WEBVTT - Crash from Death of an Artist: Krasner and Pollock

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<v Speaker 1>Pushkin.

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<v Speaker 2>You've heard of Jackson Pollock, but you may have never

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<v Speaker 2>heard of Lee Krasner, an artist Pollock's wife and the

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<v Speaker 2>woman who made him famous and in doing so, changed

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<v Speaker 2>everything about the landscape of American modern art. My name

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<v Speaker 2>is Katie Hessel. I'm an art historian and the author

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<v Speaker 2>of a book called The Story of Art Without Men.

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<v Speaker 2>I've spent the past decade uncovering the stories of great

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<v Speaker 2>women artists, but I've never come across an artist more

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<v Speaker 2>influential than Lee Krasner. Today, I'm in your feed to

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<v Speaker 2>bring you a preview of my podcast from Pushkin Industries

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<v Speaker 2>and Samasdat Audio. This is Death of an Artist Krasner

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<v Speaker 2>and Pollock. You can find the show wherever you get

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<v Speaker 2>your podcasts. I hope you enjoy this preview. It's a

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<v Speaker 2>cool summer evening in Paris, August nineteen fifty six. An

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<v Speaker 2>American artist called Lee Krasner is at a friend's place.

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<v Speaker 3>It was a magnificent apartment, was a huge skylight, easels everywhere.

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<v Speaker 3>She was completely at home, amid the smell of turpentine

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<v Speaker 3>and linseed oil.

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<v Speaker 2>Paris is Lee's mecca, the home of modern art. Now

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<v Speaker 2>in her late forties. She's finally here.

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<v Speaker 3>Looking at what was happening in Paris and who was

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<v Speaker 3>doing what, who was painting, who was showing what? Galleries

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<v Speaker 3>were showing what.

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<v Speaker 2>But this isn't just a work trip.

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<v Speaker 3>Lee was there to recharge her batteries because of a

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<v Speaker 3>very tricky relationship with a husband she had left behind

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<v Speaker 3>in the States.

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<v Speaker 2>A turbulent relationship to say the least, his ego, alcoholism,

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<v Speaker 2>and now an affair. But a month in Paris has

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<v Speaker 2>helped take her mind off life back home. That evening,

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<v Speaker 2>Lee's relaxed, drifting into sleep.

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<v Speaker 3>And as she settled in on her friend's couch for

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<v Speaker 3>the night, about three in the morning, the phone rang.

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<v Speaker 3>Her host answered the phone and didn't say anything, but

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<v Speaker 3>she could tell by the stricken look on his face

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<v Speaker 3>that something terrible had happened. Without knowing any of the

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<v Speaker 3>words on the other end of the phone, Lee knew

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<v Speaker 3>exactly what had happened, and she shouted out, Jackson's dead.

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<v Speaker 2>Lee's husband is Jackson Pollock.

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<v Speaker 3>Her host saw that agony in her face, the absolute pain,

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<v Speaker 3>and rushed over to her, held her in his arms

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<v Speaker 3>for what he described as an endless half hour, during

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<v Speaker 3>which she writhed and moaned and was in utter agony.

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<v Speaker 3>He was actually terrified for her life because their apartment

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<v Speaker 3>had a balcony, and he was afraid she might do

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<v Speaker 3>something drastic. You know, that she might try to throw

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<v Speaker 3>herself off.

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<v Speaker 2>Later that same day, Lee would get on a plane

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<v Speaker 2>to New York, arrange his funeral, and mourn her husband.

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<v Speaker 2>But the story of Lee and Jackson doesn't end there.

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<v Speaker 2>After spending weeks in a daze, unable to sleep, she

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<v Speaker 2>would embark on something extraordinary. What she'd do next would

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<v Speaker 2>change history, turning her dead husband into the most famous

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<v Speaker 2>American painter of all time and changing the way we

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<v Speaker 2>all think about art. I'm Katie Hessel, art historian and writer,

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<v Speaker 2>and this is Death of an Artist. Season two, The

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<v Speaker 2>Krasner and Pollock, Episode one Crash. Okay, so Audrey, please,

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<v Speaker 2>can you introduce yourself who you are and what you do?

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<v Speaker 4>Well?

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<v Speaker 1>I don't want to do that. You should do that.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, let's leave that.

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<v Speaker 4>You know you should say, here's Ardrey Flak and she's

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<v Speaker 4>blah blah blah, and she's uh an ancient.

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<v Speaker 1>Person.

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<v Speaker 2>Audrey flat is ninety two years old and is as

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<v Speaker 2>New York as it comes. She's been a painter for

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<v Speaker 2>seven decades now, and back in the nineteen fifties she

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<v Speaker 2>was right at the center of the downtown art scene,

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<v Speaker 2>then made up of only a handful of people.

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<v Speaker 4>I had a studio on Eighth Street and Third Avenue.

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<v Speaker 4>My studio was in a condemned building. The floors were

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<v Speaker 4>rotted and the stairway was hanging down, and it wasn't safe.

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<v Speaker 4>So of course that's a perfect place for artists.

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<v Speaker 2>A few blocks up was a dive bar called the Cedar.

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<v Speaker 4>The Cedar was, you know, the place that everybody went, smoky, crowded.

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<v Speaker 4>I was very busy and jam packed and exciting. And

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<v Speaker 4>the talk they were really arguments about who was a

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<v Speaker 4>greater artist, a Tintrredo or Caravaggia.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, not my usual Saturday night chat.

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<v Speaker 1>There was a bar with stools.

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<v Speaker 4>They were drinking little shots of Scotch with a beer chaser.

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<v Speaker 4>Jackson liked to sit towards the back. His face was bloated,

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<v Speaker 4>his skin, you know, had little capillaries had broken in

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<v Speaker 4>his nose, and you don't ever notice when somebody drinks

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<v Speaker 4>too much.

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<v Speaker 2>Audrey'd see Jackson Pollock there most nights. He was a

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<v Speaker 2>big guy early forties, scruffy, often wearing a baggy coat

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<v Speaker 2>to hide his beer belly inside the cedar. Among fellow artists,

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<v Speaker 2>he was a big deal, the one they all looked

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<v Speaker 2>up to. And that goes for Audrey Flack, then a

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<v Speaker 2>young artist.

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<v Speaker 4>One night I went to the cedar, Jackson wandered over.

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<v Speaker 4>He stumped below over because he was clearly plastered, and

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<v Speaker 4>sort of fell into the other chair next to me.

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<v Speaker 4>We were talking and I wanted to ask him about

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<v Speaker 4>his art, and then he started coming close to me.

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<v Speaker 4>He brushed his face against mine and he had a

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<v Speaker 4>three day stubble. It was scratchy, and obviously he didn't

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<v Speaker 4>smell too good because I don't think he had washed.

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<v Speaker 4>And then he burped, he belched, and then he was

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<v Speaker 4>embarrassed and he tried to pinch my behind and then

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<v Speaker 4>he leans over and he says, let's fuck. I said, no,

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<v Speaker 4>I'm not going to do that. Jackson, just calm down.

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<v Speaker 4>And that was the night that I vowed I would

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<v Speaker 4>never go back to the seat.

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<v Speaker 2>And she didn't, but plenty of others did. Because the

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<v Speaker 2>reality was that if you wanted to be in the

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<v Speaker 2>art scene, really wanted to make it, you had to

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<v Speaker 2>show your face at the Cedar.

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<v Speaker 1>They were the.

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<v Speaker 4>One of the girls who followed the rock stars groupies groupies.

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<v Speaker 1>They were groupies.

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<v Speaker 4>They thought if they slept with big had shows, it

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<v Speaker 4>would rub off and they would have some importance.

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<v Speaker 1>That is how it was.

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<v Speaker 2>And it was there at the Cedar that Jackson met

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<v Speaker 2>a friend of Audrey's who just moved to the city,

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<v Speaker 2>a twenty six year old artist called Ruth Kligman.

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<v Speaker 1>Ruth was unbelievably sexy.

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<v Speaker 4>It just wreaked, thick black hair, rimmed sunglasses and red lipstick.

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<v Speaker 1>She looked like Elizabeth Taylor. She was really knockout.

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<v Speaker 4>She really had a good eye and an ability to

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<v Speaker 4>talk that mesmerized.

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<v Speaker 1>View, which she must have done to Jackson.

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<v Speaker 4>She really got him.

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<v Speaker 2>By this point, Jackson had been married to Lee for

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<v Speaker 2>a decade. Their marriage well, it had its ups and downs,

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<v Speaker 2>and the downs largely corresponded to Jackson's binges. And when

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<v Speaker 2>Jackson met Ruth at the Cedar, he was in one

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<v Speaker 2>of his spirals.

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<v Speaker 3>Jackson had carried on his affair in secret, well secret

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<v Speaker 3>to Lee.

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<v Speaker 2>That's Mary Gabriel, a journalist who wrote the book Ninth

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<v Speaker 2>Street Women, all about the women of the American modern

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<v Speaker 2>arts scene. You'll be hearing a lot from her throughout

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<v Speaker 2>the show. Anyway, back to Jackson's.

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<v Speaker 3>Affair, everyone else in their community was well aware of

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<v Speaker 3>it because he wore Ruth Kligman and his arm like

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<v Speaker 3>a prize.

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<v Speaker 2>A few months after getting together, Ruth started spending more

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<v Speaker 2>and more time at Jackson's home in Long Island, a

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<v Speaker 2>little farmhouse right by the beach. Lee was away that

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<v Speaker 2>summer in Paris, and Ruth made the most of it.

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<v Speaker 2>One hot day, she invited her friend Edith Metzger to

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<v Speaker 2>take the two hour train ride out to Jackson's place

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<v Speaker 2>with her. Ruth couldn't wait to take a cool dip

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<v Speaker 2>in the ocean and show off her new artist's boyfriend.

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<v Speaker 3>They were met at the train station by a Sadden,

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<v Speaker 3>middle aged drunk who barely spoke, who was angry that

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<v Speaker 3>Ruth had brought Edith with her.

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<v Speaker 2>It was ten am and already he reaped of booze.

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<v Speaker 2>Not knowing what else to do, Ruth and her friend

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<v Speaker 2>Edith piled into Jackson's mint green eighty eight Oldsmobile convertible,

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<v Speaker 2>but instead of going to the house or to the beach,

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<v Speaker 2>Jackson headed straight to a bar.

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<v Speaker 3>Carlock's usual drink of choice was beer, but that day

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<v Speaker 3>he turned to gin and got immediately hammered.

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<v Speaker 2>Jackson drank until lunchtime, then finally drove them home. The

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<v Speaker 2>two women changed into their bathing suits ready to go

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<v Speaker 2>to the beach, but when they came into the kitchen,

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<v Speaker 2>they found Jackson raiding the cupboards for more booze. Ruth

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<v Speaker 2>was desperate to salvage the situation to show her friend

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<v Speaker 2>at least some kind of Saturday night. She started arguing

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<v Speaker 2>with Jackson, but he didn't want to go to the beach.

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<v Speaker 2>All he wanted to do was drink. Ruth wore him down,

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<v Speaker 2>and finally he announced that they were going to a party.

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<v Speaker 3>Was going to be a cancert at a mansion on

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<v Speaker 3>Long Island.

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<v Speaker 2>The hottest ticket in town.

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<v Speaker 3>That was exactly what Ruth and Edith needed to hear

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<v Speaker 3>to resurrect their fantasy and their plans. So they changed

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<v Speaker 3>into pretty dresses and Jackson cleaned himself up.

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<v Speaker 2>They got into Jackson's convertible. It was getting dark out

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<v Speaker 2>no street lights.

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<v Speaker 1>From the moment we ken riding the car into a mistake.

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<v Speaker 2>That's Ruth speaking in a rare interview.

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<v Speaker 5>We are on our way, kept stopping the car, crying

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<v Speaker 5>it is became provocative in the sense that she didn't

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<v Speaker 5>understand and should not.

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<v Speaker 1>Very scared.

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<v Speaker 2>Jackson was paying so little attention at this point that

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<v Speaker 2>the car simply rolled to a stop.

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<v Speaker 3>A policeman pulled up alongside him and they ask it

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<v Speaker 3>everything was okay. He had his wits about him enough

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<v Speaker 3>to reassure the policeman that yes, he said. They had

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<v Speaker 3>just stabbed to talk.

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<v Speaker 2>The policeman drove on, and Jackson turned the car around.

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<v Speaker 2>He headed towards home, stopped at another bar, but changed

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<v Speaker 2>his mind about going in. Edith couldn't take it anymore.

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<v Speaker 2>She got out of the car and refused to get

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<v Speaker 2>back in. Jackson was furious. They were just two minutes

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<v Speaker 2>from his house. Ruth managed to coax her friend to

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<v Speaker 2>get back in the car. Jackson put his key in

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<v Speaker 2>the ignition.

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<v Speaker 6>The acting just wildly started to speed, and then he put

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<v Speaker 6>his foot on the gas.

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<v Speaker 1>He did started to scream, and he laughed. He speeded

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<v Speaker 1>down Fargo's Road. That's when the car swore.

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<v Speaker 2>The car hurtled off the road into a ditch and

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<v Speaker 2>smashed into some trees. Ruth blacked out. She was woken up.

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<v Speaker 2>A few minutes later, the young.

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<v Speaker 5>Girl came up to me and she's patting me, and

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<v Speaker 5>there was a man.

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<v Speaker 6>I was holding his hand, and they covered me and

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<v Speaker 6>I made this girl.

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<v Speaker 3>I said, go over there to where the car.

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<v Speaker 2>Is and I'll be watching you and come back and tell.

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<v Speaker 1>Me if he's all right.

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<v Speaker 6>And she did, and she came back and I said,

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<v Speaker 6>is he alive? She said yes, I said, swear by God,

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<v Speaker 6>she said I can't.

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<v Speaker 1>So I knew.

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<v Speaker 2>Both Jackson and Edith were dead in only a few hours.

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<v Speaker 2>The art world would find out. That's coming up. After

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<v Speaker 2>the break, The news that Jackson Pollock was dead spread

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<v Speaker 2>quickly through the Within a few hours, it seemed like everybody.

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<v Speaker 1>Knew, Oh my god, the whole world stopped. Well, the

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<v Speaker 1>whole art world stopped.

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<v Speaker 3>He was the center of their world and now he

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<v Speaker 3>was gone.

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<v Speaker 1>Everybody called each other.

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<v Speaker 4>It was electrifying, like a spark went out. Everybody was

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<v Speaker 4>shocked and sad and depressed.

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<v Speaker 2>Later that day, while Lee Krasner, Jackson's wife, was on

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<v Speaker 2>a plane back to New York, their friends gathered at

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<v Speaker 2>their house in Long Island waiting for her arrival.

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<v Speaker 3>They weren't sure how much she knew about the circumstances

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<v Speaker 3>of Jackson's death. That Ruth was in the carr that

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<v Speaker 3>a young woman had died with him.

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<v Speaker 2>Ruth's clothes were still everywhere, as were Jackson's bottles, broken glasses,

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<v Speaker 2>cigarette butts.

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<v Speaker 3>No one was sure what to expect from Lee.

0:16:06.796 --> 0:16:10.516
<v Speaker 2>Late afternoon on Monday, the thirteenth of August nineteen fifty six,

0:16:11.076 --> 0:16:14.036
<v Speaker 2>barely forty eight hours after the death of her husband,

0:16:15.076 --> 0:16:16.276
<v Speaker 2>Lee opened the door.

0:16:17.756 --> 0:16:21.596
<v Speaker 3>She walked in the house, strong and calm and determined

0:16:21.636 --> 0:16:25.076
<v Speaker 3>and focused. They were shocked because it was a house

0:16:25.116 --> 0:16:28.876
<v Speaker 3>of mourning she had entered. Their friends were grieving. Their

0:16:28.916 --> 0:16:33.236
<v Speaker 3>friends were crying, and yet Lee wasn't. She was there,

0:16:33.876 --> 0:16:37.396
<v Speaker 3>dry eyed, seemingly to console them. It was Lee who

0:16:37.396 --> 0:16:39.836
<v Speaker 3>put her arms around people. It was Lee who was

0:16:40.276 --> 0:16:42.236
<v Speaker 3>the strength in that community at that moment.

0:16:42.836 --> 0:16:45.636
<v Speaker 2>As their friends were crying, not knowing what to do,

0:16:46.236 --> 0:16:50.236
<v Speaker 2>Lee took charge. She was ready to face what was coming.

0:16:51.116 --> 0:16:53.636
<v Speaker 3>To be the person she always was, which was the

0:16:53.636 --> 0:16:59.676
<v Speaker 3>person who took care of a situation coldly, analytically. If

0:16:59.676 --> 0:17:02.196
<v Speaker 3>there was any private morning to be done, if there

0:17:02.236 --> 0:17:04.836
<v Speaker 3>was any pain or grief to be shown, she would

0:17:04.836 --> 0:17:05.116
<v Speaker 3>do that.

0:17:05.236 --> 0:17:09.116
<v Speaker 2>Later because first Lee was going to have to organize

0:17:09.316 --> 0:17:12.116
<v Speaker 2>her husband's funeral, and there was a problem.

0:17:12.396 --> 0:17:14.716
<v Speaker 3>They only had two hundred dollars in the bank.

0:17:15.076 --> 0:17:17.116
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, only two hundred dollars.

0:17:17.596 --> 0:17:20.556
<v Speaker 3>And with that she had to find a way to

0:17:20.596 --> 0:17:23.636
<v Speaker 3>bury her husband, to arrange a funeral in a chapel,

0:17:23.716 --> 0:17:24.916
<v Speaker 3>to buy a burial plat.

0:17:25.596 --> 0:17:30.316
<v Speaker 2>Lee moved quickly. She borrowed money from friends, called Jackson's family,

0:17:30.676 --> 0:17:33.996
<v Speaker 2>made arrangements with the vicar, and just four days after

0:17:34.036 --> 0:17:37.636
<v Speaker 2>the crash, the small local chapel was hosting an odd

0:17:37.716 --> 0:17:42.436
<v Speaker 2>mix of people, artists, friends, Jackson's family, and locals.

0:17:43.276 --> 0:17:47.596
<v Speaker 3>The funeral at the Springs Chapel was somber and silent.

0:17:48.636 --> 0:17:52.916
<v Speaker 3>The artists were silent. The minister didn't mention Jackson's name.

0:17:53.596 --> 0:17:56.516
<v Speaker 2>Not the sendoff you might have imagined for Jackson Pollock.

0:17:56.916 --> 0:18:00.236
<v Speaker 3>This was where the locals from Springs were buried, the

0:18:00.276 --> 0:18:01.556
<v Speaker 3>fishermen and the farmers.

0:18:02.276 --> 0:18:05.476
<v Speaker 2>After the burial, the mourners headed back to the house.

0:18:05.796 --> 0:18:08.156
<v Speaker 3>All of that emotion that had been pent up through

0:18:08.196 --> 0:18:12.116
<v Speaker 3>the morning at the applin at the cemetery exploded in

0:18:12.236 --> 0:18:17.756
<v Speaker 3>what everyone agreed was the most raucous parody that had

0:18:17.796 --> 0:18:23.396
<v Speaker 3>ever been thrown at Fireplace Road. Someone joked at one

0:18:23.396 --> 0:18:25.956
<v Speaker 3>point that Jackson must have been spaking the punch because

0:18:25.996 --> 0:18:28.996
<v Speaker 3>they all got drunk so quickly, and they danced and

0:18:29.076 --> 0:18:30.476
<v Speaker 3>the release was palpable.

0:18:35.396 --> 0:18:39.196
<v Speaker 2>If this story had finished here, Jackson might have been forgotten.

0:18:40.196 --> 0:18:49.516
<v Speaker 2>That would be it. But as you know, that's not

0:18:49.836 --> 0:18:50.956
<v Speaker 2>what happened.

0:18:54.876 --> 0:18:55.076
<v Speaker 4>Here.

0:18:55.076 --> 0:18:57.836
<v Speaker 1>It is then, at fifty two million.

0:18:57.516 --> 0:19:00.396
<v Speaker 2>Dollars, his work would go on to sell for eye

0:19:00.476 --> 0:19:05.076
<v Speaker 2>watering sums sold fifty two million, he would become the

0:19:05.076 --> 0:19:08.796
<v Speaker 2>most famous American artist of all time. Jackson Pollock is

0:19:08.796 --> 0:19:11.596
<v Speaker 2>a name recognized by people well beyond the art world.

0:19:11.636 --> 0:19:14.196
<v Speaker 2>He's famous for those drip paintings that seem to him.

0:19:14.276 --> 0:19:18.356
<v Speaker 2>His paintings would influence filmmakers, musicians, fashion, you name it.

0:19:18.676 --> 0:19:21.556
<v Speaker 2>They would change the course of twentieth century culture.

0:19:22.356 --> 0:19:25.996
<v Speaker 4>When you enter a Pollock painting or entering out of space,

0:19:26.676 --> 0:19:28.956
<v Speaker 4>he was like a living god.

0:19:32.796 --> 0:19:36.396
<v Speaker 2>Many of us have been told a certain story about

0:19:36.476 --> 0:19:40.796
<v Speaker 2>Jackson Pollock as the man who changed art forever, who

0:19:40.876 --> 0:19:45.636
<v Speaker 2>changed America, who changed how we see. That's probably what

0:19:45.676 --> 0:19:49.036
<v Speaker 2>you know about him, and that's what's so intriguing to me,

0:19:49.716 --> 0:19:52.836
<v Speaker 2>because as I see it, the story we've been told

0:19:52.876 --> 0:19:58.556
<v Speaker 2>about Jackson Pollock is a myth. The real story is

0:19:58.676 --> 0:20:04.396
<v Speaker 2>so much better. I'm Katie Hessel, and I've spent the

0:20:04.436 --> 0:20:08.796
<v Speaker 2>past decade uncovering the stories of great women artists that

0:20:09.356 --> 0:20:13.316
<v Speaker 2>come across one more game changing than this one. When

0:20:13.436 --> 0:20:17.516
<v Speaker 2>Jackson Pollock died in nineteen fifty six, his global fame

0:20:17.636 --> 0:20:22.876
<v Speaker 2>and fortune hadn't peaked yet, nowhere near. And none of

0:20:22.916 --> 0:20:25.956
<v Speaker 2>it would ever have happened if not for someone else,

0:20:28.556 --> 0:20:32.316
<v Speaker 2>someone hiding in plain sight, the woman who just put

0:20:32.316 --> 0:20:34.836
<v Speaker 2>her husband in the ground and had less than two

0:20:34.916 --> 0:20:38.996
<v Speaker 2>hundred dollars to her name, Lee Krasner.

0:20:41.596 --> 0:20:44.476
<v Speaker 3>Nobody knew Pollack. He was just a figure in the village,

0:20:44.516 --> 0:20:48.356
<v Speaker 3>a drunk. You're kicking all these Jackson Pollock paintings.

0:20:48.356 --> 0:20:49.956
<v Speaker 4>When are you going to deal with the paper your

0:20:50.196 --> 0:20:50.756
<v Speaker 4>living room?

0:20:50.876 --> 0:20:55.236
<v Speaker 3>This shy, good looking young man appeared at this art opening,

0:20:55.556 --> 0:20:58.236
<v Speaker 3>and the arm of a supernovrite and.

0:20:58.196 --> 0:21:01.516
<v Speaker 2>One fells who she reset the entire market, not just

0:21:01.636 --> 0:21:04.596
<v Speaker 2>Jackson Pollock's market, but the market for American abstract painting.

0:21:04.876 --> 0:21:07.956
<v Speaker 3>If it hadn't been for Lee Krasner, Jackson Pollock would

0:21:08.036 --> 0:21:09.956
<v Speaker 3>not have been the the it was.

0:21:11.196 --> 0:21:15.596
<v Speaker 2>That's all coming up on Death of an Artist, Season two,

0:21:16.436 --> 0:21:27.636
<v Speaker 2>Krasner and Pollock. Death of an Artist Krasner and Pollock

0:21:27.876 --> 0:21:32.396
<v Speaker 2>is produced by Pushkin Industries and Samasdat Audio. Clem Hitchcock

0:21:32.556 --> 0:21:36.356
<v Speaker 2>is our producer. Story editing by Dasha Litz at Sina,

0:21:36.756 --> 0:21:41.916
<v Speaker 2>Sophie Crane and Karen Schakerji from Pushkin. The executive producer

0:21:42.156 --> 0:21:46.756
<v Speaker 2>is Jacob Smith from Samasdat Audio. The executive producers are

0:21:46.836 --> 0:21:52.316
<v Speaker 2>Dasherlitz at Sina and Joe Sykes. Sound design by Peregrin Andrews.

0:21:52.876 --> 0:21:57.156
<v Speaker 2>Original scoring and our theme were composed by Martin Ustwick.

0:21:57.796 --> 0:22:02.676
<v Speaker 2>Fact checking by Arthur Gompertz. Special thanks to Jacob Weissberg.

0:22:03.676 --> 0:22:04.716
<v Speaker 2>I'm Katie Hessel.