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Speaker 1: This is a me eater podcast coming in you shirtless,

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Speaker 1: severely bitten and in my case underwear lissen don't to

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Speaker 1: eat podcast. You can't predict anything. It's it's it's thank

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Speaker 1: you for that. That's all I really wanted to do tonight,

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Speaker 1: So thank you. I appreciate it. It's super dark. But

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Speaker 1: where's a dude named Justin Grimes? He's not his honeymoon

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Speaker 1: They yeah, like they made this part of the honeymoon

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Speaker 1: trip man, which is really flattering something. We're glad you're here. Um,

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Speaker 1: when I when I get uh, when I give wedding

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Speaker 1: but marriage vice, don't ever ask, but I do give it.

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Speaker 1: And I was like, say, read like you're not gonna

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Speaker 1: understand that you do it, But read the works as

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Speaker 1: you think about your married life, your married life, Read

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Speaker 1: the works of Cormick McCarthy and looking there for the

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Speaker 1: strict moral code that governs the world of Cormick McCarthy,

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Speaker 1: because you'll find that the people that he's most severe

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Speaker 1: with are people who make a decision to do something

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Speaker 1: and then later try to live a life in which

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Speaker 1: they hadn't made that decision. If you're just flat out evil,

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Speaker 1: Cormick McCarthy doesn't hurt you. He hurts people who who

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Speaker 1: dabble in evilness, So bear that in mind. Um, but

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Speaker 1: Bozeman man, like, yeah, I heard everybody yelling earlier with

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Speaker 1: from Montana like I live in never like constant jealousy

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Speaker 1: of Montana residents. Um, you know I lived your long time.

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Speaker 1: It's like I miss it. I love it. I learned

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Speaker 1: a thing from my two year old recently that when

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Speaker 1: my twyar olds jealous of something, he just destroys it.

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Speaker 1: So if his sister draws a cool picture and everybody's like, oh, Rosemary,

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Speaker 1: it's amazing, he just is like no, And um, so

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Speaker 1: I kind of want now. I almost like Montana to

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Speaker 1: go to ship because like the way more people move

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Speaker 1: here to just go to ship and then I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: have to like come here and be so bummed out

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Speaker 1: all the time. That's really heartbreaking for me to come here.

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Speaker 1: They advertised Montana where I live in Seattle, they advertised Montana.

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Speaker 1: So like, when I'm driving around stuck in traffic jams,

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Speaker 1: I gotta look at dudes in Montana, billboards of dudes

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Speaker 1: in Montana doing fun stuff. And it recently got better

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Speaker 1: because for some reason I got a guy up there

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Speaker 1: now paddle boarding and like, so I feel no jealousy,

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Speaker 1: Like I feel like it's twenty years ago. If I

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Speaker 1: if you've had a dude over your house and you

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Speaker 1: live on a lake and you're like, hey man, you

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Speaker 1: can take the kayak all you take the canoe out

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Speaker 1: bro um, you can take this surfboard. I could like

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Speaker 1: duct tape a stick onto a paddle But it's like,

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Speaker 1: it's like the Works. It's like Harry Potter books where

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Speaker 1: in a vacuum, you know, if you'd set humanity back

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Speaker 1: and let it go again, uh, we wouldn't be paddle boarding.

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Speaker 1: It's like like but but if you set the clock

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Speaker 1: back of humanity a million years and like let it

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Speaker 1: go again, I would like to do that ten times

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Speaker 1: and see which things we stick with in which we don't.

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Speaker 1: And I'm damn sure. Like a person is gonna see

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Speaker 1: a horned animal walk by and he's like, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: find a way to run a projectile through that. Things

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Speaker 1: ribs like a couple of just behind the shoulder blade.

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Speaker 1: It's like that again and again and again will emerge.

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Speaker 1: But um, I don't mean a hack on paddle board

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Speaker 1: it's just like seeing that sign really is I just

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Speaker 1: feel it's not a legitimate pastime man um moving like

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Speaker 1: moving to Bozeman though, or like like there's a long

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Speaker 1: history of moving to Bozeman, and and it's like when

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Speaker 1: I think about, oh I should move back here, you know,

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Speaker 1: your your heads overwhelmed with all the things that could

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Speaker 1: go right and the things that could go wrong. UH.

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Speaker 1: Years ago, me and Matt here we uh I went

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Speaker 1: to check out sixty six miles east of here. Basically

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Speaker 1: the highway UH runs over a grave site sixty six

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Speaker 1: miles east of here, and it's like they just there's

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Speaker 1: a bunch of bodies buried in the grave, and they

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Speaker 1: piled some rocks on it. And later like the highway

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Speaker 1: kind of runs right along. It's between the highway and

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Speaker 1: the railroad. So every time you go by, you looking

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Speaker 1: and see this grave and this guy. It was three

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Speaker 1: hundred and fifty years ago and three hundred and three

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Speaker 1: or a hundred fifty years ago and three hundred and

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Speaker 1: sixty one days, I think. Ago, there's this guy who

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Speaker 1: is in Illinois and his two daughters and his wife

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Speaker 1: carried off by pneumonia, and he's got one boy left.

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Speaker 1: This guy's by the last name of Thomas. He's got

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Speaker 1: a boy named Charlie, so the only thing he's got left,

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Speaker 1: and he's got family in Bozeman. So in eight sixty

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Speaker 1: six is dude packs up and he's gonna move out

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Speaker 1: to Bozeman, make the big jump, and he follows the

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Speaker 1: or he goes to St. Louis and follows the Oregon Trail,

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Speaker 1: and like he's the Oregon Trail going along in southern

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Speaker 1: Wyoming along the Platte, and then he jumps off and

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Speaker 1: he's gonna go and follow the Bozeman Trail. And at

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Speaker 1: that time the Bozeman Trail jumped off the Platte and

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Speaker 1: went up the east flank of the Big Horns and

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Speaker 1: hooked around to the north of the Big Horns. So

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Speaker 1: this guy is going along and he passes what the

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Speaker 1: what will be in a few months after his passing

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Speaker 1: the Fetterman Fight, where seventies some soldiers get massacred by

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Speaker 1: Sioux warriors. And he goes a little further and passes

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Speaker 1: the Little Big Horn Battlefield, where in ten years a

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Speaker 1: couple of hundred soldiers will get massacred by Sue and

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Speaker 1: Cheyenne warriors. And he's traveled Jim Bridger and they and

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Speaker 1: they come across a grave site where they just buried

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Speaker 1: some other guys and he's all been out of shape.

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Speaker 1: He's got a diary and he writes about how the

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Speaker 1: wolves that dug them up and toward the rib me

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Speaker 1: off him. And there's another grave site and the wolves

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Speaker 1: that toward their face off them, and he starts painting

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Speaker 1: this like awful picture of moving to Bozeman. Eventually a

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Speaker 1: wagon breaks down and he leaves Bridger behind. And this

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Speaker 1: guy's a minister, and he's thinking to himself that I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna put my faith in God and travel without arms,

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Speaker 1: because now that we're west of the mouth of the

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Speaker 1: Big Horn, we're in Crol country and everyone knows you're

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Speaker 1: safe from Curl country. So he pushes on by himself

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Speaker 1: and they get over. Uh, like I said, sixty six

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Speaker 1: miles here a little bit outside of Columbus, and it's

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Speaker 1: him and his boy and a wagon driver named Joel Schultz. Uh.

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Speaker 1: They get attacked. The next day they find the dad.

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Speaker 1: He's got thirteen arrows stuck in him and he's scalped

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Speaker 1: and he's parked by the rear tire of his wagon.

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Speaker 1: His little boy's got three arrows and he's scalped by

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Speaker 1: the front tire of the wagon. And Joe Schultz, the

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Speaker 1: wagon drivers down by the river. He's got a dozen

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Speaker 1: arrows in him and he had two cutthroats. Two cutthroat

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Speaker 1: trouts they found the next day. So he was one

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Speaker 1: trout over his bag limit. And I always return like

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Speaker 1: approaching I always like passed that gravesite when approaching this area,

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Speaker 1: and I always think of that. But then, like if

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Speaker 1: you juxtapose that with my brother Matt, wasn't there a

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Speaker 1: bit and there were The Sun has a um diary,

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Speaker 1: and Sad has a diary. The dad has a diary,

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Speaker 1: and in there it says something like, yeah, Jim Bridger

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Speaker 1: told me not to go this way, but he's full

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Speaker 1: of ship or something like that. That's that's rumored. He

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Speaker 1: had a diary. When he crossed Bridger Creek, he wrote

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Speaker 1: in his diary that we lost our coffee pot. The

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Speaker 1: crazy thing is the last thing Thomas wrote in his diary.

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Speaker 1: The night before he died. He wrote in his diary,

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Speaker 1: we broke our champagne bottle. People have always wondered if

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Speaker 1: it meant that he was so close to Bozeman, did

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Speaker 1: we we're celebrating prematurely? Or that like losing his coffee

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Speaker 1: pot when he crossed Bridger Creek he busted the champagne bottle.

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Speaker 1: So there's like that version of moving to Bozeman which

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Speaker 1: sticks in my mind. But then you have like Matt,

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Speaker 1: Matt moves to Bozeman, earns himself a PhD. He points

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Speaker 1: out that it was his second one because he already

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Speaker 1: had a pretty huge and then still do then Mary's

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Speaker 1: Mary's a girl of the ranch. So does that version

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Speaker 1: move into Bozeman? Um? I think about that. I do

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Speaker 1: think about this all the time. So with that preamble,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna roll through some vexing questions. And many of

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Speaker 1: these questions have come from folks in the audience tonight.

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Speaker 1: Some of them are gonna be on the easy end

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Speaker 1: of things, such as the guy was wondering, were you

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Speaker 1: to encounterate? He calls it a legitimate sasquatch. Were you

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Speaker 1: to encounter inmate sasquatsh like not you know, the fuzzy one,

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Speaker 1: not like an out of focused sasquash, but a legitimate fasquat.

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Speaker 1: And uh. The comedian Mitch Hedburg he postulates the sasquatch

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Speaker 1: Bigfoot is just blurry and you can't get a good

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Speaker 1: picture of him. But if you're gonna do it, he's like,

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Speaker 1: what did he's take a timber buck? Would you take

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Speaker 1: a crack? Like? He adds to it, he adds the questions.

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Speaker 1: The guy with the question asks some color to where

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Speaker 1: he's like, you know, no one's gonna believe you. So

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Speaker 1: here you are in this situation where you're just gonna

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Speaker 1: be the come of the laughing stock? Would you kill Bigfoot?

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Speaker 1: Are you asking? Are you looking at Yeah, no, don't.

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Speaker 1: I don't have an interesting answer that question is no way.

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna shoot some two legged thing that's walking around.

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Speaker 1: Like That's where I'm at on it. How do you know?

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Speaker 1: How do It's like there's yeah, there's no tag system.

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Speaker 1: I would just like let it walk. I would. I

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Speaker 1: would for legal reasons. No, it's not like a reward

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Speaker 1: punishment thing. It's just like, hey, I've never seen one

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Speaker 1: of them before. Let's make it be dead. Ye, Like

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Speaker 1: guys are going to African safaris, like, so that's what

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Speaker 1: that looks like. The folks that mistake or these Let's

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Speaker 1: say you go on a hunt, right, You've never been

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Speaker 1: in Bearer country ever, and you go on a hunt

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Speaker 1: in the bitter at range and the outfitter says, shoot

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Speaker 1: any bury see and that hunter she would say, grizzly bear.

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Speaker 1: I hate that. You gotta know what you're shooting at.

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Speaker 1: So for that reason, no, I like, I have never

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Speaker 1: seen that. I have no idea what it is. I'm

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Speaker 1: not going to pull the trigger for the you can't

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Speaker 1: judge the trophy quality on it, no established scories. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it might change after I come out with my story,

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Speaker 1: but I would just let it pass and then be

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Speaker 1: when the sons of bitches believe me, I'm going back. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I wouldn't know. I feel like I'm trustworthy enough.

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Speaker 1: Would it be at least a small contingent of people

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Speaker 1: that would trust me and we would It would regenerate

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Speaker 1: at least for another fifty years. Would be a strong,

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Speaker 1: you know, bigfoot community. No, I would not. I would

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Speaker 1: always think less of you. I would like I would

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Speaker 1: always I would always question your judgment. I would always

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Speaker 1: think a little bit less of you. I like when

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Speaker 1: I get into are there bigfoot arguments? Um? The thing

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Speaker 1: that I found that I like to use, I don't

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Speaker 1: know if it's really that effective. Is They bring up

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Speaker 1: that this is an argument that serious people have anymore.

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Speaker 1: Do you ever like turn on cable television? Many build No,

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Speaker 1: I will indulge in for Max. It's it's interesting. It's

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Speaker 1: a thing I try out when arguing with people about

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Speaker 1: the plausibility Bigfoot. Is like I like to go to

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Speaker 1: when Florida was down to forty some panthers, that multiple

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Speaker 1: panthers every year getting hit on the road, and look

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Speaker 1: at all their like really limited populations of animals, and

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Speaker 1: then how many of them turn up dead on the road.

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Speaker 1: And then to bring up the idea that that the

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Speaker 1: entire fire history of automobile travel, we haven't hit one

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Speaker 1: yet like that. It's just like if you got six

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Speaker 1: of something one, I'm gonna get hit by a car.

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Speaker 1: And all other populations of animals, you know, well, maybe

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Speaker 1: they're just super smart. It could be Okay. Here's another

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Speaker 1: one that came in. This is this is like I

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Speaker 1: actually want to kind of hire this guy. There is

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Speaker 1: a guy named Luke Ryan. I want to hire as

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Speaker 1: like a resident company philosopher. Luke Ryan has this He's

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Speaker 1: got a lot of things. He comes up and This

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Speaker 1: is when he comes up. Have you guys been tracking

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Speaker 1: about the lone Star tick? Okay, there's a tick, lone

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Speaker 1: Star tick. It's common in Texas. This tick bites you,

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Speaker 1: and when it bites you, you it's like when you

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Speaker 1: get bit by Uh, a chicken might carry a bacterial

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Speaker 1: infection that gives you lyme disease. This tick carries an

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Speaker 1: infection that winds up and this legit. I wouldn't read

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Speaker 1: about this. It winds up having it winds up that

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Speaker 1: you become allergic to red meat. It's an infection that

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Speaker 1: carries with it a red meat allergy. You become allergic

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Speaker 1: to red meat. You can become allergic to dairy. So

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Speaker 1: he's wondering, were this to happen to you, how would

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Speaker 1: your relationship to hunting change? Like would you keep hunting?

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Speaker 1: I hate this question. It's kind of like yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: like it's like a question that comes up. But I

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Speaker 1: just like this because it has like a spin on

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Speaker 1: like like how wet are you? You know? Because he

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Speaker 1: like he points out you could go and uh still

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Speaker 1: hunt and feed it to your kids food banks, but

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Speaker 1: you can't eat it. Yeah, I wouldn't. I just that

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Speaker 1: would that would take it out of it. I mean

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Speaker 1: the just yeah, this is it would lose its mystique

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Speaker 1: at that point. So last year my dad called up.

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Speaker 1: He said, hey, I would love it if you could

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Speaker 1: get me an elk this year. So for the first

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Speaker 1: time in a long long time, I shot to elk

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Speaker 1: last year. But yeah, I don't know if the desire

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't have the you know, hungry hunter hunts past. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a tough one. What about Well he did add

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Speaker 1: in that you could you know, you would turn into

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Speaker 1: the world's best water fowler and upen game hunters. Right,

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Speaker 1: That's what I was gonna say. I would. I would,

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, no, he gets rich. Yeah, he thinks about

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Speaker 1: this stuff. What's it's just red meat from big gaming,

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Speaker 1: red meat and dairy. You can still fish, you can

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Speaker 1: still Crane's geese ducks. Those are pretty dark. I would

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Speaker 1: definitely do it because I've off a point out. It's

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Speaker 1: like if it wasn't for if it didn't get food

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Speaker 1: and it wasn't fun. If you drop either those things out,

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Speaker 1: either those two things out, I'm done. All right, this

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Speaker 1: ceases to be fun and it ceases they old food.

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Speaker 1: I'm paddle boarding probably. Well, you're honest. You and I

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Speaker 1: were just talking the you know, purely getting groceries. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know what, there's I have spots where it's like,

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Speaker 1: all right, didn't get anything. I don't call it hunting

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Speaker 1: because I know for certainty I'm going to be coming

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Speaker 1: home with something. Yeah, the grocery get Yeah, it's total groceries. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I wouldn't say yeah, I don't want to chalk

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Speaker 1: that up. It's like, yeah, super fun outing. It's like, boy,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna go take an afternoon off and go get

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Speaker 1: a white tail though. But it's fun. Yeah, there's still

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Speaker 1: have some fun. Yeah, for sure, more fun than going

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Speaker 1: to Albertson's. It'd be hard to HiPE for me to hypothesize.

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Speaker 1: I think I'd have to go through the process and

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Speaker 1: you know, be at home but right all up, wrap

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Speaker 1: it all up, and then all of a sudden, be

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Speaker 1: later in the fall or that winner not eating it,

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Speaker 1: and then see how I felt about it. All right,

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Speaker 1: how about this one? This is another Luke Ryan Luke

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Speaker 1: Ryan's wondered nous You're okay, it's such a complicated two

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Speaker 1: part question. And then Yanni like sequestered some of the

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Speaker 1: information that I can from the cooking side of things.

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Speaker 1: How many times do you try to make some off

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Speaker 1: cut taste amazing? I feel like I would have a

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Speaker 1: horrible gastro intestinal life for a long time. Yeah, because

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Speaker 1: I just keep trying. Oh you'll see when it wore off. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well maybe if I do this. I thought about it.

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Speaker 1: I worked for many an outfitter in Colorado, more than one,

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Speaker 1: So you can say all that information. Okay, Now I

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Speaker 1: have permission to say something I was earlier forbidden from saying.

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Speaker 1: But I got it so worked out now that I

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Speaker 1: don't need to say. It would be this. A guy's

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Speaker 1: wondering this. Luke Ryan puts this out there. You go

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Speaker 1: on a guided trip. Okay, you're going to guide a trip,

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Speaker 1: and then you're thinking yourself, uh, okay, now what I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna do. It's just come back and hunt this exact

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Speaker 1: same spot. Now that I know what's up, So your

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Speaker 1: book a trip, the guy takes you out, it's like,

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Speaker 1: this is my great secret spot, and do the thing

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Speaker 1: and the next year, like, see you next year. But

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Speaker 1: as an equal, is that immoral? I say yes? Well

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Speaker 1: what like? So all the yeses go like yeah. In

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Speaker 1: the audience, that was the nose. I have to say yes,

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Speaker 1: because you came out of the guiding industry. Well, I

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Speaker 1: don't think that's the real reason why. I think I'm

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Speaker 1: saying yes, immoral. Yes, I've seen it firsthand, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean it's no different than walking in on the

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Speaker 1: last final of the year and I grabbed Stephen Ronella's

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Speaker 1: final paper off the desk, scratch his name out, put

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Speaker 1: my name, Maa. You did all the work, you did

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Speaker 1: all the study, and you filled out the test. I

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Speaker 1: just put my name on it. Yeah, I want to

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Speaker 1: weigh and I say no. I say no. I say

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Speaker 1: it's not immoral, not immoral. You paid the guy, you

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Speaker 1: know what, that's true. That is a good point. Now,

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Speaker 1: if it's your buddy and he takes you to your

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Speaker 1: spot his spot, that's an entirely different I don't even

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Speaker 1: need to ask that question. That is so immoral that

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Speaker 1: I don't need that. Yeah, it goes without saying to

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Speaker 1: the buddy, you'd never do that to a buddy. Where

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Speaker 1: is the difference you paid them? I think you could

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Speaker 1: come up with a prostitution analogy here. So now, okay, okay,

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Speaker 1: just to provide a little context here, there's a guy

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Speaker 1: that wrecked somehow he realizes where Yeah, a place of

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Speaker 1: Janice used to guide. Can I talk about this? And no,

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Speaker 1: I realized that all that. I realized that all the

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Speaker 1: outits that worked for all had a similar setup where

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Speaker 1: we sort of drove through some private property, camps on

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Speaker 1: private property, lodged on private property, and then went to

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Speaker 1: hunted national forest. The three ouferers that I worked for,

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Speaker 1: and again people can just do as much research as

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Speaker 1: they want, they all had a very similar setup. So

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Speaker 1: you know exactly where this guy was talking about. You know,

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Speaker 1: it would be hard to figure out. You have to

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Speaker 1: go hunt three different spots that are you know, a

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Speaker 1: hundred square miles each and then go, yeah, I know

335
00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:03,640
Speaker 1: we were talking about But anyways, Yeah, so he's got

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Speaker 1: But I think how his question was his question makes

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Speaker 1: it less morally, makes it more that more that it's

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Speaker 1: okay to do this. Yeah, because he wants it right,

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Speaker 1: he wants that answer. No, he here's the deal. That's

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Speaker 1: why I don't want to get into it. He's got

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Speaker 1: body working at this outfitter. So my okay, I'll tell

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Speaker 1: his question and then I'll give him my a point.

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Speaker 1: He's got buddy's working at this outfitter that have obviously

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Speaker 1: opened their mouths and talked about the setup of this location, right,

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Speaker 1: so they've gotten this inside information. Now he's asking if

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Speaker 1: it's morally okay to use that information to go behind

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Speaker 1: these private ranches and basically going hunt these spots that

348
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Speaker 1: these guys are So there's other ways to get in

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Speaker 1: there that don't involve going through the private property totally.

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Speaker 1: And what he's saying is so he's saying that his

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Speaker 1: buddy's screwed up and they lost their tight lippedness and

352
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Speaker 1: they're like, well, wherever really killing these elk is on

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Speaker 1: national forest above the ranch that we're based out of.

354
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Speaker 1: So he says, I'll see you up there. They and

355
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Speaker 1: then you take that as a transgression, transgression against your outfitter,

356
00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:15,200
Speaker 1: I think, just against your but well, one of the

357
00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:19,439
Speaker 1: guys messed up for you know, flapping their gums and

358
00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:22,199
Speaker 1: then too. Yeah, it's like, give them a little respect

359
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Speaker 1: if they told you about that spot. It's like where

360
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Speaker 1: they're working, don't go, don't go. How did everybody say

361
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Speaker 1: the other week pissing the pissing the cathedral or no

362
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Speaker 1: baptismal fountains in the baptismal pomp um. So what if

363
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Speaker 1: I mean, look at all the things. If you're going

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Speaker 1: with anybody, your buddy outfitter guide, whoever, if they can't

365
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Speaker 1: blend them all together, absolutely don't blend. The thing is,

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Speaker 1: if you are going with somebody who has a wealth

367
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Speaker 1: of knowledge about the area, about the animals, aren't you

368
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Speaker 1: take enough away without having to go to the exact spot.

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Speaker 1: I'm learning so much when I got out with you,

370
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Speaker 1: like this is the way Steven Renelant, I come away

371
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Speaker 1: with that? Do I have to go in there and

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Speaker 1: you know, kick you out of your spot too? But here, No,

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Speaker 1: because here's the thing, he's making a claim of ownership.

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Speaker 1: You're sort of making a claim of ownership that only

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Speaker 1: takes away your right to access. So you're saying, like, sure,

376
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Speaker 1: anyone else is welcome to go here, the whole sixty

377
00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:43,240
Speaker 1: million Americans are welcome to go here, but you can't

378
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Speaker 1: because of how this piece of information came to you.

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Speaker 1: So I think it winds up being like a little

380
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Speaker 1: bit like you're sort of getting screwed out of a

381
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Speaker 1: god given right because of the way that a piece

382
00:23:56,280 --> 00:24:00,800
Speaker 1: of information flowed. It's a business train, it's a business transaction.

383
00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:03,480
Speaker 1: You gave the guy money to take you to a

384
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Speaker 1: hunting spot. I mean, if if you, if you, if

385
00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:08,600
Speaker 1: the if the outfitter didn't want you to go in there,

386
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:10,480
Speaker 1: go in there. It should be part of the contract

387
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:14,240
Speaker 1: or something. Yeah, moving on, But no, no, no, because

388
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Speaker 1: it brings up the point of going into hunting spots

389
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Speaker 1: that you've never been to you with your body, and

390
00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:21,760
Speaker 1: if you're the kind of guy that might follow up

391
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:23,719
Speaker 1: with a hunt of your own in that same spot,

392
00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:25,480
Speaker 1: you might want to, you know, bring that up to

393
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:27,159
Speaker 1: your buddy's taking you into that spot. Well, if I

394
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:29,520
Speaker 1: ever hired an outfit or would be because I could

395
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:32,439
Speaker 1: go into the spot, he shoulder. I've done that on

396
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:35,120
Speaker 1: family vacations. I've done that. We go down somewhere, it's

397
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:37,199
Speaker 1: hard to figure the fishing out. Yeah, go out like

398
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Speaker 1: hire something with the PONNDA, go out and fish for

399
00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:44,800
Speaker 1: two hours, come back and be like, resume business like more.

400
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:46,400
Speaker 1: On the way back, you're like, hey, you know where

401
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:50,040
Speaker 1: I can run a punco exactly? See, I would feel mad,

402
00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:52,280
Speaker 1: So I think sometimes I would just turn down being

403
00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:55,040
Speaker 1: showed or even told about a spot and just go

404
00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:57,040
Speaker 1: there and learn it all my own to have a

405
00:24:57,240 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 1: clear conscience about it. With the with the friend thing,

406
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,320
Speaker 1: don't final thought on this with the friends thing, it's

407
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:04,440
Speaker 1: way different than when a friend takes you somewhere and

408
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:08,040
Speaker 1: shows you something. You have an obligation. It's at that point,

409
00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:11,960
Speaker 1: it's like it's like sleeping with his wife, and at

410
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,399
Speaker 1: some point if he says, you know what, you just

411
00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 1: go ahead. That's you. Then you have to later call

412
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:22,480
Speaker 1: back again and be like, Wow, my cousin, right, he's

413
00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,399
Speaker 1: in town, he's he'll probably never come back. I have

414
00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 1: anxiety going with dudes two places because I'm like, what

415
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:30,840
Speaker 1: if I really like it? What am I gonna not

416
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:33,720
Speaker 1: go back? Yeah? What if it's full of out? It's

417
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:37,280
Speaker 1: like I'd almost rather like not have to supermanently scratch

418
00:25:37,359 --> 00:25:41,919
Speaker 1: off an entire chunk of the earth and just like

419
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:48,720
Speaker 1: go find it on my own somehow. Moving on, Joe March,

420
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:55,560
Speaker 1: over your many years of hunting, what was the most

421
00:25:55,720 --> 00:26:00,879
Speaker 1: common mistake you found yourself making over and over? I

422
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:08,119
Speaker 1: know exactly right to mine is that I'm putting the

423
00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:11,199
Speaker 1: sneak on something like I've found something, I'm gonna go

424
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,440
Speaker 1: get in on it, and there's something being an animal

425
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:17,879
Speaker 1: um getting in on I mean I'm gonna, like, you know,

426
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 1: stalk in on it. Is that I, uh, all of

427
00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:26,880
Speaker 1: a sudden realized that I'm like crawling and going way around.

428
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 1: And I also realized that I'm just in plain sight

429
00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:33,760
Speaker 1: of the thing because like misreading, like like misreading of

430
00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 1: the laate like because you know, you think, like if

431
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:38,360
Speaker 1: I really was gonna do this right, I would go

432
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,120
Speaker 1: three miles that way. And you know, but I bet

433
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 1: I could you know that little rise and that little

434
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:46,240
Speaker 1: little thing and that brush and you just sort of

435
00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:47,840
Speaker 1: like you're going along and the next thing, you know,

436
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 1: you're looking like, oh, it's looking at me. It's just

437
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:55,520
Speaker 1: right there. But I somehow like misread all this stuff.

438
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:59,240
Speaker 1: That is like it just happens again again again. So

439
00:26:59,320 --> 00:27:01,560
Speaker 1: do you feel like you're misreading the landscape or you

440
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:05,000
Speaker 1: just trying to take a short cut shortcut short cutty

441
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:10,320
Speaker 1: like short cutty shitty little short cutting things. It's a gimme,

442
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:15,080
Speaker 1: it's a gimme being nonchalant. Yeah. Mind. Similar mind is

443
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 1: that I think I've spooped it, but I haven't start

444
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:23,640
Speaker 1: like being uncareful because that's gone and then I run

445
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:28,879
Speaker 1: right into it. Similar I think just moving too fast

446
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:31,879
Speaker 1: you know. You know, that's why I like going on

447
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:33,640
Speaker 1: a long haunt, because I feel like it takes three

448
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:36,480
Speaker 1: or four days until I really start moving at the

449
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 1: pace of the woods. And I feel like once I

450
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 1: hit that pace, you know, then all of a sudden,

451
00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 1: games just like doing this in front of me. But

452
00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:47,040
Speaker 1: when you're just when you're I'm moving too fast and

453
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:49,439
Speaker 1: I'm looking at my toes instead of having my head up,

454
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:51,879
Speaker 1: you know, taking it all in, I feel like you

455
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 1: just I'm not seeing the game, not in the zone. Yea,

456
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 1: yea say it could be indifferent. It's forgetting my long

457
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:08,240
Speaker 1: handled spoon and get your knuckles full of free It

458
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:11,560
Speaker 1: will bother me the entire time I'm in the woods.

459
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:16,399
Speaker 1: He has I know better. Yeah, And you just had

460
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 1: and there you are with dried cheese stuck to your knuckles. Um,

461
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:27,760
Speaker 1: do you have any okay, do you have anything profound

462
00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:31,480
Speaker 1: to say about being alone in the wilderness. This is

463
00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,200
Speaker 1: from a guy named Bob Dean, who should if he's not,

464
00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 1: he should be in the sausage business. Bob Dean, do

465
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:40,680
Speaker 1: you have anything profound to say about being alone in

466
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:43,280
Speaker 1: the wilderness by yourself or in a small group? Being

467
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:48,280
Speaker 1: completely responsible for your well being without communication or support

468
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:55,720
Speaker 1: from your society. Society. Dot's say that society. If if

469
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:59,800
Speaker 1: anybody gets anything, I'll it's gratifying to know it will

470
00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 1: be mean. Since I'm alone, I hope just someone gets something.

471
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:20,480
Speaker 1: I don't care who it is. Oh, but you're always

472
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:22,280
Speaker 1: with the llamas. So like in the morning, like you

473
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 1: look at all Yeah, you look at all that. I mean,

474
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: like somebody's gonna get some today, right, guys. I think

475
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 1: the thing that that that I've come to like about

476
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:38,040
Speaker 1: not coming. I think I've always liked about wilderness, and

477
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 1: there are many of them, and I didn't really think

478
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:46,760
Speaker 1: to articulate it this way until fairly recently. Um. I

479
00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 1: started riding my bike in Manhattan years ago, and I

480
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,240
Speaker 1: spent a couple of years, about a year riding a

481
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,760
Speaker 1: bike regularly in Manhattan, and I realized that doing it,

482
00:29:56,440 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 1: um that there was no room to have any other

483
00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:04,880
Speaker 1: There's no room for any other thought. Okay, so you're

484
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:06,760
Speaker 1: riding along and you can't be like, man, I should

485
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,360
Speaker 1: call my mom more often. It's like you just can't,

486
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,800
Speaker 1: you know, think about any besides exactly what you're doing,

487
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,959
Speaker 1: because exactly what you're doing, it's so dangerous. You just

488
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 1: described the yoga class and how they set that up

489
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:21,240
Speaker 1: and the artificial That's why I don't like it when

490
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:22,560
Speaker 1: they try to do it to me in yoga, because

491
00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 1: I'm like, it takes a lot more than a bunch

492
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:29,040
Speaker 1: of us sitting around and comfortable clothes trying to be

493
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:31,360
Speaker 1: the kind of people who aren't thinking about other stuff.

494
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:34,120
Speaker 1: I need to be like forced into the situation not

495
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:36,280
Speaker 1: think about other stuff. And so when riding my bike,

496
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 1: and like when I was doing a lot of bike

497
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:40,360
Speaker 1: riding in Manhattan, I was offered thinking about, Wow, it's

498
00:30:40,400 --> 00:30:43,600
Speaker 1: really like I don't get this feeling that often of

499
00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 1: not having any room for any of your thought but

500
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:48,640
Speaker 1: exactly what I'm doing. And I realized that, like in

501
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:53,280
Speaker 1: a lot of wilderness experiences now, when you're like laying

502
00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 1: in your bag at night, but just all the things

503
00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 1: that go into it, it winds up being like you're

504
00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,959
Speaker 1: forced to for sometimes day is on end. It's just

505
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:03,600
Speaker 1: like just be focused on this thing because there's so

506
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:05,720
Speaker 1: many there's so many aspects to it and things that

507
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:08,320
Speaker 1: keep in mind that you you do loose, you quickly

508
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 1: lose sight of all the nagging things that are rolling

509
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 1: around in the back of your head. I think I've

510
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:16,719
Speaker 1: talked about a fair bit. Is they did this study

511
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,600
Speaker 1: one time where they had people that they paired up

512
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:21,440
Speaker 1: people and put them in a gymnasium and had them

513
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:23,800
Speaker 1: throw a ball back and forth. So they break everybody

514
00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 1: up into pairs, and each pair of people has to

515
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 1: play catch, and there's a there's an observer assigned to

516
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 1: each pair, and the observer is false to just count

517
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:34,520
Speaker 1: how many times the ball changes hands. So it's a

518
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 1: gym full people playing catch and there's people watching them

519
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 1: play catching comedy times the ball changes hands. And then

520
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 1: in the middle of this they have a guy in

521
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 1: a gorilla suit walk through the gym. Later they say,

522
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:48,880
Speaker 1: like how many times the ball change hands? And you'll

523
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 1: be like a change hands thirty three times. Do you

524
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:53,400
Speaker 1: know what's anything unusual? While you were counting the ball

525
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:57,360
Speaker 1: change hands? Most people don't see the gorilla come through

526
00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,880
Speaker 1: the room. And like those are people who are bad

527
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:03,320
Speaker 1: being in the woods. Those are like those are like

528
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:06,920
Speaker 1: bad wilderness people and um, and I think it's like

529
00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 1: that you have to just be aware of like what

530
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: you know you need to be aware of, be aware

531
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 1: of what you're you're not really knowing you need to

532
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:17,800
Speaker 1: be aware of. But just like spatial awareness is nice.

533
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 1: Last night at dinner college town, a lot of pretty

534
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,720
Speaker 1: girls walking around. It's not because I don't care about

535
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:27,240
Speaker 1: what you're saying. I'm just being aware of what's going on.

536
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:38,640
Speaker 1: And you were wilderness. Um. Yeah, I think it comes

537
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 1: back to the damage about moving slowly and you know,

538
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 1: just and and getting to that point where you're just like,

539
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:48,680
Speaker 1: I think it's all the same thing that we're saying,

540
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 1: that all other stuff gets out of the way and

541
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:54,320
Speaker 1: you're so just focused on just being there, and um,

542
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:57,840
Speaker 1: you get to just experience I think days or time

543
00:32:57,920 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 1: or however you want to look at it slower than

544
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:03,320
Speaker 1: and my regular day of getting up and just like

545
00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:05,960
Speaker 1: jamming and going and cooking and then you know, the

546
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:13,280
Speaker 1: office totally back again. No. Um, So yeah, I just

547
00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: think that that's is good for me, for my head,

548
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 1: my soul, to just experience that slow pace. Yeah. Absolutely.

549
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:25,560
Speaker 1: I've been on a few hunts where um, you know,

550
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:31,000
Speaker 1: the the It's been a number of things, clients guides

551
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:35,000
Speaker 1: where there's connectivity up on the mountain some and now

552
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 1: it's worse and worse with um like the iridium go

553
00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:42,200
Speaker 1: there's ways to be connected to the outside world, and

554
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 1: I truly don't want any of that stuff on any

555
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 1: hunts anymore because I've noticed, Um I just example, up

556
00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:55,040
Speaker 1: INBC last year or the year before, had this you know,

557
00:33:55,200 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 1: awesome weasel encounter. You know, we eaels up there checking

558
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,280
Speaker 1: out and running up and looking at you and just

559
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:08,000
Speaker 1: kind of doing their very inquisitive, extremely entertaining thing. Only

560
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,719
Speaker 1: person that noticed it because the other two dudes were

561
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:12,360
Speaker 1: up on their phone because they've got a signal on

562
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 1: top of some mountain or something. Yeah. Yeah, it takes

563
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:17,279
Speaker 1: you out of the out of the space. And I

564
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:21,919
Speaker 1: think more and more as connectivity it becomes, i mean

565
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 1: almost given in a lot of these areas, you'll always

566
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:31,920
Speaker 1: have it. We need those those spaces and times to

567
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,319
Speaker 1: disconnect them. Yeah. I went to a lecture by a

568
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 1: guy that had done solo long distance canoe trips and

569
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 1: one of what to see him you'd come off of

570
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,520
Speaker 1: just doing the whole Shore Lake Superior, which is months long,

571
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:46,759
Speaker 1: and he was talking about You're saying, like, you know,

572
00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:49,439
Speaker 1: when you're out in the woods for ten days, how

573
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 1: everything seems to um be slowing down and becoming quieter

574
00:34:56,120 --> 00:35:00,520
Speaker 1: for ten days, he says, at six once, I haven't

575
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 1: found the end of that. It's still it's still happening

576
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 1: six months, in which gives you a sense of how

577
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,800
Speaker 1: wound up we could potentially be. That he hasn't unwrapped.

578
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:14,160
Speaker 1: He hasn't unraveled the string at six months. So when

579
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 1: you think you're all kicking ass at ten days, it's

580
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 1: a tight coil. Man. I remember when you and I

581
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:23,800
Speaker 1: would go first moved out here and we go hunting

582
00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 1: for four or five days. I remember we'd come out

583
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:30,120
Speaker 1: and we'd be driving home and like fifty miles would

584
00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:33,440
Speaker 1: feel super fast. Yeah, I know what you're talking about.

585
00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:39,799
Speaker 1: You missed the pacing of things. What happened for me,

586
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:43,560
Speaker 1: they'll really change. The connectivity thing is after nine eleven

587
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:49,279
Speaker 1: because you used to go um and didn't care, right

588
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:52,239
Speaker 1: because I didn't have family or anything. So you went

589
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:54,759
Speaker 1: to like be like I didn't care what was really

590
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:56,160
Speaker 1: going on, and then all of a sudden you get

591
00:35:56,200 --> 00:35:57,920
Speaker 1: introduced to this thing that's like that that you could

592
00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 1: have is like instantaneous catacort doesn't make events happened that

593
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:03,759
Speaker 1: you weren't aware of. And it took me a long

594
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:07,000
Speaker 1: time to be comfortable totally unconnected for a long time

595
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:10,839
Speaker 1: because in my mind that happened like that, You're like,

596
00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:12,720
Speaker 1: because you know, you'd be like, well, what could happen?

597
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:16,400
Speaker 1: What could possibly happen? Then all a sudden you introduced

598
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:18,840
Speaker 1: this idea that like, oh, like a thing could happen,

599
00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 1: and it nags you that you're out of the loop.

600
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:25,399
Speaker 1: We went, remember we went hunting the brakes, and it

601
00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:29,040
Speaker 1: was it was in that period, at the beginning of

602
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:33,719
Speaker 1: that period when the when the Bush gore election, like

603
00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 1: there was it wasn't clear who had won it, and

604
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:42,360
Speaker 1: we put off the trip for the election night. Then

605
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:44,440
Speaker 1: we're like, okay, I guess we're just gonna to go

606
00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:53,640
Speaker 1: and not know. Yeah. Yeah, we thought it was gonna

607
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 1: be like a just a couple of hours delay. It

608
00:36:56,040 --> 00:37:00,920
Speaker 1: turned into what was it event? Ultimately? I want to

609
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:03,719
Speaker 1: give you a flip side of this though, because something

610
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:06,440
Speaker 1: I think about quite often now is when I was

611
00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:11,360
Speaker 1: working in the woods, um, you know for the majority

612
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:15,919
Speaker 1: of my ear and I was, you know, a large

613
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 1: part because of wanting to be I was disconnected from

614
00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:24,240
Speaker 1: the outside world. I was had very little few thoughts

615
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:26,400
Speaker 1: running through my head, or at least looking back on it,

616
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:31,719
Speaker 1: I feel that way now, I feel like I get

617
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 1: cluttered because I know, like the public land's access issue

618
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:41,360
Speaker 1: is is something that you know, I'm constantly thinking about

619
00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:43,800
Speaker 1: now and when I going into the woods, I'm staring

620
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 1: around being like, oh my god, are we really going

621
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:49,800
Speaker 1: to screw this up? Whereas back before, when I was

622
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:53,200
Speaker 1: spending way more time in the woods, I never thought

623
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:55,320
Speaker 1: about any of that stuff because I just truly didn't

624
00:37:56,400 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 1: even think about being connected to it. Yeah, you were

625
00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:04,960
Speaker 1: in a global citizen in your old woods many Yeah, Um,

626
00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:07,120
Speaker 1: this guy was this guy's picking up on something, the

627
00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:09,520
Speaker 1: Cody Bomber, who's picking on something up? And I said

628
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 1: sometimes I was talking about how I know a lot

629
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:13,200
Speaker 1: of people who are a lot better at hunting than me,

630
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: and um, he's like, what's the difference between yourself and

631
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:23,520
Speaker 1: the people who are better at it? And I know, Matt,

632
00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:25,799
Speaker 1: you think a lot about Kent Unland being a real

633
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 1: good Yeah, who's not with us tonight? No, And there's

634
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:33,719
Speaker 1: a couple other guys in mild City And frankly, I

635
00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:35,600
Speaker 1: don't know if I knew, I just start doing what

636
00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:40,200
Speaker 1: that is. Yeah, you know, I think, Yeah, for me,

637
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:41,880
Speaker 1: I think it's like when I look at the people.

638
00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:43,880
Speaker 1: I think that the thing that we do to measure

639
00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,920
Speaker 1: like good hunting nous would be there. How much is

640
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:49,919
Speaker 1: someone able to do a lot of times we're looking

641
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:52,439
Speaker 1: at how much is someone able to do something again

642
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:54,920
Speaker 1: and again and again and again. So it'll be like, oh,

643
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:57,560
Speaker 1: you killed you know, in twenty years, he's killed twenty

644
00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:02,800
Speaker 1: bowls with his bow, So that person would would develop

645
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:05,840
Speaker 1: a certain renown, right, especially when it goes out and

646
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:09,480
Speaker 1: doesn't like three days. Yes, it's like burning all my

647
00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:13,600
Speaker 1: vacation time. And I find that like, and I find

648
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,120
Speaker 1: that like just because of the details of my life

649
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 1: I do. I do many, many kinds of things, and

650
00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:23,400
Speaker 1: so I have this like good cursory knowledge of tons

651
00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:26,359
Speaker 1: of ship. But don't focus in on like the thing.

652
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:28,640
Speaker 1: And when I do, when I look at like a

653
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:30,719
Speaker 1: really great hunter, I'm looking at someone who can just

654
00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:34,040
Speaker 1: like do the impossible all the time, like some guy

655
00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:38,040
Speaker 1: like you know, hunting in the Midwest on public land

656
00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:41,759
Speaker 1: with the bow, killing nice bucks every year, right, no

657
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:44,840
Speaker 1: fim permissions. I'm like that to me is like the

658
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:48,160
Speaker 1: he's doing the impossible, right. Oh, it's it's easy to

659
00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:52,880
Speaker 1: define who the who the you know, good hunter is.

660
00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:56,000
Speaker 1: It's much more difficult to say how he got to

661
00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:59,880
Speaker 1: be that way. But I think that, like when I

662
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:02,239
Speaker 1: think of the guys that are so much better than me,

663
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 1: I think it's like people who have picked a thing

664
00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:11,400
Speaker 1: that's difficult and just somehow focused and became like singular

665
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:13,480
Speaker 1: in their pursuit winds up being the guys that look

666
00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:15,560
Speaker 1: at them like that's amazing. It's not so much that

667
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:18,600
Speaker 1: someone that's like jumps around hunts every state and hunts

668
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:21,440
Speaker 1: all around the world and does all these things once.

669
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:26,080
Speaker 1: It's like the it's the the person with the laser focus,

670
00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 1: but not the laser sight define the good hunter. It's

671
00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 1: just for me dead like somebody that has like something

672
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:43,040
Speaker 1: that's hard to do um, like killing an elk on

673
00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:45,239
Speaker 1: public lands every year in Montana. I think of that

674
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:48,680
Speaker 1: with a boat, even with the rifle. But I think

675
00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:52,319
Speaker 1: of that is um. But you've achieved that, not with

676
00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:59,839
Speaker 1: a bowl um generally though, okay, with without using all

677
00:40:59,840 --> 00:41:06,560
Speaker 1: your vacation time. I like it. Yeah, Matt will go.

678
00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 1: You one time went and did twenty one days. I

679
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 1: routinely go twenty days. Yeah, there's some time card pudging

680
00:41:22,160 --> 00:41:28,319
Speaker 1: that goes into it. Good Aude you forgetting hunt twenty days.

681
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:32,239
Speaker 1: Like the guys that are better than you, what do

682
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 1: they do? Like? What makes them better than you? Oh?

683
00:41:36,600 --> 00:41:41,799
Speaker 1: I mean a ton of stuff. I'm I don't feel

684
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:43,839
Speaker 1: like I'm very good at any of it. I feel

685
00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 1: like I'm still I'm still here. I look up to

686
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:51,439
Speaker 1: many many people. So I'm just just need more days

687
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:54,920
Speaker 1: in the woods to hone your skills. I don't think

688
00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:59,440
Speaker 1: that's it for me. I think there's something differentiate differentiates

689
00:42:00,120 --> 00:42:05,799
Speaker 1: like was an excellent hunter fifteen years ago? You know,

690
00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:09,640
Speaker 1: so like I've got way more time in the woods

691
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:12,839
Speaker 1: now than Kent fifteen years ago. Yeah, you get more

692
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:15,279
Speaker 1: time in one trip than Yeah, because he doesn't you know,

693
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:21,160
Speaker 1: he doesn't need to go out very long six cents

694
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 1: something I would just will drop of something that some

695
00:42:24,640 --> 00:42:27,400
Speaker 1: hunters have and something. Yeah, maybe he doesn't smell. I

696
00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:33,840
Speaker 1: don't know. There's actually something to that man smelling people.

697
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:41,600
Speaker 1: Um dirt math, if we're right, a powerful he has got,

698
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:46,160
Speaker 1: he's got a commanding presence. Um. Is there a way

699
00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:51,480
Speaker 1: to stop hunting with someone but still be friends, he says,

700
00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:55,919
Speaker 1: he says, Or is it like uh? Or he says,

701
00:42:56,040 --> 00:42:58,719
Speaker 1: Also it sounds like the hunting equivalent of that girl

702
00:42:58,800 --> 00:43:01,920
Speaker 1: or guy in a relationship up that doesn't want to

703
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: date but still wants to be friends. Can you have

704
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:10,080
Speaker 1: a hunting buddy that you're just like it just I

705
00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:13,120
Speaker 1: can't And I've had this happen in and I know

706
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:14,520
Speaker 1: you've had to happen in your life where you're just like,

707
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:17,000
Speaker 1: I can't help with that guy anymore? Can you still

708
00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:23,080
Speaker 1: like be buddies? Something changes? It becomes hard to be friends, right,

709
00:43:24,840 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 1: But I've gone to be an ot seed out of

710
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:32,319
Speaker 1: the club, out of the club, and it's hard to

711
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:35,920
Speaker 1: find to still be friends. You know, when you've pulled

712
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:51,239
Speaker 1: out the love making kel no experiences, man, I think, boy, yeah,

713
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:53,799
Speaker 1: I'm sure I'm missing a few. But they've they've kind

714
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:58,319
Speaker 1: of naturally went their own way. Yeah, it happens, man.

715
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:00,560
Speaker 1: They don't like, they don't like to stop all. They

716
00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:05,359
Speaker 1: don't Their idea of hunting was a lot different um

717
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:10,879
Speaker 1: those those types of you know, it's more mem No,

718
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:14,840
Speaker 1: I think that like hunting together, well, no, hunting together

719
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:18,960
Speaker 1: creates like really tight close friendships. It creates really tight

720
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:21,319
Speaker 1: close relationships and it winds up it's just different, like

721
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:23,440
Speaker 1: if you spend a handful of trips with someone. It's

722
00:44:23,480 --> 00:44:26,399
Speaker 1: just it's just you're just different with them. You get

723
00:44:26,400 --> 00:44:29,520
Speaker 1: to a place you don't get to hanging out like

724
00:44:29,640 --> 00:44:33,319
Speaker 1: drinking a beer and and so yeah, the later be like, man,

725
00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:35,680
Speaker 1: I don't want like like, I don't want to go

726
00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 1: out in the woods with you anymore and be with

727
00:44:37,480 --> 00:44:39,160
Speaker 1: you out in the woods anymore because of whatever it

728
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 1: is about you. You can't you can't be like, but

729
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 1: let's go get a beer. Yeah, remember that one time

730
00:44:44,239 --> 00:44:47,000
Speaker 1: we went hunting together and then I got sick of you.

731
00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:51,719
Speaker 1: I have I mean, I have buddies that I'll go

732
00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 1: hunt with us and not pack a rifle because that's

733
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 1: the only way, you know. It's like, yeah, I love

734
00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:00,879
Speaker 1: spending time with you. Get let's go out and I'll

735
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:03,719
Speaker 1: spot some stuff to call some stuff. But you're not

736
00:45:03,719 --> 00:45:11,120
Speaker 1: gonna hume with him now, all right. So with regard

737
00:45:11,160 --> 00:45:15,840
Speaker 1: to technology, where do you draw the line and what

738
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:21,520
Speaker 1: this guy is getting at recently is there's uh uh knocks. Now, Okay,

739
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:24,279
Speaker 1: some guy recently came out of the knock that you're

740
00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:26,920
Speaker 1: putting your ararow that has a tracking device in it

741
00:45:27,360 --> 00:45:30,120
Speaker 1: so you can stick something and and track it using

742
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:34,600
Speaker 1: GPS technology. So he's talking about knocks, um, and he

743
00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:41,560
Speaker 1: talks about trail cameras. At what point is like, at

744
00:45:41,560 --> 00:45:44,719
Speaker 1: what point does fair chase not exist anymore? And I

745
00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:47,920
Speaker 1: think he's looking for he's looking for an answer. Um.

746
00:45:48,200 --> 00:45:54,120
Speaker 1: I think, uh, Justin bros Bro, Justin Brows is looking

747
00:45:54,160 --> 00:45:57,879
Speaker 1: for like a concrete thing that you just won't do,

748
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:01,520
Speaker 1: like a demarcation get you. He wants it clean, he

749
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 1: wants it you can't do that because it's a nuanced thing.

750
00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:07,319
Speaker 1: Like having a knock that tells you where your gut

751
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:10,719
Speaker 1: shot deer went. That just seems like better living through technology.

752
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:13,360
Speaker 1: Now this game camera thing you can see where that

753
00:46:13,400 --> 00:46:17,200
Speaker 1: could that's treading on some uh than I want to

754
00:46:17,200 --> 00:46:19,600
Speaker 1: talk about knock and I think it's tie it into

755
00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:24,360
Speaker 1: this what makes a good hunter thing. I would argue

756
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 1: that the more you lean on technology, the fewer skills

757
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,799
Speaker 1: you actually developed. Like I'd be like, I'm just gonna

758
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:37,879
Speaker 1: gut shoot it because I got these Knocks's gonna do that. No,

759
00:46:37,920 --> 00:46:39,759
Speaker 1: But he's saying, because you don't have to then track

760
00:46:39,880 --> 00:46:42,680
Speaker 1: the gut shot here and find it without the tracking

761
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:45,600
Speaker 1: technology that you then don't possess those Okay, but if

762
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:47,520
Speaker 1: you get a pass through. If you get a pass through,

763
00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:51,359
Speaker 1: it doesn't do anything right. But let's but it's much

764
00:46:51,400 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 1: more fun to talk about these sorts of matters pretending

765
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 1: that it's gonna work good because then it allows you

766
00:46:56,640 --> 00:47:00,360
Speaker 1: to explore that the lighted knock right like lighted you

767
00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:05,759
Speaker 1: brother of the lighted knock, or the friendly brother of

768
00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:08,759
Speaker 1: the lighted knock when it when it passes through, it

769
00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:13,320
Speaker 1: puts out little arms and stays inside. Yeah like that.

770
00:47:14,120 --> 00:47:17,880
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't even like reading books about hunting

771
00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:23,759
Speaker 1: because I feel like I'm gonna grab some chunk of

772
00:47:23,840 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 1: knowledge that I haven't actually learned yet and just assume it,

773
00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:32,640
Speaker 1: and that's gonna hurt me in the long run. So

774
00:47:32,800 --> 00:47:35,480
Speaker 1: when it comes to the technology thing, like yeah, I

775
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:39,480
Speaker 1: have a GPS, but I have a map that I

776
00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:48,479
Speaker 1: use way way, way more. But yeah, but here's five

777
00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:53,280
Speaker 1: thousand years ago people on this continent. We're not using bows. Correct,

778
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:56,840
Speaker 1: five to seven, they were using the adele addles the

779
00:47:56,840 --> 00:47:59,280
Speaker 1: bow and arrows invented a bunch of different times around Earth.

780
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:03,359
Speaker 1: So at some point in time, it went from being

781
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:06,239
Speaker 1: that you were using a spear throwing well, you were

782
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:10,000
Speaker 1: using a hand throwing spear and then you're using a

783
00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:13,080
Speaker 1: throwing board to get a better spear throw. And then

784
00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:15,239
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, some dude comes rolling over the

785
00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:19,759
Speaker 1: mountain who's got a bow. You're like, that's cool to ship, right, yes,

786
00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:23,600
Speaker 1: So he starts using that, and then you fast forward

787
00:48:23,600 --> 00:48:26,600
Speaker 1: and you have muskets, and then some guy starts besides

788
00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:30,120
Speaker 1: to cut a spiral groove inside of a musket barrel

789
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:32,640
Speaker 1: and make a rifle. And the people that you were

790
00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:35,440
Speaker 1: using that, like Daniel Boone Hunter with he had a

791
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:39,239
Speaker 1: rifle barrel. He went into the woods thinking that he

792
00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 1: was using a technologically advanced tool that was leaps and

793
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:50,560
Speaker 1: bounds ahead of what was available to his father. Get

794
00:48:50,640 --> 00:48:53,399
Speaker 1: what you're doing, it's wrong. You get what I'm doing.

795
00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:56,879
Speaker 1: But it's like, it's just it winds up being a march.

796
00:48:56,920 --> 00:48:58,879
Speaker 1: And I'm gonna play Devil's advocate for a minute here,

797
00:48:59,239 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 1: because there are people who in dealing with fair There's

798
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:05,440
Speaker 1: some like like hunting philosopher types who are dealing with

799
00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:09,719
Speaker 1: fair Chase think that we just need to abandon that

800
00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:13,640
Speaker 1: idea and focus on what they think we should focus

801
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:20,000
Speaker 1: on is the idea of of fair use. Meaning we're

802
00:49:20,040 --> 00:49:24,440
Speaker 1: dealing with a finite resource. We're gonna need to figure

803
00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:29,200
Speaker 1: out not enforcing and making ethics legal or like this

804
00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:32,560
Speaker 1: is fair not fair? He's like how much pie is

805
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:35,640
Speaker 1: there to divide up? And then we're gonna need to

806
00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:38,439
Speaker 1: limit our technology is not based on it being fair

807
00:49:38,560 --> 00:49:40,080
Speaker 1: or right or nice. We're gonna need to limit our

808
00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:44,400
Speaker 1: technologies to allow the maximum pool of individuals a chance

809
00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:47,520
Speaker 1: to get a piece of the pie. And it winds

810
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 1: up being like a you're talking about the same thing,

811
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:52,840
Speaker 1: but you're approaching in the way that I think is

812
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:56,239
Speaker 1: like it just almost winds up being easier to think about. So,

813
00:49:56,280 --> 00:49:59,239
Speaker 1: if you're gonna have technologies that are gonna drive efficacy

814
00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:01,640
Speaker 1: through the roots so used to be that are like

815
00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:04,399
Speaker 1: bone arrow like in this state, I could be wrong.

816
00:50:04,520 --> 00:50:07,560
Speaker 1: I think that archery success rates on elk had always

817
00:50:07,600 --> 00:50:12,120
Speaker 1: hovered somewhere between ten and so you could give out

818
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:16,640
Speaker 1: that many more tags, okay for every elk, Like for

819
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:18,759
Speaker 1: every elk killed, you could go out and give out

820
00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:21,960
Speaker 1: five tags and give that many people opportunity to go

821
00:50:22,040 --> 00:50:23,680
Speaker 1: and be the figure out who's gonna be the one

822
00:50:23,719 --> 00:50:27,080
Speaker 1: that gets the one elk. Once technology pushes where efficacy

823
00:50:27,160 --> 00:50:29,759
Speaker 1: rates are gonna go so high, where we push it,

824
00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:33,960
Speaker 1: you're they gonna say, Okay, most of you people are

825
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:37,520
Speaker 1: no longer able to go into the woods because we

826
00:50:37,560 --> 00:50:42,080
Speaker 1: have a limited pool of resources here. Fair use, I

827
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:44,600
Speaker 1: would say that you are then also going to have

828
00:50:44,680 --> 00:50:47,400
Speaker 1: a very limited amount of people who even want to

829
00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:53,279
Speaker 1: go into the woods because part of okay, access recruitment.

830
00:50:53,760 --> 00:50:56,279
Speaker 1: That's like the biggest issue that we're facing right now.

831
00:50:56,360 --> 00:51:00,040
Speaker 1: And and I use this analogy like the stock and

832
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:02,319
Speaker 1: it's good for out out here here. Right everybody's got

833
00:51:02,320 --> 00:51:05,880
Speaker 1: a rancher buddy or a friend who's got a rancher

834
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:08,520
Speaker 1: buddy who's got the stock pond out on their place,

835
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:11,239
Speaker 1: and it's like, yeah, I want to go fish that

836
00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:13,200
Speaker 1: stock pond. You want to go fish that stock pond.

837
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:16,680
Speaker 1: Eventually you get to go out. First cast, you catch

838
00:51:16,680 --> 00:51:20,560
Speaker 1: a fish, second cast, you catch a fish, third cast, fourth,

839
00:51:21,200 --> 00:51:24,040
Speaker 1: Eventually you're like, well, I know I can catch a

840
00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:28,360
Speaker 1: fish out here. Very rarely do you ever return to

841
00:51:28,400 --> 00:51:35,319
Speaker 1: that stock pond. Because yeah, but here's the thing I'm

842
00:51:35,400 --> 00:51:37,479
Speaker 1: driving in a lot of what you're driving at where

843
00:51:37,520 --> 00:51:41,640
Speaker 1: he were saying limiting technologies. If if we're we're gonna

844
00:51:41,640 --> 00:51:43,400
Speaker 1: have to we're gonna have to We're gonna have to

845
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:47,239
Speaker 1: continue to because already limit technologies. You can't jack light, okay,

846
00:51:47,360 --> 00:51:49,680
Speaker 1: or you can't for something jack like frogs. You can't jacklight.

847
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:51,640
Speaker 1: Deer you can't use you can't use the artificial light

848
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:54,839
Speaker 1: to find a deer. We're alreadying the practice of limiting technologies.

849
00:51:55,160 --> 00:51:57,560
Speaker 1: What these people are saying, we talk about the fair

850
00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:02,919
Speaker 1: use idea rather than fair chase or ethics are saying, Yes,

851
00:52:02,920 --> 00:52:05,280
Speaker 1: we're gonna limit technologies, but we're not going to frame

852
00:52:05,320 --> 00:52:08,680
Speaker 1: the discussion around telling you what's right and wrong. We're

853
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 1: gonna limit it to be that we're gonna be able

854
00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:14,560
Speaker 1: to have the maximum number of potential, the maximum number

855
00:52:14,560 --> 00:52:19,920
Speaker 1: of people having potential to extract a resource to maintain

856
00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:23,480
Speaker 1: the best numbers. We're gonna limit efficacy, to limit efficacy,

857
00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:26,799
Speaker 1: We're gonna start ruling out technologies. We're not dictating what's

858
00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:30,799
Speaker 1: right and fair and good. We're just dictating, like, how

859
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:37,319
Speaker 1: can we maintain maximum engagement with a limited resource. So

860
00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:38,960
Speaker 1: they're getting that way you're getting, but they're not trying

861
00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:41,239
Speaker 1: to like they're just trying to like discuss it in

862
00:52:41,280 --> 00:52:45,760
Speaker 1: the way that doesn't make it seem moral, that doesn't

863
00:52:45,800 --> 00:52:49,840
Speaker 1: make you have to pick between right and wrong. Yeah,

864
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:52,120
Speaker 1: I'm a fair user. I would say that you're fair.

865
00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:54,800
Speaker 1: I find myself being in that way because it is

866
00:52:54,840 --> 00:52:57,799
Speaker 1: It's like I do all I have all kinds of

867
00:52:57,840 --> 00:52:59,839
Speaker 1: things that do that weren't available before. And if your

868
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:03,960
Speaker 1: the measure of morality is was it available before, well,

869
00:53:04,040 --> 00:53:09,360
Speaker 1: the whole damn thing boots. It's like, you know what

870
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:12,719
Speaker 1: I mean, it gets really tricky, but it's like, you know, obviously,

871
00:53:13,040 --> 00:53:16,200
Speaker 1: terminal tackles a heck of a lot easier, more efficient

872
00:53:16,239 --> 00:53:20,160
Speaker 1: in most cases than fly fishing. I like to fly fish.

873
00:53:20,760 --> 00:53:23,040
Speaker 1: It's a fun thing to do. Some people say it

874
00:53:23,080 --> 00:53:30,440
Speaker 1: limits you that you do. Yeah, uh, but you know

875
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:34,560
Speaker 1: there's gotta be some you know. I find like anybody

876
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:39,279
Speaker 1: going into any sport, any activity, they're never going to

877
00:53:39,360 --> 00:53:42,440
Speaker 1: be more passionate about it than when they're learning. And

878
00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:46,520
Speaker 1: if we inject all this stuff that makes it easier

879
00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:49,319
Speaker 1: and easier and easier, you know, I'm like, when are

880
00:53:49,360 --> 00:53:50,920
Speaker 1: we gonna get to the point where it's like I

881
00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:53,040
Speaker 1: can kill a deer off my couch in front of

882
00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:57,040
Speaker 1: my computer, right, and then we're just not gonna have

883
00:53:57,080 --> 00:53:58,920
Speaker 1: people that want to go out in the woods. But

884
00:53:59,040 --> 00:54:01,880
Speaker 1: we're the only like we're the only like like hunters

885
00:54:01,880 --> 00:54:04,000
Speaker 1: are the only type of people. Fishermen too, who really

886
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:07,359
Speaker 1: are like screwed up about this stuff in sports. They're

887
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:09,319
Speaker 1: always like making rules and sports and people don't they

888
00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 1: don't turn it into this big like what's right and

889
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:14,560
Speaker 1: wrong and a big moral dilemma. It's just like we

890
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:16,560
Speaker 1: agree that for our game to kind of like be

891
00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:22,000
Speaker 1: the way our game is, you can't use that ship, right,

892
00:54:22,080 --> 00:54:24,600
Speaker 1: And everybody's like, like, there's nothing called this hand ringing.

893
00:54:25,600 --> 00:54:29,279
Speaker 1: You know. You got a couple of little girls coming up.

894
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:33,239
Speaker 1: They're popping some rabbits around the house, not quite yet,

895
00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:36,320
Speaker 1: not quite know. They talk about it a lot, okay,

896
00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:39,160
Speaker 1: sometimes just staying with their mother. Their mother has a

897
00:54:39,160 --> 00:54:41,239
Speaker 1: little cream on their face and they see bunny rabbit

898
00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:44,200
Speaker 1: go by it and they go, Baba, monny rabbit, let's

899
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:50,239
Speaker 1: kill it. He's like, um, but yeah, not quite yet,

900
00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:51,960
Speaker 1: but go ahead. But I mean, do you want to

901
00:54:53,560 --> 00:54:56,520
Speaker 1: you want to bring them up the way you were

902
00:54:56,560 --> 00:55:01,799
Speaker 1: brought up with that technology or you know, I don't say,

903
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:04,320
Speaker 1: I don't really care as long as they're in the woods,

904
00:55:04,360 --> 00:55:08,600
Speaker 1: you know, and enjoying it. So yeah, but I'm we've

905
00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:11,040
Speaker 1: been not gonna engage in the hand ring. No, We've

906
00:55:11,080 --> 00:55:13,000
Speaker 1: talked about the fair used thing before, and I think

907
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:14,719
Speaker 1: it makes a lot of sense. It does. I've never

908
00:55:14,719 --> 00:55:18,200
Speaker 1: heard that before, and I think you're just gonna get

909
00:55:18,239 --> 00:55:21,279
Speaker 1: more people, you know, the of of different mindsets to

910
00:55:21,440 --> 00:55:23,759
Speaker 1: sort of converge and be like, yeah, we can all

911
00:55:23,760 --> 00:55:27,600
Speaker 1: agree upon that because we all want opportunity. We all

912
00:55:27,600 --> 00:55:30,120
Speaker 1: want to hunt every year, and for me to hunt

913
00:55:30,160 --> 00:55:32,319
Speaker 1: every year and everybody else that wants the hunt every year,

914
00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:35,000
Speaker 1: we're gonna have to limit how we do it and

915
00:55:35,280 --> 00:55:39,560
Speaker 1: our success rates. Okay, how do you cope with the brutality?

916
00:55:39,600 --> 00:55:41,600
Speaker 1: This one guy named Dave Smith, who would be hard

917
00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:44,800
Speaker 1: to look up on Facebook with that name, Dave Smith says,

918
00:55:45,160 --> 00:55:47,520
Speaker 1: how do you cope with the brutality of mother nature

919
00:55:47,520 --> 00:55:51,040
Speaker 1: and its food chain? I find the wolves and bears

920
00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:54,000
Speaker 1: to be bullies of the animal world as they strive

921
00:55:54,120 --> 00:55:57,799
Speaker 1: to kill the young and helpless. Maybe I'm becoming too

922
00:55:57,840 --> 00:56:01,600
Speaker 1: soft for the sport or I'm not gonna read it

923
00:56:02,120 --> 00:56:04,680
Speaker 1: because I don't want to be associated with that kind

924
00:56:04,680 --> 00:56:08,480
Speaker 1: of thinking. Um, maybe I'm becoming too soft for the sport.

925
00:56:08,800 --> 00:56:11,840
Speaker 1: Wondering if anyone else feels the same and becomes upset

926
00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:16,440
Speaker 1: because you're unable to help a young animal live another day.

927
00:56:16,640 --> 00:56:19,400
Speaker 1: Would you rather see the yearly become a good age

928
00:56:19,520 --> 00:56:22,359
Speaker 1: rather than a bear or wolf pull it away and

929
00:56:22,440 --> 00:56:26,760
Speaker 1: shred at to pieces while it remains breathing? He really

930
00:56:26,800 --> 00:56:34,120
Speaker 1: liked its just just yeah, if you say where he

931
00:56:34,120 --> 00:56:38,799
Speaker 1: wants you to go mercilessly ripping it while it's screams

932
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:41,759
Speaker 1: an egg and he I mean, I don't know, how

933
00:56:41,760 --> 00:56:49,280
Speaker 1: do you feel about to have? You know? I always

934
00:56:49,440 --> 00:56:52,000
Speaker 1: when I see a predator prey interaction, I am damn

935
00:56:52,040 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 1: sure always rooting for the predator. Oh, I'm always rooting

936
00:56:55,120 --> 00:56:57,840
Speaker 1: for the prey, like when you watch the prey. Yeah,

937
00:56:57,880 --> 00:57:00,759
Speaker 1: like when you want on TV tvie, like if you're

938
00:57:00,760 --> 00:57:04,640
Speaker 1: watching like in your motel room, like you know, Cheetah

939
00:57:04,680 --> 00:57:08,200
Speaker 1: going after a baby gazelle or something. I'm definitely rooting

940
00:57:08,200 --> 00:57:15,000
Speaker 1: for the gazelle. But no, he's not in real life.

941
00:57:15,680 --> 00:57:18,960
Speaker 1: A break. Okay, I'll remember this, I'll remember this the

942
00:57:19,040 --> 00:57:21,560
Speaker 1: day I die. We were Do you remember when we

943
00:57:21,600 --> 00:57:24,760
Speaker 1: took the writer Ian Fraser on his first deer hunt?

944
00:57:25,080 --> 00:57:27,400
Speaker 1: Okay again, we talked about the breaks that we're in

945
00:57:27,440 --> 00:57:29,160
Speaker 1: the Missouri breaks we're in the area with all the

946
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:34,840
Speaker 1: White cliffs, and it's called the White Cliffs area. Looking

947
00:57:34,840 --> 00:57:38,880
Speaker 1: at all that area with Ian Fraser, who is full,

948
00:57:39,520 --> 00:57:43,320
Speaker 1: he's very nervous about what he knows is bound to

949
00:57:43,400 --> 00:57:47,240
Speaker 1: happen on this hunt, that the blood could very well

950
00:57:47,280 --> 00:57:51,480
Speaker 1: be shed by his hands. And I remember we're floating

951
00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:55,800
Speaker 1: along in pigeons what you're called rock doves. Where they're from,

952
00:57:55,800 --> 00:57:58,240
Speaker 1: where their you know, their native range in Eurasia. There's

953
00:57:58,240 --> 00:58:00,960
Speaker 1: a bunch of pigeons stood up in the cracks and

954
00:58:00,960 --> 00:58:04,640
Speaker 1: the White Cliffs, and there's a redtail hawk. Oh, I

955
00:58:04,640 --> 00:58:07,640
Speaker 1: would be rooting for the Hall. Yeah, working work in

956
00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:10,360
Speaker 1: the area over the cliffs, and the pigeons were real

957
00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:12,520
Speaker 1: nervous about getting out too far from the cliffs. And

958
00:58:12,600 --> 00:58:15,800
Speaker 1: I remember, and this was well over a decade ago,

959
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:20,720
Speaker 1: this was in two thousand, seventeen years ago. I remember

960
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:23,360
Speaker 1: exactly what you said. I remember the look on his

961
00:58:23,440 --> 00:58:26,760
Speaker 1: face because you said, man, I hope that thing comes

962
00:58:26,800 --> 00:58:30,880
Speaker 1: down and bitch slaps one of those pigeons. And and

963
00:58:31,040 --> 00:58:34,760
Speaker 1: it was like it was like an epiphany. It was

964
00:58:34,800 --> 00:58:38,960
Speaker 1: like a thing went off in Ian Fraser's mind of

965
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:43,720
Speaker 1: being like like a sudden awareness of a way that

966
00:58:43,760 --> 00:58:48,720
Speaker 1: one could view nature, and I think it like changed

967
00:58:48,800 --> 00:58:51,120
Speaker 1: him forever, Like the look on his face, and it

968
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:53,919
Speaker 1: was like a kind of a laugh, kind of a revelation.

969
00:58:54,080 --> 00:58:57,040
Speaker 1: It was kind of like someone saying if someone came

970
00:58:57,080 --> 00:59:01,040
Speaker 1: down and said to you, like, you know what you

971
00:59:01,080 --> 00:59:04,600
Speaker 1: know when you die? That really is that, you'd be like, jeez,

972
00:59:05,920 --> 00:59:12,760
Speaker 1: really yeah, so I know you route right, it's apparently

973
00:59:12,760 --> 00:59:20,040
Speaker 1: as case specific because yeah, all right, there's nothing sadder.

974
00:59:20,200 --> 00:59:23,840
Speaker 1: And you know, it's like it's weird too as a

975
00:59:23,920 --> 00:59:26,040
Speaker 1: hunter to say things like this and realize that you

976
00:59:26,080 --> 00:59:28,440
Speaker 1: think things like this. But to me, there's just's nothing

977
00:59:28,560 --> 00:59:33,120
Speaker 1: sadder than an offspring being separated from its mind. You

978
00:59:33,160 --> 00:59:40,880
Speaker 1: a love offspring being separated from their moms. It is sad,

979
00:59:40,960 --> 00:59:44,920
Speaker 1: I though. That makes me laugh. It just makes me

980
00:59:44,960 --> 00:59:49,160
Speaker 1: so uncomfortable, I know, but it's just true. Man Yny

981
00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:54,600
Speaker 1: prayer Man, predator man. When I'm watching BBCNE why you

982
00:59:54,600 --> 00:59:56,959
Speaker 1: guys can talk about television. It's like, you guys spend

983
00:59:56,960 --> 00:59:59,600
Speaker 1: an enormous amount of time outside. Yeah, but how many

984
00:59:59,600 --> 01:00:03,720
Speaker 1: times how often you actually see something kills something? That's

985
01:00:03,720 --> 01:00:05,320
Speaker 1: what I'm saying, are you rooting for it to happen

986
01:00:05,400 --> 01:00:08,600
Speaker 1: or not? When I'm watching. No matter what I'm watching,

987
01:00:08,680 --> 01:00:12,640
Speaker 1: I'm always like i'm watching. If I'm watching the Bear,

988
01:00:12,840 --> 01:00:14,920
Speaker 1: I'm like always hopeful that all of a sudden he's

989
01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:17,000
Speaker 1: just gonna rampage into something and tear at the piece.

990
01:00:17,080 --> 01:00:18,840
Speaker 1: Can I read between I just like, I'm like always

991
01:00:18,880 --> 01:00:22,120
Speaker 1: hoping if I'm watching, I'm in the best case scenario

992
01:00:22,200 --> 01:00:24,360
Speaker 1: in the question for a minute, you want to read

993
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:26,000
Speaker 1: what he actually No, no, no, I just want to

994
01:00:26,040 --> 01:00:30,360
Speaker 1: read between the lines. I think, don't you think that

995
01:00:30,400 --> 01:00:32,200
Speaker 1: he's saying we got to get rid of all the

996
01:00:32,200 --> 01:00:35,360
Speaker 1: wolves and stuff? He's an aunt. I believe that he might.

997
01:00:35,400 --> 01:00:37,320
Speaker 1: And I can say this name Smith because who in

998
01:00:37,400 --> 01:00:41,320
Speaker 1: the world is gonna find Dave Smith. I think Dave

999
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:43,840
Speaker 1: Smith might be an anti predator guy. Yeah, I mean,

1000
01:00:45,040 --> 01:00:47,520
Speaker 1: and that's where and he's like, I'm an anti predator guy.

1001
01:00:47,640 --> 01:00:49,320
Speaker 1: I don't want to just come right out and say that,

1002
01:00:50,280 --> 01:00:53,800
Speaker 1: So I'll talk about the brutality with how which they kill.

1003
01:00:54,920 --> 01:00:58,280
Speaker 1: I'm not picking sides. I'm rooting for the interaction that happened,

1004
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:01,160
Speaker 1: and I'm just like happy to sit there and watch

1005
01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:07,120
Speaker 1: and enjoy the observation whatever whatever you know, happens. Sometimes

1006
01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:11,760
Speaker 1: if you're watching one of them, uh documentaries, and and

1007
01:01:11,800 --> 01:01:14,480
Speaker 1: the lion looks all scraggly and super hungry. Then I

1008
01:01:14,520 --> 01:01:18,920
Speaker 1: start rooting for good boy. I am with you, honest

1009
01:01:18,960 --> 01:01:23,600
Speaker 1: completely here, Like every time I've seen something big or small,

1010
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:30,680
Speaker 1: I am just in awe of you know, just by somehow,

1011
01:01:30,760 --> 01:01:37,120
Speaker 1: some crazy set of circumstance being in that small area

1012
01:01:37,400 --> 01:01:41,480
Speaker 1: of the entire freaking planet that this is happening, and

1013
01:01:41,560 --> 01:01:44,920
Speaker 1: it just magically happens in front of me. Like I

1014
01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:47,280
Speaker 1: can't get my head around from that to be like,

1015
01:01:48,240 --> 01:01:51,000
Speaker 1: you know, I'm team squirrel on this one. You know,

1016
01:01:51,120 --> 01:01:56,560
Speaker 1: it's like it's just an amazing You're not like in

1017
01:01:56,600 --> 01:02:01,320
Speaker 1: a position to Yeah, that'd be like, hold on YouTube,

1018
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:05,880
Speaker 1: can't we work this out? Yeah? And I mean there

1019
01:02:05,920 --> 01:02:09,800
Speaker 1: are no bullies of the animal, like they're just doing

1020
01:02:09,840 --> 01:02:13,160
Speaker 1: what they do. Yeah, I got you. This is kind

1021
01:02:13,160 --> 01:02:15,400
Speaker 1: of in the same vein. Someone says, Uh, they have

1022
01:02:15,440 --> 01:02:18,280
Speaker 1: a three year old daughter. No, three year old. I

1023
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:21,080
Speaker 1: don't know if the boy or girl. Um. He started

1024
01:02:21,120 --> 01:02:24,080
Speaker 1: exploring what what is a girl? He started exposing her

1025
01:02:24,080 --> 01:02:26,080
Speaker 1: to the concept and outcomes of hunting and fishing as

1026
01:02:26,120 --> 01:02:28,800
Speaker 1: a source of food. He says, she helps and he

1027
01:02:28,840 --> 01:02:31,120
Speaker 1: throws that in quotes, and I know exactly what those

1028
01:02:31,160 --> 01:02:35,040
Speaker 1: quotes I mean. She helps me portion in package primal

1029
01:02:35,160 --> 01:02:39,600
Speaker 1: cuts of game, and again she helps clean and flay fish.

1030
01:02:39,920 --> 01:02:41,760
Speaker 1: She knows that the food we eat is deer and

1031
01:02:41,840 --> 01:02:44,920
Speaker 1: fish and turkey. But I have not exposed her to

1032
01:02:44,960 --> 01:02:47,760
Speaker 1: the more gruesome tableau. I like this guy to the

1033
01:02:47,800 --> 01:02:52,000
Speaker 1: more gruesome tableau of killing or skinning an animal for

1034
01:02:52,040 --> 01:02:56,200
Speaker 1: fear of painting her nightmares. This is good, Jonathan Ingram,

1035
01:02:56,800 --> 01:03:01,760
Speaker 1: It's really good read on. But I have not exposed

1036
01:03:01,760 --> 01:03:04,520
Speaker 1: her to the more gruesome tableau of killing or skinning

1037
01:03:04,520 --> 01:03:07,440
Speaker 1: an animal for fear of painting her nightmares. What are

1038
01:03:07,480 --> 01:03:11,120
Speaker 1: your thoughts on how best to expose our kids to

1039
01:03:11,200 --> 01:03:16,800
Speaker 1: these things without pushing them into the opposite polar extreme.

1040
01:03:17,320 --> 01:03:22,480
Speaker 1: Obviously every kid is different, but general thoughts would be appreciated.

1041
01:03:24,120 --> 01:03:26,360
Speaker 1: These guys have never bred a woman, which I pointed

1042
01:03:26,360 --> 01:03:37,080
Speaker 1: out before, so they're not like even kind of I'm

1043
01:03:37,080 --> 01:03:40,120
Speaker 1: just gonna turn slightly this one, but I can simulate

1044
01:03:40,160 --> 01:03:51,680
Speaker 1: it really good success. Never successfully bred. Um, it turned

1045
01:03:51,760 --> 01:03:56,720
Speaker 1: slightly towards honest. Uh. I get this a lot, and

1046
01:03:56,760 --> 01:04:00,480
Speaker 1: I think that there's a real um. There's like a

1047
01:04:00,520 --> 01:04:05,040
Speaker 1: lot of trepidation with parents that I think maybe didn't

1048
01:04:05,080 --> 01:04:09,760
Speaker 1: exist before, where parents are really worried about exposing kids

1049
01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:15,560
Speaker 1: to violence. I like that. I think that he really

1050
01:04:15,640 --> 01:04:17,760
Speaker 1: is getting at he doesn't want to ruin it later

1051
01:04:17,880 --> 01:04:21,160
Speaker 1: by over pushing now. But in addition to his concerns,

1052
01:04:21,160 --> 01:04:23,400
Speaker 1: I think it's a real concern where parents feel that

1053
01:04:23,560 --> 01:04:27,800
Speaker 1: like hunting is violent, it's a violent act. Can't get

1054
01:04:27,840 --> 01:04:32,640
Speaker 1: around it, um and limiting kids exposure to violence, I

1055
01:04:32,680 --> 01:04:35,880
Speaker 1: think towards this idea that like, uh, they're not going

1056
01:04:35,920 --> 01:04:38,480
Speaker 1: to become violent people like human They're not gonna pick

1057
01:04:38,560 --> 01:04:40,880
Speaker 1: up like human on human violence. I've evenen countered where

1058
01:04:40,880 --> 01:04:43,560
Speaker 1: at of people who think that their kids, like seeing

1059
01:04:43,600 --> 01:04:47,280
Speaker 1: a firearm is somehow going to push him in that direction,

1060
01:04:47,320 --> 01:04:50,400
Speaker 1: like that the only thing separating their kid from becoming

1061
01:04:50,440 --> 01:04:53,200
Speaker 1: a sociopath is that they haven't seen a gun yet.

1062
01:04:53,800 --> 01:04:55,439
Speaker 1: And I always like to think there's a little bit

1063
01:04:55,440 --> 01:05:00,600
Speaker 1: more holding my kids back on that end. Um. But yeah,

1064
01:05:00,840 --> 01:05:02,960
Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of fear around this. What

1065
01:05:03,120 --> 01:05:05,160
Speaker 1: like what have you as you've dealt with it with

1066
01:05:05,200 --> 01:05:08,480
Speaker 1: your daughters, and I know that they've seen a lot

1067
01:05:08,520 --> 01:05:13,560
Speaker 1: of the tableau. I think you can do a lot

1068
01:05:13,760 --> 01:05:20,000
Speaker 1: worse with just what's out there on television. Um, yeah,

1069
01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:23,680
Speaker 1: I guess television mostly in just general media for scaring

1070
01:05:23,720 --> 01:05:27,480
Speaker 1: your kids away from whatever it is. You don't want

1071
01:05:27,520 --> 01:05:29,280
Speaker 1: him to be a you know, scared of you know,

1072
01:05:29,320 --> 01:05:32,960
Speaker 1: I mean if he's talking about actually like painting nightmares, Like,

1073
01:05:33,000 --> 01:05:35,080
Speaker 1: I don't think it's gonna come from cutting a chicken's

1074
01:05:35,080 --> 01:05:39,720
Speaker 1: head off or gutting a deer, but it will come from, um,

1075
01:05:39,920 --> 01:05:43,800
Speaker 1: you know something like my kids are are seriously scared of.

1076
01:05:44,200 --> 01:05:45,600
Speaker 1: I don't even know the name of the movie. What's

1077
01:05:45,600 --> 01:05:50,360
Speaker 1: someone with a little um yellow characters. There's thousands of

1078
01:05:50,400 --> 01:05:54,720
Speaker 1: them minions. Yeah, they watch that ship and they are scared.

1079
01:05:55,880 --> 01:05:58,520
Speaker 1: They don't know what's going on. It's it's the stuff

1080
01:05:58,560 --> 01:06:02,320
Speaker 1: moving fast, every dire action and when you're not used

1081
01:06:02,320 --> 01:06:05,240
Speaker 1: to that. There's a lot of violence for a kid's

1082
01:06:05,280 --> 01:06:07,840
Speaker 1: movie in there, and I think a lot more there

1083
01:06:07,880 --> 01:06:12,680
Speaker 1: than us at homes, like slapsticky violence. Yeah, I think

1084
01:06:12,720 --> 01:06:14,920
Speaker 1: if you watch it with the critical yeah, yeah, but

1085
01:06:15,000 --> 01:06:16,840
Speaker 1: still again, stuff they're not used to because they just

1086
01:06:16,880 --> 01:06:21,120
Speaker 1: don't watch that kind of stuff at home, you know. Um,

1087
01:06:21,320 --> 01:06:28,160
Speaker 1: you're just interject quickly, please, So I think that there

1088
01:06:28,160 --> 01:06:31,480
Speaker 1: that a lot of this is just in eight in

1089
01:06:31,640 --> 01:06:34,560
Speaker 1: kids like some of them. I have friends whose kids

1090
01:06:34,600 --> 01:06:35,800
Speaker 1: you need to look at the kid and be like

1091
01:06:36,280 --> 01:06:41,080
Speaker 1: that kid ain't gonna hunt. Yeah yeah. And then you

1092
01:06:41,160 --> 01:06:43,240
Speaker 1: got people kids on the other end of the extreme

1093
01:06:43,280 --> 01:06:45,400
Speaker 1: and were just at the cabin and you know that

1094
01:06:45,760 --> 01:06:49,080
Speaker 1: Matt our good friend, Matt Drost, and his daughter was there,

1095
01:06:49,520 --> 01:06:52,760
Speaker 1: his eleven year old daughter. She would catch an octopus

1096
01:06:53,320 --> 01:06:55,560
Speaker 1: in one of the crap and one of the shrimp pots,

1097
01:06:55,680 --> 01:06:58,520
Speaker 1: and she's playing with this thing. It's stickers are hanging

1098
01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:00,760
Speaker 1: off and crawling them, and she plays with it for

1099
01:07:00,800 --> 01:07:06,920
Speaker 1: a half hour and then just takes a knife. She

1100
01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:10,840
Speaker 1: lives with the reality she was brought up with that though,

1101
01:07:10,960 --> 01:07:16,440
Speaker 1: I'm guessing right, are trying to make their nine hunting

1102
01:07:16,520 --> 01:07:19,800
Speaker 1: kids in the hunt in the hunters, and they're exposing

1103
01:07:19,880 --> 01:07:23,360
Speaker 1: him to all of it. But it's just not catching eye. Sure,

1104
01:07:23,640 --> 01:07:26,440
Speaker 1: you know, you know there's two the interesting things. Uh.

1105
01:07:26,520 --> 01:07:28,640
Speaker 1: The thing like we're always like tripped up that we're

1106
01:07:28,640 --> 01:07:32,520
Speaker 1: in this like now as a society, we've arrived at

1107
01:07:32,560 --> 01:07:35,880
Speaker 1: these things that other people weren't dealing with. But Francis,

1108
01:07:35,960 --> 01:07:40,440
Speaker 1: there's a historian and the nineteenth century historian Frances Apartment

1109
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:44,040
Speaker 1: and Frances Apartment wrote at the time like the definitive

1110
01:07:44,080 --> 01:07:45,800
Speaker 1: history of the French and Indian War. And he was

1111
01:07:45,960 --> 01:07:49,440
Speaker 1: asthmatic and was sent by his doctors like you need

1112
01:07:49,480 --> 01:07:51,880
Speaker 1: to go out west. In eighty six. He comes out

1113
01:07:51,920 --> 01:07:56,600
Speaker 1: west and visits the Black Hills of South Dakota in

1114
01:07:56,640 --> 01:08:00,240
Speaker 1: eighteen forty six. And now it's believed that it's his

1115
01:08:00,360 --> 01:08:06,080
Speaker 1: Partment was probably in the same Iglala Sioux camp that

1116
01:08:06,240 --> 01:08:09,120
Speaker 1: Crazy Horse is probably thirteen or fourteen years old, and

1117
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:12,320
Speaker 1: that he was traveling with Crazy Horse, and he would

1118
01:08:12,320 --> 01:08:21,960
Speaker 1: describe how joyfully the Sioux children would torment everything that

1119
01:08:22,000 --> 01:08:26,240
Speaker 1: they found that was alive with toy Bow's just it

1120
01:08:26,320 --> 01:08:29,519
Speaker 1: was just like if it moved, you went after with

1121
01:08:29,560 --> 01:08:31,479
Speaker 1: your toy bow. And he took it to be that

1122
01:08:31,560 --> 01:08:33,400
Speaker 1: it was just like a training thing. And there's a

1123
01:08:33,439 --> 01:08:37,599
Speaker 1: documentary it's about First Contact groups in South First Contact

1124
01:08:37,680 --> 01:08:42,160
Speaker 1: groups in the Brazilian rainforest and the kids in those communities.

1125
01:08:42,760 --> 01:08:45,479
Speaker 1: You were brought up to bring stuff home and jab

1126
01:08:45,560 --> 01:08:50,599
Speaker 1: it and jab every little thing you can find. It's

1127
01:08:50,600 --> 01:08:52,680
Speaker 1: so I think now like when we look at now,

1128
01:08:52,720 --> 01:08:54,080
Speaker 1: if I look at my kids and my kids like

1129
01:08:54,080 --> 01:08:56,840
Speaker 1: he's very aware of hunting, really interested hunting. I mean

1130
01:08:56,880 --> 01:08:58,400
Speaker 1: all three of them are, but the oldest one is more.

1131
01:08:58,840 --> 01:09:00,400
Speaker 1: He just puts a lot more to get other because

1132
01:09:00,400 --> 01:09:03,439
Speaker 1: he's older. Um, he has this thing now where's like

1133
01:09:03,479 --> 01:09:05,840
Speaker 1: he knows we hunt, He's done some hunting. He's the

1134
01:09:05,960 --> 01:09:08,639
Speaker 1: hunted small game. He sees it, he wants to get it.

1135
01:09:09,520 --> 01:09:11,559
Speaker 1: And you might be like, oh, you know we've created

1136
01:09:11,600 --> 01:09:15,040
Speaker 1: this demon. Well I don't know, like are you criticizing

1137
01:09:15,080 --> 01:09:18,000
Speaker 1: all those like all all those other cultures who cultivated

1138
01:09:18,040 --> 01:09:19,760
Speaker 1: that and children like you're gonna learn the skill set.

1139
01:09:19,800 --> 01:09:21,840
Speaker 1: You're gonna learn the skill set this way, you know,

1140
01:09:22,400 --> 01:09:24,519
Speaker 1: Like as much as we would disapprove it, Now, what

1141
01:09:24,520 --> 01:09:26,519
Speaker 1: do we do when we were kids? Oh we had that?

1142
01:09:27,040 --> 01:09:29,720
Speaker 1: What do we hunt? The mode of being a kid

1143
01:09:29,760 --> 01:09:33,240
Speaker 1: that you just described, where do we hunted? Chip? If

1144
01:09:33,240 --> 01:09:38,840
Speaker 1: there's a lower chamber and hell for people that wantingly kill?

1145
01:09:40,479 --> 01:09:44,840
Speaker 1: Roads were just like it was like you wanted to hunt.

1146
01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:47,439
Speaker 1: And it's like all the other stuff that later gets

1147
01:09:47,479 --> 01:09:49,880
Speaker 1: piled on top of that, all the all the ideas

1148
01:09:49,920 --> 01:09:51,960
Speaker 1: of of of use and ethics and a suff at

1149
01:09:51,960 --> 01:09:53,720
Speaker 1: the time, it's just not there at times, like there's

1150
01:09:53,760 --> 01:09:55,679
Speaker 1: certain people who just want to engage in the activity

1151
01:09:55,720 --> 01:09:58,240
Speaker 1: and learn it now, that's how you learned it. Later,

1152
01:09:58,280 --> 01:10:00,800
Speaker 1: you learn all the things that make it what it is.

1153
01:10:01,800 --> 01:10:03,920
Speaker 1: So I don't think it's necessarily like, I don't think

1154
01:10:03,920 --> 01:10:05,240
Speaker 1: it's I don't view it as a thing I need

1155
01:10:05,280 --> 01:10:08,280
Speaker 1: to shield my children from. There are things that they like.

1156
01:10:08,280 --> 01:10:12,200
Speaker 1: Like you saw my boy for whatever reason you he

1157
01:10:12,240 --> 01:10:16,200
Speaker 1: doesn't like to see c cucumbers get hard. Same kid

1158
01:10:16,240 --> 01:10:19,559
Speaker 1: that will go down to the ocean collect all kinds

1159
01:10:19,560 --> 01:10:21,439
Speaker 1: of eels and little fish and put them in a

1160
01:10:21,479 --> 01:10:25,439
Speaker 1: bucket to suffocate overnight. And you're like, hey, man, let's

1161
01:10:25,479 --> 01:10:30,840
Speaker 1: let these we're gonna die. And he's like, but but

1162
01:10:31,200 --> 01:10:35,920
Speaker 1: a seagull or I'm sorry, a c cucumber. He wept

1163
01:10:36,000 --> 01:10:40,720
Speaker 1: over the death of the c c cumber. So I

1164
01:10:40,720 --> 01:10:42,800
Speaker 1: don't know. I don't run around spending a ton of

1165
01:10:42,880 --> 01:10:48,599
Speaker 1: time like thinking that there's something wrong with what seems

1166
01:10:48,600 --> 01:10:51,120
Speaker 1: to be like really natural things about my kids. And

1167
01:10:51,200 --> 01:10:54,400
Speaker 1: I do put a ton of weight on what were

1168
01:10:54,439 --> 01:10:56,559
Speaker 1: my experiences and what are the experiences of the people

1169
01:10:56,640 --> 01:10:59,200
Speaker 1: that I love and associate with the most, and the

1170
01:10:59,240 --> 01:11:01,080
Speaker 1: people that I have sciate with the most and that

1171
01:11:01,200 --> 01:11:07,320
Speaker 1: I love the most. Grew up around catching fish, cutting

1172
01:11:07,360 --> 01:11:10,080
Speaker 1: them up and cleaning them, shooting squirrels, cutting up and

1173
01:11:10,080 --> 01:11:13,960
Speaker 1: cleaning them. And they turned into like, despite all of it,

1174
01:11:14,000 --> 01:11:16,559
Speaker 1: turned into like the most stellar individuals that I've found

1175
01:11:16,560 --> 01:11:19,040
Speaker 1: on the face of the planet. So I'm just not

1176
01:11:19,080 --> 01:11:20,880
Speaker 1: gonna now like buy into this idea that we need

1177
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:26,040
Speaker 1: to question it all. Yeah. We took some folks into

1178
01:11:26,120 --> 01:11:29,600
Speaker 1: the frank Church Wildern a couple of weeks ago. Um,

1179
01:11:29,800 --> 01:11:35,519
Speaker 1: one of which was a pscytarian that had never killed

1180
01:11:35,600 --> 01:11:40,120
Speaker 1: her own fish, so he took care of that. And

1181
01:11:40,920 --> 01:11:44,479
Speaker 1: another gal who had never caught or killed the fish.

1182
01:11:44,560 --> 01:11:47,200
Speaker 1: But can you explained that? So she was just eating fish,

1183
01:11:47,320 --> 01:11:50,920
Speaker 1: not eating it was the only protein. Yeah. And and

1184
01:11:51,040 --> 01:11:53,439
Speaker 1: this is because I put out a big spread for

1185
01:11:53,439 --> 01:11:57,240
Speaker 1: the first night, the only animal protein. Yeah, only animal protein. Yeah.

1186
01:11:57,240 --> 01:11:58,720
Speaker 1: And I took it to me and like, oh, you

1187
01:11:58,800 --> 01:12:03,200
Speaker 1: just don't like process food. It was like I got moves,

1188
01:12:03,280 --> 01:12:06,160
Speaker 1: I got all the and it was sweet, but it

1189
01:12:06,240 --> 01:12:08,639
Speaker 1: was like, no, I can eat none of that. That's

1190
01:12:08,640 --> 01:12:10,479
Speaker 1: where the last silver salmon of the year came in.

1191
01:12:11,040 --> 01:12:16,799
Speaker 1: But so it was an amazing, amazing thing. And these

1192
01:12:16,880 --> 01:12:22,479
Speaker 1: gals are in their mid thirties. Um caught their first fish,

1193
01:12:22,800 --> 01:12:28,759
Speaker 1: killed their first fish with shaking hands, coached them through

1194
01:12:29,800 --> 01:12:36,960
Speaker 1: cleaning these trout and that that was very tough. But

1195
01:12:37,000 --> 01:12:39,160
Speaker 1: I have opened up the stomach contents and look at

1196
01:12:39,200 --> 01:12:43,760
Speaker 1: stuff and that actually made things better by turning into

1197
01:12:43,760 --> 01:12:45,600
Speaker 1: a little bit more of a science project. So that

1198
01:12:45,680 --> 01:12:50,040
Speaker 1: might be a good tip for this fellow. But I

1199
01:12:50,160 --> 01:12:57,919
Speaker 1: have women are vicious. Yeah, they're crazy. There is something

1200
01:12:58,280 --> 01:13:04,200
Speaker 1: in the brain that when they know they can provide it.

1201
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:07,040
Speaker 1: I've seen it before and on this trip was no different.

1202
01:13:07,479 --> 01:13:14,120
Speaker 1: Once these gals had caught, cleaned, cooked on the campfire

1203
01:13:14,160 --> 01:13:17,320
Speaker 1: and eating their own fish and actually shared the fish

1204
01:13:17,360 --> 01:13:20,960
Speaker 1: with others, there's no doubt in my mind they would

1205
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:26,960
Speaker 1: have sat there and cleaned that lake out, like to

1206
01:13:27,000 --> 01:13:30,599
Speaker 1: the point, hey, we've caught enough fish where you you said,

1207
01:13:30,640 --> 01:13:33,680
Speaker 1: like you basically said, you know, it is okay for

1208
01:13:33,720 --> 01:13:37,800
Speaker 1: there to be some brutality in your life. Yes, and

1209
01:13:37,840 --> 01:13:41,120
Speaker 1: it was this quick and actually for yourself and it's food,

1210
01:13:41,840 --> 01:13:44,759
Speaker 1: and oh I can aid it. You know, the whole process,

1211
01:13:44,800 --> 01:13:47,759
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, out of the lake, into the fire food.

1212
01:13:49,040 --> 01:13:52,040
Speaker 1: They would not have stopped. They were had to be forcefully,

1213
01:13:52,200 --> 01:13:56,880
Speaker 1: forcefully removed from the lake. I knew a follow up

1214
01:13:56,880 --> 01:13:58,920
Speaker 1: because what I do worry about, I'd like to hear.

1215
01:13:59,000 --> 01:14:01,599
Speaker 1: Your take is that I don't because I don't worry about,

1216
01:14:01,680 --> 01:14:05,559
Speaker 1: you know, painting their nightmares with deer gut guts and blood.

1217
01:14:05,760 --> 01:14:09,240
Speaker 1: But I do worry about pushing it too hard. And

1218
01:14:09,280 --> 01:14:11,559
Speaker 1: then we have and has a couple of friends that

1219
01:14:11,640 --> 01:14:15,080
Speaker 1: have you know, adult kids now that aren't really hunters

1220
01:14:15,640 --> 01:14:18,759
Speaker 1: a few days a year and because it got shoved

1221
01:14:18,760 --> 01:14:21,960
Speaker 1: down there. Yeah, they just were pushed too hard as youngsters.

1222
01:14:22,040 --> 01:14:24,080
Speaker 1: And so I do worry about that more and really

1223
01:14:24,120 --> 01:14:26,880
Speaker 1: try to you know, balance it out with you know,

1224
01:14:27,200 --> 01:14:30,880
Speaker 1: dance class and um, you know, other things a little

1225
01:14:30,920 --> 01:14:33,680
Speaker 1: girls like, and then we have hunting and fishing, you know,

1226
01:14:33,720 --> 01:14:35,920
Speaker 1: and I try to really balance it and so and

1227
01:14:36,000 --> 01:14:39,120
Speaker 1: not jam it down their throat. Yeah, I think about that,

1228
01:14:39,200 --> 01:14:40,840
Speaker 1: and I know people say it and I've even said

1229
01:14:40,840 --> 01:14:44,920
Speaker 1: it before, but I feel like, um, I kind of

1230
01:14:44,960 --> 01:14:47,840
Speaker 1: view like with our kids, I'm like, they're either gonna

1231
01:14:47,840 --> 01:14:51,120
Speaker 1: be let's do this full balls or not, you know.

1232
01:14:51,560 --> 01:14:54,400
Speaker 1: And so I haven't really worried that much about being

1233
01:14:54,560 --> 01:14:57,120
Speaker 1: really careful about like, oh, you know, we're gonna be

1234
01:14:57,120 --> 01:14:58,800
Speaker 1: on the water an hour and if you want to stay,

1235
01:14:58,840 --> 01:15:00,240
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get you office. I don't want to burn

1236
01:15:00,320 --> 01:15:02,080
Speaker 1: you out. I just haven't thought about it, like I

1237
01:15:02,360 --> 01:15:05,200
Speaker 1: know people say it, but I've pushed him because I

1238
01:15:05,200 --> 01:15:07,559
Speaker 1: think a big thing that I want to expose them

1239
01:15:07,560 --> 01:15:10,439
Speaker 1: to through hunting and fishing is I want to expose

1240
01:15:10,520 --> 01:15:16,839
Speaker 1: them new ideas about like being comfortable being uncomfortable, okay,

1241
01:15:17,160 --> 01:15:20,040
Speaker 1: So like getting used to the idea that when you're uncomfortable,

1242
01:15:20,080 --> 01:15:23,920
Speaker 1: you're still okay, that when your board you're still okay.

1243
01:15:23,920 --> 01:15:26,559
Speaker 1: That these are things that that that lead to other things,

1244
01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:30,320
Speaker 1: right that there's like you you pass through this and

1245
01:15:30,360 --> 01:15:32,320
Speaker 1: come out the other side and it's like more amazing

1246
01:15:32,360 --> 01:15:35,040
Speaker 1: than anything you could have imagined. So if I just

1247
01:15:35,080 --> 01:15:36,960
Speaker 1: went up and set it up that everything was like

1248
01:15:37,000 --> 01:15:40,960
Speaker 1: this like really easy time, not only the thing you

1249
01:15:40,960 --> 01:15:42,960
Speaker 1: want to make it like an always like a success

1250
01:15:43,000 --> 01:15:46,479
Speaker 1: are always an easy time. But you know, not hunting fish,

1251
01:15:46,760 --> 01:15:48,920
Speaker 1: you know, twenty one days in a row. You know,

1252
01:15:48,960 --> 01:15:52,120
Speaker 1: I got what you're saying, Like, yeah, okay, that you're

1253
01:15:52,360 --> 01:15:56,040
Speaker 1: only reading only read hunting stories at night, you know,

1254
01:15:56,280 --> 01:15:58,880
Speaker 1: throw out you know, no more James and Giant Peach

1255
01:15:58,880 --> 01:16:03,639
Speaker 1: would just read about Yeah no, no, I am sensitive

1256
01:16:03,720 --> 01:16:05,120
Speaker 1: that I thought you were saying something different. I am

1257
01:16:05,120 --> 01:16:07,800
Speaker 1: sensitive to that, like like I do really want well

1258
01:16:07,920 --> 01:16:10,040
Speaker 1: rounded and it's like in my setup, in my way,

1259
01:16:10,120 --> 01:16:12,479
Speaker 1: my life structure, I can't escape the well rounded nous

1260
01:16:12,560 --> 01:16:15,000
Speaker 1: I don't have. We're not like in a place and

1261
01:16:15,080 --> 01:16:17,720
Speaker 1: sort of in a professional space where we could just

1262
01:16:17,760 --> 01:16:20,000
Speaker 1: do that one thing all the time. I think, like,

1263
01:16:20,439 --> 01:16:22,519
Speaker 1: I think we get a lot of that. That I've

1264
01:16:22,560 --> 01:16:25,479
Speaker 1: gotten a lot of uh mileage out of is that

1265
01:16:25,840 --> 01:16:28,280
Speaker 1: hunting and fishing has really opened up a lot of

1266
01:16:28,320 --> 01:16:31,200
Speaker 1: conversations and gives you a template to discuss a lot

1267
01:16:31,200 --> 01:16:33,800
Speaker 1: of things that are otherwise very difficult to discuss. I

1268
01:16:33,800 --> 01:16:37,240
Speaker 1: remember we're cleaning perch with my boy this he's seven

1269
01:16:37,240 --> 01:16:40,840
Speaker 1: now four or five. We're cleaning perch and we're looking

1270
01:16:40,880 --> 01:16:43,160
Speaker 1: at I don't know, we're flaying pink Sam sorry, we're

1271
01:16:43,160 --> 01:16:48,439
Speaker 1: looking at eggs, like like sperm sacks and eggs, and

1272
01:16:48,439 --> 01:16:54,839
Speaker 1: I'm like yo, uh and he and I was explaining.

1273
01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:58,000
Speaker 1: I'm like, she like she lays him out on the

1274
01:16:58,080 --> 01:17:02,160
Speaker 1: rocks on the bottom of the river and he comes

1275
01:17:02,200 --> 01:17:06,000
Speaker 1: in and just sprays the milk or semen on those

1276
01:17:06,000 --> 01:17:08,200
Speaker 1: eggs and that's how it's fertilized. And it was like

1277
01:17:08,280 --> 01:17:12,080
Speaker 1: it just took a second for him to think that

1278
01:17:12,080 --> 01:17:16,240
Speaker 1: that delivery mechanism would not work with human beings. And

1279
01:17:17,760 --> 01:17:21,160
Speaker 1: I then I had like then I explained him, like

1280
01:17:21,840 --> 01:17:24,519
Speaker 1: the difference, Right, there's the other way of delivering the

1281
01:17:24,560 --> 01:17:28,920
Speaker 1: sperm more directly to the egg. And the next day

1282
01:17:29,240 --> 01:17:33,920
Speaker 1: he may you can explain that to Ryan and me. Yeah,

1283
01:17:33,960 --> 01:17:36,840
Speaker 1: I keep I keep needing to change where I'm aiming,

1284
01:17:36,840 --> 01:17:41,360
Speaker 1: so I'm not gott aim back this lay you gotta

1285
01:17:41,360 --> 01:17:47,439
Speaker 1: he got a packer, uh he um. The next day.

1286
01:17:47,880 --> 01:17:52,240
Speaker 1: I the next day I overhear him He's explained this

1287
01:17:52,360 --> 01:17:55,240
Speaker 1: to his nanny and he says, and my mom did

1288
01:17:55,320 --> 01:18:04,320
Speaker 1: that three times, So it does. Yeah, this gives you, like,

1289
01:18:04,320 --> 01:18:06,680
Speaker 1: like I think, but everything man like set. You know,

1290
01:18:06,680 --> 01:18:09,320
Speaker 1: it's like the like sex and death right like death,

1291
01:18:09,800 --> 01:18:13,920
Speaker 1: sex violence. It just get gets you in a way

1292
01:18:13,920 --> 01:18:15,800
Speaker 1: of it just like opens up all this way to

1293
01:18:15,800 --> 01:18:18,559
Speaker 1: have all these conversations and that just like based off

1294
01:18:18,600 --> 01:18:20,439
Speaker 1: like books you read. You're like looking at like actual

1295
01:18:20,560 --> 01:18:24,040
Speaker 1: real ship on the land or on the ground or

1296
01:18:24,080 --> 01:18:26,040
Speaker 1: in the water, and you're talking about like real things

1297
01:18:26,040 --> 01:18:30,240
Speaker 1: that have major implications. So if there is some added

1298
01:18:30,360 --> 01:18:32,559
Speaker 1: risk that you're gonna raise a socio path because you

1299
01:18:32,560 --> 01:18:36,760
Speaker 1: guys went and flay to perch. I don't know. Um,

1300
01:18:36,880 --> 01:18:41,960
Speaker 1: I just don't think it's a real issue. I'm done.

1301
01:18:42,840 --> 01:18:48,000
Speaker 1: What was that? I mean, everybody tracking, anybody have like

1302
01:18:48,040 --> 01:18:50,439
Speaker 1: a big like a thing they need to add. Question

1303
01:18:52,920 --> 01:18:55,360
Speaker 1: everyone's tracking, Go ahead, what is the thing you gotta add?

1304
01:18:55,479 --> 01:18:59,800
Speaker 1: What is each of your favorite animals done? All type

1305
01:18:59,800 --> 01:19:06,639
Speaker 1: of game animal? You look at that, honey? Nothing really

1306
01:19:06,640 --> 01:19:08,000
Speaker 1: Now I'm just thinking if you should give him hell

1307
01:19:08,120 --> 01:19:14,600
Speaker 1: or not for asking that question. Man, I know what

1308
01:19:14,640 --> 01:19:18,639
Speaker 1: yours is. Well, it's just a difficult questions because there's

1309
01:19:18,640 --> 01:19:21,360
Speaker 1: like elcohol, which is just not fun. But it's like

1310
01:19:21,400 --> 01:19:24,520
Speaker 1: what I do most of the time, but you recognize

1311
01:19:24,560 --> 01:19:27,919
Speaker 1: it just yeah, it's a vision quest. It's not intended

1312
01:19:28,000 --> 01:19:35,320
Speaker 1: to be enjoyable, but just pure enjoyment like squirrels probably

1313
01:19:37,000 --> 01:19:41,360
Speaker 1: just as like having fun. Yeah. Yeah, for me, it

1314
01:19:41,439 --> 01:19:43,680
Speaker 1: used to be like I after having done it a

1315
01:19:43,720 --> 01:19:45,800
Speaker 1: handful of times, it was doll sheet, But now I

1316
01:19:45,840 --> 01:19:49,879
Speaker 1: think that, like, um, I really I just really enjoy

1317
01:19:51,120 --> 01:19:53,880
Speaker 1: hunting mule deer because I like to spend a lot

1318
01:19:53,880 --> 01:19:56,120
Speaker 1: of time sitting up on a glass and tip just watching.

1319
01:19:56,920 --> 01:19:59,400
Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, it's like a pretty like there's a

1320
01:19:59,439 --> 01:20:02,080
Speaker 1: lot of opera tunity There's a lot of opportunities in

1321
01:20:02,120 --> 01:20:05,040
Speaker 1: a lot of places, and I just like to I

1322
01:20:05,120 --> 01:20:07,599
Speaker 1: just I like those days where the day just passes

1323
01:20:07,600 --> 01:20:11,760
Speaker 1: and you just observe you and Mule, You're like really

1324
01:20:11,840 --> 01:20:14,560
Speaker 1: lends itself to that you're kind of being most constructive,

1325
01:20:15,200 --> 01:20:19,439
Speaker 1: sometimes being most constructive by just not doing anything, just watching, watching, watching.

1326
01:20:20,760 --> 01:20:26,160
Speaker 1: So yeah, dear mules, spotting it before your buddy, what's

1327
01:20:26,200 --> 01:20:31,639
Speaker 1: all about? When I had dogs, I would have traded

1328
01:20:31,760 --> 01:20:39,160
Speaker 1: anything for bird hunting. Um the Yeah, I don't. I mean,

1329
01:20:39,360 --> 01:20:43,519
Speaker 1: I truly enjoy it all. It's very, very tough, but yeah,

1330
01:20:43,720 --> 01:20:48,320
Speaker 1: mule there is is absolutely my most favorite thing in

1331
01:20:48,360 --> 01:20:50,439
Speaker 1: the world. When I'm hunting mule here, It's not like

1332
01:20:50,439 --> 01:20:54,320
Speaker 1: I'm everythinking about being some other place. Uh, but I

1333
01:20:54,439 --> 01:20:58,599
Speaker 1: love calling things an you know, duck, skies, elk deer

1334
01:20:58,680 --> 01:21:05,519
Speaker 1: or whatever. So uh, that's answer everything. Yeah, give me,

1335
01:21:06,040 --> 01:21:08,520
Speaker 1: give me a lot of vacation time and I'll fill it.

1336
01:21:09,640 --> 01:21:17,120
Speaker 1: Buglin bulls for sure. Really, that's real precise. I like

1337
01:21:17,200 --> 01:21:22,280
Speaker 1: that you're uh, what are your thoughts on hunting? This

1338
01:21:22,320 --> 01:21:23,720
Speaker 1: guy has a lot of questions. I feel like you

1339
01:21:23,840 --> 01:21:26,920
Speaker 1: go a little bit of axtagrind justin burden maybe, I

1340
01:21:26,920 --> 01:21:29,479
Speaker 1: mean not a bad way. What are your thoughts on hunting? Uh?

1341
01:21:29,720 --> 01:21:32,320
Speaker 1: He points out white tailed deer in the preserve, so

1342
01:21:32,320 --> 01:21:34,560
Speaker 1: he's talked about it was like animals raise in the

1343
01:21:34,640 --> 01:21:41,640
Speaker 1: pen raise environment, like high wired deer hunt. Yeah, what

1344
01:21:41,680 --> 01:21:44,280
Speaker 1: are your thoughts on that they're hunting fenced up animals?

1345
01:21:45,320 --> 01:21:47,880
Speaker 1: For me, I'd like i'd put it more on the

1346
01:21:47,920 --> 01:21:52,760
Speaker 1: grocery side of things, on the hunting side of things. Yeah,

1347
01:21:52,880 --> 01:21:57,320
Speaker 1: it's it's called farming. Like, yeah, I mean that's that's

1348
01:21:57,360 --> 01:21:59,400
Speaker 1: the only problem I have with is the confusion they're

1349
01:21:59,439 --> 01:22:03,800
Speaker 1: creating with farming and hunting. But there's that there's the

1350
01:22:03,840 --> 01:22:07,519
Speaker 1: added level of then of that they are in. Like

1351
01:22:08,120 --> 01:22:10,960
Speaker 1: the action is very similar, right, you just like go

1352
01:22:11,120 --> 01:22:14,360
Speaker 1: and kill this farm race thing. But then in post

1353
01:22:15,080 --> 01:22:18,959
Speaker 1: when it's consumed or talked about, the farm animal remains

1354
01:22:19,040 --> 01:22:23,000
Speaker 1: the farm animal and it's just eating. But the supposed

1355
01:22:23,479 --> 01:22:27,840
Speaker 1: hunted behind high fence animal sort of might have this

1356
01:22:28,280 --> 01:22:30,280
Speaker 1: that dude as a tool if he tries to be

1357
01:22:30,360 --> 01:22:35,519
Speaker 1: like yeah, and there, I knew there was a fence

1358
01:22:35,600 --> 01:22:39,479
Speaker 1: just a little ways down. That's what I'm saying is

1359
01:22:39,560 --> 01:22:41,640
Speaker 1: that's it's it's it is the same, and it's not

1360
01:22:41,680 --> 01:22:45,599
Speaker 1: the same, So it might even be worse somehow. It's

1361
01:22:45,640 --> 01:22:49,679
Speaker 1: like morally worse, worse than farming. But you have farm

1362
01:22:49,760 --> 01:22:52,600
Speaker 1: animals on your property and I've gone on with you

1363
01:22:52,600 --> 01:22:54,479
Speaker 1: and shot him to head of the twenty two lambs.

1364
01:22:55,880 --> 01:22:59,799
Speaker 1: It's just for me, it's like, there's no confusion between

1365
01:22:59,840 --> 01:23:02,280
Speaker 1: the right. We're talking about a situation here now that

1366
01:23:02,400 --> 01:23:05,000
Speaker 1: has all the trappings of hunting, but it's not hunting.

1367
01:23:05,320 --> 01:23:07,799
Speaker 1: But I don't get confused by it. There's a fence,

1368
01:23:08,160 --> 01:23:10,759
Speaker 1: but why do people why do people like could create

1369
01:23:10,840 --> 01:23:14,400
Speaker 1: the confusion? Yeah, I don't know. Well, then you can

1370
01:23:14,439 --> 01:23:17,320
Speaker 1: blow this thing way up right and you talk about

1371
01:23:17,640 --> 01:23:20,400
Speaker 1: South Africa and it's like, well, yeah, but it's twenty

1372
01:23:20,800 --> 01:23:25,120
Speaker 1: anchors fenced, right, But is that the I mean, that's

1373
01:23:25,160 --> 01:23:28,919
Speaker 1: not really question right. I don't know. It's an enormous

1374
01:23:28,960 --> 01:23:31,840
Speaker 1: gray area. I I put it the gym pose with

1375
01:23:32,120 --> 01:23:34,519
Speaker 1: who's like a like a kind of hunting philosopher. I

1376
01:23:34,560 --> 01:23:36,760
Speaker 1: put the question about it to him, and I was

1377
01:23:36,800 --> 01:23:39,559
Speaker 1: pointing it to him where I was saying, like, no

1378
01:23:39,600 --> 01:23:42,400
Speaker 1: one would say that you're bad if you raise sheep

1379
01:23:42,840 --> 01:23:45,559
Speaker 1: in a pen and shoot sheep and eat them. There's

1380
01:23:45,560 --> 01:23:48,240
Speaker 1: nothing like there's no ethical. That's the ethically wrong. That's

1381
01:23:48,240 --> 01:23:51,559
Speaker 1: just how we get me. It's like farming right ethically

1382
01:23:51,560 --> 01:23:54,679
Speaker 1: a okay, But why do when when a guy raises

1383
01:23:54,760 --> 01:23:58,960
Speaker 1: up a deer, puts camouflage clothes on, goes through some

1384
01:23:59,120 --> 01:24:03,480
Speaker 1: of these sort of like some of it, goes adopts

1385
01:24:03,479 --> 01:24:07,840
Speaker 1: many of the trappings of hunting, shoots the pander, and

1386
01:24:07,840 --> 01:24:13,280
Speaker 1: then positions it as being that he hunted it. Like

1387
01:24:13,360 --> 01:24:16,120
Speaker 1: why does that feel wrong? Like? Why does that feel wrong?

1388
01:24:16,160 --> 01:24:17,880
Speaker 1: But I don't think it's wrong. I don't think any

1389
01:24:17,880 --> 01:24:21,280
Speaker 1: of it of his unethical. It's all the first part

1390
01:24:21,280 --> 01:24:23,439
Speaker 1: of it that's all his own business. And then the

1391
01:24:23,520 --> 01:24:26,160
Speaker 1: last part where he reacts like he hunted it, that's

1392
01:24:26,200 --> 01:24:29,160
Speaker 1: just annoying. I don't think if it as an ethical issue,

1393
01:24:29,360 --> 01:24:31,639
Speaker 1: yeah not yeah not. But but he had a really

1394
01:24:31,680 --> 01:24:34,720
Speaker 1: interesting point about the business positives at an interesting point

1395
01:24:34,760 --> 01:24:39,519
Speaker 1: about the business of selling wild animals. So where you

1396
01:24:39,560 --> 01:24:42,880
Speaker 1: take wild animals, raise them in a captive environment, and

1397
01:24:42,920 --> 01:24:46,080
Speaker 1: then sell hunts for those wild animals. What he doesn't

1398
01:24:46,120 --> 01:24:47,600
Speaker 1: like about it, and he's not he doesn't pass the

1399
01:24:47,720 --> 01:24:50,480
Speaker 1: moral judge. He says, there's many ways to get meat, okay,

1400
01:24:50,840 --> 01:24:52,280
Speaker 1: But what he doesn't like about it and he and

1401
01:24:52,320 --> 01:24:53,479
Speaker 1: he put it and it was the kind of the

1402
01:24:53,479 --> 01:24:56,600
Speaker 1: most interesting take on it that I've ever heard, is

1403
01:24:56,640 --> 01:25:01,679
Speaker 1: positives pointed out, it's like what they're selling, they're selling

1404
01:25:01,720 --> 01:25:06,479
Speaker 1: the idea of a wild animal, Like the animal that

1405
01:25:06,520 --> 01:25:11,400
Speaker 1: you've gotten defence only has value because it is it

1406
01:25:11,520 --> 01:25:17,080
Speaker 1: still is brings to mind or is associative of wild animals.

1407
01:25:17,360 --> 01:25:22,280
Speaker 1: People don't pay to come shoot steers. So when you

1408
01:25:22,400 --> 01:25:25,639
Speaker 1: sell the opportunity come shoot a deer, saying like, I'm

1409
01:25:25,640 --> 01:25:28,600
Speaker 1: taking a thing of that that has value because of

1410
01:25:28,600 --> 01:25:34,120
Speaker 1: the real version that we've made a moral financial commitment

1411
01:25:34,200 --> 01:25:37,519
Speaker 1: to have wild life and it's created value for this animal.

1412
01:25:37,560 --> 01:25:40,479
Speaker 1: I'm taking that thing of value, putting it in an

1413
01:25:40,640 --> 01:25:44,200
Speaker 1: artificial sense and capitalizing on the value that wildness has

1414
01:25:44,240 --> 01:25:48,000
Speaker 1: created to sell to you. And that's that's where he

1415
01:25:48,040 --> 01:25:52,519
Speaker 1: finds the offensiveness is like the sort of false marketing

1416
01:25:52,560 --> 01:25:55,479
Speaker 1: that's going on there. But it's kind of a victimless crime.

1417
01:25:55,560 --> 01:25:58,000
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like you're only just it's just mental masturbation.

1418
01:25:58,040 --> 01:25:59,679
Speaker 1: If a guy wants to do it, it's not hurting

1419
01:25:59,680 --> 01:26:02,040
Speaker 1: anymore until you begin to look at and this is

1420
01:26:02,080 --> 01:26:03,960
Speaker 1: the point that heat again, if you were to put

1421
01:26:03,960 --> 01:26:07,439
Speaker 1: this to gym posits. It's a victimless crime until you

1422
01:26:07,479 --> 01:26:13,000
Speaker 1: get to look at issues of disease transmission, which is

1423
01:26:13,040 --> 01:26:16,360
Speaker 1: becoming a major issue with captive deal. So here you're

1424
01:26:16,400 --> 01:26:19,720
Speaker 1: in a situation where you're taking the essence of wildness

1425
01:26:20,520 --> 01:26:25,280
Speaker 1: selling that to someone in a situation that is threatening

1426
01:26:26,240 --> 01:26:29,679
Speaker 1: the existence of the side of wildness that we're all

1427
01:26:29,720 --> 01:26:33,280
Speaker 1: acknowledging we value anyways, by creating a fake version inside

1428
01:26:33,320 --> 01:26:42,160
Speaker 1: for sale. Couldn't agree more. Essence of wildness should be

1429
01:26:42,200 --> 01:26:52,440
Speaker 1: a meat eater branded cologne. All right, we're out of time. Oh,

1430
01:26:52,960 --> 01:26:55,880
Speaker 1: I was curious the last podcast came out and I

1431
01:26:55,920 --> 01:27:00,240
Speaker 1: didn't I've had a chance stop issue a question, Gin,

1432
01:27:00,439 --> 01:27:03,439
Speaker 1: But when you're on an unlimited chief hunt, you gotta

1433
01:27:03,880 --> 01:27:07,759
Speaker 1: check into the quota, right, And I've answered the question

1434
01:27:07,880 --> 01:27:10,120
Speaker 1: for myself, but you didn't answer it on the podcast.

1435
01:27:10,880 --> 01:27:13,880
Speaker 1: How do you see if the quota has been felt?

1436
01:27:14,280 --> 01:27:17,760
Speaker 1: Where those two go or two sheep shot and you

1437
01:27:17,880 --> 01:27:20,320
Speaker 1: gotta have a radio? Is that right? And then they

1438
01:27:20,360 --> 01:27:26,599
Speaker 1: put that out at noon? How's that? Oh? That's interesting questions? So, uh,

1439
01:27:26,600 --> 01:27:29,720
Speaker 1: he's referring to that there are and it's not just

1440
01:27:29,760 --> 01:27:31,559
Speaker 1: the unlimited Chief units. There are a lot of hunts

1441
01:27:31,640 --> 01:27:34,240
Speaker 1: where they'll have a unit. There's BlackBerry units like this

1442
01:27:34,360 --> 01:27:37,320
Speaker 1: and all kinds of areas where they have like a

1443
01:27:37,439 --> 01:27:42,679
Speaker 1: minimum um, they have a maximum mortality threshold that they're

1444
01:27:42,680 --> 01:27:46,280
Speaker 1: going to achieve in a population, and so sometimes it's

1445
01:27:46,320 --> 01:27:49,040
Speaker 1: limited to females, like like you might have a Mountain

1446
01:27:49,040 --> 01:27:52,200
Speaker 1: lion unit where they're they have a maximum female mortality

1447
01:27:52,280 --> 01:27:57,160
Speaker 1: threshold of three. So the season's gonna stay open until

1448
01:27:57,800 --> 01:28:01,120
Speaker 1: they hit that cap. And in those situations where you're

1449
01:28:01,160 --> 01:28:02,840
Speaker 1: hunting in one of those units, you need to stay

1450
01:28:02,840 --> 01:28:05,880
Speaker 1: apprized whether the season is still open, and they'll usually

1451
01:28:05,920 --> 01:28:08,280
Speaker 1: make it that they're gonna be like that. It closes

1452
01:28:08,320 --> 01:28:11,519
Speaker 1: on forty eight hour notice, so someone kills the third female.

1453
01:28:11,840 --> 01:28:14,840
Speaker 1: Let's say they'll put out a notice and you have

1454
01:28:14,880 --> 01:28:16,680
Speaker 1: forty eight hours. Let's say you're on a ten day

1455
01:28:16,800 --> 01:28:22,400
Speaker 1: hunting trip. Um, how do you know? And you either

1456
01:28:23,280 --> 01:28:25,719
Speaker 1: you gotta make a phone call, so you either walk

1457
01:28:25,760 --> 01:28:29,680
Speaker 1: out and you know, go to a pay phone like

1458
01:28:29,720 --> 01:28:31,880
Speaker 1: in the old days or now a lot of people

1459
01:28:31,920 --> 01:28:35,120
Speaker 1: carry satellite phones, or you time or you time your

1460
01:28:35,120 --> 01:28:37,320
Speaker 1: thing out where you know that like you can check

1461
01:28:37,360 --> 01:28:42,640
Speaker 1: it at the trailhead and it's still open, so you

1462
01:28:42,640 --> 01:28:44,800
Speaker 1: know that you have at least forty eight hours and

1463
01:28:44,840 --> 01:28:46,360
Speaker 1: then you need to recheck again. But you have it's

1464
01:28:46,360 --> 01:28:49,000
Speaker 1: your respect in those like quota system things that your

1465
01:28:49,000 --> 01:28:52,400
Speaker 1: responsibility be constantly checking in to make sure the quota

1466
01:28:52,439 --> 01:28:55,360
Speaker 1: threshold has been met. I don't Pete munic. Pete Mutick

1467
01:28:55,439 --> 01:29:02,160
Speaker 1: yelled out, is it sat phone? Pete didn't come left?

1468
01:29:02,360 --> 01:29:08,080
Speaker 1: Is Kurt here? It is the hunter's responsibility at a

1469
01:29:08,240 --> 01:29:12,040
Speaker 1: radio station that would you know? You bought your little

1470
01:29:12,160 --> 01:29:17,320
Speaker 1: radio and they play it at say or whatever time.

1471
01:29:18,760 --> 01:29:21,000
Speaker 1: That's what I read. I was just curious. Yeah, no,

1472
01:29:21,080 --> 01:29:23,680
Speaker 1: I'd like to get hear from Kurt, but he's dead.

1473
01:29:25,040 --> 01:29:33,400
Speaker 1: Um Matt concluding thoughts, oh Man woll that was kind

1474
01:29:33,400 --> 01:29:38,000
Speaker 1: of a conversation, stopper. I came in har enjoy I

1475
01:29:38,080 --> 01:29:40,160
Speaker 1: enjoyed chatting with you all in front of a bunch

1476
01:29:40,160 --> 01:29:45,000
Speaker 1: of people. Was a bright light in my face. No,

1477
01:29:45,200 --> 01:29:47,599
Speaker 1: like big meaning of all things. No, I don't have

1478
01:29:47,720 --> 01:29:50,720
Speaker 1: like some big like umbrella statement that I could make.

1479
01:29:51,840 --> 01:29:54,679
Speaker 1: Sorry you didn't tell me. I had to be prepared

1480
01:29:54,720 --> 01:29:56,280
Speaker 1: to do that. Yeah, well you know what. I wasn't

1481
01:29:56,400 --> 01:29:58,320
Speaker 1: ask it, but we ran out of time. As a

1482
01:29:58,400 --> 01:30:01,800
Speaker 1: dude named Joe March had this what makes it good

1483
01:30:01,920 --> 01:30:09,200
Speaker 1: human being? So I attempted to, like, uh, you know,

1484
01:30:09,800 --> 01:30:16,000
Speaker 1: hold court about like Kant's categorical imperative or Nietzsche's Nietzicie's

1485
01:30:16,080 --> 01:30:19,960
Speaker 1: idea of a ubermant or something like that. But I

1486
01:30:20,040 --> 01:30:23,760
Speaker 1: think I'm just gonna offer not what is a sufficient

1487
01:30:23,880 --> 01:30:26,160
Speaker 1: condition for being a good human being? But I'll offer

1488
01:30:26,240 --> 01:30:29,519
Speaker 1: what is a necessary condition, And I'd say that that's

1489
01:30:29,560 --> 01:30:39,960
Speaker 1: supporting public lands. That's good. So call I have, We're

1490
01:30:39,960 --> 01:30:41,960
Speaker 1: gonna run with what's the good? What makes it good

1491
01:30:42,040 --> 01:30:47,799
Speaker 1: human being? As the concluders what makes a good human being? Patience? Really,

1492
01:30:49,840 --> 01:30:51,880
Speaker 1: what if what if you're patiently waiting to kill a

1493
01:30:51,960 --> 01:31:01,479
Speaker 1: small child? Well, perhaps in that situation, while you are

1494
01:31:02,120 --> 01:31:06,840
Speaker 1: waiting there for your opportune moment, you have an epiphany

1495
01:31:07,479 --> 01:31:15,200
Speaker 1: and move on. Yeah, uh kind of go a trust

1496
01:31:15,200 --> 01:31:18,200
Speaker 1: and commitment. Yeah, you gotta flesh it out a little bit.

1497
01:31:18,280 --> 01:31:20,960
Speaker 1: I mean they can't, just because I just feeling it's

1498
01:31:20,960 --> 01:31:23,679
Speaker 1: a little not soft. It's a little bit like I'm like, yeah,

1499
01:31:24,120 --> 01:31:32,760
Speaker 1: like the white supremacy of that. Ah, Matt just made

1500
01:31:32,800 --> 01:31:39,479
Speaker 1: too good concluding thoughts, Um, well, I don't. I just

1501
01:31:39,520 --> 01:31:42,120
Speaker 1: feel like that if you if you have those two things, man,

1502
01:31:42,560 --> 01:31:45,640
Speaker 1: you can kind of tackle anything and continue on and

1503
01:31:47,479 --> 01:31:49,920
Speaker 1: do well and think all things that you try in

1504
01:31:50,160 --> 01:31:53,360
Speaker 1: relationships and jobs in the universe. And I agree, but

1505
01:31:53,439 --> 01:31:56,559
Speaker 1: you're taking for granted an enormous amount that they're trusting

1506
01:31:56,560 --> 01:31:59,000
Speaker 1: and committing to a thing that is that is of good.

1507
01:32:00,680 --> 01:32:05,559
Speaker 1: That's true, Um, because I had I had lugs you

1508
01:32:05,600 --> 01:32:07,400
Speaker 1: to like think about this, because I'm the guy with

1509
01:32:07,439 --> 01:32:11,120
Speaker 1: the computer with the questions on and I'm like, when

1510
01:32:11,160 --> 01:32:15,439
Speaker 1: I was saying that's an unfair man, you sound way

1511
01:32:15,439 --> 01:32:18,519
Speaker 1: more like, Yeah, I don't want you to think. Don't

1512
01:32:18,520 --> 01:32:20,519
Speaker 1: don't think I spent too much time on this. We're

1513
01:32:20,560 --> 01:32:22,439
Speaker 1: just shuffle and we were just kind of still doing this.

1514
01:32:23,000 --> 01:32:26,479
Speaker 1: My wife convouished me. I was mess to where I

1515
01:32:26,520 --> 01:32:29,080
Speaker 1: don't have any you know, I'm flying off the coffee here.

1516
01:32:31,640 --> 01:32:34,439
Speaker 1: I didn't think about this one because I questioned whether

1517
01:32:34,479 --> 01:32:38,120
Speaker 1: it was, like, you know, within our bailo Wick, right,

1518
01:32:38,160 --> 01:32:42,360
Speaker 1: Like I questioned whether it was this question, yeah, like

1519
01:32:42,439 --> 01:32:45,559
Speaker 1: does it fit the theme what the show is about?

1520
01:32:47,000 --> 01:32:51,240
Speaker 1: And no, but there's something really seductive about it. It's

1521
01:32:51,240 --> 01:32:54,360
Speaker 1: just like six clean words, man, and what makes it

1522
01:32:54,400 --> 01:32:56,360
Speaker 1: good human being? And when I had the lugs you

1523
01:32:56,520 --> 01:32:58,200
Speaker 1: thinking about this, you guys, and I would be like,

1524
01:32:58,479 --> 01:33:00,599
Speaker 1: I think I kept thinking, like, what level of fine

1525
01:33:00,640 --> 01:33:03,639
Speaker 1: tuning are we in while I'm talking with this, please

1526
01:33:03,680 --> 01:33:06,240
Speaker 1: think about the commitment stuff, because I do want to

1527
01:33:06,240 --> 01:33:08,160
Speaker 1: hear more, but like, do you be like what level

1528
01:33:08,160 --> 01:33:10,559
Speaker 1: of fine tuning? When we make a show, we start

1529
01:33:10,600 --> 01:33:14,840
Speaker 1: out where we're talking about like big, huge problems things,

1530
01:33:15,160 --> 01:33:18,639
Speaker 1: and then later like you know that, like second, can

1531
01:33:18,680 --> 01:33:22,439
Speaker 1: we change that second so that second you know? Were

1532
01:33:22,439 --> 01:33:24,280
Speaker 1: you like you're so like so good human being? I'm like,

1533
01:33:24,280 --> 01:33:27,479
Speaker 1: are we what where is he now to begin sort

1534
01:33:27,520 --> 01:33:30,720
Speaker 1: of shaping him and advising him. And the reason I

1535
01:33:30,760 --> 01:33:32,840
Speaker 1: was thinking about that as like, up until a couple

1536
01:33:32,880 --> 01:33:34,920
Speaker 1: of days ago, I wouldn't think that had to be like, oh,

1537
01:33:34,960 --> 01:33:38,960
Speaker 1: don't be a white supremacist. There's a starter, right, like

1538
01:33:39,360 --> 01:33:42,400
Speaker 1: you're setting the guy asking the question to be like,

1539
01:33:43,960 --> 01:33:46,760
Speaker 1: but now I'm like, oh, so we're starting out like

1540
01:33:47,040 --> 01:33:51,320
Speaker 1: we're starting out like really broad basics ship that we're

1541
01:33:51,360 --> 01:33:53,719
Speaker 1: not able to hone in on, like the fine tune

1542
01:33:53,800 --> 01:33:55,840
Speaker 1: details that you don't know if he's at the Ten

1543
01:33:55,920 --> 01:33:59,080
Speaker 1: Commandments level or if he's kind of further down on

1544
01:33:59,120 --> 01:34:04,720
Speaker 1: the road, and taking like this like great guy, right,

1545
01:34:04,760 --> 01:34:08,400
Speaker 1: and he's being like, yes, you trust the commitment, like

1546
01:34:08,439 --> 01:34:11,160
Speaker 1: you've got it, like you're head in the right direction,

1547
01:34:11,840 --> 01:34:16,600
Speaker 1: you know. Um so yeah, if I think about what

1548
01:34:16,640 --> 01:34:18,120
Speaker 1: makes a good human being, I'll tell you like a

1549
01:34:18,320 --> 01:34:21,120
Speaker 1: thing I like in people that like in people when

1550
01:34:21,200 --> 01:34:29,640
Speaker 1: someone is holds this contradiction where they're really um steadfast okay,

1551
01:34:30,840 --> 01:34:35,839
Speaker 1: but also really open to all the ideas floating around.

1552
01:34:36,439 --> 01:34:38,800
Speaker 1: But all the ideas floating around. Don't make him be

1553
01:34:38,920 --> 01:34:42,160
Speaker 1: like this, right, the ideas floating around, make him just

1554
01:34:42,200 --> 01:34:45,200
Speaker 1: be like this right, you see in my hands even

1555
01:34:45,200 --> 01:34:49,880
Speaker 1: moving side to side like you know, then I in

1556
01:34:49,880 --> 01:34:53,920
Speaker 1: in in that is like that's the thing I like,

1557
01:34:54,920 --> 01:34:57,080
Speaker 1: That's the thing I like that I think about and

1558
01:34:57,160 --> 01:34:59,479
Speaker 1: strive towards and like and just try to keep in

1559
01:34:59,520 --> 01:35:02,439
Speaker 1: mind as a hiding thing, like just being aware of

1560
01:35:02,479 --> 01:35:06,679
Speaker 1: all these things and and and enjoying the movement rather

1561
01:35:06,720 --> 01:35:11,400
Speaker 1: than you know, our father hated movement, like he hated

1562
01:35:11,439 --> 01:35:14,960
Speaker 1: if you thought, Like if you thought something that these

1563
01:35:16,040 --> 01:35:18,720
Speaker 1: you didn't like it that you like your Yeah, I

1564
01:35:18,800 --> 01:35:21,800
Speaker 1: like your what you're saying, Like all your beliefs are

1565
01:35:21,840 --> 01:35:26,840
Speaker 1: at least somewhat contingent, but you believe in them real

1566
01:35:26,960 --> 01:35:34,120
Speaker 1: hard somewhat quite a bit. Yeah, maybe we have. And

1567
01:35:34,200 --> 01:35:37,679
Speaker 1: it was thought I can't add to I can't add

1568
01:35:37,720 --> 01:35:42,439
Speaker 1: to you know what. I feel like that was sufficient thought.

1569
01:35:43,080 --> 01:35:47,320
Speaker 1: So what would you say to someone specifically a woman

1570
01:35:48,160 --> 01:35:51,840
Speaker 1: there was a hunter before and still is, but has

1571
01:35:51,880 --> 01:35:56,640
Speaker 1: a hard time hunting after giving birth because of the

1572
01:35:56,640 --> 01:36:00,000
Speaker 1: beauty of life. Yes, I wouldn't urge you to go hunt.

1573
01:36:02,000 --> 01:36:03,800
Speaker 1: I remember what. I think. That's something I think that

1574
01:36:03,920 --> 01:36:07,200
Speaker 1: some like things that happened to people are like pretty

1575
01:36:07,320 --> 01:36:11,160
Speaker 1: like I don't probably legitimate. Yeah, I think it's a

1576
01:36:11,160 --> 01:36:14,000
Speaker 1: great question. I don't think anybody that should doesn't want

1577
01:36:14,000 --> 01:36:15,680
Speaker 1: to go home and should go home. It's not that

1578
01:36:15,840 --> 01:36:18,760
Speaker 1: I don't want to, I think, and I tell my

1579
01:36:18,840 --> 01:36:21,400
Speaker 1: husband this, it's like, once you've given life, it's harder

1580
01:36:21,439 --> 01:36:27,120
Speaker 1: to take a life, which sounds ridiculous, but no, I

1581
01:36:27,120 --> 01:36:30,760
Speaker 1: think I've heard this from other women before. You just

1582
01:36:30,840 --> 01:36:33,320
Speaker 1: watch the whole process play out, and it gives it

1583
01:36:33,360 --> 01:36:36,559
Speaker 1: like a level of saying. And it's not anti hunting,

1584
01:36:36,600 --> 01:36:40,360
Speaker 1: because we live off the meat and we process it ourselves,

1585
01:36:40,840 --> 01:36:43,040
Speaker 1: and so it's not anti hunting at all. But it's

1586
01:36:43,080 --> 01:36:46,160
Speaker 1: almost harder for me to be able to go hunting

1587
01:36:46,200 --> 01:36:57,759
Speaker 1: now after giving birth to a human beat no objections.

1588
01:36:59,479 --> 01:37:04,160
Speaker 1: Continue to support public lands. Be patient, um beat in

1589
01:37:04,280 --> 01:37:06,439
Speaker 1: tune to the idea that you might shift on that,

1590
01:37:06,600 --> 01:37:11,880
Speaker 1: but then remain steadfast and uh focus, all right. Thanks

1591
01:37:11,920 --> 01:37:12,559
Speaker 1: for joining us,