Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is live
Speaker 1: from coast to coast with Caroline Hide in New York
Speaker 1: and v Lovelow in San Francisco.
Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Tech coming up.
Speaker 3: Oracle data center financing being questioned. Ellison's Giant says the
Speaker 3: equity deal for its Michigan project is on schedule and
Speaker 3: doesn't include Blue ol Capital.
Speaker 2: US.
Speaker 3: Open Ai is in talks to raise ten billion dollars
Speaker 3: from Amazon.
Speaker 2: We'll use this trainium chips.
Speaker 3: We have the story, and Waimo is in talks to
Speaker 3: raise more than fifteen billion dollars at a valuation that
Speaker 3: could exceed one hundred billion. Details later in the hour,
Speaker 3: but we begin with our top story. Oracle shares extending losses,
Speaker 3: worst day that we've seen since December, the tenth for
Speaker 3: the lowest since June of this year. Oracle's largest data
Speaker 3: center finance partner, that's Blue ol Capital, will not back
Speaker 3: a ten billion dollar deal for a one gigawatt facility
Speaker 3: in Michigan. Still, Oracle says that the data center project
Speaker 3: remains on schedule and said it's development partner Related Digital
Speaker 3: shows the best equity partner from a competitive group of options,
Speaker 3: which in this instance was not Blue ou More returned
Speaker 3: to Ploomberg's Brodie.
Speaker 2: Ford covering all things Oracle.
Speaker 3: You've talked about how certain data center projects that are
Speaker 3: going to be there for open AI might be behind schedule.
Speaker 2: But have you heard and.
Speaker 3: Are we reporting out that financing is becoming more difficult
Speaker 3: to raise for these data centers.
Speaker 4: The big context on Oracle is that they are embarking
Speaker 4: on a historic build out data centers where it's.
Speaker 5: Really a logistical feat.
Speaker 4: It's quite a tight schedule they need to be on
Speaker 4: and if it all goes right, it's transformational for Oracle
Speaker 4: and the entire industry. But all that needs to happen
Speaker 4: for that to get off is a couple things falling
Speaker 4: out right. And that's the issue with what we're seeing
Speaker 4: today is that the FT is reporting that there's been
Speaker 4: some issues in getting the financing for one of their
Speaker 4: big centers, and that's giving investors a lot of anxiety that, Hey,
Speaker 4: are are these lenders seeing something that we are not.
Speaker 4: That's what's driving the fear this morning.
Speaker 3: What interesting is you've been writing about the sheer scale
Speaker 3: of leases, right, and I think leases is something different
Speaker 3: because it's off balance sheet. You're always saying, we're hearing
Speaker 3: it in attend Q that they could have up to
Speaker 3: three hundred billion dollars worth they're about in terms of
Speaker 3: their overall leases that eventually they're on.
Speaker 2: The hook for paying. Yes, how is this different?
Speaker 3: How is this sort of financing different from capital expenditure?
Speaker 4: And they're like, right, so we're used to hearing about
Speaker 4: capital expenditures, which is I'm going out and buying computers,
Speaker 4: I'm buying wires, I'm buying the data centers themselves. But
Speaker 4: what's becoming more popular is renting the data centers, and
Speaker 4: that allows you to not pay everything upfront and not
Speaker 4: have that beyond your books directly. And so what we've
Speaker 4: seen is a big spike in these kind of future
Speaker 4: dated commitments. That Oracle is the example that they have
Speaker 4: about two hundred and fifty billion that they're on the
Speaker 4: hook for over the next twenty years or so, and
Speaker 4: most likely this Michigan data center would be one of them.
Speaker 4: It's just kind of, you know, one more pool of
Speaker 4: spending that we realize quite how large this buildout is
Speaker 4: going to be.
Speaker 3: What's interesting, I think is the Oracle is different from
Speaker 3: the other hyperscalers. And then it's relatively new to this
Speaker 3: whole data center least build out element.
Speaker 2: It used to be a software company.
Speaker 3: So is that something that also the market's trying to
Speaker 3: factor in How good is it at this compared to Alphabet, Microsoft, Amazon,
Speaker 3: who've been in this game for a very long time.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a huge part, right, I mean, if Microsoft
Speaker 4: has one hundred billion in commitments, people don't batinize much
Speaker 4: because their cash flow is quite a different style than
Speaker 4: of Oracles. Right, I mean, oracles spending is such a
Speaker 4: large percentage of its overall company size because it's making
Speaker 4: a very ambitious transformation. Now, if you're a bull on Oracle,
Speaker 4: you say, yeah, well, you know they are doing what
Speaker 4: it takes to transform their business. But a lot of
Speaker 4: things need to go exactly as planned for this to
Speaker 4: go right.
Speaker 3: You're going to be across how all of it does
Speaker 3: go right or as planned? Rarely forward across the Oracle story. Look,
Speaker 3: let's turn to well, the company that's buying a lot
Speaker 3: of the data center or needs the data center compute
Speaker 3: from Oracle, and it's Open AI.
Speaker 2: It's in initial discussions.
Speaker 3: To raise at least ten billion dollars from Amazon, and
Speaker 3: we'll use some of the cloud giant's Trainium chips as well.
Speaker 3: For more, let's go to Bloomberg's Matt Day, who covers Amazon.
Speaker 2: Is this a circular deal?
Speaker 6: Oh, it sure looks like it.
Speaker 7: A few row o'clock back a month, open ai bought
Speaker 7: thirty eight billion dollars of compute capacity from Amazon.
Speaker 6: That was a seven year deal. It was primarily for
Speaker 6: Nvidio chips.
Speaker 7: Per for this news that emerged last night, looks like
Speaker 7: Amazon maybe giving some chunk of that back and investment
Speaker 7: open Ai.
Speaker 3: So ten million dollars in equity so that open ai
Speaker 3: can continue to afford to buy compute, of which is
Speaker 3: going to be buying from Amazon and its trips. But
Speaker 3: go to the chips part of this, because Matt, this
Speaker 3: could be a real endorsement once again for Trainium in
Speaker 3: the same way that Anthropic lent its name on its
Speaker 3: capacity for actually using them.
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 7: Amazon also a close partner of Anthropic. They've invested eight
Speaker 7: billion dollars in that company as part of a deal
Speaker 7: that got Anthropic to use Amazon's own homegrown AI chip
Speaker 7: for their models. Right, So this would definitely be a
Speaker 7: coup for Amazon's in house chip making effort, but ch
Speaker 7: analysts are still trying to struggling a little bit to
Speaker 7: understand the effectiveness of to date, in part because there's
Speaker 7: just few enormous customers for this stuff. There's not a
Speaker 7: whole lot of big model trainers out there, so those
Speaker 7: without saying that if open ai can make the GPT
Speaker 7: suite work on top of Amazon's Silicon, that's a big
Speaker 7: deal for eight offus and for Amazon.
Speaker 3: Because it was such a big deal for Alphabet, And
Speaker 3: we think about the endorsement that its vertical model seems
Speaker 3: to be getting from the market. What does it mean
Speaker 3: for in video because as you mentioned, the previous cloud
Speaker 3: deal between open ai and Amazon actually was a ringing
Speaker 3: endorsement for in video chips.
Speaker 7: It means there's hunger for an alternative too in video.
Speaker 7: I mean, in video stuff works well, but it's expensive,
Speaker 7: it's in short supply only one supplier. So you've definitely
Speaker 7: got increased credibility among the other folks who are putting
Speaker 7: out AI accelerators on the market. You know, AMD has
Speaker 7: an open Ai ideal. For instance, Amazon and Google's TPUs
Speaker 7: are all making a claim for some of that big
Speaker 7: Nvidia business.
Speaker 3: All of this is about trying to finance the heaven
Speaker 3: needing compute coming from the likes of open ai, mat day,
Speaker 3: brilliant reporting.
Speaker 2: Thank you very much. Indeed, let's get the market reaction.
Speaker 3: Let's get an investor perspective for you, Tony Ams with
Speaker 3: us here is put flow Manager at t rope. Price
Speaker 3: is twelve billion dollars Science and Technology Fund. You are
Speaker 3: naming an own who's who of the players within AI
Speaker 3: infrastructure and AI used. Tony, are you worried let's start
Speaker 3: with Amazon and open ai. Are you worried about the
Speaker 3: circularity of deals once again at play here?
Speaker 8: Yeah, Well, I think that whenever there's some type of
Speaker 8: creative financing, there's always some scrutiny that's on there. But
Speaker 8: I kind of view it as you know, there is
Speaker 8: a synergistic partnership here and that you know, open ai
Speaker 8: is growing rapidly, they need to compute, and it makes
Speaker 8: sense that they want to look forward multisurce, and so
Speaker 8: I think going to Amazon does make sense.
Speaker 6: In addition, I think they want some of that upside.
Speaker 8: And so you're seeing like whenever there's like a new
Speaker 8: frontier of technology, there's often you know, companies that need
Speaker 8: to come together and build the ecosystem, and I think
Speaker 8: that this is an instance.
Speaker 6: Of this, and so you know, I think it's definitely
Speaker 6: something to watch.
Speaker 8: But I think that what matters at the end of
Speaker 8: the day is that AI continues to progress as scaling
Speaker 8: laws hold, the use of you know, CHATTERBTL, lens continue
Speaker 8: to grow, and I think that when you look at
Speaker 8: these tools that are coming out for the companies, they
Speaker 8: are like transformational in terms of how we are rethinking work.
Speaker 8: So I think what really matters is that the end
Speaker 8: demand continues to be really strong and that we're seeing
Speaker 8: progress on AI.
Speaker 3: I'm looking at your holdings and the number one holding
Speaker 3: that you have at the moment is Alphabet. Interesting news
Speaker 3: with a new Gemini release this morning, which we'll get into,
Speaker 3: But video is your second biggest. Now are you worried
Speaker 3: about in video losing any sort of market share too
Speaker 3: Alphabet to Amazon, to some of these other chip players.
Speaker 8: Yeah, well, I think the person market is growing and
Speaker 8: so you know, this is an exponentcial growth curve. So
Speaker 8: I don't think that it's a winner take all and
Speaker 8: so you know, multiple companies can can do well and
Speaker 8: in some ways I think when you step back and
Speaker 8: think about what's going on, you know there are there
Speaker 8: is kind of a space race for AI, but they're
Speaker 8: going to multiple areas, multiple moons, and so they're all
Speaker 8: doing their own kind of domain expertise. I think like
Speaker 8: with the TPU, it's very optimized, you know, for a
Speaker 8: specific stack and for the Google ecosystem.
Speaker 6: And then I think in video is like kind of
Speaker 6: more of the merchant.
Speaker 8: A broader platform can run everything, and I think both
Speaker 8: can have a place and you can see that. You know,
Speaker 8: Google has been doing really well over the last five years,
Speaker 8: so as Nvidia. So has a MD so has Broadcom,
Speaker 8: and so to me, I think that you know, there's
Speaker 8: not a winner take all year.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 3: I love that sort of element of there are many races,
Speaker 3: maybe many moons, Tony, But talk to us about the
Speaker 3: moon shot that Oracle is making at the moment, and
Speaker 3: the anxiety that people might not be wanting to lend
Speaker 3: to their future of leasing and the sheer scale of
Speaker 3: capacity that they're building with other partners of course out
Speaker 3: there like related Digital.
Speaker 2: Have you got any anxiety around Oracle?
Speaker 3: I know it's in your portfolio last time that it
Speaker 3: was published.
Speaker 8: Yeah, so I think that you know, Oracle delways sees
Speaker 8: the demand signals that are probably really strong, and so
Speaker 8: they're looking to meet that demand, you know, in the
Speaker 8: near term with leases and then over the long term
Speaker 8: probably with owning their own capacity. And so to me,
Speaker 8: they see that this has a big opportunity that is
Speaker 8: once in a generation, and so they're building for it
Speaker 8: and they're you know, kind of.
Speaker 6: Being creative with it.
Speaker 8: And so to me, it definitely you know, Marcus super concerned.
Speaker 8: I think that there's probably somewhat an overreaction. And I
Speaker 8: think as long as like you know, the demand is
Speaker 8: there in years three to five, I think that that's
Speaker 8: what made kind of the oracle that made sense.
Speaker 3: So all of this anxiety written large around sort of
Speaker 3: whether it's more experimental financing, creative financing, circular financing.
Speaker 2: Is it actually a buying opportunity for you.
Speaker 8: Tony, I think we're constantly managing risk and you know,
Speaker 8: rotating the portfolio to what has the highest RLI, what
Speaker 8: has the best press could justin in return, you know,
Speaker 8: I still think that AI is like continue to be
Speaker 8: a really good area of place capital.
Speaker 6: You know, it's a lot of multi year inflection.
Speaker 8: That being said, it's also been uh, you know, two
Speaker 8: three years since chatcha met has been launched, and so
Speaker 8: we are kind of, you know, further along in AI,
Speaker 8: but I still think we're pretty early, and so you
Speaker 8: know a lot of my views, you know, are expressed
Speaker 8: over the multi year and think that you want to
Speaker 8: invest in companies that strong competitive advantages, that capture the
Speaker 8: value with their ecosystem. And I think that not everyone's
Speaker 8: going to be a winner in the space race, like
Speaker 8: some rockets might not make it. But to me, I
Speaker 8: think it still is like a really great overall theme
Speaker 8: to be invested in.
Speaker 2: At the moment.
Speaker 3: You think the rockets to be betting on are in
Speaker 3: order of importance, Alphabet and Video, Broadcom, Apple, Microsoft, But
Speaker 3: how will that change as the application of AI comes.
Speaker 3: Thus far, it has all been about the AI infrastructure,
Speaker 3: but there's going to have to be proof in the
Speaker 3: putting the productivity. Are your science and tech fund going
Speaker 3: to end up looking like healthcare companies, like financial companies,
Speaker 3: like actually the users of this tech?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think that's a great question.
Speaker 8: And you know, often I think about where the economic
Speaker 8: profit pools are are shifting or where is the second derivative,
Speaker 8: like you know, accelerating too, and you've been right, like
Speaker 8: you know, the last few years have been really heavy
Speaker 8: infrastructure build outs and that's where a lot of the
Speaker 8: companies have crewed.
Speaker 6: A lot of value.
Speaker 8: You think about you know, in video broadcom those have
Speaker 8: been like you know examples, and then you're also seeing
Speaker 8: the components that are going in this system like you know, memory,
Speaker 8: hp M, you know, networking. Those companies are seeing a
Speaker 8: lot of like traction and economic profit accruing there. And
Speaker 8: then I think the next space probably is on the
Speaker 8: application layer, and so you know, there are large language
Speaker 8: models like you know, TRAGBT andthropic, you know, XAI that
Speaker 8: are all working on this, and so yeah, I think
Speaker 8: it's going to be exciting, and I think you might
Speaker 8: even see some you know previously you know, viewed as
Speaker 8: kind of on the wrong side of AI, like perhaps
Speaker 8: be able to capture value. I think there's software companies
Speaker 8: that have kind of been written off here in enterprise
Speaker 8: that you know, if you're a fortunate by grant companies,
Speaker 8: often you're going to go to your software vendor once
Speaker 8: you figured out, you know, what play you want to
Speaker 8: implement AI. So I think that there could be you know,
Speaker 8: new companies that form on application were but there could
Speaker 8: also be incumbents that are now leveraging AI seeing the
Speaker 8: compute costs go down and you know, the capabilities and
Speaker 8: models be more domain specific. So I think it's an
Speaker 8: exciting time to be in technology. It's constantly evolving, and
Speaker 8: I think that there will be also great opportunities you
Speaker 8: know that we don't think about right now.
Speaker 3: Well, you're in some of the software play, in particular salesforce,
Speaker 3: which has been a bit beaten up for perhaps being
Speaker 3: not at the typical sphere of things AI in terms
Speaker 3: of the monetization. But where's really been monetizing has been
Speaker 3: the picks and shovels and memory of late. You just
Speaker 3: mentioned memory, we've got Micron after the bell. Are you
Speaker 3: feeling positive about how much more we're seeing price strength
Speaker 3: from these sorts of companies.
Speaker 8: Yeah, we're definitely on an upward trajectory and memory prices.
Speaker 8: So I think what's going on there is that HPM,
Speaker 8: the stuff that goes into these GPUs and AI systems,
Speaker 8: you know, they soak up a lot of way for
Speaker 8: capacity and so as a results, creating shortage is in
Speaker 8: broader dram and then also that's great shortages in broader
Speaker 8: land and so that you're seeing list ripple effect into
Speaker 8: other areas like sand disks for example, I've seen, you know,
Speaker 8: tremendous appreciation of their stock price.
Speaker 6: So yeah, I think that there will be.
Speaker 8: These areas where you know, the economic product can be
Speaker 8: distributed to even more that didn't participate as much over
Speaker 8: the last few years.
Speaker 3: What's really interesting and correct me if I'm wrong, But
Speaker 3: I've gone to the bluemog terminal. I've looked at the
Speaker 3: members that make up your fund. Lambing private company is
Speaker 3: in there. You of course, of course a tro price
Speaker 3: know the opportunity there is in these crossover financings and
Speaker 3: the desire there is for private companies and exposure to it.
Speaker 2: So are you going to be.
Speaker 3: Seeing these companies going public? You're looking more for private
Speaker 3: holdings as well as public.
Speaker 6: Yeah, thanks for asking about that.
Speaker 8: You know, at Hero, I think whatever our biggest competitive
Speaker 8: avantages that we are you know, both public and we're
Speaker 8: also one of the biggest financers in the private markets,
Speaker 8: and so we partnered up with lamb Uh. You know,
Speaker 8: I think that they've got a really interesting cloud stat
Speaker 8: that is unique, and they're on the right side change
Speaker 8: of building these data centers really on you know, to
Speaker 8: what you would want a true AI data center to
Speaker 8: be like, so without a lot of the baggages that
Speaker 8: you would have to hold in traditional compute and so,
Speaker 8: you know, I think the future is bright for them.
Speaker 8: The team's executing extremely well and excited that you know,
Speaker 8: they continue to progress, you know in terms of you know,
Speaker 8: timing on public markets, like I think that they'll do
Speaker 8: it when they're ready.
Speaker 3: We'll keep an eye on Lambda and the executive team
Speaker 3: over there as well. Turny On he's portfolio manager at
Speaker 3: t Rowe Price Science and Technology Fund Public private. We
Speaker 3: went everywhere mean while coming up the bidding battle for
Speaker 3: Warner Brothers Reaching across Roads.
Speaker 2: That's up next is a Blomberg Tech Discovery.
Speaker 3: It is urging its shareholders to reject the Paramount's Guide
Speaker 3: dounce takeover bid, favoring its original agreement with Netflix, and
Speaker 3: Meg's Michelle Davis joins us. Now in the latest we're
Speaker 3: seeing the market reaction Paramounts guideounce off by four and
Speaker 3: a half percent. Now, so what is the thesis of
Speaker 3: Warner Brothers Discovery is why the thirty dollars. Paramount is
Speaker 3: not living up to what's been offered elsewhere.
Speaker 9: So what Warner Brothers is saying is they reviewed the
Speaker 9: Paramount thirty.
Speaker 2: Dollars a share offer.
Speaker 9: It's the same offer that Paramount had offered them two
Speaker 9: weeks ago when the board already deliberated and decided to
Speaker 9: go with Netflix. And in some ways they're saying this offer,
Speaker 9: the tender offer, is worse than what was initially offered.
Speaker 9: The logic is they don't view it as certain as
Speaker 9: the deal they already have signed with Netflix. And part
Speaker 9: of that has to do with the fact that Paramount
Speaker 9: has lined up okay, fifty four billion dollars of debt,
Speaker 9: but they also are going to need forty billion dollars
Speaker 9: of equity. And as detailed in this one hundred page
Speaker 9: filing that came out today, Warner Brothers' board says that
Speaker 9: they tried multiple time to get the Ellisons to make
Speaker 9: basically a personal commitment personally backstop the equity commitment, but they,
Speaker 9: so Warner Brothers said, refuse to do that. They're using
Speaker 9: a revocable trust to backstop the commitment, which Warner brother
Speaker 9: says is risky. You know, assets could be moved in
Speaker 9: and out of it. What they want is something that
Speaker 9: looks a little bit more like what Elon Musk did
Speaker 9: in the Twitter deal, which, if you remember, helped Twitter
Speaker 9: close that deal when Musk tried to back out of it.
Speaker 3: I mean fascinating that everywhere in our show, it's questioning
Speaker 3: of Larry Ellison's financing for various things at the moment,
Speaker 3: whether it's his son's bid for Warner Brother's Discovery, or
Speaker 3: whether it's his financing for future Oracle Data Center leases.
Speaker 3: It's interesting though, also that others have been pulling back
Speaker 3: on the potential financing. Talk to us about what's happening
Speaker 3: with Jared Kushner's Affinity.
Speaker 9: So yesterday we reported that Jared Kushner's Affinity was pulling
Speaker 9: out of the equity commitment or the backing of the
Speaker 9: Paramount bid in this kind of underscored some of the
Speaker 9: concern that the Warner Brothers board has around where all
Speaker 9: the equity is coming from, because Paramount has said that
Speaker 9: it's lined up, you know, sovereign wealth funds across the
Speaker 9: Middle East as well as Affinity as well as others
Speaker 9: to back the funding. And if those are falling through,
Speaker 9: what does that mean. It's also interesting because Kushner's involvement
Speaker 9: there had been seen as maybe something that would help
Speaker 9: Paramount clinch this if you know, he is the ally
Speaker 9: to Trump, that Paramount needs to get this through regulators
Speaker 9: without him there. I mean, it remains to be seen
Speaker 9: what that means. Warner Brothers has said that actually they
Speaker 9: view both the Paramount deal and the Netflix deal as
Speaker 9: on equal footing from a regulatory perspective.
Speaker 2: They say both.
Speaker 9: Can get through and we don't see any you know,
Speaker 9: marginal risk or difference between the two of them, and
Speaker 9: so it's kind of a moot point.
Speaker 2: I guess we'll.
Speaker 3: See how the formal rejection of Paramount software continues in
Speaker 3: this unfolding story.
Speaker 2: Quite the drama. Michelle Davis covering it all for us.
Speaker 2: We thank you.
Speaker 3: Now let's turn our attention back to large language models
Speaker 3: for a minute, because Google is rolling out a more efficient,
Speaker 3: more affordable version.
Speaker 2: It was my powerful AI model across its products.
Speaker 3: The company announcing today the release of Gemini three Flash,
Speaker 3: and this comes just one month after the release of
Speaker 3: Gemini three Pro, which reasserted its leadership in the AI race.
Speaker 3: Since then, of course, opening I declared a quote code
Speaker 3: read and pushed out a new version of its flagship
Speaker 3: GPT five model, as well as an updated image generation
Speaker 3: model to trankey pace for Google AI's offerings. Tesla it's
Speaker 3: facing a thirty day ban on car sales in California,
Speaker 3: the biggest US market. State regulators say the company's ads
Speaker 3: well they've misled consumers about its self driving technology. Tesla's
Speaker 3: lawyers insisted that the ads were protected speech.
Speaker 2: Now a judge back the DMV's complaint.
Speaker 3: The auto maker has ninety days to appeal or comply
Speaker 3: before the band take effects, and Tesla has worn the
Speaker 3: ban could have major consequences for the business. It Shares
Speaker 3: have been on a tear before today. They hit your
Speaker 3: all time high yesterday. Today we just pulled back some
Speaker 3: almost three percent lower. Now, turning to other autoe news,
Speaker 3: Weimo is in talks to raise more than fifteen billion
Speaker 3: dollars at evaluation that could exceed one hundred billion.
Speaker 2: It's all according to sources.
Speaker 3: Now the robotaxi maker has discussed raising billions in equity
Speaker 3: from external backers as well as it's parent company, Alphabet.
Speaker 2: Let's get the details. Some pretty bags. Sarah Fry, who
Speaker 2: helped break this story.
Speaker 3: And really we're starting to see the race being on
Speaker 3: one hundred billion or in excess of is a lot
Speaker 3: more than what it was previously valued back in twenty
Speaker 3: twenty four.
Speaker 10: And really those numbers, I mean in the AI race,
Speaker 10: they seem they seem equivalent to what we're seeing from
Speaker 10: you know, opening eye and found that there is a
Speaker 10: really big hope here for these companies in Weimo. The
Speaker 10: difference is it has a product that is changeable. People
Speaker 10: are using it.
Speaker 6: People are.
Speaker 10: Taking their waymos around San Francisco right around you know,
Speaker 10: see them outside by my window all the time as
Speaker 10: regular transportation options. It is real happening in many cities
Speaker 10: throughout the US right now, and I think that that
Speaker 10: is why they need so much money. This is a
Speaker 10: very expensive business. This is a business that's going to
Speaker 10: require a lot of capital to expand into other cities
Speaker 10: and also other types of roads right like freeways and.
Speaker 6: More rural areas. I don't know.
Speaker 10: How quickly that's going to roll out, but we are
Speaker 10: seeing some international expansion in the next few months as well.
Speaker 10: So it's a very big moment for wave Land, for
Speaker 10: Alphabet and.
Speaker 3: Your revenue run right you are reporting is above three
Speaker 3: hundred and fifty million dollars. Tell us just very briefly
Speaker 3: the Alphabet relationship here, they are being able to go
Speaker 3: to external capital.
Speaker 10: I've gotten a lot of questions about this because people
Speaker 10: are like, wait, isn't it way more part of Alphabet?
Speaker 10: But Alphabet is investing in them. What's going on here?
Speaker 10: So it's one of Alphabet's so called other bets. That's
Speaker 10: the division that includes these We previously thought of them
Speaker 10: as moons companies like Verily, the life science company, Weimo
Speaker 10: and Ruth Porrat under her leadership, has tried to make
Speaker 10: this a more financially financially safe and smart find the business.
Speaker 10: She's encouraging spin out, she's encouraging independence, and so Weimo
Speaker 10: is getting a lot of external support as well. And
Speaker 10: that idea is yes.
Speaker 2: I have to leave it there.
Speaker 3: Sarah on all the news to do with Weymo, Congratulations
Speaker 3: on the scoop with a Blue bag Tech.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Blue bag Tech.
Speaker 3: We check in on these markets that have some anxiety
Speaker 3: baked into them at the moment. When it comes to
Speaker 3: the financing of the AI spend. Still the question of
Speaker 3: bubble lingers. We're off by one point two percent on
Speaker 3: the NASTAC one hundred.
Speaker 2: We're looking at some.
Speaker 3: Of the biggest draws in terms of the overall points perspective.
Speaker 3: And look, we've got Sea of Read and Videos off
Speaker 3: by three point seven percent. When you're worth four trillion dollars.
Speaker 3: That matters to an overall benchmark.
Speaker 2: We've perhaps got some competition.
Speaker 3: Coming if open Ai does indeed start using Trainium over
Speaker 3: an Amazon.
Speaker 2: A key story for US today.
Speaker 3: Broadcom once again under pressure, this time by almost five percent.
Speaker 3: Remember it had been sort of hard since its earnings.
Speaker 3: We see it now at three hundred and twenty four.
Speaker 3: Micron has its earnings after the bell, or two and
Speaker 3: a half percent ahead of that number. But we're expecting
Speaker 3: fifty percent growth in revenue for this business as it's
Speaker 3: and managing to really capitalize a memory and the price
Speaker 3: of We'll dig into that in a minute, but for
Speaker 3: now we focus in on what's happening with Oracle. We're
Speaker 3: down by five percent once again. There is concerns about
Speaker 3: how Oracle is financing its big pivot into the world
Speaker 3: of cloud computing, the data centers, the leases, and indeed
Speaker 3: whether Blue Owl is able to be able to financing
Speaker 3: the latest one over in what's happening in Michigan. Let's
Speaker 3: talk about it with Manup saying Blue Mega Intelligence, Global
Speaker 3: head of Tech Research, And we are again questioning Oracle's
Speaker 3: capacity to get into this data leasing pivot. Are you
Speaker 3: worried about some of the intricacies. Look, the reporting from
Speaker 3: Bloomberg is that Oracle is still going ahead with the
Speaker 3: Michigan project. It's not being delayed from a financing perspective,
Speaker 3: it's just not blew out behind it.
Speaker 11: Yeah, And look, I think a lot of it is
Speaker 11: around what kind of open Ai run rate will we
Speaker 11: see in twenty twenty eight, twenty twenty nine, because you know,
Speaker 11: we're talking about build out of data center infrastructure for
Speaker 11: things that are going to go live, you know, in
Speaker 11: twenty twenty eight, twenty twenty nine. And that's where investors
Speaker 11: who are funding this do they have the patience to
Speaker 11: wait for revenues to show up, you know, three years out.
Speaker 11: I mean, in the case of Oracle, had the backlog
Speaker 11: not been skewed to open Ai, I don't think there
Speaker 11: would be as much anxiety.
Speaker 5: But because open ai seems to.
Speaker 11: Be losing its lead when it comes to, you know,
Speaker 11: the model provider race, and now Gemini and Tropic Xai.
Speaker 5: They all seem to have caught up.
Speaker 11: And that's where the anxiety seems to be stemming from.
Speaker 11: Is are you better off just you know, focusing on
Speaker 11: one LLM provider when you know it's going to be
Speaker 11: a race where you know, four or five providers are.
Speaker 5: Neck and neck.
Speaker 11: And if they diversify that you know, exposure in terms
Speaker 11: of having someone else like Xai use Oracle capacity, then
Speaker 11: I think that may calm down that anxiety.
Speaker 5: But for now, I.
Speaker 11: Think that's one thing and the other thing is training
Speaker 11: versus inferencing. I mean, if Oracle is more exposed to
Speaker 11: training workloads, then you have to ask yourself how much
Speaker 11: ROI will open Ai have with training the next version
Speaker 11: of their model, which is going to cost a lot more,
Speaker 11: but will it have the kind of returns that everyone
Speaker 11: expects in terms of the model intelligence and how much
Speaker 11: they're going to get out of that next training run.
Speaker 11: So no one wants to underwrite, you know, training workloads,
Speaker 11: which is why Microsoft refused that to begin with, and
Speaker 11: all that open Ai business went to Oracle. And now
Speaker 11: I think market is putting a question around why they
Speaker 11: should be funding Oracle because training is not someone something
Speaker 11: that you know, everyone is keen to invest in right now,
Speaker 11: because I mean, training costs will plateau and it's just
Speaker 11: a question of when, not if, and we don't know
Speaker 11: when it's going to happen.
Speaker 3: There's also the question of what chips you can use
Speaker 3: for training, and we're questioning in videos dominance at the
Speaker 3: same time. What's so interesting, though, is the more we
Speaker 3: peel away the layers of the onion, more we understand
Speaker 3: what this data center financing looks like and a lot
Speaker 3: of it.
Speaker 2: We all talked about capital expenditure.
Speaker 3: From all these big cloud companies, but actually we've got
Speaker 3: to look off balance sheet and we've got to look
Speaker 3: to ten Q reports with Oracle, how much is that
Speaker 3: being sacked in by equity investors as well as debt investors.
Speaker 11: I mean even a Meta is looking to finance stuff
Speaker 11: off balance sheets.
Speaker 5: So that's about to yeah, exactly.
Speaker 11: So that's where you know, all these companies don't want
Speaker 11: to take too much debt. In fact, part of the
Speaker 11: reason why Oracles equity seems to be going down is
Speaker 11: everyone is thinking maybe they should be you know, raising
Speaker 11: this money. Why raise everything using debt? And so that's
Speaker 11: where you know they're going to be creative, and sometimes
Speaker 11: you have to course correct. I mean, if look, the
Speaker 11: CDs spreads keep expanding and the market is now ready
Speaker 11: to fund it, maybe Oracle may have to bring down
Speaker 11: its ambitions in terms of you know, how much they
Speaker 11: are will be looking to build because all this is
Speaker 11: for future capacity. I mean, if you have capacity right now,
Speaker 11: you know the new clouds are doing well, Coreviv has
Speaker 11: a nice backlog and your supply constrained. So the question
Speaker 11: is will that demand pattern remain for the next three
Speaker 11: to five years, And if it does, then Oracle will
Speaker 11: be fine.
Speaker 5: It's just a question of you know how much training
Speaker 5: needs these model providers will have.
Speaker 11: And how much are you going to make from the
Speaker 11: next version of the model training. Is it really worth
Speaker 11: the ROI in terms of spending five x on the
Speaker 11: next training run when things seem to be closing down
Speaker 11: when it comes to all these frontier models. At the end,
Speaker 11: it comes down to who has the lead when it
Speaker 11: comes to models and or a while it was just
Speaker 11: open Ai Mandy saying.
Speaker 3: Of Blue Meg Intelligence the breakdown there. Let's focus in
Speaker 3: on some earnings after the Bell Micron schedule to report
Speaker 3: first quarter fiscal first quarture results and Alicus expect the
Speaker 3: chip make it to benefit from strong pricing trends. Let's
Speaker 3: get to Kim Forest, Boca Capital Partners, CIO. We're all
Speaker 3: ahead of these numbers, but a lot of optimism baked
Speaker 3: into Micron and memory makers.
Speaker 12: Right now, absolutely, and the price shows it. And there
Speaker 12: is a pattern to Micron's earnings right that, oh maybe
Speaker 12: a month before people and it's probably in reaction to
Speaker 12: Micron's customers talking about, you know, what they're buying from
Speaker 12: Micron the stock generally and when things are good, this
Speaker 12: is a very cyclical stock. But when things are good,
Speaker 12: things are very very good for Micron, and I think
Speaker 12: in a short term things are going to be really
Speaker 12: really good for Micron, But often the stock sells off
Speaker 12: right after just because of that build up that has happened,
Speaker 12: and you know, in the recent past.
Speaker 3: So I mean today kim stalks up one hundred and
Speaker 3: sixty eight percent, So we've got a little bit of
Speaker 3: a dip into the earnings. It's kind of nothing in
Speaker 3: terms of its performance, But what are you looking for
Speaker 3: after the bell in terms of signals that the strength
Speaker 3: is there and that we don't keep questioning the AI
Speaker 3: bubble as we know it.
Speaker 12: So there are very few providers of the big product
Speaker 12: that AI once, which is high bandwidth memory DRAM, and
Speaker 12: there's only two other players in the market. Micron has
Speaker 12: had a nice lead. The other players are coming up,
Speaker 12: but it looks like for at least the foreseeable future,
Speaker 12: infinite demand is there for this product. And I'm teasing, Okay,
Speaker 12: I don't really believe it's infinity, but it's a very
Speaker 12: high demand. So we would like to know what that's doing.
Speaker 12: And you can see how Micron is shifting away from
Speaker 12: its older products and it's more consumer related nand device
Speaker 12: is They announced, you know, one of their longtime franchises,
Speaker 12: they're going to be closing that in favor of putting
Speaker 12: all its effort behind d rams.
Speaker 5: So that's what I'm looking.
Speaker 12: For, is what is the Why do they have that
Speaker 12: confidence and why should we as shareholders, you know, go
Speaker 12: along with the ride.
Speaker 3: Because right now there is shaky confidence around certain names
Speaker 3: about the AIF structure buildout. Do you have shaky confidence
Speaker 3: about certain newer players to cloud newer areas and data centers.
Speaker 12: Well, this is going to sound like a Miss America
Speaker 12: kind of speech. I have a real I know AI
Speaker 12: is going to work out. I just don't know how
Speaker 12: The large language models seem to be consumers of tons
Speaker 12: of bandwidth, which you talked about on your last segment
Speaker 12: or not, you know, computing power.
Speaker 6: Not bandwidth.
Speaker 5: But I don't know that that goes on.
Speaker 12: Forever because this whole scaling thing where just throw more
Speaker 12: compute power at it seems like the brute force method
Speaker 12: and it's not very computer science. We like to think.
Speaker 12: I'm an ex practitioner. We like to think rather than
Speaker 12: just you know, build. So I'm thinking that breakthroughs in
Speaker 12: the design of these things are going to help out
Speaker 12: and may make a lot of the demand that we
Speaker 12: assume is there for hardware not irrelevant, but not infinite.
Speaker 3: Well to that point, we've seen what China has been
Speaker 3: forced to do because it can't just throw ever more
Speaker 3: compute at the situation, doesn't have access in terms of
Speaker 3: supply chain, what about micron zone ability to the global
Speaker 3: opportunity here, And they're exposed to China in some ways.
Speaker 12: Sure, I mean it is a concern because we don't
Speaker 12: really want to allow them to sell the really good
Speaker 12: stuff into China because of military issues. And well, just
Speaker 12: you know leadership, but that we're capitalist society, so some
Speaker 12: of that kind of has to get pushed aside and
Speaker 12: we let companies work throughout the world. That is a concern,
Speaker 12: But right now, for the foreseeable future, let's say eighteen
Speaker 12: months to thirty six months, there doesn't look to be
Speaker 12: another breakthrough other than scaling, and it looks like, all
Speaker 12: things being equal, that scaling is the path forward, especially
Speaker 12: for large language models. So it unless information comes to
Speaker 12: life tonight, it looks like the companies that are offering
Speaker 12: products to these big data centers are going to continue
Speaker 12: to have their products very much in demand.
Speaker 3: Well, it's interesting, So we're trying to understand how much
Speaker 3: Nvidia is still in demand at the same time as
Speaker 3: an Amazon builds out as trainium, as the same time
Speaker 3: as TPUs come to the forward alphabet, and indeed broadcoms
Speaker 3: used for a six What do you make of where
Speaker 3: if they can all win?
Speaker 12: Well, I think they can all win because the training, training,
Speaker 12: test and validation are parts of this prot and they
Speaker 12: can better use different hardware setups. So I think that
Speaker 12: there's a place for everyone. What you're trying to figure
Speaker 12: out is how much of a place for each one
Speaker 12: of these items. I think competition always makes it better
Speaker 12: for the end consumer. And I'm not talking about the
Speaker 12: people using lms. I'm talking about the people building LMS now.
Speaker 12: So I am very heartened to see that the leadership
Speaker 12: of Nvidia isn't overshadowing everybody else with an idea. I
Speaker 12: think it's also kind of interesting just from a performance standpoint,
Speaker 12: that companies like Google and Amazon have been able to
Speaker 12: quickly come out with something that's very usable, and we
Speaker 12: all had the assumption maybe eighteen months ago that that
Speaker 12: was you know, the horse was out of the barn
Speaker 12: and over the hill and you know, so far away,
Speaker 12: and video was.
Speaker 5: The clear winner.
Speaker 12: So actually I love it as a capitalist.
Speaker 3: Kim Forrest a poker Capital Partners Capitals in the name,
Speaker 3: We appreciate it. Fintech startup Imprint Payments has reached evaluation
Speaker 3: of one point two billion dollars, the company that helps
Speaker 3: retailers offer co branding credit cards. It's brought in one
Speaker 3: hundred and fifty million dollars in a new funding round
Speaker 3: there by. Coast Adventures CEO Darra Murphy joins us now
Speaker 3: for more, what are you using the one hundred and
Speaker 3: fifty million for dollar.
Speaker 13: Hey Carl, and great to see you. Thanks for having
Speaker 13: me at in Print. Our bet has been the same
Speaker 13: since we started the company five years ago. We want
Speaker 13: to be the modern co branded credit card and loyalty
Speaker 13: platform for the world's great brands, and we've raised as
Speaker 13: capitals to allow us to double down on that strategy.
Speaker 13: Our bet was relatively simple, and we started the company
Speaker 13: that the world's biggest banks weren't building good enough experience
Speaker 13: for great brands to launch co branded credit cards.
Speaker 6: And that's been true.
Speaker 13: And what you see is we've taken a siloed experience
Speaker 13: that used to live in the banks app and put
Speaker 13: it at the heart of our partner's experience. And so
Speaker 13: when you open our partners app or you open their website,
Speaker 13: you can engage with the card, you can pay your bill,
Speaker 13: you can check your balance, and that puts you one tap,
Speaker 13: one click away from buying your next bag of groceries
Speaker 13: and book your next flight. And for our partners, that
Speaker 13: has meant huge increases in lifetime value. It's why brands
Speaker 13: like Booking dot Com, Raku, ten create and Barrel or
Speaker 13: choosing in Print over legacy banks, and why we continue
Speaker 13: to focus on this mission with the money we've raised, a.
Speaker 3: Mission that is actually incubated in Thrive Capital. They participate
Speaker 3: in this round RIBTDG, Klaneperkins, Spice.
Speaker 2: Capital, and the Likedara.
Speaker 3: But I've sort of got a bigger question of just
Speaker 3: how many of these credit cards am I going to
Speaker 3: have or even in debit card that you're looking at now?
Speaker 3: Am I as an individual going to have a Booking
Speaker 3: dot Com one and a Racutin one and I'm going
Speaker 3: to have a turkishare line?
Speaker 2: At what point do I become exhausted with all the offerings.
Speaker 13: Well, what you see is we're working with partners that
Speaker 13: demand a lot of share of wallet from their customers.
Speaker 13: Right like, if you think about Booking dot Com, they're
Speaker 13: winning against airlines, they're winning against hotel companies, and customers
Speaker 13: are going there to book the full trip experience. And
Speaker 13: so by partnering with Booking or by partnering with Bracketen,
Speaker 13: that's taking such a large share of online commerce for customers.
Speaker 13: We end up being a meaning meaningful share of each
Speaker 13: customer's what and so you're able to give them rewards
Speaker 13: for a huge portion of they're spent. We would agree
Speaker 13: that very small, fractual brands probably don't need credit cards.
Speaker 13: But more and more we partner with brands that are
Speaker 13: parallel winners in their categories. They're winning in all of
Speaker 13: e comm, they're winning in all of travel, and so
Speaker 13: we get to give customers way more value for a
Speaker 13: bigger portion of their wallet, and so more and more
Speaker 13: customers sign up for that benefit rather than thinking I'm
Speaker 13: going to have fifty versions of a credit card.
Speaker 3: Now and do the inevitable AI question. But I imagine
Speaker 3: a lawful lot of this is about personalization, understanding where
Speaker 3: my next offering or next purchase is coming from, making
Speaker 3: sure you're meeting me where I am at. So how
Speaker 3: much are you looking at AIAI, how much you're having
Speaker 3: to hire an AI.
Speaker 13: Yeah, we think about it as kind of two sides
Speaker 13: of the coin, right. One is the customer experience that
Speaker 13: you've mentioned, and one is how we build the company
Speaker 13: on customer experience. Automation and ail I let us personalize
Speaker 13: how much rewards you get, how we talk to the customer,
Speaker 13: how the experience even shape shifts for the customer, and
Speaker 13: more and more investing in that.
Speaker 6: So it feels.
Speaker 13: Radically different to anything that a bank has ever provided
Speaker 13: in the past for these brands or free these customers.
Speaker 13: The really interesting thing, and maybe it's not as apparent
Speaker 13: under the surface, is we get to rebuild what looks
Speaker 13: like a financial company or even a fintech in the
Speaker 13: time of automation and AI and so over the last year,
Speaker 13: we've grown the business by almost three hundred percent. We've
Speaker 13: grown headcount by twenty percent. At every turn, we get
Speaker 13: to choose, are we going to build a new team
Speaker 13: here or are we going to invest in technology and
Speaker 13: automation so we don't have to hire a team of people.
Speaker 13: We can actually scale the company. We're using technology, which
Speaker 13: is an amazing opportunity that I don't think anybody has
Speaker 13: ever had.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 3: So I imagine that one hundred and fifty million dollars
Speaker 3: doesn't actually go that much on talent. It goes more
Speaker 3: on the marketing of your product. And what does it
Speaker 3: double down on in particular?
Speaker 6: Yeah, three things.
Speaker 13: One is we continue to grow, right, so we obviously
Speaker 13: continue to market to customers, but we're not burning all
Speaker 13: this capital. If you think about the market we're in,
Speaker 13: big brands can choose one hundred year old banks, or
Speaker 13: they can choose Imprint. If you choose one hundred year
Speaker 13: old bank, you probably sleep really well at night. If
Speaker 13: you choose a relatively new company, maybe you worry a
Speaker 13: little more. And so we just want to be very
Speaker 13: well capitalized to make that choice easy. BOOKO two is
Speaker 13: more financial products. We have the credit card today that
Speaker 13: serves many of the brands customers, but depending on your
Speaker 13: financial life, you don't want a credit card. Maybe you
Speaker 13: want to debit card with more rewards, So more of
Speaker 13: those products. And then the last thing is, as we've
Speaker 13: talked about, how do we build a company using automation
Speaker 13: and AI and scale without headcount, which is an amazing
Speaker 13: opportunity relative relative to where we would have been ten
Speaker 13: years ago. You see public company FinTechs today with thousands
Speaker 13: and thousands of employees. We get to make a decision
Speaker 13: every time do we hire or do we build? And
Speaker 13: more and more we get to build.
Speaker 3: Dara Murphy in Print CEO, fascinating talking to congratulations on
Speaker 3: the funding round.
Speaker 2: Thank you coming up.
Speaker 3: After burning through more than one billion dollars a space
Speaker 3: startup with turning to a tech veteran more on relativities,
Speaker 3: say that again, relativity spaces new CEO Serah Schmidt.
Speaker 2: This is going to beg tech. It's time now for
Speaker 2: talking tech.
Speaker 3: First up, China's PDD Holding. It's creator of e commerce
Speaker 3: site Temo. Of course, it's fired dozens of workers following
Speaker 3: a fistfight between employees and Chinese regulators. And that's according
Speaker 3: to sources. Two fights occurred during a government visit to
Speaker 3: investigate claims of fortulent e commerce deliveries. Class chip startup
Speaker 3: Mythic Well, it's raised one hundred and twenty five million
Speaker 3: dollars to support its efforts to challenge Nvidia.
Speaker 2: Take a look at some of the investors.
Speaker 3: Mythics Tech relies on analog chips with far less power
Speaker 3: consumption than the traditional brains of a computer, and sticking
Speaker 3: with chip maker shares, China's metax jump at least seven
Speaker 3: hundred percent on their first trading date is the latest
Speaker 3: outsize market debut by Chinese chip maker, as investors really
Speaker 3: beanning on the domestic firms that could become viable competitors
Speaker 3: to Nvidia.
Speaker 2: Now, let's talk about another startup, Relativity Space.
Speaker 3: It's set out to revolutionize the rocket industry with three
Speaker 3: D printing, but it burnt through more than a billion
Speaker 3: dollars and his big idea hasn't exactly planned out. Now
Speaker 3: the company is turning to form a Google boss, Eric Schmidt,
Speaker 3: and an eight hundred million dollar fresh funding round from
Speaker 3: him to turn around. The company has get more on
Speaker 3: this Suppoomberg Space reporter Lauren grush So a new exec
Speaker 3: same thesis, still three D printing of rockets.
Speaker 14: Now unfortunately that seems to have been changed and now
Speaker 14: the company is much more focused on traditional manufacturing, which,
Speaker 14: as you said, it's a far cry from what they
Speaker 14: started as, which was supposed to be this SpaceX disruptor
Speaker 14: that was going to revolutionize manufacturing rockets with three D printing.
Speaker 14: But what we found after months and months of reporting
Speaker 14: is that they were really struggling with the three D
Speaker 14: printing technology for a while, and over time they started
Speaker 14: to slowly incorporate more traditional manufacturing into the process, so
Speaker 14: much to the point that three D printing is barely
Speaker 14: involved in the rocket making process anymore.
Speaker 3: All this sort of speaks there for more to Eric
Speaker 3: Schmidt's commitment that we've seen of late, of competition versus
Speaker 3: China and supply chain and defense space tech. But have
Speaker 3: you heard exactly why he's decided to take the CEO role.
Speaker 14: The overwhelming theory in what he has also hinted out
Speaker 14: on social media is that he purchased Relativity for a
Speaker 14: trend that we've actually been hearing out about a lot lately,
Speaker 14: putting data centers into space.
Speaker 6: So you might have heard.
Speaker 14: That from CEO SpaceX, CEO Elon Musk or Blue Origin
Speaker 14: or Blue Orange and founder Jeff Bezos, because they've also
Speaker 14: talked about putting data centers in space, and so it
Speaker 14: seems that Eric Schmidt also has that plan as well.
Speaker 14: There might be some other things that he's cooking up
Speaker 14: that he'd like to do with a rocket company, but
Speaker 14: so far that seems to be the prevailing reason the
Speaker 14: he bought this and.
Speaker 3: We're now looking at, well, his fortune fifty two billion dollars,
Speaker 3: He has money to put to work into this, so
Speaker 3: this is his own bet on space yees.
Speaker 14: So he was actually keeping the company aflow for a
Speaker 14: little while, and then he is, so far, from what
Speaker 14: we've learned, has invested a substantial portrait of money into
Speaker 14: this company. And then we've also heard that the company
Speaker 14: is potentially fundraising again, so they're actually going out to
Speaker 14: high net worth investors to see if they want to
Speaker 14: be a part of the company. So it looks like
Speaker 14: they actually do want to grow and maybe have big plans.
Speaker 14: But yes, for a while now he has been injecting
Speaker 14: a lot of into this endeavor.
Speaker 3: Long grush for the latest space startup to keep an
Speaker 3: eye on.
Speaker 2: Thank you very much. Indeed, now that does it for
Speaker 2: this edition of Bloomberg Tech. Do not forget to check
Speaker 2: out our podcast. You can find it on the Terminal,
Speaker 2: Blows online on Apple.
Speaker 3: Spotify, and iHeart or continue on the theme of Oracle
Speaker 3: of financing of data centers throughout the shows from New York.
Speaker 2: This is Blomberg Tech.