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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Bridget and you're listening the stuff Mom

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Speaker 1: never told you. Right off the bat, we have to

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Speaker 1: have a quick trigger warning. Today's episode is about sexual harassment,

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Speaker 1: sex crimes, and me too. So if that is a

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Speaker 1: tough subject for you, just know that that was what

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Speaker 1: today's episode is all about. So we've done quite a

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Speaker 1: few episodes kind of breaking down different aspects of me too, UM,

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Speaker 1: the movement in general, times Up, the Hollywood lad Legal

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Speaker 1: Defense Fund that came after UM, some various industries that

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Speaker 1: have been sort of me too on their own, and

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Speaker 1: we realized that one of the things that we hadn't

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Speaker 1: really unpacked in a longer episode was the men of

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Speaker 1: the me too movement, the men who are speaking up,

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Speaker 1: the men who are saying, yes, I was a victim

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Speaker 1: of a sex crime, I'm by a powerful person, and

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Speaker 1: I stay quiet about it, and now I'm speaking up yes,

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Speaker 1: because obviously, of course sexual harassment happens to men as well.

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Speaker 1: And we have a few examples that were kind of

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Speaker 1: kind of dominated the news for a while. One is

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Speaker 1: Brendan Fraser. In February, he went public with an allegation

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Speaker 1: that Philip Burke, a one time president of the powerful

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Speaker 1: Hollywood Foreign Press Association groped his buttocks and put his

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Speaker 1: finger in his taints in two thousand three in a

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Speaker 1: crowded area of the Beverly Hills Hotel in public view.

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Speaker 1: The violation had Fraser overcome with panic and fear. Burke

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Speaker 1: gladly related the episode in his memoir, leaving out the

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Speaker 1: finger part and characterizing the ascrab as a playful pitch.

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Speaker 1: The h f p A promised to investigate Frasier's claims.

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Speaker 1: Three months later, they showed him their proposed follow up

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Speaker 1: statement quote. Although it was concluded that Mr Burke inappropriately

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Speaker 1: touched Mr Fraser, the evident support that it was intended

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Speaker 1: to be taken as a joke and not as a

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Speaker 1: sexual advance. So basically it happened. He definitely grab your butt,

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Speaker 1: no dabt about it, But it wasn't sexual harassment. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean a joke. Yeah, it was just joke. You're

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Speaker 1: taking things too seriously. Yeah. Something that I will get

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Speaker 1: into later in the episode is how sexual harassment against

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Speaker 1: men is so often framed as a joke and so

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Speaker 1: something that is not serious, so that you shouldn't be

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Speaker 1: upset about because it was meant as a joke. And

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Speaker 1: also that reminds me of the fact that George Herbert

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Speaker 1: Walker Bush was pinching girls bottoms and then instead of

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Speaker 1: saying no, I never did that or denying it, his

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Speaker 1: camp said, yes, he did that, but it was joking.

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Speaker 1: It was a joke, not even a good joke. Do

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Speaker 1: you ask me, I'm sure they weren't laughing. Another one,

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Speaker 1: Anthony ramp who was an actor on Star Trek Discovery,

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Speaker 1: told BuzzFeed in October seventeen that actor Kevin Spacey made

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Speaker 1: a sexual advance on him and he was fourteen. He

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Speaker 1: said this happened during a visit to the then twenty

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Speaker 1: six ye old Spacey's apartment. Spacey placed rap on his

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Speaker 1: bed and climbed on top of him. Another is James Vanderbeek.

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Speaker 1: He tweeted that he had his quote as grab by.

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Speaker 1: Old are powerful men. I've had them corner me and

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Speaker 1: inappropriate sexual conversations when I wasn't much younger. I understand

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Speaker 1: the unwarranted shame, powerlessness and inability to blow the whistle.

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Speaker 1: There's a power dynamic that feels impossible to overcome. Yeah, again,

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Speaker 1: it's a good reminder that it's about power dynamics. And

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Speaker 1: it can kind of happen to anybody. Alexander Polinsky, who

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Speaker 1: used to be on Charles in Charge with actor Scott Bayo,

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Speaker 1: who I have to add is just the general scumbag. Well,

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Speaker 1: he accused Scott Bayo of sexual harassment and abuse. You know.

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Speaker 1: February and fourteenth press conference with his lawyer Lisa Bloom,

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Speaker 1: Polinsky detailed alleged misconduct by Bayo when they worked together

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Speaker 1: on the comedy from n to nineteen ninety. At the time,

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Speaker 1: Alexander was like eleven or twelve, and you know, bay

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Speaker 1: it was an adult. He alleges that Bio would use

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Speaker 1: homophobic slurs and once pulled Doni's pants on set. He

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Speaker 1: also alleged that Bio cut a hole in his dressing

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Speaker 1: room and exposed his genitals to Polinsky. I should also

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Speaker 1: point out that their former Charles in Charge co star

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Speaker 1: Nicole Eggert also detailed allegations against Scott Bayo. Yeah that's

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Speaker 1: just creepy. Yeah, it's bad, and especially I could see

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Speaker 1: it being especially scary and awful if you were just

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Speaker 1: an eleven year old kid on a Hollywood set with

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Speaker 1: an adult at the time. Now he's like completely washed up.

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Speaker 1: Scott Bayo, but at the time, like a huge actor.

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Speaker 1: You know, in the eighties, you watched Joony Loves Chachy,

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Speaker 1: Happy Days, any of those shows, Like he was a

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Speaker 1: household name. Now he's a nobody, and you know it's

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Speaker 1: pathetic and washed up. But I can only imagine how

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Speaker 1: scary that would be if you were eleven and this

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Speaker 1: big mega star was calling you homophobic slurs and pulling

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Speaker 1: down your pants. Yeah. So those are just a few examples.

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Speaker 1: Um Men can be victims and are victims of sexual

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Speaker 1: abuse too, So here's some background on that. According to

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Speaker 1: the National Alliance to End Sexual Violence, about of reported

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Speaker 1: rapes involved men are boys, and one in six reported

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Speaker 1: sexual assaults is against a boy, and one in twenty

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Speaker 1: five reported sexual assaults is against a man. As with

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Speaker 1: male sexual violence against women, sexual violence against men is

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Speaker 1: motivated by the desire to dominate and use sex as

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Speaker 1: a weapon against the victim. The majority of the perpetrators

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Speaker 1: of sexual violence against men are white, heterosexual men. As

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Speaker 1: you probably know, male rape is also really common in

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Speaker 1: prison and in the military. The latest Pentagon survey found

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Speaker 1: that six thousand, three hundred men in the military said

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Speaker 1: they were victims of sexual assault or other unwanted sexual

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Speaker 1: contact in This is something that I think I've talked

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Speaker 1: about on the show before, but one of my biggest

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Speaker 1: pet peeves is when we make a joke out of

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Speaker 1: men being raped in prison, even against people who I

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Speaker 1: don't agree with or I don't like, you know, when

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Speaker 1: they're going to jail, people are like, oh, you know,

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Speaker 1: don't drop the soap. I don't think that's funny. I

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Speaker 1: don't think the fact that our prisons are so messed

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Speaker 1: up that so many people are being sexually assaulted, people

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Speaker 1: all along the gender spectrum in is in our really

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Speaker 1: at risk for sexual assault and sexual harassment. I don't

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Speaker 1: think that's funny. I think that's a real problem, and

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Speaker 1: I hate that we've made it into a joke. And

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Speaker 1: I also hate that I see that joke from people

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Speaker 1: that I respect on the left. When we talk about

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Speaker 1: like our political foes who we don't agree with or

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Speaker 1: we really don't like politically, it seems like some of

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Speaker 1: them might be heading to prison. And I don't think

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Speaker 1: that's a funny. As much as I don't like these people,

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Speaker 1: like I'm not going to say that Paul mana for It,

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Speaker 1: deserves to be raped in jails, and as a survivor

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Speaker 1: of sexual violence, it kind of breaks my heart a

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Speaker 1: little each time someone hurls that as a joke or

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Speaker 1: that we're supposed to be you know, like, whoo if

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Speaker 1: that actually happened to Paul Manafort in prison, it would

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Speaker 1: be awful. Like, I don't think anyone, I don't think

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Speaker 1: anyone deserves that. I don't think it's funny. And I

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Speaker 1: wish that our our movies didn't use it as jokes,

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Speaker 1: and I wish that I just wish that was something

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Speaker 1: that we removed from our lexicon and least we were

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Speaker 1: dealing with it with the seriousness that it deserved. I agree.

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Speaker 1: And I know that um John Oliver did a piece

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Speaker 1: on prison and he had like a there was a

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Speaker 1: clip but montage they put together of like all of

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Speaker 1: the jokes about men getting raped in prison and one.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they were like cartoons. They're like for kids,

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Speaker 1: that this joke we're telling is in there. I mean,

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Speaker 1: obviously hopefully the kids aren't gonna get it, but the

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Speaker 1: fact that it's in there at all, it's not funny.

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Speaker 1: It's not funny. And yeah, I just wish that we

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Speaker 1: lived in a culture. I think it's all I'm going

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Speaker 1: off rails already on this one. But I think it's

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Speaker 1: related to a larger cultural attitude around sexual violence. I

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Speaker 1: think that we don't treat it with the seriousness that

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Speaker 1: it deserves. I mean, we had lighthearted comedy is like

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Speaker 1: family comedies where rape was a plot device, like the

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Speaker 1: movie Revenge of the Nerds. The funny plot point is

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Speaker 1: that he's going to rape that girl, and it's supposed

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Speaker 1: to be lighthearted, not a crime. And so I think

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Speaker 1: it illustrates a larger cultural addict you around how we

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Speaker 1: understand rape. And I think that rape and sexual violence

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Speaker 1: is so common, is so prevalent, it's such it's such

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Speaker 1: a thing that we're grappling with that our culture is

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Speaker 1: so broken that the only way we can make sense

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Speaker 1: of it is by making fun of it and making

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Speaker 1: it into an everyday joke, by literally making it quote

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Speaker 1: unquote not that bad, like, oh, it's funny, he's gonna

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Speaker 1: rape for l O L. You know. I think that's

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Speaker 1: the I think that it's a problem that has gotten

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Speaker 1: so out of hand and it's so entrenched in our

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Speaker 1: culture that we've sort of thrown up our hands and

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Speaker 1: said we'll make it part of the culture, and it

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Speaker 1: will be, you know, not something that we because if

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Speaker 1: we were dealing with with rape and sexual violence with

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Speaker 1: the gravitass that it deserves as a serious thing, we'll

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Speaker 1: be doing all the time. And I think I think

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Speaker 1: that's where things like rape jokes come from, is that

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Speaker 1: we it's so entrenched in our culture that the only

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Speaker 1: way that we know how to deal with it at

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Speaker 1: this point is by adding it to the acceptable part

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Speaker 1: of culture. And I think in this case there's also

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Speaker 1: a lot of homophobia involves definitely. Yeah. Own Cook, a

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Speaker 1: psychiatry professor at Yale School of Medicine, has been treating

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Speaker 1: sexually abuse men for more than twenty years, and she

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Speaker 1: said many of them still espoused this John Wayne mentality

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Speaker 1: if something bad happens to you, just wall it off

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Speaker 1: and don't acknowledge it to yourself or others. I think

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Speaker 1: that when you look at the examples that we just

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Speaker 1: talked about and the examples that we're gonna talk about

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Speaker 1: going forward, it becomes crystal clear why these men don't

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Speaker 1: feel comfortable to talk about what's happening to them or

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Speaker 1: what happened to them, why they feel like they need

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Speaker 1: to just walk it off, be be strong and silent,

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Speaker 1: because our culture says that strong men, they're not victims

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Speaker 1: of sexual violence. Our culture says that strong women aren't

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Speaker 1: aren't victims of sexual violence. Our culture says that if

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Speaker 1: you are a victim of sexual violence, something is wrong

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Speaker 1: with you, and in reality, something is wrong with the perpetrator,

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Speaker 1: not the survivor. And I think that men because of

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Speaker 1: our culture, I mean, this is one of those examples

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Speaker 1: where patriarchy hurts us all men and women because of

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Speaker 1: our culture. Because of hatriarchy, men who are victims of

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Speaker 1: very serious sex crimes don't even feel like they can

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Speaker 1: speak up about it. Yeah, which is a terrible, a

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Speaker 1: terrible situation to be in. New York based psychoanalyst Richard Garter,

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Speaker 1: a co founder of Male Survivors, says there's increased public

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Speaker 1: awareness of the childhood sexual abuse of males as a

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Speaker 1: result of the extensive publicity given to scandals within the

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Speaker 1: Roman Catholic Church and at Penn State University, where Jerry

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Speaker 1: Sandusky was an assistant football coach before being convicted in

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Speaker 1: two thousand twelve of sexual abuse of ten boys. Given

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Speaker 1: the reluctance of many male survivors to speak publicly about

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Speaker 1: the abuse. Gardner says it's helpful when prominent men, including actors,

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Speaker 1: music stars, and pro athletes do make that decision, that

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Speaker 1: very difficult decision, which is why we're we're talking about

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Speaker 1: Terry Crews today. Yeah, when you think about the Jerry

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Speaker 1: Sandusky stuff and the you know, Catholic Church, you hear

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Speaker 1: so much about the perpetrator, but then you don't really

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Speaker 1: hear from the ms on a lot of cases, which

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Speaker 1: again I can understand why people wouldn't be claim rain

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Speaker 1: to come forward. But when someone who is famous or

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Speaker 1: powerful or successful or whatever has a platform does come forward,

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Speaker 1: that can really can really do some good. So let's

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Speaker 1: take a quick break and we'll get we'll get into

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Speaker 1: the Terry crew situation after this quick break and we're back.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, sponsor. So you might know Terry Crews from

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Speaker 1: a couple of things. Uh. He is delightful on the

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Speaker 1: show Brooklyn nine nine, which I think just got canceled. No,

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Speaker 1: it did, but didn't got picked up. Okay, really it's

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Speaker 1: so good. I'm so behind, but it's so good. Um.

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Speaker 1: He's also in those old spice commercials. I'm sure you've

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Speaker 1: seen those, they're pretty good as well. Cruise says that

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Speaker 1: he was growthed at a party back in February by

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Speaker 1: Adam Vennett, who was the head of the motion picture

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Speaker 1: department at William Morris Endeavor and w m E. Is

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Speaker 1: one of the biggest, if not of the biggest talent

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Speaker 1: agencies in the world. They're like three major talent agencies

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Speaker 1: in the world, and it's one of them. So this

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Speaker 1: is a massively powerful, well connected person in Hollywood circles.

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Speaker 1: He represents such stars like Adam Sandler, using the word

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Speaker 1: star a little fine, Eddie Murphy, s Leicester Saloone, William Hemsworth,

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Speaker 1: and Steve Martin, so big names for the most part, hugely,

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Speaker 1: hugely well connected. On October, watching all of these women

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Speaker 1: come forward with abuse allegations with Harvey Weinstein, Cruise tweeted,

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Speaker 1: this whole thing with Harvey Weinstein is giving me PTSD

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Speaker 1: Why because this kind of thing happened to me. My

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Speaker 1: wife and I were at a Hollywood function last year

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Speaker 1: and a high level Hollywood executive came over to me

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Speaker 1: and groped my privates. Jumping back, I said, what are

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Speaker 1: you doing? My wife saw everything and looked at him

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Speaker 1: like he was crazy. He just grands like a jerk.

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Speaker 1: I was going to kick his ass right then, but

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Speaker 1: then I thought twice about how the whole thing would appear.

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Speaker 1: So basically, you know, he all all of these people

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Speaker 1: coming forward and thought I need to come forward to

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Speaker 1: which honestly applause. Like I think it's really speaks to

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Speaker 1: his character that he was so inspired by these women

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Speaker 1: coming forward that he thought I need to lend my

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Speaker 1: voice to this as well. He describes this decision as

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Speaker 1: kind of an impulse one like it wasn't something that

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Speaker 1: he ran by his manager or his publicist. He just

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Speaker 1: decided to tweet. He says, once I hit send, I

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Speaker 1: literally felt this weight come off with me. I went

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Speaker 1: back to work, I turned my phone off, and when

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Speaker 1: I came back to my phone, the world had changed.

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Speaker 1: He told Time that in a matter of hours it

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Speaker 1: would become a number one trending topic on Twitter. And

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Speaker 1: he also had a realization. I didn't check in with

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Speaker 1: my wife or my publicist or anybody. I just did it.

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Speaker 1: But in that moment I was free. Yeah, I remember that,

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Speaker 1: I remember seeing it. I'm not on Twitter very often,

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Speaker 1: so it must have been like everyone got on your ratar.

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Speaker 1: It really must have been not everyone was happy about it.

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Speaker 1: Russell Simmons, who's also allegedly a rapist because I Stick Together,

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Speaker 1: allegedly emailed Cruise telling him that he should quote give

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Speaker 1: Vin a pass um, and CRUs called that behavior out

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Speaker 1: on Twitter, saying, dear uncle Rush, no one gets a

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Speaker 1: pass We could do a whole episode and should on

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Speaker 1: Russell Simmons, I personally hate him for a lot of reasons.

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Speaker 1: But one of the reasons I hate him the most

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Speaker 1: is because actually it's not even the most. I hate

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Speaker 1: him for lasts of reasons, and they're all number one

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Speaker 1: in my heart. You can even see it in the

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Speaker 1: email that he sent to Carry Crews. I feel like

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Speaker 1: he uses his marketing and branding as this woke guy

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Speaker 1: who does yoga and wears beadd necklaces, and he uses

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Speaker 1: that to be a toxic, abusive, abuser and in the email.

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Speaker 1: So when Cruz tweeted this, he tweeted us like a

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Speaker 1: screenshot of the email that Russell Simmons sent him, like,

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Speaker 1: I mean allegedly, because who knows it could be doctored.

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Speaker 1: We have to say that for you know, legal reasons whatever.

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Speaker 1: But the email looks like gets for him. It's clearly

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Speaker 1: sort of immersed in Russell Simmons is bogus foe, I

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Speaker 1: meditate therefore I am I am better than people kind

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Speaker 1: of vibe. And it's very clear to me that he

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Speaker 1: uses that vibe as a way of being like a

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Speaker 1: toxic person, you know what I mean. And in the email,

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Speaker 1: it's like, well, who asked you? Like? Why are you

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Speaker 1: acting as the mediator between me and somebody that I

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Speaker 1: say groped me at a party. I can talk about

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Speaker 1: it if I want to talk about it. Who who

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Speaker 1: the hell are you? I think that he is sort

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Speaker 1: of seeing, at least by himself. He sees himself as

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Speaker 1: this person with this status and society to be, you know, mindful.

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Speaker 1: So in the email that Terry Crews posted on Twitter,

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Speaker 1: Russell Simmons rights, did he ever apologize? Give the age

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Speaker 1: in the past, act that he be reinstated with great love?

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Speaker 1: All things are possible. Give me a break, Russell Simmons,

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Speaker 1: go yourself. First of all, if I got this email,

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Speaker 1: I would be seething with boiling rage. So one asked

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Speaker 1: that the person that you say sexually abused you, that

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Speaker 1: groped you in public at a party, has that he

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Speaker 1: be reinstated. Are you kidding me? Second of all that

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Speaker 1: ending great love, all things are possible, go yourself and

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Speaker 1: I hate you? Like how dare he? So that's what

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Speaker 1: I'm saying, not not to make this on Russell Simmons podcast,

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Speaker 1: but clearly, I mean, I just I feel like I

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Speaker 1: have watched for many years this bogus foe. I'm wearing

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Speaker 1: a linen shirt and I've got prayer bees on. You know,

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Speaker 1: I meditated, I'm vegan. I feel like he uses this

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Speaker 1: like I just hate this sandals. That's really when it

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Speaker 1: comes down to. I have hated him for a long time.

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Speaker 1: I silently thought he was not a good person. And

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Speaker 1: I just something about something about anybody who seems to

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Speaker 1: come off it's hoholier than now. I always think they're

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Speaker 1: hiding something where they're using this as a way to

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Speaker 1: have people not call them out. And his own growing

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Speaker 1: list of abusers who say that he rapes them publicly

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Speaker 1: say this. I come out on TV and say, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he raped me, who I one percent believed, by the way,

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Speaker 1: one that's like very cruel to me, Like, oh, you're

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Speaker 1: a toxic person. To see someone like Terry Crews like,

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Speaker 1: it's not easy to be anyone who comes out against

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Speaker 1: sexual violence, but especially a man, especially a black man,

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Speaker 1: to see that and to send an email, but it's

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Speaker 1: steeped in this kind of faux lovey dovey bogus bullshit.

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Speaker 1: I think is I can't even wrap my head around it.

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Speaker 1: I think it's such a thing to do. Yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: really insidious and manipulative. So that's why I hate Russell Simmons. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: come back from my Yeah, we'll do it well. I mean,

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Speaker 1: no one would listen to him with me, But I

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Speaker 1: just I've hated him for a long time, and I've

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Speaker 1: always known something was up. You know how you just

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Speaker 1: get spidey senses about people, don't think like something about

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Speaker 1: something on the buttermilks not clean. I always sort of

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Speaker 1: knew I got a weird sense from him, and this

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Speaker 1: just really confirmed it. So back to Cruise will sign note.

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Speaker 1: So Cruise filed a sexual assault and battery lawsuit against

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Speaker 1: both Bennett and w My Cruise followed the police report

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Speaker 1: on November eight, and the l a p D launched

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Speaker 1: an investigation, but unfortunately, the statue's limitations had asked Bennett

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Speaker 1: was actually suspended from w m E. In order to

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Speaker 1: pursue his lawsuit, Crews had to submit to a mental evaluation,

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Speaker 1: which apparently is not uncommon in legal cases where the

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Speaker 1: victim is alleging some kind of emotional trauma or distress

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Speaker 1: mental about hobuation. Okay, w m E side of the

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Speaker 1: story is pretty victim blamey, and court papers submitted to

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Speaker 1: the Los Angeles Superior Court and obtained by the Hollywood Reporter.

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Speaker 1: Representatives for w m ME present the agency side of

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Speaker 1: the story. They say that though Vinnett called to apologize

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Speaker 1: to Crews after the incident, Crews did not inform senior

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Speaker 1: management of the allegations until he tweeted about it in October.

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Speaker 1: They also point to the fact that Cruz stayed with

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Speaker 1: the agency until November, which Crews has attributed to his

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Speaker 1: initial desire to quote let it go and move on,

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Speaker 1: a desire that changed after the Weinstein accusations went to public.

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Speaker 1: So basically it sounds like he didn't say anything initially

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Speaker 1: when it happened, he saw all these women coming forward,

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Speaker 1: wanted to also come or as a show of solidarity

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Speaker 1: for these women, and w m is trying to demonize him.

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Speaker 1: For that. Another really victim blaming thing that w M

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Speaker 1: is doing the accused cruise of trying to quote equate

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Speaker 1: himself with the women and men who have been forced,

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Speaker 1: sometimes repeatedly and over an extended period, to submit to

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Speaker 1: sex or endure sexual harassment to keep their jobs or

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Speaker 1: advance their careers, while the perpetrators and others who knew

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Speaker 1: about it looked the other way. So let's break that down. Basically,

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Speaker 1: what they're saying is that there's a there's a litmus

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Speaker 1: test for being sexually abused, and cruises is can you

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Speaker 1: believe this jerk is trying to pretend like he had

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Speaker 1: to go through real sexual harassment? Real sexual harassment is

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Speaker 1: Harvey Weinstein. If you're not Harvey Weinstein, you can't actually

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Speaker 1: sexually harass anybody. Basically, what they're saying is that what

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Speaker 1: he went through wasn't that bad and how dare he

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Speaker 1: compare it to what these women went through? I hate that.

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Speaker 1: It's I mean, it's bogus, it's bullshit. Yeah, it absolutely is.

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Speaker 1: Cruse w M. He has his agency after coming forward

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Speaker 1: with the allegation, but as part of the standard agency contract,

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Speaker 1: CRUZ is still required to pay w M me a

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Speaker 1: portion of his profits from any project he made while

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Speaker 1: signed with them. Quote, what business is this that you

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Speaker 1: can do something like that to another human being and

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Speaker 1: I still have to pay you? He said. Everyone feels

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Speaker 1: like that's okay, but this is not right. There are

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Speaker 1: no checks and balances, there is no one to watch you.

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Speaker 1: And given what he did to me, imagine some young

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Speaker 1: girl and an agent rapes them and they're on a

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Speaker 1: show or whatever, and they still got to pay this guy.

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Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, he makes a really interesting economic point,

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Speaker 1: which is that, you know, Cruise is a big star.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure he's got plenty of money. But if if

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Speaker 1: you were an actress who didn't have his fame or

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Speaker 1: his platform, and you were just starting out and you

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Speaker 1: I mean, trust me, I'm trying to go through this

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Speaker 1: process myself. If getting signed to a talent agency, especially

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Speaker 1: one as big as w Emmy, is a big deal.

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Speaker 1: So if you aren't just starting out and you just

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Speaker 1: got signed to a huge talent agency, you probably are thinking, oh,

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Speaker 1: things are about to happen for me a little bit.

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Speaker 1: I'm sort of leveling up in my career. But you

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Speaker 1: might still not have a ton of money. And so

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Speaker 1: if you had to pay out to that same agent

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Speaker 1: who raped you, harassed you, groped you, whatever, you probably.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it really just financially de incentivizes coming forward,

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Speaker 1: because if you don't have a ton of money because

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Speaker 1: you're not yet booking big gigs or whatever, you might think, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna have to pay this person regardless if I

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Speaker 1: get signed to another agency, which is not guaranteed, I'll

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Speaker 1: then have to be paying an agent double. That's I mean,

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Speaker 1: it just completely the economic reasoning there completely. I mean,

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Speaker 1: it just changes the game. Actually, something else that I

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Speaker 1: respect about Cruise that he goes on to say that

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Speaker 1: he thinks that these contracts should have clauses in them

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Speaker 1: where if you do something like that, the contract is null,

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Speaker 1: that you don't have to pay if someone does something

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Speaker 1: awful to you, which of course it should. Yeah. Absolutely.

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Speaker 1: That kind of reminds me of like when I hear

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Speaker 1: songs that I know, like Kesha and that dude Oh

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Speaker 1: my god, girl, don't even get me started. Once I

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Speaker 1: was at a bar and I was very drunk and

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Speaker 1: this guy was hitting on me and Kesha started playing

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Speaker 1: and this guy had been like, I mean, I probably

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Speaker 1: should hold him a buzz off, but he had been

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Speaker 1: like hitting on me all night, and I went on

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Speaker 1: this long tangent. I was like, you just don't understand

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Speaker 1: how much Kesha has been and people don't talk about

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Speaker 1: Casha like I was on my side. I thought I

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Speaker 1: was like recording the show. And then he left and

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Speaker 1: my friend, who had been like happily being hit on

428
00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:28,600
Speaker 1: by his buddy all night, was like, oh, what happened

429
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:30,800
Speaker 1: was your friend and my friend? And he said she

430
00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:34,480
Speaker 1: just wouldn't shut off about Kesha. It's like I will

431
00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:39,159
Speaker 1: never shut off about you can't stop me. Um. It

432
00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:41,840
Speaker 1: does kind of point to your problem in our society

433
00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:43,760
Speaker 1: as a whole, because it is kind of a different

434
00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:45,720
Speaker 1: world when you're talking about talent agents and stuff. But

435
00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:48,920
Speaker 1: it also is expensive, just if you experience kind of

436
00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:52,120
Speaker 1: domestic abuse or sexual abuse, getting a lawyer, going to court,

437
00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:56,400
Speaker 1: doing all that stuff, and it's it does de incentifize reporting,

438
00:22:56,480 --> 00:23:00,040
Speaker 1: and we should re examine that because it should not

439
00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,160
Speaker 1: be the case. I mean, there have been situations where

440
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,680
Speaker 1: people have been forced to pay for their own rape kits.

441
00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:09,640
Speaker 1: I mean what is that? Yes, Like, the economic realities

442
00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,840
Speaker 1: of being the victim of abuse we don't talk about,

443
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,000
Speaker 1: and we should, and somebody who is talking about it

444
00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:19,280
Speaker 1: is Terry Crews. Basically, the Senate Judiciary Committee was holding

445
00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:21,760
Speaker 1: a hearing on the Sexual Assault Survivor's Bill of Rights,

446
00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:25,120
Speaker 1: which could condify certain rights for people of reporting sexual assault.

447
00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 1: As Crews noted in his testimony, the bill would give

448
00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:30,200
Speaker 1: survivors more access to police reports, rape kit results, and

449
00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:33,159
Speaker 1: sexual assault counselors. It would also ensure that survivors have

450
00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:36,040
Speaker 1: access to government subsidized rape kits, and that rape kits,

451
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:38,800
Speaker 1: along with other forensic evidence, would be kept for the

452
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:41,560
Speaker 1: duration of the Statute of limitations, because right now it's

453
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:44,440
Speaker 1: so jankie and so messed up that people are paying

454
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:47,120
Speaker 1: for their own rape kits. Sometimes they're thrown out while

455
00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:49,440
Speaker 1: you're still going through this case. You know, we do

456
00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:52,399
Speaker 1: not have a system in this country where people who

457
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,720
Speaker 1: are survivors of sexual violence are able to expect what

458
00:23:56,880 --> 00:24:01,240
Speaker 1: I think are very basic protections. You, very very basic,

459
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,520
Speaker 1: very very basic. Yes, um and cruises testimony is part

460
00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:09,040
Speaker 1: confession about his own experiences with toxic masculinity and his

461
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:13,320
Speaker 1: own sexual harassment, and this has had an impact on

462
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,200
Speaker 1: Cruiz's work and his testimony, and Crews shared that he

463
00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:19,439
Speaker 1: had chosen to leave the Expendables franchise to take a stand.

464
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:22,080
Speaker 1: In his words, in the wake of his lawsuit against

465
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:25,119
Speaker 1: Minnett quote, the producer of that film called my manager

466
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:27,200
Speaker 1: and asked him to drop my case in order for

467
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:28,960
Speaker 1: me to be in the fourth installment of the movie,

468
00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 1: and if I didn't, there would be trouble. And he

469
00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:35,560
Speaker 1: noted that he chose to leave the production largely because

470
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 1: producer A. Vy Lerner has been protecting Bennett. The actor

471
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:41,359
Speaker 1: went on to share other ways his account has already

472
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:45,639
Speaker 1: been minimized and reiterated that sexual abuse is neither laughable

473
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 1: nor in coming. Yeah, I would if you have not,

474
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 1: I would really listen to the full testimony that he

475
00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:54,040
Speaker 1: gives because it's so moving. But here's a clip. This

476
00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:58,600
Speaker 1: past year, we have seen powerful men in Hollywood and

477
00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:05,359
Speaker 1: elsewhere finally held accountable for sexual harassment and assault. We

478
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:11,119
Speaker 1: also saw the backlash survivors based after coming forward. I

479
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:15,399
Speaker 1: wanted these survivors to know that I believe them, I

480
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:20,480
Speaker 1: supported them, and that this happened to me too. This

481
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:24,960
Speaker 1: encouraged me to come forward with my own experience and

482
00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 1: reflect on the cult of toxic masculinity that exists in

483
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:34,639
Speaker 1: our society. Yeah, I think that his words are so

484
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:37,960
Speaker 1: so powerful, and I think that I'm just I'm just

485
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 1: so grateful that he is taking a stand, and I

486
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:44,560
Speaker 1: think what he's doing is so important and it's not easy.

487
00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:47,960
Speaker 1: He's taken a lot of hits, probably financial hits for

488
00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 1: doing this, but I'm so grateful that he's using his

489
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:54,800
Speaker 1: platform is privileged to to speak up. Yeah, and we

490
00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:57,520
Speaker 1: have a little bit more to talk about with Terry Crews,

491
00:25:57,600 --> 00:25:59,879
Speaker 1: but we're gonna pause for one more quick break for

492
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:13,760
Speaker 1: word from our sponsor and Rebecca, Thank you sponsor. There

493
00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 1: are so many reasons why I think it's so important

494
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:17,760
Speaker 1: that Terry Crews is coming forwards. I wanted to just

495
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:20,720
Speaker 1: talk through some of the bigger ones. But really, this

496
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 1: could be its own podcast of toxic masculinity and male

497
00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 1: understanding of you know, sexual assault and being the victims

498
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:30,879
Speaker 1: of crimes like this could be its own thing. But

499
00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 1: I wanted to talk to some of the examples of

500
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:36,240
Speaker 1: why I think it's so important. So one the elephant

501
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:38,200
Speaker 1: in the room is that Terry Crews is this big,

502
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:42,280
Speaker 1: muscular guy. I honestly think that having someone who is

503
00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:46,720
Speaker 1: so viscerally a big, strong dude talk about being the

504
00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:50,879
Speaker 1: victim of a sex crime is just massively powerful. Hannon

505
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:54,000
Speaker 1: Geer just points us out over at the Atlantic quote,

506
00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:57,200
Speaker 1: it is difficult to overstate the visceral impact and rarity

507
00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,320
Speaker 1: of seeing a black man want a statuesque and posing

508
00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 1: as CRUs step forward to identify himself as a survivor

509
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,480
Speaker 1: of sexual assault and reject external demands if you bury

510
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:09,640
Speaker 1: his shame. Cruise has spoken at length about the tenacity

511
00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:11,879
Speaker 1: of shame, the way it embeds itself deeply into the

512
00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 1: survivor's psyches with each dismissal of their accounts. He has

513
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 1: acknowledged at his race and size render his story unbelievable

514
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,200
Speaker 1: to some that those same factors kept him from responding

515
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:24,679
Speaker 1: to this alleged assailant with violence for fear of being

516
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:27,840
Speaker 1: stereotyped as a thug or facing violence at the hands

517
00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:31,680
Speaker 1: of police. And I think that quote really unpacks it that,

518
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:35,560
Speaker 1: first of all, that someone so big and strong and

519
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:39,000
Speaker 1: muscular and beefy, that people, a lot of people might

520
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 1: not even think that he can be the victim of

521
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:43,879
Speaker 1: sexual abuse right because he's a big, strong guy. And

522
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,879
Speaker 1: that really plays into that John Wayne theory that the

523
00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:49,600
Speaker 1: psychiatrist was talking about that we talked about in the

524
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 1: top of the episode. You know that this idea that

525
00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:55,920
Speaker 1: if you are perceived as someone big and strong and powerful,

526
00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,080
Speaker 1: nothing could happen to you. So something does happen to you,

527
00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:01,119
Speaker 1: because we know it can look about than anybody, you

528
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 1: better be quiet about it, yeah, because then it's like

529
00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 1: a threat to your masculinity, how people perceive you exactly.

530
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,400
Speaker 1: And then, because Cruz is a black man, the added

531
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:19,679
Speaker 1: trauma of that initial feeling of wanting to respond with violence,

532
00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:23,040
Speaker 1: or even if he responded to by screaming, knowing that

533
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 1: because of your race, that could be deadly for him.

534
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:28,440
Speaker 1: For me, this is so powerful because I've often said

535
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 1: I feel like in this culture, if somebody cat calls

536
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 1: you or grabs your ass, it's a cool thing to

537
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:36,240
Speaker 1: do to be like, oh, then I punched him, or

538
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 1: then I sucked him. You know. I remember I remember

539
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:40,480
Speaker 1: somebody tweeting something along the lines of like, I don't

540
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 1: think I could ever be the victim of sexual violence

541
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:45,000
Speaker 1: or rape because I think I give off the attitude

542
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 1: that if you do something wrong to me, I'll slug you.

543
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 1: And I thought, well, no, I mean, it's all well

544
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,800
Speaker 1: and good to think that that if somebody grabbed your

545
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 1: ass or groped you or cat called you, that you

546
00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 1: have the perfect response, or that you punched him in

547
00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 1: the face. But that's not how it work works. And

548
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 1: I think that really does create this narrative that it

549
00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,520
Speaker 1: quote unquote doesn't happen to strong people like For for

550
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 1: so long, I thought that because I am a survivor

551
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:14,320
Speaker 1: of sexual violence, that it meant I wasn't a strong person,

552
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 1: that I wasn't a strong woman. And it's being the

553
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 1: victim of sexual violence impacted you. If you needed therapy,

554
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 1: if it was hard for you to get over it,

555
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:24,680
Speaker 1: that that meant you weren't really a strong woman. And

556
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:28,000
Speaker 1: how I mean. Emily May, who is the founder of

557
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,320
Speaker 1: an organization called Halla Back, which is an anti cat

558
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:33,880
Speaker 1: calling organization, in an interview, she talks about how she

559
00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:36,280
Speaker 1: thought that, and of course cat calling is different than

560
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:39,400
Speaker 1: like sexual abuse, but when she would be bothered by

561
00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 1: cat calling, that she would be cat called all the

562
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:44,400
Speaker 1: time and it would get to her. Initially she thought,

563
00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 1: I'm not a strong woman, because a strong woman would

564
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 1: not be bothered by this, and they would be able

565
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 1: to discol about their day and it wouldn't get them down,

566
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:53,120
Speaker 1: and so she had internalized that she was not strong

567
00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,520
Speaker 1: because this unacceptable behavior was happening to her. And I

568
00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 1: think that the way that we talk about who can

569
00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 1: and cannot become the victim of sexual violence, it's really

570
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 1: really problematic. Yeah, I agree to. And Cruz has been

571
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:12,360
Speaker 1: talking about kind of this whole toxic masculinity and manhood

572
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 1: thing for a while. His two book, manhood Had to

573
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 1: Be a Better Man or Just Lived with One is

574
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:21,320
Speaker 1: an attack on toxic masculinity. It was then that Cruz

575
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:25,160
Speaker 1: declared himself a feminist on Larry King Now. It was

576
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:27,840
Speaker 1: also the era in which he began speaking publicly about

577
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:30,320
Speaker 1: his porn addiction, his stint in rehab to treat it,

578
00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:33,520
Speaker 1: and his changing relationship to the ideas of manliness. He

579
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 1: has also spoken up about how his time as an

580
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,760
Speaker 1: NFL player has warped his attitudes on what it means

581
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 1: to be a man. So seeing a man publicly wrestle

582
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 1: with these with these topics, um is, is a really

583
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 1: beneficial thing for us to see. I think, um And

584
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 1: it's good for men to see an example of another

585
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 1: man dealing with these things, definitely, especially a man that

586
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 1: is successful, confident, powerful. You know, it's we have so

587
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:08,360
Speaker 1: many prominent examples of men not dealing with their and

588
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,320
Speaker 1: it's sort of seen as cool. You know, has a

589
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:14,600
Speaker 1: problem and refuses to get help with it, want to

590
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:17,560
Speaker 1: want to releegade, And I think what's real, what is

591
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:20,800
Speaker 1: really cool is reshaping the culture where it says no

592
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:25,360
Speaker 1: talking about your pain, talking about things that have happened

593
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:28,680
Speaker 1: to you, talking about uncomfortable systems that you yourself have

594
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 1: been complicit in. Like we should rebrand that as cool.

595
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:36,200
Speaker 1: You know, Johnny Depp being a abuser and refusing to

596
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: get any kind of help for it and still like

597
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:41,440
Speaker 1: making millions of dollars in movies, that's not cool. What's

598
00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 1: cool is someone talking about what's going on in their

599
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 1: lives and doing it frankly and helping to lead others,

600
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:52,920
Speaker 1: especially men. And UM crews had something to say about

601
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 1: that leading other men for a time, and we wanted

602
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 1: to play play a clip for you here. As a man,

603
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:03,800
Speaker 1: I was taught my entire life that I must control

604
00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 1: the world. So I use power, influence and control to

605
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 1: dominate every situation from the football field to the film set,

606
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:20,040
Speaker 1: even in my own home with my wife and children.

607
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:27,440
Speaker 1: Then in while at a party with my wife, I

608
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 1: was sexually assaulted by a successful Hollywood agent. The assault

609
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:38,920
Speaker 1: lasted only minutes, but what he was effectively telling me

610
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:43,240
Speaker 1: while he held my genitals in his hand was that

611
00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:51,360
Speaker 1: he held the power, that he was in control. This

612
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:57,880
Speaker 1: is how toxic masculinity permeates culture. As I shared my story,

613
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:02,480
Speaker 1: I was told over over that this was not abuse,

614
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:07,720
Speaker 1: that this was just a joke, that this was just horseplay.

615
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:13,280
Speaker 1: But I can say that one man's horseplay, there's another

616
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:20,280
Speaker 1: man's humiliation. Unfortunately, not everybody out there is championing Cruise

617
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:22,760
Speaker 1: as much as we are. Cruise has been very vocal

618
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,000
Speaker 1: about the fact that many people have told him to

619
00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: laugh it off, or shake it off, or ignore what

620
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:31,240
Speaker 1: happened to him at this party, and you know that

621
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:35,080
Speaker 1: I just found that to be so upsetting. Fifty Cent

622
00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:38,960
Speaker 1: posted a really bizarre Instagram post making fun of Cruise

623
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 1: before calling it a joke and deleting it. It was

624
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:44,160
Speaker 1: a bizarre meme that featured Cruise shirtless with the words

625
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:48,280
Speaker 1: I got raped my wife just watched super imposed onto

626
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:51,280
Speaker 1: the image, as well as another picture of Cruise with

627
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:54,280
Speaker 1: a rose in his mouth with the words gym time

628
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,280
Speaker 1: inexplicably in the corner of the post. So I saw

629
00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:59,960
Speaker 1: these and I thought, what it didn't make any sense,

630
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:04,200
Speaker 1: but I understood them as insulting to cruise. The photos

631
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:07,560
Speaker 1: also included a strange, tone deaf caption in which fifty

632
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:10,120
Speaker 1: Cents suggested that he would have responded to a similar

633
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:13,800
Speaker 1: situation with gun violence rather than the trepidation that Crews recounted.

634
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:17,040
Speaker 1: He posted, I emog's l o l what the fun

635
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 1: is going on here? Man, Terry? I frozen fear laughing emoji.

636
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 1: They would have had to take me to jail get

637
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:25,400
Speaker 1: the strap and so yeah, what are he's saying in

638
00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 1: that comment is if this had happened to me, I

639
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:30,640
Speaker 1: would have shot this guy and I'd be in jail

640
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:34,440
Speaker 1: right now. L O l oh. And um, guess who

641
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 1: happened to us see this post and had something to

642
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:42,320
Speaker 1: say about it? Can you guess? I think I might? Avgas? Is?

643
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:45,600
Speaker 1: This is another Russell Simmons sidebar. It is another Russell

644
00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 1: Simmons sidebar because Russell Simmons he saw this post and

645
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:54,120
Speaker 1: added a laughing face emoji. Now, as awful as that is,

646
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:57,680
Speaker 1: part of me also thinks how stupid are you? Russell? Simmons,

647
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:01,440
Speaker 1: you have lots of women who are publicly accusing you

648
00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:04,840
Speaker 1: of rape. Right now, you see a meme on Instagram

649
00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:09,400
Speaker 1: about someone who is also publicly accusing someone of sexual harassment,

650
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:13,360
Speaker 1: and you engage with the post in public. Are you?

651
00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:18,239
Speaker 1: Are you stupid? Perhaps? I mean he needs better pr people,

652
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:19,800
Speaker 1: But but when I saw that, I thought, you know,

653
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:22,759
Speaker 1: how stupid? Are you? Just such a bad look? I mean,

654
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 1: everyone knows that sexual abusers stick together, they protect each other.

655
00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 1: We have what seems to be documented evidence of Russell

656
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:35,799
Speaker 1: Simmons doing just that. And so when another prominent black

657
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:39,480
Speaker 1: professional male makes fun of Terry Crews for being the

658
00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:43,239
Speaker 1: victim of sexual harassment, you laugh at it publicly. It

659
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:46,799
Speaker 1: just it boggles the mind. It does indeed boggle the mind.

660
00:35:46,840 --> 00:35:51,440
Speaker 1: Bridget In response to this Instagram post, Cruise tweeted, why

661
00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:53,799
Speaker 1: did I just let it happen? I didn't? Why didn't

662
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 1: you beat him up? Sigh? And again, it just really

663
00:35:57,120 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 1: shows why men wouldn't want to come forward, why they

664
00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:03,000
Speaker 1: wouldn't want to report, why they would feel they need

665
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:06,799
Speaker 1: to stay silent, because people like fifty cent who are

666
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:10,960
Speaker 1: going to use their platform, they're huge platform to make

667
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:12,799
Speaker 1: fun of somebody, and even if it was a joke,

668
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 1: it's not funny. No, it's not funny. And also just yeah,

669
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:21,040
Speaker 1: I really don't understand the impulse there. I don't know

670
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:24,480
Speaker 1: why you if someone came forward with a sexual assault

671
00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:27,880
Speaker 1: thing unrelated to you, you would feel the need to

672
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 1: get involved at all, but especially in a negative way

673
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:34,960
Speaker 1: like making fun of the person who came forward. I

674
00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:40,120
Speaker 1: think that that was very foolish indeed, agreed, agreed, and

675
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 1: also foolish of Russell Simmons to leave that emoji again.

676
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:50,160
Speaker 1: You always have the option to say nothing. Could all

677
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:53,080
Speaker 1: probably use a little bit more of it, uh geor

678
00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 1: just put it really well at The Atlantic, she writes,

679
00:36:56,320 --> 00:36:59,160
Speaker 1: and the others who mocked Crews communicated their allegiance to

680
00:36:59,239 --> 00:37:03,080
Speaker 1: an idealized masculinity that they imagine to be impervious to assault.

681
00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,560
Speaker 1: Jackson and the many others who mocked Cruz communicated their

682
00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:09,719
Speaker 1: allegiance to an idealized masculinity that they imagined to be

683
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:13,000
Speaker 1: impervious to assault. Jackson has since insisted that his post

684
00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:15,680
Speaker 1: was a joke, but even so, it's purported humor would

685
00:37:15,719 --> 00:37:19,600
Speaker 1: only stem from the surprise of a strong man's victimhood Cruise,

686
00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:22,920
Speaker 1: imparting his experience of assault placed him squarely outside the

687
00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:26,160
Speaker 1: moving goalpost, rendering him weak and emasculated in the eyes

688
00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:30,319
Speaker 1: of people, most often men who refused to untether masculinity

689
00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 1: from blaze of herculean strength or aggression. For his part,

690
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 1: Cruise responded first with love for fifty cents music, then

691
00:37:37,239 --> 00:37:40,239
Speaker 1: saying he proved that quote size doesn't matter when it

692
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:43,879
Speaker 1: comes to sexual assault. So basically, what Hannah is saying

693
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 1: there is that you know, it doesn't matter if you're

694
00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:51,640
Speaker 1: a big, strong guy. It doesn't matter if you're you know, huge, tough, muscular, whatever.

695
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 1: This can happen to anybody, and people like fifty cents

696
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:58,160
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna throw him in there. Russell Simmons are

697
00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:01,360
Speaker 1: creating a culture that's otherwise. It's creating a culture that

698
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,600
Speaker 1: says only this type of person can be a victim,

699
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 1: and we know that's not true. Yes, um, anyone, anyone

700
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:10,880
Speaker 1: can be a victim. And I think it's important to

701
00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:15,719
Speaker 1: remember with stories like this that me too includes so

702
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:19,560
Speaker 1: many more than just sis women. It isn't just about them, um,

703
00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 1: anyone can be a victim of sex crime, and it's

704
00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:24,279
Speaker 1: important that we hear those stories and lift up those

705
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:28,800
Speaker 1: voices here here. So that's that's what we have to

706
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:32,400
Speaker 1: say on Terry Crews. Obviously we're gonna have to come

707
00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:37,120
Speaker 1: back for Russell Simmons spin off called I Hate You

708
00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:41,719
Speaker 1: Russell Simmons, Go for yourself. I just even even just

709
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:48,040
Speaker 1: speaking about him bothers me, I can tell well. In

710
00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 1: the meantime, before that that spin off comes out, we

711
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:57,239
Speaker 1: have some listener mail. The first one I'm gonna start with.

712
00:38:57,320 --> 00:38:59,680
Speaker 1: It's a little bit difficult for me. I one is

713
00:38:59,719 --> 00:39:03,120
Speaker 1: that I hate reading letters that just see my compliments.

714
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:06,239
Speaker 1: It's like, oh, we picked the letter that's just very complimentary.

715
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:08,360
Speaker 1: I swear that's not what this is. Um. But I

716
00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:11,320
Speaker 1: was really impressed for this letter because I really identified

717
00:39:11,360 --> 00:39:13,960
Speaker 1: with it. It's something that I admired it. I'll put

718
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,879
Speaker 1: it that way. Because this person wrote a letter sort

719
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 1: of about their past opinion. And I'm someone who you know,

720
00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:25,279
Speaker 1: has lots of opinions and I share them freely. But

721
00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:27,440
Speaker 1: when I get them wrong, it would be very difficult

722
00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:29,000
Speaker 1: for me to come back and be like, you know,

723
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,320
Speaker 1: I rethought that I wasn't. I wasn't so on the

724
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 1: money with that one, or it would be difficult for

725
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:36,880
Speaker 1: me to talk about my growth, you know in an

726
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:38,800
Speaker 1: email to someone, so I was very impressed by this

727
00:39:38,920 --> 00:39:42,799
Speaker 1: letter personally. She writes, Hey, Bridget, I want to apologize

728
00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:44,440
Speaker 1: to you for not being very open when you and

729
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:46,880
Speaker 1: Emily came on air. I hope I never said anything

730
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:48,440
Speaker 1: to hurt you, but I think I did say that

731
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:50,520
Speaker 1: I was unhappy with the show once in a Facebook

732
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:53,120
Speaker 1: Taylor Swift thread. I've been thinking about it since others

733
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:55,200
Speaker 1: told me I was wrong, and you know what, they

734
00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:57,920
Speaker 1: were right, and for that, I'm so very sorry. I

735
00:39:58,040 --> 00:40:00,239
Speaker 1: just finished listening to your episode on gas lighting. My

736
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:02,960
Speaker 1: ex husband is a narcissist and really with me. I

737
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:05,320
Speaker 1: didn't realize how unwoke I was until I started to

738
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:09,080
Speaker 1: call my quote deconstruction in January, when I started outpatient

739
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:12,000
Speaker 1: therapy and talk therapy. I see my therapist twice a week,

740
00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 1: and now she's helped me realize that what I believe

741
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:16,440
Speaker 1: before was wrong and it checked the facts. Thank you

742
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:19,880
Speaker 1: for recommending Codependent Anonymous. My therapist has been encouraging me

743
00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 1: to find the support group, and I had no idea

744
00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:24,680
Speaker 1: that existed. Most importantly, thank you for teaching me whatever

745
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:27,200
Speaker 1: what a real fighter looks like you've been through a

746
00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:29,359
Speaker 1: lot this year, and I'm so proud of you. Thank

747
00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:31,279
Speaker 1: you for making me a more open minded person. You're

748
00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:33,279
Speaker 1: both doing great work. Please keep it up because you

749
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:35,319
Speaker 1: really are changing the world one listener at a time.

750
00:40:36,120 --> 00:40:37,560
Speaker 1: So I have a lot to say about this, I'll

751
00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:40,719
Speaker 1: keep it brief, but um, thank you. You know I

752
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:43,520
Speaker 1: when I got this email, I wrestled with it for

753
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:47,520
Speaker 1: quite a bit. Um, I know that I'm feeling feeling

754
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:49,560
Speaker 1: feelings about an email when I put it on boomerang,

755
00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:51,200
Speaker 1: so it goes to the top of my inbox, I'm like,

756
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:53,320
Speaker 1: oh God, there it is again. But yeah, what I

757
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:55,640
Speaker 1: what I connected with I think about this was that

758
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:57,880
Speaker 1: I would never have the courage to send this in

759
00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:00,919
Speaker 1: an email ever. You know what I'm I would never

760
00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:04,440
Speaker 1: I would think, my ol. I still think about things

761
00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:09,200
Speaker 1: I wrote. I wrote on people's you know, reviews years later,

762
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 1: and I think, oh, I wish I like, I was

763
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:12,399
Speaker 1: having a bad day and so I took it out

764
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:15,200
Speaker 1: on somebody online or something. You know, I would never

765
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 1: think to revisit it. And so I just I was

766
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:21,200
Speaker 1: really impressed by this email, and I didn't just read

767
00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:25,680
Speaker 1: it because it's very complimentary to us, but it's very,

768
00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:32,359
Speaker 1: um touching, and it is brave because facing facing things

769
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:35,440
Speaker 1: about yourself that you're trying to work to change. I mean,

770
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:40,160
Speaker 1: that's tough. And to reach out to someone and just

771
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:43,399
Speaker 1: apologize and admit that in that moment you were wrong,

772
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:47,280
Speaker 1: it is really rave and we appreciate it. Like listeners,

773
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:50,719
Speaker 1: hearing from you, even small little things like keep up

774
00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:54,880
Speaker 1: the great work. You can't imagine how helpful it is.

775
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 1: It really is, definitely, And I have had a weird,

776
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:00,640
Speaker 1: a weird couple months. Like someone once sent me an

777
00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:03,399
Speaker 1: email that was like, literally, girl, are you okay? You're

778
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:06,359
Speaker 1: tweeting some dark? Is everything fine? Um? And I was like, oh,

779
00:42:06,360 --> 00:42:09,719
Speaker 1: I gotta I really should take a step back, since

780
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:11,440
Speaker 1: THENCE would have gotten all social media a little bit.

781
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:13,560
Speaker 1: But um, also I want to say to this email writer,

782
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:16,080
Speaker 1: she has something to really apologize for. You know, I

783
00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:20,920
Speaker 1: appreciate criticisms as well, and so you know, obviously no

784
00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:23,840
Speaker 1: apology necessary, but it just was. It just really touched me.

785
00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:26,279
Speaker 1: You know, it's touching to hear from people. And I

786
00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:30,760
Speaker 1: think every day it's so easy to believe your critics

787
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:34,680
Speaker 1: and then shoot off your complimentars. And I do that

788
00:42:34,880 --> 00:42:36,759
Speaker 1: quite a bit, and so you know you could be

789
00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:40,080
Speaker 1: having the worst day. Ever, then somebody writes in and says, hey,

790
00:42:40,239 --> 00:42:42,880
Speaker 1: thank you for this episode. It really helped me and

791
00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:45,239
Speaker 1: it does help, so I I thank you to this

792
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:49,239
Speaker 1: person who wrote in, Yes, thank you. Um to to

793
00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:55,360
Speaker 1: another topic important to arts pockets is he wrote, I

794
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:57,800
Speaker 1: also am very frustrated with the lack of sufficient pockets

795
00:42:57,880 --> 00:42:59,960
Speaker 1: in my clothes. For one pair of jeans, I really

796
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:02,480
Speaker 1: like how they fit, but they had fake front pockets.

797
00:43:02,760 --> 00:43:04,440
Speaker 1: With the help of my mom, I was able to

798
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:07,000
Speaker 1: rip the seams of where the fake pockets attached the

799
00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:10,239
Speaker 1: pants and put in my own quite large pockets. These

800
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:12,560
Speaker 1: are now my favorite pants. Every time I wear them,

801
00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 1: I am reminded that I was able to say f

802
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:17,040
Speaker 1: you to the fashion designers and make the pants actually

803
00:43:17,160 --> 00:43:19,719
Speaker 1: fit my needs. I have been meaning to extend the

804
00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,000
Speaker 1: size of the pockets and my other pants, like cutting

805
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:24,120
Speaker 1: the bottom of the pocket open and adding more fabric,

806
00:43:24,440 --> 00:43:26,200
Speaker 1: because I am always sad when it comes time to

807
00:43:26,239 --> 00:43:29,120
Speaker 1: watch my favorite jeans. I realized many folks don't have

808
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:30,920
Speaker 1: a sewing machine, but if you ask around, you can

809
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:33,600
Speaker 1: probably find someone willing to help. You don't need a

810
00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:36,400
Speaker 1: ton of fabric. So if you don't already have scrap fabric,

811
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:38,239
Speaker 1: just go to a craft store and find the end

812
00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:40,560
Speaker 1: of the bolt clearance bin and get the cheapest one.

813
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:43,560
Speaker 1: The pattern doesn't matter because it is inside your pants.

814
00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:46,560
Speaker 1: Please go make your pockets big. Your life will be

815
00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:49,640
Speaker 1: so much better. I love this Johnny apple Seed of

816
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:56,080
Speaker 1: women's pants pockets. I do too, new crafting project for me. Yes,

817
00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:59,120
Speaker 1: thank you to both of them for writing in you

818
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:01,560
Speaker 1: two can write to you is. Our email is mom

819
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:04,480
Speaker 1: Stuff at usta dot com, and you can also find

820
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:06,960
Speaker 1: us on social media or on Instagram at Stuff I've

821
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:10,120
Speaker 1: Ever Told You and on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast.

822
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:13,480
Speaker 1: Thanks as always to our producer Kathleen Quillian, and thanks

823
00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:14,680
Speaker 1: to you for listening.