1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:03,000 Speaker 1: Hey everyone, it's os Today. We're bringing you a new 2 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:07,160 Speaker 1: episode of Smart Talks with IBM. This season, Malcolm Gladwell 3 00:00:07,200 --> 00:00:10,680 Speaker 1: talks to leaders using AI and emerging technology to change 4 00:00:10,680 --> 00:00:11,320 Speaker 1: the game. 5 00:00:11,119 --> 00:00:11,959 Speaker 2: In their industries. 6 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:14,960 Speaker 1: From Heinech and using AI to become the world's best 7 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 1: connected brewer, to UFC using data to turn chaos into 8 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:23,120 Speaker 1: clarity for fans and commentators, to Cleveland Clinic using AI 9 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: and quantum computing to accelerate discovery in biomedical research. Smart 10 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 1: Talks with IBM explores how organizations are applying technology in 11 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 1: unexpected and transformative ways. New episodes drop every month wherever 12 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:40,560 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts. Learn more at IBM dot com 13 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 1: slash smart Talks. This is a paid advertisement from IBM. 14 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:50,919 Speaker 3: Hi Malcolm Glawell, and you're listening to Smart Talks with IBM. 15 00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:54,200 Speaker 3: Imagine your business depends on a system you didn't build 16 00:00:54,320 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 3: and don't fully control. For years, it works perfectly. It's fast, reliable, afordable, 17 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 3: so over time more and more of your operations rely 18 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:07,600 Speaker 3: on it. Then one day the terms change. What once 19 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:11,959 Speaker 3: felt flexible now feels difficult to leave. Moving to another 20 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 3: provider or bringing those capabilities back under your own control 21 00:01:16,440 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 3: could take years, cost millions, and disrupt the business in 22 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:26,360 Speaker 3: the process. That's the challenge of digital sovereignty. Businesses today 23 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:30,400 Speaker 3: rely on all sorts of third party systems, cloud platforms, 24 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:36,040 Speaker 3: data pipelines, AI models, software tools. Most days, these systems 25 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:40,600 Speaker 3: operate quietly in the background, but when something changes, like 26 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:44,680 Speaker 3: costs go up or rules shift, organizations are forced to 27 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:49,840 Speaker 3: confront how much control and flexibility they actually have. This 28 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:54,240 Speaker 3: is why digital sovereignty has shifted from policy concept to 29 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:57,880 Speaker 3: board level priority. So to understand the challenge up close, 30 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:03,200 Speaker 3: I traveled to Paris to Vivtech, Europe's largest technology conference, 31 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:05,920 Speaker 3: to speak with two people who think about these. 32 00:02:05,880 --> 00:02:08,400 Speaker 4: Questions every day on a Paula a. 33 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:13,280 Speaker 3: Cis, IBM's senior vice president and chair for IBM EMEA 34 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:22,320 Speaker 3: and APAC, and Giovanni Daniello, group chief Information Officer at AKSA. Hello, everyone, 35 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:28,440 Speaker 3: welcome to a live taping of the podcast Smart Talks 36 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 3: with IBM. I was downstairs in the IBM booths chatting 37 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 3: with the people who were doing the data Sovereignty presentation, 38 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:38,360 Speaker 3: and they were discussing the and I said, oh, it 39 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:43,240 Speaker 3: sounds like you're solving a headache. And the guy I 40 00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 3: was trying to said, that's all we do at IBM. 41 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:48,640 Speaker 3: We solve headaches and cure headaches, and I want I 42 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:49,920 Speaker 3: want to start out with the two of you. 43 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:53,240 Speaker 4: What is the headache in this instance? 44 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:58,200 Speaker 5: So the topic of sovereignty gained a lot of traction 45 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:01,119 Speaker 5: over the past few years, in even though I would 46 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:05,239 Speaker 5: say it really became a buzzword this year. I think 47 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 5: that this actually started during COVID, when all the supply 48 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:15,880 Speaker 5: chains became extremely stressed and companies and governments started to 49 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:18,560 Speaker 5: understand that there were a lot of choke points in 50 00:03:18,600 --> 00:03:21,520 Speaker 5: the world, right, so how can I do more ear 51 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:24,359 Speaker 5: shore in how can I guarantee that I have autonomy 52 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 5: of key elements of my supply chain? I think was 53 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:30,280 Speaker 5: really the wake up call. And then we entered in 54 00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 5: a period of unfortunately many wars happening constraining for example, 55 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:36,240 Speaker 5: energy security. 56 00:03:36,880 --> 00:03:37,920 Speaker 6: So all these. 57 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 5: Disruptions in the world led companies and governments to think, 58 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 5: what is really that I need to consider as critical 59 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:47,840 Speaker 5: for me, and how do I have better control of 60 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 5: those capabilities? And now technology being at the core of 61 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 5: the operations, I think that actually increased the need. 62 00:03:55,280 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 6: For companies to focus on sovereignty. 63 00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 5: So that is the headache given that there are so 64 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 5: many dependencies, given that we're living in a world that 65 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,120 Speaker 5: is so interconnected, how do you get autonomy, how do 66 00:04:07,160 --> 00:04:10,840 Speaker 5: you get back control making sure that you continue to 67 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:14,320 Speaker 5: operate in a collaborative ecosystem. 68 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 7: It's a difficulty equilibrium in reality, because we have to 69 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 7: take all those dimensions into consideration making sure that at 70 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 7: the same time we can continue to access innovation. And 71 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:30,719 Speaker 7: that's where the paradigm is is really very, very complicated 72 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 7: to solve. So the headache we have in AXA and 73 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:37,839 Speaker 7: then probably many large organizations in the in the world 74 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:41,360 Speaker 7: is exactly the topic in Europe at least it's it's 75 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:44,760 Speaker 7: about sovereignty exactly in the terms you are talking about, 76 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 7: and that's becoming a topic that is very there is 77 00:04:48,680 --> 00:04:51,880 Speaker 7: a there's a lot of visibility very in the agenda 78 00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 7: at very top executive level since probably it started with Coviy, 79 00:04:57,000 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 7: I agree. 80 00:04:57,440 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 2: But the last two years there's been an acceleration clearly. 81 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 6: Yeah, and I really have a few data points. 82 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 5: Today we announced a study through our IBM Institute of 83 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 5: Business Value where basically we as companies around the world, 84 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 5: So do you have visibility of your dependencies? 85 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:17,960 Speaker 3: Right? 86 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:22,679 Speaker 5: Do you know exactly where are your exposures? And only 87 00:05:22,760 --> 00:05:25,520 Speaker 5: nine percent of the companies said that they have that 88 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 5: level of visibility, and seventy one percent of the company 89 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 5: said that if they needed to switch a provider today, 90 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 5: it would be very. 91 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:36,279 Speaker 6: Difficult to do so. 92 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 5: So I think the headache this is actually shows in 93 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:41,560 Speaker 5: numbers the size of the headache. 94 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, you're in the insurance business. Speak to the specifics 95 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:52,640 Speaker 3: of your own business. Why would this be an issue that? 96 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:54,880 Speaker 3: Am I right in thinking that this is an issue 97 00:05:54,880 --> 00:06:00,479 Speaker 3: that is a specific and special concern to an insurance. 98 00:06:00,920 --> 00:06:01,680 Speaker 2: No, I don't think so. 99 00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:04,880 Speaker 7: No, No, I don't think so, because in reality, it's 100 00:06:04,920 --> 00:06:10,240 Speaker 7: an issue for organizations using technology data in AI as 101 00:06:10,279 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 7: an important driver within the activities they manage. 102 00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 2: Insurance. 103 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:17,880 Speaker 7: Of course, insurance is about data, it's about people, it's 104 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:20,560 Speaker 7: about technology, of course, so it's very very central. 105 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 2: But it's absolutely not limited to insurance. 106 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:27,080 Speaker 7: Because at the end, if we want to talk a 107 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:29,920 Speaker 7: little bit more into details, what is sovereignty Because everybody 108 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:33,159 Speaker 7: talks about sovereignty, but what is it about? And very 109 00:06:33,160 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 7: often people believe that once you know where your data 110 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:39,680 Speaker 7: are located and if you are your open company, if 111 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:42,720 Speaker 7: you have the certainty that data are located in Europe. 112 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:47,640 Speaker 7: Many people believe I'm safe, I'm sobeer incompatible. Well it's 113 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:52,559 Speaker 7: absolutely not enough. So there are models that not only 114 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:55,560 Speaker 7: we are using an accept that are also very very 115 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:58,839 Speaker 7: public on the market. Very often will refer to four dimensions. 116 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 7: Of course, allocation is number one. If you don't know 117 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:05,560 Speaker 7: where your data are, I mean, you don't know anything. 118 00:07:06,360 --> 00:07:09,320 Speaker 7: But it's not only that, I mean how do you operate? 119 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,160 Speaker 7: Who is operating the system, who is patching, who is 120 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 7: creating new versions of whatever the feature that becomes available. 121 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:22,600 Speaker 2: That's the second one. The third one is contracts, legal terms. 122 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 7: Who is in charge legally speaking of the activities we 123 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:31,280 Speaker 7: talk about, and and and the last one is the 124 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:37,280 Speaker 7: technicality itself. Who is really mastering the technical details the 125 00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:42,120 Speaker 7: underlying stack. Is it something that is European, US, China? 126 00:07:42,240 --> 00:07:45,440 Speaker 2: You know? And I mean it's it's it's known by everybody. 127 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:51,080 Speaker 7: Most of the large European companies and US companies are 128 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 7: using US technologies. So the difficulty in soeranties to scan 129 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 7: on a permanent basis the four dimensions. Making sure that it, 130 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:02,920 Speaker 7: as we're saying, anow that you know exactly what is 131 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,120 Speaker 7: exactly the situation on your business on those four dimensions. 132 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 3: Give me an example of how a specific example of 133 00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 3: what difference it would make where your data was being held. 134 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:18,640 Speaker 3: In other words, in what sense our regulatory requirements for example, 135 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:22,120 Speaker 3: different from one country to another, or from the EU 136 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 3: to North America Or is there a practical way to 137 00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:27,600 Speaker 3: kind of express those differences. 138 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:28,520 Speaker 6: Yeah, there are. 139 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:33,440 Speaker 5: Very clear regulations in many of the countries regarding what 140 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 5: type of data needs to reside inside the country, right, 141 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:44,880 Speaker 5: so particularly financial data, health data, those are really really 142 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:49,760 Speaker 5: controlled and they have to follow those regulatory requirements. So 143 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:52,760 Speaker 5: the way that we approach that in our architecture in 144 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:58,679 Speaker 5: our platform is to enforce those regulator regulatory requirements within 145 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:01,720 Speaker 5: the platform so that this is not just relied from 146 00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:05,480 Speaker 5: a contract toal standpoint, but that you ensure with governance 147 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 5: tools and with capabilities that the platform is securing that 148 00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:15,200 Speaker 5: data in compliance with those regulatory aspects. And when you 149 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:18,360 Speaker 5: think about sovereignty, it has to go beyond just the 150 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:23,880 Speaker 5: regulatory and compliance requirements. It's really understanding your business requirements. 151 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:24,760 Speaker 6: What are the. 152 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:28,520 Speaker 5: Applications that are truly mission critical and that you need 153 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 5: to ensure that have that level of control because also 154 00:09:31,679 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 5: controlling everything is not necessarily viable, not from a technical 155 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:40,199 Speaker 5: standpoint and not from a business case standpoint, right, So 156 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 5: that is the I think that is the challenge that 157 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:46,160 Speaker 5: many companies are going right now, is to have the 158 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:51,559 Speaker 5: visibility of their application mistake, how that matches the business strategy, 159 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:54,640 Speaker 5: and then making the decisions on what is the level 160 00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:56,559 Speaker 5: of sovereignty that I need to apply. 161 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:00,679 Speaker 3: Let's say I'm a naive company, I don't pay any 162 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:04,960 Speaker 3: attention to this, I have operations in any different countries. 163 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:08,560 Speaker 3: What's the worst case scenario, what's the down What's what 164 00:10:08,679 --> 00:10:12,400 Speaker 3: happens if you don't act kind of prudently around data sovereignty. 165 00:10:13,679 --> 00:10:17,160 Speaker 5: So I think the first aspect is if something happens 166 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 5: to your infrastructure that is sitting somewhere that you don't 167 00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:26,800 Speaker 5: have visibility, goes out for some reason, a war and 168 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:32,719 Speaker 5: energy blackout, any other cyber attack in your environment, if 169 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:35,040 Speaker 5: you don't have a fallback plan, if you don't have 170 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 5: a way to move that application to operate from another 171 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:41,960 Speaker 5: place that has the backups the real time data that 172 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:43,320 Speaker 5: you are accessing to your. 173 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:46,280 Speaker 6: Pretty much go out of out of operations, right. So 174 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:46,719 Speaker 6: it's a. 175 00:10:48,280 --> 00:10:51,560 Speaker 5: That's a very important question because I think it brings 176 00:10:51,679 --> 00:10:55,240 Speaker 5: the sovereignty aspect to what I believe is the strategic 177 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:59,120 Speaker 5: role that it plays. It's about resiliency, it's not about 178 00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:04,040 Speaker 5: necessarily just meeting regulatory requirements, and I think you need 179 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,760 Speaker 5: to do that from a risk management standpoint, and I 180 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 5: think an insurance company is the best position to do that. 181 00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:14,840 Speaker 5: But it's not just regulations, it's really making sure that 182 00:11:14,880 --> 00:11:18,679 Speaker 5: you have continuous operation twenty four by seven, which is 183 00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 5: pretty much what businesses need to achieve. 184 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:29,440 Speaker 7: Currrectly in some countries for insurance, for example, but not 185 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 7: only for insurance. In some countries there are obligations locally, 186 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:38,600 Speaker 7: for example, to store data in the country. So back 187 00:11:38,640 --> 00:11:41,840 Speaker 7: to your question, there's a limit to how naive you 188 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:44,520 Speaker 7: can be if you want to develop a business, because 189 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 7: that's at the heart of getting the authorization to operate 190 00:11:47,920 --> 00:11:50,360 Speaker 7: and to run your business in the countries where you 191 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:53,760 Speaker 7: would like to. But then once you are over this 192 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:58,800 Speaker 7: kind of MVP of requirements that are mandatory for you 193 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:01,439 Speaker 7: to open and operate, then of course, I mean that's 194 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 7: a good thing that an What you said is completely 195 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:04,840 Speaker 7: completely relevant. 196 00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:11,800 Speaker 3: How does how does one anticipate these issues changing over time? 197 00:12:11,840 --> 00:12:14,280 Speaker 4: In other words, you said that people are going to 198 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,000 Speaker 4: wake up to the importance of data sovereignty during COVID. 199 00:12:17,960 --> 00:12:20,640 Speaker 3: I'm just curious if we fast forward five years, do 200 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:24,440 Speaker 3: we imagine that the kind of landscape in which companies 201 00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 3: like you as you and are operating is going to 202 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:30,040 Speaker 3: get more complex or less complex? What's the what's the 203 00:12:30,080 --> 00:12:31,000 Speaker 3: movement in this? 204 00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 5: I think it's going to become more complex because AI 205 00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:38,199 Speaker 5: is really accelerating all the trends. 206 00:12:39,320 --> 00:12:41,839 Speaker 3: Why I want you to can you expect I want 207 00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:44,160 Speaker 3: you to kind of do a little deep dive on AY, 208 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:47,800 Speaker 3: what specifically is it about AI that's complicating this? 209 00:12:48,600 --> 00:12:49,920 Speaker 6: That's a very good question. 210 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:55,600 Speaker 5: AI now moves from you know, actions just being taken 211 00:12:55,679 --> 00:13:00,000 Speaker 5: from you know, somebody operating a system to the technology 212 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:03,880 Speaker 5: actually making decisions. Right, So you have to have a 213 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:09,240 Speaker 5: much better visibility of what systems AI is touching, what 214 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:13,439 Speaker 5: data it is accessing, and where, right. So you have 215 00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 5: to have that mapping much more clear because the stakes 216 00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:21,439 Speaker 5: are higher now on how technology is actually operating your business. 217 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 6: Right. 218 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:25,800 Speaker 5: So I do think that there is an acceleration because 219 00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:29,520 Speaker 5: of that. The second element, AI is going to increase 220 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:32,920 Speaker 5: the amount of vulnerabilities that are going to be either 221 00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:36,720 Speaker 5: identified or created. So you have to have an ability 222 00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:42,240 Speaker 5: to continuously monitor and scan what is happening in the 223 00:13:42,240 --> 00:13:46,400 Speaker 5: cybersecurity landscape so that you can prevent and react in 224 00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 5: a much faster way. So there are more elements of 225 00:13:49,720 --> 00:13:53,320 Speaker 5: disruption that are coming up as a result of the 226 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 5: acceleration of technology. 227 00:13:56,280 --> 00:14:01,640 Speaker 7: I can give you a concrete example. The way applications 228 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:06,600 Speaker 7: work today is pretty much deterministic. You have rules, you 229 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:09,680 Speaker 7: have data, you have processes. Very often embed it into 230 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 7: the the code, into the business logic. So these are 231 00:14:12,920 --> 00:14:16,520 Speaker 7: executed and very often if you have the same input, 232 00:14:16,679 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 7: you have the same output. And so you have I 233 00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 7: mean application with modules, you have APIs, you have data, 234 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:25,720 Speaker 7: you have you know beautiful. 235 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 2: Mobile first front ends. 236 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:28,080 Speaker 7: You know all these fancy things that we that we 237 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 7: run on the cloud or on premium whatever. So let's 238 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:34,320 Speaker 7: project yourself into a couple of years from now where 239 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:37,000 Speaker 7: the architecture is going to be agentic native. 240 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 2: With concepts such as head less applications. 241 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 7: So you will interact with kind of prompt interface and 242 00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 7: you will start asking as a customer or as an 243 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 7: employee or as a partner, you will ask interacting and 244 00:14:52,440 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 7: asking a certain number of problems to be solved, and 245 00:14:55,680 --> 00:14:58,400 Speaker 7: this is going to be given through tokens and all 246 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:02,960 Speaker 7: these all these technologies into an ecosystem of digital agents 247 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:08,960 Speaker 7: orchestrated and orchestrating activities looking at what is in the 248 00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 7: in the rug in terms of what is the process 249 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 7: telling me about how do I have to manage that? 250 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,680 Speaker 7: What kind of data do I have in my repository? 251 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 7: And you enter into something which is going to become 252 00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:22,840 Speaker 7: much more probabilistic, and you have llms there in the 253 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 7: meantime in the middle trying to get answers smart answers 254 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:30,160 Speaker 7: to queries that will come from. 255 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:31,800 Speaker 2: Specialized digital agents. 256 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:37,600 Speaker 7: So there's nothing to do with the way applications run today. 257 00:15:38,360 --> 00:15:42,240 Speaker 7: And if you look at the flow of data today 258 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:45,560 Speaker 7: that we know, we know where the data located. That 259 00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:47,760 Speaker 7: was saying you know a lot of things we know 260 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 7: and how the data is going to flow in all 261 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:54,320 Speaker 7: the directions in this Argentic native architecture. You understand that, 262 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 7: as you said, this is going to accelerate significantly and 263 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 7: the need to understand the underlying stack and architecture in 264 00:16:02,560 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 7: the sovereign the ecosystem is going to be crucial. You know, 265 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:12,040 Speaker 7: data can suddenly become public public in the way they 266 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 7: can be used to train models and a little bit 267 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:16,840 Speaker 7: of your IP step by stead of going to go 268 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:20,000 Speaker 7: into those those models if they learn if you are 269 00:16:20,040 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 7: not careful, that's what it's going to happen. Of course, 270 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:25,040 Speaker 7: there are ways to prevent that, but if you're not careful, 271 00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:28,600 Speaker 7: you can suddenly see the world around you becoming more 272 00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:30,400 Speaker 7: intelligent than you on your own business. 273 00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:34,800 Speaker 3: It seems like there's a this is a very crude 274 00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:37,640 Speaker 3: way of putting it, but there's a race going on 275 00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:41,320 Speaker 3: with the technology on running one race and then the 276 00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:44,120 Speaker 3: other race. Is our ability to kind of make sense 277 00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:47,520 Speaker 3: of it, have visibility and it integrate the technology into 278 00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 3: the way we. 279 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 4: Do our who's winning that race right now? Is it? 280 00:16:50,520 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 4: Is it hard to keep up with the technology. 281 00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:56,880 Speaker 5: That's why I think you need the technology to govern 282 00:16:56,920 --> 00:16:59,640 Speaker 5: the technology right and and and to me, that is 283 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:04,080 Speaker 5: what our proposition with this platform that we launched a 284 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,880 Speaker 5: few weeks ago called Sovereign Core, is to provide that 285 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:11,920 Speaker 5: those that tool in and those capabilities to help organizations 286 00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:15,880 Speaker 5: create those capabilities. Because what we learned already is that 287 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:19,680 Speaker 5: as your Money explained very well, the technology is going 288 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 5: to accelerate exponentially. How do you map that with that 289 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:30,200 Speaker 5: same level of speed only another technology that is going 290 00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:34,440 Speaker 5: to you know, operate at the same level of acceleration. 291 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 6: And that is. 292 00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:39,040 Speaker 5: Exactly the proposition that we have in supporting our clients. 293 00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 5: So that's the headache that you're trying to solve. 294 00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 3: Givani, do you I'm assuming you've been in this field 295 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:46,960 Speaker 3: of technology. 296 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:49,679 Speaker 2: For how many years or thirty years? 297 00:17:50,520 --> 00:17:53,400 Speaker 3: Is there any I'm curious to compare the moment we're 298 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 3: into any previous moments. So you've now lived through several 299 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,640 Speaker 3: technological uphea How does this one compare to the ones 300 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:03,560 Speaker 3: earlier in your career? 301 00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:07,399 Speaker 7: For me, this one is very clearly the one that 302 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 7: has the highest potential and in terms of speed, there's 303 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:18,920 Speaker 7: no precedent everything we've done in the past where we've been. 304 00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:20,560 Speaker 2: Trying to modernize. 305 00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:24,639 Speaker 7: Let's take a complete, complete exam modernizing business applications. We 306 00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:27,879 Speaker 7: had this discussion a couple of months ago. So like 307 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:30,959 Speaker 7: all the companies in the world, we have legacy applications. 308 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,760 Speaker 7: All the companies have legacy applications that have been written 309 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:37,879 Speaker 7: I don't know, thirty fifty years ago, and the journey 310 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 7: to modernize those applications has been the last let's say, 311 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:46,600 Speaker 7: the last fifteen years, something like very often a five 312 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:50,159 Speaker 7: years ticket. Every time you wanted to work to modernize something, 313 00:18:50,760 --> 00:18:55,760 Speaker 7: including migration and decommissioning. And every time we even a 314 00:18:55,840 --> 00:18:58,280 Speaker 7: year ago, every time we were thinking about how there's 315 00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:01,119 Speaker 7: technology out there we can go much, much, much faster, 316 00:19:01,920 --> 00:19:05,120 Speaker 7: we've always been blocked, and then we always came back 317 00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:11,080 Speaker 7: to that unit of performance of the five years. And 318 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:17,080 Speaker 7: since this year, things are become potentially feasible, because that's 319 00:19:17,119 --> 00:19:21,199 Speaker 7: the Augentic revolution, because then you can specialize agents like 320 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:25,280 Speaker 7: people in a team, to split the process into subtasks, 321 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,040 Speaker 7: and everybody is going to be very smart and intelligent 322 00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 7: in solving a part of the problem. 323 00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:31,440 Speaker 2: And then if you are good enough to. 324 00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:37,200 Speaker 7: Orchestrate that towards an outcome, which could be an application, modernization, ABC, whatsoever. 325 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:41,359 Speaker 7: Potentially I'm saying potentially, but this is now technologically we 326 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 7: see that it can work. You can do that, not 327 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:45,679 Speaker 7: any more than five years, but maybe I don't know, 328 00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 7: a year and a half, two years, maybe a little 329 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:50,760 Speaker 7: bit less. Why not, I don't know, but you see, 330 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:53,679 Speaker 7: the difference is simply huge. I've never seen that before. 331 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:55,960 Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, I agree with that. 332 00:19:56,040 --> 00:19:59,680 Speaker 5: I think the compression that you're seeing in project delivery, 333 00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:04,760 Speaker 5: new products that we are releasing, updating versions of products, 334 00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,960 Speaker 5: it's something that is absolutely unprecedented. So the base of 335 00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:13,000 Speaker 5: innovation is happening very fast. And if we think that 336 00:20:13,119 --> 00:20:17,360 Speaker 5: AI has already created a tremendous impact, let's wait for quantum, right, 337 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:21,280 Speaker 5: which is going to even take this to another level. 338 00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:24,280 Speaker 2: And the mixed the combination, the prombination of both. 339 00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:26,120 Speaker 4: Yes, it's a very. 340 00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:29,679 Speaker 3: Interesting contradiction at the core of all this, which is 341 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:36,199 Speaker 3: that intuitively, we know that innovation thrives on openness into connectedness, 342 00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:40,159 Speaker 3: you know, no border or whatever. But so datus already 343 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:45,760 Speaker 3: makes us think very specifically and often, I would imagine, 344 00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:48,280 Speaker 3: painfully about the reality of orders. 345 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:50,720 Speaker 4: How do you manage that contradiction? 346 00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:54,600 Speaker 5: I think that is really the challenge that we are 347 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:57,239 Speaker 5: all facing right now, right I don't think we have 348 00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:02,960 Speaker 5: one hundred percent clear answer yet. There are certain elements 349 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:08,680 Speaker 5: of this tack that clearly, I mean, trying to reinvent 350 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 5: is actually going to be a reinvention of the wheel, 351 00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:15,960 Speaker 5: Like I mean, I'm not going to develop chips from 352 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:19,639 Speaker 5: the scratch from scratch, for example, infrastructure from scratch, but 353 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:21,760 Speaker 5: there are other elements of the stack that I can 354 00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:23,040 Speaker 5: get much better control. 355 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:23,560 Speaker 2: Right. 356 00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:26,680 Speaker 6: So for example, to the point that you'vanni made before, where. 357 00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:30,800 Speaker 5: My data is sitting, what is the orchestration layer that 358 00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 5: I can implement so that I can bring the right 359 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:37,719 Speaker 5: player at the right time. So look at the stack 360 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,280 Speaker 5: of technology that you are implementing and see what are 361 00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 5: the elements where number one, it's feasible to achieve control 362 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:48,960 Speaker 5: and number two, I know that it's something that I 363 00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:52,199 Speaker 5: actually have to do to make my business resilient. And 364 00:21:52,280 --> 00:21:54,960 Speaker 5: focus on those, right, because if you try to address 365 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:58,119 Speaker 5: the entire stack, or if you try to create a 366 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 5: model that basic build a fortress, that's not going to. 367 00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:06,679 Speaker 6: Be even feasible for you to achieve. 368 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 5: Right, And normally say that sovereignty is not about building walls, 369 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:13,359 Speaker 5: it's about building bridges, right, It's how you really created 370 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:14,520 Speaker 5: those connections. 371 00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:17,520 Speaker 2: I like, I like the way you phrase it. 372 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:22,720 Speaker 7: That's exactly that, because at the end, if you put 373 00:22:22,760 --> 00:22:29,439 Speaker 7: sovereignty as an architecture requirement when you do design, I 374 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 7: don't say it's the it's it's it's the key to 375 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:36,439 Speaker 7: this very difficult you know, parading, but at least. 376 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 2: It's making choices easier. 377 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:44,120 Speaker 7: So, for example, if you if you don't put sovereignty 378 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:46,800 Speaker 7: as a business requirement, and you want to develop your 379 00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:50,080 Speaker 7: business in the cloud, what you are going to. 380 00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,919 Speaker 2: Do is probably look at the available features that ive 381 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:56,120 Speaker 2: features from the cloud provider. You're going to use those 382 00:22:56,119 --> 00:22:57,480 Speaker 2: features full speed to go. 383 00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 7: As fast as possible, as efficient as possible, and get 384 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,080 Speaker 7: access to all the stack innovation and everything else. And 385 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:07,239 Speaker 7: the day you have a problem, you cannot switch, or 386 00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:10,040 Speaker 7: it will take you five years and five hundred million 387 00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:10,560 Speaker 7: to switch. 388 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:12,639 Speaker 2: If you take the. 389 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:19,439 Speaker 7: Sovereignty as a requirement by design, when you want to 390 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 7: start the configuration of your stack, you ask yourself, what 391 00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 7: do I have to concretely put here as a configuration item? 392 00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:31,399 Speaker 7: If I want to be, for example, multi cloud compatible 393 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,680 Speaker 7: or multi cloud and on prem compatible, what kind of 394 00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:39,159 Speaker 7: additional technologies maybe I have to use in order to 395 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:43,720 Speaker 7: be able to I mean, do some portability of some 396 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:46,720 Speaker 7: workload from one platform to another. Not because I want 397 00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 7: to do that every day, because it makes no sense. 398 00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:51,159 Speaker 7: But if tomorrow I have a problem, I want to 399 00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:53,919 Speaker 7: be sure that by design I can I know what 400 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:55,760 Speaker 7: the process I'm going to use. What's the process is 401 00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:58,080 Speaker 7: going to use to do that portability. So these are 402 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:03,160 Speaker 7: elements that again, if you do design your architecture using 403 00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 7: those those elements, you wake up in the morning you 404 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 7: have a problem and you have no solution except spending 405 00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:14,400 Speaker 7: alpha billion euro. So that's that's that's the first point 406 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,680 Speaker 7: I wanted to make. Now the second point is if 407 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:23,080 Speaker 7: you want to turn technology into a business outcome, at 408 00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:28,440 Speaker 7: the end, you need to be very precisely activating a technology. 409 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:32,040 Speaker 7: So at the end you have to make a choice, 410 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:35,119 Speaker 7: yes I activate this feature you know, and yes I 411 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 7: use this tech provider this solution. 412 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:39,760 Speaker 2: At the end, you don't escape. 413 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,920 Speaker 7: And what it also allows to do is making sure 414 00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:50,720 Speaker 7: that in this architecture based design you also make explicit 415 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:55,800 Speaker 7: what you buy from a tech provider and what you 416 00:24:55,880 --> 00:25:00,520 Speaker 7: do yourself, and also what you do yourself for how 417 00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:03,120 Speaker 7: long because you can try a certain number of things 418 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:06,159 Speaker 7: because you are not convinced that a certain number of 419 00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:13,679 Speaker 7: technology providers out there are sufficiently cross cross cloud platforms, 420 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:16,080 Speaker 7: and and you don't want to end up into a 421 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:19,919 Speaker 7: looking situation. So you can say I don't feel that 422 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:23,520 Speaker 7: it's mature enough, so I start doing it. But it's 423 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:26,080 Speaker 7: not because you start doing it yourself, that you have 424 00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:28,640 Speaker 7: to be stuck in that strategy of doing it yourself 425 00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:32,320 Speaker 7: for fifteen years. Again, even if you start doing it yourself, 426 00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:35,560 Speaker 7: in the design of the way you do it yourself, 427 00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 7: you plan an exit door to be able to move 428 00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:41,600 Speaker 7: into a solution from a tech provider when the strategy 429 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:45,679 Speaker 7: is mature enough. So that's the difficulty, and that this 430 00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 7: is every day discussions with discipline. What I always recommend 431 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,400 Speaker 7: the teams is make the things explicit. 432 00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:58,800 Speaker 2: There's no right or wrong answer in a limited timeframe. 433 00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:02,240 Speaker 7: There is something that is today for the company and 434 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,600 Speaker 7: may not be the case tomorrow. So let's make it 435 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:08,199 Speaker 7: explicit and don't miss that that that I mean that 436 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:10,000 Speaker 7: extra work because it's extra work. 437 00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:13,040 Speaker 2: This is not something that is coming really not falling 438 00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:15,520 Speaker 2: from the sky. This is extra work. But it's worse 439 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:16,880 Speaker 2: doing this this job. 440 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:20,560 Speaker 7: To be sure that at least we are always in 441 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:26,200 Speaker 7: this equilib difficult equilibrium between accessing technologies and being sovereign 442 00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 7: compatible by design. 443 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,320 Speaker 5: Just to stress you saw that Jovan used the word 444 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:34,240 Speaker 5: by design all the time, right, because I think that 445 00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 5: intentionality is probably what's different from what we saw in 446 00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:41,000 Speaker 5: the past on how companies were adopting innovation, It was 447 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:46,359 Speaker 5: very much driven by convenience and speed, and now you 448 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:52,000 Speaker 5: have to have convenience, speed and intentionality and understand that 449 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,840 Speaker 5: you know, you have to have visibility on the decisions 450 00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:59,200 Speaker 5: you're making, and you have to keep your choices more open. 451 00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:02,080 Speaker 3: It was curious when you describe the kind of challenges 452 00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:03,840 Speaker 3: that come along with data sovereignty. 453 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:08,440 Speaker 4: This is also the way that two of you work together. 454 00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:09,440 Speaker 4: So I can. 455 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,359 Speaker 3: Companies Insurance have been working with IBM, I imagine for 456 00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:17,760 Speaker 3: as long as they've been insurance and as long as 457 00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:20,880 Speaker 3: they've been IBM. But I mean, in this particular iteration, 458 00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 3: are we altering the nature the relationship. 459 00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:28,880 Speaker 5: Before I go specifically to the partnership with as, I'm 460 00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:30,879 Speaker 5: going to give an example of what you're doing with 461 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 5: another company, which I think illustrates very well the intention, 462 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:38,520 Speaker 5: the objective and the challenge. 463 00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:38,760 Speaker 2: Right. 464 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:42,520 Speaker 5: So we have a partnership with Locale as well, right, 465 00:27:42,560 --> 00:27:45,119 Speaker 5: which is the cosmetics company. And they were like, okay, 466 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 5: foundational models, large language models. 467 00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:49,240 Speaker 6: Are super powerful. 468 00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,920 Speaker 5: Right, But I invested one hundred years in my company 469 00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:58,000 Speaker 5: to build knowledge about building formula for cosmetics. Right, I 470 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,920 Speaker 5: don't want to give that expert is that knowledge away? 471 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:06,440 Speaker 5: So I want to train my own my own foundational model. 472 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:08,919 Speaker 6: They are not going to do the. 473 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:13,160 Speaker 5: Entire stack of training by themselves, so they partner with us. 474 00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:16,719 Speaker 5: We provide research, We provide tooling that allows them to 475 00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:20,080 Speaker 5: bring their data and create their own model based on 476 00:28:20,119 --> 00:28:24,160 Speaker 5: an open source pre trained a model. So these are 477 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 5: the types of you know, challenges that companies are facing. 478 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:31,679 Speaker 5: And to my point prior what is really critical, to 479 00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:34,280 Speaker 5: the point that you don't want, you know, a third 480 00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:38,360 Speaker 5: party to have visibility or access to And when it 481 00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:42,440 Speaker 5: comes to the to the relationship with ACTS and many 482 00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 5: other of our clients, I think number one is transparency. Right, 483 00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:51,640 Speaker 5: they totally understand how our technology operates. What are the 484 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:55,040 Speaker 5: you know, what are the elements that are part of 485 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:57,880 Speaker 5: our architecture that are going to connect with their systems, 486 00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,479 Speaker 5: and trust becomes really a fundamental element. 487 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 6: Jovanni said. 488 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:04,920 Speaker 5: There are things that I'm going to build, there are 489 00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:07,200 Speaker 5: things that I'm going to buy, So who am I 490 00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 5: going to buy from? Does this company really understand sovereignty 491 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,520 Speaker 5: by design? It's part of the way that the architecture 492 00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 5: their solutions. I think those are the elements and I 493 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,840 Speaker 5: think that's why this discussion is so important right now 494 00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:24,320 Speaker 5: because it also levels the playing field for us. Right 495 00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:27,760 Speaker 5: at IBM, we have always been a company focused on 496 00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:30,960 Speaker 5: technologies for the corporate world. 497 00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:35,840 Speaker 6: To really implement mission critical workloads. So I think now. 498 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:38,600 Speaker 5: People understand why we approach things the way we approach 499 00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:42,680 Speaker 5: and why hybrid cloud, you know, giving companies the ability 500 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 5: to access multiple providers either on prem or in the 501 00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:51,200 Speaker 5: public domain. Why we have approached our technologies in that 502 00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:55,720 Speaker 5: characterization is because we are starting to see the challenges 503 00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:59,719 Speaker 5: of not having a multi cloud. Hybrid cloud strategy can 504 00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 5: act actually imply to your business. So I think that 505 00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 5: this is really what changes for us now we have 506 00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:09,360 Speaker 5: we we are much more conscious on the risks and 507 00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:12,880 Speaker 5: those have to be considered when you are making technical decisions. 508 00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:17,960 Speaker 2: Yea, I think in contact remre with with what you said. 509 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:21,520 Speaker 7: That's that's that's at the heart of the relationship between 510 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:24,800 Speaker 7: company like accesle and and and. 511 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,160 Speaker 2: A strategic partner technology partner. 512 00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:32,640 Speaker 7: If if that understanding is not there, there is no 513 00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:35,120 Speaker 7: way we are going to rely on that strategic partner 514 00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:42,120 Speaker 7: to build whatever future strategic orientation and and and it's 515 00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:45,920 Speaker 7: true that today we have a large variety of technologies 516 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:50,680 Speaker 7: running in production as an insurance company. Like banks, we 517 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:55,120 Speaker 7: have mainframes running a lot of a lot of business. 518 00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:58,320 Speaker 7: But at the same time we are full speeding the 519 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 7: AI transformation. We have finished the cloud migration and being 520 00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:07,000 Speaker 7: able to understand the full stuck again, that's what is 521 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:08,080 Speaker 7: absolutely critical. 522 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:13,560 Speaker 3: I had asked you earlier about was there anything particular 523 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:17,560 Speaker 3: about the insurance business when it came to this question. 524 00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,000 Speaker 3: I want to come back to that a little bit, 525 00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:24,040 Speaker 3: because you know, you've both of you have talked about 526 00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:30,240 Speaker 3: trust and transparency. Our trust and transparency pretty core considerations 527 00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,000 Speaker 3: for insure, I mean, much more so than someone that 528 00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:35,080 Speaker 3: yeah making you know, handkerchiefs. 529 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:39,160 Speaker 4: Talk a little bit about Can you revisit that question? 530 00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 7: Yeah, of course, I think you have a very good 531 00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 7: point if I look at the notion of trust. As 532 00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:48,920 Speaker 7: you said, insurance is about trust, the noble purpose of 533 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:49,880 Speaker 7: an insurance company. 534 00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,000 Speaker 2: That's what I repeat every time I have the opportunity. 535 00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,160 Speaker 7: You know, I'm so happy every morning when I wake 536 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,800 Speaker 7: up because I know what I'm waking up. 537 00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:58,480 Speaker 2: AX is there. 538 00:31:59,360 --> 00:32:06,640 Speaker 7: To help families, companies, individuals when they face real difficulties. 539 00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:08,520 Speaker 2: You know why you wake up every morning. 540 00:32:08,560 --> 00:32:12,640 Speaker 7: You know what is why it's difficult and this implies, 541 00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:15,760 Speaker 7: as you said, the notion of trust. So of course 542 00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,080 Speaker 7: for us what it means, it means one, we need 543 00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:22,920 Speaker 7: to make sure you were talking about data healthcare data. 544 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:23,800 Speaker 2: And your initial intervention. 545 00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:27,760 Speaker 7: We need to make sure indeed we know perfectly exactly 546 00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:32,240 Speaker 7: where our data are stored and what kind of data 547 00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:35,600 Speaker 7: we talk about, where is it sensitive data health data, 548 00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:38,680 Speaker 7: because we need to overprotect that in order to make 549 00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:42,480 Speaker 7: sure that data that we have for our customers are 550 00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:44,600 Speaker 7: not going to be made public. You know, that's our 551 00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:47,360 Speaker 7: duty to do that. It's again a notion of trust. 552 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:51,240 Speaker 7: Our customers trust that we do that. Insurance companies are 553 00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:55,120 Speaker 7: long term companies, and if you don't have trust anymore, 554 00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:58,120 Speaker 7: I mean, we're simply out of business. So data is 555 00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 7: an important topic. But at the same time we talked 556 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:06,200 Speaker 7: about cyber You know, we have a very very strong 557 00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:12,960 Speaker 7: cyber team and cyber security practice that we use both 558 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 7: of course to protect AXA like many organisms. I mean 559 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,720 Speaker 7: we all do that, of course, but also to help 560 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:22,280 Speaker 7: our customers protect themselves. 561 00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:24,360 Speaker 2: And we have also used our. 562 00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:30,440 Speaker 7: Skills to develop insurance products for companies to protect them 563 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:34,040 Speaker 7: against cyber risks. So that's also our duty to say 564 00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:36,560 Speaker 7: not only we develop those skills, but we also give 565 00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:40,400 Speaker 7: that skill back via an insurance product to our customers 566 00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:41,120 Speaker 7: because we want. 567 00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:42,160 Speaker 2: To help them. 568 00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:46,479 Speaker 7: And then, of course back to the notion of trust itself, 569 00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:49,160 Speaker 7: if those elements are there at the end, what we 570 00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,600 Speaker 7: believe as an insurance company, and I agree with you 571 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:55,360 Speaker 7: this is valid for the insurance sector in general, is 572 00:33:55,400 --> 00:34:00,479 Speaker 7: that if we continue to demonstrate then to do that 573 00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:07,520 Speaker 7: very seriously, our customers continue to have a lot of 574 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:11,560 Speaker 7: trust in us, and probably with the air revolution, the 575 00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,560 Speaker 7: ones who will be able to be better, if I 576 00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:16,640 Speaker 7: can use that word, will be the ones who will 577 00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:20,080 Speaker 7: be able to continuously demonstrate that they can they always 578 00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:24,720 Speaker 7: deserve the trust that they received from from from their customers. 579 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,480 Speaker 7: So yes, of course this is specific. I mean the 580 00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:30,520 Speaker 7: specific to the insurance sector. Probably things also such a 581 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:34,879 Speaker 7: you know, pharmaceutical companies, you know things activities where it's 582 00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:37,400 Speaker 7: very very sensitive. 583 00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:39,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, that that's clear. 584 00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:42,200 Speaker 3: Let me ask a question an other way and maybe 585 00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:47,960 Speaker 3: Honor you can jump in here. These considerations might differ 586 00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:50,840 Speaker 3: from industry to industry, but can you what about from 587 00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:54,720 Speaker 3: big to small? Are is this a more pressing issue 588 00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:58,640 Speaker 3: for a multinational than it is for a startup. 589 00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:02,840 Speaker 5: I think that this is this this applies to all 590 00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:06,280 Speaker 5: all the companies, right, especially because they startups from today 591 00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:09,280 Speaker 5: are not like the startups from the past. Right, everybody 592 00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:12,879 Speaker 5: is scaling so fast, right, You're you're seeing companies going 593 00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:16,160 Speaker 5: from zero to billion in like months in the current 594 00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:20,200 Speaker 5: in the current world, all these startup startups in general, 595 00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:24,839 Speaker 5: they operate in a global in a global footprint. So 596 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:28,160 Speaker 5: if I am a startup going into the let's say 597 00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:32,600 Speaker 5: the healthcare, right industry, I'll need to follow the regulations, 598 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 5: even if I'm a very small startup, right. So I 599 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,960 Speaker 5: do think that probably what is happening now is that 600 00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:45,520 Speaker 5: this applies to different sizes, different industries, probably some more 601 00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:48,440 Speaker 5: regulated than others. And going back to the point of 602 00:35:48,480 --> 00:35:52,040 Speaker 5: Giovanni on insurance, I think insurance is probably the industry 603 00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:57,160 Speaker 5: where this is much more visible, because insurance is about 604 00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:00,480 Speaker 5: pricing risk, right, and how do you price risk based 605 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:04,000 Speaker 5: on knowledge, based on probabilities? And that's all data, right, 606 00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:08,720 Speaker 5: So data is their product, I would say. But every 607 00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:11,920 Speaker 5: company now will have to be watching those aspects because 608 00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:15,120 Speaker 5: as they scale, even if they are small, they'll need 609 00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:17,920 Speaker 5: to be meeting those requirements. 610 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:21,040 Speaker 3: If you were to chat with a founder who's just 611 00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:24,800 Speaker 3: starting out, came to you and said, what should I 612 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:25,799 Speaker 3: be doing about data? 613 00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:26,280 Speaker 2: Sovereignty? 614 00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:28,759 Speaker 3: Should what should I get right on day one? What 615 00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:29,640 Speaker 3: would your advice be? 616 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:32,880 Speaker 5: I think now it's much easier because when you're starting 617 00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:36,960 Speaker 5: from scratch, you can really design your solutions and your 618 00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:41,640 Speaker 5: applications already with all that in your mind, right, So 619 00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,280 Speaker 5: all the points that you're going to made before by design, 620 00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:48,319 Speaker 5: this is how you're going to design upfront. Understand what 621 00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:52,480 Speaker 5: industry are operating in. Understand what are the implications of 622 00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:56,920 Speaker 5: the data that you're manipulating, Map the risk and the 623 00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 5: critical mission applications that you're going to develop. Make sure 624 00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:04,880 Speaker 5: that those are really like sovereign to the core, and 625 00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:07,000 Speaker 5: you know, start the execution. 626 00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:09,840 Speaker 7: We have not been talking a lot about that, but 627 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:14,239 Speaker 7: if I look at Europe now, for example, encryption is 628 00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:19,279 Speaker 7: very critical. When you talk sovereignty, everything you said is 629 00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:23,520 Speaker 7: absolutely correct. But that's an advice I would give is 630 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:27,160 Speaker 7: make sure, for example that the management of the keys 631 00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:31,520 Speaker 7: is yours is yours, and do that from day one. 632 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:36,800 Speaker 7: Don't do that because when you do encryption, very often 633 00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:40,800 Speaker 7: That's what I was saying earlier. So you have native services, 634 00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:42,920 Speaker 7: for example coming from the cloud providers, and you can 635 00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:48,120 Speaker 7: encrypt using the native services, and this toward the keys 636 00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,720 Speaker 7: of course that have been used to do this encryption, 637 00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:56,200 Speaker 7: and it's very comfortable. You can go very you can 638 00:37:56,239 --> 00:38:01,120 Speaker 7: be very fast, but you lose control M and so 639 00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:04,280 Speaker 7: that's that's a very simple trick that in the design 640 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:08,520 Speaker 7: very often now comes on a regular business to pay attention. 641 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:12,640 Speaker 7: Of course, you can use the services, but again storing 642 00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:16,840 Speaker 7: the keys, the keys are yours, so then nobody can 643 00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:19,880 Speaker 7: access your data. 644 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:20,880 Speaker 4: This is a really. 645 00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:23,799 Speaker 3: Interesting theme that I'd love to sort of end on, 646 00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:27,520 Speaker 3: which is it seemed like there was a moment in 647 00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:30,000 Speaker 3: the evolution of technology where the trend was in the 648 00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:33,160 Speaker 3: other direction that I was, you want to do outsources 649 00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:35,440 Speaker 3: as much as you could and just focus on a 650 00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,160 Speaker 3: few things. But now you're talking about the importance of 651 00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:39,120 Speaker 3: taking back control. 652 00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:41,160 Speaker 4: Is that? Am I right? 653 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:44,319 Speaker 3: Is this a shift across a number of different dimensions 654 00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:45,920 Speaker 3: when it comes to technology right now? 655 00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:46,359 Speaker 2: Yeah? 656 00:38:46,480 --> 00:38:50,440 Speaker 5: I think technology now is so core to the business, 657 00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:55,080 Speaker 5: is so central to the strategy that you really have 658 00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:58,760 Speaker 5: to take it like any other major component of your 659 00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:02,440 Speaker 5: supply chain. And to me, that's the reason why we 660 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:06,520 Speaker 5: have this wake up moment where people understand that I 661 00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:08,680 Speaker 5: need to put much more control, I need to have 662 00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:10,120 Speaker 5: much more visibility. 663 00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:16,239 Speaker 2: The regulation itself is also creating, in a way the 664 00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:19,040 Speaker 2: obligation for us for. 665 00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:22,680 Speaker 7: Certain activities to have those activities back under our control. 666 00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:27,560 Speaker 7: For example, if I look at DORA regulation, what is 667 00:39:27,600 --> 00:39:32,959 Speaker 7: DORA regulation telling you? Understand your key business processes, map 668 00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,960 Speaker 7: those key business processes to your underlying technology. 669 00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:39,480 Speaker 2: Check where you have concentration risks. 670 00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:44,680 Speaker 7: Mapping again starting from your very critical business processes. And 671 00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:50,000 Speaker 7: once you've identified the areas where you have concentration, which 672 00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:59,880 Speaker 7: is normal, plan strategies, right strategies, test strategies on reversibility 673 00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:01,319 Speaker 7: and so this is. 674 00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:06,799 Speaker 2: A couple of years ago. We were doing that on 675 00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:08,440 Speaker 2: I would. 676 00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:12,440 Speaker 7: Say, just when we were feeling that something in a 677 00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:16,120 Speaker 7: specific area of the architecture was a little bit strange. 678 00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:17,719 Speaker 2: Then we were doing a deep dive. 679 00:40:18,200 --> 00:40:21,080 Speaker 7: And we were very often arriving at the conclusion that 680 00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:25,839 Speaker 7: probably there we need to change something. Let's change the technology, 681 00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:30,520 Speaker 7: create more portability and bring the thing under control. But 682 00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:33,919 Speaker 7: it was really sporadic, you know, it was not systematic. 683 00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:38,680 Speaker 7: With the regulation now it's mandatory. We are as an 684 00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:42,600 Speaker 7: insurance company, we have to demonstrate every year we do 685 00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:46,160 Speaker 7: the job. So you see, I think you are totally 686 00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:48,719 Speaker 7: right in saying that we need to make sure we 687 00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:51,840 Speaker 7: have a certain number of activities back under our control. 688 00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:56,120 Speaker 7: But it's not only us deciding that. I think it's 689 00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:59,239 Speaker 7: also regulations forcing us. And from that perspective at to say, 690 00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:00,560 Speaker 7: this was a very good initiative. 691 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:02,520 Speaker 4: So that. 692 00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:09,279 Speaker 3: When you started, Giovanni and you're in this field, you 693 00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:12,840 Speaker 3: were probably either down the hall or on another floor, 694 00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:13,840 Speaker 3: and now. 695 00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:14,359 Speaker 2: You have to be. 696 00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:17,160 Speaker 4: Directly in the C suite. 697 00:41:17,239 --> 00:41:19,640 Speaker 3: I mean, these are it's over the course of your 698 00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:23,760 Speaker 3: career you've probably gone from being marginal to being essential, 699 00:41:24,200 --> 00:41:26,920 Speaker 3: which is very fascinating. I'm wondering did you Did you 700 00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:30,399 Speaker 3: anticipate that transformation a. 701 00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:33,680 Speaker 7: Little bit, yes, because I've always been convinced that in reality, 702 00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:39,480 Speaker 7: the more the world was going to modernize and digitize, 703 00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:44,680 Speaker 7: the more the technology was going to be inevitable. But 704 00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:49,080 Speaker 7: again I was I've not anticipated the speed of the 705 00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:52,279 Speaker 7: current description that I've not anticipated. You know, I was 706 00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:55,640 Speaker 7: thinking about some of the statements that I was making 707 00:41:55,719 --> 00:42:01,040 Speaker 7: five years ago, announcing that a certain number of elements 708 00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:03,920 Speaker 7: we're going to upen probably you know, five two time 709 00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:07,600 Speaker 7: years time frame. In the meantime it's over. We have 710 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:11,840 Speaker 7: already another disruption, you know. And I'm not talking fifty 711 00:42:11,880 --> 00:42:14,880 Speaker 7: years ago. I'm just talking five years or ten years ago. 712 00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:16,960 Speaker 2: So yeah, I. 713 00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:19,040 Speaker 7: Always had that feeling that technology was going to be 714 00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:20,600 Speaker 7: really critical. 715 00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:23,239 Speaker 2: But I have to be honest and not honest, not 716 00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:24,440 Speaker 2: that the level it is today. 717 00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:28,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, the irony of this conversation is that I over 718 00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:30,480 Speaker 3: the I've been a journalist for several decades and I 719 00:42:30,520 --> 00:42:34,879 Speaker 3: realized a few months ago that my data, in which 720 00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:38,400 Speaker 3: case is just interviews, you know, interview tape and transport, 721 00:42:38,760 --> 00:42:41,680 Speaker 3: was scattered across a million different places. So I did 722 00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:43,480 Speaker 3: my own version of this, and I hired a twenty 723 00:42:43,520 --> 00:42:46,200 Speaker 3: one year old to sit in my hope and physically 724 00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:49,000 Speaker 3: go through all my old archives. I'm doing my own 725 00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:51,960 Speaker 3: version of Malcolm Data. Sovereignty is going on this summer 726 00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:53,680 Speaker 3: a lot less elaterate. 727 00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:55,960 Speaker 6: Good practice, good practice. 728 00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:56,839 Speaker 4: Yeah that's good. 729 00:42:57,239 --> 00:43:00,760 Speaker 3: But thank you very much for joining us on Smart 730 00:43:00,760 --> 00:43:04,319 Speaker 3: Talks at IBM, and good luck and thank you all 731 00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,000 Speaker 3: out there for coming and listening. 732 00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:08,279 Speaker 4: Thank you, thank you. 733 00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:15,680 Speaker 3: Smart Talks with IBM is produced by Matt Ramano, Amy Gains, McQuaid, 734 00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:20,240 Speaker 3: Trina Menino and Jake Harper. Engineering by Nina Bird Lawrence 735 00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:25,720 Speaker 3: Mastering by Sarah Braguer, music by Gramoscope, Strategy by Cassidy Meyer. 736 00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:29,800 Speaker 3: Smart Talks with IBM is a production of Pushkin Industries 737 00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:34,520 Speaker 3: and Ruby's studio at iHeartMedia. To find more Pushkin podcasts, 738 00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:39,319 Speaker 3: listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 739 00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:43,320 Speaker 3: listen to podcasts. I'm Malcolm Gladwell. This is a paid 740 00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:48,239 Speaker 3: advertisement from IBM. The conversations on this podcast don't necessarily 741 00:43:48,320 --> 00:44:01,720 Speaker 3: represent IBM's positions, strategies, or opinions.