WEBVTT - Mnuchin Pitching $916B Relief Plan 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:03.240 This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Karl Masser. Every day 0:00:03.279 --> 0:00:05.200 we're bringing you the latest news from the world of 0:00:05.200 --> 0:00:08.920 business and finance, plus technology, politics. So much going on 0:00:08.960 --> 0:00:12.160 in the world of politics, economics, and it's all harnessing 0:00:12.160 --> 0:00:14.840 the power of Business Week reporters and editors. If you 0:00:14.840 --> 0:00:18.240 can download Bloomberg Business Week on iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg 0:00:18.320 --> 0:00:20.800 dot com. You can also listen to our radio show 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:23.640 at two pm Eastern on Bloomberg Radio and be sure 0:00:23.680 --> 0:00:27.080 to watch us too on YouTube by searching Bloomberg Global News. 0:00:27.520 --> 0:00:30.720 The two things that bother people they say, well, maybe 0:00:30.720 --> 0:00:34.360 we did this too quickly. They need to understand the 0:00:34.520 --> 0:00:39.280 speed is really a reflection of the extraordinary scientific advances 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:42.040 that have been made that allowed us to do things 0:00:42.080 --> 0:00:45.760 in weeks two months that normally would have taken several years. 0:00:45.800 --> 0:00:51.320 That was not compromising safety, nor was it compromising scientific integrity. 0:00:51.520 --> 0:00:55.240 The process that went into deciding the safety and efficacy 0:00:55.520 --> 0:00:59.360 was both independent and transparent. We need to make sure 0:00:59.400 --> 0:01:02.360 people on the stand that all right that of course 0:01:02.440 --> 0:01:05.280 you know that voice, Dry Faucci, Right, it's one of 0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:07.800 those few voices that everybody knows. Yeah, you don't even 0:01:07.840 --> 0:01:12.000 need to everyone knows Vauci at this point exactly. Um, 0:01:12.040 --> 0:01:14.319 he was talking though at the third annual Bloomberg Health Summit, 0:01:14.319 --> 0:01:17.920 and of course addressing concerns that are real about people 0:01:17.959 --> 0:01:20.760 maybe not wanting to take the vaccine concerned about safety. 0:01:21.080 --> 0:01:23.360 Let's get into a discussion with Dr Seth Letterman back 0:01:23.400 --> 0:01:25.240 with US, co founder, CEO and chairman of the New 0:01:25.280 --> 0:01:29.800 York based specialty pharmaceutical company Tonics Pharmaceuticals. Set Back with Us. 0:01:30.080 --> 0:01:33.480 He is on the phone in New York City. Dr Letterman, 0:01:33.560 --> 0:01:36.520 Nice to have you here with Tim and myself. Vaccine 0:01:36.680 --> 0:01:38.759 and what we've seen a lot of news coming down 0:01:38.880 --> 0:01:42.120 the UK starting there are still some concerns. How do 0:01:42.200 --> 0:01:45.759 you see it right now? Well, first, I agree with 0:01:45.920 --> 0:01:50.560 Dr Faucci that the progress UH on the the two 0:01:50.640 --> 0:01:54.280 or three leading vaccines has been remarkable. I mean, it 0:01:54.440 --> 0:01:57.440 is just awesome to be less than a year out 0:01:57.560 --> 0:02:00.480 from the first time this virus was recognized and have 0:02:00.880 --> 0:02:04.200 you know clinical trial data on you know, at least 0:02:04.200 --> 0:02:07.680 four vaccines. But I do think that we have to 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:13.280 temper our expectations. While the data are intriguing so far, 0:02:13.840 --> 0:02:17.480 there are really four things that haven't been shown. There 0:02:17.520 --> 0:02:21.000 has not been shown. There are questions about the duration 0:02:21.440 --> 0:02:24.919 of protection. There are questions about whether these vaccines will 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:29.200 protect against death and really severe symptoms. There are questions 0:02:29.240 --> 0:02:33.200 about whether these vaccines will block forward transmission, and finally, 0:02:33.240 --> 0:02:37.040 there are questions about safety. So while I share Dr 0:02:37.120 --> 0:02:40.920 Facy's enthusiasm, I think that we all have to remain 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:44.840 cautiously optimistic and await more data. What are the questions 0:02:44.880 --> 0:02:50.840 about safety. It's not something that we've heard a lot about. Well, Uh, 0:02:51.120 --> 0:02:54.560 safety you have to think of two different groups. Uh. 0:02:54.760 --> 0:02:59.400 You have to think about the older people in retirement communities, 0:02:59.480 --> 0:03:03.600 who represent one population at risk, and then think about 0:03:03.680 --> 0:03:07.400 younger people for example, you know, college studes, healthy young adults, 0:03:07.440 --> 0:03:11.440 you know, particularly those without presisting medical problems. So for 0:03:11.480 --> 0:03:16.160 the older people in retirement communities, any vaccine will have 0:03:16.600 --> 0:03:19.400 some effect on their health. So I think we're gonna 0:03:19.400 --> 0:03:22.400 have to look at a large number of people to 0:03:22.520 --> 0:03:26.400 see how they react to this vaccine. Now, for the 0:03:26.520 --> 0:03:29.360 younger people, you know, let's call them college students with 0:03:29.440 --> 0:03:33.440 no pre existing conditions, they're really a pretty low risk 0:03:33.480 --> 0:03:38.840 of developing serious consequences anyway. So it's a lot of 0:03:38.920 --> 0:03:41.840 information is going to be needed before we can really 0:03:41.880 --> 0:03:45.600 recommend that would be beneficial to them, uh in terms 0:03:45.640 --> 0:03:49.000 of their own personal health to get any vaccine. But 0:03:49.080 --> 0:03:51.600 we've got a lot more information, certainly yesterday from the FDA, 0:03:51.640 --> 0:03:53.640 and I know there's a big review going on tomorrow 0:03:53.680 --> 0:03:56.520 that will ultimately decide, I guess whether or not there's 0:03:56.640 --> 0:03:59.200 US approval and we can move ahead. I mean, my 0:03:59.320 --> 0:04:02.160 understanding is the vaccine that you tend to know the 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:05.240 worst of it in terms of any kind of side 0:04:05.240 --> 0:04:10.560 effects within the first month. Um. I wish that was 0:04:10.600 --> 0:04:13.240 the case, but you know, we're talking about you know, 0:04:13.520 --> 0:04:17.280 using these products potentially in hundreds of millions of Americans, 0:04:17.360 --> 0:04:20.800 let alone people all over the world, So I think 0:04:20.839 --> 0:04:25.000 that you need a larger samples. And by the way, 0:04:25.240 --> 0:04:28.279 you know, the kind of approval that they're getting now 0:04:28.400 --> 0:04:32.880 is really you know, emergency use authorization. It's not full 0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:38.400 FDA approval, and the guidelines for full FDA approval really 0:04:38.440 --> 0:04:41.480 required that they're going to have to show protection you know, 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:45.520 quite a bit longer period out from from vaccination than 0:04:45.560 --> 0:04:47.760 where they are now. Well, that's sort of that at 0:04:47.760 --> 0:04:50.479 this point, that's sort of a worry for later because 0:04:50.520 --> 0:04:53.599 the idea here is to get as many people as possible, 0:04:53.680 --> 0:04:56.960 especially those vulnerable people inoculated as soon as possible. Right, 0:04:58.440 --> 0:05:01.520 That's that's correct. But but the question is will will 0:05:01.520 --> 0:05:05.400 these acts have to be administered repeatedly? Right? So, so 0:05:05.440 --> 0:05:10.360 would you take this Dr letterman Um, Well, that's an 0:05:10.400 --> 0:05:13.240 interesting question. First of all, I'm unlikely to be a 0:05:13.320 --> 0:05:16.520 candidate because they're being you know, essentially reserved for people 0:05:16.520 --> 0:05:20.080 at risk groups. And I think that what the pediatricians 0:05:20.080 --> 0:05:22.520 and other groups have done working with the CDC to 0:05:22.680 --> 0:05:27.000 work out in equitable and um efficient way to distribute 0:05:27.000 --> 0:05:30.440 the first vaccines is great. So it's really a theoretical question. 0:05:30.560 --> 0:05:32.920 I you know, I wouldn't qualify. Although I'm a doctor, 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:36.560 I'm not currently a front healthcare worker. You know, said 0:05:36.640 --> 0:05:38.800 let me just because we're running out of time. Unfortunately, 0:05:39.279 --> 0:05:41.680 got about forty five seconds here. You guys that are 0:05:41.680 --> 0:05:46.960 working on a vaccine right with a live COVID virus, Well, yes, 0:05:47.000 --> 0:05:49.000 well we're going on a live vaccine, but ours is 0:05:49.040 --> 0:05:52.720 based at Tonics. Ours is based on a live viral 0:05:52.880 --> 0:05:57.039 vector and we're designing it so it provides longer duration 0:05:57.080 --> 0:06:00.360 of immunity. And you know, Mark is also working into 0:06:00.520 --> 0:06:03.600 live viral vector vaccine so it's a different approach, right, 0:06:03.640 --> 0:06:06.520 But I think ultimately COVID is going to become endemic, 0:06:06.880 --> 0:06:09.120 so we're gonna have to think about vaccinating people for 0:06:09.160 --> 0:06:12.159 the long term and even people who haven't been born yet. Yeah, 0:06:12.320 --> 0:06:15.480 it's I think it's definitely an upheaval when it comes 0:06:15.480 --> 0:06:18.280 to how we treat this. UM. Dr Seth Letterman, thank 0:06:18.320 --> 0:06:21.360 you so much, co founder, chief executive officer Tonics Pharmaceuticals 0:06:21.360 --> 0:06:23.000 with us on the phone from New York City. I mean, 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:24.839 you know what we hear, Tim, right, is that we 0:06:24.880 --> 0:06:28.120 expect we're going to need multiple vaccine. Even if we 0:06:28.200 --> 0:06:30.200 see with fiser you have to wait three weeks to 0:06:30.279 --> 0:06:32.760 get the second dose of that, right, So it's gonna 0:06:32.760 --> 0:06:36.480 take a laugh. Interesting thoughts for perspective. This is Bloomberg 0:06:36.520 --> 0:06:40.360 Business Week with Carol Messer from Bloomberg Radio. Let's bring 0:06:40.360 --> 0:06:43.920 in Naomi Nicks. She is corporate Influence reporter at Bloomberg News. 0:06:43.960 --> 0:06:46.240 On the phone from Washington, d C. Sonami, we were 0:06:46.279 --> 0:06:49.400 expecting this, but now that we've got some of the headlines, Um, 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:50.840 what jumps out at you? What do you think is 0:06:50.839 --> 0:06:54.760 the most significant? What could this mean for Facebook? Well, 0:06:54.800 --> 0:06:59.800 it's interesting, So the Federal Trade Commission specifically highlighted Facebook's 0:06:59.800 --> 0:07:03.480 per which just of WhatsApp Instagram in in the lawsuits 0:07:03.480 --> 0:07:07.720 that it filed just moments ago. UM. And part of 0:07:07.760 --> 0:07:12.120 what it's calling for UM is a potential unwinding or 0:07:12.240 --> 0:07:16.520 dibecter of those companies by Facebook. That would be a 0:07:16.560 --> 0:07:21.480 significant alteration of Facebook's business model um and one of 0:07:21.520 --> 0:07:24.800 the growing parts of its company. UH. And so that's 0:07:24.800 --> 0:07:27.680 really interesting. And what they're saying is, UM, you know 0:07:27.720 --> 0:07:32.480 that Facebook essentially looked around for for potential competitors rivals, 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:36.000 uh and then just instead of competing against them, bought 0:07:36.080 --> 0:07:39.400 them up. Well, I mean, there's no question that that's 0:07:39.440 --> 0:07:41.600 what happened to Yeah, that's I mean, that's the way 0:07:41.640 --> 0:07:44.040 it goes. I guess the question is to what extent 0:07:44.080 --> 0:07:46.480 does the federal government do these states actually have a 0:07:46.560 --> 0:07:50.960 case here? It is that that is that is the question. 0:07:51.000 --> 0:07:54.920 And one of the defenses that Facebook will likely say 0:07:54.960 --> 0:07:57.960 is that, for for instance, in the case of Instagram, 0:07:58.280 --> 0:08:02.360 that Instagram became Intagram because Facebook bought it, and that 0:08:02.480 --> 0:08:06.600 actually at the time Instagram wasn't as much of a 0:08:06.960 --> 0:08:10.520 competitor in the market sense, and that Facebook was the 0:08:10.520 --> 0:08:13.240 one to help it grow and become such a popular 0:08:13.520 --> 0:08:16.080 I think I think that's a fair argument. I mean, 0:08:16.160 --> 0:08:18.520 Instagram was tiny, it had a staff that you could 0:08:18.560 --> 0:08:20.720 you could count on fingers and toes back then when 0:08:20.720 --> 0:08:23.320 Facebook brought it in a billion dollars and it was 0:08:23.360 --> 0:08:25.640 a huge acquisition back then. But I think a lot 0:08:25.680 --> 0:08:27.760 has changed since then. And I do think Facebook has 0:08:27.760 --> 0:08:30.120 a case that says, hey, Instagram is what it is 0:08:30.200 --> 0:08:33.920 because of our investment, right, And I want to just 0:08:33.960 --> 0:08:37.480 bring it like, is the consumer hurt in all of this? Naomi? 0:08:37.559 --> 0:08:41.800 Doesn't that ultimately what um? Those bringing the case? UM, 0:08:41.920 --> 0:08:45.000 all of these regulators and state attorneys in the FTC, 0:08:45.240 --> 0:08:47.360 the lawyers for the FTC, don't they have to prove 0:08:47.720 --> 0:08:51.640 that consumers were hurt in the process. Yes, And that's 0:08:51.880 --> 0:08:54.360 one of the tricky parts about some of these tech 0:08:54.440 --> 0:08:59.319 ant I trust cases because these UM, because these platforms 0:08:59.360 --> 0:09:03.680 are free UH, lawyers can't rely on the usual measure 0:09:03.720 --> 0:09:07.120 of harm UH that they would normally use, which is 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:13.640 priced to establish that a company hurt competition by hurting consumers. 0:09:13.760 --> 0:09:15.600 And so in this case they're going to have to 0:09:16.360 --> 0:09:19.960 be really specific in their market analysis and defining the market, 0:09:20.240 --> 0:09:23.280 in defining the consumer and in defining the harm which 0:09:23.320 --> 0:09:26.640 might use less traditional measures. I'm just gonna remind everybody Microsoft, 0:09:26.800 --> 0:09:28.800 right when all of this first came down, how many 0:09:28.880 --> 0:09:31.760 years of lawsuits went on and on and on. I mean, 0:09:32.200 --> 0:09:34.640 who knows how long this could ultimately tim take. And 0:09:34.640 --> 0:09:36.079 and it's a it's a really good point. And I 0:09:36.080 --> 0:09:38.840 think people look back at what happened with Microsoft as 0:09:39.120 --> 0:09:41.680 creating this environment for all these startups that we're talking 0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:43.520 about right now when it comes to anti trust to 0:09:43.559 --> 0:09:46.480 actually succeed. And in the meantime, you have Microsoft turning 0:09:46.480 --> 0:09:49.080 into one of the most valuable companies in the world again, 0:09:49.320 --> 0:09:51.920 right exactly. I mean, Naomi, this is just the beginning 0:09:51.960 --> 0:09:53.760 of what's going to be probably a very long process. 0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:57.199 Just got about twenty seconds here. It will be a 0:09:57.320 --> 0:10:00.360 very long past. And the key for Facebook will be 0:10:00.600 --> 0:10:03.559 how does it maintain its competitive rigger in the marketplace 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:07.240 while fighting, uh, this this issue on the regulatory front. 0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:09.520 That is always something that analyst investors right jump on 0:10:09.559 --> 0:10:11.640 and be like they're distracted. It's not a great thing, 0:10:11.920 --> 0:10:15.199 right overhang, Yeah, And as Charlie said, Facebook stock down 0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:19.800 three So it's not like investors are that concerned now exactly, Um, Naomi, 0:10:19.800 --> 0:10:22.080 thank you so much. Naomi Nick's corporate influence for Porter 0:10:22.080 --> 0:10:24.000 at Bloomberg News on the phone from Washington, d C. 0:10:24.120 --> 0:10:25.200 As a matter of fact, I was going to just 0:10:25.200 --> 0:10:27.319 take a quick check what is Facebook doing this year? 0:10:27.640 --> 0:10:31.520 They're up, So I mean, listen, we all understand kind 0:10:31.520 --> 0:10:34.040 of how this goes. Yeah, so we'll keep a watch 0:10:34.040 --> 0:10:36.000 on it, but definitely moving lower here a little bit. 0:10:36.080 --> 0:10:40.520 This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer from Bloomberg Radio. 0:10:40.760 --> 0:10:42.960 They're listening to Bloomberg Business Week Carol Masser along with 0:10:43.000 --> 0:10:47.079 Tim Stanivic Bloomberg Quick Take, and um, listen, this is 0:10:47.080 --> 0:10:49.120 gonna be a great story, great conversation because we just 0:10:49.160 --> 0:10:54.079 got the headlines about the FTC suing Facebook for illegal monopolization, 0:10:54.480 --> 0:10:57.720 for illegal monopolization. Let's get that out. Um. So they 0:10:57.760 --> 0:11:00.360 are certainly on the radar. And we love our Boomberg 0:11:00.440 --> 0:11:04.160 team because they understand companies. They understand nuances to when 0:11:04.200 --> 0:11:07.120 they do a deal or potentially what this could mean. Yeah, 0:11:07.200 --> 0:11:09.320 and this is a perfect time to get Kurt on 0:11:09.400 --> 0:11:12.560 the show because he writes about what's happen. His most 0:11:12.600 --> 0:11:16.240 recent Bloomberg Business Week story in Joel Weber also joining 0:11:16.320 --> 0:11:20.280 us live from Brooklyn right now, Hey Joel, Hello, and yeah, 0:11:20.320 --> 0:11:26.160 you couldn't have scripted this timing any better, but you know, yeah, 0:11:27.240 --> 0:11:30.000 had been so patient. He filed this story months ago 0:11:30.080 --> 0:11:31.840 and then we were like, yeah, well we're gonna do 0:11:31.880 --> 0:11:36.280 it soon. No time like the present Kurt um So story. 0:11:36.440 --> 0:11:38.360 You know, we we often try and have what I 0:11:38.400 --> 0:11:41.640 considered like a strategic lens on our stories. And you know, 0:11:41.679 --> 0:11:46.080 at Facebook, um this this behemoth that has you know, 0:11:46.440 --> 0:11:51.240 basically made a series of acquisitions that is obviously uh capturing, 0:11:52.360 --> 0:11:55.880 has captured regulators attention, hence the news today. But one 0:11:55.920 --> 0:11:58.680 of these is What's App? Right, and What's App they've 0:11:58.679 --> 0:12:03.360 basically added to the report folio. It's huge internationally, far 0:12:03.400 --> 0:12:07.320 bigger internationally than than here in the US. But the 0:12:07.320 --> 0:12:10.280 big question is has always remained sort of like, how 0:12:10.480 --> 0:12:13.840 could they go about monetizing this? And when they do 0:12:13.920 --> 0:12:16.440 monitor when Facebook does get around and monetizing things. You 0:12:16.480 --> 0:12:19.680 look at Instagram and it has just become a cash 0:12:19.720 --> 0:12:25.360 cow for for Facebook and it really relies on on advertising. 0:12:25.360 --> 0:12:27.520 But the question is has been sort of, you know, 0:12:27.640 --> 0:12:30.240 what's app is not Instagram, so how would you go 0:12:30.320 --> 0:12:33.640 about making money off of it? And that seems to 0:12:33.640 --> 0:12:36.800 be the big priority now at Facebook. So so walk 0:12:36.920 --> 0:12:41.120 us through what their plan seems to be. Curt Yeah, 0:12:41.400 --> 0:12:44.160 to your point, it is not advertising in the way 0:12:44.160 --> 0:12:47.280 that we know from the News speed or for from Instagram. 0:12:47.320 --> 0:12:49.120 And part of the reason of that is because it's 0:12:49.120 --> 0:12:51.400 hard to get the same level of data in a 0:12:51.440 --> 0:12:53.959 private messaging app that they are able to get from 0:12:54.000 --> 0:12:56.400 those other services. So it's harder to do the targeted 0:12:56.760 --> 0:12:59.240 ads that we're used to. So in this case, what 0:12:59.320 --> 0:13:02.120 Facebook wants to do is really turn what'sapp into a 0:13:02.200 --> 0:13:06.400 commerce and payments platform. And so imagine that you know, 0:13:06.440 --> 0:13:08.680 you're interacting with the business, perhaps in the way you 0:13:08.720 --> 0:13:10.600 do today. You might send them an email, you might 0:13:10.720 --> 0:13:13.960 actually pick up the phone and dial a number. They 0:13:14.000 --> 0:13:16.280 envisioned a future in which you're doing all of those 0:13:16.280 --> 0:13:20.760 interactions on WhatsApp, and you're using the service to maybe 0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:24.240 place in order make a payment, handle a customer service issue. 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:26.400 And if they are sitting at the middle of all 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:30.000 of those interactions between businesses and consumers, they see a 0:13:30.000 --> 0:13:34.120 really big business opportunity there, especially in markets outside the 0:13:34.200 --> 0:13:37.000 US where people are already kind of doing this behavior. 0:13:37.080 --> 0:13:39.960 They just don't have the structure in place to actually 0:13:40.000 --> 0:13:43.880 capitalize on it. So Facebook, but What's App for close 0:13:43.920 --> 0:13:46.959 to twenty billion dollars just a few years ago back 0:13:46.960 --> 0:13:50.360 in Kurt, what's the time frame for when we're gonna 0:13:50.400 --> 0:13:55.480 start seeing Facebook actually monetize this huge purchase. Well, this 0:13:55.559 --> 0:13:59.160 is something we've been talking about for years at this point, 0:13:59.360 --> 0:14:02.440 and when you pay nineteen billion dollars for a company, UH, 0:14:02.520 --> 0:14:05.719 you you have to answer those questions usually sooner rather 0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:09.000 than later. Facebook's abilities to continue to grow its ads 0:14:09.080 --> 0:14:11.480 business has bought it a lot more time, I think 0:14:11.520 --> 0:14:13.760 than many people thought they would have to make money 0:14:13.760 --> 0:14:17.360 from What's App. But what we saw in is that 0:14:17.440 --> 0:14:21.080 they're really starting to kind of double down on this investment. 0:14:21.120 --> 0:14:24.960 They made a five point seven billion dollar investment in 0:14:25.000 --> 0:14:28.800 an Indian technology company called Geo Platforms. The whole idea 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:30.960 there is that they're hoping that What's acting kind of 0:14:30.960 --> 0:14:33.240 partner with Geo on a lot of this commerce and 0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:36.320 payment stuff. We saw them making the acquisition of more 0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:39.080 than a billion dollars just last week of a customer 0:14:39.200 --> 0:14:42.840 service UH software company, and so the fact that they're 0:14:42.840 --> 0:14:46.800 making these big strategic investments in these acquisitions right now 0:14:47.200 --> 0:14:49.440 is a signal to me that we're going to see 0:14:49.480 --> 0:14:54.200 this idea materialize in a more real way, probably sometime 0:14:54.240 --> 0:14:57.560 in the next six to twelve prot Kurt, Before this 0:14:57.720 --> 0:15:02.440 FTC moved, you mentioned that that Customer Service acquisition that 0:15:02.560 --> 0:15:05.160 was the last kind of big story from Facebook. Um, 0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:08.760 that was the purchase of a company called Customer Uh. 0:15:08.800 --> 0:15:10.480 And as you write in the story, you know, that 0:15:10.560 --> 0:15:13.560 was met with basically crickets and kind of a shrug 0:15:13.640 --> 0:15:17.240 from everyone. But how could how could the customer acquisition 0:15:17.840 --> 0:15:20.600 and this this Nissan strategy, with what's happened, how could 0:15:20.600 --> 0:15:23.960 that all sort of start to come together? Well, the 0:15:24.000 --> 0:15:27.440 idea of being that if you are again using what's 0:15:27.480 --> 0:15:30.440 up already to communicate with your family and friends, it 0:15:30.560 --> 0:15:32.960 makes sense that you might want to just kind of 0:15:33.000 --> 0:15:36.640 bring your business or retailer relationships, if you want to 0:15:36.680 --> 0:15:39.480 call them those that's kind of an optimistic word for Facebook. 0:15:39.520 --> 0:15:42.240 You have a relationship with these business businesses, but you 0:15:42.320 --> 0:15:45.360 might imagine if you bring all those into one app, right, 0:15:45.400 --> 0:15:49.320 and let's pretend that you're a large scale retailer. You're fielding, 0:15:49.600 --> 0:15:52.280 you know, questions or complaints from people on Twitter and 0:15:52.440 --> 0:15:55.560 Instagram and WhatsApp and Facebook you kind of want to 0:15:55.560 --> 0:15:57.440 bring all of those into one place so that you 0:15:57.440 --> 0:16:00.360 can manage them. That's what customer does. And so if 0:16:00.360 --> 0:16:03.560 Facebook is buying this with the idea that perhaps that 0:16:03.640 --> 0:16:06.240 they can make it easier for businesses to you know, 0:16:06.400 --> 0:16:10.000 message with people on one of their platforms, including WhatsApp, 0:16:10.320 --> 0:16:13.760 you know that they could make the whole Facebook ecosystem 0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:17.360 a lot more valuable to businesses around the world and 0:16:17.400 --> 0:16:20.440 to them, that's that's an incredibly important thing to not 0:16:20.520 --> 0:16:22.600 only grow you know, their ads business, but build out 0:16:22.600 --> 0:16:25.680 that payment stuff that we're talking about. Okay, so these 0:16:25.720 --> 0:16:28.240 are all kind of nuts, nuts and bolts questions and 0:16:28.640 --> 0:16:30.560 blocking and tackling and all that stuff. But can we 0:16:30.560 --> 0:16:33.520 talk about the drama because you do have some some 0:16:33.520 --> 0:16:37.600 some additional drama about the when WhatsApp was acquired, the 0:16:37.680 --> 0:16:41.960 drama that unfolded between uh those founders in Zegerberg. That 0:16:42.360 --> 0:16:46.640 is an ongoing thing that we we love to report about. 0:16:47.000 --> 0:16:51.600 Sarah Friar's book No Filter about the Instagram saga was 0:16:51.960 --> 0:16:55.280 Financial Times Business Book of the Year. Um So I 0:16:55.360 --> 0:16:58.000 just have endless appetite to learn more about the drama 0:16:58.080 --> 0:17:01.800 behind the scenes, and you know, basically inability to share power, 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:03.840 what is what did you learn in the course of 0:17:03.880 --> 0:17:14.080 reporting this and what tech drama? Oh my god. I 0:17:14.160 --> 0:17:18.840 think that the very very simple way to summarize this 0:17:18.960 --> 0:17:22.399 is to say that, you know, Mark Zuckerberg acquired a 0:17:22.440 --> 0:17:27.800 company from two guys who had the exact opposite idea 0:17:28.040 --> 0:17:30.600 of of what they wanted to build. Whereas Facebook was 0:17:30.640 --> 0:17:33.520 building this thing that you shared publicly and they counted 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:36.240 your data and they showed you targeted ads. What that 0:17:36.600 --> 0:17:39.119 wanted everything to be incredibly private. It didn't want to 0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:42.840 read your messages. And most importantly, the founders said, we're 0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:45.040 never going to show you ads ever, that's a promise. 0:17:45.240 --> 0:17:48.040 Don't even worry about it. So how did the company 0:17:48.080 --> 0:17:51.119 that makes that promise then go sell itself to Facebook? Right? 0:17:51.200 --> 0:17:54.879 That those two just do not align. And so really 0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:57.040 once they got in the door, we saw a few 0:17:57.080 --> 0:17:59.760 years after the acquisition was closed that that tension really 0:17:59.760 --> 0:18:02.560 start it to build. Where Mark Zuckerberg is saying, hey, 0:18:02.800 --> 0:18:04.960 we want you to start building an ADS business, that's 0:18:04.960 --> 0:18:07.880 what we do best, and these guys saying, hey, we promised, 0:18:07.880 --> 0:18:10.080 are you We're never going to do that. We're not 0:18:10.119 --> 0:18:11.800 going to build what you want us to build, And 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:15.040 and ultimately we saw both the founders leave in the 0:18:15.080 --> 0:18:19.159 late seventeen early eighteen UM and and it's just you know, 0:18:19.640 --> 0:18:22.600 anytime you bring together clashing cultures like that, you're gonna 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:24.639 have a lot of a lot of issues. That's right. 0:18:24.720 --> 0:18:27.600 When there's ever a merger, we think about salesforce and 0:18:27.720 --> 0:18:29.880 slack like this is a question we asked, like, how 0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:32.359 is that integration going to work right? Because so often 0:18:32.359 --> 0:18:35.720 they don't exactly right. We see it throughout history. Um, 0:18:35.880 --> 0:18:37.119 for those of you listening to New York d C 0:18:37.240 --> 0:18:39.560 in San Francisco watching a YouTube Bloomberg Business Week, Tim 0:18:39.560 --> 0:18:41.080 and I, we're gonna be back. If you're listening to 0:18:41.119 --> 0:18:43.680 Bloomberg one or six one in Boston, paste tape Business 0:18:43.760 --> 0:18:45.520 is coming up next or thanks to Kurt Wagner, tech 0:18:45.560 --> 0:18:48.240 reporter at Bloomberg News and to Jill Webber, editor Bloomberg 0:18:48.240 --> 0:18:51.719 Business Week. Find more Business Week stories on the Terminal 0:18:51.800 --> 0:18:55.399 and at Bloomberg dot com. This is Bloomberg Business Week 0:18:55.640 --> 0:18:59.159 with Kirol Masser on Bloomberg Radio. So you're listening to 0:18:59.200 --> 0:19:01.680 Bloomberg rad bu Bloomberg Business Week Carol mass along with 0:19:01.720 --> 0:19:05.000 Tim Stanivik, a Bloomberg Quicktake and you're on air live 0:19:05.320 --> 0:19:09.000 on nine and noon nine and Noon, you talked about stimulus. Oh, 0:19:09.040 --> 0:19:11.240 it was the lead story for both of our both 0:19:11.240 --> 0:19:13.439 of our shows today. Yeah, I mean it's listen, we 0:19:13.520 --> 0:19:15.840 keep talking about this that until we find out what's 0:19:15.880 --> 0:19:17.520 going to happen if we get it. I mean, this 0:19:17.560 --> 0:19:19.600 is kind of crucial for so many Americans and really 0:19:19.920 --> 0:19:22.000 I feel like for the US economy. Yeah, it's true. 0:19:22.000 --> 0:19:23.600 And you know, up until now, really I think that 0:19:23.680 --> 0:19:26.600 the story has been this disconnect between Main Street and 0:19:26.720 --> 0:19:28.800 Wall Street. But it does seem like, at least today, 0:19:28.840 --> 0:19:30.880 investors are taking a little bit of a pause because 0:19:30.960 --> 0:19:33.360 lawmakers certainly seem to be taking their time to get 0:19:33.359 --> 0:19:35.600 this stimulus done. They're taking a pause to So let's 0:19:35.640 --> 0:19:37.800 get into it. Let's find out the latest. Eric Watson 0:19:37.920 --> 0:19:40.880 is all over this busy guy congressional reporter at Bloomberg News. 0:19:41.119 --> 0:19:43.680 He's with us on the phone from the nation's capital. So, Eric, 0:19:43.720 --> 0:19:46.000 where are we Because we just looked at Tim just 0:19:46.080 --> 0:19:49.600 sharing your latest story with me, um that both sides 0:19:49.640 --> 0:19:52.680 of the aisle are working on a compromise pandemic relief plan. 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:55.480 So where are we in this process? Well, there are 0:19:55.480 --> 0:19:57.960 different paths going on. But one thing we've been keeping 0:19:57.960 --> 0:20:00.560 an eye on is this gang of know eight to 0:20:00.720 --> 0:20:03.600 their coins seals are nine coalition. Uh. There were eight 0:20:03.640 --> 0:20:07.480 senators um from both parties as well as fifty Republicans 0:20:07.480 --> 0:20:09.880 of Democrats, and they had come up with an outline 0:20:09.880 --> 0:20:13.119 for a nine billion dollars stimulus. The details were lacking, 0:20:13.200 --> 0:20:16.040 and they released them along the way that outline of 0:20:16.080 --> 0:20:18.880 that but today, but they did not have the two 0:20:19.000 --> 0:20:22.800 key provisions, the lib liability protections for companies and state 0:20:22.840 --> 0:20:24.520 and local aid filled out. It just was kind of 0:20:24.520 --> 0:20:26.720 a placeholder there. So that was kind of a bad sign. 0:20:27.200 --> 0:20:29.800 We're talking to Joe Mansion at West Virginia just now 0:20:30.119 --> 0:20:32.800 and he's saying, you know, by tonight, perhaps we'll have 0:20:33.320 --> 0:20:36.520 some resolution on this. Now. For professional leaders, they don't 0:20:36.520 --> 0:20:39.280 really like these side groups to form and sort of 0:20:39.280 --> 0:20:41.359 take manage into their owned hand. They like to seize 0:20:41.640 --> 0:20:44.479 back control and we're hearing really from from Republicans they 0:20:44.480 --> 0:20:47.040 would like just to go be more of a leader 0:20:47.040 --> 0:20:50.240 to leader discussion. I think that's where we'reheaded. Next week 0:20:50.320 --> 0:20:53.280 is the deadline for government funding. A few more days, 0:20:53.640 --> 0:20:55.439 but I think that's when we'll see a deal come 0:20:55.480 --> 0:20:57.840 together and it probably won't be this gang which has 0:20:57.880 --> 0:21:00.240 at least quoted some ideas, but probably won't be able 0:21:00.280 --> 0:21:02.200 to close the deal. Well, now, it's not just liability 0:21:02.200 --> 0:21:05.840 protection four companies that's holding up this on Capitol Hill, right, 0:21:05.840 --> 0:21:08.600 it's also Republicans are sort of unwilling to budge when 0:21:08.600 --> 0:21:11.600 it comes to what they're saying, our bailouts of state 0:21:11.640 --> 0:21:15.520 and local governments. What's the progress there? Yeah, well that 0:21:16.119 --> 0:21:19.400 was an interesting move from from Secretary Minution of the Treasury. 0:21:19.640 --> 0:21:22.359 He put forward a nine hundred sixteen billion dollar a 0:21:22.440 --> 0:21:24.960 plan that has a hundred and sixty billion dollars in 0:21:25.040 --> 0:21:27.840 state and local eight in it. And that apparently one 0:21:27.880 --> 0:21:31.440 into our sources had McConnell on board. Kevin McCarthy said 0:21:31.520 --> 0:21:33.560 he was on board that the top of public commuter 0:21:33.680 --> 0:21:35.639 in the House. This is really the first time that 0:21:35.680 --> 0:21:40.320