WEBVTT - Ep 59: Primal Scream's Bobby Gillespie 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:03.000 Loud and Quiet Presents Midnight Chats. 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:28.280 Evening listeners, Welcome to Midnight Chats. It's Thursday night, it's late. 0:00:28.680 --> 0:00:32.200 It's officially the most depressing week of the year, officially 0:00:32.240 --> 0:00:36.320 for me, anyway. The clocks have just gone back, gets 0:00:36.440 --> 0:00:40.760 darker earlier in the evenings. It's cold, it's miserable. The 0:00:40.800 --> 0:00:44.920 Great British Bake Off has just finished and winter hasn't 0:00:44.960 --> 0:00:48.600 even really begun yet. But hey, we try not to 0:00:48.640 --> 0:00:52.640 wallow on Midnight Chats. And I'm actually looking on the 0:00:52.680 --> 0:00:56.720 positive side because tonight's episode of the podcast, I think 0:00:56.920 --> 0:00:59.760 is a real warmer, a real cracker. I'm not going 0:00:59.800 --> 0:01:01.720 to get give you the full history of my guest 0:01:01.920 --> 0:01:06.560 because you know Primal Scream and you know Bobby Gillespie, 0:01:06.600 --> 0:01:09.160 and there's no way we were going to comprehensively cover 0:01:09.760 --> 0:01:13.560 the story of his thirty years in music in a 0:01:13.600 --> 0:01:17.919 shortish podcast. So it's fortunate that the album Primal Scream 0:01:17.959 --> 0:01:20.680 released a couple of weeks ago, zones in on a 0:01:20.920 --> 0:01:24.480 very specific period for the band. It's called give Out, 0:01:24.560 --> 0:01:28.920 but don't give up the original Memphis recordings, and I 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:32.200 won't go into too much detail because Bobby sets the 0:01:32.240 --> 0:01:35.400 scene pretty nicely in the conversation you're about to hear, 0:01:35.920 --> 0:01:40.000 but in a nutshell. Back in nineteen ninety three, Primal 0:01:40.040 --> 0:01:43.920 Scream just won the Mercury Prize for Scream of Delica. 0:01:44.480 --> 0:01:47.960 They were suddenly a very big deal. There was a 0:01:47.960 --> 0:01:50.120 lot of heat, a lot of attension, a lot of 0:01:50.200 --> 0:01:54.440 pressure on them, and they headed to the legendary Ardent 0:01:54.560 --> 0:01:58.760 Studios in Memphis to record the follow up with producer 0:01:58.840 --> 0:02:02.920 Tom Dowd. Now, he was known for his work with 0:02:03.320 --> 0:02:09.040 Ray Charles Otis, reading Aretha Franklin Legends of Soul music, 0:02:09.760 --> 0:02:14.720 but he wasn't necessarily associated with rock bands like Primal Screen. 0:02:15.280 --> 0:02:20.080 And after a while the band realized it wasn't turning 0:02:20.080 --> 0:02:23.920 out maybe the way they wanted, and when they got back, 0:02:24.000 --> 0:02:28.040 they reworked and re recorded the album with a new producer, 0:02:28.720 --> 0:02:31.639 the album You'll know as Give Out but Don't Give Up, 0:02:31.760 --> 0:02:36.120 which has tracks like Rocks and free on Them. Now 0:02:36.520 --> 0:02:40.600 fast forward almost twenty five years, and Andrew Innis from 0:02:40.600 --> 0:02:45.600 the band found those original tapes from those Memphis sessions 0:02:45.639 --> 0:02:48.560 in his basement and they decided to share them with 0:02:48.600 --> 0:02:51.919 the world. Now they haven't just put the music they 0:02:51.960 --> 0:02:56.639 rediscovered out but also made a documentary about this time. 0:02:57.000 --> 0:03:01.080 It's broadcast on BBC four on the City sixteenth of November, 0:03:01.639 --> 0:03:06.600 and it's a really moving, funny and passionate portrait, not 0:03:06.880 --> 0:03:11.239 just of the Primal Scream story, particularly those early years 0:03:11.240 --> 0:03:15.160 back in Glasgow, but specifically the time they spent in 0:03:15.280 --> 0:03:18.400 the Deep South around the making of this album and 0:03:19.200 --> 0:03:22.359 Bobby and Andrew travel back to Memphis. In the film, 0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:26.440 You've got some big personalities who were close to it 0:03:26.520 --> 0:03:31.560 who helped tell the story, so Noel Gallagher, Alan McGhee, 0:03:31.639 --> 0:03:34.960 they're entertaining in it with their punchlines, but beyond that, 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:38.960 I found it quite a moving watch really, particularly the 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:44.280 contributions from ex Primal Scream singer Denise Johnson and Bobby's 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:49.240 emotional memories of guitarist Robert Young, who played on this 0:03:49.320 --> 0:03:52.200 album but passed away a few years ago. And you 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:58.360 maybe think of Bobby as a lot of swagger, bravado, 0:03:58.760 --> 0:04:03.000 maybe a little bit formidable. That's there, But above all, 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:09.440 it's a very tender, vulnerable film and brilliantly done. So yeah, 0:04:09.560 --> 0:04:12.360 check that out. Hopefully it'll be on BBC iPlayer afterwards 0:04:12.360 --> 0:04:15.200 as well. Before we get into that conversation, if you're 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:18.760 listening to this podcast for the first time, the second time, 0:04:19.040 --> 0:04:20.680 or maybe you've been with us for a little while. 0:04:21.040 --> 0:04:24.040 Please do subscribe to Midnight Chats. Wherever you're listening to 0:04:24.080 --> 0:04:27.320 this you're getting alert a reminder every time we put 0:04:27.320 --> 0:04:30.560 out a new episode each week on a Thursday at midnight, 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:34.800 and please do comment and rate and share all that 0:04:34.880 --> 0:04:37.560 stuff that helps spread the word. I hope you enjoyed 0:04:37.640 --> 0:04:40.480 last week's episode. By the way Stuart's speaking to cat Power, 0:04:40.640 --> 0:04:42.760 I thought that one was particularly good, so do check 0:04:42.800 --> 0:04:46.760 that out if you haven't already. We also have a 0:04:46.880 --> 0:04:49.640 new issue of the magazine we make Loud and Quiet 0:04:49.800 --> 0:04:53.680 out this weekend. Tons in there. Jimithy Lacoste is on 0:04:53.720 --> 0:04:55.960 the cover and interviews with the likes of the Beastie 0:04:55.960 --> 0:04:59.400 Boys and gets loads and loads of great new music. 0:05:00.040 --> 0:05:02.359 Loud and Quiet dot com to get hold of that. 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:07.120 But back to tonight's guest Bobby Gillespie. I'd only met 0:05:07.160 --> 0:05:10.839 Bobby once before, about two years ago. Now, we went 0:05:11.040 --> 0:05:14.280 record shopping for a video series we make at Loud 0:05:14.320 --> 0:05:17.720 and Quiet called Bands by Records. It's on YouTube if 0:05:17.720 --> 0:05:20.120 you want to check that out. Not long after that, 0:05:20.360 --> 0:05:24.240 Bobby had a really serious accident where he fell off 0:05:24.360 --> 0:05:28.440 stage at a festival in Switzerland and broke his back 0:05:28.600 --> 0:05:32.320 in four places. He had to travel by air ambulance 0:05:32.400 --> 0:05:36.000 back to the UK for treatment. So that's why I 0:05:36.040 --> 0:05:39.400 started by asking him about that in case you're wondering, 0:05:39.839 --> 0:05:43.560 and the rest I won't spoil. So here we go, 0:05:43.720 --> 0:06:04.600 Episode fifty nine of Midnight Chats with Bobby Gillespie. Last 0:06:04.640 --> 0:06:07.240 time I saw you was about two years ago and 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:10.080 we went to a great little record store in Camden 0:06:10.120 --> 0:06:12.720 Town in North London. A couple of weeks after that, 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:15.520 I read that you'd had your your accident on stage 0:06:15.800 --> 0:06:19.040 and with primal scream in Switzerland at the festival, and 0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:21.080 I was just wondering how you are because I haven't 0:06:21.080 --> 0:06:22.919 seen you since then, and that sounded pretty serious. 0:06:23.480 --> 0:06:26.039 It was a serious accident. I broke my back in 0:06:26.120 --> 0:06:29.680 four places and I was for a couple of months, 0:06:29.760 --> 0:06:32.960 and you know, I was. It was serious. You know, 0:06:33.480 --> 0:06:38.280 I'm lucky that I can walk and but I'm fine now, 0:06:38.400 --> 0:06:41.240 you know, I'm I'm good. Everything's back to normal, and 0:06:42.400 --> 0:06:45.279 it was, it was. It was an interesting experience. 0:06:46.160 --> 0:06:49.720 Was in one of those moments where you thought you 0:06:49.839 --> 0:06:52.680 did you know immediately you've done something very very serious. Yeah. 0:06:53.080 --> 0:06:55.760 Immediately I heard the ground and you it was bad. 0:06:57.120 --> 0:06:57.919 I knew it was bad. 0:06:58.200 --> 0:07:00.279 Are you still living with like the effects of like 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:01.719 do you have to go through physio and all that 0:07:01.760 --> 0:07:02.600 kind of thing after that? 0:07:02.680 --> 0:07:05.480 Yes, I had to do fazzio. I had to do 0:07:05.520 --> 0:07:11.120 all sorts of exercises. Yeah, and I wasn't like heavier 0:07:11.720 --> 0:07:17.440 drugs as well as a traumadol like stuff, a trauma door. 0:07:17.680 --> 0:07:18.120 I think. 0:07:19.800 --> 0:07:23.160 Towards the you know, when the you have to start 0:07:23.200 --> 0:07:25.960 stepping the tramadol dan and. 0:07:27.640 --> 0:07:27.960 I think it. 0:07:28.040 --> 0:07:31.800 It's six weeks and then I started to see a 0:07:31.840 --> 0:07:35.440 fezzio guy and he gave me some exercises and that 0:07:35.600 --> 0:07:35.920 was good. 0:07:36.040 --> 0:07:38.679 And yeah, I mean you mentioned that you're concerned about, 0:07:38.720 --> 0:07:40.520 you know, the basics of being able to walk again, 0:07:40.600 --> 0:07:42.440 but we're also thinking, like, how is this going to 0:07:42.640 --> 0:07:44.400 affect my performance at the stage. 0:07:44.720 --> 0:07:49.240 No, because the I was taken to hospital directly after 0:07:49.320 --> 0:07:55.440 the fall and they shot me up with morphine. At 0:07:55.480 --> 0:07:57.920 this point, no one knew what the extent of the 0:07:58.000 --> 0:08:01.920 damage was. I was lying on a slab, you know, 0:08:02.080 --> 0:08:04.640 the kind of a stretcher type thing for a couple 0:08:04.640 --> 0:08:07.560 of hours, and then the X rayed me, and I 0:08:07.600 --> 0:08:09.800 couldn't stand up to be x rayed, so they had 0:08:09.800 --> 0:08:13.200 to do it the term I don't know what it's 0:08:13.240 --> 0:08:14.920 lying down. I don't know how they did it, but 0:08:14.960 --> 0:08:18.280 they did it, and and they gave me more morphine. 0:08:18.320 --> 0:08:20.960 And then I kind of fell asleep that night and 0:08:21.000 --> 0:08:24.360 I woke up the next morning and you know, like 0:08:24.520 --> 0:08:29.040 really shot philomorphine and I started to come back to 0:08:29.080 --> 0:08:33.240 consciousness and you know, I'm in a hospital in his 0:08:33.360 --> 0:08:39.240 tiny room. What's wrong? You know, when I wonder what 0:08:39.280 --> 0:08:42.160 I've done, I wonder what the damages. Will I be 0:08:42.160 --> 0:08:48.440 able to walk again? I didn't know. So the doctors 0:08:48.440 --> 0:08:52.880 came in after my breakfast. Doctors came in and they said, 0:08:52.880 --> 0:08:56.480 we'll get some good news and some bad news. And said, 0:08:58.200 --> 0:09:01.200 the bad news is you're broke in your back in 0:09:01.240 --> 0:09:04.880 four places. The good news is the good breaks. 0:09:07.360 --> 0:09:09.440 And did you make a joke, say I have had 0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:10.720 a few good breaks in my career. 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:15.160 I was like, all right, And he said, because you 0:09:15.200 --> 0:09:17.160 know they will hear when you know you'll be able 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:19.319 to walk, and you know a couple of months you'll 0:09:19.360 --> 0:09:21.280 be okay, but you're going to be out for a 0:09:21.320 --> 0:09:24.280 couple of months. You you can't do any physico activity 0:09:24.440 --> 0:09:29.160 and said, so, you know, I had the breaks were 0:09:29.160 --> 0:09:33.720 in bones at the front of my vertebrae, had spur 0:09:33.840 --> 0:09:38.120 bits between the vertebrae, and I had to been on 0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:40.800 the back where all the nerves are. I think they've 0:09:40.800 --> 0:09:43.600 been met. I've had to operate and that could have 0:09:43.679 --> 0:09:47.760 been tricky, and but as it happens, they were just 0:09:47.800 --> 0:09:52.080 there was four fractures and I just had to wear 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:55.240 chest brace for a couple of months. And I was 0:09:55.280 --> 0:09:57.280 at home. You know, I spent a lot of time 0:09:57.320 --> 0:09:59.840 in bed, and I was very tired. I was ex 0:10:00.000 --> 0:10:03.840 dosted because the bodies, the body uses all the energy 0:10:04.040 --> 0:10:08.400 from you know, food and stuff and sleep to repair itself, 0:10:08.440 --> 0:10:11.280 and so I slept a lot. The body demanded that sleep, 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:13.719 and I did you know, I just watched a lot 0:10:13.720 --> 0:10:17.000 of films. Even that I couldn't sit in the living 0:10:17.080 --> 0:10:19.800 room and watch a film. I couldn't sit. You have 0:10:19.840 --> 0:10:22.360 to be flashypan normal. Yeah, because I had a chest 0:10:22.400 --> 0:10:26.600 brace on. It was metal chest prace. So I did 0:10:26.679 --> 0:10:29.160 just line my back and I had this, you know, 0:10:29.440 --> 0:10:32.000 got stand to put an iPad on. And I just 0:10:32.040 --> 0:10:34.360 watched a film half a film and it just doze off. 0:10:35.400 --> 0:10:38.120 I never listened to music either the whole time. I 0:10:38.120 --> 0:10:42.000 think it's very strange. I know it's you know, normally 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:45.000 I listened to music all the time. Well, maybe I 0:10:45.040 --> 0:10:51.800 was in heavy drugs and I think maybe I don't know, 0:10:51.840 --> 0:10:54.559 I was thinking a lot. You know, I don't want 0:10:54.559 --> 0:10:57.200 to hear music. The only music I really listened to 0:10:57.360 --> 0:10:59.760 was at night in my bed and I'd get headphones 0:10:59.800 --> 0:11:02.640 on when the lakes went and I would listen to 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:06.440 some tracks by George Harris and All Things Must Pass, 0:11:07.320 --> 0:11:11.840 Beware of Darkness, and the other one that was Isn't 0:11:11.880 --> 0:11:16.520 It a Pity? Real real healing music, And yeah, I 0:11:16.559 --> 0:11:19.960 listened to them every night. You know. I think there's 0:11:20.000 --> 0:11:24.640 a lot of loving those records and then those songs 0:11:24.720 --> 0:11:29.319 and yeah, very spiritual and yeah that that that was 0:11:29.360 --> 0:11:32.000 a bit. And then when I was sort of getting 0:11:32.000 --> 0:11:33.960 a bit better and I could walk a bit better 0:11:34.000 --> 0:11:36.559 and stuff, I listened a lot to Tom Paige's Greatest. 0:11:36.240 --> 0:11:39.360 Has It's just motivational music. 0:11:39.400 --> 0:11:43.240 Then, yeah, listen to Tom and you know, i'd play 0:11:43.240 --> 0:11:47.120 it loud to the speakers and yeah, and then maybe 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:48.720 I want to I want to be in a band again. 0:11:48.760 --> 0:11:50.719 You know, it's great there to hear that that kind 0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:52.600 of stuff can play a role in part of the 0:11:53.040 --> 0:11:55.880 recuperation from something like that. I mean, sure there's the paintings, 0:11:55.920 --> 0:11:58.880 but then there's also just the other stuff that goes 0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:01.160 with it. To pain colors, I had to. 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:03.719 I was on them for like four or five weeks, 0:12:03.760 --> 0:12:07.800 six weeks, and I came off. And I think it's 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:11.040 when I came off that started listening to like faster 0:12:11.120 --> 0:12:13.280 stuff like tom Pey, you know, more high energy. 0:12:13.840 --> 0:12:15.680 Finally worked your way back up to like the cramps 0:12:15.679 --> 0:12:16.640 and stage, and then I. 0:12:16.600 --> 0:12:18.360 Was like, right, I go to get back on stage 0:12:18.360 --> 0:12:18.880 with the bands. 0:12:18.920 --> 0:12:21.320 You know, yeah, what was that first show back, like 0:12:21.400 --> 0:12:24.640 after you injured yourself? Because we're a bit catious. So 0:12:25.000 --> 0:12:25.920 the first show. 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:32.880 Back it was in Glasgow weeks I think after the 0:12:33.000 --> 0:12:37.160 break after the fall, and I had I was sang 0:12:37.280 --> 0:12:40.560 a lot of sitting in a chair and a high chair, 0:12:41.480 --> 0:12:43.880 and then for a couple of numbers I stood up 0:12:44.360 --> 0:12:46.440 and just hung on the mic. Then you know, I 0:12:46.480 --> 0:12:50.200 couldn't downce, you know, I was. So we did a 0:12:50.400 --> 0:12:53.800 did a couple of shows like that, and then I 0:12:53.840 --> 0:12:56.720 went and holed you to America and I was getting 0:12:56.720 --> 0:12:59.959 bettered by that point. End of August, the injury, the fall, 0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:02.480 what happened I think on the second of June, and 0:13:02.520 --> 0:13:06.080 then maybe midway through September, we did a gig with 0:13:06.200 --> 0:13:10.160 Massive Attack at the Downs and Bristol in front of 0:13:10.240 --> 0:13:14.440 thirty thousand people, and I started moving again. You know, 0:13:14.559 --> 0:13:16.200 I had to make and I was running to the 0:13:16.240 --> 0:13:19.040 edge of the stage, and you know, I'd been doing 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:21.720 a lot of fezzio and swimming and stuff and a 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:24.880 bit of running, and I was ready to rock. 0:13:26.200 --> 0:13:29.280 I'm all right, good. Let's start with talking about the 0:13:29.320 --> 0:13:31.360 Primal Scream record is about to come out. It's actually 0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:33.400 coming out this week. But there's also by the time 0:13:33.440 --> 0:13:36.400 that people hear this podcast, there will also be an 0:13:36.440 --> 0:13:38.960 accompanying documentary that goes with it that kind of adds 0:13:38.960 --> 0:13:41.199 some more context to it. But give out, but never 0:13:41.240 --> 0:13:45.880 give up the Memphis sessions, the recordings. For people that 0:13:45.920 --> 0:13:48.640 aren't entirely familiar with the context and the time what 0:13:48.760 --> 0:13:52.400 was going on, just start by telling us a little 0:13:52.440 --> 0:13:55.600 bit of the story. It's nineteen ninety three, Screaming delic 0:13:55.679 --> 0:13:58.000 has been out, you're following that up with a new record. 0:13:58.160 --> 0:14:00.560 You decide to head to Memphis to try some different 0:14:00.640 --> 0:14:04.200 as promised have done consistently throughout your career, But what 0:14:04.640 --> 0:14:07.679 was going through yourself in the band's minds when you're thinking, right, 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:09.440 we're going to head to the Deep South and make 0:14:09.480 --> 0:14:10.120 a new record. 0:14:10.600 --> 0:14:16.400 The songs that we wrote after touring Schemi Delica quite extensively, 0:14:17.080 --> 0:14:20.840 we're rock songs, you know, rock country, so ballad mostly country, 0:14:20.880 --> 0:14:25.640 so ballads kind of dark damaged country, so ballads, and 0:14:26.400 --> 0:14:29.720 you know, with guitar riffs, and there was a step 0:14:29.760 --> 0:14:33.080 away from skimmy delicate and working with samplers and drum 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:39.120 loops and you know Andrew Weather Alex parts and you 0:14:39.160 --> 0:14:43.400 know Weather by nineteen ninety two ninety three had he 0:14:43.480 --> 0:14:46.280 was getting. He was sort of getting a harder, more 0:14:46.320 --> 0:14:50.680 extreme techno, you know, very unemotional, but Andy would say 0:14:50.680 --> 0:14:53.320 it's emotional that you know, I found it unemotional. But 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:57.640 we didn't think that it could work with, you know, 0:14:58.480 --> 0:15:03.040 the direction of songs that we were writing. So we 0:15:03.120 --> 0:15:05.720 tried to do some recording at the end of ninety 0:15:05.760 --> 0:15:10.640 two at the Rent Studio in London with Jimmy Miller 0:15:10.680 --> 0:15:13.440 who had produced The Stones and Traffic and Spencer Davis 0:15:13.440 --> 0:15:18.160 Group and Johnny Thunders and Motorhead, and we then ever 0:15:18.200 --> 0:15:21.480 worked out because Jimmy wasn't the best of shape and 0:15:21.520 --> 0:15:23.240 we weren't in the best of shape, and also we 0:15:23.320 --> 0:15:26.880 only had two songs, not enough to make an album. 0:15:27.040 --> 0:15:31.480 So those sessions folded after a while, you know, and 0:15:31.520 --> 0:15:37.000 then we reconvened. I think in the spring of nineteen 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:40.920 ninety three. We'd had the idea to work with ask 0:15:41.040 --> 0:15:44.760 Tom Dowd to produce, and we'd loved his work with 0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:49.480 Retha Franko, you know, you know, he rod Sture and 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:51.960 he'd worked with Eric Clapton. We didn't know that at 0:15:51.960 --> 0:15:54.920 that point, but you know, he'd record he'd produced Leila, 0:15:55.160 --> 0:16:01.040 and he'd also produced The Cream and engineered the Cream. 0:16:02.400 --> 0:16:05.280 He We didn't know that because we went into that music, 0:16:05.840 --> 0:16:08.200 but we knew the soul stuff that he'd worked on. 0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:11.360 We knew he'd worked with John Coltrane and my favorite Things, 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:14.920 and he'd worked with Theretha and we were listening to 0:16:14.920 --> 0:16:18.360 a lot of Aretha and we needed a rhythm section, 0:16:18.680 --> 0:16:21.520 so we asked Roger Hawkins and David did from the 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:25.400 Muscle Show rhythm rhythm section because we love their work, 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:29.160 you know, with the staple Singers with Wilson Pickett, with 0:16:29.240 --> 0:16:34.920 Bos Skaggs, with Willie Nelson, Donni Fritz, lither Ingram. You know, 0:16:35.280 --> 0:16:39.360 they're playing a lot of our favorite records. So they 0:16:39.440 --> 0:16:43.920 all Tom and the Muscle shows guys came over to 0:16:44.040 --> 0:16:48.200 London and they rehearsed with us for two weeks and 0:16:48.280 --> 0:16:51.080 so we worked up versions, early versions of the songs, 0:16:51.200 --> 0:16:53.680 and then we headed down to Ardent Studios in Memphis, 0:16:53.760 --> 0:16:55.320 Tennessee to make the record. 0:16:56.120 --> 0:17:01.000 And Memphis, for you, was that a bit like stepping 0:17:01.040 --> 0:17:06.159 into a musical holy ground because so much of the 0:17:06.280 --> 0:17:09.040 music that you've been influenced by and loved kind of 0:17:09.040 --> 0:17:11.520 came from that area, that region, that part of America. 0:17:11.800 --> 0:17:13.800 So to actually, you know, land in Memphis and be 0:17:13.880 --> 0:17:15.479 like we're going to make a new record was that 0:17:15.480 --> 0:17:17.440 a special thing. It was very special. 0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:22.359 We had been to Memphis, I think November nineteen ninety 0:17:22.359 --> 0:17:25.120 one and we went with Andrew Weatheroor and we recorded 0:17:25.160 --> 0:17:29.520 some songs that became the dex and Arca EP, which 0:17:30.040 --> 0:17:33.480 was a top ten and here in the UK the 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:35.719 lead track was moving on up. So we had already 0:17:36.000 --> 0:17:38.560 made a rock and roll pilgrimage to Memphis, and you know, 0:17:38.640 --> 0:17:41.760 went to Grace Lams and Sun Studios and all that stuff. 0:17:42.640 --> 0:17:44.880 Was the first impressions of all that those because the 0:17:45.280 --> 0:17:48.639 iconic landmarks all around Memphis, I mean Graceland, like you mentioned, 0:17:48.680 --> 0:17:52.480 Sun Studio, kind of unassuming places, but such history in them. 0:17:52.640 --> 0:17:56.080 I never went to Sun Studios. Actually we drove past 0:17:56.080 --> 0:17:58.320 it every day, but I never went. I was to 0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:01.800 this thing when I was younger that if I went 0:18:01.880 --> 0:18:04.919 in and I would spoil the romance. I was wrong, 0:18:05.000 --> 0:18:08.520 you know. I went January this year. I finally got there. 0:18:09.000 --> 0:18:11.240 But I went to Gracelands in ninety one and then 0:18:11.280 --> 0:18:14.919 that was special. All of us went. And also the 0:18:14.960 --> 0:18:17.879 studio that we were recording an Orderance studio. One of 0:18:17.920 --> 0:18:20.879 their favorite old time albums have been recorded A Sister 0:18:20.960 --> 0:18:24.199 Lovers by Big Star, and that's why we went to 0:18:24.240 --> 0:18:29.159 that studio. It was an adventure, you know, so but 0:18:29.320 --> 0:18:32.159 really we were mostly in the studio working. You know, 0:18:32.240 --> 0:18:35.560 we don't have a lot of time get but I 0:18:35.560 --> 0:18:39.280 think you know that there was the scene of Memphis had. 0:18:39.880 --> 0:18:42.040 It was a lot different from the fifties, sixties, and 0:18:42.080 --> 0:18:43.919 even the seventies. By the time we got there in 0:18:43.960 --> 0:18:46.280 the late nineties, it was it seemed. 0:18:46.040 --> 0:18:50.840 Very quiet, you know, So those sessions in Memphis, being 0:18:50.880 --> 0:18:52.840 in that room in addent studios, What are your key 0:18:52.880 --> 0:18:56.000 memories from that that time in ninety. 0:18:55.560 --> 0:18:57.840 Memory, because it's a lot, such a long time ago, 0:18:57.920 --> 0:19:01.280 and we've I've made we made so many records and 0:19:02.400 --> 0:19:07.160 toured and written so many songs since. I've seen some 0:19:07.280 --> 0:19:13.560 film that was shot and that that was, that was 0:19:13.760 --> 0:19:17.720 that was nice to see. And I've I've seen a 0:19:17.800 --> 0:19:20.359 couple of photos. It's not that much. We never documented 0:19:20.359 --> 0:19:22.920 ourselves in those days. I think I was superstitious that 0:19:23.320 --> 0:19:25.160 if you had a photographer in the studio, he would 0:19:25.160 --> 0:19:29.320 spoil the magic, you know, so which I think again 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:33.119 was wrong. But back then and even still today, you know, 0:19:33.480 --> 0:19:35.199 making a record was a very it was like a 0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:38.040 battle between good and evil. You know. It was like 0:19:38.080 --> 0:19:42.679 a real knife edge stuff. So the less people and 0:19:42.760 --> 0:19:45.120 the way, the better, you know. So it's a shame 0:19:45.160 --> 0:19:48.679 because we don't have documentation, but or we don't have 0:19:48.760 --> 0:19:54.719 much documentation. But I just remember working very hard. You know. 0:19:55.440 --> 0:20:01.479 The band shared an apartment, six rooms of rooms, and 0:20:01.520 --> 0:20:04.520 we every day, you know, we get up and breakfast, 0:20:04.600 --> 0:20:08.480 play table tennis, and then we go to the studio. 0:20:08.680 --> 0:20:13.440 And at twelve, I think midday and start working with Roger, 0:20:13.520 --> 0:20:17.720 David and Tom and work until whenever Tom decided we 0:20:17.760 --> 0:20:20.240 should finish, maybe have a couple of drinks after it, 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:24.760 then go back back home. What's your bet? Italian? And 0:20:25.000 --> 0:20:29.439 Tom Dowold demanded quiet, you know, he demanded respect because 0:20:29.480 --> 0:20:32.480 of his He was a good you know, he's obviously 0:20:32.600 --> 0:20:35.199 he had a great track record of music, and he 0:20:35.280 --> 0:20:37.840 was a real gentleman and a really intelligent man and 0:20:37.880 --> 0:20:41.520 a very courteous He was a gentleman, and you know, 0:20:41.600 --> 0:20:44.160 you wanted to do your best, not just for yourself 0:20:44.200 --> 0:20:48.160 and your band, but for Tom, you know, for even 0:20:48.280 --> 0:20:50.520 you know, we were flower that he would want to 0:20:50.560 --> 0:20:52.840 work with us, you know. So, I mean he was 0:20:52.840 --> 0:20:56.280 at sixty seven years of age at that point, and 0:20:56.480 --> 0:21:00.600 he did a long and illustrious career. As they say, 0:21:00.640 --> 0:21:05.159 you know, it's very successful. So I was still writing 0:21:05.359 --> 0:21:07.399 a lot of the lyrics for the songs. I'd have 0:21:07.560 --> 0:21:10.159 like maybe a couple, you know, a few songs, I 0:21:10.200 --> 0:21:13.960 would have all the verses and choruses, and for some 0:21:14.040 --> 0:21:16.359 others I would just maybe have like a first verse 0:21:17.400 --> 0:21:19.359 and a chorus, and I didn't have a seting verse 0:21:20.160 --> 0:21:22.920 you know, or a middle ay or a coder, you know, 0:21:23.040 --> 0:21:26.720 or there's chunks of lyrics missing, and but you know, 0:21:26.800 --> 0:21:30.119 I had the idea of what the song should be about, 0:21:30.200 --> 0:21:33.280 and so I felt that pressure when I was going 0:21:33.280 --> 0:21:35.359 to in a Memphis. I felt, oh my god, I 0:21:35.400 --> 0:21:37.879 don't want to hold this recording, but I've got to deliver, 0:21:38.080 --> 0:21:39.800 you know. And also we had the pressure of following 0:21:39.840 --> 0:21:43.240 up Screaming Delica. And then of course and Alan McGee 0:21:43.240 --> 0:21:49.480 had sold his label Creation to Sony for a lot 0:21:49.520 --> 0:21:53.520 of money, so they wanted they wanted some payback as well. 0:21:53.560 --> 0:21:57.399 I think, so these original Memphis recordings that people are 0:21:57.440 --> 0:22:00.439 going to get to, Hey, now, how did the conversations 0:22:00.520 --> 0:22:02.639 go when you came back from Memphis. You've got this 0:22:02.720 --> 0:22:05.639 collections of songs. Did you as a band feel that 0:22:05.840 --> 0:22:07.960 they went't right? Was that? Did that come out of 0:22:07.960 --> 0:22:10.480 the process of speaking to people like Ana McGee? Like? 0:22:10.640 --> 0:22:11.440 How did it all happen? 0:22:12.320 --> 0:22:18.400 It happened immediately in Memphis when Tom played as these mixes, 0:22:19.280 --> 0:22:24.040 we three of us, Andrew myself and Robert Young just 0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:27.200 we went in a room side rim spoke for about 0:22:27.240 --> 0:22:30.399 twenty minutes, and we came out of the room and 0:22:30.440 --> 0:22:32.959 we said to Tom, we want to start remixing some 0:22:33.000 --> 0:22:36.000 of the songs. So I think we began with Joebird. 0:22:36.200 --> 0:22:39.280 We took the horns off because we felt the horns 0:22:39.280 --> 0:22:45.040 were covering up the guitar, Robert Young's incredible filthy guitar raf. 0:22:46.320 --> 0:22:48.840 We started from there and then we started, you know, 0:22:49.040 --> 0:22:51.200 it was things were turned the guitars up, turn of 0:22:51.240 --> 0:22:54.399 drums down, turned the vocal down, you know, turn the 0:22:54.480 --> 0:22:57.760 back of vocals down, and take the horns off. And 0:22:57.880 --> 0:23:00.919 then we began doing things like we re recorded the 0:23:00.920 --> 0:23:04.919 song Big Jet Plane in Memphis with Tom producing. You know, 0:23:05.000 --> 0:23:07.639 I mean, the version on this album that had just 0:23:07.680 --> 0:23:11.119 been released is so beautiful. Why we wanted to record that, 0:23:11.200 --> 0:23:15.119 I don't know, because that song and that version of 0:23:15.160 --> 0:23:17.840 that song with that arrangement is the exact reason why 0:23:17.880 --> 0:23:20.920 we went to Memphis and work with Roger, David and Tom. 0:23:20.920 --> 0:23:24.480 In the first place, we must have been insane, maybe 0:23:24.680 --> 0:23:28.280 we don't know why. It might have been an immaturity 0:23:28.320 --> 0:23:29.760 and insecurity in our party. 0:23:29.760 --> 0:23:32.119 You know, I don't know why. 0:23:32.280 --> 0:23:36.479 So then we went back to England and Alan McGee 0:23:36.520 --> 0:23:40.359 wasn't enthusiastic, and he was normally very enthusiastic about Primo 0:23:40.440 --> 0:23:43.080 scream stuff like that. When he heard her and the 0:23:43.200 --> 0:23:46.080 son for the first time, he called me up and said, 0:23:46.080 --> 0:23:48.240