually looks like.

457
00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:38,240
Speaker 3: Well.

458
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:41,440
Speaker 2: Serves of Intel are surging right now. The chip maker

459
00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:43,639
Speaker 2: has agreed to pay fourteen point two billion dollars to

460
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:46,679
Speaker 2: buy back half a plan in Ireland that it previously

461
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:51,119
Speaker 2: sold to Apollo Global Management. Bloomberg Ian King covers semiconductors,

462
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:53,359
Speaker 2: and he joins US now from San Francisco.

463
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:54,040
Speaker 3: Ian.

464
00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:58,200
Speaker 2: The stock reaction to news such as this What does

465
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:01,120
Speaker 2: that represent about how investors are thinking about Intel right now?

466
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:04,280
Speaker 12: Well, they said themselves that this is kind of a

467
00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:06,959
Speaker 12: sign of confidence in where their business is going, and

468
00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:10,080
Speaker 12: it would appear from the reaction that investors have taken

469
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,000
Speaker 12: them at their word and believing that the sort of

470
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:17,560
Speaker 12: background to this is that suddenly the CPU, the chip

471
00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:21,040
Speaker 12: that Intel specializes in, has become kind of an area

472
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:23,359
Speaker 12: of interest again and people are betting that this is

473
00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:26,159
Speaker 12: going to be part of AI data centers to a

474
00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:27,600
Speaker 12: greater extent going forward.

475
00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:30,320
Speaker 2: Is that what changed between now and a couple of

476
00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:35,920
Speaker 2: years ago ian when Intel sold this steak in this facility.

477
00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:40,120
Speaker 12: Yeah, I mean, what's really changes Intel's balance sheet? When

478
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:43,199
Speaker 12: they sold this steak to Apollo, they were you know,

479
00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:45,960
Speaker 12: this was just one of a number of deals that

480
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:49,400
Speaker 12: they were doing basically to get liquidity to make sure

481
00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:51,880
Speaker 12: that that balance sheet wasn't going to drag them down

482
00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:55,800
Speaker 12: even further. Since then, they've got money from the US taxpayer,

483
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:59,760
Speaker 12: from Nvidia, from soft Bank, and you know, business has

484
00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:04,400
Speaker 12: st to improve, the losses have definitely narrowed. So what

485
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:07,920
Speaker 12: they're doing here is basically saying, hey, this plant can

486
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:10,080
Speaker 12: be a money maker going forward. We want to own

487
00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:12,320
Speaker 12: all of it, and therefore we're going to do that.

488
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:14,359
Speaker 12: Now we're going to use our improved balance sheet.

489
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 3: Okay, eighteen A.

490
00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:18,320
Speaker 2: The technology that's being rolled out first in the company's

491
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 2: US factories.

492
00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:20,119
Speaker 3: What does it do?

493
00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 12: Yeah, I mean, this is their latest production technology, and

494
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:27,960
Speaker 12: this is supposed to get them essentially back in the game.

495
00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:31,679
Speaker 12: The better your production technology, remember with advanced semi reconductors,

496
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:34,359
Speaker 12: the better your products are. So this is supposed to

497
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:36,879
Speaker 12: sort of intel on the front line of what this

498
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:39,840
Speaker 12: industry is capable of and make it sort of comparable

499
00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:43,080
Speaker 12: to what TSMC is doing. But the next one fourteen A,

500
00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:45,640
Speaker 12: that's going to be the real test whether that gets

501
00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:48,520
Speaker 12: off the ground and whether, as Intel claims, it'll get

502
00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:51,280
Speaker 12: it back to the absolute forefront of what's out there.

503
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 2: Bloomberg's Ian King cover semiconductors out there in our San

504
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:58,560
Speaker 2: Francisco bureau. Ian, thanks for joining us on Bloomberg Tech Well.

505
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,840
Speaker 2: Child development experts are calling for YouTube to ban AI

506
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:05,040
Speaker 2: generated videos from the feeds of young users. More than

507
00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 2: two hundred children specialists, advocacy groups and schools send a

508
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:11,919
Speaker 2: letter to the CEOs of YouTube and its parent Google.

509
00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:15,359
Speaker 2: Let's get the details with Bloomberg social media reporter Alexandra

510
00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:20,280
Speaker 2: Levine Alexandra Good that have you hear the concern about

511
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:23,120
Speaker 2: AI slop or so called AI slop? Well, in fact,

512
00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 2: that's what Google or that's what YouTube CEO has called

513
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,520
Speaker 2: it in the past. How does that affect or how

514
00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:30,919
Speaker 2: do these advocates say that affects a child's brain differently

515
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:33,240
Speaker 2: than a traditional short form video that may have been

516
00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:35,040
Speaker 2: made by actual human being.

517
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:35,720
Speaker 11: Yeah.

518
00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 13: Well, as we know, concerns about kids and screens and

519
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 13: how much time we're spending in front of platforms like

520
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:44,560
Speaker 13: YouTube are not new. What is new here is sort

521
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:47,160
Speaker 13: of the aipiece of this. The growing concern about AI

522
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:50,600
Speaker 13: in particular is that as young minds are developing, child

523
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:55,040
Speaker 13: development psychologists and other medical experts are worried that children

524
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:57,240
Speaker 13: are not going to be able to understand the difference

525
00:26:57,240 --> 00:26:59,439
Speaker 13: between what is real and what is not, what is

526
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 13: truth and what is not. There's also concern that because

527
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:06,119
Speaker 13: AI slop tends to be very eye catching, very clickbaity,

528
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,800
Speaker 13: very spammy, that that will be more time spent in

529
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:13,480
Speaker 13: front of the screen, and that time spend in front

530
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:15,360
Speaker 13: of a screen, they're concerned, is going to be displacing

531
00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:19,040
Speaker 13: other kinds of real life activities that are key to emotional, social,

532
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:20,160
Speaker 13: cognitive development.

533
00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:21,399
Speaker 3: Where does YouTube come in on this?

534
00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 2: Because they have in recent years rolled out an entire

535
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,879
Speaker 2: slate of tools that are supposed to be part of

536
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:28,520
Speaker 2: this YouTube kids platform.

537
00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 3: Where do they fall?

538
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:33,160
Speaker 13: YouTube has said that their priority for twenty twenty six,

539
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 13: or one of their key priorities for this year is

540
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 13: managing AI slop and making sure that YouTube remains a

541
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,880
Speaker 13: place where where people want to be spending their time.

542
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 13: They have said that they have labels that they show.

543
00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:46,919
Speaker 13: I think these advocates are concerned kids can't actually read

544
00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:50,000
Speaker 13: the labels and oftentimes the labels are not actually appearing.

545
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,159
Speaker 13: And Google has put out this whole slate of of

546
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:57,119
Speaker 13: AI tools, but the advocates really feel like that is

547
00:27:57,119 --> 00:27:59,480
Speaker 13: putting the onus on parents and caregivers and the kids

548
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:02,680
Speaker 13: themselves to be trying to avoid and dodge AI generated

549
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 13: content on the platform, versus YouTube actually taking the productive

550
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,439
Speaker 13: step of just wiping it for younger users, and broadly

551
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 13: we could.

552
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 2: I mean, we don't have time to talk about this,

553
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,720
Speaker 2: but it enters the whole debate about whether kids should

554
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:16,359
Speaker 2: even have access to this stuff in the first place.

555
00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:20,520
Speaker 2: So the story continues US. Alexander Levine of Bloomberg News,

556
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:23,879
Speaker 2: thanks so much well. A new report finds US government

557
00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:27,760
Speaker 2: requests for user data from tech companies have skyrocketed by

558
00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:31,000
Speaker 2: seven hundred and seventy percent in the past decade. The

559
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:35,320
Speaker 2: research from privacy company Proton was based on public transparency

560
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 2: reports from Apple, Google, and Meta. It shows the increase

561
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:43,120
Speaker 2: has been bipartisan. A Google spokesperson told Bloomberg that it

562
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:45,920
Speaker 2: reviews each request to ensure it complies with the law.

563
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:49,600
Speaker 2: Meta said the number of fulfilled requests has remained consistent

564
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 2: despite the government's increase. Apple didn't respond to a request

565
00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:58,040
Speaker 2: for comment. Coming up, AI data center, city supply chain bottleneck.

566
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,760
Speaker 2: What's showing and slowing the infrastructure build out?

567
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 3: That's next? Also watching chairs of Eli.

568
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,080
Speaker 2: Lily's weight loss pill won US approval, ratcheting up pressure

569
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:14,360
Speaker 2: on Novo nor Disc, which launched an obesity pill earlier

570
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 2: this year. The review process took less than four months

571
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 2: thanks to a new FDA program designed to expedi access

572
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:25,360
Speaker 2: to promising medications that meet national priorities. This is Bloomberg Tech.

573
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:37,000
Speaker 2: The US's AI ambitions are hitting a key bottleneck. Power

574
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:39,719
Speaker 2: Nearly half of the data centers planned for this year

575
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 2: are now expected to be delayed or canceled as the

576
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:46,440
Speaker 2: country grapples with a shortage of critical electrical equipment and

577
00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 2: a growing reliance on imports, particularly from China. Bloomberg Examily

578
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:54,120
Speaker 2: Foregash has the report, Emily, how did we find ourselves

579
00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 2: in a position where we were so reliant on China

580
00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:58,440
Speaker 2: for these products?

581
00:29:58,840 --> 00:29:59,040
Speaker 5: Yeah?

582
00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:02,720
Speaker 8: So the U US manufacturing capacity for these really key

583
00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 8: critical electrical parts that help get data centers up and

584
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:08,680
Speaker 8: running is just not enough right now to meet the

585
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 8: booming demand to get all the data centers that companies

586
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:14,280
Speaker 8: are building actually up and running.

587
00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:18,720
Speaker 2: There's this paradox between the presidents of America's America First policy,

588
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:21,680
Speaker 2: the goal of beating China in the AI rise.

589
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 3: How does the US sort of thread this needle?

590
00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:28,240
Speaker 8: Yeah, so the President wants an American First doctrine and

591
00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 8: wants American manufacturing to build these data centers, but we're

592
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:35,440
Speaker 8: relying on key parts from foreign countries, including China, to

593
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 8: beat China in the AI race, whereas China is somewhat

594
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:40,960
Speaker 8: reliant on the US for its chips to beat the

595
00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 8: US and the AI race.

596
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 2: I want to go back to the set that I

597
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:44,960
Speaker 2: read at the top, close to half of the data

598
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 2: center's plan for this year are now expected to be

599
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 2: delayed or canceled. What does this mean for the hyperscalers

600
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 2: who have come out quarter after quarter and said, we

601
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,760
Speaker 2: are actually spending X billions of dollars this year on

602
00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 2: these data centers?

603
00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,720
Speaker 3: Does that money? Where does that money go? Yeah, it's a.

604
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 8: Great and that's the million dollar question, or maybe six

605
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:05,800
Speaker 8: hundred and fifty billion dollar questions. So basically half of

606
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 8: the data centers that are scheduled to be built this

607
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 8: year might not actually come online this year. And that's

608
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:12,959
Speaker 8: because only around a third of those data centers are

609
00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:16,160
Speaker 8: actually under construction right now, and data centers take at

610
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 8: least a year if not more, to actually build. So

611
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:21,240
Speaker 8: that's where siteline Climate is kind of getting their risk

612
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:22,440
Speaker 8: evaluation from.

613
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:24,560
Speaker 2: All right, Emily four goash with the latest check out

614
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:26,920
Speaker 2: her reporting and the team's reporting on the terminal at

615
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:30,040
Speaker 2: Bloomberg dot com. All of this comes as Washington is

616
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:33,280
Speaker 2: way how to build a national framework for artificial intelligence

617
00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:35,840
Speaker 2: and how to ensure the US can actually deliver on

618
00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 2: its AI leadership goals. Joining US now is Kevin Frazier,

619
00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:42,080
Speaker 2: adjunct Research fellow at the Cato Institute, Kevin, I want

620
00:31:42,120 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 2: to start where we left off with Emily just now,

621
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:46,959
Speaker 2: in this bottleneck that we're seeing when it comes to

622
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:49,600
Speaker 2: developing these data centers, What, in your view would be

623
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:52,800
Speaker 2: the right policy to decrease the US reliance on China

624
00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:53,640
Speaker 2: for these key parts.

625
00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 14: Yeah, so, first and foremost, we need to consider this

626
00:31:57,280 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 14: AI infrastructure build out as a national chain. We've seen

627
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 14: that across eleven different states, there have been considerations of

628
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 14: bands or years long moratoria on data center creation. And

629
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:12,160
Speaker 14: as you know, well, data centers aren't just for AI.

630
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 14: We need data centers for healthcare, for commerce, for all

631
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 14: the things that make the Internet go. And so we

632
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:22,719
Speaker 14: need to really emphasize that states, cities, and the national

633
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 14: government all have a role in making sure we can

634
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 14: build AI infrastructure that's aligned with our AI ambitions.

635
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:31,000
Speaker 2: Okay, so, yes, in my backyard is certainly, in your view,

636
00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:33,440
Speaker 2: a big part of this, but that still doesn't address

637
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:36,480
Speaker 2: that the component problem that Emily and the team highlighted

638
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:39,240
Speaker 2: in her piece. How do you make sure that the

639
00:32:39,320 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 2: US actually has access to these key components, these key parts,

640
00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 2: when China has a stronghold on them.

641
00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 14: So this is where we really do need to work

642
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 14: with our allies and developing and strong arming our supply

643
00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:55,959
Speaker 14: chain network across the entire AI techtack. As you've noted,

644
00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:58,000
Speaker 14: we've seen that when it comes to chips, when it

645
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 14: comes to things like helium that's being up and cutter,

646
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 14: we have a long ways to go in terms of

647
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 14: making sure that we have that sort of resilience and

648
00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:08,720
Speaker 14: redundancy that's required to build AI at scale. And so

649
00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 14: this requires ultimately, unsurprisingly funding and political leadership, and right

650
00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:16,920
Speaker 14: now we're seeing that there's a sort of tendency to

651
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:20,040
Speaker 14: not be swimming in the same direction on this AI question,

652
00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 14: and that's in part for understandable reasons. But ultimately we

653
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 14: need to make this a national priority.

654
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 2: Funding from whom though Kevin, a national priority? Does that

655
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:29,760
Speaker 2: mean you want to see the US government and taxpayers

656
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:30,959
Speaker 2: shell out money for this stuff?

657
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:34,320
Speaker 14: I do want to see increase investment from the US

658
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 14: government in this domain. We've seen over the history of

659
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 14: our nation that when it comes to critical infrastructure, ultimately

660
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:43,400
Speaker 14: the central government does have a role in making sure

661
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:46,200
Speaker 14: we have a national highway system, in making sure that

662
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:48,520
Speaker 14: our ports system is resilient to go all the way

663
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:51,720
Speaker 14: back to the Articles of Confederation. So yes, this ultimately

664
00:33:51,880 --> 00:33:54,239
Speaker 14: is a core purpose of the government is to make

665
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:57,800
Speaker 14: sure that basic infrastructure for the technologies of an age

666
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:01,880
Speaker 14: is available and not subject to geopolitical conflict.

667
00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 2: So your view is that infrastructure such as this is

668
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:09,239
Speaker 2: as important, at least historically in the current context, as highways,

669
00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 2: as poor as other huge national projects. How do you

670
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:13,080
Speaker 2: get leaders on board with this?

671
00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:16,600
Speaker 14: So first and foremost, we have to do a lot

672
00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:19,120
Speaker 14: of work in terms of just making sure we're addressing

673
00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:21,360
Speaker 14: a lot of the myths that are being spread about

674
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,000
Speaker 14: this AI build out. So, for example, there was an

675
00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 14: article recently that made headwinds and made the rounds on

676
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 14: social media about how data centers were creating heat islands

677
00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:34,360
Speaker 14: wherever they were being built. Well, if you talk to

678
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,120
Speaker 14: folks like Andy Masley, who studied this issue closer than

679
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:39,239
Speaker 14: just about anyone, we see that a lot of this

680
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:42,600
Speaker 14: information is in fact bunk. And so the more that

681
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:45,920
Speaker 14: we have sort of misinformation flowing about how AI is

682
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:49,440
Speaker 14: being used and developed, those are ultimately distracting questions, and

683
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:51,960
Speaker 14: we need to move on to the questions related to

684
00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:55,880
Speaker 14: the fact that AI is increasingly a national security imperative.

685
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:59,000
Speaker 14: We're seeing right now, for example, in the war in Iran,

686
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:03,080
Speaker 14: that military are using AI in ever more sophisticated domains,

687
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:06,719
Speaker 14: and it's a real national imperative that the US military

688
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:10,200
Speaker 14: have access to leading frontier models that are the most

689
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:12,759
Speaker 14: capable and that are the most reliable across the world.

690
00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 2: Kevin, you study this stuff, so maybe you have an answer,

691
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:16,759
Speaker 2: because it certainly doesn't seem like a lot of people

692
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,880
Speaker 2: do have answers to this. If we look at increased

693
00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:23,080
Speaker 2: demand for electricity across the grid and the way that

694
00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:25,160
Speaker 2: the grid is being taxed in a way now that

695
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:27,439
Speaker 2: many people didn't think it would be in the year

696
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:30,440
Speaker 2: twenty twenty six, and the projections for the future, how

697
00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:32,960
Speaker 2: do you balance the desire and the need in your view,

698
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,600
Speaker 2: to build these data centers in the US drawing power

699
00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:40,280
Speaker 2: from American power plants, but also make sure that American

700
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 2: consumers aren't seeing hiked power bills as a result. Is

701
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:45,440
Speaker 2: it even possible?

702
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 14: I would say it is indeed possible. So I'm a

703
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:51,520
Speaker 14: man of many tired lines. One of my tired lines

704
00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:54,759
Speaker 14: is today's AI is the worst AI we will ever use.

705
00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:57,959
Speaker 14: I'll also say that today's data centers are the worst

706
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 14: data centers will ever use a huge incentive for these

707
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:06,680
Speaker 14: hyperscalers to invest in means for more efficient data center operations.

708
00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:09,640
Speaker 14: And we're seeing that states like Oklahoma, for example, are

709
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:13,440
Speaker 14: enabling behind the meter power that allows for these labs

710
00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:17,200
Speaker 14: to build out more renewable and efficient data center operations.

711
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 14: And so we've actually seen that when you talk to

712
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 14: folks like Gavin McCormick at Climate Trace, that there are

713
00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:27,600
Speaker 14: opportunities for labs to actually assist with making the grid

714
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,240
Speaker 14: more resilient and actually increasing the grid capacity by virtue

715
00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 14: of doing training runs, for example, at low hours of

716
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:35,840
Speaker 14: typical power usage.

717
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:38,839
Speaker 2: Kevin Fraser from the Cato Institute, thanks for joining us

718
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:41,640
Speaker 2: on a bloom Thank you at tech well coming out

719
00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:44,719
Speaker 2: four NASA astronauts are expected to board a space capsule

720
00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:48,759
Speaker 2: and blast off two the Moon later today. We're gonna

721
00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:51,520
Speaker 2: get the latest on Artemis two. That's next. This is

722
00:36:51,520 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 2: Bloomberg Tech. It's launch day for Artemis too. NASA's plan

723
00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:09,920
Speaker 2: return to the Moon's vicinity for the first time in

724
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:12,840
Speaker 2: fifteen years. Let's get over to our own ed Ludlow,

725
00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:15,239
Speaker 2: who has traded the West coast for the East coast

726
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,439
Speaker 2: of Florida. He's live at Kennedy Space Center. And why

727
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:20,879
Speaker 2: is this such a critical moment or a critical test

728
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:22,480
Speaker 2: for NASA's SLS.

729
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:25,279
Speaker 11: Yeah, it's a dress rehearsal for the systems, right, the

730
00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:29,800
Speaker 11: sl LS rocket system developed by Boeing, the Orion spacecraft

731
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:33,520
Speaker 11: developed by Lockheed Martin. It's only launched once before, in

732
00:37:33,560 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 11: twenty twenty two, and you know, is never launched with

733
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:40,439
Speaker 11: humans on board. It is a project that is over

734
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:44,280
Speaker 11: budget and behind schedule. But if we go today within

735
00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:46,640
Speaker 11: the two hour windows starting at six twenty four pm

736
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:50,040
Speaker 11: Eastern time, it is the first time not only that

737
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:52,520
Speaker 11: America and NASA and the world has tried to put

738
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:56,160
Speaker 11: humans back towards the Moon, but it's very deep into space.

739
00:37:56,640 --> 00:37:58,760
Speaker 11: You know, it's a six hundred and eighty five thousand

740
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 11: mile round trip hundred and fifty thousand miles plus from

741
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:06,160
Speaker 11: Earth that will take the crew over that ten day

742
00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:09,239
Speaker 11: period just four thousand miles off the Moon's surface. And

743
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 11: I bring that up because that's the ultimate goal as

744
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,400
Speaker 11: early as twenty twenty eight, the next stages of the

745
00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:16,399
Speaker 11: Artemis program to land back on the Moon.

746
00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:18,840
Speaker 2: You know, when this was the space race was happening

747
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:21,480
Speaker 2: in the nineteen sixties. It was all about the USSR

748
00:38:22,040 --> 00:38:26,920
Speaker 2: versus the United States, and now is the geopolitical context

749
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:31,000
Speaker 2: at the time. Now it's different. Now the superpower is China.

750
00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:32,920
Speaker 2: What are China's ambitions?

751
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:36,960
Speaker 11: Yeah, very simply. China has stated its ambitions to get

752
00:38:36,960 --> 00:38:40,640
Speaker 11: to the Moon by twenty thirty, and NASA has accelerated

753
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:44,640
Speaker 11: its plans, in part under the new leadership of administrative Jarediseman,

754
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,920
Speaker 11: to do as early as twenty twenty eight to establish

755
00:38:48,200 --> 00:38:51,040
Speaker 11: a base on the Moon, a thirty billion dollar commitment

756
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:54,719
Speaker 11: over a decade from this current NASA administration. That is

757
00:38:54,760 --> 00:38:56,839
Speaker 11: the current space race that we are in.

758
00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:00,000
Speaker 2: Ed and I spoke just a few minutes ago, you

759
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 2: and Bailey help with this piece exclusive Bloomberg. SpaceX said

760
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:08,279
Speaker 2: to file confidentially for an IPO before AI rivals. Why

761
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 2: are we talking about the SLS when you know SpaceX

762
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,400
Speaker 2: in a few years could do this. Could that displace

763
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:17,120
Speaker 2: the SLS at some point.

764
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:20,439
Speaker 11: SLS has had a lot of issues, principally with hydrogen leaks.

765
00:39:20,520 --> 00:39:23,839
Speaker 11: Hydrogen is the fuel with oxygen as the oxidizer, and

766
00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:26,920
Speaker 11: if the system goes tonight, it will be the most

767
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:30,919
Speaker 11: powerful human rated system to launch eight point eight million

768
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:35,719
Speaker 11: pounds of thrust at liftoff. Now Starship, the system that

769
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:38,520
Speaker 11: SpaceX is working on is almost double that in terms

770
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 11: of power, but it has never completed a mission end

771
00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:44,279
Speaker 11: to end and has not yet done human spaceflight. But

772
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:48,120
Speaker 11: as we've reported at Bloomberg, there is a proposal on

773
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:51,840
Speaker 11: the table from SpaceX for a variant of the existing

774
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:55,960
Speaker 11: Artemis plan where sles we carry O Ryan into lower orbit.

775
00:39:56,480 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 11: In lower orbit oryan wo dock was Starship and Starship

776
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:03,680
Speaker 11: under this proposal that Nastaro's green lit but is not final,

777
00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:09,000
Speaker 11: would push O'Ryan to lunar low lunar orbit and go

778
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:11,919
Speaker 11: from there. There's also a lander proposal from SpaceX as well,

779
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 11: so they're in the hunt for this. But the IPO

780
00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:17,880
Speaker 11: and the confidential filing we reported earlier be under no.

781
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,280
Speaker 11: You know, the straight matter of it is SpaceX raising

782
00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:27,240
Speaker 11: capital to fund data centers in space. Completely separate story.

783
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:31,160
Speaker 2: Okay, just thirty seconds left on this and obviously I'm

784
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:34,000
Speaker 2: going to Mars and that's the question that we want

785
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 2: answered here. How does a successful flight tonight set up

786
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:39,360
Speaker 2: a future human potentially on Mars.

787
00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:42,320
Speaker 11: Yeah, again, this is a dress rehearsal for the systems,

788
00:40:42,680 --> 00:40:44,880
Speaker 11: with the goal in the near term of getting humans

789
00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:47,320
Speaker 11: back onto the moons surface twenty twenty eight establish a

790
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:50,520
Speaker 11: base on the Moon's surface, with the academic argument that

791
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:55,040
Speaker 11: deploying resources literally launch capability or refuel from the Moon

792
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:58,160
Speaker 11: to get to Mars in the future is one interesting

793
00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:01,759
Speaker 11: avenue and those are the goals. Near a term, it's

794
00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 11: the Moon, But longer term there is still a commitment

795
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:07,800
Speaker 11: from this NASA administration and this country to getting humans

796
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:10,960
Speaker 11: to Mars. And again, SpaceX retains that ambition of making

797
00:41:11,239 --> 00:41:14,440
Speaker 11: humans a multiplanetry species with the end goal being Mars.

798
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 2: All right for now, Ed's at Kennedy Space Center, Cape Canaveral, Florida,

799
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:20,680
Speaker 2: Bloomberg's Ed Ludlow Live.

800
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:21,040
Speaker 3: There.

801
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 2: Stick around with Ed right here on Bloomberg as we

802
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:27,160
Speaker 2: follow the launch live that's at six pm Wall Street

803
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,920
Speaker 2: time tonight. Well, speaking of Elon Musk, he wants Tesla's

804
00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:33,400
Speaker 2: future to be all about AI, but at present, the

805
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,560
Speaker 2: eb maker still needs to sell cars. The company releases

806
00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:39,399
Speaker 2: its sales figures tomorrow and analysts are expecting the last

807
00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:42,480
Speaker 2: quarter to be a bit of a sluggish one. Bloomberg's

808
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:45,680
Speaker 2: Autos reporter Craig Trudell has the details. Greg, I thought

809
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 2: analyst said that, you know, the stock price of Tesla

810
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:52,719
Speaker 2: is completely divorced from autos right now. Why is this

811
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:54,320
Speaker 2: still such a closely looked at figure.

812
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:59,040
Speaker 15: Yeah, I think it's still a debate one that maybe

813
00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:01,680
Speaker 15: looks like it was settled months ago when you saw

814
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:05,239
Speaker 15: you know, the auto business for Tesla just really uh,

815
00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:08,920
Speaker 15: you know, show show signs you know, of deteriorating. I

816
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:11,840
Speaker 15: think especially early last year, right where you know, we

817
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,919
Speaker 15: saw the shares of this company get off to such

818
00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:18,440
Speaker 15: an awful start, and yet even as we didn't necessarily

819
00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:21,840
Speaker 15: see a major improvement in car sales, we saw the

820
00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:25,120
Speaker 15: shares come back because Musk was sort of pushing this

821
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:29,360
Speaker 15: narrative of AI and robots. We're now seeing the shares

822
00:42:29,840 --> 00:42:32,520
Speaker 15: have a hard time just early this year, in part

823
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:34,640
Speaker 15: because of the fact that that this is you know,

824
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 15: still not a settled issue, and this is still a

825
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:39,600
Speaker 15: company that, after all, makes so much of its money

826
00:42:39,880 --> 00:42:43,000
Speaker 15: building and selling cars and and is still very much

827
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:45,719
Speaker 15: at the early stage, the sort of prototype stage of

828
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:48,840
Speaker 15: making things like the humanoid robot to optimists that everyone's

829
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:51,439
Speaker 15: excited about, but it's really hard to value at this junk.

830
00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:53,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, perhaps that's a really good segue to talk about

831
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:58,719
Speaker 2: this report, this exclusive from Ed and Bailey about SpaceX

832
00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:01,680
Speaker 2: centifile content contently for that IPO. Just in the last

833
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,759
Speaker 2: thirty seconds that we have with you, how are analysts

834
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:09,080
Speaker 2: talking about Tesla potentially becoming part of SpaceX after this

835
00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 2: becomes a private a public company.

836
00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:14,960
Speaker 15: I think it's a really fascinating question. I think you know,

837
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:18,279
Speaker 15: this is all for me coming from a perspective of

838
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 15: Tesla and SpaceX. For all the success they've had, they've

839
00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:25,279
Speaker 15: not been the sort of money spinners that a Alphabet

840
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:29,560
Speaker 15: or a Facebook are, right, and Musk has such outsize

841
00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:33,280
Speaker 15: ambitions to play with the big boys in terms of AI.

842
00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:36,680
Speaker 15: Does he need to combine these companies in order for

843
00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:40,120
Speaker 15: them to help raise more money and fund this AI

844
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:40,680
Speaker 15: race and.

845
00:43:40,640 --> 00:43:43,600
Speaker 2: Maybe of course get that big payday in the next

846
00:43:43,640 --> 00:43:46,440
Speaker 2: few years. That Bloomberg is Craig Trudell live from London,

847
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:47,680
Speaker 2: that is going to do it for this addition of

848
00:43:47,719 --> 00:43:49,960
Speaker 2: Bloomberg Tech, don't forget to check out our podcast, find

849
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 2: another terminal, Apple, Spotify than iHeart this is Bloomberg