Speaker 1: Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the
Speaker 1: Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan Runts Hog,
Speaker 1: but that's enough about me. My guest today is a
Speaker 1: man of many talents. He's a gifted photographer, filmmaker, and
Speaker 1: author who has raised millions for global charitable causes through
Speaker 1: his White Feather Foundation. He's a man on the move,
Speaker 1: but musical talent, you could says in his blood. His
Speaker 1: platinum selling solo debut is a lot reached the upper
Speaker 1: echelons of the charts across the globe on the strength
Speaker 1: of melodic maister works like too Late for Goodbyes, Say
Speaker 1: You're Wrong, and of course the title track. A string
Speaker 1: of well loved albums were to follow, with Help Yourself
Speaker 1: being a personal favorite, and now he's gearing up to
Speaker 1: release his first new record in more than a decade.
Speaker 1: The album in question is called Jude, named for the
Speaker 1: Beatles classic he inspired as a young boy over half
Speaker 1: a century ago. It helps mark a season of reflection
Speaker 1: for the artist, whose relationship with his familiar legacy hasn't
Speaker 1: always been easy. Earlier this year, he staged the fundraiser
Speaker 1: auctioning n f T s based on memorabilia from his
Speaker 1: personal collection heirlooms to him a musical history for the
Speaker 1: rest of us. Days ago, he stunned fans by performing
Speaker 1: his father's song Imagining publicly for the very first time.
Speaker 1: It was part of the Global Citizens Stand Up for
Speaker 1: Ukraine's social media rally campaign, which has already raised ten
Speaker 1: point one billion euros for Ukrainian aid. Though reluctant to
Speaker 1: sing the song for years, the performance proved to be
Speaker 1: a Catharsis forum and a delight for the rest of
Speaker 1: us to say. He's reconciled with his past as a
Speaker 1: little too simplistic, but the joy and lightness of being
Speaker 1: as a parent on Jude, which is due out later
Speaker 1: this year. He announced the album with a stirring double
Speaker 1: a side single, Every Little Moment, backed with Freedom. Both
Speaker 1: are badly needed messages of hope and soulace, much in
Speaker 1: the spirit of Imagine fifty years ago. It's my pleasure
Speaker 1: and privilege to welcome Julian Lennon. I hope you enjoy
Speaker 1: our conversation a fraction as much as I do. Well.
Speaker 1: It is such such an honor to speak to you.
Speaker 1: I've been a fan of yours for for so many years,
Speaker 1: and you you have new music on the way, Jude,
Speaker 1: which I've been privileged to hear, and it is just incredible.
Speaker 1: Um you had the whole album, yes, and it is
Speaker 1: absolutely remarkable. And it sounds like this album has its
Speaker 1: roots back in in some tapes that date back to
Speaker 1: the vlat era. I think, how did this hold correct
Speaker 1: Jude project begin for you? The jew journey? You know, Listen,
Speaker 1: I never stopped doing music one way or another. I
Speaker 1: may leave it alone for a few months here and there,
Speaker 1: or even six months, you know, or even a year sometimes,
Speaker 1: but it's always there, you know. And a couple of
Speaker 1: years ago, um, I was changing business management, and I
Speaker 1: found that they had boxes, literally boxes in their basement
Speaker 1: of all my earlier stuff, I mean real too reels
Speaker 1: of too Late for Goodbyes, a lot, and um all
Speaker 1: the other demos that we put back together in those days.
Speaker 1: I think we were using an old Fostex six track
Speaker 1: or something like that four track I don't even know anymore. Um.
Speaker 1: And then I also found a bunch of cassettes, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean, okay, let's say not a bunch of hundreds
Speaker 1: of cassettes, and that that tapes and the elysis twelve
Speaker 1: track tapes and just a whole bunch of stuff, and
Speaker 1: I thought, oh, and they were They've been left just
Speaker 1: in an open dust in the basement, you know, out
Speaker 1: of boxes. This is why, this is why I'm changing
Speaker 1: business management right bringing there, So I m and I
Speaker 1: was praying that they were, that they were going to
Speaker 1: be okay, sent them off to you know, I found
Speaker 1: that what whichever the top digital transfer company was, they
Speaker 1: baked the tapes and then they transfer all of them,
Speaker 1: uh you know into downloadable or c d s or whatever.
Speaker 1: And fortunately all the stuff in there was was still
Speaker 1: listenable and or usable as well. So, um, you know,
Speaker 1: I've I've found a lot of stuff in there that
Speaker 1: I'm still catalogic, you know, that potential thing, you know,
Speaker 1: good ideas, uh co write ideas this that you know.
Speaker 1: But I came across a few of from thirty years
Speaker 1: ago that when I used to live here in l A,
Speaker 1: when I used to have a little home studio and
Speaker 1: my garage and and even in my little guest bedroom
Speaker 1: at that time, and uh, there were some tracks there
Speaker 1: that I'd always loved, but they never sat right with
Speaker 1: what I was doing at that particular point in time.
Speaker 1: They were kind of I won't say there were one off.
Speaker 1: They were just different grooves and different headspace and they
Speaker 1: just didn't sit with anything I was doing over the
Speaker 1: last thirty years. Um. And so as it was time
Speaker 1: to well, not time, but I was, I was. I
Speaker 1: was planning on, uh, releasing a few things, you know,
Speaker 1: singles and EPs. Maybe that was about it wasn't really
Speaker 1: planning on an album. And uh so I with my
Speaker 1: old my old, oldest best friend in the world, Justin Clayton,
Speaker 1: who co wrote with me on many of the albums
Speaker 1: and went on world tours with me. Um, he'd taken
Speaker 1: an engineering course, so we started going through all this
Speaker 1: stuff and it was a lot easier for him to
Speaker 1: catalog this stuff than for me. You know, I'd be there,
Speaker 1: but he'd be doing all the text stuff. And we
Speaker 1: realized that some of those songs, like every Little Moment
Speaker 1: and not one Night in particular, were you know and
Speaker 1: love Don't Let Me Down. Uh, you know, it was
Speaker 1: anywhere between thirty I mean a mix between thirty twenty
Speaker 1: and ten years of different work and in the process
Speaker 1: of let's say upgrading it, upgrading, the updating the production
Speaker 1: on the tracks, you know, putting new drums with great
Speaker 1: drummers on, you know, new keyboards here and there predominantly
Speaker 1: the track within great nick Um like Every Little moment
Speaker 1: the verse vocals are from thirty plus years ago. Uh,
Speaker 1: same with not One Night, and except the new vogue,
Speaker 1: new new vocals which were done about five years ago
Speaker 1: were on the choruses of every Little moment Um. And
Speaker 1: so I started doing a you know, updating a bunch
Speaker 1: of old stuff. But in the process I started playing
Speaker 1: around with new ideas. And what really took a left
Speaker 1: turn with this why us that when COVID hit, Justin
Speaker 1: had to go back to England where he lives. And
Speaker 1: so we were in the middle of doing stuff and
Speaker 1: you know, I think we've finished about five tracks, um
Speaker 1: not mixed, but had ruff mixes. Justin goes back and
Speaker 1: now I'm confronted with the idea that if I want
Speaker 1: to get anything done, I'm probably going to have to
Speaker 1: engineer it myself and do it myself. Um. You know,
Speaker 1: we do a bit of the zoom you know, and
Speaker 1: the audio movers, which is so we can play music
Speaker 1: in real time and stuff and hear each other work.
Speaker 1: But I took on that I started Freedom in fact,
Speaker 1: was the first song that I started to engineer and
Speaker 1: produce myself, just on my own in lockdown. They wondering
Speaker 1: if I can even do it? Yeah, and Freedom came
Speaker 1: out and it had such well I should I say Freedom?
Speaker 1: I I finished Freedom, and I just of the vibe
Speaker 1: that came out of this learning process again of trying
Speaker 1: to create music without really knowing what I was doing,
Speaker 1: and just engineering my way backwards really into figuring what
Speaker 1: to do, and I think out of doing all of
Speaker 1: these older songs and new songs in roughly the same
Speaker 1: time period over the last three or four years. You know,
Speaker 1: there was some semblance of connection there sonically because it's me,
Speaker 1: but it was really Spike uh Stent that the mixer
Speaker 1: that you know, once I had the framework of the
Speaker 1: album and the list and the tyle, passing it on
Speaker 1: to him one track at a time literally over the
Speaker 1: course of a year, which was to mix it was
Speaker 1: was was you know, an effort in a struggle and
Speaker 1: and and difficult. But what I think he brought to
Speaker 1: the table because he has such a specific style too,
Speaker 1: was for me, if I thought I got the best
Speaker 1: out of the rough mixes, you know, and I thought
Speaker 1: there were nine or ten in my my in my
Speaker 1: humble opinion, I think uh, Spike took it up to
Speaker 1: you know, I call what he did a Nigel. He
Speaker 1: turned it up to number A Liven literally. So so
Speaker 1: there's there's a there's a a soundscape that's now built
Speaker 1: because of the way he's taken what we did justin
Speaker 1: I did in the in the in the production, and
Speaker 1: he's just made it. There's not wall of sand, but
Speaker 1: certainly there's a feel and a flow sonically throughout the
Speaker 1: whole thing, even though there's quite a few different song
Speaker 1: types really you know, I mean there really are. It's
Speaker 1: not like the same theme all the way through, but
Speaker 1: again sonically and because it's me doing it, it's a
Speaker 1: there is a connection all the way through. And because
Speaker 1: of the way the order in which the songs were placed.
Speaker 1: Because for me, if you're going to do an album album,
Speaker 1: uh you know, the idea that we're going to do
Speaker 1: vinyl on this, then that then you have to have,
Speaker 1: you know, because the true listeners will play the tracks
Speaker 1: all the way through the way they're meant to be.
Speaker 1: And I you know, I'd like to follow Adele and
Speaker 1: in what she did that. If you're going to listen
Speaker 1: to this album, you're listening to it in this particular order.
Speaker 1: And I think that's correct as an artist, you know,
Speaker 1: to be able to say, please listen to it the
Speaker 1: way it's meant to meant to be. You know, it's
Speaker 1: sequenced for a reason. You know, we're not just splashing
Speaker 1: paint at the war here. There's this specifics involved here,
Speaker 1: you know, in in your emotional journey that you're tasting.
Speaker 1: I completely agree. I mean, songs hit you in a
Speaker 1: different way depending on how you're feeling, and the music
Speaker 1: of the prior track will completely influence that on the
Speaker 1: um on the release for this record, you've you've called
Speaker 1: it a coming of age album and hearing you talk
Speaker 1: about sort of the learning of of how to to
Speaker 1: engineer on a song like Freedom Again, was that sort
Speaker 1: of something like that that factor into Was that sort
Speaker 1: of why it feels more of a of a coming
Speaker 1: of age? Not really, to be honest with you, it
Speaker 1: was more about, you know, the whole lockdown thing was
Speaker 1: very very heavy. You know, I was I was in
Speaker 1: the South Trench in Monica. It was you know, you
Speaker 1: couldn't leave the house without written paperwork, saying for you
Speaker 1: know that what you're going out for, you were only
Speaker 1: allowed out for one hour, whether that's walking, you know,
Speaker 1: getting some kind of exercise or going to the nearest
Speaker 1: grocery store, and uh, you were only allowed out within
Speaker 1: one kilometer. So it was it was heavy, you know.
Speaker 1: The first I loved it because no cars, no noise,
Speaker 1: but wind in the trees, peace and quiet. It was
Speaker 1: glorious at first. I really, you know, everybody was panicking
Speaker 1: a little. I don't know, it's quite nice and to
Speaker 1: be to be honest with you, I hadn't stayed home
Speaker 1: for more than a few months at a time anyway,
Speaker 1: because they're all was working, traveling, whether it's phot dog
Speaker 1: feed documentaries or whatever, children's consent. You know, the list
Speaker 1: goes on. But this this was very much a moment
Speaker 1: of reflection. You know, a lot of the songs. You know,
Speaker 1: although I'm i'm i'm I'm putting it out there as
Speaker 1: an idea to people as listeners, but you know, it's
Speaker 1: looking in the mirror. Really, I mean, in all honesty,
Speaker 1: it's therapy. It's looking in the mirror. It's asking me
Speaker 1: all those questions that you're hearing about. I mean, that's
Speaker 1: really what this is about. You know. I I always
Speaker 1: write about things that I know or I'm dealing that
Speaker 1: I'm going through. Um, you know, and as I've said
Speaker 1: regarding even every little moment, this is about the internal
Speaker 1: struggles of war that we have with ourselves more than
Speaker 1: anything else. Yes, it reflects upon the world and what
Speaker 1: we have to deal with on the outside, the wars
Speaker 1: that we deal with, But it's mostly about, you know,
Speaker 1: if you can fix this first, you know, as they
Speaker 1: always say, you know, you know, if you can fix
Speaker 1: yourself first, if you can love yourself first, then you'll
Speaker 1: be able to love the rest of the world. So
Speaker 1: that is where the basis from all this comes from.
Speaker 1: It's just going through that journey on different slightly different
Speaker 1: musical styles. But you know, so yeah, that's you know,
Speaker 1: That's what I can say really about it in that
Speaker 1: regard that, and also I guess the other thing in
Speaker 1: regards to calling it Jude was that, yeah, it's coming
Speaker 1: of age. In regards to Dad the Beetle's that song, um,
Speaker 1: you know number one, especially with imagine as we might
Speaker 1: talk about. You know, I was fearful. I never said
Speaker 1: I would never sing it. I just said you know,
Speaker 1: it'll be one day when the time is right and
Speaker 1: it's appropriate. Um. And so you know a week ago
Speaker 1: when I said, yes, okay, now is the time, I thought, oh, b'ga,
Speaker 1: how am I going to do this? Yeah, because I
Speaker 1: literally for thirty years been afraid for this moment, that
Speaker 1: moment to come. Yeah, because you know, listen, the media
Speaker 1: has been beating me up for the most part for
Speaker 1: you know, thirty years. Um, and I've just been slowly
Speaker 1: but surely. No, I'm not giving up screwed a lot
Speaker 1: of you. I'm doing I'm doing it this way. This
Speaker 1: is why I Also, I delved into so many other
Speaker 1: creative fields because also I wanted a platform of work
Speaker 1: that I knew I was capable of. And you know,
Speaker 1: fortunately I've been very I've had a very lucky run
Speaker 1: with the children's books New York Times best seller Would
Speaker 1: Kiss the Ground, the documentary that was Borderline up for
Speaker 1: an Oscar. But I mean we were close, um, um,
Speaker 1: you know, and just the White Feather foundational of the
Speaker 1: work that we do on that front. Um. But it
Speaker 1: was about addressing the song you know, hey Jude, um
Speaker 1: and listening to the words and sort of coming to
Speaker 1: terms with the words and and finally being finding my place,
Speaker 1: especially after doing imagine, at some kind of place of
Speaker 1: peace in my life, i e. Not Being anxious about
Speaker 1: being me anymore, not being anxious or afraid being me anymore,
Speaker 1: coming to terms with being who I am, and being
Speaker 1: who I am on so many levels is June. So
Speaker 1: I figured here and now this is it. I'm chucking
Speaker 1: it all in in a good way, not throwing it away,
Speaker 1: chucking it in and you know, keeping my fingers across
Speaker 1: and or I mean, I've got to say the last
Speaker 1: week ten days has been mind blowing for me because
Speaker 1: I've never had such positive across the board response, not
Speaker 1: only to my dad's so I imagine, but but even
Speaker 1: for the two news songs that have just come out,
Speaker 1: and and uh, you know, we'll continue to throw things
Speaker 1: out there for for for you know, the next few months,
Speaker 1: and then of course kind of autumn time ish will
Speaker 1: be you know, getting the album out there, especially in
Speaker 1: final so you know, it's all good, you know. I
Speaker 1: feel I feel, probably for the first time ever, that
Speaker 1: I can walk around with not being afraid and with
Speaker 1: my head held high, you know, because I've always been
Speaker 1: people have always been kind of weird with me in
Speaker 1: the past, that either staring at you across the room
Speaker 1: or you know, if you go into a particular like
Speaker 1: on the road in the older days, we stopped at
Speaker 1: a diner and you know, they just put Beatles songs
Speaker 1: on to see if I reacted, to see if it
Speaker 1: was me. That's terrible. Really, really, that's what you've got,
Speaker 1: you know, that's all you've got, said, I used to
Speaker 1: I used to have to deal with that crap all
Speaker 1: the frigging time, so it was so frustrating. But really,
Speaker 1: just can't you just come up and say, hey, you Julian,
Speaker 1: you know, and it's you know. So anyway, I'm over
Speaker 1: all of that now. I think I've laid my foundation
Speaker 1: on many levels of what I do and I'm proud
Speaker 1: to big doing everything that I'm doing now. So it's
Speaker 1: a different it's a different world, you know, I'm feeling
Speaker 1: I'm like, maybe just a little bit of an adult
Speaker 1: I am. I'm so happy to hear you say that,
Speaker 1: and no, no, but just to hear that that that
Speaker 1: you feel that happiness and you know I was it. Um.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's interesting for me to hear to hear
Speaker 1: that you say you were nervous to do that song because,
Speaker 1: as as a fan of both yours and your father's,
Speaker 1: I think all that we just wanted to to was
Speaker 1: it cathartic for you? I suppose is the question? Massively? Massively?
Speaker 1: I mean, this is why I can walk partly half
Speaker 1: the reason why I can walk around with my headheld high.
Speaker 1: Because you know, again, when I said yes, I thought,
Speaker 1: how the brig am I going to do this? How
Speaker 1: am I going to do it? Where it makes sense
Speaker 1: to me, where it's real to me, it's honest and
Speaker 1: truthful from my perspective. Honor him, but do it. I
Speaker 1: have to find my own way. And the first thing
Speaker 1: I thought at the moment I said yes, I said,
Speaker 1: I can't do it on piano. Piano gives it a
Speaker 1: certain style of rhythm. It's, you know, a bit of
Speaker 1: a honky donk plunky donk. And I mean, don't get
Speaker 1: me wrong, it's still an incredible, beautiful song in the
Speaker 1: way it was the original, of course, but I needed
Speaker 1: to find a different way. Um and I immediately just thought, okay,
Speaker 1: acoustic guitar. Acoustic guitar that changes the field could give
Speaker 1: it not a swing, but a little more looser than
Speaker 1: the original. And I thought, well, okay, who do I know.
Speaker 1: That's a great guitarist that I can reach out to
Speaker 1: tomorrow for today. Uh and it's free on Tuesday, um
Speaker 1: and um and has a studio and of course no
Speaker 1: bet fot Night had done Karma Police for another charitable
Speaker 1: thing when we were in lockdown, you know, so we
Speaker 1: did the whole video, uh, you know, a continents apart,
Speaker 1: but it worked together, and we worked very well together.
Speaker 1: So I got in touch with him, said no, no,
Speaker 1: imagine Tuesday acoustic guitar. So he said, yeah, great. He
Speaker 1: just flown in. He'd been in the Azores in Portugal,
Speaker 1: which is where he's from. And and so I turned
Speaker 1: up in his house and he hadn't even played the
Speaker 1: song through yet, and so I went, you haven't haven't
Speaker 1: rehearsed it? He said no, you know, I figured we'd
Speaker 1: just do it, you know, ok, let's do it now
Speaker 1: because I got to figure out if it's works or not.
Speaker 1: And anyway, we literally sang it, literally sang it through
Speaker 1: maybe twice, just sitting on the terrace outside, and went, okay,
Speaker 1: like that field, let's just do it. And so we
Speaker 1: go in this little studio. I mean, it's a tiny, little,
Speaker 1: you know studio, and he laid down just one rough
Speaker 1: of the guitar and I came in sang it about
Speaker 1: four times, just picked the best nuances and the most
Speaker 1: honest approach um. And you know, the idea was to
Speaker 1: sing it as as as raw as possible, as as
Speaker 1: true to Dad's version as possible, but with my own nuances.
Speaker 1: My I said, I tend to sit back when I
Speaker 1: sing rather than being on the beat, so I'm not
Speaker 1: a little more loose. I'm not sure if that's the
Speaker 1: right word, but and so you know, and once we've
Speaker 1: done that, I just went, okay, that feels okay, it
Speaker 1: feels right. There are imperfections, without questions, but but leieve
Speaker 1: that because it's real, and I don't want that. This
Speaker 1: cannot be a produced thing, you know, it just has
Speaker 1: to be raw me. No, no, thank you very much.
Speaker 1: And then I booked a studio the next day for
Speaker 1: the idea of a video because we needed one. And
Speaker 1: we go to the studio and there's a great d
Speaker 1: op thor who knew brought him with this company, Atlantis,
Speaker 1: and I just said, I was looking for high contrast,
Speaker 1: you know, different dark light, and the manager of the
Speaker 1: studio said, we we we've got some candles. He comes
Speaker 1: out with like fifty candles, you know, fake. I said,
Speaker 1: can't we get some real ones? So we get the
Speaker 1: real you know, I said, no, you'll burn the place down, okay,
Speaker 1: and understood, I won't burn the place down, but I
Speaker 1: know what you're saying. So so I where the studio is,
Speaker 1: Capital Studios. It's Hollywood, you know, I said, listen, there's
Speaker 1: got to be some shops around here to have the flickering,
Speaker 1: you know, fake candles too. So I sent my poor manager,
Speaker 1: Rebecca out walking the streets, not in that manner of course,
Speaker 1: looking for flickering candles, and she came back with about
Speaker 1: another fifty. So, uh, you know, we just laid them down,
Speaker 1: turn the lights out, and then I thought that we'd
Speaker 1: have something placed around us for a bit more. Luck
Speaker 1: just used the light of the candle. That was it
Speaker 1: the whole thing, um. And luckily with the Capital Studios,
Speaker 1: they had about, you know, thirty mic stands which we
Speaker 1: take the candles onto around the room. But at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, I mean I think we did
Speaker 1: again two or four takes and just cut it together
Speaker 1: and that was it and when we all saw it,
Speaker 1: but you know, the finished thing, we just went that
Speaker 1: you couldn't be more honest or all with the production
Speaker 1: than the way we did it. You know. Anyway, again, Uh,
Speaker 1: the response has just been uh jaw dropping, I mean
Speaker 1: truly jaw dropping, so much so that you know, we
Speaker 1: have to release it as a single, you know, I
Speaker 1: mean talk about timing here. I'm trying to release the
Speaker 1: news new music and this thing is getting in the way.
Speaker 1: Only joking, but we have to release it as a
Speaker 1: single soon. We're just putting all the pieces together to
Speaker 1: make it work because you know, I mean with everything
Speaker 1: going to uh stand up for Ukraine and other refugees
Speaker 1: around the world, so that that's the idea that we
Speaker 1: throw it out there, all the money goes to that
Speaker 1: A S A p M. Because it would be stupid,
Speaker 1: not too so. Not that that's competing with the other work,
Speaker 1: with the other new work. In fact, I think they're
Speaker 1: embracing each other. And that's the kind of feeling and
Speaker 1: response I'm getting, uh, you know from the I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm looking at all social platforms and just read through
Speaker 1: and I'm like, wow, Okay, this is great. This is great.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't think I've been so widely accepted ever,
Speaker 1: So I'm happy with that for a change. And the
Speaker 1: great thing is, you know, if I've gone out, you know,
Speaker 1: out and about, you know, I thought, okay, it might
Speaker 1: be weird and might get botton again. I'm going to
Speaker 1: keep the mask on to go shopping in some places
Speaker 1: I do. But funnily enough, people, anybody that has running
Speaker 1: to me is just said, love the new stuff, love
Speaker 1: the magic. I'm going that's great, thank you on one's
Speaker 1: and upwards. That's what I said. So it's been you know,
Speaker 1: it's been magical. I've said it's been magical, probably for
Speaker 1: the first time I ever like that, so well deserved.
Speaker 1: It's a it's a beautiful thing you're doing, and it's
Speaker 1: a beautiful version of your dad's song and beautiful new music.
Speaker 1: I mean, I just the new record is just so astonishing.
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you mean you mentioned this earlier
Speaker 1: that you know, you're obviously an incredibly accomplished photographer and filmmaker,
Speaker 1: both art forms that require a gift for observation. I
Speaker 1: was wondering if the same applied to uh to your songwriting.
Speaker 1: Do you get more inspiration from looking outward or looking inward,
Speaker 1: but both listen. Predominantly the stuff is written about my experiences,
Speaker 1: what I've gone through, what I'm going through. But it's
Speaker 1: of course observation of friends and other people that I
Speaker 1: see what they're doing and what they're dealing with and
Speaker 1: what they're going through. Um, you know, so it was
Speaker 1: both ways. I don't overthink it, you know, just if
Speaker 1: something comes to mind, I'll just run with it and
Speaker 1: try and make it work as a piece, as a poem,
Speaker 1: as a song, as a you know, uh uh for
Speaker 1: me again, for me, it has to mean something. It's
Speaker 1: and also with most things I do, you know, I
Speaker 1: look at it like cooking because I'm a closet chere
Speaker 1: uh and ye know, it's about adding the right ingredients
Speaker 1: for me, at least for a song. Um yeah, whatever
Speaker 1: you're saying lyrically has to have to the sound and
Speaker 1: motion of the track has to The melody has to
Speaker 1: send that same message. The song has the same the
Speaker 1: same message. The music has to say the same message,
Speaker 1: so that if you played the melody or the lyrics
Speaker 1: or the song independently, they would all give you the
Speaker 1: same feeling. And when all those three or whatever amount development.
Speaker 1: When all of that comes together, that's when I get
Speaker 1: goose sponsed to go, oh yes, that feels okay. If
Speaker 1: I feel that somebody else has got to feel that,
Speaker 1: come on please, So that's you know, that's where it's at.
Speaker 1: That's how I how I do think. Is there for you?
Speaker 1: You're gonna hang up on me for asking this question?
Speaker 1: Is there an element of superstition involved for you? Is
Speaker 1: there a time of day that you feel is your
Speaker 1: your your time to write, or a special instrument that
Speaker 1: you feel is I don't want to call it a
Speaker 1: lucky instrument, but is there is there some sort of
Speaker 1: supernatural element to songwriting for you? Um? With everything I
Speaker 1: do again, has it has? Number one? It has to
Speaker 1: be organic. Can't be it pushed issue creatively, can't do it,
Speaker 1: don't want to do it. Didn't that if I if
Speaker 1: I try to do that, it doesn't feel real to me.
Speaker 1: Uh so yeah, That's why I say that I can
Speaker 1: go without, you know, writing and recording for months, you know,
Speaker 1: just if it doesn't if it's not doing something for me.
Speaker 1: And that's why that's why I'm happy I've found so
Speaker 1: many other outlets Because if that's not working for me.
Speaker 1: Now I'm going to go and do that. Um, I
Speaker 1: need to find one outlet that just says, lie on
Speaker 1: the beach, say for for a month, don't do anything,
Speaker 1: give yourself a bloody rest, will you. That's what I need.
Speaker 1: That outlet like on a plane to an island. That's
Speaker 1: what I did with no no stress. At some point
Speaker 1: I'll get there soon. Would you actually enjoy that? Or
Speaker 1: would you get there and think, okay, all right, I
Speaker 1: need to I need to work on a book now,
Speaker 1: or I need to work in a film or something,
Speaker 1: you know. Funnily enough, it's like what I what I
Speaker 1: do love to do is either get on a motorbike
Speaker 1: because I'm a biker, have always been since my teens.
Speaker 1: Either that or a convertible weather permitting, of course. Uh.
Speaker 1: And I love going for drives, you know. Uh. My
Speaker 1: thing wherever I go for for the first time, you know,
Speaker 1: I look at him at once and then throw it
Speaker 1: away and then discover where I am and I'll just drive.
Speaker 1: I'll take a camera with me. It's like a few
Speaker 1: years ago when I was here and I had an
Speaker 1: afternoon enough and I kept hearing about the Sultan Sea.
Speaker 1: So I just went. I just went for the afternoon,
Speaker 1: drove there, fell in love with it, had my camera
Speaker 1: with me. Now I've got a whole collection of Sultan
Speaker 1: Tea images that I absolutely adore. Almost run out of
Speaker 1: petrol in the mini in the middle of blackness and
Speaker 1: was worried that I was going to be taken in
Speaker 1: the back somewhere whatever that means. But you know, fortunately
Speaker 1: I found a guest station. Or I've been running on
Speaker 1: empty for a long time. So I like risks and
Speaker 1: challenge sometimes, you know, I don't. I like again, I
Speaker 1: like things happening organically. If it's if it's scheduled or
Speaker 1: it's planned, I'm not really interested, you know. In fact,
Speaker 1: I get anxious from planned an organized things. Really truly,
Speaker 1: It's like waking up in the morning. If I if
Speaker 1: I can't wake up naturally, you're going to get me
Speaker 1: in a funny mood all day, no alarms. Oh, I agree,
Speaker 1: if only, if only? But yeah, you know, that's that's
Speaker 1: the dream when I'm on when I'm on my own
Speaker 1: working schedule, is wake up when you wake up naturally,
Speaker 1: and okay, let's go. You know, I I'm not sure
Speaker 1: I might be reading more into this than you intended.
Speaker 1: But I loved the opening track save Me, especially of Jude,
Speaker 1: and I thought it was an interesting sentiment given your
Speaker 1: your previous song and album Help Yourself. I wasn't sure
Speaker 1: quite how much they were in conversation with each other,
Speaker 1: or if there was any connection. It's all in conversation
Speaker 1: with each other. I believe you me Um uh yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean again, it's it's all. It's all about looking
Speaker 1: in the mirror and questioning yourself and trying to figure out,
Speaker 1: how do you balance this weird life, this weird existence,
Speaker 1: this weird world. How do you make it work? Where
Speaker 1: you're not? You don't wake up fearful and full of
Speaker 1: anxiety every morning, which is something I've lived with for
Speaker 1: a long time. There was a few years back before
Speaker 1: COVID that I woke up with pure just fear in
Speaker 1: my heart for the day and anxiety just you know,
Speaker 1: just what what's going to be thrown at me today. Um.
Speaker 1: But all of the questions that I've presented to myself,
Speaker 1: I think I've I've found a pathway through that. I
Speaker 1: can't say specifically what those things are, but a lot
Speaker 1: of it comes down to and there won't say specific meditation.
Speaker 1: But it's about it's about taking a minute out to breathe,
Speaker 1: you know, to really just say, shut it all out,
Speaker 1: somewhere nice and quiet and just free focus on the
Speaker 1: moment and that it will go and think about the
Speaker 1: things that are really important and that really matter. And
Speaker 1: when you do that, you realize that the rest really
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. I mean, it does, but not in the
Speaker 1: way that it should affect you, you know that. Uh.
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously we were aware of the world around
Speaker 1: us and the problems we face, and the fact that
Speaker 1: it seems that for thousands of years we haven't learned anything,
Speaker 1: which that which is staggering, especially now when we have
Speaker 1: more available means of communication and learning, and we're still
Speaker 1: bloody idiots. You know, it's unbelievable. It's mind boggling, you know.
Speaker 1: Uh yeah, I'll leave that one at that one. How
Speaker 1: do you quiet your mind though, for those times of
Speaker 1: the day when you're when you're taking a moment to breathe,
Speaker 1: because I'm I know I struggle with that, and I'm
Speaker 1: sure so many other people do as well. But the
Speaker 1: moment that they should be taking to to take and
Speaker 1: have a breath, I think, oh well, I could take
Speaker 1: this moment to actually do all the things that are
Speaker 1: stressing me out. And how do you quiet those thoughts
Speaker 1: and actually have that moment be something that replenishes you.
Speaker 1: Sometimes it's very difficult, you know. I mean one of
Speaker 1: my results was again as I said, getting in the
Speaker 1: car and going for a drive, putting some music on,
Speaker 1: looking at some different scenery. Um, that ninety of the
Speaker 1: time works. But there are some times that it just
Speaker 1: that anxiety of that fear just doesn't disappear. And I think, again,
Speaker 1: as you just mentioned, I think doing stuff, getting the
Speaker 1: list out of the way, whatever that says, whatever it
Speaker 1: means on a personal or working level or business level,
Speaker 1: or again looking in the mirror and just going okay, okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: talking sense into yourself sometimes you know. Um, but I think, yeah,
Speaker 1: I you know, I think it's not This is why
Speaker 1: I'm such a doer, is because because if I don't
Speaker 1: get things done, you know they're on the list, then
Speaker 1: it stresses me out. You know, it just does. It's
Speaker 1: an accumulative thing that can build to horrific levels. But
Speaker 1: you know, this is why I like to call Monday
Speaker 1: second Sunday. I'm taking that that's good because no question
Speaker 1: about it. Even if I tell everybody to leave me alone,
Speaker 1: somebody will be touched with me about work over the weekend.
Speaker 1: And so funnily enough, I try as much as I
Speaker 1: can to block out Monday so that it becomes it
Speaker 1: really becomes you know, the world's open and doing stuff,
Speaker 1: but I have time to breathe and do things, and
Speaker 1: then Tuesday come into it full time. And you know,
Speaker 1: isn't there this whole new thing. At least the Japanese
Speaker 1: have been doing it for a long time, you know,
Speaker 1: And a lot of companies are considering this is making
Speaker 1: it a three four day work week, because not only
Speaker 1: does this allow you a greater amount of rest of
Speaker 1: breathing and time with your family, living, et cetera. But
Speaker 1: you know it it distresses people because you know, we've
Speaker 1: a weekend is a spec in the in the moment
Speaker 1: of time, and all we do is we're working. We're
Speaker 1: just bloody working non stuff. And then you you know,
Speaker 1: you're you're supposed to retire it whatever, age sixty six,
Speaker 1: and then you've got, you know, a few years left
Speaker 1: to enjoy what you know, you're falling down. You you
Speaker 1: can't see anything or hear anything anymore. What's that about? No,
Speaker 1: So you know, and also they've they've proved that work
Speaker 1: efficiency is through the roof when people have more time
Speaker 1: with their friends and family and have moments to enjoy life. So,
Speaker 1: you know, people and then you're determined that you have
Speaker 1: this time period, which just go for it. And I'm
Speaker 1: kind of borderline that, you know. So, um, it works.
Speaker 1: It's working for me, that's for sure. You know. Uh.
Speaker 1: Obviously there are schedules sometimes that you can't change, but
Speaker 1: for the most part, you know, I can get my
Speaker 1: second Sunday. I'm going for it. You know, this either
Speaker 1: feels like a very appropriate or very inappropriate segue. But
Speaker 1: but do you have plans to do? You have plans
Speaker 1: to to toward you? Um? Are you listening? Thought about
Speaker 1: it for years again, um. But the thing was that
Speaker 1: I again I said to myself anywhere I really got
Speaker 1: on the road again. I came up with an idea
Speaker 1: literally about twenty years ago. A friend of mine and I, UM,
Speaker 1: I wanted to do things differently, and so I thought,
Speaker 1: you know, we're also tied in with the White Feather Foundation,
Speaker 1: So I thought, okay, performing arts centers different cities around
Speaker 1: the world, I'm not one that likes to go out,
Speaker 1: you know, repeatedly and just doing that. I don't. I
Speaker 1: don't have that interest or drive. I'd rather be going
Speaker 1: to Africa and taking photographs, you know, and seeing new
Speaker 1: worlds and and meeting new cultures. So, you know, I
Speaker 1: think we will get around too, probably next year. There's
Speaker 1: a few things coming up this year that are like
Speaker 1: one off with charity with orchestras that that we're looking
Speaker 1: at right now. Um But I do like the idea
Speaker 1: of doing something in in in UH again in performing
Speaker 1: arts theaters with partial or full orchestra, you know, tied
Speaker 1: in with White Feather Foundation, UM, tied in the idea
Speaker 1: making that we raise the issues, the biggest issues of
Speaker 1: the problems in each of the location we've played and
Speaker 1: we do the idea is to involve local TV and
Speaker 1: radio competitions for the best artwork, the best photography, that
Speaker 1: and the other, and that the work UH that is
Speaker 1: sent in is judged and by a panel, and that
Speaker 1: in the foyer of the places and cities that we
Speaker 1: play is the best of the best of the local
Speaker 1: art scene, from photography, sculptures to you name it. So
Speaker 1: um so making the competition through radio, through TV, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera,
Speaker 1: to to involve all of the local community and make
Speaker 1: it you know, I think, rather than just hello, tor
Speaker 1: bus rolls in. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, that's that's
Speaker 1: my idea of doing something a bit more special, a
Speaker 1: bit more unique, and a bit more different and uh
Speaker 1: and doing good for the local community at the same time.
Speaker 1: A few years back, you had um an exhibit of
Speaker 1: your your i'll call umn your family heirlooms in Liverpool
Speaker 1: for the White Feather Foundation. Do you have any plans
Speaker 1: to do that in the States. I know there was
Speaker 1: some complecations there, I think, Well, I mean COVID was accomplicated. Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: that is also smaller. I you know, I collected a
Speaker 1: fair amount of memorabilious stuff over the last thirty years,
Speaker 1: predominantly uh Dad's stuff that was linked to me in
Speaker 1: a very personal way, and it was more about collecting.
Speaker 1: But I still plan to have a family one day
Speaker 1: and just haven't found the right loony to hang with
Speaker 1: just yet. Um. But she's out there somewhere. Um. But yeah, no,
Speaker 1: it was it was about you know, heritage and legacy
Speaker 1: and passing that on too. Hopefully my kids one day,
Speaker 1: whenever that happens. But I haven't given up hope. But anyway,
Speaker 1: so that was what it was all about. Original and
Speaker 1: then there was a few people's items that one. But
Speaker 1: that's an expensive world now, you know. Again, people think
Speaker 1: that I've had a lot of money from the get go,
Speaker 1: but I mean, I you know, when we were moms separating,
Speaker 1: you know, we've got a little something. But anyway, it
Speaker 1: doesn't cover the cost of a memorabilia, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: So uh yeah, I've got a good collection together. And
Speaker 1: we did tour it a little bit, as you said,
Speaker 1: in Liverpool, which was great, probably the best spot for
Speaker 1: it at that time ever really, and then a few
Speaker 1: other countries and and I had plans to bring it
Speaker 1: out here from museum, a couple of museums we were
Speaker 1: talking to um and then you know, COVID and a
Speaker 1: few other issues came into play as well. And I
Speaker 1: so this is why the whole n f T thing
Speaker 1: came out of it. I said, Okay, what's another way
Speaker 1: of sharing what I have. I can't I can't tour
Speaker 1: this stuff. And I hated being locked up in just
Speaker 1: a vault, in a bank vault somewhere, what's the point
Speaker 1: in having it, you know, So okay, this is another way,
Speaker 1: it's another artistic platform. You know, we're the proportion go
Speaker 1: to White Feather Foundation to that being the main thrust
Speaker 1: and crups behind this because then I can keep working
Speaker 1: on all the u because we only go through uh
Speaker 1: a White Feather We just don't. We survived through donations
Speaker 1: from the public, so we don't have any major sponsors
Speaker 1: this that ne other. It's the people out There's the
Speaker 1: fans out there that keep us alive and doing all
Speaker 1: the good work that we do. So um, yes, so
Speaker 1: the n f T thing came along. I think I'll
Speaker 1: probably do a couple of more tied in with with
Speaker 1: with some of the stuff I'm doing now. Who knows
Speaker 1: what else. You know, we're just talking, but you know,
Speaker 1: there are there's some great, great possibilities out then. Of
Speaker 1: course I welcome the idea of being able to to
Speaker 1: to tour that show, you know, in a couple of
Speaker 1: cities through the US and around the world. So you know,
Speaker 1: it's it's on a list. It's just had my hands full.
Speaker 1: So you know, well we'll get to it. We'll get
Speaker 1: to it. Oh, the n f t s were so interesting.
Speaker 1: You you have such an incredible collection. I loved that
Speaker 1: that Les Paul with the ruby glued to it and
Speaker 1: the plague. I mean, how cool is that that was?
Speaker 1: I mean I hadn't seen I hadn't seen that like
Speaker 1: twenty years because it was in a bloody voult, you know,
Speaker 1: just keeping safe. I didn't want to keep it at
Speaker 1: home because then who knows what can happen then? And
Speaker 1: but yeah, and I like the thing with the n
Speaker 1: F T s. I did want to make it different
Speaker 1: from anybody else. But thought, okay, well you can't just
Speaker 1: have a picture just spinning right. What they all was
Speaker 1: that I wouldn't want that. So I thought, okay, what
Speaker 1: would I want? Okay, how about it a bit? But
Speaker 1: the background story, right, you know, not only you know,
Speaker 1: just write a piece about what it means, where it
Speaker 1: came from, what the think is to me, and let
Speaker 1: me read it. And so that's where they took on
Speaker 1: a whole new platform for me and a whole new idea.
Speaker 1: Is making it far more interesting for me as far
Speaker 1: as NFPs go. There's having that one off vocal experience
Speaker 1: on each of the items. Um. But but also you know,
Speaker 1: tying in white feather in such a way that that
Speaker 1: as long as that was perpetually, you know, making money
Speaker 1: from sale or resale or whatever, white feather would survive,
Speaker 1: you know, which is partly what it's all about. This
Speaker 1: is an unfair question. But is there is there a
Speaker 1: favorite of yours in your in your collection of is
Speaker 1: there one piece that that means means the most too?
Speaker 1: Are just is your favorite for any other reason? I
Speaker 1: mean I loved all the guitars because I used to
Speaker 1: play them, yeah thirty years ago. Um uh, But I
Speaker 1: probably the afghan coat because it fits me. I want
Speaker 1: a picture of that maybe all right, we'll see about
Speaker 1: that one. I'll make a guess, children with clothes on underneath.
Speaker 1: So yeah, because there are you know, there are pictures
Speaker 1: of me sitting with dad, you know, with the afghan
Speaker 1: coat on the back of the chair, you know, from
Speaker 1: Magical Mystery Tour and you know all of that Stuffinitely
Speaker 1: are I think anywhere I'm the Wars. I'm not sure
Speaker 1: I think it did, but anyway, all that kind of Yeah,
Speaker 1: So that one's quite special because you see him wear
Speaker 1: it a lot throughout certain films and pictures over the
Speaker 1: period that time. Period I read. I don't know if
Speaker 1: this is true that, Um, your your picture of Lucy
Speaker 1: in the sky with diamonds is owned by Dave Gilmour.
Speaker 1: Is that is that true? Do you know where that's at?
Speaker 1: I don't know where that's at. Oh yeah, I know
Speaker 1: whether I know where that's up. Yeah. I asked him
Speaker 1: for it back, UM, to be honest with you. Uh yeah,
Speaker 1: And I've said this to Mom. I said, is it
Speaker 1: and she went, I don't think so. All right, okay,
Speaker 1: because I I don't remember specifically what that during was. Uh.
Speaker 1: I thought personally, I thought it was a different one
Speaker 1: another one. Um, all right, yeah, I was held. So
Speaker 1: I've no idea. We'll get a rock and rock and
Speaker 1: roll Indiana Jones going in on this case. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: good luck. I heard that that you seem poised to
Speaker 1: pursue a theater track and you would offer to offer
Speaker 1: a scholarship to uh Shakespeare Repertory Theater. When when did
Speaker 1: music overtake the urge to be in theater for you?
Speaker 1: And it was probably in the same h literally the
Speaker 1: same time, friend, because at the school that I used
Speaker 1: to go to in the world, which is twenty minutes
Speaker 1: away from Liverpool where I used to live with my
Speaker 1: mom and my grandmother. Um, at the end of each year,
Speaker 1: you do a performance. You know, there'd be a performance
Speaker 1: of some sort and one part of it was theater
Speaker 1: or or any artistic creativity that you kind of come
Speaker 1: up with. And so I my best friend, Justin Clayton
Speaker 1: again had been taking uh guitar lessons from our gym
Speaker 1: teacher who was a rock and roller still around Mr
Speaker 1: wind Uh and you had, you know, grease back d
Speaker 1: a head. You know, we're walking around school like that,
Speaker 1: and we're going and then on the break school breaks,
Speaker 1: you know, between lessons or if you have it, he
Speaker 1: would teach people, you know, rock and roll on on
Speaker 1: acoustic guitar. I mean, I mean, I have to admit
Speaker 1: half the Magic Dragon was the first song we learned.
Speaker 1: But but it did move quickly into you know, uh,
Speaker 1: actually a lot of Chuck Berry track, roll Over Beethove
Speaker 1: and and uh, well but let's go on uh and
Speaker 1: quite a few other rock and rollers. And so we
Speaker 1: got to a point where there was a few of
Speaker 1: us but we said let's and I think any I
Speaker 1: think we were thirteen or fourteen. It was the same
Speaker 1: time at the end of the year, I was in
Speaker 1: a place, one of the places, and we were also
Speaker 1: performing at the first time, for the first time ever,
Speaker 1: and so you know, I think I sang a couple
Speaker 1: of songs, justin sang a couple of songs. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: was a real rough rough Randy's little bands year old.
Speaker 1: But um, once you get that, like most musicians say that,
Speaker 1: that feedback, instantaneous feedback from the audience, you know, cheering
Speaker 1: and clapping and all that. After a three and a
Speaker 1: half minute song, you just go, why do anything else?
Speaker 1: So that was it? That was That was literally it,
Speaker 1: Why do anything else? That? This is fun? Yeah, that
Speaker 1: was it. I feel like for for anyone who really
Speaker 1: loves music, there's a crucial moment when they when they
Speaker 1: discover songs for themselves. It's not something that they heard
Speaker 1: through their parents or somebody else. There's a band that
Speaker 1: they like that that's there's that's you know, really feels personal.
Speaker 1: Who was that for you? I know you've talked about
Speaker 1: Keith Jared and Steely Dan of cour were some other
Speaker 1: people that really like made you fall in love with
Speaker 1: music and something that was really belonged to you. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean, I you know, in the earlier teen years.
Speaker 1: I was very much a rocker. You know, my my
Speaker 1: bands at that time were were I mean, the Beatles
Speaker 1: were in there somewhere, but predominantly I was listening in
Speaker 1: my youth, my early leather jacket biking youth were you
Speaker 1: know a C d C. That was the first band
Speaker 1: with Bond Scott. So that's the first band I ever
Speaker 1: went to see. What Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You could
Speaker 1: smoke in theaters and I was a heavy smoker even
Speaker 1: at sixteen. Uh and uh and I'm clean as a
Speaker 1: whiffle now, but yeah, bomb brain Dead, Okay, Angus was
Speaker 1: sitting on bond scott shoulders. You know. Well, Angus is
Speaker 1: soloing around the aisle. I remember running out and touching,
Speaker 1: because that's what you did, touched your hero. Uh, touching
Speaker 1: Pont's got an anger with my cigarette hand of course,
Speaker 1: and then that being knocked into me and burning me.
Speaker 1: So that was great of a very vivid memory of that. Uh.
Speaker 1: The other band that that was an early one for
Speaker 1: me was Rush. I loved Rush because of their They're
Speaker 1: insane chord changes and melodies and melodies, and I mean
Speaker 1: they're playing alone. I mean Neil Pert was just like
Speaker 1: you know, I mean they were, they were all amazing
Speaker 1: and I you know, the very serious h exams that
Speaker 1: you have to do in England were at your O
Speaker 1: levels and then your A levels. On the night of
Speaker 1: my own levels, I was at Rush and then don't
Speaker 1: kids don't do this home? And then turned up in
Speaker 1: school going what are we doing today? Hence why I
Speaker 1: have so many qualifications? What Toro was a permanent wave story,
Speaker 1: you know whatever. Whenever I was seventeen. I couldn't even
Speaker 1: tell you at this point, but I was one of
Speaker 1: the first there. I was right the change, you know,
Speaker 1: on the to the left side at the front of
Speaker 1: the stage and uh yeah, then climbed back in the window,
Speaker 1: you know, in the middle of the night. Yeah for
Speaker 1: that being caught, I don't even think Mummy about that.
Speaker 1: Some things are not meant to be talked about. Uh so. Yeah.
Speaker 1: But aside from that, yeah, I mean I really did
Speaker 1: get stuck at well. Led Zepp used to be an
Speaker 1: absolute favorite. Um, I mean, Ronnie James, d O Black Fabbits,
Speaker 1: you know, the list goes on. Uh and but then
Speaker 1: you know, with the likes of Rush really taking me
Speaker 1: on a slightly different journey than hearing stuff like Keith
Speaker 1: Jarret my Clone concert, I just went to really do
Speaker 1: because I started at that time. Mom Mom bought me
Speaker 1: a piano for my I think sixteenth birthday, sixteenth or seventeen,
Speaker 1: and I used to compose these twenty minute long instrumental
Speaker 1: pieces just by ear. And then you know, I heard
Speaker 1: about Keith Jared and I I went, oh, God, there are
Speaker 1: guys that do that. But obviously I thought at that
Speaker 1: time that if I wanted a career, and you know,
Speaker 1: I'm not going to be a jazz classical player like
Speaker 1: him and improv player, although I could have become that
Speaker 1: if pushed that, but I thought, yeah, you know, I
Speaker 1: wouldn't try writing song songs. So it was it was
Speaker 1: because I used to write these long pieces. The idea
Speaker 1: of editing that down to three to five minutes it
Speaker 1: was a bit of a nightmare. So it was. It
Speaker 1: was a self taught learning process of how to chop
Speaker 1: those kind of chords into songs like this. And that's
Speaker 1: why I've always looked for the unexpected chord to move
Speaker 1: to next and or melody. I mean, there is some
Speaker 1: sense in of regularity and rock and roll that you
Speaker 1: can only have so many chords. But I do try
Speaker 1: and write, try to write interesting passing chords or melodies
Speaker 1: that are not the norm. Because the moment I hear
Speaker 1: something in the world i'm writing that sounds anything like
Speaker 1: anybody else's, I've got to move away from that immediately.
Speaker 1: Uh yeah, Okay, obviously there are sometimes you just can't
Speaker 1: avoid that, but I try my best too. But yeah,
Speaker 1: clone concert, Keith Jarrett Steely, Dan again, melody melody, melody music. Uh,
Speaker 1: just presence they're playing their technique. Uh again. Not that
Speaker 1: I've mentioned this too often before, but actually, you know,
Speaker 1: people say, yeah, come over and jam. No, I'm not
Speaker 1: coming over and jam um. I can barely remember not
Speaker 1: my name or the three or four chords of stand
Speaker 1: by Me. Here's Here's the reason why is because I'm
Speaker 1: not a practicing musician, you know. I my sole purpose
Speaker 1: in life is not to be a musician. There are
Speaker 1: too many other creative outlets that I love. So the
Speaker 1: thing is, so I don't sit there playing every day
Speaker 1: at all. I sit there to discover and write songs
Speaker 1: I played by ear and I don't know what I'm
Speaker 1: doing at the time. And I had this one occasion
Speaker 1: where I had this complex twenty minutes piece and Herbie
Speaker 1: Hancock came to the house and I said, will you
Speaker 1: do pay this piece professionally? He said, what is that card?
Speaker 1: I'm going I don't know. I don't know. How come
Speaker 1: you don't know what it is? What the fucking jazz
Speaker 1: masters is? My friend? You know you're the master on
Speaker 1: anyway major seven flat nine with a thing of the base. No,
Speaker 1: I don't know what that is. I don't want to
Speaker 1: know what that is because if I knew, then it
Speaker 1: wouldn't be a mystery to me. And mystery um so,
Speaker 1: so he said, George, you have to learn to read
Speaker 1: and write music so you can translate between your musical
Speaker 1: partners that don't want to. I'm not going to do
Speaker 1: that because then I would know what I'm doing, and
Speaker 1: I don't want to know what I'm doing. That's about
Speaker 1: That's I think I've done the same thing with every
Speaker 1: creative outlet that I've gone into. Not a brigging clue.
Speaker 1: That's why I have imposter Uh what's the impostor syndrome?
Speaker 1: You but why how for all you've accomplished and achieved?
Speaker 1: But yeah, this is why I'm you know, it's what
Speaker 1: do you call it an overachieve or not, but it's
Speaker 1: part of that. Yeah, I feel like I don't you know,
Speaker 1: this is why I'm trying to find my way and
Speaker 1: I do all this stuff. It's because I don't know
Speaker 1: who knows. Um. So yeah, so I I can't just
Speaker 1: be given in the guitar and told to play a song.
Speaker 1: Don't do it. It's never appealed to me that to
Speaker 1: do that. I don't know why. I'm a little jealous
Speaker 1: of real players, but I just I'm too busy with
Speaker 1: all the other crap that's going on in my head. Um,
Speaker 1: And you know, people think, oh, such a diesel. Now. Literally,
Speaker 1: I can't remember my own bloody lyrics for christ if
Speaker 1: I'm not and I'm not judging, if I have to
Speaker 1: go and play a show or I have to go
Speaker 1: and rehearse, I don't know what chords I'm playing, I
Speaker 1: don't know what the lyrics are. Again, have to rehearse
Speaker 1: like anybody learning the song for the very first time.
Speaker 1: I have to do that. So when when when the
Speaker 1: idea of playing live, going on tour is an idea
Speaker 1: that's a very big consideration for me. It's because it's
Speaker 1: not just getting up there and doing it. I've got
Speaker 1: to relearn every song I ever wrote, and you know,
Speaker 1: in every way. So it's just it's it's a big
Speaker 1: thing for me to do that because again I'm one
Speaker 1: of these people that I do something right, record that,
Speaker 1: put it away, put it out next, I'm onto the
Speaker 1: next thing. I don't want to be there anymore. I'm
Speaker 1: over there already, you know. So that's that's who I
Speaker 1: am and where my head is at. I don't want
Speaker 1: to stay still for a second. I might miss something,
Speaker 1: you know, owards that's that's really me. That's it in
Speaker 1: a nutshell, nutshell well that is I think a beautiful
Speaker 1: note to end on. I want to let let you
Speaker 1: get to your get to the next thing that you
Speaker 1: need to move on to. But just thank you so
Speaker 1: much for your time today, and most importantly, thank you
Speaker 1: for your music. I've been a huge fan and it's
Speaker 1: such an art to thank, a real pleasure. I hope
Speaker 1: to see you in person one day. We hope you
Speaker 1: enjoyed this episode of Inside the Studio, a production of
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. For more episodes of Inside the Studio
Speaker 1: or other fantastic shows, check out the I Heart Radio app,
Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite podcast