1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:07,960 Speaker 1: Also media. Hi everyone, and welcome to it could happen here. 2 00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:11,440 Speaker 1: It's me James today here to bring you more terrible 3 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:16,160 Speaker 1: news about migration and deportation. And I'm joined to share 4 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:20,120 Speaker 1: that terrible news by Gillian Bruckel, a journalist who has 5 00:00:20,200 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 1: been tracking deportation flights to Djibouti. Hi, Gillian, Hi, how 6 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:26,079 Speaker 1: are you? 7 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 2: James? 8 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: I'm good. Well, amidst the crumbling of everything, that's wonderful. 9 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:33,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, this is terrible news, but I'm also 10 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:36,839 Speaker 3: very excited to be in the Cool Zone universe. 11 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:38,920 Speaker 2: I love all of the shows. 12 00:00:39,159 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, welcome, welcome to the called own universe. It's a 13 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:44,559 Speaker 1: Sophie Lichtman comic universe. 14 00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:46,360 Speaker 2: Oh my god, such a fangirl. 15 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 1: Okay. The United States government attempted to deport twelve men, 16 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 1: all of whom are Libyan, to Libya on the seventh 17 00:00:56,680 --> 00:01:00,319 Speaker 1: of May. Right, it got so far as to them 18 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 1: to the. 19 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:04,480 Speaker 2: Airport right in San Antonio. 20 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:08,520 Speaker 1: In San Antonio, Texas. And then thanks to a injunction, 21 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:11,040 Speaker 1: a court injunction, those people were not taken to Libya. 22 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 1: Those people were said returned to an intention center, where 23 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:18,000 Speaker 1: as listeners the show will now be aware they were 24 00:01:18,040 --> 00:01:23,240 Speaker 1: informed that they were being deported renditioned, howe you want 25 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:28,920 Speaker 1: to say it to South Sudan. This news broke a 26 00:01:28,959 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 1: couple of days ago, now, I think Tuesday, Tuesday afternoon, Yeah, yeah, 27 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:37,240 Speaker 1: and that was when you were able to begin using 28 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 1: your ocent aviation knowledge looking for like this this flight 29 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:45,480 Speaker 1: right that was taken them to South Sudan, because at 30 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:48,480 Speaker 1: the time the United States government was claiming that the 31 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 1: flight was was classified or like a state secret. And 32 00:01:54,080 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 1: even in court the judge wasn't aware of the flight 33 00:01:56,920 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: was in the air on the ground, could it turn 34 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:01,720 Speaker 1: around judging the anthony was going to ask you to 35 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 1: turn around? So I wonder if you could like walk 36 00:02:05,080 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 1: listeners through the time none of this deportation, and then 37 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 1: how you were able to find millions of maybe not million, 38 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: thousands of planes in the sky the one that was 39 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 1: taking these people to as it turned out to Djibooty. 40 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:18,880 Speaker 2: Sure. 41 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, So I've been a journalist for fifteen years, but 42 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:26,400 Speaker 3: before that, I was a flight attendant and you know, 43 00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:31,120 Speaker 3: I'm in av geek in aviation enthusiast the shorthand you know, 44 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:33,800 Speaker 3: the hashtag for that is af geek, And so you know, 45 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 3: I'm always looking at flight Radar twenty four. It's an 46 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 3: app where you can track different aircraft and so when 47 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 3: I heard that the flight might still be in. 48 00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:45,320 Speaker 2: The air, I just thought, I wonder if I can 49 00:02:45,320 --> 00:02:45,720 Speaker 2: find it. 50 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 3: So I went first, I went on to flight Radar 51 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:54,079 Speaker 3: twenty four, and first I looked at all of the 52 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 3: departures out of San Antonio for like the previous twenty 53 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 3: four hours since the previous flight that was supposed to 54 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:04,440 Speaker 3: go to Libya that was stopped, that departed from San Antonio. 55 00:03:04,520 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 1: And so I was. 56 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:09,760 Speaker 3: Looking there and you know, didn't see anything. Just commercial flights, 57 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:14,280 Speaker 3: very obviously military flights, and I know they've used military 58 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 3: aircraft sometimes, but I said, I'm not going to try 59 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:18,120 Speaker 3: and touch that right now. I want to see if 60 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:21,520 Speaker 3: it's one of these charter companies, you know, Global x 61 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:24,080 Speaker 3: a Vello, that have been doing these deportation flights. 62 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:26,639 Speaker 1: Can you explain those to people, because I don't think 63 00:03:26,639 --> 00:03:27,920 Speaker 1: everyone's aware of those. 64 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:32,160 Speaker 3: So these are you know, commercial carriers, but they're they're 65 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:38,120 Speaker 3: contracting with DHS to deport people on their aircraft. So 66 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:42,360 Speaker 3: you know, the A three twenty that you take across 67 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:47,360 Speaker 3: the country is sometimes used to deport people to other countries, 68 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 3: and the main companies that are doing that right now 69 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 3: are a Vello, global X. I think Omni does some 70 00:03:55,840 --> 00:04:00,520 Speaker 3: of them sometimes. And I should say there are a 71 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:03,120 Speaker 3: lot of people, especially on Blue Sky, a lot of 72 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:07,080 Speaker 3: av geeks who are tracking and cataloging all of these flights. 73 00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:11,720 Speaker 3: I wasn't even aware of that community until I started 74 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:16,800 Speaker 3: looking for so I didn't see anything, you know, in 75 00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:19,560 Speaker 3: San Antonio, and then I realized, oh, these people had 76 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:22,719 Speaker 3: been transferred to Port Isabelle in the last few weeks, 77 00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:26,280 Speaker 3: so they would have departed out of Harlingen Airport, which 78 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:30,080 Speaker 3: is nearby. It's you know, a deep deep South Texas 79 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 3: And so I looked at departures out of harling and 80 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:36,360 Speaker 3: it's a small airport. They have like ten departures a 81 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 3: day and it's generally puddle jumpers from one small Texas 82 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 3: town to another small Texas town, you know. And there 83 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:48,560 Speaker 3: was one global X flight to Miami the day before. 84 00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:52,599 Speaker 3: The timeline wasn't exactly right, but I know that DHS, 85 00:04:52,640 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 3: you know, has been slow to notify attorneys, so I thought, well, 86 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:00,920 Speaker 3: maybe this is the flight. They just didn't tell the 87 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 3: attorneys till the next day. So then I spent way 88 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:07,200 Speaker 3: too much time looking at all of the departures out 89 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:10,600 Speaker 3: of Miami to see if there were any global ex flits. 90 00:05:10,680 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 3: I saw a few things, but you know, nothing heading 91 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:19,000 Speaker 3: across the Atlantic. And so at that point, flight Radar 92 00:05:19,279 --> 00:05:24,960 Speaker 3: twenty four will show you publicly available information on flights. 93 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:26,480 Speaker 2: It won't show you all flights. 94 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 3: But there is another you know, for like deep deep 95 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 3: ab geeks, there's another website called ADSB Exchange, and this 96 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:39,440 Speaker 3: is a pool of all feeder data all over the 97 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:44,640 Speaker 3: world of all aircraft in the air that aviation enthusiasts 98 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:50,559 Speaker 3: maintained themselves, and they will have military flights that aren't 99 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:53,559 Speaker 3: going to be on Flight Radar twenty four. They also 100 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:58,200 Speaker 3: have a lot more information about planes that have a 101 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 3: LAD designation, which stands for limited Aviation Data displayed. I 102 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:07,040 Speaker 3: don't know how much you want me to explain about that. 103 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:09,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, explain, explain because I think it's interesting for people. 104 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 3: Sure, So LAD designation is used most often for like 105 00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:17,840 Speaker 3: private jet owners, like celebrities and you know, the ultra rich, 106 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:21,480 Speaker 3: And basically it means that they have an extra layer 107 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 3: of privacy for their movements in their private jets. So 108 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 3: if you try and find a specific private jet on 109 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:37,039 Speaker 3: flight radar twenty four, it won't come up. You know. 110 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:39,839 Speaker 3: So like the tail of this plane that did the 111 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:44,600 Speaker 3: Jabooty flight is N five AA eight eight a T. 112 00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 3: If you search for that in flight radar twenty four, 113 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 3: you won't see it. Nothing will come up. However, if 114 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:55,400 Speaker 3: you know what you're looking for, if you know, like, oh, 115 00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:58,160 Speaker 3: I think the flight is heading to Djibouti right now, 116 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:00,719 Speaker 3: you can see on flight radar twenty five for that, 117 00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:04,240 Speaker 3: there's a gulf Stream five had a to Djibooty right now, 118 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 3: but the registration information is obscured. 119 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:10,160 Speaker 2: Okay, you know it's not like that on the ADSB. 120 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 1: You can you could see it. 121 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, your filters have a lot more power. 122 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 3: Basically, you know your search terms, they're going to go 123 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 3: around different designations, okay, And so some people hate that. 124 00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:24,520 Speaker 3: You know, Taylor Swift had beef with some guy a 125 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 3: couple of years ago because she has a LAD designation 126 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 3: on her private jet. He was using ADSB Exchange to 127 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 3: post her flights, you know, ostensibly for to shame her 128 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:38,160 Speaker 3: for her carbon footprint. But then she like threatened to 129 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 3: sue him, and she was like, I have stalkers, Like 130 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:41,720 Speaker 3: I don't want them. 131 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:43,280 Speaker 2: To know when I'm landing in Nashville. 132 00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 3: You know, yeah, not going to get into that, but 133 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:51,720 Speaker 3: you know, that's basically the LAD designation, and ADSB doesn't care. 134 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 3: And so I went on ADSB and I said, well, 135 00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 3: since I've already seen all the publicly available flights, let 136 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 3: me just look at LAD flights, okay, And so I 137 00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:05,320 Speaker 3: set that filter and that took it down to a 138 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 3: couple hundred planes in the air, and I honestly just 139 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 3: got lucky. I just started clicking on planes because I 140 00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:14,400 Speaker 3: don't know how to search for all departures out of 141 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 3: one airport on ADSP Exchange. I'm sure AV geeks who 142 00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:20,239 Speaker 3: are better at it do, but I just started clicking 143 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:23,080 Speaker 3: on planes and I clicked. I think like the third 144 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 3: plane that I clicked on had taken off out of 145 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 3: Harlingen a couple hours earlier and was over the middle 146 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:34,439 Speaker 3: of the Atlantic, which is not a usual departure for Harlingen. 147 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:38,559 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, that's quite. 148 00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:42,240 Speaker 3: And so you know, I posted on Blue Sky to 149 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:45,559 Speaker 3: the other AV geeks who were looking for it. 150 00:08:46,520 --> 00:08:47,520 Speaker 2: I think this might be it. 151 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:52,240 Speaker 3: You know, it's a private jet with a LAD designation 152 00:08:52,559 --> 00:08:56,839 Speaker 3: that took off from this very obscure airport and it's 153 00:08:56,920 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 3: traveling internationally. Nothing else really fit the right, so we 154 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:07,320 Speaker 3: all started looking at it. Another reporter named Jacqueline Sweet. 155 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 3: You know, I looked up the registration. It's registered to 156 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:13,600 Speaker 3: a man named Igor Smirnov, which there are a lot 157 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:14,839 Speaker 3: of Igor Smirnov's. 158 00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:17,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's a pretty common name. 159 00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:20,600 Speaker 3: He's not the Chess guy, he's not the Moldovan guy. 160 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:24,320 Speaker 3: He appears to have once owned an airline in his 161 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 3: Pakistan and has been in the US for some time. 162 00:09:27,400 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 3: So he has, you know, this private jet. And then 163 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:33,480 Speaker 3: Jacqueline Sweet looked up that yes, he has DHS contracts. 164 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:34,080 Speaker 1: Okay. 165 00:09:34,679 --> 00:09:38,320 Speaker 3: Then the other thing was I just googled the tail 166 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:41,960 Speaker 3: number M five eight eight eight. One of the first 167 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 3: things that came up was that this was the private 168 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:52,960 Speaker 3: jet that carried Britney Griner home from Russia when she 169 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:54,440 Speaker 3: had been. 170 00:09:54,520 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 2: Released in a prisoner swat. 171 00:09:56,360 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, and so that, you know, was the thing where 172 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:02,440 Speaker 3: I was like, Okay, this this plane's been used for 173 00:10:02,559 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 3: like weird government business before. Yeah, Like I think I 174 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:11,080 Speaker 3: think this might be it. Yeah, So that's when I posted. 175 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:14,120 Speaker 3: Once I realized the Britney Grinder thing, then I posted 176 00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:16,960 Speaker 3: it and other people, other av geeks were. 177 00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:19,200 Speaker 2: Saying, yeah, I think that might be it. 178 00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 3: And then you know, Jacqueline got more info on the 179 00:10:23,160 --> 00:10:27,480 Speaker 3: contracts and so this is for about two hours we 180 00:10:27,559 --> 00:10:30,679 Speaker 3: watched it and JJ and DC said, I think it's 181 00:10:30,800 --> 00:10:34,320 Speaker 3: about to land in Shannon, and you know, soon enough 182 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:37,680 Speaker 3: it descended and landed at Shannon. Yep. 183 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 2: So Shannon Airport in Ireland. 184 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:56,880 Speaker 3: Is a frequent refueling stop for the US military, and 185 00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:59,439 Speaker 3: you know that's something that a lot of Irish people 186 00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:00,760 Speaker 3: really fucking hate. 187 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:03,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, not a US base, to be clear, if people. 188 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 3: On a way, Yeah, it's not a US base. These 189 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 3: are this is US military that are just they're just refueling, 190 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 3: but they're refueling to you know, do a lot of 191 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 3: things that the Irish are not okay with. 192 00:11:18,040 --> 00:11:18,599 Speaker 1: Yeah. 193 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:22,520 Speaker 3: And so there's there's an organization there called Shannon Watch, 194 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:26,800 Speaker 3: who you know, they're watching all these US activities and 195 00:11:27,200 --> 00:11:31,880 Speaker 3: you know, pressuring the government to stop this. So you know, 196 00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:34,800 Speaker 3: I tried to email them before the plane even landed, 197 00:11:35,520 --> 00:11:37,679 Speaker 3: and I don't know if it was user error on 198 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 3: my end or you know, if I don't know why 199 00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:43,679 Speaker 3: I didn't work, but they didn't get the message. I 200 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:47,240 Speaker 3: only found that out like half an hour ago. Yeah, 201 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:51,480 Speaker 3: but so I messaged them, and then I like messaged 202 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:55,600 Speaker 3: a couple friends in Ireland, like, hey, wake up, wake up. 203 00:11:56,160 --> 00:12:00,440 Speaker 3: You didn't call somebody, you know, but there's two thirty 204 00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:00,960 Speaker 3: in the morning. 205 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:02,840 Speaker 2: I'm glad my friends were asleep. 206 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:08,840 Speaker 3: And yeah, So I don't know how how much I 207 00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:12,680 Speaker 3: wanted to get into my personal hedging or my journey. 208 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:15,880 Speaker 3: But you know, I used to be like a neutral, 209 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:19,880 Speaker 3: objective journalist at the Washington Post for ten years, and 210 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 3: I left a year and a half ago, and I've 211 00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:27,400 Speaker 3: been enjoying being an opinionated journalist. I've been writing a book. 212 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:31,880 Speaker 3: But you know, there's a difference between being an opinionated 213 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:36,200 Speaker 3: journalist and actually interfering in a story. Yeah, and so 214 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:38,439 Speaker 3: I kind of hedged for a minute of like should 215 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:42,839 Speaker 3: I should I do anything else? Should I actively participate 216 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 3: in trying to stop this flight? 217 00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:45,480 Speaker 1: You know? 218 00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 2: Am I not going to get a column this job 219 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:48,960 Speaker 2: someday if I do that? 220 00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:49,839 Speaker 1: Yeah? 221 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:52,520 Speaker 3: You know, I'm ashamed to say that, But I have 222 00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:55,319 Speaker 3: to tell the truth. That's what I thought. And then 223 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 3: I just decided, you know, screw it, I have to 224 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:03,640 Speaker 3: do the right thing. So I called the Shannon Airport Police. 225 00:13:05,559 --> 00:13:08,640 Speaker 3: I called the Shannon Garda. They called the police, the 226 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:14,400 Speaker 3: Garda in Ireland, and I talked to you know whatever 227 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:17,800 Speaker 3: man answered for like a minute, and then he was like, 228 00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 3: let me let me, you know, knock you up the chain. 229 00:13:21,280 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 3: And I was forwarded to someone else, to a woman 230 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:31,640 Speaker 3: who you know. She sounded smart, urgent, interested, It sounded 231 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:33,880 Speaker 3: like she was taking notes. It sounded like she was 232 00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:37,240 Speaker 3: taking this seriously. And I was saying, there is a 233 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 3: plane with this tail number that landed fifteen minutes ago 234 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:49,200 Speaker 3: that may have people on board who have been illegally 235 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:54,679 Speaker 3: removed from the United States, who have not consented to 236 00:13:55,559 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 3: go to their destination, who are being sent to Susudan 237 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:02,240 Speaker 3: when they are not from Sau Sudan, you know. And 238 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:05,520 Speaker 3: I made clear that like, I don't know that this 239 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:09,240 Speaker 3: is the right plane, but I'm pretty sure that it is. 240 00:14:09,360 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 3: This plane has been used before for US government business. 241 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:19,200 Speaker 3: And I said, I know that our judges' orders don't 242 00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 3: matter in your sovereign country, but a judge has said 243 00:14:23,880 --> 00:14:27,640 Speaker 3: this is not allowed, and it might be happening. And 244 00:14:27,880 --> 00:14:30,520 Speaker 3: I don't know what your human trafficking laws are like, 245 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:36,400 Speaker 3: but you should know that if there are human trafficking 246 00:14:36,520 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 3: or kidnapping laws in Ireland that might apply to this, 247 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:45,360 Speaker 3: like maybe check the plane. Yeah, and you know, I 248 00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 3: didn't record the call and I didn't take notes, but 249 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:53,440 Speaker 3: I do recall her saying that she was trying to 250 00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:56,560 Speaker 3: send someone to check the plane, and she was, you know, 251 00:14:56,640 --> 00:14:57,800 Speaker 3: taking detailed notes. 252 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 2: What are their nationalities? How many are are there? 253 00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:04,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, and yes, so you know, the call 254 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 3: lasted thirteen minutes and then I waited, you know, was 255 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:14,320 Speaker 3: talking with the other av geeks on Blue Sky who 256 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:15,520 Speaker 3: were at this point. 257 00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 2: You know, this is around ten pm. It's getting a 258 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 2: little late. 259 00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:23,760 Speaker 3: And then yeah, I don't know what happened, but the 260 00:15:23,800 --> 00:15:28,000 Speaker 3: plane taxi to a parking stamp near the terminal for 261 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:31,960 Speaker 3: a while, and I thought, oh, it's been it's been 262 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:33,880 Speaker 3: turned off. It's parked for the night. I don't think 263 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:35,200 Speaker 3: they're going to let him leave. 264 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:40,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, and then the plane took off. It was two 265 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:41,400 Speaker 2: hours after it landed. 266 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:48,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and it went to Jabooty where it remains 267 00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 1: at a time of recording. Yeah, it's been raised since 268 00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 1: you first kind of identified this plane, it's been raised. 269 00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 1: I talked to Dallas or like an Irish member of 270 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:04,440 Speaker 1: Parliament raised it today. I saw there was an exchange 271 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 1: about it. I spoke to Paul Murphy, who's the TV 272 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:13,120 Speaker 1: for Dublin's Southwest. Oh, Paul, get me a statement I'm 273 00:16:13,200 --> 00:16:16,040 Speaker 1: going to read here. The very least Sierrish government must 274 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:18,760 Speaker 1: do is to inform the US authorities that no more 275 00:16:18,800 --> 00:16:22,160 Speaker 1: deportation flights are permitted to use our airspace, in our airports. 276 00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 1: We must not facilitate this in humane and illegal deportation policy. 277 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:29,960 Speaker 1: So it does seem like even if nothing was done 278 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 1: in this instance, hopefully this isn't something that will be 279 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 1: able to happen again. I know, as you said, people 280 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:37,760 Speaker 1: have been upset about that use of Shannon. I think 281 00:16:37,760 --> 00:16:40,520 Speaker 1: they used Knock Airport as well, like for a long time, 282 00:16:40,600 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: because the US use them a lot in its war 283 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:46,480 Speaker 1: on terror. An Ireland has been a neutral country for 284 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,359 Speaker 1: a long time, and that's a feeling that it compromises 285 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,600 Speaker 1: that among some people. But this raise is a really 286 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:56,720 Speaker 1: interesting question for those of us who are following the 287 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:59,720 Speaker 1: deportations right, which is like we've been thinking that it 288 00:16:59,760 --> 00:17:02,880 Speaker 1: was on military or commercial flights, like you said, but 289 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 1: there's this possibility that these smaller planes are being used 290 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:11,320 Speaker 1: for deportation, and like that's very concerning. It means we 291 00:17:11,320 --> 00:17:15,640 Speaker 1: could have missed things absolutely. It also shows the timeline 292 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:21,920 Speaker 1: here is extraordinarily rapid, right from the people being informed 293 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:26,000 Speaker 1: at six pm. I believe it's six pm Pacific. I've 294 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: been spending a lot of time on Pacer this week. 295 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:31,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, good old Pacer yep, A. 296 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:33,159 Speaker 1: Lot of the money generated by the adverts in this 297 00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:37,760 Speaker 1: show on Pacer. So six thirty five Central time, NM 298 00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:40,639 Speaker 1: who is one of the Burmese people in this this 299 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:43,720 Speaker 1: class action lawsuit? Right? So, the lawsuit a number of 300 00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:47,359 Speaker 1: people trying to get an attentative restraining order against being Center 301 00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:50,760 Speaker 1: South who done now previously Libya? Six thirty five Central Time. 302 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 1: That person's lawyer was told that they had an order 303 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:58,480 Speaker 1: of removal at nine am Pacific. The lawyer had scheduled 304 00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:02,280 Speaker 1: of video conference eight twenty seven Pacific. They were told 305 00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:08,080 Speaker 1: that that person had already been removed. Yeah, so pretty fast, 306 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:12,840 Speaker 1: And like perhaps that's why they're using these like small 307 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:15,159 Speaker 1: can you give an idea of like, I guess a 308 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 1: lot of people wear in a phone and small aircraft, 309 00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:19,440 Speaker 1: but these are quite like this isn't a usual thing, 310 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 1: right to be. 311 00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:24,119 Speaker 3: No this is a luxury jet, yeah, that you know 312 00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:31,439 Speaker 3: is moonlighting as a prisoner vessel for kidnappers. And I 313 00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:38,040 Speaker 3: just I'm so struck by the dichotomy of the luxury 314 00:18:38,359 --> 00:18:44,879 Speaker 3: of this vessel transporting them to Hell, to a country 315 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 3: where they do not speak the language, they have no 316 00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:51,600 Speaker 3: family or friends, to you know, a prison where people 317 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:55,320 Speaker 3: are being tortured that is about to descend into civil war, 318 00:18:55,440 --> 00:18:58,440 Speaker 3: may already be in civil war. I mean, the dicotomy 319 00:18:58,520 --> 00:19:02,720 Speaker 3: of that is so strike to me. Yeah, and so perverse. 320 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:06,359 Speaker 1: Yeah, perverse is the right word. It is, like it's uh, 321 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:10,359 Speaker 1: perversely ludicrous. I don't know, Like it's so striking to 322 00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:13,680 Speaker 1: me as well that somebody who has the financial means 323 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 1: to own a private luxury jet to find themselves around 324 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:21,000 Speaker 1: the world is also profiting off the rendition of people 325 00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 1: who are trying now to plead in Convention against torture, right, 326 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:29,360 Speaker 1: they will be tortured if they are flown via luxury 327 00:19:29,400 --> 00:19:33,159 Speaker 1: private jet to South Sudan, And that South Sudanese government 328 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:34,919 Speaker 1: seems to have stated that it would just return them 329 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 1: to their countries from which they have withholding it for 330 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:38,840 Speaker 1: removement in the first place. Is why the US can't 331 00:19:38,840 --> 00:19:40,280 Speaker 1: send them to their countries. Right. 332 00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:43,159 Speaker 3: That's why the US hasn't done it, right. It's like, 333 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:46,680 Speaker 3: you know, it's a diplomatic pickle, but like the solution 334 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 3: isn't well, just you know, dump them somewhere else. 335 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:54,560 Speaker 1: Right, yeah, and then have someone else do our daily work, 336 00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:55,320 Speaker 1: like send them back. 337 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:55,840 Speaker 2: Right. 338 00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:58,680 Speaker 1: You found these contracts. Do you know how much DHS 339 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 1: is spending like perf light on these things? 340 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 2: I have no idea. 341 00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:06,800 Speaker 3: I mean that is something that other reporters, I think, 342 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:10,120 Speaker 3: are you know, going to be better sources of that information. 343 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:15,879 Speaker 3: I've really just begun tracking these flights. You know, I 344 00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:18,320 Speaker 3: like to track flights all the time, just because I 345 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:22,280 Speaker 3: have ADHD. You know, it's a wonderful activity if you're 346 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:27,760 Speaker 3: neurodivergent to spend some time on ADSP exchange. But like 347 00:20:27,800 --> 00:20:29,840 Speaker 3: I said, I was just like, I wonder if I 348 00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 3: can find this plane. And I did, And that has 349 00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 3: opened up a whole world to me of you know, 350 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:42,320 Speaker 3: really dedicated people. Tom Cartwright is one, and then JJ 351 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:44,960 Speaker 3: and d C is another. He wants to remain anonymous, 352 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:50,160 Speaker 3: who have been tracking these planes for some time, and 353 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 3: I'm really inspired by them and you know, want to 354 00:20:54,920 --> 00:21:06,000 Speaker 3: join them. And help them. 355 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:08,680 Speaker 1: We see a number of issues like that, we can 356 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:10,520 Speaker 1: questions that we can answer with these things. Right, the 357 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 1: United States abording people to Venezuela, but there are lots 358 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 1: of in Venezuela which are under sanctions, right, So like 359 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:17,879 Speaker 1: how is it doing that? Who is it paying to 360 00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:21,199 Speaker 1: do that? Like where is our taxpayer money going? How 361 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 1: much is it costing to achieve this rendition of a 362 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:30,520 Speaker 1: dozen people? Right who at the current time of our recording, 363 00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:36,160 Speaker 1: which is Thursday afternoon Pacific time, the twenty second of May, 364 00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:40,720 Speaker 1: they go. I just checked the pacer again, which is 365 00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 1: what I do all day now. And Judge Murphy's most 366 00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:47,760 Speaker 1: recent order had clarified that these people would have ten 367 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:52,800 Speaker 1: days to present their reasonable fear right, so to present 368 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:56,719 Speaker 1: their reasonable fear and convention against torture proceedings that they 369 00:21:56,720 --> 00:21:59,359 Speaker 1: would be it could face torture right if they were 370 00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 1: sent to these these places. If the Department of Homeland 371 00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:07,359 Speaker 1: Security determined that they didn't have credible fear, then they 372 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:10,399 Speaker 1: would have fifteen days to again petition for reopening of 373 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:14,120 Speaker 1: their migration case. So that's twenty five days for those 374 00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:16,920 Speaker 1: who accounting that these people will presumably now have to 375 00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:21,000 Speaker 1: be accommodated in Jubouty. The DHS is claiming that they 376 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:24,080 Speaker 1: can do all these interviews and that when they saystate translators, 377 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:27,159 Speaker 1: like one of them speaks Korent, not a language that 378 00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:29,040 Speaker 1: we have. I mean that there are lots of Kren 379 00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:31,800 Speaker 1: speaking people in the United States, but it's you know, 380 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:34,120 Speaker 1: it's not language that many immigration lawyers speak. So I'm 381 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:37,399 Speaker 1: guessing there will have to be a translator provided. And 382 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:39,240 Speaker 1: so all that is now happening in Jubouty, and like, 383 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 1: we wouldn't have known that if we hadn't been able 384 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:45,560 Speaker 1: to track these flights, right, And so it's a very 385 00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:51,320 Speaker 1: interesting way of approaching this. And I think like increasingly 386 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:54,400 Speaker 1: the government have recently lost a number of fire requests. 387 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:58,720 Speaker 1: I guess, like public records do not move at the 388 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 1: same speed as in news site does. Like I file 389 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:05,439 Speaker 1: a lot of public records requests, most of them I 390 00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:07,280 Speaker 1: don't get anything back, the ones. 391 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:09,760 Speaker 2: That they take like eight years sometimes. 392 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:13,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, literally, Yeah, I mean I have public records requests 393 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:16,679 Speaker 1: that I made under the previous Trump administration that I 394 00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:20,480 Speaker 1: believe are still ongoing. Yeah, it's infuriatingly slowly. You have 395 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:22,760 Speaker 1: a right to inspect these records, but you don't have 396 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:25,159 Speaker 1: a right to inspect them in any particular time period. 397 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 1: And so doing this kind of open source tracking offers 398 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:32,439 Speaker 1: us a window into this deportation machine that the government 399 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 1: is building right exactly in cooperation with the super rich, 400 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:39,959 Speaker 1: like using your taxpayer resources. I would if people are 401 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,919 Speaker 1: interested in doing this, like, how would you suggest they 402 00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:46,320 Speaker 1: kind of get going? They could explainers out there. 403 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:48,159 Speaker 3: I mean the first thing I would do is that 404 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,439 Speaker 3: I would follow Tom Cartwright and JJ and DC on 405 00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:55,359 Speaker 3: Blue Sky. Then you know, get the flight Radar twenty 406 00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,400 Speaker 3: four app. You can see a lot of the charter 407 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:03,640 Speaker 3: planes on app. Adsp exchange is pretty buggy and hard 408 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:07,879 Speaker 3: to use if you don't have any aviation experience. 409 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:10,879 Speaker 2: At all, but you know you can learn. Yeah, and 410 00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:13,160 Speaker 2: uh yeah, I mean. 411 00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:15,719 Speaker 3: Like I said, if you're neuro divergent, this is a 412 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:19,680 Speaker 3: terrific activity to just kind of like massage your brain 413 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 3: and hyper focus, and you know, putting it to good 414 00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:28,480 Speaker 3: purpose to maybe witness or maybe even stop some of 415 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:31,400 Speaker 3: these activities from happening, you know, would be great. 416 00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:34,679 Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I think that's uh, Like there are countries 417 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:40,560 Speaker 1: which have strong legislation that can possibly prevent these You know, 418 00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 1: these either planes transiting their airspace or if they're refueling 419 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,480 Speaker 1: there as you as you said in an Ireland like 420 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:50,359 Speaker 1: perhaps prevent these people being renditioned to somewhere where they 421 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:52,320 Speaker 1: might face torture. And I think it's a really valuable 422 00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:55,600 Speaker 1: absolutely thing to try, Like we should try whatever we 423 00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:56,360 Speaker 1: can right now. 424 00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:01,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, and I mean now that Ireland knows this is happening. 425 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:05,840 Speaker 3: You know, I don't know what happened with the Garda 426 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:10,400 Speaker 3: on Tuesday night early Wednesday morning. I don't know if 427 00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:13,120 Speaker 3: they were able to board the plane, if they tried 428 00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 3: to stop it and couldn't. 429 00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:14,719 Speaker 2: I have no idea. 430 00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:17,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, now that they know this is happening, maybe they 431 00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:20,960 Speaker 3: can look a little bit deeper into their laws and 432 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:25,720 Speaker 3: regulations and find a justification so that if this happens again, 433 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:30,080 Speaker 3: they can be prepared to respond. You know, I know 434 00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:34,720 Speaker 3: that the Irish are exemplars in human rights, and so 435 00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:38,760 Speaker 3: you know, if anybody is going to do something, it 436 00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:39,600 Speaker 3: might be them. 437 00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:42,679 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I know. Artie and now camped out at 438 00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:45,280 Speaker 1: the airport wing for the plane to come back, which yeah. 439 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:46,520 Speaker 3: I know, I wish they had checked with the av 440 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:48,240 Speaker 3: geeks first, because the plane's not on the way. 441 00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:49,359 Speaker 1: Yeah, no it's not. 442 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:50,560 Speaker 2: It hasn't left. 443 00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,560 Speaker 1: Look at the coat proceedings. It's going to be three weeks. 444 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:56,800 Speaker 1: But yeah, it's great. You've made this an issue there, 445 00:25:56,960 --> 00:25:59,919 Speaker 1: which I think, Yeah, it helps, Like all this stuff 446 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 1: makes a difference. 447 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:04,840 Speaker 3: I mean, I just I want the Irish people to realize, 448 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:09,400 Speaker 3: because none of their lawmakers have said it yet, that 449 00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 3: Irish authorities knew when the plane was on the ground 450 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:18,959 Speaker 3: at Shannon that there were people who are possibly being 451 00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:22,719 Speaker 3: illegally detained on this specific airplane. 452 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 2: I just want them to know that. Yeah, yeah, you know. 453 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:30,000 Speaker 3: And I'm I hear that their public information laws are 454 00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:34,160 Speaker 3: also not great. But the police there recorded the call, 455 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:38,000 Speaker 3: so there's a recording somewhere if they can find it. 456 00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:40,640 Speaker 1: Right, I guess I can't find anyone who can answer 457 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:43,560 Speaker 1: the satisfactory the question of like whose jurisdiction the plane 458 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:43,960 Speaker 1: is under? 459 00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:48,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, and it really depends too, like was 460 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:52,119 Speaker 3: the plane parked in the international transit area? Was it 461 00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 3: in a place where you know, the guard I didn't 462 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 3: even have authority, I have no idea, you know. 463 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,439 Speaker 1: Yeah, these are real questions we can now ask because 464 00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:03,320 Speaker 1: we know right that it was there. And I think 465 00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:07,000 Speaker 1: that's very valuable. Glean where can people follow your work? Said? 466 00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:09,920 Speaker 1: You published this on your ghost newsletter first. 467 00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:14,320 Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, I'm writing a book, so I post extremely sporadically, 468 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:17,919 Speaker 3: but I do have a ghost newsletter. It's hard g 469 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:23,000 Speaker 3: History because it's hard. G Gillian Hard, Ghistory dot ghost 470 00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:25,399 Speaker 3: dot io. And then I'm on Blue Sky at g 471 00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:26,720 Speaker 3: Brackel Nice. 472 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 1: Do you want to plug your book where you have 473 00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:29,560 Speaker 1: the opportunity. 474 00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:33,920 Speaker 2: I mean, there's not like a you know, pre order links. 475 00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:37,679 Speaker 3: I'm very much still writing it, but you know, my 476 00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:39,480 Speaker 3: agent will be mad at me for saying this. The 477 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:43,120 Speaker 3: working title is people didn't know what was wrong back then, 478 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:45,520 Speaker 3: the lie at the heart of American History. 479 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:47,560 Speaker 1: I will look forward to reading that. 480 00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:50,440 Speaker 2: Thank you. Thanks for having me, James, I really appreciate it. 481 00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:51,680 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us. 482 00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:58,320 Speaker 2: It Could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media. 483 00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:01,560 Speaker 3: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website 484 00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:05,200 Speaker 3: Polsonmedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, 485 00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,880 Speaker 3: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can 486 00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,240 Speaker 3: now find sources for It Could Happen here listed directly 487 00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:12,399 Speaker 3: in episode descriptions. 488 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:13,560 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening.