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Speaker 1: Welcome to desperately devoted.

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Speaker 2: Think of us as your favorite neighbors as we chat

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Speaker 2: about life and relationships, all.

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Speaker 3: While we revisit the iconic show Desperate Housewives together.

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Speaker 2: I'm Terry Hatcher, I'm Andrea Bowen.

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Speaker 4: And I'm Emerson Tenny. Okay, Well, hi everyone.

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Speaker 3: Hi, I'm so glad that we're here to talk about

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Speaker 3: episode fifteen, Impossible. This aired February twentieth, two thousand and five.

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Speaker 1: And was directed by Larry Shaw.

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Speaker 4: And there are some big themes in this episode.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm looking at you because I was wondering you.

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Speaker 2: You always seem to tell us if this is related

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Speaker 2: to a Sondheim song, and I just kept thinking of impossible, possible, So.

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Speaker 3: You No, that is not a Stephen Sondheim song at all.

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Speaker 3: That is from the amazing Cinderella with Brandy played Cinderella.

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Speaker 1: And arguably the best Cinderella.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, what version of the Cinderella is? Tell me?

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Speaker 2: This is it on ABC Live? That?

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Speaker 4: No, it was.

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Speaker 3: It was a movie and it came out with Brandy

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Speaker 3: and Whitney Houston. Yeah, And I'm trying to think of

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Speaker 3: is it Rogers and Hammerstein, Like Who's which?

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Speaker 4: Who does which is the music for that, I think

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Speaker 4: it is. I think it's like.

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Speaker 1: It's been a different take on it, but yeah.

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Speaker 3: It's Rogers and Hammerstine's impossible, But it is not impossible

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Speaker 3: the one that you're singing, because.

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Speaker 2: I have the same thoughts love that songs. Yeah, okay, anyways, yes,

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Speaker 2: so it's not impossible that we are going to talk

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Speaker 2: about it. So fifteen because we are here and we

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Speaker 2: are ready to go there as at episode. So there's

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Speaker 2: some amazing themes in this episode that I can't wait

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Speaker 2: to get into. One of them being like, does sex

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Speaker 2: change things in your relationship? What role does sex play

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Speaker 2: in having a relationship? I think that's a big one.

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Speaker 2: Do people lie? Do people tell themselves lies? Do people

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Speaker 2: go to bed at night with lies in their head

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Speaker 2: hoping that when they wake up in the morning they

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Speaker 2: won't be there?

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Speaker 3: We have Celebrating your partner's successes can be difficult to

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Speaker 3: do or is that how you have a supportive partnership?

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Speaker 3: What is the line of feeling competitive but also wanting

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Speaker 3: your partner to be the biggest, brightest version of themselves?

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Speaker 2: And do you consider yourself lucky? And what role does

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Speaker 2: luck play? Because I always say what do I always

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Speaker 2: say about luck Emerson, Luck is just preparedness, oh meets opportunity,

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Speaker 2: opportunity the landing.

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Speaker 4: I was thinking.

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Speaker 3: I was thinking of fortune favors the prepared mind, which

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Speaker 3: is a version of saying that. But that's the expression

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Speaker 3: I always think of when I hear that. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: luck is preparedness meets opportunity. There's no real such thing

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Speaker 3: maybe as luck. And then you know big wet, hot,

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Speaker 3: wild high school parties.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I have thoughts on that, on that pool party storyline,

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Speaker 1: so you know, yeah, get there.

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Speaker 4: A lot, I mean a lot happens.

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Speaker 3: There's Mike is having some rumors swirl around him. He

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Speaker 3: gets taken down to police station and to be questioned

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Speaker 3: for Martha Hoover's murder.

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Speaker 2: Because coming into this episode he shot himself in the stomach.

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Speaker 2: And THENI has piqued Susan's sort of like curiosity.

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Speaker 3: And then Lynette's kids find the jewelry that Paul had

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Speaker 3: planted in his garage. We have Justin John's friend kind

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Speaker 3: of blackmailing Gabby into hiring her as her new hiring

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Speaker 3: him as her new gardener.

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Speaker 1: We get lots of euphemisms about Bush in those scenes.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and then she says that he wants her to

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Speaker 3: sleep with him, and he's going to tell Carlos that

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Speaker 3: she was having an affair with John if she doesn't,

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Speaker 3: although we find out he's only trying to sleep with

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Speaker 3: someone as hot as Gabby because he is struggling to

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Speaker 3: decide if he really identifies as being gay or not.

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Speaker 3: And there's an even bigger reveal about who is gay.

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Speaker 3: It's Breeze own Son.

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Speaker 2: We always says, I'm not gay, being caught naked in

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Speaker 2: the pool with.

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Speaker 3: Justin spoken like a poor closeted person. I have so

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Speaker 3: much I want to say about this.

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Speaker 2: Where should we start? I mean, I was feeling like,

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Speaker 2: right at the beginning of the episode, you have Brie again,

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Speaker 2: who is one of my favorite characters in.

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Speaker 1: All her tad wife glory. I feel like in this

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Speaker 1: opening no secret.

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Speaker 2: In this opening sequence, bree is revealed to be, you know,

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Speaker 2: leaning farther into her conservative label, right down to the

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Speaker 2: close up photograph of Reagan Ronald Reagan hiding on the wall,

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Speaker 2: which I thought was, you know, pretty timely because Canada

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Speaker 2: has just released an ad with Reagan talking about tariffs

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Speaker 2: that made Trump not want to talk to Canada. Anymore.

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Speaker 2: So Reagan's still still relevant.

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Speaker 3: But I got up not amazing home decor in my

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Speaker 3: personal opinion, Yeah.

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Speaker 2: But it was.

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Speaker 1: It's a big framed photo of him, very very yeah,

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Speaker 1: very large.

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Speaker 2: But leads Brie to find a condom in the laundry

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Speaker 2: and a wrapped like unused condom, and she immediately assumes

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Speaker 2: that well, first she thinks it's her husband's it's her

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Speaker 2: cheating husband, which I thought.

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Speaker 3: Was crazy that she immediately was like, this lime green

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Speaker 3: condom must belong to my middle aged husband.

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Speaker 1: But she has tunnel vision. She has total tunnel vision.

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Speaker 1: She didn't even entertain the thought that it could be

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Speaker 1: her teenage son.

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Speaker 4: And the first her teenage daughter exactly, Oh the scandal,

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Speaker 4: which actually turns out to be right.

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Speaker 2: And then she goes to Danielle. She confronts her, you know,

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Speaker 2: is this your condom? And Danielle admits to her that

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Speaker 2: it is, and she has it because she wants to

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Speaker 2: have sex, but she doesn't want to get pregnant. And

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Speaker 2: it's with John the gardener that she wants to have

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Speaker 2: sex because she feels like he broke up with her

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Speaker 2: because she wouldn't have sex with him. And this is

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Speaker 2: my jumping off point for what sort of manipulative or

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Speaker 2: manipulated or pressured feelings have any of us had? Could

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Speaker 2: you relate to that at all? About what sex means?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I can jump right off with saying that

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Speaker 2: I feel like in my adult life, even in my

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Speaker 2: dating life, like you know, a few decades ago or whatever,

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Speaker 2: but I feel like once you have sex with someone,

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Speaker 2: the relationship changes, and often when you're just in that

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Speaker 2: early dating stage, like if you sleep with somebody on

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Speaker 2: the first date or the third date or the fifth date,

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Speaker 2: you know, I feel like it changes, and not always

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Speaker 2: for the better. And maybe there is some value in waiting,

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Speaker 2: although I'll admit it, I never really wanted to because

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Speaker 2: sex is fun, but it's super complicated. So what do

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Speaker 2: you guys think about it?

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Speaker 4: It's funny, you know.

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Speaker 3: I was just talking to a friend of mine about

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Speaker 3: this this past week, and he was saying to me

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Speaker 3: how he has had experiences in his life where even

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Speaker 3: when you say, this isn't going to change our friendship.

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Speaker 3: And you know, very apropos of Taylor Swift's new album

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Speaker 3: with the song Ruin the Friendship, this idea that sex

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Speaker 3: will ruin a friendship and He was kind of saying that, actually,

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Speaker 3: it really has been his experience that as much as

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Speaker 3: two consenting adults can say, you know what, like, we

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Speaker 3: don't want a relationship, but we're attracted to each other,

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Speaker 3: We're just going to do this for fun. When you

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Speaker 3: introduce sex, things do change. And he was saying in

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Speaker 3: the case of the people that he's had this experience

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Speaker 3: with which there wasn't very many. He said, though in

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Speaker 3: both cases they are not really friends anymore.

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Speaker 1: It's such an age old thing, right, the idea of

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Speaker 1: can people who have attraction between them be friends and

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Speaker 1: have the attraction not get in the way if they

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Speaker 1: ever choose to give in to it, or even if

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Speaker 1: they don't, like if attraction exists within a friendship, is

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Speaker 1: is it possible to prioritize the friendship only or is

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Speaker 1: it ever really only friendship? But honestly, I was just

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Speaker 1: thinking about situations a la Danielle's predicament in this episode,

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Speaker 1: and as you were talking, I I have not I did.

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Speaker 1: I did conflate it with an experience I had, which

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Speaker 1: kind of picks up on two themes in this episode.

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Speaker 1: Because it took place in a pool, it took place.

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Speaker 3: Hot take or cold take the worst place to have sex.

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Speaker 1: Have have well ear muffs to you. Maybe I don't know,

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Speaker 1: But what if you tried to have sex and a pool.

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Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, it's like really difficult. Yeah yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: like doesn't it's.

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Speaker 2: Like a girl with both with both sexes.

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Speaker 3: It doesn't matter. Okay, the water is a problem, but

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Speaker 3: the water specifically, certainly with certain anatomy, it's just defies

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Speaker 3: the laws of what you're supposed to be doing in

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Speaker 3: a pool. So just don't if you watch some porn

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Speaker 3: or something where people were having sex in a pool,

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Speaker 3: they weren't and it wasn't hot, and don't try it.

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Speaker 3: But just like just enjoy the pool and then go

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Speaker 3: elsewhere for suck.

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Speaker 2: I have to agree that I have never had good

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Speaker 2: or like uncomplicated or pleasurable sex and a jacuzzi or whatever.

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Speaker 2: And I feel like I've tried. I mean not in

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Speaker 2: a long time, right, but I feel like I've tried,

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Speaker 2: and I've tried. And I think the reason do people

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Speaker 2: do try is because this is what we're told. I mean,

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Speaker 2: this is this is the problem with porn, especially with

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Speaker 2: the younger generation. I think they see these things and

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Speaker 2: they're like they're like brainwashed into some belief that this,

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Speaker 2: this way of being is what's hot.

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Speaker 3: I would argue, not even porn, but like a notebook

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Speaker 3: level of like romance movie. We see these really passionate

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Speaker 3: scenes and they run into the ocean and there, and

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Speaker 3: but like, that's just I just don't think that's reality.

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Speaker 1: No so hot, take bull sex not so hot, but

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Speaker 1: also so in this moment, I was in my early

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Speaker 1: twenties and I was kind of fooling around with someone,

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Speaker 1: but it was really not It wasn't a serious thing.

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Speaker 1: It was very sort of PG. Thirteen. I will say

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Speaker 1: it was not like I didn't think I was ever

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Speaker 1: indicating that it was going to go further than this.

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Speaker 1: Right on his end, though, I guess he thought and

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Speaker 1: or hoped that it was. And so when he tried

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Speaker 1: to progress things and I was like, oh, I'm not

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Speaker 1: interested in doing anything more than this, he hopped out

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Speaker 1: of the pool and he walked away and he goes, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I guess I'll just fuck myself then, oh, which honestly

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Speaker 1: is so funny to me, And it was funny to

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Speaker 1: me in the moment that I laughed because I was like,

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Speaker 1: that is a crazy reaction and like so gross and

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Speaker 1: so now it's become a thing. I mean, my husband

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Speaker 1: and I laugh about it. It's a thing that you know,

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Speaker 1: we'll say in jest to each other because it was

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Speaker 1: so ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: Oh I love now that we're part of the Okay,

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Speaker 2: I guess I'll just fuck myself saying, oh my gosh,

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Speaker 2: that should go on a shirt.

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Speaker 4: That's amazing.

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Speaker 3: And also you look so gross and it is making

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Speaker 3: me think of a time I wrote down in my

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Speaker 3: notes for this episode you so gross again? Yeah, was

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Speaker 3: justin The New Gardener when he corners Gabby up in

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Speaker 3: her bedroom, like you know, he's been pushing the lawnmower.

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Speaker 3: He's gotten Carlos to hire him. He's shirtless, he's sweating whatever,

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Speaker 3: and he corners her up when Carlos is out in

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Speaker 3: her bedroom and he says he goes to make a pastor.

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Speaker 3: He tries to kiss her and she pushes him off,

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Speaker 3: and then he says, hey.

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Speaker 4: Be nice, just just be nice.

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Speaker 3: Come here, be nice, and I it made me so

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Speaker 3: mad this, I mean, certainly, then where it goes when

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Speaker 3: he says, I'm going to reveal your affair and it

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Speaker 3: becomes this kind of sexual blackmail, which ultimately I end

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Speaker 3: up having a little bit more empathy for because he's

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Speaker 3: clearly in a particular quandary. But the expression of be nice,

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Speaker 3: it reminds me a little bit of the pressure from

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Speaker 3: boys in high school to have sex or not to

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Speaker 3: have sex. This idea that a woman who doesn't want,

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Speaker 3: or any person who doesn't want to be physically intimate

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Speaker 3: sexually is not being nice to the person who does

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Speaker 3: is so deeply problematic.

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Speaker 4: And I gotta say, I mean, I'm looking at both

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Speaker 4: of you.

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Speaker 3: I feel like we've probably all experienced at least one

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Speaker 3: version of someone, if not many versions of someone implying

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Speaker 3: that you are somehow not a nice person because you

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Speaker 3: have a boundary about your own body.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I mean that idea of that be nice.

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Speaker 2: I don't know that it to my generation where women

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Speaker 2: just put up with so much Like I'm sure that

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Speaker 2: any actress of my age who's made her way through

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Speaker 2: television and film career has a thousand stories to tell

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Speaker 2: you about the producers that have come up and secretly

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Speaker 2: whispered in their ear Hey, I had a really hot

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Speaker 2: sex dream about you last night, and you know you

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Speaker 2: just this was just my generation was like, hah, hope,

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Speaker 2: it was a good dream.

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Speaker 4: I'm gonna go.

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Speaker 2: Learn my lines now, you know, like, like we did

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Speaker 2: not think that we could push back at all, which

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Speaker 2: is why when I look at your generation and now yours,

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Speaker 2: I see a lot of hope in the way that

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Speaker 2: each of you have gotten more of a handle on

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Speaker 2: being able to have agency over your own thoughts and

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Speaker 2: your own bodies and your own you know, stance in

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Speaker 2: the world, and your ability to speak your mind, and

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Speaker 2: the way society has sort of supported that. Although you know,

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Speaker 2: I do look, I do feel like we're headed a

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Speaker 2: little backwards.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 2: I feel like some of the narrative were getting out

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Speaker 2: of you know, the government or whatever I or politicians.

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Speaker 2: I feel like, you know, some of that stuff. It

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Speaker 2: makes me feel very scared to feel like we're at

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Speaker 2: risk of losing some of that. That be nice. Feels

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Speaker 2: like that happened to me, Like you say those words

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Speaker 2: and I like want to vomit, right, yeah, Like.

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Speaker 3: I feel like I know that, And I can't have

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Speaker 3: an actual exact memory come up, but I feel like

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Speaker 3: it's a pretty do you do you? Oh?

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Speaker 1: Of course, of course. And also it just makes me

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Speaker 1: think of that, you know, the the sidewalk version of that, right,

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Speaker 1: which is men telling women to smile.

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Speaker 2: I was just going to say that, Oh my god,

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Speaker 2: I was so gonna say that.

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Speaker 1: Yes, it's that's that's the out in the daylight, put

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Speaker 1: a nice face on it type of thing.

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Speaker 2: You should smile more, smile more.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, for what because yeah, we're here, we're here,

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Speaker 3: We're existing for you in your enjoyment, right, I mean,

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Speaker 3: that's the undercurrent of that implication.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, sorry for our male listeners, Like I

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Speaker 2: don't mean to be you know, like punching down on that,

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Speaker 2: but it is a female experience that certainly existed a

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Speaker 2: lot in my generation. And I do think does I mean,

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Speaker 2: I don't know that I've had anybody say this you

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Speaker 2: should smile more recently, but I remember, I think when

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Speaker 2: I was doing Saturday Night Live. When I was hosting

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Speaker 2: Saturday Night Live, I feel like I was walking down

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Speaker 2: the street. I kind of remember to meet David Spade,

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Speaker 2: maybe like maybe I was meet I feel like like

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Speaker 2: I feel like maybe it was to talk about the

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Speaker 2: monologue or whatever, but some stranger on the street said

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Speaker 2: to me, you should smile more, And I just I

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Speaker 2: think I was like in my head of like thinking

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Speaker 2: about all the work I had to do and thinking

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Speaker 2: about all the sketches and whatever, like you're just and

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Speaker 2: this invasiveness of like you don't, well, what what what

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Speaker 2: is me smiling or not smiling? Like what does it

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Speaker 2: have to do with you? I know it is not

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Speaker 2: context at all of what I am going through as

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Speaker 2: a person in this moment, And it is crazy that

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Speaker 2: I'm sure that I'm getting some of it. The piece

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Speaker 2: is wrong, but it was New York. It was around

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Speaker 2: Saturday Night Live, and that has to be thirty years ago.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And I just want to say I want to

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Speaker 3: jump in because you said I don't. I don't want

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Speaker 3: to punch down to our male listeners. First of all,

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Speaker 3: I don't think it's punching down to our male listeners,

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Speaker 3: because if you are a male listener and you're saying

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Speaker 3: be nice to someone, what the hell's wrong with you?

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Speaker 4: But two, I think this.

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Speaker 3: I actually know straight men in this industry who I

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Speaker 3: will not name out of respect, who have experienced women

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Speaker 3: in positions of power coming on to them very recently.

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Speaker 1: Wow, right here, that it is not being a female

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Speaker 1: that issue.

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Speaker 3: It's not exclusively a female issue, and I actually think

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Speaker 3: it's an issue that gets talked about maybe less because

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Speaker 3: women have dealt with it so much more and we're

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Speaker 3: we talk.

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Speaker 2: To each other about it privately and a lot.

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Speaker 3: And my male friends who have had this experience it

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Speaker 3: is it's really hard to know what to do to

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Speaker 3: be like, I'm hired, I'm in this snart, Like what

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Speaker 3: do I say?

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Speaker 1: Well, power dynamics is always a really interesting thing when

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Speaker 1: it comes to how it makes us feel. Where it

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Speaker 1: comes in in the office or in just in any

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Speaker 1: sort of situation when someone's in a position of power

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Speaker 1: and someone isn't, and then they feel like, what do

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Speaker 1: I need to do to please this person because they

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Speaker 1: have higher power over me. But that makes me think

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Speaker 1: of the Lynette and Tom situation in this episode, and

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Speaker 1: it's not a sexual thing, but the fact that Tom

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Speaker 1: is up for this VP promotion and he wants it,

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Speaker 1: and Lynette, you know, encourages him to go for it

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Speaker 1: and and is championing him for this promotion and then

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Speaker 1: learns that it comes with him being away more now

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Speaker 1: he's going to be in charge of the West Coast office,

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Speaker 1: and her sort of unpacking the fact that Okay, now

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Speaker 1: I don't know that I want this for you. I

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Speaker 1: thought that was really interesting and I feel like I

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Speaker 1: have I could feel relating to the idea of giving

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Speaker 1: someone advice and then realizing that my my advice might

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Speaker 1: have been conditional, and maybe I can't stand by my

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Speaker 1: advice anymore because now that I know the full picture,

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Speaker 1: it's out of my own self interest. I wouldn't have

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Speaker 1: given that advice, which isn't a very good thing necessarily,

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Speaker 1: But I thought that was an interesting moment for those characters.

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Speaker 2: I also think, like I'm wondering in You're since you're

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Speaker 2: the married one of the of the three of us,

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Speaker 2: Like I mean, I found what was real about this

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Speaker 2: Lynette and Tom moment is is you really just I

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Speaker 2: felt like got a very honest look at Okay. She

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Speaker 2: has given up her very well go career that was

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Speaker 2: going very well to raise kids, and you can tell

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Speaker 2: that she was great at her job and she loved

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Speaker 2: her job, and she misses her job, and she probably

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Speaker 2: she has from the pilot, and I think she's going

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Speaker 2: to feel that way the whole way through the run

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Speaker 2: of the show. And Tom, you can see in his

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Speaker 2: masculinity he wants to succeed. It's important to him to

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Speaker 2: succeed at the job because it is feeding his ego

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Speaker 2: and he needs that. And yet you can see that

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Speaker 2: they love each other and you can see that they

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Speaker 2: both wanted this big family, but it is such a

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Speaker 2: mess and so complicated, and it kind of feels like

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Speaker 2: no one is going to get what they want. And

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Speaker 2: I mean, I look at myself and I go listen,

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Speaker 2: I'm not in a relationship. I don't have to negotiate.

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Speaker 2: If I want to move somewhere, I can move there.

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Speaker 2: If I want to get a certain job, I can

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Speaker 2: get it. Like there's and you know, I would have

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Speaker 2: to probably go to therapy and think about like why

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Speaker 2: did I do that? I mean, I'm sure I've played

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Speaker 2: a role in why I've been single for so long.

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Speaker 2: I'm not saying I'm unhappy about it, but it is

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Speaker 2: interesting that I've put myself in a position where I'm

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Speaker 2: not dealing with that. So when you look at marriage

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Speaker 2: and you're both actors and you're going to be a mom, like,

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Speaker 2: how do you guys navigate? Like what the dreams are

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Speaker 2: and where the future's going? And have you had those conversations?

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Speaker 1: We have had those conversations, and we do continue to

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Speaker 1: have them, especially in preparation of having a daughter and

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Speaker 1: navigating how we prioritize ourselves our careers. You know, for example,

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Speaker 1: he's been on a television show that's in Vancouver, and

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Speaker 1: that's been present during my pregnancy and trying to figure

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Speaker 1: out what time do we request to have him here

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Speaker 1: so that he can be a part of this experience

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Speaker 1: in accompany me to doctor's appointments, because he's just as

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Speaker 1: much responsible for this baby as I am, even though

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Speaker 1: she is growing in my body, and so it does

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Speaker 1: come up a lot and talk about it, and you know,

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Speaker 1: I think so much of it will be navigating in

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Speaker 1: real time. I am lucky to be with someone who

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Speaker 1: feels equal partnership in that regard. Doesn't expect me, I mean,

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Speaker 1: God doesn't expect me to bear more of that weight. However,

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Speaker 1: I think naturally, you got to be really cognizant of

401
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Speaker 1: avoiding those traps because I see it happen. I see

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Speaker 1: it happen in a lot of and I will say

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Speaker 1: typically heterosexual relationships where the woman becomes more of the

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Speaker 1: caretaker and nurturer and therefore automatically slips into having more

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Speaker 1: responsibility over the child just because they're like doing it,

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Speaker 1: and those roles just are so embedded in us. And

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Speaker 1: I do think from my generation it's gotten better, but

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Speaker 1: it's not. It's not great. I don't think there's a

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Speaker 1: ton of parody there yet gender wise. But I also

410
00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:03,679
Speaker 1: think another thing that's really interesting with the Lenet and

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Speaker 1: Tom things that she was clearly so shiny in her

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Speaker 1: work as an executive, Like she clearly was magnetic and

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Speaker 1: successful and strong and just naturally good at it and

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Speaker 1: earned it. Not just naturally that comes back to the

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Speaker 1: luck thing, but probably worked really hard to get there,

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Speaker 1: and he might just be okay at his job.

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Speaker 4: I want to jump in here because I agree. I

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Speaker 4: feel like.

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Speaker 3: You see Lynette's work prowess in the way she says, well,

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Speaker 3: did you ask for the promotion? Like, oh, you were

421
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Speaker 3: just sitting around on your hands hoping you were going

422
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Speaker 3: to get the promotion. Tom's been passed over for a promotion.

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Speaker 3: He's upset that it's been given to someone else, who

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Speaker 3: then ends up having a heart attack later on a

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Speaker 3: baseball field. I'm lucky for him, but Tom says, well,

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Speaker 3: he knows how hard I work. He skirts her question

427
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Speaker 3: and the answer to the question is he didn't ask

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Speaker 3: for it. And Lynette strikes me very much, probably partially

429
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Speaker 3: because she was a woman killing it in the workplace,

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Speaker 3: and you really have to double advocate for yourself as

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Speaker 3: a woman in more male dominated fields, but as someone

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Speaker 3: who did not sit around waiting for opportunities to come

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Speaker 3: to them, but who said what she wanted and sounds

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Speaker 3: like a lot of the time got it. And I

435
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Speaker 3: think that to me, that conversation between them plants such

436
00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:32,760
Speaker 3: a seed of resentment that then when he does end

437
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Speaker 3: up getting the promotion, because the original guy gets sick

438
00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:38,360
Speaker 3: and he gets picked and it's so funny that it's

439
00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 3: actually the boss's wife that kind of puts him in

440
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 3: for it. I and I'm not trying to have a

441
00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,840
Speaker 3: cynical view of Lynette, but I think it is much

442
00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:49,359
Speaker 3: less about how long Tom's going to be away and

443
00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:51,600
Speaker 3: that she's going to be more overwhelmed with the kids.

444
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:54,359
Speaker 3: And I feel the seed of resent that here is

445
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:57,119
Speaker 3: her husband who is maybe just okay at his job

446
00:23:57,400 --> 00:23:59,840
Speaker 3: that she was really great at, that she quit to

447
00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:03,359
Speaker 3: be staying at home now getting more opportunities that she

448
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:07,360
Speaker 3: wanted that she would have had, that he didn't even

449
00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:10,639
Speaker 3: have the balls to ask for until she told him to.

450
00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:12,760
Speaker 3: And I think, and I don't think this is a

451
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,639
Speaker 3: good trait in a partnership. I think you can't be

452
00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:18,480
Speaker 3: resentful of your partner's successes. I mean, you can be,

453
00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:20,680
Speaker 3: but I really think you have to keep it to

454
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:24,520
Speaker 3: yourself or put it in your therapist's office and not

455
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:26,520
Speaker 3: bring that into your relationship if you want to have

456
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:31,760
Speaker 3: a healthy, successful relationship, Because I think if you want

457
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:34,000
Speaker 3: your partner to be happy and you want to be happy,

458
00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:37,679
Speaker 3: you both need to be the brightest, shiniest, fullest versions

459
00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:42,280
Speaker 3: of yourself. But I empathize, I empathize with Lynette's what

460
00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:43,600
Speaker 3: seems to be coming up for her.

461
00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:47,439
Speaker 2: It sort of feeds into like an overall take on

462
00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:50,199
Speaker 2: the episode that Marryout Alice talks about at the end,

463
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:53,959
Speaker 2: which is where she says, like all of Suburbia is

464
00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:57,919
Speaker 2: filled with lies, you know, with white lies, the lies

465
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:00,920
Speaker 2: we tell each other, I mean, ourselves about like are

466
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:05,640
Speaker 2: we happy? You know, are we satisfied? And we go

467
00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 2: to bed like feeling these secret untruth and just sort

468
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:15,760
Speaker 2: of hope that will dream them into a morning where

469
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:19,359
Speaker 2: they don't exist anymore. But they do, and I feel

470
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:21,400
Speaker 2: like a lot of people function like this.

471
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:24,280
Speaker 3: Oh, I so agree, and I think, I mean, I

472
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:27,040
Speaker 3: want to circle back to it in a bit, the

473
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:30,320
Speaker 3: idea of white lies and they place that those exist

474
00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 3: for us in society. But to your bigger point of

475
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:35,920
Speaker 3: questions like are we happy or if we're thinking about

476
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:39,240
Speaker 3: the Justin character, that then ultimately becomes Justin and Andrew

477
00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:43,600
Speaker 3: Breeson questioning their sexuality, and I mean, I think they

478
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:46,879
Speaker 3: seem pretty gay to me, but not wanting to like

479
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 3: embrace that part of themselves. I think about this amazing

480
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:55,680
Speaker 3: thing that my therapist has said to me, that the

481
00:25:55,720 --> 00:26:01,400
Speaker 3: burden of action rests on those with awareness. And I'll

482
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,040
Speaker 3: say it again because it's a thing I have to repeat.

483
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:07,359
Speaker 3: The burden of action rests on those with awareness. So

484
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 3: if I acknowledge to myself, I'm not happy. If I

485
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:16,159
Speaker 3: acknowledge myself, okay, I'm queer, I now have that awareness,

486
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 3: and unfortunately the burden of doing something about that awareness

487
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:24,680
Speaker 3: now rests on me. So I think in the question

488
00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:27,639
Speaker 3: of like am I happy or not, so many people

489
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,560
Speaker 3: maybe go to bed. I'm certainly guilty of this, sometimes

490
00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:34,200
Speaker 3: go to bed with the lie of yeah, I'm happy

491
00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:37,600
Speaker 3: because if I said I'm not happy about this situation.

492
00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:40,840
Speaker 3: Now I have to take action against it, and that

493
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:42,639
Speaker 3: is really really hard.

494
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 2: I put it in a little bit of different words.

495
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,320
Speaker 2: Instead of action, I think the word that comes in

496
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 2: which I like this a lot, I mean, it's better,

497
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:55,360
Speaker 2: but I think I interpret that with the word responsibility.

498
00:26:55,800 --> 00:27:01,120
Speaker 2: Like people don't like to take responsibilit for where they are.

499
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:04,920
Speaker 2: They like to be the victim. They like to blame others.

500
00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:09,879
Speaker 2: It's really difficult to look at, you know, your own

501
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,160
Speaker 2: unhappiness if we just use that sort of general word

502
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:16,680
Speaker 2: and to go like, how am I responsible for this? Well?

503
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:19,560
Speaker 3: And then also if you do accept responsibility, because I

504
00:27:19,560 --> 00:27:21,520
Speaker 3: think the only reason I'd want to push back on

505
00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:24,720
Speaker 3: that phrasing is because I feel like respon it implies

506
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,240
Speaker 3: a level of like you've done things wrong, which is

507
00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 3: your class amo you love to think that you've done

508
00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:33,120
Speaker 3: something wrong and put shame and guilt on yourself.

509
00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:36,119
Speaker 2: Thank you. But it's a lifelong skill.

510
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,680
Speaker 3: But I think there is nothing wrong. I mean, okay,

511
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 3: we can totally dive into the the Andrew and Justin storyline,

512
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:49,439
Speaker 3: like in the example of recognizing your queer, there's so

513
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:52,879
Speaker 3: nothing wrong with that. But now you've acknowledged it and

514
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:54,520
Speaker 3: you have to do something about it. You know, you

515
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:56,480
Speaker 3: either have to come out to your family, you have

516
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 3: to come out to your friends. Maybe they're not all

517
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:01,320
Speaker 3: going to have realcy actions that you're going to like,

518
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,160
Speaker 3: You're going to have to take action against the fallout

519
00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:09,000
Speaker 3: with that you're going to embrace. Ultimately, I would say,

520
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 3: as a queer person, a more fulfilling and happy self

521
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:15,640
Speaker 3: because you're living in your full self and your full

522
00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:16,639
Speaker 3: truth and identity.

523
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:21,639
Speaker 4: And there can be a lot of upheaval.

524
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:24,680
Speaker 3: Especially in certain types of families, which obviously Andrew, as

525
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:27,280
Speaker 3: we can tell from the condom conversation with Brie, isn't

526
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:29,680
Speaker 3: a very conservative family, and I'm not one hundred percent

527
00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:35,520
Speaker 3: sure about Justin's family, and I think that that can

528
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 3: be challenging. I mean, I'm thinking about even when I

529
00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:41,400
Speaker 3: came out to Graham and Grandpa and how you know,

530
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 3: it was obviously my family's super liberal and was not

531
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 3: really a big deal to.

532
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:49,960
Speaker 2: But I had some I probably had even more reservations,

533
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:53,480
Speaker 2: I think than you did, because I was as their

534
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:58,560
Speaker 2: reaction would be. Yeah, I was very protective of you, and.

535
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 3: My grandparents are very conservative, the liberal but they're very concerned.

536
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 1: Right, And we've talked about how they're not the most

537
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 1: emotionally available open people in this right way, right.

538
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:09,240
Speaker 2: And I know that they, you know, love their granddaughter,

539
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:12,239
Speaker 2: but you know, there's a lot of issues there, and

540
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:15,120
Speaker 2: I just my biggest thing is your mom was to

541
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 2: protect you from having to deal with a dramatic situation

542
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:22,120
Speaker 2: that whatever. So I was for a long time, I was.

543
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 2: I I mean, I don't think I said don't tell them.

544
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:27,560
Speaker 3: I think I mean I think we did go back

545
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 3: and forth a little bit. Yeah, I have to say,

546
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 3: which was interesting because it was, like I said, it

547
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 3: was no big deal to like come out to my

548
00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:39,720
Speaker 3: friends and to my family, my like immediate parents, but

549
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:42,360
Speaker 3: but yeah, my grandparents, I said. For a few months,

550
00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 3: I said to my mom, hey, I really I want

551
00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 3: to tell them this. And I have to say, my

552
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:49,560
Speaker 3: whole first relationship with like my first like serious girlfriend,

553
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 3: I did not tell my grandparents that. I completely, for

554
00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:55,840
Speaker 3: like a year, kept that to myself. I mean, I

555
00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:57,160
Speaker 3: don't see them all the time, so it wasn't like

556
00:29:57,200 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 3: I was sitting on a gigantic secret. But they had

557
00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:03,160
Speaker 3: met the last man I ever dated, which was years

558
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:05,920
Speaker 3: ago now, and they knew him, and then they knew

559
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 3: that we broke up, and then for a long time

560
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:10,520
Speaker 3: they would ask me like, so you dating any guys?

561
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:13,040
Speaker 3: Are you going out with any guys? And I'd be like, no, Grandma,

562
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 3: I'm not going out with any guys. Yeah, and really

563
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 3: skirted it. And then you know, my ex girlfriend of

564
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 3: the time and I broke up and I was dating

565
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:27,200
Speaker 3: more women, and then I got into another serious relationship

566
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:28,719
Speaker 3: with a woman and I said to my mom, I

567
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:30,560
Speaker 3: was like, listen, this is really now something that I

568
00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:32,920
Speaker 3: want them to meet her, Like I want her to

569
00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:35,800
Speaker 3: come to holiday things. I'm gonna tell them. I mean,

570
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:38,160
Speaker 3: they're not gonna They're not going anywhere, and they I

571
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:40,160
Speaker 3: want them to know this because also I'm really in

572
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:43,040
Speaker 3: a point in my life where I just want to

573
00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 3: be known I want and that has like not even

574
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 3: just identity wise at all, like who I am, my failings,

575
00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 3: my successes. I only want relationships in my life with

576
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:59,320
Speaker 3: people who know me completely. There's this amazing Roca poem,

577
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:01,600
Speaker 3: my favorite Poe it, and he has this great line

578
00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:05,960
Speaker 3: where he says, I want to unfold because anywhere I

579
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:10,520
Speaker 3: am folded, there I am a lie. And I have

580
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 3: been thinking about that a lot recently. I just I

581
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 3: want relationships where I feel entirely unfolded. And I think

582
00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:18,360
Speaker 3: at the time, coming out to my grandparents that felt

583
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:20,400
Speaker 3: like a fold that I didn't want to be feeling

584
00:31:20,440 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 3: like I was living in a lie. So I said

585
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:23,800
Speaker 3: to my mom, I have to unfold. I have to

586
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:26,000
Speaker 3: tell them about this part of my identity. And she

587
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 3: was like, oh god, okay. And we go over to

588
00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:32,160
Speaker 3: their house and we walk in and they have Fox

589
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 3: News playing on the banner like it's muted, but on

590
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 3: the banner across the TV it says like traditional family

591
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 3: value is corrected.

592
00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:43,600
Speaker 4: No liberal media, and that's like going across the banner.

593
00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:46,440
Speaker 2: And I was like, I can't write it. You can't know.

594
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:49,840
Speaker 3: I'm like, well, there's no time like the presence. And

595
00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 3: so I sat down and I said, hey, you know,

596
00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 3: and I thought I phrased it pretty well if anyone

597
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,040
Speaker 3: is in this similar situation, I said, you know, I

598
00:31:57,800 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 3: wanted to tell you, guys, I'm really excited to tell

599
00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 3: you I met someone actually and I really love them

600
00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 3: and I'm in a relationship with them.

601
00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:05,640
Speaker 4: And my grandma.

602
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:07,680
Speaker 3: Immediately lit up because she's like, oh, thank god, you're

603
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 3: not single like your mom. Like I'm so, I'm so

604
00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:12,680
Speaker 3: glad there's my mom.

605
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 2: It's throwing me under the bush. Gosh, okay, it's another episode.

606
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 3: And I said, yeah, you know, And I said, it's honestly,

607
00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 3: it's silly that I'm even nervous to tell you this

608
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:25,160
Speaker 3: because I'm so happy that I'm in a loving relationship.

609
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 3: But it's with a woman, and this is her name,

610
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 3: and my grandma, I got to say, for all their shortcomings,

611
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:37,120
Speaker 3: really surprised me. She did not miss a beat. She goes,

612
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:41,640
Speaker 3: I am so happy that you were in a loving relationship.

613
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:43,760
Speaker 3: It is so important to be in a relationship with

614
00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 3: someone who's in love with you. And then, of course

615
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:47,200
Speaker 3: she immediately pivots and looks at my grandpa was sitting

616
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 3: next to her and goes, because if you're not in

617
00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 3: a relationship with someone you're in love with, you end

618
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:53,600
Speaker 3: up fifty years married to someone you're miserable with. And

619
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 3: I go, okay, I feel like we've moved on from

620
00:32:56,320 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 3: me being gay a bit too quickly.

621
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 1: From traditional family values to Emerson Square to.

622
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:09,880
Speaker 2: The audience knows and clarity why I am so fucked off?

623
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:10,320
Speaker 3: Guy?

624
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 1: Wow, Well, thank you for sharing all of that. I

625
00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:19,840
Speaker 1: love the idea of you know, you you saying that

626
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 1: the however you phrased it, or your therapist phrases it.

627
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:25,280
Speaker 1: And I think it's a really interesting thing that you

628
00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:27,920
Speaker 1: reframing it as responsibility and then you pushing back and

629
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:31,760
Speaker 1: I don't know, Yeah, I mean action I think inspires motion,

630
00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:34,080
Speaker 1: you know, which is kind of nice. It's like it

631
00:33:34,720 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 1: says there's something to do about this. And I but

632
00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,600
Speaker 1: I also think the idea of responsibility gives you ownership

633
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:44,440
Speaker 1: as well. And I've always thought it's such an odd

634
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:47,960
Speaker 1: thing for those who are, you know, part of the

635
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:54,120
Speaker 1: LGBTQ a community that they have to come out it's something.

636
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:55,440
Speaker 1: And the thing is is like that can be a

637
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 1: beautiful thing. And I have so many friends in that

638
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:02,360
Speaker 1: community who it is eventually a thing. They get to

639
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:04,840
Speaker 1: share their identity with those who they want to know

640
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:06,920
Speaker 1: that part of them. But it is such an inherently

641
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:10,360
Speaker 1: strange thing that falls as a burden. I would say

642
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 1: on that a member of that community that I now

643
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:15,359
Speaker 1: have to announce who I want to sleep with.

644
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 3: Wild the number of like straight men I have had

645
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 3: honestly shortly after like asking me out and we'd be like, oh, no,

646
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:26,000
Speaker 3: thank you, Like I'm queer, I'm not interested. And they

647
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:29,400
Speaker 3: go like, oh, like when did you know you were gay?

648
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:31,520
Speaker 3: And I always go, you know, when did you know.

649
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:32,160
Speaker 4: That you were straight?

650
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:32,840
Speaker 1: Yeah?

651
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, well like when when did you know? Because I

652
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:39,640
Speaker 3: think we don't we we don't ask. It is the

653
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:43,759
Speaker 3: assumed baseline heteron It's why it's called heteronormativity.

654
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:45,200
Speaker 4: It's the assumed norm.

655
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, that we don't ask kids to just say who

656
00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 3: you like?

657
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:52,600
Speaker 4: And I hear, what's the thing we shouldn't be?

658
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 3: Because that can and that can change over time and

659
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 3: you can, like, I mean, the label queer is amazing,

660
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,319
Speaker 3: and I kind of feel like I hope and I

661
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:02,319
Speaker 3: probably won't even see this in my lifetime, but I

662
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:06,200
Speaker 3: hope that queerness becomes the heteronormative standard because I think

663
00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 3: the idea of queerness being an embracing label to say

664
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:12,640
Speaker 3: I can be attracted to a lot of different people

665
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:14,120
Speaker 3: and it can depend on the circle.

666
00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:16,879
Speaker 2: I just also think that we you know, it will

667
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:18,000
Speaker 2: not be in my lifetime.

668
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 1: I was thinking about how another big truth facing moment

669
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 1: in this episode for some of our cast, some of

670
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:36,680
Speaker 1: our characters is Gabrielle and Carlo's finally coming to having

671
00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:38,800
Speaker 1: to be honest with each other and face the realities

672
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,800
Speaker 1: of we can't afford our lifestyle anymore, we can't probably

673
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:45,200
Speaker 1: afford our house anymore. Which, yeah, like, okay, I think

674
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:48,320
Speaker 1: that's been pretty apparent. I don't think Gabrielle's modeling gigs,

675
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:51,319
Speaker 1: laying on a mattress or covering that mortgage, right, But

676
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:54,000
Speaker 1: so the money's running out and they have to face

677
00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 1: this and they have this nice scene on the porch.

678
00:35:57,200 --> 00:35:59,279
Speaker 1: Hi Lar, I loved this scene too. I thought it

679
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:02,400
Speaker 1: was a an actually redeeming moment for Gabrielle.

680
00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 2: But I was gonna say a little strange because I

681
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:08,799
Speaker 2: do feel like the Gabrielle we've been seeing, the one

682
00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:11,640
Speaker 2: that was could not have been meaner to the housekeeper,

683
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:16,600
Speaker 2: the one that like is so unbelievably selfish that she

684
00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:20,120
Speaker 2: would have this affair with an underage high school student.

685
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:25,400
Speaker 2: You know, like, these are not great character traits. And

686
00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 2: you know, maybe, as James was saying, and as we've

687
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:32,080
Speaker 2: said with some of the other guests that we've had,

688
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 2: the evolution of some of these characters comes probably from

689
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 2: the writers see what the talent is doing, and then

690
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 2: the talent informs what the writer's right next. And I

691
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:49,799
Speaker 2: have to believe that there was some influence of what

692
00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:54,480
Speaker 2: Eva as a human brings to Gabby that must have

693
00:36:54,600 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 2: begun to turn this character around, because she was so awful,

694
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:03,799
Speaker 2: and this is the first episode where we see some

695
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 2: true sense of humanity.

696
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 1: Again and a moral compass pointed in remotely the right direction.

697
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:14,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, however, maybe unearned or abrupt this turn for Gabby

698
00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:18,080
Speaker 3: feels it did. I did like the scene as a

699
00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:20,120
Speaker 3: scene a lot, and it brought up questions for me

700
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:24,480
Speaker 3: of what does home mean to you?

701
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:26,240
Speaker 4: Like is home?

702
00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:31,680
Speaker 3: Is home a physical place? And if it's not a

703
00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:35,120
Speaker 3: physical place, what is it? And also how do we

704
00:37:35,239 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 3: reconcile life changing when we don't expect it to change.

705
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 1: I think that's a great question about is home a

706
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:47,719
Speaker 1: physical place? I would say no. For me, I have

707
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 1: moved so much in my life. I mean, really, we

708
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:54,920
Speaker 1: have moved as a family, Like as a young kid,

709
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 1: we moved a lot. I've been done many big cross

710
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:01,000
Speaker 1: country moves back and forth from the east to the

711
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 1: west coast. I'm somebody who really enjoys leaving spaces and

712
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:10,520
Speaker 1: creating a new space somewhere else or even changing up

713
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,719
Speaker 1: my furniture in my house, I would constantly do you

714
00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:15,960
Speaker 1: relate to that? I feel like you do. Yeah, I

715
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 1: would rearrange the furniture for no reason. I would get

716
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 1: this impulse to do it, and it would make me

717
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:27,800
Speaker 1: feel really satisfied and fulfilled and whatever. That's psychology deeper there.

718
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:30,120
Speaker 1: But so no, I don't think of home as a

719
00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:33,200
Speaker 1: physical location, though I do think of it a little

720
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:36,239
Speaker 1: bit differently now going into being a mom, because I'm

721
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:39,440
Speaker 1: so aware that this house that my husband and I

722
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:42,439
Speaker 1: just moved into this year, and again my approach to homes,

723
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:44,040
Speaker 1: it's not like, Okay, now we're living in this house

724
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:45,719
Speaker 1: and this is our forever home. I never think of

725
00:38:45,760 --> 00:38:48,640
Speaker 1: a place as a forever place, but it does feel

726
00:38:48,640 --> 00:38:51,120
Speaker 1: like maybe the most important place now because this is

727
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:53,879
Speaker 1: the place that my daughter forever will know as her

728
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:57,319
Speaker 1: first home. And so I feel differently about home right

729
00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:00,120
Speaker 1: home right now. But no, in for the most part, No,

730
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:01,359
Speaker 1: I don't think of home as a physoce it.

731
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:04,600
Speaker 2: Is a home is a place for me that holds memories.

732
00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 2: But I do have to say that got really challenged

733
00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:10,680
Speaker 2: last year with the fires, and this was the first

734
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:16,399
Speaker 2: time that I had this feeling so viscerally because even

735
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 2: though we were in not where the main fire zones were,

736
00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:24,400
Speaker 2: we did get evacuated for twenty four hours because there

737
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:27,439
Speaker 2: were two fires on either side of where we were,

738
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:30,279
Speaker 2: and if the wind had gone the wrong way, it

739
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:34,440
Speaker 2: could have been bad. So we got the alert that

740
00:39:34,480 --> 00:39:39,520
Speaker 2: you had to get out and evaluating that. Like in

741
00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:42,480
Speaker 2: the moment, I had no electricity. I hadn't had electricity

742
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:45,120
Speaker 2: in three days at that point already, and so it

743
00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:48,120
Speaker 2: was dark, it was six pm. I couldn't really see anything,

744
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:50,440
Speaker 2: and I'm by myself. I'm sort of running around like

745
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:55,840
Speaker 2: what do I take? What's important? And then the only

746
00:39:55,880 --> 00:39:57,799
Speaker 2: thing I took? Do you know what I took? So

747
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:02,000
Speaker 2: my daughter is the best card like on the planet,

748
00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:05,560
Speaker 2: and I have every birthday card that she's ever written me,

749
00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:08,120
Speaker 2: and they're up on the bookshelf in my bedroom. That

750
00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:11,080
Speaker 2: is all that I took. I mean, on my passport,

751
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:14,560
Speaker 2: I took I and the cat, Yes, and the animals,

752
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:16,960
Speaker 2: of course, but those cards were the only thing that

753
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:18,840
Speaker 2: I took. And then I went and picked up Grandma

754
00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:21,600
Speaker 2: and Grandpa were also evacuated, so I picked them up,

755
00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 2: and my mom my hoarding, mom, I need this grocery

756
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:29,680
Speaker 2: tag and I need this this, you know, bottle cap,

757
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:33,239
Speaker 2: bottle cap, I need redever. Yeah, So we went to

758
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:35,879
Speaker 2: stay at a friend's house and when we got out

759
00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:37,680
Speaker 2: of the car, it was a long drive to get

760
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:39,840
Speaker 2: to where we were staying. When we got out of

761
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:42,360
Speaker 2: the car, I got a message from my girlfriend that

762
00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:44,759
Speaker 2: lives across the street from me, and she said, oh

763
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:48,480
Speaker 2: my god, they've just dropped water from the helicopter on

764
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:51,359
Speaker 2: our backyard. So she lives we live in the hills,

765
00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 2: and she lives down the street but across the street,

766
00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:56,640
Speaker 2: and she lives more on the side that's going to

767
00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:59,719
Speaker 2: go into the like national forest. So I get that

768
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:02,279
Speaker 2: the water got dropped on her house and not my house.

769
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:06,160
Speaker 2: But still when that that was such a significant I

770
00:41:06,200 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 2: was like, oh my god, they're dropping water on my neighborhood,

771
00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:14,320
Speaker 2: Like that's this is actually real, like this could actually happen.

772
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 2: And I kind of lived through the what would I

773
00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:23,400
Speaker 2: do if it all burned down and it felt like

774
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:29,680
Speaker 2: like unsurvivable, and then there was this feeling of like,

775
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:36,200
Speaker 2: well then I would I would just have to move

776
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:38,120
Speaker 2: on to a different part of my life. And she

777
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:40,399
Speaker 2: knows how much I love cornwall, and I started thinking, well,

778
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:43,080
Speaker 2: I guess this would be my sign, and like I thought, well,

779
00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:44,640
Speaker 2: this will be my sign to just pick up and

780
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:47,360
Speaker 2: start making new memories. So to wrap up like home,

781
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:51,359
Speaker 2: I think of my home having been single, having had

782
00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:53,840
Speaker 2: my daughter, and all of our Christmases and our Easters

783
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 2: and our Halloweens and her growing up and moving. Everything

784
00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:01,160
Speaker 2: happened in that house, and I very much even though

785
00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:03,680
Speaker 2: I there's probably a big part of me that should

786
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:06,240
Speaker 2: sell the house and do something else because it's probably

787
00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 2: too bit all the things, but I can't let go

788
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:12,920
Speaker 2: of the memories. I can't let go of the home.

789
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:16,360
Speaker 2: So even though I know it could also be my

790
00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:19,160
Speaker 2: home in my Vinta Scooby do Van, I know I

791
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:20,839
Speaker 2: could make a home out of that. I could make

792
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:23,600
Speaker 2: a home out of nothing. I guess that's a good

793
00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:26,360
Speaker 2: thing to know about yourself. If you can make a

794
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:29,120
Speaker 2: home out of very very little and still feel like

795
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:31,560
Speaker 2: imagine that you could find love and happiness in it,

796
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:34,560
Speaker 2: then you're gonna be good. Because whatever happens to you,

797
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:38,880
Speaker 2: success or failure, if you know that the love and

798
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:42,840
Speaker 2: the happiness comes from something else, you're gonna be You're.

799
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:44,759
Speaker 3: Gonna feel that I really feel that my home is

800
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 3: in my relationships, Like I don't just mean romantic related,

801
00:42:48,560 --> 00:42:51,680
Speaker 3: in my friendships and my familial relationships. And I do

802
00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:54,480
Speaker 3: feel like especially I don't know at this moment in

803
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:55,839
Speaker 3: my life, I feel like I'm in a lot of

804
00:42:55,880 --> 00:43:00,360
Speaker 3: like growth and change and expansion and work potentially taking

805
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:03,640
Speaker 3: me away from California for a period of time. And

806
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:07,920
Speaker 3: I'm actually I am someone who likes my creature comforts,

807
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 3: and I love my home and I've been in my

808
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:11,600
Speaker 3: home that I live in now for the last five

809
00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:14,839
Speaker 3: years and I like to make it mine. But I'm

810
00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:17,840
Speaker 3: in this phase right now where I just want less.

811
00:43:18,080 --> 00:43:20,600
Speaker 3: I've gotten rid of so much stuff. I've gotten rid

812
00:43:20,600 --> 00:43:22,640
Speaker 3: of so many clothes, I've gotten rid of furniture. I

813
00:43:22,760 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 3: just feel like less and less attached shetting.

814
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:26,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm shedding.

815
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:28,600
Speaker 3: I've gotten less and less attached to physical things. I

816
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:29,960
Speaker 3: just bought a new pair of jeens, and I was like,

817
00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:31,600
Speaker 3: got rid of all my other jeens. I was like,

818
00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 3: all I want are these one pair of pants, Because

819
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:37,960
Speaker 3: I want to be able to let life and the

820
00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:41,840
Speaker 3: relationships and the joy and the opportunities in my life

821
00:43:41,920 --> 00:43:44,680
Speaker 3: become my home and take me where I need to

822
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:47,400
Speaker 3: be to live out those moments and not feel like

823
00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:49,359
Speaker 3: tethered to a physical place.

824
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:51,439
Speaker 2: Right now, I do think that's very healthy and right now,

825
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:54,600
Speaker 2: home for us is this is one version of my home.

826
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:56,920
Speaker 2: Can you do this podcast with you and all of

827
00:43:56,960 --> 00:43:57,600
Speaker 2: our listeners?

828
00:43:57,640 --> 00:43:59,640
Speaker 3: And well, I mean, Susan did find out that Mike

829
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 3: is a R and a drug dealer, but we're just

830
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,200
Speaker 3: gonna have to pick that up the next episode.

831
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:09,280
Speaker 2: Thanks for coming to our home here, yeah, and and

832
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:11,680
Speaker 2: and come home and visit us at home next next week.

833
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:15,040
Speaker 4: And we, as always, we are desperately devoted to you,