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Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Hey thereon, Welcome back to the latest episode of the

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Speaker 1: Book of Joe Podcast with Me, Tom Berducci and Joe Madden.

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Speaker 1: And Joe, we are on the other side of the

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Speaker 1: trade deadline after months and I really mean months, because

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Speaker 1: people love talking about the trade deadline way too far

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Speaker 1: in advance. I remember when people were talking about the

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Speaker 1: Mets and the Astros dumping players. Well, it turned out

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Speaker 1: that we didn't get any blockbusters, Joe. I mean, with

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Speaker 1: all the names out there and all the possibilities, I

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Speaker 1: don't think there was any name that made you go

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Speaker 1: wow at the trade deadline. So real quick, I'll ask

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Speaker 1: you first to give me your first overview of what transpired,

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Speaker 1: if not the last day, the last couple of days

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Speaker 1: at least, because there were a lot of moves, but

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Speaker 1: again no blockbusters.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, filling needs right, I mean, the blockbusters a fun

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Speaker 2: thing for the fans to get involved with and talk about,

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Speaker 2: and it's great fodder for talk radio, whatever, newspapers, TV shows.

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Speaker 2: But I think a lot of teams did what they

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Speaker 2: needed to do, filling spots, making themselves stronger. And I

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Speaker 2: think after all that's what it's all about. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it's always nice to get the big, splashy dude, but

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Speaker 2: that doesn't always ensure everything, ensure everything, ensure everything. It's

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Speaker 2: just I like filling my little the holes, the gaps,

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Speaker 2: whatever I think I need. I need some spackle to

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Speaker 2: put in there right now to make this thing work.

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Speaker 2: So I think a lot of teams did that. I

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Speaker 2: a lot of even like yesterday with the Mets. Blackburn.

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Speaker 2: I love Blackburn. I've always liked him, the guy from

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Speaker 2: the athletics. I think he's a really good pitcher. They're

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Speaker 2: going to be surprised because I'm sure most of them

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Speaker 2: have never are hardly ever seen him pitch. But this

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Speaker 2: guy can be very functionally good down the stretch for

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Speaker 2: this particular team and others. I mean, you know the

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Speaker 2: bet I guess Tanner Scott was one of the bigger names.

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Speaker 2: And then again, it's it's who we getting in return.

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Speaker 2: You don't even know. We have no idea what these

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Speaker 2: guys look like a lot of times, and you have

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Speaker 2: to wait a couple years to find out, you know,

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Speaker 2: really who won anything regarding a trade. So I think

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Speaker 2: it's been a gap filler, even like Chisholm, like all

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Speaker 2: of a sudden, he comes back there and starts hitting

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Speaker 2: home runs and inject some life into that team, which

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Speaker 2: is noticeable whether they're in Philadelphia. I don't know if

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Speaker 2: it's going to be sustainable. Maybe I probably should be,

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Speaker 2: but nevertheless, mission accomplished regarding like let's give these guys

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Speaker 2: a shot in the arm and kind of like kickstart

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Speaker 2: them or a jumper cable them and get them going

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Speaker 2: in the right direction again. So that was my impression. Nobody,

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Speaker 2: like you said, nothing over the top, Schooble and those

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Speaker 2: dudes Guerrero, everybody stayed place and in place, and Snell,

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Speaker 2: Matt Snell really coming on strongly. But I think a

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Speaker 2: lot of functionally good moves.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. For me, it gets back to what's taken over

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Speaker 1: the game, and that is relief pitching. I mean, there

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Speaker 1: was a scramble for these teams, and they jumped out

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Speaker 1: early to grab relief pitch. And on the final day,

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Speaker 1: thirty four players were traded, and twenty of them were

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Speaker 1: relief pitchers. And a lot of these dudes are in

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Speaker 1: their thirties. They're pitching for their third, fourth, fifth, or

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Speaker 1: sixth team. Maybe they came up with a different pitch

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Speaker 1: or a mechanical change. Everybody is looking to go deeper

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Speaker 1: and deeper and deeper in the bullpen, especially with swing

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Speaker 1: and miss guys. And you know, fortunately or unfortunately, that's

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Speaker 1: where the game has been going that the emphasis on

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Speaker 1: starting pitching just is not there anymore. Jack Flaherty was

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Speaker 1: the best starting pitcher. He changed teams and he's before

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Speaker 1: this year he selled for a one year deal with

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Speaker 1: the Detroit Tigers, and he's you know, there's no John

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Speaker 1: Lester out there getting traded. There's no Max Scherzer, there's

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Speaker 1: no you darbish, there's no Coal Hammils, there's no Justin Verlander.

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Speaker 1: The premium now is load up on as many bullpen

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Speaker 1: guys as you can. And that's why when I look

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Speaker 1: at the deadline, I think, to me, the biggest winner

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Speaker 1: is the San Diego Padres. They won the bullpen race.

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Speaker 1: First of all, they're playing great baseball these days, especially

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Speaker 1: they coming off a huge East Coast trip where they

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Speaker 1: won three series in a row. They have a lot

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Speaker 1: of momentum. Aj Pereller, you got in love with this guy,

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Speaker 1: does Joe? I mean he goes out and he makes deals.

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Speaker 1: He's not bragging about his farm system. He's not, you know,

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Speaker 1: buying himself time as an executive by saying, we get

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Speaker 1: we're loaded with guys in a ball just stick around, folks.

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Speaker 1: He's trying to win a World series and he did

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Speaker 1: it once again, getting Jason Adam and Tanner Scott to

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Speaker 1: the best relief arms in the business. With Robert Suarez

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Speaker 1: on the back end, this has got They've got a

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Speaker 1: loaded bullpen. Now maybe they get Joe Musgrove back their

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Speaker 1: starting rotation. It's just phenomenal in terms of being able

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Speaker 1: to spin a baseball. You know, they cut the Dodgers

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Speaker 1: deficit to five and a half games with a great

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Speaker 1: come from behind win the first game of that series,

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Speaker 1: down five nothing, they pull it out. So I think

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Speaker 1: san Diego now to me, Joe, and especially with the

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Speaker 1: way the Dodgers and the Phillies have hit a lull

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Speaker 1: here in the middle of the season, san Diego Padre

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Speaker 1: has really jumped out in the pack what's been a

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Speaker 1: kind of mediocre pack in the National League, and they're

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Speaker 1: as dangerous as anybody right now, especially in a postseason

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Speaker 1: matchup situation with that bullpen.

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Speaker 2: Can't disagree trying to win you know, trying to win.

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Speaker 2: Right now, I see nothing with that philosophy. I wish

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Speaker 2: more teams could incorporate that. But in regards to your

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Speaker 2: bullpen wars or your bullpen guys, watch the box scores.

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Speaker 2: I mean I don't get to see all the games,

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Speaker 2: but I definitely could read. I read the Post every morning,

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Speaker 2: and the New York Post that is. And when I do,

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Speaker 2: I'm just checking out box scores, and you try to

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Speaker 2: recreate what's going on in gosh. I mean every game,

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Speaker 2: there's tons of bullpen usage every game. Every team, it

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Speaker 2: seems starters less than five innings all the time. And

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Speaker 2: with that, yeah, you're gonna need all these guys this

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Speaker 2: time of the year. I always wanted. I've always felt

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Speaker 2: the teams I've had in the past. Yes, you always

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Speaker 2: look to bost of your pitching somehow because if that

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Speaker 2: breaks stein you're really in trouble. So you're really trying

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Speaker 2: to make sure you have the depth necessary, whether it's

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Speaker 2: starter or reliever. However, box scores, man, just check them out.

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Speaker 2: There's tons of them. An age I always liked twenty

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Speaker 2: eight twenty nine year old players that have been with

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Speaker 2: maybe one or two other organizations. They've kind of figured

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Speaker 2: it out. They really have a slower heartbeat, and they're

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Speaker 2: truly there's nothing that's going to be overly impressive to them.

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Speaker 2: There's the nervousness is gone. They're able to breathe in

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Speaker 2: the moment. I really like that age group. I do.

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Speaker 2: You know, you got the prodigies that become really good

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Speaker 2: before that, but a lot of them really have to

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Speaker 2: weigh twenty seven to twenty eight, maybe even twenty nine

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Speaker 2: to be to get to the point where their brain

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Speaker 2: and body function in unison. And I like that. I

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Speaker 2: think that's a great component of that kind of a player.

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Speaker 2: And the other thing is when these organizations get these

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Speaker 2: pictures a little bit older, they're more willing to use them.

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Speaker 2: They're not trying to protect them as much, and they

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Speaker 2: know they're there on a short term basis, and they

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Speaker 2: also know that they can replace them eventually. So there's

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Speaker 2: a lot going on there with that age group in

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Speaker 2: that particular pace, And from the pitcher's perspective, they're finally

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Speaker 2: arrived mentally, I think, and from the front office position

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Speaker 2: more willing to subtract some of the rules in regards

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Speaker 2: to the usage. I'm watching the Yankees right on Tonkin,

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Speaker 2: My god. I mean that guy seems to be out

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Speaker 2: there often almost every night. So guys that have been

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Speaker 2: banging around like that, again, you're willing to put more

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Speaker 2: mileage on the arm than those that have not. And

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Speaker 2: I think this all plays into it. But final point, yes,

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Speaker 2: I do like the guys that are reaching for the

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Speaker 2: brass ring. They're not just sitting in the weeds. You

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Speaker 2: constantly and everybody gets praised for dumping players, dumping players

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Speaker 2: and moving forward. Listen, there's times you've got to do that.

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Speaker 2: I understand that, but I like the groups to try

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Speaker 2: to win.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm glad you mentioned Dombrowski too, because he traded

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Speaker 1: for Carlos Estevez. I thought that was a great pickup.

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Speaker 1: He had a lot of uncertainty and actually still has

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Speaker 1: some in his bullpen with a lot of guys you

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Speaker 1: just can't throw strikes. And you know, Joe, there's nothing

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Speaker 1: worse as a manager to see games go away based

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Speaker 1: on free path from your relief pitchers. And he got

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Speaker 1: a true closer ninth ending guy Carlos and Stevez and

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Speaker 1: a lot of the prospect mavens are out there saying

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Speaker 1: he overpaid for this closer. The Phillies are a win

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Speaker 1: now team. They had an obvious hole in that team.

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Speaker 1: You're not going to be hanging out to prospects when

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Speaker 1: you're the Philadelphia Phillies and you're Dave Nebraski and you've

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Speaker 1: got a World Series championship on the horizon. So the

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Speaker 1: idea that teams quote unquote overpaid is based on what

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Speaker 1: prospect rankings. I mean, come on, I'd rather have a

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Speaker 1: general manager if I'm a fan of a team who's

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Speaker 1: got a window to win a World Series. I don't

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Speaker 1: like the idea of windows in terms of years because

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Speaker 1: they can come and go very quickly. But right now,

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Speaker 1: the Philadelphia Phillies, we know this year twenty twenty four,

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Speaker 1: of a chance to win the World Series. You don't

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Speaker 1: hoard your prospects. And I don't agree with the idea

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Speaker 1: of overpaying when you're filling an immediate need for a

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Speaker 1: World Series caliber type team.

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Speaker 2: Well, how about back in the day when the commissioner

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Speaker 2: could declare a trade nolin voy because it wasn't in

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Speaker 2: the best interest in baseball? Right?

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Speaker 1: Oh, that was usually against Charlie Finley. He's trying to

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Speaker 1: sell off his.

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Speaker 2: Player exactly right, that's that's what happens. I mean, the

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Speaker 2: narrative is so changed where I mean, I don't remember, well,

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Speaker 2: I'm just thinking quickly, but when we were coming up

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Speaker 2: in the seventies and the eighties, there was none of

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Speaker 2: that I remember, like the big selloffs. I'm sure that

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Speaker 2: happened on occasion, but that had to be really bad.

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Speaker 2: By the time the White Sox dumped, there were only

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Speaker 2: a couple games down and they dumped, and that was

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Speaker 2: a big uproar. I can't remember exactly what year that occurred.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the White Flag trade Wilson Alvarez. They were about

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Speaker 1: two and a half games out of a wildcard I

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Speaker 1: think it was ninety seven, and there was a big

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Speaker 1: up war.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: But you know they people cover the prospect industry a

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Speaker 1: lot more, Joe, And the way to cover that industry

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Speaker 1: is to say everybody's going to be great, because that's

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Speaker 1: going to get you attention.

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Speaker 2: Really listen, just work the minor leagues, be a minor

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Speaker 2: league player development guy, and you'll I could just sit

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Speaker 2: here and create a list right now guys that I

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Speaker 2: thought were going to be really good that couldn't even

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Speaker 2: get the double ay or outside of double a. It's

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Speaker 2: just it's very difficult to fulfill all the potential that

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Speaker 2: everybody speaks about. And right now there's even a thinner

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Speaker 2: grouping or layer of available prospects based on the number

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Speaker 2: of guys in your systems. And I know you're going

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Speaker 2: to make the argument that normally the higher draft picks

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Speaker 2: are the ones that do eventually end up in the

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Speaker 2: major leagues. But that's probably true, and that's always been true,

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Speaker 2: but there's always this undercurrent of players that is able

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Speaker 2: to surface and become functionally good or very good or great,

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Speaker 2: majorly Mike Piazza as an example. I mean, so there's

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Speaker 2: all of this is that the narrative is changing. You're right,

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Speaker 2: I don't wow when I just constantly hear about the

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Speaker 2: narrative regarding the prospects and how what they're going to

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Speaker 2: be like and how good they are and whose opinion

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Speaker 2: is that that's going to be so funny man, because

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Speaker 2: that's exactly where I'm going with the quote of the

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Speaker 2: day after this, it gets annoying sometimes. I like the

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Speaker 2: groups that play to win, and you know when you

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Speaker 2: sneak and you know things have gone wrongly. I not

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Speaker 2: even like with the White Sox that they're doing it

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Speaker 2: almost is like they've accepted How long ago have they

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Speaker 2: accepted this absolute misery? And what does that mean for

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Speaker 2: their fans and fans base. They think they're going to

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Speaker 2: make it up to them in a couple of years.

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Speaker 2: That's not necessarily true. So anyway, it's the narrative has changed.

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Speaker 2: It used to be we're going to try to win,

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Speaker 2: and there used to be situations where it was not

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Speaker 2: in the best interests of baseball.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a researcher at MLB Network, Matt Baker, did

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Speaker 1: some research on prospects traded at the deadline, went back

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Speaker 1: over the last decade, and he found that I think

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Speaker 1: the number is three percent of the prospects traded at

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Speaker 1: the deadline turned out to be impact players or major

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Speaker 1: contributors on the big league level. So if your team,

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Speaker 1: if you're celebrating because your team got some prospects, just

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Speaker 1: be very careful. I'd rather be celebrating if my team

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Speaker 1: got out there for got true major league talent to

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Speaker 1: try to win a World Series. By the way, when

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Speaker 1: I talked about relief pitching, Joe, and you've seen this

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Speaker 1: in the arc of your career. If you go back

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Speaker 1: ten years, and that's not a long time, right, Just

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Speaker 1: go back ten years, the average major league starting pitcher

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Speaker 1: would throw six innings average ninety six pitches, and they

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Speaker 1: counted for seventy percent of the wins. Okay, so that's

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Speaker 1: sixth innings, ninety six pitches, seventy percent of the wins.

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Speaker 1: This year, starting pitchers are averaging five point three innings,

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Speaker 1: you're averaging only eighty six pitches, and they're getting only

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Speaker 1: fifty nine percent of the wins available. You talk about

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Speaker 1: the declient of starting pitching, and this is what again,

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Speaker 1: I'm circling back here to the trade deadline. All these

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Speaker 1: general managers, president of baseball operations, whatever you want to

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Speaker 1: call them, keep looking for people with closer stuff to

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Speaker 1: come into the game in the fifth and sixth inning,

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Speaker 1: and they're finding them. You know, the batting average in

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Speaker 1: the Major League baseball from the seventh innings through the

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Speaker 1: ninth inning is thirty four. It's just hard to get

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Speaker 1: a hit about what's coming out of these bulls, coming

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Speaker 1: out of the bullpen. And that's why I think, to me,

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Speaker 1: the Padres are a clear winner of the deadline.

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Speaker 2: How's that work? And everybody's five hundred. I mean, I

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Speaker 2: you know, all these things everybody's trying to, like have

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Speaker 2: talked about this, playing the same game with the Rays,

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Speaker 2: then you can look this up, I'm sure pretty quickly.

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Speaker 2: I know, when we come into spring training, my goal

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Speaker 2: was to get a thousand innings out of the starting pitchers.

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Speaker 2: And I didn't mean like twenty of them. I'm you know,

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Speaker 2: it was like six, seven, ten. I mean we might

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Speaker 2: have had nine or ten. I think we did it

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Speaker 2: one year with less than ten starting pitchers. We got

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Speaker 2: a thousand innings out of these guys. So we let

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Speaker 2: them pitch. That's what they're there for. They're called starting

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Speaker 2: pitchers for a reason. And when you do that, your

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Speaker 2: bullpens stay healthier longer. You don't have to constantly search

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Speaker 2: for new guys, and there was more pitchability. It wasn't

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Speaker 2: just about coming out there and rearing back and trying

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Speaker 2: to throw as hard as you can for you know,

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Speaker 2: whatever amount of time that was.

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Speaker 1: Uh.

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Speaker 2: And even now with the new rules and just thinking

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Speaker 2: about this quickly, the three batter minimum that also impacts this.

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Speaker 2: I used to like to get guys in and out,

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Speaker 2: in and out, in and out if I could to

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Speaker 2: possibly save them and use them more often because if

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Speaker 2: he just threw maybe one hitter, one out and get

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Speaker 2: them out of there and just start matching up. I

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Speaker 2: always like to do that because I thought that had

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Speaker 2: a positive impact too. But thousand innings with the Rays,

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Speaker 2: I think we did a thousand at least one time,

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Speaker 2: maybe twice, and came close another. But that group was

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Speaker 2: so good, and that's what made the Rays great. It

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Speaker 2: was the fact that we pitched so well. We starting

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Speaker 2: pitched so well. We had the bullpen was always in

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Speaker 2: a state of flux, like you're talking about. We brought

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Speaker 2: a lot of veteran guys in, guys with some mileage,

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Speaker 2: but you never worried about hurting their arms. They knew

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Speaker 2: how to take care of themselves. You knew what they

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Speaker 2: can do. If they told you I can pitch today,

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Speaker 2: I believe them when they pitched today. If they told

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Speaker 2: me they cannot, they did not. Rafael, I've talked about

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Speaker 2: this t before. Rafael Soriano came into me after a

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Speaker 2: game where I did not use them, and because you know,

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Speaker 2: we had talked to front office, was concerned whatever, and

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Speaker 2: he said, Socio, listen to me. If I can go,

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Speaker 2: I will tell you I can go. I say, sometimes

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Speaker 2: I feel better on the third third consecutive day than

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Speaker 2: I do on this second consecutive day. He says, it

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Speaker 2: just it just varies, it's different. So he taught me

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Speaker 2: a lesson there at a betteran relief pitcher. Really listen

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Speaker 2: to this guy. He's going to give it to you

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Speaker 2: straight the line. I want the ball. Don't tell me

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Speaker 2: that I used to hate that I want the ball.

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Speaker 2: I mean that that's just such a much. He'smo kind

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Speaker 2: of an attitude. No, are you good? How do you feel?

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Speaker 2: Talk to me because they need to know this before

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Speaker 2: the game. And if you tell me before the game,

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Speaker 2: then I can think in a way that would better

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Speaker 2: suit us tonight and then tomorrow the next day. Because

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Speaker 2: the thing you have to consider with bullpen guys too,

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Speaker 2: for me was always it's not just about today. It's

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Speaker 2: about the rest of the week and who we're playing,

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Speaker 2: and who's your starter. You got a six starter starting

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Speaker 2: to Martyr tomorrow, and if you use a lot of

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Speaker 2: bullpen today, my goodness, you could be in big trouble

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Speaker 2: tomorrow with this guy. That that's really you don't expect

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Speaker 2: a lot of innings coming out of him as compared

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Speaker 2: to Okay, you got your stud the next day, go ahead,

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Speaker 2: maybe overuser abuse your bullpen the night before, because you know,

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Speaker 2: more than likely this guy's going to more deeply into

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Speaker 2: the game, the interconnectingness of the game itself, and of

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Speaker 2: course the bullpen, to me, more than any part of it,

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Speaker 2: is really something to be paid attention to. So I

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Speaker 2: could go on and on about this. I like a

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Speaker 2: thousand innings out of my starting pitchers, and I don't

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Speaker 2: think I don't think that's impossible, except the fact that

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Speaker 2: we don't promote it anymore. We promote guys that spin

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Speaker 2: the ball, throw hard at the top of the strike

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Speaker 2: zone more, and we want more of those guys, like

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Speaker 2: you said, to debilitate the latter part of the game.

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Speaker 2: But what's happening. Everybody's a five hundred club. Everybody's following

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Speaker 2: the same playbook.

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Speaker 1: I'm not a big fan of the cliche of winners

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Speaker 1: and losers before the dust is settled at the trade deadline,

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Speaker 1: but I do. It's really too nuanced, and it's obviously

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Speaker 1: too quick. But I understand why people do that. But

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Speaker 1: I'm curious as to what the Baltimore Orioles are doing, Joe,

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Speaker 1: you and I both really love Baltimore's talent and the

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Speaker 1: job and height is doing. When we get back, I

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Speaker 1: need help figuring out what the heck the Baltimore Orioles

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Speaker 1: did at the trade deadline. Welcome back to the Book

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Speaker 1: of Joe podcast, our Trade deadline wrap up edition, and

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Speaker 1: I mentioned that, Joe, I'm really curious as to what

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Speaker 1: the Baltimore Orioles did. We've talked about this. They have

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Speaker 1: reminded me with their core of young players, not just talent,

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Speaker 1: but the chemistry on this team really takes me back

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Speaker 1: to your Cubs team, going back to twenty fifteen and

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Speaker 1: the way your team was finished off with John Lester

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Speaker 1: as a free agent, world As Chapman as a trade

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Speaker 1: piece at the deadline. I get the sense that's where

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Speaker 1: Baltimore was. To me, they needed an impact front of

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Speaker 1: the rotation, or at least someone behind Corbyn Burns type

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Speaker 1: starter and another power arm of the bullpen to supplement

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Speaker 1: Craig Kimbrel was very underwhelmed by what they did at

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Speaker 1: the deadline, Joe. They got Zach Eflin, who strikeout rate

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Speaker 1: is way down this year. They got Trevor Rodgers, a

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Speaker 1: starting pitcher who literally has the worst whip among any

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Speaker 1: pitcher with one hundred innings this year, and his velocity

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Speaker 1: is down more than two miles an hour from three

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Speaker 1: years ago. He is not missing bats at all. They

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Speaker 1: got Alloy Jmenez, a guy with no defensive quotient. He's

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Speaker 1: basically a DH who's hitting more ground balls than any

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Speaker 1: hitter in the big leagues. Austin Slater and Christian Pasha

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Speaker 1: are both the same player. Both can't hit offensively. They're

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Speaker 1: true center fielders, but you're not getting much offensively.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: They were sitting on a tremendous pile of a new buzzword,

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Speaker 1: his prospect capital, and this is what they came away with.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I mean, maybe this plays out and Eflin

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Speaker 1: just turns it up. I like Zach Eflin, don't get

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Speaker 1: me wrong, But to me, the Oriols needed someone to

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Speaker 1: slot between Corbyn Burns and Grayson Rodriguez. They have again

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Speaker 1: a window right now to win the World Series. I

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Speaker 1: understand what they're doing. They wanted players with contractual control

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Speaker 1: beyond this year. They didn't want to get into the

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Speaker 1: rental market. I understand they needed starting pitchers for the

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty five season. But I think you need to

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Speaker 1: be more aggressive and go out and get a Tanner

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Speaker 1: Scott who they had before. Go out and get a

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Speaker 1: Jack Flaherty. Maybe that experience from last year didn't suit

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Speaker 1: them well and they didn't want to go back there.

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Speaker 1: But to me, Joe, this team doesn't have to make

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Speaker 1: every move with an eye on twenty five. Twenty four

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Speaker 1: is right here. The opportunities right in front of you.

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Speaker 2: Well, there's so much going on right there. First of all,

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Speaker 2: they see something. That's how I look at acquisitions like this.

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Speaker 2: There's always that we could fix somebody mentality.

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Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought that up, Joe, because I want

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Speaker 1: to ask you about that. You know so much about

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Speaker 1: player development, and I agree. Rogers has not been the

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Speaker 1: pitcher he was three years ago. F one's lost the

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Speaker 1: ability to swing a miss. They took two guys. They

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Speaker 1: didn't mention this from the Philadelphia Phillies, who Rob Thompson

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Speaker 1: had lost complete confidence in because they can't throw strikes.

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Speaker 1: Gregory Soto and Sir Anthony Dominguez. I mentioned Jimenez can't

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Speaker 1: get the ball in the air. You're putting a tremendous

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Speaker 1: amount of confidence in your major league staff with new

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Speaker 1: players in a short period of time to get these

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Speaker 1: guys straightened out. You tell me how that works out.

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Speaker 2: That's an analytical move right there. And I'm not trying

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Speaker 2: to bash on anybody right here. Please listen. That's the analysts.

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Speaker 2: There's looking at something within the data, the information to video,

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Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff, and they're looking at that

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Speaker 2: and they believe they're going to be able to fix it.

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Speaker 2: So they'll gather, they'll decide all this, and then then

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Speaker 2: they will hand it over to the coaching staff and

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Speaker 2: they'll hand it over with advice in regards to how

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Speaker 2: to do this, and strong advice. Now, back in the day,

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Speaker 2: that would obviously that was not part of the quotient.

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Speaker 2: So it was about whether you know, you thought your

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Speaker 2: coaches could look at this, figure it out, make this

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Speaker 2: guy better. But under the circumstances you're describing, more than

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Speaker 2: likely those guys would not.

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Speaker 1: Have been acquired.

429
00:21:04,918 --> 00:21:07,078
Speaker 2: That would not have been part of how we did

430
00:21:07,078 --> 00:21:09,238
Speaker 2: things at that particular juncture. So first of all, they

431
00:21:09,278 --> 00:21:13,478
Speaker 2: see something something that and analytics is brought to their attention.

432
00:21:13,958 --> 00:21:16,558
Speaker 2: I remember the time in the winter time Andrew called

433
00:21:16,598 --> 00:21:19,278
Speaker 2: me and he said what do you think about Fernando

434
00:21:19,358 --> 00:21:22,478
Speaker 2: Rodney And I said, well, you've got a good arm

435
00:21:22,558 --> 00:21:25,118
Speaker 2: is an apple. But by he says, our guys love them,

436
00:21:25,278 --> 00:21:26,798
Speaker 2: and you know what, that's your head a point six

437
00:21:26,838 --> 00:21:29,038
Speaker 2: y four e RA and set like a record. Up

438
00:21:29,078 --> 00:21:31,398
Speaker 2: to that point. They see something that's the only thing

439
00:21:31,398 --> 00:21:33,438
Speaker 2: I could I could gather right there. You've talked about

440
00:21:33,438 --> 00:21:36,678
Speaker 2: for nexte years to come. The control was starting pitching.

441
00:21:37,078 --> 00:21:39,478
Speaker 2: They believe they can fix them. Now that's another thing.

442
00:21:41,118 --> 00:21:44,518
Speaker 2: When you're in charge of development and player development and

443
00:21:44,558 --> 00:21:47,798
Speaker 2: coaching and whatever. You always believe you could fix somebody.

444
00:21:47,838 --> 00:21:49,798
Speaker 2: You always do. But then I learned it's not true.

445
00:21:50,198 --> 00:21:52,558
Speaker 2: It's not true that you could always fix somebody. There's

446
00:21:52,598 --> 00:21:56,078
Speaker 2: certain things within them that's more difficult than others to fix,

447
00:21:56,438 --> 00:21:58,558
Speaker 2: and the most difficult thing to fix with somebody's head.

448
00:21:58,838 --> 00:22:00,718
Speaker 2: So again, I don't know what these guys are like.

449
00:22:00,758 --> 00:22:02,558
Speaker 2: I don't know what they're thinking. I don't know how

450
00:22:02,598 --> 00:22:04,278
Speaker 2: they breathe. I don't know any of that stuff. Because

451
00:22:04,278 --> 00:22:06,518
Speaker 2: to me, that's still like the most important thing to understand.

452
00:22:07,518 --> 00:22:09,558
Speaker 2: How does this guy think? How does he breathe? And

453
00:22:09,598 --> 00:22:11,358
Speaker 2: then after that you can try to figure out if

454
00:22:11,358 --> 00:22:13,718
Speaker 2: we can actually fix them physically. So these are the

455
00:22:13,758 --> 00:22:16,998
Speaker 2: kind of conversations that are not at So that's independent

456
00:22:17,118 --> 00:22:20,078
Speaker 2: of how analysts work, which would be primarily almost like

457
00:22:20,118 --> 00:22:22,398
Speaker 2: in a vacuum, looking at movement and all this stuff

458
00:22:22,478 --> 00:22:25,118
Speaker 2: numbers and projections and all this stuff, whereas I'd be

459
00:22:25,198 --> 00:22:28,518
Speaker 2: more concerned in talking to the guy researching with former

460
00:22:28,558 --> 00:22:31,238
Speaker 2: coaches and players and what's he like, what does he

461
00:22:31,318 --> 00:22:33,038
Speaker 2: think of? Where's his head at right now? That to

462
00:22:33,078 --> 00:22:35,478
Speaker 2: me would be the more interesting part regarding his short

463
00:22:35,558 --> 00:22:39,718
Speaker 2: term and then eventually a long term benefit beyond that bullpen.

464
00:22:40,118 --> 00:22:42,838
Speaker 2: I mean, listen, I've had Craig Kimball, good guy, really

465
00:22:42,838 --> 00:22:44,918
Speaker 2: good guy. But to me, that's even more important if

466
00:22:44,918 --> 00:22:47,598
Speaker 2: they're trying to win right now, you cannot rely on

467
00:22:47,678 --> 00:22:51,198
Speaker 2: that with any kind of consistency. It's just I watch him,

468
00:22:51,198 --> 00:22:53,158
Speaker 2: He's going to have his spurts of being really good.

469
00:22:53,238 --> 00:22:55,958
Speaker 2: Of the spurts, it's just a little bit more if

470
00:22:55,998 --> 00:22:57,958
Speaker 2: he kind of a thing. So I really thought that

471
00:22:57,998 --> 00:22:59,918
Speaker 2: they needed to nail down that bullpen. S Or Anthony,

472
00:23:00,198 --> 00:23:02,438
Speaker 2: I watch him, great arm, Gosh, narn he's got a

473
00:23:02,478 --> 00:23:06,478
Speaker 2: great arm. But you talk about inconsistency regarding and again

474
00:23:06,558 --> 00:23:08,838
Speaker 2: when I watch him I think it's mental because he's

475
00:23:08,878 --> 00:23:11,358
Speaker 2: not focused in the sense that he's going to dominate you.

476
00:23:11,398 --> 00:23:13,038
Speaker 2: Because he's got the kind of stiff that's like he

477
00:23:13,038 --> 00:23:15,158
Speaker 2: should almost be able to say, here comes my fastball,

478
00:23:15,598 --> 00:23:17,398
Speaker 2: try to hit it and just blow it by somebody.

479
00:23:17,398 --> 00:23:20,278
Speaker 2: He's that got that kind of talent, but you don't

480
00:23:20,318 --> 00:23:22,598
Speaker 2: see that. So these are the kind of thoughts I

481
00:23:22,598 --> 00:23:25,358
Speaker 2: have as developmental guy, as a coach when you're bringing

482
00:23:25,358 --> 00:23:27,318
Speaker 2: the guys in, This is what I would be looking at.

483
00:23:27,678 --> 00:23:29,838
Speaker 2: So there's got to be a balance. I don't think

484
00:23:29,838 --> 00:23:31,918
Speaker 2: there's enough scouts on the road anymore. I don't know this,

485
00:23:32,438 --> 00:23:35,438
Speaker 2: but in order to balance this kind of projection. But

486
00:23:35,478 --> 00:23:37,798
Speaker 2: I promise you at the end of the day, whatever

487
00:23:37,838 --> 00:23:39,518
Speaker 2: the analysts say is going to out weigh with the

488
00:23:39,878 --> 00:23:40,918
Speaker 2: scout in the stands is.

489
00:23:40,838 --> 00:23:43,278
Speaker 1: Going to say, Okay, now, let me put you in

490
00:23:43,358 --> 00:23:45,758
Speaker 1: the shoes of your buddy Brandon Hyde. You're the manager

491
00:23:45,758 --> 00:23:47,798
Speaker 1: of the Baltimore Orioles. You've had a lot of these

492
00:23:47,798 --> 00:23:50,478
Speaker 1: players come up together, right the timing of these young

493
00:23:50,478 --> 00:23:52,118
Speaker 1: players as a group, they know each other from the

494
00:23:52,118 --> 00:23:55,318
Speaker 1: minor leagues. You've got a first place team and now

495
00:23:55,358 --> 00:23:59,318
Speaker 1: with two months left in the season, You're introducing seven

496
00:23:59,438 --> 00:24:01,758
Speaker 1: new players to a twenty six man roster.

497
00:24:02,238 --> 00:24:04,598
Speaker 2: Not easy, not easy, absolutely right?

498
00:24:05,118 --> 00:24:05,838
Speaker 1: How do you handle that?

499
00:24:06,638 --> 00:24:08,998
Speaker 2: The thing about that the biggest guard there for me,

500
00:24:09,078 --> 00:24:12,398
Speaker 2: The thing to watch for is whose place are they

501
00:24:12,478 --> 00:24:15,318
Speaker 2: taking and what's the perception among the group. Of course,

502
00:24:15,398 --> 00:24:17,638
Speaker 2: I mean you're in charge of the guy or the GM,

503
00:24:17,678 --> 00:24:19,198
Speaker 2: the manager, et cetera. You're the ones have to make

504
00:24:19,238 --> 00:24:21,838
Speaker 2: these decisions. But I'm here to tell you, when it

505
00:24:21,878 --> 00:24:24,518
Speaker 2: comes to a really talily nick group, if they see

506
00:24:24,558 --> 00:24:27,438
Speaker 2: somebody walk in the door that they don't perceive to

507
00:24:27,438 --> 00:24:29,518
Speaker 2: be as good as the guy that's walking out the door,

508
00:24:29,758 --> 00:24:32,238
Speaker 2: this new guy better perform well, and perform well quickly,

509
00:24:32,238 --> 00:24:33,998
Speaker 2: because there's going to be it's going to injure the

510
00:24:34,038 --> 00:24:34,958
Speaker 2: confidence of the group.

511
00:24:35,318 --> 00:24:37,878
Speaker 1: Well, Joe, I mean, you're probably looking at Cedric Mullins

512
00:24:37,878 --> 00:24:40,398
Speaker 1: losing at bat. You're probably looking at Ryan Mountcastle losing

513
00:24:40,438 --> 00:24:43,198
Speaker 1: at bat. You're probably looking at Ryan o'harn losing at bats.

514
00:24:43,438 --> 00:24:45,678
Speaker 1: These have been core players on that team.

515
00:24:45,958 --> 00:24:47,838
Speaker 2: That's it. That's that's my point. I mean, And I

516
00:24:48,038 --> 00:24:49,918
Speaker 2: used the example of Chico Lean when he came into

517
00:24:49,958 --> 00:24:54,678
Speaker 2: door in Anaheim ninety five season. Because disar gets Hurt.

518
00:24:55,118 --> 00:24:57,598
Speaker 2: We already had Spike Owing on the team, We had

519
00:24:57,918 --> 00:25:00,078
Speaker 2: Rex Huller, who are very capable of playing second base,

520
00:25:00,118 --> 00:25:02,678
Speaker 2: but we chose to bring Chico Lean in and move

521
00:25:02,958 --> 00:25:06,278
Speaker 2: Damien Easley to short. Wow, that taught me such a lesson.

522
00:25:06,318 --> 00:25:08,838
Speaker 2: That was a veteran clubhouse too, which I think has

523
00:25:08,878 --> 00:25:11,238
Speaker 2: an impact too, as opposed to a bunch of young guys.

524
00:25:11,278 --> 00:25:13,678
Speaker 2: May not see it that way, but when you're working

525
00:25:13,678 --> 00:25:16,038
Speaker 2: with a bunch of veterans, which the game was more

526
00:25:16,118 --> 00:25:18,438
Speaker 2: veteran at that time, you have to be very careful

527
00:25:18,438 --> 00:25:21,838
Speaker 2: about that because it can cause them to go on

528
00:25:21,918 --> 00:25:24,598
Speaker 2: a different trajectory because they really were upset by that.

529
00:25:24,958 --> 00:25:26,398
Speaker 2: So these are the kind of things to me that

530
00:25:26,478 --> 00:25:29,918
Speaker 2: are very necessary to really try to keep an eye

531
00:25:29,918 --> 00:25:32,718
Speaker 2: on and understand because it's real, it's true, and it

532
00:25:32,798 --> 00:25:33,958
Speaker 2: can't have an impact.

533
00:25:34,198 --> 00:25:36,198
Speaker 1: Well, now let's talk about the Yankees, because I think

534
00:25:36,238 --> 00:25:39,358
Speaker 1: the Yankees and closed the gap on the Baltimore Orioles,

535
00:25:39,758 --> 00:25:42,318
Speaker 1: and certainly if you watch them play ever since Saturday

536
00:25:42,398 --> 00:25:45,598
Speaker 1: night in Boston when Trent Grishen rescued them from a

537
00:25:45,638 --> 00:25:47,758
Speaker 1: loss with a big two out hit in the ninth inning,

538
00:25:47,998 --> 00:25:50,318
Speaker 1: they've found their groove and part of that was adding

539
00:25:50,878 --> 00:25:54,678
Speaker 1: Chisholm Junior. And they also got Mark Leier Junior, who's

540
00:25:54,718 --> 00:25:56,878
Speaker 1: been a strikeout machine by the way, from the Cubs.

541
00:25:57,278 --> 00:26:00,598
Speaker 1: Those are two really good pieces the Yankees needed, and

542
00:26:01,238 --> 00:26:05,438
Speaker 1: I like the Chisholm addition, especially Joe. He played his

543
00:26:05,438 --> 00:26:07,838
Speaker 1: first game at Fenway Park on Sunday night and said

544
00:26:07,878 --> 00:26:10,838
Speaker 1: something really interesting. He said, that's the biggest crowd I've

545
00:26:10,878 --> 00:26:14,278
Speaker 1: ever played in front of. That's Fenway Park, the smallest

546
00:26:14,278 --> 00:26:17,478
Speaker 1: park in baseball. And then from there he goes to Philadelphia,

547
00:26:17,558 --> 00:26:20,958
Speaker 1: sold out crowd forty five thousand people, half Yankee fans,

548
00:26:20,958 --> 00:26:24,198
Speaker 1: have Philly fans. The places, you know, goes crazy. This

549
00:26:24,278 --> 00:26:28,078
Speaker 1: is a guy I believe is energized by the opportunity

550
00:26:28,118 --> 00:26:30,118
Speaker 1: not just to be in a race, but to have

551
00:26:30,238 --> 00:26:33,838
Speaker 1: the attention on him. I think he's an extrovert guy

552
00:26:34,158 --> 00:26:36,878
Speaker 1: who wants to show people how great he is. And

553
00:26:37,078 --> 00:26:39,358
Speaker 1: you know, he's come out with a bag four home

554
00:26:39,438 --> 00:26:43,038
Speaker 1: runs in his first three games. He's playing third base,

555
00:26:43,078 --> 00:26:46,118
Speaker 1: a position he never played before. He gives the Yankees

556
00:26:46,118 --> 00:26:50,718
Speaker 1: a speed element and some swag that they probably needed. Listen,

557
00:26:50,758 --> 00:26:52,918
Speaker 1: never rolling right now. I love the moves that they've

558
00:26:52,918 --> 00:26:55,638
Speaker 1: made and obviously it still always comes back to Soto

559
00:26:55,718 --> 00:26:58,078
Speaker 1: and Judge. Judge has just been I mean, as great

560
00:26:58,118 --> 00:27:00,798
Speaker 1: as he's been, you know, is seventeen games in a

561
00:27:00,878 --> 00:27:03,198
Speaker 1: row on base, getting on base literally two or three

562
00:27:03,198 --> 00:27:05,718
Speaker 1: times a Night's just been incredible. But I'm telling you,

563
00:27:05,798 --> 00:27:09,358
Speaker 1: the Yankees right now have flipped their entire season. As

564
00:27:09,478 --> 00:27:12,518
Speaker 1: much as they wallowed a mediocrity, a lack of lineup

565
00:27:12,558 --> 00:27:15,758
Speaker 1: depth for two months. It's a different team right now.

566
00:27:16,158 --> 00:27:18,318
Speaker 2: And what's wrong with What's wrong with that? What's wrong

567
00:27:18,358 --> 00:27:21,518
Speaker 2: with Addy? A little charisma? Listen, I have not watched

568
00:27:21,598 --> 00:27:24,718
Speaker 2: him that much jazz play, but I've been watching the

569
00:27:24,798 --> 00:27:27,038
Speaker 2: last couple of days. First of all, I love his

570
00:27:27,078 --> 00:27:29,478
Speaker 2: attitude regarding you. I could play third base, Yeah, give

571
00:27:29,478 --> 00:27:31,638
Speaker 2: it to me. I got it where gliber did not

572
00:27:31,638 --> 00:27:33,358
Speaker 2: want to go there and he said no, I got it.

573
00:27:33,918 --> 00:27:35,758
Speaker 2: And to me, it should have just been the other

574
00:27:35,798 --> 00:27:38,638
Speaker 2: way around, just based on physical ability, athleticism, whatever, up

575
00:27:38,678 --> 00:27:42,238
Speaker 2: the middle versus the corners. So that's my old scouting

576
00:27:42,438 --> 00:27:47,078
Speaker 2: standard right there. So he comes in very charismatic. So

577
00:27:47,398 --> 00:27:51,438
Speaker 2: was Mickey Rivers. So was kind of Reggie Jackson. So

578
00:27:51,758 --> 00:27:55,478
Speaker 2: was Thurman Munson. So was Lou Panellis, So was all

579
00:27:55,558 --> 00:27:58,958
Speaker 2: the former Yankees back in the day. More recently, the

580
00:27:59,278 --> 00:28:02,318
Speaker 2: great teams, Paul O'Neill, the Ice couldn't get off of Pauloni.

581
00:28:02,438 --> 00:28:04,398
Speaker 2: I mean, they've been part of the land. I think

582
00:28:04,438 --> 00:28:06,318
Speaker 2: the team today the last couple of years has been

583
00:28:06,358 --> 00:28:09,078
Speaker 2: way more died in the wool and really lacked that

584
00:28:10,078 --> 00:28:12,758
Speaker 2: kind of a looseness, and not in the sense that

585
00:28:13,678 --> 00:28:15,598
Speaker 2: you're going to take the team down the wrong path,

586
00:28:15,678 --> 00:28:16,958
Speaker 2: just the fact that you go out there and have

587
00:28:17,198 --> 00:28:19,558
Speaker 2: a noticeably a great time playing the game. Like when

588
00:28:19,638 --> 00:28:21,598
Speaker 2: Rizzo walked in there a couple of years ago, they

589
00:28:21,638 --> 00:28:23,798
Speaker 2: automatically started talking about riz and the impact he had

590
00:28:23,838 --> 00:28:26,238
Speaker 2: in the clubhouse. The only thing I don't like I

591
00:28:26,278 --> 00:28:29,038
Speaker 2: don't like the bastardization of the uniform. I don't like

592
00:28:29,078 --> 00:28:31,398
Speaker 2: all the different colors being incorporated in the uniform. It's

593
00:28:31,398 --> 00:28:34,158
Speaker 2: in the uniform, and listen, I'm addressed. I'm not in

594
00:28:34,198 --> 00:28:36,478
Speaker 2: a dress codes. But that's the only part I would

595
00:28:36,518 --> 00:28:38,758
Speaker 2: like to see to become a little bit more strict

596
00:28:38,758 --> 00:28:41,038
Speaker 2: with if you have a uniform, have a uniform. Otherwise

597
00:28:41,158 --> 00:28:42,158
Speaker 2: just wear whatever you want.

598
00:28:42,198 --> 00:28:43,958
Speaker 1: And that's pretty much what you're talking about.

599
00:28:43,958 --> 00:28:47,398
Speaker 2: Green belts with green belts and even judged with the

600
00:28:47,398 --> 00:28:51,118
Speaker 2: aqua sleeves and stuff like that. I mean, I don't

601
00:28:51,158 --> 00:28:53,718
Speaker 2: know a uniform is uniform. I like uniforms, I do,

602
00:28:53,798 --> 00:28:56,118
Speaker 2: and that'd be the only thing other than that. I

603
00:28:56,158 --> 00:28:58,158
Speaker 2: love I love the way he is. I love his energy.

604
00:28:58,878 --> 00:29:01,118
Speaker 2: He did something the other night that wasn't called attention

605
00:29:01,198 --> 00:29:02,918
Speaker 2: to when he stole third base in a seven to

606
00:29:02,998 --> 00:29:06,598
Speaker 2: two game and nobody said anything was a ninth inning.

607
00:29:06,838 --> 00:29:08,398
Speaker 2: Those are the kind of things that could have got

608
00:29:08,398 --> 00:29:09,998
Speaker 2: you hurt back in the day a little bit. So

609
00:29:10,158 --> 00:29:12,238
Speaker 2: maybe just a little bit more education on how to

610
00:29:12,278 --> 00:29:15,078
Speaker 2: play the game. He just needs more information with that.

611
00:29:15,238 --> 00:29:19,758
Speaker 2: But when it comes to charisma, I mean, intensity is there.

612
00:29:20,478 --> 00:29:22,318
Speaker 2: He plays it hard all the time. All the things

613
00:29:22,318 --> 00:29:24,238
Speaker 2: you're looking for is there. I just think he needs

614
00:29:24,238 --> 00:29:26,478
Speaker 2: a little bit more information to really tighten his game up.

615
00:29:27,158 --> 00:29:30,318
Speaker 1: Now let's talk about the LA Dodgers, another favorite coming

616
00:29:30,398 --> 00:29:32,478
Speaker 1: into the season. What they did at the deadline. First

617
00:29:32,518 --> 00:29:35,078
Speaker 1: of all, I think I counted at last count. I

618
00:29:35,078 --> 00:29:39,398
Speaker 1: think they have six shortstops, you know, Mookie Betts, Tommy Edmund,

619
00:29:39,798 --> 00:29:43,598
Speaker 1: I'm at Rosario, Ki k Hernandez, Chris Taylor, on and

620
00:29:43,598 --> 00:29:45,678
Speaker 1: on it go. So I don't know what the final

621
00:29:45,758 --> 00:29:47,838
Speaker 1: arrangement is going to be Defensively, it's great having a

622
00:29:47,838 --> 00:29:49,798
Speaker 1: guy like Mookie. You can play him at second, playing

623
00:29:49,838 --> 00:29:53,398
Speaker 1: it short playm in center field. Kevin Kiermayer, who I

624
00:29:53,438 --> 00:29:55,478
Speaker 1: don't know if he's going to get much run in centerfield.

625
00:29:55,478 --> 00:29:57,118
Speaker 1: He hasn't hit much at all this year, but he

626
00:29:57,158 --> 00:30:00,318
Speaker 1: is a great defender. But the big move was Jack Flaherty.

627
00:30:01,158 --> 00:30:04,278
Speaker 1: That tells me that they're not totally convinced that Moto

628
00:30:04,358 --> 00:30:06,718
Speaker 1: is coming back or at least has enough time to

629
00:30:06,798 --> 00:30:10,678
Speaker 1: be playoff ready. What Clayton Kershaw might be, what he

630
00:30:10,798 --> 00:30:15,278
Speaker 1: is right now, A lot of questions, Bobby Miller, Walker Buehler.

631
00:30:15,798 --> 00:30:17,598
Speaker 1: There's just too many questions for the Dodgers. And they

632
00:30:17,638 --> 00:30:20,518
Speaker 1: went out and got the best starting pitcher who was traded.

633
00:30:20,598 --> 00:30:23,918
Speaker 1: That was Jack Flaherity Trek school Ball was never getting traded.

634
00:30:25,158 --> 00:30:28,118
Speaker 1: Garrett Crochet was never getting traded, especially to the Dodgers,

635
00:30:28,158 --> 00:30:30,558
Speaker 1: because he just imposed too many rules on an interested

636
00:30:30,638 --> 00:30:32,718
Speaker 1: team in terms of, hey, I'm not pitching in October

637
00:30:32,838 --> 00:30:36,558
Speaker 1: unless I get an extension, and so you've got and

638
00:30:36,638 --> 00:30:39,718
Speaker 1: then Blake Snell. The Giants really weren't trading unless they

639
00:30:39,758 --> 00:30:42,078
Speaker 1: got blown away, and that was another contractual issue that

640
00:30:42,118 --> 00:30:45,398
Speaker 1: made it difficult to agree on value. He's either a

641
00:30:45,518 --> 00:30:48,438
Speaker 1: rental for two months or if he opts in, he's

642
00:30:48,478 --> 00:30:51,798
Speaker 1: got thirty million dollars coming next year, and teams weren't

643
00:30:51,838 --> 00:30:53,918
Speaker 1: sure how to value a picture with that kind of

644
00:30:55,078 --> 00:30:58,998
Speaker 1: value fluctuation. So it came down to flarity. He's a

645
00:30:59,038 --> 00:31:01,838
Speaker 1: guy who's thrown his curveball and slider more than ever before.

646
00:31:01,878 --> 00:31:03,878
Speaker 1: He's really gotten heavy on spin. It's worked out for.

647
00:31:04,198 --> 00:31:06,438
Speaker 1: His strikeout rate is up, his walk rate is down.

648
00:31:07,198 --> 00:31:09,318
Speaker 1: He's a guy I believe will start a playoff game

649
00:31:09,358 --> 00:31:12,718
Speaker 1: for the Dodgers. So good for the Dodgers. I mean

650
00:31:12,718 --> 00:31:15,638
Speaker 1: they're scuffling right now, and they've tried all year to

651
00:31:15,678 --> 00:31:19,758
Speaker 1: fill the rotation holes. They needed a little certainty, Joe,

652
00:31:19,798 --> 00:31:23,158
Speaker 1: and I think they got the best option available in

653
00:31:23,238 --> 00:31:25,438
Speaker 1: Jack Flaherty. So if you want to go back to

654
00:31:25,438 --> 00:31:27,918
Speaker 1: your winners and losers, I'd have to say they want

655
00:31:28,038 --> 00:31:31,718
Speaker 1: just on Floherty alone. They didn't pay a high price either.

656
00:31:32,078 --> 00:31:35,758
Speaker 2: I love Edmund. I'm a big Edmund fan from Saint Louis.

657
00:31:36,518 --> 00:31:37,518
Speaker 2: I know he's been injured.

658
00:31:37,718 --> 00:31:39,878
Speaker 1: Yeah, he hasn't been on the field yet this year. Joe,

659
00:31:39,918 --> 00:31:42,318
Speaker 1: I know a rist surgery. It hasn't actually played a

660
00:31:42,358 --> 00:31:44,958
Speaker 1: defensive position, but I'm with you, and if he's healthy,

661
00:31:45,438 --> 00:31:47,878
Speaker 1: love the flexibility and even the offensive game.

662
00:31:48,158 --> 00:31:51,438
Speaker 2: Well, the risk injury always bothers me. Normally, when the

663
00:31:51,478 --> 00:31:54,118
Speaker 2: guy's coming back from that and he's deemed to be well,

664
00:31:54,158 --> 00:31:55,758
Speaker 2: you still have might have to wait a little bit.

665
00:31:55,878 --> 00:31:58,478
Speaker 2: Risks are really touch I mean, after all, that's a

666
00:31:58,558 --> 00:32:01,438
Speaker 2: huge part of the game, your wrists, so that would

667
00:32:01,478 --> 00:32:03,478
Speaker 2: be a little bit concerning. I'm sure they did their

668
00:32:03,558 --> 00:32:06,518
Speaker 2: due Dell homework. But here comes Flaherty. Flaerty when he

669
00:32:06,558 --> 00:32:08,798
Speaker 2: was in Saint Louis, Man, I'll tell you what, one

670
00:32:08,798 --> 00:32:12,198
Speaker 2: of the best athletes as a starting pitcher in all

671
00:32:12,198 --> 00:32:14,318
Speaker 2: of baseball those first couple of years in Saint Louis.

672
00:32:14,318 --> 00:32:16,198
Speaker 2: I was so impressed by him. He could hit, he

673
00:32:16,198 --> 00:32:18,878
Speaker 2: could also run the bases, he could pitch. He had

674
00:32:18,918 --> 00:32:22,798
Speaker 2: great stuff, just so athletic, moves so well, kind of

675
00:32:22,798 --> 00:32:25,238
Speaker 2: like Musgrove, a better version of Musgrove. I thought that,

676
00:32:25,278 --> 00:32:27,478
Speaker 2: you know, with the Pirates and the Padres, I was

677
00:32:27,518 --> 00:32:29,238
Speaker 2: always a big Flaberty. Than then all of a sudden

678
00:32:29,238 --> 00:32:32,398
Speaker 2: it was like, WHOA, what's wrong with this guy? Command

679
00:32:32,478 --> 00:32:35,718
Speaker 2: was not there, never could get out into the fifth inning.

680
00:32:36,438 --> 00:32:39,318
Speaker 2: Showed flashes of brilliance, but it was very inconsistent. And

681
00:32:39,358 --> 00:32:41,198
Speaker 2: I tell you, I like the idea of him throwing

682
00:32:41,198 --> 00:32:43,638
Speaker 2: more breaking balls. There's some guys that have issues was

683
00:32:43,918 --> 00:32:46,638
Speaker 2: commanding their fastball, and you always want you always liked

684
00:32:46,638 --> 00:32:48,958
Speaker 2: the idea of like fastball command setting up everything else,

685
00:32:49,038 --> 00:32:51,238
Speaker 2: but some guys you might have to have breaking ball

686
00:32:51,278 --> 00:32:54,438
Speaker 2: command to set up your fastball. I've had pitches like

687
00:32:54,438 --> 00:32:56,798
Speaker 2: that in the past, where I even had a pitcher

688
00:32:57,238 --> 00:33:00,038
Speaker 2: in the minor leagues that has such a great curveball

689
00:33:00,038 --> 00:33:01,878
Speaker 2: and did not know where his fastball was going. I

690
00:33:01,958 --> 00:33:05,718
Speaker 2: had said, if you threw two consecutive fastball balls, you

691
00:33:05,878 --> 00:33:08,758
Speaker 2: have to mandatory throw a breaking ball, because I thought

692
00:33:08,758 --> 00:33:11,278
Speaker 2: he commanded the breaking ball better. So I don't even

693
00:33:11,278 --> 00:33:13,678
Speaker 2: know if this is an issue of just looking at

694
00:33:13,718 --> 00:33:16,598
Speaker 2: him from the perspective that it was kind of in

695
00:33:16,678 --> 00:33:18,838
Speaker 2: vogue right now to throw more breaking balls, or if

696
00:33:18,838 --> 00:33:21,158
Speaker 2: they felt they commanded his breaking ball better. I've always

697
00:33:21,398 --> 00:33:24,838
Speaker 2: talking about wrists. I've always thought if by doing that,

698
00:33:24,998 --> 00:33:27,758
Speaker 2: you find your wrist, you find your release point, and

699
00:33:27,758 --> 00:33:31,078
Speaker 2: then eventually you find a better method of throwing your fastball.

700
00:33:31,118 --> 00:33:33,918
Speaker 2: Without even thinking about it sometimes when you're just putting

701
00:33:33,918 --> 00:33:37,278
Speaker 2: so much pressure on your fastball to control and command it,

702
00:33:36,918 --> 00:33:39,398
Speaker 2: and it becomes actually a mental kind of a gig,

703
00:33:39,598 --> 00:33:41,078
Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden it becomes shotgun. You

704
00:33:41,158 --> 00:33:43,878
Speaker 2: have no idea where it's going. So I kind of

705
00:33:43,918 --> 00:33:46,438
Speaker 2: like that without having seen it, it makes sense to me.

706
00:33:46,558 --> 00:33:48,478
Speaker 2: But this is one of the better athletes that has

707
00:33:48,638 --> 00:33:50,558
Speaker 2: coming down the pike over the last I don't know

708
00:33:50,598 --> 00:33:54,278
Speaker 2: five whenever he signed, I was with the CUBBIESYT, so

709
00:33:54,318 --> 00:33:56,878
Speaker 2: it had to be like eighteen, nineteen seventeen. He was

710
00:33:56,878 --> 00:33:59,358
Speaker 2: in there at some point. This guy has great stuff

711
00:33:59,598 --> 00:34:00,878
Speaker 2: and he's a great athlete.

712
00:34:01,118 --> 00:34:03,878
Speaker 1: Well said, let's jump around real quickly to some other teams.

713
00:34:04,038 --> 00:34:07,558
Speaker 1: Pittsburgh Pirates are a player, Joe, the Pittsburgh Pirates added

714
00:34:07,598 --> 00:34:09,718
Speaker 1: at the deadline. And how about this. On the last

715
00:34:09,798 --> 00:34:14,078
Speaker 1: day of the trade deadline, nine hitters were traded. It's

716
00:34:14,078 --> 00:34:16,438
Speaker 1: not a lot, right, I mean, it's just not a

717
00:34:16,478 --> 00:34:20,158
Speaker 1: lot out there. Nine hitters were traded. Eight of them

718
00:34:20,398 --> 00:34:25,318
Speaker 1: have below average adjusted ops's The best hitter that was

719
00:34:25,358 --> 00:34:28,918
Speaker 1: traded on the last day of the trade deadline was

720
00:34:29,038 --> 00:34:32,358
Speaker 1: Isaiah Kiner Fileffe and he went to the Pittsburgh Pirates,

721
00:34:32,438 --> 00:34:34,478
Speaker 1: and by the way, he signed for next year as well.

722
00:34:34,678 --> 00:34:36,758
Speaker 1: That was a really good pickup. They also got Brian

723
00:34:36,798 --> 00:34:41,078
Speaker 1: dey la Cruz from the Marlins. Nice pickup. Pirates are

724
00:34:41,078 --> 00:34:43,878
Speaker 1: a dangerous team, Joe. They're in the wildcard race and

725
00:34:43,958 --> 00:34:46,598
Speaker 1: I'm telling you, you've been there on bad teams, You've

726
00:34:46,598 --> 00:34:49,558
Speaker 1: been there with good teams. For a team that traditionally

727
00:34:49,638 --> 00:34:52,278
Speaker 1: has done nothing but sell off at the deadline, that

728
00:34:52,518 --> 00:34:54,958
Speaker 1: has to energize that group, no.

729
00:34:54,838 --> 00:34:56,878
Speaker 2: Doubt, no doubt. I mean, if you're not used to

730
00:34:56,918 --> 00:34:59,038
Speaker 2: having somebody walk in the door only having people leave,

731
00:34:59,078 --> 00:35:00,958
Speaker 2: it's going to make a big difference. You know, the

732
00:35:01,078 --> 00:35:03,478
Speaker 2: cutcheon being at the head of that whole thing. And

733
00:35:03,558 --> 00:35:06,958
Speaker 2: again you look at players that are less stand that

734
00:35:07,238 --> 00:35:09,718
Speaker 2: they're tradable, and they pick him up out again. I

735
00:35:09,838 --> 00:35:12,438
Speaker 2: believe that they believe they can fix this guy. Whatever

736
00:35:12,478 --> 00:35:15,438
Speaker 2: they feel like the deficiency is. They feel like they

737
00:35:15,478 --> 00:35:19,118
Speaker 2: have the anecdote they could fix this guy. And that's

738
00:35:19,398 --> 00:35:21,878
Speaker 2: that's just how this thing works now. Connor Philippa, I

739
00:35:21,958 --> 00:35:24,518
Speaker 2: like him. I liked him with the Rangers a lot.

740
00:35:24,558 --> 00:35:26,038
Speaker 2: When he was at the Rangers. He was a really

741
00:35:26,078 --> 00:35:28,678
Speaker 2: good player. He was kind of like David Fletcher is

742
00:35:28,718 --> 00:35:30,998
Speaker 2: another version of Dave. I'm still being a big David

743
00:35:31,038 --> 00:35:36,558
Speaker 2: Fletcher phantom surprised he's really drifted away. This guy could

744
00:35:36,598 --> 00:35:38,158
Speaker 2: fill a lot of these voice for a lot of

745
00:35:38,158 --> 00:35:41,078
Speaker 2: these different teams if he's playing like I saw him play.

746
00:35:41,078 --> 00:35:44,318
Speaker 2: But Conner Philippa is that kind of a player, I think.

747
00:35:44,398 --> 00:35:46,878
Speaker 2: So yes. When a guy with that experience walks in

748
00:35:46,918 --> 00:35:49,438
Speaker 2: the door to the Pirates, maybe you know it's not

749
00:35:49,558 --> 00:35:54,198
Speaker 2: the big Marque guy, but conversationally at a locker rafter

750
00:35:54,238 --> 00:35:56,758
Speaker 2: a game, a lot of locker before the game, on

751
00:35:56,838 --> 00:35:59,198
Speaker 2: the field, during batting practice, whether it's on defense or

752
00:35:59,198 --> 00:36:01,238
Speaker 2: by the cage, guys like this can do a lot

753
00:36:01,238 --> 00:36:03,118
Speaker 2: of good for you. These guys like this can get

754
00:36:03,118 --> 00:36:07,078
Speaker 2: somebody's right before the game begins, and you cannot underestimate

755
00:36:07,118 --> 00:36:09,238
Speaker 2: how important that is. So yes, I agree. I'm a

756
00:36:09,238 --> 00:36:12,318
Speaker 2: Pirate fan does my second team growing up because I

757
00:36:12,398 --> 00:36:14,758
Speaker 2: like their uniform so much and I love Roberto Clemente.

758
00:36:14,918 --> 00:36:16,878
Speaker 2: But otherwise I think they've done a lot of good

759
00:36:16,878 --> 00:36:17,918
Speaker 2: things that I'm rooting for them.

760
00:36:18,158 --> 00:36:20,318
Speaker 1: And here's a question for you. With the last person

761
00:36:20,398 --> 00:36:22,598
Speaker 1: leaving the state of Florida, turn the lights off, please.

762
00:36:23,518 --> 00:36:26,798
Speaker 1: Eighteen Major League players were traded by the Rays and

763
00:36:26,838 --> 00:36:31,198
Speaker 1: the Marlins. And I understand limited resources. I get it.

764
00:36:31,558 --> 00:36:34,278
Speaker 1: You know, they shouldn't be trying to win the World Series.

765
00:36:34,358 --> 00:36:38,518
Speaker 1: I understand that, but you also, to me, you cannot

766
00:36:38,558 --> 00:36:41,958
Speaker 1: celebrate the tremendous amount of turn that goes on. I

767
00:36:41,958 --> 00:36:44,678
Speaker 1: don't want to hear about how smart these front offices

768
00:36:44,718 --> 00:36:48,158
Speaker 1: are because they pirated somebody's, you know, number eight prospect

769
00:36:48,198 --> 00:36:52,998
Speaker 1: in their system. Eighteen major league players left the Marlins

770
00:36:53,078 --> 00:36:58,518
Speaker 1: and the Rays. It's just not good when it continually happened. Yeah,

771
00:36:58,558 --> 00:37:00,558
Speaker 1: every team's going to go through periods where you need

772
00:37:00,638 --> 00:37:04,558
Speaker 1: to retrench. I get it, but my goodness, that's a

773
00:37:04,718 --> 00:37:07,278
Speaker 1: lot of major league talent moving out of the state

774
00:37:07,318 --> 00:37:07,838
Speaker 1: of Florida.

775
00:37:08,358 --> 00:37:10,918
Speaker 2: Great, you're right on, right on. And you you know

776
00:37:11,198 --> 00:37:14,918
Speaker 2: when I was there, when we got there in six

777
00:37:16,318 --> 00:37:18,038
Speaker 2: everybody said, oh, the Ray's got to get out of

778
00:37:18,038 --> 00:37:19,718
Speaker 2: this division with the Yankees and the Red Sox, they

779
00:37:19,718 --> 00:37:21,518
Speaker 2: got to get to another division. And I said, no,

780
00:37:22,518 --> 00:37:25,038
Speaker 2: for me, it was we needed to stay there because

781
00:37:25,398 --> 00:37:27,518
Speaker 2: you got at that time, you had to play the

782
00:37:27,558 --> 00:37:31,038
Speaker 2: Red Sox and the Yankees. Was it eighteen times? Nineteen

783
00:37:31,038 --> 00:37:33,718
Speaker 2: times annually? And you had to pay half of that

784
00:37:33,798 --> 00:37:35,678
Speaker 2: in their ballpark, and I thought the best way to

785
00:37:35,718 --> 00:37:38,318
Speaker 2: get good quick was to play in those kind of

786
00:37:38,398 --> 00:37:40,958
Speaker 2: environments where it was really tough. It was very difficult.

787
00:37:41,318 --> 00:37:42,998
Speaker 2: You had to be at your best, you had to

788
00:37:42,998 --> 00:37:46,238
Speaker 2: play baseball. And my thought was, I didn't care. This

789
00:37:46,358 --> 00:37:48,118
Speaker 2: is what I mean. You look it up. I don't

790
00:37:48,158 --> 00:37:51,678
Speaker 2: care what the payroll is. It's about who plays a

791
00:37:51,718 --> 00:37:54,158
Speaker 2: better game at baseball on a specific night. That's how

792
00:37:54,158 --> 00:37:55,398
Speaker 2: I looked at it, and that's what I used to

793
00:37:55,398 --> 00:37:58,318
Speaker 2: try to sell my guys. You can look at all

794
00:37:58,318 --> 00:38:00,518
Speaker 2: the names, all this stuff. There's some great lineups, look

795
00:38:00,518 --> 00:38:02,238
Speaker 2: at the Yankee lineups, look at the Red Sox lineups

796
00:38:02,278 --> 00:38:04,518
Speaker 2: at that time, and here comes the Rays. So my

797
00:38:04,678 --> 00:38:06,918
Speaker 2: selling point was, and I believe this, and I still do,

798
00:38:07,398 --> 00:38:09,798
Speaker 2: who plays the better game tonight? Who plays the better

799
00:38:09,838 --> 00:38:16,038
Speaker 2: game of baseball tonight? Baseball, not the rote a wireball, whatever, baseball.

800
00:38:16,118 --> 00:38:19,438
Speaker 2: Who plays the better game tonight? And that's how the

801
00:38:19,518 --> 00:38:24,278
Speaker 2: race got good because we faced it down, we embraced

802
00:38:24,318 --> 00:38:27,718
Speaker 2: the target. We walked right into that fire, and eventually

803
00:38:27,758 --> 00:38:30,758
Speaker 2: we beat the Red Sox in Boston, which was not easy.

804
00:38:31,598 --> 00:38:33,238
Speaker 2: It was harder for us to beat the Red Sox

805
00:38:33,278 --> 00:38:34,598
Speaker 2: in Boston than it was for us to beat the

806
00:38:34,678 --> 00:38:36,558
Speaker 2: Yankees in New York. But you had to get those

807
00:38:36,558 --> 00:38:39,358
Speaker 2: two things. There's nothing more gratifying than walking out of

808
00:38:39,398 --> 00:38:43,278
Speaker 2: a dugout at that particular point between two thousand and seven,

809
00:38:43,318 --> 00:38:46,358
Speaker 2: eight nine ten, walking out the dugout in Fenway or

810
00:38:46,398 --> 00:38:49,038
Speaker 2: a Yankee stadium shaking hands after a win on the

811
00:38:49,078 --> 00:38:52,478
Speaker 2: Mount Gosh, that was one of my the happiest moments.

812
00:38:52,718 --> 00:38:55,278
Speaker 2: That's the happiest moment of your baseball life at that time.

813
00:38:55,638 --> 00:38:58,958
Speaker 2: So it's still there, man. I just again, I don't

814
00:38:58,958 --> 00:39:01,238
Speaker 2: know that people. It's a narrative. How do you convince

815
00:39:01,278 --> 00:39:02,718
Speaker 2: your guys that you can do this stuff, or how

816
00:39:02,758 --> 00:39:04,958
Speaker 2: do you convince that you can't do this The narrative

817
00:39:04,998 --> 00:39:07,678
Speaker 2: always is convincing that you can't do it for me,

818
00:39:08,118 --> 00:39:09,998
Speaker 2: Yet you're spending more money. But who's going to play

819
00:39:10,038 --> 00:39:11,318
Speaker 2: better brand of baseball tonight?

820
00:39:11,718 --> 00:39:13,878
Speaker 1: And finally, Joe, I want to give you two under

821
00:39:13,918 --> 00:39:16,478
Speaker 1: the radar moves to me that could have the biggest

822
00:39:16,598 --> 00:39:20,598
Speaker 1: impact the additions for me. Number one is Michael Kopak

823
00:39:20,638 --> 00:39:23,718
Speaker 1: going from the White Sox to the Dodgers. This guy,

824
00:39:23,758 --> 00:39:26,718
Speaker 1: if you look at his fastball properties, it's off the charts.

825
00:39:27,118 --> 00:39:30,118
Speaker 1: I mean, he's got a Garrett Cole fastball. He needs

826
00:39:30,118 --> 00:39:32,398
Speaker 1: work on his slider, he needs work on command. And

827
00:39:32,398 --> 00:39:35,398
Speaker 1: again you talk about teams fixing people, the Dodgers have

828
00:39:35,398 --> 00:39:38,478
Speaker 1: a tremendous history with their resources, especially when it comes

829
00:39:38,478 --> 00:39:41,598
Speaker 1: to spin. I think he's going to be a dominant

830
00:39:41,638 --> 00:39:44,718
Speaker 1: postseason pitcher for them, a multiple inning guy, come in

831
00:39:44,718 --> 00:39:46,518
Speaker 1: the six to seventh inning and shut a game down,

832
00:39:46,598 --> 00:39:48,878
Speaker 1: give the offense time to come back. The other one

833
00:39:48,878 --> 00:39:51,638
Speaker 1: for me is Alex Cobb. I know you like Alex Cobb.

834
00:39:51,438 --> 00:39:52,398
Speaker 2: A lot, love him.

835
00:39:52,478 --> 00:39:54,478
Speaker 1: Hasn't pitched at all this year, but he's coming off

836
00:39:54,518 --> 00:39:56,998
Speaker 1: a hip injury. He's on his rehab, he's got one

837
00:39:56,998 --> 00:40:00,518
Speaker 1: more start. He'll be in the Cleveland rotation. Cleveland did

838
00:40:00,598 --> 00:40:03,678
Speaker 1: need a veteran arm in that rotation, and they got

839
00:40:03,718 --> 00:40:08,278
Speaker 1: a really, really good one, a battle tested one. Listen

840
00:40:08,358 --> 00:40:10,518
Speaker 1: that the Giants are going for. But they're using a

841
00:40:10,518 --> 00:40:13,118
Speaker 1: Hayden bird song and the rookie in the rotation rather

842
00:40:13,158 --> 00:40:16,158
Speaker 1: than trusting Cobb coming back, which is fine, that's Italian

843
00:40:16,158 --> 00:40:20,158
Speaker 1: evaluation thing. But good on Cleveland to be imaginative enough

844
00:40:20,158 --> 00:40:21,638
Speaker 1: to go out there and take a picture. Who hasn't

845
00:40:21,638 --> 00:40:23,718
Speaker 1: throwing a pitch in the major leagues this year, and

846
00:40:23,798 --> 00:40:26,398
Speaker 1: think we get to the postseason, we've got ourselves a

847
00:40:26,558 --> 00:40:28,318
Speaker 1: tough cookie as a veteran starter.

848
00:40:29,278 --> 00:40:32,358
Speaker 2: Ac Alex one of my favorite that I've ever had,

849
00:40:33,118 --> 00:40:38,438
Speaker 2: among the best makeup guys I've ever had. Big game situation,

850
00:40:38,758 --> 00:40:43,518
Speaker 2: you know to expect and his stuff. Listen. I try

851
00:40:43,598 --> 00:40:45,718
Speaker 2: to convince THEO to sign him with the Cubs the

852
00:40:45,758 --> 00:40:49,198
Speaker 2: year that we signed Chatwood, that came in for a

853
00:40:49,198 --> 00:40:53,198
Speaker 2: couple of years, and we couldn't get that done because

854
00:40:53,318 --> 00:40:56,118
Speaker 2: Alex was coming off some tough moments there. But this

855
00:40:56,238 --> 00:40:59,838
Speaker 2: guy's change up, whatever that is, that vulcan pitch that

856
00:40:59,878 --> 00:41:02,958
Speaker 2: he's got is unbelievably good. And the thing that about

857
00:41:03,118 --> 00:41:06,638
Speaker 2: Alex also the totally I thought was underrated for so

858
00:41:06,678 --> 00:41:09,838
Speaker 2: many years. There's this curveball. His curveball is outstanding, and

859
00:41:10,118 --> 00:41:11,878
Speaker 2: then he knows how to pitch with this fastball and

860
00:41:11,918 --> 00:41:13,958
Speaker 2: he got a little funck in his delivery. He's great

861
00:41:13,998 --> 00:41:15,878
Speaker 2: at holding runners, he's got a very quick move in

862
00:41:15,918 --> 00:41:18,758
Speaker 2: the first base, and the makeup, like I said, is

863
00:41:19,038 --> 00:41:23,598
Speaker 2: overwhelmingly great. He when he's not pitching, talking about that group,

864
00:41:23,758 --> 00:41:26,398
Speaker 2: he's going to walk around before the game in the

865
00:41:26,438 --> 00:41:28,758
Speaker 2: clubhouse after the game. In the clubhouse, he's going to

866
00:41:28,798 --> 00:41:31,518
Speaker 2: do all the things necessary that you want from a

867
00:41:31,638 --> 00:41:36,678
Speaker 2: really established and a good starting pitcher, major league pitcher. Listen,

868
00:41:36,798 --> 00:41:38,438
Speaker 2: I could go on and on about this guy. I'm

869
00:41:38,518 --> 00:41:41,718
Speaker 2: that big of a fan. Be wonderful to see him

870
00:41:41,718 --> 00:41:44,478
Speaker 2: come back healthy and well because if he does, and

871
00:41:44,478 --> 00:41:46,238
Speaker 2: you know, the shortened part of the season like kind

872
00:41:46,238 --> 00:41:47,678
Speaker 2: of right now, he's got only a couple of months

873
00:41:47,758 --> 00:41:52,238
Speaker 2: to cover heads up. If he's If he's well, he's

874
00:41:52,278 --> 00:41:54,558
Speaker 2: because he likes it. He likes this stuff. He likes

875
00:41:54,638 --> 00:41:56,598
Speaker 2: pitching in big games, and he's really good in him

876
00:41:56,998 --> 00:41:58,998
Speaker 2: and he can get out good hit or is both

877
00:41:59,038 --> 00:42:02,398
Speaker 2: sides of the plate. A big fan of the move Kopek,

878
00:42:02,478 --> 00:42:04,158
Speaker 2: I don't really know. I know he's got a great arm,

879
00:42:04,198 --> 00:42:06,238
Speaker 2: but I've never really seen a lot of him. But again,

880
00:42:06,278 --> 00:42:08,358
Speaker 2: you're right, I think the Dodgers see something they think

881
00:42:08,358 --> 00:42:08,918
Speaker 2: they can fix.

882
00:42:09,398 --> 00:42:11,438
Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break right here. When

883
00:42:11,798 --> 00:42:13,998
Speaker 1: we get back, I want to ask Joe about something

884
00:42:14,038 --> 00:42:16,918
Speaker 1: that happened with Dave Roberts of the LA Dodgers in

885
00:42:17,038 --> 00:42:19,958
Speaker 1: terms of a manager and the rule book that I've

886
00:42:20,078 --> 00:42:23,318
Speaker 1: never seen before. Maybe he has I'll run that scenario

887
00:42:23,438 --> 00:42:38,638
Speaker 1: by him right after this. Okay, Joe, I need to

888
00:42:38,718 --> 00:42:43,118
Speaker 1: get your memory working here and your vast resources history

889
00:42:43,158 --> 00:42:45,638
Speaker 1: of the game, because I've seen a lot of baseball myself,

890
00:42:45,638 --> 00:42:48,958
Speaker 1: but I haven't quite seen this where Dave Roberts. It

891
00:42:49,038 --> 00:42:51,718
Speaker 1: was a game against the Padres, extra innings, bases are loaded,

892
00:42:51,878 --> 00:42:53,838
Speaker 1: and first of all, Mike Schiltz, who I think is

893
00:42:53,878 --> 00:42:58,238
Speaker 1: a really good manager, pinch hits for Jake Croinworth, his

894
00:42:58,358 --> 00:43:02,078
Speaker 1: number three hitter in the lineup against the lefty Alex Basia,

895
00:43:02,358 --> 00:43:04,318
Speaker 1: and I don't think the Dodgers works. I think that

896
00:43:04,438 --> 00:43:07,118
Speaker 1: to happen, he send up Donovan Solano, the right hander,

897
00:43:07,198 --> 00:43:09,918
Speaker 1: to pinch hit. So when the pinch hitter is announced,

898
00:43:10,078 --> 00:43:12,118
Speaker 1: Mark Pryor the pitching coach, goes out to the mound

899
00:43:12,198 --> 00:43:15,238
Speaker 1: to talk to Visilla. That's typical because when a pinch

900
00:43:15,318 --> 00:43:18,118
Speaker 1: hitter is announced, it's not charged. As one of those

901
00:43:18,198 --> 00:43:20,598
Speaker 1: five official mound visits you have. You get a chance

902
00:43:20,678 --> 00:43:23,478
Speaker 1: to review the scouting report on a pinch hitter, which

903
00:43:23,558 --> 00:43:27,398
Speaker 1: is fine. So then Dave Roberts came out after that

904
00:43:27,758 --> 00:43:31,318
Speaker 1: and wanted to know if he could change pitchers, and

905
00:43:31,438 --> 00:43:34,758
Speaker 1: obviously you can't because he now has to face a batter.

906
00:43:34,878 --> 00:43:36,758
Speaker 1: Once there's a mound visit, the pitcher has to face

907
00:43:36,798 --> 00:43:39,798
Speaker 1: a batter. And while this is going on, the pitch

908
00:43:39,878 --> 00:43:44,558
Speaker 1: timer is running, so a ball is charged to Visia,

909
00:43:44,758 --> 00:43:47,198
Speaker 1: so he starts with the bases loaded, tie game, extra

910
00:43:47,238 --> 00:43:50,798
Speaker 1: innings with one zero count. Next pitch, Donovan Solano wins

911
00:43:50,838 --> 00:43:53,798
Speaker 1: the game with a bass hit. There a little confusion there,

912
00:43:54,118 --> 00:43:56,358
Speaker 1: but it began to me with Mike Schildt and the

913
00:43:56,398 --> 00:43:59,638
Speaker 1: Padres making the aggressive decision to pinch hit for the lefty,

914
00:44:00,958 --> 00:44:02,918
Speaker 1: the number three hitter of the lineup, a good hitter.

915
00:44:03,038 --> 00:44:06,958
Speaker 1: Jake Cronenworth, who was typically as Jake is, was cool

916
00:44:06,998 --> 00:44:08,638
Speaker 1: with it after the game and he's like, oh, I'm

917
00:44:08,678 --> 00:44:10,638
Speaker 1: trying to do is win. Yeah, I was ready to hit,

918
00:44:10,718 --> 00:44:12,598
Speaker 1: but I'm okay with it because we're winning the game.

919
00:44:12,718 --> 00:44:15,038
Speaker 1: Beautiful interesting scenario there, beautiful.

920
00:44:15,398 --> 00:44:19,838
Speaker 2: Yeah. First of all, I'd want to believe because I

921
00:44:19,878 --> 00:44:21,398
Speaker 2: think I would have done it if I ever had

922
00:44:21,438 --> 00:44:23,198
Speaker 2: that in my back of my mind, because maybe Coroner

923
00:44:23,198 --> 00:44:24,998
Speaker 2: Whorth's been struggling, or you know, you're coming in against

924
00:44:24,998 --> 00:44:26,518
Speaker 2: the Dodgers. They have all these lefties that are going

925
00:44:26,598 --> 00:44:28,558
Speaker 2: to match up with and I have a Solano is

926
00:44:28,558 --> 00:44:31,718
Speaker 2: a really that's a perfect guy, contact guy in that situation.

927
00:44:32,478 --> 00:44:34,918
Speaker 2: Having that conversation with Coroner Worth in advance would be

928
00:44:35,038 --> 00:44:36,798
Speaker 2: vital to me that I would go out to and say,

929
00:44:36,838 --> 00:44:39,398
Speaker 2: listen if this were to occur, because it's don him

930
00:44:39,398 --> 00:44:41,358
Speaker 2: and Solono, a guy that could a veteran that could

931
00:44:41,358 --> 00:44:43,878
Speaker 2: really move to baseball. I think it's easier for obviously

932
00:44:43,958 --> 00:44:46,918
Speaker 2: for coner Worth to understand that, plus just the fact

933
00:44:46,918 --> 00:44:48,518
Speaker 2: that you'd want to do it at all. So Number one,

934
00:44:48,598 --> 00:44:51,358
Speaker 2: I think that's part of it. I'd be curious. Number two,

935
00:44:51,798 --> 00:44:54,878
Speaker 2: Shilty's a minor league manager. He's a grunt. He's seen

936
00:44:54,958 --> 00:44:57,918
Speaker 2: these situations before, he's done these things before, and he's

937
00:44:57,998 --> 00:45:00,998
Speaker 2: not concerned about having to answer tough questions afterwards if

938
00:45:01,038 --> 00:45:03,278
Speaker 2: it doesn't work, because that's why it falls under the

939
00:45:03,318 --> 00:45:06,238
Speaker 2: category of the right thing to do. So you do

940
00:45:06,398 --> 00:45:08,238
Speaker 2: the right thing, and if it doesn't work, that doesn't

941
00:45:08,238 --> 00:45:09,958
Speaker 2: mean it was a wrong decision. It just means it

942
00:45:09,998 --> 00:45:12,598
Speaker 2: didn't work out. So I'm looking at that and yeah,

943
00:45:12,598 --> 00:45:14,918
Speaker 2: I mean, yes, you have to face that one more hitter.

944
00:45:14,998 --> 00:45:17,878
Speaker 2: And that's the beauty of that whole situation, the way

945
00:45:17,918 --> 00:45:21,198
Speaker 2: it came down. So listen, I worked against Shilty, and

946
00:45:21,638 --> 00:45:23,998
Speaker 2: when I looked across the field and the things that

947
00:45:24,078 --> 00:45:26,998
Speaker 2: he did, promise you, this is exactly what I thought

948
00:45:27,038 --> 00:45:29,878
Speaker 2: to myself. This guy was a minor league manager. He

949
00:45:29,998 --> 00:45:31,878
Speaker 2: worked in the minor league. Bruce Boch, he was a

950
00:45:31,958 --> 00:45:34,638
Speaker 2: minor league manager. He worked in the minor leagues. Jimmy

951
00:45:34,718 --> 00:45:36,758
Speaker 2: Leland minor league manager, worked a lot of time in

952
00:45:36,798 --> 00:45:39,318
Speaker 2: the minor leagues. It was obvious to me. And these

953
00:45:39,318 --> 00:45:41,238
Speaker 2: are the guys that caused me my most concern, and

954
00:45:41,318 --> 00:45:44,278
Speaker 2: the other dugout because believe me, they're thinking this stuff

955
00:45:44,278 --> 00:45:46,998
Speaker 2: all the way through. They've had these conversations with you know,

956
00:45:47,398 --> 00:45:51,398
Speaker 2: their coaches in the past. They've sat after tough losses

957
00:45:51,438 --> 00:45:53,518
Speaker 2: and talked about things with the beer for years. They've

958
00:45:53,558 --> 00:45:56,878
Speaker 2: done this. So it's hard to slip something by these

959
00:45:56,958 --> 00:46:00,198
Speaker 2: guys because they've they've been there, done that. So doesn't

960
00:46:00,238 --> 00:46:02,838
Speaker 2: surprise me about Shilty. And understand, this is where all

961
00:46:02,878 --> 00:46:06,278
Speaker 2: the little nuance comes in. Have the conversation before and

962
00:46:06,438 --> 00:46:08,838
Speaker 2: give somebody heads up. You're thinking this if it were

963
00:46:08,878 --> 00:46:11,118
Speaker 2: to pop, and then that way a guy like Conaworth

964
00:46:11,158 --> 00:46:13,798
Speaker 2: could accept it more easily. But of course, when Solano

965
00:46:13,838 --> 00:46:15,158
Speaker 2: gets a hit, everybody's happy.

966
00:46:15,758 --> 00:46:18,998
Speaker 1: Yeah, good stuff. I mean, I think again, I'll go

967
00:46:19,158 --> 00:46:22,238
Speaker 1: back to where we started, Joe, with the importance of bullpens,

968
00:46:22,358 --> 00:46:25,638
Speaker 1: and it actually plays up in the postseason and on

969
00:46:25,838 --> 00:46:28,118
Speaker 1: the other side of the deadline. I am now looking

970
00:46:28,158 --> 00:46:32,398
Speaker 1: at the Cleveland Guardians and the San Diego Padres as

971
00:46:32,478 --> 00:46:37,038
Speaker 1: two nightmare matchups for a higher seeded team. If you're

972
00:46:37,078 --> 00:46:41,358
Speaker 1: looking for this year's version of say last year's Diamondbacks

973
00:46:41,478 --> 00:46:45,118
Speaker 1: or last year's Rangers, I would start with those two teams.

974
00:46:46,558 --> 00:46:49,438
Speaker 1: Both teams, by the way, also have high end talent,

975
00:46:50,158 --> 00:46:54,038
Speaker 1: real true star players, and I like the way the

976
00:46:54,118 --> 00:46:56,798
Speaker 1: managers run both of those teams. I love the fact

977
00:46:56,838 --> 00:47:00,278
Speaker 1: that they don't lose games late, and both teams have

978
00:47:00,518 --> 00:47:03,278
Speaker 1: to me some nice momentum going. So I know that

979
00:47:03,478 --> 00:47:08,678
Speaker 1: chalk is you know, top five payrolls, you know Dodgers, Yankees, Phillies, Braves,

980
00:47:08,718 --> 00:47:12,958
Speaker 1: et cetera. But if you're looking for a nightmare matchup

981
00:47:13,038 --> 00:47:15,358
Speaker 1: in the postseason environment, because it is a different kind

982
00:47:15,398 --> 00:47:18,398
Speaker 1: of game, keep your eye on Cleveland and San Diego.

983
00:47:18,758 --> 00:47:22,078
Speaker 2: Can't disagree. I love that stuff. And again, who's who's

984
00:47:22,118 --> 00:47:24,998
Speaker 2: playing better baseball? Play better baseball. It's not it's not

985
00:47:25,078 --> 00:47:27,838
Speaker 2: about your pocketbooks and how much money you've spent. Who's

986
00:47:27,838 --> 00:47:30,718
Speaker 2: playing better baseball? What is the philosophy? Look at the

987
00:47:30,718 --> 00:47:32,838
Speaker 2: way the Indians play. I mean, my gosh, that's that's

988
00:47:32,878 --> 00:47:34,878
Speaker 2: beautiful the way they play. They play hard all the time.

989
00:47:34,918 --> 00:47:37,118
Speaker 2: I'm loving you that voters having a great first season.

990
00:47:37,598 --> 00:47:39,558
Speaker 2: I love all of that. I love all of that.

991
00:47:39,678 --> 00:47:42,358
Speaker 2: Now that he's got Cobbra there, that's yeah. Probably he

992
00:47:42,438 --> 00:47:44,958
Speaker 2: probably caught Cobber with the with the race at some point.

993
00:47:45,878 --> 00:47:48,158
Speaker 2: I think they might have overlapped a little bit. That's

994
00:47:48,238 --> 00:47:50,078
Speaker 2: kind of interesting. I mean, I think Cobbra might be

995
00:47:50,118 --> 00:47:53,438
Speaker 2: as old as Steven. I. You know, that's kind of

996
00:47:53,478 --> 00:47:56,638
Speaker 2: a nice situation. But I I you know, it's noticeable

997
00:47:57,038 --> 00:47:59,718
Speaker 2: when a team develops their own personality and method of

998
00:47:59,758 --> 00:48:03,038
Speaker 2: play and it stands out. And I really really do

999
00:48:03,158 --> 00:48:07,678
Speaker 2: appreciate anything that's apparent with the Indians. It's I don't

1000
00:48:07,838 --> 00:48:09,518
Speaker 2: I don't watch the padres enough to know that, but

1001
00:48:09,598 --> 00:48:12,198
Speaker 2: I know Shilty and I know what the demands are

1002
00:48:12,238 --> 00:48:13,998
Speaker 2: going to be there, and I know the conversations are

1003
00:48:14,038 --> 00:48:17,198
Speaker 2: going to take place. So it's all interesting stuff. There's

1004
00:48:17,238 --> 00:48:19,558
Speaker 2: going to be an outlier maybe too, Like you're talking

1005
00:48:19,598 --> 00:48:22,998
Speaker 2: about somebody will separate at that particular time at the

1006
00:48:23,038 --> 00:48:24,718
Speaker 2: end of the year during the playoffs. But for right now,

1007
00:48:25,478 --> 00:48:27,518
Speaker 2: who's going to play the better game of baseball tonight?

1008
00:48:27,958 --> 00:48:31,278
Speaker 1: By the way, Joe, this is our ninety ninth episode

1009
00:48:31,798 --> 00:48:34,718
Speaker 1: of the Book of Joe, number ninety nine. It goes quickly,

1010
00:48:34,798 --> 00:48:35,118
Speaker 1: doesn't it.

1011
00:48:35,158 --> 00:48:37,878
Speaker 2: It's our Aaron Judge episode right here, there you go.

1012
00:48:39,678 --> 00:48:42,718
Speaker 1: And by the way, we are working on efforting a

1013
00:48:43,518 --> 00:48:49,678
Speaker 1: surprise mystery guest for episode number one hundred. So for

1014
00:48:49,758 --> 00:48:51,758
Speaker 1: those of you who just joined us, those of us,

1015
00:48:52,078 --> 00:48:54,638
Speaker 1: those of you who have been around, you don't want

1016
00:48:54,678 --> 00:48:57,478
Speaker 1: to miss episode number one hundred, not that you want

1017
00:48:57,518 --> 00:49:01,158
Speaker 1: to miss any any episode that we have, but especially

1018
00:49:01,278 --> 00:49:02,638
Speaker 1: for one hundred. How's that for a tease.

1019
00:49:02,718 --> 00:49:06,878
Speaker 2: That's nicely done. Looking forward to this surprise guest. Also,

1020
00:49:08,638 --> 00:49:10,638
Speaker 2: it's going to be very interesting to say the least

1021
00:49:10,758 --> 00:49:15,558
Speaker 2: is a man of many talents and interests, especially in

1022
00:49:15,638 --> 00:49:17,998
Speaker 2: the game of baseball, and I'm just curious to get

1023
00:49:18,038 --> 00:49:19,718
Speaker 2: his take on what's going on in the game today.

1024
00:49:19,998 --> 00:49:25,758
Speaker 1: Well said, And as far as ninety nine, who is

1025
00:49:25,838 --> 00:49:27,598
Speaker 1: going to take us out in the court of the day?

1026
00:49:27,758 --> 00:49:30,398
Speaker 1: Here Joe? For episode ninety nine of the Book of

1027
00:49:30,478 --> 00:49:31,918
Speaker 1: Joe Winnie Churchill.

1028
00:49:31,958 --> 00:49:36,078
Speaker 2: And this was serendipitous because going into this morning, based

1029
00:49:36,118 --> 00:49:40,918
Speaker 2: on the trade deadline, I just researched evaluation. You know,

1030
00:49:41,798 --> 00:49:46,038
Speaker 2: how do you go about evaluating quotes on evaluation? And gosh,

1031
00:49:46,118 --> 00:49:47,598
Speaker 2: it was a bunch that popped up and kind of

1032
00:49:47,638 --> 00:49:50,598
Speaker 2: surprised me. But typically Winston Churchill, you know, one of

1033
00:49:50,598 --> 00:49:52,838
Speaker 2: the greatest leaders. You know, you could bang on him

1034
00:49:52,878 --> 00:49:55,798
Speaker 2: as much as you want, but to have the cajones

1035
00:49:55,838 --> 00:49:57,838
Speaker 2: to do what he did during World War two man

1036
00:49:58,918 --> 00:50:02,838
Speaker 2: and stick to his guns literally, it is truly incredible.

1037
00:50:02,838 --> 00:50:08,078
Speaker 2: So anyway, true genius resides in the capacity for evaluation

1038
00:50:08,238 --> 00:50:14,838
Speaker 2: of uncertain, hazardous and conflicting information. So that's what he

1039
00:50:14,998 --> 00:50:17,718
Speaker 2: did back then, and that's what all these gms and

1040
00:50:19,078 --> 00:50:23,558
Speaker 2: soothsayers do today. A lot of conflicting information, sometimes hazardous,

1041
00:50:23,998 --> 00:50:29,358
Speaker 2: but you got the true genius. He really involves being

1042
00:50:29,398 --> 00:50:31,678
Speaker 2: able to sip through all that and come up with

1043
00:50:31,878 --> 00:50:36,078
Speaker 2: that decision that can set your team on a different path.

1044
00:50:36,558 --> 00:50:38,838
Speaker 1: Did Winston Churchill rely on analytics?

1045
00:50:39,438 --> 00:50:41,478
Speaker 2: Yeah? I think it's called the bottle of scotch.

1046
00:50:44,118 --> 00:50:45,038
Speaker 1: They worked for him.

1047
00:50:45,238 --> 00:50:48,598
Speaker 2: There's so many analytical equations in any bottle, it just

1048
00:50:48,678 --> 00:50:51,158
Speaker 2: got to be into it. Take the time, but we've

1049
00:50:51,198 --> 00:50:52,598
Speaker 2: all been there. We've all been there.

1050
00:50:52,638 --> 00:50:55,358
Speaker 1: Good stuff, Joe, looking forward to the next one. Number

1051
00:50:55,398 --> 00:50:57,518
Speaker 1: one hundred will be next. Folks, you got to tune in.

1052
00:50:57,678 --> 00:51:09,758
Speaker 1: Thanks Joe, Thanks going Tommy, thank you. The Book of

1053
00:51:09,838 --> 00:51:13,718
Speaker 1: Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts

1054
00:51:13,758 --> 00:51:18,438
Speaker 1: from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

1055
00:51:18,558 --> 00:51:19,638
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts.