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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: And welcome back to Coast to Coast. We're back with

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Speaker 2: Raymond Moody and Paul Perry. Their book is called Proof

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Speaker 2: of Life After Life. Raymond and Paul, let's go into

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Speaker 2: these seven reasons to believe there is an afterlife? And Raymond,

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Speaker 2: how did you and Paul come up with seven?

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Speaker 3: Not eight? Not ten?

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Speaker 4: Well? Okay, over the years. As I mentioned, we've worked

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Speaker 4: together for about thirty three years now, and we would

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Speaker 4: collect shared death experiences that we heard and after a while,

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Speaker 4: you get a bunch together and you want to categorize them,

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Speaker 4: and we ended up categorizing them into these seven reasons

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Speaker 4: to believe in the afterlife. And it's because these reasons

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Speaker 4: fit best with each of the shared death experiences we

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Speaker 4: decided to put into those. I also want to point

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Speaker 4: out that what really triggered this book. I mean, we've

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Speaker 4: been collecting and shared death experiences for years, but what

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Speaker 4: really triggered it was that both Raymond and I had

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Speaker 4: a shared death experience.

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Speaker 3: Well, that's fascinating. What was yours about?

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Speaker 5: Paul?

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Speaker 1: What happened?

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Speaker 3: I was.

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Speaker 4: Several years ago, I was working on a book with

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Speaker 4: the head of neuropharmacology University of Washington, Vernon Neppie, and

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Speaker 4: it was a book on deja vu, and we worked

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Speaker 4: on it for a long period of time. We did

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Speaker 4: a proposal on it. We couldn't sell the book, so

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Speaker 4: we kind of stopped working on books. And I had

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Speaker 4: nothing to do with Vernon for like five years. I

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Speaker 4: hadn't talked to him or written to it at all,

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Speaker 4: and the same with him anyway. At this point, my

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Speaker 4: mother had Alzheimer's and she was dying from Alzheimer's. And

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Speaker 4: one day I got a call from Vernon Neppie and

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Speaker 4: Vernon said, said, you know, I was sitting here. It

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Speaker 4: was on a Sunday, he said, I was sitting here

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Speaker 4: reading the paper and I heard a female voice say,

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Speaker 4: call Paul Perry, and I ignored it. And about an

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Speaker 4: hour later, I was into the sports section and I

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Speaker 4: heard a female voice again say call Paul Perry. So

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Speaker 4: that's what I'm doing. I'm calling you and I don't

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Speaker 4: know why. And I said, well, my mother's dying from Alzheimer's.

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Speaker 4: And he was really the perfect person to talk about

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Speaker 4: that because he was a neuropharmacologist so we spent quite

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Speaker 4: a bit of time talking about different tears that he

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Speaker 4: had attempted. He had attempted on people who had Alzheimer's.

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Speaker 4: And in the course of had that conversation, this was

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Speaker 4: before iPhones, there was that buzzing, you know, on the line,

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Speaker 4: telling me that someone was trying to give me a call.

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Speaker 4: So I said, Verne, I'll call you back later. I

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Speaker 4: answered that phone and it was the care facility telling

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Speaker 4: that my mother had died. And that fit very well

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Speaker 4: into the category of a shared death experience, because somehow

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Speaker 4: my mother, I think, had contacted Vernon and when it

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Speaker 4: felt that Vernon was the perfect person to talk about

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Speaker 4: what was going on with her, and that's how this

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Speaker 4: conversation ensued.

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Speaker 3: And Merriman, how about your shared death experience?

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Speaker 5: Well, similarly, I had been studying these things for a

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Speaker 5: long period of time, and just as Paul and I

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Speaker 5: were getting ready to write a book on it, incredibly

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Speaker 5: my mother suddenly she was found to have non Hodgkins

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Speaker 5: slim foma and we all were there and as she

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Speaker 5: was passing away, George, I mean, you know, people that

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Speaker 5: go through this, there are no words. Really, the closest

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Speaker 5: I can get to it is to say that first

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Speaker 5: thing I noticed was the the room was no longer

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Speaker 5: three dimensional. It was kind of I felt like we

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Speaker 5: were in a kind of double funnel. And light of this,

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Speaker 5: a very unusual character filled the room, and it was

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Speaker 5: full of energy. It wasn't it wasn't like vertigo was

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Speaker 5: things spinning around, but there was energy there that seemed

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Speaker 5: to be revving up. And my mother had been for

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Speaker 5: several days of pundit. We weren't getting anything from us.

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Speaker 5: But just as she was passing away, she rallied and

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Speaker 5: I heard her voice twice say I love you, But George.

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Speaker 5: The voice I didn't hear it through my ears, I know,

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Speaker 5: but it was very insistent, and twice I heard her,

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Speaker 5: but it wasn't coming from her voice, but I heard her. Meanwhile,

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Speaker 5: my sister felt the presence of my father, who had

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Speaker 5: died eighteen months ago, eighteen months before. My wife experienced something.

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Speaker 5: My brother in law felt things. And you know, as

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Speaker 5: you know, I'm driven in my life by curiosity, and

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Speaker 5: sure what that happened. We were kind of ready to

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Speaker 5: do that book, but when it happened to me, it

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Speaker 5: put me off on another I was trying to process

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Speaker 5: my own experience rather than to learn about others. But

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Speaker 5: after a while that settled down and we got busy

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Speaker 5: on it, and we went ahead and finished the book.

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Speaker 3: That's fantastic. Now your first reason, of course, for proof

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Speaker 3: of reasons to believe there's an afterlife out of body experiences.

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Speaker 3: That alone should convince people it's real, right.

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Speaker 4: Well, there's an addition to that, and that is that

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Speaker 4: people have near death experiences. About fifty percent of them

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Speaker 4: have out of body experiences, but a certain number of

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Speaker 4: them have a shared death experience, and that would be

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Speaker 4: an example of that would be that if a person

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Speaker 4: is lying on operating table from a cardiac arrest, yet

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Speaker 4: later on when they're brought back, they can recount conversations

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Speaker 4: in the hospital waiting room. For instance, They're able to

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Speaker 4: convey accurate information about what the doctors were doing and

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Speaker 4: what they were saying, and the instruments they were using.

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Speaker 4: That's a shared death experience because it shows that somehow

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Speaker 4: consciousness has separated from the body, and for all intents

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Speaker 4: and purposes, a person who has a cardiac arrest is dead.

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Speaker 4: So this shows once again that consciousness survives bodily death.

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Speaker 3: Precognitive events, of course, is important as reason too, right.

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Speaker 5: So yeah, yeah, and you know I I saw in

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Speaker 5: my practice, of course, you know, dude, to my interest,

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Speaker 5: I was the one always appointed to talk to the

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Speaker 5: terminally ill patients, right. It was a big part of

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Speaker 5: my medical practice for a long time. And I quickly

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Speaker 5: realized under that circumstance that it's and I know, any

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Speaker 5: doctor who has had a lot to do with the mental,

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Speaker 5: with the you know, the terminally ill, will tell you

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Speaker 5: the same thing that they seem to know in some

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Speaker 5: extraordinary way when they're gonna die. I saw this so

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Speaker 5: many times, and and the same thing about medical practice

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Speaker 5: in a way, so it's unreally, it's relentless, right, so

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Speaker 5: you don't have time to process all these amazing things

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Speaker 5: you're seeing. But it does occur. People know in some

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Speaker 5: way that I can't figure out when they're gonna die.

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Speaker 5: When I was back in nineteen seventy, George, my wife

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Speaker 5: was pregnant and this was my first child, and we

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Speaker 5: both woke up in the middle of the night with

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Speaker 5: the same drink that we were losing the baby. And

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Speaker 5: she was seeing it from her perspective and I was

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Speaker 5: seeing it from my in my perspective when we got

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Speaker 5: to the er, I saw the obstetrician with his back

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Speaker 5: to me, and I remember to this day it's like

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Speaker 5: the khaki pants and the plaid shirt and the tawny

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Speaker 5: colored long hair. Well, the trouble was the I had

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Speaker 5: only seen there was a It was a group of

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Speaker 5: three obstetricians. I had only met one. But this night,

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Speaker 5: that the night we had the dream. Then the next night,

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Speaker 5: twenty four hours later, it happened just as we dreamed it.

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Speaker 5: And when we went to the er, I saw that

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Speaker 5: doctor that I had never seen before, and he was

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Speaker 5: exactly like I'd seen in the dreaming. And the reason

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Speaker 5: I'm telling this is not to be autobiographical, but you

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Speaker 5: know a lot of folks listening in will say, yeah,

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Speaker 5: me too. This is in a way that I can't understand.

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Speaker 5: The time since is mixed up during the dying process,

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Speaker 5: and I just you know, I saw this all the time.

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Speaker 3: Transforming the light. What is that?

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Speaker 4: Well, it's an observation that people can make about someone

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Speaker 4: who's had in your death experience, And the observation is

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Speaker 4: is that they've they've they are able to share with

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Speaker 4: all of us around them that they're personnel. The has

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Speaker 4: changed greatly. We called it the Scrooge effect because it's

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Speaker 4: very much like what happened with Ebenezer Scrooge and the

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Speaker 4: Christmas Carol when he saw the ghost of Marley, his

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Speaker 4: business partner. All around him has changed and everything it

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Speaker 4: transformed him completely, Scooge and these there you go, and

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Speaker 4: these transformative effects and near death experiences can be documented.

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Speaker 4: So there's several studies that have documented them, and what

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Speaker 4: they say is that through near death experiences. Number one,

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Speaker 4: there's a great decrease in death anxiety with people who

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Speaker 4: have had a near death experience. But people who have

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Speaker 4: near death experiences also have a tendency to have a

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Speaker 4: higher zest for living, and that's defined as the subject

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Speaker 4: is type A without the anger. They're very aggressively living life.

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Speaker 4: And another thing that is very supernatural is that the

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Speaker 4: people who have had near death experiences have at least

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Speaker 4: four times the number of verifiable psychic experiences as people

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Speaker 4: around them. So verifiable psychic experience would be that you

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Speaker 4: have a dream the night before you're going to take

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Speaker 4: a plane flight somewhere that the plane is crashed. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: you get up in the morning, you tell your spouse

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Speaker 4: that the plane you had this dream and in fact

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Speaker 4: then there is a plane crash and you're not on it.

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Speaker 4: That's how dramatic they can be.

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Speaker 2: How many people don't react to their inner feelings like

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Speaker 2: that and would have gone on the plane.

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Speaker 4: You mean, well, there is that angle too, is that

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Speaker 4: there's a greater there's a greater increase in increase of

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Speaker 4: intuition among people have near death experiences. And that's that's

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Speaker 4: shared because it's highly visible.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, George, and all my career, I have only known

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Speaker 5: one person both before and after their near death experience.

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Speaker 5: And this only in nineteen eighty. I was on a

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Speaker 5: hematology service in my medical training. I was a resident

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Speaker 5: and we had this patient and who was a lovely

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Speaker 5: young woman, and she was pregnant and she was having

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Speaker 5: platelet difficulties. So the object of the hematologist treatment was

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Speaker 5: to try to get the platelet count back up before

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Speaker 5: she delivered. Well, anyway, I got to know this fine

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Speaker 5: young woman, and I want to emphasize that, just a

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Speaker 5: delightful person. Okay, Now, then I left that unit. That

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Speaker 5: was my service in that unit was over before she

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Speaker 5: had her baby. Now flashed forward three years. I was

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Speaker 5: sitting in the cafeteria at the hospital. In the middle

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Speaker 5: of the night, I was on call for psychiatry and George,

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Speaker 5: I mean, you know, I don't have the words. This

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Speaker 5: apparition quoated in. I mean, this young woman and she

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Speaker 5: was very then she seemed full of light for one

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Speaker 5: of the better term, very light on her feet. And

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Speaker 5: she sat down and she said, doctor Moody, you don't

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Speaker 5: remember me, but she said, three years ago I was

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Speaker 5: and it was this very young woman. And she told

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Speaker 5: me that after I had left, she did deliver the

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Speaker 5: baby and she almost bled out during the delivery and

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Speaker 5: had a cardiac arrest in a near death experience. And

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Speaker 5: she said that when she tried to tell the nurse,

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Speaker 5: they said, oh, that doctor Moody, he was here a

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Speaker 5: few weeks ago. He studies this. So there in the

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Speaker 5: middle of the night, this woman floated in. She had

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Speaker 5: she had done her nursing studies, she has been a nurse.

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Speaker 5: But the transformation I saw in that person, I mean,

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Speaker 5: I just can't describe it. It was like a transfiguration

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Speaker 5: is not a is not an exaggeration. It was one

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Speaker 5: of the most startling things I have experienced during my residency.

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Speaker 5: To see the physical transformation even in this young woman.

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Speaker 5: I mean it was and not only she was, as

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Speaker 5: I said, very nice person, but the depth after her

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Speaker 5: her experience was what impressed me. I mean, I just

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Speaker 5: really don't have the words to describe it, but I

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Speaker 5: know that these transformations of people, as I'm sure you've

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Speaker 5: noticed too, when of the people you've talked through in

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Speaker 5: the really profound.

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Speaker 2: Scientists have still yet to be able to explain the

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Speaker 2: Big Bang theory, how the universe started and all that,

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Speaker 2: Yet you two seem to have a pretty good handle

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Speaker 2: on the afterlife.

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Speaker 3: Why is that?

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Speaker 5: What I say is, you know, I know enough from

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Speaker 5: having taught to thousands of people that you can't really

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Speaker 5: imagine it right. And everybody says, no matter how articulate,

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Speaker 5: no matter how many languages they speak, no matter how

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Speaker 5: many degrees they have, they said, I just can't describe

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Speaker 5: it to you. There are no words. So there is

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Speaker 5: that limitation. However, I had numerous cases over the years

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Speaker 5: where people have told me that they had previously read

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Speaker 5: accounts of near death experiences, then subsequently had their own

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Speaker 5: near death experience, and while they were having their near

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Speaker 5: death experience, were able to recognize what it was from

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Speaker 5: what they had read.

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Speaker 1: Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at

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