Speaker 1: Of the Law and Order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies. These episodes are based on. These are our stories.
Speaker 3: Done done.
Speaker 2: Yay, that's messed up an SVU podcast. We have another
Speaker 2: episode coming to you. My name is Lisa Traeger.
Speaker 1: My name is Kara Klank, and yeah, we do a
Speaker 1: podcast about Law and Order SVU. We talk about the episodes,
Speaker 1: we talk about the true crimes they're based on, and
Speaker 1: we speak to a guest sometimes. And before that we
Speaker 1: like to catch up because now we live on zupper
Speaker 1: coasts and this is our moment to see what's going on,
Speaker 1: What's up with you, what's up with me?
Speaker 2: What's up? Honestly, I really predictable. I would say it's
Speaker 2: a lot of Bravo, a lot of Soul Cycle and
Speaker 2: a lot of comedy so and a lot of you know,
Speaker 2: I bought a couple tel fars and that's just.
Speaker 4: I yeah, basic And anyway, you know what your business
Speaker 4: manager said that that's.
Speaker 2: Fine, Yeah, it's fine. Well I want a clear bag
Speaker 2: for the beach. Great, I want a beach bag, baby, yes, yes,
Speaker 2: And but that's That's pretty much it I have. I
Speaker 2: wish I had something new and exciting, but you told
Speaker 2: me about an update. What is it?
Speaker 4: What's happening?
Speaker 2: Tell me?
Speaker 1: Oh well, okay, wait, I have a little update on
Speaker 1: one of the true crimes that we have covered when
Speaker 1: we did the Sherry Rasmussen murder, the woman who is
Speaker 1: based on the other Marcia gay Hearted episode where she
Speaker 1: is she kills her boyfriend's new her ex boyfriend's like
Speaker 1: new wife, and then she hit it for years and
Speaker 1: she was an LAPD detective. So her parole, she'd been
Speaker 1: granted parole back in life, I think November or something,
Speaker 1: and recently they're reconsidering it. They're reconsidering the parole and
Speaker 1: her family is the family of the victim is thrilled,
Speaker 1: of course, but there.
Speaker 4: Can you do that? I didn't even know you can
Speaker 4: do that.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's basically like Gavin Newsome asked for a There's some
Speaker 1: word they use, like like I now, I can't find
Speaker 1: the word, but it's basically like they think maybe there
Speaker 1: was something not cool that went on with the decision
Speaker 1: to give her parole, and so they're asking them to
Speaker 1: like re examine it. He's asking them to like, re
Speaker 1: examine it. The parole grant for her, so how much
Speaker 1: time served? Because if it's a few decades, I'm okay
Speaker 1: with it. But if it's less, it's like you were
Speaker 1: part of law enforcement and committed crime and hit it
Speaker 1: Like no, no, no, no, you don't get to just
Speaker 1: run around town, right right, But if you serve twenty
Speaker 1: I'm okay with it.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: So she was convicted in March of twenty two, twelve.
Speaker 1: She committed the crime in eighty six, so she got
Speaker 1: away with it for a long ass time. No better
Speaker 1: ask back in jail, what did she do? Have sex
Speaker 1: for parole? I'm thinking two orange is the new black?
Speaker 1: But like, what was shady about it?
Speaker 2: I feel like she had a personal connection with someone
Speaker 2: and because she's law enforcement, like, there's no fucking way
Speaker 2: you murder get away with it for decades and only
Speaker 2: serve eight what I think.
Speaker 1: She served eleven when she got parole, But now they're
Speaker 1: keeping her and.
Speaker 4: I would be pissed if I was her.
Speaker 2: Fair, I mean that is that's tough to think you're
Speaker 2: out and then you're not. But I don't have like
Speaker 2: sympathy for this person, right right.
Speaker 4: And so we will see she was an.
Speaker 1: Art theft investigator, remember, and like she hid this whole
Speaker 1: fucking murder and it was a twenty seven year to
Speaker 1: life prison sentence but she got after serving eleven. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I think I need to see you up there closer
Speaker 1: to twenty.
Speaker 2: Girl, That's what I mean. Yeah, if there was double digit,
Speaker 2: not eleven, like an actual double digit. I heard it
Speaker 2: here first, eleven is no longer.
Speaker 1: Counting, no, no longer famously a single digit number.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but yeah, like you also, like you also for
Speaker 5: twenty five years or something like, lived your life and
Speaker 5: hid this family, had no closure.
Speaker 4: That's like torture, you know.
Speaker 2: And your law enforcement you should have worst penalties, like
Speaker 2: to me, if you are on the side of the law,
Speaker 2: you should have were Yeah, it should be worse. You
Speaker 2: should get your fingers chopped off. Go back to Hammurabi.
Speaker 2: I don't want to say it like I'm saying it wrong.
Speaker 2: Aladdin Hammurabi's Aladdin. Yes, No, but Amarabie is I think
Speaker 2: a real person and time frame.
Speaker 4: But it was like, you're.
Speaker 2: Saying it correctly, Okay.
Speaker 4: It kind of sounds like halloumi And now I just
Speaker 4: want cheese and I love Halloumi so much. Oh my god,
Speaker 4: that's the best cheese. I love it.
Speaker 2: But I'm open to experiencing Hallumi in a way that
Speaker 2: I love.
Speaker 1: What's that place in New York I used to get
Speaker 1: delicious Hallumi.
Speaker 2: It's like right by where you live. It's Cafe Mogador. Yes,
Speaker 2: are you impressed? And oh wait, I was talking to
Speaker 2: someone I for Oh god, I have no memory anymore
Speaker 2: of anything. But they mentioned one word about SVU. They
Speaker 2: were like, oh, the child ended up being the pedophile.
Speaker 2: I'm like, did he have a bowl cut and he
Speaker 2: was addicted to porn because his dad worked too much.
Speaker 2: But they first thought it was the Jewish sect and
Speaker 2: they go, yeah, that that is what I mentioned. Like,
Speaker 2: it's just one word. Your illness is showing. Well, another
Speaker 2: illness has started. I don't know how deep you are
Speaker 2: into the new Drag Race All Stars nine. The first one,
Speaker 2: the first one, you know they released the second for
Speaker 2: us and the stuff. Yeah, the second one's available and
Speaker 2: it's pit Stop and Fashion Photo Reviewer out too, So
Speaker 2: I got a full experience.
Speaker 4: Okay, so you know, I don't know how to think.
Speaker 2: Unless you Tube tells me how to think about the
Speaker 2: Queens you know what.
Speaker 1: Were you what were you gonna Were you gonna say
Speaker 1: something else about drag Race or just that you watched it.
Speaker 4: I love it.
Speaker 2: I don't love that there's no steaks like that is
Speaker 2: hard we're going to say because even for the first
Speaker 2: one where no one went home, it did have like
Speaker 2: the there were just more stakes because now we're also
Speaker 2: playing for charity. And I bet even if you don't
Speaker 2: win a lot, they're going to donate a certain minimum
Speaker 2: to your charity, right I I They're not gonna leave
Speaker 2: like trans homeless kids on the loose, like because you
Speaker 2: know their person didn't win a challenge because.
Speaker 1: The yeah, the the winners were going for money in
Speaker 1: the All Winner season, they were going for money right
Speaker 1: like that they were going to earn. I think it
Speaker 1: should be like you win this big prize and then
Speaker 1: it's matched to your donation or something like. I need
Speaker 1: there to be a reason that they're all competing like
Speaker 1: and then they're key king too much.
Speaker 2: There's having too much fun and I need a little
Speaker 2: bit of not violence. But I just want the edge
Speaker 2: that I'm not really getting. And they all know each
Speaker 2: other so well and love each other, and they revere
Speaker 2: each other and it's just a little too positive for me.
Speaker 1: You're using all of the words that I've been using
Speaker 1: on a chat with other people the same thing.
Speaker 4: I was like, there's no edge. It's like a little
Speaker 4: bit too positive.
Speaker 1: It's a little bit too like look, look, look, I
Speaker 1: absolutely get that drag is like under fire right now
Speaker 1: certain states people are psychotically equivalent, like, you know, equating
Speaker 1: drag with like child molesters.
Speaker 4: It's insane and but.
Speaker 1: Like a little bit of like drag is also like
Speaker 1: edgy and like and then it's like we just get
Speaker 1: these musicals that are like drag will save the world,
Speaker 1: and I'm kind of like, a, right.
Speaker 2: I got the same with the song. I'm like, can
Speaker 2: we just have a little more fun? I don't need
Speaker 2: a we are the world? Yeah, I don't are the world.
Speaker 4: But it's like, but like I like that they tell
Speaker 4: people to vote.
Speaker 1: I like that they like try to say we like
Speaker 1: that they had that the message is but I think
Speaker 1: that just by existing and doing what you want and
Speaker 1: doing like cool numbers and funny references and stuff like
Speaker 1: that and stuff that's edgy, Like you are existing and
Speaker 1: you are on this platform that is doing that job
Speaker 1: for you, but maybe this is coming off like my
Speaker 1: like my Barbie problems, which was like, oh, don't we
Speaker 1: all know feminism is good? But like you know, there
Speaker 1: are some parts of the country where maybe they need
Speaker 1: this hammered into them more. But I for for me,
Speaker 1: for like what drag is supposed to be, I think
Speaker 1: it's just a little bit too And I know where
Speaker 1: it's coming from. I've worked on the show, Like I
Speaker 1: know who's responsible basically for all of this, like all
Speaker 1: of this like go like cis boom ba like raw
Speaker 1: raw drag stuff, which I agree with of course a
Speaker 1: thousand times.
Speaker 4: But I'm just like and even.
Speaker 2: Though the song, like I think we both are, like.
Speaker 4: It's a little corny.
Speaker 2: They are incredible, Yeah, can tell that they're all stars,
Speaker 2: Like they truly are also good. There's not even a
Speaker 2: slip I mean there is a slip up Nina West unacceptable.
Speaker 4: Oh you haven't even seen the second one.
Speaker 2: Oh I haven't seen the second Sorry to be uh
Speaker 2: it's a ball Okay, Okay, you got it's just disgusting.
Speaker 2: You need taste, you need a little bit of taste.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, it could be it could be bad. I
Speaker 2: don't know. You'll you'll see it. But plast Seek's amazing.
Speaker 2: I love the queens. I love them, I love them
Speaker 2: hanging out. It's just not why No.
Speaker 1: They're all gorgeous. That's why it's all stars. They're beautiful.
Speaker 1: They're gorgeous. I need steaks.
Speaker 4: I need a reason why am I watching this?
Speaker 2: Like why?
Speaker 4: Like you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like, because if my friend was saying, if it's for charity,
Speaker 1: then why not just have like a new group of
Speaker 1: queens every week and just make it like that's like
Speaker 1: a new.
Speaker 2: Form of the show. They're also no one is mean,
Speaker 2: like Roxy Andrews is helping everyone and she has this
Speaker 2: positive positive and I just can we And maybe it's
Speaker 2: because I'm so used to playing Jane now, but I yeah,
Speaker 2: a little bit of sh And they.
Speaker 1: Did the read they did the reads. The reads were
Speaker 1: good in the mini and they were fun. I'm so
Speaker 1: glad because you know, I famously worked on a season
Speaker 1: where the reading challenge got canceled because they all like
Speaker 1: couldn't read each other.
Speaker 4: Because that was a young season. That's what it is.
Speaker 2: The youth. They don't like mean. The youth are different
Speaker 2: than us, and it's a it's a more sensitive positive
Speaker 2: self accepting. They don't like what's it called when you
Speaker 2: make fun of yourself deprecating? Deprecating?
Speaker 1: I don't like that, and I just feel like I
Speaker 1: need and I've been listening to a lot of Tricksy
Speaker 1: and Contio's podcast, so forgive me.
Speaker 4: I know people don't like this word.
Speaker 1: I need more cuntiness, Like I need a little bit
Speaker 1: more cuntiness, Like I would have liked that first musical
Speaker 1: number to be like them all going out being like
Speaker 1: this is why I'm gonna fucking win because I'm the shit,
Speaker 1: you know, and like doing that, and then let's.
Speaker 4: Do the little drag saves the world.
Speaker 1: Like in three episodes or something, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: Like I don't know. I just was like that was
Speaker 1: a little I'm obviously gonna keep watching and love it.
Speaker 4: I will continue watching.
Speaker 2: Also the pit Stop, like I love when Violet Shotski
Speaker 2: comes to town and she's the second episode and your
Speaker 2: episode I guess of the pit Stop with Trixy is
Speaker 2: one of the most watched of all time, but number one,
Speaker 2: Like she really is such a bitch, but it's perfect.
Speaker 4: Who read got meic?
Speaker 2: Like that? You?
Speaker 1: Oh my god, congratulations on like all your success and
Speaker 1: becoming Violet Tatchki's assistant or something like that.
Speaker 2: I was like, well, they asked her about it, and
Speaker 2: she goes, well, she is and she's actually doing a
Speaker 2: bad job.
Speaker 4: So if someone can apply.
Speaker 2: It was Violet. But Violet, even though they're drag family,
Speaker 2: like on the pit Stop, she legit had a different
Speaker 2: favorite and like, you know, she's not she's not biased
Speaker 2: in that kind.
Speaker 1: Of Wait, I gotta get I gotta get into the
Speaker 1: pets Shop.
Speaker 4: You would love it.
Speaker 2: It's like Tricksy and another queen just talking jokes. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I just I'm so. I mean, I love Bob and Trixie.
Speaker 2: They got the jokes. They got the jokes. Yeah, they're
Speaker 2: very popular.
Speaker 4: On the internet. So it makes sense.
Speaker 1: Did you you were just I don't know if you
Speaker 1: want to talk about this, but you just mentioned that
Speaker 1: you went to a New York city first for you, you
Speaker 1: didn't went to a place you'd never been before.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I was talking to a friend Sam J
Speaker 2: and I had mentioned that I've never been to the
Speaker 2: Blue Note and she loves it. Oh and so I
Speaker 2: was just like getting off stage at another venue and
Speaker 2: I had an hour and a half, maybe two hours
Speaker 2: to kill until my late spot and I got a
Speaker 2: text like serendipitous from the world and that said, hey,
Speaker 2: I got a table, you should come, And so I
Speaker 2: got in a car and I zipped on over and
Speaker 2: it was all sold out and I got to be like,
Speaker 2: my friend has a table, So that felt nice. But
Speaker 2: I just, you know, I only know about jazz clubs
Speaker 2: from Sex City, but these guys are incredible and she
Speaker 2: is really in depth with her knowledge. So she's like, oh,
Speaker 2: he played on Genuine's album, he played on this album.
Speaker 2: He went on tour with Eric Abadu, like sh she
Speaker 2: knew about them, and I just the trombones were amazing.
Speaker 2: And then I told her, I go, the trombones are
Speaker 2: my favorite. She goes, everything's a boy band to you,
Speaker 2: you gotta pick one, and I go, yeah, I guess
Speaker 2: that is me.
Speaker 4: But you know, I don't, man.
Speaker 2: But the only thing that sucks is like it is
Speaker 2: a tourist, super white, old Midwestern vibe, and it's like
Speaker 2: these musicians being like can someone move a little bit?
Speaker 4: Like can someone give a whoo?
Speaker 2: Like yeah, just like families at the like at twelve,
Speaker 2: like they're tired. They went to the Statue of Liberty
Speaker 2: in the day type of vibe. And that's how I
Speaker 2: feel at Kingston Minds in Chicago, where it's like the
Speaker 2: most soulful, incredible musicians, and then the crowd is just
Speaker 2: rhythmless whites, Like I don't really know how to say it,
Speaker 2: but they're used to it.
Speaker 4: They're making money.
Speaker 2: It's fine.
Speaker 4: I also I wonder also if it's like like.
Speaker 2: And I love nothing more than chair dancing, Like nothing
Speaker 2: makes me happier than sitting.
Speaker 4: And being able to move my body, like like move
Speaker 4: your upper body only. Yes, yes, we love it.
Speaker 2: I got a wink from one of the musicians because
Speaker 2: he could tell I was really trying to woo and
Speaker 2: respond in a way that wasn't as dead as so
Speaker 2: many of them.
Speaker 1: But I wonder if they're used to it because you're
Speaker 1: putting it on it, Like when you go to the
Speaker 1: zoo and you see the animal that's alone. It's like
Speaker 1: they told you these animals don't need to be with
Speaker 1: anyone else or whatever. We are used to, like why
Speaker 1: is there no response? We're comedian, like you know, like
Speaker 1: you want to and like I was at a jet
Speaker 1: So when I lived in Rome, i lived across the
Speaker 1: street literally the same tiny little street from this jazz
Speaker 1: club in Rome that's called Alexander Platz and it's where
Speaker 1: talents mister Ripley has a scene and it's like a
Speaker 1: very famous jazz club. And I went there with my
Speaker 1: Italian friends one night and I remember it's like we
Speaker 1: were drinking. I think we're probably smoking cigarettes because you
Speaker 1: couldn't you can you could then, and I was like,
Speaker 1: would just like whisper something to a friend and they'd
Speaker 1: be like like it was like the vibe was like,
Speaker 1: don't speak, don't talk to your friends. This is about
Speaker 1: sitting here motionless and watching jazz.
Speaker 2: And I was like, okay, you know that's how the
Speaker 2: Green Mill in Chicago is, like I you can like
Speaker 2: secretly get fingered in a booth. I guess otherwise you
Speaker 2: have to be pretty silent at this. I don't know.
Speaker 2: It seemed like they'd be like who knows the words?
Speaker 2: But no, you're right that they are one hundred percent
Speaker 2: used to it. But then Sam J was telling me
Speaker 2: the next night there was gonna be a tap dancer
Speaker 2: who was on Sesame Street and he learned from Gregory
Speaker 2: Hines and that he's like this, like you know, black hero.
Speaker 2: And I go but will they be performed, Like is
Speaker 2: he gonna tap dance with this crowd? And they go no,
Speaker 2: a black, that signal has gone out, like it'll be
Speaker 2: the different crowd, So I'll have to ask her about it.
Speaker 4: Is it Savion Glover? That's exactly who it was?
Speaker 2: Oh, Savion Glover is well yeah, and then they mic
Speaker 2: the ground. I wish I knew, so I could have
Speaker 2: been cooler, but they mic the ground and one of
Speaker 2: the musicians she knows plays as he tap dances. But
Speaker 2: I wonder if for certain shows there's different you know,
Speaker 2: audiences or whatnot. But it was cool and I'd love
Speaker 2: to go again. But it's tough when you get to
Speaker 2: go VIP and then what are you gonna do? Now?
Speaker 2: Just look it in general? Yeah yeah, I can't do that. Well,
Speaker 2: I'll have to figure it out. I also fail, okay,
Speaker 2: so and we'll moving. But famously, I never know when
Speaker 2: anyone's on cocaine, Like it's just kind of auffla of
Speaker 2: mine superpower. I'm always tired and I don't have it,
Speaker 2: and then later I'm like, oh, they were on coke.
Speaker 2: So I found another blind spot. I was talking to
Speaker 2: someone that's really into soul cycle like I am. And
Speaker 2: we were talking about all the teachers and there's one
Speaker 2: that's like incredibly built, like a great god. And they
Speaker 2: were like, well, he's on steroids. I go, no, they go, yo,
Speaker 2: he does is burn like anyone that chiseled is on steroids.
Speaker 4: What They're like, can't you tell he's moody.
Speaker 2: I go, he is moody, and they're like, he's burning
Speaker 2: so many calories. There's no way he is maintaining that
Speaker 2: body from just soul cycle. And I go, oh my god,
Speaker 2: I'm like so stupid. I don't know steroids or cocaine.
Speaker 1: Wilhelm and Alaska talked about this one time on their
Speaker 1: podcast where they were like, any guy you know that
Speaker 1: is just like super super fucking jacked kind of out
Speaker 1: of nowhere. And I think they were talking specific about
Speaker 1: gay guys, but they were like, he has done a circuit,
Speaker 1: is doing circuit of.
Speaker 4: Steroids, like uh you know.
Speaker 1: And I was like, oh, okay, Like because that would
Speaker 1: have been for me. I would have been like, WHOA
Speaker 1: a lot of protein powder? Like I don't know what
Speaker 1: people are doing to get jacked, you know, Like no.
Speaker 2: I thought he counted as macroism, Like I assume just
Speaker 2: eating a lot of protein like nipping my wildest dreams,
Speaker 2: but it makes sense.
Speaker 4: His ass is just like phenomenal.
Speaker 1: Well, I went to I went to an equally iconic
Speaker 1: place as the Blue Note. I did go to Jackson's
Speaker 1: Bar yesterday last night. I'll tell a well, listen, I
Speaker 1: am loath to give. This is Jack's from vander Pump Rules,
Speaker 1: who is now on a show called The Valley. Unless
Speaker 1: you're not a Bravo head like us, And I'm not
Speaker 1: really watching The Valley. But I think I mentioned to
Speaker 1: you before. I was going with a friend who wanted
Speaker 1: We were trying to give our friend a little pick
Speaker 1: me up night and she wanted to go there, and
Speaker 1: I wasn't watching The Valley, so I quickly watched two episodes.
Speaker 2: Have you watched your watching? I'm actually shocked you're not
Speaker 2: watching The Valley. I am now, but I've watched two episodes.
Speaker 1: I'm shocked I'm not watching The Valley and I'm going
Speaker 1: to be watching Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: When I watched it, I was like, oh, this is
Speaker 1: like the natural progression for me, Like I also have kids,
Speaker 1: like and live in la and I think, like I
Speaker 1: would think that it was a fun, like you know,
Speaker 1: and they have.
Speaker 4: A lot of wild drama going on, so it's fun.
Speaker 1: So we went and when we got there, we had
Speaker 1: a little picnic table. There are so many TV setups,
Speaker 1: so it's like, honestly a really great place to watch
Speaker 1: a show. So I did watch the vander Pump reunion
Speaker 1: because I was there, and.
Speaker 4: Then that's fun.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so we all watched the vander pub reunion and
Speaker 1: then then the Valley episode came on, and they came,
Speaker 1: like a bunch of them came. So it was Kristin
Speaker 1: came and like they were all very casual. Kristin was
Speaker 1: in like leggings like and a shirt, like wearing makeup,
Speaker 1: but like she was dressed down and she came with
Speaker 1: her dog.
Speaker 4: And then Brittany was there.
Speaker 1: Wearing a T shirt that said my boyfriend's out of town,
Speaker 1: and I was like, interesting and that could barely contain
Speaker 1: her huge boobs. I'm sorry she got her boobs done
Speaker 1: to a size that is not good for her body
Speaker 1: like that. I hate Jacks for like making her get
Speaker 1: a huge boob job. And then the girl who's the
Speaker 1: beauty queen with the three kids who just had the twins,
Speaker 1: she was there, and she was very sweet and took
Speaker 1: a picture with our friends. So it was an experience.
Speaker 1: And I had Mima's beer cheese.
Speaker 2: No was the FAA drinks good.
Speaker 1: I had already had dinner, So everybody kind of ordered
Speaker 1: wings and like buffalo cauliflower and stuff like that, and
Speaker 1: I just ate a little bit of the beer cheese
Speaker 1: with the pretzel and I did enjoy it.
Speaker 4: It had like a kick to it.
Speaker 1: I don't know what beer cheese is supposed to taste, like,
Speaker 1: do you think it's going to be successful long term? Well,
Speaker 1: there were a lot of people there for this, And
Speaker 1: the thing is is like if they do play sporting events,
Speaker 1: I haven't been to a bar like it was just
Speaker 1: like rows of TVs on every wall, and I think
Speaker 1: it would be and then picnic tables. So I do
Speaker 1: think it's kind of the I think it's the kind
Speaker 1: of place where your girlfriend will go with you to
Speaker 1: watch a sports game because it's not gross, and the
Speaker 1: menu is like a little bit more elevated than just
Speaker 1: like wings and fries, you know, but like and then
Speaker 1: there's you know, there's like a decent glass of rose
Speaker 1: on the menu. You know. It's not like going to
Speaker 1: a full sports bar, but that it has all these
Speaker 1: TVs and stuff. But there were tons of people there.
Speaker 1: They were taking pictures with everybody. They were being really nice.
Speaker 2: The best, so you said, you know, unfortunately Brittany was
Speaker 2: demolished by an old, horrible sociopath and everyone did warn her.
Speaker 2: So I don't know what I feel. But who looked great?
Speaker 1: I thought Kristin looked great, like like, Kristin looked great.
Speaker 4: And I was like, you know, cause I don't think
Speaker 4: I think she's.
Speaker 1: Looks different from vander Pump now to the Valley, and
Speaker 1: I think sometimes it's her clothing choices where I'm always
Speaker 1: like this doesn't like sit well on you this outfit.
Speaker 1: But she looked really cute and she was nice, and
Speaker 1: yeah it was it was could you ask.
Speaker 4: Anyone for photos? Okay, So here's what happened. I didn't care.
Speaker 1: I didn't really care because I just I go, I
Speaker 1: just started watching the show two days ago, like, I
Speaker 1: don't really care.
Speaker 4: But they were like they really wanted to take a
Speaker 4: picture with Kristin.
Speaker 1: So our one friend that we were with, this girl, Casey,
Speaker 1: she goes, I'm just gonna go ask. I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: go ask, like she'd had like two three skinny margaritas,
Speaker 1: and I was like, I'm just gonna go ask her,
Speaker 1: but Kristin was in like a pretty intense conversation with someone,
Speaker 1: so she like bent down and went up to her,
Speaker 1: and Kristin did not even look and her didn't even move,
Speaker 1: so she just went, oh my god. I just like
Speaker 1: retreated and was like, oh my god, that was a
Speaker 1: fail that didn't work.
Speaker 2: Oh my god.
Speaker 4: And then it was so funny.
Speaker 1: So then when I saw the conversation like kind of
Speaker 1: come to a close, I went up to her and
Speaker 1: I said, Hi, my friends really want to get a
Speaker 1: picture with you. Do you mind, And she goes, oh
Speaker 1: my god, of course. I go, my friend just tried
Speaker 1: to say hi to you and you were in a conversation.
Speaker 1: And she goes, oh, I know, I felt so bad,
Speaker 1: And I go, she's mortified. So if you guys could
Speaker 1: talk it out, like I kind of tried to like
Speaker 1: work it out. So then they did a picture with her,
Speaker 1: and then I got in a picture with the girl
Speaker 1: with the kids, Nia, the girl who's like the beauty
Speaker 1: queen that does jiu jitsu or whatever, but I don't
Speaker 1: really know.
Speaker 4: Who she is, and did she look drop dead stunning?
Speaker 1: She was so beautiful and she was like someone was
Speaker 1: taking a picture of us. Oh it was our friend
Speaker 1: Lauren was taking the picture and uh, Neo was like
Speaker 1: flash like went in and like got her phone, like
Speaker 1: put the flash on, like knew how to knew her
Speaker 1: best light. And she was not wrong because in the
Speaker 1: photos she did look better with the flash on. So yeah,
Speaker 1: that was my fun little eve last night.
Speaker 2: It was huge and I'm shocked you didn't start with
Speaker 2: that immediately.
Speaker 1: I just remember that I did that, Like I wake
Speaker 1: up every morning and I'm like, what's happened in the
Speaker 1: past ten days? I don't know my memories scrub scrubbed
Speaker 1: clean every day like I'm in fifty first dates. And
Speaker 1: we will start the episode, yeah, but I would just
Speaker 1: like to say fuck Lala, and we'll talk about vander
Speaker 1: Pump Reunion three afterward next Yes, yes she I wasn't
Speaker 1: even watching this season, but I was like, girl, you
Speaker 1: are not this is not happening for you right now,
Speaker 1: like her, your dumb are bad, Laala, You're so stupid,
Speaker 1: And we will start, okay, thank you, yeah, really quickly
Speaker 1: before we start, always go to that's messed up live
Speaker 1: dot com. Go to the Lisa's website tab to see
Speaker 1: Lisa's tour dates.
Speaker 4: She'll be on the road.
Speaker 1: You can also there you can follow rate review our
Speaker 1: podcast on Spotify.
Speaker 2: Or Apple or wherever.
Speaker 1: And then also that has a shop our promo Codes
Speaker 1: link where you can get all of our promo codes
Speaker 1: to our ads in one place. So if you've got
Speaker 1: like a gift coming up, or something you've been meaning
Speaker 1: to buy that we advertise for, there's probably a link
Speaker 1: that will get you a deal, So get to it.
Speaker 1: And now let's start our episode.
Speaker 4: We are doing.
Speaker 1: Deception, very a very vague title for season four, episode two.
Speaker 1: This baby came out two thousand and two, and I've
Speaker 1: seen this one like twenty five times. This is one
Speaker 1: of the ones I've seen so so so many times.
Speaker 2: I would say a favorite for sure. You know, I'm
Speaker 2: not lighthearted, but no like soap operash totally. It's very
Speaker 2: death and sad. But and it took us forever because
Speaker 2: we really pushed for the guests. Yeah, we tried hard
Speaker 2: for you, and I wanted tot get her hands or
Speaker 2: any of it, any of them.
Speaker 1: We went through friends of guests we've had on that
Speaker 1: are friends with these people, and we still couldn't get
Speaker 1: anybody to commit, but it's fine.
Speaker 4: We needed to bring you the episode so their loss.
Speaker 4: They didn't get to talk to us.
Speaker 1: So we open on Olivia talking to a little girl
Speaker 1: named Chloe in a school library and they called in
Speaker 1: the big.
Speaker 4: Guns because Chloe drew something weird.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: The picture is of her, her mother and her half brother, Kyle,
Speaker 1: and in the drawing she's crying and her dad's not
Speaker 1: in the drawing because he's out of town. And Olivia
Speaker 1: is like, is someone hurting you? And she says, I
Speaker 1: don't know. And she's super cute, this little girl, She's
Speaker 1: very cute. And now Elliet is walking down the stairs
Speaker 1: of the school talking to Chloe's teacher, who says Chloe's
Speaker 1: usually happy and outgoing, but lately has been withdrawn and
Speaker 1: she noticed bruises. I mean, this is classic when the
Speaker 1: school should be calling law enforcement or authorities. So Stabler says,
Speaker 1: we're going to take her to the hospital for an exam,
Speaker 1: but the teacher is like, well what do I tell her?
Speaker 1: Extremely high strung dad. He's a yeller, a corporate mogul type.
Speaker 1: His name is Laurence Fuller, and Elliott recognizes his name
Speaker 1: because Fuller Telecom is on his cable bill.
Speaker 4: So it'd be like if you were a.
Speaker 1: Teacher and one of the guys at your school was
Speaker 1: named Spectrum or something like that for me. So the
Speaker 1: teacher adds, oh, and her mother is Gloria Stanfield, an actress,
Speaker 1: which is such a Neil Bear name like these are.
Speaker 1: This is episode is from the Neil Bear like generation,
Speaker 1: and that just feels like Gloria Stanfield sounds like an
Speaker 1: old timey actress from the forties, and the teacher's like
Speaker 1: she did a few movies about ten years back, so
Speaker 1: it doesn't sound like she's still a popular actress, but
Speaker 1: enough that she has some name recognition. Back to Olivia
Speaker 1: talking to Chloe, who says she sat in the picture
Speaker 1: because quote, Mommy loves Kyle more than me, and she
Speaker 1: reads him stories but not her. They close the door
Speaker 1: and she's not allowed to go in there, but one
Speaker 1: time she went in because she heard noises and she
Speaker 1: thought mommy was crying, but they were playing in bed
Speaker 1: with no clothes on.
Speaker 2: Done.
Speaker 1: Done, We're at the credits. Okay, what's happening here At
Speaker 1: the hospital. The doctor is telling the detectives that Chloe
Speaker 1: shows no sign of sexual abuse, just bruises on her shins,
Speaker 1: which is typical of a five year old.
Speaker 4: And I can back that up.
Speaker 1: Rosie is bruised, baby healed wrist and tibia fractures though,
Speaker 1: but she doesn't remember how she got them. And then
Speaker 1: the dad is there and I recognize him immediately. And
Speaker 1: the actor's named Tom Mason. He has seventy five IMDb
Speaker 1: credits and he has acted for decades.
Speaker 4: Is that how I know him?
Speaker 1: No, I know him because he is from a classic
Speaker 1: episode of s You called Families, and he plays Jason Conner,
Speaker 1: a man who has two families and acts that accidentally
Speaker 1: leads to a brother and a sister.
Speaker 4: Fucking.
Speaker 1: This is a favorite that Lisa and I have done
Speaker 1: at our live shows and we love it. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's not based on a true crime as far as
Speaker 1: we know, and that's why we haven't done it on
Speaker 1: the pod, but it's a classic one of the camp y,
Speaker 1: are or crazier episodes with the line.
Speaker 2: I had sex with my sister, So.
Speaker 4: We love that.
Speaker 2: Anyway.
Speaker 1: Here he is Lawrence Fuller and he wants answers on
Speaker 1: why his little cloak clow is in the hospital, and
Speaker 1: so the detectives get some info out of him. They're like,
Speaker 1: what's with the tibia the wrist, and he's like, oh,
Speaker 1: she was three, she fell off a slide.
Speaker 4: That would make sense.
Speaker 1: You wouldn't remember that, really, because I think that kids
Speaker 1: don't really start making memories until they're four or five,
Speaker 1: which is like, why am I spending money on these
Speaker 1: birthday parties?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 1: Elliott breaks it to him that Chloe seems to be
Speaker 1: indicating that there might be a sexual relationship going on
Speaker 1: between his wife and his son. So, just so you
Speaker 1: know the family dynamics, the son Kyle is from the
Speaker 1: dad's previous relationship. The guy is wavering between pissed at
Speaker 1: the cops but also suspicious of his wife, and he's
Speaker 1: gonna find out what the hell is going on here
Speaker 1: Back in the squad room, school records show that Kyle
Speaker 1: Fuller was a pretty normal, well adjusted kid until his
Speaker 1: mom dies in a car accident when he was in
Speaker 1: the second grade. So after that, behavior problems ensued. It
Speaker 1: got worse than fifth grade fighting an outburst, and that
Speaker 1: was the same year that his dad married Gloria Stanfield,
Speaker 1: so Craigan's like, well, maybe he was adjusting to his stepmother,
Speaker 1: and Munch suggests maybe the stepmother pulled a Woody Allen
Speaker 1: way back then and Woody and soon Yie. If you
Speaker 1: know the story of Woody Allan revealing he was in
Speaker 1: a romantic relationship with his adopted daughter Sunnyie who is
Speaker 1: now his wife, that all broke in nineteen ninety two,
Speaker 1: so ten years before this episode, but you know, the
Speaker 1: reference is there. Finn points out that having sex with
Speaker 1: a seventeen year old isn't illegal, but live is, like
Speaker 1: he turned seventeen last month.
Speaker 4: Do you think it just started like on his birthday?
Speaker 1: And this is back when Finn was still very black
Speaker 1: and white about the law, so he doesn't really care
Speaker 1: that like this woman, what this woman means to this
Speaker 1: kid as like a mother's son relationship as long as
Speaker 1: no laws are specifically being broken. So Benson argues that
Speaker 1: at a minim this is not a great environment for
Speaker 1: little Chloe, and Craigan sends Munch and Finn to go
Speaker 1: talk to Kyle. Elliott suggests they go speak to the
Speaker 1: quote hired help, and Craigan tells everyone to chill and
Speaker 1: to be chill.
Speaker 4: And discreet.
Speaker 1: So he so obviously we caught right to Munch and
Speaker 1: Finn marching up to this kid at his private school
Speaker 1: quad flashing their badges in front of all of his
Speaker 1: friends and being like, Hi, we're SVU. It's like, very subtle,
Speaker 1: just as Craigan was like, be discreet, guys, They're like, hello, son,
Speaker 1: we are the cops from the sex crimes. So Kyle
Speaker 1: is played by Jonathan Bennett, who I'm sure you all
Speaker 1: recognize as Aaron Samuel's from Mean Girls, which he made
Speaker 1: two years after this episode, And it looks like SVU
Speaker 1: was one of his first big acting jobs, and he
Speaker 1: just really looks like a baby here. He even looks
Speaker 1: older as Aaron Samuels a couple years later, of course
Speaker 1: he is, but you know it's a jump. They asked
Speaker 1: him if he's talked to his dad, how are things
Speaker 1: going at home, how he gets along with his stepmother,
Speaker 1: and he's like, if you think my stepmother and I are.
Speaker 4: Sleeping together like sex, that's just sick.
Speaker 1: She's been my step mom since I was ten, And
Speaker 1: it's like, dude, these detectives have seen way worse. But
Speaker 1: he's denied, and I deny at the Fuller Home, a
Speaker 1: vaguely British woman is telling Benson and Stabler that she
Speaker 1: signed an NBA and she can't tell them anything, so
Speaker 1: they threaten to call the IRS on Mary Poppins and
Speaker 1: tell her if they find out Gloria's bank sucked up.
Speaker 2: I don't like when they fucking bully the working class
Speaker 2: like this.
Speaker 1: The people that are gonna lose their jobs. I mean,
Speaker 1: we saw in the episode Abuse with Hayden Pantier.
Speaker 4: We saw another one we just do on the road.
Speaker 1: Sorry everyone, but the nanny gets deported for talking to
Speaker 1: the cops and.
Speaker 4: She didn't even give them that much information.
Speaker 2: Sorry if I also said working class, but I didn't know.
Speaker 4: You know, the staff, they are staff for these people,
Speaker 4: and they probably are immigrants.
Speaker 2: They're so vulnerable, and I it's it's like, stop it.
Speaker 4: I hate when they do things I don't like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So basically they just threaten this lady and they go,
Speaker 1: if Gloria goes down for banging your step son, you're
Speaker 1: going down with the sh Is that what you want?
Speaker 1: So she gives it up and she's like, okay, Well,
Speaker 1: a few weeks earlier, I walked in on Kyle and
Speaker 1: Gloria and she was kissing him in an unmotherly way.
Speaker 1: And then liv gets a phone call and the woman's like,
Speaker 1: but I hardly saw anything, and Live says, well, my
Speaker 1: phone call, says La. Gloria's back in town. She's at
Speaker 1: her lawyer's office, and our presence is kindly requested. When
Speaker 1: they get to the lawyer's office, Gloria is on the
Speaker 1: phone and just like cutely waves at them like they're fans.
Speaker 1: She's like, hi, you know, like and Gloria is played
Speaker 1: by Sherylyn Fenn, which the Twin Peaks heads like me
Speaker 1: No is Audrey Horn. I think that was her big break.
Speaker 1: She was in a bunch of other stuff, but Audrey
Speaker 1: Horn her role on Twin Peaks. She plays like a
Speaker 1: high school fem fatale kind of. She's just like a
Speaker 1: super sexy high school student. And she got nominated for
Speaker 1: I believe Emmy's and Golden Globes and stuff for that award.
Speaker 4: I don't know if she want anything, but that to
Speaker 4: me is where she pops.
Speaker 1: Also, I have famously talked about one of my Clank
Speaker 1: family classics, just one of the guys is where the
Speaker 1: boy goes undercover the girl goes undercover as a boy
Speaker 1: at a high school so she can get work on
Speaker 1: the school newspaper or some shit. And Audrey Horn aka CHERYLN.
Speaker 1: Fenn is in that movie. She works a ton right
Speaker 1: now too. She has an extensive IMDb. Her lawyer is
Speaker 1: an actor named Gerald G.
Speaker 4: Bammon. And I was like, how do I know this guy?
Speaker 1: And he's in the McAllister family and Home Alone, he's
Speaker 1: the uncle, the uncle Home Alone.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I go, I'm like, I know this man and yeah,
Speaker 2: home Alone baby.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was that was a thrill.
Speaker 2: That was.
Speaker 1: Yes, Yes, he's definitely at the at the dinner where
Speaker 1: they talk about how fuller what's the bed?
Speaker 4: Go easy on the PEPSI fuller? And that's little Kiaren,
Speaker 4: isn't it? I think so, isn't Kieren?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Almost positive, yes, Oh my god. And the pictures of him,
Speaker 1: he's so cute. Fuller is so cute. Oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: these kids, Yes, because like McCauley and Kieran are kind
Speaker 1: of the main I know I've heard of Rory, but
Speaker 1: there's a right, yes, the one about the medication, Yeah, yes, no,
Speaker 1: that's her no al abtril one of our with me.
Speaker 2: So uh.
Speaker 1: Gloria finally gets off the phone and Stabler's like, how
Speaker 1: are the Hampton's And she goes dull. I mean, she's
Speaker 1: just like chit chatting, like there's not a huge accusation
Speaker 1: against her on the table.
Speaker 2: But then she gets down to business, acting like like
Speaker 2: this is legally blonde, you know, yes, yes, like she's
Speaker 2: at the spot not not the seriousness that we want for.
Speaker 1: Yes, she is not affording SVU the respect that they
Speaker 1: have become accustomed to. And she gets down to business
Speaker 1: pretty quick. She denies having a sexual relationship with her
Speaker 1: stepson five.
Speaker 4: She makes up stories. She said she would never hurt her.
Speaker 1: Stepson five is young, but like Rosie's five, and she
Speaker 1: wouldn't like completely invent seeing two people wrestling in bed naked,
Speaker 1: like you know, like that's I don't know, five, maybe three.
Speaker 4: If she says something happen like that, I think something
Speaker 4: like that happened.
Speaker 1: But now everyone is having a meet in Cragan's office
Speaker 1: and they've really got nothing, and Live knows in her
Speaker 1: gut that something is up with these people. Sablor pops
Speaker 1: in to let them know that they just got a
Speaker 1: domestic disturbance call to Chloe's school, Laurence and Gloria are
Speaker 1: fighting over who's taking the daughter. So when they get
Speaker 1: to the school, the two parents are taking turns screaming
Speaker 1: at a uniform police officer who's really just standing there
Speaker 1: taking it.
Speaker 4: And Lawrence goes, she raped my son. Who knows what
Speaker 4: she did to my daughter?
Speaker 1: And then Gloria goes our daughter, and it's like that's
Speaker 1: not the most important part of the kid, the accusation,
Speaker 1: and he's calling her disgusting. She says he's a liar
Speaker 1: trying to evade child support. He threatens to kill her
Speaker 1: if she touches his children. She tells everyone he's the abuser.
Speaker 1: He hits her and the kid. Live says they can
Speaker 1: fight it out in family court, but until then, the
Speaker 1: kids are going to be in the custody of the state,
Speaker 1: and that shocks both of them. Live emerges from a
Speaker 1: classroom carrying Chloe, and it's like, you guys have too
Speaker 1: much money to be doing this kind of thing, Like
Speaker 1: send a nanny to go get her at school and
Speaker 1: then you can fight over this privately, like you know,
Speaker 1: this is how kids get removed from homes. Live emerges
Speaker 1: from a classroom carrying Chloe, while Stabler calls Munch to
Speaker 1: do an emergency removal of Kyle at the little preppy
Speaker 1: Kyle Private School, which looks like a college campus. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm like, sure they shot it at Columbia or something.
Speaker 1: All the little preppy boys file out. They ask his
Speaker 1: two dorky friends where Kyle is, and they're like, uh,
Speaker 1: he left. They start digging deeper and these two are
Speaker 1: leaky faucets. They're like, oh, yeah, she and Kyle got
Speaker 1: along really well. Everyone knows about Gloria. She's very open.
Speaker 1: She likes having guys around. They go, she doesn't mind
Speaker 1: if guys look at her, and I'm like, lol, are
Speaker 1: you the guys? Because you are teenage children? And she
Speaker 1: wears see through clothes and is always giving people back rubs.
Speaker 1: Kyle it it's not his real mom, so who cares,
Speaker 1: And they wouldn't be surprised if he's banging her, but
Speaker 1: they don't know for sure. So now at the precinct,
Speaker 1: we find out Chloe is with an aunt and an uncle,
Speaker 1: thank god, and they can't find Kyle. So Craigan tells
Speaker 1: Benson and stable Or their day isn't over yet and
Speaker 1: hands them a piece of paper. The music swells, so
Speaker 1: something is afoot. Now they're at the Stanfield Fuller house
Speaker 1: and Stabler's filling in Munch and Fin. The doorman called
Speaker 1: it in. No one heard a struggle, so I guess
Speaker 1: they've received a call. That's what the piece of paper is.
Speaker 1: No one heard a struggle. Where's the rest of the
Speaker 1: Adams family? Munch quips and there's no forced entry, no robbery,
Speaker 1: and then we see dun Dunn Lawrence Fuller on the
Speaker 1: ground with his head bashed in. He is no longer living.
Speaker 1: So that's the end of act one. We got a
Speaker 1: lot in on this show for the first part. Okay,
Speaker 1: So now a poor man's Melinda Warner is they're giving
Speaker 1: us her findings. This is just not who we've become
Speaker 1: accustomed to dealing with, but she is a medical examiner
Speaker 1: and she's like, there was a blow to the back
Speaker 1: of the head was likely the death, but impact wounds
Speaker 1: to the torso, thighs, fore arms. The murder weapons seems
Speaker 1: to be a baseball bat. And then Munch is there
Speaker 1: holding it going this one because he found it under
Speaker 1: Kyle's bed. The doorman is now giving them a minute
Speaker 1: by minute report of the family's movements. Mister Fuller came
Speaker 1: home at eight o'clock. Gloria left twenty minutes later, Kyle
Speaker 1: left fifteen minutes after that.
Speaker 4: He says, Kyle seemed a little upset.
Speaker 1: No one enters without signing in, he says, and he
Speaker 1: shows them the sign and she suddenly Kyle shows up,
Speaker 1: going what's up? And he has a huge shiner around
Speaker 1: his eye, like big black eye. And Finn breaks the
Speaker 1: news your dad is dead, and he's like, okay, he
Speaker 1: does not seem shaken up, and Finn points it out,
Speaker 1: like you don't seem that upset. Cut back to Mary Poppins,
Speaker 1: our nanny slash house woman.
Speaker 4: I don't know what her job is.
Speaker 1: She seems like she's in charge, though, and she came
Speaker 1: by to check on Gloria, who was very upset about
Speaker 1: the whole Chloe mess at school. And this woman's name
Speaker 1: is no, I wrote Mary, and I'm trying to say
Speaker 1: her name is Mary, but I just keep calling her
Speaker 1: Mary Poppins because we have not named her. Mary wanted
Speaker 1: to make sure she was all right, and she thinks
Speaker 1: it's impossible that she murdered mister Fuller, like impossible that
Speaker 1: Gloria could have done this. And now we're in cement
Speaker 1: Bar's room and Kyle is claiming that the shiner came
Speaker 1: from gym class and Munch and Finn are questioning him.
Speaker 4: He's like, where was I I went for a walk.
Speaker 1: They say things must have been tense between mom and dad,
Speaker 1: but he insists Gloria did not kill my dad. Munch
Speaker 1: asked how many school uniforms do you have? And he
Speaker 1: goes six and they're like, well, where's the one from today?
Speaker 1: They must have counted five in his closet. He says
Speaker 1: he changed after school and Munch cracks that bloodstains don't
Speaker 1: go with the school colors. Craigan interrupts them and pulls
Speaker 1: Munch and Finn out. Turns out Kyle has lawyered up,
Speaker 1: but he never asked for a lawyer. But a lawyer
Speaker 1: is there and guess who it is. It's the uncle
Speaker 1: from the McAllister family, Gloria's lawyer, and he is there
Speaker 1: with Gloria. Elliott brings up this is a possible conflict
Speaker 1: of interest because Gloria is also a suspect. But the
Speaker 1: guy says if charges are filed, Kyle will get a
Speaker 1: new lawyer. But until then it's all good. Gloria says
Speaker 1: she'll talk without a lawyer, even though her lawyer advises
Speaker 1: against it, and she says, I have nothing to hide.
Speaker 1: So in an office with Benson and Stabler, we're in
Speaker 1: more of a blind's wood room. Gloria tells them that
Speaker 1: she has no idea what happened. She went to a
Speaker 1: hotel that night after how her husband was at the school.
Speaker 1: She needed to not be in the home. She only
Speaker 1: went home to get a few things. Her step son
Speaker 1: was there. She tried to explain to him what happened,
Speaker 1: and he got pissed. Lawrence walked in. They started fighting.
Speaker 1: Lawrence got physical as usual and pushed Kyle. She couldn't
Speaker 1: stand it, so she left. And they're like, you left
Speaker 1: your husband there to push around your step son, a
Speaker 1: man you've outwardly told the police is abusive. You're like, bye, Kyle,
Speaker 1: good luck. I hope lacrosse practice helps you beat up
Speaker 1: your dad. She says, I couldn't stop him anyway, and
Speaker 1: she tried, and it only one time and it only
Speaker 1: made things worse. So I guess when they fight, she
Speaker 1: can't get involved.
Speaker 2: She says.
Speaker 1: The hotel will confirm her story. And they go, was
Speaker 1: your husband still breathing when you left? And she says,
Speaker 1: I didn't kill him. I had no reason to, and
Speaker 1: is like, I can think of a couple custody of
Speaker 1: your daughter inheritants money. Gloria goes, he made me sign
Speaker 1: a prenup. He always believed I was a gold digger
Speaker 1: at heart, and girl, you kind of seem like it.
Speaker 1: The money goes to Kyle and Chloe intrusts which I
Speaker 1: am not allowed to touch. So Kyle and Lawrence were
Speaker 1: fighting when you left, and she's like, yes, but Kyle
Speaker 1: didn't do this, and they go, but you left, so
Speaker 1: you don't know for sure, and she's like, I just
Speaker 1: lost my husband and my daughter. I'm not gonna help
Speaker 1: you frame my step son. So now we're talking to Cabot.
Speaker 1: She's like, who looks good for this? Like come on,
Speaker 1: and they're like, well, the murder woman weapon was found
Speaker 1: under the boy's bed. They think it's probably not Gloria,
Speaker 1: and it turns out his prints are the only ones
Speaker 1: on the bat as well. Cabot tells them to arrest Kyle,
Speaker 1: so they barge into interrogation where his lawyer demands that
Speaker 1: they arrest him or they're leaving, but that's just what
Speaker 1: they were coming to do. So they slapped some old
Speaker 1: cuffs on little Kyle and they mirandize him. They walk
Speaker 1: him out, and Gloria's there telling them you've made a mistake,
Speaker 1: and Finn is like, well, we're ready for your confession
Speaker 1: whenever you want, babe, and the lawyer says he'll have
Speaker 1: Kyle out by the morning. She touches Kyle on the
Speaker 1: shoulder and says, don't say anything. I'm getting you a lawyer.
Speaker 1: I'll take care of everything. Don't tell them anything. So
Speaker 1: now at arrangment, guess who's representing Kyle our guy, Trevor
Speaker 1: Langan personal laundry spokesman, mister Marishka Hargatea.
Speaker 4: And he's so hot.
Speaker 1: He's very hot now, but he's very hot in these
Speaker 1: early seasons as well. You can see this is probably
Speaker 1: around when they met and started falling in love. Kyle
Speaker 1: pleads not guilty, and Cabot's like, this kid is rich
Speaker 1: as fuck with zero responsibilities or ties. He is the
Speaker 1: definition of a flight risk. He could be living in
Speaker 1: the Caribbean in like two seconds. He turns back towards Gloria,
Speaker 1: sitting in the courtroom and they share a look Kyle
Speaker 1: and Gloria. So bail is set at a million dollars
Speaker 1: and he has to surrender his passport. He'll make bail
Speaker 1: in five seconds. Cabot complains to Benson and Stabler and
Speaker 1: they figure he didn't pull this off alone. Cabot says,
Speaker 1: find me evidence and I'll charge her as a co conspirator.
Speaker 1: They want to check the hotel, but they can't get
Speaker 1: a warrant to just browse. They have to be looking
Speaker 1: for something specific. So Benson says, Kyle's school uniform, if
Speaker 1: he was wearing it, it's a bloody mess, and Cabot's like,
Speaker 1: I'll go get you a warrant. So now at the hotel,
Speaker 1: they demand Gloria's room number and the concierge goes, I
Speaker 1: can tell you the room number, but she's not there.
Speaker 1: I arranged a car to take her to JFK. And
Speaker 1: they're like, was her son with her? And the guy goes, well,
Speaker 1: he was young, but I'm sure he wasn't her son,
Speaker 1: not the way they were acting. So this concierge is spilling,
Speaker 1: and obviously some canoodling was going on at the precinct.
Speaker 1: They're trying to figure out what flight these two are on.
Speaker 1: They left on a flight to Dulls this morning. They're
Speaker 1: already back, they landed two hours ago. Wild back at
Speaker 1: the hotel. The concierge is taking them to the room,
Speaker 1: but warns that the guests might be inside, and Benson's like,
Speaker 1: let's surprise them. Grab the key, click clock. They're inside
Speaker 1: the hotel room and we see a couple having sex,
Speaker 1: lady on top. Kyle goes, don't come in here like
Speaker 1: a true seventeen year old, like the most seventeen year
Speaker 1: old thing to say. Well, I get out of here,
Speaker 1: and Stabler's like, bro, did you not get the memo
Speaker 1: about not leaving the jurisdiction.
Speaker 4: You fucked up?
Speaker 1: And Gloria is like, we didn't do anything wrong, and
Speaker 1: Benson is like, bitch, get up, get dressed, and have
Speaker 1: your lawyer meet your child molesting ass down at the station.
Speaker 1: Ky goes, we don't have to say anything to you.
Speaker 1: We're married now done, dun so fuck.
Speaker 2: I want to know the details of the laws because
Speaker 2: I do believe like you shouldn't have to speak against
Speaker 2: your partner if you don't want to, but you can
Speaker 2: right like it just seems like a way to silence
Speaker 2: victims of abuse.
Speaker 4: Maybe I don't know, Like.
Speaker 2: I don't get I I want to know more.
Speaker 1: I know, like the purpose of it is like, oh,
Speaker 1: but I confide it in you because you're my what
Speaker 1: it's like you can't tell a therapist can't say anything either.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's different. They take an oath for their job. Yeah,
Speaker 2: Like they go to jail like yeah, or lose their license,
Speaker 2: like they have seven lawyers have to like if you're
Speaker 2: just married, is that in your marriage certificate?
Speaker 1: I feel like it's just these came from old time
Speaker 1: shit where it's like men can say anything they want
Speaker 1: to their wives, criminal or not, and they have to
Speaker 1: keep those seats like they it's not they can't say
Speaker 1: anything right, Like don't you think I mean, we have
Speaker 1: to look it up, Okay, I mean now we're getting
Speaker 1: everything on AI every time we look anything up. But
Speaker 1: it originated in eighteen fifty three a Section three of
Speaker 1: the Evidence Amendment Act. It's based on the idea that
Speaker 1: the sanctity of marriage is so important that no spouse
Speaker 1: should be forced to testify against their partner, even if
Speaker 1: the subject of the communication is important to the public good.
Speaker 2: But you can, right, it says, are you.
Speaker 4: I don't think you can?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 4: Can you?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: However, it does not apply to communications made before marriage
Speaker 1: or after divorce, or to communications that involve planning or
Speaker 1: assisting with a crime or fraud. The privilege is also
Speaker 1: evoked if the communication was made in the presence of or.
Speaker 4: Could be overheard by a third party.
Speaker 1: So if Jared says something to me in front of you, Liza,
Speaker 1: it's open season.
Speaker 4: If you look it up.
Speaker 1: The line that is highlighted from Wikipedia says, deriving from
Speaker 1: the legal fiction that a husband and wife are one person,
Speaker 1: which is interesting.
Speaker 2: My question that nothing is answering is can you testify it? Yeah?
Speaker 2: Can you? Why can't that be an easy, quick little
Speaker 2: google thing, Like why is this so hard?
Speaker 4: Can you test it? It can't be compelled to.
Speaker 1: It prevents one spouse from testifying against another in criminal
Speaker 1: or related proceedings.
Speaker 4: Pillow talk privilege.
Speaker 1: So I think it's like you can't because I think
Speaker 1: there have been times in this show where someone's like,
Speaker 1: all testifying, They're like, you can't. Spousal privilege. So I
Speaker 1: don't think you can even if you want to.
Speaker 2: Oh no. Think of this as like the Fifth Amendment privilege.
Speaker 2: If the witness agrees to wave the privilege, then they
Speaker 2: can testify, even if the party would rather they didn't.
Speaker 2: But this is this has reddit, this is yeah. Speedy
Speaker 2: John wrote this nine months ago, like, I'm sure we're
Speaker 2: going to get We got a lot of lawyers that
Speaker 2: listen to us.
Speaker 4: Let us know.
Speaker 1: But I bet it very It could vary state by
Speaker 1: state because I think spousal privilege is different.
Speaker 2: Person volunteers to testify against their spouse, they may the
Speaker 2: state doesn't care if people ruin their own relationship.
Speaker 4: Oh but they don't have to, got it? Okay?
Speaker 1: All right, So now these two are fucking married. This
Speaker 1: is full like you know, creepy Woody Allen Sunny Territory
Speaker 1: they walk into At the top of act three, they
Speaker 1: walk into a woodblind's room where Gloria is sitting, and
Speaker 1: she immediately wants to know where Kyle is. Sabler explains
Speaker 1: how his bail is being revoked and his teen ass
Speaker 1: is going to Rikers. So I hope you're happy, bitch,
Speaker 1: because Rikers is no picnic. The lawyer is like, nothing
Speaker 1: here is illegal. He's seventeen. You have no evidence it
Speaker 1: started before he was seventeen. Gloria is still like, I
Speaker 1: never abused him. We're in love, and they're like, you're
Speaker 1: in love with a boy you've raised since he was
Speaker 1: ten years old, sweetheart, that's not love, it's pedophilia. She says,
Speaker 1: nothing happens until after he was seventeen a month ago. Bitch, please,
Speaker 1: Benson goes, you must have given him one hell of
Speaker 1: a b Day present. It's like, so you're saying you
Speaker 1: fell in love with a seventeen year old in the
Speaker 1: last thirty days.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: Gloria says, I'll take the blame. I was lonely. My
Speaker 1: husband was always gone. He had touched me in over
Speaker 1: a year. Kyle knew I was hurt. He only wants
Speaker 1: me to be happy, and I want that for him.
Speaker 1: It might be wrong in your eyes, but we can't
Speaker 1: help the way we feel. And the lawyer is like
Speaker 1: they're not blood related, and like, okay, but what a
Speaker 1: coincidenceaid They got married in the middle of a murder investigation,
Speaker 1: so now neither can testify against each other.
Speaker 4: Spousal privilege as we talked about, so.
Speaker 1: At arraignment they have to explain to Judge Alan Ridnore
Speaker 1: that Kyle violated the terms of his bail by traveling
Speaker 1: to Virginia, where they allow people to get married without
Speaker 1: a waiting period or a blood test, and allow under
Speaker 1: seventeen to marry with permission of their legal guardian, despite
Speaker 1: the fact that he was actually marrying his guardian, who
Speaker 1: is currently under investigation for murder and child abuse.
Speaker 2: Lol.
Speaker 1: The judge revokes bail. Congratulations on your nuptials, young man,
Speaker 1: he says. Outside the courthouse, Cabot says they should cut
Speaker 1: Gloria loose. They don't have anything on her and the
Speaker 1: marriage seems legal. So they run into a swarm of reporters.
Speaker 1: It's always hilarious to me, like the big crowds of
Speaker 1: reporters that come out for which cases at the courthouse.
Speaker 1: So they run into a storm of reporter's yelling questions,
Speaker 1: and one dude goes, does Gloria Stanfield's pregnancy have any
Speaker 1: effect on the child abuse allegations? And Benson and Stabler
Speaker 1: want to know where this dirtbag reporter got his info,
Speaker 1: so they pull him aside. He says he will not
Speaker 1: reveal his sources. He works for the National Probe.
Speaker 4: Lol.
Speaker 1: Definitely supposed to be National inquirer. He claims she's knocked
Speaker 1: up three months along and the step son is the father.
Speaker 1: He says he knows because she brought him to the appointment.
Speaker 1: Use your brain's, honey, why else would she marry the kid?
Speaker 1: So at Riker's Munch enters a holding cell where Kyle
Speaker 1: and Langan are hanging out, and he goes he walks
Speaker 1: in by.
Speaker 4: Going herd, you're going to be a daddy.
Speaker 1: That true, and they they keep trying to get him
Speaker 1: to confirm it, but Langan knows their games and he's like,
Speaker 1: my client has no way of knowing the paternity of
Speaker 1: Gloria's child. And Kyle has this smug little smile on
Speaker 1: his face when he tells them that anything Gloria told
Speaker 1: him was after they were married, so he doesn't have
Speaker 1: to answer.
Speaker 2: Ugh.
Speaker 1: The next scene is Benson open a car door as
Speaker 1: Gloria gets out with a ton of shopping bags like
Speaker 1: a movie, like nothing with a brand you can see,
Speaker 1: but just like you know, she's been shopping and women
Speaker 1: do be shopping. And Benson opens the car door and
Speaker 1: she goes, thank you, Detective Benson, and they say chivalry
Speaker 1: is dead. It's like she's a woman you're weird shopping
Speaker 1: for your husband's funeral or maternity clothes.
Speaker 4: And she goes a little bit of both, like she's.
Speaker 1: Being very whimsical for how serious this situation feels.
Speaker 4: But you know, she knows. She thinks she's gonna get
Speaker 4: away with everything.
Speaker 1: They tell her she has to take a paternity test
Speaker 1: either now or when the baby is born, but later
Speaker 1: means six more months of visits from them, and she
Speaker 1: goes hit up Kevin mckowster's uncle, he'll set up the
Speaker 1: test and just scurries into her building. At the crime lab,
Speaker 1: we've got Hattie Bert Trevor aka Friend of the Pod
Speaker 1: Daniel Sunjada turns out that the fetus DNA is not
Speaker 1: a match to Kyle or his dad, so somebody else
Speaker 1: is the father. Liv gets a quick phone call and
Speaker 1: when she gets off, she tells them some wild news.
Speaker 1: Gloria Stanfield is in the hospital. She's been reaped. Wow,
Speaker 1: what's happening at the hospital. The doc tells them that
Speaker 1: she has bruising fluids, all the signs of sexual assault,
Speaker 1: but there are there is no signs of trauma to
Speaker 1: the baby. So they go into the exam room and
Speaker 1: ask Gloria, who did this? She says she doesn't know,
Speaker 1: and they're like, some stranger happened to do this, Like
Speaker 1: while all this other stuff is going on, Like you
Speaker 1: know who did it. You were sleeping with him. Everything
Speaker 1: you've told us has been a lie. You want our help,
Speaker 1: give us this guy's name. So she coughs it up,
Speaker 1: Frank Barbarossa. And that's like a thing I always remember
Speaker 1: from seeing this episode so many times.
Speaker 4: It's just like the way she says, Frank Barbarossa.
Speaker 1: And she had a fling with him months ago and
Speaker 1: thought he was over it, but all this time he's
Speaker 1: just been thinking of ways to hurt her, and he's
Speaker 1: the father of the baby. When he found out she'd
Speaker 1: married Kyle, he went nuts. Then she says, I really
Speaker 1: did think Kyle killed his dad and I was trying
Speaker 1: to protect him, But now I think it was this
Speaker 1: Frank dude. Frank allegedly went off on her and said
Speaker 1: it was her fault, she'd been playing games with people
Speaker 1: and if she didn't that he'd do the same thing
Speaker 1: to her that he did to Lawrence. So she's saying
Speaker 1: he claims to have confessed to the murder and that's
Speaker 1: the end of act three. So now top of the
Speaker 1: final act, Munch and Finn are at the gym and
Speaker 1: they find a musclehead named Frank Barbarossa and he's working out.
Speaker 1: They arrest him. He looks clueless and he's genuinely worried.
Speaker 1: When he hears Gloria's been raped.
Speaker 2: He's like, just sit, okay.
Speaker 1: So Finn is downloading Daddy Craigs through the fishbowl glass
Speaker 1: as Frank sits in the cement bar's room, And that
Speaker 1: is the most TMU sentence I could ever say.
Speaker 4: Finn is downloading.
Speaker 1: Daddy Craigs through the fishbowl glass as Frank sits in
Speaker 1: a cement bar's room, so we can put it on
Speaker 1: a T shirt. Munch reports that Frank was in the
Speaker 1: building because he trains other people in Gloria's building.
Speaker 4: He's a personal trainer.
Speaker 1: He was with a client the knight of the murder,
Speaker 1: but ended the session early, which leads thirty minutes unaccounted for.
Speaker 1: So now Finn and Munch are there interrogating him and
Speaker 1: showing in pictures of Gloria's injuries, and he's.
Speaker 4: Like, I love her, I would never lay a hand.
Speaker 1: On her, like you know he's this kind of guy,
Speaker 1: and he says I was home alone the night before
Speaker 1: and goes, well, she fingered you. And I really hate
Speaker 1: this phrase, like when it's talking about accusing someone, Fingering
Speaker 1: to me means one thing, and people are not doing
Speaker 1: it to each other in a law enforcement setting.
Speaker 2: I feel that there was a comic back in the
Speaker 2: day in Chicago had a joke about this about like
Speaker 2: why would you say finger blah blah?
Speaker 4: And I was like, what are you talking about? Like,
Speaker 4: I didn't even know that was.
Speaker 2: A saying until I heard this person's joke saying how
Speaker 2: crazy it was? Yeah or yeah, fingering is clearly something else.
Speaker 1: What's the movie Freddy Got Fingered? Isn't that supposed to
Speaker 1: be somebody got amused?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Isn't that isn't the content? I don't.
Speaker 1: I actually haven't seen Freddy Got Fingered. If you can
Speaker 1: believe it, it's.
Speaker 2: A dark comedy. Okay, directorial debut. Let's see a cartoonist
Speaker 2: trying to put it's it's the it's the sex fingering.
Speaker 1: Ew and they just he just made a mainstream movie
Speaker 1: called Freddy Got Fingered, and they let that happen.
Speaker 4: That's wild. He had a choke holed on society.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like, imagine it's a movie that's like Susie Got
Speaker 1: eaten out. Like I don't know, I just can't imagine
Speaker 1: that that would be a movie title.
Speaker 4: But okay, way to go, Tom Green getting well, let's right,
Speaker 4: Susie got eaten out.
Speaker 1: Let's really it. Well, I think the literation helps. Freddy
Speaker 1: got fingered. Yeah, but Jesus, okay, Eleanor got eaten out,
Speaker 1: Edie got eaten out Edie. It's about and it's about
Speaker 1: one of the Grey Gardens women's Okay, so.
Speaker 4: He's in the building. Okay, uh okay. So this poor
Speaker 4: dumb dumb does not get what's happening.
Speaker 1: He's like, I didn't do anything, and they tell him
Speaker 1: his parole officer hasn't even been born yet, which I
Speaker 1: feel Finn does say all the time, your parole and stable, Like,
Speaker 1: your parole officer hasn't even been born yet. We've heard
Speaker 1: that a lot. They think the motive here is he's
Speaker 1: jealous of all these rich people that he trains, and
Speaker 1: so he knocks up the actress, he kills the husband,
Speaker 1: and he sets up the son so that he can
Speaker 1: like step into this life of like the rich and powerful,
Speaker 1: and they're really grilling him, and he looks scared. As
Speaker 1: he realizes, like what's going on, he starts calling Gloria
Speaker 1: a lying bitch and says he's going to kill her,
Speaker 1: and then he asks for a lawyer, so he's had
Speaker 1: some kind of realization. The gang is chatting about Frank
Speaker 1: getting a lawyer. They're waiting on DNA, but when Benson
Speaker 1: comes in with the cell phone, luds she found something interesting.
Speaker 1: He got a call the knight of the murder at
Speaker 1: eight point forty from a payphone at the deli across
Speaker 1: the street.
Speaker 4: You know, for the young people. Payphones used to.
Speaker 1: Be kind of everywhere, and now they're just a relic
Speaker 1: of old times. But that's how I used to call
Speaker 1: my parents to pick me up. So either Gloria made
Speaker 1: the call or Kyle made the call. But why would
Speaker 1: Kyle be calling his stepmom slash wife's boyfriend, So it
Speaker 1: was probably Gloria. It makes more sense. Why does she
Speaker 1: call him minutes before he kills her husband? So they
Speaker 1: go to the deli. The deli owner says.
Speaker 4: Oh, that Gloria is a real diva.
Speaker 1: She wanted an autograph and she acted like I asked
Speaker 1: for an autograph, and she acted like I was stalking her,
Speaker 1: and he's like, screw her. She's not that good of
Speaker 1: an actress. It's like, well, you did want the autograph, sir.
Speaker 1: She made a call at the payphone, looking out the
Speaker 1: window for a few minutes, and then made one more
Speaker 1: call and then left, and it seemed like she was
Speaker 1: waiting for someone to come out of the building. He
Speaker 1: did try to eavesdrop, but he got nothing. So this
Speaker 1: deli owner is a citizen detective. The next stop is
Speaker 1: back to Sexy tech Bert Trevor, who asks them the
Speaker 1: age old question, what did you do to my sperm?
Speaker 1: He says, there's no way this came off of a
Speaker 1: rape victim. The sperm tails are bent, which I remember
Speaker 1: this from this episode that when you freeze sperm you
Speaker 1: it does affect it like it does you can tell,
Speaker 1: So I this is like, you know, another place where
Speaker 1: SVU told me taught me something about forensics. So it
Speaker 1: does match your guy Frank frozen or not, but it
Speaker 1: was frozen. And also there's spermicide in there, like from
Speaker 1: a condom, So Gloria clearly saved the spunk after having
Speaker 1: sex with Frank. Froze it planted it on herself to
Speaker 1: set him up for rape and murder. So in the
Speaker 1: next scene, Frank is being defended by friend of the
Speaker 1: Pod Joe Marie Lawrence as defense attorney Cleo Conrad. But
Speaker 1: earlier they mentioned that they had to wait for legal
Speaker 1: aid to get there for Frank's lawyer. And I don't
Speaker 1: think Cleo is a public defender like she's she just
Speaker 1: she defended mister Landrix aka Bosh in the episode we
Speaker 1: just covered Resilience. She's done Erica Christensen, Agent Lauren Cooper,
Speaker 1: the Little Psycho Boy, and the cal McLaughlin episode. Like
Speaker 1: I thought she was kind of a pricey lawyer, So
Speaker 1: I think I think I found a continuity error for
Speaker 1: the wiki, if anyone wants to add that in there. Anyway,
Speaker 1: she tells them to drop the rape charge and they'll
Speaker 1: agree to murder to minimum sentencing recommendation, and Cabot's like, hellol,
Speaker 1: why would I do that, and either like, he'll give
Speaker 1: you Gloria. So Cabot agrees to the deal if he
Speaker 1: testifies and we can corroborate the story. So Frank spills
Speaker 1: the bitch set me up. He didn't care about the money.
Speaker 1: He would have done anything for Gloria. He admits he
Speaker 1: killed the husband, but only because Gloria told him to.
Speaker 1: She set it up, called him, said the husband was
Speaker 1: crazy and was going to kill her if he didn't
Speaker 1: do it right. Then, he says he didn't do it
Speaker 1: for money. Gloria was afraid for her life. He used
Speaker 1: to knock her and the kids around. She said if
Speaker 1: he was out of the way, they could be together.
Speaker 1: But he uh, but that you know, Lawrence would never
Speaker 1: let her go. So Cabot's like, Babe, her complaining about
Speaker 1: her husband being an asshole doesn't mean that she asked you.
Speaker 4: To kill him.
Speaker 1: And he's like, well, how do you think I even
Speaker 1: got in there? She gave me the security code, and
Speaker 1: Cabot's like, that proves nothing. But you're like a trainer.
Speaker 1: You've probably have been in there.
Speaker 4: He says.
Speaker 1: She told me where to get the baseball bat and
Speaker 1: told me what to do with it when I was done.
Speaker 1: It was all her idea, and Cabot is like, sweetye, Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: right now you are the only one going to jail
Speaker 1: for this crime. I need something I can prove. And
Speaker 1: then poor Frank just sits back and looks bummed, and
Speaker 1: he's like, I guess she's gonna get away with it.
Speaker 1: Like again, sir, well you didn't have to murder somebody
Speaker 1: for a woman. That's probably not going to go great.
Speaker 1: But in the squad room, Cabot reconfirms that nothing Frank
Speaker 1: told them is good enough to arrest Gloria. Munch points
Speaker 1: out that they got the calls from the payphone, and
Speaker 1: the second call she made was to Kyle Sell. I
Speaker 1: figured she called to get Kyle out of the house,
Speaker 1: and now he's sitting in Riker's thinking that she did
Speaker 1: do the murder and that he's protecting her. So let's
Speaker 1: get Kyle to testify to that, and we've got corroboration.
Speaker 1: And Gloria goes down and Kabot goes, Okay, well, hurry up,
Speaker 1: because I'm getting the charges against Kyle dropped tomorrow morning
Speaker 1: because another man has confessed to doing this killing, So
Speaker 1: he'll be a freeman by noon and a dead man.
Speaker 1: Finn adds, now that she has access to all Kyle's cash,
Speaker 1: there's no reason to keep him around anymore. So remember
Speaker 1: those trusts that she talked about. Now that they're married,
Speaker 1: she would have access to the trusts as his next
Speaker 1: of kid. So she's really thought this all fucking through.
Speaker 1: So now they're at Riker's trying to convince Kyle. He
Speaker 1: does not believe the killer is his mom slash wife's boyfriend,
Speaker 1: and he doesn't believe that she set him up. The
Speaker 1: weapon was your baseball bat. It was hidden under your bed.
Speaker 1: That was Gloria's idea. They break it to him that
Speaker 1: his wife is having another guy's baby. The music amps up,
Speaker 1: so maybe Kyle is starting to get it. He still
Speaker 1: doesn't believe it, but Langan gives him a nod. So
Speaker 1: I'm a little confused here. If she wanted Kyle to
Speaker 1: go down for the murder, why did she make up
Speaker 1: the rape, Like she had to know that they would
Speaker 1: find out that Frank did the murder, so Kyle would
Speaker 1: get off and she'd have to stay married to a
Speaker 1: fucking high school student. I don't really get why she
Speaker 1: made up the rape at this.
Speaker 2: Point, Like she's an actress, she's just i know, doing research.
Speaker 1: She could have just let Kyle go down for the
Speaker 1: murder and then she still gets access to all his money, right.
Speaker 4: She loved him on some sort of level.
Speaker 1: Yeah, actually as well, Yeah, yeah, and she's fine to
Speaker 1: let Frank Barbarossa go down. So he says, that night
Speaker 1: when she called, she told him to leave and that
Speaker 1: she was going to take care of everything. So I
Speaker 1: guess we're Our point is proven here. He's now, Oh, no,
Speaker 1: they weren't married yet and rhen He says that the
Speaker 1: night when she called his cell phone, she said leave,
Speaker 1: get out of there. I'm going to take care of everything.
Speaker 1: She said she loved him and that they would be together.
Speaker 1: So now cut to Gloria getting out of a Mercedes
Speaker 1: walking to Ahi met clinic Benson's Stabler shop er outside
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, so you're getting rid of the baby too,
Speaker 1: and what about little Chloe? Like has anyone talked about
Speaker 1: what's happening with her? Is she part of Gloria's plan
Speaker 1: at all?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 1: Kyle shows up then at outside of this clinic and
Speaker 1: Gloria walks up to him so awkwardly and guiltily and
Speaker 1: goes hey, and he's like, what are you doing? And
Speaker 1: she goes, I told you why I can't have the baby.
Speaker 1: We agreed that this was the best thing for us.
Speaker 1: He says, right, but you said it was mine, which
Speaker 1: proves we were having sex before I was seventeen, and
Speaker 1: she says, Kyle, this is for us, and he says, no,
Speaker 1: it's not. I know the baby isn't mine, and if
Speaker 1: you want to kill it, go ahead. I don't care anymore.
Speaker 1: Just tell me something. This whole year we were together. Okay,
Speaker 1: so they've been fucking since he was probably fifteen turning sixteen.
Speaker 1: Was it all part of your plan to make me
Speaker 1: love you so I would do what you wanted.
Speaker 4: You didn't have to do that.
Speaker 1: You didn't have to pretend I already loved you, Gloria,
Speaker 1: I can't remember when I didn't.
Speaker 4: So she says, I do love you, Kyle.
Speaker 2: We're mary.
Speaker 1: That's why I don't want to another man's baby. I
Speaker 1: only lied to you because I thought you were too
Speaker 1: young to understand, but not too young to marry me.
Speaker 1: So then Kyle slips a paper in her hand and
Speaker 1: it's a petition for divorce. The cops start to cough
Speaker 1: Gloria and tell her she's under arrest for murder. She
Speaker 1: tells Kyle, you don't know what you're doing, and he says,
Speaker 1: I know exactly what I'm doing, mom, and that's dick
Speaker 1: wolf baby, Damn, I.
Speaker 2: Always love an episode where there's deformed sperm.
Speaker 4: That's the smoking.
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, well what was it in the episode in
Speaker 1: the color it's like the meat one, yes, but also
Speaker 1: in manipulated, manipulated. She's got something light paces in her spit,
Speaker 1: like there's something in the spit that, yeah, shows that
Speaker 1: it's from a BJ Anyway, we love, we love different
Speaker 1: states of sperm on this pod.
Speaker 2: Okay, we'll be right back. So this crime is wild
Speaker 2: and obviously sad. There's life loss, there's fucked up shit.
Speaker 2: But it reads like the Gonzell episode, like it's kind
Speaker 2: of wild the things that are happening and that other
Speaker 2: finance guy like it's just pretty wild. And it happens
Speaker 2: in Florida. Okay, so it's in Florida. And this case,
Speaker 2: according to the Daytona Beach News Journal, had everything. Murders, swingers, adultery, incest,
Speaker 2: a drug addled attorney, and a vixen for a defendant. Woo,
Speaker 2: this case has everything. Virginia was a native of Lake Wales, Virginia,
Speaker 2: and that's funny.
Speaker 4: Virginia, Virginia.
Speaker 2: And she says she was subjected to sexual and emotional
Speaker 2: abuse in a poor household. So you know, very very
Speaker 2: classic kind of upbringing of MANIAX. Her husband Norman Larzola.
Speaker 2: But like, I don't, I don't know.
Speaker 4: How lars Larzella Larzellae.
Speaker 2: So her husband Norman Lazzellaay, we're adding an extra l
Speaker 2: Larza Laire Larsa Laire.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So Norman and his wife, Virginia, they were at work
Speaker 2: March eighth, nineteen ninety one, at his dental practice in Edgewater, Florida.
Speaker 2: He was standing near a hallway. He heard a noise
Speaker 2: coming from the back of the building, so he turned
Speaker 2: the corner to see what the noise was. He saw
Speaker 2: a masked man armed with a shotgun, so he ran away,
Speaker 2: trying to get to the front of the building. He
Speaker 2: was closing a door behind him, but a buckshot pellet
Speaker 2: went through the wood doors and entered his chest. The
Speaker 2: gunman fled the scene, and Virginia called nine one one.
Speaker 2: One witness, who was a patient in the waiting room,
Speaker 2: said she heard the dentist say, Jason, is that you?
Speaker 2: Who is Jason?
Speaker 3: You?
Speaker 2: Asked? That was their eighteen year old son. So Virginia
Speaker 2: went over to her husband and placed her lips over
Speaker 2: his nose and mouth and smothered him that no one
Speaker 2: else could hear him name Jason. And this is according
Speaker 2: to the Daytona Beach News Journal in a quote from
Speaker 2: police detective Dave Gammle. So Gammel and everyone's kind of
Speaker 2: a wild person, so like Gamal also played Santa Claus
Speaker 2: for local kids. So a detective and a local Santa
Speaker 2: Norman sadly died in a helicopter. In the helicopter on
Speaker 2: the way to the hospital. He was three weeks away
Speaker 2: from turning forty years old, a young man and because
Speaker 2: of this death, the murder of the gunman everything There
Speaker 2: was a two month investigation which got pumped to full
Speaker 2: force when another witness came forward with detailed instructions on
Speaker 2: where to find the murder weapon. So, six weeks after
Speaker 2: the murder, ish eighteen year old Steven Hidell told him
Speaker 2: the detective that he knew where the murder weapon was.
Speaker 2: That he was someone that worked odd jobs for the family,
Speaker 2: and so did a friend of his, Kristen Paul Mary,
Speaker 2: who was a reception to the dental practice.
Speaker 4: So he was like a handyman.
Speaker 2: She was a receptionist, and he claims they were ordered
Speaker 2: by Virginia to rub acid on the murder weapon, encase
Speaker 2: it in cement, and get rid of it. They drove
Speaker 2: sixty miles to north to Saint John's County and dumped
Speaker 2: the evidence and Pellicer Creek. Pellister Creek. Okay, I'm sure
Speaker 2: people in Florida will hit me up, so into this creek.
Speaker 2: A dive team ended up recovering the weapon on May third,
Speaker 2: and while divers searched, Gamble stood on the bridge with
Speaker 2: a shotgun watching for alligators.
Speaker 4: Florida.
Speaker 2: Okay. Apparently the cement found inside the family home matched
Speaker 2: with the cement used to encase the weapon. So then
Speaker 2: when they got her, police found her driving out of
Speaker 2: town with a purse stuffed with cash and gold. And
Speaker 2: that is the makings of an innocent Yeah, I think
Speaker 2: innocent person. I think it's cash gold in a purse
Speaker 2: speeding out of town. And she also kept lying to
Speaker 2: the authorities throughout the investigation. Her description of the gunman
Speaker 2: kept changing. She and assisted that someone had come to
Speaker 2: rob the place, but no other evidence led detectives to
Speaker 2: think that it was anything but a planned hit against Norman.
Speaker 2: So Virginia and her son Jason were both charged with
Speaker 2: first degree murder, but and more Virginia info, just to
Speaker 2: go backwards.
Speaker 4: She had been married four times.
Speaker 2: She was investigated in nineteen seventy five on suspicion of
Speaker 2: trying to murder her first husband, who was shot during
Speaker 2: an ambush along a dark highway. He was there because
Speaker 2: his wife told him to go there because to help
Speaker 2: her cousin who was having car trouble, but instead he
Speaker 2: was shot by a stranger but lived. He was shot
Speaker 2: so many times, but he did survive. He ended up
Speaker 2: not pressing charges because he didn't want to break apart
Speaker 2: the family. And the son that they had together, who
Speaker 2: was a toddler during this time, was Jason. So maybe
Speaker 2: a little dexter energy born from blood, okay, but also oh,
Speaker 2: she was a teen when she got married to this
Speaker 2: first husband. His name was Harry Mathis and at the
Speaker 2: time she went by Gail Mathis and they stayed married
Speaker 2: for another two years. After all of this attempted murder stuff,
Speaker 2: and you know, I was upset that she was like
Speaker 2: married as a teen, and it was because she wanted
Speaker 2: to escape being molested by her father and that was
Speaker 2: the way out. Her sisters quoted saying, like they were
Speaker 2: all molested, but she had it the worst and once
Speaker 2: she left, she never came back. So in nineteen eighty two,
Speaker 2: after the divorce, she then married Florida Highway Patrol trooper
Speaker 2: and they got separated in this within the same year.
Speaker 2: She accused him of pointing his gun at her, but
Speaker 2: he cleared up the accusations AKA he is a cop.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: But they were fully divorced April nineteen eighty three, two
Speaker 2: months after she already married again.
Speaker 4: I hope that makes sense.
Speaker 2: So during the divorce, she already married another person, a
Speaker 2: former Valucia County building contractor, and that was done by
Speaker 2: August nineteen eight three in an annulment she done. Yeah, busy.
Speaker 2: She then met Norman on a weekday afternoon in nineteen
Speaker 2: eighty five when she went to a dental office and
Speaker 2: she met a dark haired dentist named Norman and they
Speaker 2: married quickly June fourteenth, nineteen eighty five. Married. The news
Speaker 2: Journal also discovered that Norman did file for divorce in
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty nine, and he fought for full custody of
Speaker 2: all the children and he adopted her children from previous
Speaker 2: marriages as well, and court filings he described his wife
Speaker 2: as suicidal, drug addicted and a thief. She operated under aliases,
Speaker 2: falsely claimed to have been a doctor, or a financier
Speaker 2: or an heiress to a fortune, and this stayed true
Speaker 2: because some of the articles I read were like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is about a socialite, but she's a liar.
Speaker 4: She was never an heiress to any fortune.
Speaker 2: But then in nineteen ninety he did drop all the
Speaker 2: divorce proceedings and they reconciled. Reconciled other things that happened
Speaker 2: during their marriage. So Virginia was accused of embezzling thousands
Speaker 2: of dollars from builders in Ormond Beach, Flagler County. She
Speaker 2: paid restitution and the case was dismissed, but she was okay.
Speaker 2: She introduced her husband to the swinging lifestyle to salvage
Speaker 2: their rocky marriage, a plan that's sure to work. So
Speaker 2: since she was a cheater, she thought it was a
Speaker 2: great way that they could have sex with other people
Speaker 2: without the deception. So he did agree to it, but
Speaker 2: she still had affairs behind his back. One of her
Speaker 2: lovers was an exotic bird importer, and she offered him
Speaker 2: fifty thousand dollars to kill her husband.
Speaker 1: He declined, oh my god, so he's out of Wildlife.
Speaker 1: The episode Wildlife, I mean, this is amazing. This is
Speaker 1: like a real cast of characters.
Speaker 2: That's what I mean. And it gets wilder and wilder
Speaker 2: and more kind of like out there. But yet at
Speaker 2: the end of the day, we do know there was
Speaker 2: a tragedy that occurred. But the case, yeah, like to
Speaker 2: have an exotic bird importer be your lover, you know
Speaker 2: it is. Yeah, it's one of the cases where you're like,
Speaker 2: how is this not more well known? Well, it was
Speaker 2: like during the time, it was everyone it's so splash
Speaker 2: she but we were young, we were young. Yeah. So
Speaker 2: she also offered twenty five thousand dollars to a new
Speaker 2: and a new motorcycle to another man she was having
Speaker 2: sex with.
Speaker 4: He also said no, thank you.
Speaker 2: Then, in a direct quote from the Daytona Beach News Journal,
Speaker 2: there was one other sex partner. Las Larzlary felt she
Speaker 2: could manipulate done done. Her own son, Jason, didn't refuse
Speaker 2: and was offered two hundred thousand dollars to kill his
Speaker 2: adoptive father. God.
Speaker 1: Yeah, at least in the episode they're not blood related,
Speaker 1: but here they are.
Speaker 2: Yeah, full incest, Oh God, full incest.
Speaker 4: So we can take a moment for that, okay.
Speaker 2: So, Dorothy Sedgwick was the special prosecutor who was lead
Speaker 2: counsel for the state, and Jack Wilkins represented Jason and Virginia,
Speaker 2: but they were tried separately. He mostly represented drug dealers
Speaker 2: for cash and this was his first capital murder case.
Speaker 2: There were a lot of witnesses called to the stand,
Speaker 2: including some lovers who all testified that she offered all
Speaker 2: of them thousands of dollars to murder her husband. Oh
Speaker 2: my god, you can't trust a loose lover, Okay. All
Speaker 2: the lovers said that she was abusive and manipulative and
Speaker 2: hell bent on eliminating her husband, and throughout the whole
Speaker 2: trial she was popping breath mints. She couldn't stop. Wow.
Speaker 4: Interesting detail.
Speaker 2: There's all these little details that like aren't pertinent to
Speaker 2: the case, but it's just like, what is happening?
Speaker 4: Okay.
Speaker 2: So, prosecutors said that she killed her fourth husband to
Speaker 2: receive two point one million dollars in a life insurance
Speaker 2: money the situation. When her incest lifestyle and drug use
Speaker 2: and cheating was brought up in court, she did cry
Speaker 2: and she was really like embarrassed, like tears streaming down
Speaker 2: her face. Otherwile things that came up in court. One
Speaker 2: that Jason the son was having a fling with Heidel,
Speaker 2: the most critical of the state witnesses for the case,
Speaker 2: who said that he had the weapon.
Speaker 4: You know, oh my god.
Speaker 2: And we're going to learn more about Steve High but
Speaker 2: he sadly did take his own life in nineteen ninety nine.
Speaker 2: And on February twenty fourth, nineteen ninety two, she was
Speaker 2: convicted of ordering the execution style murder of her husband
Speaker 2: in Edgewater, Florida. So that was a first degree murder charge.
Speaker 2: And then on March fifth, they recommended the death penalty.
Speaker 2: This was the jury's idea. They recommended death. They only
Speaker 2: deliberated for just one hour to put this woman to death.
Speaker 2: Now that really reminded me of Eileen Warnos. And I
Speaker 2: don't know if you remember that case, but like how
Speaker 2: gung Ho Florida was, how they didn't really talk much,
Speaker 2: that they sentenced her to death immediately, and like the
Speaker 2: pastors and all these people that were fighting for her death,
Speaker 2: fought for like the saving of all these men who've
Speaker 2: killed dozens of women, and just how like there's like
Speaker 2: a bloodlust for yeah, Florida.
Speaker 1: But because I'm also wondering if they introduced at court
Speaker 1: her upbringing, like if she was from like that, probably
Speaker 1: mentally damaged her forever.
Speaker 2: Like Kara, worse than that, Okay, Okay, it's worse than
Speaker 2: you can even Okay, So what happened in this trial,
Speaker 2: but you're gonna get okay.
Speaker 4: So she you know.
Speaker 2: She was sentenced to death and she was on death
Speaker 2: row with Eileen Warno, So I was like doing research,
Speaker 2: going damn, this really kind of reminds me of Eileen
Speaker 2: and the fact that there was abuse and then such
Speaker 2: a quick jury decision to murder like an abused woman.
Speaker 2: But Deirdre Hunt was another killer on death row with her.
Speaker 2: There was like a few women, but holy shit, Eileen
Speaker 2: and Virginia didn't get along, and at one point they
Speaker 2: were in the same wing together and Warnos attacked Virginia
Speaker 2: and caused one of her breast implants to rupture. Oh
Speaker 2: my god.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is a wild This is wild. This is
Speaker 1: a television show. It's insane, Okay, keep going.
Speaker 2: So in two thousand and eight, her sentence was reduced
Speaker 2: to life in prison because her attorney had unethical and
Speaker 2: criminal behavior that actually landed him in federal prison in
Speaker 2: So you're thinking, oh, they didn't bring up her abuse
Speaker 2: during the trial.
Speaker 4: Now, this motherfucker was out of his gourd.
Speaker 2: He had a full on drunk drug problem and he
Speaker 2: would wear dark tinted glasses to court and he was
Speaker 2: very Sonya Paxton. There was a bar at the office
Speaker 2: and he would come to court smelling like booze. They
Speaker 2: say it was vodka, cocaine, and meth. And he does
Speaker 2: deny this claim, of course he does.
Speaker 4: Olivia, don't do this to me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, please, We've all seen Sonya Paxston.
Speaker 4: Have a fucking drunk court meltdown.
Speaker 2: But he was eventually convicted of tax evasion, money laundering,
Speaker 2: and other charges, and he did serve time for his
Speaker 2: con So he was convicted of sixteen felonies and served
Speaker 2: four years. And the cherry on top was he was
Speaker 2: also romantically involved with the court reporter.
Speaker 1: Like you just want to give Florida the break sometimes,
Speaker 1: but they keep coming back with more stories.
Speaker 4: Like this, like this is so Florida.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, there's a reason Taylor wrote this song Florida. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 2: But he also, on top of everything, he just sucked.
Speaker 2: It is reported by the Miami New Times that he
Speaker 2: spent less than three thousand dollars on her defense. The
Speaker 2: prosecution entered seventy pieces of evidence, and Wilkins countered with
Speaker 2: one just one day of defense. He did not enlist
Speaker 2: even one expert to refute anything. And Florida has the
Speaker 2: worst capital justice system in the nation. They have exonerated
Speaker 2: more people than any other state since nineteen seventy three.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: Orange County Judge Mark Lubette is quoted in the Miami
Speaker 2: New Times saying, in quote in Florida, circumstantial evidence like
Speaker 2: in Virginia's trial can put a needle in your arm
Speaker 2: end quote. And so at first, like I said, she
Speaker 2: was sentenced to death. She spent fifteen years on death
Speaker 2: row at Laurel Correctional Institution in Osala, Florida. She now
Speaker 2: is being held at Homestead Correctional Institutution in Florida City,
Speaker 2: and with good behavior she might get released in twenty
Speaker 2: thirty four m and she will be eighty one years
Speaker 2: old at that time. She does maintain her innocence, and
Speaker 2: she says that my reputation convicted me, and I never
Speaker 2: got the benefit of the doubt during the time Norman's
Speaker 2: parents gained custody of the youngest children. If you were
Speaker 2: wondering where the kids were now before Jason's trial, remember
Speaker 2: they were tried separately. He ended up firing this lawyer
Speaker 2: for conflict of interest, and thank god, I mean or not,
Speaker 2: I don't know, but his instinct of Wilkins being not
Speaker 2: good is true. So Jason ended up hiring this guy
Speaker 2: named Wesley Lasley to cover his case. This guy drove
Speaker 2: a Porsche, wore a thousand dollars suits penthouse condo, and
Speaker 2: he only did murder one cases, which she called the
Speaker 2: super Bowl. According to the Miami New Times, he monitored
Speaker 2: to Virginia's case and he was disgusted at how bad
Speaker 2: the defense was. He ended up finding a ton of
Speaker 2: evident that would have helped Virginia's case little like little
Speaker 2: errors everywhere, and like she didn't forge the signature on
Speaker 2: her husband's will like was brought up during the case. Also,
Speaker 2: the notary signature was genuine, and a life insurance analyst
Speaker 2: confirmed that the amount of policies weren't excessive and it's
Speaker 2: like a totally normal amount for how much this dentist
Speaker 2: was making. He also found evidence refuting that the cement
Speaker 2: was the same. He says that if this was brought
Speaker 2: up that they didn't mix the concrete in the house
Speaker 2: and it wasn't in the same place, she would have
Speaker 2: been acquitted because it would have shown like they should
Speaker 2: have been impeached. Like that means there was perjury and
Speaker 2: lies with the with the guy and girl because it
Speaker 2: wasn't the truth. So like, I guess he found evidence
Speaker 2: that the cement was fully different. And also infok came
Speaker 2: out that hide Out had bad qualities and he was
Speaker 2: like a monger, money hungry liar as well. But this
Speaker 2: is all from a defense attorney, so like he's just
Speaker 2: as untrustworthy as everyone. But like you know, he is
Speaker 2: saying that they got a lot of evidence that this
Speaker 2: guy was not trustworthy at all and that another friend
Speaker 2: testified how Stephen was like violent as hell, and he
Speaker 2: basically this new attorney argued that Hidell was the shooter
Speaker 2: the whole time and that's why he had the murder
Speaker 2: weapon all along, and it was in his house and
Speaker 2: he put it in the creek. He says, how often
Speaker 2: does someone have the murder weapon of a crime that
Speaker 2: they did not commit, And this is the Miami New Times.
Speaker 2: So and it got like really competitive. Dorothy the DA
Speaker 2: approached him and said, I've won thirty two straight capital
Speaker 2: cases and this is going to be number thirty three.
Speaker 2: And Lasley replied, get ready to be thirty two and one.
Speaker 2: So her son was tried the year after her, and
Speaker 2: again so much more evidence, and in a shocking twist,
Speaker 2: the jurors acquitted him of all charges. He was fully acquitted.
Speaker 2: Lasley straight up was like Heidel did it, and then
Speaker 2: Heidel got immunity and lied to save his own ass.
Speaker 2: The courtroom was in stunned silence. Jason hugged his attorney.
Speaker 2: He drove off after court in a Sheriff's deputy squad
Speaker 2: car yelling I'm free. It's the best feeling I've ever
Speaker 2: felt in my life. He then enlisted in the US Navy,
Speaker 2: and in terms of his whereabouts, that's that's it. And
Speaker 2: then David Henry, an attorney with the State Capitol Collateral
Speaker 2: Regional Council who tried to vacate her conviction, like says, like,
Speaker 2: how does the shooter get off but the mastermind of
Speaker 2: the shooting be guilty? Yeah, Like that doesn't make sense
Speaker 2: because all of the evidence is like she made her
Speaker 2: son do it and she is guilty, yet he is innocent.
Speaker 2: How does that work? And he thinks, like this David
Speaker 2: Henry guy, he thinks it is an unsolved murder. And
Speaker 2: that was to the New Times and the bottom line
Speaker 2: as there was more than enough reasonable doubt. If we
Speaker 2: don't know who the actual shooter is, we have doubt.
Speaker 2: But she is serving a life sentence and he is off.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like it's like it kind of be
Speaker 1: It sort of sends a message that like you know
Speaker 1: where a murder weapon is, don't say don't tell anyone
Speaker 1: because you could be accused of being the person.
Speaker 4: But also, like, what.
Speaker 1: Did the lawyer say was Steve Hydell's motive?
Speaker 4: Why did he just want to kill this dentist?
Speaker 2: Well, maybe Virginia did pay Steven like he was there,
Speaker 2: he was just there defending Jason. So and the mom
Speaker 2: that's found guilty, so in his head like maybe that
Speaker 2: was it, like she hired this other guy and not Jason.
Speaker 1: And then they didn't let in the witness who said Jason,
Speaker 1: is that you who heard that? You would have thought
Speaker 1: that would have been like a really like a smoking
Speaker 1: gun kind of fuck this case is insane.
Speaker 2: Wow. Yeah. And I didn't find any like New York
Speaker 2: Times or Washington Post or like any national type of stuff.
Speaker 2: There's a snap and there's like other stuff like docu
Speaker 2: style or whatnot. But the fact that there wasn't national,
Speaker 2: like all of my resources are local Florida paper.
Speaker 1: I mean, listen, I don't think Jason seems like he
Speaker 1: had a great life. He went from mom like husband
Speaker 1: to husband with his mom who had been affected by
Speaker 1: trauma and was clearly not in her right mind, and
Speaker 1: then they had.
Speaker 4: A sexual relationship.
Speaker 1: It's like I didn't necessarily want this kid to go
Speaker 1: to jail, but he did do it.
Speaker 4: I feel right, well, I don't know.
Speaker 2: And then because of all this, I'm having like a
Speaker 2: Scott Peterson moment where I'm just like, for Jinga doesn't
Speaker 2: deserve this, like if there's reasonable doubt, like you can't
Speaker 2: do it.
Speaker 4: And her lawyer did suck.
Speaker 2: And so that's why, Oh, I don't know if I
Speaker 2: mentioned this, but that's why her death sentence was turned
Speaker 2: down to a life sentence was because of her lawyer's actions. Yes,
Speaker 2: you said that, I did, Okay, Yeah, So it's like
Speaker 2: she had this bad fucking attorney who didn't do a
Speaker 2: good job, and Jason just sat there letting his mom
Speaker 2: go down. Then fired him and got a better attorney,
Speaker 2: because like, why wouldn't he be like, mom, this attorney sucks,
Speaker 2: Like get a better.
Speaker 4: Oh my god, what a fucking case.
Speaker 2: Shit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, you know, I hope Gloria Stanfield and Eileen
Speaker 1: warn I mean the fact that she was like in
Speaker 1: jail with in prison with with Eileen Warnosen, that the
Speaker 1: popped Breaston plant.
Speaker 4: I mean, you really can't make this shit up.
Speaker 1: Crazy anyway, we don't have a guest today, so let's
Speaker 1: just get right into our post mortem. So yeah, no
Speaker 1: guests this week, so we can dive right into our
Speaker 1: post mortem. What an episode. I mean, it's it's a
Speaker 1: classic to me this one. I a little baby Jonathan Bennett.
Speaker 1: We got Audrey Horn from Twin Peaks, and a lot
Speaker 1: of step Son setting people up, setting up your personal
Speaker 1: trainer for you know. I mean, it's like literally this
Speaker 1: is from a telenovela. This episode.
Speaker 2: Uh well, also, you know we we mention Mean Girls
Speaker 2: and he's out and about. But I did share a
Speaker 2: joint with Damian and from Mean Girls when I was
Speaker 2: last in La and That was really exciting because he's
Speaker 2: winked at me once, but I have never talked to him,
Speaker 2: so that was kind of fun.
Speaker 1: Daniel friend Daisey right, yes, yeah, I met him on
Speaker 1: drag race. And then also when I went to the
Speaker 1: drag competition that you would not the drag competition the
Speaker 1: lip syncing competition at a gay bar in LA that
Speaker 1: you and I judged once. I had gone to the
Speaker 1: one before and he had been competing.
Speaker 2: He had sang, I want to compete, Jacob, I wouldn't
Speaker 2: be good at it. But also I feel it happens
Speaker 2: more in female prisons than male prisons, but I do
Speaker 2: like that all the criminals do end up together or
Speaker 2: they hang out or if like you're the most notorious,
Speaker 2: like you know how like Eileen Warnos and Virginia were
Speaker 2: at the same prison. I feel like it happens more
Speaker 2: with women prisoners than male ones, but they all end
Speaker 2: like the fact that Jen Shawn Elizabeth Holmes together and
Speaker 2: hanging out, like yeah, it's I don't wild.
Speaker 1: I don't really feel like I ever hear like, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: al al Capone was in.
Speaker 4: Jail with I don't even I'm like making.
Speaker 2: Up gangsters, so the one where a lot of people
Speaker 2: were was I feel like a lot of people were
Speaker 2: with Charles Manson and didn't get along with him. I
Speaker 2: feel like we covered a crime where like she didn't
Speaker 2: get people Charlie Soon, Oh, Charlie Wow.
Speaker 4: Okay, Charlie Manson.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's the I'm sort of like, I think
Speaker 1: that's so.
Speaker 4: Wild that they were in jail together. It didn't like
Speaker 4: each other.
Speaker 1: Because also it's like, also Eileen Warno's as you did
Speaker 1: the research for your crime. When we covered the episode Chameleon, like,
Speaker 1: she wasn't like a bloodthirsty killer. She kind of killed
Speaker 1: out of self defense most of the time, right, Like,
Speaker 1: and she had had been like she had been completely
Speaker 1: abused as a child and stuff, and like this woman
Speaker 1: Virginia starting a relationship with her son and then killing
Speaker 1: her husband, the dentist. It didn't really feel like they.
Speaker 1: I wonder if they when they met in prison, Eileen
Speaker 1: was like, no, you're just like, honestly kind of a
Speaker 1: sick fuck. And I was doing this because I uh,
Speaker 1: I was trying to these johns were trying to hurt me,
Speaker 1: and I had to kill him.
Speaker 2: I think maybe the first John was necessity and then
Speaker 2: and then she loved it.
Speaker 4: I think, well, because I think it was the.
Speaker 2: Like they represented everybody that ignored her and abused her
Speaker 2: in the past, and her dad that molested her. Like
Speaker 2: I do feel like, you know, you get triggered or
Speaker 2: maybe they said one thing or something and then it's
Speaker 2: like fuck yourself. Like I can I can see having
Speaker 2: it make you feel better, like smoking a joint, like
Speaker 2: a nice release. If I was a kid like I,
Speaker 2: I bet if you're a killer, killing probably makes you
Speaker 2: feel good after versu if you killed someone and you're
Speaker 2: not a real killer on the inside, you might be panicked.
Speaker 2: You might be.
Speaker 1: Like what I created this benevolent feminist character of Eilean
Speaker 1: more Nose in my head, where I'm like, she's just.
Speaker 4: Killing people that are trying.
Speaker 2: To hurt her, Like I think it's started that way.
Speaker 2: I think all these gens are probably bad people. I
Speaker 2: do you know murder is bad? To quote Gypsy Rose,
Speaker 2: I actually just watched a TikTok of Gypsy Rose. I
Speaker 2: think she's about to get into the category that I
Speaker 2: like Secrets from Prison and she was. She was doing
Speaker 2: a recipe for at home red Bull that she would
Speaker 2: make in prison and she still has it sometimes.
Speaker 4: So it's like folgers.
Speaker 2: You mix it in with water and then you put
Speaker 2: in crush Jolly Ranchers fanta and there was one more
Speaker 2: pink ingredient and then you mix it up and drink
Speaker 2: it and it gives you the jolts you need.
Speaker 4: But anyways, right, murder's bad.
Speaker 2: I mean, I think what I remember from all that
Speaker 2: research was just that women get sentenced to death so
Speaker 2: much faster. Evidence wasn't brought on, the jury didn't deliberate,
Speaker 2: and you have the Ted Bundy type figures who truly
Speaker 2: murder dozens and dozens of women, and they get people
Speaker 2: trying to get them off the death penalty, and yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, the jury's really thinking about it, and you
Speaker 2: have this woman and I think in like two hours
Speaker 2: they were like, yeah, I murderer, bye, and just that
Speaker 2: kind of thing.
Speaker 4: But yeah, no, I don't I don't know anymore. I
Speaker 4: really don't know.
Speaker 2: I guess.
Speaker 1: So what have we learned from this episode? Leave the
Speaker 1: teen boys alone? Please don't fuck your child? Is that
Speaker 1: or your stepchild or your step I don't really care
Speaker 1: about the blood anyone that you've had a mother like
Speaker 1: role in their life.
Speaker 4: I don't care if you haven't seen them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, teacher, neighbor, leave the children alone. That we should
Speaker 2: start a charity called leave the children Alone.
Speaker 4: Leave the children.
Speaker 1: Let this boy play lacrosse in peace, for fuck's sake,
Speaker 1: Jesus talking about the guy in the And.
Speaker 2: It's really tough because so often when it's like an
Speaker 2: attractive older woman and a young boy, people don't want
Speaker 2: to even take it seriously.
Speaker 4: They're like jazzed about it, and yeah, they're.
Speaker 2: Like, lucky guy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the lucky bastard disease or something like that, or yeah,
Speaker 1: it's so fucking o. Wait, but I was gonna say
Speaker 1: someone was scared to tell me something they were like
Speaker 1: and then it was the most benign thing. I was like,
Speaker 1: I just researched a man who raised like a child
Speaker 1: to be a pedophile to in a van, Like nothing
Speaker 1: you say can harm me, nothing like it was just
Speaker 1: such a not even gross thing. I'm like, you don't
Speaker 1: even know where the depths of my brain have gone.
Speaker 1: And all of you listeners as well, I'm not letting
Speaker 1: you off the hook. We're all fucking maniacs.
Speaker 2: And it's just it's tough the threshold other people have
Speaker 2: and I was just like, you.
Speaker 4: Know, there wasn't there like a TikTok trind a while ago.
Speaker 1: That was like, you think you can hurt me? I
Speaker 1: did like this in third grade or whatever. It's like,
Speaker 1: you think you can hurt me. I literally research a
Speaker 1: man who raised a child, like stole a child and raised.
Speaker 4: Him to be a pedophile.
Speaker 2: I'm in casting steel or even the bear thing, like,
Speaker 2: it's like you don't even know the depths of what
Speaker 2: your fellow man can do.
Speaker 1: Oh, somebody messaged us about the bear thing. That was
Speaker 1: so interesting too. It's like, look at it, look at
Speaker 1: it factually. Statistically, when you look at the statistics of
Speaker 1: bear of bear deaths, there's been like one in the
Speaker 1: United States in the past year. And if you look
Speaker 1: at how many deaths are caused by men to women, please.
Speaker 2: You know that is good. I'm feeling thank you for
Speaker 2: writing that in Yeah, let's look at the numbers, bitch. Yeah,
Speaker 2: rather meet a shark too? About that?
Speaker 4: How about that?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 4: And that submarine? Oh god, remember that?
Speaker 1: Oh my god, the submarine that haunts me. That is
Speaker 1: truly haunting to me like that.
Speaker 2: Oh, actually, when I was eating alone in Santa Fe,
Speaker 2: I met in a really cool lesbian couple was sitting
Speaker 2: next to me celebrating their one year wedding anniversary, and
Speaker 2: I asked, oh, how was the wedding? You know, I
Speaker 2: love weddings, and they started laughing and basically one of
Speaker 2: the brides, her mother died the morning of the wedding.
Speaker 2: Oh my god.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and my god.
Speaker 2: So this is like their one year and so they
Speaker 2: went on like, you know, a woo woo kind of
Speaker 2: trip Grand Canyon, New Mexico.
Speaker 4: But that's I digress.
Speaker 2: We fuck now. I forgot because I got into I
Speaker 2: got so into the wedding. Why was I taught? But
Speaker 2: we got into the podcast. Oh, I started about Casey.
Speaker 2: That's it. We started talking about the podcast because one
Speaker 2: of them loves law and Order. And then I, you know,
Speaker 2: famously Casey came up with soft straight right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I was bringing up our He's.
Speaker 2: Our favorite soft straight Yeah, because sometimes when we talk
Speaker 2: about the bears in the me, I would rather meet
Speaker 2: Casey than a bear.
Speaker 1: Sure, woods, Yeah, but you don't get to pick the
Speaker 1: man in the scenario. So you got to go with
Speaker 1: the numbers.
Speaker 2: No, yeah, I could just but you Yeah, but I
Speaker 2: was that's the nicest thing you've ever said, should say
Speaker 2: lots of nice things. But I was explaining to this
Speaker 2: couple about soft straits and they were like laughing so hard.
Speaker 1: I think I'm married to a soft straight. I think
Speaker 1: Jared's a soft straight for sure. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I think I've told him that. But it just makes
Speaker 2: sense because you know, Casey, when we rile you rail
Speaker 2: about all this, He's never afterwards gone, well, you know,
Speaker 2: I actually am okay, you know what I mean. It's
Speaker 2: like it's just such a thing that doesn't happen often.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, that's true. Jared would argue with me more.
Speaker 1: But if I ran in him in the woods, I
Speaker 1: could kill him in a second, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he's gonna argue with me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but yeah, that's so amazing. Yeah. Cool. There's a
Speaker 2: couple coming to one of my shows and I'm like,
Speaker 2: I think you guys are going to break up after
Speaker 2: keep us posted. I could. I just know what I
Speaker 2: know what I've heard about the boyfriend that like, I
Speaker 2: know he's going to have an issue with something like
Speaker 2: I just I can sense it in my bones. So
Speaker 2: we'll see.
Speaker 1: I love that people are bringing like I think every
Speaker 1: woman should be required to bring their spouse or their
Speaker 1: male partner to a Lisa Trigger Comedy live comedy performance
Speaker 1: to as a litmus test.
Speaker 2: There was a man yesterday alone in the front row.
Speaker 2: I was not Yeah, I was kind excited. Ye love that,
Speaker 2: Oh god, And that's bless everyone that I've run into.
Speaker 2: I've run into a bunch of our listeners all across
Speaker 2: the city.
Speaker 4: It's nice. That's so nice.
Speaker 2: Yeah, really cutie people respect. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I love everybody I've ever run into. All right, well, no,
Speaker 4: I just ran into somebody.
Speaker 3: No.
Speaker 1: I just ran into somebody at my comedy show last
Speaker 1: week and she was inside the bar and I go,
Speaker 1: are you coming to the show?
Speaker 2: She was like no, and I was like, okay.
Speaker 4: She just wanted to tell me she loved my podcast
Speaker 4: but wasn't coming.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah's my student. They're surely humiliating because sometimes people
Speaker 2: will approach me and then I talk so much that
Speaker 2: they're like okay, bye, like they're over me at one point,
Speaker 2: or when I go do you want a photo and
Speaker 2: they're like no, I just wanted to say so say hi.
Speaker 4: All right, let's get into what would sister Peg?
Speaker 2: Do you guys know?
Speaker 1: This is our weekly segment where we direct you towards
Speaker 1: an organization, a blog post which I love to say
Speaker 1: to keep myself young, a documentary, something that gives you
Speaker 1: more info about what we talked about today.
Speaker 4: And you know, I think that we're talking.
Speaker 1: About these the stereotype is that a young boy who's
Speaker 1: involved in a relationship with an older woman or something
Speaker 1: is that it's a relationship, and it's not.
Speaker 4: It is sexual assault.
Speaker 1: And so I wanted to point you guys to the
Speaker 1: organization called one in six. It is an organization named
Speaker 1: for the fact that at least one in six men
Speaker 1: have been sexually abused or assaulted. The group was formed
Speaker 1: in response to a lack of resources addressing the impact
Speaker 1: of negative childhood sexual experiences on the lives of adult men,
Speaker 1: one of the many underrecognized aspects of childhood sexual abuse,
Speaker 1: and they offer free and confidential online support groups, training,
Speaker 1: and male survivor stories. So, yeah, like when you talk
Speaker 1: to someone who's like, I lost my virginity at twelve,
Speaker 1: that's not really what happened. So for more information, you
Speaker 1: can go to one in six dot org. And as always,
Speaker 1: I will post this as a story on the day
Speaker 1: that this episode comes out, and it will be saved
Speaker 1: forever in our WWSPD highlight on our Instagram page, which
Speaker 1: is That's Messed Up Pod, and I hope you're following us.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for that.
Speaker 4: It is a topic that I feel passionately about.
Speaker 2: And next week we will be doing fast Times at
Speaker 2: the Wheelhouse from season twenty three, episode five.
Speaker 4: It might be called something different. Yeah, the drill. We'll
Speaker 4: get onto it.
Speaker 2: Just get on fucking Hulu, get on Peacock, and get
Speaker 2: to season twenty three episode five. We'll discuss everything that
Speaker 2: seemed authoritative and rude. But I am obsessed with you
Speaker 2: and I am gentle. Thank you, Bye, got ex next week,
Speaker 2: That's Messed Up as an exactly right production. If you
Speaker 2: have compliments you'd like to give us or episodes you'd
Speaker 2: like us to cover, shoot us an email it That's
Speaker 2: Messed uppod at gmail dot com. Follow the podcast on
Speaker 2: Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod and on Twitter at
Speaker 2: messed Up Pod, and follow us personally at Kara Klank
Speaker 2: and at glitter Cheese.
Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
Speaker 1: more information.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much to our senior producer, Casey O'Brien
Speaker 2: and our associate producer Christina Chamberlain, and to our.
Speaker 1: Mixer John Bradley and our guest booker Patrick Cottner.
Speaker 2: And to Henry Kaperski for our theme song and Carly
Speaker 2: gen Andrews for our artwork.
Speaker 1: Thank you to our executive producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgareff,
Speaker 1: Daniel Kramer and everybody at Exactly Right Media dot