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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Pike Did Massacre a production of Katie

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Speaker 1: Studios and I Heart Radio. This special episode will recap

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Speaker 1: our previous seasons to get you up to date on

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Speaker 1: the case. Season three is airing now and can be

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Speaker 1: found wherever you get your podcasts. Multiple people found dead

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Speaker 1: in more than one location along Union Hill Road in

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Speaker 1: piked In this morning two PM. Investigators say they found

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Speaker 1: eight people dead, seven adult victims and a sixteen year

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Speaker 1: old boy, all from the Rodent family. Just a nightmare scenario,

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Speaker 1: all of them shot in the head execution style. They

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Speaker 1: were trying to possibly wipe out this entire Family's absolutely shocking.

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Speaker 1: I hope that the unfortunate in this area apprehend eaching everyone.

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Speaker 1: These are people, these are monsters. This has been by

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Speaker 1: far the longest, most complex and labor intention of investigation

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Speaker 1: the Ohio Attorney General's Office has ever undertaked. No no

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Speaker 1: on your knee, have mind your back, Have mind your back. Yesterday,

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Speaker 1: a Pike County grand jury and dted four individuals for

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Speaker 1: aggravated murder with death pality specifications for allegedly committing this heartless,

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Speaker 1: ruthless murder. One family targeted murdered in their sleep and

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Speaker 1: the killers vanished. It's personal, and somebody was trying to

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Speaker 1: send a message. Everyone was talking about who could have

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Speaker 1: done it and why they would have done it. I

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Speaker 1: want to know exactly what happened that night. Thirty two

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Speaker 1: gunshot wounds, eight people dead, two families destroyed, one grizzly crime.

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Speaker 1: What will happen is anyone's guess. This is the Piked

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Speaker 1: and massacre seasons one and to recap how we got here.

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Speaker 1: M Courtney Armstrong a television producer at Katie Studios with

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Speaker 1: Stephanie Laidecker and Jeff Shane. Our journey started back in

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Speaker 1: when we made a documentary about the crime, and we've

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Speaker 1: been covering the story ever since. I think I speak

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Speaker 1: for all of us when I say that from then

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Speaker 1: until now, we have not been able to shake it

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Speaker 1: or get it out of our heads. I think for

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Speaker 1: me personally, the part of this case that continues to

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Speaker 1: haunt me is the fact that there were mothers brutally

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Speaker 1: murdered in front of their babies. What kind of a

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Speaker 1: monster would do that. We've had the benefit of going

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Speaker 1: to Pike County many times and have interviewed to date

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Speaker 1: probably hundreds of people whether that's local townspeople or experts,

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Speaker 1: or family members to the victims and family members of

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Speaker 1: the accused. And one thing we can say, in a

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Speaker 1: small town like this, there's not a single person that

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Speaker 1: hasn't been affected by this hideous story. And there's not

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Speaker 1: a single person you can talk to on the street

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Speaker 1: that doesn't know somebody connected to it in a meaningful way.

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Speaker 1: Through all these conversations, we began to piece together what

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Speaker 1: happened on that Pebule night. As you'll learn in the

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Speaker 1: upcoming season three, there is still so much left to

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Speaker 1: unravel in the community. Here's piked In, Native barb piked

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Speaker 1: In is considered a village, and it is just a

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Speaker 1: small little town that has a grocery store and a

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Speaker 1: pizza shop and gas stations, and there's a tire shop.

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Speaker 1: People sit and talk to the gas station. Wherever they go,

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Speaker 1: people know each other and they just sit and talk.

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Speaker 1: You know, at the tire shop you're waiting for an

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Speaker 1: oil and oil change or whatever. You just sit there

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Speaker 1: and chat with your neighbor whoever happens to come in.

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Speaker 1: You know somebody anywhere you go. But at some point

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Speaker 1: out in the shadow of its green hills, the area

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Speaker 1: has an eerie passed. Everybody thinks all about bad stuff

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Speaker 1: happens in the big cities, but the devil works in it. Everywhere.

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Speaker 1: I County and beautiful. It's a beautiful place, but there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of dirty people here too. From the side

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Speaker 1: of our town. There's been a lot of murders here

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Speaker 1: that have not been solved. On April, evil reared its

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Speaker 1: face in Pike County in the dead of night under cool,

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Speaker 1: cloudy skies. Eight people were brutally shot and killed in

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Speaker 1: four separate homes. I'll never forget that day. I'll never

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Speaker 1: forget that day. I had gone into the office at

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Speaker 1: the high school to pick Brittany up for an appointment.

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Speaker 1: And when I walked in, they had a TV on

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Speaker 1: and everyone in there was sitting with their mouths hanging open,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, what's going on in here? And

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Speaker 1: the secretaries said, my god, there's been a shooting. They

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Speaker 1: said six people were killed, and she said, we are

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Speaker 1: very worried because was little Chris Roden didn't show up

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Speaker 1: today and we think he might be one of them.

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Speaker 1: Everyone was just in shock. So little Chris law enforcement

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Speaker 1: because I couldn't find him. There was some speculation early

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Speaker 1: on that he might have been involved. For the residents

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Speaker 1: of piked In there was little more than confusion at

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Speaker 1: this point. People knew there was a shooting and that

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Speaker 1: Chris Roden Jr. A sixteen year old freshman at Pikedon

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Speaker 1: High was missing. Where was the team? It was at

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Speaker 1: the home of Chris Roden Senor that the nightmare began.

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Speaker 1: Chris Roden Senor was known to be a strong, hard

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Speaker 1: working family man. He was, you know, a great father.

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Speaker 1: He was a good man, just like the rest of

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Speaker 1: the guys you know in that family. He would do

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Speaker 1: anything for anybody. Christen Dana Roden were married for twenty

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Speaker 1: two years, and although they divorced, they remained close, so

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Speaker 1: close that Chris Sr. Had recently bought Dana a home

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Speaker 1: on the same road he lived on Union Hill Road.

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Speaker 1: He did it so they could stay close to their children.

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Speaker 1: Chris Senior's cousin, Gary Roden, was more like a brother

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Speaker 1: to him and often stayed at his place. Little Chris's aunt,

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Speaker 1: Bobby Joe, who also lived nearby, was the first to

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Speaker 1: make the gruesome discovery at seven forty nine am when

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Speaker 1: she came to feed the dogs. O patriarch of the family.

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Speaker 1: Chris Rodin was dead. He looked like he'd been beaten

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Speaker 1: to death. Chris's cousin, Gary Roden, who was staying with Chris,

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Speaker 1: was also dead. What's here saying? Very right and franking

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Speaker 1: Gary rod start times in. It looks like the dead, right,

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Speaker 1: they're both good. I think you're gods out. Okay, you're

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Speaker 1: anybody open of the house? I don't know us okay,

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Speaker 1: So door was awfully got here but on her bride,

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Speaker 1: her letting on the floor. Bobby, I need to get

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Speaker 1: out of the house. And Wayne house started right now? Okay.

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Speaker 1: This three year old Christopher Roden was the only one

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Speaker 1: of the eight family members who was shot somewhere other

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Speaker 1: than the head. He had multiple gunshot wounds to the head,

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Speaker 1: torso and extremities Corner Distinguished Professor and criminal forensic expert

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Speaker 1: Joseph Morgan tried to make sense of the Rodent murders,

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Speaker 1: starting with father and family patriarch, Chris Sr. Some of

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Speaker 1: this will be hard to hear, particularly if you're personally

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Speaker 1: connected to the tragedy, but it's important to understand the

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Speaker 1: magnitude of what happened that night. He was shot nine times.

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Speaker 1: Now for me, as a forensic investigator, I would look

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Speaker 1: at that and I would deem that as overkilled. And

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Speaker 1: you know, why would somebody need to be shot nine times?

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Speaker 1: They're saying that there's evidence that he attempted or reacted

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Speaker 1: at least to the point where he raised his arm

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Speaker 1: his right form and it it shattered one of the bones.

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Speaker 1: When you've got an individual that has gotten defensive loans,

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Speaker 1: that person has an awareness, so that goes to a

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Speaker 1: level of callousness that that's roses to victim. Gary Roden,

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Speaker 1: Chris Sr's cousin, was a beloved member of the family.

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Speaker 1: By all accounts, Gary and Chris Sr. Were very close.

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Speaker 1: Gary just happened to be at Chris's home that night.

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Speaker 1: He was actually from Kentucky, so you know, he didn't

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Speaker 1: even live in the area or the neighborhood, but you know,

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Speaker 1: lived close enough to where he was staying with Chris

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Speaker 1: that evening. We do know that the shooter was very

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Speaker 1: very close to Gary when they fired, because they talked

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Speaker 1: about what is referred to as a press contact events

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Speaker 1: wanted and if if our listeners will essentially take your

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Speaker 1: index finger, okay, and point it towards the palm of

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Speaker 1: your hand and extend the tip of your finger maybe

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Speaker 1: I don't know, probably about half an inch away from

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Speaker 1: the surface of your palm. That's kind of what we

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Speaker 1: refer to as a contact moon. And what that means

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Speaker 1: is that you're going to have you know, the bullet

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Speaker 1: is not the only thing coming out of the end

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Speaker 1: of the weapon. You're going to have the fire that

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Speaker 1: actually the ignition of the bullet, and around you'll have

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Speaker 1: this burning of powder that's coming out. You'll have unburned

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Speaker 1: powder that's coming out. So this is a very intimate event.

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Speaker 1: I spoke with Mike Gallen, criminal defense attorney from Ohio.

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Speaker 1: Are you able to talk about the scenes themselves? You know,

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Speaker 1: if you look at it and it's all from the

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Speaker 1: autopsy reports, those kind of injuries leaves no doubt that

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Speaker 1: this was an intentional or these all were intentional killings,

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Speaker 1: kind of designed to send a message to someone. The

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Speaker 1: muzzle marks sticks in my mind. You have to be

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Speaker 1: obviously arms reached. I mean, you are locking eyes with

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Speaker 1: the victim, it would seem Does that paint any kind

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Speaker 1: of picture to or indicate to officers or attorneys anything? Sure,

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Speaker 1: it does, and maybe even closer than arms length I

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Speaker 1: mean maybe just inches. It indicates to me, at least,

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Speaker 1: especially when you have the number of shots like that here,

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Speaker 1: that somebody was trying to send a message. I don't

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Speaker 1: think there can be any doubt about that. I mean

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Speaker 1: it was personal and I think that's what that demonstrates.

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Speaker 1: At this point, Bobby Josie's two people did by twelve

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Speaker 1: gunshot wounds. While waiting desperately for police to arrive, she

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Speaker 1: makes her way over to her nephew, Frankie's house. She

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Speaker 1: wanted to get some help and to tell him what

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Speaker 1: happened to his father and uncle, whose bodies she had

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Speaker 1: just found. Frankie Rowden was Chris Senior and Dana's oldest son.

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Speaker 1: The twenty year old was a father to two boys.

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Speaker 1: Like his parents, Frankie was a hard worker. He loved fishing, hunting,

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Speaker 1: and demolition derby, but nothing so much as his family

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Speaker 1: and his fiance, nineteen year old Hannah Gilly. Hannah Gilly

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Speaker 1: was on the homecoming court in high school, and at

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Speaker 1: that time she told friends she planned to go to college,

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Speaker 1: get a business degree, and open a daycare. Frankie and

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Speaker 1: Hannah wanted a lot of kids. They had a bright

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Speaker 1: future The young family lived together just up the street

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Speaker 1: from Chris sr All on Union Hill Road. They were

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Speaker 1: looking forward to getting married soon. So after Bobby Joe

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Speaker 1: made the call to nine one one, she went to

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Speaker 1: Frankie's house near right nearby, and the person who came

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Speaker 1: to the door was Frankie's three year old son. As

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Speaker 1: the police reports and newspaper reports showed, he was, you know,

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Speaker 1: covered in blood, and he, like any three year old,

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Speaker 1: sort of didn't fully understand what was going on. And

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Speaker 1: he told his aunt that, you know, his father was

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Speaker 1: playing zombie in the bedroom, and that's because the family

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Speaker 1: were fans of The Walking Dead, so you know, he

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Speaker 1: was in there with his father playing zombie, which is

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Speaker 1: absolutely heartbreaking. Twenty year old Frankie Rodin was shot three

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Speaker 1: Tom's in the head as he lay in bed next

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Speaker 1: to his fiance and they're six month old. We talked

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Speaker 1: about Hannah Gilly shot trib Tom's. She she catches one

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Speaker 1: in the eye. It poses this idea, why are you

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Speaker 1: shooting these people in the face. What's the purpose of it,

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Speaker 1: because not only shoot him in the face, you're shooting

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Speaker 1: him multiple talks. What what threat did she post? She's

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Speaker 1: laying there was her child in the bed meanwhile, and

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Speaker 1: this is all happening. Around eight am on April, Bobby

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Speaker 1: Joe calls their brother James. She's in hysterics. There's now

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Speaker 1: two murder scenes, four people dead, twenty gunshot wounds, two

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Speaker 1: children left alive at the scenes. James immediately goes over

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Speaker 1: to his sister Dana's house to check on her and

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Speaker 1: the remaining kids. Dana Roudin was a nurse known for

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Speaker 1: her gregarious nature and loving smile. She had met Chris

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Speaker 1: Rodden Sr. When she was just in high school and

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Speaker 1: it was love at first sight. Even though they divorced

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Speaker 1: twenty two years later, they remained very close together. The

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Speaker 1: pair had three beautiful children, twenty year old Frankie, Hannah May,

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Speaker 1: and little Chris. She's goodhearted, a lot of fun, you know,

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Speaker 1: always laughing, cracking up. She was. She was a very

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Speaker 1: very good person. She sent me a text she said,

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Speaker 1: my grand babies here and I said, we congratulations. I said,

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Speaker 1: she's beautiful. What did you What did Hanna May name her?

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Speaker 1: She said Kylie May and I said that's so pretty.

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Speaker 1: And that was the last, you know, the last thing

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Speaker 1: I ever heard from Dana. She again like Chris Senior

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Speaker 1: was shot multiple times, and not only was she shot

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Speaker 1: multiple times, but specifically reports have her having been shot

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Speaker 1: five times, four times. Pull Tom's in the head. Now,

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Speaker 1: what the hell would you shoot somebody four Toms in

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Speaker 1: the head, because you know one should suffice. But the

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Speaker 1: shooter took the top to take that muzzle of that weapon.

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Speaker 1: Stick it beneath Dana's chin, Stick it beneath her chia.

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Speaker 1: This is a common location for suicide, all right, This

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Speaker 1: is a typical for homicide. This particular April seemed extra

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Speaker 1: special because Hannah May had just given birth to her

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Speaker 1: second daughter five days prior. Just weeks before that, Dana

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Speaker 1: threw Hannah May a big baby shower at their new house.

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Speaker 1: The pictures from the shower show what a happy celebration

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Speaker 1: it was. Sadly, James, Dana's brother, was about to enter

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Speaker 1: yet one more unimaginable scene. Dana and her nineteen year

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Speaker 1: old daughter, Hanna May, were both dead. Hannah roding She

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Speaker 1: was shot twice in the head as her newborn laid

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Speaker 1: beside her. Maybe they're curled in a fetal posture along

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Speaker 1: with her baby, just curled in a fetal posture. Mom

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Speaker 1: was slowly stroking the head of the baby and try to, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, calm suit the baby during the night. Maybe

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Speaker 1: she she awakes, some breastfeeds the baby during the night

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Speaker 1: while she's sleeping, and said, it's a position and people

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Speaker 1: have slept in for thousands and thousands of years. It's

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Speaker 1: a position of comfort. You imagine you're laying there, You're

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Speaker 1: there to protect your baby, and you're curled up on

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Speaker 1: your side. There's an awareness. This brings us back to

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Speaker 1: in Dana's son, the high school freshman, Chris Jr. Was

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Speaker 1: nowhere to be found. It took detective several hours to

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Speaker 1: locate him, but finally little Chris was found in the

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Speaker 1: home with his mother, Dina and his sister Hannah. May

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Speaker 1: sixteen year old Chris Jr. Was shot four toms in

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Speaker 1: looting twice in the top of his head. He was

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Speaker 1: found wedged behind his bed, implying that he was trying

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Speaker 1: to hide from the killer killers. There's now seven people dead,

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Speaker 1: thirty one gunshot wounds, and three children left alive at

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Speaker 1: the scenes. The once small and sleepy town became the

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Speaker 1: epicenter for grizzly crime and the subsequent complex murder investigation.

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Speaker 1: When it was all said and done, two families would

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Speaker 1: be destroyed and the town would never be the same.

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Speaker 1: For the Quiet Town, the scene was unreal. Nearly seven

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Speaker 1: hours after the first bodies were found at one PM

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Speaker 1: and April a final fatal discovery. Yeah I need it.

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Speaker 1: He has been out to close to seven on nine

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Speaker 1: lat Force. Uh, it's all that stuff. It's on the news.

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Speaker 1: I just found this down My cousin with a game shop. Wind. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's see it right So, okay, I'll be saying that

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Speaker 1: by the very way on the whole thing, Donald done,

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Speaker 1: whole thing done. Yeah, it says, what do you mean

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Speaker 1: can Rody? Yeah? Okay, care honey, out of the house.

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm out of the house right now. I just

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Speaker 1: went in Alora and check Laura and a little to

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Speaker 1: say he had a game shop. Wind. Okay, we're gonna

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Speaker 1: get that down there to okay, all right, kick Mark.

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Speaker 1: A few miles down Union Whole Road was Chris Roden

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Speaker 1: Senior's brother. There, Kenneth year old, was shot once through

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Speaker 1: his right eye. Kenneth's cousin, Donald Stone, went to check

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Speaker 1: on Kenneth after hearing about the murders of their six

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Speaker 1: other family members he had failed to hear from Kenneth

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Speaker 1: that day. What does it say that they would take

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Speaker 1: the time and put themselves in a position where they

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Speaker 1: could be face to face with Kenneth. He was found

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Speaker 1: covered with dollar bills that were strewing about his body. Um,

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Speaker 1: he just god, I mean, you can't you can't make

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Speaker 1: this up. By the time officials released the names of

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Speaker 1: the eight victims piked In, residents were reeling. You know,

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Speaker 1: they had snuck in in the night and committed this,

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Speaker 1: these murders, and nobody had a clue about you know

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Speaker 1: who or why, And that's really scary. We're going to

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Speaker 1: take a break. We'll be back in a moment. There

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Speaker 1: were rumors about who had done the crime everywhere online,

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Speaker 1: in the coffee shops, amongst the police. I mean everyone

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Speaker 1: was talking about who could have done it and why

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Speaker 1: they would have done it. Investigators believe that the murders

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Speaker 1: were clearly premeditated, but the killing spree was so staggering

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Speaker 1: and merciless there were endless questions. One of the first

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Speaker 1: things investigators studied where confrontations the roads had with locals

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Speaker 1: in recent years. Could these conflicts have triggered a vendetta

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Speaker 1: against the family. There was one concerning incident that had

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Speaker 1: happened at a demolition derby. Based on what's been reported

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Speaker 1: in the court documents, I think it's fair to say

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Speaker 1: that Frankie and Chris Jr. I'm definitely were hotheads. It

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Speaker 1: definitely got into fights here and there. They had an

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Speaker 1: incident with a fellow named Tommy Gorman, who was a

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Speaker 1: rival in the demolition derby's. They got into a bit

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Speaker 1: of a sort of heated match and there was a

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Speaker 1: believe at incident on the track. They got up say

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Speaker 1: with each otherous bad blood um. And then again it's

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Speaker 1: you know, kind of kicked up speed with Facebook posts

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Speaker 1: about sort of consulting each other. And then of course

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Speaker 1: Chris Junior Frankie drove over to Gorman's house and proceeded

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Speaker 1: to uh really beat on Gorman and his father um

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Speaker 1: and they fights and meetings were only really broken up

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Speaker 1: after the grandfather came out and pumped a few shotgun

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Speaker 1: shells into the air. Chris Junior had also gotten into

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Speaker 1: a scuffle with another local kid named Rusty mongol we

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Speaker 1: On gold Head posted on Facebook that Christian your hid

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Speaker 1: him with a car and in his message. You know,

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Speaker 1: he uses some pretty tough language. I mean, Rusty was

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Speaker 1: nineteen at the time, and you know he's talking about

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna break his fucking legs and curb stop his

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Speaker 1: ass and sort of nineteen year old bluster. Really, the

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Speaker 1: Rusty Mungle thing happened just two weeks before the murders.

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Speaker 1: But police scoured both of these leads, even taking DNA

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Speaker 1: evidence of the suspects. They came up empty. An ominous

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Speaker 1: feeling had spread throughout Pike County. He was investigative reporter

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Speaker 1: Jodi Barr. You've got eight members of one family targeted,

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Speaker 1: murdered in their sleep, in their homes, and the killers

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Speaker 1: seemingly vanished. We didn't know the pieces, We didn't know

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Speaker 1: how to put it together. There was no information coming

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Speaker 1: out about these murders, about motives, even the family members

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Speaker 1: who were in direct communication with law enforcement, even they

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Speaker 1: were being told anything. I mean, it's called it good

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Speaker 1: investigative work, and you know, you hold your card close

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Speaker 1: to the chest as an investigator. Maybe that's what it was.

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Speaker 1: But from the outside looking in, it was almost like

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Speaker 1: law enforcement didn't have a clue at that point in time.

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Speaker 1: Led by an ambitious Sheriff Charles Reader. The ensuing investigation

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Speaker 1: soon became the largest in Ohio's history. I've got a

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Speaker 1: message for the killers. We will find you. The family

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Speaker 1: and the victims will have justice one day. There's so

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Speaker 1: many pieces that have to be put into place with

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00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 1: this your lead progging from this blood bath to another

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Speaker 1: blood bath. One of the first major developments in the

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Speaker 1: case came when Mike Dwine, then Ohio's Attorney General, announced

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Speaker 1: that he believed the killings were planned and premeditated. He

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Speaker 1: cited clear efforts taken by the shooter or shooters to

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Speaker 1: remove any incriminating forensic evidence. The Attorney General Dwine at

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Speaker 1: the time said it was a pretty sophisticated operation and

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Speaker 1: the people that that carried it out, we're trying to

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Speaker 1: do everything that they could to make sure that they

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Speaker 1: didn't get caught. Attorney General Dwine and Sheriff Reader, they

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Speaker 1: both said that the investigation was going to be a

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Speaker 1: long one in a lengthy process, and boy, sure has

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Speaker 1: played out that way. An investigative task force of massive

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Speaker 1: scope kicked into gear, led by the Ohio Bureau of

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Speaker 1: Criminal Investigation the b c I. More than two one

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Speaker 1: law enforcement officials were mobilized, including sheriffs from offices across Ohio.

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Speaker 1: The FBI and the d e A stepped in to

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Speaker 1: provide technical expertise to de Win's office. Solemn funerals were

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Speaker 1: held for all the victims. For two years, not a

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Speaker 1: single arrest was made. You lived in that area, man,

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Speaker 1: it was hush hush. You were just kind of walking

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Speaker 1: around looking over your shoulder at seeing with some of

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Speaker 1: these people, not knowing you know, who could be next,

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Speaker 1: who did it? There was one very curious lead that

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Speaker 1: investigators had unhearthed. At three of the crime scenes on

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Speaker 1: Union Hill Road, police found a substantial marijuana grow operation,

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Speaker 1: including a grow house harboring hundreds of cannabis plants. This

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Speaker 1: grow operation on the Rodents property was clearly being cultivated

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Speaker 1: for sale. It was also worth almost half a million dollars.

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Speaker 1: The Rodents had a pretty sposible crop of marijuana plants

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Speaker 1: on their property. You know. There were indications that they

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Speaker 1: were involved in some drug deals and drug trade with marijuana.

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Speaker 1: That obviously feeled even more speculation that these were outside operators.

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Speaker 1: Possibly was as a drug deal gone bad, or was

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Speaker 1: somebody trying to take over their turf. All kinds of

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Speaker 1: Rumors started slow after that disclosure. As the months wore on,

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Speaker 1: no one's been arrested, no one charged, no people named.

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Speaker 1: This person's of interest, you really started to wonder, you know,

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Speaker 1: maybe this drug cartel thing there was something to that.

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Speaker 1: They definitely knew how to kill people. You know, you're

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Speaker 1: looking for signs of the drug cartel, and then you

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Speaker 1: find Kenneth Roden with what appeared to be a gunshot

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Speaker 1: in the head, but that there were dollar bills or

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Speaker 1: some sort of paper money spread around the body. Was

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Speaker 1: that a sign? What did that mean? Could the Rodents

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Speaker 1: operation have motivated a cartel hit, a lethal battle over territory?

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00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 1: It was a tenable idea. But over the next months,

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Speaker 1: as the investigation dug deeper, an entire new set of

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Speaker 1: possible culprits came into frame. The Wagner family Angela Wagner

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00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:03,560
Speaker 1: for the eight years old, her husband Billy Wagner, their

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00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:06,800
Speaker 1: two sons, George and Jake, both in the mid twenties,

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Speaker 1: Angela's mother, Rita Newcombe, and the family matriarch, Frederica Wagner.

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Speaker 1: Here's Jeff. The Wagners were a well known and well

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Speaker 1: to do family in the Pickton area. And Frederica Wagner

395
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:21,639
Speaker 1: was at the helm of this A self described entrepreneurs

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00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 1: she owned properties all of her Pike County that spanned

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Speaker 1: over sevent acres and were valued at more than four

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00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:30,800
Speaker 1: million dollars. She had also founded two nonprofits, Lucasville Mission,

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Speaker 1: a church that helps underprivileged children, and the Crystal Springs Home,

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Speaker 1: a facility that provides services to developmentally disabled adults. As

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00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,680
Speaker 1: we've learned throughout the series, Frederica had her detractors as

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00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 1: well as her supporters in the community. We probably need

403
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: to clarify here. The Wagner seemed like a good, god

404
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:53,399
Speaker 1: fearing country family, but police were gathering heart evidence linking

405
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:56,560
Speaker 1: the Wagners to the crime, and the Wagners had had

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00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: some tangles with law enforcement in the past. In two

407
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:03,439
Speaker 1: thous and in one seemingly homespun, mother Angela Wagner, along

408
00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 1: with Billy Wagner, were charged with him properly handling a firearm.

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Speaker 1: In two thousand and twelve, they are both charged with

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Speaker 1: receiving stolen property, a felony. Investigators discovered that in the

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00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 1: months prior to the killings, the Wagners began making their

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00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:22,520
Speaker 1: own gun silencers, police believe silencers were necessary to pull

413
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:26,640
Speaker 1: these killings off because they happened in such close proximity.

414
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Speaker 1: Investigators also found that the Wagner family had bought ammunition,

415
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 1: a magazine clip, a bug detector, and materials to build

416
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Speaker 1: brass catchers. The brass catcher is a bag that hooks

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00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:44,320
Speaker 1: on the side of a firearm. It will catch spent cartridges,

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00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:48,720
Speaker 1: so every time you pull the trigger, cartridges is ejected.

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Speaker 1: And if you were really interested in not leaving anything behind.

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Speaker 1: As far as holistic evidence, this sounds like a great story.

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00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 1: This bag will collect the shell casing so there's no

422
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 1: evid left behind. The bug attector apparently that helps someone

423
00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:09,080
Speaker 1: find listening to oaxes and sometimes create white noist a

424
00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:17,440
Speaker 1: muffle sounds or discussion Authority search to seventy one acre

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00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,200
Speaker 1: farm and peebles that was once owned by Jake Wagner.

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00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 1: Jake was victim Hanname Roden's former boyfriend. The pair shared

427
00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: a three year old child together. Jake and Hanname Rodin

428
00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 1: had parted bitterly and were fighting over custody at the

429
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 1: time of her murder. The vice was tightening around the

430
00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:38,920
Speaker 1: Wagner family and some speculate that the only way they

431
00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:41,240
Speaker 1: felt they could escape it was to move four thousand

432
00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:46,240
Speaker 1: miles away. They moved to Alaska, which raised even more

433
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 1: suspicious But then the very following month, law enforcement actually

434
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:53,400
Speaker 1: finally searches properties where the Wagners lived. So that was

435
00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:58,120
Speaker 1: really the first public indication that the Wagners were possible suspects,

436
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:04,040
Speaker 1: if not people of interest. The Wagners made keen I, Alaska,

437
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,320
Speaker 1: their new home. It's a tiny town south of Anchorage.

438
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:12,280
Speaker 1: All the while they vehemently denied any wrongdoing. Jake's mother,

439
00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:16,040
Speaker 1: Angela Wagner, said her husband, Billy Wagner, and victim Chris

440
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:19,920
Speaker 1: Roden Senor, were like brothers. She claimed that Billy would

441
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 1: never harm Chris. Billy's mother, grandmother, Frederica Wagner, said the

442
00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 1: Wagners were quote a good Christian family and despite the

443
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 1: speculation about the family, many in Pike County couldn't figure

444
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 1: the Wagners from murder us. I read that and I

445
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 1: had to laugh. I had to laugh so hard. Okay,

446
00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:51,040
Speaker 1: so you have to remember that this was a very organized,

447
00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:58,520
Speaker 1: brilliantly done execution. This is something that you wouldn't learn

448
00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 1: on a d v D with military background, Navy seals.

449
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:12,160
Speaker 1: I mean, whoever did it was was brilliant. Their professional

450
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 1: These people are not professional killers. I think that is

451
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:23,160
Speaker 1: the common theme of this entire story about Pike County

452
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 1: and about this road and massacre, is it seems just

453
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 1: too far fetched out when you try to connect the

454
00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 1: dots through the histories of you know, how the Wagoners

455
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:35,440
Speaker 1: conducted their business, how they live their lives. I don't

456
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:38,720
Speaker 1: know that I have seen any reporting, any fact brought

457
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:41,240
Speaker 1: out about the Waggoners that would say, yep, there you go,

458
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 1: mass murderers. I think that is the draw that continues

459
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:49,080
Speaker 1: to to keep people interested in this story, is that

460
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:52,480
Speaker 1: you would have never seen any of this coming. In

461
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:55,480
Speaker 1: the spring of two thousand and eighteen, the Wagoners returned

462
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:57,520
Speaker 1: to the pikes In area to take care of Billy's

463
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 1: aging father. The plan was to set up with care

464
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 1: and then returned to Alaska, but things did not go

465
00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:11,440
Speaker 1: as planned. If you seek about it, the Wagners were

466
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:14,240
Speaker 1: scott free. They went to Alaska. They could have took

467
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:17,080
Speaker 1: off and nobody could have ever seen them again ever,

468
00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:22,320
Speaker 1: but they came back here. They came back. Now, my

469
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 1: the way that I am, I would never do that.

470
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:27,560
Speaker 1: But if I had pulled something off like that and

471
00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:30,160
Speaker 1: got away into that long and went to Alaska, you know,

472
00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: I'm packing my ship and I'm hitting the woods, and

473
00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:34,760
Speaker 1: nobody's ever going to see me again. I'm sure the

474
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:36,400
Speaker 1: hell I'm not going to come back. It's the only

475
00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 1: way I would come back is if I thought my

476
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:44,680
Speaker 1: ask covered. With their investigation reaching a fever pitch, then

477
00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 1: Ohio Attorney General Mike Dwine and Pike County Sheriff Charlie

478
00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:52,240
Speaker 1: Reader asked the public for information on the Wagner family.

479
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:57,080
Speaker 1: I hope that the unfortunate in this area apprehend each

480
00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:05,000
Speaker 1: and everyone. These are people, These are monsters, the Wine said.

481
00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:11,080
Speaker 1: He was quote laser focused on the Wagners, their business dealings, vehicles, firearms,

482
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: and ammunition. Investigators had solid ballistic evidence connecting firearms using

483
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:19,320
Speaker 1: the homicide with guns believed to be owned by the Wagner's.

484
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 1: These included a twenty two caliber long rifle, a forty

485
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:32,760
Speaker 1: caliber handgun, and a thirty caliber gun. They also recovered

486
00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 1: a homemade silencer at the bottom of a well on

487
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:40,040
Speaker 1: the Wagner's property. Well, good afternoon. We promised that the

488
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:43,400
Speaker 1: day would come when a rush would be made in

489
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:47,600
Speaker 1: the Pike County massacres today or is that today? In

490
00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 1: a series of arrests that sent shock waves through the

491
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:54,120
Speaker 1: insulated community, six members of a local family, the Wagners,

492
00:33:54,200 --> 00:34:03,280
Speaker 1: were taken into custody. Hands up, a right up. Forty

493
00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 1: seven year old Billy Wagner is the patriarch of the

494
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:08,880
Speaker 1: Wagner family and was arrested near Lexington, Kentucky, and a

495
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:17,200
Speaker 1: horse trailer that was pulled over. Name Angelo Wagner is

496
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 1: Billy's wife and matriarch of the Wagner family. The forty

497
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,360
Speaker 1: year old was arrested at their home near Piked In, Ohio.

498
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 1: Angelo and Angela and Billy's two sons, George Wagner and

499
00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 1: Jake Wagner, were arrested together during a traffic stop. George

500
00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 1: seven and Jake was twenty six. Seventy six year old

501
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:46,000
Speaker 1: Fredrico Wagner, Billy Wagner's mother was arrested at the family's

502
00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:50,520
Speaker 1: horse farm, the Flying w Angelo Wagner's mother, sixty five

503
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,279
Speaker 1: year old Rita Joe Newcomb, was arrested at her home

504
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:59,719
Speaker 1: while six members of the Wagner family were arrested and

505
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:03,680
Speaker 1: action with the crime. Billy Angela, George and Jake Wagner

506
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:08,839
Speaker 1: were charged with eight counts of aggravated murder. Details about

507
00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 1: the arrests of four people and the murders of eight

508
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:16,359
Speaker 1: members of the Rodent family. All the arrests happened within

509
00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 1: minutes of each other. And that tells me that the

510
00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:24,320
Speaker 1: b c I, the Ohio Bureau of Criminal Identification, who

511
00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:27,360
Speaker 1: was in charge of this investigation, they know what they're doing,

512
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:30,439
Speaker 1: and they wanted to make sure that they affected these

513
00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 1: arrests without any kind of problems or tipping anybody off.

514
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:39,799
Speaker 1: So they had that thing down pretty tight. Six months later,

515
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 1: four members of the Wagner family were indicted on charges

516
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 1: of aggravated murder with death penalty specification for the murders. Yesterday,

517
00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 1: a Pike County grand jury and died four individuals for

518
00:35:55,640 --> 00:36:02,840
Speaker 1: aggravated murder with death penalty especially vacation, for allegedly committing

519
00:36:03,840 --> 00:36:14,400
Speaker 1: this heartless, ruthless, cold blooded murder. Did they do it?

520
00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:16,719
Speaker 1: We want to know now, obviously everybody wants to note

521
00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:19,840
Speaker 1: right now. And man, if they're cooperating, as this attorney says,

522
00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:24,240
Speaker 1: they're giving over computers and laptop DNA, whatever it takes.

523
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:26,799
Speaker 1: You know, people who aren't experts of criminology. We look

524
00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:28,680
Speaker 1: at that and go, well, man, that sounds like an

525
00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:34,839
Speaker 1: innocent person. An innocent person will be doing that. On

526
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:38,920
Speaker 1: the other hand, there were the ballistics discoveries. Here's Bureau

527
00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:42,920
Speaker 1: of Criminal Investigation agent Ryan Scheiderer testifying in court that

528
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:46,160
Speaker 1: shell casings found in the Wagness property match the ones

529
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:50,160
Speaker 1: found at the Rodent's crime scenes. We recovered twenty two

530
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 1: caliber shell cases. And where we recovered those which at

531
00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:56,080
Speaker 1: to sixty Peterson Road, which was the property that was

532
00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:59,959
Speaker 1: owned by George Wager and his brother Jake. And we're

533
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:03,560
Speaker 1: of those shall casing submitted to the lab for comparison

534
00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:07,160
Speaker 1: to the shaw cases that had been recovered from both

535
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:14,400
Speaker 1: Frankie's and Dana's residences. Yes, and what was the opinion

536
00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 1: of the The weapon that fired the shell casings at

537
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:22,960
Speaker 1: two sixty Person Road also fired the shell casings at

538
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 1: Anna's and Dana's residents as well as Frankie and Hannah

539
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:31,600
Speaker 1: Gillies residents. So the same firearm had been inspired on

540
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:35,000
Speaker 1: the same properties. Okay, So the exact same gun, not

541
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:39,360
Speaker 1: just the same type of gun, the same firearms. Okay.

542
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:46,480
Speaker 1: The indictment also includes a reference to a specific pair

543
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:49,480
Speaker 1: of boots that the Wagner family purchased at Walmart and

544
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:54,600
Speaker 1: allegedly war during the murders. The theory was that the

545
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,040
Speaker 1: Wagners were trying to frame Dana Roden's brother, James Fanley,

546
00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:02,480
Speaker 1: who was known to add this make of boot. Sheriff

547
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:05,760
Speaker 1: Frieder said the Wagner's plan these killings for months, studying

548
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 1: the Rodents habits. He alleged that they then covered up

549
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,880
Speaker 1: the killings, including stealing the road and security footage and

550
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:19,200
Speaker 1: tampering with their phones. It seems a single minded cult

551
00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:25,400
Speaker 1: like obsession drove these murders. So we've talked about the

552
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,480
Speaker 1: Wagners and how insulated that family was, and you know,

553
00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:32,000
Speaker 1: the word cult has been thrown around in reference to

554
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:36,759
Speaker 1: the family. It's hard to imagine a nuclear family of mother, father,

555
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:40,960
Speaker 1: and two adult sons who started doing reconnaissance on the

556
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,160
Speaker 1: Rodent family, which by all accounts, where the family that

557
00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:46,600
Speaker 1: they were close with, friendly with in some ways, and

558
00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:50,960
Speaker 1: months before the murders, allegedly the Wagners started to track

559
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:54,759
Speaker 1: their comings and goings. And the question is why would

560
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:56,560
Speaker 1: they do that? I Mean, the only thing I can

561
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:59,000
Speaker 1: think of is that Angela Wagner was this obsessed mother

562
00:38:59,719 --> 00:39:02,319
Speaker 1: who who not only wanted to control her son Jake,

563
00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:05,040
Speaker 1: but also all the people in his life. By all accounts,

564
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:08,080
Speaker 1: it appears that the Rodents were being hunted by the

565
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:11,880
Speaker 1: Wagner family, and that's unbelievable when you really put it

566
00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:15,200
Speaker 1: into context. The idea of a killer family sitting around

567
00:39:15,200 --> 00:39:20,719
Speaker 1: the kitchen table holding murder meetings is impossible to imagine.

568
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:24,400
Speaker 1: What came into focus is that there was a raging

569
00:39:24,440 --> 00:39:28,320
Speaker 1: custody dispute between Jake Wagner and his former girlfriend Hannam

570
00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:31,960
Speaker 1: rod In over their three year old daughter that is

571
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:37,759
Speaker 1: speculated as the real motive behind these murders. They would

572
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 1: travel back and forth between Hannah's mother's house and Jake's

573
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:45,000
Speaker 1: family's house, and they would live as a family for

574
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:47,160
Speaker 1: a few weeks at a time in each home. And

575
00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:48,960
Speaker 1: for everyone who knew them, they said that the couple

576
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:51,280
Speaker 1: was very happy. They were talking about marriage and building

577
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:55,040
Speaker 1: a life together until seemingly in March they broke up.

578
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:57,360
Speaker 1: And that's when Hannah started dating a new guy, a

579
00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:01,719
Speaker 1: man named Charlie Gilly, and Jake was devastated. Jake was

580
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:04,840
Speaker 1: pressuring Hannah to sign over full custody, something she adamantly

581
00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 1: did not want to do so. In the summer of

582
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 1: when Hannah wrote in announced that she was pregnant with

583
00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:13,880
Speaker 1: a new child, Jake Wagner was adamant that he was

584
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:16,400
Speaker 1: the dad of this kid, and he was desperate to

585
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:18,239
Speaker 1: prove it, so much so that he went to the

586
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:20,799
Speaker 1: hospital when the baby was born and checked for a

587
00:40:20,800 --> 00:40:24,799
Speaker 1: Wagner family trait in the tow And we know that

588
00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:29,200
Speaker 1: just days after Hannah was murdered, the Wagner family filed

589
00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:31,600
Speaker 1: for custody of not only Jake's three year old daughter,

590
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:34,560
Speaker 1: but also the newborn baby, So it's clear that this

591
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:38,759
Speaker 1: family had plans to raise both children as their own.

592
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 1: As you'll hear in season three, there's a lot more

593
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:45,600
Speaker 1: context to Jake's relationship with Hannah and what his state

594
00:40:45,640 --> 00:40:48,960
Speaker 1: of mind was around the murders and before the murders

595
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,319
Speaker 1: in terms of moving on and how he felt about her.

596
00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:55,759
Speaker 1: The Wagners wanted custody over Jake and Hannah's child at

597
00:40:55,760 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 1: all costs, but was that pause sibly enough to justify

598
00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:05,080
Speaker 1: a whole scale slaughter of another family. It seemed Jake

599
00:41:05,120 --> 00:41:09,640
Speaker 1: Wagner was highly distraught over having lost Hanname Roden here

600
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 1: is an anonymous Wagner source. He was trying very hard

601
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:16,560
Speaker 1: to make sure that they got back together. He still

602
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:19,919
Speaker 1: wanted to be with her. He was trying to get

603
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:23,400
Speaker 1: get back with her just everything that he could. On

604
00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:26,640
Speaker 1: top of the breakup, Hannah was also allegedly withholding their

605
00:41:26,719 --> 00:41:30,200
Speaker 1: daughter from Jake. There was a custody battle. Hannah wasn't

606
00:41:30,239 --> 00:41:34,240
Speaker 1: allowing Jake to see her or any of the family

607
00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 1: to see her, and so it kind of just got

608
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 1: out of hand at that point. It just sent him

609
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:45,759
Speaker 1: off to the point where Jake um because he had

610
00:41:45,760 --> 00:41:49,120
Speaker 1: made the comments a couple of times, I mean, and

611
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 1: I had told a com people about this. I mean,

612
00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:53,200
Speaker 1: he had made the comments, you know that he were

613
00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:59,200
Speaker 1: going to to kill her, and he told her that,

614
00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:01,799
Speaker 1: you know, He's like, I going to I'm going to

615
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:04,120
Speaker 1: have to kill you. Like you're not going You're not

616
00:42:04,239 --> 00:42:06,799
Speaker 1: gonna let me see the navy then you know you're

617
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:08,839
Speaker 1: not going to have her. And I'm like, Jake, you

618
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:13,839
Speaker 1: can't say the thing. Please just chill out. And of course,

619
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:16,120
Speaker 1: you know, nobody ever really thinks like, oh my god,

620
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:21,239
Speaker 1: he's actually going to He was just completely out of

621
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:27,759
Speaker 1: his mind. Get really really upset him. The Wagners had

622
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:33,520
Speaker 1: allegedly orchestrated another ruthless custody battle once before. Jake's brother,

623
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:36,799
Speaker 1: George Wagner, had a child with a woman named Tabitha,

624
00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:40,920
Speaker 1: and when they split up, accusedma or George Wagner and

625
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:44,440
Speaker 1: his mother, Angela Wagner, blocked Tabitha from seeing her son.

626
00:42:45,719 --> 00:42:51,239
Speaker 1: Here's Tabitha's sister, Christina Tabby like whenever she would try

627
00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:53,160
Speaker 1: to reach out to George, like hey, can I come

628
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:57,239
Speaker 1: visit my son? And Angela would get on there and

629
00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:01,399
Speaker 1: be like, oh, he's not your son anymore. Would tell

630
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:05,279
Speaker 1: Tabby like, oh, you might have gave Bartolin beyond his

631
00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 1: real mother because I take care of these and all

632
00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:16,120
Speaker 1: these just nasty things. At one point, accused murderer Angela

633
00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 1: Wagner even threatened Tabitha and ran are out of town.

634
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:24,840
Speaker 1: Here's court testimony about the incident. Eventually, there was a

635
00:43:24,840 --> 00:43:27,279
Speaker 1: comment by Angela that she was gonna kill Tabitha, so

636
00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:30,320
Speaker 1: she fled to a gas station and ultimately never returned.

637
00:43:30,719 --> 00:43:33,919
Speaker 1: And actually specifically she first hit on the property until

638
00:43:34,120 --> 00:43:38,680
Speaker 1: nightfall and then and drove to a gas station and

639
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:41,680
Speaker 1: neither escape that way. And never went back after that corp.

640
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:47,319
Speaker 1: And yet the idea that the Wagners would resolve a

641
00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 1: custody issue in such a ruthless fashion is confounding. I

642
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,520
Speaker 1: don't think anybody would believe that a family could have

643
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:59,239
Speaker 1: put together such a tactical hit on another family that

644
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:02,880
Speaker 1: they had created life with. It's still too difficult to accept,

645
00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:06,320
Speaker 1: it too hard to believe. Let's stop here for another break.

646
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:12,600
Speaker 1: Before the killings, the Wagners were trying to coerce victim

647
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:16,640
Speaker 1: Hanname Roden into signing forged documents seating custody of her

648
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:19,919
Speaker 1: daughter to Angela Wagner in the event of Hannah's death.

649
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: The forged custody documents that have been discussed in this case,

650
00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:29,919
Speaker 1: they were declaration documents, and it was stated in Rita

651
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:33,480
Speaker 1: Newcome's case because she was the one accused of charged

652
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:37,160
Speaker 1: with forgery or obstruction, it said that it was declarations

653
00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:41,600
Speaker 1: for the children of Hannah Roden, George the Fourth and Jake,

654
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:46,840
Speaker 1: And so basically these documents designated a guardian should any

655
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:50,600
Speaker 1: of them die. And these documents had been signed and

656
00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:54,759
Speaker 1: notarized nineteen days before the murders, and it designated the

657
00:44:54,840 --> 00:44:58,600
Speaker 1: children go to Angela should any of them die. That's

658
00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:00,839
Speaker 1: just one of those puzzle pieces that I felt like

659
00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:04,359
Speaker 1: showed that Angela she may have been the driving force

660
00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 1: here since she was the one that had the Facebook

661
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 1: message that's been referenced in court that showed that Hannah

662
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:12,239
Speaker 1: said they'd have to kill me first before I gave

663
00:45:12,320 --> 00:45:14,719
Speaker 1: up my child, and she showed that message to Jake.

664
00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 1: This paper says, if Hannah is to meet her demise,

665
00:45:20,680 --> 00:45:26,399
Speaker 1: then Sophia should go to Jake. Correct. Okay, But if

666
00:45:26,520 --> 00:45:32,560
Speaker 1: Jake meets his demise and his child goes to his mom, correct,

667
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:40,640
Speaker 1: not to Hannah. Correct. Then, on a on the five

668
00:45:40,760 --> 00:45:43,600
Speaker 1: year anniversary of the murder, and in a case where

669
00:45:43,680 --> 00:45:49,040
Speaker 1: nothing made sense, accused murderer Jake Wagner abruptly pled guilty

670
00:45:49,080 --> 00:45:54,720
Speaker 1: to aid counts of aggravated murder, felony, conspiracy, unlawful possession

671
00:45:54,760 --> 00:45:59,200
Speaker 1: of a dangerous ordinance, and tampering with evidence. The State

672
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:02,000
Speaker 1: of Ohio read as part of the guilty plead not

673
00:46:02,120 --> 00:46:05,520
Speaker 1: to seek the death penalty for him or his father, mother,

674
00:46:06,200 --> 00:46:10,000
Speaker 1: or older brother. Here's Stephanie speaking with reporter James Pilcher.

675
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:13,480
Speaker 1: Is it possible that Jacob could say I was in

676
00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:18,040
Speaker 1: a very controlling environment. My mother, Angela Wagner, controlled us.

677
00:46:18,600 --> 00:46:22,080
Speaker 1: My father was a bully and said I had to

678
00:46:22,120 --> 00:46:26,160
Speaker 1: do these things, and we were courced into it. Is

679
00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:29,880
Speaker 1: there any value in that even? I mean, that's entirely possible,

680
00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:32,040
Speaker 1: and some of the reporting, that's what we've heard Leekal.

681
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:35,080
Speaker 1: The other thing I will say is that maybe they're

682
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:37,359
Speaker 1: going after bigger game than Jake, and they figured we'll

683
00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:39,359
Speaker 1: cut this deal. Now he'll give us what we want

684
00:46:39,880 --> 00:46:42,040
Speaker 1: and then we can go get the mom and the dad.

685
00:46:42,560 --> 00:46:45,319
Speaker 1: But clearly they were going after the people who plotted it.

686
00:46:45,840 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 1: This was not Jake's idea, right, or at least not

687
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:52,360
Speaker 1: according to the prosecutors. This was the family coming together.

688
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:55,640
Speaker 1: That's what the prosecutors are after, is that, Okay, we

689
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:58,839
Speaker 1: get Jake to help us, we get Jake to plead out,

690
00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:01,799
Speaker 1: shows that this really he did happen. Now we can

691
00:47:01,840 --> 00:47:06,880
Speaker 1: go after the people who were actually planned it. Jake,

692
00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:09,880
Speaker 1: who admitted to shooting five of the eight victims, agreed

693
00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:13,759
Speaker 1: to cooperate with prosecutors and testify against his family members.

694
00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:17,759
Speaker 1: He knows he will die in prison. Do you think

695
00:47:17,840 --> 00:47:20,759
Speaker 1: Jake is lying about being personally responsible for five of

696
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 1: the eight. I don't know what his incentive to lie

697
00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:25,279
Speaker 1: about that is. I mean, is he that afraid of

698
00:47:25,320 --> 00:47:28,759
Speaker 1: the death penalty? The economics of that equation just does

699
00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:31,520
Speaker 1: not make sense to me. Where he would openly confess

700
00:47:31,560 --> 00:47:35,319
Speaker 1: to murdering five people. Probably the worst act you could

701
00:47:35,320 --> 00:47:38,040
Speaker 1: commit as a human is taking the life of another,

702
00:47:38,239 --> 00:47:40,400
Speaker 1: and he did that five times over. I think we

703
00:47:40,480 --> 00:47:42,920
Speaker 1: got a good idea of what happened here. The charges

704
00:47:42,960 --> 00:47:47,280
Speaker 1: against Frederica Wagner were dismissed. She maintained her faith throughout

705
00:47:47,320 --> 00:47:51,520
Speaker 1: the ordeal, even as her son, accused murderer, Billy Wagner,

706
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:55,160
Speaker 1: and his family were charged with horrible crimes. Trust in

707
00:47:55,160 --> 00:47:57,359
Speaker 1: the Lord with all your heart, lean not to your

708
00:47:57,360 --> 00:48:01,600
Speaker 1: own understanding, in all your ways. Acknowledge Him and he

709
00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:05,200
Speaker 1: will direct her path. And as my attorney will tell you,

710
00:48:05,560 --> 00:48:08,120
Speaker 1: it was dismissed because I was innocent. They had no

711
00:48:08,200 --> 00:48:14,839
Speaker 1: evidence against me. I'd never lied about anything. The investigation

712
00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:17,800
Speaker 1: had a snag when Sheriff Frieder was arrested on phony

713
00:48:17,880 --> 00:48:21,320
Speaker 1: charges not related to the case. There had been criticism

714
00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:24,360
Speaker 1: about how Sheriff Frieder handled evidence in the road massacre,

715
00:48:25,120 --> 00:48:29,560
Speaker 1: but these new charges conflict of interest. Saft In office

716
00:48:29,719 --> 00:48:34,400
Speaker 1: and tampering with evidence stripped him of his badge and office.

717
00:48:36,080 --> 00:48:38,880
Speaker 1: I stand here before you today to take accountability for

718
00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:42,719
Speaker 1: my actions, to accept responsibility for my conduct, I said,

719
00:48:42,719 --> 00:48:47,600
Speaker 1: shared of Ohio, I should excuse me. Everything that I've

720
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:52,759
Speaker 1: worked for professionally in honorably for years was tripped to

721
00:48:52,840 --> 00:48:59,520
Speaker 1: me with nobody good playing but myself. If I could

722
00:48:59,600 --> 00:49:03,960
Speaker 1: go back contangent, I would a million times. This. This

723
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:08,840
Speaker 1: is not who I am. Never ever did I imagine

724
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:13,600
Speaker 1: myself on the defense side of this court route that

725
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:17,360
Speaker 1: I've spent twenty five years of my life and in

726
00:49:17,400 --> 00:49:21,320
Speaker 1: this country in law enforcement. I am a good person,

727
00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 1: made bad decisions and choices I have and I'm now

728
00:49:27,640 --> 00:49:32,000
Speaker 1: pray that the court will find mercy on me. According

729
00:49:32,040 --> 00:49:35,480
Speaker 1: to reports, Reader allegedly stole cash sees from drug arras

730
00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:38,960
Speaker 1: to fund a gambling problem. He even blamed his gambling

731
00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:42,960
Speaker 1: addiction on the stresses of investigating the Rodan killings. You know,

732
00:49:43,080 --> 00:49:47,960
Speaker 1: now he's blaming his gambling habits on because what he's

733
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 1: seen in the Rodent crime scenes have haunted in so

734
00:49:51,719 --> 00:49:54,279
Speaker 1: much he couldn't sleep, so he would go gamble one

735
00:49:54,440 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 1: name Charlie for thirty years and He's been gambling way

736
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:02,439
Speaker 1: before this happened, and that's just that, just to me,

737
00:50:02,920 --> 00:50:05,759
Speaker 1: shows you his character. You know, I'm gonna I'm gonna

738
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:08,600
Speaker 1: use the death of eight people to try to smooth

739
00:50:08,719 --> 00:50:11,760
Speaker 1: over that I'm still a money off my county and gambling,

740
00:50:12,040 --> 00:50:16,880
Speaker 1: and that is disgusting to me. You're talking about a

741
00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:20,160
Speaker 1: guy who led the sheriff's office and who for a time,

742
00:50:20,200 --> 00:50:22,840
Speaker 1: a moment in time when this first happened, these murders

743
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:26,520
Speaker 1: first happened, who was also leading that investigation until the

744
00:50:26,600 --> 00:50:28,960
Speaker 1: state came in and took it over. You just sit

745
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:31,000
Speaker 1: back and go, man, let's see where this is. I mean,

746
00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:34,480
Speaker 1: Pike County has been a crazy ride ever since the

747
00:50:34,560 --> 00:50:38,640
Speaker 1: end of April. It has been an absolutely crazy half

748
00:50:38,640 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 1: a decade there. But despite Sheriff Reater's downfall, the Wagner's Billy, George, Jake,

749
00:50:44,680 --> 00:50:49,400
Speaker 1: and Angela remain locked up. Jake's mother, Angela, father Billy,

750
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:52,680
Speaker 1: and brother George await their fate as Jake prepares to

751
00:50:52,680 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 1: testify against them. The Wagners are facing three thirty two

752
00:50:57,200 --> 00:51:01,360
Speaker 1: thousand files of evidence from the prosecution. Will the Wagners

753
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:05,080
Speaker 1: remain behind bars and what will Jake reveal about what

754
00:51:05,200 --> 00:51:13,600
Speaker 1: happened that harrowing night in April. The HEAs found the

755
00:51:13,640 --> 00:51:16,640
Speaker 1: totality of information now known by the state, including the

756
00:51:16,680 --> 00:51:20,000
Speaker 1: fourth right statements of the defended. We have overwhelming evidence

757
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:22,279
Speaker 1: of the defendant and the three co defendant members of

758
00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 1: his family foreign fact responsible for planning and carrying out

759
00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:29,360
Speaker 1: the homicide. Jay admitted it in the late evening hours

760
00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:33,160
Speaker 1: of two thousand sixteen into the early morning hours of

761
00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:36,680
Speaker 1: Able twenty second, two thousand sixteen, is when they emitted

762
00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:42,040
Speaker 1: these hop sides. You think about staring into the eyes

763
00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:45,800
Speaker 1: of your kin folks across the room as you're sitting

764
00:51:46,680 --> 00:51:50,120
Speaker 1: in the dock there, and you're looking at them straight

765
00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:56,239
Speaker 1: in the eyes, and um, people that you've spent Thanksgivings

766
00:51:56,280 --> 00:52:02,399
Speaker 1: with Christmas is uh. You know these moments throughout your life,

767
00:52:02,440 --> 00:52:06,839
Speaker 1: and you're looking at them, and you're potentially sending them

768
00:52:06,840 --> 00:52:09,719
Speaker 1: to the proverbial gallows by virtue of what you're going

769
00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:16,480
Speaker 1: to say, Will we figure out exactly what happened on

770
00:52:16,520 --> 00:52:20,239
Speaker 1: the night of April in Piketon. I want to know

771
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:24,080
Speaker 1: exactly what happened that night. You know, how did they

772
00:52:24,080 --> 00:52:27,359
Speaker 1: get in the homes? We know the end We've got

773
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:30,600
Speaker 1: some idea what happened in the middle, but I think

774
00:52:31,120 --> 00:52:34,080
Speaker 1: I want to know about the beginning. You know, was

775
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:37,440
Speaker 1: this truly about custody? You know, I would just like

776
00:52:37,520 --> 00:52:41,560
Speaker 1: to know, you know exactly why from Jake Wagner. When

777
00:52:41,560 --> 00:52:45,000
Speaker 1: did the switch flip to where the only resolution to

778
00:52:45,160 --> 00:52:48,080
Speaker 1: whatever was going on between him and the Rodents at

779
00:52:48,120 --> 00:52:51,120
Speaker 1: that point was to go and kill them all? It

780
00:52:51,200 --> 00:52:55,160
Speaker 1: makes absolutely no sense. And was Angela the mastermind behind

781
00:52:55,239 --> 00:52:58,759
Speaker 1: it all? I think it was bil Angelo behind the

782
00:52:58,880 --> 00:53:02,440
Speaker 1: theme controlling everything in a little public after. What will

783
00:53:02,480 --> 00:53:07,840
Speaker 1: happen in the meantime is anyone's guess? Will there be

784
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:10,319
Speaker 1: another Plea deal? It'll be interesting to see where this

785
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:13,319
Speaker 1: case goes from here. It's the pike and massacre. Who knows.

786
00:53:13,560 --> 00:53:17,160
Speaker 1: You never know where this is going next. This season,

787
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:20,080
Speaker 1: we have a much fuller picture of who the Wagner

788
00:53:20,160 --> 00:53:24,520
Speaker 1: family was prior to this and how they became the

789
00:53:24,560 --> 00:53:27,000
Speaker 1: monsters we now know them to be. We've really started

790
00:53:27,040 --> 00:53:30,080
Speaker 1: to learn more about the Wagner family, not only the

791
00:53:30,120 --> 00:53:33,000
Speaker 1: lives that they lead, but also their motivations for the

792
00:53:33,040 --> 00:53:37,520
Speaker 1: crimes they allegedly committed. Just when we thought it couldn't

793
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:44,279
Speaker 1: get any stranger, or darker it has. All will be

794
00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:50,640
Speaker 1: revealed on season three of The piked In Massacre. For

795
00:53:50,719 --> 00:53:53,920
Speaker 1: more information in case photos, follow us on Instagram at

796
00:53:54,000 --> 00:54:00,560
Speaker 1: Katie Underscore Studios. This special episode was produced by Stephanie Leidaker,

797
00:54:00,760 --> 00:54:05,600
Speaker 1: Jeff Shane, Chris Graeves, Alan Wieder, and me Courtney Armstrong.

798
00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:10,800
Speaker 1: Editing and sound design by Jeff Ta music by Jared Aston,

799
00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:15,560
Speaker 1: audio mixing by Ken Novak. The Pikedon Massacre is a

800
00:54:15,600 --> 00:54:19,359
Speaker 1: production of Katie Studios and I Heart Radio. For more

801
00:54:19,400 --> 00:54:22,799
Speaker 1: podcasts from I heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app,

802
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:26,800
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.