WEBVTT - When Did We All Start Saying "Bulls*t"? 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:27.520 Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to 0:00:27.560 --> 0:00:30.960 the show, fellow Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so 0:00:31.160 --> 0:00:33.519 much for tuning in. Let's hear it for the Man, 0:00:33.600 --> 0:00:36.479 the Myth, the Legend, our super producer, mister Max the 0:00:36.520 --> 0:00:37.680 freight Train Williams. 0:00:39.120 --> 0:00:40.520 I'm still here in the Bahamas. 0:00:40.880 --> 0:00:44.880 We're all in the Bahamas in our hearts. Max Bullshnip Williams. 0:00:45.640 --> 0:00:49.120 That's mister nol no poop Brown. 0:00:49.960 --> 0:00:51.240 They called me straight poop. 0:00:51.560 --> 0:00:54.480 They call me Ben Bullen in this part of the world, 0:00:54.600 --> 0:00:58.520 primarily due to tax purposes and folks. Before we get 0:00:58.560 --> 0:01:04.319 into today's exploration, we have a disclaimer disclaimer disclaimer. 0:01:04.400 --> 0:01:09.240 Somebody's one We're talking disclaimer disclaimer disclaimer. 0:01:09.600 --> 0:01:14.320 This episode may not be appropriate for all Ridiculous Historians. 0:01:14.640 --> 0:01:18.000 It may be one that you cannot play in the classroom. 0:01:18.200 --> 0:01:21.720 We were on the fence about whether to include a 0:01:21.920 --> 0:01:26.039 million bleeps here or just to label it explicit and 0:01:26.280 --> 0:01:28.920 let it ride spoiler. We went for the latter. 0:01:29.200 --> 0:01:32.120 Death by a million bleeps was not something that we wanted. 0:01:31.840 --> 0:01:33.520 To go with right right. 0:01:33.959 --> 0:01:36.280 We did it out of honestly, we did it out 0:01:36.319 --> 0:01:39.679 of empathy for our dear long suffering producer Max. 0:01:40.400 --> 0:01:43.680 The conversation was, uh, yeah, I mean, as long as 0:01:43.680 --> 0:01:46.240 it gets more production time on this one, we can 0:01:46.480 --> 0:01:48.640 I'll believe them all, and both Ben and nol No 0:01:48.720 --> 0:01:50.720 we're not gonna. We're not gonna. Yeah, no, we're not 0:01:50.720 --> 0:01:51.240 gonna do that. 0:01:51.760 --> 0:01:54.840 Well, there were also philosophical reasons for the choice, you know. 0:01:55.240 --> 0:01:58.480 Also, I believe that censorship is bullshity. 0:01:59.400 --> 0:01:59.920 First one. 0:02:00.320 --> 0:02:03.200 Also, first one, lets we have kind of agreeed, or 0:02:03.200 --> 0:02:05.240 it ended up on the same page, that bullshit is 0:02:05.320 --> 0:02:08.680 a bit of a PG. Thirteen swear, not even sure 0:02:08.680 --> 0:02:10.440 if it makes an R rating. I think you can 0:02:10.480 --> 0:02:11.560 have unlimited bullshit. 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:14.080 You can have what bullshit if you want, and that 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:17.639 bullshit will be fine. That's right, folks agreed. 0:02:18.000 --> 0:02:24.560 We think the term bullshit has been normalized throughout throughout 0:02:24.560 --> 0:02:29.720 a US discourse, throughout the anglosphere, honestly, And a few 0:02:29.760 --> 0:02:33.959 weeks ago, you guys had this moment of ridiculous epiphany. 0:02:34.000 --> 0:02:36.040 I was talking with some friends about Believe It or 0:02:36.080 --> 0:02:39.720 Not politics, and I realized we were all using an 0:02:39.760 --> 0:02:44.079 English phrase bullshit. And it's kind of bizarre because every 0:02:44.240 --> 0:02:49.880 English speaker knows what that phrase means. But riddle me this. 0:02:50.000 --> 0:02:54.000 There's so many animals walking, flying, and swimming along this 0:02:54.160 --> 0:02:57.760 wide world of ours, so know how to cows of 0:02:57.800 --> 0:03:02.120 all things, and just apparently male cows in specific. How 0:03:02.120 --> 0:03:05.919 did they get such an unfair wrap? With everything pooping 0:03:06.000 --> 0:03:07.240 all the time on the world? 0:03:07.480 --> 0:03:08.720 How did everybody poops? 0:03:08.919 --> 0:03:09.040 Right? 0:03:09.240 --> 0:03:11.880 Or the less popular book, nobody poops but you you 0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:12.639 shout out? 0:03:12.680 --> 0:03:16.720 Family guys? How did how did bull feces in particular 0:03:17.120 --> 0:03:20.080 become a stand in for that all that is untrue, 0:03:20.240 --> 0:03:24.880 false or misleading? Like when did we all start saying bullshit? 0:03:31.800 --> 0:03:32.799 You know? It's funny, Ben. 0:03:33.840 --> 0:03:37.560 I also enjoy using the phrase horseshit, but that usually 0:03:37.600 --> 0:03:40.920 just refers to something that I'm not into, like that's horseshit, 0:03:41.120 --> 0:03:46.640 Like I'm angry about that. Bullshit, however, does imply incredulity, 0:03:47.040 --> 0:03:49.520 And that's what I want to dig into. Man, Where 0:03:49.520 --> 0:03:53.360 does that come from? Why are we so suspicious of bullpoop? 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:58.360 First off, this may surprise the more polite, ridiculous historians 0:03:58.440 --> 0:04:02.960 in the crowd. Bullshit is a real word. It is 0:04:03.040 --> 0:04:07.360 found in multiple dictionaries from Oxford English down to Merriam 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:11.680 Webster and Cambridge. Merriam Webster defines bullshit as also, I'm 0:04:11.680 --> 0:04:13.680 gonna stop keeping it tally because I don't have a 0:04:14.520 --> 0:04:19.320 fool errand yeah. Merriam Webster defines bullshit as both a 0:04:19.440 --> 0:04:23.159 noun and a verb, because anything can become a verb, 0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:27.920 especially in American English. But no, I am not yeah 0:04:28.000 --> 0:04:31.760 God as a as a noun to your earlier point there, 0:04:31.839 --> 0:04:38.560 noel as a noun. Mirriam Webster says bullshit indicates quote, foolish, 0:04:39.000 --> 0:04:42.880 or insolent talk. As a verb, it can mean either 0:04:43.000 --> 0:04:48.279 to talk foolish, foolishly, boastfly, or idly, or the less 0:04:48.320 --> 0:04:52.240 cutting second definition, which I think is kind of wholesome 0:04:52.839 --> 0:04:57.280 to engage in a discursive discussion, which you know they 0:04:57.720 --> 0:04:58.200 like to. 0:04:58.440 --> 0:04:59.760 We're just having a bull sash. 0:05:00.040 --> 0:05:01.640 You can me if you want to be polite about it, 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:03.680 you could call it a bull sash. But it we're 0:05:03.720 --> 0:05:06.279 just bullshitting man, just having a good old time talking, 0:05:06.440 --> 0:05:10.559 talking a game. But yeah again, yeah we're just horsing around, 0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:11.359 balling around. 0:05:11.839 --> 0:05:16.080 Yeah, that second definition is fascinating, guys. It shows us 0:05:16.120 --> 0:05:20.599 a meaning wherein bullshit is not always inherently bad. It's 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:23.920 just sort of irrelevant. It's small talk. It's like shooting 0:05:23.960 --> 0:05:27.680 the breeze. We all stayed a little later after dinner 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:31.599 just bullshitting, which literally happened to us in Baha Mar. 0:05:31.640 --> 0:05:35.760 It doesn't mean we all stayed late to shout quote foolish, 0:05:35.839 --> 0:05:39.760 insolent talk at each other. Instead, we probably joked about 0:05:39.760 --> 0:05:42.640 the weather, caught up with old friends, We talked about books, 0:05:42.640 --> 0:05:45.680 we were reading, new films we wanted to see. In 0:05:45.720 --> 0:05:47.880 our case, we talked a little bit about the beach 0:05:47.920 --> 0:05:52.080 and the casino in that sense, in the beach casino, Yeah, 0:05:52.680 --> 0:05:56.440 in that sense. People around the world bullshit constantly. 0:05:57.000 --> 0:06:00.320 So let's jump right into uh, you know, one of 0:06:00.320 --> 0:06:04.720 the more high falutin dictionaries the Cambridge who agrees that 0:06:04.800 --> 0:06:06.920 bullshit is both a noun and a verb, but they 0:06:07.000 --> 0:06:12.919 take a slightly different and arguably meaner approach because they're British. 0:06:13.120 --> 0:06:16.200 Yeah they're they're a little bit less. Let's know how 0:06:16.200 --> 0:06:19.159 to cut you to the quick. Oh yeah, they've got 0:06:19.160 --> 0:06:21.560 some of the best insults either of us have ever heard. 0:06:21.960 --> 0:06:28.360 To Cabridge, there's just bollocks. To Cambridge. 0:06:28.480 --> 0:06:33.400 Bullshit as a noun is a rude word for complete 0:06:33.440 --> 0:06:36.880 nonsense or something that is not true and spoiler, there's 0:06:36.920 --> 0:06:40.160 a clue in that definition They also turn up the 0:06:40.160 --> 0:06:43.839 heat with their definition of bullshit as a verb, which 0:06:43.880 --> 0:06:48.440 sounds downright accusatory. Noel, would you do the honors? 0:06:48.800 --> 0:06:49.000 Yeah? 0:06:49.040 --> 0:06:51.119 I mean this is we've kind of touched on this one. 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:53.479 A rude word. Why did you do an H? There? 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:55.800 It's just not being British that they wouldn't have done. 0:06:55.640 --> 0:06:56.880 That either, A rude word. 0:06:56.920 --> 0:06:58.880 I do love it though, when they say the letter H, 0:06:58.960 --> 0:07:01.640 they say H, which is a lot of fun. Sorry 0:07:01.680 --> 0:07:04.120 to continue. A rude word meaning to try to persuade 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:07.240 someone or make them admire you by saying things that 0:07:07.360 --> 0:07:11.680 are not true. Don't bullshit a bullshitter, Ben, Yeah, don't 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:13.360 bes a bs or so. 0:07:14.400 --> 0:07:18.320 Again, this is all too common in political discourse. As 0:07:18.360 --> 0:07:22.000 we were talking with maxoft Air and we all, I 0:07:22.000 --> 0:07:25.200 think it's fair to say ridiculous historians, we all almost 0:07:25.280 --> 0:07:29.280 certainly have met someone that makes wild claims in day 0:07:29.360 --> 0:07:32.680 to day life. Surely a lot of us, especially in 0:07:32.720 --> 0:07:35.400 the States. We had that one kid in grade school 0:07:35.600 --> 0:07:39.720 whose dad definitely invented Nintendo, or that one or the 0:07:39.720 --> 0:07:43.200 cop Salad who yeah, who swore up and down that 0:07:43.240 --> 0:07:46.320 they had a boyfriend or girlfriend for real, for real, 0:07:46.520 --> 0:07:48.640 who just happened to go to a different school. 0:07:48.720 --> 0:07:49.240 Oh that's me. 0:07:49.360 --> 0:07:51.520 My girlfriend does go to a different school, lives in 0:07:51.560 --> 0:07:53.120 a different state, as it turns out. 0:07:53.160 --> 0:07:54.160 Oh you're going to school. 0:07:54.600 --> 0:07:57.280 Yeah, oh yeah, I'm going to night school. I'm studying 0:07:57.320 --> 0:07:59.360 bullshittery Ah. 0:07:59.240 --> 0:08:02.760 That's not bullshit at all, right, yes, the God honest. Hey. 0:08:02.800 --> 0:08:05.040 And also, by the way, we talked about this a 0:08:05.040 --> 0:08:06.920 little bit in the inso or I may be dropped it. 0:08:07.160 --> 0:08:11.800 I'm fascinated with a kind of Midwestern term, the straight poop, 0:08:12.640 --> 0:08:15.760 which is which means the truth, the God honest. So 0:08:15.800 --> 0:08:19.320 how can shit be both true and fault at the 0:08:19.320 --> 0:08:19.880 same time? 0:08:20.200 --> 0:08:21.080 Strangers shit. 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:26.600 There's this great Finnish comedian that I follow, a stand 0:08:26.680 --> 0:08:30.000 up guy who plays with language a lot, and he 0:08:30.240 --> 0:08:35.319 is fascinated by something being a piece of shit being bad, 0:08:35.520 --> 0:08:39.640 something being the shit being good. That guy's name is 0:08:39.640 --> 0:08:44.640 Ismo I S m O. Last name Likola l e 0:08:44.760 --> 0:08:47.920 I k O l A. Do check him out. He's 0:08:48.120 --> 0:08:51.480 just a genius, and we're wrestling with a lot of 0:08:51.520 --> 0:08:55.160 the stuff our Finnish stand up pal is wrestling with 0:08:55.320 --> 0:08:58.559 as well. You know, it's weird because Noel, there are 0:08:58.679 --> 0:09:02.680 dozens of synonyms that convey the same or similar meaning 0:09:02.880 --> 0:09:08.080 without themselves being curse words. Nonsense, hogwash, ballooney bollocks in 0:09:08.120 --> 0:09:12.000 the UK also means nonsense. It is considered a rude 0:09:12.000 --> 0:09:14.760 word like bloody, but it's not on the left. 0:09:14.760 --> 0:09:18.679 Bollocks. Also the bulls bollocks. Right, Yeah, that's a good thing. 0:09:18.840 --> 0:09:19.880 It's like yelling. 0:09:19.640 --> 0:09:24.720 Balls now the bulls. The dog's bollocks is a good thing. Ah. 0:09:24.840 --> 0:09:27.920 Yes, once again, I'm just saying we've got and antonyms. 0:09:28.280 --> 0:09:32.720 Huh is that Cockney rhyming the dog ball, porky pies. 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:38.640 Yeah, porky pies is lies. Being in Barney is being 0:09:38.679 --> 0:09:42.000 in trouble because Barney rubble. A lot of Cockney rhyming 0:09:42.080 --> 0:09:46.480 slang seems to involve Hannah Barbara cartoon characters. Scooby. Not 0:09:46.600 --> 0:09:49.199 a Scooby means you don't know what you're talking about, 0:09:49.360 --> 0:09:53.120 not a Scooby doo a clue, that's the right one. 0:09:53.400 --> 0:09:56.959 Yeah, yeah, yeah, I believe the dog's bollocks may be 0:09:57.320 --> 0:10:00.600 a different episode of World put it in our were 0:10:01.120 --> 0:10:03.720 our quarterly things we left out? 0:10:04.320 --> 0:10:07.280 Yeah, the dogs bollocks is good, but a dog's breakfasts 0:10:07.400 --> 0:10:07.880 not good? 0:10:08.240 --> 0:10:12.760 Right, yes, because as we know it, dogs youatpoop, and. 0:10:13.160 --> 0:10:15.880 It all comes back around, comes from dust to dust. 0:10:16.320 --> 0:10:22.480 Right, Yeah, bull dust is also an Australian version of bullshit. 0:10:23.080 --> 0:10:27.599 But there there are so many words, right, nonsense, hogwash, maloney, bollocks, 0:10:27.800 --> 0:10:32.280 uh and who could forget obviously, flap doodle, oh my gosh, 0:10:32.520 --> 0:10:36.680 not to mention, not to mention. Still, for some reason, 0:10:37.520 --> 0:10:41.439 bullshit as a phrase occupies this special place in the 0:10:41.480 --> 0:10:45.679 beating heart of the American dialect, right, or the various 0:10:45.679 --> 0:10:51.400 American dialects. It's weird because it crosses generations, acrosses demographics. 0:10:51.679 --> 0:10:55.360 You will hear the most wealthy, oldest people say something 0:10:55.480 --> 0:10:58.480 is bullshit, and then you will hear the youngest people 0:10:58.960 --> 0:11:02.160 say bullshit, like a fifth grader might say bullshit, and 0:11:02.200 --> 0:11:05.679 then you both pause. Right, It's like uh in a 0:11:05.760 --> 0:11:08.840 Christmas story where the kid says the F word RF 0:11:11.520 --> 0:11:14.760 and then the narrator kicks in. But I didn't say fudge. 0:11:14.880 --> 0:11:18.800 No, he sure, that's a fun movie. Now, this is great, Ben, 0:11:18.840 --> 0:11:21.440 It's a really good point. It does seem to cross 0:11:21.520 --> 0:11:24.880 a lot of generational divides. I think it also just 0:11:25.040 --> 0:11:29.000 has a good mouthfeel to it. I think sometimes words 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:31.200 just kind of take on a life of their own 0:11:31.240 --> 0:11:33.560 and get popular because they're fun to say. 0:11:33.800 --> 0:11:37.480 It's that it's got that cool you in the first syllable, 0:11:37.640 --> 0:11:40.439 and then it's got not to sound too spectrmy here, 0:11:40.640 --> 0:11:41.360 and it's got a. 0:11:41.360 --> 0:11:44.080 Tight t at the end, so yeah, and a hard sush. 0:11:44.400 --> 0:11:48.760 Yeah. It's emphatic, right, and so. Like so many other words, 0:11:49.120 --> 0:11:54.559 the origin story of the phrase bullshit is surprisingly murky. 0:11:54.720 --> 0:11:59.040 It is fraught with misconceptions. Uh, let's put on our 0:11:59.240 --> 0:12:01.840 etymology caps nol because. 0:12:01.520 --> 0:12:03.760 We played wearing it, Ben, Yeah you did. 0:12:03.840 --> 0:12:07.080 I think it looks good on you, and we played 0:12:07.520 --> 0:12:10.199 a bit of a trick at the top of the show. 0:12:10.400 --> 0:12:15.400 We were kind of bullshitting you, fellow ridiculous historians about bullshit. 0:12:15.760 --> 0:12:20.200 It is a common misconception that bullshit directly refers to 0:12:20.280 --> 0:12:23.559 male cattle. That is not the case. It is a portmanteau, 0:12:23.840 --> 0:12:29.079 which we love, of bull meaning nonsense, not a bovine animal, 0:12:29.160 --> 0:12:32.959 not a cow. It's pretty directly related, therefore, to the 0:12:33.000 --> 0:12:36.520 English phrase bollocks, which comes to English via the French 0:12:36.559 --> 0:12:40.360 word bull, which means fraud or deceit. And it's also 0:12:40.440 --> 0:12:43.560 quite likely the meaning of bull here. 0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:50.840 Latines, way, Wayne, that's wild, Okay, so that's one mystery 0:12:51.120 --> 0:12:52.240 somewhat done and dusted. 0:12:52.320 --> 0:12:53.200 We'll get back to it. 0:12:53.800 --> 0:12:57.000 Yet, things, as they tend to do in the historical 0:12:57.040 --> 0:13:00.240 game of telephone, we always like to reference, get a 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:03.079 little bit murkier and order to part the more we 0:13:03.120 --> 0:13:07.920 attempt to figure out exactly how this term originated. And 0:13:08.200 --> 0:13:14.720 you know, much like manure spread gardener, that was a 0:13:14.760 --> 0:13:15.440 gardening joke. 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:19.280 That's for all the gardeners in the crowd tonight. Similar 0:13:19.320 --> 0:13:24.840 to the F word, sorry mom, bullshit has several competing 0:13:25.000 --> 0:13:27.840 origin stories, and one of these is really interesting. A 0:13:27.880 --> 0:13:31.559 common bit of scuttle but argues that the word comes 0:13:31.600 --> 0:13:35.040 from agrarian communities. 0:13:35.120 --> 0:13:37.840 Right all right, already said that one up by accident, 0:13:37.920 --> 0:13:40.600 and they would sell cow manure, of course, to use 0:13:40.640 --> 0:13:42.360 as fertilizer that they would spread. 0:13:43.559 --> 0:13:48.120 According to this story, the poop of the female cow 0:13:48.440 --> 0:13:51.720 is good for plants and agriculture, yet the poop from 0:13:51.760 --> 0:13:56.319 the male cow is either less helpful or downright harmful. 0:13:56.400 --> 0:14:01.240 So if you're a bad intention unethical farm you are 0:14:01.360 --> 0:14:04.400 out to up your profits, then you start to step 0:14:04.440 --> 0:14:08.160 on or cut your proper cow manure with poop from 0:14:08.320 --> 0:14:12.840 the male cows as well, you sell the literal bullshit 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:17.400 by claiming it is cowshit. Later down the line, as 0:14:17.440 --> 0:14:20.800 the seasons progressed, the customer they had suckered would see 0:14:20.920 --> 0:14:24.520 damaging effects on the crops. So the story tells us 0:14:24.560 --> 0:14:28.600 that people started saying, don't sell me no bullshit, and 0:14:28.880 --> 0:14:32.120 over the years this was shortened to just bullshit, and 0:14:32.160 --> 0:14:34.920 then further shortened to bull. 0:14:35.640 --> 0:14:39.040 I don't know. That seems like something someone invented. 0:14:38.960 --> 0:14:42.440 And Ben I definitely had no idea, this idea or 0:14:42.480 --> 0:14:46.800 this notion that cow manure, not all manure was created equal. 0:14:47.120 --> 0:14:49.640 But I have a little bit of a suspicion that 0:14:49.800 --> 0:14:52.560 the negative effects of manure had less to do with 0:14:52.640 --> 0:14:55.160 the gender of where the poop came from and more 0:14:55.200 --> 0:14:57.080 to do with the fact that it may have been 0:14:57.200 --> 0:15:01.480 uncomposted fresh uncomposted or it turns out can actually be 0:15:01.520 --> 0:15:03.760 harmful to crops due to high levels of ammonia and 0:15:03.840 --> 0:15:08.840 nitrogen and salts that can actually damage and inhibit seed germination. 0:15:09.600 --> 0:15:12.440 But I think you were going to that place with this. 0:15:13.120 --> 0:15:15.480 Yeah, you know, what's a fun story. We love a 0:15:15.520 --> 0:15:19.240 fun story. I'm a Max's team here. It's up there 0:15:19.320 --> 0:15:22.080 with the concept of buying a pig in a poke 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:26.840 or caveat temptur it's probably wrong. There are a couple 0:15:26.920 --> 0:15:31.120 of immediately obvious issues with the narratives. So first off, 0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:34.680 cowpoop is going to be more or less a question 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:39.600 of processing. It's the same across biological sex. The things 0:15:39.600 --> 0:15:43.200 that are really going to affect your cowpoop output or 0:15:43.800 --> 0:15:47.240 cowpoop output are going to be factors like the diet, 0:15:47.320 --> 0:15:53.240 hydration environment, individual medical conditions or disease, and again processing. 0:15:53.920 --> 0:15:56.880 And secondly, you know, as we were pointing now, the 0:15:56.920 --> 0:16:00.720 timeline doesn't really match with the etymology here. You can 0:16:00.880 --> 0:16:07.320 still see dictionaries of great repute. Encyclopedia is arguing over 0:16:07.360 --> 0:16:11.320 this bull as an animal versus bull as nonsense question. 0:16:12.000 --> 0:16:14.640 But for now it is safe to say the farmer 0:16:14.840 --> 0:16:20.720 origin story is itself wait for it, a bullshit you need. 0:16:22.240 --> 0:16:22.800 It's a bit. 0:16:23.360 --> 0:16:26.560 It's a bit of shit, So it's full of shit 0:16:27.000 --> 0:16:30.720 it is. Whoever may have told this tale out of school, 0:16:37.440 --> 0:16:40.760 It does turn out the real meaning of it, as 0:16:40.800 --> 0:16:43.840 you mentioned earlier, much more likely stems from that French 0:16:43.880 --> 0:16:49.320 translation bull meaning nonsense or an untruth, dating back to 0:16:49.360 --> 0:16:53.640 the seventeenth century. Bullshit's been used since around nineteen fourteen 0:16:53.720 --> 0:16:57.520 nineteen fifteen and British and American slang, and that word 0:16:57.600 --> 0:17:00.160 made its way into the American lexicon late in the 0:17:00.200 --> 0:17:03.920 nineteenth century, where bullshit was first documented in a nineteen 0:17:04.040 --> 0:17:08.320 fifteen edition of The New Republic and used to describe hollow, 0:17:08.880 --> 0:17:13.639 empty rhetoric. You know thing or two about that. American 0:17:13.680 --> 0:17:16.879 serviceman in World War One adopted the term to describe 0:17:16.880 --> 0:17:19.960 things taking it's a little broader as just things that 0:17:20.000 --> 0:17:22.200 are generally not good, and. 0:17:22.160 --> 0:17:26.920 So by the mid twentieth century, bullshit is firmly ensconced 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:32.439 in the casual American vocabulary, but it's mostly going to 0:17:32.440 --> 0:17:38.080 be confined to these unrecorded, unpublished conversations because of the 0:17:38.160 --> 0:17:40.400 vulgarity of its second syllable. 0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:42.560 It's kind of haram right. 0:17:42.760 --> 0:17:50.360 In fancy pants discourse. It becomes popularized in World War Two, 0:17:50.560 --> 0:17:52.880 and no kidding, this is a bit of a plot 0:17:52.920 --> 0:17:56.720 twist for us, we have to thank one of America's 0:17:56.840 --> 0:18:00.680 best writers for the popularization of bullshit. 0:18:01.040 --> 0:18:01.320 Guys. 0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:07.040 It's none other than the legendarily uptight, the lovingly pretentious, 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:12.800 the problematically racist poet Extraordinariy ts Elliott. 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:13.240 Ah. 0:18:13.400 --> 0:18:15.919 Yes, the jellical man himself. 0:18:16.000 --> 0:18:17.680 There it is, that's. 0:18:17.520 --> 0:18:20.320 Him, right, yeah, yeah, he wrote cats Yeah, the Cats guy. 0:18:20.560 --> 0:18:22.440 He would not have liked the Filmata. 0:18:22.760 --> 0:18:24.400 She would have preferred them with buttholes. 0:18:25.200 --> 0:18:27.919 So it sounds crazy, right, He was kind of a 0:18:27.920 --> 0:18:29.800 buttle Yeah, he kind of was. 0:18:30.640 --> 0:18:34.800 Sorry, man, we know you're from Missouri. So it sounds crazy. 0:18:34.840 --> 0:18:37.840 It sounds almost like bullshit. Hang on, hear us out. 0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:43.880 Between nineteen ten and nineteen fifteen he wrote a poem 0:18:44.080 --> 0:18:48.239 called The Triumph of Bullshit and it's a ballad, and 0:18:48.280 --> 0:18:52.680 he finalized it with a few small changes in nineteen sixteen. 0:18:53.560 --> 0:18:57.119 Just to give you a sense of this. It is 0:18:57.160 --> 0:19:01.080 not on the level of Proof Rock or The Wasteland, 0:19:01.520 --> 0:19:05.240 but it is an early example of this phrase in print. 0:19:05.920 --> 0:19:07.800 The final form of it, Just to give you the 0:19:07.920 --> 0:19:13.360 first first verse is ladies on whom my attentions have waited. 0:19:13.440 --> 0:19:25.280 If you consider my merits a small it, deoliated, alembicated, utund, tasteless, fantastical, monotonous, crotchety, constipated, impotent, 0:19:25.440 --> 0:19:31.800 galimattias affected, possibly imitated. For Christ's sake, stick it up 0:19:31.840 --> 0:19:37.359 your ass, and every scene, everythow dude, every verse. And 0:19:37.520 --> 0:19:41.800 it's like a three verses right, and every verse ends 0:19:41.840 --> 0:19:45.320 with a refrain for Christ's sakes, For Christ's sake, stick 0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:50.719 it up your ass, the triumph of bullshit. Look this 0:19:50.800 --> 0:19:51.359 guy is all. 0:19:51.320 --> 0:19:54.679 Right Susian for a minute there, Ben, it was I love. 0:19:55.040 --> 0:19:57.879 All this jelical language. 0:19:58.280 --> 0:20:01.280 Yes, that is true. Susianis to that as well. 0:20:01.800 --> 0:20:05.600 Elliott did not invent this word sucineity. 0:20:05.720 --> 0:20:06.159 I love it. 0:20:06.200 --> 0:20:10.520 We should keep it, Max, keep it please. And he 0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:16.800 popularized the phrase bullshit with this poem, but the poem 0:20:16.880 --> 0:20:21.800 did not see print immediately after he wrote it. The 0:20:21.840 --> 0:20:26.960 earliest citations of the phrase bullshit come to us from 0:20:27.119 --> 0:20:32.200 the equally fancy pants boffins at the Oxford English Dictionary. 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:32.440 Ah. 0:20:32.520 --> 0:20:36.359 Yes, second in fancy pants neess only to Cambridge in 0:20:36.440 --> 0:20:39.600 my humble estimation. Not sure there's the data there to 0:20:39.600 --> 0:20:40.080 back it up. 0:20:40.640 --> 0:20:41.040 I don't know. 0:20:41.119 --> 0:20:44.560 Cambridge versus Oxford ultimate smash. 0:20:44.840 --> 0:20:49.800 Let's go fight, So the earlier. That's a great question. 0:20:50.160 --> 0:20:51.719 I wonder how they feel about each other. 0:20:51.800 --> 0:20:53.480 Yeah, who's the fancist of lads? 0:20:53.600 --> 0:20:57.040 Who's got the cravat versus the regular necktie? 0:20:57.600 --> 0:20:59.960 Oh, that is the question. You know, we're a cravat? 0:21:00.080 --> 0:21:03.200 To Ben, who's that? It was? Uh? 0:21:03.359 --> 0:21:05.080 Fred from the Scooby Doo Gang. 0:21:05.400 --> 0:21:08.120 Oh that's right. A bit of a cravat, I keep 0:21:08.160 --> 0:21:09.040 forgetting about or. 0:21:08.960 --> 0:21:09.760 Was it an ascot? 0:21:10.119 --> 0:21:12.280 Never mind? I think wait, wait, wait, didn't we know? 0:21:12.400 --> 0:21:15.440 I think a cravat is just to catch all the 0:21:15.560 --> 0:21:16.240 umbrella term. 0:21:16.520 --> 0:21:20.320 That's where I was going. Yeah, everything's necktie everything like that. 0:21:20.920 --> 0:21:22.720 I love quibbling over semantics. 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:46.680 All right, Max, with the facts, we are one and 0:21:47.240 --> 0:21:54.400 we know that regardless of egghead hierarchy. The Oxford English Dictionary, 0:21:54.560 --> 0:21:58.640 which we love, says the earliest citations. 0:21:58.440 --> 0:22:02.720 Book, it's you. It's a page turner, second only to 0:22:02.800 --> 0:22:03.320 the Bible. 0:22:05.240 --> 0:22:11.680 Uh yeah, okay, I've definitely read cover to cover a 0:22:11.800 --> 0:22:12.600 question about. 0:22:12.359 --> 0:22:14.760 It many times. I U name a verse. 0:22:15.240 --> 0:22:17.000 They're all good, They're all just so good. 0:22:17.359 --> 0:22:19.720 Oh yeah, that's real write my. 0:22:19.760 --> 0:22:23.119 Favorite, especially that one from Bubble Fiction that wasn't in 0:22:23.160 --> 0:22:24.960 the Bible. You know it isn't in the Bible. Ben, 0:22:25.119 --> 0:22:28.679 what's that potatoes? And that was a big reason that 0:22:28.800 --> 0:22:30.200 the people were suspicious of. 0:22:30.800 --> 0:22:35.000 Yes, yeah, during the Great Exchange, which will be another episode. 0:22:35.080 --> 0:22:37.240 Dare I say a series we're getting to in the 0:22:37.280 --> 0:22:40.600 futures coming right up day tuned for Thursday for part 0:22:40.640 --> 0:22:44.240 one of that. We want you to know that the 0:22:44.280 --> 0:22:50.920 Oxford English Dictionary the OED they cite the first occurrence 0:22:50.960 --> 0:22:55.639 of bullshit coming from the letters of a British writer 0:22:55.920 --> 0:23:03.040 named Wynton Lewis and the American essayists and poet Ee Cummings. 0:23:03.400 --> 0:23:04.200 This is still. 0:23:04.000 --> 0:23:10.160 Confusing because here Wyndham Lewis is directly quoting Elliot's poem 0:23:10.600 --> 0:23:14.560 in a letter from nineteen fifteen, and Lewis writes, quote, 0:23:14.840 --> 0:23:18.360 Elliot has sent me bullshit and the ballad for Big Louise. 0:23:18.760 --> 0:23:25.520 They are excellent bits of scholarly reboldry. So rebolds cheeky 0:23:26.080 --> 0:23:30.760 cheeky devil that that ts Eliot. So we do know 0:23:30.880 --> 0:23:33.800 that there are other modern writers that began using the 0:23:33.840 --> 0:23:36.760 phrase as well, because why wouldn't they. It's already starting 0:23:36.800 --> 0:23:39.439 to creep into the lexicon. It's fun to say. One 0:23:39.480 --> 0:23:42.800 of my favorite names in modern literature Ezra Pound. 0:23:43.080 --> 0:23:43.439 I don't know. 0:23:43.480 --> 0:23:45.480 It's like give me an Ezra pound you meaning like 0:23:45.840 --> 0:23:48.560 dab me up. He used it in nineteen fourteen in 0:23:48.600 --> 0:23:53.840 a letter to James Joyce, who liked farts writing include 0:23:54.320 --> 0:23:57.520 check that one out if you want another rebald episode 0:23:58.320 --> 0:24:03.120 talking about James Joyce and love of Lady Farts. He said, 0:24:03.440 --> 0:24:06.560 I enclose a prize sample of bullshit. 0:24:08.320 --> 0:24:10.760 Yeah, he spaced it out, he said bull space ship 0:24:10.920 --> 0:24:11.360 he did. 0:24:12.000 --> 0:24:14.440 It's still we're still getting there. We're still getting there. 0:24:14.480 --> 0:24:17.400 I think we can all agree. We're pretty sure that 0:24:17.440 --> 0:24:20.720 Ezra Pounds, another problematic guy who was an excellent poet. 0:24:21.560 --> 0:24:25.760 We're pretty sure he meant bullshit in the figurative sense, because, 0:24:25.760 --> 0:24:28.960 so far as we can tell, ol Ezra did not 0:24:29.119 --> 0:24:32.680 actually include cow poop with the letter. 0:24:33.000 --> 0:24:34.359 That would have been a terrorist act. 0:24:34.720 --> 0:24:38.120 Yeah, that would have been like Jared Leto playing the joker. 0:24:38.040 --> 0:24:40.280 Right, Yeah, apparently all those rumors though, by the way 0:24:40.320 --> 0:24:43.640