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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of I Heart Gradios How Stuff Works. Hello, welcome

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Speaker 1: back to the show. My name is Matt, my name

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Speaker 1: is Noel. They call me Ben. We are joined as

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Speaker 1: always with our super producer Paul, Mission controlled dec and

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Speaker 1: most importantly, you are you. You are here and that

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Speaker 1: makes this stuff they don't want you to know. Quick

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Speaker 1: check in as we want to do recently, how are

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Speaker 1: you guys? Feeling feeling good? Did some traveling now I'm back.

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Speaker 1: It's good to be with you, guys. Good to be

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Speaker 1: with you, dude. And the sacred space that is stuff

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Speaker 1: they don't want you to know. That's right. Hey, I

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Speaker 1: got to uh know, none of you will ever hear it,

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Speaker 1: but I got to be on an episode of Ridiculous

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Speaker 1: History this weekend. That's right, that's right. And the reason

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Speaker 1: that no one ever will ever hear is because we

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Speaker 1: forgot to record it. Yeah, who recorded a version of

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Speaker 1: it while you were on adventures? Man? Well, there we go. See,

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Speaker 1: it was just an ephemeral moment that occurred and I

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Speaker 1: thoroughly enjoyed it. I hope you guys did too. Oh gosh,

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Speaker 1: you saved the show. Okay, I don't accept to your

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Speaker 1: what you say, but it was it was a lot

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Speaker 1: of fun. Let's paint a picture real quick. Matt was

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Speaker 1: the voice of the super producer figure in the you

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Speaker 1: know scenario, uh like super much like Superproducer Paul Mission

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Speaker 1: Control Decca, but he was super Producer Matt the Madman Frederick,

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Speaker 1: and he decided it would be fun and ended up

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Speaker 1: being very fun if he was off stage like the

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Speaker 1: voice of God, like the man behind the curtain, and

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Speaker 1: he chimed in with great quotes and did voices and

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Speaker 1: sound effects and it was just a delight. Man. I

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Speaker 1: all I said were words written by Mr Ben Bullen.

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Speaker 1: A lot of those were quotations from Richard Warren Sears. Okay, well,

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Speaker 1: then big ups, Richard, and you did some great re enactments.

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Speaker 1: So we I hope you will be able to join

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Speaker 1: us for a recorded episode of that show one day.

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Speaker 1: Um you also, can we mention this on air? You

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Speaker 1: were in New Orleans? Yeah, I went to a crime

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Speaker 1: con and just hung out for a little bit, met

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Speaker 1: a wonderful couple the last names white and black. They

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Speaker 1: were they were really awesome and uh, I did some

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Speaker 1: montering of a panel. Yeah, it was. It was a

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Speaker 1: lot of fun. We've been doing more and more of

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Speaker 1: these paneled things recently. No, no, Paul, I know, I

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Speaker 1: know that despite trying to cajole you into talking on

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Speaker 1: the show, it's it's not really your bag. So maybe

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Speaker 1: for a check in with you, we can get a

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Speaker 1: thumb up or a thumb down. Is this a thumbs

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Speaker 1: up or thumbs down? Day? Oh, that's a vigorous thumbs up.

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Speaker 1: As a specific, uh follow up question, Paul, I saw

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Speaker 1: you at movies the other day going to see a film.

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Speaker 1: Was that thumbs up er thumbs down? Film? Double thumbs up?

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Speaker 1: You gotta remind me what it was called again? D

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Speaker 1: M and T now and it seemed like a really

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Speaker 1: kind of interesting twist d not sci fi, but kind

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Speaker 1: of an interesting, absurdist, weird kind of ride. I'm looking

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Speaker 1: forward to checking it out. Alright, alright, well here we

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Speaker 1: are again, folks, and we hope that your check in

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Speaker 1: with yourself has gone well. Uh, feel free to tell

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Speaker 1: us about it. If you've discovered something especially strange, you

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Speaker 1: can you don't have to wait. You can just pause

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Speaker 1: the episode and call us now because we have a

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Speaker 1: call in number. That's right, We're one eight three three

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Speaker 1: s C T W y t k A. All of

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Speaker 1: saying at once make it more or less intelligible more.

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Speaker 1: That's fun. People like rituals. Well, it feels like a ritual.

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Speaker 1: It feels like we're summoning something when we say that.

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Speaker 1: And here we are again, folks, Uh conspiracy realist. Long

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Speaker 1: time and first time listeners, thank you for tuning in.

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Speaker 1: We have spent several recent episodes diving into the true

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Speaker 1: crime aspects of this show. Proven conspiracies, many horrifying or

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Speaker 1: disquiet mean things that were acts of mundane human beings,

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Speaker 1: just kind of crappy people who were self important and

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Speaker 1: or had power and wanted more of it. That's kind

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Speaker 1: of how this stuff goes often. But don't worry. We

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Speaker 1: have never forgotten about the supernatural side of this show,

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Speaker 1: the world of the occults, the world of the hidden,

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Speaker 1: the esoteric, the unknown. Today we are delving into the

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Speaker 1: controversial world of what is called theistic Satanism and the

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Speaker 1: strange story of something called the order of nine angles

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Speaker 1: angles not angels. Well, what the heck is this thing?

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Speaker 1: You might ask. The best way to answer this question

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Speaker 1: is to begin laying down some groundwork first. So here

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Speaker 1: are the facts. Most people are cartoonishly wrong about Satanism.

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Speaker 1: It's just true, you know. Yeah, when you when you

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Speaker 1: hear satanism, you probably think about some of the imagery

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Speaker 1: that I myself have UH placed into videos about Satanism.

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Speaker 1: Robed figures, baffa mats everywhere, the horns of goats, and

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Speaker 1: certainly pentagrams, pentacles, all of those kinds of things. The

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Speaker 1: chanting yes is definitely one um and oh always almost

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Speaker 1: always black, like just black clothing with some hints of red,

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Speaker 1: or maybe all red with some hints of black. The

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Speaker 1: head of a goat, certainly heads of goats, black goat

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Speaker 1: with a thousand young yes, sacrifices both animal and human

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Speaker 1: right right. The idea here is there's a secretive group

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Speaker 1: of humans and maybe some not quite humans, opposed to

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Speaker 1: the more publicly dominant narrative, ideology or religious movements of Christianity, Judaism, Islam.

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Speaker 1: The people of the book right and the people who

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Speaker 1: worshiped this mon atheist to God who has uh in

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Speaker 1: this entity's past had a conflict with Uh, an adversary

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Speaker 1: sometimes called Lucifer more old scratch, the devil, el diablo. Um,

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Speaker 1: what are other good devil names like the actual devil

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Speaker 1: not demons? Yes, that's the one, yeah, and uh that

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Speaker 1: the morning Star and the morning Star two, the Lightbringer.

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Speaker 1: That's so yeah, it gets into that Promethean thing, right.

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Speaker 1: So the idea here is for for most people, when

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Speaker 1: they think of stereotypical Satan or devil worshippers, they're picturing

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Speaker 1: people who accept this sort of supernatural religious narrative, right,

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Speaker 1: that there is a God, and God had an adversary

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Speaker 1: of some sort who had all is known by these names.

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Speaker 1: This was once an angel, first among the angels, and

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Speaker 1: then it fell in rebellion and it took its fellow

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Speaker 1: mutineers with it. Uh. And now these people who worship

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Speaker 1: this fallen angel seek to spread this message and to

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Speaker 1: transform this the mundane world into something closer to his

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Speaker 1: infernal vision. They also, they also seem to UM usually

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Speaker 1: informally refer to Satan as a dude. Yeah. Absolutely, And

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Speaker 1: it's almost it's interesting how it's seen as and we

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Speaker 1: we actually talked to David I briefly about this. How

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Speaker 1: there are these two opposing forces, a force of light

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Speaker 1: and a force of darkness essentially, or corruption on the

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Speaker 1: other side, like creation and corruption. Something kind of duality

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Speaker 1: bounces around in a lot of things, right, and gnosticism

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Speaker 1: as well, and Star Wars movies, Star Wars movies, and

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Speaker 1: some animistic beliefs. I don't really know where I'm going

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Speaker 1: with them, just to say like that, that really is

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Speaker 1: such an old vision of how the universe functions within

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Speaker 1: these sects or within these groups. So how accurate are

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Speaker 1: these images that pop up when we hear the word,

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Speaker 1: you know, Satanism or seat wars or is luckily for us,

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Speaker 1: they are not very accurate at all. There there are

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Speaker 1: several let's call them genres of Satanism, right, and there

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Speaker 1: are multiple interpretations of things that could be called Satan

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Speaker 1: in the genres, or there are people's interpretation of what

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Speaker 1: this thing called Satan actually means or represents. And without

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Speaker 1: getting two into the weeds on old Boys identity, we'd

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Speaker 1: like to refer you to our earlier video episode. There

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Speaker 1: is all about the origins of Satan in Near Eastern

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Speaker 1: and Western ideology. Can we even have a show called

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Speaker 1: are There Real Satan? Worshippers or something. Oh we do,

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Speaker 1: we do have that as well. Yeah, and it tells

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Speaker 1: into almost all the questions you you might have like

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Speaker 1: at the beginning of this, So we're skipping all of that.

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Speaker 1: So if you pause today's episode to call us and

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Speaker 1: leave us a message telling us how you're doing, which,

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Speaker 1: thank you, by the way. If you did, uh, feel

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Speaker 1: free to posit again and watch those YouTube videos as

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Speaker 1: long as you're not you know, driving or or flying

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Speaker 1: a plane or something like that. Uh. So let's assume

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Speaker 1: you unpaused it, and now you know all about the

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Speaker 1: origins of satan and whether they are real Satan worshippers.

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Speaker 1: As with any religion or religious movement, Satanism has numerous branches.

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Speaker 1: It's more of a convenient umbrella term for some related

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Speaker 1: beliefs rather than any specific dogma because they they have

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Speaker 1: vastly different opinions, but they do have some commonalities, right

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Speaker 1: they have They have a couple of things that they

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Speaker 1: all generally agree on. Ye, largely an interest in magic

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Speaker 1: um that can be played out in several ways, either

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Speaker 1: like as some sort of psychodrama um, which to me

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Speaker 1: is a ritualized kind of performative kind of experience, is

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Speaker 1: that there are another way of looking at that. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's uh, yeah, it's it's one in which the you know,

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Speaker 1: we get catharsis, which is why people watch and participate

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Speaker 1: in plays. So it's sort of an empowerment of Catharsis

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Speaker 1: or a leverage gene of that. So now the person

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Speaker 1: who um the person the psychodramas everywhere, it's in Christianity,

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Speaker 1: it's an innocuous version of psychodrama. Would be the re

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Speaker 1: enactment of the Birth of the Christ child, got it,

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Speaker 1: which all the kids do in church. But in this

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Speaker 1: stuff they're like, I in this role, now am whatever deity.

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Speaker 1: So really a performative ritual is kind of a good

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Speaker 1: or there's another kind of ritual which is maybe less performative.

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Speaker 1: It would ascribe mystical events and much more of a magic,

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Speaker 1: magical power kind of to these acts as opposed to

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Speaker 1: the psychodrama. Wish to me, maybe it implies that you're

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Speaker 1: embodying it, but it's more a catharsist rather than some

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Speaker 1: kind of like spell the first or the second the psychodrama. Psychodrama, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because the mystical event that would be that that is

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Speaker 1: more of a spell. That is more of like saying,

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Speaker 1: I am doing this to create this effect, you know,

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Speaker 1: in real time, and we can we can also explore

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Speaker 1: an instance of that, but we would want people to

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Speaker 1: know what's what's going on first. Yeah, so that's that's

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Speaker 1: one thing. Yes, this interest in in magic and and

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Speaker 1: the ritualized performance or an action of magic. But that's

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Speaker 1: not it, right, there's other stuff. There's also a sense

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Speaker 1: of community, the creation of a community that defines roles

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Speaker 1: in a hierarchy relationship between members somewhere between people who

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Speaker 1: share a mystical pursuit to those who live according to

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Speaker 1: a set of religious belief doctrine. And generally, when you're

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Speaker 1: talking about a lot of this stuff and how they're

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Speaker 1: forming their community, you're talking about people who really see

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Speaker 1: this philosophy of a symbolic lucifer or satan, which is

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Speaker 1: more about uh, your yourself, your own like um, the

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Speaker 1: single members, nonconformity to society in almost everywhere or as

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Speaker 1: many ways as are achievable, right, philosophy thriving on they

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Speaker 1: maybe instead of nonconformity, they might say something like the

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Speaker 1: benefits of being true to one's self. Yes, and in

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Speaker 1: that way it's it's a lot of times about breaking

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Speaker 1: your chains from a lot of societal's norms depending on

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Speaker 1: the type of Satanist. Okay, okay, right, because you know,

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Speaker 1: there can be conformity with there can be internal conformity,

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Speaker 1: uh strictly enforced in groups that are externally nonconforming, you

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Speaker 1: know what I mean. Yes, it's a little bit of

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Speaker 1: a a securitous way to put that point, but you're

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Speaker 1: right there the end of more of there's some that

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Speaker 1: focus a lot on individual like the individuality, others on

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Speaker 1: like the actual sect kind of and of course the

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Speaker 1: last commonality not a big spoiler, uh, some sort of

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Speaker 1: reference to Satan, if not worship of a singular entity.

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Speaker 1: And there are there are many many Satanist groups, the

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Speaker 1: best known of which are today are probably the Church

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Speaker 1: of Satan Anton lave A, right, and the spinoff of

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Speaker 1: that the I almost called it the sequel of Set,

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Speaker 1: the Temple of Set. Uh. It's sort of like how

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Speaker 1: Golden Girls was a spinoff of Maud, but with Satan

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Speaker 1: that's a deep cut for Golden Girls fans. So the

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Speaker 1: Church of Satan and the Temple of Set have this

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Speaker 1: sort of low level hierarchical leadership and kind of a

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Speaker 1: loosely agreed upon thing. Right, we we agree these following

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Speaker 1: things and then do as they'll wilt. So I want

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Speaker 1: to be very careful not to seem um disrespectful of

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Speaker 1: anyone's personal religious beliefs. If you were listening to this,

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Speaker 1: odds are you're probably not in the Church of Satan,

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Speaker 1: just because there's so many other religions with so many

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Speaker 1: other adherents out there. But your personal beliefs are your

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Speaker 1: own as long as you're not inflicting them on anyone else,

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Speaker 1: you know, are harming someone. It's it's our opinion that

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Speaker 1: you you can do what you want. You know, absolutely agreed.

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Speaker 1: So with that all in mind, here are some just

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Speaker 1: a few different types of Satanism. Right, there's one that

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Speaker 1: I think you were you're probably alluding to directly there, Matt.

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Speaker 1: Rational Satanism. It's secularized. It comes about in the nineteen sixties.

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Speaker 1: It's atheistic, meaning that there's not really a God, there's

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Speaker 1: not They calling it Satanism is sort of um using

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Speaker 1: satan as a stand in for something else. This was

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Speaker 1: under the direction of the famous Anton Leaves, an author

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Speaker 1: and occultist based in the States, who you can find

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Speaker 1: audio and video recordings of his voice. Sounds far less

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Speaker 1: sinister than one would initially, you know, assume it really does.

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Speaker 1: And I will never understand why he didn't begin going

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Speaker 1: like exclusively by Xander Lava because his I mean, having

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Speaker 1: sz Andert as a middle name, that's powerful stuff. Thought

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Speaker 1: he looked like Ming the Merciless from the Flash Gordon movie. Okay, wow,

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Speaker 1: he really does interesting. Yeah, okay, well, the Western society

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Speaker 1: has a thing with bald or shaved head guys and goateees.

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Speaker 1: It's a very pointy goateee. It's a particular type of gotee.

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Speaker 1: It's like that super angled kind of one. Yes and uh.

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Speaker 1: And this this gentleman, I'm just gonna call him Sander

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Speaker 1: or see that. That's the whole of the law. He

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Speaker 1: created the Satanic Bible. It still to this day remains available.

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Speaker 1: You can find it. It's one of the most um

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Speaker 1: at least most available books that you can find about

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Speaker 1: Satanism or the Satanic religion. And he formed this thing

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Speaker 1: known as the Church of Satan that we've already mentioned.

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Speaker 1: It is by far the most well known. It's the

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Speaker 1: thing that is mentioned. Oh, what's the what is that show.

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Speaker 1: Oh gosh, why can't I think of it on HBO?

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Speaker 1: It's a comedy about nerds. It's awesome. Freak. No that

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Speaker 1: the what is it? What's it called, Paul, It's the

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Speaker 1: Silicon Valley, Jesus Silicon Valley. You'll see it mentioned or

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Speaker 1: at least referenced heavily in Silicon Valley where there is

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Speaker 1: a Satanist character who talks about Anthon Levy all the time. Um.

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Speaker 1: And again, as you said, it's it's all about atheism,

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Speaker 1: it's about the individual essentially being empowered. And it really

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Speaker 1: does have this nice symbolic mirroring going on between you know,

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Speaker 1: satan rebelling against God or whatever the large God is

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Speaker 1: and then the Satanist rebelling against mainstream culture or or

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Speaker 1: mainstream religion. Right right, there is a nice symmetry to

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Speaker 1: the structure of the philosophy. Right And it's exactly as

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Speaker 1: you said. According to Levy, neither God nor Satan are

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Speaker 1: actual beings. And this is heretical to many people who

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Speaker 1: believe otherwise, even some Satanist or people who consider themselves such.

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Speaker 1: The only God in this sort of Satanism is the person,

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Speaker 1: the selves, the individual. So Satan quote unquote, Satan is

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Speaker 1: a symbol representing the qualities that Satanists embrace. So it's

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Speaker 1: kind of like they they took a character that they

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Speaker 1: thought was cool and didn't think was real, like Superman

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Speaker 1: or something, and they said, that's it. Those are the

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Speaker 1: those are the things you want to aspire to be.

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Speaker 1: Uh So invoking the name of Satan and other infernal

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Speaker 1: names is a tool in their rituals to focus one's

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Speaker 1: mind on on the manifestation of those qualities and those workings.

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Speaker 1: Tipping the hat to Alistair Crowley of course, no, right, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's still in play. Have you guys seen Good Omens? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the TV adaptation, I preferred it to the book. I

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Speaker 1: found the book whimsical in a way that didn't really

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Speaker 1: speak to me. But I know I'm gonna get some

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Speaker 1: heat for that. I found that about the show. I

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Speaker 1: couldn't make it three episode one. I thought it was

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Speaker 1: a little too Keetsie and the c G I really

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Speaker 1: called too much attention to itself. I'm gonna give another shot, though.

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Speaker 1: But Crowley is the name of the demon character, which

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Speaker 1: is based on the self styled most evil or wicked

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Speaker 1: man in the world. Alistair Crowley UH, famous um, famous

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Speaker 1: sexual predator, heroin addict uh and egoaniac. There you go

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Speaker 1: doing rituals in the middle of the Great Pyramid with

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Speaker 1: his wife. Well, okay, that's that's true. I am being

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Speaker 1: I am being a bit flippant about that because I

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Speaker 1: think that guy gets more credit than he deserves. But

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Speaker 1: but in some circles he is considered a pioneer. I've

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Speaker 1: never done that. No, no, I would be surprised if

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Speaker 1: you had. I don't know. It's just we can do

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Speaker 1: an episode on that. Maybe I need to be more

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Speaker 1: fair and come to terms with it. So the problem.

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Speaker 1: The problem is that at certain points in Crowley's life,

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Speaker 1: and this is a little bit of a soapbox for me,

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Speaker 1: at certain points in Crowley's life he demonstrably functions more

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Speaker 1: as a con artist than a true believer in someone's thing. Now,

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Speaker 1: if you're not if you're a true believer in something

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Speaker 1: and you're not hurting people, it doesn't matter what someone

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Speaker 1: else believes about it, you know what I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: your decision. But if you are an acting harm on

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Speaker 1: people who you know have not agreed to be in

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Speaker 1: your shenanigans, or if you are pretending to believe something

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Speaker 1: that you do not believe for the purposes of bilking

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Speaker 1: the credulous, Then what are you. You're not You're not

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Speaker 1: a leader of people. You're not you're not a holy being.

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Speaker 1: You're You're the same as anybody playing a crooked game

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Speaker 1: of three card Monty And just for the record, being

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Speaker 1: the Merciless and out they look exactly the same. I

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Speaker 1: just want to point that out. Simnel's holding this. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I've got comics with mean the Merciless. That's them. That's

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Speaker 1: that's the Merciless, modeled it after after not just being

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Speaker 1: but several other ones. Yeah, because there there are other

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Speaker 1: characters that appear in um oh, what's that Flash Gordon comics?

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Speaker 1: Do you guys remember Flash Cordon comics from Okay? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but there's a there's a predacess. Then maybe I'm thinking

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Speaker 1: of someone else, because I swear there's a predecessor in

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Speaker 1: the Encyclopedia of Supervillains. I was talking about the movie

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Speaker 1: and you know with the Queen soundtrack flash oh Master

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Speaker 1: out of a University. Oh yeah, that's good stuff. So

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Speaker 1: in comparison uh to or in contrast rather uh to

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Speaker 1: the Church of satan Uh philosophy. There are theistic Satanists.

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Speaker 1: These are what we think about, right, if we're the

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Speaker 1: average person, we're thinking about what a Satanist is uh.

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Speaker 1: Two members of this branch. Satan is not just some

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Speaker 1: symbol nor some clever useful metaphor. Instead, Satan is a genuine,

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Speaker 1: actual entity. These are the ones that you could refer

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Speaker 1: to as devil worshippers. Sure r. Yeah, they might worship

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Speaker 1: associated demons as well. Yeah. Different groups of theistic Satanists

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Speaker 1: may have differing interpretations about the nature of this being,

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Speaker 1: but they all agree it's real. It's similar in a

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Speaker 1: way to the process Church of the Final Judgment. How

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Speaker 1: they would have some lucifers and then they would have

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Speaker 1: some um where they sets Satan's I can't remember, but

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Speaker 1: they some worship this sort of light bringer Promethean aspect,

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Speaker 1: and others worshiped this punishment and fascist aspect. So examples

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Speaker 1: of this include things like the Temple of Set the

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Speaker 1: Golden Girls to the Maud of Church of Satan, and

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Speaker 1: then something called the Order of Nine Angles also known

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Speaker 1: as O n A or O nine A, and a

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Speaker 1: lot of the A lot of these sorts of UH

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Speaker 1: self styled organizations just like scientology or just like federal

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Speaker 1: government agencies. There's a huge emphasis placed on the on

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Speaker 1: initialisms and acronyms. So let's talk about how they were founded.

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Speaker 1: But let's do that after a quick word from our sponsor.

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Speaker 1: M alright, we're back. Let's talk about the Order of

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Speaker 1: the Nine Angles. So according to you know, one of

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Speaker 1: the I guess the common story that you can see

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Speaker 1: people within the Order of the Nine Angles, which are

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Speaker 1: we We're gonna get into it later. It's a bit

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Speaker 1: hard as an outsider to discern what is what, as

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Speaker 1: we'll find later in the episode within the Order of

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Speaker 1: the Nine Angles. But of the things that are publicly

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Speaker 1: facing in the virtual world, the common story is that

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Speaker 1: the organization itself was founded sometime in the nineteen sixties,

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Speaker 1: and then um as it continued along, it started to

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Speaker 1: gain more and more attention, especially in the nineteen eighties,

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Speaker 1: and a lot a lot of it had to do

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Speaker 1: with activism, specifically neo Nazi activism, which tied this group

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Speaker 1: into itself described traditional Satanism at times. The Order of

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Speaker 1: the Nine Angles has been just scribed as one of

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Speaker 1: the world's most extremist and dangerous of Satanic groups, and

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Speaker 1: it's known for its support of far right militant movements

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Speaker 1: overwhelmingly um, racially or religiously motivated. Vice called it the

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Speaker 1: most secret of Satanic groups as well, claiming that it

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Speaker 1: advocates for animal sacrifice, human sacrifice, and reshaping the world

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Speaker 1: entire to one's will. So what is the true story?

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Speaker 1: Where does the order of nine angles come from? And

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Speaker 1: how do the rumors stack up to the facts. Here's

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Speaker 1: where it gets crazy. First version, according to their story,

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Speaker 1: it's very much like like like you said now. First version,

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Speaker 1: it's established in the nineteen sixties by this shady lady

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Speaker 1: who's usually called not an intentional rhyme, usually called lady Master.

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Speaker 1: And she had previously, according to the story the tail

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Speaker 1: they spend, been involved in a quote secretive pre Christian

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Speaker 1: tradition that survived in the Welsh marches of western England.

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Speaker 1: So before the time or the rise of Christian ideology,

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Speaker 1: there was this secret mystery religion and this uh, this

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Speaker 1: person inherited the secrets passed down through um, through ritual,

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Speaker 1: through oral folklore, through rights and passages, unbeknownst to the

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Speaker 1: greater world and the oh nine a or Ona believe

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Speaker 1: that Satan is one of two a causual beings. A

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Speaker 1: causual being, Uh, something that is is not dependent upon

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Speaker 1: cause for it to exist, something that sort of prefigures

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Speaker 1: the uh if then reality of human existence. Uh. These

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Speaker 1: eternal beings are there are two of them, going back

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Speaker 1: to your thing about duality, right, One is Batha met

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Speaker 1: it was female in their mind, and one is Satan,

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Speaker 1: who is male in their mind. And then in nineteen

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Speaker 1: seventy three, guy calling himself Anton Long was initiated into

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Speaker 1: this group, eventually attaining the title of Grand Master, and

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Speaker 1: he really popularized the group with other groups because he

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Speaker 1: was quite prolific. He was the Alexander Hamilton's of his group.

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Speaker 1: He he wrote to wrote and wrote and wrote Man

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Speaker 1: the Kid is NonStop, etcetera. Other quotes from the Hamilton's

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Speaker 1: Broadway show. Because of this, you'll hear a lot of

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Speaker 1: people say that he was really the de facto founder. Uh.

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Speaker 1: It's suspected that the person who was the original they

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Speaker 1: called her the Lady Master, eventually had a child with

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Speaker 1: the person calling themselves Anton Long and relocated to Australia,

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Speaker 1: at which point Long began running the show. Here you go. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you'll you'll find you'll find different versions of it. One

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Speaker 1: in this website called a cult dash study dot org

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Speaker 1: talks about how it was Anton Long who actually and

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Speaker 1: again this is probably likely from whoever is calling themselves

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Speaker 1: like you said, Ben anton Long, from the own his

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Speaker 1: own writings essentially where he brought together three different groups,

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Speaker 1: essentially three different um secret orders, Um what is it? Nocturalian's,

423
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,200
Speaker 1: the Temple of the Sun, and the cam Lad tradition,

424
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 1: that this guy brought them all together and created this

425
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:25,399
Speaker 1: thing called oh nine a UM. And again you'll find

426
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:31,600
Speaker 1: various versions of it throughout the internet. Right. They expanded

427
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 1: on the orders, concepts and their ideas in all these

428
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:38,879
Speaker 1: publications which will get into and and they tied it

429
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:43,679
Speaker 1: into um some oh what should we call it, some

430
00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:49,479
Speaker 1: some contemporary politics of their time. In they made their

431
00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:54,440
Speaker 1: journal Thin Rear, which was another was another Um sort

432
00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:58,200
Speaker 1: of rung in the ladder of walking up to public prominence,

433
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:01,240
Speaker 1: which is what they always wanted. With each publication, this

434
00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:05,159
Speaker 1: group sought to establish links with other neo Nazi Satanist groups,

435
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:08,600
Speaker 1: which are totally a thing. And there there are more

436
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:12,000
Speaker 1: than you might imagine, uh, and by that I mean

437
00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:16,119
Speaker 1: not just not just people who are being profiled because

438
00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 1: they're fans of metal. People honestly do consider themselves Satanist. Yeah,

439
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:24,679
Speaker 1: and this is where we get into the full society

440
00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:30,239
Speaker 1: and some of the strange occult beliefs and actions of

441
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 1: portions of the Nazi Party, or at least some of

442
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,119
Speaker 1: the upper echelon of the Nazi Party. I'm really glad

443
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,560
Speaker 1: that you mentioned that, because the Order at times has

444
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 1: preferred to describe its ideology as Nazi occult. And it's

445
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:48,639
Speaker 1: strange the way these things become ephemeral. Right, the names

446
00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 1: can be worn and discarded like old jackets, or reused

447
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:58,399
Speaker 1: and reshaped, and now it means something completely different, redefined, right, Yeah,

448
00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 1: like you know that mean that's also just a human thing,

449
00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:04,919
Speaker 1: that's just a mundane thing. There is some magical power

450
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:08,680
Speaker 1: in names for people who are adherents of those belief systems.

451
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,399
Speaker 1: But take the term neoliberal versus liberal. Liberal means something

452
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:16,200
Speaker 1: very different in the international sphere than it does here.

453
00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:20,720
Speaker 1: And the leading conservative party in Australia, for instance, Australia

454
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 1: just how an election as we're recording this, the leading

455
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:27,440
Speaker 1: conservative party is the Liberal Party. I believe there you go.

456
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,000
Speaker 1: I don't know names. What are they? Maybe they are

457
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 1: all old jackets. So the Order prefers to describe itself, um,

458
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:38,960
Speaker 1: what's ideology rather as Nazi occult. So that's promoting a

459
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 1: supernatural system of thoughts that condemns liberal Judeo Judeo Christian

460
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:50,480
Speaker 1: society and longs for a new imperial age created by

461
00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 1: a sub Nietzschean superman figure called the Vindex. And that

462
00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:58,280
Speaker 1: is not Windex is pronounced with a German accent to

463
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:03,760
Speaker 1: the vindex, the V right they that's true, Yeah, it is,

464
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 1: and they ant on long to do that, right, Okay,

465
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 1: And ultimately the idea is to expand to the stars, uh,

466
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 1: and to bring this ideology outside of the terrestrial sphere. Yeah,

467
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 1: I mean, that's it's an ambitious belief system. It sounds

468
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:30,160
Speaker 1: like they want to be stormtroopers, you know what I mean,

469
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 1: like full on the whatever the New Order is in

470
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:38,120
Speaker 1: the new Star Wars systems. It feels like that to me.

471
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:41,200
Speaker 1: And they also did some really disturbing stuff. The way

472
00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 1: it's it's tied up in in this kind of love

473
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:49,240
Speaker 1: of fascism and this this um again. I don't know

474
00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:53,040
Speaker 1: how sincere it is, this worship of characters like Adolph Hitler.

475
00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:56,920
Speaker 1: So that's the first version. The second version is a

476
00:29:56,960 --> 00:30:02,160
Speaker 1: little different and it dives into more mundane matters according

477
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:05,840
Speaker 1: to observers and commentators, and you'll find a surprising amount

478
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:09,560
Speaker 1: of literature on this. Uh. There is no real Anton Long.

479
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:13,479
Speaker 1: This is a pseudonym used by a British uh former

480
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:17,240
Speaker 1: neo Nazi named David Mayat. I think it's Mayatt M

481
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,760
Speaker 1: y A T T who either used this organization to

482
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 1: further his own ends or created an elaborate hoax out

483
00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:28,640
Speaker 1: of whole cloth. Um. Yeah. He's known in Britain for

484
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:33,760
Speaker 1: being a hardline national socialist or neo Nazi, advocating national

485
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:36,800
Speaker 1: socialism as well as violence. In the past, he's been

486
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 1: implicated in physical beatings of people. And usually when these

487
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:46,920
Speaker 1: sorts of characters are implicated in violence, they attack and packs,

488
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:49,080
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So like a group of

489
00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:52,800
Speaker 1: people jumping a single person. Uh, the oh nine a

490
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: grab national attention and the global war on terror. When

491
00:30:56,880 --> 00:31:02,800
Speaker 1: the organization was um second or even third hand associate

492
00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:07,400
Speaker 1: with series of murders. So then this order wanted to

493
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 1: you know, move up, get some more things like uh,

494
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:14,760
Speaker 1: not really infiltrate just bring in other groups to grow

495
00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:17,320
Speaker 1: their own ranks. Right, So they attempted to infiltrate some

496
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:21,280
Speaker 1: of these um non satanic Nazi groups or neo Nazi

497
00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:24,400
Speaker 1: movements such as there's one specifically this mentioned in several

498
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 1: publications called the atom Woffen Division, which is often atom

499
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:34,440
Speaker 1: whatever it is, atom Offen, And it's a US based organization.

500
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:38,920
Speaker 1: And this group, at least it's affiliates killed five people

501
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:42,440
Speaker 1: in two thousand seventeen and two thousand eighteen. So this

502
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: is recent. This is very recent, and it is a

503
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:49,720
Speaker 1: real group. It's just sounds it sounds odd from the

504
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:53,240
Speaker 1: law enforcement side of things. Um, the all this esoterica

505
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:57,440
Speaker 1: and occult ritual uh, doesn't really matter anymore than say

506
00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:01,840
Speaker 1: like a gang initiation or some kind of really heavy hazing. Yeah,

507
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:06,920
Speaker 1: right exactly, because they're not going to It's useful in

508
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:11,760
Speaker 1: that it can identify members of an organization, but to them.

509
00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:14,440
Speaker 1: You know, imagine, if your job is to stop organized

510
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 1: crime and game killings, you want to learn about these

511
00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:20,840
Speaker 1: groups so that you can to some degree predict and prevent,

512
00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 1: predict their behavior and prevent further criminal acts. But you're

513
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:28,520
Speaker 1: not you know, odds are if you're if you're in

514
00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: the FBI or something, You're not going to stay up

515
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 1: at night worrying that these people may curse you. You're

516
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:38,960
Speaker 1: more concerned about whether they have access to firearms and explosives.

517
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 1: It's a you know, it's it's kind of a more

518
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:46,560
Speaker 1: grounded or mundane look at this. However, do you have

519
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 1: to say on a side note, I did find two

520
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:54,560
Speaker 1: Freedom of Information Act request to the FBI about this

521
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:58,720
Speaker 1: order of nine angles, and in both cases the FBI

522
00:32:58,840 --> 00:33:01,520
Speaker 1: responded by saying that they searched and they didn't have

523
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 1: anything there. You go, So maybe they're not a pic deal.

524
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:09,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. Uh mayat for for his own his

525
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:12,640
Speaker 1: own right, has also in addition to the nine things,

526
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:15,760
Speaker 1: like the Holocaust, Uh denied that he ever went by

527
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:20,080
Speaker 1: the name Anton long Uh. He also went through iterations

528
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:23,360
Speaker 1: where he practiced as a Buddhist monk, and then he

529
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 1: embraced radical Islam, praising al Qaeda and attempting to unite

530
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 1: Nazis and Islamic terrorists. That's nightmare material. That's an odd couple,

531
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 1: isn't it. It seems strange, right, but so so we

532
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:40,880
Speaker 1: already see in the origins of this thing there, there

533
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,280
Speaker 1: is a bit of duplicity. The question is whether it's

534
00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 1: an purposeful or whether it's just kind of bungling, you

535
00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Um, how much of this is

536
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:51,440
Speaker 1: meant to be taken seriously? How much of it is

537
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,080
Speaker 1: meant to be believed? I think we mentioned a little

538
00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 1: bit about their process and you mentioned vindex. Uh what

539
00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:01,840
Speaker 1: what about the the rest of their beliefs? What what's

540
00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:05,280
Speaker 1: their plans? Yeah? So they believe that civilization has to

541
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:10,839
Speaker 1: be destroyed from within, completely undermined and disassembled, dismantled. So

542
00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:16,880
Speaker 1: the adherents are actually encouraged to be pretty awful people, like,

543
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 1: as you know, part of their whole prescribed course of

544
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 1: making this happen. Um. So that includes things like committing

545
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:27,719
Speaker 1: crimes and random acts of violence, sexual assaults, and even

546
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:31,600
Speaker 1: this whole like genocide kind of idea, calling human victims.

547
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:35,399
Speaker 1: They also embrace magic. They do share that same commonality

548
00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:38,799
Speaker 1: that we had mentioned at the top, right, But when

549
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,040
Speaker 1: we talk about their magic, what what are we what

550
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 1: are we talking about? I guess that's part of why

551
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,279
Speaker 1: they're called the Order of the Nine Angles. All right,

552
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:49,160
Speaker 1: you ready for this? I got this from uh oh

553
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 1: nine a dot org. And it's just a post there,

554
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:55,800
Speaker 1: and it's talking about what the nine angles actually represent.

555
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:58,239
Speaker 1: So it says, quote, their nine angles refer to the

556
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 1: nine combinations of the three basic alchemical substances mercury, sulfur, salt.

557
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:09,080
Speaker 1: And these nine angles slash combinations were first outlined in

558
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:12,600
Speaker 1: this text. It's nine from nine four is called emanations

559
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:18,799
Speaker 1: of Urania Urania Urania who knows and Uh. These nine

560
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:21,480
Speaker 1: combinations can be used to symbolize how the causal and

561
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:25,160
Speaker 1: a causal are manifest to us, as for instance, in

562
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:29,560
Speaker 1: our psyche the nexion of causal a causal that we

563
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:33,200
Speaker 1: are via archetypes personality types. And it just goes on

564
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:37,320
Speaker 1: with stuff that I honestly am struggling to understand. And

565
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:39,880
Speaker 1: and a lot of this, a lot of writing in

566
00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:43,799
Speaker 1: this fear, whether it's hawking left hand path, right hand path,

567
00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:47,560
Speaker 1: stuff does tend to be a little bit up touse. Uh.

568
00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:53,120
Speaker 1: They also practice something that they call the sevenfold Way.

569
00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 1: So the sevenfold Way is a series of steps meant

570
00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:01,200
Speaker 1: to make someone a a practical master of all forms

571
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 1: of sorcery physically mentally fit. Uh. In this way is

572
00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 1: divided into these seven stages. The stages are neophyte, initiative,

573
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:15,600
Speaker 1: external adept, internal adept, master of temple or mistress of earth,

574
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:21,319
Speaker 1: grand master or Grand mistress, and of course immortal. Uh.

575
00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 1: Sometimes initiatives are described or called novices, and adepts are

576
00:36:26,239 --> 00:36:30,920
Speaker 1: called priest or priestess. It goes on majors, major strap.

577
00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:35,840
Speaker 1: It's also known as hebdomadry. Does that our word for today?

578
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:40,000
Speaker 1: Met her? Or the sevenfold way? How does it? How's

579
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 1: it spelled? H G B D O M A D

580
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 1: R Y All right? Uh? Someone used that in a

581
00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:49,319
Speaker 1: sentence and call us. Uh. So it's strange when we

582
00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:53,399
Speaker 1: look at this, because what we're seeing quickly becomes a

583
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:58,920
Speaker 1: rabbit hole of occult's philosophy and working again tied in

584
00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:02,920
Speaker 1: very much like the Thule Society or Toulife Society to

585
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:11,600
Speaker 1: these um to these race based beliefs h and what

586
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:15,200
Speaker 1: what we pointed out, however, should already be pretty disturbing.

587
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 1: The purpose here for the members of this society, by

588
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:24,399
Speaker 1: their own statements, are to destroy what we know of

589
00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:30,080
Speaker 1: as civilization, up to and including human sacrifice, which they

590
00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 1: do talk about at length, and which differentiates them from

591
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:36,640
Speaker 1: a lot of other Satanic groups. Let's let's pause for

592
00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,200
Speaker 1: a moment, for a word from our sponsors, and then,

593
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 1: assuming that we have not been killed via magical means,

594
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:52,640
Speaker 1: let's explore a little bit more about their work. We

595
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:57,520
Speaker 1: made it. We're still here. Yes, no one has uh

596
00:37:58,160 --> 00:38:01,879
Speaker 1: gotten us by magical psyche or more traditional means. So

597
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:08,200
Speaker 1: let's check the Paul. Oh he's there, he's in tact alright. Good.

598
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:10,640
Speaker 1: I don't know when his eyes turned all black, but

599
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 1: you know it's it's it's it's it's called the Monday.

600
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:20,640
Speaker 1: It's a Monday cometic. Yeah, these kids these days, so, uh,

601
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:24,400
Speaker 1: they're not. This group, the Order of Nine Angles, is

602
00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:29,960
Speaker 1: not known for subtlety, especially um so they have a

603
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:34,160
Speaker 1: book called the Black Book of Satan, comes in three volumes. Uh.

604
00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:36,560
Speaker 1: These are considered so extreme that they're kept in a

605
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:40,320
Speaker 1: special section of the British Library or they're not available

606
00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:42,520
Speaker 1: to the general public. You have to ask for them

607
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 1: at a counter research purposes kind of thing. That's because

608
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 1: these books repeatedly talk about the idea of of culling

609
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:55,080
Speaker 1: committee acts of violence and destabilization up to an including

610
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:58,680
Speaker 1: terrorism and with with the active culling. What's fascinating is

611
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:00,879
Speaker 1: one of the steps that they're they're told to do

612
00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:07,280
Speaker 1: is to groom someone to voluntarily submit to being sacrificed.

613
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:11,520
Speaker 1: That's the ultimate, uh, the ultimate coup there. Uh. And

614
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:16,239
Speaker 1: they also have a an interesting work study program for

615
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 1: lack of a better term, that they send their members on.

616
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:21,479
Speaker 1: Would you believe I had looked up the Black Book

617
00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:24,359
Speaker 1: of Satan Amazon and there is one paperback available used

618
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 1: for eight hundred and sixty four dollars. Yeah, I would

619
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:31,239
Speaker 1: believe that. I guess they're hard to get a hold of.

620
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:34,200
Speaker 1: That happens with a lot of occult books. Yeah, I

621
00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 1: mean it maybe two that someone has. Someone is either

622
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:40,239
Speaker 1: like billoking someone, or they have multiple copies and they're

623
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:43,120
Speaker 1: just putting them out one at a time. I saw

624
00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 1: that before, you know, I wonder if anybody does have

625
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:48,399
Speaker 1: a copy of the Black Book of Satan. I found

626
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 1: a free download pdf on a called boards dot com.

627
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:56,319
Speaker 1: I'm sure it's the real deal. I don't know, Yeah, right,

628
00:39:56,680 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 1: getting a PDF of the Black Book of Satan. I

629
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:03,560
Speaker 1: laugh at the So let's get into what is required

630
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:05,799
Speaker 1: of oh and A members who are going along that

631
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:09,600
Speaker 1: sevenfold path, trying to get into one of the noxioms

632
00:40:09,719 --> 00:40:11,680
Speaker 1: or whatever they're called. Yeah, that work study, I was

633
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:15,280
Speaker 1: mentioning exactly one of these, one of these cells essentially,

634
00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:21,040
Speaker 1: so they they want people to spend six months either uh,

635
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:25,759
Speaker 1: just traveling like hitchhiking the way you would traditional traveler

636
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:30,480
Speaker 1: along that path, working as either you know, a burglar,

637
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:35,120
Speaker 1: maybe working even as a police officer, or infiltrating some

638
00:40:35,120 --> 00:40:38,799
Speaker 1: some version of an extremist political group where you're just

639
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 1: kind of roaming and in working inside one of these

640
00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:48,359
Speaker 1: other organizations. Two things that that connect with this. This

641
00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:52,759
Speaker 1: is very inspiring for any of us horror writers in

642
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:56,040
Speaker 1: the audience. There used to be a television show maybe

643
00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:59,520
Speaker 1: in the nineties barely two thousand's that was sort of

644
00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:03,799
Speaker 1: the scary anthology show called the Hitchhiker, Remember that and

645
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:06,840
Speaker 1: the Hitchhiker. The frame was that someone picks up the

646
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:11,680
Speaker 1: hitchhiker and terrible stuff happens, which was which was gold.

647
00:41:12,320 --> 00:41:16,239
Speaker 1: But it makes me, it makes me see how appealing

648
00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:20,160
Speaker 1: this could be, uh to people who are fearmongers in

649
00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:24,719
Speaker 1: the uh nineteen eighties Satanic panic scare here in the

650
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:27,719
Speaker 1: United States, you could say Satanists are all around you.

651
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:32,160
Speaker 1: They're low level criminals, they're hitchhikers, they're living off the grid.

652
00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 1: You know, they're going to rainbow gatherings or you know,

653
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:41,440
Speaker 1: they're hopping trains. They're avoiding the spotlight of mainstream America.

654
00:41:41,920 --> 00:41:44,600
Speaker 1: And with the fact that you know that seems like

655
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,400
Speaker 1: that seems like just some something people would say to

656
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:51,400
Speaker 1: sell headlines, right or get people to tune into sixty

657
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:54,240
Speaker 1: minutes or something. But here we have a real group

658
00:41:54,280 --> 00:41:59,840
Speaker 1: saying yes, go do this for six months. Yeah. Especially

659
00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:04,839
Speaker 1: what baffles me is thinking that, at least on this list, um,

660
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:07,799
Speaker 1: where it was mentioned saying a police officer would be

661
00:42:07,800 --> 00:42:09,600
Speaker 1: a good route for this, And I guess it's because

662
00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:15,080
Speaker 1: you're you're essentially practicing power over others. Um. I guess

663
00:42:15,080 --> 00:42:19,120
Speaker 1: there's reasons too that a police officer would be on

664
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:22,320
Speaker 1: that list. Yeah, and one in one passage they said,

665
00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 1: do something that is far outside your previous life experience,

666
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:31,319
Speaker 1: but working in law enforcement will give you liam nice

667
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,000
Speaker 1: and ask a certain set of skills. There you go,

668
00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 1: you know, for physical altercation, the tactical thinking. Well that yeah,

669
00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:41,040
Speaker 1: and that's something we kind of talked about before in

670
00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:43,719
Speaker 1: this but when we're mentioning that sevenfold path that you

671
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:46,720
Speaker 1: go down to join this group, you it is about

672
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:53,160
Speaker 1: the psychological it's about the empowering that, it's about empowering

673
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:57,040
Speaker 1: you psychically, it's about empowering you physically and all these things.

674
00:42:57,040 --> 00:42:58,640
Speaker 1: So I guess a police officer would be a really

675
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:03,359
Speaker 1: good way to get there. And from their literature this

676
00:43:03,480 --> 00:43:07,880
Speaker 1: has uh, this is weird. I want to see you

677
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:10,240
Speaker 1: guys think of this. So from their literature they attempt

678
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:13,960
Speaker 1: to quote undertake the role of extreme political activists and

679
00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:17,719
Speaker 1: so champion heretical views by e g. Becoming involved in

680
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:21,400
Speaker 1: extreme right wing activism. They demand this. In one of

681
00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:24,279
Speaker 1: their introductory books, they say, quote the aim is to

682
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:28,399
Speaker 1: express fanaticism and action X and be seen by all

683
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:32,680
Speaker 1: right thinking people as extremists and dangerous. So they want

684
00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:34,960
Speaker 1: to be the people who are I don't know. It

685
00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:37,880
Speaker 1: feels to me like they're talking about edginess for the

686
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:41,520
Speaker 1: sake of edginess, you know, like they're gonna bust into

687
00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:46,360
Speaker 1: an all right meeting and someone's gonna say, well, you know,

688
00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:50,080
Speaker 1: I just I just don't think we should. They're gonna

689
00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:52,239
Speaker 1: bust into a tea party meeting. Maybe let's make it

690
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:54,759
Speaker 1: even more innocuous than They'll say, I don't think we

691
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:57,840
Speaker 1: should pay taxes, And they're like Yeah. Additionally, we should

692
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:01,759
Speaker 1: burn all the money. Yea. Everybody's like, oh, those guys

693
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:04,799
Speaker 1: are dangerous. So so they've they've kind of got this

694
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:10,400
Speaker 1: idea of um again, very very motivated by racism. Uh,

695
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:14,280
Speaker 1: they've kind of got this idea similar to um Joker

696
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:18,520
Speaker 1: in the Dark Night, where they the heath Ledger Joker,

697
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:22,440
Speaker 1: the good one, where they want to just so chaos

698
00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:26,680
Speaker 1: and discriminately. But unlike the Joker, who is a who's

699
00:44:26,719 --> 00:44:29,239
Speaker 1: a fictional character and exists only to spread chaos for

700
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 1: the sake of chaos itself. Uh, this group seeks to

701
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 1: spread chaos to make it easier to propagate their twisted

702
00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:42,319
Speaker 1: world and cosmic view. So let we see that's strange,

703
00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 1: tragically not necessarily alien marriage of ideology. Here the Nazis

704
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 1: and the so called Satanist U nineteen to pursue goals

705
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:56,359
Speaker 1: that are at least non mutually exclusive. So for the

706
00:44:56,360 --> 00:44:59,720
Speaker 1: oh nine a, fascism is actually seen as a means

707
00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:03,000
Speaker 1: to you, an end rather than an end in and

708
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:07,960
Speaker 1: of itself, particularly this idea of a sinister dialect um

709
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:12,480
Speaker 1: that's the key to the aonic evolution of human civilization

710
00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:18,560
Speaker 1: into a higher form. But the Maijian Nazarene distortion also

711
00:45:18,640 --> 00:45:22,120
Speaker 1: known as the Christians and the Jews UH is holding

712
00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:25,480
Speaker 1: back Western civilization. According to this doctrine, UM from reaching

713
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 1: its final step, some sort of evolutionary step, and must

714
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:35,439
Speaker 1: be overthrown if humanity is to advance. So holy war

715
00:45:35,640 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 1: or unholy war. Absolutely, yeah. And the vision here goes

716
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:42,520
Speaker 1: to that thing that you mentioned earlier, been that Vindex,

717
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:49,839
Speaker 1: yes right, being led by Vindex deep into the cosmos

718
00:45:49,920 --> 00:45:54,680
Speaker 1: where um Gri mentioned, they'll establish a galactic Reich to

719
00:45:54,920 --> 00:45:58,600
Speaker 1: champion and make known our unique human destiny of galactic

720
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:02,879
Speaker 1: exploration and the colonization of outer space. This is from

721
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:06,279
Speaker 1: the Direki and Way d R E C C I A.

722
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:10,240
Speaker 1: And Uh, we're not recommending that you check out these books.

723
00:46:10,239 --> 00:46:13,399
Speaker 1: Were just letting you know that these are these are

724
00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:19,040
Speaker 1: the the tenants, the goals, and the aims as self

725
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:24,719
Speaker 1: described by this by this UH organization. Oh yeah, and

726
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:27,680
Speaker 1: they really do want to you know. It's it's this

727
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:32,799
Speaker 1: concept at least of creating a sinister world. And but

728
00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:35,680
Speaker 1: here's the thing. In order to have the world be sinister,

729
00:46:35,719 --> 00:46:37,359
Speaker 1: you've got to make the people that they were living

730
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:40,320
Speaker 1: in that world or controlling and running that world sinister.

731
00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:43,799
Speaker 1: So they think this can happen through what they call

732
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 1: the practice of genuine modern heresies. I know, I like that.

733
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:51,440
Speaker 1: I don't mean to poke fun at it, but genuine

734
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 1: modern heresies. Um, and this is you know, again taking yourself,

735
00:46:56,680 --> 00:47:00,560
Speaker 1: the individual person through all of these mental and physical

736
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:04,960
Speaker 1: trials that you know, well, you're going through mental and

737
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:07,959
Speaker 1: physical trials and at the same time, you're also practicing

738
00:47:08,160 --> 00:47:12,520
Speaker 1: magic with the k so ritualizations, things you're you're basically,

739
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:16,000
Speaker 1: I don't know, you're you're honing yourself on all possible

740
00:47:16,120 --> 00:47:19,600
Speaker 1: fronts to become evil I guess in a way, or

741
00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:23,240
Speaker 1: maybe maybe not. The word evil is correct here, but uh,

742
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 1: to do the things that the group wants to do. Well,

743
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:28,719
Speaker 1: here's a question. Do you think people that are adherence

744
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:32,320
Speaker 1: to this kind of belief system do they see themselves

745
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:37,319
Speaker 1: as evil? That's interesting in some In some cases there

746
00:47:37,360 --> 00:47:43,200
Speaker 1: would be people associating with this because they want to

747
00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:46,120
Speaker 1: they want to be seen as evil. But don't they

748
00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 1: just think that the path of satan is the better path?

749
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 1: Then you probably do. Yeah, So I'm just wondering if

750
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:55,200
Speaker 1: even if good and evil even enters into it at

751
00:47:55,200 --> 00:47:56,800
Speaker 1: this point, when you when it comes to your thinking

752
00:47:56,840 --> 00:47:59,879
Speaker 1: behind getting behind something like this. I guess that's why

753
00:47:59,880 --> 00:48:02,279
Speaker 1: I was hesitant to use the term. I guess when

754
00:48:02,280 --> 00:48:06,120
Speaker 1: I'm what I mean is adversarial to the status quo

755
00:48:06,200 --> 00:48:09,160
Speaker 1: and or the the ways in which society are set up,

756
00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:11,520
Speaker 1: in the institutions that hold that society up. I'm just

757
00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:14,160
Speaker 1: getting all big picture about it in my head. And

758
00:48:14,200 --> 00:48:15,879
Speaker 1: it's just interesting to think about the nature of good

759
00:48:15,880 --> 00:48:18,560
Speaker 1: and evil and this. Does true evil really see itself

760
00:48:18,600 --> 00:48:20,720
Speaker 1: that way? Or do they just believe that they're actually

761
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:25,200
Speaker 1: doing what's best. It's an interesting question because in many cases, yeah,

762
00:48:25,239 --> 00:48:29,200
Speaker 1: in many cases, Uh, all great villains are the heroes

763
00:48:29,200 --> 00:48:32,040
Speaker 1: of their own stories. Right then say I'm doing terrible things,

764
00:48:32,040 --> 00:48:34,640
Speaker 1: but I'm doing it for a greater reason, right and

765
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:37,080
Speaker 1: there you know, people have to die, but the world

766
00:48:37,160 --> 00:48:41,200
Speaker 1: will be better, etcetera, etcetera. The thing that's interesting about

767
00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:44,759
Speaker 1: some theistic satanism and why it can be so attractive

768
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:49,480
Speaker 1: to people who are already um involved in something that

769
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:55,200
Speaker 1: that puts the bulk of its emphasis on violence in

770
00:48:55,239 --> 00:48:59,160
Speaker 1: the short term, UH, is that there's not too much

771
00:48:59,160 --> 00:49:02,560
Speaker 1: of a leap to go to something else like this. UH.

772
00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:05,680
Speaker 1: And one thing that's interesting about the question about regarding

773
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:09,400
Speaker 1: seeing oneself as good or evil is that you can

774
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:12,040
Speaker 1: get a little bit of a sense, not a re

775
00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:15,120
Speaker 1: not a reliable sense. You can get a little bit

776
00:49:15,120 --> 00:49:19,680
Speaker 1: of a sense of how someone sees themselves by what

777
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:23,280
Speaker 1: emphasis they place on things. Do they place the emphasis

778
00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:27,720
Speaker 1: on their ultimate end goal? Vision? Is that like sevent

779
00:49:27,800 --> 00:49:31,040
Speaker 1: of this you know, like most uh many religions spend

780
00:49:31,280 --> 00:49:34,800
Speaker 1: uh seventy percent or so of their time talking about

781
00:49:34,880 --> 00:49:38,319
Speaker 1: how to be a decent person now right, or do

782
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:41,520
Speaker 1: they spend the majority of their time talking about the

783
00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:44,360
Speaker 1: violet things they will do to get a vaguely explained

784
00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:48,239
Speaker 1: thing in the past or in the sorry in the future. Y. Yeah,

785
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 1: I mean that's to me. It's tough because it probably

786
00:49:51,239 --> 00:49:54,239
Speaker 1: various case by case. But I'm sure in Satanism there

787
00:49:54,239 --> 00:49:56,759
Speaker 1: are a few people who think I am evil, I

788
00:49:56,840 --> 00:49:59,440
Speaker 1: embrace it, I'm the son of the beasts or whatever,

789
00:50:00,040 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 1: and they probably really believe it. Maybe they're misled, you know,

790
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:04,920
Speaker 1: whatever does it for you, is what I say. Like

791
00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:07,319
Speaker 1: we're talking about the beginning of the show. If you

792
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:11,360
Speaker 1: if you can use religion and maybe not ritualistically murder people,

793
00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:13,920
Speaker 1: but if this doesn't for you, you know, being evil,

794
00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:16,000
Speaker 1: the idea of being evil, and you're not gonna, you know,

795
00:50:16,160 --> 00:50:18,880
Speaker 1: call an entire population, then I say more power to you.

796
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:22,200
Speaker 1: But unfortunately this particular idea involved a lot of these

797
00:50:22,480 --> 00:50:25,600
Speaker 1: random acts of murder and rape and violence and all

798
00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:30,799
Speaker 1: terrible stuff doing unto the innocent. So I can't get

799
00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:34,040
Speaker 1: behind the can't get behind the on nine A here, guys,

800
00:50:34,080 --> 00:50:36,600
Speaker 1: I'm sorry you cannot throw my endorsement at this, this order,

801
00:50:36,800 --> 00:50:38,719
Speaker 1: which is weird because it was your pitch. I know

802
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:41,480
Speaker 1: it sure, and I think it was interesting because I

803
00:50:41,880 --> 00:50:43,520
Speaker 1: had never heard of this. And this leads us to

804
00:50:43,880 --> 00:50:46,360
Speaker 1: maybe one of our bigger questions which we always have

805
00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:49,160
Speaker 1: to ask with these sorts of groups. Is it a

806
00:50:49,200 --> 00:50:52,319
Speaker 1: case of Satan's military as Satanic army, or is it

807
00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:57,080
Speaker 1: a case more of internet bravery? You know, like the

808
00:50:57,520 --> 00:50:59,719
Speaker 1: Order has been referred to a Satan's military, But it

809
00:50:59,760 --> 00:51:03,839
Speaker 1: seem too more accurate to say that the order or

810
00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:06,480
Speaker 1: the people who claimed to be involved with it, because

811
00:51:06,480 --> 00:51:09,240
Speaker 1: we can't verify a whole bunch of people, seems accurate

812
00:51:09,280 --> 00:51:12,399
Speaker 1: to say that they are maybe militant in attitude more

813
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:16,160
Speaker 1: than organized and violent in person. Because the crimes that

814
00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:18,799
Speaker 1: can be reasonably traced to OH nine A affiliates and

815
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:22,000
Speaker 1: partner organizations seem to be crimes that were sort of

816
00:51:22,040 --> 00:51:24,840
Speaker 1: egged on by the group but not enacted by the

817
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:29,560
Speaker 1: group directly. And Uh, the OH nine A was also

818
00:51:29,680 --> 00:51:32,840
Speaker 1: once dismissed by other occultists as the order of no

819
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:36,759
Speaker 1: members because this one guy, David Meyatt and I think

820
00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:39,960
Speaker 1: another guy named Molt appeared to be the only visible

821
00:51:40,000 --> 00:51:43,360
Speaker 1: figures within the organization. So how much of it is

822
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:47,160
Speaker 1: just them writing prolifically under different names? You know what

823
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:52,960
Speaker 1: I mean? The pseudonym aspect I can see at work here. Um.

824
00:51:53,000 --> 00:51:55,399
Speaker 1: But again, we didn't point this out already a little bit,

825
00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:58,800
Speaker 1: but we have noticed, and it's been documented that their growth,

826
00:51:58,880 --> 00:52:02,959
Speaker 1: this this OH nine A growth has been right alongside

827
00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:05,439
Speaker 1: other like I guess what we would call right wing

828
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:10,040
Speaker 1: extremist groups, sure, yeah, yeah, supremacist organizations would be a

829
00:52:10,080 --> 00:52:14,640
Speaker 1: big one, UH, Neo Nazi organizations. And this has led

830
00:52:14,680 --> 00:52:20,439
Speaker 1: to a couple of really strange conspiratorial thoughts, UH. One

831
00:52:20,520 --> 00:52:24,839
Speaker 1: being there was actually some infighting between UH members of

832
00:52:25,280 --> 00:52:29,719
Speaker 1: white supremacy groups and members of this OH nine A thing,

833
00:52:29,840 --> 00:52:33,120
Speaker 1: because there were people saying look, guys, I'm just here

834
00:52:33,160 --> 00:52:35,440
Speaker 1: because I'm a white supremacist. I don't like all this

835
00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:39,480
Speaker 1: weird hocus pocus stuff. I'm we've lost, We've lost our

836
00:52:39,520 --> 00:52:43,320
Speaker 1: way out of the game. And everyone's like, oh, well,

837
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:46,359
Speaker 1: that guy doesn't get it. And then someone else said,

838
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:50,640
Speaker 1: you know, I feel like I also fault more on

839
00:52:50,719 --> 00:52:55,080
Speaker 1: the supremacy now side, and like the magic stuff is cool. Like,

840
00:52:55,120 --> 00:52:57,560
Speaker 1: don't get me wrong, dude, I love metal or whatever.

841
00:52:57,880 --> 00:53:00,680
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not knocking metal. I am slocking racist,

842
00:53:00,719 --> 00:53:03,200
Speaker 1: but I'm not knocking metal. It does make me feel

843
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:06,080
Speaker 1: a little bit sad for the people who joined up

844
00:53:06,120 --> 00:53:08,760
Speaker 1: because they were all about that magic and all about

845
00:53:08,800 --> 00:53:11,640
Speaker 1: the that stuff, and they realized, oh, this is a

846
00:53:11,680 --> 00:53:15,479
Speaker 1: separatist group. Yeah. Right. There are other people who said,

847
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:18,239
Speaker 1: I thought we were just doing rituals. I mean, I'm

848
00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:22,399
Speaker 1: down for our infernal Lord and Master, but I feel

849
00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:24,719
Speaker 1: like our infertile Lord and Master should be an equal

850
00:53:24,760 --> 00:53:29,120
Speaker 1: opportunity employer. So I mean, we're making a little bit

851
00:53:29,120 --> 00:53:32,360
Speaker 1: of light of this, but it's it's um, it's a

852
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:35,120
Speaker 1: dangerous thing when we see this connection of ideologies and

853
00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:38,960
Speaker 1: these people are conspiring in secret. We don't know we

854
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:41,600
Speaker 1: don't know how much of it is just bluff and

855
00:53:41,640 --> 00:53:44,160
Speaker 1: bluster on the on and a part we don't know

856
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:46,480
Speaker 1: how much of it, even to some degree, has taken

857
00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:49,560
Speaker 1: seriously for all the people. Is it an elaborate hoax.

858
00:53:49,600 --> 00:53:52,919
Speaker 1: There's a lot of writing out there, but again it's

859
00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:56,880
Speaker 1: not as if there is a center that you can visit.

860
00:53:57,160 --> 00:54:01,040
Speaker 1: You know, there's not. There's not a our structure that

861
00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:03,400
Speaker 1: is readily apparent to a lot of people, and perhaps

862
00:54:03,480 --> 00:54:07,279
Speaker 1: that's they've just kept it internal. We do know that

863
00:54:08,280 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 1: at this point the organization is still considered to be

864
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:16,000
Speaker 1: out there, but the views it espouses have have mainly

865
00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:20,520
Speaker 1: caught UH the attention of law enforcement and governments because

866
00:54:20,560 --> 00:54:24,879
Speaker 1: of the actions of its affiliates white supremacist hard right

867
00:54:24,920 --> 00:54:30,240
Speaker 1: wing UH terror groups terrorist groups. At a two thousand

868
00:54:30,239 --> 00:54:33,760
Speaker 1: three UNESCO conference in Paris concerning the growth of anti

869
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:38,480
Speaker 1: Semitism in Europe and abroad, UH, they stated David Mayatt,

870
00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:41,719
Speaker 1: the leading hardline Nazi intellectual in Britain since the sixties,

871
00:54:41,840 --> 00:54:48,000
Speaker 1: who maybe what is it Anton long has converted to Islam.

872
00:54:48,040 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 1: This was true at the time. He praised Bin Laden

873
00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:52,880
Speaker 1: and al Qaeda, he called the nine eleven tax and

874
00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:56,399
Speaker 1: active heroism. He urged for the killing of all like

875
00:54:56,719 --> 00:55:01,359
Speaker 1: all Jewish people, and he also he used another name,

876
00:55:01,640 --> 00:55:05,960
Speaker 1: Abdul Laziz ibbin Mayattuh. He supported suicide missions. He has

877
00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:10,719
Speaker 1: one of the most thorough English language defenses of that. Uh.

878
00:55:10,760 --> 00:55:14,440
Speaker 1: He urged young Muslims to take up violent jihad, which

879
00:55:14,520 --> 00:55:18,399
Speaker 1: is not any Any actual Muslim will tell you that

880
00:55:18,719 --> 00:55:22,680
Speaker 1: the kind of thing he's calling jihad is not jihad. Uh.

881
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:25,879
Speaker 1: Observers warned that he's a dangerous man, But since two

882
00:55:25,920 --> 00:55:28,799
Speaker 1: thousand ten, he claims to have changed. He says, I've

883
00:55:28,800 --> 00:55:32,759
Speaker 1: rejected Islam. My extreme has passed, and guys, it's all

884
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:36,000
Speaker 1: about loving each other. Yeah, that's what he says now.

885
00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:39,160
Speaker 1: But the extremism seems to carry on. The question now

886
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:42,040
Speaker 1: is whether it's legitimate, whether the people who claim to

887
00:55:42,040 --> 00:55:45,719
Speaker 1: believe it online actually practice it in person, or as

888
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:49,040
Speaker 1: some have proposed, as the entire thing a hoax. Is

889
00:55:49,080 --> 00:55:52,839
Speaker 1: it a government front to monitor right wing groups? Let

890
00:55:52,920 --> 00:55:55,719
Speaker 1: us know what you think that's the most promising for me,

891
00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:59,360
Speaker 1: or the most silver lining answer for me. It's a

892
00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:02,560
Speaker 1: front group of some sort that's trying to stop some

893
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:06,080
Speaker 1: of these other organizations. But people still got killed. So

894
00:56:06,160 --> 00:56:08,719
Speaker 1: they must not be doing that great of a job. Yeah,

895
00:56:08,760 --> 00:56:10,600
Speaker 1: you know you're you're probably right. So what do you

896
00:56:10,600 --> 00:56:16,319
Speaker 1: guys think front or legitimate like splinter group of real

897
00:56:16,400 --> 00:56:20,400
Speaker 1: deal Satanism. Let us know. You can hit us up

898
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:22,920
Speaker 1: on our Facebook group we are called Here's where it

899
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:25,279
Speaker 1: gets crazy. That's really the funnest way to interact with

900
00:56:25,320 --> 00:56:27,840
Speaker 1: the show. If you ask me. A lot of members

901
00:56:27,840 --> 00:56:31,160
Speaker 1: on their posting responses to every episode, like messageboard style

902
00:56:31,239 --> 00:56:33,680
Speaker 1: posting all kinds of memes and topics. It's just a

903
00:56:33,719 --> 00:56:36,000
Speaker 1: good group of folks. Yeah, and if you could reach

904
00:56:36,040 --> 00:56:37,839
Speaker 1: out and just give us, you know, if you've had

905
00:56:37,880 --> 00:56:40,919
Speaker 1: any interaction with this group whatsoever, if you have any

906
00:56:40,960 --> 00:56:44,080
Speaker 1: personal stories that you are are not um that you

907
00:56:44,120 --> 00:56:46,120
Speaker 1: don't mind telling us, Yeah, reach out, reach out to

908
00:56:46,160 --> 00:56:49,560
Speaker 1: us for sure about that stuff. You can give us

909
00:56:49,600 --> 00:56:51,680
Speaker 1: a call, like we said at the top one eight

910
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:56,680
Speaker 1: three three std w y t K. It goes right

911
00:56:56,680 --> 00:57:00,000
Speaker 1: into the the hands of us, particularly to my phone.

912
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:02,759
Speaker 1: So whenever you feel like calling, it doesn't matter what

913
00:57:02,840 --> 00:57:05,920
Speaker 1: time it is, it'll uh, it won't ring, but it

914
00:57:05,960 --> 00:57:08,239
Speaker 1: will say, hey, you got a message? Is that true? Yeah?

915
00:57:08,480 --> 00:57:10,880
Speaker 1: You gotta set up like that. Yeah, last night I

916
00:57:11,000 --> 00:57:14,200
Speaker 1: got a ton of messages. Can you set us? Can

917
00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:17,280
Speaker 1: can everybody get notifications? Yeah? If you guys download ring

918
00:57:17,320 --> 00:57:19,800
Speaker 1: Central and in and use it. We don't want to

919
00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:22,360
Speaker 1: burden just you with that. We should we should share

920
00:57:22,400 --> 00:57:24,400
Speaker 1: the well, we'll shoulder that for you time. I'm a

921
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:26,640
Speaker 1: bit behind, so I need to get up. We had

922
00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:29,240
Speaker 1: maybe we had so many great messages too. I've actually

923
00:57:29,240 --> 00:57:31,640
Speaker 1: texted a few people back and I thought that that

924
00:57:31,720 --> 00:57:33,520
Speaker 1: was to my episode was a lot of fun, like

925
00:57:33,640 --> 00:57:35,960
Speaker 1: the column I mean there, I was just enamored listening

926
00:57:35,960 --> 00:57:38,919
Speaker 1: to the messages. Yeah, they're fantastic. I could have taken

927
00:57:38,920 --> 00:57:41,160
Speaker 1: our left are you know commentary, but the messages were

928
00:57:41,200 --> 00:57:44,000
Speaker 1: just great. Just as a quick story, we uh, one

929
00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:47,640
Speaker 1: person called in on Friday while I was in the hotel.

930
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:52,040
Speaker 1: It was at night and I was working on Actually

931
00:57:52,040 --> 00:57:54,560
Speaker 1: I was looking over the ridiculous history outlined Ben that

932
00:57:54,600 --> 00:57:57,880
Speaker 1: you sent, and this person left four messages in a row,

933
00:57:58,280 --> 00:58:02,080
Speaker 1: and the fourth one that he sent was about monster

934
00:58:02,240 --> 00:58:05,360
Speaker 1: energy and how maybe there's out maybe some group out

935
00:58:05,360 --> 00:58:07,880
Speaker 1: there is trying to control us with monster energy. And

936
00:58:07,920 --> 00:58:10,920
Speaker 1: it was while I was finishing one, and it really

937
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:14,520
Speaker 1: did uh give me the I don't know the feeling

938
00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:16,680
Speaker 1: what it is that the heb gbs give me the

939
00:58:16,840 --> 00:58:20,720
Speaker 1: spine tingling feeling like maybe someone is trying to control me.

940
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:25,560
Speaker 1: Maybe it's you. That would be monstrous. You can also

941
00:58:25,680 --> 00:58:29,040
Speaker 1: find us on Instagram. You can also find us on Twitter. Hey,

942
00:58:29,080 --> 00:58:31,600
Speaker 1: you might be saying, I hate all that social media stuff.

943
00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:35,320
Speaker 1: It's twenty nineteen. I'm scared of phones. All I hey

944
00:58:35,400 --> 00:58:38,200
Speaker 1: do is use email? Then, boy, have we got some

945
00:58:38,240 --> 00:58:41,040
Speaker 1: good news for you. You can email us directly. We

946
00:58:41,080 --> 00:59:03,560
Speaker 1: are conspiracy at iHeart radio dot com. Ye Stuff they

947
00:59:03,560 --> 00:59:05,160
Speaker 1: Don't want you to Know is a production of I

948
00:59:05,280 --> 00:59:08,000
Speaker 1: Heart Radio's How Stuff Works. For more podcasts from my

949
00:59:08,080 --> 00:59:11,000
Speaker 1: heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

950
00:59:11,120 --> 00:59:12,960
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.