1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:18,640 Speaker 1: M all right, welcome to a special edition of the 2 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:21,960 Speaker 1: State of the Lakers podcast. Today, we're going to focus 3 00:00:22,120 --> 00:00:25,600 Speaker 1: on a bunch of stuff related to Stephan Lebron because 4 00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 1: he's been brought back to the forefront here ironically, even 5 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 1: though the two of them haven't really had a legitimate 6 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:36,240 Speaker 1: playoff match up against each other, and what's this now 7 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:40,239 Speaker 1: almost four years? But I think Stephen A. Smith is 8 00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 1: one of the big guys who's kind of brought this 9 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:43,360 Speaker 1: to the forefront. But it's been a big topic in 10 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:46,000 Speaker 1: a bunch of different ways. Now. We had the weird 11 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 1: interview where somebody said that Steph was the Michael Jordan 12 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:52,120 Speaker 1: of this era. We had the Bill Simmons podcast for 13 00:00:52,200 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 1: him and Syrah, so he went all in on a 14 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:57,640 Speaker 1: couple of different topics related to whether or not step 15 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 1: was the best player of the last ten years, and 16 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 1: whether or not him and Lebron have had different different 17 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:10,120 Speaker 1: levels of impact on the game, changing the game of basketball. Um. So, 18 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:13,319 Speaker 1: the three main questions that I want to hit today 19 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:17,560 Speaker 1: in the step Lebron conversation is one, is Steph the 20 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:21,920 Speaker 1: Michael Jordan of this era? And then two, could Steph 21 00:01:21,959 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 1: ever pass Lebron? And then last, how did Lebron and 22 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:28,760 Speaker 1: Steph change the game? Just kind of getting into that 23 00:01:28,800 --> 00:01:30,959 Speaker 1: because there's a lot of people who think step step 24 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:32,960 Speaker 1: has changed the game, but Lebron hasn't. But Lebron has 25 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:34,680 Speaker 1: changed the game in a lot of ways. So I 26 00:01:34,720 --> 00:01:37,119 Speaker 1: wanted to get into that as well. So let's start 27 00:01:37,160 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: with this Michael Jordan's concept. So you know, obviously Steph 28 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:44,959 Speaker 1: is not the Michael Jordan of this era because he 29 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 1: hasn't been better than Lebron James. That said, you know, 30 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:51,559 Speaker 1: I don't even think Lebron James has been the Michael 31 00:01:51,600 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: Jordan of this era because there's a huge difference between 32 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 1: the way that MJ dominated the league in the way 33 00:01:57,640 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: that Lebron dominant dominated the league. Now, there's a couple 34 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 1: of different elements to that, right, because MJ dominated the 35 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:09,440 Speaker 1: league in the nineties during an era where both Larry 36 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:13,040 Speaker 1: Bird and Magic Johnson had their careers cut short by 37 00:02:13,120 --> 00:02:17,720 Speaker 1: on like unfortunate circumstances. Larry Bird throughout his back towing 38 00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:21,799 Speaker 1: his driveway and French lack and and Magic Johnson got 39 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 1: hib and in both cases, guys who in their late 40 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:28,640 Speaker 1: primes would have been able to go on a run 41 00:02:29,160 --> 00:02:34,880 Speaker 1: to potentially derail Michael Jordan's championship contenders just never really 42 00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:36,799 Speaker 1: got that chance, and so then you ended up with 43 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 1: guys who were in a significantly lower tier all time 44 00:02:40,320 --> 00:02:43,320 Speaker 1: trying to take titles off of m J. Guys like 45 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 1: you know, Karl Malone, guys like Charles Barkley. And so 46 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:49,680 Speaker 1: part of that is you have to give credit to 47 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 1: Michael Jordan's for being so much better than everybody in 48 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:57,960 Speaker 1: his era. That is a legitimate, uh testament to how 49 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:00,400 Speaker 1: good he was at the time. But at the same time, 50 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:02,840 Speaker 1: you know, you also have to factor in the fact 51 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:05,680 Speaker 1: that you didn't have a year like this year where 52 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:09,360 Speaker 1: you're looking at Lebron and Kevin Durant and Steph Curry 53 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: and Nicola Yokich and Jana Santana Croompo all playing like 54 00:03:13,360 --> 00:03:16,839 Speaker 1: super duper duper duper duper stars, like there's there never 55 00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:20,280 Speaker 1: There hasn't been a season like that during the nineties 56 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 1: that we could look back to and be like, here's 57 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 1: a year where MJ dominated an unbelievably stacked top of 58 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 1: the league. It just didn't happen. So again, you could 59 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:31,880 Speaker 1: choose to interpret that two ways. You can interpret it 60 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:35,080 Speaker 1: as MJ was just way better than everybody. So that's 61 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:38,480 Speaker 1: a credit to MJ or MJ took advantage of a 62 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:41,680 Speaker 1: downturn in talent in the NBA. There's a bunch of 63 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: different ways to look at that, but Lebron, who has 64 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:48,240 Speaker 1: been by far the most dominant player of this era, 65 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 1: even that dominance isn't the same type of dominance that 66 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:56,240 Speaker 1: you saw from Michael Jordan's. So that's why I compared 67 00:03:56,320 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 1: them more to the Lebron step dynamic, to me, compares 68 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:04,600 Speaker 1: a lot more to the Magic Johnson Larry Bird rivalry 69 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:08,120 Speaker 1: that took place in the eighties. Now those two players 70 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:11,920 Speaker 1: are closer all time than Stephan Lebron are. I have 71 00:04:12,120 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 1: Lebron to maybe one, depending on what they asked me. 72 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:19,599 Speaker 1: I have Steph right around number ten, whereas Bird and 73 00:04:19,640 --> 00:04:22,120 Speaker 1: Magic are both in that four five range. So they're 74 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,400 Speaker 1: definitely closer to each other than Stephan Lebron were. But 75 00:04:25,440 --> 00:04:28,080 Speaker 1: Stephan Lebron are definitely a lot closer to each other 76 00:04:28,480 --> 00:04:31,800 Speaker 1: than Michael was to anybody that he played against in 77 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:33,560 Speaker 1: his era. So that's kind of what I was trying 78 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 1: to say. A lot of people interpreted that tweet that 79 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:37,479 Speaker 1: I sent out as some sort of shot at Lebron. 80 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,400 Speaker 1: It wasn't at all. It's just the dynamic between Lebron 81 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:45,080 Speaker 1: and Steph it's very different now, uh than than the 82 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:48,719 Speaker 1: mj dynamic was in that era. But could could Steph 83 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:51,719 Speaker 1: be the Michael Jordan's this era? Absolutely not, because what 84 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 1: Michael Jordan did in the nineties is kind of unprecedented 85 00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 1: in modern basketball. There hasn't been anybody in this era 86 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 1: who has come close to that level of dominance, and 87 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 1: that needs to be respected. That that phrase is somebody 88 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:06,799 Speaker 1: the Michael Jordan of this era just shouldn't be thrown 89 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:09,280 Speaker 1: out unless we have a player come into the league 90 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: who is just monumentally better than everybody else in the game. 91 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:19,000 Speaker 1: That's what it would require to to receive that distinction. Okay, 92 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:22,799 Speaker 1: moving on to question number two. Could Steff ever pass Lebron? 93 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: Of course you could. There's nothing saying that Steph. Couldn't, 94 00:05:26,760 --> 00:05:29,680 Speaker 1: you know, rip off an MVP this year in the finals, 95 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:32,000 Speaker 1: MVP this year, and then come back next year and 96 00:05:32,080 --> 00:05:35,400 Speaker 1: be an MVP again and win another NBA title and 97 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 1: rip off two or three in a row, and all 98 00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:39,040 Speaker 1: of a sudden you're looking at a guy who's got 99 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 1: five or six titles and was definitively the best player 100 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 1: on you know, multiple championship teams that he would certainly 101 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:49,080 Speaker 1: become a conversation, but he does have a long way 102 00:05:49,120 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 1: to go. That's the important thing that you have to understand, 103 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:55,360 Speaker 1: and it's a lot easier said than done. Like it's 104 00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 1: it's it's one thing to look at the situation and 105 00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:00,360 Speaker 1: be like, Okay, Steph is on arguably the best team 106 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:03,520 Speaker 1: in the league right now, and he's he's you know, 107 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 1: in the conversation for m v P, although I think 108 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:07,920 Speaker 1: Kevin Durant has surpassed him in recent weeks because he 109 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:10,680 Speaker 1: hasn't been playing as well. But let's say, you know, 110 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:14,279 Speaker 1: it's just the the idea of step ripping off multiple 111 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:16,840 Speaker 1: m v P s and ripping off multiple titles at 112 00:06:16,839 --> 00:06:19,799 Speaker 1: this point, it could happen, but it's a long shot. 113 00:06:19,960 --> 00:06:21,840 Speaker 1: A lot of things have to break his way. He 114 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:25,280 Speaker 1: has to stay healthy, he has to avoid a physical decline. 115 00:06:25,640 --> 00:06:28,440 Speaker 1: He needs to get something out of Andrew Wiggins. He 116 00:06:28,440 --> 00:06:31,600 Speaker 1: needs to get something out of Jonathan Cominga and Jonathan 117 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 1: and James Wiseman. He needs Draymond Green to not physically decline. 118 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:37,839 Speaker 1: He needs Klay Thompson to come back from this injury 119 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:40,719 Speaker 1: and to look like more or less what he was 120 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 1: and before he got hurt. A lot of things have 121 00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:45,799 Speaker 1: to break right for that to happen, but it could. 122 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:48,919 Speaker 1: And I'm not like, yeah, I'm a Lebron fan, but 123 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:52,240 Speaker 1: I'm not beholden to him. I'm not like, in the 124 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:54,520 Speaker 1: first and foremost, even though I am a Lebron fan, 125 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:58,719 Speaker 1: I'm a basketball fan and I take NBA history very seriously. 126 00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:01,040 Speaker 1: That's why I've been so heads attempt to put Lebron 127 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 1: above Michael Jordan's because I do think there's a certain 128 00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 1: amount of respect that is owed in that direction. And 129 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 1: I feel the same way you know about this Lebron 130 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 1: Steps situation. Steph has a lot to accomplish in order 131 00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:16,400 Speaker 1: to pass Lebron, but it certainly is possible. But you 132 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:19,320 Speaker 1: have to keep in mind, like with Lebron, even if 133 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 1: even if you just like a lot of people want 134 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 1: to simplify it to Lebron has four rings and step 135 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 1: has three rings, but it's actually a lot more complicated 136 00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:30,280 Speaker 1: than that. Like Lebron on all four of those championship 137 00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:34,840 Speaker 1: teams was definitively the very best player on his team, 138 00:07:34,920 --> 00:07:37,720 Speaker 1: whereas with Steph there's one in two thousand fift team, 139 00:07:37,720 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 1: where he was definitively the best player on his team. 140 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:42,960 Speaker 1: But then there's the other two where you know he 141 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 1: was playing with somebody who arguably was better than him 142 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 1: at the time. Now, I personally think that Steph at 143 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 1: the time was every bit as good as Kadi, if 144 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:52,600 Speaker 1: not a little bit better. But there are people who 145 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 1: think that kat was better, and those teams, you have 146 00:07:55,360 --> 00:08:01,120 Speaker 1: to admit that specific accomplishment doesn't necessarily feel the same 147 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:05,320 Speaker 1: as a Lebron in two thousands sixteen beating the Warriors 148 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: with with Kevin Love and Kyrie Irving. The point is is, 149 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 1: obviously no two titles are weighed the same, and I'm 150 00:08:10,240 --> 00:08:13,000 Speaker 1: not trying to undercut titles by any stretch of the imagination, 151 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:18,040 Speaker 1: but Lebron's four are clearly different than steps three, two 152 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 1: of which he did he got alongside Kevin freaking Durant 153 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: at the absolute peak of his powers. But even if 154 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:27,880 Speaker 1: we set that aside, even if we said, okay, Steph 155 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:30,720 Speaker 1: has four titles, Lebron has four titles, you have to 156 00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:34,680 Speaker 1: look at the rest of Lebron's resume for him to 157 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 1: have made First Team All m b A as many 158 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,079 Speaker 1: times as he has for him to win four m vps, 159 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 1: and I think he absolutely should have one at five. 160 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:44,600 Speaker 1: A lot of the ones in NBA history that people 161 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:47,000 Speaker 1: look at as Lebron should have one m v P, 162 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:50,640 Speaker 1: I actually disagree. But in particular the year they just 163 00:08:50,640 --> 00:08:53,240 Speaker 1: won the title, he should have won the MVP that year. 164 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 1: That should not have been Nice's award. It was a 165 00:08:56,559 --> 00:09:00,120 Speaker 1: huge benefit thrown to Janice through advanced metrics and a 166 00:09:00,160 --> 00:09:01,720 Speaker 1: lot of things that had to do with the Bucks 167 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:06,440 Speaker 1: playing in a terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible Eastern Conference, and 168 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:09,880 Speaker 1: that was legitimized when he lost quickly in the bubble. 169 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:13,720 Speaker 1: The point being, you know, Lebron has this extensive resume, 170 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 1: multiple m vps, multiple you know what does he have now? 171 00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:20,840 Speaker 1: Ten finals appearances. There's so much more to Lebron's resume 172 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:25,560 Speaker 1: above and beyond what you get with the championships that 173 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:28,959 Speaker 1: it's just it's so much would have to be added 174 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:31,440 Speaker 1: to what Steph has done in order for him to 175 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 1: pass Lebron. And you guys know, like I'm not. I 176 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: got to do a conversation with a couple of guys 177 00:09:36,520 --> 00:09:40,440 Speaker 1: yesterday about this on Twitter. But you know, you don't 178 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:42,840 Speaker 1: have to love one and hate the other. That's been 179 00:09:42,880 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: the most confusing thing to me over the course of 180 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:49,280 Speaker 1: my time being on Twitter, seeing people think like, Okay, 181 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 1: I like Steph, so therefore I must hate Lebron, or 182 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 1: I like Lebron, so therefore I must hate Steph. Like 183 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: to me, when I see stuff like that, I'm like, 184 00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:01,720 Speaker 1: do you even like basketball? Because I love basketball and 185 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 1: I love watching Steph play basketball. Do I get annoyed 186 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 1: sometimes by some of the things his fans say? Sure, 187 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 1: but I also get annoyed by the things Lebron James 188 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 1: himself does and says, you know, because he could be 189 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 1: so corny sometimes. The point is is, like, as a 190 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 1: basketball fan, it's I struggle to understand how anybody could 191 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:21,520 Speaker 1: not like the two of them, and look at the 192 00:10:21,559 --> 00:10:24,120 Speaker 1: two of them and understand how much better they are 193 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:26,960 Speaker 1: than everyone else that has played in this era. And 194 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:30,720 Speaker 1: again like step has the ability to pass Lebron, and 195 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:33,440 Speaker 1: I have a ton of respect for stef and I 196 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:35,520 Speaker 1: love the way he plays the game. But right now 197 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 1: there's a pretty significant chasm there. He would have to 198 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:41,480 Speaker 1: make up a lot of ground over the course of 199 00:10:41,520 --> 00:10:44,280 Speaker 1: the next few seasons. He has an opportunity to Golden 200 00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:46,400 Speaker 1: State has a ton of talent, a lot of their talent. 201 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:50,440 Speaker 1: He's young. He absolutely has the opportunity to pass Lebron, 202 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:52,480 Speaker 1: but he has a long way to go. And that's 203 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:55,640 Speaker 1: not a slight against step And I've heard a lot 204 00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:57,559 Speaker 1: of people with that tweet that I said out yesterday 205 00:10:57,600 --> 00:11:00,360 Speaker 1: saying no, it's k D. It should be Braun and 206 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 1: k D, or should be Katie and Steph fighting for 207 00:11:03,320 --> 00:11:08,320 Speaker 1: that third spot. I vehemently disagree. Now, Kevin Durant has 208 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 1: a very good basketball resume in its own right, but 209 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 1: Steph has accomplished more at every level of the game 210 00:11:14,920 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 1: than Kevin Durant has. He has the more m vps, 211 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:20,839 Speaker 1: he's He's won more championships. He definitively has won a 212 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:22,920 Speaker 1: title as the best player on his team. Kevin Durant 213 00:11:22,920 --> 00:11:24,800 Speaker 1: has not. He may or may not have been better 214 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:27,600 Speaker 1: than Steph. And then on a day in, day out basis, 215 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:30,319 Speaker 1: over the course of the last decade, Steph has impacted 216 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:33,400 Speaker 1: winning more than Kevin Durant has, in my opinion, and 217 00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:36,640 Speaker 1: that has manifested in the way that his teams have 218 00:11:36,679 --> 00:11:39,000 Speaker 1: performed in the standings year in and year out. I 219 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:42,280 Speaker 1: don't care that they lost in the in the playing 220 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 1: game last year. If you look at that team, they 221 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:46,680 Speaker 1: shouldn't even have been in the play in if Steph 222 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:49,560 Speaker 1: had not landed on his tailbone on a freaky play 223 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:52,080 Speaker 1: where he fell into the stands in the year before 224 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:54,720 Speaker 1: he broke his hand. So like, I don't really look 225 00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 1: too much into that. It's very similar to Lebron missing 226 00:11:56,880 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 1: in twenty is just injury related, but over the worse 227 00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:04,760 Speaker 1: of the last decade, steps record is unassailable against someone 228 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:08,760 Speaker 1: like KD. So to me, Lebron is definitively number one, 229 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:13,200 Speaker 1: but Steph is definitively number two, and Katie is probably 230 00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 1: definitively number three. But there isn't really there's a very 231 00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:19,600 Speaker 1: clear and discernible boundary that separates those three guys from 232 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:22,319 Speaker 1: each other, in my opinion, And it's not a disrespect 233 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:24,040 Speaker 1: to any of them. It's just the reality of what 234 00:12:24,040 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 1: they've accomplished on the court. Like you can argue whether 235 00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:31,120 Speaker 1: or not Steph or Lebron has been better in any 236 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:35,280 Speaker 1: specific season because maybe you value one skill set over another. 237 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:38,880 Speaker 1: Maybe you think what Lebron does impacts winning more, maybe 238 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:41,480 Speaker 1: you think what Steph does impacts winning more. But the 239 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 1: reality of the situation is in terms of what actually 240 00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 1: has happened on the scoreboard, in terms of actual team accomplishments, 241 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:53,520 Speaker 1: Lebron has Steph beat. He has step beat by significant margin, 242 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:57,480 Speaker 1: and Steph has KD beat by a significant margin. So 243 00:12:57,679 --> 00:12:59,959 Speaker 1: in terms of their place in history in this lead, 244 00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:04,400 Speaker 1: it's pretty clear where those three land. But I'm never 245 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,079 Speaker 1: gonna shut the door on Steph being able to pass Lebron. 246 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:09,880 Speaker 1: He certainly came. He just has a long way to go, 247 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 1: and I think that it needs to be pointed out now. 248 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:15,280 Speaker 1: Moving on, how did how did Lebron and step change 249 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,640 Speaker 1: the game? This was the big topic that was brought 250 00:13:18,760 --> 00:13:28,280 Speaker 1: up in that recent Bill Simmons podcast. So Steph obviously 251 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:29,920 Speaker 1: changed the game in a bunch of different ways people 252 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:32,640 Speaker 1: think about. You know, there's certain areas of the way 253 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:35,520 Speaker 1: step change the game that actually aren't remembered correctly. Like 254 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:38,920 Speaker 1: the league was trending heavily towards taking more threes with 255 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:42,160 Speaker 1: or without step that would have happened anyway. Where I 256 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 1: think Steph changed the league has a lot to do 257 00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 1: with what the pick and roll ball handler does or 258 00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:51,400 Speaker 1: what the isolation ball handler does. It used to be 259 00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: that an off the dribble three point shot was incredibly taboo. 260 00:13:55,679 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 1: You would never it would you would be extremely rare 261 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:01,000 Speaker 1: for you'd even see one in m in an NBA game, 262 00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:04,480 Speaker 1: and almost never at the lower levels, and it was 263 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 1: consistently viewed as a low percentage bad shot that was 264 00:14:07,880 --> 00:14:10,080 Speaker 1: bad for the offense, is bad for the flow in 265 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,600 Speaker 1: rhythm and confidence of your team. It was just all bad. 266 00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 1: And that was kind of the ironic thing of the 267 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:17,720 Speaker 1: two thousand fifteen and two thousand sixteen Warriors was Steph 268 00:14:17,800 --> 00:14:20,920 Speaker 1: taking all these shots that people thought were bad shots 269 00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 1: that actually ended up being good shots because of how 270 00:14:23,880 --> 00:14:27,400 Speaker 1: good he was at converting them, which inevitably led to 271 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,200 Speaker 1: a change in defense. And this is where step changed 272 00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:31,680 Speaker 1: the game. It's funny if you guys, remember, if you 273 00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:35,359 Speaker 1: ever watched an NBA game from the late two thousand's, 274 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 1: almost every team in the league did some variation of 275 00:14:38,880 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 1: a hedge and recover on pick and roll defense. So 276 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:44,600 Speaker 1: you like, just just imagine watching the old Calves games 277 00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 1: and you'd see, you know, Larry Hugh's garden the ball 278 00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:50,560 Speaker 1: handler and the ball handler would come off a ball 279 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 1: screen and you see zydrenas galwas kiss or Anderson bears. 280 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:56,440 Speaker 1: Youw like run almost out to half court on like 281 00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 1: a hedge to try to send the ball handler back, 282 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 1: and then the guy guarding the ball handler would go 283 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:05,880 Speaker 1: under the screen, and he'd go under the screen and 284 00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:07,920 Speaker 1: try to meet the ball handler on the other side. 285 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:10,440 Speaker 1: It's a hedge and recover defense. It was the most 286 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:13,560 Speaker 1: common pick and roll defense, you know, fifteen years ago 287 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 1: that was rendered completely useless by Steph Curry because every 288 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:20,920 Speaker 1: single time, as soon as he beat the hedge, the 289 00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:23,400 Speaker 1: hedger would recover to the roll man and he'd have 290 00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 1: a little bit of a gap of space between him 291 00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 1: and the guard going underneath the screen, and he would 292 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 1: just make people pay every single time knocking down the three. 293 00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:35,240 Speaker 1: And now if you watch, almost every team runs a 294 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: drop coverage where they chase over the top. Why is that. 295 00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:41,600 Speaker 1: It's because every guard has now tried to copy what 296 00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:44,720 Speaker 1: Steph Curry did, which is shoot threes off the dribble, 297 00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:46,920 Speaker 1: going over the top of a screen and pick and roll. 298 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:49,720 Speaker 1: And so now since every single guard in the league 299 00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 1: can do that, at least the majority of guards. You know, 300 00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:54,520 Speaker 1: there are a lot of guards who are extremely good 301 00:15:54,520 --> 00:15:56,560 Speaker 1: at that, but there are so many guards that are 302 00:15:56,560 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 1: good at shooting coming off the top of the screen 303 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:02,320 Speaker 1: that now almost repick and roll defense involves the guy 304 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 1: guarding the ball handler to chase over the top of 305 00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:08,720 Speaker 1: the screen. That is an example of Steph completely changing 306 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,520 Speaker 1: the game and the irony there there is. You've seen 307 00:16:11,560 --> 00:16:15,840 Speaker 1: so many guys try to copy Steph by attempting to 308 00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 1: take a ton of optagital threes. But what they missed 309 00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: and the reason why those guys aren't as good as 310 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 1: step the reason why there's such a huge gap between 311 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:26,800 Speaker 1: a guy like Dame Lillard and Steph. You know, it 312 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 1: has a lot to do with the other facets of 313 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 1: the game that Steff has never gotten enough credit for 314 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 1: him moving every single time he passes the ball. He's 315 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 1: always in motion. He is never making himself easy to guard. 316 00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:41,440 Speaker 1: If you want to guard Steph well for forty eight minutes, 317 00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:45,840 Speaker 1: it requires a team effort of consistent attention, and every 318 00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:48,000 Speaker 1: time you lose him, he will make you pay, or 319 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:50,280 Speaker 1: at least as a high percentage chance that he will 320 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:54,000 Speaker 1: make you pay. That sort of off ball action that 321 00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:57,880 Speaker 1: Steph weaponizes is something that no one else has been 322 00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:00,640 Speaker 1: able to replicate at the guard position, and that's the 323 00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 1: irony of people trying to be like Steph Is, they 324 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:07,280 Speaker 1: miss that huge part of his offensive game and how 325 00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 1: important that is to UH to staying a threat and 326 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 1: making sure that you don't get diminished in your impact 327 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:17,000 Speaker 1: in a playoff series, because that's the important detail there. 328 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:19,600 Speaker 1: You know, Steph has shot below from three in his 329 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 1: last two playoff runs, that doesn't mean he's played poorly. 330 00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:26,000 Speaker 1: All shooting percentages, especially on jump shots, go down in 331 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:27,959 Speaker 1: the playoffs because guys are tired. It's a much more 332 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 1: physical game. It's a much more slower paced game, and 333 00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:32,680 Speaker 1: it's just harder to make jump shots when you don't 334 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:35,840 Speaker 1: have your base underneath you. That's why steps shooting percentages 335 00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:38,120 Speaker 1: dropped in the playoffs has nothing to do with anything 336 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 1: other than the natural order of things in the playoffs. Now, 337 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:43,439 Speaker 1: the flip side of that is that's where all the 338 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 1: other things Steph does carries so much value. Everything step 339 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:51,120 Speaker 1: Doubs does in terms of his gravity, that absolutely translates 340 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,639 Speaker 1: to the playoffs. Step everything he does as a defensive player, 341 00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 1: making it so that you know, like step Is, it's 342 00:17:57,359 --> 00:17:59,360 Speaker 1: just a bad idea to attack him in isolation now 343 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:02,080 Speaker 1: because he's expreien. He's very strong and he does a 344 00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:03,680 Speaker 1: good job moving his feet, and he is good. He's 345 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:07,200 Speaker 1: got quick hands, and so you know, obviously he might 346 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 1: be the best option for you to attack in a 347 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:13,199 Speaker 1: lineup with the Warriors that has like Andrew Wiggins and 348 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 1: you know UH Andrea Guadala and Klay Thompson in it, right, 349 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:20,920 Speaker 1: But the truth of the matter is like even when 350 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 1: you attack step it's not a great matchup. He holds 351 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:26,439 Speaker 1: his own and then off the ball, he does a 352 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:29,679 Speaker 1: very good job always being in the right spots, using 353 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:32,359 Speaker 1: his hands and doing all of the little things necessary 354 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:35,960 Speaker 1: to make him a plus defender instead of a minus defender. 355 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:38,640 Speaker 1: And that's always been the big difference between him and 356 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:41,720 Speaker 1: all of the other UH guards in the league that 357 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:44,520 Speaker 1: try to be him. They think it's all about three 358 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:47,400 Speaker 1: point shooting. It's not all about three point shooting. There 359 00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: is a total package to what Steph Curry brings to 360 00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:52,920 Speaker 1: the table that is different than what these other guards 361 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:56,240 Speaker 1: are doing. And that's why those guys can't touch that impact. 362 00:18:56,600 --> 00:18:59,120 Speaker 1: And that's why what Steph does works all the way 363 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:03,000 Speaker 1: through June, whereas you've seen Dame consistently flame out in 364 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:06,439 Speaker 1: earlier rounds. It's just a different total package of a 365 00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:10,960 Speaker 1: basketball player. Now where I pushed back on what uh 366 00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 1: real quickly, one last thing with Steph, his off ball 367 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:19,440 Speaker 1: style does cultivate a ball movement that is very different 368 00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:22,200 Speaker 1: than what you see in other offenses. It's very difficult 369 00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:24,560 Speaker 1: to replicate. You know, We've seen a little bit of 370 00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:27,280 Speaker 1: it from Spurs teams in the past, but the Warriors 371 00:19:27,359 --> 00:19:29,720 Speaker 1: just keep the ball moving around really, really well, and 372 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,120 Speaker 1: a lot of that has to do with Steph being 373 00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:35,240 Speaker 1: off the ball. But there's a flip side to that. 374 00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 1: The role players that play with Steph have to be 375 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:41,520 Speaker 1: a certain archetype, whereas the role players that play with 376 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:44,000 Speaker 1: Lebron have to be a different archetype. Right, Like we've 377 00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: seen We've literally seen Lebron load up on playmakers like 378 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 1: you did in two thousand nineteen, if you guys remember, 379 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,879 Speaker 1: and it kind of didn't really work because you know, 380 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:55,199 Speaker 1: it actually makes more sense to have playmakers with a 381 00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:58,800 Speaker 1: guy like Steph because with Steph he drags bodies away 382 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,160 Speaker 1: from the paint. So what you've really need are guys 383 00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:03,920 Speaker 1: that can run a lightning quick four on three attack 384 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:08,120 Speaker 1: and get layups or wide open threes. If if that's 385 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,360 Speaker 1: what it provides with the point being with step you're 386 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 1: looking for guys that can attack with an advantage on 387 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: a shrunken court where the paint is open, So it 388 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 1: actually helps better that it helps more to have guys 389 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:21,760 Speaker 1: like Andrea Guadala who are not great shooters but can 390 00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:24,440 Speaker 1: put the ball on the floor and make really smart, intelligent, 391 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:27,359 Speaker 1: quick decisions with the basketball, and when they get to 392 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:30,480 Speaker 1: the rim, they can finish at the rent, whereas with Lebron, 393 00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:33,800 Speaker 1: you actually do want shooters and cutters. You want guys 394 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:36,359 Speaker 1: that do stuff without the ball in their hands. You 395 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:39,159 Speaker 1: want guys that have a good understanding of when to 396 00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:41,919 Speaker 1: cut off the ball to the to the basket, and 397 00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:44,800 Speaker 1: you want shooters that do a good job of relocating 398 00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:47,320 Speaker 1: and doing things off the ball to occupy defenders so 399 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:50,000 Speaker 1: that Lebron can attack or when they're guys help that 400 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:52,840 Speaker 1: can consistently make you pay. And then obviously for both guys, 401 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:54,680 Speaker 1: you want them to be able to defend. But that's 402 00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:58,720 Speaker 1: the point, like they both played super unique styles that 403 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: require specific types of role players, he swapped Lebron and 404 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:07,159 Speaker 1: Steph today, arguably both teams would underachieve to where they 405 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:10,520 Speaker 1: are now because of the way that those specific role 406 00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:13,679 Speaker 1: player groups are catered to their specific skill sets. So 407 00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:15,440 Speaker 1: moving on to Lebron, because this is this is where 408 00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:17,879 Speaker 1: I disagreed with what Bill Simmon was saying, because built 409 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:22,119 Speaker 1: Lebron James absolutely has changed the game. When Lebron came 410 00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 1: into the league, when he was playing with Paul Silas, 411 00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 1: if you ever go back and watch, you could find it. 412 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:28,399 Speaker 1: All you have to do is look at old highlight 413 00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:30,520 Speaker 1: films of Lebron when he was a rookie. Look up 414 00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 1: the one when he was playing against Tracy McGrady, that 415 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:35,760 Speaker 1: famous Christmas Day game. He was constantly off the ball. 416 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:38,320 Speaker 1: And not only was he off the ball, they had 417 00:21:38,359 --> 00:21:41,000 Speaker 1: like to kind of they put like two big guys 418 00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:44,359 Speaker 1: on the block, and they'd set kind of constant cross 419 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:48,160 Speaker 1: screens and they'd have Lebron run the baseline, and when 420 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:49,960 Speaker 1: he'd run the baseline, he'd catch on one of the 421 00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:51,680 Speaker 1: wings and if he was open, he'd shoot a jump 422 00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 1: shot a lot of times midrange jump shots, or he 423 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:57,159 Speaker 1: catch an attack. But a lot of what Lebron was 424 00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:00,199 Speaker 1: doing was what all small forwards and power forwards at 425 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 1: the time, like if they were really talented offensive players, 426 00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 1: a point guard would bring the ball up the floor. 427 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:07,680 Speaker 1: They'd run an action to get you to a spot 428 00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:09,919 Speaker 1: on the floor where you thought you could succeed, and 429 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:12,359 Speaker 1: they would hit you in that spot and let you 430 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:14,880 Speaker 1: go to work, kind of like what Carmelo Anthony did 431 00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:17,399 Speaker 1: during his whole career. Carmelo Anthony is an example of 432 00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:20,119 Speaker 1: a player who came at the same time as Lebron, 433 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 1: but rather than changing the game the way Lebron did, 434 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,640 Speaker 1: Carmelo kind of became the ultimate version of what we 435 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:29,439 Speaker 1: were doing as a league at that time. Lebron popularized 436 00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:34,240 Speaker 1: helio centrism, and this is a style of basketball, just 437 00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:37,679 Speaker 1: like with Steph that people have attempted to recreate, but 438 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:41,200 Speaker 1: they fail. We've seen guys like James Harden, like Trey Young, 439 00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 1: like Luca don Chez attempt to do what Lebron does, 440 00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:46,960 Speaker 1: but for whatever reason, it just doesn't have the same 441 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:49,439 Speaker 1: level of impact. And there's a very specific reason for 442 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:52,440 Speaker 1: that when you get into a playoff setting in particular, 443 00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 1: and by the way, when I say helio centrism a 444 00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:56,560 Speaker 1: quick definition, I just mean get the ball in the 445 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:58,919 Speaker 1: hands of your best player, not your point guard, but 446 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,720 Speaker 1: your best player, and effectively have him play point guard. 447 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:03,640 Speaker 1: At the top of the key with the spread floor 448 00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:06,199 Speaker 1: either an isolation or the high pick and roll, and 449 00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:08,679 Speaker 1: let him consistently make decisions out of that. With the 450 00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,400 Speaker 1: spread floor, it's just really hard to guard a guy 451 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 1: thirty ft from the basket, So he's probably gonna beat 452 00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:15,880 Speaker 1: his man off the dribble, and then from there he's 453 00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:17,720 Speaker 1: gonna get you in rotation. He's either gonna get you 454 00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:20,400 Speaker 1: helping at the rim or missing a cut or something 455 00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:23,640 Speaker 1: along along those lines on the weak side, and he's 456 00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:27,000 Speaker 1: gonna consistently make you pay. But the key difference between 457 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:29,680 Speaker 1: that style the way Lebron does it, in the way 458 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 1: that You're Lucas and your Trays and your James Harden's 459 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:38,160 Speaker 1: do it is Labron applies consistent rim pressure and there so, 460 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:42,360 Speaker 1: essentially in a playoff series when teams are switching a 461 00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:46,679 Speaker 1: lot and it becomes kind of an isolation contest, the 462 00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:49,520 Speaker 1: guys that get to the rim, the guys that get 463 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:53,240 Speaker 1: high percentage shots at the rim, typically win those battles, 464 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:57,280 Speaker 1: whereas guys that depend on step back jump shots or 465 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:01,120 Speaker 1: Finnesse type of moves away from the basket, they succumb 466 00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:04,760 Speaker 1: to the fatigue elements. That's where that's why James Harden 467 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:07,440 Speaker 1: is shot so poorly in the playoffs in his career. 468 00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,440 Speaker 1: That's step back three. Any of you have ever done 469 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:13,199 Speaker 1: that shot before? Have you ever tried that shot? It's 470 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:16,159 Speaker 1: it's every bit as athletic a move as a dunk. 471 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:20,040 Speaker 1: To generate the separation you need stepping back and to 472 00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:23,800 Speaker 1: get enough lift to knock the shot down. It's like 473 00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:28,240 Speaker 1: a dunk. It's extremely tiring, and so when you get 474 00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:31,160 Speaker 1: like when you're tired and you get to the basket. 475 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:33,399 Speaker 1: As long as you're getting to the basket, you can 476 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,359 Speaker 1: still make those layups at a high percentage, right, But 477 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 1: if you're taking step back three's and you're tired, they're 478 00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:41,680 Speaker 1: probably gonna start missing. And that's what you see happen 479 00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:44,200 Speaker 1: with Luca, That's what you see happen with James Harden. 480 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:46,440 Speaker 1: So that's what you see happen with the tray Youngs 481 00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:49,560 Speaker 1: of the world. They play a helio centric style, but 482 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,639 Speaker 1: they rely on more difficult shot making, and when the 483 00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:57,280 Speaker 1: fatigue elements of the postseason come into play, they tend 484 00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:01,520 Speaker 1: to fade. But we've seen lebron Celio's entric style last 485 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:05,160 Speaker 1: all the way through the end of June consistently because 486 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:09,239 Speaker 1: of his specific attack, his method of attack, and there 487 00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:11,520 Speaker 1: are a bunch of other elements too, right, Like, Lebron 488 00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:14,080 Speaker 1: is probably a better passer than all three of those guys, 489 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,119 Speaker 1: So that's another reason why that works. Just like with 490 00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:18,720 Speaker 1: step he's an off the dribble jump shooter, but he's 491 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:21,120 Speaker 1: just way better off the dribble jump shooting than any 492 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:23,880 Speaker 1: of those guys. So you're not only are you trying 493 00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:26,520 Speaker 1: to copy a specific skill that you're not as good at, 494 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:28,719 Speaker 1: but you miss all of the other elements. And then 495 00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:30,680 Speaker 1: the big one of the other big difference is the 496 00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:33,800 Speaker 1: last thing I wanted to mention about Lebron's heliocentric attack 497 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 1: is the way that he attacks from different spots on 498 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:41,120 Speaker 1: the floor. When you watch James Harden, chances are it's 499 00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:44,640 Speaker 1: gonna be a live dribble thirty ft from the basket, 500 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 1: either on the left wing or the right wing, and 501 00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:48,520 Speaker 1: he's either going to call a ball screen or it's 502 00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:51,040 Speaker 1: gonna be isolation. But it's gonna be a series of 503 00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:54,360 Speaker 1: dribbles between the legs, either setting to a left right crossover, 504 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:56,680 Speaker 1: right to left crossover, or into his step back three. 505 00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:00,159 Speaker 1: You're consistently going to see that there will never be 506 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 1: a point in the game where James Harden catches in 507 00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:06,440 Speaker 1: the corner and tries to make something happen. There will 508 00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:08,359 Speaker 1: never be a point in the game where James Harden 509 00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:11,119 Speaker 1: posts you up. There will never be a point in 510 00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:13,240 Speaker 1: the game where James Harden tries to get a face 511 00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:16,199 Speaker 1: up touch at the midpost or the high post. There 512 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:17,879 Speaker 1: will never be a point in the game where James 513 00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:19,280 Speaker 1: is going to run the floor and do a deep 514 00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:22,879 Speaker 1: seal underneath the basket. You're getting all of that with Lebron. 515 00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:26,440 Speaker 1: Lebron is going to mix in post ups. Lebron is 516 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:28,879 Speaker 1: going to mix up face up, mix in face ups. 517 00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:32,000 Speaker 1: He's gonna mix in dives to the basket off the 518 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:34,560 Speaker 1: ball where he tries to get easy touches right under 519 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:38,320 Speaker 1: the rim for layoffs. He's going to, you know, find 520 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,480 Speaker 1: like probably a half dozen different types of attack that 521 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:44,840 Speaker 1: he brings at you in a playoff series, mixed in 522 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:48,399 Speaker 1: with your normal heliocentric, high pick and roll, high isolation 523 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:50,960 Speaker 1: type of players, and so becomes because of that, it 524 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,720 Speaker 1: becomes much harder to guard him over the course of 525 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:56,240 Speaker 1: a playoff series when you're Guarden James Harden. There's a 526 00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:58,640 Speaker 1: reason why he struggles towards end of games. You give 527 00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 1: a guy like you know, you give a good defensive 528 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:06,480 Speaker 1: player who's guarding him possessions in a row to watch 529 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 1: the same move at the top of the key, like 530 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,680 Speaker 1: chances are eventually he's gonna pick up on cues. Okay, 531 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:13,560 Speaker 1: I think he's gonna go left here. Okay, I think 532 00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:15,120 Speaker 1: he's gonna go right here. Oh, it looks like he's 533 00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:18,439 Speaker 1: setting up for a step back. You eventually become a 534 00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:21,600 Speaker 1: tuned to what they're doing, and you figure out how 535 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,520 Speaker 1: to eventually start to bother them a little bit more 536 00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:26,640 Speaker 1: on those shots, and that's when the misses start coming. 537 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,040 Speaker 1: You can't do that with Lebron because he mixes it 538 00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 1: up so much. If you started sitting on some of 539 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 1: his isolation moves far from the basket, he will post 540 00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 1: you up. If you're too strong and he's not getting 541 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:41,080 Speaker 1: a physical advantage on you in the post, he'll move 542 00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:43,000 Speaker 1: you further away from the basket and try to face 543 00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:45,560 Speaker 1: you up. He has so many different angles to his 544 00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 1: offensive attack that he stays versatile enough that he doesn't 545 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:53,760 Speaker 1: get undercut by the normal things that undercut offensive basketball 546 00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:57,120 Speaker 1: players in the postseason. So kind of insummation looking back 547 00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:02,360 Speaker 1: at this, Yes, Lebron and Steph both have brought changes 548 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:06,359 Speaker 1: to the game, and Lebron with his heliocentrism, stepped with 549 00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 1: his author dribble, jump shooting, and with everything else that 550 00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:11,359 Speaker 1: he does on the basketball court. But the truth of 551 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,119 Speaker 1: the matter is is nobody in the league does it 552 00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:15,800 Speaker 1: as well as they do it, and that's why they're 553 00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:18,359 Speaker 1: still in the top tier. That's why step at his 554 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,439 Speaker 1: age and Lebron at his age are still in the 555 00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:25,000 Speaker 1: top tier superstars in the league, and why everyone who 556 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:28,240 Speaker 1: tries to be like them seems to fail. It's because 557 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:31,160 Speaker 1: everyone wants to minimize what they do down to one 558 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:35,840 Speaker 1: thing like Steps shooting right or Lebron high pick and 559 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,840 Speaker 1: roll or high isolation, when the reality is that they 560 00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:41,880 Speaker 1: do so much more to impact the game, and everyone 561 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 1: who tries to be like them inevitably comes up short. 562 00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:49,040 Speaker 1: Now everyone brings a different touch right, like Janice is 563 00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:51,280 Speaker 1: going to find a whole new angle to his game. 564 00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 1: Janice is basically, you know, Joannice is basically a shock 565 00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 1: that dribbles from the perimeter. So he's kind of unprecedented 566 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 1: in his own way. And just watch, I bet you 567 00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 1: the raptors try to do this um um with Scotty Barnes. 568 00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:08,840 Speaker 1: They're gonna try to turn him into honest. And the 569 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,920 Speaker 1: truth of the matter is Joannice is honest. No one 570 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:13,920 Speaker 1: else is going to be able to be what Janice 571 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,480 Speaker 1: can can be. You know, everyone talks about Ben Simmons. 572 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,000 Speaker 1: If I swapp Ben Simmons, Ben Simmons onto the Bucks, 573 00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:22,560 Speaker 1: would he be able to do what Jannice does? Hell no, 574 00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:26,600 Speaker 1: absolutely not. There's Janice is a one of one. Step 575 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,000 Speaker 1: is a one of one. Lebron is a one of one, 576 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:32,680 Speaker 1: and there's there there's nothing. There's no ability to to 577 00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 1: recreate what they do. Um. But I just I wanted to, 578 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:39,440 Speaker 1: you know, because the Steph Lebron topic can be so 579 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:43,840 Speaker 1: toxic because Step fans hate Lebron fans, or step fans 580 00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:46,800 Speaker 1: hate Lebron for whatever reason, and Lebron fans hate step 581 00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 1: for whatever reason, which, like I said earlier, is lame 582 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:50,960 Speaker 1: because if you like the game of basketball, you should 583 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:54,480 Speaker 1: like them both. You can dislike a basketball player for 584 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:57,840 Speaker 1: regular reasons, right, Like I'm not a huge fan of 585 00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 1: James Harden and his style of play, but that's not 586 00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:04,920 Speaker 1: associated to my like for another player. I don't dislike 587 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:08,280 Speaker 1: James Harden because I like Lebron James, you know, but 588 00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 1: there's a lot of Steph fans who dislike Lebron just 589 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:12,800 Speaker 1: because they like Steph. And there are a lot of 590 00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:15,960 Speaker 1: Lebron fans who dislike Steph just because they like Lebron. 591 00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:18,760 Speaker 1: And I've always thought that was silly. And when I 592 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 1: look back at this era, I'm really thankful that I 593 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,640 Speaker 1: got to watch this era because this is two of 594 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,600 Speaker 1: the top ten basketball players, top ten basketball players of 595 00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:31,840 Speaker 1: all time, who have gone to gone to war basically 596 00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 1: consistently over the course of this decade, and they've definitively 597 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 1: been you know, any given season, if you pick they're 598 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:41,959 Speaker 1: the best player in the world. You know, like it 599 00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:43,560 Speaker 1: it's been cool to be able to winness this and 600 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:46,080 Speaker 1: I hate that people want to undercut one of them 601 00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:48,719 Speaker 1: to raise up the other, you know, Like it's like 602 00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:52,400 Speaker 1: if you if you prefer Michael Jordan over Lebron, just 603 00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:54,560 Speaker 1: say you thought Michael was better. It doesn't have to be. 604 00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 1: Lebron plays in a Pansy league, right Like, if you 605 00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:00,800 Speaker 1: think Lebron is better than step it doesn't have to 606 00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:04,520 Speaker 1: be steps And you know, a system player, you know, 607 00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:06,880 Speaker 1: like David Mediman said all those years ago, like it 608 00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:10,160 Speaker 1: doesn't have to be that, it can be. I think 609 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:13,440 Speaker 1: steps incredible, but I think Lebron is a little better, 610 00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:16,200 Speaker 1: which is where I'm at. I think step is the 611 00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:20,320 Speaker 1: ninth or tenth best basketball player ever, and probably when 612 00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:22,000 Speaker 1: he's all said and done, will be closer to five 613 00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:25,920 Speaker 1: or six. But he's definitively below Lebron. That's not a 614 00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:29,800 Speaker 1: shot at Steph, just the reality of this situation. And 615 00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:32,600 Speaker 1: I'll react to new information. If over the course of 616 00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 1: the next five years Steph rips off three more and 617 00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:38,240 Speaker 1: he's definitively the best player on all three teams, and 618 00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,920 Speaker 1: he wins two more m v p s, then guess what, 619 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:43,200 Speaker 1: we have to have a new conversation about Lebron and Steph. 620 00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:47,160 Speaker 1: But where we stand right now, Lebron has an extensive 621 00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 1: resume that runs laps around what step is accomplished, and 622 00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:54,600 Speaker 1: he's won four titles where he's definitively been the best 623 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:58,480 Speaker 1: player on all four teams. So right now there's a gap. 624 00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:01,240 Speaker 1: There might not be there in five years, but right 625 00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 1: now there's a gap there. So saying something like Steph 626 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,920 Speaker 1: is the Michael Jordan of this era is outrageous. That's 627 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,000 Speaker 1: just it's just not realistic. Like I said earlier, like 628 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:12,920 Speaker 1: Lebron might not even be the Michael Jordan of this 629 00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:16,000 Speaker 1: era because he hasn't been dominant enough. But I just 630 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 1: in general, I wish all of the toxic discourse surrounding 631 00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 1: these two players would go away because they are the 632 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:24,960 Speaker 1: two best players of this era. Kevin Durant is definitively 633 00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:29,000 Speaker 1: beneath both of them, so they need to be Both 634 00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:30,960 Speaker 1: of them need to be pumped up and to be 635 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:34,360 Speaker 1: remembered and enjoyed while they're here. All right, guys, that's 636 00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:37,720 Speaker 1: all I have for today. This is this recording. We'll 637 00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:40,520 Speaker 1: air on Dash Radio tomorrow morning at seven am Pacific 638 00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 1: Standard time, and will be on my podcast feed here 639 00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:46,920 Speaker 1: at about four pm Pacific standard time. So if you 640 00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:48,440 Speaker 1: miss the beginning and you want to check that out, 641 00:32:48,440 --> 00:32:50,520 Speaker 1: you can find out our podcast feed, and then Rog 642 00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:53,720 Speaker 1: and I will be back for our normal postgame show 643 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:56,040 Speaker 1: tomorrow night. Thanks as always for the support. We'll see 644 00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:56,880 Speaker 1: you guys in a day or so.