1 00:00:02,920 --> 00:00:10,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the 2 00:00:10,640 --> 00:00:14,560 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at 3 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:17,239 Speaker 1: noon Eastern on Apocarplay and then roud Otto with the 4 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:21,280 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, 5 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:26,599 Speaker 1: or watch us live on YouTube, Kayleie. 6 00:00:26,720 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 2: Senators are going to be in the position to start 7 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:33,440 Speaker 2: voting on confirmations up or down on a large team 8 00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:36,880 Speaker 2: that Donald Trump has assembled. It will not include Matt Gates. 9 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:38,560 Speaker 2: It will include Pambondi. 10 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 3: That's right, someone else who's from Florida. She of course 11 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 3: did a few rounds as the attorney general of that state. 12 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:47,480 Speaker 3: And our next guest is someone who actually knows her 13 00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:50,040 Speaker 3: pretty well, and that is the Palm Beach County State 14 00:00:50,080 --> 00:00:52,920 Speaker 3: Attorney Dave Arenberg, who's here with us on Bloomberg TV 15 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 3: and Radio. Welcome back to Balance of Power. Dave would 16 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:58,639 Speaker 3: love just your hot take on this pick, which might 17 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 3: i add, was made very quickly after Matt Gates announced 18 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:04,839 Speaker 3: he was withdrawing his consideration. We're talking less than twelve 19 00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:05,400 Speaker 3: hours here. 20 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:10,360 Speaker 4: He likes us Floridians and Pam Bondi. Yeah, clearly, Haley 21 00:01:10,400 --> 00:01:11,319 Speaker 4: and Joe good to be with you. 22 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:15,120 Speaker 5: Pam Bondi is a loyalist, someone that he doesn't have 23 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:17,960 Speaker 5: to worry about going off the reservation. But at the 24 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:21,679 Speaker 5: same time, she's on team normal. She's no Matt Gates. 25 00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:25,039 Speaker 5: She's not ultra Maga. She's not going to engage in 26 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 5: crazy conspiracy theories. She's not gonna walk Tony Fauci out 27 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 5: of his house in an orange jumpsuit and handcuffs. 28 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:35,760 Speaker 4: But she will be loyal to Donald Trump. I know 29 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:39,360 Speaker 4: Pam well. She does believe in the rule of law. 30 00:01:39,480 --> 00:01:40,600 Speaker 4: She treats her people well. 31 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:43,760 Speaker 5: There will not be mass resignations in the Department of Justice. 32 00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 5: She will get confirmed through the US Senate. She is 33 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:49,800 Speaker 5: liked by people on both sides of the isle who 34 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:52,880 Speaker 5: know her, and I think it was actually a smart 35 00:01:52,920 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 5: pick by Donald Trump, especially because in the wake of 36 00:01:57,040 --> 00:01:59,880 Speaker 5: the Matt Gates disaster, he didn't waste any time and 37 00:02:00,200 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 5: finding someone who will do his agenda by going after 38 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 5: undocumented migrants, femal at the border, and other things. She'll 39 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:12,520 Speaker 5: do some controversial things, she'll do some popular things, but 40 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:16,080 Speaker 5: at least she's just not going to weaponize the DOJ 41 00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:19,920 Speaker 5: to Trump up for lack of a better word, false 42 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 5: cases bake cases to try to go after Trump's enemies. 43 00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:30,440 Speaker 2: Interesting when you consider the idea of loyalty in some 44 00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 2: of these picks, and I wonder your thoughts on this. 45 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 2: Bondi declined to take legal action against Trump University, even 46 00:02:37,600 --> 00:02:40,480 Speaker 2: after receiving nearly two dozen complaints in her office. In 47 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:43,919 Speaker 2: twenty thirteen. She also joined the team defending Donald Trump 48 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:47,880 Speaker 2: during his first impeachment. How will that inform the way 49 00:02:47,919 --> 00:02:50,800 Speaker 2: she takes directives from the president elect? 50 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 4: She is loyal to Donald Trump. He wouldn't have appointed her otherwise. 51 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 5: But it's not the first time we've seen a loyalist 52 00:02:57,120 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 5: as attorney General. Bill Barr was supposed to be a 53 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:01,880 Speaker 5: loyal than he was for the most of his term. 54 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:05,280 Speaker 5: JFK had his own brother as attorney general, so it's 55 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:08,519 Speaker 5: not that unusual. And as for the twenty five thousand 56 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 5: dollars contribution that Trump made to Pambonni's campaign, remember there's 57 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:16,360 Speaker 5: a natural tension when you have to run for office 58 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 5: as a state attorney general. You have to go to 59 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 5: your supports and ask for money. She did that to 60 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:24,480 Speaker 5: Donald Trump. He wrote the check and signed it days before. 61 00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:28,519 Speaker 5: There was an article that came out about the investigation 62 00:03:28,600 --> 00:03:32,240 Speaker 5: into Trump University in New York. So there is no 63 00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:34,359 Speaker 5: evidence that there was a quid pro quote because the 64 00:03:34,480 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 5: check was written and signed before the article came out, 65 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:40,320 Speaker 5: which is what informed Pambonni and her team that there 66 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 5: was this investigation going on. Plus, when you mentioned a 67 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 5: couple dozen complaints, yes, but those complaints don't go to 68 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 5: her office. They go to the Department of Agriculture and 69 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:53,880 Speaker 5: Consumer Services. And although twenty four complaints is not insignificant 70 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:56,120 Speaker 5: in a huge state like Florida, it's not going to 71 00:03:56,160 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 5: rise to a level of the Attorney General's office taking 72 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,240 Speaker 5: action until there's more or until they're notified about it 73 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:04,119 Speaker 5: in a different way. And one more thing on that 74 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 5: her office turned over at the time eight thousand pages 75 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:11,760 Speaker 5: of documents to show that there was no communication between 76 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:16,040 Speaker 5: her office and Donald Trump about Trump University. So yes, 77 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:19,960 Speaker 5: I admit the timing doesn't look good, but as far 78 00:04:20,000 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 5: as evidence of quid pro quo and bribery, there is none. 79 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:28,479 Speaker 3: Well, so as we consider here the role that the 80 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:31,640 Speaker 3: Attorney General has leading the Department of Justice overall, there's 81 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:35,559 Speaker 3: also the consideration of what falls underneath that very large 82 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:39,800 Speaker 3: umbrella Dave, like, for example, the Federal Bureau of Investigation. 83 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:43,240 Speaker 3: And I wonder what this pick, if anything, suggests to 84 00:04:43,279 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 3: you about the way in which we may see those 85 00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 3: other choices shaped by the President elect. 86 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:52,039 Speaker 4: It depends who he's able to pick. 87 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:54,400 Speaker 5: Now, the fact that he's going to terminate Chris Ray 88 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 5: as troubling because you're supposed to get a ten year term, 89 00:04:56,560 --> 00:05:01,000 Speaker 5: you're supposed to be insulated from politics. But then to 90 00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 5: try to remove him in favor of Cash Betel, that's ultramaga, 91 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 5: that's taking loyalists a step further. That's a Matt gats 92 00:05:08,920 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 5: type pick. If he picks Mike Rogers from Michigan, that's 93 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:17,000 Speaker 5: a little more like Team Normal. So it depends who 94 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:19,919 Speaker 5: he picks, in addition to the fact that he'll be 95 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:22,000 Speaker 5: doing something he's not supposed to do and getting rid 96 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:25,400 Speaker 5: of of Chris Ray. So we'll see what happens there. 97 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:27,359 Speaker 5: But I do see Pambondi as a bit of a 98 00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:30,760 Speaker 5: guardrail because as someone who knows her and has worked 99 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:34,160 Speaker 5: with her, she does believe in the rule of law, 100 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 5: and I think that whatever she does, she'll tether it 101 00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:40,479 Speaker 5: to the rule of law. She doesn't want to lose 102 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 5: her bar license or getting incarcerated like Mike Knifong, the 103 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:48,080 Speaker 5: prosecutor the Duke Lacross case who went rogue. She knows better. 104 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 5: She's been a twenty year prosecutor. She was an eight 105 00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:55,320 Speaker 5: year attorney general. So although she will support the Trump agenda, 106 00:05:55,760 --> 00:05:58,960 Speaker 5: she's not gonna do something that she believes is illegal. 107 00:05:59,080 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 2: For him suggesting that she would stand up to Donald 108 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:06,480 Speaker 2: Trump if necessary. If that's the case, the far cry 109 00:06:06,520 --> 00:06:11,599 Speaker 2: from Matt Gates. So net here, Pam BONDI will not 110 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:15,440 Speaker 2: break the Department of Justice, is your message today, Dave Erenberg. 111 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:19,800 Speaker 5: Yes, she's a loyalist, and she is at the same 112 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 5: time someone who's a career prosecutor, who's got experience, who's qualified, 113 00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 5: and who believes in the rule of law. She is 114 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 5: not going to take this job to burn the place down. 115 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:32,599 Speaker 5: Matt Gates promised to burn the place down. That's a 116 00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:35,120 Speaker 5: big difference. And for my fellow Democrats who are saying, well, 117 00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:38,360 Speaker 5: there should be a better choice, Sallyates ain't walking through 118 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:40,720 Speaker 5: that door. Eric Holder is not going to be appointed 119 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:44,160 Speaker 5: by Donald Trump. So if you're talking about the kind 120 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:47,480 Speaker 5: of candidate who Donald Trump will nominate for Attorney general, 121 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:50,279 Speaker 5: it won't get better than Pam BONDI. 122 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:52,719 Speaker 3: Dave, just quickly before we let you go. We have 123 00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:54,960 Speaker 3: about a minute left here. We also learned today that 124 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:57,400 Speaker 3: the judge in Donald Trump's New York hush money case, 125 00:06:57,400 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 3: in which he was convicted on thirty four fellow accounts 126 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:03,560 Speaker 3: one Mrshawn, has agreed to postpone his sentencing that was 127 00:07:03,560 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 3: supposed to happen next week indefinitely. I wonder if you 128 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:09,320 Speaker 3: think that is a the right move and if b 129 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:12,440 Speaker 3: that means he's never actually going to get sentenced in 130 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 3: this case. 131 00:07:14,280 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 4: No, I was to be expected, Kayleie. 132 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:20,120 Speaker 5: I would have been surprised he's sentenced them just weeks 133 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 5: before he entered the White House. I mean, judge Mrschawan 134 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 5: doesn't want to look like he's weaponizing his position. And 135 00:07:26,680 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 5: also he knows that Trump is going to appeal anyways 136 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:33,280 Speaker 5: and that will stay his sentence. So why sentence from 137 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:35,679 Speaker 5: now when there's going to be many months of appeals 138 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 5: as he goes all the way up to the Supreme 139 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 5: Court claiming he had immunity And the court should never 140 00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:43,239 Speaker 5: have admitted the evidence of a couple of his aids 141 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:46,560 Speaker 5: Mallard western Hot and Hope Hicks into evidence, So the 142 00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:49,120 Speaker 5: Supreme Court is going to deal with that. So I 143 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:51,920 Speaker 5: think you and I and Joe should check back in 144 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:55,720 Speaker 5: January of twenty twenty nine, when we can see the 145 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 5: sentencing hearing. By then, of course, we could be living 146 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:01,440 Speaker 5: on Mars by then, we don't know, or you know, Kaylee, 147 00:08:01,440 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 5: you'll be owning Bloomberg TV by then. We don't know, 148 00:08:04,920 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 5: but that will happen one day. 149 00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:10,160 Speaker 2: Is that in the cards you're buying Bloomberg. 150 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 3: Okay, let's not get me in trouble with management here. 151 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:15,680 Speaker 2: Listen. This is important because it's coming from the center 152 00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:18,360 Speaker 2: of the political universe, which is Palm Beach. Dave Herenberg, 153 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 2: thank you so much for being with us, a Palm 154 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:24,120 Speaker 2: Beach County state attorney, a friend of Pam Bondi. By 155 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:26,880 Speaker 2: the way, while we're talking transitioning, Kaylee, we've got another report. 156 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 2: This is not officially from the Trump camp, but a 157 00:08:29,640 --> 00:08:31,640 Speaker 2: new name for ag secretary. 158 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:34,319 Speaker 3: That's right, Kelly Leffler, the former senator who of course 159 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:38,040 Speaker 3: lost after she was named to fill that seat. She 160 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:41,640 Speaker 3: lost the actual seat in Georgia in twenty twenty one, 161 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:44,560 Speaker 3: but she is expected to be named the Secretary of 162 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 3: Agriculture We'll still waiting for treasury though. 163 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast kens 164 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:55,080 Speaker 1: just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and then 165 00:08:55,160 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 1: roun Oto with a Bloomberg Business app. You can also 166 00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:01,319 Speaker 1: listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, 167 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:04,319 Speaker 1: Just say Alexa Play. Bloomberg eleven. 168 00:09:07,080 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 2: Survived another week, and we still don't know who the 169 00:09:09,040 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 2: Treasury Secretary is going to be. I know that's your 170 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 2: first question every day when we come to air, and 171 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:16,600 Speaker 2: we're gonna find out. Remembering it was the week after 172 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:20,280 Speaker 2: Thanksgiving in the first Trump administration when the economic team 173 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 2: was assembled. As Charlie Pellett mentioned, we're talking about now 174 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:27,120 Speaker 2: the Trump Treasury two step. We'll explain that little bit 175 00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 2: later when we spend some time with Nathan Dean. He's 176 00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:31,480 Speaker 2: looking at all of the picks here, by the way 177 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:36,600 Speaker 2: that we have heard, and I realize we still have 178 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:38,200 Speaker 2: some blanks to fill in and what they're going to 179 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:41,480 Speaker 2: mean for policy moving forward in the new administration in 180 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 2: the new Congress. How about this for a headline for you. 181 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 2: The most important event of the day so far in 182 00:09:47,520 --> 00:09:50,840 Speaker 2: Washington the US Capitol, Christmas Tree rolled up on the 183 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 2: flatbed on the west front of the US Capitol. Yes, 184 00:09:55,960 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 2: it is the season. 185 00:09:57,679 --> 00:09:57,839 Speaker 6: Now. 186 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:00,160 Speaker 2: Imagine a world with all the business we talk about here, 187 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:03,440 Speaker 2: the madness on Capitol Hill. Imagine a world in which 188 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:06,480 Speaker 2: you could become senator for a day or a couple 189 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:11,200 Speaker 2: of months and have the experience representing the state that 190 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:14,440 Speaker 2: you grew up in. That has been the experience for 191 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 2: George Helmy, the newest Senator in Washington, who's already packing 192 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:23,440 Speaker 2: his bags as a caretaker. This is the man nominated 193 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 2: by the Governor of New Jersey, Phil Murphy, to replace 194 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:30,840 Speaker 2: Senator Bob Menendez and fill the seat, holding it for 195 00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:34,480 Speaker 2: Andy Kim when he comes in here after votes are certified. 196 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 2: And it's a real pleasure to spend some time today 197 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:40,520 Speaker 2: with George Helmy, Senator. Welcome to Bloomberg. It's great to 198 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:42,880 Speaker 2: have you. Did you ever think in the years you 199 00:10:42,920 --> 00:10:45,439 Speaker 2: were working for Frank Lautenberg or Corey Booker that you 200 00:10:45,480 --> 00:10:46,959 Speaker 2: would ever become a US Senator? 201 00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:51,040 Speaker 7: Joel, thank you so much for having me. It's great 202 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:55,679 Speaker 7: to be on with you. No, absolutely not. I'm a 203 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:59,200 Speaker 7: public policy person first and foremost. I've always enjoyed being 204 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 7: the the guy behind the principle, and I've always enjoyed 205 00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:06,559 Speaker 7: sort of being at the table but behind the scenes 206 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:10,200 Speaker 7: and not being the candidate. But this has been an 207 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 7: incredible experience, and frankly, as you point, it's been the 208 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 7: continuance of a third tour of duty in the United 209 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:18,920 Speaker 7: States Senate in a different role and obviously continuing my 210 00:11:18,960 --> 00:11:22,080 Speaker 7: public service following my time as the longest serving chief 211 00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 7: of staff in the state of New Jersey's history. 212 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 2: Well, that's pretty cool. And by the way, I do 213 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 2: want our listeners and viewers to know that we're going 214 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:33,040 Speaker 2: to be having a conversation this same hour. We're bookending 215 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 2: the hour with New Jersey Senator your former boss, Phil 216 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:38,840 Speaker 2: Murphy is going to be in the second half of 217 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:42,120 Speaker 2: the hour in a special conversation. So let's talk about 218 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:44,559 Speaker 2: your experience for a moment. And I am curious, by 219 00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 2: the way, about your tenure because I understand that there 220 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:48,880 Speaker 2: is a special arrangement here. You're going to hold the 221 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:52,200 Speaker 2: seat until, as I mentioned, votes are certified in New Jersey. 222 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:53,920 Speaker 2: That would mean Andy Kim is actually going to be 223 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 2: part of this session. Is that the plan? 224 00:11:57,400 --> 00:11:58,959 Speaker 7: Yeah, Well, first let me say you you can never 225 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 7: get enough New Jersey, especially with all the great things 226 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:04,640 Speaker 7: that are especially an innovation sector. So you've got a 227 00:12:04,640 --> 00:12:08,960 Speaker 7: great Friday show planned here. But yes, Andy and I 228 00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:11,200 Speaker 7: go way back. We've known each other for over a decade. 229 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:14,959 Speaker 7: I will be in the seat about three months and 230 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,199 Speaker 7: I'm looking forward to him getting in. We had a 231 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:20,840 Speaker 7: great conversation last Friday about the things that I've carried 232 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:22,960 Speaker 7: coming out of the state and now working in the Senate, 233 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:25,679 Speaker 7: and I do hope to hand over the reins shortly. 234 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 7: So you know, New Jersey, the way the seniority works 235 00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:32,440 Speaker 7: in the Senate will stand to gain from Andy having 236 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,040 Speaker 7: a few weeks ahead of the incoming freshman. 237 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 2: That's pretty cool. Give him a little bit of a 238 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:39,600 Speaker 2: head start. Does he get a bigger office, I don't know. 239 00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:41,319 Speaker 2: You can let me know if that happens, because I 240 00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:44,920 Speaker 2: know that your tenure has been brief, Senator, but you've 241 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:47,480 Speaker 2: actually sunk your teeth into some pretty important issues, and 242 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:50,439 Speaker 2: one of them is youth mental health awareness. You've come 243 00:12:50,480 --> 00:12:53,680 Speaker 2: together with Katie Britt, which our audience should also know. 244 00:12:53,760 --> 00:12:55,960 Speaker 2: You've reached across the aisle to work with a Republican 245 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:58,800 Speaker 2: from Alabama here on the floor of the Senate is 246 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:01,400 Speaker 2: this the defining issue for your brief term. 247 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:05,080 Speaker 7: I've been really lucky, Joe to get on all of 248 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:10,200 Speaker 7: the committees that Center Menendez was on, which include, frankly, 249 00:13:10,200 --> 00:13:12,080 Speaker 7: three of the most important committees in the United States 250 00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:16,600 Speaker 7: Senate Banking, Finance, and Senate for Foreign Relations. But knowing 251 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:18,319 Speaker 7: that I was here for a short time, as you mentioned, 252 00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:20,719 Speaker 7: I wanted to find an issue that I felt, as 253 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:23,960 Speaker 7: a father and as a public policy person needed more 254 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:27,320 Speaker 7: attention and that there was already bipartisan support. Knowing that 255 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:30,360 Speaker 7: things in the Senate, frankly, the things in Congress take 256 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 7: a long time to get done, what could I use 257 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:35,560 Speaker 7: this opportunity the relationships I already had as you mentioned 258 00:13:35,640 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 7: Katie Britt just like me, a former staffer turned senator. 259 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:41,440 Speaker 7: Obviously she was elected to. 260 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:42,120 Speaker 2: A full term. 261 00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:45,160 Speaker 7: Where was there already momentum that I could use my 262 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:49,079 Speaker 7: time there to go talk to folks on both sides 263 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:51,400 Speaker 7: of the island the Senate, and I've been really engaging 264 00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:53,560 Speaker 7: members on the House to say, hey, this is a 265 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:55,959 Speaker 7: national issue. We know the data coming out of the 266 00:13:56,000 --> 00:14:00,840 Speaker 7: twenty tens about self harm young girls whom making suicide 267 00:14:00,880 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 7: plans exasperated. In my opinion, by the effects of the pandemic. 268 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:07,960 Speaker 7: You know, what can we do to better protect our 269 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:10,000 Speaker 7: children on the front end, knowing what the inputs are 270 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:12,319 Speaker 7: to some of the issues we're facing, but also help 271 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 7: create more access when we do have our young people 272 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:19,200 Speaker 7: in moments of crisis. And thankfully we've been very successful 273 00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 7: in advancing the issue at a great colloque on the 274 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:25,840 Speaker 7: floor attended by many of our Republican and Democratic senators 275 00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 7: the other day, and we just introduced new legislation and 276 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:32,400 Speaker 7: I'm hopeful. Look, I'm a public policy person, as I 277 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:34,440 Speaker 7: said a few times, Joe, I'm okay with none of 278 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:36,920 Speaker 7: this carrying my name when it gets done. But I 279 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 7: really feel confident that sometime, whether it be next month 280 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:42,960 Speaker 7: or next year, we're going to see progress on these 281 00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:44,160 Speaker 7: on this really important issue. 282 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:48,120 Speaker 2: Well, I salute you for your approach here. One of 283 00:14:48,120 --> 00:14:51,560 Speaker 2: your ideas is the Pride in Mental Health Act that 284 00:14:51,600 --> 00:14:53,840 Speaker 2: I want to ask you about, Senator would award grants 285 00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:58,280 Speaker 2: to assess and improve mental health and substance use outcomes 286 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:00,720 Speaker 2: of LGBTQ plus youth. 287 00:15:01,160 --> 00:15:01,600 Speaker 7: How do you. 288 00:15:01,640 --> 00:15:06,400 Speaker 2: Rationalize this idea when next door in the House of Representatives, 289 00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 2: there's now a resolution that's been brought forth by the 290 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:12,360 Speaker 2: Speaker of the House to block the first transgender House 291 00:15:12,400 --> 00:15:16,320 Speaker 2: member from using certain bathrooms. How do we have both 292 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:16,760 Speaker 2: at once? 293 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, to me, they're really sort of disconnected, Joe. 294 00:15:20,520 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 7: I really with all the issues that Americans are facing, 295 00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:27,560 Speaker 7: you know, just using my own experience in public policy 296 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:30,360 Speaker 7: in the state of New Jersey, higher education costs are 297 00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:33,000 Speaker 7: going up, you know, we're still dealing with the inflationary 298 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 7: challenges that came out of COVID as you know, Joe, 299 00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 7: I've been so focused on the humanitarian ills and crises 300 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:42,120 Speaker 7: in the world, where maybe the nine million in South 301 00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:45,120 Speaker 7: Sudan that need daily humanitarian aid, the issues in Gaza, 302 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:48,200 Speaker 7: the issues in Ukraine, but really the issues that working 303 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 7: families are facing. It's frankly surprising that the Republican leadership 304 00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:54,239 Speaker 7: in the House spends so much time talking about bathrooms. 305 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 7: On the other hand, we know the mental health issues 306 00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:02,160 Speaker 7: and the vulnerability that are LGBTQA youth already face. We 307 00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 7: have in New Jersey incredible nonprofit organizations that help those 308 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 7: help those young people in moments of crisis so that 309 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 7: they don't commit acts of self harm and don't take 310 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 7: their own lives and to provide federal grants to better 311 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 7: support them. I think is really important, and as you know, 312 00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:21,920 Speaker 7: a number of my bills also speak to the much 313 00:16:21,960 --> 00:16:24,640 Speaker 7: broader issue, whether it be transparency in those who are 314 00:16:24,680 --> 00:16:28,080 Speaker 7: going after our youth and providing grants for other opportunities 315 00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:29,760 Speaker 7: for pure support, which is very important. 316 00:16:30,800 --> 00:16:32,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, I appreciate that. I just wonder what a headline 317 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:36,000 Speaker 2: like that means for mental health for young trans people. 318 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:38,520 Speaker 2: I have to ask you about salt if I'm talking 319 00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:40,840 Speaker 2: to the senator from New Jersey here. This is something 320 00:16:40,880 --> 00:16:43,360 Speaker 2: that comes up every day on Bloomberg. There's an effort 321 00:16:43,400 --> 00:16:47,400 Speaker 2: now endorsed by Donald Trump himself to kind of undo 322 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 2: what was done in the twenty seventeen tax cuts. Raise 323 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 2: the cap. You're more specific. You want to exchange the 324 00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 2: ten thousand dollars deduction for a one hundred thousand dollars deduction. 325 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:57,560 Speaker 2: How's that going over? 326 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 7: I think there's actually a great reception to it. I'm 327 00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:05,440 Speaker 7: really happy that the president who installed the cap the 328 00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:09,640 Speaker 7: twenty seventeen bill is now for lifting the cap. That's 329 00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:13,920 Speaker 7: a that's welcome news. I've had two hearings in the 330 00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:17,159 Speaker 7: Banking Committee and the subcommittee that has jurisdiction over the 331 00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:19,760 Speaker 7: tax policy. Just one the other day in which I 332 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:24,280 Speaker 7: elevated this again to the chairwoman and the Republican members, 333 00:17:24,560 --> 00:17:26,840 Speaker 7: talking about the investments that New Jersey makes with its 334 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:30,280 Speaker 7: property taxes for the best public schools, for open spaces, 335 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:32,840 Speaker 7: and why I put a cap on it is, Look, 336 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:35,280 Speaker 7: you know, I come out of the business world, Joe, 337 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:37,119 Speaker 7: which I think is important for your audience to know. 338 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:42,560 Speaker 7: And these tax deductions do have a cost associated with them, 339 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:45,080 Speaker 7: and I think you you know, those make those who 340 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:50,160 Speaker 7: have significantly higher above one hundred thousand dollars in property taxes, 341 00:17:50,359 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 7: you know, can afford to pay a little bit more, 342 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 7: while the majority of the middle class we'll be able 343 00:17:56,119 --> 00:18:01,399 Speaker 7: to deduct a significant portion of their of the texts. 344 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:03,920 Speaker 2: Well, Senator, I'm glad we had a chance to spend 345 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:06,560 Speaker 2: some time together. George heelll me the Democrat from New Jersey, 346 00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:10,280 Speaker 2: the pride of Jersey City, getting our New Jersey or 347 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:13,879 Speaker 2: bust hour off and running with style. Senator, thank you. 348 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:15,840 Speaker 2: You'll have to let me know if it's safe to 349 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:18,840 Speaker 2: go back to Morton's one of these days here in Washington, 350 00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:20,680 Speaker 2: d C. We'll have a lot more coming up. Nathan 351 00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:22,320 Speaker 2: Dean is next here. I'm Bloomberg. 352 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:29,359 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 353 00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:32,479 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon Eastern on Apocarplay and then 354 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:35,520 Speaker 1: roun Oo with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand 355 00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:41,440 Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 356 00:18:41,960 --> 00:18:44,160 Speaker 2: I'm Joe Matthew. It's good to see you. You made 357 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:47,919 Speaker 2: it to Friday, the weekend before Thanksgiving. Maybe you have 358 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:49,760 Speaker 2: a long one. I hope for your sake that you do. 359 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 2: It's awfully quiet around here in Washington as lawmakers head 360 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:57,160 Speaker 2: home for the holiday and we wait for the big transition, 361 00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,159 Speaker 2: which we're of course talking about all day long around here. 362 00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:03,720 Speaker 2: Let me just answer the question that you have in mind. 363 00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:06,240 Speaker 2: We don't have a Treasury secretary pick, but we do 364 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:10,119 Speaker 2: have a new concept. Let's work with what we have. Right, 365 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 2: We're gonna go to war with the army we have 366 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:13,919 Speaker 2: seems to be the idea at mar Alago, but we 367 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:17,399 Speaker 2: might need everybody for this. It's the Treasury two step 368 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 2: President elect floating this idea of Kevin Warsh as Treasury Secretary, 369 00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:29,360 Speaker 2: with the understanding he would be later nominated to run 370 00:19:29,359 --> 00:19:34,199 Speaker 2: the FED. When Jay Powell's term as chair ends Scott 371 00:19:34,280 --> 00:19:38,119 Speaker 2: Bessett meantime, keep him in the House, the White House, 372 00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:43,720 Speaker 2: he runs the National Economic Council, he becomes Treasury Secretary, 373 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:49,639 Speaker 2: when Worsh becomes FED chair Nathan Dean, how did I do? 374 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 4: I think you did great? 375 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:52,800 Speaker 2: Is that what that's really the plan here? 376 00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 8: Well? 377 00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:55,560 Speaker 9: I think that it's a plan to make sense from 378 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:59,520 Speaker 9: President Trump's perspective, because you know President Trump said prior 379 00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:02,399 Speaker 9: that you you know he's floated this idea of firing 380 00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:04,440 Speaker 9: or demoting drome Pole at the FED. We don't think 381 00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 9: that's gonna happen. Better makes better sense just to let 382 00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 9: Paul serve out the rest of his term. But they've 383 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:11,560 Speaker 9: also floated this idea of a shadow banking FED chairman. 384 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 9: And if Kevin Worsh is now Treasury Secretary with the idea, 385 00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:16,600 Speaker 9: than in a year it's gonna be the FED chairman. 386 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:19,120 Speaker 9: Wall Street is going to be looking at the Department 387 00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:22,040 Speaker 9: of Treasury over on over next to the White House. 388 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:25,160 Speaker 9: They're not gonna be looking down constitution having at the FED. 389 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:28,400 Speaker 9: So it makes sense because with Kevin Worsh, you get 390 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,440 Speaker 9: somebody that wall Street I think can work with wall 391 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:32,639 Speaker 9: Street respects and then they move to the Fed and 392 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:34,919 Speaker 9: then you get Scott Bessett at any Sea chair to 393 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 9: move up against somebody that Wall Street can work work with. 394 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:39,440 Speaker 9: So I think this plan, if it were to go 395 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:42,479 Speaker 9: into fruition, certainly would pass the Senate. I think Wall 396 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:44,280 Speaker 9: Street would be pretty happy with it. I think a 397 00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:46,360 Speaker 9: couple of folks on the populous side of the Republican 398 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:48,480 Speaker 9: Party may not be so happy with it. But I 399 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:51,639 Speaker 9: would also just remember Treasury doesn't play the same amount 400 00:20:51,680 --> 00:20:54,119 Speaker 9: of role that it plays in terms of tariffs like 401 00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:57,240 Speaker 9: Commerce does, which is why Howard lutnake A. Commerce is 402 00:20:57,320 --> 00:21:01,760 Speaker 9: much more important to President Trump's initial of implementing those tariffs. 403 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:03,520 Speaker 2: So you put yourself down at mar A Lago. You 404 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,240 Speaker 2: know the President elect was interviewing all three. It was 405 00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:11,439 Speaker 2: right Rowan worsh Besson. This week he's sitting down with besstt. 406 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:15,200 Speaker 2: It was his idea to have this shadow FED chair, right, 407 00:21:15,640 --> 00:21:17,879 Speaker 2: So you know, mister president, they starts spitballing on this. 408 00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:19,919 Speaker 2: I said, well, how about you, maybe we could do that, 409 00:21:20,040 --> 00:21:23,200 Speaker 2: make the Treasury Secretary be the shadow. You just hang 410 00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:24,680 Speaker 2: out with me in the White House till he's done. 411 00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:26,399 Speaker 2: We'll pull the trigger on this whole thing. Did they 412 00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:28,480 Speaker 2: work it out together on the patio. 413 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:30,320 Speaker 9: Yeah, I'm not sure. I mean, obviously I wish I 414 00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:32,040 Speaker 9: was on that patio because of the weather. 415 00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:32,920 Speaker 2: It's knowing here, but. 416 00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 9: Be just just to listen about how they're gaming this out. 417 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:38,879 Speaker 9: But what I will say is that President Trump wants speed. 418 00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:41,560 Speaker 9: The reason why he wants these picks done and he 419 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:44,920 Speaker 9: wants to move them quickly is because every single moment 420 00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:47,280 Speaker 9: that the Senate is focused on nominations, you're not focused 421 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:50,320 Speaker 9: on tax reform. And if Speaker Johnson kicks the funding 422 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:53,720 Speaker 9: fight from December into March again, it's going to junk 423 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:56,239 Speaker 9: up a lot of President Trump's first hundred days on 424 00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:58,880 Speaker 9: Capitol Hill. So if they can get this plan to work, 425 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 9: and if they can get enough for republic and Senators 426 00:22:00,640 --> 00:22:03,199 Speaker 9: go with it. I presume that they can, then you 427 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:06,680 Speaker 9: score your idea of moving quickly, getting a shadow fed share, 428 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:09,560 Speaker 9: and also making Wall Streets fairly comfortable with where you're 429 00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,280 Speaker 9: going on two of the biggest picks from the economic perspective. 430 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:18,200 Speaker 2: Meanwhile, Secretary Lutnik, assuming he's confirmed, becomes the tariffs. Are 431 00:22:18,640 --> 00:22:22,480 Speaker 2: they put USTR under commerce that's the tariff House. That's 432 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:26,640 Speaker 2: how that works. Treasury gets cover because Lutnik is doing it. Yeah. 433 00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:28,280 Speaker 9: So this is where the soap opera version of the 434 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,440 Speaker 9: Trump administration begins, because on one hand, you're going to 435 00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:34,679 Speaker 9: have President Trump pushing tariffs. Tariffs are very popular with 436 00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:36,639 Speaker 9: the President. This is something that he's campaigned on and 437 00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:38,119 Speaker 9: most likely something that we're going to see in the 438 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 9: first half of next year. But Wall Street, on the 439 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:43,160 Speaker 9: other hand, may not like tariffs so much. If companies 440 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:45,480 Speaker 9: like home Depot or a Nike or Adidas have to 441 00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:48,159 Speaker 9: start buying a lot more expensive products from outside of 442 00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,280 Speaker 9: the United States, Wall Street's not going to like that. 443 00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 9: So you're going to have the Treasury Secretary at one 444 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 9: point saying, look, these stocks may be going into the 445 00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:56,720 Speaker 9: red because if your tire of policy. But on the 446 00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:58,479 Speaker 9: other hand, you're going to have Commerce saying, well, this 447 00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:00,600 Speaker 9: is what we were elected to do. I don't envy 448 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 9: them and how they're going to have to have this 449 00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:03,800 Speaker 9: decision and how they're going to have to fight this out. 450 00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 9: But ultimately it's going to be President Trump's decision to 451 00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:08,639 Speaker 9: be either direct Commerce to move forward with these tariffs 452 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:10,800 Speaker 9: are not We will always tell our clients though Just 453 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:13,440 Speaker 9: remember tariffs, for the most part, come from the power 454 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 9: of the presidency, which means that you're going to see 455 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:18,120 Speaker 9: a lot of headline miss to begin, but then as 456 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 9: the process plays out, there could be exemptions, there could 457 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,840 Speaker 9: be lobbying, there could be reciprocal tariff threats from China, 458 00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 9: for example. So presidents never back themselves into political back 459 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:29,800 Speaker 9: corners with tariffs. It's a long, drawing out process as 460 00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:32,040 Speaker 9: opposed to a magic wan that happens on DA fascinating. 461 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 2: Your eyebrows must have raised when you heard this idea 462 00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 2: of a crypto tzar floated. We've got no details still, 463 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:42,239 Speaker 2: at least that I've heard on what this is, what 464 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:45,760 Speaker 2: the title really would be, what agency this person would 465 00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:48,359 Speaker 2: floating around the White House somehow? Do you know anything 466 00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 2: about her? Who that would be? 467 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:49,440 Speaker 6: No. 468 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:51,280 Speaker 9: So, but what we tell folks with when it comes 469 00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,320 Speaker 9: to czars is that they have fancy titles, but a 470 00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:57,320 Speaker 9: lot of times they don't have huge implementation avenues. Because remember, 471 00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:58,960 Speaker 9: in the crypto space, it's going to be the SEC 472 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:02,840 Speaker 9: chair and the CFTC chair that will be implementing regulations. 473 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 9: It'll be Congress on the other hand, So think of 474 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:07,400 Speaker 9: czars in this case, the cryptos are. Think of them 475 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 9: as cheerleaders. They're going around, they're telling folks, yes, we 476 00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:11,879 Speaker 9: are working on this. We're going to work with the 477 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:14,720 Speaker 9: SEC to make the market. It's to make the market happy. So, 478 00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 9: but czars are most the most difficult positions from Washington 479 00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 9: because they can't have the power to actually implement things. 480 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:21,880 Speaker 9: They need to rely on others. 481 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:25,840 Speaker 2: Well, meanwhile, Gary Gensler is packing up the office right now. 482 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:28,280 Speaker 2: There's a short list of about one hundred people to 483 00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:29,720 Speaker 2: replace them. How's this going to work? 484 00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:31,800 Speaker 9: Yeah, so you know, I think the SEC chair is 485 00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 9: a second tier priority for Mario Lago. The reason being 486 00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:37,679 Speaker 9: is there's about eighteen names I counted, which means fifteen 487 00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:38,840 Speaker 9: of them are probably self promoting. 488 00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 2: They're eighteen counted, eighteen names. 489 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 9: But for the SEC chair, what we're looking at is 490 00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:45,639 Speaker 9: are you going to get a crypto pick or a 491 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:47,879 Speaker 9: Wall Street pick? The crypto pick, there's a lot of 492 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,080 Speaker 9: money that's gone in the President Trump's campaign to ensure 493 00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:52,080 Speaker 9: that crypto is a top issue, but it's not the 494 00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:54,320 Speaker 9: top issue for the SEC. Are you going to get 495 00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:56,320 Speaker 9: a Wall Street pick? Think of somebody that comes from 496 00:24:56,320 --> 00:24:59,320 Speaker 9: the Paul Atkins Commissioner Paul Atkins or even who came 497 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:01,440 Speaker 9: from the cloth of the J. 498 00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:03,120 Speaker 2: Clayton, you know, the former SCC chair. 499 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:05,879 Speaker 9: Now Trump's picked the lead DSD and why you know 500 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:08,160 Speaker 9: that is a Q Capital formation pick. They'll be close 501 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:10,199 Speaker 9: to Wall Street. I think what will happen over the 502 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,679 Speaker 9: SEC is they'll hit pause. They'll wait till about April 503 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,120 Speaker 9: or May. It's second tier pick. You'll have a two two. 504 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:16,240 Speaker 1: Yeah. 505 00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:17,439 Speaker 9: I think what they're going to do is they're going 506 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:19,760 Speaker 9: to focus on other things. You'll have Commissioner Waio or 507 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:22,359 Speaker 9: Commissioner Purse, the Republican commissioners, one of them will step 508 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 9: up the acting chair. They'll lay it on an agenda. 509 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:26,600 Speaker 9: But I don't think you're going to see this really 510 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:28,960 Speaker 9: fast deregulatory effort over at the SEU. 511 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,240 Speaker 2: Crypto loves this, right, I mean, we're looking at one 512 00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:35,680 Speaker 2: hundred thousand dollars here. The difference since the election has 513 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:38,040 Speaker 2: been wild and the money made. I know you're not 514 00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:41,560 Speaker 2: a technical analyst here, but those who do cover the 515 00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,880 Speaker 2: space think there's a new floor, that this idea of 516 00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:49,800 Speaker 2: a national reserve has completely changed the dynamic for bitcoin 517 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:51,160 Speaker 2: at least do you see it that way? 518 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:53,240 Speaker 9: So sort of. So right now, the United States is 519 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 9: sitting on around two hundred and eight thousand bitcoins, so 520 00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:58,119 Speaker 9: you know, that's a lot of that's a lot of 521 00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:00,479 Speaker 9: cash right now. And so you know, Senator Lemus has 522 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:02,720 Speaker 9: proposed this bill that the United States should build a 523 00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:05,720 Speaker 9: strategic reserve of about five percent of the world's bitcoins 524 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:07,359 Speaker 9: so the United States can own it. So we are 525 00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:09,680 Speaker 9: I own two hundred and eight thousand, so that could 526 00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:12,520 Speaker 9: be packaged together put into what they call quote unquote 527 00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:15,800 Speaker 9: a reserve. The problem, however, is to get additionally, is 528 00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:19,760 Speaker 9: you're going to need appropriations from Congress to essentially direct 529 00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 9: moneys to purchase bitcoin, and or the executive branch is 530 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 9: going to have to figure out how to finagle appropriations 531 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:27,960 Speaker 9: for other things to be used to purchase for bitcoin. 532 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 9: It's going to get messy. And so that's why I 533 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,399 Speaker 9: think this bill is the most likely scenario, certainly something 534 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 9: that we'll be talking about next year. I don't want 535 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 9: to say it's going to have decent chances of passage immediately, 536 00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:40,920 Speaker 9: but what I would always say to the bitcoin crowd is, yes, 537 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,560 Speaker 9: you're getting good sentiment right now because you have a 538 00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:46,080 Speaker 9: president who is going to be very much pro crypto, 539 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:51,560 Speaker 9: but the logistics and the specifics of what cryptocurrency regulation 540 00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:54,879 Speaker 9: looks like will more likely turning coinbase into something like 541 00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:58,600 Speaker 9: CME Group or the Continental Exchange, very similar to what 542 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:00,359 Speaker 9: we see in the derivatives world today, which not the 543 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:01,160 Speaker 9: wild wild West. 544 00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:04,879 Speaker 2: Fascinating, always fascinating to spend time with Nathan Dean at 545 00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,680 Speaker 2: Bloomberg Intelligence. You're just back from a tour of European 546 00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:10,960 Speaker 2: capitals because clients want to know what in the world 547 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:14,200 Speaker 2: is going on post election. The great part about Nathan 548 00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:15,760 Speaker 2: Dean is he's about to go on another tour of 549 00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:19,080 Speaker 2: European capitals after Thanksgiving. What was the most common question, 550 00:27:19,560 --> 00:27:21,880 Speaker 2: most common worry that you encountered. 551 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:24,080 Speaker 9: So obviously the European tariffs, and our view on that 552 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 9: is that it will eventually come, but you know, I 553 00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 9: think China's iis priority. But then we got a lot 554 00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:30,920 Speaker 9: of questions about the Inflation Reduction Act because there's a 555 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:33,879 Speaker 9: lot of European capacs coming into the United States on 556 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,520 Speaker 9: these ideas that solar incentives are going to stick around. 557 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:39,240 Speaker 9: So our thought on the IRA is that even though 558 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:41,280 Speaker 9: you'll hear whispers of it being thrown into the tax 559 00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:43,560 Speaker 9: reform debate. The IRA, for the most part, we think 560 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 9: is cemented. It's four hundred thirty three billion dollars. That's 561 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:47,320 Speaker 9: cheap when you have to figure out how to pay 562 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 9: for four to four and aftullion of tax extensions. Certain 563 00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:52,879 Speaker 9: aspects of it can be cut, but ultimately there's a 564 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 9: lot of European money going in from the industrial base 565 00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:59,960 Speaker 9: into southern Trump states like you know, Alabama, Louisiana and Texas. 566 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 9: That's building solar farms and solar plants, and local politicians 567 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:06,680 Speaker 9: do not want to see those seven hundred jobs disappear 568 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:08,240 Speaker 9: because of something that the. 569 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:11,040 Speaker 2: Solar stocks have fallen off a cliff since the election. Yeah, 570 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:12,879 Speaker 2: I mean, you know, it could be an opportunity. 571 00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:13,879 Speaker 9: He could be an opportunity. 572 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:17,000 Speaker 2: Great to see you, happy Thanksgiving, Thanks for always being great. 573 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:19,399 Speaker 2: That's Nathan Dean, of course, you know that with his 574 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:22,280 Speaker 2: patented fleece vest. 575 00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:28,840 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast Ken 576 00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:32,080 Speaker 1: Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and then 577 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,760 Speaker 1: royin Otto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can also 578 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:38,320 Speaker 1: listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, 579 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:41,400 Speaker 1: Just Say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven thirty. 580 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 3: Here in Washington, we've been looking for some answers in 581 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 3: the last twenty four hours after the news that Matt 582 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:52,040 Speaker 3: Gates was taking himself out of contention for Attorney General. 583 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:54,680 Speaker 3: We know that Donald Trump has now nominated the former 584 00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:58,520 Speaker 3: Florida Attorney General, Pam Bondi to replace him, at least 585 00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:01,080 Speaker 3: as nominee. But we had another question, Joe, which was, 586 00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:03,880 Speaker 3: what does Matt Gayz's political future then look like? Will 587 00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:06,200 Speaker 3: he try to take a seat in the one hundred 588 00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,160 Speaker 3: and nineteenth Congress. And according to an interview he did 589 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 3: with Charlie Cook or Kirk Rather, the answer to that 590 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,480 Speaker 3: question is no, he's not planning on returning to the House. 591 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:17,280 Speaker 3: So we've got one question answered, but we still have 592 00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:19,600 Speaker 3: a lot more we're looking for answers we do. 593 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,280 Speaker 2: We still don't have a Treasury secretary pick. We're told 594 00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:25,920 Speaker 2: that could be any time or after Thanksgiving. And then 595 00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:29,800 Speaker 2: there's this idea. As we drill down into this idea, 596 00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:34,840 Speaker 2: keep me honest here, the Treasury two step we'll call it. 597 00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:38,960 Speaker 2: You put Kevin warsh In as Treasury Secretary. You keep 598 00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:41,680 Speaker 2: him there until he becomes fed chair in j Powell's 599 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:44,640 Speaker 2: term ends. All the while Scott Bessent is in the 600 00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:48,360 Speaker 2: White House chairing the National Economic Council, and he becomes 601 00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:51,000 Speaker 2: Treasury Secretary when Warsh goes to the Fed. Did I 602 00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:51,320 Speaker 2: do it? 603 00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:54,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what the Wall Street Journal has reported. 604 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:59,000 Speaker 2: That's exactly the report today that has tongues wagging in Washington. 605 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 2: And we wanted to talk to Laura Davison about this 606 00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:05,600 Speaker 2: Bluebird Politics editor. Are we just keeping ourselves busy waiting 607 00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:07,160 Speaker 2: for a name to drop here? Or is this a 608 00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:08,480 Speaker 2: real concept at mar A Laco. 609 00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:11,360 Speaker 10: This is an idea that's being considered when they're looking 610 00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 10: at the Treasury role, they're looking at the broader suite 611 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:17,560 Speaker 10: of economic jobs, and they're trying to get a team 612 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:20,760 Speaker 10: that's cohesive. You know, we saw in some cases that 613 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:22,600 Speaker 10: you know, people didn't want to work for Howard Lutnick, 614 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:24,480 Speaker 10: for example, So people said, no, I won't take the 615 00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:27,280 Speaker 10: NEC job, you know, if he's going to be Treasury secretary. 616 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 10: So there's a lot of jockey and not just like 617 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:31,120 Speaker 10: I want this certain title, but also who are going 618 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:33,760 Speaker 10: to be the people around me in that specific role. 619 00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:35,400 Speaker 4: So that's a lot of what's happening here. 620 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:39,360 Speaker 10: But Also, Trump is not satisfied with the choices he has. 621 00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:42,320 Speaker 10: You there's no one perfect candidate, and that's why we're 622 00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 10: seeing this drag on and we could potentially see new 623 00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:47,920 Speaker 10: names or even surprise names crop up into the mix here. 624 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:51,400 Speaker 3: I think it's fascinating that it's taken this long to 625 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 3: figure out Treasury, and it could take much longer. Still, 626 00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 3: we don't know timeline here. Whereas Matt Gates drops out 627 00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 3: and less than twelve hours later, he already has a 628 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,760 Speaker 3: new name on the list for AG ready to go. 629 00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:07,800 Speaker 3: So clearly there were ideas in place here, backup plans, 630 00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,000 Speaker 3: as there was perhaps writing on the wall for Matt Gates. 631 00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:12,080 Speaker 3: But does that not mean there's not backup plans to 632 00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:14,280 Speaker 3: the backup plans if he doesn't like the Treasury options 633 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:15,760 Speaker 3: that have been presented to him thus far. 634 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:17,720 Speaker 10: We're on the backup plans right now. 635 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:19,520 Speaker 4: So Mark Rowan and Kevin Warshaw. 636 00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:21,760 Speaker 10: Okay, so these are not in the initial dis sessions 637 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:23,960 Speaker 10: brought them down there this week, But those interviews were 638 00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:26,240 Speaker 10: days ago. There's still meetings happening, They're still trying to 639 00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 10: figure everything out, and there's just you know, you basically 640 00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:32,080 Speaker 10: have an internal conflict here if Trump wants someone who 641 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:34,800 Speaker 10: is a Wall Street person who has the pedigreeing experience 642 00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:38,000 Speaker 10: but also is maga and those things are oftentimes at odds. 643 00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:41,440 Speaker 2: Pete Haig Seth making the rounds yesterday in the Senate, 644 00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:44,200 Speaker 2: he did have an answer to the charges that had 645 00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:47,400 Speaker 2: been levied against him. A police report came out detailing 646 00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 2: this sexual assault case that he paid money to Settle 647 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:53,640 Speaker 2: who says that they decided not to file charges. And 648 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 2: that's the end of the story, is it. 649 00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:58,360 Speaker 10: We'll find out. Two months is a really long time. 650 00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:00,560 Speaker 10: There could be a drip drip drip of ault allegations 651 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:03,400 Speaker 10: that continue to come out here. You know, Trump is 652 00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 10: basically daring the Republican senator, saying, look, defy me. But 653 00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:09,320 Speaker 10: you know, there's we saw that Republicans, you know, in 654 00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:11,360 Speaker 10: the Senate are not afraid. They said no to Matt 655 00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:13,120 Speaker 10: Gates and they could say no to someone else. So 656 00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:15,080 Speaker 10: this is really going to be sort of the key 657 00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:17,400 Speaker 10: one to watch here. You know, it looks like some 658 00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:20,800 Speaker 10: of the others, perhaps Tulsa Gabbard, RFK Junior, may get by. 659 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:24,600 Speaker 10: They're a little bit more qualified from a at least 660 00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:26,560 Speaker 10: that's what Republican Senators are saying, you know, if you 661 00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:28,240 Speaker 10: look at the resumes, a lot of people they don't 662 00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:30,959 Speaker 10: necessarily have the experience that one would traditionally have. But 663 00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:34,400 Speaker 10: I think there's a widespread recognition among Republicans in the 664 00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:37,120 Speaker 10: Congress that they can't, you know, say no to three 665 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:39,040 Speaker 10: or four or five of these picks. So is the 666 00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:42,480 Speaker 10: prevailing thinking here that John Thune essentially used his one 667 00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 10: free pass to tank a nominee even though he didn't 668 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:48,960 Speaker 10: really Matt Gates had to take himself out, or that 669 00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:50,920 Speaker 10: there still could be a free pass yet to go 670 00:32:50,920 --> 00:32:54,400 Speaker 10: for one of these other controversial nominees. This is really 671 00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:56,760 Speaker 10: what remains to be seen here, And I think what 672 00:32:56,960 --> 00:32:59,400 Speaker 10: the what the specific circumstances and facts on the ground 673 00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 10: and alligations are. You know, everything that was swirling around 674 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:04,360 Speaker 10: mad Gates was really bad. And you know there was 675 00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:08,560 Speaker 10: also this you know, House Ethics Committee report that contained 676 00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:10,880 Speaker 10: more and clearly Gates did not want to have that 677 00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:14,160 Speaker 10: out there. So this is they think that the facts 678 00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:16,320 Speaker 10: and circumstances may matter here. If there are more details 679 00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:18,840 Speaker 10: or things that come out that are they're problematic, Thune 680 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,120 Speaker 10: may have more leverage, but you know the fact that 681 00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:22,680 Speaker 10: he was willing, and he just got the job, you know, 682 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:24,920 Speaker 10: not just a couple of days ago. This week was 683 00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:27,080 Speaker 10: already willing to say no. Indicates that this might be 684 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:29,600 Speaker 10: emblematic of his leadership style. 685 00:33:30,800 --> 00:33:33,959 Speaker 2: Laura Davison, thank you so much, Bloomberg Politics editor. On 686 00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:36,000 Speaker 2: this Friday, just imagine what the weekend could bring. 687 00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:38,600 Speaker 3: I hope she does not want to imagine that. 688 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:40,280 Speaker 4: I think has been great with us. 689 00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:44,040 Speaker 2: No, absolutely not. Nothing will happen until Monday. You heard 690 00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:46,520 Speaker 2: it here first. Headlines have been flying though. This has 691 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,680 Speaker 2: been quite a time for our politics team. We spent 692 00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:53,000 Speaker 2: some time just yesterday talking with Mikey Cheryl, a congressoman 693 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:55,920 Speaker 2: from New Jersey Democrats is running for governor. Her ideas 694 00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:59,520 Speaker 2: on this heg seth Matter, as a veteran of the. 695 00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 3: Navy, a former female Navy helicopter pilot, told us. 696 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:07,720 Speaker 6: This, look, if you sort of attacked women's service in 697 00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:11,480 Speaker 6: the way he has, that would be really concerning to 698 00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:13,480 Speaker 6: any commanding officer in the fleet. 699 00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:14,000 Speaker 4: Right now. 700 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,920 Speaker 6: We have built so much and it has continued to 701 00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:19,520 Speaker 6: make us a strong, resilient force. And I would hate 702 00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,719 Speaker 6: to see a Secretary of Defense that had as his 703 00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:27,799 Speaker 6: agenda and goal tearing that apart, Let's. 704 00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:30,600 Speaker 2: Turn down to our signature political panel. Rick Davis and 705 00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:33,600 Speaker 2: Jeanie Shanzo are back with us. Rick, of course, Bloomberg 706 00:34:33,640 --> 00:34:38,120 Speaker 2: Politics contributor and partner at Stone Court Capital, Bloomberg Politics 707 00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:42,520 Speaker 2: contributor and political science professor at Iona University. What's your 708 00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:45,040 Speaker 2: thought on this today, Genie, now that we've had a 709 00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:47,520 Speaker 2: little bit of time for this to settle, Pete Hegseth 710 00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 2: making the rounds in the Senate with this scandal hanging 711 00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,799 Speaker 2: over his head and an idea that we should bar 712 00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:58,000 Speaker 2: women from combat roles like the one that Mikey Cheryl had. 713 00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:02,799 Speaker 8: Yeah, you know, there's been time now that we've had 714 00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:06,560 Speaker 8: several people go back and read. You know, Pete Hegseth 715 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,960 Speaker 8: is the author of four books that have been best sellers, 716 00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:13,040 Speaker 8: and he has said a lot, a lot that's controversial 717 00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:16,000 Speaker 8: in those books. People have been reading through those and 718 00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:19,160 Speaker 8: you know, with two months to go, potentially before he 719 00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:21,879 Speaker 8: gets to a hearing, if it gets that far, how 720 00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:25,840 Speaker 8: much more can come out and be chewed over? You know, 721 00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:30,359 Speaker 8: I think your conversation with mikey Yl Cheryl is absolutely 722 00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:33,719 Speaker 8: on point. You know, he is going to have to 723 00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 8: defend these views or he's going to have to pivot, 724 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:39,520 Speaker 8: and he's going to do it in front of senators, 725 00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:43,960 Speaker 8: including vets, including female senators who are vets, who have 726 00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:48,160 Speaker 8: given their lives for the military. So he's going to 727 00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:50,920 Speaker 8: have a lot of explaining to do. And that doesn't 728 00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:53,640 Speaker 8: even start to get to the police report that is 729 00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:54,960 Speaker 8: pretty damning as well. 730 00:35:56,719 --> 00:35:56,959 Speaker 7: Well. 731 00:35:57,080 --> 00:35:59,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, so Rick would love for you to weigh in here, 732 00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:02,680 Speaker 3: because if we look back at history and the things 733 00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:06,319 Speaker 3: that have taken down candidates for foreign nominations like this 734 00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:08,440 Speaker 3: in the past, perhaps you could see a number of 735 00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:11,319 Speaker 3: things that would have previously been found to be disqualifying, 736 00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,520 Speaker 3: whether it was these character questions or just a question 737 00:36:14,719 --> 00:36:17,520 Speaker 3: of experience, not to diminish his service. He of course 738 00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:21,840 Speaker 3: has served in the National Garden, He's done tours of duty, 739 00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:24,960 Speaker 3: and yet he hasn't actually been a leader in the 740 00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:27,640 Speaker 3: way we typically see of Defense Department nominees. And we're 741 00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:30,720 Speaker 3: talking about the United States military here, the greatest fighting 742 00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:31,520 Speaker 3: force in the world. 743 00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:36,160 Speaker 11: Yeah, I think that most of the time when I've 744 00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:41,839 Speaker 11: seen cabinet sub cabinet members who required Senate confirmation, investadors 745 00:36:42,600 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 11: wind up not getting through a confirmation, it's mostly personal issues. 746 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:49,920 Speaker 11: It's not paying taxes, having a nanny that is undocumented 747 00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:54,239 Speaker 11: and not paying taxes, you know, personal issues related to 748 00:36:54,320 --> 00:37:01,280 Speaker 11: the law. It's very rarely lack of experience in plethora 749 00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:05,520 Speaker 11: of cabinet members who've served well, who you know, were 750 00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:08,880 Speaker 11: sort of thrust into leadership roles and did fine. And 751 00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:11,760 Speaker 11: I would say, you know, there's a very simple answer 752 00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:15,360 Speaker 11: to this heg Seth question about women in the military 753 00:37:15,480 --> 00:37:17,239 Speaker 11: is that's not the policy he's going to make. The 754 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,600 Speaker 11: White House is going to make that policy. And when 755 00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:22,080 Speaker 11: you look at all the work that's been done around 756 00:37:22,120 --> 00:37:29,920 Speaker 11: this transition, whether it's you know, AFPI, you know a 757 00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:32,960 Speaker 11: thing tank that's been writing on this twenty twenty five, 758 00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:36,239 Speaker 11: none of them have been recommending taking women out of 759 00:37:36,239 --> 00:37:39,239 Speaker 11: combat roles. And so I'd be high I'd be very 760 00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:42,160 Speaker 11: surprised if the White House, you know, is going to 761 00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:45,480 Speaker 11: adopt a Heggseth view, or if Hegseth's going to adopt 762 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:50,000 Speaker 11: the White House view, which is his job. So look, 763 00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:53,080 Speaker 11: there are a lot of controversial people in this cabinet. 764 00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:58,560 Speaker 11: Tulsi Gabbert's comments about Syria and Iran and Russia much 765 00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:03,440 Speaker 11: more sort of inflammatory than that. And you know, RFK Junior. 766 00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:04,959 Speaker 2: Let's not even go there. 767 00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:08,360 Speaker 11: We'd have one hundred days of talking about every controversy 768 00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:11,560 Speaker 11: over mark he's had in the healthcare field that will 769 00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:14,080 Speaker 11: now relate to his tenure as head of HHF. So 770 00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:16,880 Speaker 11: there's plenty to chew on here, but I doubt if 771 00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:20,000 Speaker 11: any of it's going to rise to the level of disqualification. 772 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:24,680 Speaker 2: How about Pam Bondi Genie. This is the name, of course, 773 00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:28,279 Speaker 2: that Donald Trump announced shortly after Matt Gates withdrew for 774 00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:33,040 Speaker 2: Attorney general, first female Attorney general in Florida elected in 775 00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:36,839 Speaker 2: twenty ten, tried unsuccessfully to overturn the Affordable Care Act, 776 00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:40,840 Speaker 2: declined to take legal action against Trump University, and served 777 00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:43,759 Speaker 2: on the team defending Donald Trump in his first impeachment. 778 00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:47,000 Speaker 2: If Matt Gates was the man to break or shake 779 00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:49,960 Speaker 2: up the DOJ, what will she mean for the agency? 780 00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:54,399 Speaker 8: You know, she has a much stronger record obviously eight 781 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:56,960 Speaker 8: years to your point, as an ag of one of 782 00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:59,640 Speaker 8: the largest states in the country, she's been a prosecutor 783 00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:03,000 Speaker 8: for men years. But as it pertains to America first, 784 00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:05,640 Speaker 8: she very much seems to, at least as far as 785 00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:08,560 Speaker 8: we know, agree with Matt Gates. So there will be 786 00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:12,240 Speaker 8: plenty of questions for her, but of course she doesn't 787 00:39:12,280 --> 00:39:15,480 Speaker 8: come with all the baggage. You didn't mention, Joe that 788 00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:19,640 Speaker 8: people are starting to call her legally Blondie, which maybe 789 00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:22,759 Speaker 8: the moniker that sticks with her. But I think she 790 00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:26,120 Speaker 8: is probably unless something comes out that we don't know 791 00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:30,319 Speaker 8: about yet, going to sail through this confirmation process and 792 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:32,480 Speaker 8: she is going to be able to work to do 793 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:36,239 Speaker 8: the bidding of Donald Trump in the way that Matt 794 00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:39,359 Speaker 8: Gates had talked about. But without all that baggage, it's 795 00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:43,000 Speaker 8: not going to impede her confirmation process as far as 796 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:43,600 Speaker 8: we can tell. 797 00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:48,240 Speaker 3: Did it have to be another person from Florida? Ricky 798 00:39:48,320 --> 00:39:51,440 Speaker 3: replaced Florida with Florida after you've already pulled from Florida before. 799 00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:52,360 Speaker 3: What's all this about. 800 00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:55,840 Speaker 11: It's going to be awful tough to get a reservation 801 00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:58,200 Speaker 11: in a Palm Beach restaurant by the time this group 802 00:39:58,320 --> 00:39:59,239 Speaker 11: uses first brick. 803 00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:00,399 Speaker 1: Yeah. 804 00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:03,280 Speaker 11: No, Look, I mean I think she's the maybe sixth 805 00:40:03,840 --> 00:40:07,800 Speaker 11: resident of Florida to be appointed to the cabinet or 806 00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:13,200 Speaker 11: a sub cabinet level and a former employee of Brian Ballard, 807 00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:17,040 Speaker 11: who I think you know, premier lobbyist in Florida, Susie 808 00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:20,239 Speaker 11: Wiles partner, and it looks like he's going to have 809 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,759 Speaker 11: quite a franchise in Washington, d C. Over the course 810 00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:25,480 Speaker 11: of the next four years. So yeah, it's definitely a 811 00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:30,760 Speaker 11: Florida centric administration. And better make your Christmas plans early 812 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:33,120 Speaker 11: if you plan to get a hotel room down in 813 00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:33,720 Speaker 11: Palm Beach. 814 00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:38,759 Speaker 3: Yeah, we started calling Florida like southern Florida Wall Street South. 815 00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:40,560 Speaker 3: It's going to be Pennsylvania Avenue. 816 00:40:40,239 --> 00:40:42,280 Speaker 2: South also, that's right, the Breakers. 817 00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:45,040 Speaker 3: Or maybe the White House is Florida North in I 818 00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:45,360 Speaker 3: don't know. 819 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:47,400 Speaker 2: I'm fine with that. We need some palm trees in 820 00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:48,879 Speaker 2: our life. It's getting chillier in here. 821 00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,719 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was snowing in Washington earlier today. I don't 822 00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:53,759 Speaker 3: know if Rick Davis and Genie Schanzy who got to 823 00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:56,720 Speaker 3: experience it, but we're glad as always to experience another 824 00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:58,960 Speaker 3: conversation with our signature political panel. 825 00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:07,040 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make 826 00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:10,000 Speaker 2: sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 827 00:41:10,120 --> 00:41:12,680 Speaker 2: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find 828 00:41:12,760 --> 00:41:16,000 Speaker 2: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern 829 00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:17,720 Speaker 2: at bloomberg dot com,