WEBVTT - I Smell Pop Culture: Milli Vanilli 0:00:00.680 --> 0:00:16.400 I Am all in again. Oh, I guess you. 0:00:17.760 --> 0:00:23.439 I Smell pop Culture with Eastern Allen and iHeartRadio podcast. Hey, everybody, 0:00:23.680 --> 0:00:26.479 do you smell that? Do you smell what I'm smelling? 0:00:26.800 --> 0:00:29.240 My name's Easton Allen. This is I smell pop culture. 0:00:29.280 --> 0:00:32.160 That is what I'm smelling. Spoiler alert, I'm smelling pop 0:00:32.200 --> 0:00:34.440 culture and you're smelling it too. This is the I 0:00:34.520 --> 0:00:38.760 Am all In podcast where we celebrate Gilmore Girls. We 0:00:38.800 --> 0:00:42.320 go to stars Hollow, we live amongst our favorite people 0:00:42.479 --> 0:00:47.199 and on this show. If you're just joining us, if 0:00:47.240 --> 0:00:49.800 you forgot to delete the episode before you hit play, 0:00:50.159 --> 0:00:52.199 if you're waiting for the Scott episodes, you're waiting for 0:00:52.240 --> 0:00:54.920 Gilmore Girls Gazette, thank you first of all for keeping 0:00:55.000 --> 0:00:57.760 us around hitting play on that on that podcast app 0:00:58.360 --> 0:00:58.960 so you know. 0:00:59.040 --> 0:01:00.720 Also the good reviews. 0:01:01.240 --> 0:01:02.920 I saw a couple of these come in, But I 0:01:03.000 --> 0:01:05.280 just want to remind you again. If you're enjoying what 0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:08.600 you're hearing, go to Apple, go to iTunes, tell them 0:01:08.600 --> 0:01:11.200 that pop Culture with Easton is your favorite part of 0:01:11.200 --> 0:01:14.679 this podcast, and leave five stars. We would appreciate it. 0:01:14.720 --> 0:01:16.560 But here's what we do here. Here's what we do 0:01:16.640 --> 0:01:19.959 on the show. We take the pop culture moments from 0:01:20.000 --> 0:01:22.919 Gilmore Girls, and we go so deep. We dive into 0:01:23.000 --> 0:01:27.959 them with both legs. We step into these pop culture moments. 0:01:28.080 --> 0:01:29.880 We talk to the people that made them real. We 0:01:29.920 --> 0:01:33.000 talk to the people behind these pop culture references and 0:01:33.040 --> 0:01:34.880 Gilmore Girls. And that's what we're doing again this week. 0:01:34.880 --> 0:01:36.920 This is a big one, everybody, This is a really 0:01:36.920 --> 0:01:41.480 big one. We're going to season three, episode nineteen keg Max. 0:01:42.240 --> 0:01:46.360 Remember that episode, Big House Party at Kyle's house. Lane's 0:01:46.360 --> 0:01:49.919 band is performing, So they're at the house, they're getting 0:01:49.920 --> 0:01:54.040 set up, they're setting up the drums, and Zach tells 0:01:54.080 --> 0:01:56.720 Brian move back more because when I do my double 0:01:56.800 --> 0:01:58.920 jump kick off the amp with slashing windmills, I'm going 0:01:59.000 --> 0:02:01.440 to need more room. And Lane says, well, don't do 0:02:01.520 --> 0:02:04.400 that then, and then Dave says, yeah, sounds a little 0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:07.880 too Milli Vanilli Zach, So, if you don't know who 0:02:07.960 --> 0:02:12.079 Milli Vanilli is, first of all, what's going on? What 0:02:12.200 --> 0:02:16.160 is going on? Milli Vanilli. They're a pop duo Fab 0:02:16.240 --> 0:02:21.480 mor Van and Rob pilattis in the late eighties, is 0:02:21.520 --> 0:02:23.360 like nineteen eighty eight, they put. 0:02:23.200 --> 0:02:24.040 Out an album. 0:02:24.360 --> 0:02:26.360 They put out a single called Girl You know it's true, 0:02:27.360 --> 0:02:32.280 huge hit, seven million albums. They sell just this massive, 0:02:32.400 --> 0:02:38.799 massive hit. But there's one issue. Rob and Fab are 0:02:38.840 --> 0:02:41.520 not the singers. You do not hear their voices on 0:02:41.560 --> 0:02:47.000 that album. They were lip syncing, and Milli Vanilli kind 0:02:47.000 --> 0:02:51.720 of became the poster boy for lack of a better term, 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:57.480 they became the example for lip syncing, for deception in music. 0:02:58.040 --> 0:03:00.679 It was a it's one of the crazy things that's 0:03:00.680 --> 0:03:04.080 ever happened. It's really insane that this how this all 0:03:04.120 --> 0:03:10.440 went down. They used studio performers to record the album, 0:03:10.919 --> 0:03:16.480 and then Rob and Fab became the visual representation of 0:03:16.520 --> 0:03:19.560 Millie Vanilli. So they would record, they would perform, and 0:03:19.600 --> 0:03:21.919 they'd have like a backing track that would play and 0:03:21.919 --> 0:03:24.120 they would lip sync and they'd perform it visually. And they're 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:28.679 incredible dancers, incredible performers, truly like remarkable, and that's why 0:03:28.720 --> 0:03:31.520 they got so big is because of their presence. But 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:34.800 then it all kind of came out that they held 0:03:34.800 --> 0:03:37.960 this press conference they announced that you are not listening 0:03:38.000 --> 0:03:40.480 to us when you look at Milli Vanilla, who you 0:03:40.560 --> 0:03:42.760 know is Milli Vanilli. They're not singing on this album, 0:03:43.160 --> 0:03:46.400 and it just became this whole scandal. Everything stopped. Arista 0:03:46.480 --> 0:03:50.360 Records deleted the album. They deleted it from there from 0:03:50.440 --> 0:03:53.760 their catalog. That's the biggest selling album of all time 0:03:53.800 --> 0:03:56.760 to be deleted by a record label. They won the 0:03:56.800 --> 0:03:59.400 Grammy for Best New Artists. They to give that Grammy back. 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:02.640 I think that's the only time the Grammys have rescinded 0:04:02.720 --> 0:04:03.920 in an award. 0:04:04.440 --> 0:04:05.520 It's really crazy. 0:04:06.760 --> 0:04:09.960 We're going to talk to fab more Van, one of 0:04:09.960 --> 0:04:14.240 the guys from Billy Vanilli, the surviving member uh, and 0:04:14.240 --> 0:04:17.240 we're going to find out how this happened. How does 0:04:17.240 --> 0:04:19.960 it get to this point? How like did they sign 0:04:20.080 --> 0:04:22.440 on to lip sync today? Know what was going on? 0:04:23.000 --> 0:04:25.120 How did it feel when everything came out? There's so 0:04:25.560 --> 0:04:28.040 it's so wild. It's such an interesting story, and we're 0:04:28.080 --> 0:04:30.320 going to get to the bottom of it. Fab is 0:04:30.440 --> 0:04:32.120 in the waiting room right now. We're going to bring 0:04:32.240 --> 0:04:33.839 him in. We're not going to make him wait any longer. 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:36.599 One of the greatest performers in all of pop culture history. 0:04:36.880 --> 0:04:38.560 What is going on? Fab more Van, thank you so 0:04:38.640 --> 0:04:39.320 much for doing this. 0:04:39.839 --> 0:04:43.080 Pleasure to meet pleasure always a pleasure to to travel 0:04:43.160 --> 0:04:48.040 down memory lane and do it in and now go 0:04:48.120 --> 0:04:51.279 back in time and then bust and bleede, you know, 0:04:51.600 --> 0:04:53.719 looking to what's going on in the future. You know, 0:04:54.080 --> 0:04:57.440 I'm traveling is something very familiar with. So let's go. 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:01.120 I love it, and you know we'll get into this. 0:05:01.160 --> 0:05:02.200 We have so much to talk about. 0:05:02.200 --> 0:05:02.320 You. 0:05:02.320 --> 0:05:05.040 You have one of the most fascinating stories of anyone 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:09.679 in music of all time. It's just everything you've done 0:05:09.800 --> 0:05:15.120 and been through is so interesting to me. And do 0:05:15.200 --> 0:05:18.800 you say time traveling? Like it's so interesting how music 0:05:18.839 --> 0:05:19.200 can do that? 0:05:19.320 --> 0:05:20.320 Right? Like it? 0:05:21.240 --> 0:05:24.400 Yeah, it really can. And so many people listen to 0:05:25.880 --> 0:05:28.800 Millie Vanilli and are brought back to such a specific 0:05:28.839 --> 0:05:31.760 moment in time. But I want to go back to 0:05:31.800 --> 0:05:35.640 the very beginning when you first met your collaborator, Rob plattis. 0:05:36.160 --> 0:05:38.560 What was that like? When when did you guys meet? 0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:40.279 Where did you meet? How that happen? 0:05:40.480 --> 0:05:43.840 We met long time ago in Munich, Germany, in Bevaria, 0:05:44.360 --> 0:05:47.520 That's where we met. And when we met, we were 0:05:48.560 --> 0:05:52.400 there were not many black people there, so here you go. 0:05:52.839 --> 0:05:55.719 You know, hip hop, the hip hop culture was rising. 0:05:55.920 --> 0:05:58.760 He was a breakdancer. I used to do pop luck 0:05:58.839 --> 0:06:03.240 but also was a trained answer and there lies I'll 0:06:03.320 --> 0:06:08.400 come and interest. You know, hip hop graffiti, rap, breakdance, 0:06:09.560 --> 0:06:14.279 pop in luck, you know, crush, grooven, hip hop movies 0:06:14.320 --> 0:06:18.400 coming out at the same time, and we associated with 0:06:18.800 --> 0:06:21.440 the culture very much and with each other because we 0:06:21.880 --> 0:06:25.200 you know, we were black kids like in Europe and 0:06:25.600 --> 0:06:27.680 this is how we just came together. 0:06:28.960 --> 0:06:31.360 So like, was that like an instant thing when you 0:06:31.400 --> 0:06:33.080 first met him, like like, oh, this is a guy 0:06:33.080 --> 0:06:34.680 I'm going to work well with, where we're going to 0:06:34.720 --> 0:06:35.520 be collaborators. 0:06:36.880 --> 0:06:41.479 Not really wow, And I was very competitive, you know, 0:06:41.600 --> 0:06:44.360 like I was on his turf and he was like, 0:06:44.640 --> 0:06:46.440 who's bad, dude? Because I was there with two other 0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:51.760 friends from Paris, and it was like, hmm, okay, you know, 0:06:51.920 --> 0:06:53.760 what does he want to do with Are they leaving? 0:06:53.880 --> 0:06:57.640 Are they staying? And you eventually we talked about it, 0:06:57.680 --> 0:07:01.760 and you know, he was really trying to to connect essentially. 0:07:01.800 --> 0:07:04.240 But you know, when you don't know people, you kind 0:07:04.240 --> 0:07:07.440 of become stand offish at first, and sometimes those are 0:07:07.440 --> 0:07:11.400 the best relationships because you're like, it's kind of like feisty, 0:07:11.560 --> 0:07:15.520 it's like competitive. But then once once we started talking 0:07:15.560 --> 0:07:18.600 to each other, we started to realize everything we have 0:07:18.680 --> 0:07:21.000 in common. We loved music, and we had to come 0:07:21.080 --> 0:07:25.040 and dream and together we said, hey, let's put your energy, 0:07:25.160 --> 0:07:28.120 let's put my energy, and let's see what happens. And 0:07:28.120 --> 0:07:31.760 then of course fireworks. You know, we went to a 0:07:31.840 --> 0:07:35.520 place like Wow and beyond, which you know sometime when 0:07:35.560 --> 0:07:41.680 you think about manifestation, you know, we surely manifested that 0:07:41.800 --> 0:07:47.360 thing because I even I even drew the costumes one 0:07:47.480 --> 0:07:50.080 Christmas and said this is what we're going to wear. 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:54.040 And then we found that envelope years later and it 0:07:54.160 --> 0:07:57.200 was exactly what we were wearing because we were involved 0:07:57.200 --> 0:08:00.360 in many aspects of what we were doing and from 0:08:00.880 --> 0:08:05.080 from you know, the show performance to the clothing design, 0:08:05.280 --> 0:08:08.280 with the costs and designers and all that stuff. So 0:08:08.640 --> 0:08:11.480 I believe in manifestation and the fact that I'm still 0:08:11.520 --> 0:08:15.280 here right now. You know, it's something that I've willed 0:08:15.960 --> 0:08:19.200 and it was unsure, you know, call it blind faith. 0:08:19.600 --> 0:08:23.080 And certain deeds are photogrounds for creativity. But I use 0:08:23.200 --> 0:08:27.320 creativity and music to keep me afloat, you know, really 0:08:27.400 --> 0:08:32.559 mentally physically. And that being said, I'm down traveler. That's 0:08:32.600 --> 0:08:36.760 what I am. With music as my magic carpet. 0:08:38.760 --> 0:08:39.280 I love it. 0:08:39.720 --> 0:08:44.120 Wow that I mean, that manifestation story is incredible. So 0:08:44.679 --> 0:08:49.280 you get approached by Frank Farian. Uh, yeah, the producer, 0:08:49.920 --> 0:08:54.079 and when you sign with him originally, and and what 0:08:54.160 --> 0:08:57.720 you're talking about like making records and recording. Were you 0:08:57.920 --> 0:09:00.840 and Rob under the impression like Bill that you guys 0:09:00.880 --> 0:09:03.720 would record and you recorded girl? You know it's true 0:09:03.720 --> 0:09:07.920 you recorded the music. But so so take me through 0:09:07.920 --> 0:09:09.080 those early moments. 0:09:09.120 --> 0:09:12.440 I mean, you know, it's very simple. You know, you 0:09:12.440 --> 0:09:14.880 have two young guys who have who've been working with 0:09:15.559 --> 0:09:20.280 lower level producers in Munich, and you know, but we 0:09:20.280 --> 0:09:22.720 were playing, we played a couple of games with live 0:09:22.840 --> 0:09:27.400 musicians that we're working with Frank, and then Frank heard 0:09:27.440 --> 0:09:30.720 about us, but we were known for performing and singing 0:09:30.760 --> 0:09:34.560 and dancing at the clubs. So when he came and 0:09:34.679 --> 0:09:36.920 went to his studio and looked at the gold records 0:09:36.920 --> 0:09:39.120 on the wall, we were like, yoh, this is the 0:09:39.200 --> 0:09:43.319 right place man. And since love was not something that 0:09:43.640 --> 0:09:45.920 there was not a lot of love at home, and 0:09:46.080 --> 0:09:49.640 and then you had Frank Farren his assistant Ingrid, we 0:09:49.640 --> 0:09:52.199 were like, wow, this is the surrogate family we've been 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:56.200 looking for. So when the contract came on the table 0:09:56.280 --> 0:09:59.360 and they gave us the last three page of the contract, 0:10:00.040 --> 0:10:03.320 we didn't know that's not how it works. We felt like, okay, 0:10:03.760 --> 0:10:06.199 you got some money right there, it's on the table. 0:10:07.520 --> 0:10:11.240 We're gonna be able to eat. Okay. Contract. There was 0:10:11.280 --> 0:10:13.160 not a lot of money before us. It was like okay, 0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:16.160 to give us money. That means this is real. You 0:10:16.200 --> 0:10:21.040 know this is there was no management now, atturning no protection. 0:10:21.320 --> 0:10:25.640 Were like the Gold Records, blinded by the light like wow, 0:10:26.080 --> 0:10:28.680 we're gonna make it. Started making movies in our mind 0:10:28.800 --> 0:10:31.200 like yo, it's gonna be all right. So when you 0:10:31.280 --> 0:10:35.480 go back home, you spend that money and you wait, 0:10:35.679 --> 0:10:38.080 You're like, what's up? What are they gonna call? So 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:42.120 you call them, Oh you need money? Yeah, kind of 0:10:42.480 --> 0:10:45.120 all right, what you need? We we need that. So 0:10:45.160 --> 0:10:47.080 they sent it to you in months after months that 0:10:47.320 --> 0:10:51.920 this ad adds up to a sum that there was 0:10:51.960 --> 0:10:54.800 a lot for us. So now I know you're going 0:10:54.840 --> 0:10:59.640 to the next question, what happened? Well, we walked into that. 0:10:59.760 --> 0:11:04.160 True that was said perfectly. They were recording. I found 0:11:04.200 --> 0:11:07.680 out later that they were recording. There were recording songs 0:11:08.320 --> 0:11:11.920 with the original singers with Brad Awl and John Davis, 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:14.920 which I've been on stage with. We were working together 0:11:14.920 --> 0:11:18.080 for about sixty seven years here in Europe and doing 0:11:18.080 --> 0:11:22.040 shows together as a project called Faceman's Voice. So while 0:11:22.040 --> 0:11:24.720 they were working on that, Frank was looking for guys 0:11:24.760 --> 0:11:28.040 and that we fell into that. You know, we matched 0:11:28.440 --> 0:11:32.760 perfectly his vision. And then when we were told like, hey, 0:11:32.760 --> 0:11:35.920 you're not going to sing, We're like, well, no, thank you. 0:11:36.640 --> 0:11:40.559 But we as naive young kids and Rob was two 0:11:40.640 --> 0:11:43.439 years young older than me. It was my older brother 0:11:44.200 --> 0:11:47.240 and speaking German, I mean I am in his home country. 0:11:47.960 --> 0:11:49.680 I'm listening to what he tells me. When we signed 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:52.640 the contract, it was like, I said, it's cool because 0:11:52.640 --> 0:11:54.960 it was in German. I don't I didn't read German, 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:58.080 so you know, I studied German for one year, but 0:11:58.120 --> 0:12:00.480 that was it. So I turned to him, We're cool. 0:12:00.520 --> 0:12:03.240 He's like, yeah, yeah, we're cool. So he was the lead. 0:12:03.440 --> 0:12:05.640 And then when they came to him and told him 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:08.000 this was the plan, he got pissed off. Tried to 0:12:08.040 --> 0:12:11.320 explain to me because it was so emotional, and I'm like, 0:12:11.400 --> 0:12:14.000 we're not doing that. And then they came back and say, hey, 0:12:14.520 --> 0:12:17.520 money's not free. You know. In a few words, I'm paraphrasing, 0:12:17.559 --> 0:12:19.720 but that's pretty much what it was. Like, Yo, we 0:12:19.840 --> 0:12:25.120 give you money, so it's up like oh really. So 0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:28.680 the quickest way to repay them was really to like, okay, 0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:31.480 we do one song. But we were signed with three 0:12:31.520 --> 0:12:36.679 albums which we had no idea about options A single, one, two, three, 0:12:36.840 --> 0:12:38.439 we don't know. So we thought we'd do this one 0:12:38.480 --> 0:12:42.520 song and then we out. Yeah, but when we thought 0:12:42.600 --> 0:12:45.800 we were out and never heard from them and get 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:49.600 that record that just shoots off up the charts and 0:12:49.600 --> 0:12:52.959 then you're like, yo, that's that's us, but that's not us, 0:12:53.000 --> 0:12:56.319 but yeah, but that's us. And then suddenly the phone 0:12:56.360 --> 0:12:59.920 start ringing and like, well, you know, you go into 0:12:59.920 --> 0:13:04.319 it apprehensive, not knowing that they got a plan. You know, 0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:08.199 you stepped into a realm you're not familiar with. Stardom 0:13:08.520 --> 0:13:12.120 is something that you don't know about, but it truly 0:13:12.280 --> 0:13:15.800 is addictive. So once you step into that and certainly 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:18.440 you're at the focal point. And we never had problems 0:13:18.480 --> 0:13:24.240 with ladies, yeah, never, of course, but when that came, yeah, 0:13:24.760 --> 0:13:27.840 it was like wow. And then suddenly you were on 0:13:27.960 --> 0:13:30.440 stage and you were living your dreams. It was half 0:13:30.480 --> 0:13:34.800 a dream, was dreams slash nightmare. But at first it 0:13:34.880 --> 0:13:39.160 was a dream comes true and we were we didn't 0:13:39.160 --> 0:13:40.800 know what the hell to deal with it. So when 0:13:40.800 --> 0:13:43.160 the second single came, it was like, okay, we want 0:13:43.200 --> 0:13:46.480 to sing, No, you can't. And then that's what we 0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:53.520 realized that, So what do you do? You you don't 0:13:53.559 --> 0:13:56.440 know what to do, so you stay in hoping that 0:13:57.840 --> 0:14:01.840 you might get another opportunity to jump off and do something. 0:14:02.280 --> 0:14:07.880 But from the first album to the fourth single, we 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:10.000 had no idea where we were going, and there was 0:14:10.040 --> 0:14:13.400 no protection, no support, no one to say, hey, I'll 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:16.880 protect you. There was nobody, you know, And I think 0:14:16.920 --> 0:14:24.120 that's the movie shows that because we were bigger than life. Yeah, 0:14:24.160 --> 0:14:27.240 and you know, when you're bigger in life, people tend 0:14:27.280 --> 0:14:32.440 to believe that you're not really truly human even you know, 0:14:32.680 --> 0:14:35.960 they think you're touchable. Life is beautiful. When we were 0:14:35.960 --> 0:14:37.800 in a cage, it was a golden cage, but it 0:14:37.840 --> 0:14:43.600 was still a cage. And also, yeah, it was a 0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:47.320 tough one to navigate. 0:14:49.720 --> 0:14:52.960 How did you How many times did you perform the 0:14:53.040 --> 0:14:57.640 song live, like with the backing track, Like was that 0:14:57.920 --> 0:14:59.920 were you performing a lot at that point or was 0:15:00.040 --> 0:15:01.240 is it not that? 0:15:00.720 --> 0:15:01.800 Yeah? 0:15:02.400 --> 0:15:07.520 Yeah, man, we were we were just like a just 0:15:07.560 --> 0:15:09.960 like a pilot. You know, you've got to make those hours. 0:15:10.040 --> 0:15:13.120 We did those hours. Man, it was you know, we 0:15:13.160 --> 0:15:14.960 did him and did it and did it. And then 0:15:14.960 --> 0:15:21.440 we went from the MTV MTV tour to line and 0:15:21.680 --> 0:15:24.360 you know, being at the head of our tour, you know, 0:15:24.680 --> 0:15:27.320 and doing one hundred and seven cities in eight months, 0:15:27.560 --> 0:15:32.400 thirty thousand people almostly. That was crazy. And I gained 0:15:32.440 --> 0:15:35.760 a lot of experience as a result of doing all that. So, 0:15:36.920 --> 0:15:39.840 you know, I felt like I had a dream. I 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:43.640 strayed away from the dream. I knew that, but I 0:15:43.680 --> 0:15:47.520 was like, I want to stand there because I don't 0:15:47.520 --> 0:15:49.120 know what else I can do, what else I'm going 0:15:49.160 --> 0:15:49.400 to do? 0:15:50.320 --> 0:15:52.800 I mean, anyone would have you know, when you're faced 0:15:52.800 --> 0:15:55.920 with that, anyone would have done that, you know. And 0:15:56.120 --> 0:15:58.280 the thing that's so interesting to me is that you 0:15:58.360 --> 0:16:02.840 and Rob are skilled, incapable singers, like you got you know, 0:16:03.120 --> 0:16:06.280 you're you are, You're incredible singers. So I must have 0:16:06.280 --> 0:16:09.400 been so frustrating, especially to not be able to like, like, 0:16:09.480 --> 0:16:12.360 this isn't our voice. We have voices and we can 0:16:12.400 --> 0:16:12.880 show it off. 0:16:13.240 --> 0:16:17.280 It was frustrating, and it was so frustrating that, you know, 0:16:17.720 --> 0:16:22.640 Rob became dissillusioned with what was going on. Was how 0:16:22.640 --> 0:16:27.280 it was going down. But also the rumors were coming, 0:16:28.040 --> 0:16:32.880 the jokes would come in, and because of the secret 0:16:32.960 --> 0:16:36.360 as first was very it was very light to carry. 0:16:36.720 --> 0:16:38.840 That's what I talked about. At first, it was like drink, 0:16:38.840 --> 0:16:42.800 I'm through wow doing this. But then you start to realize, like, yo, 0:16:44.960 --> 0:16:49.240 we're not only lying to the fans, which we adored 0:16:49.280 --> 0:16:51.920 and love and did everything to give them like the 0:16:51.920 --> 0:16:55.320 best of time, but we're lying to ourselves. So in 0:16:55.360 --> 0:16:59.000 the end, when the party leaves, you know, you do 0:16:59.040 --> 0:17:02.960 two things the same. You know, you go to bed, 0:17:03.360 --> 0:17:06.000 brush your teeth, wash your face, and you look in 0:17:06.000 --> 0:17:11.880 the mirror, you know, and that's like, m that ain't right. 0:17:11.920 --> 0:17:14.359 You wake up in the morning and then you feel 0:17:14.400 --> 0:17:17.240 the same that you felt before you went to bed, 0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:21.320 and that was like the vicious circle. But once someone 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:24.840 knocked on the door, he showtime, or like yeah, we 0:17:24.840 --> 0:17:26.600 gotta get ready, man, you gotta get on the bus. 0:17:26.640 --> 0:17:29.639 Like you just clicking, and life was going so fast 0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:33.200 that you you never had time to just slow down. 0:17:33.600 --> 0:17:37.240 So you go on this roller coaster hoping that maybe 0:17:37.240 --> 0:17:39.160 someone is going to save you. But then I look 0:17:39.200 --> 0:17:44.880 at my bro and I'm like, I want to save him. 0:17:44.880 --> 0:17:47.960 And I'm doing everything I can't, but it doesn't seem 0:17:48.000 --> 0:17:50.880 like you want to be saved. Until I realized later 0:17:50.920 --> 0:17:54.560 that you can't save nobody. They have to save themselves. 0:17:55.080 --> 0:17:59.280 So when I kind of got that, you know, it's like, okay, well, 0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:02.560 I guess it's time for me to take care of myself, 0:18:02.880 --> 0:18:07.800 you know. Unfortunately, you know, Rob passed away, and that 0:18:07.920 --> 0:18:12.280 was very traumatic because for a long time I felt 0:18:12.320 --> 0:18:14.639 like I didn't do enough. You know, you're kind of 0:18:14.640 --> 0:18:19.719 blaming yourself for for your bal you know, partying. You know, 0:18:19.920 --> 0:18:23.080 it's like you're partying, but you're not even able to say, 0:18:23.080 --> 0:18:26.000 hey man, it was great, you know, to just say 0:18:26.240 --> 0:18:29.400 last words. And that's like the weirdest thing ever. 0:18:30.119 --> 0:18:33.600 That must have been so difficult to process when that 0:18:33.640 --> 0:18:43.199 when when Rob passed, And so in nineteen ninety, the article, 0:18:43.640 --> 0:18:45.680 you know, you do the interview, the article comes out, 0:18:45.800 --> 0:18:49.560 you do the press conference. Everything is kind of now 0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:54.639 it's like out in the open. Everybody knows. I just 0:18:55.000 --> 0:18:59.160 the like Arista deleting the album, giving back the Grammy. 0:18:59.760 --> 0:19:03.720 It's it's so wild, it's so crazy that this happened. 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:10.120 You know, it's like it's hypocrisy at its finest. Yeah, 0:19:10.480 --> 0:19:16.760 you know, that's it because they made they made a 0:19:16.760 --> 0:19:20.080 lot of money. We're talking past three hundred four hundred 0:19:20.080 --> 0:19:27.640 million dollars right that money was reinvested in other ventures. 0:19:27.840 --> 0:19:29.359 And I'm not going to go too deep in there, 0:19:29.840 --> 0:19:32.320 you know, but it's it's it's in a Wall Street journal. 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:34.960 All those things are written, you know when someone when 0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:39.720 when a businessman makes money, extra amount of money, then 0:19:39.760 --> 0:19:43.360 he's going to invest it in other ventures. That's what happens, 0:19:43.400 --> 0:19:46.879 you know. But the fact that we were the last, 0:19:47.080 --> 0:19:49.920 the small links, the smallest link in the chamber of 0:19:49.960 --> 0:19:53.200 the most forward, you know, because we were the artist. 0:19:53.440 --> 0:19:56.560 And then in the end it's like Robin fact were blamed. 0:19:57.440 --> 0:20:01.399 We're blamed for everything. My problem, my issue that I 0:20:01.480 --> 0:20:07.040 have still have today, you know, thanks to my emotional intelligence, 0:20:07.280 --> 0:20:12.040 I've grown true generally is you go to school. You know, 0:20:12.080 --> 0:20:14.320 you go to school, you do it, you make and 0:20:14.359 --> 0:20:17.680 you do an Oh, there's an oath, and that oath 0:20:17.760 --> 0:20:23.560 consists of you know, uh, investigating and partially each in 0:20:23.680 --> 0:20:26.920 every character in the story. But that's not what happened. Certainly, 0:20:26.920 --> 0:20:33.199 the label who made the money, everybody disappears and then 0:20:33.240 --> 0:20:36.600 this press conference was it was bad, and sometimes I 0:20:36.640 --> 0:20:39.399 tried to understand why. But I think that the labels 0:20:39.560 --> 0:20:43.800 were so powerful, and the media and labels and everything 0:20:43.880 --> 0:20:47.679 was in codes. So once the story was told and 0:20:47.880 --> 0:20:51.400 entered you know, the four pipelines that were there back then. 0:20:51.480 --> 0:20:53.919 Because now you've got social media, we're talking about a 0:20:53.960 --> 0:20:58.399 whole different ecosystem. Right back then, it was just like, 0:20:58.560 --> 0:21:00.680 once the story was written, it was oh she wrote, 0:21:00.720 --> 0:21:02.440 and then it's like, okay, we can move on now. 0:21:02.720 --> 0:21:05.840 And there was no way you could turn turn a 0:21:05.880 --> 0:21:09.080 new leaf and try to say, hey, but listen, it's 0:21:09.119 --> 0:21:12.239 too late, you know. So it was it was it 0:21:12.280 --> 0:21:14.440 was that in a sense, was one of the most 0:21:14.480 --> 0:21:20.880 difficult because you know, the truth was buried, the narrative 0:21:21.119 --> 0:21:29.680 had been totally uh like, how can I say there 0:21:29.720 --> 0:21:33.480 was nothing true about the narrative? You know, Robin fab 0:21:33.520 --> 0:21:36.280 with the word responsible. They were responsible. They were they 0:21:36.440 --> 0:21:38.720 planned it all. And then let me tell you, you know, 0:21:38.760 --> 0:21:44.240 I still have a slight accent. Anyone can everyone can 0:21:44.280 --> 0:21:49.200 notice I have an accent right back in the days, 0:21:50.280 --> 0:21:54.720 you know, it was a lot thicker. The day we 0:21:54.760 --> 0:21:58.240 came to New York and sat down with whoever in 0:21:58.240 --> 0:22:03.200 that one room, and you know, the promotion department, radio department, 0:22:03.240 --> 0:22:06.280 marketing department, publicity department, like old departments. You know, you 0:22:06.320 --> 0:22:09.880 meet everybody and say hi, nice, nice to meet you, 0:22:10.359 --> 0:22:15.040 and like really, you know, you hear that look numb before. 0:22:15.520 --> 0:22:19.760 I know, early on, like oh yeah, you sound different. 0:22:20.800 --> 0:22:24.199 You know. I remember being in a in a on 0:22:24.240 --> 0:22:26.520 the road during that one hundred and SI City tour, 0:22:26.960 --> 0:22:28.879 stopping at one of those you know, in the middle 0:22:28.880 --> 0:22:32.320 of nowhere, going into like doing some food, and you know, 0:22:32.440 --> 0:22:35.160 they're like, oh, what what kind of First we're talking 0:22:35.160 --> 0:22:38.280 in German? What kind of language is that where you 0:22:38.320 --> 0:22:41.320 guys from. Then me speaking, you're like, oh, you sound weird, 0:22:41.480 --> 0:22:47.719 sounds strange, you know, and obviously we sounded different. You know, 0:22:47.800 --> 0:22:51.520 how can how can anybody say that we had no idea? 0:22:52.200 --> 0:22:57.960 Really you had no idea? All right, Dan, I don't 0:22:57.960 --> 0:23:00.880 know what was I don't know, I don't know, you know. 0:23:01.080 --> 0:23:04.520 So you know, so that's that's how it went. And 0:23:04.640 --> 0:23:07.040 you know, it's hard for me to watch part of 0:23:07.040 --> 0:23:09.760 the documentary when it makes me cringe when I see 0:23:09.800 --> 0:23:14.960 some of those executives, you know, paying a legion to 0:23:15.040 --> 0:23:19.240 the old regime and still saying until the interview person 0:23:19.400 --> 0:23:22.280 kind of like goes in and like, yo, listen, really 0:23:23.040 --> 0:23:27.920 you didn't know, and then coming out. So imagine we're 0:23:27.920 --> 0:23:32.880 talking about thirty years later. Now go back in time 0:23:32.920 --> 0:23:35.320 and see what kind of allegiance they had with each other. 0:23:35.600 --> 0:23:37.560 I understand you to be for your tuition for your 0:23:37.640 --> 0:23:43.679 kids university school, you know, like mortgage car, I understand, 0:23:43.840 --> 0:23:46.399 But thirty years later, give it up, Give it up, 0:23:46.480 --> 0:23:51.119 tell the truth you knew and then you know you 0:23:51.200 --> 0:23:53.680 knew to say it, but for some reason. 0:23:55.000 --> 0:23:55.520 It was very. 0:23:55.440 --> 0:23:58.680 Difficult to pull that. It was like pulling teeth side 0:23:58.680 --> 0:24:01.200