WEBVTT - Super Team vs Superteam with Michael Voepel 0:00:00.680 --> 0:00:03.119 Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where we're wondering 0:00:03.240 --> 0:00:06.439 how much negative feedback it'll take for the new NWSL 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:10.160 Boston team to change its name marketing approach. 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:13.360 In hold general five cool colors though. 0:00:13.840 --> 0:00:16.160 On today's show, we'll be talking with longtime ESPN writer 0:00:16.239 --> 0:00:19.239 Michael Voppel about the WNBA Finals ahead of Game three. 0:00:19.400 --> 0:00:22.079 Plus we ask why too many Balls dot Com is 0:00:22.120 --> 0:00:22.560 a thing. 0:00:23.000 --> 0:00:25.880 In twenty twenty four, we hear from you Slices, and 0:00:25.920 --> 0:00:28.880 we embrace the beginning of hoodie season. It's all coming 0:00:28.960 --> 0:00:40.680 up right after this. Welcome back, Orange Slices. Here's what 0:00:40.720 --> 0:00:45.480 you need to know today in WNBA News. Game three 0:00:45.479 --> 0:00:48.080 of the Finals is tonight and the Minnesota Links are 0:00:48.080 --> 0:00:50.320 at home for the first time in the series. They'll 0:00:50.320 --> 0:00:51.720 try to avoid drop it a game in front of 0:00:51.760 --> 0:00:54.040 the crowd at Target Center after they stole one on 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:56.200 New York Liberty Turf in Game one of the series. 0:00:56.520 --> 0:00:59.680 Coverage begins with WNBA Countdown on ESPN at seven thirty 0:00:59.680 --> 0:01:02.080 East and the game tips at eight. We'll have more 0:01:02.080 --> 0:01:04.480 on that matchup with our interview later in the show. 0:01:04.840 --> 0:01:07.120 A cool note, by the way, the duel between Minnesota 0:01:07.160 --> 0:01:09.120 and New York is currently on pace to set a 0:01:09.200 --> 0:01:12.039 viewership record for a five game series, so last Thursday's 0:01:12.040 --> 0:01:15.000 game on ESPN had the largest audience for Game one 0:01:15.000 --> 0:01:18.280 of a WNBA Finals series in league history, with one 0:01:18.319 --> 0:01:20.160 point one four million viewers. 0:01:20.200 --> 0:01:20.880 Pretty awesome. 0:01:21.440 --> 0:01:24.480 In NWSL news, NWSL Boston, set to begin play in 0:01:24.520 --> 0:01:30.400 twenty twenty six, has a name Boss Nation Football Club BOS. 0:01:30.640 --> 0:01:34.200 It's an anagram for the term Bostonian. The team revealed 0:01:34.200 --> 0:01:37.640 that championship green will be the primary color, with several 0:01:37.680 --> 0:01:44.480 accent colors per news release, quote Relentless, Raspberry, Loyal, Charcoal, Daring, pink, Rise, yellow, 0:01:44.520 --> 0:01:47.600 and orange press, which speak to the rich diversity of 0:01:47.600 --> 0:01:50.720 Boston's neighborhoods and the team's values and signal a new 0:01:50.760 --> 0:01:53.760 era in the city's sports landscape. The name, the hype 0:01:53.840 --> 0:01:56.720 video the landing page, which was too many balls dot 0:01:56.760 --> 0:02:01.080 com are getting mixed reviews to put a kindly more 0:02:01.080 --> 0:02:03.960 on that in a moment. Meantime, more soccer news, we 0:02:04.040 --> 0:02:06.160 told you about the three point deduction and two hundred 0:02:06.200 --> 0:02:09.200 thousand dollars fine Angel CITYFC received for exceeding the league's 0:02:09.240 --> 0:02:12.040 salary cap this season, while on Monday, the club pushed 0:02:12.040 --> 0:02:15.480 back a little. ACFC released a statement expressing disappointment with 0:02:15.520 --> 0:02:19.040 the three point deduction and more. The statement reads, in part, quote, 0:02:19.080 --> 0:02:22.800 we disagreed with one aspect of the league's conclusions. Our understanding, 0:02:22.800 --> 0:02:25.240 based on the league's salary cap rules, was that childcare 0:02:25.240 --> 0:02:28.480 payments do not count against the salary cap. The statement continued, 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:31.600 we believe that ACFC did not exceed the salary cap 0:02:31.639 --> 0:02:34.920 and formally requested a reconsideration of the three point reduction 0:02:35.280 --> 0:02:38.480 end quote. The league stood firm on the deduction, denying 0:02:38.520 --> 0:02:42.120 acfc's appeal, and the NWSL rules are actually pretty clear 0:02:42.160 --> 0:02:45.120 cut on this, so it's surprising that ACFC used this defense. 0:02:45.400 --> 0:02:48.160 According to step Young of the Athletic per last year 0:02:48.160 --> 0:02:51.200 and this year's competition manual, it hasn't changed. Players with 0:02:51.320 --> 0:02:53.800 kids can receive a dependent care stipend up to the 0:02:53.840 --> 0:02:56.760 IRS maximum five thousand dollars without a hit to the 0:02:56.800 --> 0:03:00.040 salary cap, but quote any amount in excess of the 0:03:00.080 --> 0:03:03.359 IRS annual maximum will count against the team's salary cap. 0:03:03.520 --> 0:03:04.040 End quote. 0:03:04.200 --> 0:03:06.480 We'll keep you updated on this story as more reporting 0:03:06.520 --> 0:03:09.880 comes out in hockey news. The PWHL just released its 0:03:09.880 --> 0:03:12.960 regular season schedule and the season gets underway one month 0:03:13.040 --> 0:03:16.200 earlier than last year. The first puck drops November thirtieth, 0:03:16.200 --> 0:03:18.480 and the league's six teams will each play thirty games 0:03:18.480 --> 0:03:21.080 in the regular season. That's six more than last year. 0:03:21.360 --> 0:03:23.960 Regular season wraps up on May third, twenty twenty five. 0:03:24.440 --> 0:03:27.040 Last season, Minnesota won the Walter Cup, beating Boston in 0:03:27.080 --> 0:03:29.520 a five game final series for the Ages, and I'm 0:03:29.560 --> 0:03:32.960 expecting more drama this season and hoping for some fresh 0:03:33.040 --> 0:03:35.120 jerseys along with the new team names and logos that 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:38.400 dropped in the offseason. College hoops were getting close to 0:03:38.440 --> 0:03:41.920 one of the most anticipated women's college basketball seasons ever, 0:03:42.280 --> 0:03:45.280 and the AP dropped its preseason top twenty five list. 0:03:45.600 --> 0:03:48.280 Don Staley's reigning champions South Carolina game Cocks are in 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:53.520 the top spot, followed by Yukon, USC and Texas. Notably, Iowa, Stanford, 0:03:53.520 --> 0:03:56.680 and Tennessee all received votes but didn't crack the list. 0:03:57.040 --> 0:04:00.960 This year feels primed for some historic for mitzs and 0:04:01.000 --> 0:04:02.640 don't worry, we'll get you all the news and notes 0:04:02.680 --> 0:04:05.080 you need before the season tips off on November fourth, 0:04:05.400 --> 0:04:09.920 just nineteen days from today. Also interesting tidbit conferences are 0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:13.320 releasing their picks for preseason player awards and the SEC 0:04:13.440 --> 0:04:17.320 has three, yes, three co preseason Players of the Year. 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:19.120 There was a three way tie in the voting between 0:04:19.120 --> 0:04:22.599 Texas's Madison Booker and Flaje Johnson and Anissa Morro, both 0:04:22.600 --> 0:04:25.480 from LSU. Morow and Johnson were number two and number 0:04:25.480 --> 0:04:28.159 three in scoring behind Angel Reese for the Tigers last season, 0:04:28.400 --> 0:04:29.320 and Booker. 0:04:29.000 --> 0:04:30.320 Led the way for the Longhorns. 0:04:30.480 --> 0:04:33.320 Five other players in the conference also received Player of 0:04:33.320 --> 0:04:34.040 the Year votes. 0:04:34.640 --> 0:04:35.960 Finally, a quick correction. 0:04:36.320 --> 0:04:38.599 The other day we said the Seattle rain hadn't missed 0:04:38.600 --> 0:04:41.760 the postseason since twenty thirteen. They were actually last on 0:04:41.800 --> 0:04:45.120 the outside looking in in twenty seventeen. We apologize for 0:04:45.160 --> 0:04:47.600 the error. Those responsible have been sacked. 0:04:48.000 --> 0:04:49.559 And another note from me here. 0:04:49.720 --> 0:04:52.920 When we talked Liberty on Monday, I mentioned Benijelni Hamilton 0:04:52.960 --> 0:04:55.719 played for the Libs during their Westchester County Center days, 0:04:55.960 --> 0:04:57.920 but she actually got to New York in twenty twenty one, 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:01.080 one year after the franchise started laying a Barclay Center. 0:05:01.360 --> 0:05:04.159 We apologize again for the error. Those responsible for sacking 0:05:04.160 --> 0:05:06.360 the people who have just been sacked have been sacked. 0:05:06.600 --> 0:05:09.440 And if you're confused, watch Monty Python and the Holy Grail. 0:05:09.480 --> 0:05:10.240 You Heathens. 0:05:12.320 --> 0:05:14.640 All right, before we get to today's interview, we have 0:05:14.720 --> 0:05:16.800 to talk Boss Nation real quick. 0:05:17.360 --> 0:05:19.400 Okay, the team name, the logo of the brand. 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:22.800 They were all introduced using the campaign too Many Balls 0:05:23.920 --> 0:05:26.960 upun about the number of famous men's sports teams in 0:05:27.000 --> 0:05:28.560 Boston and the need. 0:05:28.400 --> 0:05:29.599 For more women's sports. 0:05:30.120 --> 0:05:33.200 Now. First, the video is conspicuously missing any mention of 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:36.560 the town's women's professional hockey team, PWHL Boston. 0:05:36.800 --> 0:05:39.320 And the unusual team name Boss Nation. 0:05:39.600 --> 0:05:42.960 It's, like I said, an anagram of Bostonian and per 0:05:43.120 --> 0:05:47.039 statement quote doesn't just represent the fans, it signifies a 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:53.440 collective identity made up entirely of its fan base. Hmmm, Alex, 0:05:53.480 --> 0:05:55.240 We're gonna get into more of this tomorrow, but as 0:05:55.240 --> 0:05:57.760 a greater Boston area fan, I'm gonna need your first 0:05:57.760 --> 0:05:59.120 reaction to me. 0:06:00.839 --> 0:06:03.600 My first thought was, this is the bad name that 0:06:03.680 --> 0:06:05.960 you put in the mix to make your good name 0:06:06.120 --> 0:06:09.359 or your mediocre name stand out and really shine. 0:06:09.480 --> 0:06:09.600 Right. 0:06:09.640 --> 0:06:12.200 It's like the throwaway, like I just need some fluff 0:06:12.240 --> 0:06:14.960 in here to make sure the people like the thing. 0:06:15.080 --> 0:06:21.520 I like that being said Jennifer Epstein was on CBS 0:06:21.640 --> 0:06:25.479 Morning's Plus to announce it. Wearing I thought a pretty 0:06:25.520 --> 0:06:29.599 cool jacket with the Boss Nation logo in a circle, 0:06:29.720 --> 0:06:32.080 Like I like that branding. I think the name is weird. 0:06:32.560 --> 0:06:35.280 I'm not usually somebody that feels really strongly one way 0:06:35.400 --> 0:06:37.760 or the other about new names, you know, I think 0:06:37.760 --> 0:06:39.480 it's hard actually to come up with a team name 0:06:39.480 --> 0:06:41.200 in the year twenty twenty four. We look back on 0:06:41.240 --> 0:06:44.560 old men's team names and it's like, if you were 0:06:44.560 --> 0:06:46.719 to name a team the Red Sox this year, like 0:06:46.880 --> 0:06:49.960 people would be so mad, like what a stupid name. 0:06:50.040 --> 0:06:52.359 So I think the bar is a lot higher. That 0:06:52.440 --> 0:06:55.400 being said, I think the campaign is way worse than 0:06:55.400 --> 0:06:59.200 the name. The fact that PWHL Boston is totally erased, 0:06:59.240 --> 0:07:00.679 the fact that bos and it has been a women's 0:07:00.720 --> 0:07:04.679 hockey city even before the PWHL, with the Boston Pride 0:07:04.720 --> 0:07:07.920 winning titles and having banners like it just is so 0:07:08.080 --> 0:07:10.880 bad to me that they erased another women's pro team 0:07:11.480 --> 0:07:14.360 in order to focus on a too Many Balls campaign. 0:07:14.760 --> 0:07:16.720 Yeah, I mean, the name's just weird to me. I 0:07:16.720 --> 0:07:19.080 don't hate it. I'm not like offended by it, but 0:07:19.160 --> 0:07:21.200 it's just weird. It makes me think it'd be like 0:07:21.240 --> 0:07:24.240 sponsored by like Hugo Boss. It just sounds like it'd 0:07:24.240 --> 0:07:27.480 be more of like a a like a fashion campaign 0:07:27.520 --> 0:07:31.840 than a sports team like Boss Nation. Also, I agree 0:07:31.880 --> 0:07:33.680 with you on the too Many Balls, it feels like 0:07:33.680 --> 0:07:36.800 we're so far past that, Like that feels very late nineties, 0:07:36.840 --> 0:07:40.360 early two thousands, like fempower was about, like we. 0:07:40.320 --> 0:07:42.440 Don't need that anymore now. 0:07:42.520 --> 0:07:44.240 Not only does it feel like there's so much for 0:07:44.280 --> 0:07:46.360 women's sports to stand on on its own that doesn't 0:07:46.440 --> 0:07:49.640 have to be a pushing back on men, but also, 0:07:49.800 --> 0:07:53.960 like with the whole trans conversation, like getting rid of 0:07:54.080 --> 0:07:59.280 balls thing also just feels touchy and unnecessary. Like I 0:07:59.360 --> 0:08:01.920 said this on tw but like for the olds among us, 0:08:02.240 --> 0:08:04.320 it feels like there'd be a website called too Many 0:08:04.320 --> 0:08:06.320 Balls dot com that would be competing with the other 0:08:06.480 --> 0:08:09.320 BROI sports blogs that were like the beginning of the 0:08:09.320 --> 0:08:11.280 wild Wild West of sports blogs back in the day 0:08:11.280 --> 0:08:14.440 the Kissing Susie Colber with Leather Sports by Brooks, where 0:08:14.480 --> 0:08:16.560 it was like half hot chicks and half sports content. 0:08:16.680 --> 0:08:19.680 Like it feels of that time, so it's very strange 0:08:19.680 --> 0:08:21.560 to see it right now. And like I'm all for 0:08:21.600 --> 0:08:23.720 dick jokes and ball jokes, it just doesn't feel like 0:08:23.760 --> 0:08:29.440 the way to best professionally and maturely and in a 0:08:29.600 --> 0:08:33.480 cool way offer up a new product, so that I 0:08:33.559 --> 0:08:36.319 didn't like. I do love the colors, but I'm confused 0:08:36.320 --> 0:08:38.640 because they look like they're black and green, and then 0:08:38.679 --> 0:08:40.680 based on the press release, it's green and then like 0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:44.520 eleventeen other colors, So I'm not sure where that's gonna. 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:47.440 Go, which are also the same colors as PWHL Boston, 0:08:47.480 --> 0:08:49.439 which is also now Boston Fleet. I have to get 0:08:49.480 --> 0:08:50.800 in the habit of saying that name. 0:08:51.400 --> 0:08:55.480 Yeah, so they picked the same colors but didn't acknowledge 0:08:55.480 --> 0:08:58.640 their existence. And also worth noting there was a Boston 0:08:58.720 --> 0:09:03.040 Breakers soccer team. I understand wanting to separate yourself from 0:09:03.040 --> 0:09:06.480 that team how the franchise went everything else, but there 0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:08.440 almost feels like there could be at least a reference 0:09:08.440 --> 0:09:10.400 of sort of Phoenix rising from the Ashes thing, as 0:09:10.400 --> 0:09:14.040 opposed to a complete elimination of the existence of that team. 0:09:14.400 --> 0:09:17.160 It just the whole thing feels. 0:09:17.920 --> 0:09:21.040 Even the press release has a line that is playfully 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:23.640 pointing out that in a city filled with championships, it's 0:09:23.640 --> 0:09:27.160 sports heroes need not all be male, Like, okay, well 0:09:27.160 --> 0:09:28.200 what about Hillary Knight? 0:09:29.240 --> 0:09:29.440 Right? 0:09:30.080 --> 0:09:32.920 Oh, I think it's Honestly, it's getting back to your point, Sarah, 0:09:32.920 --> 0:09:35.560 of like what era this feels like it's from, and me, 0:09:36.160 --> 0:09:39.400 it just feels like a red flag of if this 0:09:39.600 --> 0:09:42.240 is the campaign, what is it signifying about? What else 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:45.360 is happening behind the scenes in terms of the professional 0:09:46.080 --> 0:09:47.120 layout of this team. 0:09:47.520 --> 0:09:48.280 Completely agree. 0:09:48.320 --> 0:09:50.200 We don't want to make any snap judgments, but it 0:09:50.240 --> 0:09:53.760 does feel like it's a try hard from a different 0:09:53.760 --> 0:09:56.200 time and it feels like we're in a different place now, 0:09:56.240 --> 0:09:59.760 and I really hope that this is not indicative of 0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:04.000 how the larger team and franchise will be run and managed. 0:10:04.040 --> 0:10:05.840 Okay, much more on this tomorrow. 0:10:05.920 --> 0:10:07.600 We got to take a quick break, But first I 0:10:07.640 --> 0:10:09.400 want to tell y'all that we got a survey that 0:10:09.440 --> 0:10:11.280 we want you Orange slices to fill out. 0:10:11.320 --> 0:10:12.559 It's really important to us. 0:10:12.840 --> 0:10:14.800 We are in the business of constant improvement here and 0:10:14.840 --> 0:10:16.079 we need your help to do it. So if you 0:10:16.200 --> 0:10:18.679 visit the link in the episode notes, it'll take two 0:10:18.760 --> 0:10:21.079 minutes of your time. Alex Meisch and I would really 0:10:21.080 --> 0:10:24.640 appreciate it, and one lucky participant will win a sports 0:10:24.640 --> 0:10:26.680 prize pack, So you know you want to fill it 0:10:26.720 --> 0:10:29.839 out now. I promise it's super quick, super helpful to us. 0:10:29.920 --> 0:10:31.079 Thank you when we come back. 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:33.200 Michael Voppel on who's got the edge in Game three? 0:10:33.280 --> 0:10:39.760 The Links or the Limps? 0:10:41.080 --> 0:10:44.120 Joining us now an ESPN senior writer who has reported 0:10:44.120 --> 0:10:47.520 on women's sports for the Worldwide Leader since nineteen ninety six. 0:10:47.600 --> 0:10:50.320 A mazoograd that first cut his teeth in newspapers. In 0:10:50.360 --> 0:10:52.679 twenty twenty two, he received the Kurt Gouty Media Award 0:10:52.679 --> 0:10:55.040 for Print Media from the Nasmith Memorial Basketball Hall of 0:10:55.040 --> 0:10:58.240 Fame for contributions to basketball media. He's a lifelong Saint 0:10:58.240 --> 0:11:00.400 Louis Cardinals fan, but we'll try not to hold that 0:11:00.559 --> 0:11:01.200 against them. 0:11:01.520 --> 0:11:03.240 It's Michael Volpol what's up, Michael? 0:11:04.120 --> 0:11:07.160 How you doing, Sarah? I think we were both equally 0:11:07.760 --> 0:11:09.600 unhappy during this baseball season. 0:11:09.760 --> 0:11:12.240 Yeah, I heard it's still going on, but who could 0:11:12.240 --> 0:11:13.360 eat track of those things. 0:11:13.400 --> 0:11:15.120 I'm just ready for spring training next year. 0:11:15.880 --> 0:11:18.160 Okay, let's talk hoops because on Monday you dropped a 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:20.480 comprehensive history of the Liberty franchise. 0:11:20.480 --> 0:11:21.600 You've been covering ball. 0:11:21.400 --> 0:11:23.840 Since the mid nineties, so I want to know what 0:11:23.880 --> 0:11:25.920 stands out to you from those early days of the 0:11:25.920 --> 0:11:28.960 Liberty because I loved reading about you know, Rebecca Lobo 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:32.280 telling you Rosy O'donald, Tyra Banks, Gregory Hines, Jone Jet, 0:11:32.320 --> 0:11:35.560 Penny Marshall, all these folks courtside, and there were huge 0:11:35.600 --> 0:11:38.040 fan bases then, like it was really a thing in 0:11:38.040 --> 0:11:39.360 the nineties to be a Liberty fan. 0:11:39.400 --> 0:11:40.640 What stands out to you from back then? 0:11:41.880 --> 0:11:44.200 It was a lot of fun going to those games, 0:11:44.400 --> 0:11:50.920 and I think those teams were teams that embodied New York. 0:11:51.160 --> 0:11:53.720 And the interesting thing about that, Sarah is there was 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:56.559 only you know one where I say, true new york Er, 0:11:56.760 --> 0:11:59.440 Sue Wix, who's this new York is new York gets 0:11:59.720 --> 0:12:03.080 But you had people from all over the country, including 0:12:03.600 --> 0:12:09.200 Teresa Weatherspoon from very little town Pineland, Texas, and they 0:12:09.240 --> 0:12:12.400 all came to New York and became New Yorkers. Stu 0:12:12.480 --> 0:12:14.720 Wicks told me something I thought was sort of you 0:12:14.720 --> 0:12:19.720 could use this as an example of any occupation. She said, 0:12:19.720 --> 0:12:22.520 people go to New York to become who they are, 0:12:23.240 --> 0:12:27.520 and I think that's what that group did, and you're right, 0:12:29.360 --> 0:12:31.560 there was so there were a lot of celebrities there. 0:12:31.600 --> 0:12:33.520 They were a fun team to watch, and it was 0:12:33.559 --> 0:12:37.439 an atmosphere that I think really helped propel the early 0:12:37.520 --> 0:12:38.319 years of the w. 0:12:39.600 --> 0:12:41.920 On a recent show, we talked about an excerpt from 0:12:42.240 --> 0:12:44.679 Those Guys Have All the Fun, the book about ESPN 0:12:44.760 --> 0:12:48.480 the Oral History, and one of the things that came 0:12:48.600 --> 0:12:51.640 up was that a ESPN exec was intentional about trying 0:12:51.679 --> 0:12:54.120 to bury the WNBA, wasn't a fan, wanted to put 0:12:54.120 --> 0:12:57.560 it on the side channels, and was effective in sort 0:12:57.640 --> 0:13:01.360 of preventing the growth that might have had happened. Do 0:13:01.440 --> 0:13:03.600 you think that that's the main reason that when we 0:13:03.679 --> 0:13:07.560 hear some of these statistics like biggest audience sense and 0:13:07.600 --> 0:13:11.280 it's usually the late nineties or highest attendance sense, and 0:13:11.320 --> 0:13:14.560 it's sometimes back in the early years that those Halcyon 0:13:14.640 --> 0:13:16.800 DAEs for the Liberty and other teams that were early 0:13:17.000 --> 0:13:20.880 in the WRE could have. You know, it resulted in 0:13:20.920 --> 0:13:22.920 even more growth, and we could be even further along 0:13:22.960 --> 0:13:24.679 than we are now if not for some of the 0:13:24.720 --> 0:13:27.800 intention of people in holding the league back. 0:13:28.800 --> 0:13:31.160 I think that's a fair thing to say, Sarah, when 0:13:31.200 --> 0:13:38.000 you understand the culture that we were dealing with, which 0:13:38.920 --> 0:13:43.080 was openly hostile. It's one thing for television executives to say, 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:44.959 you know what, I'm not sure this is going to 0:13:45.080 --> 0:13:49.280 work we've got to make business decisions. I don't feel 0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:52.240 like a lot of the decisions that got made and 0:13:52.760 --> 0:13:55.800 unfortunately sometimes still get made with women's sports is coming 0:13:56.840 --> 0:13:59.680 all the time from people who don't have other agendas. 0:13:59.720 --> 0:14:02.640 They may not, I will give them some credit. They 0:14:02.679 --> 0:14:07.200 may not always understand their own biases, but there's definitely biases. 0:14:07.559 --> 0:14:12.480 And I found it interesting people. You know, you mentioned 0:14:12.480 --> 0:14:15.040 that people can figure out who this was because this 0:14:15.800 --> 0:14:17.040 gentleman was right. 0:14:17.080 --> 0:14:19.359 We already mentioned it on the show. Yeah. 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:24.960 What I find interesting in sort of a fun ironic 0:14:25.080 --> 0:14:28.360 way is he went to the University of Iowa, and 0:14:28.400 --> 0:14:30.680 I think we know that somebody from the University of 0:14:30.680 --> 0:14:34.840 Iowa has really helped these days. Sometimes I'm not sure 0:14:34.840 --> 0:14:38.440 it would go the same, Yeah, exactly, but the way 0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:42.240 that you described that, which is very true, that at 0:14:42.320 --> 0:14:48.200 least initially there was so much positive forward momentum and 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:52.200 then there was some intentional actions that stopped. 0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:53.200 That moment Yeah. 0:14:53.520 --> 0:14:55.760 Yeah, I mean it's interesting, and we talked about it 0:14:55.800 --> 0:14:57.920 when I was still full time at ESPN and now 0:14:57.920 --> 0:15:01.200 even part time at ESPN, that it's both such a 0:15:01.240 --> 0:15:05.440 massive part of the rights packages and highlighting women's athletes 0:15:05.480 --> 0:15:09.360 and giving amazing storytelling, and also it feels like there 0:15:09.360 --> 0:15:13.880 are other ways that it could be using its power 0:15:13.920 --> 0:15:17.920 and its influence, and certainly feels like maybe it did 0:15:18.040 --> 0:15:21.480 at that time. And so we're looking at incredible, huge 0:15:21.560 --> 0:15:24.640 growth now, but we also maybe could be further along 0:15:24.720 --> 0:15:27.240 if not for some of those stretches where people were 0:15:27.240 --> 0:15:30.160 acting with intention to hold it back. In that Liberty 0:15:30.200 --> 0:15:33.080 story that you wrote, you accurately dubbed the Liberty franchise 0:15:33.200 --> 0:15:38.040 history as tortured. Nineteen playoff appearances, five finals appearances, and 0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:41.080 no titles yet for the Libs, what has to change 0:15:41.120 --> 0:15:43.280 for New York to finally get the victory this year? 0:15:45.240 --> 0:15:47.840 They have the talent, you know, we've seen that the 0:15:47.920 --> 0:15:51.520 last two years by bringing in especially bringing in bringing 0:15:51.600 --> 0:15:54.520 a store, you know, at in her prime years, the 0:15:54.680 --> 0:15:58.000 biggest free agent signing we've seen in the league. And 0:15:58.760 --> 0:16:01.280 the fact that you have an another MVP and John 0:16:01.320 --> 0:16:04.040 will Jones who's really adjusted her game to play well 0:16:04.160 --> 0:16:08.480 with Brionna scort. I think Sabrina Yanesque has grown up 0:16:08.560 --> 0:16:13.480 so much right before our eyes in her game, Sarah, 0:16:13.480 --> 0:16:15.760 because you know how good she was in college, but 0:16:15.840 --> 0:16:18.720 that game had to evolve. She's done that and I 0:16:18.760 --> 0:16:22.480 also think she's just a really good, smart leader for 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:29.280 this group. Can they get past the can they get 0:16:29.280 --> 0:16:34.320 past their history? And this is what I think. You 0:16:34.480 --> 0:16:39.520 know this as a fan. It's almost, I would say, 0:16:39.560 --> 0:16:45.200 eerie sometimes how franchise is in different sports. Even though 0:16:45.280 --> 0:16:48.200 everybody who was involved in that history twenty five thirty 0:16:48.280 --> 0:16:51.440 years ago is no longer with the team, those histories 0:16:51.760 --> 0:16:55.440 can still weigh on teams and it can take a while. 0:16:55.920 --> 0:16:59.960 They have slain one demon, if you will. They got 0:17:00.120 --> 0:17:03.880 past the Las Vegas asis, but that didn't get him 0:17:03.880 --> 0:17:07.800 a championship, right. They still have to jump one more hurdle. 0:17:08.119 --> 0:17:10.359 It's interesting you say that because I actually remember on 0:17:10.440 --> 0:17:13.240 Around the Horn talking about the Cubs during their twenty 0:17:13.240 --> 0:17:16.520 sixteen World Series run and saying to all the fans 0:17:16.560 --> 0:17:18.959 who were losing their minds about the deficit they had 0:17:19.000 --> 0:17:21.760 dug for themselves and how they were all going to 0:17:21.800 --> 0:17:23.840 feel the weight of one hundred plus years of not 0:17:23.920 --> 0:17:26.439 having won. And I said, the longest tenured person on 0:17:26.480 --> 0:17:28.440 the team is Anthony Rizzo, which I believe at the 0:17:28.480 --> 0:17:31.640 time was eight years. He is not carrying around your 0:17:31.960 --> 0:17:35.760 seventy years of disappointed fandom, right, like most of these 0:17:35.760 --> 0:17:37.480 people have only been around for a couple years, and 0:17:37.520 --> 0:17:39.600 of course they get it, but it's not the same. 0:17:39.640 --> 0:17:41.560 And I hope that that's the case for the Liberty 0:17:41.600 --> 0:17:44.359 as well, that yes, they know that they're trying to 0:17:44.520 --> 0:17:47.920 end this streak of no franchise titles, but also they 0:17:48.400 --> 0:17:52.119 in particular folks like Brianna Courtney Vanderslo like people have 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:54.520 won elsewhere and they come to this perhaps with a 0:17:54.520 --> 0:17:57.439 little bit less of these sphincter tightening than the fans 0:17:57.440 --> 0:17:59.440 of the Liberty who have felt this way for the 0:17:59.560 --> 0:18:01.320 entirety of the franchise's existence. 0:18:01.320 --> 0:18:04.480 You know you mentioned Sabrina and Nescu. Gosh, you're so right. 0:18:04.560 --> 0:18:06.320 Her game has changed this year in ways that have 0:18:06.359 --> 0:18:09.520 been so important to this team, and in this series. 0:18:09.880 --> 0:18:13.880 She was decent numbers in Game one, but terrible shooting percentage, 0:18:13.880 --> 0:18:15.680 and then in Game two effective as a scorer in 0:18:15.720 --> 0:18:18.160 the first half and then became a facilitator and defender 0:18:18.160 --> 0:18:19.840 in the second half, which was just what the team 0:18:19.880 --> 0:18:22.800 needed as other folks like Benija Laney Hamilton and Brianna 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:25.320 Stewart were scoring well. Can you put in perspective how 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:28.360 important her improvement was for this year's team, particularly during 0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:31.600 stretches where Courtney Vanderslut had to be out and wasn't 0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:34.439 available for the team, and sab stepped up as more 0:18:34.480 --> 0:18:35.639 of a point guard type player. 0:18:36.480 --> 0:18:41.280 That's exactly what happened, you know. Unfortunately, very sadly, Courtney 0:18:41.400 --> 0:18:44.280 Vanderslute lost her mom did have a long battle with cancer. 0:18:44.320 --> 0:18:48.960 So Courtney was out for several games, and during that time, Sabrina, 0:18:49.200 --> 0:18:51.520 you know, really had to be a rock for the 0:18:51.560 --> 0:18:56.440 franchise in terms of playing the point guard role. Is 0:18:56.480 --> 0:18:59.680 it is so insightful that you bring up the differences 0:18:59.720 --> 0:19:02.000 between in games one and two because you could look 0:19:02.040 --> 0:19:04.840 at I think Sabrina only took one shot in the 0:19:04.880 --> 0:19:08.560 second half and in tours and some people, if you 0:19:08.680 --> 0:19:10.720 just look at a box score, you might say, oh, well, 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:12.840 you know what happened, she had fourteen points. Well what 0:19:12.920 --> 0:19:16.560 happened is she adjusted to the defense that Minnesota was playing, 0:19:16.560 --> 0:19:19.560 and as you said, she became a facilitator and defender. 0:19:20.280 --> 0:19:23.600 I think that made a big difference, because when you're 0:19:23.880 --> 0:19:26.679 somebody who can score the way she does, sometimes you 0:19:26.800 --> 0:19:31.040 have to realize they're really selling out on me. I 0:19:31.160 --> 0:19:33.639 can I can help this team win other ways? And 0:19:33.680 --> 0:19:38.040 she said something actually today, right before the Liberty practice, 0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:40.359 she said, I don't want to be the type of 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:43.520 player that teams can say, if we stop her from shooting, 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:47.679 we can beat the Liberty And that is exactly what 0:19:47.720 --> 0:19:48.639 you're talking about. 0:19:48.720 --> 0:19:53.399 Yeah, being a multi threat. Yep, yep, that's great that 0:19:53.440 --> 0:19:54.840 she gets that. All right. 0:19:54.880 --> 0:19:57.200 Game three shifts to Minneapolis. What do you see changing 0:19:57.240 --> 0:19:58.040 as the target center? 0:19:59.440 --> 0:20:03.320 Obviously you're going to have the different vibe, but this 0:20:03.400 --> 0:20:06.439 is a Liberty team that had the best road record 0:20:06.640 --> 0:20:11.199 in the league, So I think that they're not, you know, 0:20:11.280 --> 0:20:14.600 going in intimidated, but it is going to be very loud, 0:20:14.880 --> 0:20:18.800 very huge crowd. I think they're hoping they're going to 0:20:18.800 --> 0:20:23.879 get a sell out for this. But from a strategy standpoint, 0:20:24.240 --> 0:20:28.640 it'll be interesting to see what Minnesota tries to do 0:20:28.960 --> 0:20:35.879