1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:02,520 Speaker 1: This is Kelly Henderson and you're listening to the Velvet 2 00:00:02,640 --> 00:00:05,280 Speaker 1: Edge Podcast. This week on the podcast, my guest is 3 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:08,800 Speaker 1: author Mary Laura Philpotts. She is an incredible author and 4 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:11,760 Speaker 1: has recently written a memoir titled I Miss You When 5 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: I Blink. I met Mary Laura while we were both 6 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: being interviewed on another podcast, and while I listened to 7 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:20,960 Speaker 1: her talk, I had this overwhelming thought of man, I 8 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:23,840 Speaker 1: just want to be her friend. Her down to earth, 9 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:26,960 Speaker 1: humor filled approach to some of life's hardest seasons was 10 00:00:27,080 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: so refreshing to me and something that might sometimes overly 11 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 1: serious mind really needed that day. I Miss You When 12 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:36,880 Speaker 1: I Blink is a book about reinvention. No matter where 13 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 1: we are in life, we are all susceptible to reaching 14 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:41,239 Speaker 1: those moments where we have all that we could have 15 00:00:41,280 --> 00:00:44,320 Speaker 1: ever dreamed of, and maybe even more, yet we feel 16 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:48,000 Speaker 1: incredibly empty inside. Mary Laura says these times are not 17 00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:50,760 Speaker 1: times to blow up your life. Instead, we talked through 18 00:00:50,760 --> 00:00:54,200 Speaker 1: ways that she defeated her hardest season of reinvention, what 19 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 1: she learned from all of it, and how she continues 20 00:00:56,720 --> 00:01:02,240 Speaker 1: to reinvent. Now here's our conversation. Okay, so you're an 21 00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 1: author's I feel like I need to do a little 22 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:08,319 Speaker 1: character developed and I needed, ok okay to the character. Okay, 23 00:01:08,319 --> 00:01:10,080 Speaker 1: so we're gonna start with that. So you know how 24 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:13,640 Speaker 1: people say we are human beings, not human doings. Yes, 25 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: but I was reading your bio and I'm like, holy shit, 26 00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 1: she's a like big human doing like you've done a lot. Well, 27 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:24,560 Speaker 1: you've read the book, so you know that's true. Character 28 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 1: like I am only I only have a sense of 29 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 1: piece when I'm doing a lot. So I am a 30 00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:35,040 Speaker 1: like died in the wool work alic and and I 31 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:37,120 Speaker 1: will change a lot of things about myself. I have 32 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:39,680 Speaker 1: changed a lot of things about myself, but I am 33 00:01:39,680 --> 00:01:41,679 Speaker 1: self aware enough to know that will never change. I 34 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,920 Speaker 1: do always just a little too much. And that just 35 00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:47,520 Speaker 1: seems to be where I where I am content, where 36 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:49,800 Speaker 1: you feel comfortable. Well, let's talk about some of the 37 00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 1: things you've accomplished. So your writing has been featured in 38 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:57,360 Speaker 1: The New York Times, the Washington Post, the Los Angeles Times, 39 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:01,960 Speaker 1: McSweeney's The Parents were really the Paris Review. Let me 40 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:05,520 Speaker 1: try that again, Oh, the Oprah Magazine. I mean that one. 41 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:08,440 Speaker 1: To me, I'm like, that is goals. And you've had 42 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:11,799 Speaker 1: a ton of other publications too. You're the founding editor 43 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,359 Speaker 1: of Musing, the online magazine for is It Parnassis is 44 00:02:15,560 --> 00:02:18,959 Speaker 1: always Bok Parnassis Books, as well as the Emmy winning 45 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: co host of the literate literary interview show A Word 46 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:27,399 Speaker 1: on Words, which is on Nashville Public Television. And you've 47 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,720 Speaker 1: done all this while having a family with a husband 48 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:33,920 Speaker 1: and kids and dogs and dogs. I didn't know about 49 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:39,680 Speaker 1: the dogs. They're the worst. They take up the most time. Yeah. Wow. 50 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 1: And now so this is what, like we talked about 51 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:44,600 Speaker 1: the human doing, but this is what I think is 52 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 1: so cool about you. You've now written a book kind 53 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 1: of about the human being parts of you. Yeah, and 54 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 1: the human undoing. Yeah. And look about that. Yeah, I have. 55 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:58,680 Speaker 1: So it's called I Miss You When I Blink, which 56 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:01,880 Speaker 1: it's amazingly honest. I laughed out loud multiple times. By 57 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 1: the way, you shouldn't know that. It's a group of 58 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:08,080 Speaker 1: essays about your life, your struggles, but also your resolve 59 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 1: and the solutions you've kind of come to through the 60 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 1: years and what you've learned from all these imperfect experiences. 61 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:16,720 Speaker 1: That's a good summary. Thank you, thank you, thank you 62 00:03:16,760 --> 00:03:20,880 Speaker 1: for the elevator. Pitch. I'll send you that later seeking 63 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:22,919 Speaker 1: use it. But so, what made you decought to get 64 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:27,520 Speaker 1: here and do this to write this book. Well, what's 65 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 1: interesting is that when I talk about kind of what 66 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:34,080 Speaker 1: I where this book fits in the literary world, and 67 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 1: where this book fits in people's lives, why I have 68 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:40,440 Speaker 1: it in my hands and why I'm going around talking 69 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:43,120 Speaker 1: about it now is different from why I started writing it. 70 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 1: I started writing it purely to see if I could, 71 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 1: if I could write enough essays that stuck together and 72 00:03:51,240 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 1: made a pile that could be bound into a book. 73 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 1: Essays or what I write there, what I've I've always written, 74 00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:57,080 Speaker 1: and I usually published them one at a time, and 75 00:03:57,200 --> 00:03:59,760 Speaker 1: newspapers and magazines that kind of thing. And a few 76 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 1: years ago I thought, you know, I wonder if I 77 00:04:01,440 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 1: could get like twenty or thirty of these things, because 78 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:06,600 Speaker 1: they're short, I could I could publish that as a book. 79 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 1: At the time, did not know what they would be about, 80 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:11,760 Speaker 1: because I never know what I'm writing until i've written it. 81 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:14,360 Speaker 1: I sit down thinking I'm writing about one thing, and 82 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:18,119 Speaker 1: then five hours later I've written something completely different. Um, 83 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:21,359 Speaker 1: So it wasn't until I was well into writing the 84 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:23,599 Speaker 1: stack of essays that became this book, that I saw 85 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:25,960 Speaker 1: what I was doing, and what I was doing was 86 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 1: telling stories that in the beginning I thought were just 87 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:33,120 Speaker 1: unrelated personal stories from my life, funny stories, sad stories. 88 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:35,919 Speaker 1: But what I was doing was going back and revisiting 89 00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:39,560 Speaker 1: the question and the issue of reinvention again and again, 90 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 1: and how I became kind of the perfectionist person that 91 00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:47,960 Speaker 1: I turned into, and then what that did to my life, 92 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 1: and how I was able to change my life. But 93 00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 1: I could see these patterns repeating as I wrote about 94 00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:55,599 Speaker 1: different times in my life. So now when I go 95 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: out and I and I talked about this book, I'm 96 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:02,359 Speaker 1: talking about it because I'm happy to have produced a 97 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 1: narrative about reinvention that is different from the blow your 98 00:05:07,120 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 1: life all the way up kind. But I didn't know 99 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:11,840 Speaker 1: that's what I was doing when I started. Even the 100 00:05:11,880 --> 00:05:14,400 Speaker 1: way you're saying that the reinvention that sounds a lot 101 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:17,240 Speaker 1: better than a midlife crisis. I hate the term mid 102 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 1: life crisis. First of all, I hate the term midlife same. 103 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:24,160 Speaker 1: It's just frompy it's old, it's plus, I mean, nobody 104 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 1: knows how long they're going to live, so it's an 105 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: inaccurate term probably for most of us. I can get 106 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 1: hit by a bus on my way out of here 107 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 1: and then guess what midlife was my early twenties life, right, 108 00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:38,960 Speaker 1: So that's a problem. Um. But I also I fully 109 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 1: believe and I know everyone is different, and there probably 110 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:45,920 Speaker 1: are some people who live forty fabulous years and then 111 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:49,360 Speaker 1: have a giant hiccup and then move on with forty 112 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:52,000 Speaker 1: more fabulous years, and I guess that's a midlife crisis. 113 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: But for me and for so many of my friends, 114 00:05:55,600 --> 00:06:00,479 Speaker 1: there have been these decision points or breaking points that 115 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:03,719 Speaker 1: have happened at all different ages, really kind of starting 116 00:06:03,720 --> 00:06:05,400 Speaker 1: when we got to adulthood, like we got out of 117 00:06:05,440 --> 00:06:08,839 Speaker 1: school and we entered this now we are independent adults phase, 118 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 1: and roughly every five years or so we seem to 119 00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:16,800 Speaker 1: run into some kind of decision tree where we have 120 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:19,960 Speaker 1: to figure out what we're going to be next. So 121 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:23,480 Speaker 1: I feel like reinvention happens more commonly on a recurring 122 00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:27,800 Speaker 1: scale than on the kind of stereotypical blow up your 123 00:06:27,800 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 1: life when you're forty kind of thing, right, and you 124 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:33,239 Speaker 1: actually say there are other solutions than blowing up your life, 125 00:06:33,240 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 1: which I love. What Elizabeth Gilbert, who I'm a huge 126 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 1: fan of what she wrote about the book. She said, 127 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:44,359 Speaker 1: Mary Laura Philipot is a writer, artist, and creator of 128 00:06:44,360 --> 00:06:46,919 Speaker 1: a singular spark in delight. I adore her and I 129 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 1: love her work. Thank god she has finally written a memoir. 130 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:54,479 Speaker 1: By offering these dispatches from her own life experience, she 131 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 1: leaves us thinking about ourselves, where we've been, where we 132 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 1: are going, and who we really want to be. I 133 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:02,760 Speaker 1: love her. Oh my gosh. Right, and I don't know 134 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:04,279 Speaker 1: when people are going to be listening to this, but 135 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:05,840 Speaker 1: I would just like to say that as we are 136 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:08,239 Speaker 1: speaking right now and recording this episode, it is Liz's 137 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 1: fiftieth birthday today. So happy birthday list. Oh my gosh, 138 00:07:11,800 --> 00:07:13,800 Speaker 1: happy birthday list. I don't know you, but I love you. 139 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:16,840 Speaker 1: They're a huge fan. Um, So I kind of want 140 00:07:16,840 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 1: to break this down. I want to talk about let's 141 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:21,720 Speaker 1: talk about where we've been, because in the book you 142 00:07:21,760 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 1: talk a lot about what you mentioned, your perfectionism and 143 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,800 Speaker 1: your O c D. I love the chapter about the 144 00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:33,800 Speaker 1: perfect murder weapon. So when I when I started writing 145 00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 1: these essays, I told myself, I'm not going to write 146 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,000 Speaker 1: too much about childhood because who cares about you, know, 147 00:07:38,040 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 1: who wants to read about some kid in the eighties. Um, 148 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:43,360 Speaker 1: But there is a small section at the beginning where 149 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: I do write about childhood, and I kind of couldn't resist. 150 00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:49,200 Speaker 1: There were things I couldn't write about an adulthood without 151 00:07:49,240 --> 00:07:52,360 Speaker 1: kind of tracing backwards and going away. When did that start? 152 00:07:52,840 --> 00:07:57,320 Speaker 1: And I can see starting in childhood this um desire 153 00:07:57,360 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 1: I have to get everything right. And you know, we 154 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:01,800 Speaker 1: can talk about that later if you want. But a 155 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:03,960 Speaker 1: lot of that came from sort of my academic childhood 156 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 1: and my parents, and or it didn't might just be 157 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,400 Speaker 1: in my d n A. But what that grew into 158 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:11,280 Speaker 1: as an adult was not only kind of a serious 159 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:15,480 Speaker 1: desire to live my life right, but also a really 160 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 1: silly and ridiculous compulsion to get the right answer, even 161 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:24,640 Speaker 1: on things that are none of my business. Like I like, 162 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 1: I can't watch a crime show. I can't. I never 163 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:29,560 Speaker 1: could watch c S I because I would watch the 164 00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 1: show and the whole time I would be like sweating 165 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,679 Speaker 1: and stressing out, like, oh, that's not the place to 166 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:37,079 Speaker 1: hide that knife. They're going to find it. And then 167 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:39,040 Speaker 1: the show would end, and you know, they always catch 168 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:41,320 Speaker 1: the purp at the end, and I would lie awake 169 00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:43,240 Speaker 1: in bed, going, oh, he could have gotten away with 170 00:08:43,280 --> 00:08:45,679 Speaker 1: it if he had just taken the knife and thrown 171 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:48,960 Speaker 1: it in the ocean, or you know. I did not 172 00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:51,720 Speaker 1: not to give spoilers away, but I do decide in 173 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:54,440 Speaker 1: the course of this essay that the perfect murder weapon 174 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:59,080 Speaker 1: is an icicle. Because it melts, there would be no 175 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:01,640 Speaker 1: c s I, there be no law in order. Every 176 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:04,400 Speaker 1: murder would be doable and you could get away with 177 00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 1: it if everybody just stabbed people with Isaac with a 178 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 1: really sharp bicycle and then it melts, there's no fingerprints. Like, 179 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:12,959 Speaker 1: this is what my brain does. It wants to solve 180 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 1: even like questions like what is the because you have 181 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:17,320 Speaker 1: to get it right. I gotta get it right. I 182 00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:20,240 Speaker 1: need order, I need the right answer all the time. Yeah. 183 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:23,320 Speaker 1: And then there's a story about how that's kind of 184 00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 1: affected your relationships, even with friends talking about the dinner 185 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:29,199 Speaker 1: and you were like, okay, texting your friend, We've got 186 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 1: to be on time. Yeah she wasn't. Yeah, it's I like, 187 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:36,080 Speaker 1: timeliness is definitely part of the wanting things to always 188 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:38,320 Speaker 1: be right and wanting you know, we're gonna meet our goal. 189 00:09:38,559 --> 00:09:40,640 Speaker 1: Twelve of us are going to go out for somebody's 190 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:43,640 Speaker 1: thirty fifth birthday and we're going. Our reservation is at seven, 191 00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 1: and you know, I tell the story about my friend 192 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:47,560 Speaker 1: coming to pick me up, and she picked me up 193 00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:49,760 Speaker 1: at like seven oh five, so we were already late. 194 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:51,679 Speaker 1: And this is when I lived in Atlanta, when it 195 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:53,600 Speaker 1: you know, it takes an hour to get anywhere, it's 196 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:57,959 Speaker 1: like living in l A. And and I was so anxious. 197 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:01,680 Speaker 1: And my anxiety about being late came from a good place. 198 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 1: It came from a place I want us to have 199 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:05,560 Speaker 1: this wonderful dinner, and I wanted to start on time. 200 00:10:05,600 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 1: And I want to respect the restaurant they're just holding 201 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: our table, and I want to respect the birthday girl 202 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 1: who was waiting. But it came across as my just 203 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:17,840 Speaker 1: being an asshole and and nagging my friend and being like, oh, 204 00:10:17,880 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 1: you need to hurry, red light, and and what I 205 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:24,160 Speaker 1: did instead of, you know, instead of making a great evening, 206 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 1: which is what I wanted, I just made her mad 207 00:10:26,200 --> 00:10:27,960 Speaker 1: at me and made everyone else mad at me. And 208 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,400 Speaker 1: I can I can look back at so many times 209 00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 1: and go, oh gosh, I had such good intentions, But 210 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 1: I really came across as extremely annoying and trying to 211 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:39,440 Speaker 1: get everything perfect right. I mean, I I don't identify 212 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:42,760 Speaker 1: with the time thing as much, but one that perfectionism, 213 00:10:42,760 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 1: and it's it's like this anxiety that you cannot shut off, yeah, 214 00:10:47,400 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 1: no matter what. And people like people who are not 215 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 1: that way. And I I probably have more friends who 216 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 1: do have a touch of anxiety and a touch of 217 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:57,320 Speaker 1: wanting to be right than who don't. But I do 218 00:10:57,440 --> 00:10:59,240 Speaker 1: have some who are just the most laid bad people 219 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:00,880 Speaker 1: in the world, and they're lovely to be friends with. 220 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:03,120 Speaker 1: But they have said to me over over the years, 221 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:06,520 Speaker 1: you know, can't you just let it go? Let's staff go. 222 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:08,720 Speaker 1: And I think part of what I was doing and 223 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: writing this book that I didn't realize I was doing 224 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 1: until I was finished, was trying to write the answer 225 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:15,599 Speaker 1: to that question, why can't you let it go? I 226 00:11:16,400 --> 00:11:21,199 Speaker 1: can't let things go because if you trace this all 227 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: the way back to where it came from, there is 228 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:27,679 Speaker 1: a hardwired part of me that started super early that 229 00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 1: believes I have to do things right and be successful 230 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:36,400 Speaker 1: in order to earn love, and in order to earn 231 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 1: the oxygen I breathe, to prove my right to exist, 232 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:42,960 Speaker 1: I need to be right all the time. See, that's 233 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:45,960 Speaker 1: where I actually think childhood is super interesting. You said, Oh, 234 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:47,679 Speaker 1: nobody want to want to hear about that, But that's it, 235 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 1: Isn't it fascinating? And when you trace back to all 236 00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:54,120 Speaker 1: your steps or your experiences, it really does shape the 237 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:56,600 Speaker 1: person you are. But I do love what you say 238 00:11:56,640 --> 00:11:59,839 Speaker 1: when you're like or I would have been that way anyway, right, 239 00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:02,840 Speaker 1: because we both we all are. If you have a sibling, 240 00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:05,760 Speaker 1: you can look at the two people raised in the 241 00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:08,880 Speaker 1: same house totally different responses that utterly different people. Yeah, 242 00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:10,360 Speaker 1: I have a brother who's a couple of years younger 243 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: than I am, and you can tell that we're related. 244 00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 1: We both have like a really weird sense of humor, 245 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:18,040 Speaker 1: and there's threads about us that are similar. But he 246 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:21,960 Speaker 1: doesn't have this, um the super type a anxiety. And 247 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 1: he grew up right there next to me in the 248 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 1: same house. So you know, when I tried to figure 249 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 1: out where did this come from? I can I could 250 00:12:31,760 --> 00:12:34,079 Speaker 1: do the thing that everybody always does in their memoirs 251 00:12:34,080 --> 00:12:35,760 Speaker 1: and the people always do on talk shows and go, well, 252 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 1: you see, it came from my mother. Um. And I 253 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 1: have an essay in the book called Wonder Woman, which 254 00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:44,520 Speaker 1: is named for my wonder woman backpack. Um where I say, Okay, 255 00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:47,040 Speaker 1: let's try it. Let's go back to the earliest memory 256 00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:49,560 Speaker 1: I have of being this god to get it right, kid, 257 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:52,000 Speaker 1: And I can trace it back to the spelling bee 258 00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 1: and my mom wanting me to win, and my seeing 259 00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:58,400 Speaker 1: my mother's face when I won the spelling be and 260 00:12:58,400 --> 00:13:01,880 Speaker 1: she was smiling, and I got this extra love and 261 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 1: approval that no one else got, and that that must 262 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,160 Speaker 1: be where it came from. That's where I learned that 263 00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 1: I have to get things right to be loved. So 264 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:13,120 Speaker 1: therefore everything I hate about myself as my mother's fault. 265 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:15,839 Speaker 1: And then I start the essay over. I tell it again, 266 00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:19,720 Speaker 1: I tell the same story, and I say, or everything 267 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:22,600 Speaker 1: I love about myself is to my mother's credit. My 268 00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 1: mother is the one who believed in me. My mother 269 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:28,000 Speaker 1: is the one who saw what I thought were the 270 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:30,920 Speaker 1: natural limits of my mind and and knew I could 271 00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:34,760 Speaker 1: do more and pushed me harder. And without her confidence 272 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:37,839 Speaker 1: in me, and without her encouragement and her being my cheerleader, 273 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 1: I wouldn't have accomplished all that I've accomplished. I wouldn't 274 00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:43,040 Speaker 1: have done as well as I did in school and 275 00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 1: in college and earned the kinds of jobs and things 276 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:48,720 Speaker 1: that I have in life. So actually it's all to 277 00:13:48,800 --> 00:13:52,840 Speaker 1: my mother's credit. And really both of those things are 278 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:55,319 Speaker 1: kind of true, and neither of those things is really true. 279 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:58,120 Speaker 1: I love that that both the two things can be 280 00:13:58,120 --> 00:14:00,720 Speaker 1: true at the same time. Though, like it is your experiences, 281 00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:02,640 Speaker 1: it's also the way you're wired. And you can't really 282 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:06,240 Speaker 1: put the blame on any one person, and you can 283 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:10,600 Speaker 1: look at it either negatively or positively. Right, you say, 284 00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:12,600 Speaker 1: now that you are a parent, you would never blame 285 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:18,680 Speaker 1: a parent for anything, I mean really like abject abuse. Yes, 286 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:23,000 Speaker 1: but it's so hard and there's no way to do 287 00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:25,920 Speaker 1: it right. And it's because it's so hard you're just 288 00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:28,280 Speaker 1: guessing all the time, or maybe other people aren't. I 289 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:30,400 Speaker 1: feel like I'm guessing all the time. I am. I 290 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 1: hope I'm doing life right. Um, And you just don't 291 00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:37,240 Speaker 1: know the effects of what you do as a parent 292 00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:40,760 Speaker 1: don't show up for so long. So I can see 293 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:43,560 Speaker 1: now I have two children and they are now teenagers. 294 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:47,440 Speaker 1: So I had them very young, and um, I can 295 00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:52,120 Speaker 1: see now sort of blossoms of seeds that I planted 296 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:56,120 Speaker 1: when they were little. But I couldn't have told you then, oh, 297 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: I'm doing this and this is going to turn out 298 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:01,520 Speaker 1: this way. So the whole like everything that's wrong with 299 00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 1: me is my parents fault. I don't want to I 300 00:15:04,120 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 1: don't want that to be the way we all live 301 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:07,520 Speaker 1: our lives. It's not fair because I don't want it 302 00:15:07,520 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 1: to come back to me. That's what I was going 303 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 1: to say. And also it's so funny. I was laughing 304 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 1: so hard at the part where you were like, you know, 305 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:15,960 Speaker 1: you're you're resolved to the situation with your mother, who 306 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:18,760 Speaker 1: was a little bit hardcore. Maybe you say when your 307 00:15:18,800 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 1: kids get home from school, you say, how is lunch? First? 308 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:24,280 Speaker 1: Before like what did you accomplish to kind of thing? 309 00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 1: I don't say what did you make on your math tests? Exactly? 310 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:28,000 Speaker 1: And I started this when they were teeny little, like 311 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 1: when they were in preschool. I decided that the first 312 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 1: question I would ask every day was, um, what did 313 00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:35,320 Speaker 1: you have for lunch? And I don't know why that's 314 00:15:35,320 --> 00:15:36,920 Speaker 1: what I landed on, Like it must have just been 315 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:38,400 Speaker 1: the thing I said that day, and I was like, great, 316 00:15:38,400 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 1: I'm gonna go with that so instead and I still 317 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:42,840 Speaker 1: do it now they're in high school and instead of 318 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:46,000 Speaker 1: saying you know, how did you do on that English project? 319 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:47,560 Speaker 1: I say, what did you have for lunch? And they're 320 00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:50,080 Speaker 1: probably gonna you know, in twenty years right, a memoir 321 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:54,040 Speaker 1: that's like I have issues with food and obsession with lunch, right, 322 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 1: and it's all my mother's fault because every day she 323 00:15:57,280 --> 00:16:02,040 Speaker 1: made me feel like it really mattered. Why can't wait 324 00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:05,160 Speaker 1: for lunch? Just can't wait at that one meal? It's 325 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 1: all about lunch. In therapy, all they do is talk 326 00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:12,160 Speaker 1: about lunch. But here's what's so interesting about you in 327 00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:15,520 Speaker 1: general in this book to me was you do have 328 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:19,120 Speaker 1: this background, this and you talk about openly your perfectionism 329 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:21,240 Speaker 1: and your O c D. And it got you to 330 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:23,800 Speaker 1: accomplish a lot like we talked about. And then you 331 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: had this amazing life and you have you have the 332 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:29,160 Speaker 1: business stuff, you have the husband, you have the kids, 333 00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: you have the dogs that I just learned about. Um, 334 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 1: so you have all those things and then you wake 335 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:38,920 Speaker 1: up and you're like not satisfied after you thought you 336 00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: should be satisfied. What was that? Like? What part of 337 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 1: that that was there was being the kind of person 338 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 1: that I am and that a lot of people I 339 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:50,680 Speaker 1: know are where you like to live life according to 340 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:53,040 Speaker 1: having goals and meeting your goals and going Okay, these 341 00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 1: are the things I am going to do with my life. 342 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 1: I began adulthood not with an literal checklist, like I 343 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:01,680 Speaker 1: didn't actually have a list of like get a dog, 344 00:17:02,040 --> 00:17:04,439 Speaker 1: find a guy, get married. You know, it wasn't like that. 345 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:05,960 Speaker 1: But I did, in the back of my mind have 346 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 1: conscious certain like this is what adults do. They they 347 00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:13,520 Speaker 1: buy a home that is made of bricks, because that's 348 00:17:13,520 --> 00:17:16,679 Speaker 1: what the Three Little Bigs taught us. And you when 349 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:20,160 Speaker 1: you marry somebody and you have children, and you pursue 350 00:17:20,200 --> 00:17:22,639 Speaker 1: your career and you do balance, because that's what we do. 351 00:17:22,720 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 1: Now we have it all. And I and I did 352 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:30,720 Speaker 1: these things really almost almost like unmomentum, Like there was 353 00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:32,840 Speaker 1: a there's a period of like fifteen years of my 354 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:36,640 Speaker 1: adulthood that was just like a runaway train, a good 355 00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:39,280 Speaker 1: runaway train, like I found the guy, we had, the 356 00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:41,840 Speaker 1: one baby, we had the next baby, we bought the house, 357 00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:45,359 Speaker 1: we bought the next house. We you know, I moved 358 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 1: from doing full time work in the corporate world to 359 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,320 Speaker 1: freelance writing. This is all going great. I was checking 360 00:17:51,359 --> 00:17:54,879 Speaker 1: all the boxes and because the equation that had always 361 00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:59,000 Speaker 1: worked for me growing up was if you succeed, you 362 00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:03,520 Speaker 1: will be I didn't feel happy I was. I kept 363 00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:05,399 Speaker 1: going with that, like I gotta succeed, I gotta do 364 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:06,760 Speaker 1: all these things and that's how I'm going to feel 365 00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:09,640 Speaker 1: loud and feel happy. And it was jarring to me 366 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:12,919 Speaker 1: and really kind of catastrophic when I got And I 367 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:14,919 Speaker 1: think this happens to people at different times, but for me, 368 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:17,760 Speaker 1: a really kind of hit mid thirties where I looked 369 00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:21,159 Speaker 1: up and went, I actually am not so happy in 370 00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 1: the daily existence I'm living, Like if you actually look 371 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:26,600 Speaker 1: at my waking hours and how I'm spending my time, 372 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:31,840 Speaker 1: I dislike more than I like about my life, which 373 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:35,280 Speaker 1: is unsettling because this life is exactly as I designed it. 374 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 1: And if you're the kind of person who likes to 375 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 1: get things right and who feels like I gotta gotta 376 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:43,960 Speaker 1: make it work, um to say, I made all these 377 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:46,719 Speaker 1: decisions and they were the right decisions, but now I 378 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:55,520 Speaker 1: feel all wrong. That's just it's mind blowing. It's catastrophic. Well, 379 00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:58,240 Speaker 1: so what did you do? Because this is what I did? Like? 380 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:02,200 Speaker 1: Is that call this? Uh? What you? What? Did you 381 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,679 Speaker 1: call it? An identity crisis? In some way. Um, but 382 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:09,240 Speaker 1: you say, you know, you think these happen maybe multiple 383 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: times throughout people's lives and you don't have to go 384 00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:15,439 Speaker 1: blow up your life. Yeah. Well, so there was a 385 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:17,720 Speaker 1: book that I read around this time in my life 386 00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:20,520 Speaker 1: that was life changing for me. And it's it's actually 387 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:22,960 Speaker 1: a business book. This is dorky, but I'm married to 388 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:26,320 Speaker 1: this wonderful, uh, the very smart business person, and so 389 00:19:26,359 --> 00:19:28,119 Speaker 1: he's got all these shelves of business books and I 390 00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:31,480 Speaker 1: pulled this office shelf one day. It's called Decisive and 391 00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:35,080 Speaker 1: it's by these uh pair of nerds, these brothers, Chip 392 00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:38,919 Speaker 1: Heath and Dan Heath, and it's about business and how 393 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:42,080 Speaker 1: when you um, when you have a tough business decision 394 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:45,000 Speaker 1: to make, the human brain loves a dichotomy. So the 395 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: human brain loves to go, well, it's either choice A 396 00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:50,800 Speaker 1: or choice B. Like let's say you have a difficult employee. 397 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:55,639 Speaker 1: Either I gotta fire him or he's got to be 398 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:58,680 Speaker 1: better at what he does, Like these are the only options, um. 399 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,360 Speaker 1: When in fact, in most sch suations, if you're creative 400 00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:03,320 Speaker 1: about it, there's an option C and an option D. 401 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:05,240 Speaker 1: And you know what, maybe you take that guy. Maybe 402 00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 1: he's in the wrong role. With the company and maybe 403 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:10,159 Speaker 1: we need to put him here. And um, I read 404 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:13,520 Speaker 1: that book and it was part of a process of 405 00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:18,199 Speaker 1: my realizing maybe there are ways I can change my 406 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:22,680 Speaker 1: life that would make it a happier life, and maybe 407 00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:25,520 Speaker 1: it's not just these two these two options that immediately 408 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:28,280 Speaker 1: popped a mind, which are either you know, dig my 409 00:20:28,320 --> 00:20:30,000 Speaker 1: heels in and smile and be happy and make it 410 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,120 Speaker 1: work because I made these decisions and now I'm stuck 411 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:34,200 Speaker 1: with them, and if I'm a successful person, I've got 412 00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:38,879 Speaker 1: to succeed at everything I've chosen. Or option B, you know, 413 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:42,080 Speaker 1: pull them under the tusk and sun and run away 414 00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:45,000 Speaker 1: from my life and go to Italy, or you know, 415 00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:47,120 Speaker 1: put on a backpack and change my name and hike 416 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,000 Speaker 1: a trail in South America or something. There are a 417 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 1: lot of narratives like that out there, the whole blow 418 00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:54,399 Speaker 1: up your life thing. Um they always work out on 419 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:56,920 Speaker 1: the movies that they work out on their fabulous and 420 00:20:57,080 --> 00:20:59,119 Speaker 1: to be honest, I love all those stories and I 421 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:02,560 Speaker 1: actually read I read every single one during this time 422 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:04,639 Speaker 1: of my life because I was kind of trying to 423 00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:07,879 Speaker 1: mentally try on different solutions, like I'm trying to do 424 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:11,160 Speaker 1: identity crisis right, let's here Exactly. I was like, now 425 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:13,080 Speaker 1: I've got to do my research on how to have 426 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 1: a breakdown. Should I have a breakdown like Cheryl straight 427 00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:21,280 Speaker 1: and wild? Should I have a breakdown like Elizabeth Gilbert? Exactly? 428 00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:25,879 Speaker 1: Like breakdown? Should I model my breakdown after um? Which, 429 00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:28,480 Speaker 1: first of all, is why I love books and why 430 00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:31,160 Speaker 1: I love memoirs. Telling our stories and putting them out 431 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:33,720 Speaker 1: there so that we can, you know, have them as 432 00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:36,720 Speaker 1: models that one another can follow, is wonderful. But what 433 00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:40,400 Speaker 1: I ended up finding was there were changes I could 434 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:43,359 Speaker 1: make that change my life to some degree, but that 435 00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:46,440 Speaker 1: didn't completely blow it up. There were things I wanted 436 00:21:46,480 --> 00:21:50,000 Speaker 1: to keep. I wanted to keep my family. I played 437 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:51,840 Speaker 1: with the idea I shouldn't say played with that sen 438 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:54,639 Speaker 1: so casual, but I thought about, you know, if I'm miserable, 439 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:57,639 Speaker 1: is it partly my husband's fault? Should I ditch this 440 00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:01,440 Speaker 1: whole marriage? For most people, right, you go to what's 441 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:03,399 Speaker 1: closest to you and think, well, if I'm doing that 442 00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:06,359 Speaker 1: and I'm miserable, it must be their fault, right, you know, 443 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:08,679 Speaker 1: if that's the person who's been here all along, somehow 444 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:12,439 Speaker 1: they must be responsible for why I feel terrible. Um, 445 00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:17,080 Speaker 1: there's a common narrative out there that motherhood kind of 446 00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:20,760 Speaker 1: ruins lives and that if you're a creative person but 447 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:23,120 Speaker 1: you've had children, they must be dragging you down and 448 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:25,439 Speaker 1: that's the reason you haven't realized all your dreams, and 449 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:28,080 Speaker 1: which I kind of thought about that that it is 450 00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:32,040 Speaker 1: not true for me. Um. So I've I've found things 451 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:35,800 Speaker 1: I could change, like number one, where I lived at 452 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 1: the time. I was living in Atlanta, which is a 453 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:41,200 Speaker 1: wonderful city. It may be the right city for many 454 00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:45,400 Speaker 1: many listeners, it was not the right place for me anymore. 455 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:48,800 Speaker 1: I did not have around me the kind of creative 456 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:51,720 Speaker 1: community that I have learned I really need to feel 457 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:54,959 Speaker 1: not lonely and to feel like I'm part of something bigger. 458 00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,879 Speaker 1: I did not love the way I was spending a 459 00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 1: lot of my time, which was in traffic, because the 460 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 1: traffic is miserable there. Um. There was a lot about 461 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 1: it that wasn't working for me, and I felt stuck 462 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:10,120 Speaker 1: because there was also a lot about it that did work. 463 00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:11,920 Speaker 1: I had a ton of friends in Atlanta, really good 464 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:15,080 Speaker 1: friends I've had for a long time, and for a 465 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:18,200 Speaker 1: while I was wrestling with the idea of I don't 466 00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:20,240 Speaker 1: belong here, and I know I don't belong here, and 467 00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:22,920 Speaker 1: I know I need to get out, but I love 468 00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:26,680 Speaker 1: these people. How oh no, what you know, I'm either 469 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 1: going to have to stay with the people I love 470 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:30,119 Speaker 1: or I have to like run away from them, And 471 00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:33,080 Speaker 1: there are all these in between. There's all these options 472 00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 1: c d E. Where you can say to somebody, I 473 00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,480 Speaker 1: love you and you were my best friends and I 474 00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:38,920 Speaker 1: want to see you all the time, but I can't 475 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:41,600 Speaker 1: live here every day. This isn't working for me anymore. 476 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:45,800 Speaker 1: So that's I'm summarizing a lot, and it's all in 477 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:49,960 Speaker 1: the book, But there there were distinct changes I could make, 478 00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:52,560 Speaker 1: incremental changes that enabled me to feel like I was 479 00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:55,840 Speaker 1: starting my life over in some ways while keeping a 480 00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,440 Speaker 1: lot of what was really important to me foundational stuff. 481 00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:01,520 Speaker 1: Is sounds like I think as as I've gotten older, 482 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,240 Speaker 1: I used to think of life kind of what you're 483 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,600 Speaker 1: saying that A B is like it's very black and white, 484 00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:08,280 Speaker 1: like there is this option in that option, and I've 485 00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:11,840 Speaker 1: really started to lean into life really happens in that 486 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 1: gray area, you know, And you're right. In every single 487 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:21,160 Speaker 1: situation I'm faced with these days, I my reaction is always, well, 488 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:23,359 Speaker 1: I guess that's over, or you know, like it's just 489 00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:26,720 Speaker 1: oh God, I need to quit my job and I'm 490 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:30,240 Speaker 1: just unhappy and it's so extreme. But if I sit 491 00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:31,840 Speaker 1: with it for a couple of days or a week 492 00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,160 Speaker 1: or a month, or sometimes it takes longer or five 493 00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:38,600 Speaker 1: years or whatever, that looks like, Um, you get to 494 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:41,840 Speaker 1: the place where you're like, oh, I don't have to 495 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:44,440 Speaker 1: blow it up, as you said, and I can still 496 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:47,320 Speaker 1: do this part. I don't like that part. And you 497 00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 1: find yourself again. What I loved what you talk You 498 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:53,120 Speaker 1: talk about like it is about finding yourself, but it's 499 00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:57,679 Speaker 1: also about finding what you're not, which is so important. 500 00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 1: I think giving yourself permission to witch, which if you're 501 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:04,479 Speaker 1: so hard, it's so hard, And if you're a driven 502 00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,280 Speaker 1: person and you're a person who kind of identifies with success, 503 00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:12,160 Speaker 1: it's hard to let yourself quit because you feel like, well, 504 00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:15,080 Speaker 1: you know, if you know somebody, you don't just give up. 505 00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,480 Speaker 1: I don't want to be a quitter. Yeah, it's hard. 506 00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:18,879 Speaker 1: I used to be. I used to be the kind 507 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,359 Speaker 1: of person who would not put down a book. I 508 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:23,320 Speaker 1: could get two hundred pages into a book and be 509 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:25,800 Speaker 1: thinking I hate this, this is horrible. And I would 510 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:30,640 Speaker 1: make myself read to the end. I don't do that anymore. Um. 511 00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:32,960 Speaker 1: But there's a story I tell in the book as 512 00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:35,920 Speaker 1: an example of getting to a place in my life 513 00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:37,840 Speaker 1: where I would let myself quit things. And it is 514 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:42,240 Speaker 1: um the year that I had a a gig as 515 00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:46,080 Speaker 1: part of the Fashion Police and US Weekly, which on 516 00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:49,840 Speaker 1: the surface seems like the best thing in the world today, right. 517 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:52,919 Speaker 1: I love making people laugh. It's all jokes. It's you know, 518 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,760 Speaker 1: this magazine is everywhere. It's like next to every pedicure 519 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:57,679 Speaker 1: chair in the country, and I was like, this is 520 00:25:57,840 --> 00:25:59,760 Speaker 1: perfect for me. I love to talk about fashion, and 521 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:01,360 Speaker 1: yet I am no good at it, so it's it's 522 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:04,639 Speaker 1: like fun and funny to me. Um. But what I 523 00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:07,360 Speaker 1: found after doing this job for about a year was 524 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:11,240 Speaker 1: I hated it. No offense to US Weekly. They were 525 00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:14,280 Speaker 1: lovely to work with, the people, they are great, um, 526 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:19,960 Speaker 1: But the task of looking at photographs of people who 527 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 1: were just trying to do their job or make their 528 00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:26,840 Speaker 1: art or go to the fucking gym, you know, and 529 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,760 Speaker 1: someone's taking their picture and then being asked to crack 530 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:31,960 Speaker 1: jokes about what they have on or what they look like, 531 00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:35,560 Speaker 1: felt horrible to me. I couldn't do it. I was like, 532 00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,280 Speaker 1: this is this is making myself sick. First of all 533 00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:40,359 Speaker 1: the jokes that they The way it would work is 534 00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:42,840 Speaker 1: you would submit like ten jokes per picture and then 535 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,119 Speaker 1: they would pick one to run in the magazine. And 536 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:47,399 Speaker 1: the one they picked was always the worst one. So 537 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:52,439 Speaker 1: there was that. But also it's just it didn't feel 538 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:55,680 Speaker 1: it wasn't sitting right with me. But at the same time, 539 00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:57,080 Speaker 1: I have this part of my brain that's like, well, 540 00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:00,600 Speaker 1: you can't just quit and the exposure right, and you know, 541 00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:02,879 Speaker 1: it's us weekly. It's cool to be part of the fashion, 542 00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:05,480 Speaker 1: but you can't give up. And I did finally let 543 00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:09,840 Speaker 1: myself give up, and it felt so good. Tory, thank 544 00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:12,280 Speaker 1: you for having me. I can't do this anymore. And 545 00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:14,199 Speaker 1: I can't do it anymore. The fine. The one that 546 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:19,399 Speaker 1: broke me was this precious picture of Kelly Clarkson and 547 00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:23,960 Speaker 1: she happens the nicest person who was lovely. Um. She 548 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:25,840 Speaker 1: had on a T shirt and this really cute skirt 549 00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:28,920 Speaker 1: with records all over it, and we were supposed to 550 00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,160 Speaker 1: make fun of it, and first of all, I thought 551 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:33,600 Speaker 1: she looked adorable. So I would have warned if I 552 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 1: knew how to take a shirt into a skirt, which 553 00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:40,160 Speaker 1: I can't um. But also, you know, I've watched her 554 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 1: career since she was on American Idol, Like I've watched 555 00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 1: her on TV grow up, and she worked so hard, 556 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:47,800 Speaker 1: and like you said, she's such a nice person. I'm 557 00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:49,240 Speaker 1: not going to make fun of her. I can't. I 558 00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:51,000 Speaker 1: just can't do it. So did you do it? No? 559 00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:56,199 Speaker 1: Would you say that's what? That's what? I can't do 560 00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:59,600 Speaker 1: it anymore. This is not me, you said at some 561 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:01,440 Speaker 1: point I can't remember I read this, But it's okay 562 00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:06,920 Speaker 1: to give yourself the permission to change deciding what you 563 00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:09,840 Speaker 1: and I really kind of had to game the system 564 00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:11,560 Speaker 1: in my mind because my mind wants to do the 565 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,760 Speaker 1: most successful right choice all the time, which means on 566 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:18,399 Speaker 1: the surface, quitting doesn't work within that system. But you 567 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,960 Speaker 1: can gain the system instead of yourself. It's actually an 568 00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:25,960 Speaker 1: even greater kind of success to identify what needs to 569 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 1: be removed from your life so that you can focus 570 00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,439 Speaker 1: on the right things. So if you can choose the 571 00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:37,960 Speaker 1: right things to quit, you're actually succeeding at focusing your life, 572 00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 1: which does help my mind. Yeah. There, you you look 573 00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:43,320 Speaker 1: at it all about how you do it. I we 574 00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:45,800 Speaker 1: talked earlier about when you first got here. It's something 575 00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:50,880 Speaker 1: about the age seven. Yeah, happy birthday, thank you. So 576 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 1: I just turned thirty seven. If you can't figure it out, 577 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:56,400 Speaker 1: but yeah, I've literally been going through what you wrote 578 00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:58,560 Speaker 1: about in this book and what we're talking about right now, 579 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 1: going what do I really want to do with my life? 580 00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:03,560 Speaker 1: Something is not sitting right. I feel like I've lost 581 00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:08,680 Speaker 1: myself because I'm doing all the time and you're exhausted everyone. 582 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:11,760 Speaker 1: I know, it's exhausted, exhausted. There's some there's some key 583 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:15,160 Speaker 1: ages that I have figured out in my extremely unscientific 584 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:19,360 Speaker 1: research of going on foot tour um one. And I 585 00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 1: don't know if it's this is this way for guys, 586 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,240 Speaker 1: but I know for women because so many have come 587 00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:26,960 Speaker 1: through my signing line and said this, turning thirty really 588 00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:30,200 Speaker 1: knocks people off their feet dirty. Was a terrible year 589 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 1: for me. There's so many that's a thing. Yeah, so 590 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:36,520 Speaker 1: many people can have come through my signing line at 591 00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:38,960 Speaker 1: events with like tears running down their face and said, 592 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: I just I'm about to turn thirty, Oh my god, 593 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,840 Speaker 1: and I really needed this. And I don't know if 594 00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:49,240 Speaker 1: it's because thirty somehow signals like you're officially an adult, 595 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,640 Speaker 1: cannot get by calling yourself a kid anymore. Therefore the 596 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:56,480 Speaker 1: stakes feel higher, and every choice you make, therefore there's 597 00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:59,400 Speaker 1: more pressure to choose the exactly right thing every time 598 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:05,000 Speaker 1: you have a choice. Um. But then also thirty seven ish, 599 00:30:05,320 --> 00:30:08,280 Speaker 1: thirty six, maybe thirty eight, there's something about that mid 600 00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 1: to late thirty time, that phase where and again maybe 601 00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:15,360 Speaker 1: this is true for guys as well, but I hear 602 00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:17,480 Speaker 1: more from women and for me, you know, obviously I'm 603 00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:21,320 Speaker 1: a woman, But um, something hits right about there, and 604 00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:24,640 Speaker 1: I think maybe that's when the momentum wears off a 605 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:27,760 Speaker 1: little bit, like the momentum that carried you through your 606 00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:30,080 Speaker 1: twenties and over the hump of your thirtieth birthday and 607 00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:33,600 Speaker 1: through a lot of decisions, whether they are professional decisions 608 00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:38,280 Speaker 1: or creative decisions, or personal life decisions or you know, 609 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,920 Speaker 1: if you're somebody like you and like me are professional 610 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 1: and creative and personal lives are all blended together. Um, 611 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:48,000 Speaker 1: so we're carrying a lot at one time. Something about 612 00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:50,440 Speaker 1: getting to kind of mid to late thirties, the weight 613 00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:53,959 Speaker 1: of all that just hits you, and you look at 614 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,280 Speaker 1: what's ahead of you, and and you have enough life 615 00:30:57,360 --> 00:30:59,000 Speaker 1: left ahead of you that you want to be happy 616 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 1: with it, but your care all this stuff around and 617 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:04,960 Speaker 1: you're not sure you're happy. There's something about that age totally, 618 00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:07,120 Speaker 1: and I think that you look at the stuff around 619 00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 1: you because at thirty seven, I have way more than 620 00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 1: I've ever had, you know, like of things, of opportunities, 621 00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:17,720 Speaker 1: of just all of it. And from the outside, I go, 622 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:19,960 Speaker 1: oh my god. If my even my thirty year old 623 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:22,640 Speaker 1: self would have dreamed of this stuff, I would have 624 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,200 Speaker 1: been like, oh my god, that's where I'm going. So 625 00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:29,240 Speaker 1: you feel like you should be the happiest you ever been. 626 00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:33,560 Speaker 1: On paper, it looks awesome exactly, And then and then 627 00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:36,400 Speaker 1: you start having the self doubt, like am I ungrateful? Oh? 628 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:38,720 Speaker 1: I tell myself that every day be grateful for the 629 00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:40,600 Speaker 1: things you have, and I do think that's a thing 630 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,200 Speaker 1: like you. You know, of course I'd love gratitude lists 631 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:46,200 Speaker 1: and all of that. That definitely helps. But on the 632 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:49,880 Speaker 1: flip side, there's this other new pressure now of oh 633 00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:52,959 Speaker 1: my god, I'm thirty seven. I do have a lot 634 00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:55,600 Speaker 1: of accomplishments. Yet I thought I would have more, or 635 00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:57,840 Speaker 1: I thought my life would look like X, Y and Z, 636 00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:01,200 Speaker 1: and it looks like this, So you just start beating 637 00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:03,400 Speaker 1: yourself up for that, right, and then you beat yourself 638 00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:06,080 Speaker 1: up for beating yourself up because you're being ungrateful. There's 639 00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:09,200 Speaker 1: a chapter in this book called Ungrateful Bitch where I 640 00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:13,840 Speaker 1: imagine I always feel like people think no one's thinking 641 00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:15,840 Speaker 1: about me, first of all, but like I'm always imagined 642 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,200 Speaker 1: that people are thinking I'm ungrateful when I when I 643 00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:20,000 Speaker 1: admit that I am not happy with something or I 644 00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:22,480 Speaker 1: want to make a change, I'm like, oh, everyone thinks 645 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:25,840 Speaker 1: I'm an ungrateful trust me. I've literally already thought should 646 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:31,000 Speaker 1: I edit this out of the podcast? And I have 647 00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:33,760 Speaker 1: this little exercise that I recommended the book where I'm like, so, 648 00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:37,520 Speaker 1: here's the deal. Either you are an ungrateful bitch or 649 00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:41,520 Speaker 1: you're not. Who cares? I mean, your feelings are your feelings, 650 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,560 Speaker 1: no matter what. And if you're unsatisfied, you're unsatisfied, and 651 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,000 Speaker 1: if you are satisfied, you're satisfied. Try to show gratitude 652 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:50,640 Speaker 1: as often as you can, but quit worrying about whether 653 00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:53,840 Speaker 1: you're an ungrateful bitch. Say those words until they have 654 00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 1: no no meaning anymore, Like stand in front of the 655 00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:59,240 Speaker 1: mirror and go Hello, I'm an ungrateful bitch. Like when 656 00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:01,120 Speaker 1: you go to star x Igo, what name should we 657 00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,400 Speaker 1: put on your cup? Say that's ungrateful with the capital 658 00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:07,000 Speaker 1: you and a capital. Just say it until it has 659 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 1: no meaning anymore and it's not poisonous and it can't 660 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:14,360 Speaker 1: hurt you ungrateful bits Ready, Yeah, my god, that's We've 661 00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:18,040 Speaker 1: got a triple latte for ungrateful bitch. So taking the 662 00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:22,920 Speaker 1: power away essentially cares. I mean, I still care a lot, 663 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:27,320 Speaker 1: but I'm gonna work on Okay. So now I get 664 00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,800 Speaker 1: to the last thing Elizabeth Gilbert said, basically, which is 665 00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:33,480 Speaker 1: who you really want to be? Which can you talk through? 666 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:35,680 Speaker 1: I feel like, like, you know, your book is about 667 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:37,280 Speaker 1: the thirty seven year old you, and now you're at 668 00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:40,080 Speaker 1: a different place, and I see this whole confidence and 669 00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:43,600 Speaker 1: also just peace and who you are, Like, what how 670 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:45,680 Speaker 1: did you get there? I love that you look at 671 00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:48,880 Speaker 1: me and see confidence in peace. I love, but because 672 00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:51,040 Speaker 1: I don't feel that all the time, you look that 673 00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:53,480 Speaker 1: way from the outside. Well, yeah, I worked hard on 674 00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:57,200 Speaker 1: my hair today, which looks great, Thank you, thank you. 675 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:03,360 Speaker 1: Mental and emotional peace is so elusive and so hard 676 00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:05,960 Speaker 1: to pin down and so hard to reach And I 677 00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:08,120 Speaker 1: use that phrase a lot because I want to be 678 00:34:09,160 --> 00:34:13,479 Speaker 1: clear that when I talk about UM, when I'm talking 679 00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:15,000 Speaker 1: with people, not only about my life and what I 680 00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:16,960 Speaker 1: write in my book, but just with people i'm having 681 00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:21,320 Speaker 1: conversations with them, we're discussing being unsatisfied or wanting something 682 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:28,160 Speaker 1: different the time. We don't mean wanting different things. We 683 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:32,319 Speaker 1: don't mean wanting more things. This is not about I'm 684 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,040 Speaker 1: not grateful for what I have. This is about no 685 00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:38,120 Speaker 1: matter what I have, whether it's enough or not enough, 686 00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:43,080 Speaker 1: if you don't have mental and emotional peace, you will 687 00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:47,040 Speaker 1: always be unsettled. And for a long, long, long long time, 688 00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:51,480 Speaker 1: I thought, if I can just be successful enough at everything, 689 00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:57,440 Speaker 1: at writing, at business, at friendship, at being you know, 690 00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:00,360 Speaker 1: female role model, whatever, being a mom, I canna be 691 00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:03,759 Speaker 1: successful at every single thing, then I'll get mental and 692 00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:09,040 Speaker 1: emotional peace. But you know, I remember remember last year 693 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:13,640 Speaker 1: when um Kate Spade and Anthony Bourdain died one right 694 00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:16,600 Speaker 1: after the other, both by suicide, and I remember thinking, 695 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:21,200 Speaker 1: are we ever going to learn as human beings that 696 00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,680 Speaker 1: you there is no level of success that guarantees mental 697 00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:28,239 Speaker 1: and emotional peace. So when I think about who I 698 00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:30,800 Speaker 1: want to be a I would like to be someone 699 00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:33,880 Speaker 1: who at least has some kind of a grip on 700 00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:37,879 Speaker 1: mental and emotional peace. But I also want to be 701 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 1: somebody who is a meaningful part of other people's lives. Connection. Yeah, 702 00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:49,080 Speaker 1: I want I want not to be lonely. Like when 703 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:50,719 Speaker 1: I look at every time in my life that I 704 00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:54,160 Speaker 1: have been really unsatisfied or really miserable, what went along 705 00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:59,160 Speaker 1: with it was loneliness. And part of loneliness is thinking 706 00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:01,279 Speaker 1: that you're the only part new has the problems you have. 707 00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:03,960 Speaker 1: So this is part of what keeps me writing and 708 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:06,640 Speaker 1: what keeps me, you know, what made me right, keep 709 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,120 Speaker 1: going writing this book and and hopefully we'll get me 710 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:11,680 Speaker 1: to write another one. One day is feeling like if 711 00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:14,200 Speaker 1: we share our stories with each other and we talk 712 00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:17,120 Speaker 1: about the things that are kind of awkward and weird 713 00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:21,920 Speaker 1: and uncomfortable, we can at least alleviate loneliness from everybody's 714 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:24,799 Speaker 1: plate because you're because you're connecting and you come out 715 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:29,319 Speaker 1: of isolation. Yeah, and loneliness compounds every problem, anything you're 716 00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:32,080 Speaker 1: going through, no matter how bad it is, it is 717 00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:34,520 Speaker 1: ten times worse if you think you're the only person 718 00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:36,759 Speaker 1: going through it. So when I think about who I 719 00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:39,160 Speaker 1: want to be I would I would like to as 720 00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:41,719 Speaker 1: much as I can be someone who connects with other 721 00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:46,000 Speaker 1: people and helps alleviate loneliness in other people. I don't 722 00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:47,719 Speaker 1: know who I want to be. I mean, who knows 723 00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:49,759 Speaker 1: who I'll be in ten or twenty years. I will 724 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,879 Speaker 1: say one of the funniest things that has happened as 725 00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:55,600 Speaker 1: I've been out touring and talking about this book, people 726 00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:57,600 Speaker 1: come through the line. They're the crying thirty year olds. 727 00:36:58,080 --> 00:36:59,799 Speaker 1: There are the thirty seven year olds who are like 728 00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:03,520 Speaker 1: right there, and then there are the women in their 729 00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:08,080 Speaker 1: sixties and seventies. They're hysterical. They lay in with this 730 00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:12,120 Speaker 1: like conspiratorial look on their face and they're like, guess what, 731 00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:16,799 Speaker 1: it never gets better? Great, but which they think is 732 00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:19,160 Speaker 1: so funny. So many have said that, but I think 733 00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:22,279 Speaker 1: what they mean is you do get to keep reinventing. 734 00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,520 Speaker 1: So don't fall into the trap of going, oh, yeah, 735 00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:27,839 Speaker 1: I figured out that reinvention happens, and now I've done 736 00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:30,280 Speaker 1: it and I'm done, and here I am or whatever 737 00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:34,440 Speaker 1: figured it out. If you're going to accept that reinvention 738 00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:37,480 Speaker 1: can happen, you know, in a recurrent kind of way, 739 00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:40,760 Speaker 1: you also need to accept it's going to keep happening. 740 00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:44,279 Speaker 1: So in ten years, I don't know where I'll be. 741 00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:46,759 Speaker 1: I don't know what I'll be doing. I think what 742 00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:50,480 Speaker 1: I have learned is that it should be something different 743 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,440 Speaker 1: from where I am and what I'm doing now, because 744 00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:58,000 Speaker 1: change has been good for me. That's growth. Yeah. I mean, 745 00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:00,239 Speaker 1: it's kind of funny that we actually think we're going 746 00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:02,640 Speaker 1: to figure out who we should be, what job we 747 00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:04,920 Speaker 1: should do for the rest of our lives when like, 748 00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:07,320 Speaker 1: life doesn't happen that way. It does not and that 749 00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:09,640 Speaker 1: and even if it, even if you do think you 750 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:12,440 Speaker 1: have it figured out, the goal post is always moving. 751 00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:15,160 Speaker 1: You know, you can get to this thing, go got it, 752 00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:19,000 Speaker 1: and look up and go oh wait, whoops. Yeah, that's 753 00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:22,880 Speaker 1: what I thought I wanted. That's not working. Um. Do 754 00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:29,200 Speaker 1: you feel like you belong now? Yes? And no. I 755 00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:31,719 Speaker 1: feel like there's a lot of I have, um in 756 00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:35,440 Speaker 1: some ways, more community in my life and more connection 757 00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:40,160 Speaker 1: than I did, say ten years ago. I love being 758 00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:42,080 Speaker 1: in Nashville. That's been a really great place for me 759 00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:44,000 Speaker 1: for the last few years. I was born here, but 760 00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:46,480 Speaker 1: I did not grow up here. Um. And the book 761 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,880 Speaker 1: kind of tells the story of how I left Atlanta 762 00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:51,600 Speaker 1: after seventeen years and came here with my family. I 763 00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:55,360 Speaker 1: love um where Nashville is right now as a creative community. 764 00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:57,520 Speaker 1: That's been wonderful for me. I don't think I could 765 00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:00,640 Speaker 1: have written this book living in it, Anna. It was 766 00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:02,839 Speaker 1: good for me to be surrounded by other people who 767 00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:06,480 Speaker 1: right and other people who you know, sing or act 768 00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:09,719 Speaker 1: or do creative things in a legitimate way. That was 769 00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:12,440 Speaker 1: helpful for me. So I do feel like I belong 770 00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:17,160 Speaker 1: more in that way. I think there's a part of 771 00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:20,080 Speaker 1: me and probably a part of everybody that always feels 772 00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:24,040 Speaker 1: a little disconnected. I still I'm always like, do I belong? 773 00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:25,880 Speaker 1: Am I in the right place? Am I doing the 774 00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:27,880 Speaker 1: right thing? Or maybe that's just me. I don't know. 775 00:39:27,960 --> 00:39:31,560 Speaker 1: I don't think so. I think we're always or for me, 776 00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:34,360 Speaker 1: I think I'm always wanting more connection. And then you 777 00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:35,880 Speaker 1: get to the places I don't know if you have 778 00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:38,359 Speaker 1: this feeling where I think, do I belong or do 779 00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:42,200 Speaker 1: I deserve to be here? Yes, And that's always the 780 00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:44,600 Speaker 1: big question for me. So I'm kind of seeking the 781 00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:49,480 Speaker 1: belonging through that. I don't know what happens at forty 782 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:51,600 Speaker 1: Are you going to write us another book? I loved 783 00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:56,200 Speaker 1: forty forty was great. Forty birthday is like everything that 784 00:39:56,280 --> 00:40:00,160 Speaker 1: the thirtieth birthday is not. Thirtieth birthday is all like, oh, oh, 785 00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:02,400 Speaker 1: I'm an adult. What have I done? Know? What am 786 00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:04,920 Speaker 1: I going to do next? And there's something really lovely 787 00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:08,240 Speaker 1: about forty. And I was telling you earlier before before 788 00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:11,880 Speaker 1: we started recording, I think there's something about our generation. 789 00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:13,279 Speaker 1: And I'm a little bit older than you are, but 790 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:16,400 Speaker 1: I'm lumping our generation is kind of a big, a 791 00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:19,640 Speaker 1: big group. But I think in some ways we're reacting 792 00:40:19,719 --> 00:40:24,160 Speaker 1: against what the view was in like the eighties and 793 00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:28,680 Speaker 1: early nineties of being like over the hill and it's 794 00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,200 Speaker 1: kind of silly. Yeah, But now I think we all 795 00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:34,279 Speaker 1: look at forty. Not we all, but a lot of 796 00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:37,560 Speaker 1: people look at forty as a chance to start a 797 00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:42,080 Speaker 1: new phase, which is fun and refreshing. And you've gotten 798 00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:44,000 Speaker 1: a lot of the bullshit out of your life by 799 00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:49,799 Speaker 1: that point, you've left seven first of all, Right, I 800 00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:54,400 Speaker 1: loved fort forties have been fun. I like them. It's 801 00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:56,880 Speaker 1: sounds like from what I've heard from friends, it's a 802 00:40:56,920 --> 00:41:00,880 Speaker 1: little more of the who cares like you said it, Yeah, 803 00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,200 Speaker 1: you just don't have as many cares to give, right 804 00:41:03,280 --> 00:41:06,399 Speaker 1: and you're I mean, honestly a little tired. So you're 805 00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:08,120 Speaker 1: going to conserve the energy I have and I'm not 806 00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:10,080 Speaker 1: going to spend it on stupid stuff I don't want 807 00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:15,000 Speaker 1: to do. Mary Laura, Where can people find you? Uh? 808 00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:20,560 Speaker 1: In my house? You can find meself. You can't find 809 00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:24,839 Speaker 1: me on Instagram, that's probably my favorite. On Twitter? What's 810 00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:27,919 Speaker 1: your handle? I love Twitter. On Instagram, it's my whole name, 811 00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:31,120 Speaker 1: Mary Laura Philpott. Twitter does not give you that many 812 00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:37,080 Speaker 1: letters and the handles. On Twitter, it's it's Mary Laura 813 00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:39,759 Speaker 1: pH It cuts off, but you know, search Mary Laura 814 00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:41,640 Speaker 1: Philpott on either one you will find me. I do 815 00:41:41,719 --> 00:41:43,600 Speaker 1: have an author page on Facebook as well, but I 816 00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:46,600 Speaker 1: don't use Facebook quite as much. Yeah, and the book 817 00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:48,920 Speaker 1: is called I Miss You When I Blink, which I 818 00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:52,200 Speaker 1: love the title to something your son said. Right. You 819 00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:54,680 Speaker 1: can read about that all in the book. It's amazing. 820 00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:56,719 Speaker 1: It makes you laugh out loud. There's a couple of 821 00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:59,200 Speaker 1: moments where I actually cried as well, like teared up, 822 00:41:59,239 --> 00:42:02,479 Speaker 1: you know, choka ups, probably because probably because I'm thirty 823 00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:05,839 Speaker 1: seven and related. But even if you're not thirty seven. 824 00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:08,480 Speaker 1: It's a really really great read, and I love that 825 00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:12,120 Speaker 1: it's just letting us all off the hook a little bit. Yeah, 826 00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:14,719 Speaker 1: the humanity of us all. We gotta let each other 827 00:42:14,760 --> 00:42:16,640 Speaker 1: off the home because it's hard to let yourself off 828 00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:17,880 Speaker 1: the hook. So we need to look at each other 829 00:42:17,960 --> 00:42:22,319 Speaker 1: and go, no, you're you're good, you're grace all right. Well, 830 00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:24,080 Speaker 1: thank you so much for doing this. Thank you for 831 00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:26,120 Speaker 1: having me, of course, thank you guys for listening. Check 832 00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:30,080 Speaker 1: out Mary Laura on Instagram and Twitter and Facebook, and 833 00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:32,960 Speaker 1: let's read the book I Miss You We're Not by. 834 00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:36,719 Speaker 1: This is Kelly Henderson and you've been listening to the 835 00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:40,440 Speaker 1: Velvet's Edge podcast. I truly believe that every one of 836 00:42:40,520 --> 00:42:43,080 Speaker 1: us has a little velvet and a little edge, so 837 00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:45,759 Speaker 1: it's so important to remember that to be strong, you 838 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:48,920 Speaker 1: must be soft too. Thank you so much for sharing 839 00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:51,759 Speaker 1: in those stories with me. You can follow Velvet's Edge 840 00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:54,959 Speaker 1: on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter, as well as velvet's Edge 841 00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:57,480 Speaker 1: dot com. If you have it yet, go to Apple 842 00:42:57,520 --> 00:43:01,439 Speaker 1: Podcast and subscribe, rate and review the this podcast. Join 843 00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:06,440 Speaker 1: me every Wednesday for more conversations on lifestyle, beauty, and relationships. 844 00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:08,759 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. H