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Speaker 1: Welcome to the solid verbal hell that for me. I'm

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Speaker 1: a man, I'm for I've heard so many players.

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Speaker 2: Say, well, I want to be happy, you want to

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Speaker 2: be happy for Dake, Edith Steak is that woof woof?

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Speaker 1: And Dan and Tie welcome back to these solid verbal

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Speaker 1: boys and girls. My name is Tye hilde Brandt. That

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Speaker 1: fine gentleman over there as always in the heart of

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Speaker 1: the Midwest. Dan the man Rubinstein, Sir, welcome back to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. How goes it? My friend?

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Speaker 2: It's great as always, ty It's great. Very excited for

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Speaker 2: this episode because it is the absolute height of the

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Speaker 2: math I'm able to do on the fly.

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Speaker 1: I maxed out.

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Speaker 2: I think at like a trigonometry what's trigonometries?

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Speaker 1: After algebra two in high school? I believe so? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I had.

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Speaker 2: I never took calculus. I took statistics AP stat gotta

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Speaker 2: be tied not to Brad.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I had trigonometry, then I had calculus, and then

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Speaker 1: I for whatever reason, when I went to Penn State,

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Speaker 1: I was put in another calculus class that I needed

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Speaker 1: to take as one of my prerecs for something. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was one of those pilot courses that allowed you

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Speaker 1: to use a graphing calculator, which you're just a felon.

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Speaker 1: That saved my hide in a way like you would

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Speaker 1: not believe. I do believe it. I don't know any

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Speaker 1: of that stuff. I don't remember a damn thing from it. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I remember hearing my smarter friends, whether they were business

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Speaker 2: majors or something, that had to keep taking math, and

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Speaker 2: I was like, wait, what comes after calculus? And they

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Speaker 2: said linear algebra and I was like, that sounds way

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Speaker 2: easier than calculus. It's a line, it's algebra. I have

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Speaker 2: no idea what I'm talking about. So to all of

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Speaker 2: those who are mathematically inclined, I salute you, because again,

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Speaker 2: this episode is the absolute height of what I'm now

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Speaker 2: able to do in my fifth day decade of life

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Speaker 2: on the fly.

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Speaker 1: So here's what we're doing today, Dan, Yeah, you may

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Speaker 1: have seen out on ESPN dot com, as they are

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Speaker 1: wont to do here in the off season, they put

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Speaker 1: together a top ten coaches ranking. Yeah, very subjective. It

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Speaker 1: of course brought in the power and the knowledge and

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Speaker 1: the insight of many of ESPN's great college football reporters.

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Speaker 1: They're ranking when as follows Kirby Smart, Kalin Debor Kyle

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Speaker 1: Whittingham at three, Dabo Swinney, Mike Norvel, Dan Lanning four, three, six,

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Speaker 1: Steve Sarksian, Lane Kiffin, Lance Leipold, and Ryan Dada to

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Speaker 1: round out the top ten.

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Speaker 2: With no real rhyme or reason. Right, it was sort

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Speaker 2: of aggregating a number of different opinions, right, I think

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Speaker 2: it was different writers or was it one writer? I

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Speaker 2: used to say, But it was just it was going

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Speaker 2: off of like specific perceptions and you're like, well, this

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Speaker 2: is important to me, or this person was able to

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Speaker 2: do this at a smaller place so I'm impressed by this,

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Speaker 2: or this person has done this lately, or this person

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Speaker 2: has shown this over so many years, so he has

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Speaker 2: to be here. But it wasn't fully clear, Like everything

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Speaker 2: wasn't like attached to the same rubric. That's crazy. That

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Speaker 2: wasn't weighed all the same way. Yeah, that's correct.

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Speaker 1: So people online have been talking about this ranking system

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Speaker 1: because again, it's early April, mid April. What else are

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Speaker 1: we going to talk about other than the transfer portal

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Speaker 1: and the Super League and some of the other news

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Speaker 1: topics going on in college football? Spring football is starting up,

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Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. We decided this needed an actual formula. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this needed a rubric of sorts. We needed to put

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Speaker 1: up some walls around this ranking system. Yes, you said

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Speaker 1: to me yesterday, can we come up with a coach

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Speaker 1: rating system that uses the initials DABO? Correct? I took

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Speaker 1: it into the lab here in Eastern Pennsylvania, Soliverbole East Headquarters.

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Speaker 1: What we're going to present before you today is something

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Speaker 1: we're calling the x DABO coach and I guess it's unweighted, right,

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Speaker 1: because the four elements of the formula, none is weighted

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Speaker 1: more than the other. Right, it's equal weight given to

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Speaker 1: each one. It's equal weight here in the x DABO scale,

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Speaker 1: the unweighted x DABO. Yeah, here is the way that

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Speaker 1: this thing works. In each of these four categories, we're

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Speaker 1: going to rank a coach on a scale of one

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Speaker 1: to ten, one being the worst, ten being the best. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The D stands for dependability. Yep, what does that mean?

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Speaker 1: It means dependability? How consistent is a coach? How reliable

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Speaker 1: are his results? How comfortable are we with projecting results

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Speaker 1: forward based on the track record?

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Speaker 2: This is what he's done, and for that we expect

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Speaker 2: him to do this.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. The A stands for adaptability. And there's a lot

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Speaker 1: that I think we can bundle in here. But how

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Speaker 1: good is a coach at adjusting on the fly with

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Speaker 1: decisions and play calling in the moment and then bigger

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Speaker 1: picture if we zoom out, how good is that guy

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Speaker 1: at adjusting the philosophy of his program? So the example

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Speaker 1: that I've used a million times over, maybe it's not

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Speaker 1: as applicable now given what we saw last season. But

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Speaker 1: after Dave Randa's year one with Baylor, there were a

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Speaker 1: lot of gripes with how he managed things, super conservative. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and he came out the next year and went for

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Speaker 1: a lot more and fourth down and made some changes

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Speaker 1: and Baylor was a lot better. That was a moment

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Speaker 1: of adaptability. We won't spend too much time talking about

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Speaker 1: what Dave r and has done since then.

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Speaker 2: Right, or somebody hired a coordinator Year one clearly didn't

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Speaker 2: work and instead of drawing it out hoping for improvement,

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Speaker 2: they knew that it wasn't a match and they just

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Speaker 2: moved on immediately.

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Speaker 1: That's right, that's right. The bee is build quality. Yep.

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Speaker 1: How good is a guy at acquiring talent? How good

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Speaker 1: is he at developing the talent? So this applies on

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Speaker 1: the recruiting front. This also applies on the hiring front. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Nick Sable, well, Nick Saban for years had this well

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Speaker 1: known famous coaching tree. Guys who went there for a

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Speaker 1: one or two year internship went on to bigger and

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Speaker 1: better things, maybe running their own shop like Sark or

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Speaker 1: Lane Kiffin or Nick Saban's known for that. So how

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Speaker 1: good are these guys at developing their players and their

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Speaker 1: coaches that are underneath them? Correct, that's your b dab. Finally,

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Speaker 1: is oh opportunity? H opportunity? What's a coach is ceiling? Man?

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Speaker 1: What's a coach's ceiling is? This is a very relative

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Speaker 1: measure as part of this extremely goof an imaginary skill.

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Speaker 2: Right, how do you define a six? How do you

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Speaker 2: define an eight? How do you define a three? How

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Speaker 2: do you define a ten?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you can make a pretty good case that Kaylen

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Speaker 1: de Bor, even though Kaylan de Bor went to a

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Speaker 1: national championship with Washington, he made a pretty good case

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Speaker 1: that his ceiling at Washington was a lot lower, bigger

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Speaker 1: picture than it will be at Alabama. He will have

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Speaker 1: more opportunity at Alabama, I think to be great to

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Speaker 1: win championships, to get back to that guy. So no, yeah, okay,

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Speaker 1: you can make that case. We can argue that out.

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Speaker 2: So what we're doing essentially is we are taking four

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Speaker 2: different categories as elements of our methodology. Within those categories,

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Speaker 2: we are hoping to consistently define what each number is.

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Speaker 2: And even though we are picking numbers subjectively, we're showing

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Speaker 2: our work and applying that same method to each guy.

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Speaker 2: So you can disagree with you know, I'm giving Ryan

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Speaker 2: Day a seven here, I'm giving Luke Fickle a nine here,

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Speaker 2: but at least we're applying the same that's right method

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Speaker 2: to each of them. And so you know, there are

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Speaker 2: some of these where I like, I found out like

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Speaker 2: my top ten based on independently selecting scores for each

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Speaker 2: of these these elements, and I was like, I don't

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Speaker 2: know that that's my top ten, But how do I

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Speaker 2: argue with? You know, this is my choice, and this

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Speaker 2: is what I have to roll with because at least

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Speaker 2: it's applied evenly throughout the process.

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Speaker 1: So there is one other element to this. Oh bonus,

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Speaker 1: I said, X dabo, Oh, that's true. We put the

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Speaker 1: X there to make it look official, like there was

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Speaker 1: some actual science behind this. There is no science there

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Speaker 1: is just rudimentary math. I assure you of that, we're

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Speaker 1: capable of nothing more. Thank you computer. The X stands

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Speaker 1: for pr and media chops. Yeah, doesn't apply to everybody.

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Speaker 1: So I think for somebody like Brian Kelly, Brian Kelly,

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Speaker 1: we might be willing to give them a few bonus points.

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Speaker 1: So this is something that we can use if we

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Speaker 1: want to zero to five, if we want to add

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Speaker 1: a few bonus points for somebody who is particularly good

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Speaker 1: at dealing with the media. Now, can we say the excess.

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Speaker 2: For extroverts extraversion per extraversion If that's a word, sure,

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Speaker 2: synergy right here.

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Speaker 1: Love it. I love it. The reason that we would

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Speaker 1: incorporate this as part of the skill, it doesn't have

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Speaker 1: anything to do with what's going on on the field,

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Speaker 1: right but back check, extraversion is a word. Extraversion is

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Speaker 1: definitely word. I didn't know. The reason that we should

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Speaker 1: put this in here is because if the media turns

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Speaker 1: against a guy, or if the fan base turns against

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Speaker 1: a guy because of the way he handles the media

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Speaker 1: or the media portrays him, that often can spell doom.

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Speaker 1: We have seen that happen before. Got to play the game.

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Speaker 1: Got to play the game. So Brian Kelly's going to

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Speaker 1: get a few extra bonus points with this zero to five.

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Speaker 1: Don't have to use it, but you can use it

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Speaker 1: if you want to give a guy a few more

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Speaker 1: bonus points to boost is rating a little bit based

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Speaker 1: on what he's doing. That rule with the emojis, that's

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Speaker 1: gotta be worth something, right.

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Speaker 2: Well, Look, if it's out of five, I'm giving mac

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Speaker 2: Brown like a nine right now for memorizing every reporter's

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Speaker 2: first name, Doc Rivers, Mac Brown, great question, Adrian.

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Speaker 1: You could get a five. So that is the x

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Speaker 1: DABO scale. We came up with it yesterday. We're very

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Speaker 1: proud of it. We're very excited about this, and I

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Speaker 1: think it finally puts some walls up with respect to

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Speaker 1: how we're going to actually rank coaches.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so your worst coach is probably a four, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: if we're doing four categories one through ten, and of

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Speaker 2: course if a coach has a perfect grade. Essentially this

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Speaker 2: scoring is out of just a clean, A clean, A clean, okay.

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Speaker 1: Beautiful, and could go up to forty five if for

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Speaker 1: feeling generous.

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Speaker 2: Well, no, I'm saying I'm using that as a bonus,

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Speaker 2: but yes we can after the fact, I scored it

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Speaker 2: out of forty and I'm using it the X extra

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Speaker 2: version as a separate element. But yeah, we can do

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Speaker 2: the math on the fly because once again, between us,

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Speaker 2: we have a twelfth grade education mathematically.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the moment in the show where I

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Speaker 1: just casually remind everyone that if you like this concept,

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Speaker 1: if you like this show, if you want to support us,

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Speaker 1: the most important thing you can do is hit follow

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Speaker 1: or subscribe wherever it is that you're listening or watching

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Speaker 1: this show right now. Yeah, following on social media, hit

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Speaker 1: the like button on all the stuff we're doing there.

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Speaker 1: We've been pushing extra hard in the off season because

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Speaker 1: we've got the time and the energy and we're excited

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Speaker 1: about the season ahead. But these are some basic things,

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Speaker 1: some simple things. We have people email all the time,

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Speaker 1: what can I do to support the show? That's what

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Speaker 1: you can do to support the show if you're really

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Speaker 1: into it. For Ballers dot Com, we'll post this episode

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Speaker 1: early without the ads. There's a discord that I know

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Speaker 1: is going to be popping off talking about this as

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Speaker 1: well as we get into all things x Nabo, Dan Rubinstein,

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Speaker 1: Shall we dive in? Let's dive in the number one

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Speaker 1: ranked coach in ESPN's on official ranking system was Kirby Smart.

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Speaker 1: Kirby Smart, I think, for all intents and purposes here

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Speaker 1: does he represent the forty? Would he be the perfect

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Speaker 1: forty or Dabbo scale x daboskill? Absolutely not? Why not?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I want to make people earn it over,

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Speaker 1: Like forty just seems like.

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Speaker 2: There's only one forty in my mind. Ty, that's you. Okay,

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Speaker 2: thank you. I have Kirby Smart at thirty eight. Okay,

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Speaker 2: where is he getting doc points?

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Speaker 1: Okay?

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Speaker 2: So I have a ten in terms of dependability. Okay,

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Speaker 2: I have him as a ten in terms of adaptability.

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Speaker 2: I have him an eight in terms of build quality

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Speaker 2: and a ten in terms of opportunity ceiling. I'm giving

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Speaker 2: him the eight in terms of build quality. Obviously Georgia

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Speaker 2: and Kirby Smart, they've been a sensational recruiting machine. But

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Speaker 2: I'm docking him the eight because of the quarterback shuffling

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Speaker 2: and the quarterback question throughout the years. But I'm taking

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Speaker 2: his experience in totality and so we're talking about using

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Speaker 2: the Justin Fields example, mismanaged. We're talking about you know,

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Speaker 2: Jake from getting worse that like and I don't know

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Speaker 2: if you want to put that in terms of development whatever,

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Speaker 2: but Jake from and it's a defensible move to stick

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Speaker 2: with Jake from the way he did.

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Speaker 1: But the JT.

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Speaker 2: Daniels element, the Jamie Newman not playing element, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's hard to put that fully on Kirby Smart and

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Speaker 2: then like essentially peaking at quarterback kind of by accident

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Speaker 2: with Stetson Bennett.

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Speaker 1: Well, and so I think there is an important distinction

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Speaker 1: here that we should draw if we're going to go

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Speaker 1: based on this scale. Sure, there is a distinction to

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Speaker 1: be made between acquiring the talent and developing the talent. Agree,

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Speaker 1: And they're almost two separate things. He's been very good

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Speaker 1: at developing talent. What we do with Stet's and Bennett agree,

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Speaker 1: totally agree, right, Ste's stets and Bennett turned into like

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Speaker 1: one of the all time greats in Georgia history, maybe

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Speaker 1: SEC history, A very very good college quarterback by the

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Speaker 1: time he left. But I think if Kirby Smart were

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Speaker 1: starting over again Sets and Bennett, he wouldn't have been

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Speaker 1: the number one guy that he recruited to run his offense. Right,

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Speaker 1: as you said, that quarterback system was a bit mismanaged,

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Speaker 1: So I'm not against docking some points there for build quality.

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Speaker 1: We know that assistant coaches have developed handsomely under Kirby,

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Speaker 1: Smart Dan Lanning. Dan Lanning, who we're going to talk

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Speaker 1: about here, I'm sure in a little bit, is a

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Speaker 1: great example of that. Fran Brown just left to go

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Speaker 1: and coach Syracuse. He's obviously, Kin is doing great things

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Speaker 1: in the NFL. Yeah, Monkin's doing well in the NFL.

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Speaker 1: Like there are definitely some guys that will go through

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Speaker 1: and mention in passing that get it incomplete because we

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Speaker 1: don't have a full picture of what they can do yet.

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Speaker 1: But in terms of that side of things, Kirby's been

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Speaker 1: really really good. If we're pointing to just one thing though,

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Speaker 1: the most important thing to me at quarterback, and like

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Speaker 1: the Jacob Eason thing didn't work out like that, That's

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Speaker 1: what I'm pointing to, quarterback recruitment, selection and management. Can

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Speaker 1: we give him a few extra bonus points though at

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Speaker 1: the PR and media chops the extra version category? Can

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Speaker 1: we throw in a few out of five? What would

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Speaker 1: I give Kirby? Yeah, we'll give him like a maybe

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Speaker 1: a three. Give him it's two or three.

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Speaker 2: The only the docking thing is the way that he

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Speaker 2: is weaponizing the state of Georgia with like the foyer

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Speaker 2: stuff that's not as open as you'd like. But yeah,

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Speaker 2: two or three somewhere in there.

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Speaker 1: We'll give him a two. We'll get we'll get him

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Speaker 1: up to an even forty. Yeah, if that works for you.

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Speaker 2: Do you want me to quickly go through all of

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Speaker 2: the coaches I have outside of my top ten? Or

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Speaker 2: is that jumping around too much?

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Speaker 1: Why don't we go next man up after Kirby? Okay?

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Speaker 1: On my list, on your lift or on the ESPN list.

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Speaker 1: On your list, they've got Klin to board number two,

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Speaker 1: which I saw and that I understand why they put

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Speaker 1: him that high. Yeah, surprise me a little bit. Surprised

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Speaker 1: me a little bit that he was number two on

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Speaker 1: this list already. Who do you have two on yours?

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Speaker 2: I have Kyle Whittingham on mind, which I might not

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Speaker 2: do if you were just having a conversation with me

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Speaker 2: just over some fantas or something. TI. I don't know

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Speaker 2: what the kids drink now, But in terms of like

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Speaker 2: when I went item by item, I have him at

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Speaker 2: thirty four out of forty.

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Speaker 1: Wow, that's really high.

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Speaker 2: I have Kyle Whittingham there, And I don't know if

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Speaker 2: that's just because he's been like the sort of one

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Speaker 2: of the deans of the sport, because he's been at

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Speaker 2: Utah forever and succeeding at Utah forever in different circumstances,

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Speaker 2: with different assistants and different conferences. This will now be

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Speaker 2: what his third conference. Sure while at Utah at least

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Speaker 2: and so here I scored him nine to nine eight,

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Speaker 2: so a nine. Dependability. He has been consistent, you know

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Speaker 2: that the results are something you can depend on, led

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Speaker 2: by defense, led by line play, adaptability on the fly

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Speaker 2: with decisions, play calling. Utah is not a team that

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Speaker 2: generally beats its elf in these games. They're the actual

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Speaker 2: They're the one who knock. They're the ones who beat

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Speaker 2: the teams that are not able to navigate games consistently

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Speaker 2: well build quality. I knock them a little bit because

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Speaker 2: of you know, some offensive struggles, especially passing game struggles

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Speaker 2: throughout the year that like, he hasn't been able to

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Speaker 2: adapt well. I guess adaptability is nine, but he hasn't

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Speaker 2: in terms of like, uh, finding offensive players, game changers

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Speaker 2: at receiver, specifically quarterbacks to go downfield.

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Speaker 1: That has not always been the case.

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Speaker 2: And I have a ceiling as eight, and the eight

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Speaker 2: ceiling I came to define as this is somebody who

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Speaker 2: can with regularity compete for a conference title, to end

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Speaker 2: up in a conference title game, or beat teams consistently

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Speaker 2: who are.

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Speaker 1: Of that quality.

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Speaker 2: Nine I have is like you know, in a playoff

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Speaker 2: conversation pretty often. Ten I have as like a definitive

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Speaker 2: national championship threat often Kirby So right, So I have

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Speaker 2: Kyle Whittingham in that eight category because Utah has been

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Speaker 2: to those games, They've won those games, They've beaten teams

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Speaker 2: who've won those games, like they've been played in major

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Speaker 2: bowl games as recently as what a couple of years

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Speaker 2: ago with the Rose Bowl gave what Penn State all

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Speaker 2: they could handle. They had you know, Ohio State recently.

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Speaker 2: So that's where I have him scoring as a thirty four.

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Speaker 1: Dependability is I think his greatest ability. He's been very,

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Speaker 1: very solid. Yeah. As a coach, you sort of are

340
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Speaker 1: more comfortable with Kyle Whittingham projecting his track record forward,

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Speaker 1: yeah than maybe anybody else on this list. Yeah, you

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Speaker 1: just know what you're going to get from year to year.

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Speaker 1: Adaptability and build quality though I push back a little bit,

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Speaker 1: especially in the build quality. You know, like the dependability

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Speaker 1: is good in that you know, most years you're going

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Speaker 1: to get nine or ten wins out of them, you

347
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Speaker 1: just but from an adaptability standpoint, from a build quality standpoint,

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Speaker 1: do we feel like the talent do we feel like

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Speaker 1: the willingness to adjust has gotten better with witting him?

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Speaker 1: Because I see the same team kind of year and in

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Speaker 1: year out, dependable but not always adaptable to the way

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Speaker 1: that college football around has changed. I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I still feel like more teams are scared of Utah

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Speaker 2: and their evolution over the course of the years. And look,

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Speaker 2: it's it's consistency. I mean that's under dependability. The way

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Speaker 2: that they've used the portal on both sides of the

357
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Speaker 2: ball has been impressive, Right have maybe their best playmaking

358
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Speaker 2: quarterback ever via the portal. They've filled in some gaps

359
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Speaker 2: via the portal. They're not crazy aggressive, I know they've

360
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Speaker 2: done pretty well at corner there. And even build quality

361
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Speaker 2: via high school recruiting has steadily improved, probably maxing out

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Speaker 2: with the Clark Phillips recruitment and development, you know, into

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Speaker 2: a an all American caliber corner. So I don't know, man,

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Speaker 2: the evaluation, you know, even though recruiting stars wise, they're

365
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Speaker 2: like top twenty five ish, Like, I don't know, they've

366
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Speaker 2: got an unbelievable eye for talent on both sides of

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Speaker 2: the ball outside of wide receiver.

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Speaker 1: Do we want to throw in a bonus point or two? Oh?

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Speaker 1: I think he's super likable. I'd put him in like

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Speaker 1: two or three. I think he's probably a three. He's

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Speaker 1: a good. Yeah, he's a good all right, So he's

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Speaker 1: a thirty four. I don't fundamentally disagree with any of that.

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Speaker 1: I think that's fair, but yeah, we need to push

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Speaker 1: back on he's also let some local talent go. When

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Speaker 1: you look at like what Devin Brown, panay Sewell Jackson

376
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Speaker 1: powers Johnson's probably a first round pick here, there's been

377
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Speaker 1: some some top level Utah talent that hasn't stayed home.

378
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Speaker 2: But I don't know. I'm grading him pretty highly still.

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Speaker 1: So what's interesting about this? If he's number two on

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Speaker 1: your list? Yeah, who's number two? Again? On ESPN's they've

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Speaker 1: got Caitlyn de Bor, but they've got Kyle Whittingham three, right, Okay,

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Speaker 1: witting him at thirty four number two. I think that

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Speaker 1: feels about right to me.

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Speaker 2: So you would dock him where you would dock him

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Speaker 2: with the build quality like a six seven.

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Speaker 1: I think I dock him with build quality a little bit. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it might go down a little bit more on that.

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Speaker 1: So you gave him a nine, a nine, an eight,

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Speaker 1: and an eight. Yes, okay, So that's thirty four.

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Speaker 2: Thirty four for Winningham, thirty eight for smart, thirty four

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Speaker 2: and out of a possible Yeah.

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Speaker 1: What I like about this is that there is a

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Speaker 1: clear tier system drop yes, and that feels right to me.

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Speaker 2: Continue, all right, So I have three guys tied at

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Speaker 2: thirty three.

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Speaker 1: Are you ready for it? Please this one?

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Speaker 2: So this is not necessarily my number three tied for third.

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Speaker 2: This might be the most controversial today, Ryan Day. Okay, here,

399
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Speaker 2: here's here. The knock on Ryan Day obviously is like, oh,

400
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Speaker 2: he started on third base. Like Urban Meyer built up

401
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:49,360
Speaker 2: that program. Ryan Day has largely kept it going successfully.

402
00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:52,639
Speaker 2: He inherited a bunch of talent. You still have to

403
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Speaker 2: win the games. To me, so Ryan Day has been

404
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Speaker 2: to a national championship game and lost, and has been

405
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Speaker 2: to a semi final against the clear best team in

406
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Speaker 2: America and barely lost. He's lost to precisely one team

407
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Speaker 2: in conference, which is the absolute worst team for Ryan

408
00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:15,439
Speaker 2: Day and Ohio State to lose two. But his record

409
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Speaker 2: is still crazy good. He does actually win the games

410
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Speaker 2: more often than not. They're blowing teams out with regularity.

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Speaker 2: And I think it's very easy to look at Ryan

412
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Speaker 2: Day and saying like, oh, he's diet Urban or whatever,

413
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Speaker 2: and he's building off of something else. And obviously he

414
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Speaker 2: can't win the big one against Michigan, so we dock

415
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Speaker 2: him there. All fair, but in this specific rubric tie,

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Speaker 2: I grade Ryan Day out as a nine six nine, okay,

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Speaker 2: So I would be glad is to say.

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Speaker 1: Nine. Give him another point for build quality. The talent

419
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Speaker 1: on hand is sure ridiculous, and furthermore, the coaching talent

420
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Speaker 1: that he's got around him, I think is pretty good.

421
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Speaker 1: They have kept their foot on the gas this offseason,

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Speaker 1: in particular, will trying to improve their talent. Again. I

423
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Speaker 1: harken back to what I said on the last episode

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Speaker 1: or two episodes ago about Jeremiah Smith, who looks like

425
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Speaker 1: a man among boys, probably is going to contribute, hopefully

426
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Speaker 1: will contribute as part of that receiving corps. Sure this

427
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:26,080
Speaker 1: year could already be the best receiver on the damn roster.

428
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Speaker 1: The build quality at Ohio State is I mean, I

429
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Speaker 1: it's like second to none at this point. They've got

430
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Speaker 1: so much talent, Dan, I hear you.

431
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:41,680
Speaker 2: They get a nine because they just had a quarterback

432
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:45,160
Speaker 2: who for a number of reasons didn't fully work out,

433
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:48,439
Speaker 2: and offensive line recruiting and developments is not in a

434
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,480
Speaker 2: great place at the moment. Am I a victim of

435
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:55,159
Speaker 2: the moment? Perhaps, but ten just means across the board,

436
00:23:55,560 --> 00:24:00,520
Speaker 2: your nails deep right, and they're not at the moment.

437
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,879
Speaker 2: I've liked most of the hires. He has had to

438
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 2: make some changes because it hasn't worked out at a

439
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:10,960
Speaker 2: couple of different positions. Had to make a defensive coordinator

440
00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:15,560
Speaker 2: change a couple of years ago, and that was kind

441
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,040
Speaker 2: of the reason that that team was a little bit

442
00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:20,240
Speaker 2: too flawed in that national look. DeVante Smith was going

443
00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:22,719
Speaker 2: to get in on anybody, but like, I don't know,

444
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:25,840
Speaker 2: the linebackers that year being torched by receivers against the

445
00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,960
Speaker 2: better team. Like, I just don't think it's perfect. Ten

446
00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 2: out of ten is an a plus, all right. I

447
00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:33,879
Speaker 2: don't think we give him any bonus points for media.

448
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,399
Speaker 2: I probably have maybe one or two, maybe one somewhere

449
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:42,240
Speaker 2: in there. I have Ryan Day tied. Do you have

450
00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:44,240
Speaker 2: issue with the other? I have A six is like

451
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,359
Speaker 2: the in game no, a little bit stubborn, And.

452
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:50,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I think Ohio State fans who listened

453
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:54,800
Speaker 1: to this would take issue bitpicky, would take issue, mostly

454
00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:57,719
Speaker 1: with the adaptability part of it, because everybody in their

455
00:24:57,760 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 1: right mind new follows this would agree that there's plenty

456
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: of opportunit Ohio State, Like it's still all there for him,

457
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 1: and if they can assemble the troops and get organized

458
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:09,320
Speaker 1: in a big way this season, I mean, this could

459
00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:11,200
Speaker 1: be the year they're gonna there. We're pretty much already

460
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:13,879
Speaker 1: writing them into the playoffs. So I think A nine

461
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:18,680
Speaker 1: is like a starting point for opportunity, you know, build quality.

462
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:21,440
Speaker 1: The talents there, the coaches are there, and he's obviously

463
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,040
Speaker 1: developing guys. Lovemore hate him. He's developing guys and putting

464
00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:26,639
Speaker 1: them in the league. There, the recruiting system seems to

465
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:28,720
Speaker 1: have reached critical mass where kind of recruits.

466
00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:31,280
Speaker 2: Bringing Jim Knowles and Chip Kelly to run either side

467
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:31,880
Speaker 2: of the ball.

468
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:36,200
Speaker 1: I mean, come on, and dependability again, Michigan fans would say, yeah,

469
00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:39,400
Speaker 1: we love Ryan Day's dependability. He loses to us every year. Yeah,

470
00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:42,120
Speaker 1: of course, fair point, but he beats everybody else, So

471
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:45,439
Speaker 1: that in and of itself, I think we'll maybe dock

472
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:48,120
Speaker 1: him a point because he's not beating Michigan, but otherwise

473
00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 1: he's like right there. It's the adaptability piece of this.

474
00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:52,840
Speaker 1: So what number would you give him? I give him

475
00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:54,399
Speaker 1: a sick. I think I agree with you on that one.

476
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:57,360
Speaker 1: I think I agree with you on that one, and

477
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:01,879
Speaker 1: it's a six by it has potential to go up

478
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 1: to like an eight very quickly depending on how they

479
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:05,359
Speaker 1: look this season.

480
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:12,359
Speaker 2: I suppose, yeah, all thirty three on your list. I

481
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:15,160
Speaker 2: have Lance Leipold out of thirty three as well. Woh,

482
00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:18,400
Speaker 2: I have Lance Lipole who else?

483
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:19,160
Speaker 1: Who else? With?

484
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:22,360
Speaker 2: With Lance and Kaylin de Boor. I have Lance Liphold

485
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:27,200
Speaker 2: with nine eight eight eight that I believe checks out.

486
00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 1: Eight eight eight, Okay.

487
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,400
Speaker 2: So the interesting thing with Lance Leipold is I think

488
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:34,120
Speaker 2: it's only fair. You're not just looking at what he's

489
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 2: done and improving Kansas, right. You look at what he

490
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:38,159
Speaker 2: did at Buffalo, and then you look at what he

491
00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:40,920
Speaker 2: did on every other level that he's coached at, winning

492
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,160
Speaker 2: a ton of national champion you know, national championship, winning

493
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:46,080
Speaker 2: a ton of games. So I have Lance Lightpold nine

494
00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:49,000
Speaker 2: eight eight eight. So the dependability of like, you can

495
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:52,760
Speaker 2: depend on Lance Lightpold growing a program without a doubt?

496
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:54,680
Speaker 1: Right? Nine?

497
00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:58,440
Speaker 2: Can you a nine? Did it at Buffalo, a very

498
00:26:58,440 --> 00:26:59,680
Speaker 2: difficult place to win.

499
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:04,159
Speaker 1: It at Wisconsin Whitewater, Yeah, did it at Buffalo and

500
00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:08,240
Speaker 1: now is in the process of doing it at Kansas. Okay,

501
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:11,919
Speaker 1: you could argue though Devil's Advocate. I love Lance Lipold.

502
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:16,040
Speaker 1: You know this, sure Devil's Advocate. He has done that

503
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:22,200
Speaker 1: at places that couldn't really go down any further, right, Okay,

504
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:24,720
Speaker 1: I'm not going to speak for Wisconsin Whitewater. I certainly

505
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:26,359
Speaker 1: don't know that side of his career as.

506
00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:28,000
Speaker 2: Right now, and it's been a machine there. But yeah,

507
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:30,679
Speaker 2: but like I'm just saying, his vorp is off the charts.

508
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:32,919
Speaker 1: His vorp is off the charts. But in terms of

509
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:38,600
Speaker 1: dependability in the early part of his Power five career, yeah,

510
00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:42,080
Speaker 1: it is definitely taking flight. I'm not going to nine though,

511
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 1: if lance Leipold would have taken over at Michigan. If

512
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 1: lance Leipold eventually takes over at I'll throw a rock

513
00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:50,600
Speaker 1: and say Florida. Sure. I mean, we know Jed Fish

514
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:51,960
Speaker 1: is going to go to Florida in a year, But

515
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:54,760
Speaker 1: let's just throw lance Leipold in that discussion for now.

516
00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:58,040
Speaker 1: What what does Lance Leipold look like at a bigger

517
00:27:58,080 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: place with better competition.

518
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:01,959
Speaker 2: Than what existing in a universe that doesn't exist. I'm

519
00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 2: choosing to be a reality based evaluator here.

520
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:08,680
Speaker 1: He has been consistent. I think his results have been

521
00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:11,720
Speaker 1: reliably pointed up and to the right.

522
00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:16,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, beats big teams, takes players that other people recruited,

523
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:19,240
Speaker 2: brought in transfers that contributed right away.

524
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:23,919
Speaker 1: I am not giving him a nine though with dependability.

525
00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:26,960
Speaker 1: It's too soon for me to give him a nine too.

526
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:29,199
Speaker 1: He's been a head coach forever. Too soon for me

527
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:30,919
Speaker 1: to at at the Power five level. How long has

528
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 1: it been in Kansas, But he's been ahead.

529
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:34,960
Speaker 2: We're talking about we're evaluating him as a head coach,

530
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:37,960
Speaker 2: not only the Kansas head coach.

531
00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 1: I need more Power five data before I'm willing to

532
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 1: go nine on Lancelipold, who I love like a father. Okay,

533
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,680
Speaker 1: I love the guy. I'd love for him as a

534
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 1: coach any of my teams. Yeah, but if we are

535
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 1: putting true scientific what's the word methodology? Dan? Behind this?

536
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:00,920
Speaker 1: I don't go nine, Maybe I go and eat.

537
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:03,600
Speaker 2: But so this is how you describe it. How consistent

538
00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 2: is a coach consistently improving a team without a doubt?

539
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:06,720
Speaker 1: Right?

540
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:10,240
Speaker 2: How reliable are his results? He beats big teams and

541
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:11,320
Speaker 2: keeps winning games?

542
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 1: Right? Yes?

543
00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:16,560
Speaker 2: How comfortable are we in projecting these results forward? Now

544
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 2: you can say maybe he has a ceiling of improving

545
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:21,480
Speaker 2: a team but not taking them to you know, a

546
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 2: top tier. Well, that's where opportunity would come in.

547
00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 1: Okay, opportunity. You're giving him an eight for opportunity at Kansas? Yes?

548
00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:33,880
Speaker 1: At Kansas? Yes? Is that because of the Big twelve changing?

549
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:37,240
Speaker 2: It's both because of the Big twelve changing, and it's

550
00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 2: also because of the teams. He has already shown Kansas

551
00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:44,080
Speaker 2: having an ability to beat or compete with. Right, he's

552
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 2: gone toe to toe or beaten Texas Oklahoma schools like that.

553
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:52,640
Speaker 1: I just know he's beaten both. Right, you are out

554
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 1: of your mind going this high on lance Leipold on

555
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:56,120
Speaker 1: this one.

556
00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:58,240
Speaker 2: Well, basically what I'm saying is I think Lance Leipold

557
00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:01,240
Speaker 2: has the ability to be Kyle Whittingham, Right, which is

558
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:03,760
Speaker 2: not a crazy thing to say. If Kyle Whittingham has

559
00:30:03,760 --> 00:30:06,120
Speaker 2: an eight ceiling because he's proven it.

560
00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:07,040
Speaker 1: Wow, And.

561
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,320
Speaker 2: I don't know, man, Okay, Look he's won a bunch

562
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 2: of games. Look, maybe it's optimistic for sure, but the

563
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:19,360
Speaker 2: other elements of this I feel like balance it out.

564
00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:24,160
Speaker 1: Well to be fair. I mean, ESPN ranked Lance Lipold

565
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 1: ahead of Ryan Day. Sure, and they've got Ryan Day

566
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:29,520
Speaker 1: at nine. They've got Lancelipe or Ryan Day at ten,

567
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:33,680
Speaker 1: Lance Slipold at nine. Yeah, they're pretty high on Lance Lipol.

568
00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:36,880
Speaker 1: They've got him again in between Ryan Day and Lane

569
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 1: Kiffin towards the bottom of their top ten. Obviously a

570
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:42,959
Speaker 1: very very good coach. I can't go nine, eight, eight,

571
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:44,960
Speaker 1: eight for Lance Lipold. I don't know, man.

572
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 2: You look at the depths of Kansas. I'll go look

573
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:51,800
Speaker 2: at Charlie Weiss, Les Miles, David Beatty like they've tried

574
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,000
Speaker 2: a bunch of different ways and the only one that

575
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:58,320
Speaker 2: works since Mark Mangino, Lance Lightphold.

576
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:03,920
Speaker 1: I will go eight for dependability Turner Gill god, I

577
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 1: will go eight. In terms of adaptability, build quality, you're

578
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 1: giving him an eight, Yes, I'm not giving him an eight.

579
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:16,280
Speaker 2: What has he done that is that you feel like

580
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 2: he's done an average job building this roster out.

581
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:25,520
Speaker 1: He hasn't played defense. He has multiple quarterbacks. I haven't

582
00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:27,000
Speaker 1: played defense in two years.

583
00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:29,720
Speaker 2: That's fair, that's fair. If you want to give him

584
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 2: a seven there, it still puts him in the top

585
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 2: five ish category.

586
00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 1: I will go eight eight seven, and for opportunity at Kansas.

587
00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:43,560
Speaker 2: I'll go seven eight eight seven seven, So sixteen and fourteen.

588
00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 1: So you have him at a thirty. I got him

589
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:48,600
Speaker 1: at a thirty. Okay, that's fair, and I don't have

590
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:50,480
Speaker 1: Are you okay with that? Are you okay with that?

591
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:53,840
Speaker 2: I'm okay with your opinion of it. I'm not gonna,

592
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:56,400
Speaker 2: you know, take specific all right, because I've.

593
00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:59,880
Speaker 1: Got him thirty three. In terms of media, I've never

594
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 1: heard Lance slide pold speak. He's pretty good. He's all business.

595
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:05,880
Speaker 1: It seems. We'll give him a one. We'll just throw

596
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:06,480
Speaker 1: one in there.

597
00:32:06,600 --> 00:32:09,360
Speaker 2: So I have Kaylen de Borr in here, and Kaylen

598
00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 2: de Boor I have as a nine nine to six

599
00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 2: y nine.

600
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:17,120
Speaker 1: Okay, talk me through. So nine is dependability nine. I

601
00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:21,680
Speaker 1: look we I'm talking myself into a bit of a

602
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:23,840
Speaker 1: corner here because of what I just said about Lance

603
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 1: slide pold.

604
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:30,400
Speaker 2: But similar background, smaller school, overwhelming success. But also, if

605
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:33,440
Speaker 2: you're talking about Kaylen de Bor's track record, you're including

606
00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 2: I guess coordinator time and certainly presno state time.

607
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:37,720
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, so say that again.

608
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 2: It was nine nine six nine for Kaylen de Bor.

609
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:41,320
Speaker 1: Nine.

610
00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:46,160
Speaker 2: Dependability. How consistent is he yeah, wins beats really good teams.

611
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 2: How reliable is results, does it in almost identical fashion

612
00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 2: every time? How comfortable we projecting these results forward? I

613
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 2: think he's gonna win at Alabama. I think when you

614
00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 2: look at he's just all he does is exclusively win,

615
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 2: And a coach's track record is exclusively winning to a

616
00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:06,240
Speaker 2: huge degree.

617
00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:08,680
Speaker 1: Adaptability, I'd be inclined to go up to a ten

618
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:11,920
Speaker 1: after this year. After this year. I agree with the

619
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 1: nine because I think just the multitude of guys that

620
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:19,400
Speaker 1: he has had under him that he has made better, yeah,

621
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 1: in a short period of time, indicates somebody who knows

622
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 1: how to adapt. Sure, right, So I'm I'm with that.

623
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:29,959
Speaker 1: If he can turn Jalen Milrow into a quarterback that

624
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:33,040
Speaker 1: thrives in his system, which is something you know, I

625
00:33:33,080 --> 00:33:36,440
Speaker 1: am skeptical of, even though I like Jalen Milrow generally speaking,

626
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 1: I need to see how he fits into this offense,

627
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:42,040
Speaker 1: because that, to me, remains a big unknown. That's like

628
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:45,080
Speaker 1: a big spring and summer and fall question that I

629
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:47,800
Speaker 1: think we need to figure out. So I'll go nine

630
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 1: because I agree. But if he gets mill Row to

631
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:52,520
Speaker 1: the point where he's thriving in that offense, it's an

632
00:33:52,560 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: easy ten.

633
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:57,200
Speaker 2: Well, certainly, so the adaptability thing wasn't there with the defense,

634
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 2: and it's you gotta just way the fact that he

635
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:04,360
Speaker 2: didn't recruit the roster, didn't by a large that he

636
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:08,719
Speaker 2: had at Washington, and so that's the knock there. But

637
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:13,000
Speaker 2: obviously in game Kaylin de Borr and you know, winning

638
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:17,080
Speaker 2: close games, you know, game planning successfully, Like even when

639
00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 2: they're not playing well, they're not losing because of coaches

640
00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:21,280
Speaker 2: on the sideline.

641
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:24,800
Speaker 1: Generally, Hey, look at and you know this better than anybody. Yeah,

642
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:27,360
Speaker 1: look at what he did against Oregon. Look at what

643
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:29,840
Speaker 1: he did against Oregon twice. I'm not saying this is

644
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:34,280
Speaker 1: Trent and Dunk on you or Oregon, sure, but like finishes.

645
00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:37,080
Speaker 1: I remember those conversations we had. I remember the text

646
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:40,640
Speaker 1: you were getting from Jeff Jeff Schwartz talking about you know,

647
00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 1: Oregon's got an advantage here. Oregon should be able to

648
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:48,200
Speaker 1: press that advantage, and Washington played defense in a way

649
00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 1: that we did not expect against a really good Oregon offense.

650
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 1: They especially earlier, were ready. Yeah, they were ready, and

651
00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,120
Speaker 1: they were well prepared for that moment. Build quality, though,

652
00:34:58,160 --> 00:34:58,759
Speaker 1: you got a six.

653
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 2: I have a six because it's not really proven. Look,

654
00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:04,600
Speaker 2: you have to give him a ton of credit for

655
00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:07,200
Speaker 2: Michael Pennix that he had the relationship with Michael tent

656
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:11,640
Speaker 2: Pennix brings him in. Obviously, the offensive coaching staff. Bringing

657
00:35:11,640 --> 00:35:14,480
Speaker 2: in the new receivers coach I believe from Purdue Ryan

658
00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 2: Grubb in huge demand, is now what the Seahawks offensive coordinator.

659
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:23,320
Speaker 2: So in terms of, you know, the offensive line continue

660
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,520
Speaker 2: to develop and get better at Washington under him. So

661
00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:30,439
Speaker 2: a number of different position groups did really well under

662
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:35,400
Speaker 2: his assistance. Offense obviously thrived bringing in Michael Pennix was huge,

663
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 2: but didn't recruit on a level that is comparable to

664
00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:42,400
Speaker 2: some of the best coaches on this list.

665
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:44,760
Speaker 1: I was thinking about it as he gave me those numbers,

666
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:47,520
Speaker 1: trying to figure out why you would go so low

667
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:50,600
Speaker 1: on the build quality. Yeah, and then I remembered. Oh,

668
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:52,880
Speaker 1: he didn't really recruit the guys he had. He developed,

669
00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:56,000
Speaker 1: and that's going to stand for something. But in terms

670
00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:59,160
Speaker 1: of recruiting, I think he's got a lot to prove it.

671
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:01,160
Speaker 1: Certainly he had a lot to prove at Washington, and

672
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 1: I think he's going to have even more to prove

673
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:04,760
Speaker 1: at Alabama. It's certainly going to be easier to recruit

674
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:05,600
Speaker 1: at Alabama.

675
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 2: I think Jalen Polk was another key. I think it

676
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:11,239
Speaker 2: was a Texas Tech transfer, but I don't remember if

677
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:13,839
Speaker 2: it was under debor or I think it was early

678
00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:18,160
Speaker 2: to bor. But yeah, by and large, Dylan Johnson was

679
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:21,239
Speaker 2: a Mississippi State transfer, so filled in some gaps really impressively.

680
00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:25,560
Speaker 2: Jabarmahammad from Oklahoma State. So utilize the portal well in

681
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 2: terms of finding, you know, sometime or a lot of

682
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:33,279
Speaker 2: the time star power. But yeah, high school recruiting still

683
00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:33,759
Speaker 2: matters to me.

684
00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:35,880
Speaker 1: We should do one of two things here. Okay, I'm

685
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:37,400
Speaker 1: don't really take issue with this at all. I mean,

686
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:39,640
Speaker 1: he deserves to be in the top five, right, Yeah,

687
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:41,880
Speaker 1: we either need to bump up build quality to a

688
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 1: seven or opportunity to attend.

689
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:50,719
Speaker 2: Build quality to a seven. Opportunity to attend.

690
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:54,480
Speaker 1: One of those two. Why just went to a national

691
00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:59,359
Speaker 1: championship game. Yeah, went to a national championship game. Did

692
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 1: well for as Oh also with Jake Hayner. Yeah, did

693
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:06,000
Speaker 1: very well at Fresno. And I think day one stepping

694
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:07,880
Speaker 1: in at Alabama is going to have an opportunity to

695
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:13,120
Speaker 1: get back to that national championship. Okay, so you're talking

696
00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:17,120
Speaker 1: about opportunity though his ceiling is about as high as

697
00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:18,320
Speaker 1: any coach in college football.

698
00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:23,759
Speaker 2: No, I mean, I'm a ten. Opportunity indicates to me

699
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:30,040
Speaker 2: that you can go toe to toe often with Kirby Smart. Okay, well,

700
00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:31,879
Speaker 2: then let's don't have somebody on this list that can.

701
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:35,000
Speaker 2: Then let's go up build quality. Let's take that seven.

702
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 2: Let's take that.

703
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:42,000
Speaker 1: One, because look it, it definitely stands to reason that

704
00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 1: he didn't recruit at Washington in the way that we

705
00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:46,239
Speaker 1: would like to put him a little bit higher on

706
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 1: this list. So we're gonna we're going to dock him

707
00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:51,240
Speaker 1: for that. But and developing those receivers was huge. Yeah.

708
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,000
Speaker 1: His his ability to develop those guys, though if you

709
00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:56,920
Speaker 1: didn't recruit them, definitely stands for and is not the

710
00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:59,799
Speaker 1: position coach. Yeah, right, so we'll go we'll go seven there,

711
00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:04,040
Speaker 1: what is that? Nine? Nine, thirty four? Sure, thirty four.

712
00:38:04,120 --> 00:38:06,080
Speaker 1: I think he's crazy like, so that puts him even

713
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:09,400
Speaker 1: with Whittingham. Even with Whittingham. I think he's crazy likable,

714
00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 1: and I'll give we'll give him a three. Let's give

715
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 1: him three on the on the on the X side of.

716
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:17,000
Speaker 2: That crazy likable, I don't know. He seems kind of.

717
00:38:17,040 --> 00:38:20,640
Speaker 1: Understated, but he's very understated. I think that makes him likable. Okay,

718
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:22,440
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give him a three on that front. So

719
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:25,839
Speaker 1: we've got right now, Kirby Smart with thirty eight. Yeah,

720
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:29,279
Speaker 1: we've got Whittingham with a thirty four alongside Klein de

721
00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:34,360
Speaker 1: boor Ryan Day and Lance Lipold. I'll I'm not as

722
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:36,600
Speaker 1: high on Lance Lighthold. I've only got him with a thirty.

723
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:40,319
Speaker 1: You've got him a thirty three alongside Ryan. Yeah. We've

724
00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:44,359
Speaker 1: done five coaches here. Let's go have a few other

725
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:47,760
Speaker 1: four way tie a four way tie, Okay, six through nine?

726
00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:50,520
Speaker 1: What is your yeah?

727
00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:56,280
Speaker 2: Okay, in no particular order, Chris Cleman, Dabels, Twiney, Dan Lanning,

728
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:57,040
Speaker 2: Mike Norvell.

729
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:03,200
Speaker 1: Ooh, why don't we do dabbo? Because this is the

730
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:05,680
Speaker 1: X DABO scale right, Yeah, this one was very difficult

731
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:07,279
Speaker 1: for me. I changed this one a bunch. I have

732
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:13,839
Speaker 1: Dabbo as an eight seven seven ten, eight seven seven ten, Yeah,

733
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:14,719
Speaker 1: ten nine tents.

734
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:18,040
Speaker 2: I can go eight seven seven nine If I'm saying

735
00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:19,839
Speaker 2: he can go toe to toe with Kirby Smart, which

736
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 2: I don't believe to be the case in the present.

737
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:25,200
Speaker 2: But when you win multiple national championships and you have

738
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:28,120
Speaker 2: proven that you can go toe to toe with the

739
00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:31,279
Speaker 2: modern I mean the modern, the all time goat here

740
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 2: and Nick Saban. We know Dabo's ceiling is multiple national championship.

741
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:37,440
Speaker 2: It's got to be a fact. It's got to be

742
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:39,319
Speaker 2: a ten. So I have it as a ten, and

743
00:39:39,360 --> 00:39:40,880
Speaker 2: it has to be a ten. Stay on it. It

744
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:43,200
Speaker 2: has to do ten. So what did I say? Eight

745
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:45,960
Speaker 2: nine nine seven eight seven seven ten excuse me? Yeah,

746
00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:48,160
Speaker 2: we've got eight seven seven ten.

747
00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:49,879
Speaker 1: By the way, in the dock, I'm jotting these down

748
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:51,680
Speaker 1: as you mentioned them, if it if it helps to

749
00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:57,399
Speaker 1: kind of keep us aligned here. Yeah, lowest grades than

750
00:39:57,640 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 1: are for the adapt adaptability and build and build quality. Yeah,

751
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:06,480
Speaker 1: which do you think he is worse at between those two?

752
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:13,280
Speaker 2: Adaptability program philosophy with the portal? I think is where

753
00:40:13,960 --> 00:40:16,719
Speaker 2: you're gonna get knocked down with dabble, because still like

754
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:21,640
Speaker 2: adjusting on the fly with decisions play calling, like for

755
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:26,200
Speaker 2: the overwhelming majority of his tenure at Clemson, you know,

756
00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:30,200
Speaker 2: having Brent Venables there, having you know, Jeff Scott and

757
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 2: Tony Elliott do the job they mostly did, especially when

758
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:38,200
Speaker 2: they were co coordinators. Like he oversaw really good philosophy.

759
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:48,480
Speaker 2: He oversaw teams just destroying everybody in their path, and philosophically,

760
00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 2: his vision was nearly flawless for a long stretch. Now though,

761
00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:58,080
Speaker 2: via the portal, via some of those assistant hires, you're

762
00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:00,560
Speaker 2: seeing a stubbornness that are not come down.

763
00:41:01,080 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 1: I would go down farther man further, I know.

764
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:06,360
Speaker 2: But you still have to weigh the totality of his career.

765
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:09,920
Speaker 2: You can say this is what Dabo is in this

766
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 2: if you were to say, like, I am judging this

767
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:16,680
Speaker 2: by exactly what I feel about them in this second

768
00:41:16,719 --> 00:41:21,200
Speaker 2: as a coach with zero track record, sure I.

769
00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:25,520
Speaker 1: Go down to a at least a six on adaptability,

770
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:29,399
Speaker 1: I go down to I think I gotta go down

771
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:31,120
Speaker 1: to a six. I agree with the aid I think

772
00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:35,399
Speaker 1: eight is actually very very smart for dependability. I think

773
00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:38,400
Speaker 1: By the way, that's the right number for the for

774
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:43,520
Speaker 1: the d side of this. But the adaptability and build

775
00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:47,120
Speaker 1: quality I think kind of work hand in hand, you know,

776
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:50,479
Speaker 1: Like he has proven he used to be a little

777
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,160
Speaker 1: bit more adaptable, but even now he's bringing Remember it

778
00:41:53,200 --> 00:41:55,800
Speaker 1: was like a big deal, like, wow, Dabo's got ice

779
00:41:55,840 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 1: in his veins. He went, he stole Garrett Riley. They're

780
00:41:58,040 --> 00:42:00,359
Speaker 1: in the same offense, the same offense and that they

781
00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:04,480
Speaker 1: ran the year before. And I think you can argue

782
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:07,320
Speaker 1: I docked the portal thing a lot. I'm a five

783
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:08,920
Speaker 1: with adaptability for Dabo.

784
00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:14,320
Speaker 2: Here's the here's the knot I worked myself into with Dabo.

785
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:19,480
Speaker 2: You can say philosophically, Dabbo is taking things off the table.

786
00:42:20,040 --> 00:42:22,839
Speaker 2: But now with one hand tied behind their back, they

787
00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:25,760
Speaker 2: still win nine and ten games still, so he's adapting

788
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:29,959
Speaker 2: to his own poor adaptation pretty well. They've won since

789
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:32,560
Speaker 2: Clemson has you know, quote unquote fallen off a cliff

790
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:35,600
Speaker 2: or whatever. Ten and three, eleven and three, nine and four.

791
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 1: Is he is like the best example we have in

792
00:42:38,040 --> 00:42:39,920
Speaker 1: the coaching ranks of machine learning.

793
00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:44,160
Speaker 2: Right, It's the cause and solution to all of Clemson's problems.

794
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:47,080
Speaker 2: So yeah, they went eight to oh in the ACC in.

795
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 1: Twenty twenty two. I'll give the six In adaptability. Here

796
00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:54,359
Speaker 1: was again in the last three years. Here were there.

797
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:58,520
Speaker 2: They're year ending AP ranks fourteen, thirteen and twenty for

798
00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:02,560
Speaker 2: somebody who fell off a cliff. Still not terrible. He's

799
00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 2: adapting to his poor adaptation.

800
00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:04,960
Speaker 1: Well.

801
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:09,800
Speaker 2: Build quality, yeah, I mean the high school recruiting is

802
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:13,480
Speaker 2: still strong, the defense is still very as great at

803
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 2: developing players. Running back has been good. Receiver has fallen

804
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 2: off the cliff for sure, which is specifically against Dabo

805
00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:23,920
Speaker 2: given his position, coaching background, and the track record at

806
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:25,120
Speaker 2: receiver previously.

807
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 1: You've got eight seven, seven ten. I'll go eight six.

808
00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:32,680
Speaker 1: Do I want to.

809
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:34,239
Speaker 2: Sellfing NFL players?

810
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:40,520
Speaker 1: I'll go eight six, seven ten. So I'm a point

811
00:43:40,640 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 1: underneath you. What is that? What does that add up to?

812
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:47,320
Speaker 2: Eighteen eight, seven, six ten, thirty two? Eight and seven

813
00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 2: is fifteen six is twenty one thirty one.

814
00:43:51,640 --> 00:43:55,200
Speaker 1: I'm a thirty one year thirty two? Yeah? What what

815
00:43:55,320 --> 00:44:00,799
Speaker 1: kind of media score does he get in terms of

816
00:44:00,840 --> 00:44:03,480
Speaker 1: extra version? The locals love him. I mean, if you're

817
00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:07,760
Speaker 1: a media if you're a media guy in Clemson, yeah,

818
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:11,360
Speaker 1: you love Dabo Sweeney. If you're a Clemson fan, I

819
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:15,200
Speaker 1: think you probably, on most things anyway, enjoy hearing what

820
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,400
Speaker 1: Dabo has to say. We enjoyed it from a content

821
00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:21,200
Speaker 1: creation standpoint, just because when you get him off script

822
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:22,800
Speaker 1: a little bit, that's when it gets real weird.

823
00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:25,400
Speaker 2: He is the personality of Clemson football. I think you're

824
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:28,680
Speaker 2: probably giving him a four, right, I.

825
00:44:28,640 --> 00:44:31,360
Speaker 1: Think I'm inclined to go four. You don't have to

826
00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:34,240
Speaker 1: love him. He's got great mic skills.

827
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:37,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, in terms of like his presence behind a microphone.

828
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:41,400
Speaker 2: In terms of you understanding who he is as a

829
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:46,800
Speaker 2: public person, I think he communicates that very well. Like

830
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:49,399
Speaker 2: it or not, I think he does a very good

831
00:44:49,480 --> 00:44:56,440
Speaker 2: job as a face of a largely winning program. Likable, unlikable,

832
00:44:56,760 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 2: you know where he standing, You know where he stands.

833
00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:00,279
Speaker 1: I agree with that, all right, Which, what are the

834
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:03,120
Speaker 1: other three coaches that you had tied with Dabo?

835
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:08,560
Speaker 2: So tied with Dabo? I have Chris Cleman, Dan Lanning,

836
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:09,240
Speaker 2: Mike Norvel.

837
00:45:10,520 --> 00:45:16,600
Speaker 1: Okay, so Climban is not part of ESPN's top ten ranking, right,

838
00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 1: but both Norvella and Landing are. Norvell and Lanning are

839
00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:27,440
Speaker 1: five and six. We have now accounted for ESPN's top six.

840
00:45:28,360 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 1: In addition to Lancelipold and Ryan Day. We can get

841
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:36,360
Speaker 1: to Sark and Lean Kiffen here momentarily, I'm sure. But

842
00:45:37,640 --> 00:45:40,560
Speaker 1: to talk me through the reasoning on Chris Climan, I

843
00:45:40,600 --> 00:45:44,880
Speaker 1: have eight's across the board for Chris Climan. Okay.

844
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:47,840
Speaker 2: I think he's dependable and has a track record to

845
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:51,640
Speaker 2: back it up. I think he adapts well. Both sides

846
00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:55,400
Speaker 2: of the ball have succeeded. They're another one of those

847
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,879
Speaker 2: teams that by and large they're beating the flawed they

848
00:45:58,920 --> 00:46:03,279
Speaker 2: are not the flawed game build quality. I think he's

849
00:46:03,280 --> 00:46:06,719
Speaker 2: done a nice job utilizing the portal. He's done a

850
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 2: nice job on the trail, nice job developing. I think

851
00:46:09,640 --> 00:46:13,759
Speaker 2: his hires have been sound. I mean, we'll see how

852
00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:16,399
Speaker 2: you know how well. I think it's the offensive line coach,

853
00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:21,240
Speaker 2: replacing Colin Klein at offensive coordinator. But they've developed NFL

854
00:46:21,440 --> 00:46:25,040
Speaker 2: players on both sides of the ball. They've won without

855
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:29,160
Speaker 2: NFL players, you know, especially you know, quarterback whatever. But

856
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:33,360
Speaker 2: Will Howard a couple of years ago, now I knocked

857
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:37,520
Speaker 2: him down from like a nine, maybe because the Adrian

858
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:42,920
Speaker 2: Martinez experiment. I think that was poor vision. There coaches

859
00:46:42,960 --> 00:46:46,439
Speaker 2: ceiling eight as like can threaten, especially in the current

860
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:49,640
Speaker 2: Big Twelve, can threaten for the conference more often than not. Yeah,

861
00:46:50,239 --> 00:46:53,920
Speaker 2: Conference championship caliber won the conference with Texas and Oklahoma

862
00:46:53,960 --> 00:46:54,759
Speaker 2: in it two years ago.

863
00:46:55,840 --> 00:46:59,720
Speaker 1: I'm a solid thirty on climbing. So you're eights across

864
00:46:59,719 --> 00:47:02,480
Speaker 1: the board thirty two. Yeah, I agree with the first

865
00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:05,280
Speaker 1: two eights. I go seven in terms of build quality

866
00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:09,680
Speaker 1: because it's a talent question. It's not a development question. Sure,

867
00:47:09,719 --> 00:47:10,760
Speaker 1: it is a talent question.

868
00:47:11,520 --> 00:47:13,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, receiver fell off last year a bit.

869
00:47:14,239 --> 00:47:17,319
Speaker 1: I want to see what Avery Johnson looks like. I

870
00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:19,440
Speaker 1: want to see what Avery Johnson looks like if given

871
00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:21,440
Speaker 1: more of a role in this offense. I know you're

872
00:47:21,520 --> 00:47:23,400
Speaker 1: high on him. I'm high on on two they are

873
00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:26,040
Speaker 1: as well. But I want to see what he can do.

874
00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:29,759
Speaker 1: If he can turn that. Yeah, it's a pretty highly

875
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:33,839
Speaker 1: rated recruit. If he can turn him into something at

876
00:47:33,920 --> 00:47:36,520
Speaker 1: quarterback that they have not had, that would be I

877
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:40,560
Speaker 1: think a very positive signal on the opportunity side. It's interesting,

878
00:47:40,600 --> 00:47:42,800
Speaker 1: you know, there's a little bit of addition by subtraction,

879
00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:48,440
Speaker 1: isn't there. Because you've got Texas and Oklahoma leaving, leaving

880
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:52,680
Speaker 1: the Big twelve, You've got I think a power vacuum

881
00:47:52,719 --> 00:47:54,919
Speaker 1: of sorts at the top. Now because those schools are gone,

882
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:57,680
Speaker 1: you've also got an expanded playoff and there's probably gonna

883
00:47:57,680 --> 00:47:59,640
Speaker 1: be two teams from the Big twelve getting into this thing,

884
00:48:00,280 --> 00:48:03,880
Speaker 1: which is opportunity for Kansas State in a way that

885
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:06,359
Speaker 1: they have not had again given that vacuum. So I'm

886
00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:10,560
Speaker 1: I think before if I were a six, I'm going

887
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:14,520
Speaker 1: to go seven now on the opportunity side, just because

888
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:17,760
Speaker 1: of the addition by subtraction things. So I'm we agree,

889
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:21,280
Speaker 1: We disagree, agree on most disagree on the final number.

890
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:24,720
Speaker 1: I've ultimately got climb In in line with Lance Leipold,

891
00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:26,759
Speaker 1: which is not something I planned but kind of works

892
00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:29,640
Speaker 1: out in the great state of Kansas. What do we

893
00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:32,480
Speaker 1: think for media chops any kind of bonus points here

894
00:48:32,520 --> 00:48:36,600
Speaker 1: for the two or three? It's fine. We got lance

895
00:48:36,680 --> 00:48:41,080
Speaker 1: Leipold as a one. Yeah, yeah, somewhere there one or two.

896
00:48:41,120 --> 00:48:43,359
Speaker 1: I'll give them a one. Fine, all right, So climb In.

897
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:46,120
Speaker 1: We you know, I always agree on some minor things

898
00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:49,120
Speaker 1: just in terms of build quality as well. The twenty

899
00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:53,600
Speaker 1: four to seven Sports Metric had the number twelve hundred

900
00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:57,120
Speaker 1: player in the class of twenty twenty as somebody Kansas

901
00:48:57,120 --> 00:49:00,919
Speaker 1: State looked at and said, come on in, do spun. Wow,

902
00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:05,600
Speaker 1: it's pretty good. Pretty good Lanning. Okay.

903
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:12,640
Speaker 2: Lanning's grades as I have them are eight seven nine eight.

904
00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:19,120
Speaker 1: Eight seven nine eight. And let me start the conversation

905
00:49:19,239 --> 00:49:22,480
Speaker 1: with on Landing with this. M hm. He gets the

906
00:49:22,520 --> 00:49:27,080
Speaker 1: full five in extra version. Okay, he gets the full five.

907
00:49:28,120 --> 00:49:30,800
Speaker 1: I think he has played the media about as well

908
00:49:30,880 --> 00:49:34,680
Speaker 1: as anybody in college football, better than Lane Kiffin.

909
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:37,319
Speaker 2: He's out there. He puts himself out there a great

910
00:49:37,360 --> 00:49:40,120
Speaker 2: he puts himself out there. And I will harken back

911
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:43,320
Speaker 2: to something that we talked a little bit about amid

912
00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 2: the coaching carousel. Dan Lanning used the rumors about him

913
00:49:49,320 --> 00:49:56,560
Speaker 2: potentially being interested in you know, Alabama better than anybody.

914
00:49:57,000 --> 00:49:59,600
Speaker 2: Mike Norvell used it to get a pay increase and

915
00:49:59,640 --> 00:50:03,759
Speaker 2: maybe interested in that job, but Dan Lanning reportedly was

916
00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:06,560
Speaker 2: never all that interested in it. Likes where he's at.

917
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:09,400
Speaker 1: Wasn't so much interested in getting the pay increase or

918
00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:11,759
Speaker 1: anything like that. He was interested in the social media

919
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:13,880
Speaker 1: hit that he could get from it. They had a

920
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:18,040
Speaker 1: video ready to roll. I am not the Oregon alum

921
00:50:18,120 --> 00:50:18,440
Speaker 1: between it.

922
00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:21,759
Speaker 2: Is this his personality or is this his like strategic

923
00:50:21,840 --> 00:50:22,520
Speaker 2: It doesn't matter.

924
00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:26,799
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter if it's personality or strategicy. But the

925
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:30,440
Speaker 1: fact that they had a video ready to roll almost

926
00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:34,480
Speaker 1: the millisecond that he turned that job down. That tells

927
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:36,400
Speaker 1: me this is a dude who's scheming, like there's some

928
00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:38,640
Speaker 1: game of Throne stuff going on up in his head.

929
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:42,319
Speaker 1: That he gets the five. He gets the five for

930
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:44,840
Speaker 1: how he used the media. The only other person that

931
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:47,080
Speaker 1: I'm going to give a five to two on the

932
00:50:47,120 --> 00:50:50,719
Speaker 1: media side is Brian Kelly. Because Brian Kelly is a

933
00:50:50,719 --> 00:50:53,640
Speaker 1: politician first and foremost. A lot of folks don't like

934
00:50:53,719 --> 00:50:55,919
Speaker 1: him for that. I have Mac Brown as a five.

935
00:50:55,960 --> 00:50:59,880
Speaker 2: But continue, uh, okay, we could go. I could be

936
00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:05,160
Speaker 2: he's the politician's politician. Yeah, eight, seven, nine, eight with

937
00:51:05,360 --> 00:51:07,360
Speaker 2: the with the kicker of the five for Landing is

938
00:51:07,360 --> 00:51:09,840
Speaker 2: what you've got. Talk me through that quickly. I have

939
00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:12,399
Speaker 2: Landing as a three. By the way, in terms of personality,

940
00:51:12,840 --> 00:51:15,680
Speaker 2: really he gives very generic answers. I don't think he's

941
00:51:15,680 --> 00:51:17,760
Speaker 2: shown much of a sense of humor, which is fine.

942
00:51:18,239 --> 00:51:22,760
Speaker 1: I'll split the difference and go four with you, Okay,

943
00:51:24,320 --> 00:51:25,239
Speaker 1: all right? Eight.

944
00:51:25,360 --> 00:51:29,839
Speaker 2: As in terms of dependability, one double digit games ended

945
00:51:29,880 --> 00:51:33,759
Speaker 2: his season in the conference championship game and blowing out

946
00:51:33,840 --> 00:51:36,600
Speaker 2: a clearly inferior team in a New Year six game.

947
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,880
Speaker 2: I have very comfortable, given where the talent is and

948
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:43,000
Speaker 2: will continue to be, saying he is going to be

949
00:51:43,719 --> 00:51:48,160
Speaker 2: dependably at an eight or nine. But right now, you know,

950
00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:50,600
Speaker 2: I just have him as an eight because he just

951
00:51:50,600 --> 00:51:54,040
Speaker 2: hasn't broken through in terms of like showing that what

952
00:51:54,120 --> 00:51:59,200
Speaker 2: he can do against Utah or whoever is meaningful when

953
00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:03,960
Speaker 2: they play Washington. Right, Adaptability on the fly with decisions.

954
00:52:03,960 --> 00:52:05,239
Speaker 2: What did I say six, No.

955
00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:07,160
Speaker 1: You've got a seven? Seven? Yeah?

956
00:52:07,480 --> 00:52:13,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I obviously have a orgon bias here, but like, yes,

957
00:52:13,400 --> 00:52:16,080
Speaker 2: there are moments where you can argue, yes, too aggressive,

958
00:52:16,560 --> 00:52:20,759
Speaker 2: but there is a very specific vision to it. He's

959
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:26,000
Speaker 2: not inconsistent with that, and so philosophically, he's saying we

960
00:52:26,040 --> 00:52:28,600
Speaker 2: are always going to have our foot on the gas,

961
00:52:29,239 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 2: and yes, that might get him in trouble. Yes you

962
00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:37,439
Speaker 2: can question some of the individual ones, absolutely, but he's

963
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:40,840
Speaker 2: sticking to an ethos and I think that's smart. So

964
00:52:41,480 --> 00:52:44,279
Speaker 2: that's why I docked points, because you know, some of

965
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:48,399
Speaker 2: the over aggression, But play calling wise, I think they've

966
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:51,279
Speaker 2: been a great place he's hired two good offensive coordinators

967
00:52:52,239 --> 00:52:53,640
Speaker 2: that have adapted to the modern game.

968
00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:56,920
Speaker 1: Really well, I take issue with some of this, but

969
00:52:56,960 --> 00:53:00,760
Speaker 1: why don't you, why don't you close it out build quality?

970
00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:06,839
Speaker 2: I'm near a ten, but it's a nine, and I

971
00:53:06,840 --> 00:53:10,880
Speaker 2: don't really have like if it's a ten's he's stringing

972
00:53:10,920 --> 00:53:13,879
Speaker 2: together top three classes essentially, and he hasn't done that yet.

973
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:16,480
Speaker 2: They've been incredible in the portal. They've added a ton

974
00:53:16,520 --> 00:53:18,759
Speaker 2: of value in the portal. Obviously bo Nicks is the

975
00:53:18,760 --> 00:53:22,239
Speaker 2: height of that, but you know, bringing Dylan Gabriel, now

976
00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:24,799
Speaker 2: Dante more, the pieces on defense, especially at corner this

977
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:28,200
Speaker 2: coming year, Evan Stewart at receiver, Tess Johnson. Last year

978
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:32,839
Speaker 2: it said, you know, went over a thousand yards, Bucky Irving, like,

979
00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:35,920
Speaker 2: they're all just enormous wins. So I've hadded nine just

980
00:53:35,960 --> 00:53:40,839
Speaker 2: because they haven't strung together enormous classes yet. And then

981
00:53:40,880 --> 00:53:43,279
Speaker 2: what did I have as the final one? Landing had

982
00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:49,719
Speaker 2: an eight in terms of ceiling, mostly because I haven't

983
00:53:49,719 --> 00:53:51,600
Speaker 2: seen him win a conference, haven't seen him in this

984
00:53:51,640 --> 00:53:56,960
Speaker 2: current conference. So okay, okay, I can see a universe

985
00:53:57,440 --> 00:54:01,200
Speaker 2: in which, especially in a twelve team playoff world, he's

986
00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:02,480
Speaker 2: a nine after next year.

987
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:05,160
Speaker 1: I agree. I agree with that. Here, here's the issue.

988
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:07,160
Speaker 1: It has to take in the data we have as well.

989
00:54:07,640 --> 00:54:11,240
Speaker 1: The issue I have with this is on the dependability side. Okay,

990
00:54:11,640 --> 00:54:15,040
Speaker 1: and it's just a numbers game. He's been coach at

991
00:54:15,040 --> 00:54:18,520
Speaker 1: Oregon for what two years? Yep, We've got two years

992
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:23,560
Speaker 1: worth of data. Three recruiting classes, three recruiting classes. Want

993
00:54:23,680 --> 00:54:27,279
Speaker 1: finished ten to three overall after the first season with

994
00:54:27,320 --> 00:54:30,960
Speaker 1: the Bowl win twelve and two this past year destroyed

995
00:54:30,960 --> 00:54:35,439
Speaker 1: Liberty in the Fiesta Bowl. Yeah, those are two really

996
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:39,600
Speaker 1: good results. You're one and two. I'm not ready to

997
00:54:39,680 --> 00:54:45,320
Speaker 1: go that high on the dependability scale, you know, because

998
00:54:45,320 --> 00:54:48,799
Speaker 1: why going into a new conference that I think is

999
00:54:51,080 --> 00:54:56,040
Speaker 1: more difficult. I think, only two years to fall back

1000
00:54:56,040 --> 00:54:59,319
Speaker 1: at the top at the top, only two years to

1001
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:05,160
Speaker 1: fall back on with that number with a usc that

1002
00:55:05,280 --> 00:55:10,480
Speaker 1: was problematic with a Utah team didn't have a quarterback.

1003
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:13,560
Speaker 1: With the Washington team that was very good that they

1004
00:55:13,640 --> 00:55:16,759
Speaker 1: lost to twice this past three times, three three times

1005
00:55:16,800 --> 00:55:22,759
Speaker 1: time you three times? Excuse me. I'm a six on dependability,

1006
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:27,120
Speaker 1: Dan six, I'm a six with the potential to go

1007
00:55:27,239 --> 00:55:29,520
Speaker 1: up very quickly, you know, if he if he wins

1008
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:34,560
Speaker 1: eleven games this year, let's go up to seven and eight. Okay,

1009
00:55:34,640 --> 00:55:38,080
Speaker 1: we're grading him with respect to track record. We are

1010
00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:42,840
Speaker 1: grading him against guys who have been in their positions

1011
00:55:42,840 --> 00:55:45,120
Speaker 1: for much longer and have much more of a proven

1012
00:55:45,200 --> 00:55:48,680
Speaker 1: track record. By comparison, Dabo Sweeney is also an eight.

1013
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:52,040
Speaker 1: Are we going to give Chris Cleiman is also an eight?

1014
00:55:52,600 --> 00:55:56,279
Speaker 1: By your metric? Lance Leipolds in nine? Are we going

1015
00:55:56,320 --> 00:56:00,480
Speaker 1: to give Dan Lanning an eight when compared to Ryan Day,

1016
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:03,680
Speaker 1: who's a nine winning ten games a year? Are we

1017
00:56:03,680 --> 00:56:07,160
Speaker 1: gonna put Dan Lanning that high? In the dependability.

1018
00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:10,080
Speaker 2: He's consistently won, He's consistently improved both twice.

1019
00:56:10,120 --> 00:56:12,520
Speaker 1: He's done it twice. Not consistently he's done it twice.

1020
00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:15,400
Speaker 2: I'm saying consistently won over like twenty five games or

1021
00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:20,720
Speaker 2: something like that. How comfortable in projecting what he's done forward?

1022
00:56:20,760 --> 00:56:22,400
Speaker 2: I'm very comfortable. Are you comfortable?

1023
00:56:24,200 --> 00:56:25,719
Speaker 1: No? That's why I give him a six?

1024
00:56:25,760 --> 00:56:27,840
Speaker 2: So you're not comfortable, Okay, agree to disagree.

1025
00:56:27,880 --> 00:56:31,040
Speaker 1: That's the only thing I disagree with. I love Dan Lanning. Yeah,

1026
00:56:31,840 --> 00:56:35,440
Speaker 1: I've got him a six, seven nine eight, So I'm

1027
00:56:35,440 --> 00:56:38,319
Speaker 1: at six or seven nine eight, So thirty thirty for me,

1028
00:56:38,400 --> 00:56:41,080
Speaker 1: thirty two for you. We split the difference will go

1029
00:56:41,200 --> 00:56:45,320
Speaker 1: four and the ex kicker and then I think it's Norvel.

1030
00:56:46,440 --> 00:56:50,719
Speaker 1: You got Mike Norvell. Okay, yes, give me his.

1031
00:56:50,719 --> 00:56:56,920
Speaker 2: Numbers, Mike Norvell, I have at seven, eight, eight, nine.

1032
00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:03,240
Speaker 1: Seven, dependability, eight, adaptability eight in terms of build quality

1033
00:57:03,480 --> 00:57:06,839
Speaker 1: nine no nine nine build quality nine build five opportunity

1034
00:57:06,840 --> 00:57:12,280
Speaker 1: and nine opportunity. Okay, thank you, computer, appreciate that talking

1035
00:57:12,280 --> 00:57:14,520
Speaker 1: me through it quick. Dependability? Why seven?

1036
00:57:14,800 --> 00:57:18,160
Speaker 2: The consistency, the consistency through his time. Now you you

1037
00:57:18,240 --> 00:57:22,280
Speaker 2: add in success at Memphis, of course, but at Florida State,

1038
00:57:23,240 --> 00:57:26,720
Speaker 2: I don't know. There's it's been a little bit inconsistent,

1039
00:57:26,800 --> 00:57:29,240
Speaker 2: not blowing out teams like you blow out LSU in

1040
00:57:29,240 --> 00:57:31,400
Speaker 2: the second half and then you sneak by a couple

1041
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:34,880
Speaker 2: of ACC teams, or you just don't look as up

1042
00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:38,840
Speaker 2: for some of those games within the ACC, it seems

1043
00:57:40,720 --> 00:57:46,720
Speaker 2: projecting the results forward, I don't know they're they're overhauling

1044
00:57:46,720 --> 00:57:50,360
Speaker 2: a lot. Yeah, I just don't think they've been a

1045
00:57:50,400 --> 00:57:54,320
Speaker 2: super consistent performer, even when winning games. I think his

1046
00:57:54,440 --> 00:57:56,240
Speaker 2: track record is there, but I think I'm just a

1047
00:57:56,280 --> 00:57:59,320
Speaker 2: little impressed, less impressed with the pop that Florida State

1048
00:57:59,360 --> 00:57:59,680
Speaker 2: has had.

1049
00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:05,080
Speaker 1: Here where Here's where the dependability and build quality I

1050
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:08,240
Speaker 1: think play off each other really well. Okay, all right,

1051
00:58:08,320 --> 00:58:11,960
Speaker 1: So the build quality side of this from Mike Norvell

1052
00:58:12,560 --> 00:58:15,400
Speaker 1: in his time at Florida State has been an interesting

1053
00:58:15,440 --> 00:58:18,520
Speaker 1: balance that he has walked. And I've used Norvel often

1054
00:58:18,560 --> 00:58:21,360
Speaker 1: as an example of somebody who knew how to use

1055
00:58:21,400 --> 00:58:25,240
Speaker 1: the portal well in addition to definitely the recruiting. He

1056
00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:31,080
Speaker 1: has walked that balance, used the portal effectively, used recruiting effectively,

1057
00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:35,040
Speaker 1: kind of use them together as one thing, as opposed

1058
00:58:35,040 --> 00:58:39,400
Speaker 1: to high school recruiting transfer portal being separated. He has

1059
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:42,440
Speaker 1: played one off the other, and I think a particularly

1060
00:58:43,200 --> 00:58:46,240
Speaker 1: interesting way, bringing in guys like Jared Vers, bringing guys

1061
00:58:46,280 --> 00:58:49,800
Speaker 1: like Keon Coleman in right. He has had an eye

1062
00:58:49,840 --> 00:58:51,640
Speaker 1: for the talent that is out there and you use

1063
00:58:51,720 --> 00:58:53,800
Speaker 1: that to make the team better. We'll see this year

1064
00:58:53,840 --> 00:58:56,920
Speaker 1: with DJU. You know, we could do our own ex

1065
00:58:57,000 --> 00:59:00,560
Speaker 1: Dabo on DJU if we wanted to, and we could

1066
00:59:00,600 --> 00:59:04,880
Speaker 1: talk through that. So the dependability side of this is

1067
00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:06,760
Speaker 1: is an interesting concept.

1068
00:59:06,920 --> 00:59:08,720
Speaker 2: I mean, he's had a he's had a five and

1069
00:59:08,800 --> 00:59:12,320
Speaker 2: seven season that featured a loss to Jacksonville State, and

1070
00:59:12,680 --> 00:59:14,800
Speaker 2: like there has to be some knocks on him. There

1071
00:59:14,840 --> 00:59:19,200
Speaker 2: has to be a knock And yeah, the Jordan Travis

1072
00:59:19,600 --> 00:59:26,680
Speaker 2: thing kind of masks the dependability side of this. Yeah,

1073
00:59:26,800 --> 00:59:29,200
Speaker 2: he made Jordan Travis better. Jordan Travis got of course,

1074
00:59:30,480 --> 00:59:34,000
Speaker 2: but what do you have behind Jordan Travis?

1075
00:59:35,440 --> 00:59:39,880
Speaker 1: Not much? That was kind of the argument against Florida State, right.

1076
00:59:40,320 --> 00:59:42,240
Speaker 2: But I think it's just more and more difficult now

1077
00:59:42,400 --> 00:59:45,640
Speaker 2: in twenty in the Portal era to have like a

1078
00:59:45,640 --> 00:59:49,640
Speaker 2: deep quarterback room. Like it's just, you know, it's never

1079
00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:53,160
Speaker 2: going to be usc with like Carson Palmer and Matt

1080
00:59:53,240 --> 00:59:55,520
Speaker 2: Leonard in the same room and John David Boot Like,

1081
00:59:55,520 --> 00:59:56,640
Speaker 2: it's just not to happen.

1082
00:59:56,760 --> 00:59:59,360
Speaker 1: A bunch of capable guys. Yeah, it's not going to

1083
00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:02,000
Speaker 1: be that to have like at nuss Meyer as your backup. Yeah,

1084
01:00:02,160 --> 01:00:07,200
Speaker 1: it's it's not going to be that. I I agree,

1085
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:10,560
Speaker 1: But I do wonder if we knock him a little

1086
01:00:10,560 --> 01:00:15,920
Speaker 1: bit because there wasn't a plan B behind Jordan Travis. Sure,

1087
01:00:16,320 --> 01:00:18,360
Speaker 1: if we knock him a little bit because there is

1088
01:00:18,400 --> 01:00:21,600
Speaker 1: the five and seven season gotten better, right, Yeah.

1089
01:00:22,160 --> 01:00:24,880
Speaker 2: Rota Maker did get hurt. He was like a capable guy,

1090
01:00:25,080 --> 01:00:25,600
Speaker 2: got hurt.

1091
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:27,880
Speaker 1: Got hurt. Okay, all right, that's fair, that's fair. Yeah,

1092
01:00:29,000 --> 01:00:31,400
Speaker 1: you've got here again for Norvelle, just three out or

1093
01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:34,600
Speaker 1: eight A seven eight eight nine seven in terms of

1094
01:00:34,640 --> 01:00:38,920
Speaker 1: dependability and eight in terms of adaptability. I think he's

1095
01:00:38,920 --> 01:00:39,520
Speaker 1: been pretty good.

1096
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:42,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's been improvement on both sides of

1097
01:00:42,200 --> 01:00:42,480
Speaker 2: the ball.

1098
01:00:42,560 --> 01:00:45,439
Speaker 1: Yeah, in eight or excuse me, a nine in terms

1099
01:00:45,480 --> 01:00:46,280
Speaker 1: of build quality.

1100
01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:48,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean the portal stuff has been great.

1101
01:00:48,840 --> 01:00:50,400
Speaker 1: Portal stuff's been I'm going down.

1102
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:52,360
Speaker 2: Here and Johnny Wilson, Yeah, I'm gonna go down to

1103
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:56,320
Speaker 2: an eighth though, Trey Benson seven eight eight and I'll

1104
01:00:56,360 --> 01:00:58,200
Speaker 2: go nine as well. I don't know, man, you're bringing

1105
01:00:58,200 --> 01:01:00,480
Speaker 2: in full on star power in the portal.

1106
01:01:00,600 --> 01:01:01,080
Speaker 1: I don't you know.

1107
01:01:01,120 --> 01:01:04,280
Speaker 2: I'm not crazy high on DJU, but year over year

1108
01:01:04,320 --> 01:01:09,200
Speaker 2: to keep doing that now hasn't been stringing together Jimbo

1109
01:01:09,280 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 2: light classes right, had a couple of pretty major whiffs,

1110
01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:15,080
Speaker 2: and like has developed the talent.

1111
01:01:15,160 --> 01:01:18,560
Speaker 1: Well, okay, we'll go, we'll go. I agree with you.

1112
01:01:18,560 --> 01:01:20,959
Speaker 1: You talked me into it. Seven eight eight nine seven

1113
01:01:20,960 --> 01:01:23,720
Speaker 1: eight eight nine. So that's what fifteen eighteen thirty three

1114
01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:24,320
Speaker 1: for Norville.

1115
01:01:24,960 --> 01:01:27,040
Speaker 2: Now, I may have been a little bit ambitious with

1116
01:01:27,080 --> 01:01:31,200
Speaker 2: the nine opportunity, But that also just sort of comes

1117
01:01:31,240 --> 01:01:34,160
Speaker 2: in what the acc for as long as Florida State

1118
01:01:34,240 --> 01:01:38,480
Speaker 2: is in it, like clear path to the playoff consistently

1119
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:43,000
Speaker 2: has already shown the ability to build a playoff caliber program,

1120
01:01:43,560 --> 01:01:46,680
Speaker 2: has won double digit games these last two years. So

1121
01:01:46,800 --> 01:01:48,640
Speaker 2: I don't think it's crazy to say, like, if a

1122
01:01:48,720 --> 01:01:53,400
Speaker 2: nine opportunity means consistent playoff conversation, I think Florida State

1123
01:01:53,520 --> 01:01:57,120
Speaker 2: fits that, pending long term quarterback proof.

1124
01:01:57,200 --> 01:02:01,000
Speaker 1: I suppose I'll throw in an extra point, but.

1125
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:02,800
Speaker 2: Because of his background, you know, I give him the

1126
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:04,320
Speaker 2: benefit of the doubt with quarterback as well.

1127
01:02:04,880 --> 01:02:06,600
Speaker 1: Thirty three and then one point if we want to

1128
01:02:06,600 --> 01:02:10,400
Speaker 1: go kicker. Yeah, that was your four way tie.

1129
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:12,640
Speaker 2: You want to my four way tie went around out

1130
01:02:12,680 --> 01:02:15,760
Speaker 2: the top ten quick? Well, I have another set of

1131
01:02:15,800 --> 01:02:19,120
Speaker 2: ties there. Okay, the I didn't use decimals. Oh but

1132
01:02:19,240 --> 01:02:22,440
Speaker 2: here's so I have another four five way tie. All right, well,

1133
01:02:22,480 --> 01:02:24,480
Speaker 2: ten through fourteen, I'll go through it quickly. We don't

1134
01:02:24,480 --> 01:02:25,720
Speaker 2: need to go through each elements.

1135
01:02:25,720 --> 01:02:27,920
Speaker 1: Why why don't we do this? My hunch is that

1136
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:31,080
Speaker 1: there will be a fair amount of discussion around this

1137
01:02:31,160 --> 01:02:33,840
Speaker 1: ranking system. We know our audience wall people are gonna

1138
01:02:33,960 --> 01:02:36,880
Speaker 1: I think be into the ex Dabo and we can

1139
01:02:36,920 --> 01:02:40,320
Speaker 1: certainly make another show out of this at some point soon. Yeah,

1140
01:02:40,400 --> 01:02:42,640
Speaker 1: let's round out what you've got nowt here with your

1141
01:02:42,680 --> 01:02:43,439
Speaker 1: five way tie.

1142
01:02:43,480 --> 01:02:46,760
Speaker 2: You said five way tie, thirty way tie, thirty ones.

1143
01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:50,320
Speaker 2: All right, you just tell me if you would separate

1144
01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:51,720
Speaker 2: it or leave it as is.

1145
01:02:51,880 --> 01:02:53,480
Speaker 1: Okay, Okay, go ahead.

1146
01:02:53,960 --> 01:02:57,920
Speaker 2: James Franklin, Lane Kiffin, Mike Gundy, Steve Sarksian, Luke Fickle.

1147
01:02:59,160 --> 01:03:01,360
Speaker 2: I have in there our own thirty one point tier.

1148
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:09,840
Speaker 1: James Franklin, Steve Sarksian. Yeah, Lane Kiffin, Mike Gundy, Luke Fickle. Hmmm.

1149
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:12,919
Speaker 2: Sark for recent pop, but you have to take full

1150
01:03:12,960 --> 01:03:16,560
Speaker 2: track record. Gundhy for totality of his career, Kiffin for

1151
01:03:16,680 --> 01:03:22,960
Speaker 2: recent pop, Franklin for consistency, but with the definitive ceiling.

1152
01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:27,120
Speaker 2: Luke Fickle, with what he did at Cincinnati is crazy impressive,

1153
01:03:27,280 --> 01:03:29,800
Speaker 2: and I'm still optimistic that he can hit a bunch

1154
01:03:29,840 --> 01:03:31,240
Speaker 2: of benchmarks at Wisconsin.

1155
01:03:32,240 --> 01:03:33,360
Speaker 1: And you say Gundy too.

1156
01:03:33,960 --> 01:03:37,440
Speaker 2: Gundhy as well, just because he's been largely very consistent,

1157
01:03:37,520 --> 01:03:39,360
Speaker 2: has developed players on both sides of the ball, Well

1158
01:03:39,400 --> 01:03:43,280
Speaker 2: has largely a really good eye for assistant coaches, so

1159
01:03:43,480 --> 01:03:45,840
Speaker 2: that's what powered his score there. Do you want to

1160
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:47,320
Speaker 2: see the next three way tie or do you want

1161
01:03:47,320 --> 01:03:50,040
Speaker 2: to hit anything specifically? Like do any of those guys

1162
01:03:50,040 --> 01:03:53,919
Speaker 2: not fit in that region? I'm surprised Brian Kelly isn't

1163
01:03:53,960 --> 01:03:57,800
Speaker 2: higher for you. Now I'll tell you why Brian Kelly

1164
01:03:58,040 --> 01:03:59,400
Speaker 2: is not as high for me?

1165
01:04:00,120 --> 01:04:01,720
Speaker 1: You why that's the one? Go ahead?

1166
01:04:01,720 --> 01:04:04,280
Speaker 2: I'll I completely forgot to grate Brian Kelly.

1167
01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:05,880
Speaker 1: Okay, that's okay.

1168
01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:08,800
Speaker 2: Look, let's be honest. This is about Brian Kelly.

1169
01:04:08,920 --> 01:04:10,520
Speaker 1: This is a show about honesty. Do you want me

1170
01:04:10,560 --> 01:04:12,560
Speaker 1: to quickly grade out Brian Kelly. No, I want you

1171
01:04:12,600 --> 01:04:15,640
Speaker 1: to go through your your your tie breaking thoughts here

1172
01:04:15,760 --> 01:04:17,760
Speaker 1: on those five guys that you had tight. Give me

1173
01:04:17,800 --> 01:04:21,120
Speaker 1: your numbers for all five of those guys, just real quick.

1174
01:04:21,160 --> 01:04:22,960
Speaker 1: We don't have to talk through each of them in detail,

1175
01:04:23,040 --> 01:04:25,160
Speaker 1: and then we can we can maybe figure out where

1176
01:04:25,160 --> 01:04:26,200
Speaker 1: we want to put Brian Kelly.

1177
01:04:26,480 --> 01:04:32,120
Speaker 2: All right, Kiffin, I have as seven eight eight eight, okay, Sark,

1178
01:04:32,440 --> 01:04:38,400
Speaker 2: I have as seven seven nine eight. Gundhy I have

1179
01:04:38,680 --> 01:04:44,680
Speaker 2: at eight seven eight eight, Fickle, I have at eight

1180
01:04:44,760 --> 01:04:46,120
Speaker 2: seven eight eight as well.

1181
01:04:47,600 --> 01:04:50,080
Speaker 1: And who's the last one? The last one here would

1182
01:04:50,080 --> 01:04:51,280
Speaker 1: be James Franklin.

1183
01:04:51,440 --> 01:04:54,320
Speaker 2: Franklin, I have as eight, six, nine.

1184
01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:57,160
Speaker 1: Eight, Man, I don't agree with these.

1185
01:04:57,720 --> 01:04:59,400
Speaker 2: I really tell me about the Franklin one that you

1186
01:04:59,440 --> 01:05:03,680
Speaker 2: don't agree with. I absolutely know what I'm getting from

1187
01:05:03,720 --> 01:05:06,160
Speaker 2: James Franklin dependability. You know, I know that he is

1188
01:05:06,200 --> 01:05:10,200
Speaker 2: going to struggle to adapt and philosophically struggle at times.

1189
01:05:10,200 --> 01:05:14,120
Speaker 2: That's a six build quality both portal and high school.

1190
01:05:14,320 --> 01:05:18,160
Speaker 1: I was a nine, I would go lower. I would

1191
01:05:18,160 --> 01:05:20,360
Speaker 1: go lower. I mean he's been, he's been so good

1192
01:05:20,400 --> 01:05:24,120
Speaker 1: as a recruiter. Where I think there is some real

1193
01:05:24,200 --> 01:05:25,400
Speaker 1: question is.

1194
01:05:25,600 --> 01:05:28,439
Speaker 2: Oh, man, I don't know. He's developed like high round

1195
01:05:28,440 --> 01:05:30,040
Speaker 2: picks at like every position.

1196
01:05:29,760 --> 01:05:33,680
Speaker 1: Group, not quarterback. Does quarterback matter still? Okay?

1197
01:05:33,760 --> 01:05:37,960
Speaker 2: Quarterback matter is a lot quieback quarterback has developed like

1198
01:05:38,040 --> 01:05:40,960
Speaker 2: trace mcsreally like I think they've at least been You're right,

1199
01:05:41,000 --> 01:05:45,320
Speaker 2: You're right. So you want to say eight, fine, I'll

1200
01:05:45,320 --> 01:05:46,760
Speaker 2: say you know.

1201
01:05:46,880 --> 01:05:48,560
Speaker 1: You definitely know what you're getting with him from a

1202
01:05:48,560 --> 01:05:53,280
Speaker 1: dependability side. Effings and I would actually go a seven

1203
01:05:53,360 --> 01:05:56,640
Speaker 1: instead of an eight because I think this is one

1204
01:05:56,680 --> 01:06:00,160
Speaker 1: of those instances where dependability and adaptability are hand in hand.

1205
01:06:00,600 --> 01:06:04,240
Speaker 1: He is dependably bad at in game decisions, Okay, okay,

1206
01:06:04,680 --> 01:06:07,600
Speaker 1: So I dock him on on both of those fronts.

1207
01:06:08,240 --> 01:06:13,040
Speaker 1: I would say seven, five, eight, eight For Franklin, man.

1208
01:06:12,880 --> 01:06:15,440
Speaker 2: I still think the build quality, Like you're totally right

1209
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:19,040
Speaker 2: about quarterback, and that's where I docked Kirby Smart. So

1210
01:06:19,200 --> 01:06:23,040
Speaker 2: it would be you know a bit of a a

1211
01:06:23,080 --> 01:06:26,880
Speaker 2: both direction element for me here, but like I don't

1212
01:06:26,880 --> 01:06:29,560
Speaker 2: know with like the defenses that have come through recently,

1213
01:06:29,960 --> 01:06:32,440
Speaker 2: offensive line and just in terms of development, you know,

1214
01:06:32,640 --> 01:06:34,520
Speaker 2: Ola Fashan, who's going to be a you know, top

1215
01:06:34,520 --> 01:06:37,440
Speaker 2: whatever draft pick. This very good book has put it's

1216
01:06:37,480 --> 01:06:41,400
Speaker 2: been money receiver. There's been star power until this past year,

1217
01:06:41,720 --> 01:06:44,160
Speaker 2: last year, until this past year, this past year. But

1218
01:06:44,200 --> 01:06:47,160
Speaker 2: there has been star quality there with what Jaha Dotson,

1219
01:06:47,440 --> 01:06:50,240
Speaker 2: John Dotson and kJ Hamler most recently.

1220
01:06:50,120 --> 01:06:52,040
Speaker 1: Hanler, even Chris Godwin. I mean there have been plenty

1221
01:06:52,080 --> 01:06:52,560
Speaker 1: of guys.

1222
01:06:52,440 --> 01:06:55,240
Speaker 2: Sean Hamilton, Yeah, like there have been real like across

1223
01:06:55,320 --> 01:06:59,840
Speaker 2: the field corner safety, linebacker, Like they may have had

1224
01:06:59,880 --> 01:07:02,600
Speaker 2: the best linebacker of the past decade at Penn State.

1225
01:07:02,760 --> 01:07:04,960
Speaker 1: An eight. Parsons, we have an eight? Right? Did you

1226
01:07:05,000 --> 01:07:05,840
Speaker 1: give him an eight or a nine?

1227
01:07:05,840 --> 01:07:06,000
Speaker 2: There?

1228
01:07:06,000 --> 01:07:07,000
Speaker 1: Oh? I had him medicine nine.

1229
01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:09,000
Speaker 2: You would give him a just because of across the

1230
01:07:09,000 --> 01:07:11,160
Speaker 2: board on both sides of the ball. Give me your

1231
01:07:11,200 --> 01:07:13,760
Speaker 2: numbers again for Franklin running back has been struggle. Give

1232
01:07:13,800 --> 01:07:16,800
Speaker 2: me a number one more hih level star power for Franklin. Yeah,

1233
01:07:16,840 --> 01:07:19,960
Speaker 2: you had an eight six nine eight. Yeah, I'm a

1234
01:07:20,040 --> 01:07:23,160
Speaker 2: seven five nine eight seven five nine eight. So you

1235
01:07:23,160 --> 01:07:25,480
Speaker 2: have a twenty nine I have uh.

1236
01:07:25,120 --> 01:07:28,000
Speaker 1: No, no, no, what is that? Seventeen? Yeah, twenty nine,

1237
01:07:29,680 --> 01:07:31,560
Speaker 1: and you're a little bit higher than you've got a fourteen,

1238
01:07:31,560 --> 01:07:32,160
Speaker 1: And go.

1239
01:07:32,120 --> 01:07:33,880
Speaker 2: Through the rest of my stuff. I think it's fair

1240
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:36,400
Speaker 2: to give Brian Kelly a score here. He's at LSU,

1241
01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:38,439
Speaker 2: He's done incredible things as a college football coach.

1242
01:07:38,520 --> 01:07:42,160
Speaker 1: Do this firstly, Okay, yeah, just give me give me

1243
01:07:42,360 --> 01:07:46,360
Speaker 1: a real quick rundown of the lane Kiffen versus Steve

1244
01:07:46,400 --> 01:07:50,720
Speaker 1: Sarkisian debate. You've got seven seven nine eight for sark

1245
01:07:51,360 --> 01:07:54,680
Speaker 1: and seven eight eight eight four k.

1246
01:07:54,760 --> 01:07:57,680
Speaker 2: Well, so these guys have like the interesting element compared

1247
01:07:57,720 --> 01:07:59,960
Speaker 2: to a lot of these guys of coaching at major

1248
01:08:00,120 --> 01:08:01,360
Speaker 2: places previously.

1249
01:08:01,600 --> 01:08:04,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, and coaching at the same place for a moment

1250
01:08:04,280 --> 01:08:06,320
Speaker 1: in touching at the same place, right, So that that's

1251
01:08:06,320 --> 01:08:09,080
Speaker 1: why I wanted to spot shadow these two and.

1252
01:08:09,400 --> 01:08:12,440
Speaker 2: Also within the Alabama program as well, like very close

1253
01:08:12,480 --> 01:08:12,919
Speaker 2: ten years.

1254
01:08:13,000 --> 01:08:13,320
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1255
01:08:13,440 --> 01:08:16,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, so talking overlapped through Sark took over in the

1256
01:08:16,400 --> 01:08:17,360
Speaker 2: National championship game.

1257
01:08:17,400 --> 01:08:20,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, talk me through how you graded these guys out

1258
01:08:20,280 --> 01:08:24,200
Speaker 1: Because Sark recently was at a playoff. Lane Kiffin has

1259
01:08:24,280 --> 01:08:26,719
Speaker 1: obviously been doing a lot on the on the talent

1260
01:08:26,880 --> 01:08:29,720
Speaker 1: side as well that has made waves in the in

1261
01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:32,559
Speaker 1: the portal here so far this offseason. You still grade

1262
01:08:32,560 --> 01:08:35,800
Speaker 1: Sark higher, which I think I agree with. But seven

1263
01:08:35,960 --> 01:08:39,439
Speaker 1: seven nine eight for Sark, seven eight eight eight for

1264
01:08:39,600 --> 01:08:41,600
Speaker 1: Lane Kiffin. If you add it up again, this is

1265
01:08:41,600 --> 01:08:43,960
Speaker 1: the Dan list, not necessarily mine. I'm kind of Devil's

1266
01:08:44,000 --> 01:08:46,639
Speaker 1: advocate here. You've got them graded equally.

1267
01:08:47,240 --> 01:08:51,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm comfortable with saying Texas will dependably have a

1268
01:08:51,920 --> 01:08:56,200
Speaker 2: good defense and great offense by and large moving forward

1269
01:08:57,120 --> 01:09:00,680
Speaker 2: after these last couple of years. Adaptability, I think I

1270
01:09:00,760 --> 01:09:05,040
Speaker 2: knocked I have as a seven there. Philosophically, I think

1271
01:09:05,080 --> 01:09:05,960
Speaker 2: they're in a good place.

1272
01:09:06,280 --> 01:09:06,880
Speaker 1: You know they're there.

1273
01:09:06,960 --> 01:09:10,200
Speaker 2: Year two years ago gave me some pause about Texas

1274
01:09:10,200 --> 01:09:13,719
Speaker 2: in the second half and even in their game against Washington,

1275
01:09:13,760 --> 01:09:17,439
Speaker 2: to be honest, like just deciding, you know, to go

1276
01:09:17,560 --> 01:09:19,920
Speaker 2: against what has worked for them this year, and that

1277
01:09:20,040 --> 01:09:21,920
Speaker 2: was the run setting up the pass. Like they went

1278
01:09:21,920 --> 01:09:23,599
Speaker 2: away from the run, and I know there were fumbles

1279
01:09:23,600 --> 01:09:26,800
Speaker 2: that helped to inform those decisions, but even still like

1280
01:09:26,840 --> 01:09:28,760
Speaker 2: they were getting whatever they wanted against Washington on the

1281
01:09:28,760 --> 01:09:31,599
Speaker 2: ground and went away from it, especially early on in drives.

1282
01:09:32,640 --> 01:09:34,400
Speaker 2: So I knocked him there as a seven, but like

1283
01:09:34,479 --> 01:09:37,120
Speaker 2: you still like it worked to the tune of winning

1284
01:09:37,120 --> 01:09:39,280
Speaker 2: the conference in a blowout and ending up in the playoffs.

1285
01:09:39,400 --> 01:09:42,920
Speaker 2: So that's why I give them nine. Build quality been

1286
01:09:42,960 --> 01:09:46,760
Speaker 2: great in the portal and high school ranks, and I

1287
01:09:46,760 --> 01:09:49,800
Speaker 2: think his assistant hires have been strong to very strong,

1288
01:09:49,880 --> 01:09:51,800
Speaker 2: especially when you look at Pete Kuitkowski and what he

1289
01:09:51,840 --> 01:09:54,200
Speaker 2: did with the defense in a couple of years and

1290
01:09:54,240 --> 01:09:56,360
Speaker 2: what the both lines turned into.

1291
01:09:56,200 --> 01:09:56,920
Speaker 1: This past year.

1292
01:09:58,240 --> 01:09:59,559
Speaker 2: I just think it would be hard to give him

1293
01:09:59,560 --> 01:10:01,880
Speaker 2: anything less than a nine, uh, and then an eight

1294
01:10:01,960 --> 01:10:06,839
Speaker 2: in terms of opportunity just within the SEC moving forward,

1295
01:10:07,360 --> 01:10:11,000
Speaker 2: Like I have them in the mix for winning the conference,

1296
01:10:11,320 --> 01:10:14,200
Speaker 2: and I just don't think they're going to be consistently

1297
01:10:14,200 --> 01:10:17,400
Speaker 2: in the playoff conversation, but I can see universe in

1298
01:10:17,439 --> 01:10:20,880
Speaker 2: which they are. I just we've seen a year from

1299
01:10:20,960 --> 01:10:21,960
Speaker 2: Sark putting it together.

1300
01:10:21,960 --> 01:10:24,200
Speaker 1: We've seen a year. Yeah, I think I agree with

1301
01:10:24,240 --> 01:10:27,320
Speaker 1: all that on Sark. Where I disagree is with Kiffin. Okay,

1302
01:10:27,439 --> 01:10:29,679
Speaker 1: I disagree a little bit with Kiffin. I understand where

1303
01:10:29,680 --> 01:10:32,479
Speaker 1: you're coming from, dependability with the seven seven eight eight eight, Yeah,

1304
01:10:32,880 --> 01:10:36,360
Speaker 1: I understand where you're coming from. Adaptability in eight Okay,

1305
01:10:36,400 --> 01:10:38,439
Speaker 1: It's been pretty good in game, has been pretty good

1306
01:10:38,439 --> 01:10:41,519
Speaker 1: at modifying the philosophy of the program as needed. Has

1307
01:10:41,560 --> 01:10:46,600
Speaker 1: been good using the portal. Right, yeah, but again, adaptability

1308
01:10:46,600 --> 01:10:48,560
Speaker 1: build quality do kind of work hand in hand a

1309
01:10:48,600 --> 01:10:50,479
Speaker 1: little bit. I dock them a little bit on the

1310
01:10:50,479 --> 01:10:55,879
Speaker 1: build quality. Docs recruited well and has been like nails

1311
01:10:55,920 --> 01:10:58,160
Speaker 1: in the portal. He's been really good. He's been really

1312
01:10:58,160 --> 01:11:00,599
Speaker 1: good at talent acquisition. Do you do you feel like

1313
01:11:00,680 --> 01:11:05,040
Speaker 1: they are making guys better? Do you feel like there

1314
01:11:05,040 --> 01:11:08,920
Speaker 1: are there is like this conveyor belt of guys who

1315
01:11:08,960 --> 01:11:12,320
Speaker 1: are getting better under Kiffin? Moving on to the NFL

1316
01:11:12,479 --> 01:11:14,799
Speaker 1: and that that has become an NFL factory of sorts

1317
01:11:15,000 --> 01:11:16,320
Speaker 1: in terms of player development.

1318
01:11:17,320 --> 01:11:23,240
Speaker 2: No, maybe not an NFL factory, but this is college football,

1319
01:11:23,520 --> 01:11:25,000
Speaker 2: and I all you them to get to a point

1320
01:11:25,040 --> 01:11:27,280
Speaker 2: where they're good players winning college games.

1321
01:11:27,840 --> 01:11:32,280
Speaker 1: I'm a seven there. I'm an easily influenced seven, maybe

1322
01:11:32,360 --> 01:11:34,439
Speaker 1: up to an eight, but I go down. I go

1323
01:11:34,600 --> 01:11:37,000
Speaker 1: down just because of them as an eight. Yeah you've

1324
01:11:37,000 --> 01:11:39,519
Speaker 1: got an eight, I've got I've got a seven. And

1325
01:11:39,640 --> 01:11:43,639
Speaker 1: I think it's because I feel like they get into

1326
01:11:43,640 --> 01:11:46,439
Speaker 1: these big games and with the talent that they have,

1327
01:11:46,560 --> 01:11:49,200
Speaker 1: maybe I should knock them with adaptability instead. Actually that's

1328
01:11:49,240 --> 01:11:51,719
Speaker 1: what I'll do. Let me go seven to seven eight.

1329
01:11:52,720 --> 01:11:54,920
Speaker 1: They get into these big games and they just get

1330
01:11:54,960 --> 01:11:58,200
Speaker 1: like blown off the field by Georgia. You know, sure

1331
01:11:58,800 --> 01:12:02,040
Speaker 1: that's not necessarily a scarlet letter. A lot of teams

1332
01:12:02,160 --> 01:12:05,240
Speaker 1: get blown off the field by Georgia. Yeah, I just

1333
01:12:05,360 --> 01:12:08,679
Speaker 1: want to expect more from Lane Kiffin. The part where

1334
01:12:08,680 --> 01:12:14,160
Speaker 1: I really disagree is on opportunity. I really disagree with opportunity.

1335
01:12:13,720 --> 01:12:18,240
Speaker 2: Eight as in conversation for Conference Crown, I'm gonna go

1336
01:12:18,280 --> 01:12:22,360
Speaker 2: down to a six six with ten and two last year, Okay.

1337
01:12:22,720 --> 01:12:24,679
Speaker 1: They did go ten and two, and that I think

1338
01:12:24,760 --> 01:12:31,160
Speaker 1: works too. Dependability. I just think it's really hard to

1339
01:12:31,160 --> 01:12:34,599
Speaker 1: to realize that ceiling that you're saying within eight, when

1340
01:12:34,600 --> 01:12:38,479
Speaker 1: you've got SEC competition and when we've got the almost

1341
01:12:38,560 --> 01:12:43,679
Speaker 1: track record of not living up to that hype. Yeah,

1342
01:12:43,800 --> 01:12:46,040
Speaker 1: and that that's why I dock him there, because I

1343
01:12:46,120 --> 01:12:49,040
Speaker 1: just think I think it has gotten harder. It has

1344
01:12:49,040 --> 01:12:51,719
Speaker 1: gotten harder. It's gotten a little bit easier because Kiffin's

1345
01:12:51,720 --> 01:12:54,679
Speaker 1: walking away, But everything else around the SEC is wide

1346
01:12:54,720 --> 01:12:57,559
Speaker 1: open and harder, and just adding a guy like a

1347
01:12:57,600 --> 01:13:00,600
Speaker 1: Walter Nolan or whoever through the portal does not necessarily

1348
01:13:01,760 --> 01:13:03,799
Speaker 1: make me forget about what we've seen in the past.

1349
01:13:04,479 --> 01:13:06,840
Speaker 1: So I agree that the opportunity is there. I think

1350
01:13:06,880 --> 01:13:09,280
Speaker 1: we're all pretty high on Lane Kiffin. I we like

1351
01:13:09,360 --> 01:13:09,880
Speaker 1: Lane Kiffin.

1352
01:13:10,280 --> 01:13:12,639
Speaker 2: But by the way, if we're dealing if Lane Kiffin

1353
01:13:12,640 --> 01:13:15,360
Speaker 2: at ole Miss existed in a twelve team playoff universe,

1354
01:13:15,360 --> 01:13:17,400
Speaker 2: he's making the playoff two of the past three years.

1355
01:13:17,600 --> 01:13:20,639
Speaker 2: I know, I know, I know, so I know fits

1356
01:13:20,680 --> 01:13:23,080
Speaker 2: how I'm I looked at it and we're looking at

1357
01:13:23,080 --> 01:13:24,880
Speaker 2: it in different ways. But that's how that's my defense

1358
01:13:24,920 --> 01:13:27,519
Speaker 2: of an eight there, that he's in the playoff conversation

1359
01:13:27,560 --> 01:13:28,439
Speaker 2: two out of three years.

1360
01:13:28,600 --> 01:13:32,480
Speaker 1: I mean, like in the playoff, I don't know. I'm

1361
01:13:33,040 --> 01:13:37,759
Speaker 1: I'm mixed on how high this program can fly. Okay,

1362
01:13:38,400 --> 01:13:42,040
Speaker 1: I'm ant a twenty eight. I'll give him, though, give

1363
01:13:42,120 --> 01:13:46,280
Speaker 1: him a solid four for the for the X factor

1364
01:13:46,320 --> 01:13:49,479
Speaker 1: there with the extra version. I think he's been really

1365
01:13:49,479 --> 01:13:52,840
Speaker 1: good at doing that. Do you want me to keep going?

1366
01:13:53,160 --> 01:13:56,320
Speaker 1: We've got Gundy and Fickle both eight seven eight eight.

1367
01:13:56,479 --> 01:13:59,320
Speaker 1: I'm I don't know how you can give Gundy an

1368
01:13:59,320 --> 01:14:02,080
Speaker 1: eight with buildco q. I just I don't know how

1369
01:14:02,080 --> 01:14:04,080
Speaker 1: you could do that. That That to me is like

1370
01:14:05,000 --> 01:14:08,440
Speaker 1: now practice, he's a good coach. I might go nine dependability.

1371
01:14:08,479 --> 01:14:10,360
Speaker 1: You know what you're gonna get with him pretty much

1372
01:14:10,360 --> 01:14:10,920
Speaker 1: most years.

1373
01:14:10,920 --> 01:14:14,200
Speaker 2: But yeah, there's twenty twenty two thrown in there though.

1374
01:14:14,280 --> 01:14:16,920
Speaker 1: Yeah. I've been throwing around build quality with Mike Gundy

1375
01:14:16,960 --> 01:14:20,160
Speaker 1: as like a pejorative for the last three years. So

1376
01:14:20,560 --> 01:14:22,800
Speaker 1: we can have that discussion at some other point in time.

1377
01:14:23,200 --> 01:14:25,280
Speaker 1: And my hunch is, again because there are so many

1378
01:14:25,320 --> 01:14:26,920
Speaker 1: other coaches that I know people are going to have

1379
01:14:26,920 --> 01:14:29,720
Speaker 1: an opinion on, we're almost definitely gonna need to do

1380
01:14:29,760 --> 01:14:34,599
Speaker 1: a part two of this. Sure. Brian Kelly, though, Brian Kelly, let's.

1381
01:14:34,439 --> 01:14:36,240
Speaker 2: Great him out to finish this out, to finish the

1382
01:14:36,280 --> 01:14:37,479
Speaker 2: show out and see where he fits.

1383
01:14:37,880 --> 01:14:40,639
Speaker 1: Where does Brian Kelly fit here? Let's talk it through

1384
01:14:41,360 --> 01:14:42,200
Speaker 1: as a collective.

1385
01:14:43,680 --> 01:14:47,679
Speaker 2: I would have Brian Kelly as a nine dependability eight

1386
01:14:47,760 --> 01:14:52,160
Speaker 2: or nine. It's gotta be adaptability, play calling, overall program

1387
01:14:52,280 --> 01:14:58,920
Speaker 2: philosophy decisions. I'd have him as an eight there, Okay,

1388
01:14:59,520 --> 01:15:03,320
Speaker 2: I'm not wowed year to year with what Notre Dame

1389
01:15:03,360 --> 01:15:05,280
Speaker 2: and LSU have always looked liked in games, and the

1390
01:15:05,560 --> 01:15:11,439
Speaker 2: big step back on defense has has definitely shown throughout

1391
01:15:11,479 --> 01:15:12,080
Speaker 2: his career.

1392
01:15:13,120 --> 01:15:18,840
Speaker 1: The ability to be adaptable. Yeah, the ability to be adaptable.

1393
01:15:19,400 --> 01:15:24,040
Speaker 1: There is some I think question as to whether or

1394
01:15:24,120 --> 01:15:27,040
Speaker 1: not he is proactively adaptable or if it's just when

1395
01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:28,840
Speaker 1: guys leave. Now, he did fire Matt House.

1396
01:15:29,720 --> 01:15:32,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, has whipped on DC a couple at least a

1397
01:15:32,920 --> 01:15:33,960
Speaker 2: couple of times.

1398
01:15:34,520 --> 01:15:37,120
Speaker 1: But I think by a large is pretty adaptable and

1399
01:15:38,240 --> 01:15:41,160
Speaker 1: has a good, strong philosophy for his programs. So I

1400
01:15:41,160 --> 01:15:42,360
Speaker 1: think eight's about right to me.

1401
01:15:42,920 --> 01:15:48,639
Speaker 2: But also you're talking about Brian Kelly, who has done

1402
01:15:49,040 --> 01:15:52,400
Speaker 2: like Tommy Reese is a good offensive coordinator. I don't

1403
01:15:52,400 --> 01:15:55,959
Speaker 2: know if he's great, he's good. You have Tommy Reese,

1404
01:15:56,160 --> 01:15:59,639
Speaker 2: you have the string of defensive coordinators at Notre Dame,

1405
01:16:00,080 --> 01:16:04,920
Speaker 2: and what Marcus Freeman, Clark Lee and mikeke elcho like

1406
01:16:05,760 --> 01:16:09,439
Speaker 2: really nice eye for both position coaches by and large,

1407
01:16:10,280 --> 01:16:13,639
Speaker 2: but especially defensive coordinator, which as an offensive guy. Nailing

1408
01:16:13,680 --> 01:16:17,599
Speaker 2: defensive coordinator is pretty significant and not batting a thousand,

1409
01:16:17,880 --> 01:16:23,280
Speaker 2: but has hit some solid wood build quality. I have

1410
01:16:23,320 --> 01:16:26,960
Speaker 2: it as an eight. I have nine, eight eight nine.

1411
01:16:27,479 --> 01:16:33,040
Speaker 2: For Brian Kelly. Notre Dame is competing for a playoff

1412
01:16:33,080 --> 01:16:35,679
Speaker 2: pretty often with him as head coach, and he will

1413
01:16:35,680 --> 01:16:38,120
Speaker 2: absolutely be competing pretty often at LSU for a twelve

1414
01:16:38,160 --> 01:16:38,719
Speaker 2: team playoff.

1415
01:16:41,120 --> 01:16:44,800
Speaker 1: I'm eight eight eight nine. I'll go one point shy.

1416
01:16:45,200 --> 01:16:49,400
Speaker 2: So step I said nine eight eight nine, that's eighteen

1417
01:16:49,439 --> 01:16:51,599
Speaker 2: and sixteen. That's thirty four, So that puts him at

1418
01:16:51,600 --> 01:16:53,799
Speaker 2: like the two or three.

1419
01:16:54,000 --> 01:16:55,519
Speaker 1: You got him as a thirty four. I'll go I'll

1420
01:16:55,560 --> 01:17:00,439
Speaker 1: go thirty three, okay, and look I'm a five. I'm

1421
01:17:00,439 --> 01:17:03,840
Speaker 1: a five with the X the X factor, the extra

1422
01:17:03,920 --> 01:17:07,519
Speaker 1: version thing. I don't know if Brian Kelly is the

1423
01:17:07,560 --> 01:17:09,600
Speaker 1: proverbial guy you'd like to have a beer with, like

1424
01:17:09,720 --> 01:17:13,879
Speaker 1: Lane Kiffin, maybe like Dan Lanning or even James Franklin.

1425
01:17:13,920 --> 01:17:16,920
Speaker 1: To some extent, Dabbo probably goes into that conversation as well.

1426
01:17:17,560 --> 01:17:20,559
Speaker 1: I think the knock on Kelly from people who have

1427
01:17:20,600 --> 01:17:22,479
Speaker 1: played under him is that agent you don't really know

1428
01:17:22,520 --> 01:17:25,120
Speaker 1: who he is. He sort of plays a character when

1429
01:17:25,120 --> 01:17:29,160
Speaker 1: he's out there as the coach. But he's very good

1430
01:17:29,200 --> 01:17:33,040
Speaker 1: at playing politician. He's very good at doing that everywhere

1431
01:17:33,080 --> 01:17:34,719
Speaker 1: he's been even very very good.

1432
01:17:35,120 --> 01:17:37,760
Speaker 2: He's a decent quote. I think I knock I do

1433
01:17:37,880 --> 01:17:39,640
Speaker 2: a little bit of the knock against him with like

1434
01:17:39,680 --> 01:17:42,439
Speaker 2: the turning beat Red on the sidelines early on in

1435
01:17:42,520 --> 01:17:46,200
Speaker 2: Notre Dame beat Red. I might give him a four here.

1436
01:17:46,280 --> 01:17:50,080
Speaker 1: Throwing coaches, throwing players under the bus, not taking responsibility

1437
01:17:50,080 --> 01:17:52,240
Speaker 1: for things. He's got a track record for that as well.

1438
01:17:52,840 --> 01:17:55,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, but again you have a sense for his personality.

1439
01:17:55,040 --> 01:17:56,559
Speaker 2: Though he's not covering up.

1440
01:17:56,800 --> 01:17:59,200
Speaker 1: You know exactly who he is. So I'm a solid

1441
01:17:59,280 --> 01:18:02,160
Speaker 1: five here because I think he's a good politician. We agree,

1442
01:18:02,840 --> 01:18:06,600
Speaker 1: I disagree slightly on the overall metric, but here is

1443
01:18:06,640 --> 01:18:09,680
Speaker 1: the way that this has kind of shaken out. If

1444
01:18:09,720 --> 01:18:12,519
Speaker 1: we are talking through our top ten, this is our

1445
01:18:12,600 --> 01:18:16,800
Speaker 1: general consensus. Also generally generally speaking, and again there will

1446
01:18:16,800 --> 01:18:18,519
Speaker 1: be a part two. We need to talk about the

1447
01:18:18,640 --> 01:18:23,120
Speaker 1: likes of Dean Sanders and Lincoln Riley. There's a Brent

1448
01:18:23,200 --> 01:18:26,679
Speaker 1: Venables conversation that needs to be had, and jeff.

1449
01:18:26,479 --> 01:18:28,880
Speaker 2: I Havenables on my list, yep, a crystal ball.

1450
01:18:29,439 --> 01:18:32,240
Speaker 1: I want to talk about Kirk Farrence and Matt Ruhle

1451
01:18:32,320 --> 01:18:33,120
Speaker 1: and Mike Elko.

1452
01:18:33,240 --> 01:18:35,800
Speaker 2: And here's, by the way, this is who I graded out.

1453
01:18:35,800 --> 01:18:38,360
Speaker 2: I'm not going to give you their grades. Yeah, after

1454
01:18:38,439 --> 01:18:42,759
Speaker 2: that tie, that five way tie, I have Marcus Freeman, Mario,

1455
01:18:42,840 --> 01:18:47,000
Speaker 2: Chris Ball again, no order, Marcus Freeman, Mario, Christobal, Kirk Farrence,

1456
01:18:47,080 --> 01:18:51,600
Speaker 2: Jonathan Smith, Lincoln Riley, Gus Malson, Mark Stoops, Jeff Tedford,

1457
01:18:51,640 --> 01:18:53,080
Speaker 2: Pat Nardoozy.

1458
01:18:54,880 --> 01:18:55,760
Speaker 1: Troy Calhoun.

1459
01:18:57,760 --> 01:18:59,599
Speaker 2: I'm trying to like scramble these, so I don't give

1460
01:18:59,600 --> 01:19:02,840
Speaker 2: anything way. Yeah, yeah, this is no particular order. He said,

1461
01:19:02,840 --> 01:19:05,720
Speaker 2: no particular order those guys. So I've with Brian Kelly

1462
01:19:05,800 --> 01:19:06,960
Speaker 2: upgraded out thirty guys.

1463
01:19:07,040 --> 01:19:09,479
Speaker 1: I almost had a caronary when you said Freeman next.

1464
01:19:09,520 --> 01:19:12,960
Speaker 2: There's no way, but Marcus Freeman's on my list of

1465
01:19:12,960 --> 01:19:13,839
Speaker 2: graded out coaches.

1466
01:19:13,880 --> 01:19:16,240
Speaker 1: But yeah, he he deserves a grade. He does not

1467
01:19:16,320 --> 01:19:19,240
Speaker 1: deserve to be in the upper echelon, not yet. Could

1468
01:19:19,280 --> 01:19:22,439
Speaker 1: get there, a lot of potential, obviously, But okay, here

1469
01:19:22,520 --> 01:19:24,439
Speaker 1: is the way that we have ranked these out. Then

1470
01:19:24,479 --> 01:19:27,680
Speaker 1: we've got Kirby smart one. I think I think that's obvious.

1471
01:19:28,120 --> 01:19:30,479
Speaker 1: The next highest score. He's got thirty eight points. The

1472
01:19:30,479 --> 01:19:34,320
Speaker 1: next highest scores are Kyle Whittingham with the thirty four,

1473
01:19:35,120 --> 01:19:38,599
Speaker 1: Kaylin de Boor with the thirty four, and we've got

1474
01:19:38,600 --> 01:19:42,760
Speaker 1: Brian Kelly also with a thirty four. There are some

1475
01:19:42,920 --> 01:19:48,759
Speaker 1: slight disagreements here, but generally that's where we're at. Next

1476
01:19:48,840 --> 01:19:52,360
Speaker 1: rung down after that thirty four, there is a gap

1477
01:19:52,400 --> 01:19:55,280
Speaker 1: between Kirby Smart and the next closest. We've got Ryan

1478
01:19:55,360 --> 01:19:59,639
Speaker 1: Day with the thirty three, Mike Norvell with the thirty three.

1479
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:02,040
Speaker 1: I've got Brian Kelly with thirty three, but obviously he's

1480
01:20:02,040 --> 01:20:05,080
Speaker 1: still in that conversation. And then the next wrong down

1481
01:20:05,120 --> 01:20:08,120
Speaker 1: we've got Dabbo with thirty two to thirty one points.

1482
01:20:08,160 --> 01:20:13,840
Speaker 1: We've got Chris Climbing thirty two points, Dan Lanning with

1483
01:20:13,880 --> 01:20:16,320
Speaker 1: thirty two points. I should add Lance Sliphold also had

1484
01:20:16,320 --> 01:20:21,040
Speaker 1: a thirty three. Yeah, pretty high. Lance Lightphold, and then

1485
01:20:21,080 --> 01:20:24,960
Speaker 1: beyond that, we've got the likes of guys like Steve Sarkisian.

1486
01:20:25,600 --> 01:20:27,640
Speaker 1: We've got the likes of guys like Len Kiffin with

1487
01:20:27,680 --> 01:20:31,680
Speaker 1: a thirty one. We've also got James Franklin, who's in there.

1488
01:20:31,720 --> 01:20:33,320
Speaker 1: You had him at a thirty one, I had him

1489
01:20:33,320 --> 01:20:35,519
Speaker 1: at a twenty nine. You had Luke Fickel and Mike

1490
01:20:35,560 --> 01:20:38,320
Speaker 1: Gundy and such. So listen, here is what I promised

1491
01:20:38,320 --> 01:20:41,720
Speaker 1: to do for the verballer hood. Okay, on our website,

1492
01:20:42,600 --> 01:20:46,960
Speaker 1: I will put these numbers together into a table so

1493
01:20:47,000 --> 01:20:49,760
Speaker 1: that you can read them more easily and you could

1494
01:20:49,800 --> 01:20:53,479
Speaker 1: tell us what you think and where we went wrong.

1495
01:20:53,520 --> 01:20:57,080
Speaker 1: That will be on our website at solid verbal dot com,

1496
01:20:57,080 --> 01:20:59,640
Speaker 1: where you can find all of our old episodes and

1497
01:20:59,680 --> 01:21:01,920
Speaker 1: clip if you want to read more about Dan and I. Okay,

1498
01:21:01,920 --> 01:21:04,400
Speaker 1: if you're into that thing, I will make a table

1499
01:21:04,439 --> 01:21:06,840
Speaker 1: out there where you can read all of these and

1500
01:21:06,960 --> 01:21:10,400
Speaker 1: think about them and put your thoughts into an email

1501
01:21:10,960 --> 01:21:15,320
Speaker 1: or preferably into a social media response. Out on Twitter,

1502
01:21:15,560 --> 01:21:18,559
Speaker 1: out on Instagram, out on threads, wherever you are. We

1503
01:21:18,600 --> 01:21:21,080
Speaker 1: will post this yeah, and you can let us know

1504
01:21:21,120 --> 01:21:23,080
Speaker 1: what you think. There will be a part two coming

1505
01:21:23,120 --> 01:21:26,960
Speaker 1: next week. Do we agree on all that? Agree? Done?

1506
01:21:27,200 --> 01:21:36,800
Speaker 1: The x DABO Dan x DABO dependability, adaptability, build quality, opportunity,

1507
01:21:36,840 --> 01:21:38,720
Speaker 1: and then the X factor is just how they are

1508
01:21:38,760 --> 01:21:41,320
Speaker 1: behind them, like dealing with the media, that sort of thing.

1509
01:21:41,600 --> 01:21:44,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, extraversion grade extra version.

1510
01:21:45,280 --> 01:21:48,680
Speaker 1: We covered all of ESPN's top ten in our own

1511
01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:51,600
Speaker 1: specific way write in sliver, but at gmail dot com.

1512
01:21:51,680 --> 01:21:55,200
Speaker 1: Let us know your thoughts. Yeah, on the x DABO metric.

1513
01:21:55,600 --> 01:21:57,920
Speaker 2: Who we should grade out? How you grade that person out?

1514
01:21:57,920 --> 01:22:02,920
Speaker 2: By the way, alphabetically, it's own Farrence Freeman, Fritz Gus, Hypel,

1515
01:22:03,000 --> 01:22:10,520
Speaker 2: mac Mario, Narducci, Narduzzi, Narducci, Ci Naduzzi, Rule, Riley Smith, Stoops, Tedford, Venables.

1516
01:22:10,840 --> 01:22:14,519
Speaker 2: That's all just alphabetical, not grade wise. Okay, we've just

1517
01:22:14,600 --> 01:22:15,439
Speaker 2: got a first name in there.

1518
01:22:15,439 --> 01:22:18,080
Speaker 1: That was nice. We've got many more coaches to cover

1519
01:22:18,240 --> 01:22:21,160
Speaker 1: here as part of this new thing we were rolling out.

1520
01:22:21,240 --> 01:22:25,839
Speaker 1: Let us know your thoughts again. Appreciate the social media engagement.

1521
01:22:25,880 --> 01:22:29,519
Speaker 1: It helps more people find us. Just that's true. Link link, nudge, nudge,

1522
01:22:29,600 --> 01:22:33,040
Speaker 1: hit follow, hit subscribe wherever it is you are listening

1523
01:22:33,160 --> 01:22:36,880
Speaker 1: or watching to this podcast episode right now. Rebowlers dot

1524
01:22:36,880 --> 01:22:39,960
Speaker 1: com get this a little bit early without the ads

1525
01:22:39,960 --> 01:22:43,880
Speaker 1: for the support. What Dan and I do agree, this

1526
01:22:43,920 --> 01:22:46,240
Speaker 1: is fun. Man. I enjoyed it. I really enjoyed it.

1527
01:22:46,920 --> 01:22:49,800
Speaker 2: I'm surprised you enjoyed it being wrong as often as

1528
01:22:49,840 --> 01:22:52,639
Speaker 2: you were, Like, I felt like that would have dented

1529
01:22:52,800 --> 01:22:54,719
Speaker 2: your excitement, but I'm glad to say it didn't.

1530
01:22:54,920 --> 01:22:57,600
Speaker 1: For that guy over there, my good friend Dan Rubinstein

1531
01:22:57,640 --> 01:23:00,519
Speaker 1: for myself, Tie Hildebrant. We will be back with more

1532
01:23:00,720 --> 01:23:04,040
Speaker 1: x Dabo x Dabo next week. We meet Times Pay

1533
01:23:04,080 --> 01:23:11,360
Speaker 1: Solid Peace m HM