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Speaker 1: Mr Vice President. I look out over my Biden sign

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Speaker 1: in my front yard and I see a sea of

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Speaker 1: Trump flags and yard signs. Is that a question for

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Speaker 1: Joe Biden during the town hall? Why does nobody have

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Speaker 1: any enthusiasm for you? It was a lead up to

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Speaker 1: a different question. I was gonna lay out just the

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Speaker 1: things we've been talking about today for lawn Hea Chen.

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Speaker 1: We've talked about Biden's softball UH press conferences in town

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Speaker 1: halls versus Trump getting grilled? Does that matter? The Trump's

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Speaker 1: the flat delivery of a really good message yesterday, and

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Speaker 1: then I thought a grievance leaden rally last night with

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Speaker 1: not a lot with not enough reason to vote for him,

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Speaker 1: and there's a lot of stuff out there. Well, let's

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Speaker 1: join lan Hea Chen for the discussion. Long here's the

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Speaker 1: David and Diane Stephy, fellow in American Public Policy Studies

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Speaker 1: at the Hoover Institution, and joins is, now, how are you, sir?

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Speaker 1: I'm fine, great to be with you. Thank you. So.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if you've had a chance to observe

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Speaker 1: the president lately, but he seems a little tired. Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, here, here's what I think the president has

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Speaker 1: a a certain comfort zone he likes to operate in,

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Speaker 1: and he likes the environment where he can just kind

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Speaker 1: of get out there, let a rip talk about whatever

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Speaker 1: he wants to talk about. And the question is how

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Speaker 1: that modus operandi works with the closing weeks of a campaign.

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Speaker 1: And I think one of the things that made him

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Speaker 1: effective in sixteen at the end was his ability to

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Speaker 1: focus on message and to just get out there and

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Speaker 1: relentlessly deliver it. And generally speaking, candidates are successful when

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Speaker 1: they can do that. Right now, the president is not

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Speaker 1: there yet, and I think until he can get there,

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Speaker 1: and I think he probably will get there, the question

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Speaker 1: is when, I do think some of these rallies and

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Speaker 1: some of these events end up doing more harm than good,

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Speaker 1: and that's something that they're going to have to con runt.

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Speaker 1: I only took in fifteen minutes of last night, so

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Speaker 1: you know, it's anecdotal evidence. But instead of you know,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna build the wall and nobody thought he was

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Speaker 1: actually gonna build the wall in Mexico isn't gonna pay

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Speaker 1: for it. But here's somebody that finally gives a crap

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Speaker 1: about a legal immigration. Yeah, you know, I'm gonna bring

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Speaker 1: your jobs back, that sort of stuff, reasons to vote

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Speaker 1: for him. God, he was going on it was a

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Speaker 1: perfect phone call. You're talking about the Ukraine phone call?

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Speaker 1: Oh my god. Yeah. Wow. Meanwhile, they're hurling soft softballs

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Speaker 1: at Joe Biden. Do you catch any of the town

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Speaker 1: hall last night? Uh? Yeah, I mean it was a

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Speaker 1: big wet kiss, right. And I think it shouldn't be

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Speaker 1: surprising because we have seen that over and over again.

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Speaker 1: The media does treat the two people differently. It treats

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Speaker 1: Trump and Biden differently. Uh. And you know, you guys

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Speaker 1: asked the questions, do I think it's going to make

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Speaker 1: a difference, And the answer is I don't. I don't

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Speaker 1: think it's going to make a difference because I think

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Speaker 1: people have already weighed these issues in their vibes. They

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Speaker 1: get the media likes Joe Biden one of the lifestyle Trump.

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Speaker 1: They end stand that. You know, as a result, the

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Speaker 1: two candidates are going to be treated differently. I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure it affects how people view them, though. I think

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Speaker 1: if you I said this a lot before, which is

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Speaker 1: at this point in Donald Trump's presidency, You've figured out

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Speaker 1: how you feel about Donald Trump. Probably I still have.

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Speaker 1: I mean, if you still have questions about, hey, what

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Speaker 1: do I think of Donald Trump, you must have been

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Speaker 1: living on another planet for the last couple of years.

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Speaker 1: So all this stuff that's out there, you know, the

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Speaker 1: Woodward Book and the media's treatment of them and all

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Speaker 1: of the noise, you know, most Americans I think have

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Speaker 1: tuned it out, and I think they figured out, you know, look,

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Speaker 1: this is what I think of Donald Trump. And by

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Speaker 1: the way, just because you don't like him doesn't mean

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Speaker 1: you're not going to vote for him. And I think

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Speaker 1: that's an important factor to consider as well. Well, we're

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Speaker 1: talking earlier. We think the best, you know, for people

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Speaker 1: who like some Trump stuff, but when he bothers them

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Speaker 1: so much, they just can't vote for him. The reluctant

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Speaker 1: Trumpers as a buddy of mine. Text of that, getting

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Speaker 1: the sixteen nineteen project out of the schools and ending

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Speaker 1: critical race theory training and the government agencies that could

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Speaker 1: be huge. Well, it is because people sort of say, listen, uh,

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Speaker 1: I'm you know, I think a lot of Americans would

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Speaker 1: say that. They would say, look, I'm all for a

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Speaker 1: society that's got people that look different from me and

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Speaker 1: sound different from me. That's fine, But I don't want

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Speaker 1: to be told that the history of my country is

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Speaker 1: so foul and so odious that I can't learn about it.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to be told that everything America has

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Speaker 1: done is wrong. I don't want to be told that,

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Speaker 1: you know, everything that I've done as a non you know,

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Speaker 1: non minority, non person of color, non whatever, uh is wrong.

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Speaker 1: And I think people just say, look, I don't want

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Speaker 1: That's not the environment I want to be in. And

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Speaker 1: so there are common sense things that the president does,

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Speaker 1: and there's common sense things that people do when they say, look,

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Speaker 1: you know, you're right. Not all of that is wrong.

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Speaker 1: And we and there are things about our history and

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Speaker 1: our culture that we should learn. And we should understand

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Speaker 1: times when things went badly, but we should also understand

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Speaker 1: that there are a heck of a lot of times

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Speaker 1: in our history when things went well. And and that's

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Speaker 1: something that everybody and every child should learn country. I think, well, right,

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Speaker 1: the idea of having wonderful ideals and sometimes falling short

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Speaker 1: of them is not an ugly story. I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: it's it's a it's worth telling. But again it's and

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Speaker 1: and the lefty media is trying to like give you

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Speaker 1: an inverse description of what's happening here, that he's trying

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Speaker 1: to eliminate any teaching of America's sins. The problem is

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Speaker 1: and just as a personal note, lony, judging by our listeners,

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Speaker 1: um and we hear from them by the hundreds and

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Speaker 1: hundreds every day. This, the far left indoctrination from kindergarten

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Speaker 1: through grad school is a huge issue among real people,

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Speaker 1: and I credit the Trump administration for having their ear

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Speaker 1: to the ground enough to realize it. I think the

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Speaker 1: New York Times and and NPR they're so snyde anytime

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Speaker 1: they make reference it's a conspiracy theory. But I'm telling

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Speaker 1: you it's big in the hinterlands. Well, here's the problem.

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Speaker 1: The people that are reporters for these outlets, the people

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Speaker 1: who are opinion itiers for the most part, for these outlets,

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Speaker 1: they are far to the left of even many Democrats

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Speaker 1: in this country. They make up a disproportionate percentage of

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Speaker 1: you know, these sort of relatively far to the left

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Speaker 1: progressive folks, and they are in very influential positions. And

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Speaker 1: so I think when most Americans look at that, they say,

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Speaker 1: you know what, that doesn't really sound like what you

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Speaker 1: know what I think is right. Just at a gut level,

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Speaker 1: people don't think that what they're reading and what they're

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Speaker 1: seeing sounds right. So this disconnect between mainstream media and

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Speaker 1: you know, many Americans that that's going to be a

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Speaker 1: huge problem going forward. This is not a not a

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Speaker 1: campaign problem, it's not a political problem. It goes to

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Speaker 1: the breakdown of our institutions, and the media is one

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Speaker 1: of them. I think, outside of a major event occurring,

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Speaker 1: you know, uh, something international or whatever, I don't see

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Speaker 1: what's going to change the trajectory of the election except

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Speaker 1: for that first debate, particularly if Joe Biden is on

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Speaker 1: the debate stage with the world watching and says something

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Speaker 1: like he said last night that all two thousand people

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Speaker 1: would still be alive if Trump had done his job,

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Speaker 1: and Washington Post even says Biden is making this up?

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Speaker 1: How would that affect things? I mean, that's an extraordinary

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Speaker 1: thing to say. How about the fact that Anderson Cooper

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Speaker 1: didn't even follow up on that. Yeah, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: think this first debate is going to be interesting to

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Speaker 1: watch because you're going to see the ultimate prevent defense,

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Speaker 1: uh in in Joe Biden's strategy. I mean, really, his

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Speaker 1: job is to get up there and to not screw

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Speaker 1: things up. I mean, there are many bland things he

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Speaker 1: can say, and I think it'll be totally fine. But

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Speaker 1: you're right. I think where where the Biden campaign is

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Speaker 1: concerned in all likelihood is they're concerned he's going to

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Speaker 1: get up there and he's going to say something or

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Speaker 1: say a few things that will really demonstrate kind of

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Speaker 1: either that he's lost a few steps or that that

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Speaker 1: you know, he just has positions that are fundamentally out

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Speaker 1: of step with most Americans. And I think that's the

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Speaker 1: worry for the Biden campaign. You know that the Trump team,

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Speaker 1: they they kind of feel like, look, people are used

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Speaker 1: to the freewheeling style of the president. He's not gonna

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Speaker 1: say things carefully. He's going to get up there and

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Speaker 1: say what he's gonna say, and so I think they

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Speaker 1: feel it's relatively lower risk, which is why you hear

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Speaker 1: the President saying let's let's debate more. But but the

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Speaker 1: Biden team, I think they are they're playing pre event

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Speaker 1: and they really do not want people to to hear

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Speaker 1: or see some of the things that Joe Biden could

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Speaker 1: say or that could pop out his mouth. Well, the

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Speaker 1: question was asked to Joe Biden on the New Green

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Speaker 1: Deal or the Green New Deal. Sorry, do you think

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Speaker 1: it's too much? Anderson Cooper said no, I don't, said

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Speaker 1: Vice President by no follow up, it's gonna cost sixty

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Speaker 1: trillion dollars. We're gonna stop driving cars with gas within

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Speaker 1: ten years year for that. Yeah, and it's going to

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Speaker 1: require every single building to be retrofitted and change. I

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Speaker 1: mean even ones that are historic and go back many,

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Speaker 1: you know, many centuries. I mean, it's it's the Green

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Speaker 1: New Deal is crazy. And this is a point that

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Speaker 1: I've started to make because I've been looking at Joe

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Speaker 1: Biden's policy plans recently. He would be the most liberal

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Speaker 1: president in modern history if he won. His ideas are

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Speaker 1: far more progressive than any can date since McGovern. His budget,

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Speaker 1: by the way, is double what Hillary Clinton proposed in

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Speaker 1: twenty sixteen. Just just think about that for a minute.

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Speaker 1: Five trillion dollars in you spending double what Hillary Clinton proposed.

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Speaker 1: His tax increases are going to hit every American household.

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Speaker 1: This is not some moderate guy. I mean, if he

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Speaker 1: if he's elected president, he's going to be an extreme liberal.

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Speaker 1: And I think, look, that's just something people need to

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Speaker 1: come to terms with They might be okay with that.

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Speaker 1: They might say, look, I'm willing to have that over

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Speaker 1: the chaos of Trump. I'll vote for Biden, doesn't matter.

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Speaker 1: But people need to go into this selection eyes wide open,

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Speaker 1: understanding what the alternatives are. I think that's a very

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Speaker 1: important thing. My final question for Lonie Chen of the

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Speaker 1: Hoover Institution, um, given the near certainty that there will

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Speaker 1: be chaos and confusion during voting month, as mail and

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Speaker 1: ballots are counted and rejected and the rest of it,

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Speaker 1: how do you like the idea of some sort of

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Speaker 1: bipartisan commission getting to work like today by noon on

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Speaker 1: standards and messaging and and and bipartisan statements of solidarity,

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Speaker 1: that sort of thing. Let's being pre about dealing with

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Speaker 1: the chaos. I would love that. I think that'd be

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Speaker 1: a great idea to get respected, you know, respected Republican,

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Speaker 1: respected Democrats, get people together and and and help us

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Speaker 1: make our way through this vest We cannot have this

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Speaker 1: be a partisan process. Regardless of how you feel who

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Speaker 1: you're going to vote for, we all agree we want

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Speaker 1: this election to be fairly decided, and we want to

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Speaker 1: have confidence in the outcome of the election and the

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Speaker 1: direction we're headed, and I really worry about because that's

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Speaker 1: not the direction we're headed in. And bringing this back

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Speaker 1: to de politicize it as much as possible, I think

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Speaker 1: that'd be great. So I I'd be all for it.

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Speaker 1: I don't think it's gonna happen. Boy. Dan Coates OpEd

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Speaker 1: in the New York Times yesterday. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: you read it, but he said, Joe Biden or Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump are not a death blow to the country, but

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Speaker 1: losing faith in our elections could be. Yeah. That's good stuff. Yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: let's keep an eye on this one going forward. Lanh

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Speaker 1: Chen David Diane Stiffy, Fellow in American Public Policy Studies

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Speaker 1: at the Ober Institution. Lan, he thanks so much for

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Speaker 1: the time. Good to talk to you. Oh boy, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I worry way more about that. At the post election

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Speaker 1: day chaos, hatred, angst conspiracy theories, Russian propaganda, trolls and

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Speaker 1: bots and and the rest of it, not to mention

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Speaker 1: Nancy Pelosi and Donald j saying irresponsible things. I'm more

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Speaker 1: worried about that than about anything. Yeah. Okay, that's interesting.

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Speaker 1: Don't mean to freak you out. Everybody