1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:05,560 Speaker 1: Also media. 2 00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:09,640 Speaker 2: Hi everyone, and welcome to the show. I'm joined today 3 00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:13,120 Speaker 2: by Gordayen, who's a journalist from Kurdistan who's based in Germany, 4 00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 2: and we're going to discuss the bombing of Iran. How 5 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:17,920 Speaker 2: you got in. 6 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:23,000 Speaker 3: Hello, Thank you again for inviting me, and yeah, I'm 7 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:26,680 Speaker 3: ready to talk about what's happening in Iran right now. 8 00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:31,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, it's a lot, a lot is happening. I 9 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 2: mean we should begin, I suppose by if someone happens 10 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:38,120 Speaker 2: to have been avoiding the news and has somehow managed 11 00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 2: to avoid learning what is happening, can we give like 12 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:45,880 Speaker 2: a small summary of the events that have happened since 13 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:47,720 Speaker 2: Friday night US time. 14 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:54,160 Speaker 3: So yeah, it was early morning, around eight nine in 15 00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 3: the morning in Iran time, that the Israeli army attacked 16 00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:04,319 Speaker 3: the center of Tehran where Alikamani's house, which is known 17 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:09,679 Speaker 3: as Beraberti, the Leader's house, was located and apparently the 18 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:15,560 Speaker 3: Iranian officials were having a very important meeting there. And 19 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:19,640 Speaker 3: following that there were more attacks across Tehran and other cities. 20 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:23,800 Speaker 3: And by night as the attacks were going on. As 21 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:26,759 Speaker 3: the strikes were going on, Benna Montanio came on TV 22 00:01:26,840 --> 00:01:30,319 Speaker 3: and he said that I have some news, I have 23 00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:35,800 Speaker 3: some information that confirms that Alikamani is dead, which caused 24 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 3: a lot of panic and excitement among the people, and 25 00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 3: everybody was really excited and they were waiting for this 26 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:49,800 Speaker 3: to be confirmed. And then some people came out and said, no, 27 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:54,840 Speaker 3: it's not true. But after some hours the Iranian state media, 28 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:59,880 Speaker 3: the TV channels all started confirming that. So following that 29 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 3: the attacks did not stop. They were still going on, 30 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:07,920 Speaker 3: and then the American Army also joined. This is a 31 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:14,240 Speaker 3: completely coordinated cooperation between US and Israel. So as they 32 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 3: were attacking different IIERGC bases and the facilities belonging to 33 00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 3: the government, the Iranian government started attacking the neighboring countries. 34 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 3: They attacked UAE, they attacked Katar, they attacked Bahrain, they 35 00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 3: attacked Iraq, and they attacked also Iraqi Curtistan region. And 36 00:02:32,880 --> 00:02:37,680 Speaker 3: they were just mainly targeting the US basis or facilities 37 00:02:37,680 --> 00:02:41,000 Speaker 3: belonging to the US, but soon after they started attacking 38 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:47,840 Speaker 3: civilian buildings like hotels, like just randomly attacking different directions. 39 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 3: And at the same time they also started sending missiles 40 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:56,519 Speaker 3: and drones towards Israel, which majority of them were intercepted. 41 00:02:56,560 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 3: So they've been attacking these neighboring countries since the beginning 42 00:03:02,760 --> 00:03:08,079 Speaker 3: of this war, and they have been specifically targeting Iraqi 43 00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 3: Curtistan because first, the US has a lot of big 44 00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:15,560 Speaker 3: military bases there in Iraq and Iraqi Kuddistan region. And 45 00:03:15,600 --> 00:03:18,799 Speaker 3: at the same time they are the Kurdish parties from 46 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:22,040 Speaker 3: Iran who are based there and the regime has been 47 00:03:22,080 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 3: seeing them as one of the major threats since decades. 48 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 3: So since the beginning of this whole war, they have 49 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:34,079 Speaker 3: been targeting these Kurdish parties a lot, and they also 50 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 3: attacked there is a refugee base that the families of 51 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 3: the Kurdish forces basically lived there. They also attacked there, 52 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 3: but luckily nobody was killed or injured, but some buildings 53 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:48,840 Speaker 3: were damaged, and they attacked erville with drones and missiles 54 00:03:48,880 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 3: several times, which were all mainly intercepted by the US 55 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 3: air defense systems because of the remainings of the missiles 56 00:03:57,320 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 3: and the drones that were falling down from the scuise. 57 00:03:59,520 --> 00:04:03,320 Speaker 3: Some people were lightly injured or some buildings were damaged, 58 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:07,080 Speaker 3: but yeah, still it's a crazy thing to see because 59 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:11,920 Speaker 3: previously in the past years, Iran had attacked or built 60 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:15,800 Speaker 3: several times and also other regions, but the US or 61 00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:19,560 Speaker 3: the other countries that were there, they didn't really intercept 62 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:23,960 Speaker 3: the drones or the missiles. There's also something new that 63 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:27,720 Speaker 3: we're seeing. It's also important to know that Iran has 64 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 3: also attacked Cypress, like British military bases were targeted there, 65 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 3: but the drones or the missiles were sent from Lebanon. 66 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 3: What's going on right now is the full scare war, 67 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:42,919 Speaker 3: and I think when you look at it, it's nothing 68 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 3: like what we've seen before. If you want to compare 69 00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 3: it to what happened in Iraq the US invasion, this 70 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:52,279 Speaker 3: is completely different. I think it's even larger than that 71 00:04:52,440 --> 00:04:56,280 Speaker 3: because Iran is a very big country and there are 72 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 3: hundreds or maybe thousands of points across the country that 73 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:05,600 Speaker 3: have been targeted with heavy bombings inside Tehran, around Tehran. 74 00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:09,720 Speaker 3: It's also really incredible to know because the amount of 75 00:05:09,839 --> 00:05:13,280 Speaker 3: intel that you need for this is also really a lot. 76 00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:17,840 Speaker 3: I've seen videos, I've seen footage, I've seen reports that 77 00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 3: some random checkpoints on some remote places, especially in Curtison, 78 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:28,359 Speaker 3: we're targeted. So this is also something that shows that 79 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:33,280 Speaker 3: how really coordinated and well planned this attack and this 80 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:36,480 Speaker 3: war is I want to jump into something because a 81 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:40,360 Speaker 3: lot of people are really focused on these major attacks, 82 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:45,240 Speaker 3: major developments like yeah, they're attacking Dubai, they're attacking Doha. 83 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:48,280 Speaker 3: These are all happening, and of course the civilians they're 84 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 3: also in danger. I think somebody in Doha was killed 85 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:53,359 Speaker 3: in the first day. It was just a civilian that 86 00:05:53,560 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 3: was killed by the remainings of a massoul or a drone. 87 00:05:56,800 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 3: And this has made things really hard for the people 88 00:05:59,640 --> 00:06:03,240 Speaker 3: on the round. Many people are trapped in the airports 89 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 3: on the borders, so this is this is something that's 90 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:08,679 Speaker 3: happening to the people outside of a round, but inside 91 00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:14,960 Speaker 3: Iran there is massive bombings everywhere wherever the IERGYC or 92 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:19,320 Speaker 3: the intelligence service has a facility. And at the same time, 93 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:22,080 Speaker 3: the regime has cut off the internet, even though the 94 00:06:22,120 --> 00:06:25,640 Speaker 3: normal phone lines barely work, and it's just so hard 95 00:06:25,680 --> 00:06:31,160 Speaker 3: and almost impossible to get really precise information about what's 96 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 3: happening in the cities in the and the towns around, 97 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:37,280 Speaker 3: just like what happened in the in the early January, 98 00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 3: like during the process. Only a few people have access 99 00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 3: to the internet and it's very limited. Yeah, they share 100 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 3: some videos with channels and like with news agencies, but 101 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:50,880 Speaker 3: it's very limited. For example, in my hometown today, some 102 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:56,840 Speaker 3: of the major iergycy bases and intelligence facilities that were 103 00:06:57,160 --> 00:07:00,360 Speaker 3: some of the most important ones in western side of Iran, 104 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 3: or as we call it, Iranian Critisonal or Rochalot, they 105 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:06,760 Speaker 3: were all bombed and I've been trying to contact people 106 00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:10,440 Speaker 3: to see what happened exactly. I'm sure that there are 107 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:14,400 Speaker 3: civilians killed because the regime also has put all these 108 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 3: bases inside the cities, near parks, near hospitals, near schools, 109 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 3: near just random houses in the city, So a lot 110 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 3: of people are possibly killed, but we don't know how 111 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:29,360 Speaker 3: many who are they. So this is this is also 112 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 3: like not just in my city, in other cities to 113 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:35,280 Speaker 3: it's it's the same. This is also something that a 114 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 3: lot of people are not talking about. But again, this 115 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 3: is war, and the bombings are so heavy, and they're 116 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:47,120 Speaker 3: all being carried out with really advanced weapons, and it's 117 00:07:47,200 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 3: just so hard. And when I talk to the people 118 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:52,560 Speaker 3: outside of Iran, the people in Europe, like some of 119 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:57,360 Speaker 3: my friends relatives, everybody's worried that what if one of 120 00:07:57,400 --> 00:07:59,440 Speaker 3: my relatives, what if one of my one of my 121 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 3: friends get get killed randomly on the street. But because 122 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 3: of this that people are seeing this also on the news. 123 00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:09,800 Speaker 3: At least I know this from my family because I 124 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:13,120 Speaker 3: was able to talk to them two nights ago. Everybody's 125 00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 3: staying home, they have enough food for a few weeks, 126 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 3: and they're just watching the news. They don't go out. Yeah, 127 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 3: they're just trying to stay safe. But at the same time, 128 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:28,280 Speaker 3: in major cities like for me, for example, the people 129 00:08:28,320 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 3: who have a house outside of the city or in 130 00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:35,079 Speaker 3: a village, or if they have relatives outside of the city, 131 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:39,800 Speaker 3: they have moved out because it's generally safer. There are 132 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 3: not many IRGC bases or like government government buildings or 133 00:08:44,040 --> 00:08:47,720 Speaker 3: whatever in the villages and smaller towns, so this is 134 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:51,880 Speaker 3: also happening, and people are trying to stay safe as 135 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:56,600 Speaker 3: much as possible. And yeah, this is something that's going on. 136 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:59,480 Speaker 3: And at the same time, when I talk to the people, 137 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 3: I mean I haven't been able to properly talk to 138 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:04,720 Speaker 3: anyone because the internet is really bad. But like I 139 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:07,800 Speaker 3: talked to my family and they told me that the 140 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:11,679 Speaker 3: food prices are really, really, really high, and it's really 141 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:15,880 Speaker 3: hard to buy food now because everybody's panicking and there 142 00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:19,000 Speaker 3: are shortages, like there's some items cannot be found, some 143 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:22,240 Speaker 3: like essential items like I don't know, oil, meat and 144 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:25,240 Speaker 3: rice and things like that. It's it's too hard to 145 00:09:25,320 --> 00:09:28,000 Speaker 3: find in the market. And a lot of people are 146 00:09:28,080 --> 00:09:31,120 Speaker 3: going to the to the gas stations to get some 147 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 3: gas and to be prepared if something happens. But yeah, 148 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:39,080 Speaker 3: so this is also something that's going on, and people 149 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:42,000 Speaker 3: are worried about that what if it's it's going to 150 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 3: get bigger, if it's going to scale it, so, like 151 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 3: how are they going to deal with all these shortages. 152 00:09:49,960 --> 00:09:52,560 Speaker 3: There is one more topic that I want to talk about. 153 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:55,839 Speaker 3: I also wrote about it a little bit earlier. I 154 00:09:56,320 --> 00:10:01,040 Speaker 3: published some text. It's the topic of or soldiers. 155 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:03,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, explain that to people. 156 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 3: The civilians who are forced into the military service. This 157 00:10:07,840 --> 00:10:11,960 Speaker 3: is also like a very sensitive topic because there are 158 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:16,680 Speaker 3: probably thousands or maybe hundreds of thousands of young men 159 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:20,000 Speaker 3: who are about eighteen years old that are forced into 160 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:23,400 Speaker 3: the military service because it's mandatory in Iran, and they 161 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:26,760 Speaker 3: are forced into the service. And there are also in 162 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:30,600 Speaker 3: these military bases, and the military bases are being targeted 163 00:10:30,920 --> 00:10:34,040 Speaker 3: non stop, and there is a possibility, I mean not 164 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:38,360 Speaker 3: the possibility of course, it's surreal today. One person, a 165 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:41,680 Speaker 3: young man from Curtison, was confirmed that he was killed, 166 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 3: but I'm sure that there are more because we don't 167 00:10:44,400 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 3: have a proper internet connection so we cannot like get 168 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:52,319 Speaker 3: all the information. But these military bases are being also targeted, 169 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:55,280 Speaker 3: and of course I think a lot of them might 170 00:10:55,559 --> 00:10:58,960 Speaker 3: get killed or injured. And just from my own family, 171 00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:01,840 Speaker 3: one of my cousins who is twenty four, he was 172 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:05,720 Speaker 3: also forced into this because he wanted to open a business. 173 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:07,680 Speaker 3: And like in Iran, a lot of people also maybe 174 00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 3: I should give a little bit of context, like in Iran, 175 00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 3: if you want to open a business, if you want 176 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 3: to have a passport or things like that, you have 177 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:17,960 Speaker 3: to serve in the army and we'll give you that. 178 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:22,040 Speaker 3: So yeah, he just he was listed, like I don't know, 179 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:25,480 Speaker 3: about five months ago or so, and then he wasn't 180 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:28,640 Speaker 3: in a military base between Tabriz and Urmia, and their 181 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:35,440 Speaker 3: base was targeted. Luckily, the slipping quarters were not targeted. 182 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:39,680 Speaker 3: It was just where the commanders were I think staying. 183 00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:42,200 Speaker 3: And yeah, I mean I couldn't talk to him, but 184 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:46,440 Speaker 3: he told my cousin who I called like two days ago, 185 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:49,320 Speaker 3: he said that the moment they was bombed, everybody just 186 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:52,080 Speaker 3: ran out, and then everybody went back in and they 187 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 3: took all their belongings and backpacks and they just left 188 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:58,199 Speaker 3: the military base and they went home without telling the 189 00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:01,839 Speaker 3: wiser or something, and they were not they're they're not 190 00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:04,880 Speaker 3: going to go back there anyways. So this is also 191 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:08,720 Speaker 3: something that I am personally worried about. All those young 192 00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:12,679 Speaker 3: men who are forced to be in the military basis, 193 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:16,200 Speaker 3: and they are absolutely not a part of the regime. 194 00:12:16,240 --> 00:12:19,920 Speaker 3: There are just civilians who are forced into this, So 195 00:12:20,040 --> 00:12:22,960 Speaker 3: that that's also something that I think it's it's not 196 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,560 Speaker 3: really discussed because the whole focus right now is just 197 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:30,480 Speaker 3: on the major attacks. Which place was targeted or like 198 00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 3: which I don't know commander was killed or things like that. 199 00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, let's take a little break for advertisements and we'll 200 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 2: come back, because I'd like to discuss more of that, 201 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:43,000 Speaker 2: like the structure of the Iranian state and who is 202 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:57,720 Speaker 2: and it's not like part of it. Okay, we are back, 203 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:00,200 Speaker 2: So I think that will be a really good place 204 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:03,679 Speaker 2: for us to do some deep dives. Would be people 205 00:13:03,760 --> 00:13:06,679 Speaker 2: understand this part of the world through the lens of states, 206 00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:09,440 Speaker 2: because they understand the world through the lens of states 207 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:12,240 Speaker 2: because they have been raised in a state system. But 208 00:13:12,280 --> 00:13:14,560 Speaker 2: I don't think that that it's a particularly it's not 209 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:17,000 Speaker 2: useful to see everybody who lives in the Iranian state 210 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:19,040 Speaker 2: as part of the Iranian state. It doesn't actually give 211 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:22,959 Speaker 2: us a good grasp on reality. So perhaps you could explain, 212 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:26,480 Speaker 2: first of all, perhaps explaining the structures of the Iranian 213 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:31,160 Speaker 2: state when it comes to like, there are pro regime 214 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:35,800 Speaker 2: militias right there are the ILGC, and then we have 215 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:40,160 Speaker 2: like the leadership, many of whom are now dead, some 216 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 2: of whom we know, some of whom we think are dead. 217 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 2: But then we also have and I know you and 218 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:47,800 Speaker 2: I have spoken about this before, but it's worth explaining again, right, 219 00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:51,760 Speaker 2: Like Iran is the ethnically diverse country, so we have 220 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:56,200 Speaker 2: people who are ethnically excluded from power. We also have 221 00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:59,680 Speaker 2: people within the majority ethnicity Persian, people who are not 222 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:03,959 Speaker 2: pro ratime. So could you perhaps explain like those structures 223 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:06,800 Speaker 2: that exist. And then you and I spoke about this 224 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:09,720 Speaker 2: a little bit before we were recording, But many of 225 00:14:09,760 --> 00:14:14,600 Speaker 2: the facilities of the regimes, armed forces and repressive forces 226 00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 2: are right in the middle of town, right right next 227 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:21,360 Speaker 2: to civilian building. So perhaps we could explain the consequences 228 00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 2: of that for civilians as bombs of falling on these facilities. 229 00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:30,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, so if I want to explain how the Iranian 230 00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:33,960 Speaker 3: state system is, I would simply compare it to a 231 00:14:34,040 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 3: full monarchy, but with a different label. Yeah, there's kink 232 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:42,760 Speaker 3: who owns all of the power, and there are the 233 00:14:42,800 --> 00:14:46,600 Speaker 3: people who are around him m hm that also share 234 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 3: some bits of power with him. And there is the 235 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:53,320 Speaker 3: army that is a full amount of the leader or 236 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:57,240 Speaker 3: the people around him. So this is simply something like 237 00:14:57,320 --> 00:14:59,600 Speaker 3: that if I want to make it very very simple. 238 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:07,000 Speaker 3: But the Iranian state structure is actually quite complicated. You know. 239 00:15:08,080 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 3: They follow some sort of religious hierarchy that the Supreme 240 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:17,680 Speaker 3: Leader is the representative of God on earth and he 241 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:23,720 Speaker 3: is leading the Muslim nation until the Ima Mahti, the 242 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:26,640 Speaker 3: savior of the world, comes from the skies and saves 243 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:29,240 Speaker 3: the world and brings peace. So this is what they 244 00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 3: actually believe. So the Supreme Leader is actually the person 245 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:36,880 Speaker 3: who approves everything. Yeah, there is normal parliament with the 246 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:40,000 Speaker 3: representative of the people, but at the same time there 247 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 3: is another type of religious parliament that decides on the 248 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 3: interests of the regime, which consists of some high level 249 00:15:52,080 --> 00:15:57,360 Speaker 3: clerics or the molas, who are on a higher social level. 250 00:15:57,840 --> 00:16:01,040 Speaker 3: And at the same time, there is also a council 251 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:05,720 Speaker 3: of twelve people, six of them are molas, six of 252 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 3: them are like lawyers and jurists that they are monitoring 253 00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:15,200 Speaker 3: the let's say, the whole political process in the government. 254 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 3: But whatever happens when you see that, Yeah, this is 255 00:16:19,560 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 3: on paper and theory, this is a system that could 256 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:26,720 Speaker 3: possibly work. But all of these organizations or these parts 257 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 3: of the regions or layers of the regime that I mentioned, 258 00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 3: all of them they follow the supreme leader and whatever 259 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:36,600 Speaker 3: they do has to be approved by him. Yeah. I mean, 260 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:39,080 Speaker 3: I'm not talking about like I don't know, the things 261 00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:42,760 Speaker 3: that are decided in a city council or like very lolol. 262 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:46,680 Speaker 3: I'm talking about the national interests or things like that, 263 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:49,840 Speaker 3: or who's going to be the next president for example. 264 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:55,160 Speaker 3: But basically that parliamentary system or those counselings are basically 265 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:58,800 Speaker 3: non functional. They're just there for a show. And at 266 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:03,400 Speaker 3: the same time, especially in the past decades, the iergy 267 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:07,040 Speaker 3: see it's not only a military force that it's not 268 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:11,560 Speaker 3: a militia that follows the leader. It's a whole organized 269 00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:18,199 Speaker 3: and complicated structure that owns the economy, owns all the 270 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:23,359 Speaker 3: institutions in Iran and controls all of them. We're talking 271 00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:27,359 Speaker 3: about the oil sector, we're talking about industry, we're talking 272 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 3: about agriculture. I mean, almost everything is owned by them. 273 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:38,400 Speaker 3: And I ergy is a network of countless high level 274 00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:43,840 Speaker 3: commanders or even let's say non military person that are 275 00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:46,679 Speaker 3: that are all working together and they are running the 276 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 3: country somehow, and of course even if the leader is dead, 277 00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:55,960 Speaker 3: they still have some structures to continue to carry carry on. 278 00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:59,600 Speaker 3: And this is how how the structure is in Iran. 279 00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 3: And I think I think this is what makes Iran 280 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 3: very very different from other states and in the Middle East. 281 00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:08,280 Speaker 3: And it's something that makes run also very different from 282 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:10,119 Speaker 3: what for example, if you want to compare it to 283 00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 3: Sudamhossein system or in in Libya or in Syria, it's 284 00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:19,400 Speaker 3: it's very different because the IRGC has put its hands 285 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:24,480 Speaker 3: and roots everywhere in every institution. We're talking about schools, 286 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:27,880 Speaker 3: we're talking about universities, we're talking about hospitals, we're talking 287 00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 3: about anything that you can imagine even in a post 288 00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:35,360 Speaker 3: office like we were talking about this earlier, So that 289 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:40,320 Speaker 3: there is like in every governmental institution, from universities to 290 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:45,240 Speaker 3: schools and hospitals. Ii ERGC always has a specific office 291 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 3: in every facility. It's supposed to recruit people to join 292 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 3: the resistance, but in fact it's just a it's just 293 00:18:57,160 --> 00:19:00,679 Speaker 3: an office to observe the people who are there or 294 00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:04,960 Speaker 3: the people who are going there for their daily matters. 295 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 3: So they have control over everything, and that's what makes 296 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:14,600 Speaker 3: this regime very very structured and very hard to just 297 00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:18,600 Speaker 3: topple in two nights. So that's why they are still resisting. 298 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:21,560 Speaker 3: There are still fighting back. There are still even though 299 00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:26,400 Speaker 3: Israel and America have destroyed majority of their military basis 300 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:29,199 Speaker 3: and facilities, but they are still fighting back. This is 301 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:32,200 Speaker 3: also important to understand, I think, yeah. 302 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:36,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, And like with it being a little bit unclearly, 303 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:40,120 Speaker 2: like who is still alive, especially in that top end 304 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:42,520 Speaker 2: of the pyramid, right, Like we know hamah and I 305 00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:45,960 Speaker 2: is dead, or we know we're pretty sure he's dead. 306 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 2: Ran has announced he's dead. We know that other people 307 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:53,400 Speaker 2: within that religious leadership and political leadership structure are dead. 308 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:57,680 Speaker 2: We know that they struck the Assembly of Expert today, 309 00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:00,679 Speaker 2: which could have removed a good number but more of 310 00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:04,000 Speaker 2: those religious leaders. Like what they did in Venezuela was 311 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:06,679 Speaker 2: that they found somebody who was no less repressive, but 312 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:11,480 Speaker 2: was amenable to doing what they wanted right specifically with resources, 313 00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:14,000 Speaker 2: specifically with oil. You know, we run the risk of 314 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:17,080 Speaker 2: a similar thing happening in it Ran, right of like 315 00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:20,439 Speaker 2: someone within the IRGC being like, we will do what 316 00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 2: you need us to do with oil as long as 317 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:25,159 Speaker 2: you allow us to continue murdering the Iranian people as 318 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:29,479 Speaker 2: much as we wish. Like, that's a real worry. They 319 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:31,479 Speaker 2: will find someone who they think they can do business 320 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:35,280 Speaker 2: with that that's what they wanted in Venezuela, right, Ran 321 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:39,320 Speaker 2: in Venezuela are different. They are both allied, but they're 322 00:20:39,320 --> 00:20:43,199 Speaker 2: the very different countries. Yeah, but that's a real worry 323 00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:44,080 Speaker 2: for people. 324 00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:48,919 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's also like with Venezuela, it's completely 325 00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:54,399 Speaker 3: different right now because with Venezuela, America had like a 326 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:57,679 Speaker 3: clear person as you said that, yeah, he or she 327 00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:01,960 Speaker 3: is going to be the next leader or whatever, yeah, WROTEZ. 328 00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:06,359 Speaker 3: But with it Ron it's not really clear yet. You know, 329 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:12,240 Speaker 3: the so called Prince Pahlavi, he is he is always 330 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:15,960 Speaker 3: on TV, always on on his social media saying that 331 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 3: I'm gonna come back. I'm going to do this and that. 332 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:21,760 Speaker 3: But it's not really clear if USA and America have 333 00:21:21,920 --> 00:21:24,640 Speaker 3: made a deal with him, because he doesn't really have 334 00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:28,919 Speaker 3: that social base that he claims to have. And on 335 00:21:28,960 --> 00:21:32,919 Speaker 3: the other side, there are the ethnic groups, especially Kurts, 336 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:37,919 Speaker 3: Balucci's and Aquasi Arabs. They're they're like better organized compared 337 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:41,480 Speaker 3: to other ethnic groups. And then today we just saw 338 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:45,400 Speaker 3: that Trump has made phone calls with the Kurdish leaders 339 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:49,600 Speaker 3: of these parties and the other parties in Iraqi curtism, 340 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:54,160 Speaker 3: this means something, and so yeah, it's it's not really 341 00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:56,800 Speaker 3: clear that they're going to have a similar plan like 342 00:21:56,920 --> 00:22:00,800 Speaker 3: Venezuela or they're gonna have something completely different for Iran. 343 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,040 Speaker 3: We're just waiting to see what's going to happen in 344 00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:06,360 Speaker 3: the in the upcoming weeks, because it's just a few 345 00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 3: days that the war is going on. The entire region 346 00:22:10,840 --> 00:22:14,040 Speaker 3: is in a shock. It's it's it's still not clear 347 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:17,320 Speaker 3: that how people are going to decide on their future 348 00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 3: now because the war is still going on and it's 349 00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:23,840 Speaker 3: a very very high level. So of course it's it's 350 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:26,919 Speaker 3: also like even when I when I was talking to 351 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:30,520 Speaker 3: my family the other day, they were telling me, I 352 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:33,560 Speaker 3: mean most people in Kurdistan. I would say, majority of 353 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,880 Speaker 3: the people in in Kurdistan, they don't want monarchy back 354 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 3: of course, they don't want another form of dictatorship. And 355 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,159 Speaker 3: they would say, yeah, we want anyone to be installed, 356 00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:46,400 Speaker 3: but not this Sky, not not this Razapala. We don't 357 00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:50,480 Speaker 3: want him. Anyone is better than him. So this is 358 00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 3: also something and I think probably if they want to 359 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 3: install Raza Palavi, the ethnic groups will not accept it 360 00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 3: and there's going to be more resistance and therefore more wars. 361 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:06,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, let's take another break and we'll talk a little 362 00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:09,000 Speaker 2: bit about that, maybe specifically the Curdis situation, as I 363 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:10,720 Speaker 2: know of interest in both of us. 364 00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 3: All right, we're back. 365 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,920 Speaker 2: So, yeah, you mentioned this piece, right, There was an article. 366 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 2: It was a very poorly written article. I will say, 367 00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:33,680 Speaker 2: for instance, it seemed to think that Talabani and Barzani 368 00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:36,879 Speaker 2: were Iranian. But nonetheless the central thrust of it was 369 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:42,280 Speaker 2: correct that Trump has communicated with the KDP and the 370 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:44,280 Speaker 2: p UK. I understand this is like a lot of 371 00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 2: acronyms coming at people, and so maybe we can just say, 372 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 2: like political parties in Iraqi, Kurdistan, Southern Kurdistan, but that 373 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 2: doesn't necessarily tell us anything. I think it's very easy. Again, 374 00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:01,840 Speaker 2: like there's this American media frame of analysis which sees 375 00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:05,360 Speaker 2: groups in the Middle East as monolithic, right, the Kurds, 376 00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:08,399 Speaker 2: as if they're like an entirely homogeneous entity with one 377 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,760 Speaker 2: political interest, which is not the case. But like, for 378 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:15,720 Speaker 2: America to fully remove this regime and Israel, it needs 379 00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:18,240 Speaker 2: either a partner force or to be willing to commit 380 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:22,760 Speaker 2: thousands of its own soldiers to fight and know that 381 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:26,720 Speaker 2: hundreds of them will die, right, like like they'd in 382 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:30,800 Speaker 2: a ruck, I guess, like knowing what we know and 383 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:33,600 Speaker 2: knowing that there are these groups, right, and maybe it 384 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:35,320 Speaker 2: would be good to give people a primer on the 385 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:41,280 Speaker 2: Eastern Kurdistan resistance groups and the alliance that they've recently formed, 386 00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:44,960 Speaker 2: Like where are they standing right now? And know they 387 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 2: released a statement yesterday, but can you explain that to 388 00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:48,080 Speaker 2: a little bit to people. 389 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 3: There are several parties across Eastern Kurdistan or as they say, 390 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:56,119 Speaker 3: Irenian Kurdistan, and of course they were very diverse and 391 00:24:56,320 --> 00:25:01,639 Speaker 3: each of them have a different ideology. That's that's very normal. Yes, 392 00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:05,120 Speaker 3: what happened in the past few months was that it's 393 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,760 Speaker 3: also a very great development for our people at least 394 00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:12,439 Speaker 3: because they have been also calling for a form of 395 00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:17,040 Speaker 3: cooperation between these parties, and they finally announced that. Of course, 396 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 3: two parties like the Komala and another branch, they did 397 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 3: not join it because they had some disagreements, but that 398 00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:29,720 Speaker 3: is also normal. So the thing is that these parties 399 00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 3: would definitely work together if the things are going to 400 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:37,400 Speaker 3: escalate more. For example, if I want to say about 401 00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:40,840 Speaker 3: a week ago, the Riza Palavi, he published a statement 402 00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:45,040 Speaker 3: and he threatened Kurdish people that if they think about 403 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:49,560 Speaker 3: autonomy or I don't know, thinking about taking quote unquote 404 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:52,040 Speaker 3: parts of Iran's oil, We're going to use the army 405 00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:55,199 Speaker 3: against them in the future. It's incredible that the first 406 00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:59,920 Speaker 3: Kurdish official who answered to that statement was Abdullah Mortardi 407 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,280 Speaker 3: from the Komala, who was not a part of the coalition. 408 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 3: So that means that even though they have disagreements, but 409 00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:11,160 Speaker 3: they are still trying to work together and help each other. 410 00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:13,720 Speaker 3: I have talked to some people in the Kourtish parties. 411 00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:17,119 Speaker 3: They are fully prepared for anything that could happen in 412 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:20,040 Speaker 3: the upcoming weeks or days or even months. I don't know. 413 00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:24,920 Speaker 3: They're fully prepared, And what I know is that they 414 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:29,120 Speaker 3: are telling me that they are prepared that the Israeli 415 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 3: army and also the American army would bomb or destroy 416 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:37,919 Speaker 3: the military bases on the border and also the checkpoints 417 00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 3: so that it would be easier for them to enter. 418 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:45,639 Speaker 3: And probably if it's going to be bigger than that, 419 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:48,800 Speaker 3: then maybe they could take over the controls of the cities. 420 00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:53,320 Speaker 3: And what's really interesting is that they yesterday, these five 421 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:58,000 Speaker 3: parties the coalition, published a statement and there were several points, 422 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:00,560 Speaker 3: but one of the points was that was really interesting 423 00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:03,399 Speaker 3: for me was that they were calling on people to 424 00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:09,959 Speaker 3: not damage any public buildings like banks, goals, I don't know, offices, 425 00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,840 Speaker 3: and that means that probably there is a movement that 426 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,240 Speaker 3: they want to come back and take over all these 427 00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:21,560 Speaker 3: buildings and try to control the cities better. So this 428 00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:25,040 Speaker 3: is also something and there is a lot of discussion 429 00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:28,920 Speaker 3: on social media and people are all saying that, yeah, 430 00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:32,359 Speaker 3: we are ready that if something happens, we will go in. 431 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:35,879 Speaker 3: And I think right now the situation is really complicated 432 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:39,480 Speaker 3: and like we don't know how people can actually enter yet. 433 00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:42,240 Speaker 3: And you said that, yeah, if there is going to 434 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 3: be a force that's ready, to sacrifice thousands of its members. 435 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,159 Speaker 3: I think there are the Kurts are ready to fight. 436 00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:55,000 Speaker 3: They have been ready to fight for forever, for decades. Yeah, 437 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 3: so this is also like something that the Courtish people 438 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:00,719 Speaker 3: already know that if we want to get rid of 439 00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:04,880 Speaker 3: this regime, we have to sacrifice more. For me, it's 440 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:09,280 Speaker 3: very painful to say this, but I think our people 441 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:12,200 Speaker 3: have to sacrifice a little bit more more than that. 442 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,440 Speaker 3: They have been sacrificing for over one hundred fifty years, 443 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:18,199 Speaker 3: and I think maybe they have to sacrifice more. But 444 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,520 Speaker 3: one point here is that when I see what's happening, 445 00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:25,600 Speaker 3: when I see that what is being said, that Trump 446 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 3: is talking to the Kurdish parties, to the Kurdish organizations 447 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,199 Speaker 3: about the situation, one thing that I think about is 448 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:38,080 Speaker 3: that given the history of at least fifteen sixteen years 449 00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:43,120 Speaker 3: of cooperation between America and the Kurds in Rajava, in 450 00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:46,760 Speaker 3: in Syria and the fight against ISIS, which was which 451 00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:50,320 Speaker 3: was a great opportunity for Kurdish people, but at the end, 452 00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:55,360 Speaker 3: Trump just let Kurts down and didn't really support them 453 00:28:55,400 --> 00:29:00,120 Speaker 3: against Turkey, against all these Jadist groups that are supporting Seria. 454 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 3: So the question is that what if we fight against 455 00:29:03,440 --> 00:29:06,680 Speaker 3: this regime, we we destroy the regime. I mean, it's 456 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 3: not just us. I have to mention that the other 457 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 3: ethnic groups are also ready. But what if all these 458 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:18,320 Speaker 3: ethnic groups fight this regime, they destroy this regime. And 459 00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:23,920 Speaker 3: what if Trump just brings someone really bad and someone 460 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:30,040 Speaker 3: really useless, like Rizopaalavi or other Iranian figures that of 461 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:34,640 Speaker 3: course are not after Kurdish people's interests. What if somebody 462 00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:37,440 Speaker 3: likes that comes in power and then the same situation 463 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:40,440 Speaker 3: goes on, and then we have to fight that system 464 00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:43,720 Speaker 3: over and over again. So this is also something that 465 00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 3: I that I also think about it, but we still 466 00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:52,040 Speaker 3: don't know what will happen is America's exact plan. It 467 00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 3: could be something like Iraqi Curtisan, which could benefit the 468 00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:01,840 Speaker 3: ethnic groups a lot. Of course, there's still gonna be 469 00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:05,200 Speaker 3: civil war, probably there's gonna be instability, but at least 470 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:10,640 Speaker 3: the ethnic groups might be able to self determine, you know, 471 00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:13,560 Speaker 3: like might might be able to control their areas and 472 00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:17,440 Speaker 3: get rid of that Iranian control to some extent, maybe 473 00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:21,440 Speaker 3: not fully, but that is also something that could be possible. 474 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,120 Speaker 3: And of course there's going to be killing, there's going 475 00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:27,120 Speaker 3: to be a lot of civilians killed, and we know 476 00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:30,760 Speaker 3: that already during all these bombings, many civilians are killed. 477 00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:33,720 Speaker 3: We don't know how many exactly because there is no 478 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:37,320 Speaker 3: internet connection to make sure about the numbers or to 479 00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:43,000 Speaker 3: investigate that. But of course all these Iranian government buildings 480 00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:47,720 Speaker 3: are RGC bases, intelligence offices or facilities that are all 481 00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:53,040 Speaker 3: located in civilian areas in the cities, in the city 482 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 3: centers all over Iran and also Kurtistan. So there's always 483 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:01,080 Speaker 3: going to be some civilians who are living, were walking 484 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:05,240 Speaker 3: around there and they get killed. So this is also 485 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:09,600 Speaker 3: something that's that's really painful. But I think our people 486 00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:12,880 Speaker 3: really had have had enough and they were ready for this, 487 00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:15,520 Speaker 3: and they were they knew that this is this was 488 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:19,040 Speaker 3: this was going to happen, and yeah. 489 00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:21,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's uh, it's such a difficult thing because 490 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:24,239 Speaker 2: like it's what four or five weeks ago that we 491 00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:29,480 Speaker 2: saw the STG and groups affiliatory and Transitional government and 492 00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:34,440 Speaker 2: groups affiliated with it like live streaming them killing and 493 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:39,080 Speaker 2: mutilating the remains of captured Kurdish men and women in 494 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:42,280 Speaker 2: their resort right like a place where maybe it wasn't 495 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 2: a desire to liberate Kurdish people that took the SDF there. 496 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:48,360 Speaker 2: It was the battle against Isis and and this idea 497 00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:50,880 Speaker 2: of brotherhood of people's right that they would liberate the 498 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,840 Speaker 2: Arab people who lived there. Obviously that has resulted in 499 00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:56,920 Speaker 2: these horrible things that we've seen over the last month. 500 00:31:56,960 --> 00:32:00,480 Speaker 2: And then the thought of like, oh, well, you just 501 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,840 Speaker 2: sent ten thousand more of your children to die so 502 00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 2: you can liberate people in Tehran and then we'll leave 503 00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:10,280 Speaker 2: you again. I was just thinking about like a four 504 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:14,240 Speaker 2: years ago, I was in the Solomonia and I went 505 00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:17,160 Speaker 2: to the museum. You know that they have the Red 506 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:21,400 Speaker 2: Security Building and they have like a very good history 507 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 2: of the Amphile, the genocide against the Kurdish people committed 508 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:28,360 Speaker 2: by the Bathist state, and then they have the nineteen 509 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:32,000 Speaker 2: ninety one uprising, and then they have a lot of 510 00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:34,880 Speaker 2: commemoration of the battle against the Islamic State. And like, 511 00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:40,440 Speaker 2: for my entire life, like the Americans have been leaving 512 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:44,040 Speaker 2: Kurdish people to die and then urging them to rise 513 00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:49,120 Speaker 2: up again. And it's just it's an incredible like revolutionary 514 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,239 Speaker 2: capacity and capacity for sacrifice. But it's also just very 515 00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:55,760 Speaker 2: sad that Americans constantly expect Kurdish people to continue to 516 00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:59,840 Speaker 2: sacrifice and then never fill up their end of the bargain. 517 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:05,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's unfortunately true. And yeah, this has been 518 00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:09,240 Speaker 3: evident in the past few years as well, like in 519 00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:14,080 Speaker 3: in Syria when when when America gave the green light 520 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 3: to Turkey to invade Rajava, and also recently that how 521 00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:21,280 Speaker 3: they just abandoned Kurts. Of course they are still saying, no, 522 00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:24,320 Speaker 3: we didn't abandon curse, but but but they did, and 523 00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:28,240 Speaker 3: we basically lost almost everything that we had gained in 524 00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:33,040 Speaker 3: in Rajava. And there is also like a threat against 525 00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,640 Speaker 3: the Iraqi Curtism region right now from Turkey and also 526 00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:43,480 Speaker 3: from Iraq, and it's it's just the bitter truth that, yeah, 527 00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:47,480 Speaker 3: apparently Curts are not considered as a long term partner 528 00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:50,520 Speaker 3: for the us R and also the other Western countries. 529 00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:54,280 Speaker 3: But like all these horrible things that are that have 530 00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:57,320 Speaker 3: been happening to our people in the past one hundred years, 531 00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:00,160 Speaker 3: I mean, a part of it is of course the 532 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:04,040 Speaker 3: result of the Western countries and colonization from the European 533 00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:08,360 Speaker 3: countries Great Britain, Russia and also America. But at the 534 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:12,600 Speaker 3: same time, it's it's it's really important to not forget 535 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:16,480 Speaker 3: that the majority of this tragedy that our people are 536 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:19,360 Speaker 3: are living in is also caused by by by Turks, 537 00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:22,200 Speaker 3: Arabs and Persians. And by that I just don't mean 538 00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 3: the state. I also mean the whole structure in the 539 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:28,839 Speaker 3: Middle East that has been prosecuting the Kurts. It's it's 540 00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:33,080 Speaker 3: been centuries that are our people are trapped between these powers, 541 00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:37,319 Speaker 3: the Turks, Prisions and Arabs that are also fighting each other. 542 00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:42,480 Speaker 3: But then they bring all of their wars inside or homeland, 543 00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:45,600 Speaker 3: and then our people get killed and displaced and face 544 00:34:45,680 --> 00:34:49,760 Speaker 3: all the tragedies. So yeah, this is also our situation 545 00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 3: right now, and I don't know if it's going to 546 00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:59,360 Speaker 3: be changed to a better situation because it's just so 547 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 3: unclear that how the superpowers, how the major powers, the 548 00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:07,000 Speaker 3: original powers are are planning for these things, and how 549 00:35:07,120 --> 00:35:13,200 Speaker 3: their interests actually matter. Like we talked about, if America, 550 00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:17,239 Speaker 3: if Turkey or NATO and other Arab countries were not 551 00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:21,320 Speaker 3: backing the new Syrian government, I would call it Syrian 552 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:24,120 Speaker 3: Arab government because that's how they identify themselves. 553 00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:27,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's still the Syrian Arab Republic even a year 554 00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:27,759 Speaker 2: and a bit later. 555 00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, if it was only British forces and the new government. 556 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:37,080 Speaker 3: Trust me, they would not be able to enter all 557 00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:41,000 Speaker 3: the territories controlled by SDF because STF is way more 558 00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,640 Speaker 3: advanced and more powerful than them, like military wise. But 559 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:46,600 Speaker 3: STF was left alone, and there was so much pressure 560 00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:50,880 Speaker 3: on STF from all the Arab countries, Turkey and also 561 00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:56,600 Speaker 3: Western countries and America. So this this whole thing, like, 562 00:35:57,160 --> 00:35:59,839 Speaker 3: maybe this is a little bit unrealistic, but a lot 563 00:35:59,880 --> 00:36:01,879 Speaker 3: of people ask me that what's going to be next. 564 00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:06,000 Speaker 3: I think the next is going to be what America 565 00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:09,960 Speaker 3: and Europe want. Like I'm sure that they don't care 566 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:13,480 Speaker 3: about what the people in Kurdistan or the people in 567 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:16,439 Speaker 3: Iran want. They just want to do whatever they want, 568 00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:20,040 Speaker 3: whatever that benefits them. And of course the neighboring countries 569 00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:23,720 Speaker 3: will also follow, from the Arab countries and definitely Turkey, 570 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:27,279 Speaker 3: they will follow the plan that benefits them. So the 571 00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:31,719 Speaker 3: people are trapped between these decisions. If the Iranian structure 572 00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:37,879 Speaker 3: also remains, probably they would also change course and then 573 00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:42,719 Speaker 3: cooperate with the with America or Israel or NATO or 574 00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:48,200 Speaker 3: Arab countries only to remain in power and maintain their interests. 575 00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:51,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a really difficult time if people are looking 576 00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:54,560 Speaker 2: to stay informed on this right. Coverage in the US 577 00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:59,279 Speaker 2: has been poor in the English language. Where would you 578 00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:01,880 Speaker 2: suggest what people follow your work and where would you 579 00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:04,360 Speaker 2: suggest people people look to stay informed of what's happening. 580 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:08,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, I personally don't post a lot. I'm just trying 581 00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:10,640 Speaker 3: to gather information and like be updated and then share 582 00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:13,120 Speaker 3: it with other media that are asking me about and 583 00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:17,920 Speaker 3: other journalists. But there are several pages that I can suggest. 584 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,800 Speaker 3: One of them is definitely our organization hang Out and 585 00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:24,239 Speaker 3: our Organization for Human Rights. I would also suggest to 586 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:29,720 Speaker 3: follow news channels like Rudolph, which they have been working 587 00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:33,520 Speaker 3: really good on this war. It's a Kurdish TV channel 588 00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:37,560 Speaker 3: based in Iraqi, Curtistan. I would also suggest to follow 589 00:37:37,719 --> 00:37:42,840 Speaker 3: the social media pages belonging to the Kurdish parties like 590 00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:47,640 Speaker 3: KDPI or Comala, just like their official pages on Twitter 591 00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:51,120 Speaker 3: or It's for example, they post a lot of really 592 00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:55,399 Speaker 3: good information. I would also suggest, I think I also 593 00:37:55,400 --> 00:38:00,160 Speaker 3: suggested in our last talk, there is this person and 594 00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:03,120 Speaker 3: called Vahit online. He is an independent journalist and he 595 00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:05,440 Speaker 3: has like some really big platforms and he posts a 596 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:09,279 Speaker 3: lot of reliable information and videos about the locations and 597 00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:13,280 Speaker 3: the things that are happening. And I would also suggest 598 00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:19,000 Speaker 3: to follow some other journalists like Ali Jawan Mahrdi. He 599 00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:23,239 Speaker 3: is the manager and supervisor of the Voice of America. 600 00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:27,880 Speaker 3: He also like he has several platforms and they post. 601 00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:31,840 Speaker 3: He posts a lot of updated information about what's happening. 602 00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:35,200 Speaker 3: But here's also something that I want to warn about. 603 00:38:35,840 --> 00:38:39,000 Speaker 3: I would suggest people to not really believe in what 604 00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:44,560 Speaker 3: they see on TV channels or media like Iran International, MANOTO, TV, BBC, 605 00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:49,560 Speaker 3: Persian because all these media have turned into a platform 606 00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:53,279 Speaker 3: to do the propaganda for the monarchists, and they have 607 00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:56,520 Speaker 3: been posting a lot of fake news, a lot of 608 00:38:56,719 --> 00:39:02,440 Speaker 3: AI generated content, and it's been really damaging the whole 609 00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:05,040 Speaker 3: course of the if I want to call it the 610 00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:09,560 Speaker 3: revolution or the war or whatever like that's happening inside 611 00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:13,080 Speaker 3: Iron and Curtiston. So yeah, these are the things that 612 00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:14,960 Speaker 3: I can suggest so far. 613 00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:18,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great suggestion. Thank you well, thank you 614 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,920 Speaker 2: very much for joining us today. We'll get this out 615 00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:23,400 Speaker 2: as soon as possible because I know people are very 616 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:24,719 Speaker 2: interested to know more about it. 617 00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:28,480 Speaker 3: Thanks Cody, thanks for inviting me. The next time. 618 00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:34,240 Speaker 1: It could happen here is a production of cool Zone Media. 619 00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:37,480 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media. Visit our website 620 00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:40,120 Speaker 1: cool Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the 621 00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:44,120 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. 622 00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:46,440 Speaker 1: You can now find sources for It could happen here 623 00:39:46,480 --> 00:39:49,480 Speaker 1: listened directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.