WEBVTT - Buying Land in the Metaverse 0:00:02.560 --> 0:00:05.560 This is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily Bloomberg I Heart podcast, 0:00:05.760 --> 0:00:08.640 and I'm Stacy Marie Ishmael, Managing editor of Crypto for 0:00:08.640 --> 0:00:23.600 Bloomberg News. It's Tuesday, November twenty nine. This episode about 0:00:23.600 --> 0:00:26.680 buying land in the Metaverse with my colleague Carly Juanna 0:00:27.240 --> 0:00:30.760 was recorded before the collapse of FTX. Just putting that 0:00:30.800 --> 0:00:37.160 out there for context. Have you heard the one about 0:00:37.159 --> 0:00:39.600 how broke millennials who had given up on owning a home. 0:00:39.680 --> 0:00:42.280 We're supposed to be super excited about the opportunities in 0:00:42.280 --> 0:00:45.040 the metaverse, or maybe you've heard that it was gen 0:00:45.159 --> 0:00:47.640 Z who's supposed to be super excited about opportunities in 0:00:47.640 --> 0:00:51.440 the metaverse. Yeah, about that not quite turning out that way. 0:00:51.960 --> 0:00:54.440 Despite the hype and the fact that entities is different 0:00:54.480 --> 0:00:58.360 as Snoop Dogg himself, and for reasons not entirely cleared me, 0:00:58.440 --> 0:01:02.120 the Beijun government boils into said hype, Owning a property 0:01:02.160 --> 0:01:03.920 in the metaverse hasn't turned out to be a winning 0:01:03.960 --> 0:01:08.679 investment strategy for everyone, and yet despite falling prices and 0:01:08.720 --> 0:01:12.120 declining user activity, some people are still betting on virtual property. 0:01:12.840 --> 0:01:15.000 For more on Who's building what in the Metaverse, I'm 0:01:15.080 --> 0:01:17.919 joined by Bloomberg reporter call I wanna. There's a fixed 0:01:17.920 --> 0:01:21.959 plot of land, so there's certain levels of values that 0:01:22.040 --> 0:01:25.480 are attributed to that, and it's your individual plot. It's 0:01:25.560 --> 0:01:39.680 your n f T. Carly, Welcome to the podcast. Tell 0:01:39.760 --> 0:01:43.480 us what you do? I cover crypto at Bloomberg News. 0:01:43.480 --> 0:01:47.800 How's that been? It has been fascinating, to say the least. 0:01:47.960 --> 0:01:53.200 It's odder than I would have expected coming in. It's diplomatic, 0:01:53.480 --> 0:01:57.000 yes when you say odd. One of the stories that 0:01:57.040 --> 0:02:01.160 you published recently is about Virtue to all Land, which 0:02:01.240 --> 0:02:04.880 to me seems like a contradiction in terms, but to 0:02:04.960 --> 0:02:08.240 some people seems like a worthwhile investment opportunity. What did 0:02:08.280 --> 0:02:10.760 you find in the course of reporting that story. Yes, 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:14.239 I found out a lot. I think the most surprising 0:02:14.280 --> 0:02:18.040 thing I found out was that it's very expensive. You know, 0:02:18.240 --> 0:02:22.600 people will spend thousands and thousands of dollars to buy 0:02:22.760 --> 0:02:26.640 these virtual plots of land in the metaverse, and a 0:02:26.639 --> 0:02:30.080 lot of them are looking at it as an investment opportunity. 0:02:30.120 --> 0:02:35.320 They think that these plots of land are actually going 0:02:35.440 --> 0:02:40.360 to increase in value significantly, and so they're willing to 0:02:40.360 --> 0:02:43.480 shell out for it, despite the fact that over the 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:48.040 past year, values have really dropped off. When you say 0:02:48.080 --> 0:02:50.120 values have really dropped off, like what kind? And you 0:02:50.120 --> 0:02:52.000 say expensive, like what are we talking about here? We 0:02:52.000 --> 0:02:56.000 talked about five five million dollars, Like what's the range? Right? Yeah, 0:02:56.040 --> 0:02:59.679 so it varies. I talked to one guy, for example. 0:03:00.200 --> 0:03:02.800 He told me that he had bought a plot of 0:03:02.919 --> 0:03:05.760 land in one of these virtual worlds. It's called the 0:03:05.880 --> 0:03:09.320 Central Land, and he purchased it for about three thousand 0:03:09.360 --> 0:03:13.400 dollars in August. Um. I talked to a guy last year, though, 0:03:13.480 --> 0:03:16.760 who kind of in the fall, purchased something that was 0:03:16.880 --> 0:03:20.519 sixty dollars. And granted that was a bigger plot of land, 0:03:20.680 --> 0:03:23.360 but you know, the prices on these really do vary. 0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:25.399 And part of the reason they were so much more 0:03:25.520 --> 0:03:29.239 expensive last year was because, you know, these virtual plots 0:03:29.240 --> 0:03:32.600 of land I should mention too, are often denominated and 0:03:32.680 --> 0:03:37.160 sold in cryptocurrencies, so their values are inherently tied to that. 0:03:37.360 --> 0:03:41.040 Last year crypto prices were a lot higher than they 0:03:41.080 --> 0:03:45.040 are right now, especially you know, in the October time frame. 0:03:45.160 --> 0:03:47.240 So the guy who bought the plot of land, you know, 0:03:47.440 --> 0:03:51.560 the value of that sixty thousand dollar estate as it 0:03:51.640 --> 0:03:55.240 is called, is a lot less. Now today, what do 0:03:55.320 --> 0:03:59.000 you do with the sixty dollar virtual plot of land? Exactly? 0:03:59.680 --> 0:04:03.000 That is a golden question. You know, a lot of 0:04:03.040 --> 0:04:06.480 the people who I spoke with and even just kind 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:10.240 of walking around these worlds, you know, there's not that 0:04:10.520 --> 0:04:13.960 much going on. So going back to the guy who 0:04:14.160 --> 0:04:17.200 purchased the plot of land in August for three thousand dollars, 0:04:17.240 --> 0:04:21.560 he is years old. That was his first quote unquote 0:04:21.680 --> 0:04:25.960 real estate purchase, if you will. And he actually has 0:04:26.000 --> 0:04:28.320 done nothing with that plot of land. He doesn't really 0:04:28.320 --> 0:04:31.320 have any specific plans in the future to do anything 0:04:31.360 --> 0:04:35.120 with it. Right now, he rents it out. He rents 0:04:35.160 --> 0:04:40.080 it for fifty to seventy dollars a month to a company. 0:04:40.200 --> 0:04:43.720 And on the plot of land there is a billboard 0:04:44.120 --> 0:04:49.279 that is touting a a metaverse marketing startup, which is 0:04:49.480 --> 0:04:55.719 very meta in my opinion. So and when I reported, 0:04:55.800 --> 0:04:58.039 you know, I would go into these lands that you 0:04:58.080 --> 0:05:00.560 can access from a web browser and you walk around, 0:05:00.600 --> 0:05:04.120 and you know, give or take, there's not that much 0:05:04.200 --> 0:05:07.720 going on. There's kind of you know, some areas are 0:05:07.720 --> 0:05:10.280 more populated than others, but a lot of these people 0:05:10.320 --> 0:05:13.080 are betting that these virtual realities really will take off 0:05:13.120 --> 0:05:19.960 and they will become cool and popular and fun. Okay, 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:23.520 I don't know if I would describe any of this 0:05:23.960 --> 0:05:28.599 as either cool or fun, and it would seem from 0:05:28.640 --> 0:05:30.960 the user numbers, because you know, you mentioned to Central 0:05:30.960 --> 0:05:34.080 and another big one of these is the Sandbox. They're 0:05:34.120 --> 0:05:38.000 not necessarily popular either. Our colleague of Miller, who's regularly 0:05:38.040 --> 0:05:40.880 on the podcast, in a story that she published closer 0:05:40.880 --> 0:05:43.960 to the end of October, said that the Sandbox has 0:05:44.000 --> 0:05:48.640 about five hundred daily active uses. That's not a lot 0:05:48.760 --> 0:05:54.320 of people in these particular environments. So, you know, various 0:05:54.320 --> 0:05:57.000 of these places were sold as this is going to 0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:58.640 be a place to hang out. This is like Mark 0:05:58.720 --> 0:06:00.880 Zuckerberg's whole thing. You'll do anything that you want to 0:06:00.880 --> 0:06:03.720 do in the metaverse. But what they're turning into is 0:06:03.760 --> 0:06:08.040 almost like desolate strip malls where there isn't a ton 0:06:08.080 --> 0:06:12.360 of activity. There's weird inception e billboards, but not a 0:06:12.360 --> 0:06:14.920 lot of happening. When you ask the folks in the 0:06:14.960 --> 0:06:17.799 story who were continuing to buy land why they're optimistic 0:06:17.839 --> 0:06:20.440 about the future of these platforms, what did they say? 0:06:20.960 --> 0:06:24.200 A lot of them really bet that at some point 0:06:25.000 --> 0:06:28.600 these lands are going to become more popular there's a 0:06:28.640 --> 0:06:31.360 lot of risk associated with that because there are so 0:06:31.400 --> 0:06:33.680 many of these digital worlds. You know, we kind of 0:06:33.720 --> 0:06:37.279 focused on two of the biggest ones being Sandbox and 0:06:37.360 --> 0:06:40.520 decentral Land. Part of the reason that those are kind 0:06:40.520 --> 0:06:42.520 of getting a lot of attention and are more popular 0:06:42.600 --> 0:06:44.440 is because they're the ones that have gotten a fair 0:06:44.440 --> 0:06:48.200 bit of traction off of one of the things that 0:06:48.480 --> 0:06:52.400 causes them to have higher property values, which is celebrities 0:06:52.640 --> 0:06:56.160 and companies and brands that are taking interest in the metaphors. 0:06:56.360 --> 0:06:59.880 So granted this is not a universal thing. There's still 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:01.840 lot of room to go, but there have been some 0:07:01.880 --> 0:07:05.120 companies and brands that have purchased land in the metaverse 0:07:05.520 --> 0:07:10.080 or otherwise made investments or marketing campaigns there. So, for example, 0:07:10.320 --> 0:07:13.920 Gucci has purchased an estate in the metaverse, and they're 0:07:13.920 --> 0:07:17.280 going to be able to have some sort of events 0:07:17.320 --> 0:07:20.400 that they're going to put on on the celebrity front, 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:24.160 you have Snoop Dogg has purchased land in the metaverse. 0:07:26.800 --> 0:07:29.360 I've got my Monuma money and my money only I 0:07:29.440 --> 0:07:31.880 built the whole metaverse called you know what I'm saying 0:07:31.880 --> 0:07:37.760 to STANDBOXXM and you know that then makes other parcels 0:07:37.760 --> 0:07:40.960 and plots of land that are around them go up 0:07:41.000 --> 0:07:44.760 significantly in value because the assumption and the bet here 0:07:44.880 --> 0:07:48.920 is that, Okay, if you own land that's really close 0:07:49.000 --> 0:07:52.200 to Snoop Dogg, you're going to be in a cool 0:07:52.280 --> 0:07:55.160 part of town where more people are going to be 0:07:55.200 --> 0:07:58.880 walking around. You know, if you're near a really cool 0:07:59.120 --> 0:08:02.280 fashion brand store, people are going to be walking in 0:08:02.320 --> 0:08:04.559 and out of those districts and they're going to see 0:08:04.640 --> 0:08:08.400 your area, and you're going to have a highly valued property. 0:08:08.920 --> 0:08:12.360 You know, there's a taco Taco bell is having a 0:08:12.360 --> 0:08:15.160 wedding in the metaverse soon. There's all sorts of weird 0:08:15.200 --> 0:08:18.880 and kiki things going on, and they are they are disparate, 0:08:19.120 --> 0:08:22.560 But these people who have bought this land are betting 0:08:22.720 --> 0:08:25.640 they're going to become more common. I spoke with one 0:08:25.680 --> 0:08:29.800 guy who he wants to set up a virtual furniture 0:08:29.840 --> 0:08:32.960 store in the metaverse, and he wants to hold onto 0:08:33.160 --> 0:08:35.880 his plot of land so that then he can eventually 0:08:35.920 --> 0:08:38.000 be able to do that. So it's kind of a 0:08:38.559 --> 0:08:42.760 bet overall. But other people have, you know, entrepreneurial aspects 0:08:42.880 --> 0:08:45.520 and kind of interest themselves. I'm just gonna say a 0:08:45.559 --> 0:08:49.040 couple of like nineties kid things as a as a 0:08:49.120 --> 0:08:52.160 nineties kid one. Anytime I have people talk about Snoop 0:08:52.320 --> 0:08:56.000 was like this like cool childred, I am reminded that 0:08:56.040 --> 0:08:57.920 this was also a dude who became famous for seeing 0:08:57.920 --> 0:08:59.559 the song Murder was the case that they gave me. 0:09:00.040 --> 0:09:02.480 So so you know, just putting that out there, like 0:09:02.600 --> 0:09:05.120 you know, Martha Stewart, Snoop and Stoop of the nineties 0:09:05.160 --> 0:09:08.480 are two very different people. But I also I'm a 0:09:08.520 --> 0:09:15.960 person who played the SIMS and Second Life, which was, 0:09:16.160 --> 0:09:19.119 for all intents and purposes, one of the very earliest 0:09:19.240 --> 0:09:24.000 of these kinds of metaverse like experiences where you have 0:09:24.280 --> 0:09:29.400 an avatar and you had brands that showed up in 0:09:29.440 --> 0:09:31.760 these spaces and you have like the Microsoft's of the 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:34.600 world and the royces Is of the world. Royce's had 0:09:34.600 --> 0:09:37.400 a bureau in there, the you know, like various tech 0:09:37.440 --> 0:09:40.080 companies would sort of set up you could like buy clothes. 0:09:40.760 --> 0:09:43.280 And there are still people I don't know if they're 0:09:43.280 --> 0:09:45.600 still brands who are in Second Life, but like every 0:09:45.640 --> 0:09:49.680 generation gets the metaverse it deserves. I suppose one of 0:09:49.679 --> 0:09:52.840 the things that strikes me about the biggest difference between 0:09:53.440 --> 0:09:57.200 these current meta verses and places like Second Life is 0:09:57.360 --> 0:10:00.960 what you identify, which is the prime refocused being like 0:10:01.040 --> 0:10:05.000 the potential for monetization. Right. Second Life absolutely had monetization. 0:10:05.040 --> 0:10:07.120 It had enough to have a bank run, which is 0:10:07.120 --> 0:10:11.040 a pretty good indicator that there was a real financial ecosystem, 0:10:11.080 --> 0:10:16.079 but it wasn't pitched as come hand, make your fortune speculating. 0:10:16.320 --> 0:10:20.920 And a big criticism of Web three has been around 0:10:20.920 --> 0:10:26.160 the idea that profits come before fun. Did the people 0:10:26.160 --> 0:10:28.839 that you spoke to sound like they were having fun? 0:10:30.760 --> 0:10:33.280 I think the best way to answer that would be 0:10:34.080 --> 0:10:36.440 going back to the fact that not a lot of 0:10:36.480 --> 0:10:39.680 them had done much on their land. That's not to 0:10:39.880 --> 0:10:43.080 say that they didn't have ideas to do stuff on 0:10:43.120 --> 0:10:46.800 the land, for example setting up a furniture store or 0:10:47.559 --> 0:10:51.320 other endeavors like that, but the bottom line is that 0:10:51.600 --> 0:10:54.679 they hadn't yet. I think one of the things that 0:10:54.840 --> 0:10:57.840 we've reported on a Bloomberg is that, you know, gambling 0:10:57.880 --> 0:11:01.120 and casinos have been popular for terms of entertainment that 0:11:01.160 --> 0:11:05.240 have taken off in these worlds, but yeah, they're not 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:09.400 seeing this as a fun place where they're hosting parties 0:11:09.400 --> 0:11:13.480 with their friends. I talked to a professor who said that, 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:16.559 you know, in some ways. Buying land in the metaverse 0:11:17.120 --> 0:11:21.679 is a way to diversify your crypto holdings, because even 0:11:21.800 --> 0:11:24.960 though it's a little bit different than buying bitcoin, I mean, 0:11:25.040 --> 0:11:27.679 it does kind of come with this promise of an 0:11:27.720 --> 0:11:30.920 online experience that you would assume comes with some sort 0:11:30.960 --> 0:11:34.000 of promise or hope for fun. At the end of 0:11:34.040 --> 0:11:37.880 the day, they're denominated in crypto, their prices are at 0:11:37.960 --> 0:11:43.040 least right now somewhat moving with cryptocurrency. Exact, a pot 0:11:43.080 --> 0:11:46.520 of land in the metaverse is a non fungible token, yeah, exactly. 0:11:46.600 --> 0:11:48.840 So that's a little bit of a distinction too, is 0:11:48.880 --> 0:11:50.880 that when you buy these, you know, it's recorded on 0:11:50.920 --> 0:11:54.240 the blockchain. It is its own separate thing, and these 0:11:54.280 --> 0:11:57.920 plots of lands are fixed. That's another thing that is 0:11:57.960 --> 0:12:00.240 going to appeal to a lot of the buy areas. 0:12:00.360 --> 0:12:03.360 That's not like ubiquitous across virtual worlds, but that is 0:12:03.360 --> 0:12:06.000 a big selling point is that there's a fixed plot 0:12:06.000 --> 0:12:10.040 of land, so there's certain levels of values that are 0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:13.600 attributed to that, and it's your individual plot, it's your 0:12:13.800 --> 0:12:18.640 n f T. So these individuals who are buying these lands, yeah, 0:12:18.720 --> 0:12:21.080 they might not be doing much on them now, but 0:12:21.480 --> 0:12:24.680 they're thinking they will in the future, and I would 0:12:24.679 --> 0:12:28.440 assume that if more activity comes to the metaverse, that 0:12:28.520 --> 0:12:31.520 would increase the chances that they actually do set up 0:12:31.559 --> 0:12:34.760 their virtual furniture store. With the reports of places like 0:12:34.760 --> 0:12:38.920 Sandbox only have active users, the investors in these platforms 0:12:39.000 --> 0:12:42.079 say very similar things to the folks that you're talking 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:45.679 to who are buying land. So yeah, so of anamoca. 0:12:46.720 --> 0:12:49.040 You know, made the case to our colleague Hannah Miller 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:53.160 that like looking at just daily active users is not 0:12:53.280 --> 0:12:56.360 really as he described it, like representative of the overall 0:12:56.400 --> 0:12:59.720 scale of activity, like he has amazing quotes, which is 0:13:00.160 --> 0:13:02.360 to look at this metric would be comparable to claiming 0:13:02.400 --> 0:13:04.400 that how many people trade on Wall Street is the 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:08.240 size of the American population. And you know, from his perspective, 0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:10.640 what you need to look at is things like revenues 0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:13.240 that are being generated and other opportunities that people have, 0:13:13.320 --> 0:13:16.680 which sounds very much like what you're also saying. I 0:13:16.720 --> 0:13:21.600 think the challenge for a lot of folks is if 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:27.240 the speculative asset isn't currently delivering returns to them, if 0:13:27.280 --> 0:13:29.600 there doesn't seem like very much to do right now, 0:13:30.160 --> 0:13:33.439 holding onto their attention can be a little bit hard. 0:13:33.920 --> 0:13:36.600 You know, so the folks who you spoke to, how 0:13:36.640 --> 0:13:39.680 many of them see like the this activity is going 0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:41.160 to pick up in the next six months, the next 0:13:41.200 --> 0:13:45.120 five years, Like what's the time horizon that's they're talking about. 0:13:45.520 --> 0:13:50.120 Oh gosh, it's so hard to say. I think the 0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:55.119 other distinction here is that there are dozens and dozens 0:13:55.280 --> 0:13:59.559 of these virtual worlds. So you know, the sandbox might 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:02.280 be the thing today, but that's not to say that 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:05.920 another one won't come in and completely take its place. 0:14:06.080 --> 0:14:09.360 So when you buy these lands, not only are you 0:14:09.400 --> 0:14:14.000 taking a bet that the metaverse will become cool and popular, 0:14:14.080 --> 0:14:17.520 you're taking a bet that you were specific chosen digital 0:14:17.600 --> 0:14:20.880 world will be the one that is cool and popular. 0:14:21.040 --> 0:14:25.000 So this isn't like a, oh, in twenty years, this 0:14:25.040 --> 0:14:26.840 will be the thing. It's kind of more of a 0:14:27.280 --> 0:14:29.840 right now, you're assuming that this will be the thing. 0:14:29.880 --> 0:14:32.160 Like I talked to one guy who I mean he's 0:14:32.200 --> 0:14:36.840 bought He's diversified his diversified crypto holdings in the metaverse 0:14:37.040 --> 0:14:40.800 by purchasing land in a variety of different virtual worlds. 0:14:40.840 --> 0:14:43.400 I mean, he has dozens of plots of land. So 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:46.720 it's kind of a question of all right, you're choosing 0:14:46.720 --> 0:14:50.080 one digital world, but you're also choosing that digital world 0:14:50.120 --> 0:14:54.640 among several other options that you could possibly have. Right, 0:14:54.760 --> 0:14:57.600 It's like, you know, ten years ago nobody thought TikTok 0:14:57.640 --> 0:15:01.120 was a thing, and now TikTok definitely a thing. Will 0:15:01.120 --> 0:15:03.560 it still continue to be one in ten years from now? 0:15:05.000 --> 0:15:07.560 Up next more from Bloomberg report to Collie Wanna on 0:15:07.640 --> 0:15:10.080 buying land in the mesa Verse. We'll be right back. 0:15:23.000 --> 0:15:25.840 I think one one of the things it's often helpful 0:15:25.920 --> 0:15:28.560 for us to remember is that at its hots, the 0:15:28.600 --> 0:15:31.280 dynamics and crypto are a tech story, and they're a 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:34.000 lifestyle story and their culture story, and they're not just 0:15:34.080 --> 0:15:38.600 always a monetization or financial one. When you were reporting this, 0:15:38.680 --> 0:15:40.320 did you how much time did you have to spend 0:15:40.360 --> 0:15:44.680 in these worlds? I spent a fair bit just walking around. 0:15:44.800 --> 0:15:50.080 There's a games reporter at Bloomberg who Cecilia. She is great, 0:15:50.200 --> 0:15:52.800 She is so cool. She showed me kind of the 0:15:52.920 --> 0:15:55.680 ends and the outs of these worlds. And I will 0:15:55.720 --> 0:15:58.400 say when I walked around, I would get forward a 0:15:58.400 --> 0:16:02.240 little bit fast. I'm not that in to gambling in casinos, 0:16:02.280 --> 0:16:04.520 but it was fun to just kind of get in 0:16:04.560 --> 0:16:06.880 your little avatar and pull up the browser and just 0:16:06.960 --> 0:16:09.840 run around a little bit in the world. I also 0:16:10.000 --> 0:16:14.000 enjoyed in talking with my sources. I asked them for 0:16:14.000 --> 0:16:17.440 for photos of their avatars on their plots of land. 0:16:18.160 --> 0:16:20.960 I'm a reporter. I'm very used to people not being 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:23.760 comfortable giving you photos, and I guess maybe it's a 0:16:23.800 --> 0:16:26.440 little bit different if it's your digital avatar. But they 0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:29.280 were excited, like they love their avatars, they love their 0:16:29.280 --> 0:16:32.120 plots of land. They were happy to share them. One 0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:35.800 even said, like he sent me one during the daytime, 0:16:35.960 --> 0:16:39.320 and then he circled back later in the day after 0:16:39.360 --> 0:16:42.880 he emailed me and said, oh gosh, like I realized 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:45.800 that that picture isn't like the best, I'll send you 0:16:45.880 --> 0:16:48.520 another one, And so he sent me a different picture 0:16:48.720 --> 0:16:52.200 to like cover the basis. It was just nice, like 0:16:52.360 --> 0:16:55.560 they enjoyed and we're very proud of it. So, you know, 0:16:55.720 --> 0:16:58.680 I got bored in these lands, but it does seem 0:16:58.720 --> 0:17:01.760 like some people are very, very, very very excited about them. 0:17:01.840 --> 0:17:04.439 I will say that really reminds me of kind of 0:17:04.440 --> 0:17:07.679 playing SIMS, where, you know, since it's a game, as 0:17:07.720 --> 0:17:10.240 opposed to sim City, where you design an entire ecosystem 0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:13.520 and sims, you like control little folks that are called sims. 0:17:13.560 --> 0:17:16.880 And I was certainly a person who would spend so 0:17:16.960 --> 0:17:19.840 much more time just like designing the sim and then 0:17:19.920 --> 0:17:23.040 never doing anything. I was like down to like the 0:17:23.080 --> 0:17:26.800 eye color and the outfits I once recreated, like the 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:30.680 j Lo dress, and I was like, it took so long, 0:17:31.000 --> 0:17:33.639 and then I'd be like, okay, cool, like let me 0:17:33.640 --> 0:17:35.439 move on to creating another one and continue to do 0:17:35.840 --> 0:17:38.280 nothing else. So I I understand being proud of of 0:17:38.280 --> 0:17:41.159 one's digital personas. Yes, it is. It is a real thing. 0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:44.440 Thank you so much, Carly, appreciated having you on the show. Yeah, absolutely, 0:17:44.480 --> 0:17:47.800 thank you so much, y'all. You can find more of 0:17:47.840 --> 0:17:50.360 Carly one as reporting on the Bloomberg Terminal on Bloomberg 0:17:50.440 --> 0:17:53.320 dot com, or follow her on Twitter. She's at Carly 0:17:53.520 --> 0:17:57.159 d Wanna. That's c A r L Y d w 0:17:57.400 --> 0:18:06.600 A n n E. This is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily 0:18:06.640 --> 0:18:10.040 podcast from Bloomberg and I Heart Radio. For more shows 0:18:10.040 --> 0:18:13.600 from iHeart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 0:18:13.800 --> 0:18:17.719 or wherever you get your podcasts. Send us your comments, questions, 0:18:17.760 --> 0:18:20.840 or suggestions for the show to Crypto at Bloomberg dot net. 0:18:24.080 --> 0:18:27.199 The supervising producer of Bloomberg Crypto is Vicky Very Galina. 0:18:27.600 --> 0:18:31.320 Our senior producer is Janet Babin. Our producers are Mohammed 0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:34.919 Faruk and Sharon Barriro. Our associate producers are Ty Butler 0:18:35.000 --> 0:18:38.600 and Moses on Them. Desta wonder At is our engineer. 0:18:38.960 --> 0:18:44.120 Original music by Leo Sidrn. I'm Stacy Marie Schmal We'll 0:18:44.160 --> 0:19:01.640 be back tomorrow.