1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:07,720 Speaker 1: My dear Latino USA listener. Hi, it's Mariao Hosa. Today 2 00:00:07,720 --> 00:00:10,240 Speaker 1: we're going to bring you something a little bit different. 3 00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:13,240 Speaker 1: A few weeks ago, I was part of the inaugural 4 00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:18,160 Speaker 1: Democracy Summit at Howard University. It was organized by the 5 00:00:18,200 --> 00:00:21,880 Speaker 1: Center for Journalism and Democracy, which was founded by our 6 00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:25,639 Speaker 1: colleague Nicole Hannah Jones, one of the leading journalists in 7 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:29,920 Speaker 1: the country covering racial injustice in the history of the 8 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:34,080 Speaker 1: United States. Now. It was a really interesting summit looking 9 00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: at the dangers to our democracy, and we wanted you 10 00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:42,120 Speaker 1: to feel a part of this conversation too. As part 11 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 1: of the summit, I sat down in conversation with journalist 12 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:51,559 Speaker 1: Jody Rave Spotted Bear and historian Kathy roberts Ford, and 13 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 1: we talked about the history of journalistic blind spots and 14 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 1: how the mainstream media often fails to see the dangers 15 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:04,200 Speaker 1: of white nationalism in our mainstream news media. All right, 16 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:08,240 Speaker 1: here's an edited version of the conversation, moderated by Professor 17 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:10,039 Speaker 1: doctor Jason Johnson. 18 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:11,759 Speaker 2: Enjoy. 19 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 3: You know, in this country, there's a long history of 20 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 3: blind spots when it comes to the way that mainstream 21 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:28,120 Speaker 3: journalism fails to see the dangers of white nationalism. The 22 00:01:28,120 --> 00:01:31,959 Speaker 3: way its coverage has often legitimized campaigns against marginalized people 23 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:35,400 Speaker 3: and the white regular people who push for these kinds 24 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:38,920 Speaker 3: of changes. Jody Rave Spotted Bear, Kathy roberts Ford, and 25 00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:42,520 Speaker 3: Marie Henehjosa are going to discuss the US media's past 26 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 3: complicity and the echoes we see today of the media's 27 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:50,880 Speaker 3: complicity and pushing white nationalist themes, whether we're talking about demographic, 28 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 3: economic anxiety, anti CRT, immigrant and trans issues, and other 29 00:01:56,600 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 3: anti democratic forces that are given space and platform by 30 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:02,640 Speaker 3: quote unquote mainstream journalism. 31 00:02:02,920 --> 00:02:05,920 Speaker 4: So we'll start with everyone. Do you want an introduction? 32 00:02:06,080 --> 00:02:08,920 Speaker 5: Yes, Hello, My name is Jody Raves Spotted Beart, and 33 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:15,240 Speaker 5: I reported for the mainstream press for Lee Enterprises for 34 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 5: a good part of more than a decade, covering specifically 35 00:02:19,720 --> 00:02:24,200 Speaker 5: American Indian issues across the United States, and since then 36 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 5: I have moved back to the Fort Berthold Reservation in 37 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:33,080 Speaker 5: North Dakota, where I've lived for about the last ten years, 38 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:38,239 Speaker 5: and just in hindsight of what was what I saw 39 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 5: not happening in the press, I founded the Indigenous Media 40 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:47,680 Speaker 5: Freedom Alliance and we also publish online at Buffalo's Fire. 41 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:51,880 Speaker 6: Hi everyone, I'm so grateful to be here with you 42 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 6: and learning from you and with you today. My name 43 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:59,320 Speaker 6: is Kathy roberts Ford. I'm an historian of the press 44 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 6: and professor in the Journalism Department at the University of 45 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 6: Massachusetts Samherst. I am here today as a representative for 46 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 6: a really diverse and extraordinary group of scholars who worked 47 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:15,600 Speaker 6: with me to put together this new book called Journalism 48 00:03:15,680 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 6: and Jim Crow, White Supremacy and the Black Struggle for 49 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:22,480 Speaker 6: New America. And so my presence on this panel today 50 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:25,720 Speaker 6: is to be a voice for this group of dedicated 51 00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 6: historians who have excavated some troubling past of the role 52 00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:33,200 Speaker 6: of journalism and building white supremacy in this country. 53 00:03:34,560 --> 00:03:36,720 Speaker 1: My name is Maria, you know Josa, and it is 54 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:41,760 Speaker 1: great to be here with Nicole and everybody else. Oh 55 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 1: my god, this is such a beautiful day. So well, 56 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 1: it's a little cloudy but in freezing but it's a 57 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:49,520 Speaker 1: really beautiful day to be here. 58 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 2: And I have my own nonprofit media company. 59 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 1: I'm the only Latina that runs a national newsroom in 60 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:58,320 Speaker 1: the United States of America that also has an investigative unit. 61 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:02,400 Speaker 1: We're based in Harlam, USA, on one hundred and twenty 62 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:05,560 Speaker 1: fifth Street right outside of the A train, So please 63 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 1: look at us, look for us. 64 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 2: We're Futuro Media. 65 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:11,600 Speaker 1: We do Latino USA in the Thick, which is a 66 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:14,760 Speaker 1: politics podcast that Jason has been on more than once 67 00:04:15,200 --> 00:04:17,840 Speaker 1: and that's basically Meet the Press with f bombs only 68 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:21,160 Speaker 1: for journalists of color. It's a lot of fun and 69 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 1: we do a lot of things. So you should check 70 00:04:23,760 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 1: out Futuro Media. But oh, we want a pulitzer in May. 71 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:32,200 Speaker 2: Low key. Low key. 72 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:35,600 Speaker 3: So what we're going to do is someone sort of 73 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:38,320 Speaker 3: last panel. Each of our panelists is going to talk 74 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,839 Speaker 3: for about five minutes about how the US media throughout 75 00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:45,480 Speaker 3: history sort of reinforced white supremacy with their particular focused 76 00:04:45,440 --> 00:04:48,039 Speaker 3: and expertise. After they've each spoken for about five minutes, 77 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:50,600 Speaker 3: I'll sit down, we'll have our questions, and then we'll 78 00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:51,720 Speaker 3: do our Q and A with the audience. 79 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:55,120 Speaker 5: Okay, Well, I do want to say that I really 80 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:57,880 Speaker 5: thankful for Nicola creating this event, and I hope that 81 00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 5: we see similar its workshops seminars across the nation because 82 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:06,120 Speaker 5: this work is very much needed. One of the things 83 00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:09,680 Speaker 5: that I wanted to start off is saying that for 84 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:14,480 Speaker 5: American Indian issues, it's not something that I think crosses 85 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:18,000 Speaker 5: a lot of people's minds. When I first was asked 86 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:19,840 Speaker 5: to be on the panel, one of the things that 87 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 5: just kept coming across my mind was a reference to 88 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:28,720 Speaker 5: Felix Cohen, who wrote the Handbook of Federal Indian Law, 89 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 5: which really is considered the Bible, that talks about the 90 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 5: all of the tribes across the country, their interaction with 91 00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:41,760 Speaker 5: the US government and with Congress. And after World War Two, 92 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 5: Felix Cohen had had looked at the Nazi Holocaust in 93 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:51,719 Speaker 5: the context of American society. And here's what he told 94 00:05:51,720 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 5: this then, and it's really relevant today. He said, like 95 00:05:55,240 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 5: the miners Canary, the Indian marks the shift from fresh air, 96 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 5: toys and gas in our political atmosphere, and our treatment 97 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:07,599 Speaker 5: of Indians reflects the rise and fall and our democratic faith. 98 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 5: So our last speaker on one of the panels earlier 99 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:14,520 Speaker 5: had mentioned that I believe her name is Kianga, had 100 00:06:14,520 --> 00:06:19,760 Speaker 5: spoke of the need for multicultural coalitions, and I would 101 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 5: say that is really true across the board for all races, 102 00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:30,160 Speaker 5: because the issues that we heard today, like voting rights, germandering, 103 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 5: racial fascism, assimilation, those problems just aren't unique to black 104 00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:43,400 Speaker 5: American society. This crosses the board for all races. So 105 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:46,599 Speaker 5: if you look at it in that context, you know 106 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 5: we're looking at white nationalism and media relations. So the 107 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:56,360 Speaker 5: issues that are happening today were just as relevant, probably 108 00:06:56,400 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 5: more so, are equal than and today. So in eighteen 109 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 5: twenty eight, we had the first Native American newspaper established 110 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:08,720 Speaker 5: in the country, and that was the Cherokee Phoenix. And 111 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 5: the reason that they had started that was there was 112 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 5: an assault on American, Indian and sovereignty of the Cherokee nation. 113 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:22,000 Speaker 5: So they used that newspaper to write about not only 114 00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:25,360 Speaker 5: what was happening in their community with their ceremonies and 115 00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:29,000 Speaker 5: cultural events, but they also use that newspaper to talk 116 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:33,920 Speaker 5: about the congressional assault upon their homelands. I think many 117 00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:37,920 Speaker 5: of you here familiar with the trail of tears. Back 118 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:41,720 Speaker 5: when that newspaper was started, the Supreme Court had issued 119 00:07:41,760 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 5: the assimilation mandates to force the Cherokee out of Georgia. 120 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:50,120 Speaker 5: So that was one reason why they had to start 121 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:55,560 Speaker 5: their own newspaper. And not too much later, another example 122 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 5: of why we need to tell our own stories in 123 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:03,360 Speaker 5: the press is because of the stories such as the 124 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 5: Bismarck Tribune in eighteen seventy six when Custer made the 125 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:12,360 Speaker 5: mistake of taking on the Sioux Nation the Lakota in 126 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 5: the Battle of the Little Big Horn. The headlines and 127 00:08:15,840 --> 00:08:19,840 Speaker 5: the Bismarck Tribune in eighteen seventy six reflected the bias 128 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 5: of the media at that point. They called it a 129 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 5: massacre of a victim, that being Custer. They talked about 130 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:29,920 Speaker 5: how there was no one left to tell the tale 131 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:33,800 Speaker 5: of what had happened in what they called that massacre. 132 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 5: On the front page of the Bismarck Tribune, it was 133 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:40,000 Speaker 5: headline after headline after headline, and then the final one 134 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:43,440 Speaker 5: said what is Congress going to do about it? And 135 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:47,600 Speaker 5: that takes us to where we're at today because we're 136 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:52,960 Speaker 5: having a similar assault by Congress against American Indian issues. 137 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:56,760 Speaker 5: I was really glad to hear mister Carr earlier bring 138 00:08:56,840 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 5: up the Indian Child Welfare Act. If it's not your radar, 139 00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:06,160 Speaker 5: it should be. There is Supreme Court hearings or arguments 140 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 5: we made last week. And what this is is an 141 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:14,640 Speaker 5: assault on Native children and removing Native children from their families, 142 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:19,079 Speaker 5: not giving Native families the right to keep those children 143 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:22,720 Speaker 5: in their communities, and the arguments being made by many 144 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 5: of the white families is that they shouldn't be last 145 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:29,439 Speaker 5: in line to keep these Native children and adopt them 146 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:32,120 Speaker 5: and keep them in their own families. But really this 147 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 5: is just a continuation of the assimilation practices we were 148 00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:39,679 Speaker 5: seeing way back when the Cherokee Phoenix was started in 149 00:09:39,760 --> 00:09:45,680 Speaker 5: eighteen twenty six. That assimilation practice is still ongoing, but 150 00:09:45,800 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 5: in this case, it's more about the taking of Native children. 151 00:09:49,280 --> 00:09:52,800 Speaker 5: This is an assault on Native treaty rights and on 152 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:56,520 Speaker 5: tribal sovereignty. So that's something that we really ought to 153 00:09:56,559 --> 00:10:00,560 Speaker 5: be paying more attention to. So there's all so the 154 00:10:00,720 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 5: issue of you know, we talked about critical race theory. 155 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:07,040 Speaker 5: Another thing, a really common theme brought up here today 156 00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 5: was redistricting and state legislatures and why we need to 157 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 5: pay attention to those particular issues. So in North Dakota, 158 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 5: in twenty seventeen, I think North Dakota legislature was one 159 00:10:19,520 --> 00:10:22,360 Speaker 5: of the first states to try to pass a law 160 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:27,440 Speaker 5: that made it lawful for motorists to run over protesters. 161 00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:30,520 Speaker 5: Since then, you have, you know, dozens of other states 162 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:34,360 Speaker 5: that are trying to or have enacted similar laws. In 163 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:38,199 Speaker 5: North Dakota. Last year, the legislature just did a ban 164 00:10:38,440 --> 00:10:42,679 Speaker 5: on critical race theory. The argument there was what the 165 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 5: people that were supporting critical race theory, They argued, well, 166 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:50,280 Speaker 5: we're not even teaching it in the first place. But 167 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:55,400 Speaker 5: the legislature's response is that this would be a proactive measure. 168 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,559 Speaker 5: So that passed in a legislature by a vote of 169 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:03,839 Speaker 5: seventy six to sixteen. We're also dealing with jerrymandering issues 170 00:11:04,120 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 5: in North Dakota's so we only have two Native Americans 171 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:12,000 Speaker 5: in the legislature, and that is only the result of 172 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 5: new subdistricts that were actually created. So my reservation, for 173 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:20,200 Speaker 5: the first time since eighteen seventy one, we actually have 174 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:24,280 Speaker 5: a subdistrict where we can elect somebody from our reservation 175 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:28,079 Speaker 5: to go represent us in the state legislature. And then 176 00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:31,360 Speaker 5: as far as jerrymandering, we only had one the first 177 00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:35,120 Speaker 5: Native woman who was a Democrat elected to the legislature, 178 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:40,400 Speaker 5: Ruth Buffalo. She had won her election two four years 179 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:44,000 Speaker 5: ago and she was up for reelection again, but our 180 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:48,960 Speaker 5: legislature actually jerry mandered her district and so she is 181 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 5: no longer in office. And if it weren't to those 182 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:56,600 Speaker 5: for those two subdistricts, we wouldn't have any representation in 183 00:11:56,640 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 5: the legislature. So that said, I just do want to 184 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 5: encourage the multi cultural alliances, and I look forward to 185 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:06,920 Speaker 5: having more discussion about that. 186 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:13,520 Speaker 6: Journalism is neither a neutral cultural product nor a neutral 187 00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 6: institution in American democratic life. That's one of the messages 188 00:12:18,880 --> 00:12:21,640 Speaker 6: of our book Journalism in Jim Crow, and that's a 189 00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:25,640 Speaker 6: really important takeaway from the history that I am my 190 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:30,719 Speaker 6: colleagues excavated and doing this work over the course of 191 00:12:30,760 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 6: a number of years. What we show is how democracy 192 00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:38,920 Speaker 6: died in the US South from eighteen seventy five to 193 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:42,120 Speaker 6: nineteen sixty five, which plenty of scholars have done. What 194 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:46,000 Speaker 6: they've failed to see adequately, we argue is that white 195 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 6: newspaper editors and publishers in the South were critical political 196 00:12:51,480 --> 00:12:56,640 Speaker 6: and economic actors in making that happen. This is a 197 00:12:56,720 --> 00:13:00,199 Speaker 6: kind of shocking and disturbing reality, I think for a 198 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:03,440 Speaker 6: lot of historians and students of journalism, and for journalists 199 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:07,600 Speaker 6: and for news institutions, primarily historically white news institutions, to 200 00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:12,200 Speaker 6: understand it is absolutely vital. It seems to me that 201 00:13:12,320 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 6: news institutions, because of the role that they play in 202 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:18,319 Speaker 6: American democracy and the constitutional protection they receive. 203 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:19,280 Speaker 2: To play that role. 204 00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:22,719 Speaker 6: They those who have been involved in these kinds of 205 00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:28,560 Speaker 6: anti democratic, anti black, violent, white supremacist building of political 206 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:31,600 Speaker 6: economies and social orders in this country come to terms 207 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:35,280 Speaker 6: with their role in that history. That they make atonement 208 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 6: that there are reparations that contemporary journalism institutions that are 209 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:44,120 Speaker 6: predominantly white that may not have a legacy of these 210 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:49,080 Speaker 6: particular involvements, That they too understand how history works, how 211 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:55,200 Speaker 6: path dependence works, that they understand the inheritance today that 212 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:58,240 Speaker 6: is part of the world we've inherited, and that we 213 00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:01,959 Speaker 6: also all understand that the Black press from its very 214 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:06,440 Speaker 6: beginnings in eighteen twenty seven, through the creation of Jim Crow, 215 00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:10,760 Speaker 6: the ending of Reconstruction, the creation of Jim Crow, and 216 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:15,760 Speaker 6: about ninety years of racial terror reign of white supremacist 217 00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 6: democrats in the South, that the black press fought this. 218 00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:22,600 Speaker 6: They documented what happened as it was happening. These black 219 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 6: journalists and leaders, black newspaper editors and publishers were all 220 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:30,800 Speaker 6: activists and leaders in the black community and creating a 221 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:34,240 Speaker 6: black discursive space. As de Weston Heywood, a contributor to 222 00:14:34,320 --> 00:14:38,600 Speaker 6: our book and professor at Hunter College, has documented beautifully 223 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:41,680 Speaker 6: for us on an absolutely gorgeous chapter about the Black 224 00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 6: press and what they were working toward. This is a 225 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 6: history that is poorly understood, and we're really hoping that 226 00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 6: lots of black journalists have been quite interested in it. 227 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 6: I really hope more journalists will be interested in this 228 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 6: as well. 229 00:14:57,240 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 1: So I guess I want to say one quick thing, 230 00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:03,840 Speaker 1: talk one because I really want to get into the dialogue. 231 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:07,760 Speaker 1: If you understand, like the situation that we have regarding 232 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:12,040 Speaker 1: immigrants and immigration, I think that it's really interesting to 233 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 1: think about why are we still stuck particularly on that issue. 234 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:17,680 Speaker 1: And by the way, we know increasingly many of the 235 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:21,200 Speaker 1: migrants and refugees are black, whether from Africa, Haiti, the 236 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 1: Black Caribbean. We don't see this because we can't get 237 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,760 Speaker 1: into the immigrant detention camps and show this, and I 238 00:15:26,760 --> 00:15:29,520 Speaker 1: think that that's it's not it is obviously on purpose. 239 00:15:29,880 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 1: But anyway, if you think about the overwhelmingly our mainstream 240 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:39,200 Speaker 1: media today and forever has been run by some of 241 00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 1: them are my best friends, right, white cis male presenting, 242 00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:50,880 Speaker 1: heterosexual men of extreme means and privilege. But they may 243 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:53,040 Speaker 1: be you know, like our friends and all, but that 244 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:56,360 Speaker 1: doesn't mean, we all see the perspective through their eyes, right. 245 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:57,520 Speaker 2: That's the whole thing, and that's. 246 00:15:57,840 --> 00:16:00,760 Speaker 1: Why there is this history which is well, jectivity looks 247 00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:03,040 Speaker 1: like Walter Cronkite, who, by the way, I worked for 248 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 1: and actually would have been really down with the conversation. 249 00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:06,160 Speaker 6: Now. 250 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:09,800 Speaker 2: But if you understand that they continue to run the 251 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:12,480 Speaker 2: mainstream media, then we understand how we are in the situation. 252 00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:15,160 Speaker 1: Let's just take on the issue of immigration, because they 253 00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 1: have been raised consuming media over the past fifty years 254 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 1: that has basically maintained that same narrative. So when they 255 00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:27,480 Speaker 1: start running news media organizations, they're like, well, yeah, right, 256 00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:31,080 Speaker 1: illegal immigrants. Right, No, there's no such thing as any 257 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:35,320 Speaker 1: illegal immigrant. There's no such thing as an illegal human being. 258 00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:41,440 Speaker 1: It's grammatically incorrect and also wrong. So that gives us 259 00:16:41,440 --> 00:16:43,880 Speaker 1: a perspective in terms of the longevity. And I so 260 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:46,520 Speaker 1: appreciate what Jody, Jody. I need that quote because I 261 00:16:46,600 --> 00:16:50,720 Speaker 1: talk about journalists of color today as being the ones 262 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: who are seeing the canaries on the mine falling, falling, falling, falling, 263 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 1: and we're screaming, and you know, we're being told, can 264 00:16:57,880 --> 00:17:02,000 Speaker 1: you just calm down? Always just calmed down. I raised 265 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:05,760 Speaker 1: the issue of the mainstream media, because, for example, Fox News, 266 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:08,359 Speaker 1: which would fall into what my colleague was just mentioning 267 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:12,440 Speaker 1: in terms of organizations that are purposely misleading and having 268 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:15,440 Speaker 1: a political and economic agenda, that would be Fox News 269 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:20,199 Speaker 1: today that basically carried and maintained repeating the lies of 270 00:17:20,240 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 1: a candidate that then become the president, that then said 271 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:26,159 Speaker 1: over and over again a lie right the way he 272 00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:29,399 Speaker 1: launched his career, I mean, his campaign. I don't know 273 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:31,399 Speaker 1: what's happened today. I don't really want to know or 274 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,800 Speaker 1: think about what that person is doing today. But the 275 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:38,320 Speaker 1: question for the journalists is why did you repeat that 276 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:42,760 Speaker 1: over and over and over again without a warning, now 277 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:45,520 Speaker 1: that without saying, by the way, what you're about to 278 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:49,199 Speaker 1: consume is factually incorrect. We know this because we are 279 00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 1: journalists and we do our work, and we know that 280 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:54,199 Speaker 1: there is less crime in immigrant communities than there is 281 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:58,520 Speaker 1: in American citizen communities. So the question really is, you know, 282 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:02,399 Speaker 1: to our colleagues, some of whom here is why. I 283 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,480 Speaker 1: remember when I presented a question to a very senior 284 00:18:06,560 --> 00:18:10,040 Speaker 1: journalist about the Trump White House in fact, and it 285 00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:13,880 Speaker 1: was like, you want me to be objective, but how 286 00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 1: can I be objective when I represent everything that that 287 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,480 Speaker 1: person hates and he says it, I'm gonna tell you 288 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: little jokes so you can laugh. Okay, I don't have 289 00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 1: to say this anymore because he's no longer president, but 290 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:26,679 Speaker 1: i'd say, you know this, man, I'm five things that 291 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:29,880 Speaker 1: this person hates. Right, I'm Mexican, I'm an immigrant, I'm 292 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 1: a journalist, I'm a woman, and I'm flat chested. 293 00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:35,480 Speaker 2: Thank you for the laugh. 294 00:18:37,880 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: But the point is is that you know, it was like, so, 295 00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:43,680 Speaker 1: how am I supposed to be quote unquote objective? That 296 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:46,359 Speaker 1: for me is one of the central issues right for me, 297 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 1: the issue of solidarity is key for me. My entire 298 00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:54,359 Speaker 1: understanding of my role as a journalist of conscience in 299 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:57,640 Speaker 1: this country really solidified when I read the book News 300 00:18:57,640 --> 00:18:59,960 Speaker 1: for All the People by Juan Gonzalez and Joe Torres. 301 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:01,760 Speaker 1: If you haven't read it, please do. It is the 302 00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:04,200 Speaker 1: History of Journalists of color. And that was when I 303 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:07,480 Speaker 1: understood that my founding father is a journalist, is Frederick Douglas, 304 00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:11,400 Speaker 1: and my founding mother is Ida be Wells. And that 305 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:15,720 Speaker 1: allowed me to understand the kind of responsibility that I have, 306 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:20,160 Speaker 1: which is about telling the truth. And I guess I'll 307 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 1: just end like this because I really want to This 308 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:23,399 Speaker 1: is five minutes, but I do want to say one 309 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:25,880 Speaker 1: quick thing, and it's a little bit more political than 310 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 1: I normally would, although if you listen to in the thick, 311 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:32,280 Speaker 1: we get pretty political. But in terms of this particular conversation, 312 00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:36,600 Speaker 1: I think it behooves journalists to understand and point out 313 00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:40,240 Speaker 1: the relationship between the Black Lives Matter movement of today, 314 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:42,840 Speaker 1: which started from the first day of black person was 315 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:45,920 Speaker 1: traffic to this country. That's when the Black Lives Matter 316 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:48,760 Speaker 1: movement started, in my view, But the Black Lives Matter 317 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:54,240 Speaker 1: of today tied and connected to what's happening with the 318 00:19:54,280 --> 00:19:58,760 Speaker 1: pro immigrant rights movement. Those two things. As journalists, we 319 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 1: must put them together because they are the centerpiece of 320 00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 1: what is happening now. Black journalists assured that prisons, mass incarceration, 321 00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:10,920 Speaker 1: private prisons, all of this is on the center center 322 00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:13,919 Speaker 1: of the conversation. What that has given rise to is 323 00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:20,360 Speaker 1: immigrant detention camps. There's no legal, binding support for any 324 00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:23,280 Speaker 1: of the people there, and those are the places which 325 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:27,560 Speaker 1: are now housing and incarcerating and holding our people, and 326 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:30,480 Speaker 1: we can't see them and they have no rights anyway, 327 00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:30,800 Speaker 1: thank you. 328 00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:32,359 Speaker 2: I look forward to the conversation you. 329 00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:38,679 Speaker 3: I want to start with this and I want to 330 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 3: sort of do a rapid fire and get an answer 331 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:41,560 Speaker 3: from each of you. 332 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:41,760 Speaker 4: Guys. 333 00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 3: We're going to go through a couple of things like this. 334 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:46,040 Speaker 3: One of the purposes of this panel is too, as 335 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 3: I said at beginning, identify blind spots, right, not just 336 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:52,159 Speaker 3: sort of historic blind spots, but also current blind spots 337 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:54,880 Speaker 3: in our mainstream media. Because we're here at a university, 338 00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:58,159 Speaker 3: name names, because I'm going to name names, right, and 339 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:00,919 Speaker 3: I want to hear from each of you an example 340 00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:03,280 Speaker 3: that you have seen in the last couple of years, 341 00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:05,720 Speaker 3: whether it's in your area of expertise or just an observation. 342 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:07,879 Speaker 3: You're you're you're at the gym, you're in the kitchen, 343 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 3: and you that thing that you see on TV or 344 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:12,640 Speaker 3: you reading it. You're like, what the how did how 345 00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:14,560 Speaker 3: did they get this frame, how did they put this 346 00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 3: in this particular way, and how you sort of responded 347 00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 3: to that as a journalist. 348 00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 4: And I'll give you a quick example. 349 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:23,280 Speaker 3: I am I got my doctorate in political science from 350 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:25,880 Speaker 3: the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, but I 351 00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:30,240 Speaker 3: my undergraduate institution is the University of Virginia. And so 352 00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:33,639 Speaker 3: I remember going on the air very soon after the 353 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,720 Speaker 3: Charlottesville terrorist attack, and I made a point to say 354 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 3: on the air, sitting with it's a great colleague of mine, 355 00:21:39,359 --> 00:21:42,119 Speaker 3: Chris Matthews. But I remember sitting on the air and saying, 356 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:46,480 Speaker 3: this was a terrorist attack. Chris, and the president, President 357 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:50,359 Speaker 3: Trump at the time, is a terrorist sympathizer, and his 358 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:51,840 Speaker 3: reaction was not positive. 359 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 4: And again I like Chris, but he was like Jason. Jason. 360 00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:57,480 Speaker 3: I was like, no, no, no, this is terrorism, and 361 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:00,359 Speaker 3: he's a terrorist sympathizer. By saying there's good people on 362 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 3: both sides, we wouldn't be having this question in any 363 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:07,600 Speaker 3: other context. That's terrorism, and he's okay with it. And 364 00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:11,680 Speaker 3: there was a tremendous amount of pushback from a lot 365 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,600 Speaker 3: of white journalists, from some black journalist who didn't know 366 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,399 Speaker 3: no better, and a lot of mainstream news outlets to 367 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:20,960 Speaker 3: try to frame Charlottesville as just a riot or just 368 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 3: an attack and not recognize it as a terrorist attack. 369 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 3: That was foeman to mean quite literally, the President was 370 00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:29,840 Speaker 3: as responsible for what happened at Charlotsville as he was 371 00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:32,560 Speaker 3: of January sixth. You know, we was fomented by what 372 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:34,840 Speaker 3: he was talking about. So just each of you quickly, 373 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:37,080 Speaker 3: can you give an example of something that you saw 374 00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:41,720 Speaker 3: the mainstream press was clearly sort of promoting a white 375 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:45,240 Speaker 3: nationalist frame about some kind of issue without doing the 376 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:47,840 Speaker 3: kind of inspection, and you're sort of exemplifying the blind 377 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:48,640 Speaker 3: spider that we're talking about. 378 00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:51,359 Speaker 1: We can start with you, Mary, Uh, what happened to 379 00:22:51,359 --> 00:22:54,760 Speaker 1: that red wave? I'm sorry. One of the basic things 380 00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 1: that journalists need to understand is how to understand propaganda 381 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 1: in an authority tarian regime. This is one of the 382 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: basic things. We teetered on authoritarianism, and because of what 383 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,080 Speaker 1: happened just a few days ago, maybe we've saved ourselves. 384 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:14,200 Speaker 1: Maybe okay, it's still but teetering a little bit less 385 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:14,720 Speaker 1: towards that. 386 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,679 Speaker 2: Okay, so we do in the thing. 387 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 1: We created our own political podcast because we were tired 388 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:24,200 Speaker 1: of being excluded from the mainstream media conversations and also 389 00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:26,679 Speaker 1: to challenge these kinds of things, because we were like, 390 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:32,520 Speaker 1: where's this red wave? It was political propaganda? Which why 391 00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:36,160 Speaker 1: are our fellow colleagues using polls that are being sourced 392 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 1: by Republicans without double sourcing? What the hell is this 393 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:40,960 Speaker 1: media literacy? 394 00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 2: One oh one? 395 00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:46,000 Speaker 1: Next, from the Red Wave is the red Latino Latina 396 00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:52,480 Speaker 1: latinx Latine wave, No baso, no basso atonses. We again, 397 00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:56,359 Speaker 1: as journalists, we've got to be more astute. That's the 398 00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,960 Speaker 1: real question. That's why democracy and journalism go together, because 399 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:04,120 Speaker 1: it is the astuteness to understand everything that we've said here, 400 00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:05,800 Speaker 1: the canaries in the mind that we're not going to 401 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:10,199 Speaker 1: accept propaganda, and all of us journalists who raise these questions, 402 00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:13,200 Speaker 1: as you know, we are always labeled as just too 403 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:16,760 Speaker 1: activists and we have an agenda, and thank god, it's 404 00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,399 Speaker 1: not happening to me anymore, thank god because I have 405 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,960 Speaker 1: my own company. But I feel terrible because it continues 406 00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:24,560 Speaker 1: to exist to this day. 407 00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:27,920 Speaker 6: And that is why my students love you and listen 408 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:30,000 Speaker 6: to your podcast and write about it in their media 409 00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 6: reflection journals, and it's meant a lot to them and 410 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 6: to me. I think in terms instead of focusing on 411 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:37,840 Speaker 6: one event, I really just want to talk a little 412 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,919 Speaker 6: bit about right wing news media because I'm sorry to 413 00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 6: tell us all or to but I do think that 414 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:48,520 Speaker 6: it's mainstream media now and the places like Fox News 415 00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:52,560 Speaker 6: are overly involved in a political project that is anti 416 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:57,040 Speaker 6: democratic and White's nationalist at the very least, and I 417 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:01,480 Speaker 6: think worse than that. And I am deeply concerned about 418 00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:05,919 Speaker 6: our news ecosystem in which this kind of particularly Fox 419 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:08,600 Speaker 6: News and other right wing news media, their right wing 420 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:13,399 Speaker 6: news media allies are aligned with right wing extremists on 421 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:16,679 Speaker 6: a working together on a political project that's anti democratic. 422 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:22,119 Speaker 6: They are involved in, of course, very unpleasant efforts at 423 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:27,240 Speaker 6: gerrymandering and at suppressing the vote, and at encouraging anti 424 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:32,320 Speaker 6: CRT legislation and much more. This is troubling. We have 425 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,240 Speaker 6: a problem in our news ecosystem in this country. And 426 00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:40,320 Speaker 6: I'm certainly not going to let the other mainstream media, 427 00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:44,359 Speaker 6: the reality based, fact based, tethered to reality news media, 428 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:47,120 Speaker 6: off the hook. But thank god for them. I think 429 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:49,560 Speaker 6: we've got a lot doing some really important work. But 430 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:53,800 Speaker 6: we do need this revolution in journalism standards. We do 431 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:56,840 Speaker 6: need the Center for Journalism and Democracy. We do need 432 00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,879 Speaker 6: this Democracy Summit and all to be talking together about 433 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:05,919 Speaker 6: how we escape from news values like impartiality and neutrality 434 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 6: that have been used for far too long as a 435 00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:10,440 Speaker 6: cover for anti democratic work. 436 00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:16,320 Speaker 5: Jason, you started off this question, you know, on point, 437 00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:20,120 Speaker 5: and that is the reminder that speakers earlier reminded us 438 00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:24,679 Speaker 5: that we can't neutralize our vocabulary when we're writing about 439 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,840 Speaker 5: these very tough issues, and I found myself doing that. 440 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:33,639 Speaker 5: I was working on some stories about an opinion piece 441 00:26:34,119 --> 00:26:38,600 Speaker 5: about the North Dakota Legislature, and I found myself censoring myself. 442 00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:42,520 Speaker 5: It's like, what is a more neutral word for white 443 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:46,320 Speaker 5: supremacist here? But it's like, Okay, I resigned myself to 444 00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:48,399 Speaker 5: saying I'm going to say it because a lot of 445 00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:53,160 Speaker 5: these people where I live would actually probably embrace that word. 446 00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,359 Speaker 5: So I don't think I'd be offending many too many people. 447 00:26:56,760 --> 00:27:01,359 Speaker 5: But as far as specific examples, you know, currently, this 448 00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:04,720 Speaker 5: issue with the adoption of Native children, I've just been 449 00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:07,840 Speaker 5: in the news for decades. You know, white families have 450 00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:13,280 Speaker 5: been fighting for Indian children for decades, and I think 451 00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:16,360 Speaker 5: because the story has been around for decades, you're starting 452 00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:18,919 Speaker 5: to see a little bit more nuanced reporting on it. 453 00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:23,119 Speaker 5: I really advise people to look at this land podcast 454 00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,880 Speaker 5: by Rebecca Nagela slams that story out of the water. Yeah, 455 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:30,240 Speaker 5: give her some. I'm applause, because if you want nuance 456 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:34,439 Speaker 5: in what is happening in the history of American Indian 457 00:27:34,520 --> 00:27:39,080 Speaker 5: lives and children and how Congress has intersected in our lives. 458 00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:42,199 Speaker 5: I just have to say that a tip of the 459 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:45,640 Speaker 5: hat to Nicole because all of her work is grounded 460 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:49,919 Speaker 5: in history and context and bringing that to our reporting, 461 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:55,280 Speaker 5: and Rebecca and Nagel in that EQUA podcast hits everything 462 00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:58,199 Speaker 5: right out of the park. But yeah, to that point, 463 00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:02,000 Speaker 5: the stories that had been tilled prior to that were 464 00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:09,439 Speaker 5: really based in misinformation. Reporters, we're telling that story as 465 00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:12,920 Speaker 5: this is a racial issue, and you know, how dare 466 00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 5: they try to keep Indian kids in their homes based 467 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:21,879 Speaker 5: on race? But really, American Indians were Our whole grounding 468 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:28,199 Speaker 5: in the US Constitution is based on political classification, not 469 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:32,160 Speaker 5: racial and that is the story that the mainstream press 470 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,560 Speaker 5: had got wrong for a for a long time. 471 00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:37,280 Speaker 4: So we're just coming out of. 472 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 3: I contend that similar to what Maria said that the 473 00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:43,959 Speaker 3: midterms may have just I don't know, it's like the 474 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:46,000 Speaker 3: political groundhol woke up and said, hey, you might have 475 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,239 Speaker 3: eighteen more months of democracy. Right, that's about as good 476 00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 3: as we got out of this. But you know, Maria, 477 00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:52,040 Speaker 3: one of the things I want to talk about is 478 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:56,920 Speaker 3: that you've covered elections abroad. You went to Nairobi, Kenya 479 00:28:57,160 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 3: in two thousand and eight, you talked about how the 480 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:02,239 Speaker 3: press played around and sort of fomenting racial violence. And 481 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:04,240 Speaker 3: what I want to sort of ask you is, you 482 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:07,600 Speaker 3: know there's occasionally you'll see it online, somebody will write 483 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:10,080 Speaker 3: an article where they'll say, this is how we would 484 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:12,520 Speaker 3: cover this if this were happening in another country. Right, 485 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:14,920 Speaker 3: if what we saw happening in America was happening in 486 00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 3: another country, every mainstream news outlet would be like, this 487 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,240 Speaker 3: oppressive regime, this terrible place is keeping certain people from writing. 488 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 3: But that's not how the Washington Post covers it. That's 489 00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 3: not how the Atlanta covers it. Right, if the two 490 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,240 Speaker 3: thousand election happened in another country. 491 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:29,840 Speaker 4: Think about that. 492 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:32,600 Speaker 3: If this was Brazil, if this was Spain, if an 493 00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:36,160 Speaker 3: entire election presidential election came down to the district run 494 00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 3: by the brother of one of the guys running, America 495 00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:40,920 Speaker 3: would be screaming about that. We would say that this 496 00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 3: is a fraud in the country. We'd be calling it 497 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 3: a Banana Republic or some other racially tinged that's the 498 00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:47,360 Speaker 3: other term they'd like to use, racially tens some other 499 00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:49,920 Speaker 3: racist term. So, Rhea, I'd like you to talk a 500 00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 3: little bit about your coverage of elections in Kenya and 501 00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:57,040 Speaker 3: also what that may have shown you about how our 502 00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:00,560 Speaker 3: elections continue to sort of frame white supremacy as norm 503 00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:02,920 Speaker 3: whereas you have a bit more freedom sometimes when you're abroad. 504 00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:06,400 Speaker 1: So I was incredibly lucky to go travel to Kenya 505 00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 1: after the two thousand and seven elections, which feels like 506 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:11,560 Speaker 1: such a long time ago, but the two thousand and 507 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:15,160 Speaker 1: seven elections in Kenya actually turned out to be very bloody. 508 00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:18,280 Speaker 1: There was a massacre of about fifteen seventeen hundred people 509 00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:20,719 Speaker 1: massacred in very brutal and ugly ways. 510 00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:22,480 Speaker 2: And this is after Rwanda. 511 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:25,520 Speaker 1: Rwanda's right next to Kenya, So it was like, how 512 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:29,720 Speaker 1: could this repeat itself? And in meeting journalists, senior level 513 00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:33,680 Speaker 1: journalists in Nairobi, they talked to me about how post 514 00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:37,520 Speaker 1: that dynamic, seeing the blood on the streets right, and 515 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,840 Speaker 1: kind of like, wow, we literally have blood on our hands. 516 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:45,600 Speaker 1: Because the journalists were fomenting, right, repeating things about tribal 517 00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:50,760 Speaker 1: divisions and fomenting putting photographs using headlines that were about 518 00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:52,280 Speaker 1: creating and sowing the division. 519 00:30:52,680 --> 00:30:53,520 Speaker 2: Sound familiar. 520 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:56,400 Speaker 1: So what the journalists did is that they met up 521 00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 1: and they said we're now going to practice something that 522 00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 1: we label peace journalism. Where As a journalist, primary on 523 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,840 Speaker 1: your mind has to be getting to peace, not selling 524 00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 1: the most papers or supporting one tribe versus another. But 525 00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:15,000 Speaker 1: how do we get to peace? And this is something 526 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,640 Speaker 1: that I remember thinking, like, oh my god, this is 527 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 1: so radical. If I go back to the United States 528 00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:22,120 Speaker 1: and talk about wanting to be a peace journalist, I 529 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:24,520 Speaker 1: was like, that'll be the end of my career because 530 00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:26,840 Speaker 1: it'll be like, oh, yeah, you're so immigranty, so Mexican 531 00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,040 Speaker 1: me and now you want to be PC. Get out 532 00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:33,480 Speaker 1: of here. Not PC, but PC. So I think that 533 00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:37,240 Speaker 1: this is again to me right now. One of the 534 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:39,880 Speaker 1: things that I'm obsessed with is I'm a democracy junkie, 535 00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:43,240 Speaker 1: like Jason. This is like like Nicole right, like I 536 00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:46,480 Speaker 1: live and breathe democracy. And we have to understand that 537 00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 1: right now, the second largest voting cohort, not a block, 538 00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:54,640 Speaker 1: but cohort of voters are Latinos and latinas latinx Latine 539 00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:58,880 Speaker 1: and this is huge. But we don't really understand that. 540 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:01,000 Speaker 1: It's not like you see this being talked about in 541 00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:04,400 Speaker 1: every single political conversation in the United States of America. 542 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:10,040 Speaker 1: And yet Why why are we still essentially invisible? Why 543 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 1: does that happen? Why does it continue to happen? And 544 00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:18,920 Speaker 1: understanding that perpetuating that is actually the worst possible thing 545 00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:21,880 Speaker 1: that can happen to a democracy. So the most common 546 00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:24,000 Speaker 1: age of Latinos and Latinas in the United States right 547 00:32:24,040 --> 00:32:24,840 Speaker 1: now is eleven. 548 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 2: You understand what. 549 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:28,840 Speaker 1: I'm talking about in terms of democracy and getting to 550 00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:33,560 Speaker 1: voting age and the massive amount of Latinos and Latina 551 00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:37,160 Speaker 1: voters that are going to be around. So talking about 552 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:42,240 Speaker 1: that that population that cohort. Understanding talking politics all the 553 00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:45,240 Speaker 1: time is what I say to you know, when I speak, 554 00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:48,320 Speaker 1: Latinos and Latinas have to be talking politics, breakfast, lunch, 555 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:52,720 Speaker 1: and dinner, domestic politics because we have to embrace this all. 556 00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:56,800 Speaker 1: So for me understanding peace journalism, but then also like 557 00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:00,960 Speaker 1: factual journalism, data based journalism, I still don't like I'm 558 00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 1: not a data whiz. 559 00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:03,719 Speaker 2: I'm just saying what's true. 560 00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:06,120 Speaker 1: I don't understand why people are not kind of running 561 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:07,480 Speaker 1: up and saying, oh my god, well we got to 562 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,120 Speaker 1: do this in the parties, for example. But that is 563 00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:12,520 Speaker 1: one of the dynamics that we face today in our country. 564 00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:14,840 Speaker 4: You know, Kathy A. Lot of your work. 565 00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:18,000 Speaker 3: Your book in particularly we're talking about talks about how 566 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:22,400 Speaker 3: the press actively sort of fomented and helped maintain basically 567 00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:25,720 Speaker 3: the American apartheid system with housing segregation and Jim Crow, 568 00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 3: and that of course affected language. Right, Like we're now 569 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:33,640 Speaker 3: discussing like the Great Migration in the United States, but 570 00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,000 Speaker 3: it's people leaving the South, it's not people fleeing the 571 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:39,560 Speaker 3: apartheid state, which is what was happening in the United 572 00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:43,360 Speaker 3: States at the time. So given that background, what do 573 00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:48,320 Speaker 3: you see linguistically in journalism today where you see the 574 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:51,960 Speaker 3: same tendencies that you saw in the sort of soft 575 00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:53,720 Speaker 3: touch that Jim Crow was given. What do you see 576 00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 3: now that our main newspapers are using that same kind 577 00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:00,440 Speaker 3: of language to paper over what is actually an opress system. 578 00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:05,960 Speaker 6: That's an interesting question. Oftentimes it's simply avoiding describing the 579 00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:08,920 Speaker 6: systems and the structures and how they work. And it 580 00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,960 Speaker 6: may not be avoiding it purposefully, but it's avoid it's 581 00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:16,440 Speaker 6: not doing that really critical work of describing the context 582 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:21,880 Speaker 6: in which politics happens, economic and social life happens. So, 583 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:24,960 Speaker 6: you know, so many things are sins of emission. I mean, 584 00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:28,920 Speaker 6: they're certainly linguistic ones. In our book, We're really we 585 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:31,520 Speaker 6: talk about the soft power of the news that is 586 00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:34,239 Speaker 6: in the US South, and this is true all over 587 00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:38,719 Speaker 6: the country. Of course, that news narratives shape, these stories 588 00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:44,080 Speaker 6: that are told shape people's attitudes, beliefs, ideas, and certainly 589 00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:47,480 Speaker 6: in the South for generations after the Civil War, these 590 00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:53,080 Speaker 6: white newspapers spread ideas about about black criminality and degradation 591 00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:58,359 Speaker 6: and spread a lot of disinformation and demonization. And they 592 00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:01,120 Speaker 6: did it for a purpose, right, was just to create 593 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:05,000 Speaker 6: this racial apartheid system. So these you know, the news 594 00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:09,800 Speaker 6: had soft power, but these news, white news leaders had 595 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:14,600 Speaker 6: they exercised hard political and economic power. So, for example, 596 00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,960 Speaker 6: Ethel Barksdale in eighteen seventy five in Mississippi. 597 00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:20,040 Speaker 2: Helped He was the editor of the Jackson Clarion. 598 00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:24,080 Speaker 6: He helped plan and execute the Mississippi Plan, which was 599 00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:28,960 Speaker 6: this murderous Democratic Party political campaign to wrest power from 600 00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:33,480 Speaker 6: the biracial Republican government of Mississippi. And they did this 601 00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,320 Speaker 6: by stealing an election. And part of the stealing of 602 00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:40,320 Speaker 6: the election was to go around the state and prevent 603 00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:44,960 Speaker 6: black Mississippians from being able to participate in political rallies 604 00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:48,319 Speaker 6: in organizing and in voting. And they did this with 605 00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:52,439 Speaker 6: the use of violent paramilitary groups and they killed they 606 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:57,400 Speaker 6: killed hundreds of black Mississippians. And that is how reconstruction 607 00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:01,280 Speaker 6: ended in Mississippi. And it was divine by a newspaper leader. 608 00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:04,120 Speaker 6: In fact, he used the offices of the Jackson Clarion 609 00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:08,560 Speaker 6: as an ammunition dump for these paramilitaries. That's just one 610 00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:10,759 Speaker 6: of the many stories like this that we tell in 611 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,640 Speaker 6: our book. Joseph fitzt Daniels the editor of the Raleigh 612 00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:16,480 Speaker 6: News and Observer. He was part of the Democratic Party 613 00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:20,240 Speaker 6: leadership in North Carolina in eighteen ninety eight in which 614 00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:24,360 Speaker 6: they create a political party, built a political party campaign 615 00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:28,200 Speaker 6: to wrest power from a biracial group of fusionists, white 616 00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:30,320 Speaker 6: and poor. White and black people in the state of 617 00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:34,240 Speaker 6: North Carolina joined political fortunes. It was biracial democracy back 618 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:36,600 Speaker 6: for this little moment in time in North Carolina. 619 00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:37,760 Speaker 2: So what happens. 620 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:40,840 Speaker 6: You get the Democratic Party leadership with Joseph fitz Daniels, 621 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:43,600 Speaker 6: whose newspaper was basically created to be part of this 622 00:36:43,719 --> 00:36:48,680 Speaker 6: work to create a racial pogram that quashed black voting 623 00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:52,000 Speaker 6: rights and killed black people and intimidated them and kept 624 00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:54,600 Speaker 6: them from organizing and told all kinds of lies about 625 00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:58,800 Speaker 6: black minissexual predators, talk about linguistics right at that time, 626 00:36:59,120 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 6: told these lies. This is the threadbare lie that was 627 00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:05,160 Speaker 6: used to justify the lynching of black men that I 628 00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:08,120 Speaker 6: to b Wells laid there as well. So what happens 629 00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:12,600 Speaker 6: in North Carolina. You have black men and women, children 630 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:16,759 Speaker 6: intimidated all over the state. The electionist the state legislature 631 00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:20,400 Speaker 6: election of stolen. Wilmington, however, is the seat of fusionist power. 632 00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:23,759 Speaker 6: Is a biracial government in place, and so the Democratic 633 00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:27,600 Speaker 6: Party puts together a paramilitary group, organized group. They walk 634 00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:30,680 Speaker 6: into Wilmington and it's a murderous coup d'etais and they 635 00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:35,120 Speaker 6: kill hundreds of black Womantonians. A year later, after the 636 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:38,799 Speaker 6: Wilmington coup, they institute the Democratic Party as rulers. All 637 00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:43,040 Speaker 6: this newspaper guys righted the leadership of this A year later, 638 00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:45,759 Speaker 6: all black men in the state of North Carolina are 639 00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:48,000 Speaker 6: disenfranchised by constitutional amendment. 640 00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:50,680 Speaker 3: I want to point out I did not learn that 641 00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:54,560 Speaker 3: storingel about three years ago. And I'm supposed to be 642 00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:57,920 Speaker 3: a professional smart person, I mean, like like objectively, you know, 643 00:37:58,000 --> 00:37:59,879 Speaker 3: just be more journals who admit the stuff to data. Now, 644 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:04,319 Speaker 3: because as far as what we're educated on, right, you know, 645 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:07,279 Speaker 3: the country spent a year, the mainstream expressmen a year 646 00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:09,600 Speaker 3: talking about Tulsa as if that was the only thing 647 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:12,000 Speaker 3: that happened, right, And most people figured that out because 648 00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:14,560 Speaker 3: they saw watchmen, not because it's something that they have 649 00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:17,640 Speaker 3: been taught in schools. And so you know, you're right, 650 00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:21,319 Speaker 3: that same sort of language. It's terrifizing to terrifying to 651 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:23,600 Speaker 3: imagine that in forty or fifty years that you know, 652 00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:27,120 Speaker 3: Ferguson will be called a protest as opposed to an uprising. 653 00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:30,760 Speaker 3: It took thirty years for what happened in Los Angeles 654 00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:32,719 Speaker 3: to be referred to as an uprising as opposed to 655 00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:35,200 Speaker 3: just a riot. With this in mind, Jody, I want 656 00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:36,279 Speaker 3: to ask you this. We've got a couple of minutes 657 00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:38,520 Speaker 3: before we go to our Q and A. We've all 658 00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:41,680 Speaker 3: been talking about the importance of journalism in fighting back 659 00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:45,120 Speaker 3: against this language and fighting back against these blind spots. 660 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:48,000 Speaker 3: But it's interesting, you know, there are thirty four tribal 661 00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:50,160 Speaker 3: colleges across the United States. 662 00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:53,680 Speaker 4: None of them have a journalism program, none of them. 663 00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:59,120 Speaker 3: And so what role does that play that children who 664 00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:01,720 Speaker 3: are coming off there as adults who may be coming 665 00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:04,799 Speaker 3: off of reservations, who may be going to a sort 666 00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:07,800 Speaker 3: of Native American journal in schools, they're not being taught 667 00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:10,200 Speaker 3: how to report on their own community. 668 00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:14,640 Speaker 5: Yeah, that's highly problematic. There's just kind of one like 669 00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:20,600 Speaker 5: caveat to that haskell. Indian Nations University, the oldest tribal 670 00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:24,120 Speaker 5: college in the United States, does have a two year 671 00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:31,200 Speaker 5: communication program. However, their staff was recently cut and they 672 00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:35,600 Speaker 5: don't offer a whole lot of news reporting classes. So, yes, 673 00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:39,359 Speaker 5: we have a we don't have journalism programs, and I 674 00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:44,759 Speaker 5: think to me it almost seems by design, because so 675 00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:47,719 Speaker 5: we don't just have two forms of government in the 676 00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:50,680 Speaker 5: United States. It is not just state, it's not just federal. 677 00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:56,440 Speaker 5: We have tribal governments. Our tribal governments have constitutions. Many 678 00:39:56,440 --> 00:40:01,319 Speaker 5: of our constitutions are just boilerplate language which does not 679 00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:06,480 Speaker 5: reflect our cultural backgrounds. And so my tribe, for example, 680 00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:10,879 Speaker 5: is created by the Indian Reorganization at again a boilerplate 681 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:15,839 Speaker 5: language that does not give us First Amendment protections. We 682 00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:19,879 Speaker 5: do have the Indian Civil Rights Act embedded into that, 683 00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:23,680 Speaker 5: and that is where we get the civil liberty, civil 684 00:40:23,760 --> 00:40:28,200 Speaker 5: liberties of press, freedom, and the right to assemble. However, 685 00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:33,280 Speaker 5: there is nothing to protect us if our tribal leaders 686 00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:38,040 Speaker 5: decide not to. So the backup for that is okay, 687 00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:41,880 Speaker 5: so my civil rights have been violated, then I'm supposed 688 00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:44,520 Speaker 5: to go to tribal court. But if your tribal council 689 00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:50,200 Speaker 5: is controlling your judicial branch. We do not have any 690 00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:53,279 Speaker 5: any press freedoms in our country. And so that I 691 00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:56,399 Speaker 5: say that because it's really no big surprise. We don't 692 00:40:56,400 --> 00:41:00,440 Speaker 5: have any journalism programs. It's just I think intention by 693 00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:05,440 Speaker 5: design that those abilities for Native people to be heard, 694 00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:07,360 Speaker 5: to be seen, to have a voice, to have the 695 00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:10,600 Speaker 5: right to assemble, they're just wiped out. And so that 696 00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:13,799 Speaker 5: is something you know, we in journalism have our work 697 00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:14,640 Speaker 5: cut out for us. 698 00:41:15,080 --> 00:41:17,000 Speaker 4: All right, thank you so much. All right, we have 699 00:41:17,080 --> 00:41:19,280 Speaker 4: a round applause for our panels here. 700 00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:26,080 Speaker 3: I want to thank you guys so much for your time, 701 00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:28,560 Speaker 3: your energy, your patience. Please make sure if you have 702 00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:30,440 Speaker 3: any questions that you come up and chat with any 703 00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:31,960 Speaker 3: of the panel. I think we've got to take a 704 00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:34,279 Speaker 3: quick picture at the step and repeat. But everybody will 705 00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:36,719 Speaker 3: be here and available, and then in a couple of minutes, 706 00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:38,920 Speaker 3: Nicole Hanna Jones will be back up here to introduce 707 00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:39,480 Speaker 3: the next panel. 708 00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:40,160 Speaker 4: Thank you so much. 709 00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:15,320 Speaker 6: Don't you tell me about th