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Speaker 1: You're listening to Cleveland Brown's Daily live on the Cleveland

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Speaker 1: Browns Podcast Network, presented by Brown's VIP Tailgate, coming.

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Speaker 2: To you live from the Cross Country Mortgage Campus in Barrie, Ohio.

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Speaker 2: This is Cleveland Browns Daily, presented by Bally Batt, an

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Speaker 2: official sports betting partner of your Cleveland Browns on a

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Speaker 2: fifty ESPN Cleveland. You are your hosts, Bo Bishop and

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Speaker 2: Nathan Zegura.

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Speaker 3: Happy Thursday, everybody.

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Speaker 4: I'm Jason Gibbs alongside senior staff writer Kelsey Russo. That's right,

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Speaker 4: I'm giving you a promotion.

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Speaker 3: Dribble pay. It's fine. There we go.

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Speaker 4: Welcome to Cleveland Browns Daily on a sun splash Thursday,

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Speaker 4: Sweet sixteen. We'll get to that in a little bit.

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Speaker 4: G Man Austin Ward from ninety seven to one. The

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Speaker 4: fan in Columbus will join us at one twenty. At

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Speaker 4: one forty, Tyvas Powell and Gerrod Sherry join me. But

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Speaker 4: for the next half hour, Kelsey Russo joins us.

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Speaker 3: How are you I'm great? How are you good? Good?

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Speaker 4: We're rolling through things. Four weeks from today the NFL Draft,

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Speaker 4: Green Bay, Wisconsin, probably be a foot of snow, probably

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Speaker 4: be about twenty below.

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Speaker 5: Probably that was Jack right, yep, exactly.

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Speaker 4: That will be the that will be the end, all

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Speaker 4: be all I think for the NFL Draft. Now that

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Speaker 4: being said, the Browns remain a pick number two. Adam

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Speaker 4: Schefter yesterday dropping a little Schefter bomb at like five

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Speaker 4: o'clock as I was trying to leave here. Hey, I

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Speaker 4: think the Browns right now too, They're gonna take up

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Speaker 4: Duel Carter in this room. Maybe not the most popular pick,

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Speaker 4: is it the best pick it could be if the

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Speaker 4: if the Browns brass feels that way on our end,

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Speaker 4: we've talked about it, that maybe there doesn't need to

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Speaker 4: be another defensive end and in an already talented and

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Speaker 4: deep defensive end room. However they feel that he's the guy,

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Speaker 4: then he will be the guy. Four weeks from today

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Speaker 4: we will know. But if you take a look at things,

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Speaker 4: mock draft madness, something with Dak Prescott yesterday, silly season,

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Speaker 4: Kelsey is officially here.

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Speaker 5: It's here. Everything is. There are so many rumors going around,

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Speaker 5: there's no can census about who's going to go where,

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Speaker 5: which leaves so much up her interpretation of who's going

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Speaker 5: to be available to who's taking at one et cetera,

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Speaker 5: and where do the Browns go? It just leaves so

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Speaker 5: much up for interpretation at this point, and we've still

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Speaker 5: got four weeks, which you know, it's going to get

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Speaker 5: even crazier as we get closer, because that's how this

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Speaker 5: always goes. Just as you get closer, people want to

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Speaker 5: try to predict. And you know, I think it's really

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Speaker 5: interesting because there is no consensus about, honestly, like what's

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Speaker 5: going to happen at number one is leading to this

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Speaker 5: at number two? And why you know, when you look

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Speaker 5: at mocks across you know, so many platforms, there is

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Speaker 5: no consensus of it could be cam it could be

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Speaker 5: Travis Hunter, it could be Carter. Like there's everybody's everybody's

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Speaker 5: name is still floating around at that spot. And so

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Speaker 5: it's a big kind of shrug at this point of

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Speaker 5: wondering who's going to be there?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, and yet the Browns are in a

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Speaker 4: great position with whatever the Titans end up doing. And

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Speaker 4: I know Nathan brought it up the other day. You know,

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Speaker 4: you're options are to stand pad it two and maybe

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Speaker 4: cam Ward is there. If not, should Sanders is going

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Speaker 4: to be there? If you don't want a quarterback well,

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Speaker 4: you've got a couple other options as well. If you

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Speaker 4: want to trade back, you can do that. If you

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Speaker 4: feel like maybe you don't want any of these guys

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Speaker 4: and you want to generate a few more assets, you

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Speaker 4: know you could do that by moving back in the draft.

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Speaker 4: There are just so many options as it pertains to

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Speaker 4: this football team and what they can or can't do.

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Speaker 4: And you know, there's news out this morning rap sheets

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Speaker 4: saying that the Browns brass is going to privately work

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Speaker 4: out Shoulder Sanders now and then Jonathan Jones from CBS

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Speaker 4: Sports reporting Abduel Carter's not going to do anything at

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Speaker 4: the Penn State Pro day tomorrow, so there's some question

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Speaker 4: marks then with him. What do you make of all

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Speaker 4: of this?

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Speaker 5: It's a lot of information, and it's like tough to

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Speaker 5: kind of take in because it's just like there's so

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Speaker 5: many different factors and you're like, Okay, well, one piece

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Speaker 5: of information may lead you to think one thing another

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Speaker 5: because there was that report yesterday that they worked out

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Speaker 5: cam Ward as well, and so you know that plays

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Speaker 5: a factor into this as well. So while there's so

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Speaker 5: much information, it's also not necessarily shocking because we're still

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Speaker 5: in this evaluation process for these teams. You know, now

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Speaker 5: that we're in protase, you know, the you know brass

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Speaker 5: for the Browns, but also around the league, they're going

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Speaker 5: to see these players up close at their prote's coming

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Speaker 5: off the combine, coming off those interviews. You know, they're

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Speaker 5: having their top thirty visits, et cetera. So these are

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Speaker 5: all like steps in this process that I think are

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Speaker 5: really good, you know, indications of where this is going

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Speaker 5: to go. But you know, it's not it's still kind

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Speaker 5: of early for these like final decisions to be happening

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Speaker 5: because there's so many factors in this leading up to it.

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Speaker 5: You know, while we're through the first kind of wave

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Speaker 5: of free agency, there's still things that could happen and

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Speaker 5: technically in free agency up to the draft that could

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Speaker 5: affect what ends up happening. So it's all like really

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Speaker 5: good piece of information to take in, but it's also

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Speaker 5: like have to remember, like, Okay, we still got a

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Speaker 5: lot of time before we figure out what's going to happen.

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Speaker 3: Correct.

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Speaker 4: How many more times is Adam Schefter going to drop

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Speaker 4: a I think the Browns are going to take so

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Speaker 4: and so, and you go, are we sure? Yeah, maybe

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Speaker 4: tomorrow it'll be someone different, right, Yeah, it's a good

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Speaker 4: kay and a lot of it, A lot of it

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Speaker 4: is the clickbait. Not that these guys don't know what

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Speaker 4: they're talking about, but you know, it depends on the

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Speaker 4: information being disseminated. Who wants it out there? Why do

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Speaker 4: they want it out there? And you know, maybe we

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Speaker 4: get a little more clarity. I know you'll be at

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Speaker 4: the Owner's meetings, the NFL's annual meetings, as Andrew Siciliano

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Speaker 4: called them. Yes, not the owner's meetings, it's the annual

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Speaker 4: meeting for the NFL in Florida, And obviously coaches breakfast

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Speaker 4: on Monday, so we'll have a little bit better idea,

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Speaker 4: And maybe there's a meeting with the Haslims Andrew Berry,

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Speaker 4: you know, Jimmy Aslim reportedly was that cam Ward's private

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Speaker 4: workout with our top brass as well. So you know,

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Speaker 4: there's a lot to come and a lot still to

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Speaker 4: happen here over the next four weeks or so, four

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Speaker 4: weeks from today when the NFL draft takes place. All right,

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Speaker 4: we did you made us do mock drafts? That's right,

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Speaker 4: she made did you had cam Ward at number at

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Speaker 4: pick number two? Was that a hope or was that

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Speaker 4: a would you like cam Ward?

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Speaker 5: I would it was a hope. You know, it's I

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Speaker 5: think because it again kind of it so much depends

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Speaker 5: on where the Titans go and what they what they

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Speaker 5: see as their top need. Is it a quarterback, is

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Speaker 5: it somebody like a dual carter on the edge in

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Speaker 5: that place such a big factor obviously of where where

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Speaker 5: the Browns go. So the hope I was thinking was

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Speaker 5: they take Abduel, which leaves the door open for the

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Speaker 5: Browns to take cam And I think he's just a

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Speaker 5: great fit from when we talked when we talked him

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Speaker 5: at the Combine, when he did his press conference, his

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Speaker 5: mature and his poise I thought really stood out of

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Speaker 5: just how he handled all of that and how he

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Speaker 5: views himself. And you know, not that there's not areas

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Speaker 5: for his game to grow, but I think he could

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Speaker 5: come in and really develop in this type of system

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Speaker 5: and succeed, especially, you know, depending on if the Browns

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Speaker 5: add a veteran quarterback and we'll see what happens. But

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Speaker 5: even somebody under like Kenny Pickett who has a couple

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Speaker 5: of years of experience to learn from him and figure

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Speaker 5: out the nuances of the league. So yeah, that still hope.

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Speaker 5: I still kind of stick to that. You know, if

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Speaker 5: if he is available out at two, I think he's

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Speaker 5: the way to go, and it.

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Speaker 3: Could be possible.

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Speaker 4: I mean, the way the Titans are sending things out,

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Speaker 4: I mean we really don't know. I mean, maybe Abduall

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Speaker 4: Carter's number one on their list, Maybe Travis Hunter's number

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Speaker 4: one on their list. Maybe Shuter Sanders is number one

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Speaker 4: on their list. Uh, there's still a lot together. Based

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Speaker 4: on the contingent they sent to cam Ward's pro day,

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Speaker 4: I would tend to think that they're leaning towards cam Wree.

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Speaker 4: But you know, if if Duel Carter is not working

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Speaker 4: out tomorrow, we're not going to know exactly what that

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Speaker 4: contingent looks like. If they had sent everybody to that,

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Speaker 4: then okay, maybe they're just trying to take us all

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Speaker 4: down a road and keep us guessing for the next

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Speaker 4: four weeks.

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Speaker 3: All right.

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Speaker 4: Later on in the draft, I'm not holding you to

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Speaker 4: this a mock draft. One point, Oh, I went all

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Speaker 4: over the place. I had us taking Harold Fannon at

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Speaker 4: one point, my favorite tight end for ball of Green

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Speaker 4: State University.

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Speaker 5: I support it.

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Speaker 4: Thank you. You had offensive tackle in the second round.

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Speaker 4: Josh Connery, you had quinc Jenkins from Ohio State at

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Speaker 4: pick sixty seven in the third round. I feel like

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Speaker 4: he's working his way up and I got a bad feeling.

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Speaker 4: I don't know if he'll be there when we pick

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Speaker 4: at thirty three. Travon Henderson might be there, and Judkins

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Speaker 4: could still be there. But if you look at this

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Speaker 4: football team, at what they've done in free agency so far,

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Speaker 4: the additions, the guys we brought back so far, what

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Speaker 4: is the top need on an offensive side of the

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Speaker 4: football and what is the top need on the defensive side? Overall,

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Speaker 4: top need is quarterback, we all understand that. But what

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Speaker 4: is the top need on offense and what is the

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Speaker 4: top need on defense?

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Speaker 5: I think, depending seeing how free agency has played out,

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Speaker 5: I think that top met on the offensive side is

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Speaker 5: running back or wide receiver. I think you target one

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Speaker 5: of those two positions or both in that sense. In

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Speaker 5: those top kind of second round, third round picks. You

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Speaker 5: know they added Cornelius Lucas, who brings such a like

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Speaker 5: a an option as a tackle as a swing tackle

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Speaker 5: for the offensive line, especially as they kind of await

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Speaker 5: Dwan Jones in his return and you know, you add

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Speaker 5: the guard to oh my gosh, Jenkins, Jenkins, Yes, thank you,

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Speaker 5: Sorry blanked for a second, but another option for depth,

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Speaker 5: and I think that's really what this offensive line needs.

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Speaker 5: You know, when you have Joel Botonio coming back for

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Speaker 5: twenty twenty five, which is a really big boost from

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Speaker 5: not only a veteran presence, but a leadership presence and

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Speaker 5: just what he brings to this offensive line. Once you

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Speaker 5: have a really healthy group. When we saw the end

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Speaker 5: of last season, there's a lot of potential still there

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Speaker 5: with these guys that they've played together for so long.

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Speaker 5: So I think with those additions, they're in a pretty

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Speaker 5: good spot, especially as they wait for Dowan to come back.

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Speaker 5: So that's why I kind of think you target running

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Speaker 5: back wide receiver, especially as we await you know, kind

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Speaker 5: of what happens with Nick Chubb. That's still you know,

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Speaker 5: he's an unrestructed free agent, so really at any time

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Speaker 5: he could be back, or he could be going to

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Speaker 5: the round back.

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Speaker 6: That I love Nick.

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Speaker 5: But you know, that's still a possibility of you don't

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Speaker 5: know how that's going to turn out. And at the

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Speaker 5: time right now, it's just Jerome and peer Strong, So

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Speaker 5: you kind of need some depth there wide receiver. You know,

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Speaker 5: you're led by Jerry jud and you have a ton

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Speaker 5: of young guys who have really showcased their potential, but

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Speaker 5: there's still, you know, room there for that second guy

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Speaker 5: to really step up. And so is it a young

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Speaker 5: guy that you bring in in one of that second

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Speaker 5: third round, et cetera. Defensively, I think you target safety.

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Speaker 5: I think with you know, with Rodney retiring, you kind

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Speaker 5: of have this whole left, yeah, exactly, and so you

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Speaker 5: need somebody there, even if they're a young guy, but

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Speaker 5: you that brings in the depth piece that then they

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Speaker 5: can grow, they can learn from somebody like Grant who's

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Speaker 5: been around, he can kind of find his footing and

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Speaker 5: establish that role. But you know, Grant's obviously stepping up

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Speaker 5: into that veteran role, especially now because that was Rodney's

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Speaker 5: role obviously last year, but now it's very much Grants

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Speaker 5: and so he steps into that and then you know

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Speaker 5: Ronnie can step up, but it's basically your two and

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Speaker 5: so you need somebody else to fill that that depth piece.

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Speaker 5: So defensively, I think that's where they go, or seems

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Speaker 5: a good place to go, especially because of who they

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Speaker 5: added in free agency. You know, Malie Collins on the interior,

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Speaker 5: Joe on the edge. You know, he was obviously a

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Speaker 5: linebacker before, but now in this kind of system he

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Speaker 5: can play on that edge, and I think that's going

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Speaker 5: to be a really good role for him. They both

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Speaker 5: were super excited about the opportunity to play in this

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Speaker 5: attack style defense and that their skill sets are really

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Speaker 5: apt for that type of defense, and so I think

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Speaker 5: they'll be good pieces, which then kind of leaves the

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Speaker 5: door open to kind of go other directions in the draft,

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Speaker 5: because you have kind of a core here to add

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Speaker 5: to the defensive line guys that have already here. You know,

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Speaker 5: Shelby Harris, I mean Miles obviously, you know even the

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Speaker 5: young guys, and so you have a really good, solid

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Speaker 5: core at the moment that I think leaves the door

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Speaker 5: open to go other places.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think that that's there are a lot

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Speaker 4: of eats. You have a lot of draft picks. I

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Speaker 4: would like a lot of the sixth and seventh round

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Speaker 4: picks to move up. So we're not here till midnight

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Speaker 4: on Saturday. That's a selfish reason, but you take a look.

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Speaker 4: I mean, you mentioned it in addition to the quarterbacks.

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Speaker 4: You need one or two running backs. You'd probably need

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Speaker 4: one or two wide receivers. You need one or two

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Speaker 4: tight ends. You need some more depth to tackle. You

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Speaker 4: need maybe another center, and maybe that's a late free

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Speaker 4: agent acquisition. I still think defensive tackle. You know, I

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Speaker 4: don't know what Mike Hall status is, you know, coming

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Speaker 4: off of that injury at the end at the end

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Speaker 4: of the season, in that last game in Baltimore. The

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Speaker 4: edge rusher room, I think. I like where we're at linebacker.

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Speaker 4: With the acquisition of Baker, I think helps, But maybe

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Speaker 4: you go get another young guy, especially because you've got

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Speaker 4: a lie a lot of linebackers that are on one

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Speaker 4: year deals and you need someone that you can build

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Speaker 4: with at corner. I like the depth already that you have,

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Speaker 4: and as you mentioned, safety, I think is.

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Speaker 3: A big deal.

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Speaker 4: I did want to you get a thought. You mentioned

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Speaker 4: both of them, but two cornerstones of this franchise. We

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Speaker 4: haven't had yon to get your reaction. But with Botonio back,

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Speaker 4: with Miles Garrett back, you know, two guys, and Miles

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Speaker 4: was under contract, you know, and he wasn't going anywhere.

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Speaker 4: This organization made a clear he wasn't going anywhere, renegotiated his.

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Speaker 3: Contract, and.

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Speaker 4: I think for forty eight hours he was the highest

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Speaker 4: pay non quarterback in the NFL. It might have been

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Speaker 4: forty eight hours, but he's one of the top, and

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Speaker 4: rightfully so. But Miles being here and wanting to be here,

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Speaker 4: and then you know, Joel Botonio coming back from a

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Speaker 4: leadership standpoint, I don't think it can be, you know,

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Speaker 4: taken lightly. To have both those guys back in the building.

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Speaker 5: I think it's super important. I think Joel's step was

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Speaker 5: really important for him, you know, to work through just

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Speaker 5: kind of the frustrations from the twenty twenty four season

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Speaker 5: and take a step back and think about what his

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Speaker 5: future looked like. But him being back from the offensive

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Speaker 5: side of the ball, yeah, and then Miles being back

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Speaker 5: on the defensive side the ball. You have these two

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Speaker 5: franchise players that really do mean a lot to this

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Speaker 5: organization and their buy in and their want to be

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Speaker 5: here next season. And plus obviously for Garrett and we'll

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Speaker 5: see what happens with Joel, is such an important buy

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Speaker 5: and piece that the younger guys need, you know, you

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Speaker 5: need those guys that are going to they're gonna rally

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Speaker 5: behind Joel the will rally behind miles of Okay, you

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Speaker 5: have this veteran guy who's played X many seasons, you know,

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Speaker 5: has done so much in their careers, and they want

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Speaker 5: to be here because they believe in this future. And

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Speaker 5: so I think that was really important. I think it's

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Speaker 5: a good thing for both sides of the ball. And

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Speaker 5: you need you just need both those guys in that conversation.

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Speaker 5: But yeah, I am happy to see them both back.

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Speaker 7: You know.

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Speaker 5: I think it'll be a really good thing for any

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Speaker 5: young guys they bring in, but also just for the

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Speaker 5: overall morale of that locker room.

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Speaker 3: All Right.

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Speaker 4: You host the Backstage Past series on our social media platforms,

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Speaker 4: our website, Cleveland Browns dot com, YouTube dot com, slash Browns.

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Speaker 4: Is there a moment? Is there a takeaway from any

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Speaker 4: of the Backstage Pass interviews here this offseason with a

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Speaker 4: lot of the additions. I had a conversation with Andrew

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Speaker 4: Siciliano about this on this week's edition to the Best

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Speaker 4: Podcast Available. I said, you know, a year ago and

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Speaker 4: this time. The last week in March was a busy week.

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Speaker 4: We had a lot of signings, we had a lot

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Speaker 4: of people through the building. It's been quiet. Yeah, And

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Speaker 4: I think it's quiet throughout the National Football League. I mean,

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Speaker 4: and it's something that I didn't see coming, and I

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Speaker 4: don't think a lot of people did. There doesn't seem

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Speaker 4: to be a lot happening. But of the guys we

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Speaker 4: brought in, I mean, Kenny Pickett, Cornelius Lucas try and Choyanka,

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Speaker 4: Malik Collins entertaining might want to have the dump button ready,

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Speaker 4: Jerome Baker, DeAndre Carter. Is there a takeaway? Is there

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Speaker 4: one that stood out for.

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Speaker 5: You on in the football side of the conversation. I'd say, Malik,

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Speaker 5: you know that it was a really good conversation because

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Speaker 5: he's played in attack stile defenses. It's basically all he's

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Speaker 5: done his whole career. He played for Jacques and so

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Speaker 5: he was really excited about that opportunity to come back.

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Speaker 5: He's played alongside Obo, so that familiarity piece for him

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Speaker 5: was super important, and he talked about like wanting wanting

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Speaker 5: to be here and feeling wanted and feeling very excited

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Speaker 5: about that. So I liked that aspect, you know, and

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Speaker 5: wanting to play in this kind of style of defense

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Speaker 5: and feeling that he can really contribute because he's developed

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Speaker 5: his game and kind of developed a reputation as somebody

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Speaker 5: who fits in this type of style. So I liked

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Speaker 5: that a lot. On the non football side, there was

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Speaker 5: a couple of things that I loved. Joe said that

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Speaker 5: he loves to hike, so he talked a lot about

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Speaker 5: you know, CVMP around here and the trails and the

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Speaker 5: metro parks and stuff. Cornelius Lucas wants to bring his

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Speaker 5: swim camps to Cleveland, so he talked about, you know,

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Speaker 5: he does them in New Orleans, but he wants to

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Speaker 5: bring them here as just you know, a lot of

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Speaker 5: players do football camps and everything. But he took a

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Speaker 5: different direction and went swim camps helped teach young boys

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Speaker 5: how to swim and so they had that knowledge. So

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Speaker 5: I thought that was really cool and very different. And

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Speaker 5: then one of our own guys, that's back but Devin

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Speaker 5: Bush was talking about how he likes he learns. He

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Speaker 5: knows how to juggle, and he taught himself how to juggle,

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Speaker 5: and you know, not it's not something a lot of

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Speaker 5: the guys know, but he has done.

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Speaker 3: It, but a rookie, so during the rookie talent.

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Speaker 5: Exactly, so he wasn't. It was an unknown skill set

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Speaker 5: of his.

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Speaker 8: I think we need a veteran town.

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Speaker 5: I think so too.

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Speaker 3: So it has been a busy off season.

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Speaker 4: There's still a lot to go, and we'll wait and

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Speaker 4: see what happens over the next four weeks and beyond.

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Speaker 4: Players are back in the building in about three weeks,

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Speaker 4: so right before the draft, and we'll see what happens

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Speaker 4: with this organization as we go. As I mentioned, coming

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Speaker 4: up at one forty tyas Poal and Girod Cherry will

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Speaker 4: join the program. Up next Austin Ward from ninety seven

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Speaker 4: one the Fan in Columbus recapping Ohio States Pro Day

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Speaker 4: talking about the seventeen Ohio State players that are coming

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Speaker 4: out in the draft.

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Speaker 3: She's at Georgia.

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Speaker 8: I love.

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Speaker 4: She couldn't be more excited about this right and Austin

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Speaker 4: Ward will join us when we come back. You're listening

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Speaker 4: to Cleveland Browns Daily presented by bally Bett, a sports

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Speaker 4: betting partner of Your Cleveland Browns on eight fifty ESPN.

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Speaker 2: Cleveland Cleveland Browns Daily presented by bally Bet, an official

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Speaker 2: sports betting partner of Your Cleveland Browns on eight fifty

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Speaker 2: esp and Cleveland.

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Speaker 4: Elk and Elk, serious lawyers for serious injuries called one

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Speaker 4: eight hundred Elk Ohio for your free case review. Elk

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Speaker 4: and Elk a proud spart a proud partner of Your

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Speaker 4: Cleveland Browns. I do know how to talk. My name

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Speaker 4: is Jason Gibbs. She is senior staff writer at Kelsey Russo.

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Speaker 4: From Cleveland Browns dot com. This is Cleveland Browns Daily,

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Speaker 4: presented by Bally bet. We go now to the Twisted

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Speaker 4: t Hart Iced tea hotline and official sponsor of your

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Speaker 4: Cleveland Browns. Keep It Twisted Cleveland Talking a little Buck

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Speaker 4: guys with our great friend of the program, Austin Ward

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Speaker 4: from the podcast on ninety seven to one the Fan Award.

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Speaker 3: How the heck are you buddy?

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Speaker 7: Great? Always great to be with you, guys. Feels like

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Speaker 7: we a time. This went up pretty regularly, right after

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Speaker 7: Ohio State Pro Day, which was another great showcase with

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Speaker 7: those Buck guys on Wednesday at the Woody.

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Speaker 3: Definitely a great day, indeed.

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Speaker 4: And you're also in the middle of springball too, because

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Speaker 4: you don't have enough going on, you know, very little

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Speaker 4: time to celebrate a national championship. But seventeen Buck guys

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Speaker 4: at Ohio State's pro day yesterday. All of them showed

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Speaker 4: up and showed out. And as I like to say,

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Speaker 4: I don't think you can you can hurt yourself more

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Speaker 4: than you can help yourself at a pro day. But

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Speaker 4: I feel like Ohio State players may have actually debunked

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Speaker 4: that myth and actually helped themselves. There a number of

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Speaker 4: them with really great days yesterday.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, just some There's some jaw dropping numbers coming out

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Speaker 7: of the testing. And you know, not everybody does everything.

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Speaker 7: If you can choose the spots that you might need

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Speaker 7: to improve from the combine or what you didn't do

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Speaker 7: at the combine, and some of these guys didn't have

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Speaker 7: a ton of you know, really room to move up.

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Speaker 7: But if you see someone like Ty Hamilton, who has

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Speaker 7: overlooked even as the defensive tackle for Ohio State kind

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Speaker 7: of overshadowed by not just JT. Twimolo aw and Jack

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Speaker 7: Sawyer on the edge with Ty Hamilton, excuse me, Tally

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Speaker 7: Williams next to him with defensive tackle. He puts up

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Speaker 7: thirty four reps on the bench press. He looked like

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Speaker 7: a million bucks and might earn a contract somewhere along

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Speaker 7: those lines after the way he works out really. You know,

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Speaker 7: you look at his older brother, Devon Hamilton's been riding

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Speaker 7: out a career in the NFL level for several years.

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Speaker 7: He's got the genetics. He worked out great. I think

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Speaker 7: that will get people's attention. If you had Jordan Hancock,

436
00:22:57,240 --> 00:22:59,520
Speaker 7: you know, posting you know, one of the best forty

437
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,600
Speaker 7: times the best vertical jumps to anybody among the defensive

438
00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:05,520
Speaker 7: backs would have posted in Indianapolis. He's someone who's definitely,

439
00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:08,679
Speaker 7: I think is going to get more attention because he

440
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,240
Speaker 7: could play both cornerback and safety at the NFL level,

441
00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:13,400
Speaker 7: depending on what you need. So I think he helped

442
00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 7: himself a Mecca BUCA. I think you know he has

443
00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:20,760
Speaker 7: certainly been, whether it was two years ago someone in

444
00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,600
Speaker 7: the shadow of Marvin Harrison Junior and then Jeremiah Smith

445
00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:26,399
Speaker 7: a year ago. Anyone who's watched the film and the

446
00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:28,920
Speaker 7: productivity of a Mecca at BUKO over four years knows

447
00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:31,399
Speaker 7: what kind of player he can be and his measurables

448
00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:34,639
Speaker 7: met that moment on Wednesday as well. So you're absolutely right.

449
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:37,080
Speaker 7: And I didn't even get into what will Howard if

450
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,240
Speaker 7: he needed to prove some people to some you know

451
00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,840
Speaker 7: people about his accuracy there was some criticism from a

452
00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:46,000
Speaker 7: couple throws at the combine. Amazing what happens when you

453
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:47,719
Speaker 7: get to tow to some receivers, you know, and some

454
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:50,800
Speaker 7: really talented guys. I thought he was awesome on Wednesday.

455
00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:54,560
Speaker 7: He missed maybe one throw, another was dropped, but you know,

456
00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:57,080
Speaker 7: he's got a lot of film of high level football

457
00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,520
Speaker 7: and four playoff games. I think people can refer to

458
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:02,040
Speaker 7: as well those guys. I think Jason would be at

459
00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:04,919
Speaker 7: the top of that list. And it was fun to

460
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:07,080
Speaker 7: be out there because it's rare that you would have

461
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:10,480
Speaker 7: a pro day where whatever position you're looking for, Ohio

462
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:11,760
Speaker 7: State has somebody out there to do it.

463
00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:15,760
Speaker 5: Austin kind of going off that and this is Kelsey Russo,

464
00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:18,359
Speaker 5: I'm our senior staff writer, but I was kind of

465
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:21,960
Speaker 5: curious more so about Will and coming off the combine.

466
00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:25,440
Speaker 5: You know, these teams are taking into so much consideration

467
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,960
Speaker 5: the combine, their interviews, their pro days, et cetera. But

468
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:31,879
Speaker 5: what more show do you think he showcased in that

469
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 5: throwing session that really just maybe solidified his tape and

470
00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:39,919
Speaker 5: you know, kind of putting everything into perspective for him.

471
00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:45,080
Speaker 7: Yeah, I think he was. Will Howard does not hide

472
00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:47,639
Speaker 7: his emotions very well, and I think that's part of

473
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,520
Speaker 7: what made him great and a perfect fit as a

474
00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:52,720
Speaker 7: leader for Ohio State last year. So he was annoyed,

475
00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:56,119
Speaker 7: I think by the way he was being picked apart,

476
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:59,359
Speaker 7: which comes with the territory, not just because he's used

477
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:01,320
Speaker 7: to that from being a quarterback at Ohio State winning

478
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,680
Speaker 7: a national championship, but he knows that when you're going

479
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:06,119
Speaker 7: on to the next level and you want to be

480
00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:09,480
Speaker 7: an NFL quarterback, that that business side, they're gonna pick

481
00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:12,359
Speaker 7: apart any little thing. They're making million dollar decisions and

482
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,159
Speaker 7: trying to build, you know, franchises around this position. So

483
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:16,720
Speaker 7: he knows that that's part of the deal. But I

484
00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:19,680
Speaker 7: think that you know, he made the choice to throw,

485
00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:23,439
Speaker 7: and not everybody does that at the combine, and you know,

486
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:25,840
Speaker 7: you sit around, you don't just get an opportunity to

487
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 7: get into a rhythm. You don't necessarily have a script

488
00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:29,640
Speaker 7: of things that you're going to work on and show off,

489
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:31,919
Speaker 7: and that can be a difficult spot. That's why some

490
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:35,520
Speaker 7: of these quarterbacks opped out of that in Indianapolis. So

491
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 7: I do think that he took that challenge, you know,

492
00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:42,200
Speaker 7: whether that's took it personally or just understood the gravity

493
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 7: of the situation on Wednesday that he wanted to be

494
00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:47,240
Speaker 7: extremely well prepared for that. You want to make sure

495
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:50,399
Speaker 7: that they had a good script, that he knew all

496
00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:52,080
Speaker 7: the throws that he was going to need to show off.

497
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:55,640
Speaker 7: Deep throws, intermediate throws, short throws. There's examples of all

498
00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:58,280
Speaker 7: of that on his film at Ohio State. But you know,

499
00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 7: you get into this next phase of the process. That's

500
00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:03,119
Speaker 7: where you know you're splitting hairs and you're looking for

501
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 7: any excuse to draft or not draft somebody. I don't

502
00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:09,240
Speaker 7: think you could watch what Will Howard did with the accuracy,

503
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:11,720
Speaker 7: with the way he You know, sometimes people talk about

504
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:14,920
Speaker 7: the command of the script and pointing things out to

505
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,439
Speaker 7: receivers on Pro Day, and that that I think can

506
00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:20,840
Speaker 7: be overblown compared to what you did in college. And

507
00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 7: it wasn't just sixteen games at Ohio State for him,

508
00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:26,119
Speaker 7: and you know, several years of starting experience at Kansas

509
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:28,520
Speaker 7: State before that. I think people know he can do that.

510
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:31,560
Speaker 7: But you watched some of the coaches and general managers

511
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:33,439
Speaker 7: that were there. They were really impressed, and they were

512
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:35,320
Speaker 7: talking about if they were clapping or in the workouts

513
00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:38,399
Speaker 7: and throws were on the money. It didn't really surprise me.

514
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:40,679
Speaker 7: That was what I expected to see from Will Howard

515
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:42,680
Speaker 7: on a day where he got to go back out

516
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,200
Speaker 7: there with you know, a Becca Buca and Carnell Tate

517
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 7: and Brandon Ennis and Trevion Anderson, guys that he's known,

518
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:50,879
Speaker 7: you know, and worked with plenty. They had a good

519
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:53,199
Speaker 7: report and just about every ball was right where it

520
00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:53,679
Speaker 7: needed to be.

521
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,439
Speaker 4: Talking with Austin Ward, Ohio State Buckeye Reporter, member of

522
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:03,639
Speaker 4: the podcast nine wherever you get your podcasts, the running

523
00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 4: back position Quinn Shawn Judkins, Traveon Henderson. How do we

524
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:13,119
Speaker 4: separate the two and who if you have to guess

525
00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,560
Speaker 4: who who goes first, who's the first one off the

526
00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 4: board in the NFL draft four weeks from now?

527
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:23,520
Speaker 7: Boy, you flip a coin and you win either way. Honestly,

528
00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:26,439
Speaker 7: I think both of these guys, you know, they have

529
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:28,880
Speaker 7: so much that they bring to the table. The thing

530
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:31,320
Speaker 7: that that I think separates quinch On is a little

531
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:35,520
Speaker 7: bit more of the physicality. Now he's got speed, he

532
00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:38,159
Speaker 7: can he can certainly get to the next level, But

533
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:41,480
Speaker 7: it is the stiff arm, the willingness to break down,

534
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:43,960
Speaker 7: in the ability to break tackles that I think sets

535
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:47,280
Speaker 7: him part apart and Travion. It's not that he can't

536
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:49,840
Speaker 7: do that. Both of these guys have every tool you

537
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:52,760
Speaker 7: could want from a running back. And I think that's what,

538
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:55,399
Speaker 7: you know, elevated the Buckeyes down the stretch, was that

539
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:58,119
Speaker 7: they didn't have to just say, well, if Travion is

540
00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:00,359
Speaker 7: in the game, this is what's gonna happen there. They're

541
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:02,560
Speaker 7: only going to throw screens to him. They're only going

542
00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:05,880
Speaker 7: to use him on the perimeter. Travion was he got

543
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 7: so good throughout his career about picking up liszes, and

544
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:12,960
Speaker 7: sometimes he was too physical with that and he would

545
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:17,000
Speaker 7: hurt himself. And has he learned to navigate through that

546
00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:20,479
Speaker 7: and got more mature the way he needed to approach

547
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 7: the game and use his body. He gave you everything

548
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 7: he wanted. And Quinchewan could do that too, And I

549
00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:29,320
Speaker 7: think that to separate them, I think would almost be

550
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:32,440
Speaker 7: impossible for me. I think, you know, Quinchohn's got maybe

551
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:34,639
Speaker 7: a little bit more mileage on the tires because he

552
00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:38,440
Speaker 7: was so in my opinion, overworked at ole Miss. I mean,

553
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,320
Speaker 7: you're talking about six hundred touches at that level. Part

554
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:43,040
Speaker 7: of the appeal for him to come to Ohio State

555
00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:46,120
Speaker 7: last year was that he could form a one to

556
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 7: end him with Travion Henderson and that neither one of

557
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 7: them would have to take four hundred carries or four

558
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 7: hundred touches in the Ohio State offense. And the Buck

559
00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 7: guys did a really good job I think of managing

560
00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 7: that throughout the season so that they were playing their

561
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:02,160
Speaker 7: best in those last four five games, which they did.

562
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 7: And Travian, I think, is someone who when he got

563
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 7: to Ohio State it was more about just the raw

564
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:12,080
Speaker 7: athleticism and trackstar speed. But he hadn't played you know,

565
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:14,120
Speaker 7: he didn't play his last year of high school. Sometimes

566
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:16,479
Speaker 7: we forget about these stories coming out of the end

567
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:18,760
Speaker 7: of COVID. He hadn't played a ton of football, and

568
00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 7: you could see him getting better and better throughout his

569
00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:25,320
Speaker 7: career at Ohio State. So I think that maybe as

570
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 7: NFL talent evaluators, and I see some of these mock

571
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 7: drafts and I'll defer to the experts of where they slot,

572
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:33,320
Speaker 7: you know, how much value to put on them. I

573
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 7: think some of the ones that I've seen elevating Travian,

574
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 7: I'm guessing that is more to do with people expecting

575
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:42,720
Speaker 7: that there's more football ahead of Trevion Henderson and that

576
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:44,880
Speaker 7: maybe his best football still could be ahead of him.

577
00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 7: I think that could also be a little bit unfair

578
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:50,200
Speaker 7: to Quinn Sean, because you know, it wasn't his fault

579
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:51,920
Speaker 7: that he was being asked to do that for an

580
00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:53,800
Speaker 7: SEC team and doing it at a really high level.

581
00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:56,960
Speaker 7: But I would take either one of them in a heartbeat.

582
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 7: You're not gonna have any issues off the field with them.

583
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:01,240
Speaker 7: You're not going to have any question about the work ethic,

584
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 7: and I don't think there are any holes in their game.

585
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 7: They are both complete running backs.

586
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,840
Speaker 5: I saw a ton of clips yesterday of Amika's day

587
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 5: at or at the Pro Bowl or Pro Day, And

588
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:16,560
Speaker 5: you know, when you talk about just what he brings

589
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,080
Speaker 5: to the game, what do you think he showcased even

590
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 5: more so at this Pro day that then maybe just

591
00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 5: helped secure where he is in this draft.

592
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 7: Yeah. I think we get sometimes spoiled by getting to

593
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,080
Speaker 7: watch every snap of these guys. And I think that

594
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 7: a few of the catches that he made over the

595
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 7: shoulder at full speed, I hope, and I think and

596
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:41,760
Speaker 7: I expect that people left on Wednesday with a really

597
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,640
Speaker 7: great appreciation for the hand, eye coordination and the ball

598
00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:47,680
Speaker 7: skills of a mecca because they're off the charts and

599
00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:51,000
Speaker 7: there's nothing. We have a series that we do on

600
00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 7: the podcast where we play you know, nine holes of

601
00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:56,360
Speaker 7: golf and a simulator with these guys and a mecca.

602
00:30:56,520 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 7: He's a great baseball player, he's a great golfer. I

603
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 7: don't know that there's any thing that he doesn't do

604
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:04,680
Speaker 7: at a very high level. And sometimes I mentioned, like

605
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 7: you know, Marvin Harrison a couple of years ago and

606
00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:10,720
Speaker 7: Jeremiah Smith bursting the promise. I think sometimes that reliability,

607
00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:16,680
Speaker 7: that consistency sometimes gets mistaken for it and diminishes how

608
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,600
Speaker 7: high level it is and how elite what a mecca

609
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 7: is doing at a really reliable, consistentle. So doing that again,

610
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 7: I I'm not sure that he had to do it

611
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 7: on Wednesday. I bet the thing that people are gonna

612
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 7: latch onto, and I know that it was important to

613
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 7: him as soon as he ran it was the forty

614
00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,200
Speaker 7: yard dash. Time comes down for these wide receivers. That's

615
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:38,400
Speaker 7: the you know, you're looking at every last part of

616
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:42,120
Speaker 7: their game and trying to differentiate between guys who've been

617
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 7: very productive at not just Ohio State, but LSU or

618
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,240
Speaker 7: anywhere else across the country. There's lots of really good

619
00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 7: wide receivers, but Ohio State has been churning them out.

620
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:53,400
Speaker 7: He knows how to be a professional. His work ethic

621
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:55,600
Speaker 7: is one of the best that I've ever been around.

622
00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:58,880
Speaker 7: He's another one of these guys where it'll sound like,

623
00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:03,120
Speaker 7: you know, lip service cliche. I mean, he You're not

624
00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:05,040
Speaker 7: going to ever have a concern that a Mecca is

625
00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:07,239
Speaker 7: not going to show up on time or represent your

626
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 7: organization the right way. And then when you had on

627
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 7: top of that the productivity and stopping the clock the

628
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:14,520
Speaker 7: way he did in the forty and running the shuttle

629
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 7: and all those other things, there's just not a box

630
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:19,720
Speaker 7: that you can't check with a Mecca a BUCA. And

631
00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 7: you know, again, I don't want it to sound like

632
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:25,600
Speaker 7: gushing just because this is the team that I cover.

633
00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 7: These are the guys that I know. But part of

634
00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:30,640
Speaker 7: the reason that they won the national championship was because

635
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:33,120
Speaker 7: you had leaders like Trevion and because you had a

636
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:35,400
Speaker 7: Mecca a Buca out there, and you had Will Howard.

637
00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:38,840
Speaker 7: These are really really good people, and I think the

638
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:42,080
Speaker 7: interview portion that you mentioned as well, and you're talking

639
00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 7: about Will Howard. That's gonna separate these guys. And there

640
00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:49,600
Speaker 7: there are people that I think organizations won't regret using

641
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:51,920
Speaker 7: a draft pick on somebody that contributed to this national

642
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:53,240
Speaker 7: championship run in Ohio state.

643
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 4: Austin, as long as a BUCA, if he doesn't go

644
00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:58,640
Speaker 4: to US, doesn't go to someone in the AFC North,

645
00:32:58,720 --> 00:32:59,800
Speaker 4: I'm going to be really really.

646
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:01,760
Speaker 3: Happy with that.

647
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 7: I promise you.

648
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:09,080
Speaker 4: No, No, Austin, No, every mock draft I tell, I

649
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:11,320
Speaker 4: tell my intern and I and I tell him all

650
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:11,720
Speaker 4: the time.

651
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 8: I don't.

652
00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 4: No, No, we're not addressing that. That's not happening. We're

653
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,120
Speaker 4: not going to speak that into existence. We're speaking everything

654
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:21,680
Speaker 4: else into existence except that Austin Ward joins us the

655
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,480
Speaker 4: member of the podcast on ninety seven to one the Fan.

656
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:28,440
Speaker 4: We've talked offense defensively. I mean, you got Jack Sawyer,

657
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 4: Tyleek Williams, I know went down yesterday, but I think

658
00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 4: he's gonna be okay. Uh, Tom Tomalu, Perfect Ransom, Denzel, Burt,

659
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 4: Cody Simon. I mean these guys that maybe you're not

660
00:33:39,640 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 4: going to hear on day one, and maybe you get

661
00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:44,000
Speaker 4: a couple of them on Day two, but maybe more

662
00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:46,600
Speaker 4: so day three. But don't go to sleep on this

663
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 4: defensive class coming out here for the Buckeyes.

664
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:52,920
Speaker 7: Oh gosh, yeah, absolutely not. And I think the name

665
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:56,640
Speaker 7: you mentioned there with Denzel. If people turned the tape

666
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:59,400
Speaker 7: off after the Oregon game, which was difficult for a

667
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 7: lot of people, the midseason Oregon game, that's not the

668
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:04,320
Speaker 7: Rose Bowl game. You can turn that one off early.

669
00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 7: But but for a different reason. Ohio say defense, that

670
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:10,080
Speaker 7: was the only time all year that they got picked on,

671
00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:12,920
Speaker 7: and Denzel had the roughest day out of all of

672
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 7: them in coverage. But you know, some of it was

673
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:17,319
Speaker 7: a lack of pass rush and they didn't get home.

674
00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:21,160
Speaker 7: So everybody, I think, you take the front, Jack, JT,

675
00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:24,520
Speaker 7: Tie and tie up front, you know, Cody Simon. They

676
00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 7: all bore some responsibility for that. Denzel took more criticism

677
00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:30,960
Speaker 7: than any of them. He owned that he was phenomenal,

678
00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:33,440
Speaker 7: lights out, lockdown for the rest of the year. He

679
00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:35,759
Speaker 7: came back for one more season at Ohio State. His

680
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:38,120
Speaker 7: goal was to be the first cornerback taken in the draft.

681
00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:41,040
Speaker 7: I don't think that's going to happen next month, but

682
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:43,200
Speaker 7: he's certainly in the conversation and if you wind up

683
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:46,879
Speaker 7: getting him as the third or fourth corner, I think

684
00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,120
Speaker 7: that would be like stealing in my opinion, because you

685
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:51,280
Speaker 7: know you're going to take the worst moments from anybody

686
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:54,000
Speaker 7: and you're going to ask why that happened, and you know,

687
00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:55,760
Speaker 7: how did you learn from that? How did you adapt?

688
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:58,600
Speaker 7: If you turn on you know, the next ten games

689
00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 7: from Denzel Burg after that, he saw one of the

690
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:03,680
Speaker 7: best cornerbacks in America playing at a really high level,

691
00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:05,719
Speaker 7: and teams were not having success. They were not throwing

692
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:08,880
Speaker 7: the wide receivers down the stretch against Ohio State's defense.

693
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:11,399
Speaker 7: Part of that is Denzel. Part of that is Jordan

694
00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:14,240
Speaker 7: Hancock there with his work at Nickel that I mentioned earlier.

695
00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:18,480
Speaker 7: His testing was also great, and having Leython Ransom, you know,

696
00:35:18,520 --> 00:35:21,360
Speaker 7: he's another one that just sort of slips through the cracks.

697
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 7: So much talk about Caleb Downs and what the conversation

698
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:26,000
Speaker 7: is going to be like for him as a draft

699
00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:28,640
Speaker 7: pick at this time next year. There was a partnership

700
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:31,319
Speaker 7: between Layson Ransom and Caleb Downs that helped elevate that

701
00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:34,000
Speaker 7: defense to another level where you had safeties where you

702
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:36,240
Speaker 7: could move them and ask them to do anything. Pre safety,

703
00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 7: strong safety, play in the box, defend a tight end.

704
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:41,440
Speaker 7: They could do anything that Ohio State needed them to

705
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:44,879
Speaker 7: do and that NFL talent evaluators would want them to do.

706
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 7: They checked all those boxes. Cody Simon, he's the block

707
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,839
Speaker 7: oh he was the captain as you sort of look

708
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:54,239
Speaker 7: at it for Ohio State. He's another one that I

709
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:56,440
Speaker 7: mentioned that goes in this same box where but if

710
00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:59,239
Speaker 7: you just narrow it down to his leadership skills, you

711
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:01,520
Speaker 7: would be ignoring the fact that every time Ohio State

712
00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:04,279
Speaker 7: played a ranked opponent, every time they played a playoff game,

713
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:07,200
Speaker 7: he was You could count on him for double digit

714
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:10,959
Speaker 7: tackles and a pass breakup and a tackle for loss

715
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 7: or two. He is a very productive linebacker that focusing

716
00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:17,440
Speaker 7: just on the intangible part and the captaincy would be

717
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:19,799
Speaker 7: ignoring what I think are all the tools that you

718
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:22,000
Speaker 7: would want from an NFL linebacker who could play for

719
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:24,399
Speaker 7: a long time. So when you say don't sleep on it, yeah,

720
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:27,359
Speaker 7: you're absolutely right. It may not be five or six

721
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:30,640
Speaker 7: guys going in the first round, but there's gonna be

722
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 7: seven or eight of them that go by the time

723
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:36,000
Speaker 7: the fourth into the fourth round happened. And if they're

724
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 7: just if you're gonna stash them away and develop them,

725
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 7: or you want to try and plug them in by

726
00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:44,719
Speaker 7: day one in training camp or whatever. I think all

727
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:46,239
Speaker 7: these guys can do it. And they played a lot

728
00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 7: of football. They came back for another year with a

729
00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:51,879
Speaker 7: goal to some of it was, you know, to try

730
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:54,359
Speaker 7: and win the rivalry game. That didn't happen, elevate their

731
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:56,440
Speaker 7: draft stock. I think that absolutely happened. And win a

732
00:36:56,520 --> 00:37:00,880
Speaker 7: national championship. They did that too. So they they're veterans,

733
00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:03,239
Speaker 7: they're mature guys, and they're not going to need a

734
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 7: lot of you know, training wheels once they get into

735
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:07,200
Speaker 7: that NFL franchise.

736
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:10,440
Speaker 4: Austin Ward, appreciate a few minutes of your time. I

737
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:13,120
Speaker 4: know you're a very very busy man. Don't take any

738
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,960
Speaker 4: flak from our guys, Bishop and Poll down there. Whatever

739
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:20,040
Speaker 4: you do, keep them on their toes, keep them going,

740
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:23,000
Speaker 4: keep them honest, and I look forward to talking with

741
00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:24,520
Speaker 4: you a little bit more here as we get closer

742
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:27,640
Speaker 4: to the draft and obviously the the upcoming season where

743
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:31,040
Speaker 4: the Buckeyes defend that national championship. Appreciate a few minutes today,

744
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:31,439
Speaker 4: my friend.

745
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 7: Sure happy to do great to catch up with both

746
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:34,520
Speaker 7: of youll.

747
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:38,279
Speaker 4: Seeeah absolutely, Austin Ward from the podcast on ninety seven

748
00:37:38,320 --> 00:37:40,440
Speaker 4: to one the fan, you got another, you got a

749
00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:44,320
Speaker 4: few minutes. Yeah, we're sticking around, g man, are you ready?

750
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 3: You're ready?

751
00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:47,359
Speaker 4: This is going to be an electric segment coming up.

752
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 4: In my mind, it's electric. I don't know if it's

753
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:52,920
Speaker 4: going to be or not. No dump button needed, well,

754
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,319
Speaker 4: at least I jinxed this. But good Gerrod Sherry and

755
00:37:56,360 --> 00:38:00,440
Speaker 4: Tyvas Powell join us. Next we play fact or the

756
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:03,319
Speaker 4: award winning episode or addition, I should say from our

757
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:06,239
Speaker 4: pregame show. The two join us next. You're listening to

758
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:09,280
Speaker 4: Cleveland Browns Daily, presented by Bally Bet, an official sports

759
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,840
Speaker 4: betting partner of Your Cleveland Browns on a fifty ESPN Cleveland.

760
00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:21,720
Speaker 2: Cleveland Browns Daily presented by Bally Bet, an official sports

761
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 2: betting partner of Your Cleveland Browns on eight fifty esp

762
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 2: and Cleveland.

763
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:33,080
Speaker 4: All right back here on Cleveland Browns Daily, he brought

764
00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:37,200
Speaker 4: to you my Bally Bet, Jason Gibbs, Kelsey Russo. I

765
00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:40,799
Speaker 4: know we're missing Siciliano. I know we're missing Baskin, but

766
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 4: I had this in my head yesterday. I looked at

767
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,000
Speaker 4: the g Man, I said, we need a segment for today.

768
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:47,239
Speaker 4: You know what we need to do. We need to

769
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:51,520
Speaker 4: bring in the award winning often imitated but never duplicated

770
00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:54,799
Speaker 4: fact or fiction pregame segment. A lot of people were

771
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:57,160
Speaker 4: saying that, And the only two people that I can

772
00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,600
Speaker 4: bring in to do that are the two people that

773
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:03,120
Speaker 4: really make it go, and that would be Buck Eye

774
00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:08,760
Speaker 4: legend Tyvas Powell, and the three time Super Bowl champ

775
00:39:09,239 --> 00:39:15,320
Speaker 4: Gerrod Cherry, who also doubles is Tyvas's cousin in season. Gentlemen,

776
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:16,560
Speaker 4: how are.

777
00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 3: We I miss my cousin.

778
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 9: I missed my cousin. It's great to have.

779
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:28,840
Speaker 4: Uh all right before we get before we get going.

780
00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:32,399
Speaker 4: And g Man came up with all these so we'll

781
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:36,520
Speaker 4: judge him accordingly here in just a minute. What did

782
00:39:36,560 --> 00:39:40,439
Speaker 4: you do best at your pro day? Tyvus, I'll start

783
00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 4: with you.

784
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:43,640
Speaker 3: Well, I only think I did that.

785
00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:46,000
Speaker 9: My Pro day was due drills. I wasn't due. I

786
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 9: had did all my other combine stuff at the combine

787
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:51,200
Speaker 9: when I got to do When I got to Pro day,

788
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:52,719
Speaker 9: all I wanted to do was the drills, and I

789
00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:55,799
Speaker 9: moved very well for me being six three two ten

790
00:39:56,040 --> 00:40:01,200
Speaker 9: I moved like a guy that was five nine.

791
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:04,520
Speaker 3: That wasn't named the Miami University wide receiver. We ran

792
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 3: a four a forty day.

793
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:09,239
Speaker 9: Oh oh well, you think he came out and said

794
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:10,879
Speaker 9: that he'd been dealing with a hamstring.

795
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:14,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, son, then yep, so do I every morning when

796
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:15,279
Speaker 3: I wake up.

797
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:18,640
Speaker 4: That's fine. Uh, Gerrod Cherry, what did you do best

798
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:19,359
Speaker 4: at your pro day?

799
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:22,240
Speaker 10: That was a no brainer because at the combine, I

800
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:26,320
Speaker 10: embarrassed myself, the university, anyone who said they ran tracking college.

801
00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 10: I came back and ran out four or three something

802
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:33,440
Speaker 10: in the forty So, yeah, I had to get that

803
00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:35,960
Speaker 10: off my chest. So that's what I did very well there.

804
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:37,600
Speaker 10: And the drills went well too. But I will say

805
00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:42,000
Speaker 10: with the individual workout, guys Tom Coughlin and Randy Elsel

806
00:40:42,080 --> 00:40:43,240
Speaker 10: worked me out.

807
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:45,000
Speaker 11: And I did not know Randy.

808
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:47,759
Speaker 10: Elsel played quarterback on the D one level, but I

809
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:48,680
Speaker 10: found out that day.

810
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 11: I dropped every pass that he could.

811
00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:53,760
Speaker 3: He attempted that that's why you were a dB.

812
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:56,600
Speaker 11: Yeah, your HiT's your DV for a reason.

813
00:40:57,600 --> 00:40:59,120
Speaker 3: You making us look bad. I caught.

814
00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:02,160
Speaker 9: I made it a mission to catch every ball. I

815
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:03,920
Speaker 9: didn't drop no money that day, you.

816
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:07,480
Speaker 10: Know, I dropped thousands of dollars that day.

817
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:12,960
Speaker 4: All right, that being said, it is time for factor fiction.

818
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:17,680
Speaker 4: It's Kelsey, it's Tybas, it's Gerad, it's yours truly, and

819
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:18,959
Speaker 4: I welcome in the g man.

820
00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:20,839
Speaker 3: Right, let's jump or right?

821
00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:24,600
Speaker 1: In factor fiction, the Browns will select a quarterback with

822
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:25,759
Speaker 1: the number two overall.

823
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:28,080
Speaker 3: Pick Tyvas Powell will kick things off with you.

824
00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:31,400
Speaker 9: I'm gonna say that's a fact. I think that I

825
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:33,239
Speaker 9: do think that they might trade up to one to

826
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 9: get cam Ward, but if they do, I can see

827
00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:38,160
Speaker 9: them definitely taking in Shador at number two. I think

828
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:39,960
Speaker 9: the Giants kind of feel that way too, That's why

829
00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:42,200
Speaker 9: they signed two different quarterbacks. So I think, yeah, I

830
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:44,279
Speaker 9: think the Browns will take somebody with either one or

831
00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:47,360
Speaker 9: two a quarterback Gerond Chrry.

832
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:49,000
Speaker 3: What say you fiction?

833
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:52,880
Speaker 11: And it's really yeah, it's really simple.

834
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:56,040
Speaker 10: Why Jim Schwartz went to Andrew Berry and Couty and said,

835
00:41:56,040 --> 00:41:58,560
Speaker 10: you know what, give me Abdul Carter and you know

836
00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 10: what's gonna take place, he and Miles together.

837
00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:02,640
Speaker 11: You imagine the defense is I could.

838
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:04,560
Speaker 10: Come up with, we don't have to worry about scoring

839
00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:06,800
Speaker 10: points because nobody's gonna nobody's gonna score.

840
00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:10,200
Speaker 11: So I'm gonna say fiction, they're gonna take Abduall.

841
00:42:09,840 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 4: Carter, Girod Cherry, You're lucky, bo Bishop and Nathan Zegera

842
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:16,759
Speaker 4: aren't here. They're jumping down your throat right now for

843
00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:21,080
Speaker 4: saying for saying this blasphemy according to them, Kelsey Russo

844
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:21,680
Speaker 4: what say you?

845
00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:25,600
Speaker 5: I'm gonna say fact. I think that the Browns also

846
00:42:25,640 --> 00:42:28,640
Speaker 5: go the direction of taking the quarterback. And whether that's

847
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:31,239
Speaker 5: cam they trade up kind of like Tyva said, or

848
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 5: they take sure, I think that's the route they're gonna

849
00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:34,560
Speaker 5: go too.

850
00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:38,719
Speaker 4: All right, all right, so Kelsey and Tivas are going

851
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:41,920
Speaker 4: to the barbecue and Gerrod's on the outside working on

852
00:42:41,960 --> 00:42:46,080
Speaker 4: his forty time or catching footballs, uh next.

853
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:46,880
Speaker 11: Or lack thereof?

854
00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 3: Oh for the top Gerrod the interns taking shots.

855
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:53,840
Speaker 11: I gonna hope he hit around in a couple of months.

856
00:42:56,719 --> 00:42:58,839
Speaker 6: Gerrod has more Super Bowls than I have.

857
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:05,040
Speaker 1: Whatever, I don't know, we'll see, Uh okay, factor fiction.

858
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:07,840
Speaker 1: The biggest position of need for the Browns outside of

859
00:43:07,960 --> 00:43:12,000
Speaker 1: quarterback is offensive tackle Girod Cherry.

860
00:43:12,440 --> 00:43:14,520
Speaker 11: That is a great question.

861
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:17,319
Speaker 10: I'm gonna say fact on that because we haven't really

862
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:18,040
Speaker 10: talked about it now.

863
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:18,880
Speaker 11: Don't get me wrong.

864
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:22,719
Speaker 10: I love big Thanos and what Duhn Jones represents. But

865
00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:25,719
Speaker 10: at the same time, he does have some issues with

866
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:27,840
Speaker 10: injuries and he's gonna have to recover from that. And

867
00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 10: we have not made mentioned at all of a tackle

868
00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:32,200
Speaker 10: or a guard or a center or anything of that nature,

869
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:34,600
Speaker 10: because simply put, it's not as sexy as a quarterback

870
00:43:34,680 --> 00:43:37,480
Speaker 10: or a rush in Kelsey.

871
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,880
Speaker 5: I'm gonna say fiction, and as we talked about earlier

872
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:43,320
Speaker 5: on this, I think they would. I think the biggest

873
00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:46,160
Speaker 5: position of need is running back or ride receiver outside

874
00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:47,919
Speaker 5: of quarterback on the offensive side of the ball.

875
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 3: Tyvis, I'm gonna say fiction as well.

876
00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:55,719
Speaker 9: I'm gonna agree with Kelsey. I'm gonna say running back

877
00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:58,120
Speaker 9: because if you think about they want to get back

878
00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:00,839
Speaker 9: to the old Keevis Stefanski Allen, what do you need

879
00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:03,360
Speaker 9: for that to be successful? A good run game, and

880
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:05,480
Speaker 9: that's the one thing that was missing last year. So

881
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:06,680
Speaker 9: I'm gonna go running back.

882
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:10,040
Speaker 4: Do you guys want to see Nick Chubb come back

883
00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:12,399
Speaker 4: like the rest of us still here in this building, Yeah,

884
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:12,960
Speaker 4: I don't want to see.

885
00:44:15,640 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 9: Yeah, I think that even even if you want him,

886
00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:19,919
Speaker 9: if you don't even want him to be your one

887
00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:22,360
Speaker 9: A I think as a one B. Or if you

888
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:24,960
Speaker 9: draft a young guy, that's a guy that you probably

889
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:27,000
Speaker 9: want them to look up to, you know, to teach

890
00:44:27,080 --> 00:44:28,799
Speaker 9: them how to be a pro in the NFL. So

891
00:44:29,160 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 9: I think there's just so many other things that Nick

892
00:44:32,160 --> 00:44:35,120
Speaker 9: Chubb can bring to the organization. Just then just what's

893
00:44:35,160 --> 00:44:35,840
Speaker 9: on the field.

894
00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:38,200
Speaker 11: Yeah, give him the Kareem Hunt roll. Nothing wrong with that.

895
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:42,800
Speaker 3: Absolutely, Next effect or fiction.

896
00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:45,200
Speaker 6: Okay, I wanted to do that.

897
00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:50,000
Speaker 1: Uh, speaking of running backs, factor fiction, one of Ohio

898
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:54,239
Speaker 1: State's running backs, either Judkins or Henderson, will be a

899
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 1: Brown following the draft.

900
00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:56,160
Speaker 8: Uh.

901
00:44:56,360 --> 00:44:58,840
Speaker 4: Now, I was gonna go in order, I should go

902
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:02,719
Speaker 4: Kelsey first, but Captain Buckeye down there, I think has

903
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:05,759
Speaker 4: to go first here, Tyvas, what say you?

904
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:08,719
Speaker 9: As much as I would love for this to be

905
00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 9: a fact, I'm gonna say I think I just wait

906
00:45:13,200 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 9: hear me out yet, night. Look, the reason that I

907
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:19,960
Speaker 9: think that they won't get them is because I think

908
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 9: they'll go before the Browns try to get try to

909
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:25,160
Speaker 9: get them. I think that if Brown's take them at

910
00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:27,200
Speaker 9: thirty three, then they would have one. But I don't

911
00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:29,160
Speaker 9: think that they're gonna do that. Because this running back

912
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 9: room is so deep. I think that they're going to

913
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:33,279
Speaker 9: try to address another need somewhere else and then try

914
00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 9: to get one in the third round, and I just

915
00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:36,440
Speaker 9: think those two guys would probably be.

916
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 3: Gone by dead.

917
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:40,439
Speaker 5: Kelsey, I kind of agree with that that line of thinking.

918
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:42,719
Speaker 5: I was gonna say fiction of I think, you know,

919
00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:46,360
Speaker 5: those guys have jumped, They've improved their draft stocks, so

920
00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 5: I don't think they're going to be available, and I

921
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:51,319
Speaker 5: think there's gonna be other needs that the Browns use

922
00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:54,400
Speaker 5: it thirty three before they kind of address that running

923
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 5: back position.

924
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:58,759
Speaker 10: Gerd Sherry, It's a trifecta because I'm gonna say fiction

925
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:01,840
Speaker 10: as well, but my rational is much different in that

926
00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:04,640
Speaker 10: I just see these guys more so in that third

927
00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:07,560
Speaker 10: down back category and we kind of have that on

928
00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:10,319
Speaker 10: the roster already, so to speak, and that we're gonna

929
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:11,640
Speaker 10: go with more of that guy who can be on

930
00:46:11,680 --> 00:46:13,879
Speaker 10: the football field for all the downs. And granted, their

931
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:16,160
Speaker 10: skill set shows that they are capable of being on

932
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:18,520
Speaker 10: the football field multiple downs, but I just think that

933
00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:20,400
Speaker 10: they don't fit what we want to do from a

934
00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:24,640
Speaker 10: size and position standpoint with the running back position.

935
00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:32,880
Speaker 1: Next okay, next fact or fiction. The Seattle Seahawks are

936
00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 1: better with Sam Darnold and Cooper Cup than they were

937
00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:39,200
Speaker 1: with Geno Smith and DK Metcalf.

938
00:46:41,120 --> 00:46:43,799
Speaker 4: I will start with Kelsey here factor fiction.

939
00:46:43,719 --> 00:46:51,480
Speaker 5: Gabe, this is so hard. I am going to say fiction.

940
00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:57,320
Speaker 5: That's right, but Girod likes it, but not to discount that.

941
00:46:57,360 --> 00:46:59,239
Speaker 5: I don't think they will be so good together. And

942
00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:03,680
Speaker 5: I think there is an opportunity for some awesome offense

943
00:47:03,760 --> 00:47:06,840
Speaker 5: on that like with that group together. But I just

944
00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:10,080
Speaker 5: think the combination of Gino and DK was just so

945
00:47:10,200 --> 00:47:12,960
Speaker 5: good and had their years there where they looked really

946
00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:16,359
Speaker 5: good together. And well, we'll see what happens with Sam

947
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:18,640
Speaker 5: and Cooper, but I don't think you can top it.

948
00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:22,560
Speaker 3: Typus Paul, I'm always say fact.

949
00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:25,040
Speaker 9: I'm gonna say they are better with those two for

950
00:47:25,120 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 9: the simple fact that you got guys that's gonna fit

951
00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:30,200
Speaker 9: the system or the style of play that you want

952
00:47:30,200 --> 00:47:31,719
Speaker 9: to run in Seattle. You know, you got a two

953
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:33,480
Speaker 9: headed monster in the run game, So what do you

954
00:47:33,520 --> 00:47:34,799
Speaker 9: want to do off of that? You want to run

955
00:47:34,840 --> 00:47:38,320
Speaker 9: play action off of those things. And obviously Sam Darnold,

956
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:41,080
Speaker 9: coming from Kevin O'Connell, he runs that similar type of thing.

957
00:47:41,320 --> 00:47:42,840
Speaker 9: Where a lot of things is set up off of

958
00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:45,600
Speaker 9: boots and all those and I think Cooper Cup, obviously

959
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:47,879
Speaker 9: he won't be the number one JSN to be there

960
00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:50,680
Speaker 9: go Bucks, but I think he will be very productive

961
00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:52,879
Speaker 9: in that slot. I think he still got some stuff

962
00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:55,000
Speaker 9: left to him. So I think those guys will be

963
00:47:55,040 --> 00:47:57,479
Speaker 9: productive in that offense because of the style of play

964
00:47:57,520 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 9: in which they both come from. Where but both of

965
00:47:59,600 --> 00:48:02,919
Speaker 9: them came from that under center heavy zone play action

966
00:48:03,080 --> 00:48:04,040
Speaker 9: type system.

967
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:05,800
Speaker 3: Gerrod Sheard.

968
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:08,480
Speaker 10: Now, when you first posed this question gave, I was like, Ah,

969
00:48:08,520 --> 00:48:11,560
Speaker 10: this is simplistic, it's not that hard. But after hearing

970
00:48:11,600 --> 00:48:15,360
Speaker 10: the rationale of my two colleagues here after he consider

971
00:48:15,440 --> 00:48:17,560
Speaker 10: what I was thinking. But you know what, I'm still

972
00:48:17,560 --> 00:48:19,640
Speaker 10: gonna stay with fiction. The reason why I'm still saying

973
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:23,480
Speaker 10: with fiction is I don't trust Sam Darnold. I believe

974
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 10: that he came back to who he is more so

975
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:30,760
Speaker 10: than Sam least Gino did it a couple of years.

976
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:31,440
Speaker 8: True.

977
00:48:32,520 --> 00:48:34,480
Speaker 3: No, it is true.

978
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:39,320
Speaker 10: With that being said again, DK, he is a malcontent.

979
00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:40,279
Speaker 11: We understand and get that.

980
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:42,120
Speaker 10: Cooper Cup is not gonna give you any issues or

981
00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:44,120
Speaker 10: problems with whatsoever. And I still think there's some gas

982
00:48:44,160 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 10: left in his tank. But Sam, I'm not trusting in

983
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:49,719
Speaker 10: on a lot of levels. I'm trying to figure out

984
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:51,080
Speaker 10: what the heck Seattle.

985
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:51,479
Speaker 11: Is actually doing.

986
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:55,239
Speaker 10: But I do think Geno and DK is gonna be

987
00:48:55,239 --> 00:48:56,680
Speaker 10: something that they're not gonna be able top. So I'm

988
00:48:56,719 --> 00:49:01,600
Speaker 10: gonna say again fiction, do they.

989
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:02,160
Speaker 3: Get to everybody?

990
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:02,600
Speaker 8: Yeah?

991
00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:06,440
Speaker 3: I lost track. Next, Sorry, I'm going through my list here.

992
00:49:06,600 --> 00:49:09,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, it'll be interesting to see what Seattle does because

993
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:10,480
Speaker 1: right now they have two slot.

994
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:14,320
Speaker 6: Receivers, so you get a deep threat uh factor. Fiction.

995
00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:19,160
Speaker 1: Following free agency, the Baltimore Ravens have the best roster

996
00:49:19,640 --> 00:49:21,000
Speaker 1: in the National Football League.

997
00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:23,040
Speaker 3: Gerrod Cherry will start with you.

998
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:27,279
Speaker 10: I'm not gonna say they have the best roster the

999
00:49:27,360 --> 00:49:29,880
Speaker 10: National Football League. The Philadelphia Eagles have the best roster

1000
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 10: the National Football League by far. They won the Super

1001
00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:35,520
Speaker 10: Bowl for a reason. And the Ravens signed a couple

1002
00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:37,719
Speaker 10: guys and do what they do. But no, they don't

1003
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:39,879
Speaker 10: have the best roster in the National Football League. It's

1004
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:41,800
Speaker 10: simply put the Eagles.

1005
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 3: Tyas Paul, I have to agree with my cousin on

1006
00:49:46,719 --> 00:49:47,200
Speaker 3: this when.

1007
00:49:49,960 --> 00:49:52,239
Speaker 9: We've been going there to this whole town. But that's

1008
00:49:52,280 --> 00:49:54,800
Speaker 9: why he's on the money I mean, listen, the Eagles

1009
00:49:54,880 --> 00:49:57,520
Speaker 9: did everything the correct way. They depend on a lot

1010
00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:00,720
Speaker 9: of young guys. I know they lost Darius Slay, guess what.

1011
00:50:00,640 --> 00:50:01,919
Speaker 3: They drafted really well.

1012
00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:05,200
Speaker 9: They lost the defensive tackle, but guess what they drafted

1013
00:50:05,280 --> 00:50:07,719
Speaker 9: really well in those positions. So when you look at

1014
00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:09,880
Speaker 9: it from top to bottom, they're starting twenty two is

1015
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:11,719
Speaker 9: still good. And I mean they're coming off of a

1016
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:15,040
Speaker 9: Super Bowl win, which is something Baltimore has not done.

1017
00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:15,600
Speaker 7: In quite a time.

1018
00:50:17,040 --> 00:50:21,440
Speaker 5: Kelsey, I will also round out the trifecta and agree

1019
00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:24,560
Speaker 5: with fiction, but I do think the Ravens. The Ravens

1020
00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:27,640
Speaker 5: moves obviously were really really good. So I'm, you know,

1021
00:50:28,680 --> 00:50:31,239
Speaker 5: as a as a division rival, a little worried now,

1022
00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:33,240
Speaker 5: even more so than I have been in the past years.

1023
00:50:33,239 --> 00:50:35,360
Speaker 5: But you know, I don't think you can top the

1024
00:50:35,400 --> 00:50:37,719
Speaker 5: Eagles at this point with what they came off of

1025
00:50:38,239 --> 00:50:38,800
Speaker 5: last season.

1026
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:42,480
Speaker 4: I am still shocked that the Bengals were able to

1027
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:47,000
Speaker 4: retain all of their people. Well, I mean, I don't

1028
00:50:47,040 --> 00:50:48,960
Speaker 4: know who's going to play defense. You're right, you might

1029
00:50:49,000 --> 00:50:50,920
Speaker 4: have to You and Timas both might have to come

1030
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:51,600
Speaker 4: out of retirement.

1031
00:50:53,280 --> 00:50:53,760
Speaker 8: Paycheck.

1032
00:50:54,239 --> 00:50:56,520
Speaker 9: I couldn't. I couldn't.

1033
00:50:57,080 --> 00:50:57,759
Speaker 3: I couldn't do it.

1034
00:50:57,800 --> 00:51:00,160
Speaker 9: I would point shave against the Browns. I just at

1035
00:51:00,200 --> 00:51:00,600
Speaker 9: him score.

1036
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:04,720
Speaker 11: I'd be like, does this add another year of my pension?

1037
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:05,239
Speaker 11: We're good?

1038
00:51:10,440 --> 00:51:12,720
Speaker 6: Goodness all right? Fact or fiction?

1039
00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:19,560
Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers will retire rather than sign with the Pittsburgh Steelers.

1040
00:51:19,640 --> 00:51:21,680
Speaker 3: Kelsey, you lead us off here, no pressure.

1041
00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:26,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm gonna say fiction.

1042
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:26,959
Speaker 8: I don't.

1043
00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:31,080
Speaker 5: I think I think he still obviously wants to play,

1044
00:51:31,120 --> 00:51:33,799
Speaker 5: and I think he's gonna take any opportunity that he can,

1045
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:39,440
Speaker 5: and if that's in a Steelers jersey, so helpless. But

1046
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:43,080
Speaker 5: you know, I think I don't think he's gonna hang

1047
00:51:43,080 --> 00:51:44,440
Speaker 5: it up. I don't think he wants to hang it

1048
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:47,240
Speaker 5: up anytime soon. So I think he's gonna find whatever

1049
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:48,479
Speaker 5: opportunities out there.

1050
00:51:48,840 --> 00:51:51,959
Speaker 3: Times Paul, Yeah, I think he's gonna play.

1051
00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:54,360
Speaker 9: I think that ultimately they're doing this song and dance,

1052
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:57,360
Speaker 9: but Pittsburgh is probably the best place for him for

1053
00:51:57,440 --> 00:51:59,400
Speaker 9: then it gives them the best chance to be successful

1054
00:51:59,440 --> 00:52:01,880
Speaker 9: this season. So I think today ultimately are gonna go

1055
00:52:01,920 --> 00:52:02,400
Speaker 9: in Aaron.

1056
00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:04,120
Speaker 3: Rodgers, Gerrod Sherry.

1057
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:07,040
Speaker 10: I mean when fiction, when you use everyone telling you

1058
00:52:07,080 --> 00:52:09,319
Speaker 10: what you want to hear and getting what you need,

1059
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:11,759
Speaker 10: it's hard to give that up. And it's also hard

1060
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:14,840
Speaker 10: giving up the celebrity that he has as a celebrity quarterback.

1061
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:18,959
Speaker 10: He is not looking to lose that limelight anytime soon,

1062
00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:22,040
Speaker 10: ladies and gentlemen. So fiction, he will if it doesn't

1063
00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 10: have to be a Pittsburgh Steeler uniform, he will just

1064
00:52:24,280 --> 00:52:26,279
Speaker 10: keep the idea out there. So every time he turns

1065
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:28,720
Speaker 10: on Sports Center we hear his name being mentioned.

1066
00:52:28,719 --> 00:52:31,280
Speaker 3: So fiction final one.

1067
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:34,680
Speaker 1: I want all the passion that you have in this

1068
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 1: question factor fiction. Michael Jordan is the greatest of all time,

1069
00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:41,480
Speaker 1: not Lebron James.

1070
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:45,239
Speaker 3: Like Stephen A said this morning, Geron, what say you.

1071
00:52:47,680 --> 00:52:48,839
Speaker 11: I'm so torn on this?

1072
00:52:49,719 --> 00:52:53,200
Speaker 3: Come on, there's no torn. Jordan's the best.

1073
00:52:53,520 --> 00:52:55,799
Speaker 10: And then the reason why I'm torn is that what

1074
00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:59,040
Speaker 10: Lebron is doing to going on Pat McAfee's show is patty,

1075
00:52:59,560 --> 00:53:02,560
Speaker 10: what Steve even A is doing his petty. And if

1076
00:53:02,600 --> 00:53:06,680
Speaker 10: they had a one on one competition, I'm thinking Lebron's

1077
00:53:06,719 --> 00:53:08,799
Speaker 10: gonna beat him in the game. As a matter of fact,

1078
00:53:08,800 --> 00:53:12,080
Speaker 10: I'm pretty sure of it's the stress, fact of the speeds,

1079
00:53:12,080 --> 00:53:14,000
Speaker 10: fact in all those things. So I'm gonna have to

1080
00:53:14,040 --> 00:53:14,840
Speaker 10: say fiction on that.

1081
00:53:16,480 --> 00:53:17,920
Speaker 3: Timas Poull what's say you.

1082
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:22,040
Speaker 9: He overthinking that Michael Jordan is to go I'll respect

1083
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:25,960
Speaker 9: what Lebron has done, he probably has every record, but Mike,

1084
00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:28,640
Speaker 9: what Mike did and how he changed the game and

1085
00:53:28,680 --> 00:53:30,960
Speaker 9: going six and on in the finals Wizards.

1086
00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:32,920
Speaker 11: Mike Lebron's Lakers Wizards.

1087
00:53:33,840 --> 00:53:36,279
Speaker 9: I'm sorry, It's just what it is. And on top

1088
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:38,000
Speaker 9: of that, when I look down at my feet, guess

1089
00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:41,800
Speaker 9: what I see Jordan's.

1090
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:46,200
Speaker 4: I know is Lebron's got as many finals losses as

1091
00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:47,200
Speaker 4: Jordan has wins.

1092
00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:47,920
Speaker 3: That's all you need.

1093
00:53:51,640 --> 00:53:56,000
Speaker 4: He's play twenty two years to thirty, is still walling,

1094
00:53:55,760 --> 00:53:56,200
Speaker 4: playing like.

1095
00:53:56,200 --> 00:53:57,400
Speaker 8: Jordan was playing in his prime.

1096
00:53:57,440 --> 00:54:00,319
Speaker 9: It for the diamond back.

1097
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:03,960
Speaker 5: See, this is the problem. This is a debate that

1098
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:07,359
Speaker 5: happens a lot for me. So I'm gonna hear about

1099
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:09,279
Speaker 5: this one way or the other, whatever I choose. But

1100
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:15,239
Speaker 5: I think I'm going to go fact with Jordan being

1101
00:54:15,280 --> 00:54:19,560
Speaker 5: the goat because you think of the championships, you think

1102
00:54:19,560 --> 00:54:21,560
Speaker 5: of what he did in a shorter period of time.

1103
00:54:22,200 --> 00:54:24,840
Speaker 5: The way that the game was back then is so

1104
00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:27,399
Speaker 5: different than it was now. The game and now has

1105
00:54:27,400 --> 00:54:31,120
Speaker 5: evolved where it's so offensive heavy versus what it was

1106
00:54:31,160 --> 00:54:34,759
Speaker 5: when Jordan played and I think that really creates a difference.

1107
00:54:35,200 --> 00:54:38,520
Speaker 5: I think, yes, this like in this modern age of

1108
00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:42,920
Speaker 5: the NBA. Lebron owns that, no doubt about that. But

1109
00:54:43,239 --> 00:54:46,640
Speaker 5: I think when you compare the two Jordan wins.

1110
00:54:46,360 --> 00:54:52,239
Speaker 4: Out tyas Paul Gion Sheerriot's an honor and a pleasure

1111
00:54:52,680 --> 00:54:57,440
Speaker 4: to see both of you, you know what, running running

1112
00:54:57,960 --> 00:55:02,680
Speaker 4: kick him out, you know no, you know what. I

1113
00:55:02,760 --> 00:55:04,920
Speaker 4: will call you at one o'clock in the morning when

1114
00:55:05,120 --> 00:55:06,000
Speaker 4: that final goes.

1115
00:55:12,719 --> 00:55:14,839
Speaker 9: It was nice to talk to my cousin again, even

1116
00:55:14,920 --> 00:55:17,960
Speaker 9: though he's Wow. That just says Outland is stained.

1117
00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:25,960
Speaker 3: Hey man, we all have relatives. TP Geron, Thank you

1118
00:55:26,040 --> 00:55:26,520
Speaker 3: very much.

1119
00:55:26,600 --> 00:55:28,600
Speaker 4: We will talk to you guys coming up in a

1120
00:55:28,680 --> 00:55:32,560
Speaker 4: few weeks with our draft coverage coming up. Kelsey, appreciate

1121
00:55:32,719 --> 00:55:39,400
Speaker 4: all of your time here today. They bo Bishop Nathan's

1122
00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:44,040
Speaker 4: whatever zigura actually goes one on one. We've been holding

1123
00:55:44,080 --> 00:55:47,600
Speaker 4: it since the combine, uh, and you are not going

1124
00:55:47,600 --> 00:55:50,479
Speaker 4: to want to miss it. We've got some big stuff coming,

1125
00:55:50,640 --> 00:55:53,040
Speaker 4: really big stuff, right g man.

1126
00:55:53,719 --> 00:55:56,880
Speaker 6: Some people say it's the biggest We've.

1127
00:55:56,719 --> 00:55:59,640
Speaker 4: Saved the best interview from the Combine for last you

1128
00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:02,480
Speaker 4: will or that in hour two on Cleveland Browns Daily

1129
00:56:02,560 --> 00:56:04,680
Speaker 4: presented by bally Bett and official sports betting partner of

1130
00:56:04,719 --> 00:56:07,440
Speaker 4: Your Cleveland Browns on eight to fifty ESPN.

1131
00:56:07,160 --> 00:56:17,040
Speaker 2: Cleveland Cleveland Browns Daily presented by bally Bet, an official

1132
00:56:17,080 --> 00:56:19,800
Speaker 2: sports betting partner of Your Cleveland Browns on eight to

1133
00:56:19,840 --> 00:56:21,719
Speaker 2: fifty ESP and Cleveland.

1134
00:56:25,840 --> 00:56:28,480
Speaker 4: Want to thank Kelsey Russo for joining us. Want to

1135
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:31,480
Speaker 4: thank Tyvas, Paul Girod Cherry and Austin Word for their

1136
00:56:31,520 --> 00:56:34,520
Speaker 4: time as well. I mentioned it before we went to break.

1137
00:56:34,640 --> 00:56:37,279
Speaker 4: There is one combine interview we have not given you

1138
00:56:37,600 --> 00:56:40,560
Speaker 4: so far in twenty twenty five. We've been holding it

1139
00:56:41,120 --> 00:56:44,200
Speaker 4: waiting for that right time, right day, maybe a day

1140
00:56:44,239 --> 00:56:47,680
Speaker 4: that both guys are off and we have an hour

1141
00:56:48,040 --> 00:56:51,320
Speaker 4: and well, every time Nathan sits down with this fine

1142
00:56:51,400 --> 00:56:54,520
Speaker 4: human being, it's at least a good thirty to thirty

1143
00:56:54,560 --> 00:56:58,560
Speaker 4: five minute interview. It is in depth. It's on the quarterbacks.

1144
00:56:59,040 --> 00:57:02,320
Speaker 4: It's on the quarterback class, not just the first round guys,

1145
00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:06,080
Speaker 4: but guys on day two, guys on Day three, and

1146
00:57:06,120 --> 00:57:10,200
Speaker 4: what NFL people are looking for in quarterbacks. Here is

1147
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:14,719
Speaker 4: part one of three. This hour Nathan Zegura with the

1148
00:57:14,760 --> 00:57:20,000
Speaker 4: executive producer and analyst for NFL Matchup and NFL films.

1149
00:57:20,640 --> 00:57:23,800
Speaker 4: The legendary Greg co Cell, what.

1150
00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:24,760
Speaker 8: An absolute treat.

1151
00:57:24,800 --> 00:57:28,440
Speaker 12: Favorite part of the Combine the yearly interview make co

1152
00:57:28,640 --> 00:57:29,640
Speaker 12: Cell from NFL.

1153
00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:30,959
Speaker 8: You must have had a slow day.

1154
00:57:31,240 --> 00:57:34,600
Speaker 12: No, I'm still riding high up for yesterday I got

1155
00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:35,840
Speaker 12: to hang out with you and Charles Davis.

1156
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:38,960
Speaker 8: That was a great conversation. It was awesome.

1157
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:40,760
Speaker 12: It was a great conversation. I said after that, I said,

1158
00:57:40,760 --> 00:57:42,120
Speaker 12: I think I should leave. I don't think Combine is

1159
00:57:42,120 --> 00:57:44,040
Speaker 12: gonna get any better for me. That was awesome, it

1160
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:45,600
Speaker 12: was fun. Well, this is gonna be awesome too, And

1161
00:57:45,680 --> 00:57:49,439
Speaker 12: it is great to see you again when you come here.

1162
00:57:49,680 --> 00:57:51,600
Speaker 12: And I know that those are the interactions certainly that

1163
00:57:51,680 --> 00:57:52,720
Speaker 12: I love to have.

1164
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:54,760
Speaker 8: What do you like the most about being here? Just

1165
00:57:54,800 --> 00:57:55,840
Speaker 8: to see you? That's it?

1166
00:57:56,320 --> 00:57:58,520
Speaker 13: After that, I'm not gonna leave after this, and I'm

1167
00:57:58,560 --> 00:57:58,840
Speaker 13: good to.

1168
00:57:58,840 --> 00:58:02,040
Speaker 8: Go me too. Yeah, it works out. It's a musical admirations.

1169
00:58:02,160 --> 00:58:04,400
Speaker 13: Well, you know, it's funny. I mean all kidding. Aside

1170
00:58:05,120 --> 00:58:08,600
Speaker 13: the conversation you mentioned yesterday. Those are the things I

1171
00:58:08,640 --> 00:58:10,840
Speaker 13: love about the Combine. You know, you get to have

1172
00:58:10,880 --> 00:58:14,080
Speaker 13: these impromptu conversations. I get to go out for breakfast

1173
00:58:14,160 --> 00:58:17,040
Speaker 13: or lunch with scouts, you know, coaches. You know, this

1174
00:58:17,080 --> 00:58:20,320
Speaker 13: is what I really love, because you know, I just

1175
00:58:20,360 --> 00:58:23,440
Speaker 13: love talking ball and I love learning. I love hearing

1176
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:25,040
Speaker 13: things that resonate.

1177
00:58:25,400 --> 00:58:25,600
Speaker 7: You know.

1178
00:58:25,800 --> 00:58:28,280
Speaker 13: I watch a ton of tape, and obviously I've been

1179
00:58:28,280 --> 00:58:30,240
Speaker 13: doing it for years and years. But then you hear,

1180
00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:33,360
Speaker 13: you know, whether it's you know, Charles Davis or a

1181
00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:35,600
Speaker 13: scout or a coach, say something in a way that

1182
00:58:35,720 --> 00:58:38,920
Speaker 13: just resonates differently, even though you know what they're saying,

1183
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:41,120
Speaker 13: and you go, oh, yeah, but it just hits you

1184
00:58:41,200 --> 00:58:44,400
Speaker 13: in a different way and you'll learn something. And then

1185
00:58:44,440 --> 00:58:46,480
Speaker 13: when I go back and watch tape, I feel like

1186
00:58:46,600 --> 00:58:49,440
Speaker 13: my mind has expanded a little bit. And you know,

1187
00:58:49,440 --> 00:58:51,840
Speaker 13: I've always been intellectually curious, you know, I love to

1188
00:58:51,880 --> 00:58:55,520
Speaker 13: read books. So I just that, to me is the

1189
00:58:55,640 --> 00:58:58,439
Speaker 13: joy of the combine. And everybody's relaxeduse No no coach

1190
00:58:58,480 --> 00:59:00,960
Speaker 13: has a game Sunday. No one is uptight, you know,

1191
00:59:01,320 --> 00:59:03,320
Speaker 13: so you just have I mean, I had an impromptu

1192
00:59:03,400 --> 00:59:06,160
Speaker 13: conversation with a defensive coordinator. I had lunch with a

1193
00:59:06,200 --> 00:59:08,120
Speaker 13: really good friend of mine today who's a scout, and

1194
00:59:08,160 --> 00:59:10,760
Speaker 13: then we're walking back and we see a decoordinator that

1195
00:59:10,800 --> 00:59:13,680
Speaker 13: he knew and introduce me and we ended up talking

1196
00:59:13,680 --> 00:59:17,120
Speaker 13: for twenty five minutes just about conceptual football. You know

1197
00:59:17,360 --> 00:59:19,160
Speaker 13: that that's the kind of stuff you can't put a

1198
00:59:19,160 --> 00:59:19,920
Speaker 13: price tag on that.

1199
00:59:20,200 --> 00:59:22,080
Speaker 12: I agree, I think that is the best part of it.

1200
00:59:22,120 --> 00:59:23,840
Speaker 12: You call it talking about I like to listen ball

1201
00:59:24,160 --> 00:59:24,640
Speaker 12: right right?

1202
00:59:24,680 --> 00:59:24,880
Speaker 8: Listen?

1203
00:59:25,040 --> 00:59:27,440
Speaker 13: Well, I'm listening mostly too, I mean, because that's the

1204
00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:27,920
Speaker 13: way I learn.

1205
00:59:27,960 --> 00:59:28,360
Speaker 8: You listen.

1206
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:30,640
Speaker 13: But I mean, you know, having those conversations, you know,

1207
00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:31,880
Speaker 13: to me, they're the best.

1208
00:59:32,480 --> 00:59:34,280
Speaker 8: And I've learned and I am saying this, this is

1209
00:59:34,320 --> 00:59:34,840
Speaker 8: not kidding it.

1210
00:59:34,880 --> 00:59:37,600
Speaker 12: I've learned more from you and just over the years

1211
00:59:37,680 --> 00:59:42,320
Speaker 12: just trying to glean information about how to understand football.

1212
00:59:42,360 --> 00:59:44,240
Speaker 12: When you said earlier, I watch a lot of tape.

1213
00:59:44,240 --> 00:59:46,400
Speaker 12: I would like the people who are listening and watch

1214
00:59:46,440 --> 00:59:48,800
Speaker 12: this program to understand what that really means. Will you

1215
00:59:48,880 --> 00:59:51,280
Speaker 12: let them help take them through a film a week

1216
00:59:51,560 --> 00:59:53,240
Speaker 12: in the life basically.

1217
00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:56,880
Speaker 13: I mean, obviously the the NFL season, I'm basically grinding

1218
00:59:56,920 --> 01:00:00,360
Speaker 13: tape all day Monday, all day Tuesday. I've say I

1219
01:00:00,360 --> 01:00:02,480
Speaker 13: have to do work for my NFL Matchup show, which

1220
01:00:03,240 --> 01:00:05,720
Speaker 13: I created in the eighties, produced for years, and now

1221
01:00:05,760 --> 01:00:07,560
Speaker 13: have been on it as an analyst for seven or

1222
01:00:07,600 --> 01:00:11,520
Speaker 13: eight years. But then once that work is done, and

1223
01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:14,000
Speaker 13: we normally shoot that show on a Friday. But then

1224
01:00:14,320 --> 01:00:16,560
Speaker 13: when that work's done, I just go back to watching

1225
01:00:16,600 --> 01:00:18,840
Speaker 13: as much tape as I can throughout the course of

1226
01:00:18,880 --> 01:00:21,760
Speaker 13: a week. I can't get through every game, particularly when

1227
01:00:21,760 --> 01:00:25,080
Speaker 13: there's sixteen games, but I get through as much as

1228
01:00:25,080 --> 01:00:29,840
Speaker 13: I possibly can. I probably take thirty five type written

1229
01:00:29,840 --> 01:00:33,120
Speaker 13: pages of notes every week on the National.

1230
01:00:32,800 --> 01:00:35,200
Speaker 12: Football Yes, and what are you when you're doing that?

1231
01:00:35,280 --> 01:00:39,720
Speaker 12: Are you looking more for league concepts, league trends, steamatic

1232
01:00:39,720 --> 01:00:41,880
Speaker 12: football or is it or players?

1233
01:00:42,120 --> 01:00:44,840
Speaker 13: It's a combination of both. I would say I've evolved

1234
01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:47,880
Speaker 13: when it comes to the NFL, mostly in terms of

1235
01:00:48,000 --> 01:00:51,200
Speaker 13: tactics and schematics. Like if I get a call from

1236
01:00:51,200 --> 01:00:53,080
Speaker 13: a writer saying, hey, I'm doing my all pro team,

1237
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:55,320
Speaker 13: who are the best left guards in the league, I'm

1238
01:00:55,360 --> 01:00:57,240
Speaker 13: probably not going to be able to answer that in

1239
01:00:57,280 --> 01:00:59,600
Speaker 13: a great way. I'm not studying it like that.

1240
01:01:00,160 --> 01:01:00,320
Speaker 8: You know.

1241
01:01:00,640 --> 01:01:03,240
Speaker 13: Obviously, if I'm looking at a team and they have

1242
01:01:03,280 --> 01:01:06,120
Speaker 13: a high draft choice at a certain position, yeah, maybe

1243
01:01:06,120 --> 01:01:10,000
Speaker 13: I'm taking a little more of a more detailed look

1244
01:01:10,040 --> 01:01:12,000
Speaker 13: at that guy just because of who he is. Sure,

1245
01:01:12,040 --> 01:01:16,120
Speaker 13: But I mean, you know, I can't study in detail.

1246
01:01:16,320 --> 01:01:19,600
Speaker 13: You know, five offensive linemen, you know, of course, But

1247
01:01:20,120 --> 01:01:21,720
Speaker 13: so I do that every single week.

1248
01:01:21,800 --> 01:01:22,920
Speaker 8: I work on weekends.

1249
01:01:23,360 --> 01:01:26,440
Speaker 13: I probably work seventy seventy five hours a week, and

1250
01:01:26,480 --> 01:01:30,360
Speaker 13: then mid January, once there's fewer NFL games, that's when

1251
01:01:30,360 --> 01:01:33,560
Speaker 13: I really start hitting the college players. That has a

1252
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:37,200
Speaker 13: different intellectual feel to it, because even though you have

1253
01:01:37,280 --> 01:01:40,880
Speaker 13: to have some sense of schematics, then I'm a little

1254
01:01:40,920 --> 01:01:45,760
Speaker 13: more focused on individuals and what their traits, attributes, characteristics are.

1255
01:01:45,920 --> 01:01:48,520
Speaker 13: But you still have to think about it in terms

1256
01:01:48,600 --> 01:01:51,400
Speaker 13: of their projection and transition to the league. You're not

1257
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:54,800
Speaker 13: evaluating college players in a vacuum, you know. You have

1258
01:01:54,840 --> 01:01:56,920
Speaker 13: to think about okay, and since I don't work for

1259
01:01:56,960 --> 01:01:59,200
Speaker 13: a team, I don't have a mandate from let's say

1260
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:01,880
Speaker 13: a scouting direct. They're saying, hey, here's the kind of

1261
01:02:01,880 --> 01:02:04,520
Speaker 13: player we want. So I have to think in terms

1262
01:02:04,520 --> 01:02:08,920
Speaker 13: of Okay, I'm watching a defensive tackle. What kind of

1263
01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:11,200
Speaker 13: player is he? Is he a power player? Is he

1264
01:02:11,240 --> 01:02:14,840
Speaker 13: a quickness player? You know, what teams you know rely

1265
01:02:15,040 --> 01:02:17,320
Speaker 13: more on they want their players, you know, with what

1266
01:02:17,360 --> 01:02:19,680
Speaker 13: they do with their fronts to be power players. What

1267
01:02:19,800 --> 01:02:21,960
Speaker 13: teams you know look maybe more for quick to you know,

1268
01:02:22,120 --> 01:02:24,280
Speaker 13: I try to think like that. Ye, you know, so

1269
01:02:25,160 --> 01:02:28,720
Speaker 13: that changes sort of my intellectual approach and academic approach.

1270
01:02:29,040 --> 01:02:30,120
Speaker 13: And I really like that.

1271
01:02:30,680 --> 01:02:32,959
Speaker 12: How much in the NFL portion of it, you're talking

1272
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:34,520
Speaker 12: schematics and I could be like, oh, look at how

1273
01:02:34,520 --> 01:02:37,240
Speaker 12: this team plays It's quarters, coverages right, neat and things

1274
01:02:37,280 --> 01:02:39,480
Speaker 12: like that. How much are you also kind of saying

1275
01:02:40,080 --> 01:02:42,520
Speaker 12: to kind of keep your learning going? You said you're

1276
01:02:42,560 --> 01:02:46,520
Speaker 12: actually intellectually curious. But you know this last year coming

1277
01:02:46,520 --> 01:02:48,560
Speaker 12: out of college, I thought this guy was this. Now

1278
01:02:48,600 --> 01:02:50,440
Speaker 12: I'm actually seeing it here. So I could go back

1279
01:02:50,440 --> 01:02:51,800
Speaker 12: to my notes and be like, this is where I

1280
01:02:51,840 --> 01:02:53,600
Speaker 12: got this writer. Maybe I'm really good at kind of

1281
01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:57,800
Speaker 12: identifying well this and here's where I find that. I

1282
01:02:57,840 --> 01:03:01,080
Speaker 12: get guys wrong for two reasons. One, I'm just wrong,

1283
01:03:01,160 --> 01:03:02,320
Speaker 12: you know. I maybe I missed.

1284
01:03:02,360 --> 01:03:05,280
Speaker 13: I didn't evaluate him, you know, and I just made

1285
01:03:05,280 --> 01:03:08,440
Speaker 13: a misevaluation. Sure, other times it can be wrong because

1286
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:11,440
Speaker 13: I see a guy in my mind to be deployed

1287
01:03:11,440 --> 01:03:14,640
Speaker 13: in the NFL a certain way, and then for whatever reason,

1288
01:03:14,680 --> 01:03:17,200
Speaker 13: whatever team he goes to, they don't deploy him in

1289
01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:20,080
Speaker 13: that way. And I think to myself and again, no

1290
01:03:20,160 --> 01:03:22,560
Speaker 13: knock on, coach, I mean, you know, it's still human

1291
01:03:22,600 --> 01:03:25,560
Speaker 13: beings evaluating human beings, you know, And in my mind,

1292
01:03:25,600 --> 01:03:29,160
Speaker 13: I think, God, I really thought that this guy could

1293
01:03:29,240 --> 01:03:31,800
Speaker 13: do this better and would fit better being used in

1294
01:03:31,880 --> 01:03:35,200
Speaker 13: that role, and that's not the way he's being deployed. Right,

1295
01:03:35,240 --> 01:03:37,959
Speaker 13: So again, doesn't make me smarter than coaches. I never,

1296
01:03:38,680 --> 01:03:42,080
Speaker 13: I never ever rip coaches. I never ever am critical

1297
01:03:42,080 --> 01:03:44,240
Speaker 13: of coaches. Like I get asked a lot, what do

1298
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:45,560
Speaker 13: you think of the game plan? What do you think

1299
01:03:45,600 --> 01:03:48,640
Speaker 13: of the play calling? I don't answer those questions because

1300
01:03:48,640 --> 01:03:51,160
Speaker 13: I always say, you know what, you'd have to be

1301
01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:55,120
Speaker 13: there from Monday morning until Saturday night and know what

1302
01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:58,120
Speaker 13: the whole process is to even be able to make

1303
01:03:58,160 --> 01:04:01,640
Speaker 13: a comment about it, much less really say something meaningful

1304
01:04:01,680 --> 01:04:02,040
Speaker 13: about it.

1305
01:04:03,080 --> 01:04:05,240
Speaker 12: Well, people believe they can make comments about anything. Well,

1306
01:04:05,240 --> 01:04:07,680
Speaker 12: we know relative, we know that.

1307
01:04:07,760 --> 01:04:09,880
Speaker 13: I mean, you're in a situation where you probably get

1308
01:04:09,920 --> 01:04:12,000
Speaker 13: a chance to talk to the coaches because you're doing

1309
01:04:12,080 --> 01:04:15,320
Speaker 13: the games, so and again you're not getting every morsel

1310
01:04:15,400 --> 01:04:18,320
Speaker 13: of information, but you're being given enough so that you

1311
01:04:18,360 --> 01:04:21,080
Speaker 13: can speak intelligently when you're doing the games, understand what

1312
01:04:21,120 --> 01:04:24,840
Speaker 13: we're trying to attack and accomplishment. Correct, correct, Right, you know,

1313
01:04:25,160 --> 01:04:27,520
Speaker 13: but you know, it's like when people ask me about

1314
01:04:27,520 --> 01:04:29,960
Speaker 13: a guy's character or leadership, I say, I can't answer that.

1315
01:04:30,000 --> 01:04:31,600
Speaker 13: You have to be there every day to know that.

1316
01:04:31,880 --> 01:04:34,640
Speaker 13: I can't answer that. You know, you know you got

1317
01:04:34,640 --> 01:04:35,439
Speaker 13: to be there every day.

1318
01:04:35,520 --> 01:04:36,040
Speaker 8: Yeah, I can't.

1319
01:04:36,200 --> 01:04:38,240
Speaker 13: I can't answer that from seeing a guy give an interview,

1320
01:04:38,440 --> 01:04:40,800
Speaker 13: you know, a postgame interview or a week or a

1321
01:04:40,840 --> 01:04:44,480
Speaker 13: Wednesday interview. I don't know that for sure. No, yeah,

1322
01:04:44,520 --> 01:04:46,880
Speaker 13: that's one of those things, right, it's and those are

1323
01:04:46,960 --> 01:04:49,840
Speaker 13: traits that that's why they have these area scouts.

1324
01:04:49,560 --> 01:04:51,360
Speaker 12: And that's why you hopefully have familiarity and you can

1325
01:04:51,400 --> 01:04:53,680
Speaker 12: kind of flush some of those things out. Let's talk

1326
01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:56,080
Speaker 12: quarterbacks for a second. I love hearing the way that

1327
01:04:56,160 --> 01:04:58,960
Speaker 12: you approach this position. One thing I wanted to ask

1328
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:01,120
Speaker 12: you is, I'll never forget talking to you about Patrick

1329
01:05:01,120 --> 01:05:04,280
Speaker 12: Mahomes of the twenty seventeen draft, and you were when

1330
01:05:04,320 --> 01:05:04,840
Speaker 12: I say.

1331
01:05:04,640 --> 01:05:07,400
Speaker 13: It seems like that was about, you know, eons ago.

1332
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:08,440
Speaker 8: It seems like it was decades.

1333
01:05:08,520 --> 01:05:11,240
Speaker 12: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, But I remember you saying that

1334
01:05:11,440 --> 01:05:14,520
Speaker 12: you found him. You don't say, oh, I think this

1335
01:05:14,560 --> 01:05:15,320
Speaker 12: guy's gonna be greater.

1336
01:05:15,400 --> 01:05:15,720
Speaker 8: He's not.

1337
01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:18,560
Speaker 12: You watch the tape and you'd say, here are basically

1338
01:05:18,600 --> 01:05:20,920
Speaker 12: my findings. And I remember you saying at the time

1339
01:05:20,960 --> 01:05:24,120
Speaker 12: that Patrick Mahomes was for you kind of the hardest

1340
01:05:24,880 --> 01:05:28,600
Speaker 12: projection because you just we han't seen anybody play the

1341
01:05:28,640 --> 01:05:32,400
Speaker 12: game the way that he played like that. Correct when

1342
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:35,160
Speaker 12: you think about that frame of mind, now, how you've

1343
01:05:35,200 --> 01:05:37,560
Speaker 12: seen him actually play the game now? And I would say,

1344
01:05:37,600 --> 01:05:39,960
Speaker 12: a variety of quarterbacks play similar style of game.

1345
01:05:40,280 --> 01:05:41,080
Speaker 8: How is your.

1346
01:05:41,000 --> 01:05:46,040
Speaker 12: Evaluation of that position changed? And I'm leading to in

1347
01:05:46,080 --> 01:05:48,480
Speaker 12: twenty seventeen, I feel like you probably would have thought

1348
01:05:48,520 --> 01:05:51,400
Speaker 12: cam Ward was maybe a tougher evaluation for you than

1349
01:05:51,600 --> 01:05:52,480
Speaker 12: than he is today.

1350
01:05:52,520 --> 01:05:55,120
Speaker 13: Yeah, And I think that's a great question, Nathan, because

1351
01:05:55,120 --> 01:05:57,600
Speaker 13: you have to evolve with the game, and I like

1352
01:05:57,680 --> 01:05:59,560
Speaker 13: to think I do that. I mean, I could be

1353
01:05:59,600 --> 01:06:02,400
Speaker 13: totally honest at fifteen or twenty years ago, you know,

1354
01:06:02,640 --> 01:06:05,480
Speaker 13: I was probably still caught up in six four to twenty

1355
01:06:05,520 --> 01:06:07,800
Speaker 13: five pocket quarterback and that's what you had to be.

1356
01:06:08,360 --> 01:06:10,640
Speaker 13: And then you see how the game changes, and it

1357
01:06:10,760 --> 01:06:15,120
Speaker 13: changes and evolves for many reasons, because don't forget, defenses

1358
01:06:15,240 --> 01:06:18,440
Speaker 13: change in the quarterback position, and offenses have to evolve

1359
01:06:18,480 --> 01:06:22,680
Speaker 13: as well. Sometimes offense fuel changes in defense. Sometimes defense

1360
01:06:22,720 --> 01:06:26,200
Speaker 13: fuel changes and offense. None of this is one hundred percent.

1361
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:28,400
Speaker 13: A lot of fans think this stuff's one hundred percent.

1362
01:06:28,640 --> 01:06:32,480
Speaker 13: You know, Oh you made one thing you don't like

1363
01:06:32,480 --> 01:06:33,880
Speaker 13: about a guy, Oh you hate him.

1364
01:06:34,040 --> 01:06:34,280
Speaker 8: You know.

1365
01:06:36,120 --> 01:06:39,040
Speaker 13: That's never the way it is. Yes, So what we've

1366
01:06:39,080 --> 01:06:43,680
Speaker 13: seen over time in the NFL is defenses have become

1367
01:06:44,000 --> 01:06:48,320
Speaker 13: so much more skillful at pressuring the quarterback. More and

1368
01:06:48,400 --> 01:06:52,640
Speaker 13: more teams use second and third level players, particularly third

1369
01:06:52,760 --> 01:06:55,880
Speaker 13: level players, of which De Spagnolo is a master. Todd

1370
01:06:55,920 --> 01:06:59,400
Speaker 13: Ball is a master as blitzer, So you end up

1371
01:06:59,400 --> 01:07:02,400
Speaker 13: with more at rushing the quarterback. You end up with

1372
01:07:02,480 --> 01:07:06,280
Speaker 13: players coming from distance that offensive linemen don't necessarily see

1373
01:07:06,280 --> 01:07:09,160
Speaker 13: in their vision. So you know, the game has become

1374
01:07:09,280 --> 01:07:13,560
Speaker 13: faster on defense. So now there are more plays where

1375
01:07:13,640 --> 01:07:16,880
Speaker 13: the quarterback is under more duress. A lot of people

1376
01:07:16,880 --> 01:07:19,840
Speaker 13: would still argue that the biggest mismatch in the NFL

1377
01:07:19,960 --> 01:07:23,200
Speaker 13: is still pass rushers versus all lignement. As good as

1378
01:07:23,240 --> 01:07:26,160
Speaker 13: all linemen have gotten in terms of better athleticism than

1379
01:07:26,200 --> 01:07:29,400
Speaker 13: fifteen or twenty or twenty five years ago, we see that,

1380
01:07:29,480 --> 01:07:32,400
Speaker 13: you know, when you're facing a Miles Garrett or just

1381
01:07:32,480 --> 01:07:35,560
Speaker 13: the great athletes as pass rushers. Those guys are just

1382
01:07:35,600 --> 01:07:37,480
Speaker 13: better athletes than the offensive linemen.

1383
01:07:37,640 --> 01:07:39,440
Speaker 8: Yep, it's just the way it is. Yep. You know.

1384
01:07:39,800 --> 01:07:44,760
Speaker 13: So now quarterbacks, yes, do we still believe that quarterbacks

1385
01:07:44,800 --> 01:07:48,000
Speaker 13: have to have some level of efficiency throwing from the pocket.

1386
01:07:48,040 --> 01:07:50,720
Speaker 13: Of course they do, because that's how the game is taught.

1387
01:07:51,160 --> 01:07:54,000
Speaker 13: You know, they've got to be able to drop back

1388
01:07:54,320 --> 01:07:58,080
Speaker 13: execute the way the offense is taught. But now the

1389
01:07:58,120 --> 01:08:01,160
Speaker 13: game is such that there are many more plays than

1390
01:08:01,160 --> 01:08:04,720
Speaker 13: ever before where the defense wins the early part of

1391
01:08:04,720 --> 01:08:08,240
Speaker 13: the down and the quarterback has to have some kind

1392
01:08:08,280 --> 01:08:12,840
Speaker 13: of reactive mechanism, whether it's pocket movement where he doesn't

1393
01:08:12,840 --> 01:08:16,479
Speaker 13: necessarily leave the pocket but he's able to avoid reset

1394
01:08:16,600 --> 01:08:19,400
Speaker 13: and still deliver the ball, whether it's the ability to

1395
01:08:19,439 --> 01:08:22,679
Speaker 13: get outside the pocket and make a play. So now

1396
01:08:22,920 --> 01:08:25,720
Speaker 13: the trait that when you mentioned twenty seventeen in Mahomes

1397
01:08:25,840 --> 01:08:28,559
Speaker 13: and now we look at a cam Ward you think, okay,

1398
01:08:28,960 --> 01:08:32,080
Speaker 13: that has become a little more of an essential trait.

1399
01:08:32,400 --> 01:08:35,600
Speaker 13: If you can't do that, you have to be so

1400
01:08:35,600 --> 01:08:40,240
Speaker 13: so good pre snap and post snap that you have

1401
01:08:40,320 --> 01:08:44,719
Speaker 13: to be just really really good. And it's that's hard.

1402
01:08:45,280 --> 01:08:49,760
Speaker 13: That's really particularly since younger quarterbacks don't grow up being

1403
01:08:49,880 --> 01:08:53,840
Speaker 13: taught the position that way anymore. Everything is pure progression.

1404
01:08:54,040 --> 01:08:58,320
Speaker 13: They're not really taught defense. All they're taught is here's

1405
01:08:58,320 --> 01:09:01,000
Speaker 13: your primary, here's your secondary, here's your third. If you

1406
01:09:01,120 --> 01:09:03,320
Speaker 13: drop back and your primary is not open, hey, it

1407
01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:05,120
Speaker 13: doesn't matter why he's not open, Just look to the

1408
01:09:05,160 --> 01:09:08,120
Speaker 13: next guy. So they really don't know about defense, right.

1409
01:09:08,479 --> 01:09:10,639
Speaker 13: All they know at the basics, like is it single

1410
01:09:10,720 --> 01:09:11,679
Speaker 13: high or two shell?

1411
01:09:12,520 --> 01:09:14,200
Speaker 8: You know? Might I get a blitz?

1412
01:09:14,240 --> 01:09:14,360
Speaker 10: Oh?

1413
01:09:14,360 --> 01:09:14,720
Speaker 8: I don't know.

1414
01:09:14,760 --> 01:09:16,960
Speaker 13: The center is gonna figure that out, you know. I

1415
01:09:16,960 --> 01:09:18,960
Speaker 13: mean that's the way these guys are taught right now,

1416
01:09:19,000 --> 01:09:22,599
Speaker 13: to be totally honest. So you know, it's it's it's

1417
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:27,200
Speaker 13: becoming harder and harder to just be a pure pocket

1418
01:09:27,320 --> 01:09:31,320
Speaker 13: player with no other real meaningful ability. You have to

1419
01:09:31,360 --> 01:09:34,439
Speaker 13: be so so good at a really high.

1420
01:09:34,360 --> 01:09:36,800
Speaker 8: Level, and you have to be so cerebral so do that.

1421
01:09:36,840 --> 01:09:38,800
Speaker 13: You have to be able to win a lot of

1422
01:09:38,840 --> 01:09:41,120
Speaker 13: plays before the balls even snapped exactly.

1423
01:09:42,040 --> 01:09:45,919
Speaker 4: That's Part one with Greg Cosell and our own Nathan Zigura.

1424
01:09:46,080 --> 01:09:47,960
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01:09:58,120 --> 01:10:01,759
Speaker 4: Part two of our interview with Greg Cosell and Nathan

1429
01:10:01,840 --> 01:10:05,000
Speaker 4: Zger comes your way in just a couple minutes, Talking

1430
01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:08,120
Speaker 4: cam Ward when we return. Cleveland Browns Daily is presented

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1440
01:10:46,000 --> 01:10:49,679
Speaker 4: Gibbs with you on this Thursday. Boe and Nathan Off

1441
01:10:50,560 --> 01:10:53,479
Speaker 4: enjoying some well deserved time away with their families for

1442
01:10:53,520 --> 01:10:57,800
Speaker 4: spring Break Right Now, Part two of Nathan's interview with

1443
01:10:57,880 --> 01:11:02,320
Speaker 4: the legendary Greg Cosell, Talking cam Ward at the Combine

1444
01:11:02,320 --> 01:11:03,680
Speaker 4: just a few weeks ago and.

1445
01:11:03,640 --> 01:11:07,479
Speaker 12: Anything about the greats Peyton and Brady and Drew Brees.

1446
01:11:07,560 --> 01:11:08,479
Speaker 8: That's what they did.

1447
01:11:08,520 --> 01:11:11,360
Speaker 12: And then I think those guys as young players in

1448
01:11:11,360 --> 01:11:13,840
Speaker 12: today's game, not Peyton obviously because of his pedigree, but

1449
01:11:14,360 --> 01:11:16,479
Speaker 12: it would be different, and you wonder what that would

1450
01:11:16,520 --> 01:11:16,880
Speaker 12: look like.

1451
01:11:16,920 --> 01:11:19,160
Speaker 13: And so I think, I mean, I've heard Brady talk.

1452
01:11:19,439 --> 01:11:21,800
Speaker 13: You know, they beat the Chiefs obviously in the Super

1453
01:11:21,800 --> 01:11:25,000
Speaker 13: Bowl with the Bucks, which was not that long ago. Yeah, okay,

1454
01:11:25,439 --> 01:11:27,280
Speaker 13: I think it was thirty one to nine. They killed him,

1455
01:11:27,360 --> 01:11:30,080
Speaker 13: killed him and and Brady and I don't you know,

1456
01:11:30,160 --> 01:11:33,000
Speaker 13: he wasn't bragging. He was just saying, and we all

1457
01:11:33,040 --> 01:11:36,280
Speaker 13: know how difficult to Steve spagnolo defense is to play against.

1458
01:11:36,520 --> 01:11:40,240
Speaker 13: And he said, going into that game, I knew more

1459
01:11:40,280 --> 01:11:43,880
Speaker 13: about Spagnola's defense than he did. He said, I won

1460
01:11:44,280 --> 01:11:47,640
Speaker 13: the plays before the ball was snapped. Now you know

1461
01:11:47,640 --> 01:11:50,479
Speaker 13: how hard that is to do. Now, Brady's Brady arguably

1462
01:11:50,479 --> 01:11:53,840
Speaker 13: the greatest of all time. But still we're talking about

1463
01:11:53,840 --> 01:11:57,519
Speaker 13: the concept of playing that way, So you know that's

1464
01:11:57,640 --> 01:11:59,960
Speaker 13: hard to do. Yeah, And if you're gonna be just

1465
01:12:00,240 --> 01:12:04,000
Speaker 13: purely a pocket quarterback, which Brady was, then you're really

1466
01:12:04,080 --> 01:12:06,280
Speaker 13: have to gonna be good at that. That's where you

1467
01:12:06,360 --> 01:12:08,439
Speaker 13: have to get to. You don't expect a guy coming

1468
01:12:08,439 --> 01:12:11,320
Speaker 13: in as a rookie to be that, but that's kind

1469
01:12:11,320 --> 01:12:12,559
Speaker 13: of where you have to get to.

1470
01:12:13,040 --> 01:12:13,840
Speaker 8: Like I think CJ.

1471
01:12:14,000 --> 01:12:16,880
Speaker 13: Stroud, who does have a little bit mobility, but he's

1472
01:12:16,960 --> 01:12:19,759
Speaker 13: essentially a pocket quarterback. I think he kind of learned

1473
01:12:19,760 --> 01:12:21,639
Speaker 13: this year. This was a little bit of a learning year.

1474
01:12:21,800 --> 01:12:24,080
Speaker 13: The old line wasn't quite as good. He started to

1475
01:12:24,080 --> 01:12:26,960
Speaker 13: play a little faster at times, he missed some throws

1476
01:12:27,000 --> 01:12:30,800
Speaker 13: that he makes, you know, and I think he probably

1477
01:12:30,880 --> 01:12:33,599
Speaker 13: learned this year that, you know what, now my next

1478
01:12:33,600 --> 01:12:35,639
Speaker 13: step in my dev and you hope the coaches work

1479
01:12:35,640 --> 01:12:38,160
Speaker 13: with him on this is I'm gonna have to get

1480
01:12:38,520 --> 01:12:41,040
Speaker 13: the best I can be pre snab and I'm gonna

1481
01:12:41,080 --> 01:12:43,479
Speaker 13: have to be better in squeezed pockets because when you're

1482
01:12:43,479 --> 01:12:45,759
Speaker 13: a pocket quarterback in the NFL, there's gonna be bodies

1483
01:12:45,800 --> 01:12:48,200
Speaker 13: around you and you still have to execute. It's not

1484
01:12:48,280 --> 01:12:50,639
Speaker 13: an excuse that, oh, my old line isn't as good

1485
01:12:50,680 --> 01:12:52,280
Speaker 13: as it was. You still gotta play.

1486
01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:56,160
Speaker 12: Yeah, you still gotta plight and play well right right, Yeah,

1487
01:12:56,200 --> 01:12:56,840
Speaker 12: that's the job.

1488
01:12:57,040 --> 01:12:57,719
Speaker 8: That's the job.

1489
01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:00,840
Speaker 13: Yeah, No one cares that your line may not have

1490
01:13:00,840 --> 01:13:01,760
Speaker 13: been as good as it was.

1491
01:13:02,479 --> 01:13:06,120
Speaker 12: And nobody talks because the Eagles won in the manner

1492
01:13:06,160 --> 01:13:08,000
Speaker 12: in which they did, and I think people do lose

1493
01:13:08,040 --> 01:13:10,040
Speaker 12: sight of the fact that, yes, they have a tremendous

1494
01:13:10,040 --> 01:13:12,640
Speaker 12: offensive line and they've done an incredible job replenishing that.

1495
01:13:13,680 --> 01:13:17,640
Speaker 12: Jalen Hurts, I think, is a uniquely great quarterback. And

1496
01:13:17,680 --> 01:13:22,840
Speaker 12: he's surrounded by Devonte Smith, A J. Brown, Saquon Barkley.

1497
01:13:22,560 --> 01:13:26,519
Speaker 13: Dallas Goddard and the best you know, clearly the best

1498
01:13:26,600 --> 01:13:29,559
Speaker 13: run blocking all line, and a really good pass protecting

1499
01:13:29,600 --> 01:13:30,080
Speaker 13: all line.

1500
01:13:30,280 --> 01:13:33,080
Speaker 12: Right, but they still have elite skill correct, and he

1501
01:13:33,200 --> 01:13:36,960
Speaker 12: is uniquely and by the way they won in away,

1502
01:13:36,960 --> 01:13:39,519
Speaker 12: and this is a great conversation too, they won in

1503
01:13:39,560 --> 01:13:41,600
Speaker 12: a way that we've certainly been led to believe in

1504
01:13:41,600 --> 01:13:44,519
Speaker 12: recent years you can't win in the NFL, because there

1505
01:13:44,520 --> 01:13:46,360
Speaker 12: were plenty of games this year where Jalen threw for

1506
01:13:46,400 --> 01:13:48,200
Speaker 12: one hundred and thirty yards and they won.

1507
01:13:48,439 --> 01:13:52,760
Speaker 13: Now, his magic sauce is he's phenomenal as a scrambler,

1508
01:13:52,920 --> 01:13:55,280
Speaker 13: and there were many many plays this year that were

1509
01:13:55,320 --> 01:13:57,400
Speaker 13: third and seven and he runs for a first down

1510
01:13:57,560 --> 01:14:00,519
Speaker 13: and that's a very meaningful part of his game and

1511
01:14:00,560 --> 01:14:04,000
Speaker 13: he's terrific at it. But there were plenty of games

1512
01:14:04,000 --> 01:14:05,760
Speaker 13: where he threw twenty two balls and threw fo one

1513
01:14:05,800 --> 01:14:09,400
Speaker 13: hundred and thirty yards. And you know, it's not a

1514
01:14:09,479 --> 01:14:12,599
Speaker 13: large enough sample size to say the NFL game is changing.

1515
01:14:12,960 --> 01:14:16,559
Speaker 13: But this year there there were six backs that had

1516
01:14:16,600 --> 01:14:19,000
Speaker 13: over three hundred carries, and twenty twenty three there were

1517
01:14:19,080 --> 01:14:22,120
Speaker 13: no backs that had over three hundred carries. So again

1518
01:14:22,280 --> 01:14:23,639
Speaker 13: we're not going to sit here and say the whole

1519
01:14:23,720 --> 01:14:26,559
Speaker 13: NFL game is changing, but it's just an interesting kind

1520
01:14:26,600 --> 01:14:30,920
Speaker 13: of fact that more teams ran the ball with greater volume.

1521
01:14:31,160 --> 01:14:33,160
Speaker 12: Well, and it was also a response to the fact that,

1522
01:14:33,320 --> 01:14:36,360
Speaker 12: according to a great many people that too high shells

1523
01:14:36,400 --> 01:14:38,559
Speaker 12: were invented in the year twenty twenty four. We'd never

1524
01:14:38,600 --> 01:14:39,280
Speaker 12: seen that, right.

1525
01:14:39,200 --> 01:14:41,479
Speaker 13: And of course they weren't invented, but more and more

1526
01:14:41,560 --> 01:14:43,240
Speaker 13: teams were playing with that umbrella.

1527
01:14:43,280 --> 01:14:45,280
Speaker 12: Look, yes, yes, right, we're not going to give up

1528
01:14:45,280 --> 01:14:47,559
Speaker 12: the chunks and right, teams that could run, block and

1529
01:14:47,600 --> 01:14:49,800
Speaker 12: have explosed ringments could get chunks on the ground in

1530
01:14:49,800 --> 01:14:50,440
Speaker 12: the eagle.

1531
01:14:50,200 --> 01:14:52,280
Speaker 13: Which is a great example of the evolution of football.

1532
01:14:52,280 --> 01:14:54,240
Speaker 13: I mean, with the allegian of Boom, everybody wanted to

1533
01:14:54,240 --> 01:14:56,840
Speaker 13: play cover three, yep, and then what happened was is

1534
01:14:56,920 --> 01:14:59,720
Speaker 13: offense has clearly figured out how you can beat cover

1535
01:14:59,800 --> 01:15:02,599
Speaker 13: three because there's major voids in it. And then all

1536
01:15:02,600 --> 01:15:04,599
Speaker 13: of a sudden, teams felt like, well, we can't really

1537
01:15:04,600 --> 01:15:07,599
Speaker 13: play Cover three is our foundation because you know, teams

1538
01:15:07,640 --> 01:15:10,879
Speaker 13: are beating it. So now to take away the seams,

1539
01:15:11,120 --> 01:15:13,519
Speaker 13: teams said, you know what, we're not gonna play cover three. Yeah,

1540
01:15:13,840 --> 01:15:16,400
Speaker 13: we're gonna play with a too high safety structure because

1541
01:15:16,439 --> 01:15:17,519
Speaker 13: the seams aren't there.

1542
01:15:18,000 --> 01:15:20,160
Speaker 12: Right, and we're not gonna give up those chunks down

1543
01:15:20,160 --> 01:15:22,880
Speaker 12: the exactly make you matriculate the ball.

1544
01:15:22,960 --> 01:15:25,040
Speaker 13: And that's why none of this is. It's not a

1545
01:15:25,080 --> 01:15:27,880
Speaker 13: mathematical equation, and people view it as such. This is

1546
01:15:27,920 --> 01:15:31,160
Speaker 13: not black and white. It's not like there's one way

1547
01:15:31,439 --> 01:15:34,559
Speaker 13: you know this is. You know this because of what

1548
01:15:34,600 --> 01:15:37,160
Speaker 13: you do. You're around coaches, you hear the way they talk.

1549
01:15:37,520 --> 01:15:40,920
Speaker 13: None of this is we have the answers to everything,

1550
01:15:41,560 --> 01:15:44,559
Speaker 13: you know. I was talking to a DC today, great

1551
01:15:44,600 --> 01:15:47,519
Speaker 13: conversation for thirty minutes, and he was talking about all

1552
01:15:47,560 --> 01:15:50,439
Speaker 13: his own concepts and he said, hey, in all our

1553
01:15:50,520 --> 01:15:53,559
Speaker 13: own concepts, we know where the stress points are. We

1554
01:15:53,640 --> 01:15:56,280
Speaker 13: have to let the players know where the stress points are.

1555
01:15:56,680 --> 01:15:59,240
Speaker 13: You know, because in zone there's always going to be

1556
01:15:59,320 --> 01:16:02,479
Speaker 13: stress points. And he says, sometimes the offense finds the

1557
01:16:02,520 --> 01:16:04,840
Speaker 13: stress points and they get a successful play, and you

1558
01:16:04,880 --> 01:16:06,240
Speaker 13: know what, you move on to the next play.

1559
01:16:06,600 --> 01:16:09,400
Speaker 8: It happens, you know. But he's good, right, right.

1560
01:16:09,600 --> 01:16:11,600
Speaker 12: Their whole goal is to find those stress points, and

1561
01:16:11,600 --> 01:16:13,559
Speaker 12: it's right, and your whole goal is to try to

1562
01:16:13,560 --> 01:16:15,320
Speaker 12: minimize them and stop.

1563
01:16:15,080 --> 01:16:15,599
Speaker 8: That, right.

1564
01:16:15,640 --> 01:16:18,679
Speaker 13: I mean thing of it this way, when you play zone,

1565
01:16:19,120 --> 01:16:21,600
Speaker 13: what you're trying to do in your zone concepts is

1566
01:16:21,680 --> 01:16:25,559
Speaker 13: compress space for an offense. And Ben Johnson is a

1567
01:16:25,560 --> 01:16:27,920
Speaker 13: master at this. I mean he's not the only one,

1568
01:16:27,960 --> 01:16:30,519
Speaker 13: but he just came to mind. What they're trying to

1569
01:16:30,560 --> 01:16:34,040
Speaker 13: do is increase the space, you know. And so now

1570
01:16:34,040 --> 01:16:36,280
Speaker 13: you have this t trying to press it and the

1571
01:16:36,320 --> 01:16:39,680
Speaker 13: offense trying to expand it. And you know, sometimes the

1572
01:16:39,720 --> 01:16:41,639
Speaker 13: offense wins, sometimes the defense wins.

1573
01:16:41,880 --> 01:16:43,880
Speaker 12: That's why it's the great chess match. That's why it

1574
01:16:44,000 --> 01:16:46,000
Speaker 12: is the most fun that you can have.

1575
01:16:46,120 --> 01:16:48,240
Speaker 8: Right. I know you like cam Ward alone, I do.

1576
01:16:48,400 --> 01:16:48,640
Speaker 8: I do.

1577
01:16:48,800 --> 01:16:51,320
Speaker 12: So let's talk about him for a second here before

1578
01:16:51,360 --> 01:16:52,120
Speaker 12: because this is.

1579
01:16:52,000 --> 01:16:54,040
Speaker 13: We could you and I can go on tangent. I

1580
01:16:54,080 --> 01:16:55,960
Speaker 13: love these you know, it's fun. The main point is

1581
01:16:55,960 --> 01:16:58,400
Speaker 13: I hope people understand that none of this is a method.

1582
01:16:58,439 --> 01:17:00,160
Speaker 13: It's not like saying two and two is four. It's

1583
01:17:00,160 --> 01:17:02,320
Speaker 13: not you know, it's not a mathematical equation.

1584
01:17:02,680 --> 01:17:05,240
Speaker 12: And whatever two and two today is in four years

1585
01:17:05,240 --> 01:17:07,920
Speaker 12: could be a completely different answer. You might not even

1586
01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:08,920
Speaker 12: be able to do addition anymore.

1587
01:17:08,960 --> 01:17:09,040
Speaker 9: Now.

1588
01:17:09,040 --> 01:17:11,800
Speaker 8: You got to be a way. Yeah, that's another question. Yeah,

1589
01:17:11,840 --> 01:17:12,479
Speaker 8: all changes.

1590
01:17:12,600 --> 01:17:14,800
Speaker 12: Let's talk about Cam and the things that you like

1591
01:17:14,840 --> 01:17:17,160
Speaker 12: when you put the tape on with him. Obviously the

1592
01:17:17,240 --> 01:17:20,759
Speaker 12: arm talent jumps off at you. Part of the evolution

1593
01:17:20,840 --> 01:17:22,120
Speaker 12: I think that you would say is I know that

1594
01:17:22,160 --> 01:17:24,760
Speaker 12: there was a time when quarterback valuers were so stuck

1595
01:17:24,800 --> 01:17:28,000
Speaker 12: on somebody's footwork because the feet had to marry to

1596
01:17:28,080 --> 01:17:29,679
Speaker 12: the concepts to deliver the football.

1597
01:17:29,880 --> 01:17:31,840
Speaker 13: That's kind of that still does I mean, you can't

1598
01:17:31,840 --> 01:17:34,360
Speaker 13: say no it but because it's taught that way, of course,

1599
01:17:34,400 --> 01:17:36,960
Speaker 13: but you can be somewhat right. People throw at different

1600
01:17:37,000 --> 01:17:39,720
Speaker 13: bases now then, yeah, and it's just kind of customary

1601
01:17:39,720 --> 01:17:42,759
Speaker 13: and just so people understand. Last summer I watched seven

1602
01:17:42,760 --> 01:17:45,320
Speaker 13: games of ward at Washington State from twenty twenty three,

1603
01:17:45,800 --> 01:17:49,400
Speaker 13: and in the last month I've watched probably seven or

1604
01:17:49,400 --> 01:17:51,479
Speaker 13: eight games from the U, so I've seen a lot

1605
01:17:51,520 --> 01:17:54,519
Speaker 13: of cam Ward. To me, he's a high level traits guy.

1606
01:17:54,600 --> 01:17:56,760
Speaker 13: He's got a live arm. The ball comes out of

1607
01:17:56,800 --> 01:17:59,519
Speaker 13: his hand. He can drive the ball with power. He

1608
01:17:59,560 --> 01:18:01,679
Speaker 13: can sit on his back foot and drive the ball.

1609
01:18:02,120 --> 01:18:04,559
Speaker 13: I thought he was efficient from the pocket. Does he

1610
01:18:04,600 --> 01:18:08,240
Speaker 13: need to clean up some footwork. Absolutely. He made some

1611
01:18:08,280 --> 01:18:11,960
Speaker 13: phenomenal throws outside of structure on the move. We've all

1612
01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:15,960
Speaker 13: seen those highlights. But there's plenty of other plays. Well,

1613
01:18:16,000 --> 01:18:18,760
Speaker 13: you wouldn't call him a creator. He certainly can run

1614
01:18:18,800 --> 01:18:24,599
Speaker 13: for a first down. So I guess, and I'm not looking.

1615
01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:26,240
Speaker 13: You know, everybody said to me, where would he fit

1616
01:18:26,280 --> 01:18:28,280
Speaker 13: if he was in last year's draft. That's not relevant

1617
01:18:28,280 --> 01:18:32,439
Speaker 13: to me. He's in this year's draft. It's not relevant. Yeah,

1618
01:18:32,479 --> 01:18:35,320
Speaker 13: you know, But I don't understand why he's not being

1619
01:18:35,360 --> 01:18:40,040
Speaker 13: talked about more as a really meaningful, potential high high pick.

1620
01:18:40,360 --> 01:18:43,280
Speaker 13: I mean, the way people now talk, and I'm talking

1621
01:18:43,280 --> 01:18:46,439
Speaker 13: about coaches talk about the quarterback position in the NFL.

1622
01:18:46,800 --> 01:18:49,680
Speaker 13: It seems to me he fits that mold. And I'm

1623
01:18:49,720 --> 01:18:51,720
Speaker 13: not going to sit here and compare him to Patrick Mahomes,

1624
01:18:52,120 --> 01:18:57,880
Speaker 13: but you know, stylistically, it's it's it's somewhat similar in

1625
01:18:57,920 --> 01:19:00,639
Speaker 13: that he can function from the pocket, he can make

1626
01:19:00,680 --> 01:19:03,520
Speaker 13: throw it. Now, he's not I wouldn't say he's especially

1627
01:19:03,640 --> 01:19:07,439
Speaker 13: aware as Mahomes or as special as Mahomes. You know,

1628
01:19:07,600 --> 01:19:08,960
Speaker 13: we're not going to go there, and I don't want

1629
01:19:08,960 --> 01:19:12,200
Speaker 13: people to think that's what I mean, but just stylistically, right,

1630
01:19:12,439 --> 01:19:13,480
Speaker 13: there's a similarity.

1631
01:19:13,560 --> 01:19:15,479
Speaker 8: Yeah, I mean.

1632
01:19:15,520 --> 01:19:17,400
Speaker 12: One of the first things I wrote down in when

1633
01:19:17,400 --> 01:19:19,680
Speaker 12: I went was doing cam was he must have been

1634
01:19:19,720 --> 01:19:21,760
Speaker 12: a fan of Mahomes because you can see some of

1635
01:19:21,800 --> 01:19:24,200
Speaker 12: the things he does, some of not the mannerisms, but

1636
01:19:24,240 --> 01:19:27,080
Speaker 12: the way he throws the football at times, and even

1637
01:19:27,320 --> 01:19:29,200
Speaker 12: the Lamar where he's kind of flat footing and he'll

1638
01:19:29,240 --> 01:19:31,800
Speaker 12: just fling it out there that those things jump out

1639
01:19:31,800 --> 01:19:33,879
Speaker 12: at you. But his ability to really throw the football

1640
01:19:34,200 --> 01:19:37,400
Speaker 12: anywhere on the field right with pace is kind of

1641
01:19:37,439 --> 01:19:38,200
Speaker 12: stunning to watch.

1642
01:19:38,280 --> 01:19:38,519
Speaker 8: Yeah.

1643
01:19:38,640 --> 01:19:40,880
Speaker 13: No, I think he's a high level traits guy. And

1644
01:19:41,280 --> 01:19:43,680
Speaker 13: I happen to know some people at Washington State and

1645
01:19:43,720 --> 01:19:46,439
Speaker 13: they told me he's highly accountable, that he has an

1646
01:19:46,479 --> 01:19:49,519
Speaker 13: alpha dog personality, you know, So that just made me

1647
01:19:49,560 --> 01:19:51,840
Speaker 13: feel even better. Normally, I don't get to find out

1648
01:19:51,840 --> 01:19:53,439
Speaker 13: that kind of stuff. I'm just sitting in my office

1649
01:19:53,439 --> 01:19:55,640
Speaker 13: at Films watching tape. But I just happen to know

1650
01:19:55,720 --> 01:19:59,160
Speaker 13: some people out there, So I don't understand why he's

1651
01:19:59,240 --> 01:20:01,439
Speaker 13: just not being talked about that way in your mind

1652
01:20:01,479 --> 01:20:03,479
Speaker 13: that he's clear cut that in my mind for the

1653
01:20:03,520 --> 01:20:05,160
Speaker 13: if you're the Cleveland Browns, you want to come out

1654
01:20:05,160 --> 01:20:06,920
Speaker 13: of the straft with cam Ward. Yeah, And I can

1655
01:20:07,000 --> 01:20:09,160
Speaker 13: understand why. You know there's other points of view.

1656
01:20:09,160 --> 01:20:09,479
Speaker 8: I don't.

1657
01:20:09,520 --> 01:20:11,080
Speaker 13: You know, you know me well enough to know I'm

1658
01:20:11,120 --> 01:20:13,280
Speaker 13: not one of those guys like I'm right and you're wrong. Sure,

1659
01:20:13,320 --> 01:20:16,679
Speaker 13: you know, there's there's so many variables, but to my mind,

1660
01:20:16,720 --> 01:20:17,439
Speaker 13: he's number one.

1661
01:20:18,680 --> 01:20:21,960
Speaker 4: You've heard about cam Ward with Greg Cosell. Now hear

1662
01:20:22,040 --> 01:20:25,040
Speaker 4: him talk about Sedar Sanders. After this quick time out,

1663
01:20:25,040 --> 01:20:27,639
Speaker 4: you're listening to Cleveland Browns Daily presented by bally Bet,

1664
01:20:27,920 --> 01:20:30,479
Speaker 4: and official sports betting partner of Your Cleveland Browns on

1665
01:20:30,560 --> 01:20:31,679
Speaker 4: eight to fifty ESPN.

1666
01:20:31,760 --> 01:20:39,799
Speaker 2: Cleveland Cleveland Browns Daily presented by bally Bet, an official

1667
01:20:39,840 --> 01:20:42,960
Speaker 2: sports betting partner of Your Cleveland Browns on eight fifty

1668
01:20:43,439 --> 01:20:44,520
Speaker 2: esp and Cleveland.

1669
01:20:49,400 --> 01:20:51,160
Speaker 4: As the guys like to say, so much more to

1670
01:20:51,200 --> 01:20:55,439
Speaker 4: come and this is it. Greg Cosell, Nathan Zigura talking

1671
01:20:55,560 --> 01:20:59,040
Speaker 4: Schedeur Sanders from the combine, do.

1672
01:20:59,080 --> 01:21:01,400
Speaker 12: You think if we looking at Shador and maybe this

1673
01:21:01,520 --> 01:21:04,479
Speaker 12: is a something you know, just kind of When I

1674
01:21:04,479 --> 01:21:09,240
Speaker 12: think of Shador's best traits, to me, it is accuracy,

1675
01:21:09,560 --> 01:21:12,679
Speaker 12: decision making from the pocket. I think he's very tough.

1676
01:21:12,680 --> 01:21:15,080
Speaker 12: He will take hits and deliver the football. I think

1677
01:21:15,120 --> 01:21:16,960
Speaker 12: his arm is adequate. I don't think it's a It's

1678
01:21:16,960 --> 01:21:19,600
Speaker 12: not Campwart's arm, but it's it's certainly good enough in

1679
01:21:19,640 --> 01:21:23,679
Speaker 12: the National Football League level, and maybe ten years ago

1680
01:21:24,520 --> 01:21:29,240
Speaker 12: we would have these guys flipped because of pocket winning

1681
01:21:29,360 --> 01:21:32,799
Speaker 12: is right at its best. He if he maximizes everything,

1682
01:21:32,840 --> 01:21:35,320
Speaker 12: the way that he would play the game is similar

1683
01:21:35,360 --> 01:21:37,760
Speaker 12: to the way that a Brady or a Breeze would

1684
01:21:37,840 --> 01:21:40,040
Speaker 12: play the game. I'm not saying he's those guys, but

1685
01:21:40,439 --> 01:21:41,600
Speaker 12: that's how he has.

1686
01:21:41,800 --> 01:21:43,520
Speaker 8: He has to play in the league.

1687
01:21:43,320 --> 01:21:46,040
Speaker 12: Correct, right, what you're saying, and that is tougher now

1688
01:21:46,080 --> 01:21:48,639
Speaker 12: than it has been at any point in league history.

1689
01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:49,160
Speaker 8: Correct.

1690
01:21:49,400 --> 01:21:52,200
Speaker 13: So he when we spoke, you know, ten minutes ago

1691
01:21:52,280 --> 01:21:55,800
Speaker 13: about playing from the pocket and being pristine in pre

1692
01:21:55,920 --> 01:21:59,080
Speaker 13: snap post snap, he has to be that guy. At

1693
01:21:59,120 --> 01:22:03,519
Speaker 13: his core, he is a ball distributor and an efficient executor. Yep,

1694
01:22:03,640 --> 01:22:05,760
Speaker 13: that's what he is. To use the basketball term, he's

1695
01:22:05,760 --> 01:22:06,360
Speaker 13: a point guard.

1696
01:22:06,439 --> 01:22:06,599
Speaker 8: Yep.

1697
01:22:06,640 --> 01:22:09,320
Speaker 13: Okay, that's what he has to be. I'm not saying

1698
01:22:09,320 --> 01:22:12,040
Speaker 13: he can't be that. I think that's harder to do

1699
01:22:12,240 --> 01:22:14,439
Speaker 13: right now, and I think there's a number of things

1700
01:22:14,439 --> 01:22:16,720
Speaker 13: he would have to clean up in order to do that.

1701
01:22:17,120 --> 01:22:19,080
Speaker 13: He has a glaring tendency to hold the ball with

1702
01:22:19,120 --> 01:22:21,240
Speaker 13: one hand. That has to be cleaned.

1703
01:22:21,040 --> 01:22:22,679
Speaker 8: Up hands on. Yeah.

1704
01:22:22,840 --> 01:22:25,479
Speaker 13: Second thing he has a tendency to do is he

1705
01:22:25,520 --> 01:22:29,080
Speaker 13: retreats backwards. You can't retreat backwards in the NFL. The

1706
01:22:29,120 --> 01:22:31,040
Speaker 13: only guy who can do that is Lamar Jackson, and

1707
01:22:31,040 --> 01:22:31,559
Speaker 13: he's a freak.

1708
01:22:31,800 --> 01:22:32,680
Speaker 8: Mahomes a little bit.

1709
01:22:32,840 --> 01:22:35,880
Speaker 13: Yeah, yeah, Well Mahomes has a spatial awareness that's just

1710
01:22:36,040 --> 01:22:37,599
Speaker 13: ridiculous that you can't teach that.

1711
01:22:37,840 --> 01:22:38,040
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1712
01:22:38,120 --> 01:22:41,320
Speaker 13: Yeah, So you know, I think there are some things

1713
01:22:41,360 --> 01:22:44,759
Speaker 13: that Shadeer clearly has to clean up. But he throws

1714
01:22:44,800 --> 01:22:47,360
Speaker 13: a good ball. I think he sees it well. He

1715
01:22:47,439 --> 01:22:50,240
Speaker 13: actually does throw well on the run. But he's not

1716
01:22:50,600 --> 01:22:52,720
Speaker 13: he won't. He's not a playmaker, but he does throw

1717
01:22:52,760 --> 01:22:55,040
Speaker 13: the ball well in the run. Can he run for

1718
01:22:55,040 --> 01:22:57,360
Speaker 13: a first down? Yeah, but sure, that's not his game.

1719
01:22:58,439 --> 01:23:01,200
Speaker 13: So he has to be at the highest level of

1720
01:23:01,240 --> 01:23:03,680
Speaker 13: efficiency playing from the pocket.

1721
01:23:03,439 --> 01:23:04,920
Speaker 12: And I think that would be something that you need

1722
01:23:04,920 --> 01:23:08,920
Speaker 12: to understand about him. Is his schematic understanding. One of

1723
01:23:08,960 --> 01:23:10,800
Speaker 12: the things that I in my notes, I'm curious to

1724
01:23:10,800 --> 01:23:13,120
Speaker 12: see if you thought this as well. With him, I

1725
01:23:13,200 --> 01:23:16,840
Speaker 12: felt like he did a very good job of understanding

1726
01:23:16,840 --> 01:23:18,439
Speaker 12: what a defense was doing, because there are a lot

1727
01:23:18,479 --> 01:23:20,080
Speaker 12: of times where he would throw the ball and I'm,

1728
01:23:20,120 --> 01:23:22,160
Speaker 12: you know, watching it right like deposit and I'm like, Okay,

1729
01:23:22,200 --> 01:23:24,759
Speaker 12: where's the ball gonna go? Right, and the ball's actually

1730
01:23:24,800 --> 01:23:26,519
Speaker 12: coming out of his hand and I'm like, I have

1731
01:23:26,560 --> 01:23:29,280
Speaker 12: no idea where this ball is going, and instead he's no,

1732
01:23:29,360 --> 01:23:31,519
Speaker 12: he knows where nobody's gonna be and gets it to.

1733
01:23:32,760 --> 01:23:35,840
Speaker 13: I mean, there's no question he has really positive traits

1734
01:23:35,840 --> 01:23:38,720
Speaker 13: as a pocket quarterback. Yeah, and you know you and

1735
01:23:38,800 --> 01:23:41,879
Speaker 13: how it is people then think, oh, you know, Cochelle,

1736
01:23:41,880 --> 01:23:44,040
Speaker 13: hey shraud or shitt No, I don't know. I know,

1737
01:23:44,200 --> 01:23:46,360
Speaker 13: And I think he could be a good quarterback. I

1738
01:23:46,520 --> 01:23:50,120
Speaker 13: just think that's harder to play that way, and particularly

1739
01:23:50,160 --> 01:23:52,800
Speaker 13: to start his career, he would need to be on

1740
01:23:52,880 --> 01:23:56,920
Speaker 13: a team with a good online with a viable run game.

1741
01:23:57,000 --> 01:23:59,160
Speaker 13: Doesn't have to be an Eagles run game, you know,

1742
01:23:59,280 --> 01:24:02,760
Speaker 13: or a Titans excuse me, a Raven's run game. But

1743
01:24:02,880 --> 01:24:05,679
Speaker 13: he would need a viable run game. He needed defense

1744
01:24:05,720 --> 01:24:08,559
Speaker 13: that for the most part, keeps the game relatively close,

1745
01:24:08,760 --> 01:24:10,439
Speaker 13: because you don't want him to be in a situation

1746
01:24:10,439 --> 01:24:12,320
Speaker 13: where he's got to put up thirty every week just

1747
01:24:12,320 --> 01:24:16,120
Speaker 13: to compete, right you know? Yeah, so I think he

1748
01:24:16,160 --> 01:24:18,599
Speaker 13: can be a good player. I just I don't think

1749
01:24:19,000 --> 01:24:22,599
Speaker 13: his overall traits level is is what cam Wards is.

1750
01:24:22,840 --> 01:24:25,000
Speaker 12: I think then I and we agree on that completely.

1751
01:24:25,280 --> 01:24:27,960
Speaker 12: Do you think for a kai with those kind of traits.

1752
01:24:28,160 --> 01:24:30,320
Speaker 12: There's a couple kinds of offenses in the NFL, now,

1753
01:24:30,360 --> 01:24:33,320
Speaker 12: and you go through these schemes, and I'm oversimplifying it greatly,

1754
01:24:33,360 --> 01:24:39,160
Speaker 12: but there is the we'll call it Shanahan McVeigh, you know, O'Connell,

1755
01:24:39,240 --> 01:24:44,120
Speaker 12: some Ben Johnson, Stefan Ski where they ask very particular

1756
01:24:44,160 --> 01:24:46,920
Speaker 12: things of their quarterbacks, and then there's kind of the

1757
01:24:46,960 --> 01:24:49,880
Speaker 12: others where the quarterback kind of is the offense, which

1758
01:24:49,920 --> 01:24:52,240
Speaker 12: is Josh Allen mo Now, I do schematic.

1759
01:24:52,160 --> 01:24:54,880
Speaker 13: Obviously, they still schemes. Yes, I know what you're saying.

1760
01:24:54,680 --> 01:24:57,760
Speaker 12: But some of them are more Okay, we're setting this

1761
01:24:57,880 --> 01:24:59,880
Speaker 12: up so that you're reading this and if you read

1762
01:24:59,880 --> 01:25:02,240
Speaker 12: this correctly, you know that the ball goes here. If

1763
01:25:02,240 --> 01:25:05,240
Speaker 12: you see that the ball goes there, can you execute that?

1764
01:25:05,280 --> 01:25:07,479
Speaker 12: Can you be an executor? So in your mind, is

1765
01:25:07,520 --> 01:25:10,200
Speaker 12: should do if the Browns say we're to get your door,

1766
01:25:10,240 --> 01:25:12,280
Speaker 12: Is that we at least have the kind of system

1767
01:25:12,320 --> 01:25:14,200
Speaker 12: in place that you think he would be in the

1768
01:25:14,240 --> 01:25:15,680
Speaker 12: best position to succeed in.

1769
01:25:15,880 --> 01:25:19,479
Speaker 13: I think he could succeed in Afanski offense. You know,

1770
01:25:20,040 --> 01:25:22,719
Speaker 13: the run game obviously, you know the Chubb whole Chub issue.

1771
01:25:22,760 --> 01:25:24,760
Speaker 13: I guess he's a free agent too, so who knows

1772
01:25:24,760 --> 01:25:26,640
Speaker 13: what their run game is gonna look like. But he

1773
01:25:26,680 --> 01:25:29,280
Speaker 13: needs a run game the O line. I don't know

1774
01:25:29,320 --> 01:25:31,280
Speaker 13: about all the players that are there, you know, whether

1775
01:25:31,280 --> 01:25:32,040
Speaker 13: there's free agency.

1776
01:25:32,080 --> 01:25:34,599
Speaker 12: Hopefully Joel comes back, it should be at least plus.

1777
01:25:34,640 --> 01:25:37,280
Speaker 12: It's a plus offense, right right, so you know he

1778
01:25:37,320 --> 01:25:39,760
Speaker 12: would need that. I think he can execute his Tofanski

1779
01:25:39,840 --> 01:25:44,439
Speaker 12: offense without question. You know, I think there's plenty of

1780
01:25:44,439 --> 01:25:49,320
Speaker 12: offenses he can execute well. You know, the question is

1781
01:25:49,360 --> 01:25:52,120
Speaker 12: how quickly he can become that guy that can basically

1782
01:25:52,160 --> 01:25:55,080
Speaker 12: dominate pre snap. You know, think of Joe Burrow, Okay,

1783
01:25:55,080 --> 01:25:57,320
Speaker 12: and I'm not. This is not a one to one comparison, I.

1784
01:25:57,240 --> 01:25:59,280
Speaker 8: Hope, but I've heard multiple people say something like.

1785
01:25:59,200 --> 01:26:02,800
Speaker 13: That, Yeah, Joe Burrow is a computer chip when it

1786
01:26:02,800 --> 01:26:06,560
Speaker 13: comes to pre snap and post snap elite. Yeah, is

1787
01:26:06,600 --> 01:26:09,080
Speaker 13: going to have to move in that direction, and he

1788
01:26:09,120 --> 01:26:11,519
Speaker 13: may be more than capable of it. You know again,

1789
01:26:11,640 --> 01:26:13,680
Speaker 13: he maybe maybe in two years. That's what we were

1790
01:26:13,680 --> 01:26:16,240
Speaker 13: talking about him. It's very possible. I'm not I'm not

1791
01:26:16,280 --> 01:26:17,360
Speaker 13: saying that can't.

1792
01:26:17,120 --> 01:26:17,719
Speaker 8: Be the case.

1793
01:26:18,520 --> 01:26:20,320
Speaker 13: You're saying, but that's what that's going.

1794
01:26:20,240 --> 01:26:23,719
Speaker 12: To have to do it, whereas Cam has the ability

1795
01:26:23,760 --> 01:26:25,040
Speaker 12: to kind of make something out of.

1796
01:26:25,040 --> 01:26:25,880
Speaker 8: Nothing more often.

1797
01:26:25,920 --> 01:26:27,719
Speaker 13: I mean, you know, when you look at the Mahomes

1798
01:26:27,720 --> 01:26:30,679
Speaker 13: and the Josh Allens, you know they're going to miss

1799
01:26:30,680 --> 01:26:33,559
Speaker 13: some throws within structure. But my guess is the coaching

1800
01:26:33,600 --> 01:26:36,360
Speaker 13: staff doesn't say, oh man, you got to throw those

1801
01:26:36,400 --> 01:26:39,200
Speaker 13: balls or else because they don't want to take away.

1802
01:26:38,960 --> 01:26:41,040
Speaker 8: Their ability to do that special stuff.

1803
01:26:42,200 --> 01:26:44,160
Speaker 13: You know, you're not going to say to Josh Allen,

1804
01:26:44,479 --> 01:26:47,840
Speaker 13: who you know makes ridiculous plays, you know, particularly running

1805
01:26:47,840 --> 01:26:50,280
Speaker 13: to his right, that oh you know what, you kind

1806
01:26:50,280 --> 01:26:52,800
Speaker 13: of missed Shakir there, you know on that.

1807
01:26:52,800 --> 01:26:54,040
Speaker 8: Throw you should have thrown it.

1808
01:26:54,240 --> 01:26:57,040
Speaker 13: You know, you don't want to say that to Josh

1809
01:26:57,080 --> 01:26:58,840
Speaker 13: because you don't want to start thinking, well, gee, do

1810
01:26:58,920 --> 01:26:59,880
Speaker 13: they want me not to move?

1811
01:27:00,320 --> 01:27:01,840
Speaker 8: You know, you don't want to do let them play.

1812
01:27:01,920 --> 01:27:04,799
Speaker 12: Yeah, it's interesting because it does feel like at times

1813
01:27:04,840 --> 01:27:07,920
Speaker 12: in the league, the teams that are better on offense

1814
01:27:08,000 --> 01:27:10,280
Speaker 12: are more explosive, and that can come in a variety

1815
01:27:10,280 --> 01:27:14,280
Speaker 12: of ways. But it's hard to run thirteen plays against

1816
01:27:14,280 --> 01:27:16,800
Speaker 12: these defenses and score at the end of it. You

1817
01:27:17,000 --> 01:27:19,880
Speaker 12: need kind of that chunk. And then my notes on

1818
01:27:20,240 --> 01:27:22,920
Speaker 12: chunk play machine, I just kept writing right camera, So

1819
01:27:23,200 --> 01:27:25,479
Speaker 12: that's something you look for, right, And that's why I

1820
01:27:25,479 --> 01:27:28,920
Speaker 12: think in your evolution of what you do, that's why

1821
01:27:28,960 --> 01:27:29,840
Speaker 12: he jumps out so.

1822
01:27:29,880 --> 01:27:32,559
Speaker 13: Much right, right, and and and again. Just to reiterate,

1823
01:27:32,600 --> 01:27:35,880
Speaker 13: it doesn't mean that jadear Sanders can't become a good player, No, and.

1824
01:27:35,840 --> 01:27:38,240
Speaker 12: He made plenty of chunks. But it's a different it's

1825
01:27:38,280 --> 01:27:40,160
Speaker 12: it is, there is a there's different there.

1826
01:27:40,080 --> 01:27:44,759
Speaker 13: Are different players who ultimately will need to succeed differently.

1827
01:27:45,000 --> 01:27:47,599
Speaker 8: Right. I'd even take it back to that you mentioned kind.

1828
01:27:47,400 --> 01:27:51,960
Speaker 12: Of the the Stroud and the Bryce Young draft. Those

1829
01:27:51,960 --> 01:27:54,120
Speaker 12: two are actually, in some ways I think more similar

1830
01:27:54,439 --> 01:27:56,360
Speaker 12: in terms of how they're gonna ultimately have to win

1831
01:27:56,360 --> 01:27:58,519
Speaker 12: in the league. They're gonna have to win mentally.

1832
01:27:58,680 --> 01:28:01,720
Speaker 13: I mean, you can argue twenty you mentioned Stroud, you

1833
01:28:01,760 --> 01:28:05,600
Speaker 13: can argue that coming into the draft. Okay, we know

1834
01:28:05,640 --> 01:28:08,040
Speaker 13: what Stroud's done. He's been very good for the most part.

1835
01:28:08,920 --> 01:28:11,360
Speaker 13: But you could argue that Ja Dear Sanders is a

1836
01:28:11,520 --> 01:28:15,040
Speaker 13: lesser Stroud because he's smaller and he doesn't throw it

1837
01:28:15,080 --> 01:28:19,160
Speaker 13: as well. So I mean, again, Stroud was a second

1838
01:28:19,200 --> 01:28:23,040
Speaker 13: pick in the draft, had a phenomenal rookie season. Who's

1839
01:28:23,120 --> 01:28:24,960
Speaker 13: up and down is the second year, but they still

1840
01:28:24,960 --> 01:28:26,439
Speaker 13: made it to the second round of the place I

1841
01:28:26,439 --> 01:28:28,240
Speaker 13: want to play off Dame. I wanted Division two years.

1842
01:28:28,080 --> 01:28:28,720
Speaker 8: In a row. I know.

1843
01:28:28,800 --> 01:28:30,719
Speaker 13: So you can't sit here and say, well, gee, Stroud's

1844
01:28:30,720 --> 01:28:33,519
Speaker 13: no good. So my shader is is a in terms

1845
01:28:33,520 --> 01:28:37,479
Speaker 13: of pure talent, he's a lower case Stroud.

1846
01:28:37,200 --> 01:28:41,800
Speaker 12: Which would absolutely absolutely, And then it comes to what

1847
01:28:41,840 --> 01:28:45,200
Speaker 12: you do to maximize the right What is and we'll

1848
01:28:45,200 --> 01:28:47,479
Speaker 12: get you out of here because it's talk to you

1849
01:28:47,520 --> 01:28:51,320
Speaker 12: all day. What is in your mind coming off of

1850
01:28:51,360 --> 01:28:54,000
Speaker 12: what we saw and knowing how you like to dive

1851
01:28:54,000 --> 01:28:55,720
Speaker 12: into the schemes, what do you think because this is

1852
01:28:55,760 --> 01:28:58,160
Speaker 12: a it's in some sense of copycat leaks. Some things

1853
01:28:58,160 --> 01:29:00,240
Speaker 12: can't be cop copycatted, and I think the way the

1854
01:29:00,320 --> 01:29:02,519
Speaker 12: Eagles do it really can't be because they start at

1855
01:29:02,560 --> 01:29:04,240
Speaker 12: first to nine and nobody else in the league has

1856
01:29:04,280 --> 01:29:06,200
Speaker 12: figured out how to start every drive at.

1857
01:29:06,080 --> 01:29:07,719
Speaker 8: First and nine, right, right right?

1858
01:29:08,080 --> 01:29:10,960
Speaker 12: What do you think will be kind of our defenses

1859
01:29:11,000 --> 01:29:12,679
Speaker 12: with the run game? Are they going to be like, Okay,

1860
01:29:12,680 --> 01:29:14,320
Speaker 12: maybe we have to do a little more single higher

1861
01:29:14,320 --> 01:29:15,679
Speaker 12: Do you think we're going to be in a phase

1862
01:29:15,720 --> 01:29:18,160
Speaker 12: for a while where they're saying, our goal is to

1863
01:29:18,439 --> 01:29:20,960
Speaker 12: make teams do what we just said is hard go

1864
01:29:21,040 --> 01:29:22,599
Speaker 12: on twelve thirteen play drives.

1865
01:29:22,800 --> 01:29:25,000
Speaker 13: Well, I'm going to answer that this way. And I

1866
01:29:25,000 --> 01:29:27,840
Speaker 13: think this wasn't talked about enough, and I remember at

1867
01:29:27,840 --> 01:29:30,679
Speaker 13: the Super Bowl, you know, doing shows and talking about.

1868
01:29:30,479 --> 01:29:31,000
Speaker 8: This a lot.

1869
01:29:31,560 --> 01:29:33,960
Speaker 13: I'm going to be very curious to see because the

1870
01:29:34,000 --> 01:29:37,320
Speaker 13: Eagles are a four down offense one hundred percent, and

1871
01:29:37,439 --> 01:29:39,680
Speaker 13: I think I'm curious to see if more teams are

1872
01:29:40,200 --> 01:29:43,120
Speaker 13: going to start doing that, because if the Eagles have

1873
01:29:43,280 --> 01:29:46,200
Speaker 13: fourth and none of this is one hundred percent, But

1874
01:29:46,240 --> 01:29:49,639
Speaker 13: if the Eagles have fourth and four or less from

1875
01:29:49,680 --> 01:29:52,920
Speaker 13: the minus forty going forward, they're going They pretty much

1876
01:29:52,920 --> 01:29:55,960
Speaker 13: are going forward, yep, and that changes the way you

1877
01:29:56,000 --> 01:29:59,679
Speaker 13: have to play defense against them. So I'm very curious

1878
01:29:59,680 --> 01:30:02,880
Speaker 13: to see if more teams are going to you know,

1879
01:30:02,920 --> 01:30:06,400
Speaker 13: and maybe that's a function of analytics, metrics, whatever you

1880
01:30:06,400 --> 01:30:09,880
Speaker 13: want to call it, but they're really good at it.

1881
01:30:10,120 --> 01:30:13,519
Speaker 12: Yeah, well it's and it changes to your point, Third

1882
01:30:13,560 --> 01:30:17,679
Speaker 12: and nine against most teams is just stop them short

1883
01:30:17,840 --> 01:30:18,760
Speaker 12: and we get the ball back.

1884
01:30:18,800 --> 01:30:20,200
Speaker 13: I mean, how many times do you see in the

1885
01:30:20,320 --> 01:30:23,040
Speaker 13: NFL third and nine team game seven? It's fourth and

1886
01:30:23,080 --> 01:30:25,559
Speaker 13: two and the defense gets so excited, everybody puts their

1887
01:30:25,560 --> 01:30:28,160
Speaker 13: hands up. It's fourth down. Well, Eagles are going to

1888
01:30:28,240 --> 01:30:31,360
Speaker 13: go for that. Eagles Lions. Yeah, and by the way,

1889
01:30:31,400 --> 01:30:33,240
Speaker 13: both pretty successful teams. But that's my point.

1890
01:30:33,320 --> 01:30:34,720
Speaker 12: In the old days, you would say, let them check

1891
01:30:34,720 --> 01:30:36,960
Speaker 12: it down, right, they can pick up seven, what other.

1892
01:30:36,960 --> 01:30:39,280
Speaker 13: Thing, Let them check it down. We'll rally up and

1893
01:30:39,320 --> 01:30:41,880
Speaker 13: tackle lov who will be fourth and three. Well, maybe

1894
01:30:41,920 --> 01:30:44,160
Speaker 13: you don't want to play a defense now where you'll

1895
01:30:44,240 --> 01:30:46,400
Speaker 13: let them check it down to gain six yards on

1896
01:30:46,479 --> 01:30:48,920
Speaker 13: third and nine. So now it changes the way you

1897
01:30:49,000 --> 01:30:49,920
Speaker 13: play defense, which.

1898
01:30:49,840 --> 01:30:51,600
Speaker 8: Means now you might get beat for twenty nine on

1899
01:30:51,680 --> 01:30:52,200
Speaker 8: third and nine.

1900
01:30:52,240 --> 01:30:54,280
Speaker 13: Maybe you have to play more Man. Maybe you have

1901
01:30:54,320 --> 01:30:56,280
Speaker 13: to use a spy if you're gonna play more Man,

1902
01:30:56,400 --> 01:30:58,439
Speaker 13: because Hurts can beat you with his legs. You know,

1903
01:30:58,960 --> 01:31:03,000
Speaker 13: it changes every thing about how you play specific down

1904
01:31:03,040 --> 01:31:04,320
Speaker 13: in distant situations.

1905
01:31:04,439 --> 01:31:06,640
Speaker 12: That's gonna be fun because that's another layer to this

1906
01:31:06,800 --> 01:31:09,400
Speaker 12: chess match because it used to be assumed, okay, get

1907
01:31:09,439 --> 01:31:10,000
Speaker 12: the ball back.

1908
01:31:10,080 --> 01:31:13,080
Speaker 13: Now we don't know, and those become and that's why

1909
01:31:13,080 --> 01:31:15,559
Speaker 13: this none of this is like I said, in mathematical equation.

1910
01:31:15,600 --> 01:31:17,679
Speaker 13: You know, there's so many variables here.

1911
01:31:18,080 --> 01:31:21,599
Speaker 12: I like, and I'm curious if I'm phrasing this right.

1912
01:31:22,240 --> 01:31:24,960
Speaker 12: What we're seeing as a shifting in what are actually

1913
01:31:25,040 --> 01:31:27,720
Speaker 12: the high leverage plays in the game, correct, which I

1914
01:31:27,720 --> 01:31:29,320
Speaker 12: think is very cool. And now, all of a sudden,

1915
01:31:29,360 --> 01:31:32,680
Speaker 12: if you can be the most dominant team in a

1916
01:31:32,760 --> 01:31:36,920
Speaker 12: situation where you need three yards, you have an advantage

1917
01:31:36,960 --> 01:31:37,519
Speaker 12: on the league.

1918
01:31:38,000 --> 01:31:38,200
Speaker 8: Right.

1919
01:31:38,280 --> 01:31:39,760
Speaker 12: If you can gain three yards when you have to

1920
01:31:39,760 --> 01:31:41,360
Speaker 12: gain three yards, or stop three yards when you have

1921
01:31:41,400 --> 01:31:43,200
Speaker 12: to stop three yards, you're gonna.

1922
01:31:42,880 --> 01:31:45,160
Speaker 13: And by the way, it also changes offensive play calling

1923
01:31:45,240 --> 01:31:48,000
Speaker 13: because if you're third and seven, you may run the ball.

1924
01:31:48,080 --> 01:31:50,800
Speaker 13: Now maybe running running game becomes more viable because you

1925
01:31:50,880 --> 01:31:54,160
Speaker 13: know what, so you gain four becomes fourth and three, right,

1926
01:31:55,520 --> 01:31:57,559
Speaker 13: I mean, it just changes a lot of things.

1927
01:31:58,040 --> 01:31:58,920
Speaker 8: So there's a part of you.

1928
01:31:59,040 --> 01:32:02,080
Speaker 12: I think that at this time you are loving the

1929
01:32:02,120 --> 01:32:04,080
Speaker 12: prospects and the draft and all of that, but then

1930
01:32:04,120 --> 01:32:06,360
Speaker 12: you also can't wait to see what are the scheme

1931
01:32:06,439 --> 01:32:08,599
Speaker 12: changes that are gonna come to this league that affect

1932
01:32:08,640 --> 01:32:09,240
Speaker 12: that chess match.

1933
01:32:09,360 --> 01:32:11,720
Speaker 13: What I really love is the fact that there's so

1934
01:32:11,840 --> 01:32:15,360
Speaker 13: many variables. I mean, I love the fact that you

1935
01:32:15,360 --> 01:32:19,280
Speaker 13: know it's there's there's so many ways to do things.

1936
01:32:19,320 --> 01:32:20,960
Speaker 13: One of the first things I learned, and this goes

1937
01:32:20,960 --> 01:32:24,040
Speaker 13: back twenty five thirty years ago, when I you know

1938
01:32:24,080 --> 01:32:26,320
Speaker 13: when I really started, because I started getting the coaching

1939
01:32:26,360 --> 01:32:28,000
Speaker 13: tape in nineteen ninety two and I had to learn

1940
01:32:28,000 --> 01:32:31,679
Speaker 13: in the game that way is I remember coaches telling

1941
01:32:31,760 --> 01:32:35,040
Speaker 13: me there's so many different ways to do things, and

1942
01:32:35,120 --> 01:32:37,000
Speaker 13: I think you have to understand that there's not one

1943
01:32:37,040 --> 01:32:39,680
Speaker 13: way to do things here. Yeah, and you know, you

1944
01:32:39,680 --> 01:32:41,760
Speaker 13: can win a lot of different ways, and you can

1945
01:32:41,800 --> 01:32:44,280
Speaker 13: win a lot of different ways each week. Sometimes what

1946
01:32:44,360 --> 01:32:46,280
Speaker 13: you do week four is not what you're going to

1947
01:32:46,360 --> 01:32:48,599
Speaker 13: do week five against the next opponent.

1948
01:32:48,680 --> 01:32:50,519
Speaker 12: By frankly, that better be the case, right right, You

1949
01:32:50,600 --> 01:32:52,120
Speaker 12: better be changing it every week.

1950
01:32:52,160 --> 01:32:54,960
Speaker 13: Right, I mean you're not changing, you're not reinventing the wheel.

1951
01:32:55,120 --> 01:32:57,920
Speaker 8: No, But the tailoring, yeah yeah, the tailoring. Yeah.

1952
01:32:58,000 --> 01:33:01,200
Speaker 13: And that's what I kind of really find fascinating because

1953
01:33:01,240 --> 01:33:03,559
Speaker 13: to me, and I know coaches think this way. You

1954
01:33:03,680 --> 01:33:07,920
Speaker 13: know this for coaches, it's an academic and intellectual experience.

1955
01:33:08,120 --> 01:33:10,200
Speaker 13: We know football is a physical game. We know on

1956
01:33:10,320 --> 01:33:12,839
Speaker 13: defense you want your guys to hit people in rally

1957
01:33:13,040 --> 01:33:15,880
Speaker 13: and you know, we know all that, but the actual

1958
01:33:16,160 --> 01:33:18,320
Speaker 13: you know, how do you put together a defense, how

1959
01:33:18,400 --> 01:33:20,920
Speaker 13: you structure your z own concepts, how you do it.

1960
01:33:21,000 --> 01:33:22,640
Speaker 13: That's all academic and intellectual.

1961
01:33:22,880 --> 01:33:24,559
Speaker 12: Well, then you know as well as I do. When

1962
01:33:25,080 --> 01:33:28,280
Speaker 12: they come they see something, they say, okay, we know

1963
01:33:28,360 --> 01:33:30,920
Speaker 12: they're gonna do this right when we show them this,

1964
01:33:31,360 --> 01:33:34,439
Speaker 12: So we're gonna actually make this tweak right, and they

1965
01:33:34,439 --> 01:33:36,320
Speaker 12: see it pre snap and they start to get excited

1966
01:33:36,320 --> 01:33:37,920
Speaker 12: on the sideline and then it ends up being a

1967
01:33:37,920 --> 01:33:39,759
Speaker 12: touchdown and they knew it before the ball was snapped.

1968
01:33:40,439 --> 01:33:42,640
Speaker 13: That's hey, you know what it is. You know the

1969
01:33:42,640 --> 01:33:45,280
Speaker 13: guy upstairs. You know, because there's so many coaches upstairs

1970
01:33:45,360 --> 01:33:48,639
Speaker 13: who are watching specific things like let's say it's offense.

1971
01:33:48,960 --> 01:33:52,280
Speaker 13: You know, let's say after two drives, the guy upstairs

1972
01:33:52,320 --> 01:33:54,679
Speaker 13: tells the guy on the bench, whether it's the OC

1973
01:33:54,960 --> 01:33:57,639
Speaker 13: or whether it's a quarterback, whoever's down on the say hey,

1974
01:33:57,680 --> 01:34:00,839
Speaker 13: you know, hey, Joe, we ran that motion three times.

1975
01:34:00,960 --> 01:34:04,960
Speaker 13: All three times, here's how the defense reacted. Now they

1976
01:34:05,040 --> 01:34:05,600
Speaker 13: work off that.

1977
01:34:05,960 --> 01:34:08,120
Speaker 8: Yep, you know. They don't just call plays.

1978
01:34:09,200 --> 01:34:11,519
Speaker 12: Of course, they think about what Andy Reid dialed up

1979
01:34:11,560 --> 01:34:13,559
Speaker 12: in the Super Bowl they won over the Eagles, where

1980
01:34:13,560 --> 01:34:15,960
Speaker 12: they knew when they ran that rap motion right, it

1981
01:34:16,000 --> 01:34:16,800
Speaker 12: was gonna get kicked and.

1982
01:34:16,720 --> 01:34:18,320
Speaker 8: They were going to get a light open. Yeah. I

1983
01:34:18,360 --> 01:34:21,320
Speaker 8: mean that to me is the is the real fun

1984
01:34:21,360 --> 01:34:23,960
Speaker 8: of football. It's the best. You're the best. This is

1985
01:34:24,000 --> 01:34:24,599
Speaker 8: the best. I love.

1986
01:34:24,680 --> 01:34:27,280
Speaker 13: These conversations are great, the best. And that's what I

1987
01:34:27,280 --> 01:34:30,000
Speaker 13: hope people take away is that there's so many variables.

1988
01:34:30,280 --> 01:34:33,559
Speaker 13: It's and then it's you know, it's it's it's this.

1989
01:34:33,600 --> 01:34:35,720
Speaker 13: Stuff's really hard. That's why coaches say it's hard to

1990
01:34:35,760 --> 01:34:38,680
Speaker 13: win on Sundays. It's really hard, and the margins are

1991
01:34:38,680 --> 01:34:40,679
Speaker 13: smaller than oh my god, that's.

1992
01:34:40,520 --> 01:34:42,240
Speaker 12: Why it's the best. Yeah, best, Thank you so much.

1993
01:34:42,240 --> 01:34:44,479
Speaker 12: Appreciates the great great co cell.

1994
01:34:45,439 --> 01:34:47,639
Speaker 3: Thanks to Greg Cosell. Thanks to Austin Ward.

1995
01:34:47,760 --> 01:34:50,840
Speaker 4: Thanks to Kelsey Russo, thanks to Tyris pol And, Gerrod Cherry,

1996
01:34:50,880 --> 01:34:54,000
Speaker 4: the g Man, the j Man. Everybody doing well. Enjoy

1997
01:34:54,080 --> 01:34:57,679
Speaker 4: the sweet sixteen games tonight. We are back with you tomorrow.

1998
01:34:57,720 --> 01:35:00,360
Speaker 4: The next level is next. Thanks for listening, every everybody,

1999
01:35:00,360 --> 01:35:03,240
Speaker 4: Thanks for watching The Cleveland Browns Daily, presented by Bally

2000
01:35:03,280 --> 01:35:06,160
Speaker 4: Batter sports betting partner of your Cleveland Browns on eight

2001
01:35:06,240 --> 01:35:07,879
Speaker 4: fifty ESPN Cleveland.

2002
01:35:08,280 --> 01:35:10,960
Speaker 2: You've been listening to Cleveland Browns Daily, a production of

2003
01:35:11,000 --> 01:35:14,240
Speaker 2: the Cleveland Browns and eight fifty ESPN Cleveland