WEBVTT - Rice and Resilience Part 1 0:00:00.440 --> 0:00:02.080 So why do we do We do because we love 0:00:02.120 --> 0:00:04.920 the rice. It's part of our part of our heritage, 0:00:04.920 --> 0:00:09.760 our legacy, and besides that, it's just a damn good rice. Yeah, 0:00:09.800 --> 0:00:19.799 it is. Welcome back to Point of Origin, the podcast 0:00:19.880 --> 0:00:22.400 about the world of food from around the world. I'm 0:00:22.440 --> 0:00:28.680 your host, Steven Sadderfield today on Point of Origin, Rice 0:00:28.800 --> 0:00:35.000 and Resilience Asia to California, Africa to South Carolina, from 0:00:35.000 --> 0:00:38.000 the Areza glab Arima of West Africa to the Areza 0:00:38.080 --> 0:00:42.760 Sativa and Eastern Asia. Humans across the world and lifetimes 0:00:42.880 --> 0:00:49.640 are all bound to the story of rice. Our next 0:00:49.720 --> 0:00:53.720 guest is a very good friend of mine, Jasmine Lee, 0:00:53.760 --> 0:00:56.720 who is a writer and a cook based in Queens 0:00:56.880 --> 0:01:01.560 but for this particular story she is in californ Cornia. Jasmine, 0:01:01.720 --> 0:01:05.200 thank you for joining us today on Point of Origin podcast. 0:01:05.680 --> 0:01:10.600 Hey Steven, thanks for having me. Of course, so, Jasmine, 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:16.760 um for your forthcoming story in Whetstone, you visited a 0:01:16.840 --> 0:01:21.920 really remarkable farm in California called Coda Farms, a company 0:01:21.959 --> 0:01:27.840 that has been producing and harvesting Japanese rice for many, 0:01:27.880 --> 0:01:30.720 many years. Can you tell us about this farm and 0:01:30.760 --> 0:01:35.280 what you observed when you win? Yeah, so I visited 0:01:36.040 --> 0:01:39.080 Robin Coda, who is one of the co owners of 0:01:39.240 --> 0:01:46.880 Coda Farms with her brother Roth. I'm sitting here with 0:01:47.080 --> 0:01:55.160 Robin Coda. Hi, Robin, Hello, Jasmine. So I am Sancee, 0:01:55.360 --> 0:01:59.640 Japanese American third generation born raised in California, as were 0:01:59.680 --> 0:02:06.040 my parents, and like a lot of immigrants to California, 0:02:06.400 --> 0:02:11.240 they my my grandparents eventually came around to agriculture and 0:02:11.280 --> 0:02:15.639 so Coat of Farms is located in South Dost Palace 0:02:15.880 --> 0:02:20.320 in the Central Valley in California, which is based in 0:02:20.480 --> 0:02:24.799 the southwest corner of Merced County in the Central Valley 0:02:24.880 --> 0:02:31.160 of California. Central Valley, California compasses sort of paradoxically, the 0:02:31.200 --> 0:02:35.200 Sacramento Valley and the San Joaquin Valley. The geographical division 0:02:35.200 --> 0:02:41.280 between those two is literally the Sacramento River and the 0:02:41.320 --> 0:02:45.200 Delta area. So there we are in is the San 0:02:45.280 --> 0:02:51.040 Joaquine Valley. I had a really just amazing time hanging 0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:53.600 out with Robin. You know, we we talked about a 0:02:53.680 --> 0:02:57.399 lot of things. We got into the sort of like 0:02:58.360 --> 0:03:01.560 what the lamp looks like when her grandfather arrived, and 0:03:01.720 --> 0:03:05.639 essentially like why her family settled in the Central Valley 0:03:05.720 --> 0:03:09.560 as opposed to up in the Sacramento region where really 0:03:09.600 --> 0:03:12.800 that is where the heart of you know, rice growing 0:03:13.000 --> 0:03:17.359 is on the West coast. But Robin is such an 0:03:17.360 --> 0:03:22.440 amazing person. Um, she's such a character. And so she's 0:03:22.480 --> 0:03:25.240 the granddaughter of Casa Borrow Coda, who was the founder 0:03:25.280 --> 0:03:29.880 of the farm. And when you meet Robin, you're just 0:03:29.960 --> 0:03:35.400 immediately struck by her style, her sense of style. Um, 0:03:35.520 --> 0:03:40.320 she has this really just gorgeous like mane of long 0:03:40.760 --> 0:03:44.840 fotton pepper hair that she throws up into this messy bun. 0:03:45.280 --> 0:03:48.280 You know, when I met her on the farm that morning, 0:03:48.360 --> 0:03:53.400 she was wearing this gorgeous you know, blue um shirt 0:03:53.480 --> 0:03:56.840 dress that went down to her ankles, and we were 0:03:56.880 --> 0:04:00.720 like climbing through the field. I was obviously in she 0:04:00.880 --> 0:04:05.560 was just so like, um, just elegantly climbing through the 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:09.640 fields and like sandals and this gorgeous dress. We go 0:04:09.800 --> 0:04:13.560 into her into this little farmhouse just to talk and 0:04:13.640 --> 0:04:16.800 she was making me kanji and you know when you 0:04:16.839 --> 0:04:20.440 walk into the house, you're you're just immediately also struck 0:04:20.480 --> 0:04:27.479 by just really incredible antique furniture pieces and like like 0:04:27.600 --> 0:04:30.800 antique art around the house. So yeah, you just you 0:04:30.839 --> 0:04:35.400 really get a sense that like Robin is sort of 0:04:35.520 --> 0:04:47.000 like on another tip, So, our paternal grandfather, Casavakota, started 0:04:47.040 --> 0:04:51.840 farming rice in the late nineteen tents in the sacrament 0:04:52.080 --> 0:04:55.560 Mental Valley north of Sacramento, which has been traditionally historically 0:04:55.680 --> 0:04:58.520 the stronghold of the rice industry in California, dating back 0:04:58.560 --> 0:05:06.520 to the eighteen hundreds. So we start farming rice, and 0:05:07.000 --> 0:05:11.279 my grandfather eventually move the headquarters of the business down 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:14.080 to where we are today, which is about the same 0:05:14.120 --> 0:05:18.880 latitude as Monterey, but in land off five in the 0:05:18.960 --> 0:05:23.320 Central Valley. So it's not This is definitely not rice 0:05:23.720 --> 0:05:28.000 farming ground zero for California. We're an oddball. We're kind 0:05:28.000 --> 0:05:33.680 of south. So, Jasmine, you mentioned that you were interested 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:37.280 in this, but what brought you to want to learn 0:05:37.320 --> 0:05:39.920 more about rice and to go make this trip? I 0:05:40.480 --> 0:05:43.599 wanted to write about Coat of Farms and their and 0:05:43.640 --> 0:05:47.400 their heirloom variety of organic rice because I'm interested in 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:52.320 expanding this. Notion of tirre, which in its etymology refers 0:05:52.360 --> 0:05:55.560 literally to the land, is a term that some might 0:05:55.600 --> 0:05:59.480 associate with exclusive wine production in France, for example, but 0:06:00.160 --> 0:06:03.880 it can be used to describe the overall growing conditions 0:06:04.000 --> 0:06:08.480 or environmental factors of any given region in the world 0:06:08.720 --> 0:06:11.800 that are then expressed through specific types of crops like 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:16.440 grapes um or other cultivars and in this case ingrains 0:06:16.480 --> 0:06:19.919 like rice. And so I I wanted to ask whether 0:06:20.000 --> 0:06:22.480 we could talk about to war in the US without 0:06:22.600 --> 0:06:26.560 talking about the history and politics um of land use 0:06:27.080 --> 0:06:30.039 in this country, which in the case of code of 0:06:30.080 --> 0:06:34.200 farms and and their cocohoa rose heirloom rice um, those 0:06:34.200 --> 0:06:38.080 things are inextricably tied. And so in other words, cocoa 0:06:38.160 --> 0:06:41.880 rose airlooe rice is an expression of the land it 0:06:42.000 --> 0:06:46.440 was grown on and the political and historical experience and 0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:50.400 trauma and perseverance of the family who worked that land. 0:06:50.960 --> 0:06:55.040 And so I think cocoa rose for me is just 0:06:55.120 --> 0:06:57.880 the start of thinking more meaningfully about the origins of 0:06:57.920 --> 0:07:00.760 food and land use and labor in the US. And 0:07:01.120 --> 0:07:05.360 you know, I'm a second generation ABC or American born 0:07:05.440 --> 0:07:08.440 Chinese who who was born and raised in the Bay Area, 0:07:08.560 --> 0:07:11.880 and you know, my diet has always revolved around rice, 0:07:12.400 --> 0:07:15.160 and in fact, my ancestors were actually rice farmers and 0:07:15.200 --> 0:07:18.480 merchants in Hong Kong. But anyway, I never really gave 0:07:18.960 --> 0:07:22.880 too much thought about where my rice comes from because 0:07:22.880 --> 0:07:26.920 it's really just so ubiquitous and so quotitian and and 0:07:26.960 --> 0:07:30.080 I think that this is true for most of us. 0:07:30.360 --> 0:07:32.960 But over the last few years, as I've been like 0:07:33.000 --> 0:07:36.960 going home and visiting California, I started noticing this really 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:41.080 just beautiful name that kept coming up on menus, which 0:07:41.080 --> 0:07:45.040 was cocahoa rose. And it's the house rice for these 0:07:45.520 --> 0:07:49.040 locally and seasonally focused restaurants. And that was, you know, 0:07:49.240 --> 0:07:52.200 really the first time I had seen rice named so 0:07:52.280 --> 0:07:55.960 specifically on menus. And not only that, it's just like 0:07:56.120 --> 0:08:01.720 really delicious stuff. So Code of Farms they grow a 0:08:01.840 --> 0:08:06.000 number of things, but namely they grow glutenous rice, which 0:08:06.040 --> 0:08:09.880 they used to make the Chico flower, which is something 0:08:10.000 --> 0:08:14.000 that you know if you especially if you're Asian American 0:08:14.080 --> 0:08:16.440 growing up on the West Coast, it's probably something that 0:08:16.480 --> 0:08:21.040 was in your pantry. Um. They also grow this really 0:08:21.120 --> 0:08:25.680 incredible variety of heirloom grain rice, which is what I 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:33.280 was interested in learning more about, called cocahoa rose. So 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:36.560 one of the things my grandfad liked to do was 0:08:36.720 --> 0:08:42.160 he had an artistic side and consider himself somewhat of 0:08:42.160 --> 0:08:46.280 a creative type. And what he did was create he 0:08:46.320 --> 0:08:50.840 wanted to create trademarks brands for his own products. So 0:08:51.000 --> 0:08:55.280 after the war, he wanted to grow a strand of 0:08:55.360 --> 0:08:59.760 rice that was proprietary. So to that end, he brought 0:09:00.080 --> 0:09:02.760 in one of the preeminent rice breeders in the country 0:09:02.800 --> 0:09:08.079 that at that time, a gentleman name Hughes Williams. And 0:09:08.200 --> 0:09:12.559 Hughes Williams was unusual that obviously was Caucasian, and he 0:09:12.840 --> 0:09:18.559 was willing to come work for our family here in California. 0:09:18.640 --> 0:09:21.800 I mean, there was still so much strong anti agent 0:09:21.880 --> 0:09:25.679 sentiments that that was that was really unusual. So Hugh 0:09:25.720 --> 0:09:30.920 wasn't came here, and in the course of approximately ten years, 0:09:31.559 --> 0:09:35.960 bread and kept cross breeding and crossbreeding and created a 0:09:36.040 --> 0:09:42.080 modern cultivar which was very very to us good tasting 0:09:42.480 --> 0:09:47.520 and has a beautiful aroma, good cooking qualities, and was just, 0:09:47.720 --> 0:09:53.680 you know, we thought a winner. So for instance, people 0:09:53.760 --> 0:09:56.480 like know the nomber cal rose. Cal rose is just 0:09:57.040 --> 0:09:59.920 it refers to a type of very generic, high yielding, 0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:05.160 fast maturing sort of bland medium grain. Cocohole rose was 0:10:05.559 --> 0:10:09.560 essentially a premium medium grain, meaning it tasted better. It 0:10:09.679 --> 0:10:13.400 just it has better appearance, better cooking quality. Is just 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:19.480 a better grain altogether. We have primarily specialized in Japanese 0:10:19.559 --> 0:10:25.080 style rice or Japonica, Japonica being the classification that covers 0:10:25.240 --> 0:10:30.760 short grain to medium grain sticky glutinous rices. So we 0:10:31.280 --> 0:10:35.880 do coca hole rose, which is a medium grain premium 0:10:35.880 --> 0:10:38.120 medium grain that is a table rice what we would 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:44.120 use essentially for sushi or your everyday rice. So cocoa 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:46.640 rose is not a high yield crop. No, I mean 0:10:46.679 --> 0:10:48.800 well back in the back in the nine fifties, and 0:10:48.800 --> 0:10:51.959 by the time it was commercially introduced by the early 0:10:52.040 --> 0:10:55.760 nineteen sixties, I think sixty two. Formally at that time 0:10:55.760 --> 0:10:57.920 it would have been considered a modern cultivar. But but 0:10:58.120 --> 0:11:02.199 today's standards, it's it's certainly not what our family is 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:09.440 going to retire on the fact of the matter is 0:11:09.480 --> 0:11:13.120 that rice breeding drivers in the US for so long 0:11:13.920 --> 0:11:20.560 have been oriented to prioritize just literally high yield, fast 0:11:20.960 --> 0:11:25.040 growing cultivars that all the characteristics of a good eating 0:11:25.160 --> 0:11:28.640 rice have literally dissipated to the point where rice in 0:11:28.679 --> 0:11:30.600 the U s now is just largely thought of it 0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:34.000 as a bland commodity, something we slap something else on 0:11:34.080 --> 0:11:37.760 top of. Rice has lost its own merits. So what 0:11:37.920 --> 0:11:41.640 we have preserved here what we believe. It's a rice 0:11:41.720 --> 0:11:45.480 that has outstanding characteristics and stands on its own just 0:11:45.800 --> 0:11:55.160 simply a good eating rice. For us, it literally is 0:11:55.200 --> 0:11:57.920 a tie to our past. It's a tie to our grandfather, 0:11:58.240 --> 0:12:00.439 who my brother and I were too young to interact 0:12:00.440 --> 0:12:07.160 with or no personally, but of course his history, his work, 0:12:07.280 --> 0:12:09.720 all of what he achieved, his surrounds us here on 0:12:09.720 --> 0:12:12.920 a daily basis. We're both raised here on the farm, 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:18.800 and it's the reminders are around you literally every single day. 0:12:19.440 --> 0:12:23.560 So for what we feel, that obligation, that sense of legacy, 0:12:23.640 --> 0:12:27.720 that center of debts, we will we will never stop 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:35.360 going Cocohoa Rose. Okay, so let's talk more specifically about 0:12:35.400 --> 0:12:39.160 this legacy that Robin is referring to. A big part 0:12:39.160 --> 0:12:42.600 of her family's story is about resiliency, but what they 0:12:42.600 --> 0:12:47.680 were responding to is an equally important thing to interrogate. Yeah, 0:12:48.280 --> 0:12:53.920 So it was really interesting for me to, as I mentioned, 0:12:53.960 --> 0:12:56.680 to kind of start to learn about this rice because 0:12:56.720 --> 0:13:00.240 it was really an entryway into learning more about out 0:13:00.400 --> 0:13:03.880 agricultural history in the United States. And so what I 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:06.880 began to piece together and learning more about Coota farms 0:13:07.960 --> 0:13:13.480 um was more broadly the fundamental role of Asian Americans 0:13:13.720 --> 0:13:17.800 and more specifically Japanese American farmers and labors um on 0:13:17.840 --> 0:13:23.280 the development of agriculture in the US. And so as 0:13:23.320 --> 0:13:26.199 we dip into this, and I think that some people 0:13:26.200 --> 0:13:29.880 are familiar with this history, especially if you grew up 0:13:29.880 --> 0:13:32.760 on the West Coast, but you know, there was a 0:13:32.840 --> 0:13:37.720 lot of racial resentment from white folks, and you know, 0:13:37.800 --> 0:13:42.960 we really see that kind of that racial resentment just 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:48.000 ratified through racist policies like the Chinese Exclusion Act or 0:13:48.040 --> 0:13:51.800 the Alien Land Law Act, to name a few, and 0:13:51.840 --> 0:13:55.520 then during World War Two, through the imprisonment of Japanese 0:13:55.559 --> 0:13:59.040 Americans in concentration camps across the United States. And I 0:13:59.040 --> 0:14:02.199 think most of us are familiar with this history, um, 0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:07.040 but what we often miss are the sort of economic 0:14:07.120 --> 0:14:11.800 motivations and material consequences. And there's a really great piece 0:14:11.960 --> 0:14:16.440 by Gwen Guildford that goes into what was essentially the 0:14:16.480 --> 0:14:20.560 stripping and selling of land and property from Japanese American 0:14:20.600 --> 0:14:24.200 farmers during World War two and the effects that this 0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:28.560 mass incarceration had on the food supply in the United 0:14:28.600 --> 0:14:32.440 States during that time. And so the code of family 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:35.720 who had seen a lot of success growing and selling 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:46.920 rice are just one example of this history. Wow, so Jasmine, 0:14:47.000 --> 0:14:50.880 I know that Kaisaboro was a skilled farmer, but prior 0:14:50.920 --> 0:14:54.200 to his generation of immigrants, what was the history and 0:14:54.280 --> 0:14:57.400 the origins of Asian rights in the US. You know, 0:14:57.440 --> 0:14:59.720 as it pertains this story, how how did rice like 0:14:59.840 --> 0:15:02.800 end up on the West coast? And you know it 0:15:02.920 --> 0:15:07.760 came because of Chinese laborers who are working on the 0:15:07.840 --> 0:15:12.920 railroad in the nineteenth century. And it's interesting because the 0:15:13.040 --> 0:15:16.640 variety of rice that we see coming out of California, 0:15:16.760 --> 0:15:20.000 which the bulk of it is Japanica, it's not the 0:15:20.120 --> 0:15:23.680 kind of rice that the Chinese were eating um or 0:15:23.760 --> 0:15:27.800 eat to this day. Speaking geographically of the rice that's 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:33.200 that comes from mostly southern China. The irony of the 0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:37.200 rice industry in California is historically the roots are based 0:15:37.520 --> 0:15:44.320 in the Chinese labors who built our railways. For the 0:15:44.360 --> 0:15:49.440 most part, rice was very expensive and had to be 0:15:49.480 --> 0:15:53.920 all imported in from the from Asia to California to 0:15:54.360 --> 0:15:59.000 feed these labor forces. So of course, I mean they 0:15:59.040 --> 0:16:01.600 were looking for ways to economize, so one of those 0:16:01.760 --> 0:16:05.480 was to start growing rice here in California, not having 0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:08.320 to like buy it from Asia and ship it across 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:14.200 the Pacific, so literally cost cutting. So ironically what's been 0:16:14.240 --> 0:16:18.560 grown in California is Japonica, Japanese style rice for in 0:16:18.600 --> 0:16:22.040 there for the Chinese rail workers. And you know, between 0:16:22.080 --> 0:16:25.520 you and I, since you're Chinese distant and I moved Japanese, 0:16:25.520 --> 0:16:27.800 is it Chinese and Japanese do not eat the same 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:30.720 type of rice for the table rice, So the Japanese 0:16:30.840 --> 0:16:33.560 rail I mean, the Chinese rail workers are being fed Japonica, 0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:35.800 which is just a short grained to medium grain rice. 0:16:35.800 --> 0:16:40.080 It's a lot more sticky than what Chinese typically think 0:16:40.080 --> 0:16:43.240 of as table rice, which is long grain, lower starch, 0:16:43.560 --> 0:16:47.480 more dry and more fluffy rice. But that's that's where 0:16:47.600 --> 0:16:53.000 those roots started. And to this day California still grows 0:16:53.080 --> 0:16:57.560 predominantly Japanese style rice, whereas the rest of the country 0:16:57.560 --> 0:17:01.760 grows predominantly long grain. There is more short grain and 0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:05.760 more meaning grain being grown in other areas in this 0:17:05.960 --> 0:17:09.280 current day and age, but historically that's the way it's been. 0:17:10.480 --> 0:17:14.320 So as most Asian Americans, especially on the West Coast, 0:17:14.359 --> 0:17:17.000 are keenly aware of what is known as the Alien 0:17:17.080 --> 0:17:21.439 Land Laws, which were formalized in n and because of 0:17:21.760 --> 0:17:26.360 very strong anti Asian sentiments of that meant that Asians 0:17:27.040 --> 0:17:32.200 really were very much prejudiced against and every all kinds 0:17:32.240 --> 0:17:37.320 of daily going on, and that included landholding. So the 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:42.800 Alien land law essentially had a short lived loophole where 0:17:42.880 --> 0:17:46.680 Asians could buy land in the name of their American 0:17:46.720 --> 0:17:50.679 born children. So that loophole, my grandfather took advantage of 0:17:50.680 --> 0:17:53.480 that started looking for land up in the area where 0:17:53.480 --> 0:17:55.600 he was least far at least hold farming, which was 0:17:55.680 --> 0:17:58.600 north of Sacramento. And because that land was very desirable 0:17:58.720 --> 0:18:02.480 and people would not sell to them, so our grandfather 0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:07.920 settled down here, bought land and just started to put 0:18:07.920 --> 0:18:12.320 down his roots, which included building a mill and all 0:18:12.320 --> 0:18:16.000 the processing to be vertically integrade so he could handle 0:18:16.320 --> 0:18:18.840 his product from start to finish. Could you tell me 0:18:18.920 --> 0:18:25.679 about what happened when your family realized that internment was 0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:30.679 like a done deal and that's where the country was headed. 0:18:30.920 --> 0:18:34.440 What happened in those days um leading up to that. 0:18:35.000 --> 0:18:39.040 My grandfather, by the early nineties and the outbreak of 0:18:39.080 --> 0:18:44.639 World War two was farming approximately ten thousand acres and 0:18:45.200 --> 0:18:52.120 was very very successful. And rice being of the cultural 0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:56.600 importance it is to the Japanese people. It just earned 0:18:56.680 --> 0:19:01.520 him this nickname of the Rice Kings. So the family 0:19:01.680 --> 0:19:07.200 was doing well, relatively affluent for that era, and when 0:19:08.000 --> 0:19:12.520 the interment was pretty much going to be a done deal, 0:19:12.760 --> 0:19:15.080 they decided that they wanted to shut down the business 0:19:15.160 --> 0:19:22.480 and hopefully keep it intact. That did not happen, so 0:19:22.800 --> 0:19:26.720 that's essentially what he started off to do. But because 0:19:26.920 --> 0:19:34.119 of because of the scale operation we suspect that caught 0:19:34.119 --> 0:19:37.280 the attention of the government. The government literally stepped in 0:19:37.680 --> 0:19:40.159 and handed them the mandate saying that they had to 0:19:40.840 --> 0:19:45.480 stay open and operate during their interment to produce fiber. 0:19:47.359 --> 0:19:52.520 So being interned in Colorado and obviously not being able 0:19:52.600 --> 0:19:57.600 to manage your business from from an internment camp, they 0:19:57.640 --> 0:20:02.120 had to sign over powered attorney to non agents. So 0:20:02.440 --> 0:20:07.560 essentially when that happened, um, the farm was just literally 0:20:08.119 --> 0:20:14.280 torn apart. Our grandfather upon his upon their release from 0:20:14.480 --> 0:20:18.960 the Machi and Sherman camp in Colorado, they drove NonStop 0:20:19.080 --> 0:20:22.480 from Colorado back to South Dolls Palace to see what 0:20:22.640 --> 0:20:26.280 had happened to the farm. And when they got here 0:20:26.280 --> 0:20:29.560 they found that the homes, the mill, the farm, and 0:20:29.600 --> 0:20:35.960 the processing plant, all of their best equipment their airplanes, livestock, 0:20:36.119 --> 0:20:40.240 everything had been sold, so there were there was no recourse. 0:20:40.280 --> 0:20:43.920 Back then you could file, you could file for for reparations, 0:20:43.960 --> 0:20:47.800 and that's what they did. But um, my grandfather did 0:20:47.800 --> 0:20:49.720 not live to see a dime of that. It dragged 0:20:49.720 --> 0:20:55.439 on till nineteen sixty five. He passed away in nineteen 0:20:55.520 --> 0:20:58.280 sixty four. And for what it was settled for, it 0:20:58.400 --> 0:21:01.000 was pennies on the dollar, did not even cover the 0:21:01.040 --> 0:21:05.320 attorney's fees. For having dragged on those many many years, 0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:10.399 it was obviously a very terrible experience. That's not to 0:21:10.480 --> 0:21:12.960 say that that's the only experience that happened, because I've 0:21:13.000 --> 0:21:15.400 told him, as I've said many times, my mother's side 0:21:15.400 --> 0:21:17.679 of the family, she was born raised in the area, 0:21:17.920 --> 0:21:22.760 and they had a very good rosary rose nursery business. 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:24.480 They had a German American friend who took care of 0:21:24.480 --> 0:21:26.920 that business from kept an intact, managed it through the war, 0:21:27.080 --> 0:21:29.080 handed them the keys when they came back from the 0:21:29.160 --> 0:21:31.720 German council. So not everybody had the experience that my 0:21:31.800 --> 0:21:35.920 grandfather had, but we again suspect it because they were 0:21:36.000 --> 0:21:39.520 just too large and too successful and drew too much 0:21:39.560 --> 0:21:44.720 attention to themselves. So after the war, and after finding 0:21:44.720 --> 0:21:48.080 everything decimated, my grandfather, as you do, he sets up 0:21:48.080 --> 0:21:51.280 shop quarter mile down the road. Diggs is in his heel, 0:21:51.480 --> 0:22:06.080 build a new mill and starts all over again. It 0:22:06.160 --> 0:22:10.520 was also interesting, like to see Robin in this place 0:22:10.760 --> 0:22:13.240 and to talk with her about like what it means 0:22:13.400 --> 0:22:16.600 to grow up and still live on the farm. She 0:22:16.640 --> 0:22:19.760 lives there with her nine year old mother, so there 0:22:19.760 --> 0:22:23.959 are these like constant reminders of what happened to her 0:22:24.000 --> 0:22:29.000 family and just this incredible sense of grit and perseverance 0:22:29.320 --> 0:22:33.960 that her grandfather had to just like return to this 0:22:34.040 --> 0:22:39.800 place after they were imprisoned and to like, you know, 0:22:40.280 --> 0:22:53.280 rebuild again. You have been amazing as always. Thank you 0:22:53.359 --> 0:22:56.240 so much, Jasmine. I really appreciate your reporting and you 0:22:56.359 --> 0:22:59.800 sharing the story with us. Thanks for having me see 0:22:59.840 --> 0:23:14.359 the of course see soon. M h. You've been listening 0:23:14.400 --> 0:23:17.040 to Point of Origin, a podcast about the world of 0:23:17.080 --> 0:23:22.200 food worldwide today. On Point of Origin, Rice and Resilience 0:23:23.000 --> 0:23:28.119 Asia to California, Africa to South Carolina. You just heard 0:23:28.240 --> 0:23:31.159 a very moving account of the story of the Coda 0:23:31.240 --> 0:23:35.560 family farm and Robin Coda, who was continuing her grandfather's 0:23:35.640 --> 0:23:42.560 incredible legacy of perseverance. You know this story, as Jasmine said, 0:23:43.160 --> 0:23:45.840 is one that many of us know parts of, but 0:23:46.680 --> 0:23:50.440 to hear it in such personal testimony and such personal 0:23:50.520 --> 0:23:54.399 detail and Robin's own words, really just gives you a 0:23:54.440 --> 0:23:59.119 sense of how recent these atrocities were. And there's certainly 0:23:59.160 --> 0:24:03.800 no service and suppressing the details. But we also want 0:24:03.880 --> 0:24:06.720 to recognize that it is a difficult story to tell, 0:24:07.480 --> 0:24:10.919 So we are very grateful to Robin and Jasmine and 0:24:10.960 --> 0:24:15.560 their generosity and sharing this story. Thanks to you both. 0:24:23.359 --> 0:24:26.280 We're picking up in the low country of South Carolina, 0:24:26.840 --> 0:24:30.080 where in Charleston we learned that rice wasn't just an 0:24:30.080 --> 0:24:34.640 integral part of the culture, it was the culture. B. J. Dennis, 0:24:34.680 --> 0:24:37.960 the chef and scholar on Gala Gichi food Ways, joins 0:24:38.080 --> 0:24:41.800 us to discuss the regional history and distinct culture of 0:24:41.880 --> 0:24:49.840 the descendants of West Africa's Rice coast. You know, I 0:24:50.000 --> 0:24:53.960 came up as a dishwasher here and Charleston. You know, 0:24:54.160 --> 0:24:55.960 um what the college for one year, I had too 0:24:56.040 --> 0:24:58.040 much fun. Parents was like, yo, you're not staying here 0:24:58.080 --> 0:25:01.600 for free anymore. Long story short, I started working in 0:25:01.720 --> 0:25:05.480 kitchens and I went to trade school for business. I 0:25:05.680 --> 0:25:08.960 found out that I eventually I said master later I 0:25:09.000 --> 0:25:12.520 started taking culinary went from dishwasher, bus boy to line 0:25:12.560 --> 0:25:14.880 cook and you know, just kind of took off from there. 0:25:15.200 --> 0:25:18.080 Two thousand and four, I left Charleston to move to St. 0:25:18.080 --> 0:25:20.960 Thomas in the Virgin Islands because my neighbors from in 0:25:21.080 --> 0:25:23.880 Charleston were from there. That was my connection there. That's 0:25:23.880 --> 0:25:26.160 when it really hit me because they really would talk 0:25:26.200 --> 0:25:29.000 to me about us here and and as a Galachi culture, 0:25:29.560 --> 0:25:34.320 people from Jamaica, I mean Haiti St. Lucia, you know, 0:25:34.680 --> 0:25:37.480 individuals knew about this culture here. So that was opened 0:25:37.520 --> 0:25:40.200 up for me and the fact that the culture was 0:25:40.359 --> 0:25:43.879 unapologetic in the West Indies. So I came back to 0:25:43.920 --> 0:25:48.200 Charleston two thousand eight started working. Um that was when 0:25:48.240 --> 0:25:50.560 it was the crim Della crime in Charleston with Sean 0:25:50.880 --> 0:25:53.000 Brown was just taking off. You couldn't get a job 0:25:53.000 --> 0:25:56.320 in the city then, um, so I started. I was 0:25:56.359 --> 0:25:58.840 the PM kitchen manager at what is now the busiest 0:25:58.840 --> 0:26:03.040 restaurant in the city and called Fleet Landing, which is 0:26:03.080 --> 0:26:06.400 one of the classic seafood houses here, which ironically enough, 0:26:06.480 --> 0:26:08.639 is how I started off my career as a dishwasher 0:26:09.000 --> 0:26:11.119 and the seafood houses of Charleston. I wanted to go 0:26:11.320 --> 0:26:13.879 and do the you know, the French thing, the crumb 0:26:13.880 --> 0:26:16.480 della crumb. At the same time, when all our French 0:26:16.520 --> 0:26:18.879 stuff I was learning through school, all the cookbooks that 0:26:19.040 --> 0:26:20.720 ever grabbed. When I go to the store, I would 0:26:20.720 --> 0:26:22.879 go to like Bonds and Nobles. I was always searching 0:26:22.920 --> 0:26:25.720 for West African West Indian food ways that asked for 0:26:25.800 --> 0:26:29.800 food wads and I started working in restaurants throughout Charleston. 0:26:30.280 --> 0:26:33.000 Pop up scene started hitting around two thousand and twelve, 0:26:33.040 --> 0:26:36.160 two gos and thirteen and the brothers started doing representing 0:26:36.160 --> 0:26:37.880 the culture, and I was like, you know, we got 0:26:37.880 --> 0:26:40.520 some great black owned restaurants in the city, but you know, 0:26:40.560 --> 0:26:42.520 in my opinion, there's nobody's who are doing it in 0:26:42.640 --> 0:26:47.120 the purest form. You see the purest form from Land 0:26:47.160 --> 0:26:50.240 from the Sea season though you know, you know, I'm 0:26:50.240 --> 0:26:52.160 not talking about the mac and cheese and the can 0:26:52.200 --> 0:26:54.919 string beans and the can beans. I'm talking about the 0:26:54.960 --> 0:26:58.240 airline varieties that were part of our culture that I 0:26:58.320 --> 0:27:00.480 was seeing being played around in these high in kitchens 0:27:00.520 --> 0:27:04.359 and Charleston. So, you know, wanting to see the calendar 0:27:04.400 --> 0:27:06.680 goal rights back, I wanted to see these things back. 0:27:06.720 --> 0:27:09.399 So uh, you know, the seasonality, you know, the the 0:27:09.480 --> 0:27:15.200 opra there, the virietoes of oprah and peas back into 0:27:15.280 --> 0:27:17.280 the restaurant. So I started doing the pop ups, the 0:27:17.320 --> 0:27:21.280 Gottachy pop ups, and at the same time I started 0:27:21.280 --> 0:27:25.800 to transition myself into wanting to be fully independent. It's 0:27:25.840 --> 0:27:28.280 like two thousand and thirteen. I would give people my cards, 0:27:28.280 --> 0:27:31.359 say I'm also a carterer, so you want to taste 0:27:31.400 --> 0:27:33.000 this food, you can hire me for Where don't you 0:27:33.080 --> 0:27:35.520 have me for a house party? Whatever? Whatever? Was clever. 0:27:36.200 --> 0:27:40.159 From there, it just took off and evolved into what 0:27:40.240 --> 0:27:43.679 it is now, which is more than food. It's history 0:27:43.920 --> 0:27:46.640 is cultural. It's connecting the dots to the dish board 0:27:47.320 --> 0:27:52.360 through food. So I guess that's the long short road. 0:27:52.800 --> 0:27:57.000 That's a good version. While you were in process, obviously 0:27:57.040 --> 0:28:00.840 you were garnering a lot of inspiration, as many chefs 0:28:00.880 --> 0:28:05.159 to from the French style of cooking, since that's what 0:28:05.440 --> 0:28:09.960 the culinary education is really rooted on Um and most 0:28:10.040 --> 0:28:14.119 of the Western world at least. What were you researching 0:28:15.119 --> 0:28:20.920 to help deepen your knowledge about this seasonal cuisine of 0:28:21.440 --> 0:28:25.520