Speaker 1: From the heart of where innovation, money and power COLLI
Speaker 1: in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with
Speaker 1: Emily Jay. I'm I'm only checking San Francisco and this
Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Technology. Coming up in the next hour, more
Speaker 1: sanctions the U s upping the pressure on Putin and
Speaker 1: those closest to him. We will bring you the latest
Speaker 1: from the White House, plus how the war in Ukraine
Speaker 1: is affecting its world renowned tech sector. We're gonna talk
Speaker 1: to two engineers who've been helping their employees stationed across
Speaker 1: Ukraine about how it's going down and more than a
Speaker 1: billion dollars in losses for graph this last quarter. I'll
Speaker 1: speak with President ming Mo about how he plans to
Speaker 1: turn it around. Despite the relentless onslaught of Russian forces,
Speaker 1: Ukraine's vital tech sector is still operating for clients around
Speaker 1: the world, while Ukraine's own tech leaders are helping support
Speaker 1: the war effort in working around the clock to keep
Speaker 1: their own employees safe. I want to bring in two
Speaker 1: of those tech leaders now, Lasha onto DAWs, the co
Speaker 1: founder of the n f T a PI platform, Rarefy,
Speaker 1: as well as Pavel Crecenko, founder of the blockchain Blockchain
Speaker 1: Expertise Center Distributed Lab, who just helped some of his
Speaker 1: team members get out of the city in Carkeev Pavela,
Speaker 1: I know you are in western Ukraine right now, so
Speaker 1: you're holding up your phone in front of your face
Speaker 1: where you are hunkered down. I would love for you
Speaker 1: to talk to us about what you're experiencing there. I
Speaker 1: know you're in a city called Uzgrut, which has been
Speaker 1: quieter till now. How are you doing and what is
Speaker 1: the situation there? Yeah, the situation is he's okay, but
Speaker 1: you know, seven days ago a volk from the rockets
Speaker 1: and explosions and Kiev, so that that was like an
Speaker 1: experience and still like big part of my team is
Speaker 1: experiencing this in Hearkiv. The ARKive was all over the
Speaker 1: news because Russians have demolishing the city. So today, yesterday,
Speaker 1: tomorrow we're like avacating the team and also people who
Speaker 1: are like in big need. Thank you so much for
Speaker 1: taking the time to talk to us about what you're experiencing. Obviously,
Speaker 1: my heart goes out to you and your team. Lasha.
Speaker 1: I know you left Ukraine for safety in Georgia. A
Speaker 1: few weeks ago, but you still have almost two dozen
Speaker 1: employees and developers still in the Ukraine. What are they
Speaker 1: telling you right now? So definitely as you can stay
Speaker 1: on trying to manage from outside of country, and it's
Speaker 1: the kind of a challenge as well. But I want
Speaker 1: to like actually stank the community internally and power when
Speaker 1: he steam because there's a huge coordination among the the
Speaker 1: developer community and in terms of like even evacuating and
Speaker 1: living and coordinating UH this process and overall what we've
Speaker 1: seen inside UH is a huge help because the chats
Speaker 1: that were used previously for inviting the greatest speakers in
Speaker 1: Ukraine and really showing what we're building are now kind
Speaker 1: of coordination chets in terms of like who needs would
Speaker 1: and UH that's a huge help, especially for me who's
Speaker 1: outside and trying to manage all that and get hand
Speaker 1: on hand. Pavel, I know you're working around the clock
Speaker 1: to help your employees get to safer places. How hard
Speaker 1: is it to get out talk to us about the
Speaker 1: logistical challenges that you're dealing with. I know they are
Speaker 1: first of all leaving everything they know it is incredibly costly.
Speaker 1: They won't have access necessarily to a consistent supply of
Speaker 1: food or or medication. Basically, there are a few challenges.
Speaker 1: You have this shortage of like taxi drivers, so anybody
Speaker 1: who can deliver anything. And the prices went up like
Speaker 1: fifty times, so for normal people it's just impossible to pay.
Speaker 1: Uh for I T people is still possible, but it's
Speaker 1: a very expensive operation. Uh. And plus the martial laws,
Speaker 1: like you you cannot stay outside after six or in
Speaker 1: some cities after four and yeah, you logistics need to
Speaker 1: be finished before so the day starts at six am. Um.
Speaker 1: Yeah in some places, like one developer just called me said,
Speaker 1: I need yeah way out because our home has no electricity,
Speaker 1: has no heat, has no gas because it was bumped
Speaker 1: and yeah, so he needs to escape tomorrow. So this
Speaker 1: type of stuff we have right now, like Hearkeep is
Speaker 1: under like heavy heavy fire. There are some other cities
Speaker 1: that are even worse, um, like Popo and her Son.
Speaker 1: But yeah, Hearkeef is a very big city. It's like
Speaker 1: one and a half million, and approximately like fifty developers
Speaker 1: were there. So the business is obviously disrupted. But our
Speaker 1: clients supporting us, they're sending us money to donate because
Speaker 1: we donated to people who are in need to whom
Speaker 1: like such a doors is like fortune currently to buy
Speaker 1: like bread, but yeah, not everything you can buy with money.
Speaker 1: That's that's the truth that comes when you are in ward.
Speaker 1: The money doesn't save you. Lasha, I, I know that
Speaker 1: you are working to support your developers on on the
Speaker 1: ground and there has been an incredible means of internal
Speaker 1: communication in the way that you've all come together. How
Speaker 1: are you organizing? You know? How how often is this
Speaker 1: a minute by minutes, second by second thing you like
Speaker 1: the first thing that comes like every morning you wake
Speaker 1: up and try to figure out what happens. So this
Speaker 1: is the the most kind of uh strange moment when
Speaker 1: you wake up and you don't know what happened over
Speaker 1: the hours that you were asleep and trying to like
Speaker 1: individually and into the group group chats find out who's
Speaker 1: how who the bombs that were seeing like how close
Speaker 1: they were to the places they spend the night, and
Speaker 1: this coordination is like I don't know, a couple of
Speaker 1: times over the day and especially when somebody leaves and
Speaker 1: tomorrow like some of the developers are going to live it.
Speaker 1: It's a kind of challenge. So is it going to happen.
Speaker 1: What time will they be able to get to the
Speaker 1: other cities. So there's a lot of risks and uncertainty,
Speaker 1: and I'm trying to keep the momentum of controlling and
Speaker 1: understanding who's at what stage. But well, I understand some
Speaker 1: of your employees have expressed wine to fight for your country.
Speaker 1: Are they taking up arms? Are you being asked to fight? Actually,
Speaker 1: there are lots of people who want to fight, and
Speaker 1: if you don't have an experience, they will not let you.
Speaker 1: So like, yeah, many companies were kind of afraid that
Speaker 1: they are people will be drawn to army, but actually, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's very little amount of unexperienced people will go there.
Speaker 1: But yes, they kind of it's a very pathotic like
Speaker 1: spirit here because it's a whole lands and they just
Speaker 1: bomb that. And surprisingly, like Hearkieve was always considered like
Speaker 1: you know, they will speak Russian um, and it was
Speaker 1: kind of friendly city and now they kind of rush
Speaker 1: demolishes it like more than other cities. And that's kind
Speaker 1: of made people like wonder like that what they supported
Speaker 1: in the past was really a kind not good. So yeah,
Speaker 1: that's the four. More and more people are willing to
Speaker 1: h to go to the army, and I know many
Speaker 1: people who come from abroad to fight, like Ukrainians that
Speaker 1: came from abroad. So that's the situation basically, and everybody's helping.
Speaker 1: Like I have Facebook. Your wife, I understand is there
Speaker 1: with you and and isn't leaving the country, but she's
Speaker 1: making supplies for the army. Can you tell us about
Speaker 1: that decision deciding to stay rather than leave when leaving
Speaker 1: could be safer, Like we all in the same boat.
Speaker 1: So like if you leave you home once, then you
Speaker 1: leave your home twice then the third time, so that
Speaker 1: that will never end, you know, like the apartments that
Speaker 1: were bombed day before yesterday, I was living in the
Speaker 1: same area in two a part and one of them
Speaker 1: I sold to the guy who moved from the nisk
Speaker 1: and then was already yeah, heavily destroyed when the separatists
Speaker 1: came there. And now like carkieve, so like that's the faith.
Speaker 1: If you move another time, then they'll come and take
Speaker 1: something from there. Like surprisingly, we have a Georgian like
Speaker 1: Lasha year and Georgia experienced this twice with Abasia and Salicitia,
Speaker 1: so like, yeah, it will never stop if you don't fight. Um,
Speaker 1: the Ukrainian government has been so crypto forward accepting crypto donations.
Speaker 1: And I know that you have experienced in blockchain and
Speaker 1: and n f T technology, Lasha, you know some of
Speaker 1: the way that the Ukrainian government has been able to
Speaker 1: accept these donations to come up with this idea to
Speaker 1: auction off digital assets has been pretty incredible. What is
Speaker 1: it about Ukraine and the deep bunch of tech talent
Speaker 1: they're like yourself that's enabled the country to do this definitely,
Speaker 1: So Ukraine is is one of the greatest countries and
Speaker 1: people who are like tech savy, especially into so called
Speaker 1: webtry and block chain space and especially power his team
Speaker 1: and like in time network crypto community as we call
Speaker 1: each other, that has been like super strong, like both
Speaker 1: like in building pro pro products for like on the
Speaker 1: global level and really outsourcing. It has been the massive
Speaker 1: force of outsource for the Western companies to build out
Speaker 1: this new web. But unlike I can probably say that
Speaker 1: the same community is like building and fighting and the
Speaker 1: same time and we're going to continue doing until we win.
Speaker 1: And the crypto has like become like a widely used
Speaker 1: think even before the world and now it's helping a
Speaker 1: lot to fund the fund the campaigns and fund the
Speaker 1: people who are in need for that, and the government
Speaker 1: like really enabling the crypto the nations and the community
Speaker 1: assisting that sopre than thirty million as I know by
Speaker 1: the last statistics have been mobilized over that, and that
Speaker 1: shows like how big the crypto community and support from
Speaker 1: the outside is of that particular space in the industry. Well,
Speaker 1: it has been incredibly powerful to hear your story, to
Speaker 1: hear how you are fighting to keep your employees safe
Speaker 1: and continuing to work and run your companies. Thank you
Speaker 1: for taking the time to share your stories with us,
Speaker 1: Lasha Anta's and Pavel Cochenko. We hope that you stay safe.
Speaker 1: All right, coming up, we're gonna have to Singapore. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna speak with the president of Grab meg Mob. The
Speaker 1: company continues to push towards profitability as the pandemic drags on.
Speaker 1: That is next. This is Bloomberg. The effects of the
Speaker 1: pandemic still being felt. Grab Southeast Asia's ride hailing and
Speaker 1: delivery giant, reporting mounting losses in its latest earnings results,
Speaker 1: losing more than a billion dollars for the quarter. Joining
Speaker 1: now ming Ma, President of Grab Ming, you are of
Speaker 1: course based in Singapore, which just announced rare unilateral sanctions
Speaker 1: on Russia. What do you think of Singapore's response so
Speaker 1: far and how the world community is really rallying against Russia. Hey, Emilie,
Speaker 1: first of all, thank you for very much for having
Speaker 1: me on here. UM. It goes without saying that our
Speaker 1: hearts UM just absolutely go out to everyone that's been affected. UM.
Speaker 1: We do have a few grab her that's also been
Speaker 1: affected in the region that we're doing a week that
Speaker 1: we can UM. I would say, you're actlutely right. The
Speaker 1: COVID impact has been severe. UM. We're seeing potential impacts
Speaker 1: of a global basis, and frankly we're despite that. I
Speaker 1: think we feel very happy with a lot of performance
Speaker 1: that we've achieved. UM. In spite of all the city
Speaker 1: lockdowns and spite of all the macro turmoil, was our
Speaker 1: best year ever. We exceeded guidance on g MB revenues
Speaker 1: group by and we delivered against our Ibada guidance. UM.
Speaker 1: In terms of Southeast Asia, it's clear that our super
Speaker 1: apt strategy is working. UM. Our users are spending more.
Speaker 1: Customers from our cohort are now spending close to five
Speaker 1: times what they spent when they first joined grap and
Speaker 1: our retention rates are now up to sevent for customers
Speaker 1: that use three or more services from graph. We are
Speaker 1: generating solid margins and mobility, and we are focused on
Speaker 1: building value over the long term UM and just really
Speaker 1: unlocking the tremendous market opportunity that we see here. And
Speaker 1: we are convicted that the position that we've taken in
Speaker 1: our rategy as the only regional super app is the
Speaker 1: right one for us. How are you thinking about delivery
Speaker 1: and ridehaling workers in Southeast Asia at this time? Many
Speaker 1: of them are part time workers, they have little rights.
Speaker 1: How are you factoring that into the future of the company. Well,
Speaker 1: the key for us has always been around how do
Speaker 1: we create true economic empowerment for micro entrepreneurs across Southeast Asia?
Speaker 1: And these micro entrepreneurs certainly include our driver partners, includes
Speaker 1: many of the restaurant partners that we work with in
Speaker 1: food delivery, and the key for us is how do
Speaker 1: we provide the largest income opportunities for drivers for merchants
Speaker 1: over time? And the key aspect for that is executing
Speaker 1: on our super ap strategy. It's about cross sell um
Speaker 1: selling multiple services to our consumers and over time, generating
Speaker 1: increased wallets share for consumers, and I think that's the
Speaker 1: best way for us to continue empowering um economic stability
Speaker 1: for the region. W Now, the war in Ukraine is
Speaker 1: only escalating, as we've been discussing, there's concern it could
Speaker 1: lead to rising food prices. It will certainly makes supply
Speaker 1: chain issues potentially worse. How is GRAB potentially impacted by
Speaker 1: that and preparing for that. Yeah, well, we're obviously monitoring
Speaker 1: the situation pretty closely. It's a little bit too early
Speaker 1: to see that to really tell how the effects will
Speaker 1: rippull through Southeast Asia. We're monitoring gas prices, oil prices
Speaker 1: as it relates to our drivers. That certainly hits the
Speaker 1: driver p mls in a very direct way. We're also
Speaker 1: monitoring food costs and the effects of inflation across Southeast Asia.
Speaker 1: But if I just step back for a second, the
Speaker 1: real key for us as a platform is how do
Speaker 1: we provide the lowest cost services to our merchants, our
Speaker 1: drivers and to our consumers. And ultimately, if we're able
Speaker 1: to do that, then I think the sustainability will be
Speaker 1: on the platform. I just want to give a quick example.
Speaker 1: When you look at our total segment of just Abada margins.
Speaker 1: We've improved those by from from a minus two percent
Speaker 1: loss in one and I think a large part of
Speaker 1: that is by driving continued cost reductions and the platform
Speaker 1: which ultimately we then share with all of our partners
Speaker 1: restaurants and drivers. All right, MGMA, President of GRAB, thank
Speaker 1: you for joining us. We'll see how GRAB continues to
Speaker 1: weather the COVID storm. Welcome back to bloomber Technology. I
Speaker 1: Emily Changing in San Francisco. It's estimated that more than
Speaker 1: a million refugees has left Ukraine as the war has
Speaker 1: now stretched into its second week, and it's a brutal one,
Speaker 1: many fleeing to Poland, leaving behind a cloud of uncertainty
Speaker 1: on when they can return and what they will be returning.
Speaker 1: To bloom book Zaggi Control is in Poland and spoke
Speaker 1: to those leaving it all behind. I saw a lot
Speaker 1: of damages, a lot of crashes, and I even just
Speaker 1: I don't see my Kiev as it was earlier at
Speaker 1: the main train station in Chemichel, a border town with Ukraine.
Speaker 1: Poland is experiencing an influx of refugees from the war
Speaker 1: just over the other side of their border. We're seeing
Speaker 1: people who have come from Kiev and volv and other
Speaker 1: parts of the country arrive in Poland in the EU,
Speaker 1: and this is something that is happening in a lot
Speaker 1: of places around the European Union's borders with Ukraine. It
Speaker 1: was very, very frightened. We're just here with my son
Speaker 1: and my husband's stayed in Ukraine and trying to fight.
Speaker 1: I hope that here he will alive, and I hope
Speaker 1: that he will come here. I leave in Ukraine, my
Speaker 1: husband and I come to Poland with my daughter and
Speaker 1: with my friends. We are going to Germany today and
Speaker 1: I don't know how many time we stay there. We
Speaker 1: have also heard about people who are not Ukrainian citizens,
Speaker 1: but we're living in the country. At the time that
Speaker 1: the war began, discussing the fact that they found it
Speaker 1: harder to leave the country because they weren't Ukrainian. It
Speaker 1: was very very challenged because I was not Ukrainian, and
Speaker 1: so even the guys they were pushing us, and they
Speaker 1: were trying to stop us from mentoring the train and
Speaker 1: allowing the Ukrainians to go first. Although I'm from Africa,
Speaker 1: but I have a wife who is from Ukraine. First,
Speaker 1: when you arrived at the border of Ukraine. They took
Speaker 1: my wife and my child away and they told me
Speaker 1: to wait, so I stood for I stood there for
Speaker 1: about threday more or four hours before the quarter as become.
Speaker 1: He was really really stressful. It took me two days
Speaker 1: to get to Poland. Like leaving Ukraine is was very,
Speaker 1: very like stressful. And I didn't want to leave Ukraine
Speaker 1: now because all my life is there, my child, everything
Speaker 1: is like we left everything in Ukraine. So I don't
Speaker 1: know from now, because if they were still continuous in Ukraine,
Speaker 1: I don't know what will happen. And now they're telling
Speaker 1: us you can only stay fourteen days here, and I
Speaker 1: don't know what to do. The U n A c
Speaker 1: R has said that any sort of discrimination against people
Speaker 1: from third countries would not be acceptable under the Geneva Convention,
Speaker 1: but that they haven't had confirmation of such things from
Speaker 1: the authorities. Here. We're seeing people who get hot food
Speaker 1: and SIM cards in order to try and stay in
Speaker 1: contact with their families back home, and also to try
Speaker 1: and see what their next steps are, whether they're going
Speaker 1: to remain in Poland or try and find a new
Speaker 1: life in some other parts of the European Union, whether
Speaker 1: that be just for now or potentially more permanently. I
Speaker 1: hope that we will return soon because I didn't want
Speaker 1: to leave. I want I want to be home, but
Speaker 1: unfortunately such institution. We are hoping that it will end soon.
Speaker 1: At this moment, I don't see the opportunity to return.
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Zaggy Control they're in Poland. Now. I want to
Speaker 1: bring in Ali Partoby, the CEO of NA, which just
Speaker 1: launched a new accelerator. I want to get to that
Speaker 1: in a moment. Um, Ali with me here in the studio.
Speaker 1: I want to start actually by asking a little bit
Speaker 1: about your family history, because you grew up during a
Speaker 1: war in Iran, and I'm so curious. What is it
Speaker 1: like watching these images and seeing Ukraine under attack. Yeah, Emily,
Speaker 1: and thank you for having me here. Um, it's really tough. War.
Speaker 1: War is really terrible, and for me it's personal because
Speaker 1: I was seven years old, um, when living in Iran
Speaker 1: when Iraq invaded us and for the next five years.
Speaker 1: You know, Um, there was just this ever present sense
Speaker 1: of fear and as a as a child, it's really difficult. Um.
Speaker 1: You know that, not just the fear, but the seeing
Speaker 1: you're seeing the grown ups be afraid, seeing your parents
Speaker 1: be stressed out or anxious. Uh, and not knowing what's
Speaker 1: going to happen next is particularly difficult for children. And um,
Speaker 1: I will say that on the on the bright side,
Speaker 1: my twin brother and I were very lucky because we
Speaker 1: had a special form of escape. As you know I've
Speaker 1: told you in the past. Um, we were amongst the
Speaker 1: only kids in the country to have a computer, and
Speaker 1: we learned how to program, and that for us was
Speaker 1: a way to have a way to create our own world,
Speaker 1: you know, in software that you know, that we could
Speaker 1: control and that followed the rules, and that was predictable,
Speaker 1: and it's that was an enormous comfort for us. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, to have that, and I would say it
Speaker 1: helped us get to and and you both founded a
Speaker 1: company called code dot org, which I believe you can
Speaker 1: access anywhere. I mean, do you have any advice for
Speaker 1: parents and children who are there right now trying to
Speaker 1: figure out how to pass the days and survive? It's hard.
Speaker 1: It's not my place to give advice, but I will
Speaker 1: say if I can brag about my my brother Hatti
Speaker 1: a bit. I mean, he has led that organization code
Speaker 1: dot Org to have so much impact, and you know,
Speaker 1: tens of millions of kids worldwide are now able to program,
Speaker 1: and um, and it's it is not just a skill
Speaker 1: that helps them think, but it also helps them cope.
Speaker 1: In Ukraine alone, six and a half million kids use
Speaker 1: code dot org, which out of a country of forty
Speaker 1: four million, that's a large number. And um, you know,
Speaker 1: and having that escape is I'm sure comforting to them.
Speaker 1: I do also want to I think it's we need
Speaker 1: to mention that this is not the only unjust war
Speaker 1: going on right now. You know, war is terrible and
Speaker 1: it really needs to stop. But there are also kids
Speaker 1: coding in Iraq, which has been occupied by the US
Speaker 1: for twenty years now, and their kids coding on codat
Speaker 1: organ Yemen, which is being bombed as we speak. And
Speaker 1: those are wars that I don't think Americans support either,
Speaker 1: but there was that our government has been supporting. And
Speaker 1: the sad thing is that these kids are innocence, regardless
Speaker 1: of their skin color or how they were born or
Speaker 1: where they're born. It's you know, and it's not fair
Speaker 1: for them to have to pay some price because of
Speaker 1: these wars. Now, I know, one of the most important
Speaker 1: things to you has been to find tech talent no
Speaker 1: matter who they are or where they are, and given
Speaker 1: the tool to succeed, which is what you're doing at NEO.
Speaker 1: And you have launched this new accelerator. What is the
Speaker 1: goal here and how will it work in the context
Speaker 1: of other opportunities that exist in the tech industry. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: you know, I mean my own path was, you know,
Speaker 1: very much the American dream and that I came to
Speaker 1: America with not very much other than the ability to program,
Speaker 1: and that enabled me, you know, to have this power
Speaker 1: to create and being able to programmings, you can create
Speaker 1: apps and even build a company. And in my case,
Speaker 1: I started a company when I was twenty three and
Speaker 1: became successful. And um, today, uh, kids who are graduating
Speaker 1: from college with that ability have the potential to create
Speaker 1: the the epocal companies of the future. And we've created
Speaker 1: we've just announced this program, NEO Accelerator, which is aiming
Speaker 1: specifically for relatively young engineering leaders, you know, one to
Speaker 1: four years out of college who want to start companies
Speaker 1: and to give them both financial support and mentorship to
Speaker 1: help them build great startups. And it's uh, it's a
Speaker 1: program that is a three month program that includes a
Speaker 1: four week long retreat in Oregon to kick it off,
Speaker 1: where UM founders of companies will live under the same
Speaker 1: roof alongside each other and mentors UM and it will
Speaker 1: come culminate at the end of the program with a
Speaker 1: a pitch date, not to raise more money, but to
Speaker 1: pitch other engineers, to pitch software engineers to join your
Speaker 1: team to help you with recruiting, because that's the one
Speaker 1: of the toughest problems facing all companies today. Now it's
Speaker 1: been described as the anti y C, a reference to
Speaker 1: y Combinator, which is a long established accelerator in Silicon
Speaker 1: Valley that has been operating here for years. What do
Speaker 1: you think YC is doing wrong? And how will new
Speaker 1: do some of those things differently? So why Combinator is
Speaker 1: an incredible and amazing organization and UM I have it's
Speaker 1: incredibly inspiring. I would say it's not an exaggeration to
Speaker 1: say it's one of the most impactful organizations of the
Speaker 1: twenty one century if you look at all the amazing
Speaker 1: companies they've spawned, and I don't think they're doing something wrong.
Speaker 1: It's said as the startup world has expanded and become
Speaker 1: more and more vibrant UM. There's room for different UM
Speaker 1: you know, for different investors to support different types of companies.
Speaker 1: And why combinators primary focus or the culmination of the
Speaker 1: program is to help with fundraising, and it appeals to
Speaker 1: companies who are struggling with fundraising, you know, and as
Speaker 1: access to capital has become UM, you know, capital has
Speaker 1: become more and more abundant in the last couple of years,
Speaker 1: it hasn't been equally distributed. There are some companies for
Speaker 1: whom it's really easy to raise funds and that's you know,
Speaker 1: just less relevant to them, and there's others for whom
Speaker 1: it's more difficult. So why Combinator today has UM has
Speaker 1: really shifted to focus on emerging markets, very large and
Speaker 1: lucrative opportunity, helping countries from Africa, Latin America, etcetera, get
Speaker 1: access to capital. And it's an amazing business which is
Speaker 1: doing really great work. It is less relevance than it
Speaker 1: used to be for for top engineers who are perhaps
Speaker 1: graduating from American universities or graduating from American tech companies
Speaker 1: like Google or Stripe or Microsoft and starting companies because
Speaker 1: for them, they don't need help with raising money. They
Speaker 1: you know, it's so easy for them to raise money
Speaker 1: these days. They need help with other things, and so
Speaker 1: we're tailoring a program to help them with the things
Speaker 1: that are their challenges. Well, we are excited to watch
Speaker 1: you try to or start a new chapter in Silicon
Speaker 1: Valley history. Ali Partovi, CEO of NEO, thank you so
Speaker 1: much for joining us and for sharing your personal story
Speaker 1: as well. I appreciate it. Coming up, how crypto exchanges
Speaker 1: can navigate the war, we're gonna be joined by coin
Speaker 1: Shares to talk about crypto exchanges responsibility at sanctions keep
Speaker 1: piling on Russia and mean if cryptocurrencies can truly be
Speaker 1: regarded as a safe haven. That's next. This is bloomer.
Speaker 1: After plunging at the start of the Russian attack on Ukraine,
Speaker 1: cryptocurrencies had reasserted themselves as a refuge in recent days,
Speaker 1: but after bitcoin rallied more than six over the last
Speaker 1: two days, it's starting to lose some steam as the
Speaker 1: possibility of expanding sanctions has been raised to prevent Russians
Speaker 1: from using cryptocurrencies as a work around restrictions. I want
Speaker 1: to bring in my next guest to talk about this
Speaker 1: and much more. Melton demurrors. The chief strategy officer at
Speaker 1: coin Shares Melton, what do you make of all of
Speaker 1: this back and forth then up and down. Is bitcoin
Speaker 1: really a safe haven or not? Yeah, it's it's great
Speaker 1: to be here. I wish it were under better circumstances.
Speaker 1: I think this has been a really interesting few weeks. Um.
Speaker 1: Not only do we have this conflict happening in Western
Speaker 1: Europe in Eastern Europe, but we also recently had um
Speaker 1: the Canadian truckers and their access to the banking system
Speaker 1: getting getting cut off, which again was an instance where
Speaker 1: there was a lot of conversation around bitcoin, around cryptocurrency.
Speaker 1: At the end of the day, I think what we're
Speaker 1: seeing here is a growing awareness around the world that
Speaker 1: for the first time, people, right citizens who really are
Speaker 1: the victims of wars that are are fought by superpowers,
Speaker 1: they have a choice. Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies are non political
Speaker 1: global money. And again we're seeing not only an increasing
Speaker 1: trading activity in Ukraine and Russia, but also a lot
Speaker 1: of the trading activities coming from the US as people
Speaker 1: are looking at what's unfolding around the world, and maybe
Speaker 1: this is the start of this Bitcoin no longer being
Speaker 1: a risk on asset, but potentially over time becoming a
Speaker 1: risk off asset. Now, a couple of weeks is really
Speaker 1: not enough time for that thesis to play out. But
Speaker 1: I think in the coming months, in the coming years,
Speaker 1: we're certainly going to be able to have a lot
Speaker 1: more data that allow as US to more definitively proved
Speaker 1: that relationship holds over time. Now, crypto exchanges have said
Speaker 1: they'll comply with sanctions but not do a blanket ban
Speaker 1: on all Russian users. What do you make of how
Speaker 1: they're navigating this and can they really differentiate between Russian
Speaker 1: tycoons if you will, and everyday Russians. Yeah, absolutely, and
Speaker 1: look that's a great question. Um. In twenty eighteen is
Speaker 1: when we saw Finn sen Um and Treasury issue the
Speaker 1: first sanction against a bitcoin wallet address. Now, one of
Speaker 1: the interesting challenges here is a bitcoin wallet address just
Speaker 1: a string of characters you can attach it to a person,
Speaker 1: although there are a lot of tools that allow us
Speaker 1: to do that. And obviously, any time you want to
Speaker 1: interact the legacy financial system, meaning meaning thee out currencies,
Speaker 1: which is the money we spend and use. That's the
Speaker 1: money that oligarchs and tycoons have to use to buy
Speaker 1: fuel for their jets and their yachts. Um you're interacting
Speaker 1: typically with a financial institution which will do a out
Speaker 1: of background checks and gather data on who you are. Now,
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, I think the stance
Speaker 1: that many changes have taken is they're going to comply
Speaker 1: with the rules as they're written, and at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, private citizens in Ukraine and Russia and
Speaker 1: any part of the world that are not subject to
Speaker 1: blanket sanctions should be allowed to use these platforms just
Speaker 1: as they have in the past. And again, anyone who
Speaker 1: is the subject of an official sanction, anyone who's on
Speaker 1: an ol fact list, will be blocked. Now, what happens
Speaker 1: in the decentralized side of this is obviously much more
Speaker 1: challenging to control, but at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: it's very difficult to move millions, tens hundreds of millions
Speaker 1: of dollars and move them in and out of crypto
Speaker 1: without touching the legacy financial institution. So again it's really
Speaker 1: at those end points where we're touching cash the control
Speaker 1: is going to be happening. Now, after raising almost forty
Speaker 1: seven million dollars in donation via cryptocurrency. Ukraine has been
Speaker 1: so crypto forward, and you know, accessing all of these
Speaker 1: new technology, some of these things would be unheard of
Speaker 1: here in the United States. They said they would air
Speaker 1: drop rewards to those who contributed, though then they said
Speaker 1: they were they're canceling that, but they're now talking about
Speaker 1: auctioning off n f T s. What do you make
Speaker 1: of their use and exploration of these new technologies. Look,
Speaker 1: I think it's absolutely incredible. Over thirty five thousand different
Speaker 1: wallet addresses have given close to fifty million dollars in
Speaker 1: direct aid to the government of Ukraine and in real
Speaker 1: time right with settlements to this wallet address that's owned
Speaker 1: by the Ukrainian government. Now, in contrast, the country has
Speaker 1: raised two D seventy million in war bonds and received
Speaker 1: three D fifty million in military aid from the US.
Speaker 1: So while fifty millions not a huge number, it's a
Speaker 1: sizable number that can really make a difference. Now, what's
Speaker 1: really cool about this to me is anyone in the
Speaker 1: world could give money. This is non political, global money
Speaker 1: that's transferred on the Internet. So anyone with an Internet connection,
Speaker 1: whether they live in Africa, whether they live in Southeast Asia,
Speaker 1: whether they live in the US. They can send money
Speaker 1: either via an intermediary or directly via their own wallet,
Speaker 1: and I think that's really exciting. Um it brings a
Speaker 1: lot of transparencies. While in terms of where the donations
Speaker 1: are going, we're not shipping palettes of cash into these countries,
Speaker 1: which is what's been done in the past and these conflicts,
Speaker 1: but we're able to confirm with certainty that these funds
Speaker 1: are going to go to the government. And what's really
Speaker 1: exciting isn't a matter of hours a decentralized exchange protocol
Speaker 1: called unit swap actually was able to spin up a
Speaker 1: really cool new product that would allow people to convert
Speaker 1: any token into donation that would send directly to Ukraining government.
Speaker 1: So the fact that we can do this in hours,
Speaker 1: I think is incredible. The fact that the crypto community
Speaker 1: has mobilized around this, I think is incredibly exciting. And again,
Speaker 1: I think Ukraine's embrace of this is acknowledgement that the
Speaker 1: world is supporting the people of Ukraine. The world wants
Speaker 1: to help and whether they get a token or an
Speaker 1: n f T indicating their support. We buy things all
Speaker 1: the time. People buy poppies on Remembrance Day, people buy
Speaker 1: bumper stickers to denote their support of specific causes in
Speaker 1: the digital world right on the internet. Um, we might
Speaker 1: buy n F t s or we might donate to
Speaker 1: get a digital tope and that indicates our support of
Speaker 1: a cause. Well, I appreciate your enthusiasm and helping us
Speaker 1: put all of this into context. It has been amazing
Speaker 1: to watch the way that Ukraine has taken advantage of
Speaker 1: this new technology and how the world has responded. Melton
Speaker 1: Demeor's chief strategy officer at coin Shares, thank you for
Speaker 1: joining us. Shares of electric pickup maker Rivian dropping to
Speaker 1: another record low Thursday after the startup you turned on
Speaker 1: a decision to raise prices for preorder customers the backtrack,
Speaker 1: just forty eight hours after the company first announced it
Speaker 1: would boost the price of its R one T pickup
Speaker 1: by and it's R one S suv by twenty present.
Speaker 1: Joining us now at leoad Logo covers Rivian And where
Speaker 1: do we stand now? Are the prices rising or not? Yeah?
Speaker 1: So the prices are rising if you make an order today.
Speaker 1: So anyone that was a pre order customer or put
Speaker 1: their order in before March the first will pay the
Speaker 1: original prices. You know there were a number of cancelations.
Speaker 1: I spoke with Rivan. They wouldn't tell me how many,
Speaker 1: but you can find a number of upset customers on Twitter.
Speaker 1: So you know, when they first launched this product, that
Speaker 1: the price of the pickup truck, for example, was sixty
Speaker 1: seven thousand, five dollars. If you ordered before March the first,
Speaker 1: at any time in the last couple of years, you'll
Speaker 1: pay that price. But going forward, as an example of
Speaker 1: the R one t you're paying sevent more almost eighty dollars.
Speaker 1: It's a big jump. I still don't understand why they
Speaker 1: thought they could raise the prices on people who had
Speaker 1: ordered something, you know, potentially as much as many as
Speaker 1: two years ago. But okay, I mean there's some broader
Speaker 1: significance here beyond customers being upset, which I do understand.
Speaker 1: Talk to us about why this really matters. Well, it's
Speaker 1: a great point. You saw that quote there from the
Speaker 1: CEO R J. Scaryinge. He wrote this letters of customers
Speaker 1: basically saying that this is supply problems right, semiconductor shortage,
Speaker 1: rising input costs, look at what's happening in global commodities markets.
Speaker 1: They had to do something, but they just got it
Speaker 1: wrong in the way they went about it, making it
Speaker 1: relevant to pre order customers. Remember, this is a company
Speaker 1: that had the sixth biggest I p O in history.
Speaker 1: It has billions of dollars on its balance sheet at
Speaker 1: its disposal, but it's years away from profitability, years away
Speaker 1: from being cash flow positive. So this really matters. You know,
Speaker 1: Joe's fact RBC calculated that by backtracking, they're they're leaving
Speaker 1: about eight d and fifty million dollars of potential revenue
Speaker 1: on the table when you take into account the worst
Speaker 1: case scenario of cancelation. So this is really meaningful. But
Speaker 1: it's a classic hiccup for a company that's grown really big,
Speaker 1: really fast, but isn't really building that in any trucks yet.
Speaker 1: How do you think the higher prices will impact demand
Speaker 1: and quickly? Great question, because we don't know who they're
Speaker 1: competing with, right which are they going off to Tesla
Speaker 1: or Tesla has lower price points. Are they going off
Speaker 1: to the premium segment or trying to go to traditional
Speaker 1: pickup buyers. Remember, you know, Ribbing kind of builds itself
Speaker 1: as the patagon ear of the evy world for adventurers explorers,
Speaker 1: So this is a question going forward how relevant these
Speaker 1: products will be with customers. All right, Bloodlow, thanks for
Speaker 1: bringing us that story. We'll see how that continues to
Speaker 1: fall out. And that does it for this edition of
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Technology. We're gonna be joined tomorrow by Jesse Powell,
Speaker 1: CEO Craft and himself to talk about the rise in
Speaker 1: crypto during the war, the impact of sanctions and their approach.
Speaker 1: You don't want to miss that conversation. He's been pretty
Speaker 1: active on Twitter about this. We'll be back with that tomorrow.
Speaker 1: I'm Emily Chang. This is Bloomberk